EMERGENCY EPISODE: Impact of ICE Raids in the Southeast Asian Communities w/Quyen Dinh

0:04 Hey, everyone. My name is Randy Kim from the Bunmi Chronicles podcast. So I am doing an emergency episode because of the current ice rates that have been going on nationally, specifically what we are seeing in Minneapolis. And so I am really honored to bring on Quinn Aden, whoistheexecutivedirectorof the Southeast Asia Resource Action Center, otherwise known as C-RAC. And to give a context about what C-RAC is, itisanationalcivilrightsorganizationwithamissiontobuildpowerwith diverse communities from Cambodia, Laos, Vietnam to create a socially just and equitable society.

0:45 As representatives of the largest refugee community ever resettled in the U.S., C-RAC focuses on three primary goals, policy advocacy, leadership development, and community mobilization. Sea Rock has been in existence for 47 years. It was founded in 1979 as the Indochina Refugee Action Center in response to the humanitarian crisis and mass resettlement of refugees following the wars in Southeast Asia. Over the decades, it has evolved from a resettlement-focused organization into a leading national advocacy for Southeast Asian American civil rights. This is an organization, and I have followed them for a number of years, that the work has also been very focused on the anti-deportation work.

1:36 And this has been... something that has been happening for such a long period of time, well before the Trump 2.0 administration has been accelerating its harm to the community. And before I begin, right now, the recording of this episode is 9.05 a.m. Central Time on Thursday, February 5th. And also, content warning... thattherewillbediscussionsregardingtheICEraidviolencethathasbeen happening in the community. So I do hope that you navigate this episode with care and tenderness.

2:17 And Quinn, first of all, welcome to the show. And I know you've been a longtime executive director with C-RAC. Sohowhaveyoubeendoingandhowhavethestaffbeendoinginthewakeofthis ongoing escalation of the federal government's raid on our communities? Randy, thank you so much for having me. It's an honor to be on Banh Mi Chronicles. You know, it's been heartbreaking. It's been horrific to see our own family members be impacted by what's happening across the country with Just the terror of not being able to live your life, not being able to go to work, not being able to drive your car, to go get groceries, to leave your home, to go pick up your kids.

3:10 And today is February 5th, and every day I pray for November 2028. when this will finally, when the presidential transition will finally happen and these terrors can finally go away. And that is not a prayer that I've ever had in my entire life, nor has it ever been this violent across my 14 years of being at SEARAC. And I think for our SEARAC team, We hold team care and hope and joy with great sincerity and love.

3:53 What we can control is making sure that we hold on to our hope, that our advocacy voice, that our muscles still matter, and that it brings us optimism and hope when community also recognize their voice and power in this moment and as we come together to really try to protect belonging for Southeast Asian American communities nationwide. Thankyousomuchforsharingjustlikethesnapshotofwhatyouandyourstaff have been observing and witnessing in real time. And I wonder, like for nonprofit organizations such as SEARAC, how does one try to not always be in rapid response mode, but how do we or how do nonprofits position themselves to be more prepared and more equippedto be in a place of taking action rather than playing defense?

4:59 That's a great question. It's a hard question. I think... Now more than ever, there is so much being asked of our communities. The attacks are everywhere, from elders not getting their SSI benefits, to folks not knowing if they're going to have food on the table, to these violent attacks of civil liberties happening. across the country beyond just immigration, that there's more that's being asked of nonprofits than ever before.

5:39 And I think what And being a leader right now is incredibly challenging because you're constantly needing to navigate what are the right decisions for my organization to stay true to our mission while still meeting the needs of this moment and feeling like we have an opportunity to test and experiment. And I think for SEARAC, what we look at when we take a step back is And what we also encourage other organizations to do is to think about what are your core strengths that the community has always relied on you for, to lean into those core strengths and to really build from there rather than invent something new.

