Episode 153: Chapter HO

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Adam Curry: podcasting 2.0 for
November 3 2023, episode 153

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Chapter everybody once again for
your weekly board meeting of

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podcasting 2.0 Everything
happening in the modern podcast

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space. You Yes, we are the only
boardroom where a vote of no

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confidence is a good thing.
Everything happening your

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podcasts index.org with a
namespace Of course all the

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goings on a podcast index dot
social. I'm Adam curry here in

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the heart of the Texas Hill
Country and in Alabama ladies,

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he's had 989 days of uptime say
hello to my friend on the other

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end, the one and only Mr. De
Jones.

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Dave Jones: The servers ahead of
time.

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Adam Curry: Oh, I'm sorry. My

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Dave Jones: body is down.

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Adam Curry: Man, you're still
sick, huh?

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Dave Jones: Um, for for Tiny
Tim, I've gone I've gone all the

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way back like that little. I
have that little little crutch

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the with the stick?

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Adam Curry: Under the under the
under your your armpit stick?

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Dave Jones: Yeah, yeah. I'm
gonna blow my nose. Like,

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seriously when I'm blowing my
nose. It looks like a crime

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scene. It's like a murder scene
around here.

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Adam Curry: I think you have
this every year. Don't use kind

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of a annual thing for you.

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Dave Jones: Oh, yes. My annual
health. I got. I got COVID on

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Halloween. Oh, no. I got
shingles on Halloween. Oh,

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Adam Curry: that was that was
three years ago. Three years.

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Yeah,

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Dave Jones: I had, yeah, my
annual appointment. So I'm

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trying this new thing. Okay,
this is great.

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Adam Curry: I bet it's great.
Okay, what new thing do you have

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going on?

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Dave Jones: So I go to the I go
to the end. User, here's my

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typical. Here's my typical
strategy. So I'll give it a

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week. And then if I'm not
getting better by day seven,

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Adam Curry: you call 911.

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Dave Jones: I just drove to the
emergency room. I go to the end.

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And it's like, it's always
about, sorry, it's a bacterial

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infection like sinus infection,
antibiotic. You know, Bada bing,

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bada boom. So I go. And I talked
to him. He's like, hey, you

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know, I would like to try
something different with you

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this year. And I'm like, okay,
all right. And he's like, we got

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this compounding pharmacy.
Usually, usually I like, I like

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those guys. Yeah. He's like, we
got this combat. And so it's

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like an antibiotic. He's like,
he gets it. He's like, You got a

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neti pot. I'm like, Yeah, I get
I love netic. He's like, get

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your net. He's like you poured
you know, get your distilled

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water, put your saline pack and
the neti pot. And then you open

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a capsule of this compounded
stuff and drop it in there and

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mix it up in the new neti pot.
You're yourself with that. And

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it's got an antibiotic and
steroid in the, in the, in the

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compound. So he's like, do that
twice a day for 15 days. All

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right. So I start yesterday. And
I'm like, you know, do I do it

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at it twice yesterday. Once this
morning, I get to work this

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morning. And everybody's like,
man, your face is like cherry

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red. What's wrong? Oh, no

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Adam Curry: allergic reaction is

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Dave Jones: something dude. Oh,
no. My face is like, my face is

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like bright red. Looks like it's
all chapped and red. So I had to

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call them the pharmacy and like,
Hey, I'm having some sort of

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reaction.

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Adam Curry: Like you have
leprosy.

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Dave Jones: So now I'm walking
around on the Tiny Tim crud, you

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know, with like, the red face.
And I'm like, you know, is it's

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a disaster over here.

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Adam Curry: You're on the prayer
list. Brother. This is no good.

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We got we got a call on the big
guns for this one.

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Dave Jones: This is my obituary.

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Adam Curry: He was tiny, but his
name wasn't him. Hey, man, I

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want to start off by saying
something. I I saw what Jason

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was doing with podcast guru. And
I'm like, you know, I really

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ought to try podcast guru. Now
I'm on an Android derivative,

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which is known as Graphene OS.
So basically, his android

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android derivative derivative.
Holy crap. podcast is

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phenomenal. Great. Yes. I mean,
it's, it's just, I don't know

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what everyone else is because I
typically I'm using pod verse

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and fountain. But podcast Guru
is snappy. You know, it really

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responds was is it some other
programming language is being

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used there that's more native to
Android or what is that? What

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what why, why? Why am I noticing
the snappiness difference?

