#47 Wisdom of The Kings -- Rarely Addressed Aspects of Being a Man, with Ryan King

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We've got to all participate in this movement to help men rise to be the very best version of themselves as husbands and fathers, fathers and businessmen and leaders in men today, my guest is Ryan, King and online.

He's a rights at the wisdom of Kings, which is motivational nuanced content on wisdom, manhood relationships, and Leadership, and he's a husband and father to two young men and Difference Maker, right?

And he's that, he's the CEO of Guardian payments.

We dive into how he built.

That was really one transaction at a time, which is pretty awesome story.

He just kept plugging away.

I got it done but also dies in and connects to lessons.

He learned as a baseball, pitcher in college and how you just throw the next pitch, and how you build one thing at a time, really leaning in, to whatever, whatever it is, that needs to be improved for any tells his awesome story, got married 24.

And, and while I was pregnant, he's like, look, I had to become a man fast and figure things out and Learn by trial and error.

And then now he's sharing a lot of the things that same thing I am on the same Journey, we're sharing.

The lessons we learned along the way, the kind of the hard slow.

Trial-and-error way hoping to shed some light and inspiration and insights and wisdom, so that others don't have to make the same mistakes.

We can literally collapse Time by learning what took us months to learn.

We can share in moments and we can learn that from others and then we can turn around Sheridan, even talks about that the three, the three men that everyone Every man needs, right?

And I'm not going to spoil that you get into that, but there's some great stuff here.

Really awesome strategies for business and life.

So let's dive in.

Enjoy Brian man, we are super excited to have you on the show brother and appreciate it with you, share some incredible content that I want to talk about.

And you've done some really cool things with with family and business and fitness.

I want to, I want to hit it all but give us a little bit of background how how to start and add to get where you are and give us a little bit of your story.

Oh man.

Well, for me, it's getting exposed to a lot of this stuff on Instagram has been kind of eye-opening because, you know, when I got started, when I got married at 24 and My wife, I was actually pregnant at the time with my first son, and it was kind of a you guys, you guys started right away.

You go from 0 to 6.

I had to turn into a man, real quick.

Yes, you did that.

But I didn't I didn't actually turn into trying to urgently and so, yeah, for me, you know, so much of the stuff that I read about now, you know, back at the time.

And in 2007, um you know podcasts are mainly Sports, you know, like there wasn't a whole lot of self-improvement podcast, masculine podcast, you know, YouTube was, you know, instructional videos and cat videos and Instagram with people taking pictures of their food and, you know, so I Man I just said trial and error you know just as I encountered something whether it was business or marriage or being a dad or whatever it was just like and I don't really have outside sources that I know of that I can say hey what do I do about this?

What do I do about that?

So I just had to Be real, be real reflective and analytical and try things.

And see what worked.

And and so, yeah, I'm just the product of a, whole lot of experimentation.

And yeah, man.

And I may, I can relate to that.

You're right.

As you start thinking, kind of pre what the internet is.

Now, when you get before that, it's like now, where where do you find access to truth to like principles and practices to have its instruction?

I mean, I can see you've got your huge Library.

I've got my library like I turned to books because that's where I like I could find things there, but it was interesting how much of a dearth of just an absence of rock-solid men and mentors that I had growing up and I'm with you man.

I'm like, and I remember the frustration, you probably did too of like months or years of like come on.

Like how do we figure this out?

Hey, let's go.

And then finally experimentation or trial and error or reading.

You're finally you meet somebody like there it is.

That's it and it's a game changer.

Oh, absolutely.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

I mean, yeah, we did have books, you know, they're absolutely books but, you know, there wasn't really like a rating system on it.

So you just went to the bookstore and you really didn't know the pope is any good or not.

So you said to read it And you know, maybe two chapters are actually applicable.

You know, the rest of it was just like that was a waste of time, you know, there was a feel like what the resources that you know, men have available now and the resources that men like you.

And I are creating it really helps filter through a lot of this stuff that doesn't work and help and helps speed that process up that, you know, men like you.

And I had had to learn the hard way, you know, over the course of You know, years, you know, we can, you know, if a younger dude is actually wise enough to, you know, humble enough to be like, you know what, I'm going to listen to these guys that have been there.

Yeah, we can, we can really help help you skip over a lot of the stages that cause a lot of pain and a lot of frustration, but you have to be willing to be humble and be like, you know what, even if it doesn't make sense to me, I'm going to trust these guys have been there, right?

Because they're saying something that sounds important even though if I haven't experienced that yet, man, this stuff matters.

You're saying right there so important because that's how we can collapse time.

So to speak.

We can take decades and quite literally turn them into days.

Yeah, yeah.

Go things you and I've learned over decades, hey look, fellas, pay attention to this.

It matters so much and and you collapse time and that's, that's what dads are supposed to be doing.

Anyway.

Yes.

A lot of dads weren't taught it, so they don't have it to teach, or they aren't there at all of their passive or they're tired, because they're working.

A lot of whatever moves a lot of reasons why that's didn't pass that stuff on.

But a lot of dads, I mean, think about it, talk about how bad we had it think about how bad our debts had talked about not having access to anything different.

Like all you all those dad's had to go off of his have their dads and uncles acted they had nothing.

Yeah, very very local community with very limited.

Even any any kind of media that was coming in through radio or TV was was really entertainment-based.

So, you're wrong.

We had like mail ordered audio tapes.

Yeah, so it's easy to point the finger at our dads and be like, oh, they didn't teach us the stuff.

All that mean, they can't teach the stuff.

They didn't know.

And they usually only had access to three or four human beings.

It happened to be in small town, they lived in, you know.

So, yeah.

So that's a huge huge reminder for you and me still with with them, massive amounts of information and stuff is available and all the massive amount of entertainment that's available.

I want to just kind of dial in what you said there.

You can't.

Teach what you don't know.

Yeah, and so, one of the, I think of our responsibilities, our moral obligations is men is to acquire knowledge and and know it like deeply for ourselves so that we have something to offer.

So especially for our kids, we can answer questions.

Yeah.

Well, I think one of the things in this is probably going to be the topic of my next post is.

You know, one thing I've noticed is that there's an abundance of young men seeking mentors.

I think all young ambitious men are looking for mentors to help invest forward, right?

But one of the things that has men were not doing a very good job of is once we've made it, we're not becoming mentors to others, you know, we want mentors to help us.

We want to take Because, but once it wants our lives, get to where they need to be, we don't we don't see the duty that we have to pass along that knowledge to more than just our sons are so many men out there that didn't have father figures is still don't have father figures him and so yeah.

Yeah, it's great.

I think young men need to have the humility to seek out mentors, you know?

But I think a lot of men are doing a really bad job of like oh I've made it.