6:28 And I think also to be reminded of our work as future ancestors, knowing that the work of policy change takes decades. Andthatthisisamomentintimethatwewilldoeverythingwecaninallthe small steps that we can that will hopefully add up to a larger movement and larger change. And that those small changes, those small actions, even if small, add up when everyone else is also trying their best and doing their best. And so I think at the end of the day, we're really encouraging folks to Remembertheirpowerandhavethatpowerandthatwisdomguidetheminmaking really hard decisions on what to do and what not to do.

7:20 As someone who's been doing nonprofit for a number of years, specifically in development, so this is kind of where my nonprofit nerd head comes on. I wonder about... this onslaught of different work that is being thrown at nonprofits, and especially in regards to immigration. And how do you try to navigate this new reality, knowing that, you know, fundings has been cut for nonprofits, specifically in the federal end, but also foundations have been also getting leery about what they're funding because, you know, they're also getting targeted by the Trump administration and also with the economy being, you know, free-for-off, I have to be very nice about it, and how it affects individual donors.

8:14 I'm curious about how do you try to you know, pivot and navigate with these barriers that are now hitting a lot of the nonprofits and even grassroots. Oh, Randy, it's so hard. I mean, we'veseenorganizationshavetodomassivelayoffsasoflastyearwiththe diminishment of federal resources and investment in our communities. And we've seen organizations try to stay afloat for one year. Andmanywithinournetworkhaveaonetotwoyearhorizoncomparedtoafiveor seven or even 10 year horizon that used to exist for some of us. It's, I think, more than anything, our organizations are also looking at where the community needs us most.

9:04 And what we hear over and over again is that in this moment, mutual aid, investing in local organizations, like it just matters so much. And that helps us to guide our fundraising strategy is to really understand what the needs of the community are and to see where we can be leveraged to meet those needs rather than reinvent ourselves into something that we're not. So I think at the end of the day, fundraisingandallnonprofitworkisreallyabout understanding and honoring the will of our people and really seeing our organizations as just vehicles. And in this moment, we are all looking to survive another year or two.

9:49 AndinhopesthattherewillbeshiftsinphilanthropyafterthesecondTrump administration where philanthropy can feel less threatened and be brave and courageous and really investing in the long-term work that all ofour communities have needed for decades. And so for the Southeast Asian community, like what we are seeing with the ice rates now, especially what we've seen in Minneapolis. Now, for those who aren't aware, this has not been... a new development that has happened to the communities.

10:33 The Vietnamese, Cambodian, Lao, Hmong communities have been targeted for deportations for a number of years. And I wonder about the context, because we always hear about undocumented individuals from other parts of Asiaand in Mexico, Central and South America. But I'm curious about why this community in particular seems to be the target for ICE? Yeah, great question. For folks who don't know, there are over 15,000 individuals from Cambodia, Laos, and Vietnam who have deportation orders to Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos, primarily for crimes of poverty and youth served decades ago.

11:24 And what we see when we work with families is that these are individuals who were borninrefugeecampsorcamehereasveryyoungpeoplewhowereleftbehindat school and didn't have the support that they needed at home or within the community and unfortunately made mistakes and joined gangs. And from those mistakes, they transformed their lives. And today, our spouses of US citizen partners, they have US children, some even have grandchildren. And the reason for this is because the majority of our community members came hereasrefugees Or at this point, we're about 1.5 generation, folks who came here as young people, but really not knowing Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos as their homes.

12:20 And for many years, actually, they've been living with this deportation order, living in limbo, not knowing if Vietnam, Cambodia, or Laos will ever accept them. But what we've seen and to take a step back, one of the root causes is actually our 1996 immigration policies, which expanded the grounds of deportation, expanded the definition of aggravated felony. So even minor crimes like possession of drugs would be deemed deportable. It took away due process like judicial discretion. So before 1996, if you arrived here as a refugee, for example, committed a crime, transformed from it, you have a family, you'd be able to plead your case to an immigration judge.