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Dave Jones: I don't know what
his I don't know what his build,

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like environment looks like. I
mean, Android is natively Kotlin

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I think now, which is better
squid Java

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Adam Curry: and it's just the
May I have a couple may give a

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couple of pieces feedback for
Jason since I'm talking about it

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one I get node lit alerts I
don't know if that's the if I

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should be expecting it but it'd
be live items it does find it oh

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Dave Jones: no, it shows I did
not get the best signal for this

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show by the way. Well, I sent

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Adam Curry: it out you didn't
get a bad signal Let me double

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check make sure everything's
okay. Yeah, saves published

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Okay, let me double check
published all right. Let me send

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that again. I've had been having
some some weird issues like

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Bookstagram ball Okay, Dred
Scott didn't get it either maybe

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I maybe I messed it up was fine.
It could it be you know, gosh, I

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don't know who knows. But but I
know I haven't been getting lit

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alerts. It'll show up fine. Like
episode is live in two minutes.

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One minute does all that but it
doesn't fire off. All the other

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alerts work perfectly. I mean,
right away, boom. I get I get

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alerts. But I just got it. You
just got it now. Okay. Yeah.

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What do you do? Well, like fired
I fired it off again. I don't

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know. Maybe. I don't know. But I
still don't have one for podcast

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guru.

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Dave Jones: I just got it on.
John. On the podcast index like

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Adam Curry: pod pod podcast
live. Yeah. Which is a surefire

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way to know it's working. A
couple of things. And I've

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noticed this in general, this is
also for that get Albey guys

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when connecting my wallet to a
podcast app and the only two I

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have to do that in is well now
it's actually curio caster pod

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first partners. And and now
podcast guru. This is set up

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sometimes man it can take a long
time before it finally goes

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through. But you know, just sits
there gives you no visual cues

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that it's waiting to
authenticate or whatever it's

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doing. It just it fails a lot.
It does this they still have

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disconnects man the split kit.
Sometimes I have to, you know,

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I'll be saving stuff. And like
it didn't save it because the

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login timed out or something.
There's there's something going

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on with the get Alby times you
out. I think I think I'm not

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sure.

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Dave Jones: Yeah, I agree. It's
it's generally like in pod verse

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a lot of times I have to read a
lot. I had to re log in verse a

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lot. Yeah. Quite a bit, because
I'll just notice that the boost

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buttons not showing up to go
reconnect, I'll be well,

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Adam Curry: and that's another
thing, podcast guru, not my

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expected behavior. Maybe it's
not a bad thing. But you have to

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specifically opt into every
podcast to sense that. So

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Dave Jones: I'm like, I'll have
an account, so to speak. Well,

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Adam Curry: well, when you're
streaming sets, it'll say it

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right there. And you can set it
manually for your session. But

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that's not it doesn't keep it
going for the next session. And

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if you're not paying attention,
like oh, I wasn't streaming any

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Sass, I feel really stupid now.
So and I understand that, you

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know, maybe not having it
automatically. But it means that

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if I've gone through the through
the time of setting up my

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default, streaming sites, and by
default boost, I'm thinking like

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everything that is a is a V for
v should be default on but it's

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default off, as okay. Now,
there's also no way to see what

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my wallet amount is. Is like as
guru. Yeah, yeah. So I think

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that's something that should be
in there. And I'm just spouting

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this off Jason just because he
happens to be here. I just wrote

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down this list. Like, let me
talk about this. Also, I think

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he's, I think he's batching SATs
and so it's very confusing when

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I see 500 SATs and I'm like,
Whoa, is that per minute because

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I set it to 200. And but I think
it's a batch which is okay, but

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you know, I It doesn't What are
you drinking?

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Dave Jones: This is liquid death
sparkling water.

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Adam Curry: Oh, sweet. What's
wrong with you? Don't drink

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liquid death. This is not good
stuff. This

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Dave Jones: is leftover from the
Halloween party.

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Adam Curry: Oh, this is
horrible. Is it all caffeine or

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amphetamines or something? It's
just it's just pure water.