So I'm going to sit back and enjoy.

You know the life that I've been life that I've built instead of taking that and being like you know what?

Now it's my turn.

To find people.

I can mentor and pass on the knowledge that I've learned.

And you know there's a there's an abundance of young men seeking mentors.

There is not an abundance of older experienced men saying here I am.

I'll Mentor you.

Yeah, you know, they'd rather sit and just sit back and enjoy The Spoils of so they can take for mentors, which as somebody who's, you know, I guess viewed as a mentor, you take and take.

Intake from mentors and that's fine, I'm perfectly happy to give, but when I would, I expect in return, is that when I die, when I'm older, you're passing on what I've taught you to somebody else.

What's all this knowledge that I've acquired in order to help myself and to help you is going to die with you?

Yeah.

And so you have a responsibility to take.

I don't mind if you take for me, that's what I want.

But I expect you.

To give that to somebody else to.

Yes.

Not just use it for your own personal life.

I want you to have a great life pursuing but it doesn't end there, you've got to give and it begs the question in our we are, we as anxious or desirous to turn around and help and lead and teach and Mentor as we are to seek help and succeed.

I don't think because it's easy to want help and succeed because that's because you're driven like it.

There's benefits there man.

Well, but a lot.

So many men.

It's a really, it really irks me is when I see those men that have made it talking down to these young guys that haven't made with all your soft or whatever.

It's like, then help them be not soft, man.

They probably don't want to be soft.

It is to haven't been taught how, right?

Exactly.

You don't know and it's easy.

It's easy.

You'll probably relate to this too.

Is once you, once you get to a certain level, sometimes it can actually be hard to, really remember what it was like?

Yes.

In your previous self.

With my wife and I'll be rolling along.

We're like, and we'll have to stop something like, oh, yeah.

Like we used to have totally fixed mindsets.

Like no, we can't do this.

That's just the way we are.

We still live in that world and now we're like nah, we figure out anything, right?

We have to remember, we used to be really good and funny as you know, for me, I've only been in this in any kind of public space and that six months ago, I've never been in a podcast until six months ago, I started my Instagram page in January, so this is all very new for me, but one of the things that I'm really shocked by is just how many people there are.

That just really basic stuff is like mind blowing for him.

So have we don't have to have it all figured out to be really helpful for people.

Yeah, you know I forget that to all the time I get into the complexity of it all and and I again I'm you kind of like oh yeah Basics like let's hit some next-level stuff and and I forget Get like know the basics.

It common, you know, Common Sense isn't common practice or common knowledge and like we got to share the funnels.

This still make a huge difference as much as I.

What's really what's really funny and rewarding and bow and has given me a lot of value for myself is just how much better a man I've become since I started talking about this.

Yeah, you know, like it's forced me to take things that I did kind of accidentally Usually and the process of thinking through it and teaching it to somebody else's, maybe, you know, conceptualize it in a way they're not going to fly on my own.

I'm actually a better men now for having mentor to other people.

Exactly.

You know, my wife will tell you, like, my whole Persona, is not my whole persona, but like the consistency of the kind of persona that I'm wanting ask consistency, is, is, is far more reliable.

I'm not just accidentally being the right.

My husband the right kind of death every once in a while, you know, I've identified traits that I used to just kind of be aware of, but it wasn't really drilled down to its Essence in a way that I could have, but I even could apply universally right into.

There's a lot of value I think for men and becoming mentors because teaching is to other people, you learn when you teach.

Yeah, I have that experience so many times where I'm like, while I'm teaching Teaching something.

I'm learning so much because you're trying to conceptualize you're like, how can I, how can I give this a metaphor, a comparison or how can I give this framework, you know like oh there it is?

Yeah, it makes you sharper because of it.

Yeah.

So I think of, you know, I think if we could just snap our fingers and create an ideal scenario, I think every man needs three roles in his life.

You know.

He needs a mentor.

No matter where you're at in life.

You still need a mentor.

Yep.

Need somebody.

You're accountable to besides just yourself him.

You need brothers who are the same thing as a life that you're in.

That are dealing with the same struggles and you guys can help link arms and hold each other up.

And then you and then you need people below you that you're mentoring, you know, and I kind of view it as like this escalator were eventually.

At some point you don't have a mentor because everybody's everybody that older than me is dead, right?

And then you're officially the patriarchy.

You know, I know that words not sexy anymore but and then that person falls Of the end of the escalator and we always need somebody ahead of you.

Somebody on the stipulation, somebody behind you, as you, yes, celebrate in life.

And if we had, if we had that in some sense, some sort of systematize way of society as men man, that'd be powerful.

Huge, that's massive and Anna.

So cool, it's around around those exact same things.

Well, I created, I created What's called the master.

I'd be the man master class in tribe, right?

It's it was, it was driven by those exact same things.

You talked about that, we need Billy mentors and coaches.

We need a community, a Brotherhood of Band of Brothers to be together and we need people, we can help and lead and and teach and share things with and learn from.

Yeah.

So it's that same model your spot on brother.

So what's driving you man?

What's driving you to kind of take what you've been learning over all these years and just start sharing it.

Um, man, I just I think anybody that's been sitting sitting back and observing Society and just across the board, we could get into all kinds of leads about that but anybody that's just been sitting back and observing Society for the last not just the last two years it's gotten really bad last two years but over the course of the last five years.

You know, I found myself thinking like Is nobody going to step up and lie and talk to since, you know, and I kept waiting for somebody to do it.

Finally, just was like, well I don't really feel qualified, but if nobody else is going to do it, I'll try, you know, and awesome.

I didn't know what to expect.

I mean, I really figured, you know, nobody really care about anything.

I had to say, you know, I'm not a famous rock star or anything, you know?

Like so the Has been shocking.

You know that my page is grown the way that it has, you know, I've been really fortunate and humbled to get invited under podcasts like this and all that, you know?

Because for me I think that's what holds a lot of men back from doing their inventory is, you know, any man that has the leadership qualities is, you know, humble enough to be aware of his own faults.

You know, you kind of feel this.

It's weird to step up and say, hey, follow.

I know what I'm talking about, you know, because it's like and there's a lot of stuff that I I'm still figuring out, you know.

And that's a weird place to be in, you know, because I'm all too aware of my myself in my failures and the things that I've screwed screwed up.

So it's kind of strange to step up and say, hey, y'all should listen to me.

You know, it's feels very weird, but what I've learned is that, you know, you don't have to know everything.

I just have to know enough to help the people that don't know what, I know, I'm right.

The stuff that I don't know, I need to find somebody to teach me that, you know, completely really helpful for a long time and to just be like, you know, to hear that like, man, it's okay.

If you don't know everything.