13:08 And that immigration judge would be able to see whether or not you actually are a threat or... being torn apart from your family is what would create more harm. And you'd actually be able to stay with your families. All of that was eliminated. All of those due process provisions were eliminated with our 1996 immigration policies. And that's the reason why we see this alarming number of individuals from Southeast Asian American communities with deportation orders. And as you noted at the beginning of the podcast, the numbers have grown exponentially.

13:50 So between 1998 and about 2024, on average, across all presidential administrations, even Trump version one, you saw about 90 folks being deported to Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos. Last year, between January and October alone, there have been nearly 900 individuals deported to Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos. That is a tenfold increase. And not only that, but the tactics that ICE is using has changed tremendously. Previously, if you went into your, you folks went into their annual ICE check-ins and were released, ortheywouldknowthatthisiswhentheywouldbedetainedandtheywoulddo preparation with their family in the case that their separation happened.

14:41 Now ICE is picking folks up while you're driving to go get groceries, while you're picking your kids up. As you see in Minnesota, everyone is being impacted, including ICE just charging into your home. And the case of Chong Li Tao in Minnesota has been spotlighted in media and national media. And it's It's horrific that folks in Minnesota right now are sharing that they're sheltering in place the way that they did during COVID. But it's worse than COVID because you have five ICE officers with their guns outin front of your home.

15:27 And that has never been the reality for our communities to live in this violence, regardless of whether or not you are a US citizen, whether or not you're a refugee, just trying to live your life. Andsowhatisjustsoviolentandsohorrifictoseeisthatit'snotjustour Southeast Asian American communities who are being impacted, it's everyone who's being impacted. What have you learned about the Southeast Asian community organizations andgroups that are in Minnesota right now? AndwhatsupporthaveSEARACandotherpartnersprovidedtothesecommunity organizations and their communities?

16:12 That's a great question. Ithinkoneofthewaysthatwe'vecontinuedtosupportisbyamplifyingthe stories of impact that's happening to Hmong folks, Vietnamese, Khmer folks, AAPI folks in Minnesota, to our federal legislators, for them to recognize that all AAPI communities are being impacted and that even beyond Hmong communities, even beyond Chong Li's case, thatourcommunitiesarebeingimpactedinmassandthatwereallyneedtheir support to call for decreased and elimination of funding to DHS and ICE.

16:53 And to really make sure that the stories of our community members are also being part of the fight to fight back against this huge escalation of violence in our communities. We've also been trying to uplift ways that folks can donate two organizations in Minnesota. One of the efforts right now is called AAPIs United, which allows folks to see and have access to all the mutual aid efforts that are happening across Minnesota. We're also been working in community to build coalition with organizations in Minnesota and others across the country for us to be able to share resources to strategize and to really also understand what's happening internationally.

17:41 So organizations like Collective Freedom, like Malo, whoaresupportingfolksonthegroundwho'veactuallybeenrepatriatedare incredibly important right now as well because that international infrastructure just does not exist. And finally, uplifting the narratives and stories that folks are sharing on social media as well. Now more than ever, journalists are finding out about our community through social media. There is more access to our communities than ever before. So we're really leveraging that as an opportunity to uplift our communities. I really appreciate the scope because I do think what's very important for CRXRO and also for other organizations is to really amplify the stories that legacy traditional media have not been covering.

18:32 I mean, as someone who lives near Chicago, when the ice rates were happening back in fall, youwouldnothearapeepaboutitfromthemediabecauseIwouldaskpeople or share stories about what's happening in Chicago to friends and other folks, and they weren't even aware of what was going on, despite the fact that there were tear gases thrown at local supermarkets, and Black children were getting arrested in the middle of the night in their own homesandsoiseethevalueofwhatsocialmediacanbringdespiteyouknowthe constant surveillance and what ice has been weaponizing as of late um but thereis powertoyouknowbringingthesestoriesaliveandithinkthatwealldohavea responsibility to uh to name that, but also to intercept the harmful narratives that have been created by the Trump administration.