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Dave Jones: Okay, but it's got a
huge skull on it. Makes me feel

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Adam Curry: feel feel good.
Makes you feel ready. Ready for

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the journey? Yeah. So that
there's also no way to see the

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splits. And the and here's the
here's the big one for me. The

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wallet switching? So it'll say
in the amounts and it'll say T

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S. Which is I mean, I'm like,
oh, that must mean time split.

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Because I'm listening to a
podcast with with music. But

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yeah, you mean say something
else. I mean, this is wallet

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switched or whatever. or, you
know, or show me who else it

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went to because I want to know
the artists got it. So it's just

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it's just a minor stuff. But
just let me

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Dave Jones: let me add that
cast. Cast thematic, you know

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course, is only that cast ematic
like I don't have I don't I

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rarely ever have my lb wallet
disconnected and cast ematic I

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mean, I go into it, I go weeks
without having to, like

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reconnect my wallet, okay, oh,
I'm not sure what Franco's doing

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differently than what maybe
Mitch and Jason are doing. But

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in it, but it's like that, that
connection that token or

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authorization token unless
Franco's just renewing it

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silently in the background. Like
it is long it seems to be much

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longer lived and cast thematic
dangerous and the other

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interesting

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Adam Curry: interesting yeah,
and and also if you don't know

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it's disconnected you don't know
You know, that's another thing

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Yeah, I think these are these
may be general comments.

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Everyone should take a look at
it like I know it's not like

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you're busy or anything doing
stuff. There's nothing going on.

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Nothing else you gotta be
working on. But these are just

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little the I love the way pod
verse shows that pod verse

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really shows it well, but pod
verse Then conversely, when you

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hit the boost button, it can
take a long time before you get

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some you get some satisfaction
before you get to your confetti

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podcast guru by the way does
lightning bolts and all kinds at

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all I'm missing is a
thunderclap. Yeah, and then I

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think it just you know just does
that and then does it in the

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background and figures it out
for you which I think is a

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better user experience. That's

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Dave Jones: That's what curio
caster does to you hit you get

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confetti. Yeah, right

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Adam Curry: away. You get comfy?
Yeah,

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Dave Jones: you get satisfied
and eat. Exactly,

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Adam Curry: exactly. And I want
to welcome my buddy Cody from

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Kerrville who got his sidestream
music podcast up on RSS blue,

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without without me having to
help him at all.

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Dave Jones: That's real man
right there.

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Adam Curry: I think Dolby does
help them out but or if he said

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Hey, Dolby das listen to what he
said. It sounded great. But ya

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know, I love him for doing that.
So he's he does the morning

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show. On what is it? Now I
forgot what the rock of the rock

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of Texas rock of Texas and man
he knows a lot of these value

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for value guys, a lot of them.
So yeah, he's doing it. You got

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interviews going on all kinds of
stuff. So we need a place as a

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pipeline then yeah. Oh, yeah.
Oh, definitely. Oh, he's he's

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been onboarding a lot of people.
was great. So he's on RSS.

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blue.com. I see that pod home.fm
just launched today, I think,

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which also that oh, yeah, pod
home.fm also has value time

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split, magical wallet switching
technology.

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Dave Jones: I've been talking
with. I think his name is Barry.

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Is that right? Yes. Barry.
Barry. Yeah, I've been talking

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with him. You know, he's helped
him with index stuff and getting

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set up with API keys and all
that kind of stuff. I did not

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know that they launched That's
great.

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Adam Curry: Yeah. And he has, I
think even has a music lookup

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thing. Just like ours is
blue.com has Oh, yeah. You know,

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I just love that. It's working
that people get it. It's like,

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oh, okay, I understand how to do
this. Fantastic.

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Dave Jones: It tells me that
it's not that of course, it's

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calm. It's complicated. But
that's complicated in quotes. I

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mean, you know, lots of stuff is
complicated. I feel this way

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about activitypub to, I feel
like people get really freaked

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out over over sort of a more a
more in depth protocols like

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that. But they're really at the
end of the day if you if you sit

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down and really bang it out.
It's not that hard, right? No, I

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mean, it's still just because if
it was that complicated nobody

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would do it like caisson, you
know, exhibit A, you know, web

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monetization or whatever that
crap was that you had to have

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like a PhD you know, in order to
understand the why paper nobody

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just nobody does it. The fact
that people are doing this

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coming in sort of a little blind
and doing it kinda off to you

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know, without a lot of hand
holding is encouraging.