You know and what you do know will be really helpful for a lot of people great.

And that's like it's so cool to you the way you articulate that and I remember feeling that so I ended up out of my own at 16 just like desperate to find it I am I come on.

Me something.

And I would, I would have an experience or come across the book or a principal in a book and I was like, man.

Okay, that's it.

First, it was just interesting to me.

I'm like that's interesting, that's something I haven't thought about before and so I would try it and as soon as it worked I literally felt like running down the street telling people like you guys.

I just tried this.

It totally worked, it was amazing and especially where you know I was I was in really poor neighborhoods and tough circumstances back then and I would meet people and we hear him you interact and see their conversation especially where you'd see people suffering and struggling.

And I'd be like, look man, I just read this thing and I tried it.

This principle is habit, this mindset.

It just works and and that's really where it started.

For me.

I was I was 18 19 already like just longing to share the few things that I found that we're working, right?

Even though I was like, man, I'm still working on all this.

Like this is working for me here and I started sharing that with that.

It's along that same line of like, like I don't have it all figured out but this is working for me and and you maybe you want to try it.

Well, I think what's really interesting and hear you say that, you know, this there's some characteristics there at the root of that, that aren't the nobody talks about in terms of what being a man, but they're really important, you know?

Like so for me, what jumps out to me is that you're curious and curiosity, like, what are other people doing this work?

And better, you know, and and Imagination, having that imagination to picture.

What your life could be.

Like, yes, trying to figure out how to get to that, you know, those are things.

When you say the words, curiosity and Imagination, you think of like a five-year-old, right?

Like that's not something that grown man or like, you know, what, helped me be successful as curiosity, but at the root of what you're talking about, is a very masculine expression.

They're very mature grown-up expression of A childlike quality exert, a city and Imagination.

You know, and I think a lot of men would benefit greatly from realizing how that those things can be childish but they're also very very masculine grounded expression of those characteristics that would really benefit a lot of men if they cultivated some curiosity and Imagination.

Oh true.

Both of those characteristics can be a very manly, absolute power.

Powerful like you're supposed to you know, men create things, are you supposed to be if you don't you can't imagine them first.

Yes.

If you can't what, one of the things I teach is like like so many men as far out as they can see is this weekend like how do I get through the week?

They can do you know the extent of their vision is?

Okay Friday.

Gosh, I'm done with the work week.

I just entertain myself to death all weekend and I don't want to think about Monday.

So that's about the extent of the vision or imagination and your On there with was like because we have to see again but like it was Zig Ziglar I think he said you know you can't you can't hit a Target you don't have or you can't hit a Target.

You can't see.

Right?

And if we don't have the target we don't have the imagination.

If we can't at least a try to see what it could be.

Like like you're just shooting blind.

You're throwing darts in the dark and you're hoping right and hope is never a strategy just doesn't work.

You gotta like something start building.

I think it's important to try to get to the Root of it and explain it in a different way because what we cut we call that as men and you know, his vision, I have Vision you know, but for a 19 year old kid.

It's like was that was that mean?

It's like okay, here's how to have Vision manly, you're like a zoo animal.

That's forgotten how to hunt and Italy, remember being five years old and you just imagine stuff and you're like, man, I can't wait to be an adult.

I'm going to do all these things.

I imagine when you get life beat you down, you get to this point.

We are just surviving for the weekend.

So how do How do you teach a man to have Vision?

Will go back to Childhood?

And you at one point you had an imagination and cultivate that until it becomes something that's a vision.

Yeah that's really.

What vision is, is a very masculine.

I'm ambitious word for a childlike imagination.

It's just a mitch its imagination.

That's mature.

Yeah.

What was interesting for me as we're talking through this and and the way you're articulating Nah, so well.

I think it was the desperation of my circumstance that it almost forced me.

To to imagine something better like now, I teach it like where there's pain.

There's power.

And it's in that pain.

You're like this sucks so bad.

Yeah, you have to imagine something better and then then the mental process there.

The Mets was like, okay, how could this be different?

How could the marriage be different?

How Could my health be different, How Could my work situation, be different and imagine it and then, then you can just be like, wait a minute.

If that's what's possible, and this is where I am.

What are the steps to get me from where I am to where I want to be?

Yeah, these are mapping out his plan that to recreate your life.

Yeah, yeah.

And what's really interesting to me was that you say that, it was desperation but there's a lot of desperate people that don't take the steps that you're talking about, you know?

And I don't know what that answer is.

You know, what is it that distinguishes, somebody one person is desperate and they start looking for how to make it better you know like you believe that you could Could have something better whereas a lot of people don't have that hope that my end up believing their desperate but they don't think that they that is possible for them to do anything about it.

You feel, you know, disenfranchised, they feel discontent.

Like they make those good things aren't for them and that's really sad, but I haven't been at something.

I wish I knew the answer to so I could write about it, but I haven't been able to.

I haven't been able to figure out how I can put a hundred people over the desperate situation, And not all Hunters are gonna come out of it.

Yeah, I've got five of them were going to react like you.

Yep.

The other 95 or just going to think man this sucks but I don't know what separates those people on, you know, it's I knew the answers.

I think that'd be a lot of help that you have there.

It's worth pondering.

And now ones were thinking about for a lot of years.

Yeah, that one's you're right.

There's something there's something there but what's interesting, I don't I don't look at myself as like special or different or like there was something about me that I think anyone can do what I did.

Yeah but it's worth some thought there was something that switched.

You're right because some of the people I was around they stayed there and never came out man.

Well and to you it's not special to different, you know.

That's that's why it's a gift.

Yeah.

Because people there's a lot of things I think that's one of the things that I really try to do and things that are very in two sizes.

You know, we have a lot of power or words have a lot of power because There's a lot of things people have told me about myself that I've say the same thing, you know.

I didn't think I was different or special.

But what seems like, just what we take for granted about ourselves other people see using see what the value really is.

And then to a lot of times, People don't know what our gifts, our intellect, we don't.

It's hard for us to see what our gifts, our until the someone else speaks to.

It is looking over like, dude, Ryan.

This is what your superpower, bro.

I got the information.

I just I just wake up and do what makes the most sense but like, you know, and at the same time, you're seeing me in, you know, you're seeing me in my sweet spot, you're seeing me in my gift.

And so what we have a bad habit of doing is we fill in the blanks with section 2 and it's like, really like you might think that I have all this stuff figured out or whatever you're seeing areas that I'm gifted at, like, he took me to Home Depot.

You wouldn't.

You wouldn't think that about loss.

Yeah.

Like so it's easy to fill in the blanks.

Somebody that's when we see the not operating in their gift and soon that their gifts in every area of your life, right?

As opposed.

And we just, we have that tendency to fill it, right?

