Aug. 16, 2023

#32 - TJ Participated in an “Oriented to Love” Dialogue--Here Are His Thoughts

#32 - TJ Participated in an “Oriented to Love” Dialogue--Here Are His Thoughts

In the spring, TJ attended a small dialogue, Oriented to Love (OTL), sponsored by the Christians for Social Action. OTL hosts thoughtful conversations across difference, specifically among Christians, both queer and straight, who take on different beliefs and positions on questions of gender, sexuality, and how those topics interact with their faith. It’s a rare opportunity when someone can hold space for people to meet, care well, listen carefully, and share their stories honestly. Oriented to Love aims not to change anyone’s mind, but to facilitate listening and thoughtful dialogue among participants.

In this episode, TJ talked David through his experience in this group conversation and the many additional questions that emerged from the experience.

Note: This episode uses the terms “Side A” and “Side B” (and X, Y) as shorthand quite a bit. If you’re new to the conversation, our Communion & Shalom episode #3, talks through the 4 “sides”: #3 - A-B-Y-X | 4 Sides on SSA/Gay Sexuality

Also note that “Side C” is sometimes used to refer to a perspective that doesn’t choose a “side” or tries to make space for all “sides” to exist in unity.



(00:27) What Is "Oriented to Love"?

(09:53) Stepping into the first room of the conversation

(14:41) The second room: Not just listening, but sharing convictions

(21:31) Discomfort is inevitable

(27:49) "We don't think you're a worse Christian”

(37:56) Heresy, inheriting the kingdom, sin, salvation…

(44:34) 3 questions that distinguish "wings" of Side B

(51:14) Faith and works, degree of severity, fear and trembling

(1:03:49) We recommend OTL


Links and References

“Oriented to Love”:


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Creators and Hosts: David Frank, TJ Espinoza

Audio Engineer: Carl Swenson (

Podcast Manager: Elena