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Adam Curry: Yeah, and that's and
I think there's there's also a

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general thinking that no one
will ever do this is to vie for

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V is too hard and makes no
sense. People don't in fact, Oh,

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yeah. A little bit of feedback
for the podcast weekly review

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boys. All right, I was doing my
show prep. School. This is

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ongoing, because I mean, I'm
boosting I'm boosting and I'm

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saying you can't do micro
payments with Apple Pay. And

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Apple can't do them. Then James
is just like Adams wrong. I'm

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sorry, Adams wrong here. But I'm
not wrong, because you have to

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the whole reason lightning
exists in a way bitcoin is

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because they can't do that. They
can't, they would have to have a

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bank charter, which will
probably never be approved by a

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regulator. Now, this is why I'm
curious to see how Elon Musk

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will do it. The only thing I can
think he can use is fed now, but

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even then he'll have to
piggyback on some other bank.

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Because you can't Apple can't
just start doing micro payments

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because you gave him all your
money. You know, there's a

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there's money laundering,
there's all kinds of stuff that

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they then have to do. And it
goes on their balance sheet. No,

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the hard No, it's not going to
happen. This is why lightning is

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such so beautiful. And so to
keep hammering on, no one will

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ever do it until it's dollars
and fiat money. No, it's just

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not going to happen. Be won't go
look at how the money system

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works in America. It has to be
you know, the Buy Now pay later.

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That's MasterCard, and the apple
credit card that's Goldman Sachs

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and boy they want to get rid of
that business is so bad

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everyone's defaulting.

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Dave Jones: Well, Fred said, you
know, fed now came out with a

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with a with a bang and it's just
like, I've never seen nothing. I

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mean, is there any adoption
before there

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Adam Curry: was at a conference
in Vegas? Like the money 2020

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conference or something like
that? Oh, yeah, I think it'll

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show up. It may be what what x
implement but just so you know,

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it's like it's not it's not a
matter of that apple technically

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couldn't you know, do your
account but they don't do your

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account that's all banks that do
that they are only middleware

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between you and your own bank.
They don't have an account has

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to

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Dave Jones: be a bank No, I
think what x wants to be is a

270
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bay Yeah. Are they wants to be
good luck. That's but that's

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different than Google and Apple
those there. Those things there

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Google pay Apple pay all that
stuff? Those are Yeah, like he

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said those are using banks the
same way that cash app does

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Adam Curry: Yeah. And exactly
they got they have a banking

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license, a bank charter, by the
way, things are really cracking

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wide open. Did you see strikes
announcement?

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Dave Jones: Now strikes? thing
to me is what is how this

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evolves into the thing that
James was talking about with

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using dollars, Yes, you bet you
pay because I mean, strikes

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00:17:32,010 --> 00:17:37,530
whole thing really, ultimately
is sin money, but use Lightning

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as the as the substrate. And
that that is very, that is

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doable.

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00:17:43,230 --> 00:17:47,370
Adam Curry: But also you can do
direct deposit to strike. You

284
00:17:47,370 --> 00:17:50,820
can you can wire money, you can
do all kinds of things with

285
00:17:50,820 --> 00:17:56,580
strike. Now you can set it up so
that it be you can pay in

286
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lightning payments, and it's
deducted immediately from your

287
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debit card. I mean, of course,
he's on the inside, right? His

288
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,390
parents are big in the financial
industry. So he's got all the

289
00:18:06,660 --> 00:18:10,200
connections in the legality. I'm
talking about Mallory. Sorry,

290
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:13,230
Molly. Yeah, so he's got he's
got all that set up. And it's

291
00:18:13,230 --> 00:18:16,290
great, you know, so but this is
really mainstreaming and if

292
00:18:16,290 --> 00:18:20,610
you'll see what's happening with
Bitcoin, and I, I pay attention

293
00:18:20,610 --> 00:18:24,030
to these things part of what I
do and all you're hearing now