19:35 And with that said, what do you know about the whereabouts of other Southeast Asian immigrants and citizens being detained by ICE so far? It's a good question. Books are being sent to detention centers across the country, everywhere, from Florida to New Orleans. And I need to get back to you on the actual locations that have the highest concentrations. Mm-hmm. But the information, folks are also being sent to different detention facilities really quickly.

20:18 And so it's really hard for family members to be able to track them down and try to get the medication, try to get them their reading glasses. And what we know is that folks who have shared that detention is described as hell. And for individuals who have even been previously incarcerated, that it's worse than prison. We know that a recent data about deaths in ICE custody show that there were at least 30 people who died last year, including Vietnamese individuals and including Parady, as you shared earlier in 2026.

21:04 These are the highest numbers that we've seen in two decades. The conditions are inhumane. They're deplorable. I know what happened with Party Law. I think a lot of folks, you know, in the midst of what we've seen with Renee Good, Alex Pretti, Keith Porter, IfeelthatthestoryofParadyLareallyneedstobenamedbecauseheisoneof several Southeast Asian folks. He's specifically a Khmer man who was murdered or died under ICE custody. as we should be very clear about.

21:45 What have you learned about what was shared about his death and what his familyand community members have noticed during this period of time when he was detainedand what they've learned after? Yeah, it's a good question. We are probably not the right people. I'd probably refer you to our Philadelphia partners to share a little bit more. But from what we understand, Parady's family is mourning his loss. They are aghast at how this could have happened, that he was crying for water and help. How does this happen in America?

22:26 They're looking for answers, not excuses. And... There's no transparency around how these deaths have happened and families are needing to go through additional legal recourses to get answers so that there's justice and accountability to the deaths of their loved ones. So I think the fight for information and really being able to raise up the horrific andtragicdeathsthatwouldhaveneverhappenedhadthesepeoplenotbeen detained.

23:10 It is impossible to believe that this could happen. AndIthinkthattheirfamiliesarestillholdingontohopethatthey'llget answers and that at least by sharing their stories, thattherewillbejusticetothefactthattheirdeathswillnotbeinvainand that their deaths reveal how horrific conditions really are and how change hasto happen now. andithinkthishasalsobeensomethingthathasbeenkeepingalotofusupat night is what have you learned about the deportations of southeast southeastasian detainees and what has happened since because there have been reports that there were allowed detainees that were getting deported to places like in africa places that are not anywhere remotely close to the the family homeland.

24:06 So I wonder if you were able to shed some light about, you know, what you've learned about what has happened to folks that have been deported since. Yeah, good question. If the legal advocates who have been leading the the cases and trying to support the families for third country removals have seen folks removed to Eswatani, to Libya, to South Sudan, that these are individuals who have not been able or were really struggling tobe able to even see their attorney. And be deported to countries that they've literally never known. We have not seen the use of third country removals to this extent used by any other administration.

24:53 And for folks who have been returned to Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, the infrastructure there, it just does not exist. And in cases for folks being deported to Laos, for example, where the country is still trying to figure out their system, we're learning that folks are continuing to be detained even when they get to Laos, because there's a process that the Lao government wants them to go through to get family sponsorship the way that are a sponsorship. sponsoring an individual or family from Laos for them to actually be removed from that detention center. And at the end of the day, these are individuals who look and talk and walk like Americans.

25:37 And even when our family members have been detained, a lot of what we heard from other individuals who were detained is, why are these Americans being detained? We don't understand. They look like American kids. And what we're seeing is that these are older adults now being sent to countries they fled as refugees, and many have never known these countries. And even though it is not Eswatani or South Sudan or Libya, it might as well be a foreign country for folks to have to now navigate a completelynewworldwithoutspeakingthelanguageorfamilyorfriendsora network there to protect them.