Oh, I see this person doing Is three things really?

Well, he must have everything figured out.

It's like no, you're seeing a very small picture of who I am.

But there's plenty of other things that you're gifted, at that, I'm clueless about, right?

And I think that's really, I think it's important to talk about those things too.

So the people don't compare themselves to something unrealistic.

Exactly.

And where we can?

We each of us operates in our strengths.

Yes, and don't compare other strengths to our weaknesses because you're right there.

In fact, I would, I would say there's there's more areas of weakness in there are strengths.

There's there's more Arenas where you and I step in and are just awkward total noobs, whether it's a dance floor, or on stage singing, or like some athletic thing, or whatever work, what you step in anywhere you like, I got nothing, you sent me some computer and asked me to program something.

I'm like, sorry, folks.

Yeah, I'm that way.

I'm that way.

Mechanically, like you put me.

If you put me inside in front of it, Engine revs me to build something.

It's like I can follow steps on a YouTube video but it makes it makes no sense to me.

Whereas I meet other people that man, they're not very good at communicating.

They say I'm really closed off or whatever.

Do they can take anything apart and just put it back together and nobody taught them.

They just get it, you know?

And you see this was like musicians man, like you hand, somebody get a guitar and they just it's like they just magically not magically they have to work but they just get it right.

Lee, no, no, no.

And that's something I don't think is talked about enough in a lot of these, a lot of these spaces where we're talking about self-improvement, or whatever, is it?

You know, everything everybody has things that just come easily.

Yeah.

And then they have things that manages.

I'm like a caveman trying to understand calculus in micro like I'm right.

I'm helpless.

When it comes to a lot of different things in my life, you know, I think same and it's interesting.

Not only like you're saying, not only, is it not Talked about enough.

It's also not valued enough where they're there are certain things that we value above other things, kind of, especially some of the obvious things that are kind of measured and out in society, like, hey, hey, this is its kind of its seen, it's real obvious.

And so people are, well, that's really value That We're Men.

None of society would work if some of the behind-the-scenes stuff wasn't happening and that's where those guys are back there there.

You know, making me.

Magic happen, obviously, they're just, they're great at it.

They're Geniuses there.

They're building incredible things that make our life so much better, but it's all behind the scenes, and so it's nothing.

I tell you this much.

I think that's something that, you know, the men that have experienced, the men that are more grounded there that are out, you know, talking about these things and trying to help men.

It's important for us to speak out against that narrative.

He's cliches of like, oh, you got to be an alpha male.

Right?

So you can be as Alpha as you want.

If you go step on the football field, with Tom Brady, the head due to the alpha and everybody on that team is an alpha.

They're all rich, they're all athletic, they're all high testosterone guys but when they when it comes to real life you're really trying to accomplish something you need role players and Tom Brady needs an offensive line and yeah he might get the glory.

But he couldn't do it without that left tackle either, you know, and as men were not doing a very good job of trying to invite men in that said, let's say, you know what, bro you don't have to be an alpha, you don't have to know how to, you know, kick box or whatever.

Like you bring your gift.

Yeah.

And your gift is valued even if it's just a pot Return Man.

Well get a Super Bowl ring, right?

Even in even in that comparison.

Like think how many off the field?

Absolutely people are required for the NFL even do exist.

Yeah.

And I think we really, I think a lot of men don't don't feel comfortable coming to the table with things like what we're doing because the their gift really is just maybe they're the trainer of the punter, you know?

And they're like oh man, all these guys are quarterbacks and I'm just not a quarterback and makes them feel like they don't belong.

I just have a problem with that like in reality it's not good to have a team of Alphas.

That's the deed a wide receiver was complaining to Tom Brady that he's not giving up catching so that doesn't help the team.

Win it helps the team win.

Is everybody being humble and everybody just playing the role that they had to play?

If that means that you're the one that has to step up and be the quarterback, then you need to have the confidence in the ability and the capability to do that.

But if somebody else is a better quarterback and you need to have the humility to say, what job can I If you could contribute to the NES and I don't think we're doing a very good job as men of letting other men, know, that might be introverted, right?

Or that might be might not have these hyper masculine traits, but they're really gifted in a lot of other ways and they have a lot of value that they can contribute suno much to offer to manhood in general, right?

Look at whether it's a group of men or a brotherhood, like what you've got or whatever.

I really think as men we We need to be more.

And I don't know, more inviting to just say, bro, you don't have to be Tom.

Brady, man, you're welcome to be here.

We're proud to call you brother.

Come as you are come as you are and be willing to learn and be happy to fill the role that needs to be filled.

And sometimes that might mean, you have to lead even if you don't feel qualified, right?

Because you might be the best qualified of the group.

You might not be the most qualified in the world, but you're the best qualified we've got So even if you don't feel up to it, do it anyway so it's both, you know, and I think we've lost a lot of that in this whole, everybody be an alpha male conversation greed.

You know, you know if you need to be Alpha than, to be able to be, but there's still a place for for men that don't have, there's a lot of men that have no desire to be in the spotlight.

They just went to show up, do their job and be part of something.

Meaningful.

Enjoy the camaraderie, enjoy the Brotherhood and To be a good Lieutenant.

I think that's most men.

Yeah.

Probably, you know, we're not, we're not telling anyone.

Hey, that's okay, dude.

Yep.

You know what, there's nothing to be ashamed of about that.

You're not wrong because you don't there's not something wrong with you because you don't want to be the quarterback.

Yeah, we want you here, you know, and we want you to be part of these conversations.

We want you to feel welcome in this Brotherhood.

And, you know, I don't see anybody promoting that there's this very Narrow restrictive, definition of being a man and say if you're not an alpha then your beta man that's such nonsense such nonsense and it's not it doesn't reflect the real world at, all right?

So what?

Okay, that's actually a good.

Well, there's a couple things I want to think kind of shift to, but if you're right, there is a misconception.

Like if I'm going to be a man, it's this and and I think from my perspective, there are some common denominators that I think all of us should I work on, but it doesn't have to be this role.

So that's a good question or like, lean in, like what is, what is real manliness?

What are, what are those elements that you and your experience?

And some of your thoughts?

Like what?

What is real manliness?

What what is this think?

It's I think I think it's virtue and I mean I really think you know Aristotle, bro?

Right there.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, I think it's things like, you know, and I just wrote a post and it's, you know, we're looking at For me, I kind of have to go back to everything that predates.

The Industrial Revolution to really find what masculine he's always been because I feel like ever since the Industrial Revolution everything's so tainted by Hollywood and radio room and I'm not just talking about like the last 15 years, you know, like in the 80s.

It was like, oh you men are like Rambo, it's like now not every dudes of Rambo.