294
00:18:24,030 --> 00:18:27,690
from the financial markets is
well bitcoins a safe haven you

295
00:18:27,690 --> 00:18:31,800
know, they're treating it as a
legitimate I'll say asset but

296
00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:34,500
really it's a commodity but
they're they're treating it as a

297
00:18:34,500 --> 00:18:38,280
legitimate investment or use
vehicle they still haven't

298
00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:41,640
figured out that people are
actually using it as money. I

299
00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:46,170
buy beef with it. We are using
we have a complete microcosm

300
00:18:46,170 --> 00:18:49,650
economy with with the Lightning
Network there. Yeah, we're

301
00:18:49,650 --> 00:18:52,290
boosting back and forth, but
it's value. We're boosting it

302
00:18:52,290 --> 00:18:56,430
back and forth between podcasts.
Okay, maybe it's not going that

303
00:18:56,430 --> 00:19:01,230
far out of the system just yet.
But Tina, who has CloudHealth

304
00:19:01,230 --> 00:19:05,340
she says, Oh, in January, I can
start paying my bi monthly

305
00:19:05,340 --> 00:19:09,000
CloudHealth bill with lightning.
It's like okay, beautiful. So

306
00:19:09,030 --> 00:19:09,240
yeah.

307
00:19:10,859 --> 00:19:12,659
Dave Jones: Yeah, I got a buddy
that does CloudHealth that's

308
00:19:12,659 --> 00:19:14,369
pretty sweet service. Yes,

309
00:19:14,369 --> 00:19:16,979
Adam Curry: it's fantastic. It's
really good.

310
00:19:17,580 --> 00:19:20,190
Dave Jones: He's not had any any
trouble with it at all.

311
00:19:21,270 --> 00:19:23,310
Adam Curry: Only good, good
experiences.

312
00:19:23,820 --> 00:19:27,090
Dave Jones: So yeah, I think
this like the strive to be to be

313
00:19:27,210 --> 00:19:29,820
clear, if people didn't keep up
with that as the strike thing.

314
00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:33,870
Like what the feature that I was
talking about was, you can with

315
00:19:33,870 --> 00:19:37,200
the new version of strike you
can you know, is like you can

316
00:19:37,230 --> 00:19:40,350
attach a debit card to your
Stripe account and then you can

317
00:19:40,350 --> 00:19:45,030
pay a lightning payment. And you
don't have to already have a

318
00:19:45,030 --> 00:19:49,050
balance right? It will just it
will pay the payment. It will do

319
00:19:49,710 --> 00:19:54,660
it will immediately deduct
enough cash out of your debit

320
00:19:54,660 --> 00:19:57,600
card right then do the
conversion sin the lightning

321
00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:02,940
payment and you never have to
like transfer money out of your

322
00:20:02,940 --> 00:20:08,040
bank account into the into your
Bitcoin balance ahead of time.

323
00:20:08,100 --> 00:20:12,030
Right? It's just It does all the
conversion in one. One swift

324
00:20:12,030 --> 00:20:16,140
motion. Yeah. That's like,
that's how we get to that thing

325
00:20:16,140 --> 00:20:17,340
that they were talking about.

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00:20:17,609 --> 00:20:21,329
Adam Curry: Yeah. Yeah. And that
that is the way forward and

327
00:20:21,329 --> 00:20:24,029
Apple might be able to implement
that. I don't know if they will.

328
00:20:24,029 --> 00:20:26,009
I don't care. I really don't

329
00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:29,250
Dave Jones: you told James
Boggs, two and a half years,

330
00:20:29,250 --> 00:20:30,600
three years ago, they should
have

331
00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:35,760
Adam Curry: told them a lot of
things. And many left. He's

332
00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:40,050
like, Stacy, can do it all. Let
her do it.

333
00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:42,240
Dave Jones: He was like, How
about what do you think about

334
00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:44,160
this new Plaskett podcast
subscription thing that we're

335
00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:45,480
about to do? Like it's stupid.