26:18 When you were talking about them being detained in that homeland, how long have they been detained and what happens afterwards? What does the transition look like for folks who are literally going into a family homeland that really was not a homeland for them? Yeah, it's from what we've heard, we're actually still trying to learn the process because it seems like there'sa lot of variation in terms of how long folks are detained. And what we have learned is historically, because this has been happening for 20 years, is that individuals just feel ostracized in countries that they now have to rebuild their lives in.

27:10 There are individuals who have... actually had their family members go with them to Cambodia. And these are rare instances. For these families, they choose to start a new life, but that is not the reality and that's not the choice that many individuals can make or have. And one of the barriers that we've also noticed is the communication, the language barriers with the Southeast Asian communities. And there are a number of folks in our community that are very much supporting what the Trump administration is doing. Now, how do you intercept those harmful narratives, especially with the language barrier within the community regarding ICE andwhat the government has been doing to the people?

27:58 How do you... How do you intercept these harmful narratives that are being made about folksthat are being detained? That's a really good question. And it's a hard question. I think the way that, and I'll speak from my personal experience here, isthat With Trump, under the first Trump administration, there was an increase in media. There was an increase in reporting about Southeast Asian deportation for thefirst time, including in language media.

28:40 So I was interviewed, for example, in Al Jazeera, and that piece got out on YouTube. And one of my family members called my dad and said, hey, I saw Gwen on TV. And you were talking about deportation. And I was like, uh... Was I? Because we actually had not had a conversation about deportation. So I shared with my dad, I asked my dad, he said, tell me more about it. I said, well, what we're seeing are cases like My cousin, our cousin, your nephew, who came to the U.S. as a young person and made mistakes, but now they have families and they've transformed their lives and they're being sent back to Vietnam forcibly.

29:30 sharing how our own family is being impacted. And what my dad told me was, this is so painful. Try your best, try your best to change this. He passed away about four years ago. And when I think about deportation and when I think about what's happening in our communities, I hold hope that these stories that we're working on to elevate our fathers, our uncles, our mothers, that they will soften the hearts and allow our families to really see how we're being impacted.

30:16 And through those stories, understand the injustice and our power to actually call for change. And on the hardest of days, I think about my dad saying, and continue to uplift these stories, however small or however big, hoping that it's by seeing our humanity that is really what shifts power. And it's by sharing our stories at the end of the day, like May Chronicles and what you're doing right now. It all matters. These conversations all matter. Yeah, Ireallyappreciatehowyouwereabletojustshareeventhepersonalstories becauseithasbeenasourceofmyowntensionabouthowIseetheVietnamese community, being both Vietnamese and Khmer, like to see this vitriolic backlash in some ways from some of our community members and howdo wetrytoworkwithlocalmediathatlikehowdoweworkwithlikedifferent avenues where these stories can reach them because they're not I think for a lot of us, language barrier in my Vietnamese is not very good at all.

31:30 And so it's hard for a lot of folks to have very nuanced conversations. AndIfeellikethesearelostopportunitiestogetabetterscopeofwhatis really happening to them. But also, I think it's a struggle to... howdowebestprotectthemtoobecauseitalsofeelslikeafailureonourendi mean that's why i feel like i take it personally too because it's like i feel like likegoshiwishwewereabletofindabetterwaytogetthelanguageoutthere beforeit'stoolateandi'mgladthatnowwearestartingtoyouknowmakeita priorityanduhwhatincursionshaveyouseensofarfromthecommunitiesand and that you have connected with in terms of the mutual aid, the communication, the protection of residents?

32:29 I think what brings me most hope is seeing these new formations that have never existed to support our family members abroad, like Collective Freedom or like Malo Project. Because at the end of the day, we are a family and we are here to support each other. That as one of our long-term advocates shared with us that I am not my crime and that... They're not. They are loved.

33:09 And I think what has also been really remarkable is that this next week, we're actually going to be looking at a piece of legislation that is called the Southeast Asian Deportation Relief Act. It's going to be reintroduced next week on Thursday, February 12th. This is legislation that was written by the directly impacted family members to call for our rights as Southeast Asians, and a call to a right to family, a right to peace, right to work, and a right to come home.