Are you kidding me that introduced Arnold Schwarzenegger?

You know like and before that it was like oh yeah, whatever, man.

A swab, like Cary Grant and you know, it's like we've always had these things.

And so for me, if you go back, what does masculinity always been, what have, what have we always respected about men in all cultures, across all the time and there are common threads.

And so for me it's like I do.

One of the posts I just wrote is in the modern time.

We've gotten into this really bad habit of saying, you know, what is a man?

And when we say what's manly, our first instinct is to think.

Well, what's not woman?

Ali.

Hold on a second.

The opposite of being when you see a guy he must show like Yellowstone.

Right.

And you see, you know, I don't know if you've watched the Yellowstone, but one of the characters on there, as it is, you know, kind of becoming famous for being like the guy.

Every woman wants he's like you watching and you have this reaction like, oh, that's a man right there and we've all heard that like, that's a grown-ass man.

You know, when we say that phrase we are we are we thinking of a woman when you say that Or are we comparing him to other males?

So we're comparing him to other males, you know, the opposite of a man isn't a woman opposite mayor's a boy and I think we've gotten too distracted by women's place in all that instead of saying boy makes excuses, the doesn't take responsibility.

You know, a boy was kind of voids making decisions, he's indecisive because it makes anything, you know, a boy whines and complains when things are fair, you know.

And so look at Childish and expressions of things and then look at masculine Expressions.

So for me, I compare this, the guy they didn't grow up.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I compare a man to a boy, you know, if you're making excuses and blaming other people that's not manly.

What's manliest thing?

You know what?

Yeah, that stuff happens when we step up and take ownership and overcome it anyway, you know of a man whines and complains instead of doing something about it, you know?

And so yeah.

I mean it's important because yeah I I saw that was awesome list.

This is worth sharing and you're right.

The race is a great distinction.

There is like and you're comparing if there is a comparison that's helpful valuable or Healthy.

It's like yeah, what'swhat's immature.

What's the avoidance?

Where haven't you?

Grown up?

Where haven't you taken on ownership or responsibility?

Where are you, underdeveloped?

Yeah, I love this idea of like, it's not that you're broken, or that something is inherently wrong.

It says often it's like hey you're just in this aspect here, still underdeveloped, it's not very manly, it's kind of boyish.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So like this list that I made is you know, boys selfish.

Whereas a man serves the cause be bigger than himself feel like that's pretty Universal.

You know, a boy wants to fit in and be cool.

You look at teenage boys and Junior High high school.

They just want to fit in and be cool and every boy was like that for the most part in high school, right?

Like it's very natural to want to fit in and be cool when you're 15.

You know where, as a man stands up for what he, what he believes and weather is cool or not.

Yes, a boy is indecisive and unsure of himself.

Old man makes a decision and commits a boy whines.

When life isn't fair?

A man doesn't feel sorry for him.

Still a boy as a slave to his appetites.

A man has self control over his urges.

The boy is in irresponsible and untrustworthy, and a man takes responsibility for everything.

That to me is something that you don't have to be an alpha or a beta, or you have to be extroverted or introverted.

And I have to be, you know, a bodybuilder or a triathlete or whatever any any mail can make the decision to embody those things.

That's so powerful brother.

You don't have to be an alpha male or any particular kind of mail to do manly things and to have those attributes, those virtues those characteristics that make a man.

And to be honest, most of those things apply to women, to mature woman versus a mature man, right?

That to me is I think we're one of the one of the real root issues, with how we talk about these things is Virtue and I get it right.

Like, feminism has has has, has it has affected a lot and it's skewed.

A lot of the way we view things and so men are trying to carve out and remember what me being a man is and the easiest way to do that is to say oh well what's manly and what's womanly you know and so I don't I'm not looking down on people that are making that game.

I'm trying to really just go deeper than that and say you know when I really think when I hear that statement I think of a man I admire and respect its yeah that's-- man.

That's-- a Grown man with you, I'm comparing him to the way boys Bay right now.

Even thinking about how a woman behaves, but even then even cross my mind, right?

You know, it's like that's a mature adult, man.

I love them for that Harrison to an immature or teenage boy, you know.

So if you're behaving in a way that reminds me of a teenage boy, where something goes wrong and you start whining about it, I don't think, oh, you're behaving like a woman, I think.

Oh, you're behaving, like, you sound like my 15 year old son.

Yeah, whining and complaining.

And you haven't matured enough to realize that's just part of life and the sooner you do the sooner, you learn to do to do something about that.

The better off.

Everybody is going to be including yourself.

Archer grade distinction, man.

I love that.

So it actually I wanted to ask I'm curious about your writing process.

You you do it seems like correct me if I'm wrong.

You seems like you do a lot more writing than you do, like, making videos or post or audios or things like your writing and what's what does that look like for you?

What it seems like you're quite thoughtful about it.

Your analytical, like have you been writing for a long time you enjoy the writing process, you No, I have not been been riding for for a long time.

Now, in my career I've been communicating my whole life.

I'm a business owner, you might have done a lot of sales of done.

I had to coach my teams of had you know so as far as developing that skill set I learned it in my career you know.

But as far as my writing process you know for me The, I feel like what we need.

In a lot of these dialogues as we need to have some meaning Nuance, we need real fully thought-out dialogues, not soundbites, you know.

And so when I started writing a lot of people told me like man you need to make reels and you turn measles quick posts or whatever and he s man like yeah I can't say what I need to say in context to really get the point across in Thornton in a 56 s real.

And so I'm going to do it the way.

I know it needs.

Be done and if people respond to it, great, if not well, but I'm not gonna I'm gonna water down.

I feel like it's important for me to say, no, I don't post very often and everybody everybody says oh you gotta say you get the most engagement and it's like I can't do that.

You know, I spend, you know, week reflecting on an idea and I'll really, and it'll be something that, you know.

That I haven't even fleshed out yet.

It's like something, I'll have a thought that I'm like there's something there that I need to reflect on and bring some depth to and I'll just spend you know how to spend time thinking about it and then when I right you know I actually wrote point because that's all I knew how to use.

So all of my Instagram stuff and make it in PowerPoint.

So my creative process is you know I'll just make I'll just make the slides and I'll just write out everything I need to write and that that you That usually comes pretty quickly, kind of like this, we're just talking, but I'll usually end up with like 22 slides.

And so, the process of refining all that down is, by far, the most time-consuming part, you know, is taking the brainstorm part of it, or do I just, I really fully had the whole conversation and refining that down and refining it down running around and the 10 in the nine slides, basically, It is, by far, the most time-consuming part, but I would say I probably spend four to five hours of each post.

That's awesome.

And what's happening, really?

That's really insightful.

Thanks for showing a process because writing Is.

The golden key to thinking.