336
00:20:49,230 --> 00:20:52,920
Adam Curry: So I want to talk
about Apple in a moment, because

337
00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:56,400
two other things I want to
mention to our developers. Right

338
00:20:56,400 --> 00:21:02,730
now, the breeze SDK, along with
green light, these are full

339
00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:07,980
noncustodial very simple to
implement wallets that are

340
00:21:07,980 --> 00:21:13,470
really full nodes that you can
use might want to consider

341
00:21:14,100 --> 00:21:19,470
looking at those, because we're
all on Albie right now. I love

342
00:21:19,470 --> 00:21:24,180
to get Alby guys, please don't
get me wrong. But it's it's

343
00:21:24,180 --> 00:21:28,560
going to be a sad day, when
you're going to be answering 100

344
00:21:28,650 --> 00:21:34,860
emails an hour of people saying
it doesn't work. And the breeze

345
00:21:34,860 --> 00:21:38,490
is doing with their SDK, which
is actually I think, may even

346
00:21:38,490 --> 00:21:41,730
become a part of get Alby. I
think that Roy mentioned that

347
00:21:41,730 --> 00:21:45,000
I'm not quite sure how they're
working together. But also, and

348
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,700
you get the you get your 12
words, you know, so you can

349
00:21:47,700 --> 00:21:50,730
backup your account, you can
recover your account from

350
00:21:50,730 --> 00:21:55,260
anywhere, it's fully
noncustodial. I think it's worth

351
00:21:55,260 --> 00:22:00,870
looking at, because we're so
reliant on really one player is

352
00:22:00,870 --> 00:22:06,030
just something I'd like to
mention. And they will

353
00:22:06,030 --> 00:22:11,130
eventually have key send
incoming mail. So it'll be two

354
00:22:11,130 --> 00:22:14,670
way and it might behoove you to
have that as a part of your app.

355
00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:17,580
So you can go up as

356
00:22:17,580 --> 00:22:21,390
Dave Jones: the green light just
went public. Yeah. They just

357
00:22:21,390 --> 00:22:25,440
released like, what, couple of
days ago? Yeah, as they

358
00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:27,600
Adam Curry: say, it's all really
simple. And you don't have to

359
00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:31,140
worry about stuff. And you don't
have to worry about liquidity or

360
00:22:31,140 --> 00:22:35,070
any of that any of that stuff.
It's worth having a look at, you

361
00:22:35,070 --> 00:22:40,200
know, just we should we should
have more options available. And

362
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,420
I think they're available, but
we haven't really talked about

363
00:22:42,420 --> 00:22:44,730
him and was just like, Okay,
it's implemented, it's good to

364
00:22:44,730 --> 00:22:51,780
go. But, you know, and then back
to Apple and podcasts, Pocket

365
00:22:51,780 --> 00:22:54,960
Casts, I just wanted to say how
incredibly disappointed I am in

366
00:22:54,960 --> 00:23:00,030
these people. Seriously, I mean,
we even have antenna pod now

367
00:23:00,060 --> 00:23:03,900
implement implementing
transcripts, there's so much

368
00:23:03,900 --> 00:23:08,580
richness being published. After
about three years, such rich

369
00:23:08,580 --> 00:23:13,680
content. And you really, I
think, you all know that your

370
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:17,670
business model is not going to
be in providing this for people

371
00:23:17,670 --> 00:23:21,930
who only use your app that the
content is being created freely

372
00:23:21,930 --> 00:23:27,960
for you by wonderful podcast
hosts. You know, it's there, he

373
00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:31,440
all you have to do is just
implement it. And I have high

374
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:36,090
hopes for Apple. Because of
Stacey now being over there. I

375
00:23:36,090 --> 00:23:40,260
hope that she can push through
some some of the newer modern

376
00:23:40,260 --> 00:23:44,250
features, but it's just like,
What are you guys doing? I mean,

377
00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:47,010
what is wrong with you? Do you
know where this came from? Do

378
00:23:47,010 --> 00:23:52,260
you know who your daddy is?
Daddy

379
00:23:56,400 --> 00:24:00,810
Dave Jones: Apple told us to
podcast moments ago that they

380
00:24:00,810 --> 00:24:03,870
were about to do transcripts in
the podcast in Apple podcasts

381
00:24:03,870 --> 00:24:07,950
and they still haven't done it.
Scripps is not that mean? Like

382
00:24:07,950 --> 00:24:13,020
that's, that's they've already
done it in in Apple Music is not

383
00:24:13,020 --> 00:24:16,140
like it's not gonna be able to
like copy and paste right.