33:49 And that seeing this piece of legislation be supported by members of Congressgives hope to our communities that advocacy still matters, that we are able to collectively call for our rights, and that in the long term, it is these policy changes that we will band around, unite around, build power around so that these conditions and these systemic root problemscan finally be addressed. What actionable steps are you also looking to do in the next several months? And what should Southeast Asian community members prepare for in the meantime? Yeah, great question. I think in...

34:33 In being able to get CEDRA reintroduced, wearecallingonourcommunitymemberstocallandtoemailtheirmembersof Congress to also support the legislation to stand up for our communities. And it matters. It matters to impacted family members that their members of Congress believein them and believe that our systems have failed us and that we have power to call for change. We are hoping to also increase information about how folks can donate to their local communities, whether it's APIs United in Minnesota or trying to find a way to crowdsource all the information of the different GoFundMe efforts that are happening.

35:18 And I think finally continue to push out Know Your Rights materials that are also being produced in language by a lot of our partners like MNA or like Southeast Asian Freedom Network so that our communities and our families can continue to be informed and prepared and know what their rights are when it just feels like there's nothing that we can do and to remind ourselves that we do still have power. And I think finally is just making sure that folks know that being informed is a huge way to continue following our work and other organizations as a way to join us and to fight back and to join a big movement calling for change.

36:05 And I know you mentioned AAP United. What other organizations and groups should people follow? And also, how can people follow the work of CROC? Good question. You can follow us online at SEARAC dot org. I'll also share our Instagram and Blue Sky and Facebook. We You can find out about other organizations that we're also working with from our website, including folks like Asian Prisoner Support Committee in California, Khmer Girls in Action, folks working with young people, folks working with elders like BPSOS Houston.

36:47 Across the country, we're working with about 70 organizations who are Southeast Asian-led or serving. And Everyone, everyone needs all the support that they can get. I want to say thank you so much for being on my show. Ever since I came back to the podcast back in last fall, I didn't realize that I would end up doing so many emergency episodes on ICE, but also because... our communities are being very much affected and I feel that it is a moral duty for all of us to keep people informed but also how do we protect one another and also likeoneofthethingsIalwaystrytostressisthatIdon'twantustobeso focused on what of what we can't do, but what we can still do.

37:45 What are the hopes, what are people doing to fight back? And what CIRAC has been doing over the years has really been elevating the voices ofSoutheastAsianAmericanswhodidn'thaveavoicewhentheyweregetting detained and getting deported. AndIthinkthatitshowsthestrengthofhowbeingthesevoicesorhelpingto amplify their voices changes the narrative of all of our communities and how we view um the administration and how we become more informed about how we can better protect folks you know from danger not just in the southeast asian communities but for everyone that has been impacted so i really really appreciate your work and i know it'sbeenaveryverytoughtimeforyouandthestaffandihopethatthestaff and yourself take better care along with your partners because it is a very rough fight.

38:42 And I hope that at the end of the day, you'll be in a place of abundance, you know, rather than being in a place of deficit, which is hard to do, but I do hope that that's where we'll get. Amazing. Thank you so much, Randy. And I think something we've been trying to exercise at CREC is also celebrating Southeast Asian joy, that joy itself is part of liberation, that coming together, breaking bread. Communing with our families, with our faith communities, all of that matters now more than ever. And so I really appreciate your call for abundance in this moment where it just seems like there is so much darkness, but that our light still prevails and that that is also a source of protection, that we protect our souls in this moment to continue holding hope, to continue having optimism and continuing to hold on with each other.

39:41 And thank you so much, Quyen, for your time. And also, I hope that people get to follow SEARAC and follow the updates that are going onin social media. I would absolutely share that and tag SEARAC because it is very important to know what's going on in our communities and to make sure that these stories are being represented and being made accessible to all of our communities. Thank you so much, Randy. It's been an honor.