Absolutely.

And there's a lot of Mind work and I love the way you just described your process.

Is that, it's the thinking process, right?

It's where we learn how to think in articulate and it's tough.

Yeah, his really like there's so much going on everywhere and you could just dump it all.

But to go through that work and my work a, what is this actually mean?

And how do I get it down to a concise, meaningful element here that I can use?

Wow, that's a powerful process.

Yeah, absolutely.

You know, and it's very challenging, it's not easy.

It's very, very demanding, you know, and after I read a post and then I'm very engaged with the comments to, you know, like, I really engage with it with.

There's a lot of good dialogues even in the comments section.

But after about two days, after I post, I have to just, you know, kind of disengage from Instagram because I just depletes me too much.

Yeah, but yeah, I mean, I know it's, you know, I I'm really, I'm really proud of the people that follow me and, you know, a lot of people say, oh, you know, people are too dumb to have a good attention span and they, you know, they are not willing to invest in reading some reading along, post, whatever and say man you look at the engagement in the number of comments that I'm getting in the number, you know, just how fast my page has grown.

It's like, no people are hungry for debt, for Hunger for knowledge.

And so I'm really proud of, you know, At least my at least my audience of my followers and how many people will follow me and engaged in my stuff for, you know, it's easy to sit and think people are, you know, lose hope and people, you know, if You observe him but his behavior but and I've been really encouraged, you know, to receive what I've received from the people that have because there are, there are plenty of people people out there who want a long dialogue.

They want depth, they want to sit in If it's good and if you know, if you really take the time to put the quality and the effort in and I think that's her, I think that is reflected in my work.

I mean, I think it's very obvious that I've spent a lot of time really thinking through this stuff and really trying to come at it from every angle, not just like, oh here's what I think everybody should be doing, you know, I try to write in the first person, you know, because I'm and talk about my own mistakes and how I learn these things you know, the right way because Because I think too often think about it.

Like, being a father, right?

Like Nobody responds really.

We've all most of us.

Had that dad ordered you surround you do this, do this, do this, do this.

How'd that work?

When you were the kid, right?

Whereas there's the dad set you down says, Here's why I don't want you to do this.

Here's what I did wrong and I want you to learn from me and I think so much of the content that's written on Instagram just across the border on Twitter and everything is we're being that Dad.

That's just ordinary buddy around instead of saying, man.

I learned this the hard way, I'm telling you this because here's what years when I didn't do it and what it cost me and, you know, I feel like having having that kind of tone in a lot of the stuff that I write his really changed how it's received and you're so right.

And I've been guilty of the other side where I go through the experience.

You know, have like is earn this thing and then my thing I guess so excited.

You guys everybody guys.

I stopped doing that like this.

Do this is awesome but you're, you're exactly right.

You're just nailing it.

Where, if all, if I step back and say, hey, this is again, it's like we all know the dad lecturing doesn't work, right?

Yeah.

Did that lecture just does not work as false flag humanize it and you sit down and say, man, you tell you a story about when I was 16 and I did something similar and what happened to me, right?

And you know and you really just talk and you can your authentic and your Human.

That's always going to be more effective than, you know, and I don't think people do it on purpose.

I just think it's easy to fall into that trap of like Even with very good intentions coming across as condescending and talking down to people with might not know what, you know, right?

Like, if you're not careful, you, it's really easy to do that.

And that's why right over there.

That's why I do so much proofreading.

That's what takes me so long to edit those things down.

It's not just what I'm saying, but, you know, am I saying this in a way there?

It's relatable.

You know, that's, it isn't going to make people feel dismissed, or condescended to talk down to refraining from a A place of like, listening.

When I was in your position, I was I made the same mistakes to not.

I'm not, I'm not telling you you're an idiot for doing this stuff.

What I am telling you is that if you stay on the track that you're on I did that man.

And here's what happened.

Yep.

Yeah.

And I think I've been able to touch on some topics that if I would have handled them the wrong way.

Really?

Who did lead on the wrong way?

Yeah, inflammatory.

Nobody would have learned and what I've just been.

It's been cool.

I've gotten a lot of comments so far from a lot of different posts.

Like, you know, man, at the beginning, I was prepared to disagree with you.

But by the end, I see what you're saying.

Yeah, it's you walk through and you know, and you don't see many people saying that I'm so drained.

Yep, exactly.

And I really think that there's so much vitriol so much disagreement so much these battles where where seems as though they're not even considering other views, it's just like this is mine is yours and we're going to slash each other.

We're trying to win right now was like, man.

I don't I'm not trying to be right?

I'm trying to get it right?

Yep.

Yeah.

Or or worrying about who's right versus what's right?

Yes, that's great food powerful, man, I love that.

Brother.

Hey I want to I want to shift gears to two things with you and I just kind of touched on before we hit the recording just the the slow steady work of some awesome results that you created like one element at a time and one was business and the other one was was transforming, your body putting on some serious muscle mass.

Yeah.

And in both of those instances he talked about it was a long process kind of one step at a time.

Walk us walk us through that a little bit both of those because I think it's their similar principles.

If not the same principle where maybe you had the imagination, the Curiosity the vision of something you wanted to create and then you just kept at it until you got the results.

You want it.

Yeah, you know, I think the best way to talk about that I would use the metaphor of I was a, I was a baseball player.

I played baseball in college was a picture, right?

And so part of being the picture is You know, you have to just make the next pitch, you know, I can't control the Empire, I can't control.

If my Fielder's make an error, I can't control.

If the batter gets a good hit, but I think it's easy in life to judge your success or failure on every pitch.

And I see a lot of people, I see a lot of people judging success and failure after every single action and I think, what's going Really helpful for me growing up and you know as a baseball player is if you look at somebody like in the major leagues for us it's like we don't judge them by every pitch.

That's crazy.

Don't even judge them by every game because everybody has a judge me.

We definitely don't judge them by every inning.

We don't even really judge them after a whole game 130 pitches, right?

We judge them over the course of a season and even more.

So in judgment over the course of a career have career yet and life is the same way.

And I think if you can shift your mindset from trying to win every pitch, I mean nobody wins every pitch.

Nobody throws every pitch perfectly, and there's always going to be a lot of elements that you have no control over any.

And a lot of people get distracted by that, you know, it's like, oh, the Umpire Made a metaphorical umpire made a bad call and I lose my mind for 20 pitches in the game.

With no, you have to immediately forget about what the umpires just did.

And go back to focusing on what you can control and executing the next pitch and if you can, it's hard to do.

But if you can keep that discipline mindset of like, I'm just going to execute each pitch the best I can.

If I mess up I'm going to learn from it and not going to do that again.

By the time the game is over.

You usually win.