384
00:24:18,630 --> 00:24:19,830
Adam Curry: I don't understand
why I

385
00:24:19,830 --> 00:24:23,820
Dave Jones: did enjoy this. I
did enjoy reading the podcast

386
00:24:23,820 --> 00:24:32,220
industrial complex, trying to.
Yes, I did enjoy reading All of

387
00:24:32,220 --> 00:24:39,120
the explanations that we worked
with Apple to convince them that

388
00:24:39,120 --> 00:24:43,350
their way of doing downloads,
automatic downloads was bad for

389
00:24:43,350 --> 00:24:47,400
the advertising industry.
Therefore, they said that they

390
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,820
were going to change and update
their tool and they did so we

391
00:24:50,820 --> 00:24:55,140
had this we all signed this
letter and blah blah. Sure. And

392
00:24:55,590 --> 00:24:59,130
then and then it comes out later
Apple says we made this change

393
00:24:59,130 --> 00:25:00,750
to improve battery Live? Yes.

394
00:25:02,310 --> 00:25:05,520
Adam Curry: Well, that is a
bring up a good point. And you

395
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:09,150
have some good opinions on this.
I would like to say that this

396
00:25:09,150 --> 00:25:15,030
latest change in iOS 17 shows
how fragile your business model

397
00:25:15,030 --> 00:25:20,670
is in the podcast industrial
complex, just wait until ipv6,

398
00:25:20,670 --> 00:25:23,880
and we're going to talk to our
boardroom guests today, when

399
00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:28,020
ipv6 become real, and it will
eventually mean it's showing up

400
00:25:28,020 --> 00:25:30,690
more and more, and you're going
to be gone, it's going to be

401
00:25:30,690 --> 00:25:35,130
done, whether it's ipv6, or
Apple flipping on their VPN, or

402
00:25:35,130 --> 00:25:39,570
just, you know, more VPNs in
general, the EO. And immediately

403
00:25:39,570 --> 00:25:44,790
I thought, how can I spin this
into something good? And well,

404
00:25:44,790 --> 00:25:48,930
first of all, why don't you talk
a little bit about you wrote a

405
00:25:48,930 --> 00:25:51,060
great blog post about this, I
should probably put that in the

406
00:25:51,060 --> 00:25:55,470
show notes. That the writing is
on the wall, it's coming. It's

407
00:25:55,470 --> 00:25:58,950
like a freight train. And the
pic is standing on the tracks

408
00:25:58,950 --> 00:26:02,220
going with what like a deer in
the headlights going, Whoa,

409
00:26:02,460 --> 00:26:04,260
what's those motorcycles,
Lincoln?

410
00:26:04,619 --> 00:26:05,069
Dave Jones: Cat?

411
00:26:06,030 --> 00:26:09,150
Adam Curry: Do you not see that
this is going to run right over

412
00:26:09,150 --> 00:26:12,750
you the image and you know, just
like Apple waited for a reason

413
00:26:12,750 --> 00:26:16,680
to do out this download thing
was oh, save battery life.

414
00:26:16,770 --> 00:26:21,810
They'll wait for another reason
to switch on the VPN. It's

415
00:26:21,810 --> 00:26:22,530
coming.

416
00:26:22,860 --> 00:26:25,260
Dave Jones: I've got a lot of
thoughts about Apple's role in

417
00:26:25,260 --> 00:26:34,680
things in you know, app. So
Apple, we've all been myself

418
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:40,350
included, have been irritated at
Apple for not allowing you to

419
00:26:40,350 --> 00:26:46,020
specify a default podcast app on
iOS. Yeah, for a very long time.

420
00:26:46,110 --> 00:26:48,900
And so, and I have railed about
it

421
00:26:48,930 --> 00:26:51,150
Adam Curry: anti competitive,
really, I mean, if I had enough

422
00:26:51,150 --> 00:26:53,430
money, I'd sue them over. It's
anti competitive.