But not if you let a bad call, throw you off your game 44 15 pitches.

Yeah, you know, not if you let one of your Fielder's making it making your through your game on.

So I've just kind of learned from that.

It's you know, ever it's really easy to succeed.

If you just take like a death by a Thousand Cuts approach, just show up every day.

Execute Every Act, every action to the best of your ability and Don't really focus on.

You know, the results, you know, at least not in the short term, find the find, the right actions and just trust that at the time, the game's over.

If you just execute that action over and over and over again, it will work out often enough.

That you'll win the game, man.

That's true in investing and in business and in every field.

Yeah.

I feel like so many people think if they don't throw a no-hitter, it's a failure.

Now, let's say, did you going to give up hits?

You're going to walk people like stuffs gonna happen in real life and maybe every once in a while, once a year of issue will throw a perfect game, right?

And I think if people took a lot of the real, the immediate pressure off and expanded their their time frame for how they're You waiting either their personal growth of their Fitness your business or whatever, is their marriage, anything expand your time frame and execute the right actions over and over again.

It will work out often enough.

The people will eventually that eventually will be something people like.

Wow your marriage is amazing, your business does awesomer, you're in great shape.

And it's like, my marriage is amazing, because we spent about 2,000 hours arguing, you know there's Only one way to get there and that's showing up and doing the tootsie grunt word over and over and over again until you don't have to do.

Yes, so good and that's not sexy.

Now it is well it's almost a right, it's almost but you know it's like Zig Ziglar.

You mentioned Zig Ziglar earlier, one of my favorite quotes is you know, he said there's no elevator to success.

You have to take the stairs, you know, and if you get really good A lot of people try to swing for the fences of hit home runs.

Because that's what we see highlights of, that's what you're sexy, right?

But if you just go up and get a single every single time, you just literally just one step at a time, it's almost impossible to fail, right?

It really is.

It's just it's a matter of if Irwin, that's where Talent comes on this.

How long does Talent will help me climb three steps at once.

So, it's just how soon do you succeed, but regardless of your talent level, if you just execute the right action, repeatedly success is a foregone conclusion.

If you just have the patience to stick with it.

Keep going bad.

So, that's worth re-emphasizing right there.

It's almost impossible to fail.

If you just keep going, you persist in the right action.

Yes.

Yeah, you know I mean and it's almost cliche for all the people that have become successful, we all say it.

You say it?

I see it.

I see it 100 times a day on Instagram but people still keep like how do I go get the Home Run, that's why you're going to fail do because you know you want the sexy part, you want to be able to hit the ball over the fence and have everybody cheer for you and it's Pride driven ego-driven.

Instead of we're all telling you, there is no overnight success.

We all just have to grind it out.

Everybody that's on the other side is successful, says the same thing but every 20 year old guy, messages means Lee and I'm so frustrated that I'm not really short Crow, you're a toddler meal, you kidding me right now, you're 20, I feel like I've already screwed my whole life.

You just get started, you have no idea.

Like it's been 10 years, grinding it out, and then tell me that you're not successful like I don't want and then they never message me back because I didn't tell him what, why?

I'm here.

It's gonna be rich tomorrow. 10 years of work.

Yeah.

And they keep hearing these little these rare stories of the kind of a, you know, something something for nothing quick success.

But you write the recipe is it's years of doing the right action.

Yeah, it's like yeah, you can go dig a bunch of holes in the ground.

You might strike oil in the one guy that strikes oil is going to get a lot of publicity.

And so everybody is about digging holes.

It's like, or you can just do the basics and the fundamentals, you know, with the fundamentals all their the fundamentals are fundamental for a reason.

They always work.

And around, we you were telling me before we got on this, the same with your business, you just built it.

One, one cell at a time, one client at a time.

It wasn't, it wasn't this big mass of one day than a whole bunch of people showed up.

You just one client at a time and then the compounding effect, compound effort.

Yeah.

It's coming.

Do you like it?

Hits you like, wow, okay.

Now our business is vastly different from than what it was last year three years ago and I knew that going in.

I think that reside, you know, I actually listened to all the people that said, success doesn't come overnight.

You got to just execute the right activities, show up everyday and carry the water, do the work and just keep doing it.

Well, I actually listened and I just did That's awesome.

People people reach out to me and they want to know what the secret to success is just do the boring stuff over and over and over again.

Yeah, I like that.

It's yeah, exactly.

Can you give me a better answer, please?

Something a little more exciting little easier.

A little faster.

If you want to try that, that's fine.

You can swing for the fences every time and you might hit a homerun more, likely your strikeout.

And the guy who's hitting the, the base hits every single time is going to succeed is undefeated, okay.

How do you do this in Fitness?

Because you went front will give us your number.

Like the pictures.

I saw like you were, you were you were pretty skinny, bro.

And then you use bulked up.

Well, I the pictures were, I was really skinny.

I was really hoping I was working 100 hours a week and I was barely I was so focused.

Like I wasn't even really eating, you know, I was just so I didn't have time to go eat.

I just had chocolate milk in the refrigerator.

It's like, oh, this feeling of hunger is a distraction.

Yeah, chocolate milk because I don't have time for that shit.

You know.

I got work to do.

Yeah.

So I happen to be like, an ectomorph, you know, so I lose weight, if I'm not careful.

A lot of people had the opposite problem for me, it's like, if I don't eat for A thousand calories a day, I lose weight, right?

Metabolisms crazy.

So that picture, I was really underweight, you know, I was probably 30 pounds underweight, and in that before picture, so getting back to, like, I was like 165 and I'm 64.

So, I was 165.

So, I mean, how are you?

I look like a mini.

Yeah, I mean, I look like some something wrong.

And so it was pretty easy to get up to like 200 just slowing down and just eating three times a day, it got me up to like 200 and then, you know, the rest of it was just, you know, I was in shape, in college.

I was in pretty good shape already.

I was, I was about to 10 to 15 and so it really wasn't.

Yeah, it didn't take what it takes.

A lot of people put on muscle for me, just because of my body type, but it took about two and a half years is just, you know, I was at the gym every, you know, five nights a week, for two hours because but I had, you know, I think it's important to point out, you know, this was after my business was successful, I think a lot of men are grinding it out, you know?

And they are like, oh, I'm not also in great shape.

It's like, man, you can't be great at everything at the same time.

You know, like I had the capacity to spend two hours, you know?

Like right now they'll go to the gym at 2:00 in the afternoon.

I'm going to 24 while everybody else is having nice.

Let me ask you, let me ask you a question about that if you could go back and do it over again.

Would you could you prioritize your health?

In a different way.

So you didn't get unhealthy.

Because I know you know, especially when you're in it and you're learning at again.

We don't we don't get the chance to go back and do it over again but I personally wouldn't have done it any differently.

If you had just grinded just push hard, you know, get it over with it.

I think the important context I would add is it in your career.

Are you doing that in in a field or a vertical?

That that kind of grind has the potential to be to have an end date to where you don't have to grind that much anymore?

I don't think anybody should grind.

So getting just obsessed for a fixed short period of time.

But for me, it was like, alright, the next seven years, my kids were babies.

And I said, I told my wife, I said, I don't have much to offer a baby.

You know, the next seven years or Mommy time.

If I want us to establish a life, I've got seven years to make that happen.

So that by the time, they're old enough to need me, I have the capacity to be there.

So what I'm going to do is I'm going to try to Pile in 20 years worth of work in seven years so that I can check that box off and be done with it.

And then I'll be will be in a position financially that I can be present at home.

I can be there for my voice.

I can do all.

These things.

And so it was a straight-A strategy that I decided on before I ever started.

Yeah, this is something that I've got, I've got a timeline, I've got a deadline, but I've got to hit this certain number financially, but this deadline and I and anything that I have to cut anything within reason, you know, I'm not saying go, get them cocaine, what you know.

But you know, anything within reason that has to be it has to be put on the back burner for now.

I'll get to that when I'm done with this.

So setting, the setting a Target setting a deadline and then paying a price to get a result.

Do you feel like you missed out on life during those seven years?

Oh absolutely.

Yeah.

I uh, I have, you know, I have almost no memories of my voice especially my younger son.

I have about a six-year window where I have no memories of you at all.

I just have pictures.

That's hard, that's super hard.

It is, you know, but at the same time, I'm proud of what I did.

You know, I'm proud of the sacrifices that I made because now, I'm able to really, really be there for him now that he's old enough, who got a really close relationship now.

Here we talk really deeply, you know, we go do Muay Thai together twice a week.

Yes, we'll drive to and from movie tie together and we'll practice will practice it together.

And then on the way back, we have all these chances to talk and do all these things.

And so, yeah, I don't have many memories of him when he was.

Six, but I'm going to have a lot of really good quality memories.

That will balint little more than balance that skill back out and how are you able to flip the switch?

I know some, some men get going, they get in that drive and they never let up.

And and they kind of get to a point where it's insatiable.

It's never enough and so they'll just some going like that.

And definitely, it feels like seems little, you you hit a Target you're like hey I can switch that for me.

The goal wasn't the doing, it was the target.

It's like I'm aiming at, you know, I'm just hypothetically, I'm aiming at 500 Grand a year, right?

And once and I did it's easy because, you know, the business that I'm in, isn't something that I'm really passionate about.

It's pretty dry.

It's not exciting.

It's not anything that I'm excited to wake up and go do, it was a means to an end, right?

It was that it was the vehicle that I had to build the life that I needed to build sometimes me.

And so for me at the very beginning, it was like, I don't really care what the vehicle is to get me there.

I just know where I'm trying to go.

So once I hit it once, I hit 500,000 a year amount in I'm out because it's my tari, I hit my time nude, but now I'm living more in on purpose.

Yes, that was a vehicle.

Let's get this phase over with.

Let's build the foundation for my life.

Let's get this launched into orbit.

You know because the spaceship uses 90% of its fuel, just getting into orbit and as a man that's the most challenging phase of life is like, yep, you've got to go from from 0, unless you inherited money or you're just more insanely talented, or whatever.

When you get married, you have a family and you got kids you have to go from zero with no momentum.

No nothing.

Oftentimes you get to dig yourself out of holes, you created for yourself and you've got to launch your, not just you, but your family's life from Ground-level into orbit and that takes an insane amount of fuel to do that.

But once you get into orbit, Just like getting in shape.

It's really hard to get in shape, but it's not that hard to stay here.

Stay in shape.

Yep.

Yeah.

You get in your systems and habits and patterns and I would say, that's true.

Also for everything in life.

Once you get things dialed in and optimizes the word, I like to use optimized when she get things optimized, it's a lot easier to keep them there, but you gotta get out with say, one of the ways that I've done to shift, the gears is I just, I found other things to pour that tenacity into that aren't work by 10.

I said he is like yeah, after I was done with that work, there was a lot of work.

I had to do to get my marriage weird because my marriage wasn't I didn't completely ignore it, but I had caused enough pain that I had a lot a lot that I had to reconcile with a lot to, you know, ask forgiveness for a lot that I've had to restore, you know, I had to, you know.

And so I feel like it was easy to shift gears, by just finding New things to pour myself into supposed to, you know, just chasing more and more, and more, and more money, more and more, and more and more business.

You know, like you can go back to, you know, whether you're a, whether you're a Christian, you can go look in the read.

What Solomon wrote in Ecclesiastes about how it's all going to be another.

You can go read Philosophy from the stoics and the Greeks.

And I mean in every every ancient literature, you know, all with anything you would call wisdom has been Warning men against that hemp long as men have been alive this chant.

There's no, there is no fulfillment in that constant spacing of material possession of wealth Fame and power.

It's a black hole.

You know, like, everybody in every man in history, that knew anything has tried to do, has been screaming.

Hey, that's my bro.

That's not gonna work, you know.

And so I knew going dried gentlemen, it has been tried and it's like I'm still saying the same thing.

Try to argue like Grill.

You don't have to listen to me, like just read anything.

Read it, anything from men that have tried to like, put themselves in a position to be an advisor, whether it's a spiritual person, or not spiritual person, or whether it's Gandhi or Buddha, or Jesus, like nobody's telling you.

I've never read anything that is told men.

Hey bro, the key to satisfaction is constant.

Well feckin position power.

Yes, you'll be okay, you'll die.

Yeah, nobody has ever said that.

Nope.

Yeah.

At what point are you gonna hear it?

And so for me, like, I feel like I was impressionable enough at a young age to believe that you know, like I was, I heard that stuff.

I read that stuff.

It's like, okay.

I'm just going to believe that those older dudes know what they're talking about and I'm not going to, you know?

And so yeah, I mean, I had a knew when it was time to stop before every started, That's it.

I feel like that really is so important, man.

I love that.

So good Ryan this has been awesome and I got to I got to run to a speaking engagement.

This has been so fantastic.

Really appreciate will your posts the things you the price?

You're paying to think and write and share and things that are working for you, right?

That's that's huge.

That's so valuable to turn around and give back some of the things you're learning and to take some time, make some time today to come Ah, man, I really appreciate that.

Where can where can people connect with you, brother?

Right now, it's just Instagram at the wisdom of Kings, okay.

But wisdom of Kings on Instagram is the perfect, great platform there.

Lot a lot of great content, a lot of great stuff.

Ryan, appreciate you, brother.