423
00:26:53,820 --> 00:26:58,770
Dave Jones: It feels that way.
And but I've actually started to

424
00:27:00,180 --> 00:27:06,030
shift, I've started to see this
in a different way. It's still

425
00:27:06,870 --> 00:27:12,900
to be clear, is still
irritating. And but I think I

426
00:27:12,900 --> 00:27:15,090
may understand why they're doing
this.

427
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:18,119
Adam Curry: Okay. And why
they're doing what?

428
00:27:19,230 --> 00:27:24,030
Dave Jones: Why they don't allow
that. Oh, okay. So I think it's

429
00:27:24,030 --> 00:27:27,840
all has to do with the
competitive landscape. So they

430
00:27:27,870 --> 00:27:32,460
their apples in the business of,
you know, they have Apple Music.

431
00:27:33,120 --> 00:27:37,290
They have Apple TV, and they
have Apple podcasts, let's just

432
00:27:37,290 --> 00:27:41,100
say those are their three media
in media centric apps on the

433
00:27:41,100 --> 00:27:53,100
phone. And you have Spotify, who
has music and and podcasts. And

434
00:27:53,100 --> 00:27:57,360
now they're trying to do get
into video. You have YouTube,

435
00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:02,610
who has music pot, you know,
video, obviously, and now

436
00:28:02,610 --> 00:28:08,160
they're trying to get into
podcasts. So you have these two

437
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:12,300
players that over here, YouTube
and Spotify. I'm speaking as

438
00:28:12,300 --> 00:28:16,740
apples. This is this is an
apple. I won't even say I'm an

439
00:28:16,740 --> 00:28:20,100
Apple executive or an Apple guy.
I'm not gonna say I'm somebody

440
00:28:20,130 --> 00:28:24,060
in the Apple podcast team. And
those people have been there

441
00:28:24,060 --> 00:28:30,210
forever. And they have a
different perspective. They tend

442
00:28:30,210 --> 00:28:35,100
to care about open podcasting.
They may not always do

443
00:28:35,100 --> 00:28:38,460
everything, this ride for open
podcasting, but they do care

444
00:28:38,460 --> 00:28:43,230
about it. There's a there's a
history there. And they look at

445
00:28:43,230 --> 00:28:47,460
spod cast at Spotify, and
YouTube and they say okay, these

446
00:28:47,460 --> 00:28:51,870
are two walled gardens that if
we let them they are going to

447
00:28:51,870 --> 00:28:55,230
take over pod of they're going
to try to put a moat around open

448
00:28:55,230 --> 00:28:58,830
podcasting. There, they will try
to capture it.

449
00:28:59,460 --> 00:29:01,200
Adam Curry: Oh, and I know
exactly how they're gonna do it.

450
00:29:01,230 --> 00:29:02,190
You're I think you're right.

451
00:29:03,089 --> 00:29:08,219
Dave Jones: And if and if we
Apple began speaking as an apple

452
00:29:08,219 --> 00:29:14,009
podcast insider here, if we
Apple allow people to set a

453
00:29:14,009 --> 00:29:18,239
default pod, their own default
podcast app, they lose people,

454
00:29:18,539 --> 00:29:24,209
they lose, they lose the ability
to force podcast, open

455
00:29:24,209 --> 00:29:30,299
podcasting to be a thing on in
the Apple ecosystem. Right now

456
00:29:30,299 --> 00:29:33,719
if you want to play in the Apple
ecosystem in the podcasting

457
00:29:33,719 --> 00:29:40,019
world, your your 99% of the time
forced into the apple podcast

458
00:29:40,019 --> 00:29:44,999
app, which still uses RSS as his
primary mechanism. If you allow

459
00:29:44,999 --> 00:29:50,429
that to to change, immediately,
immediately. You run the risk of

460
00:29:50,429 --> 00:29:58,979
having 25% or plus of the
podcast world, maybe switch over

461
00:29:58,979 --> 00:30:04,529
to become confined behind
Spotify. And I think they care.

462
00:30:05,009 --> 00:30:08,069
I think they care about that not
happening. They don't make money

463
00:30:08,069 --> 00:30:11,339
off. Apple doesn't make any
money on podcasting. No, but

464
00:30:11,489 --> 00:30:17,159
they do care about not giving.
I'm not saying this is all

465
00:30:17,159 --> 00:30:20,639
altruistic, I think it's I think
it's enlightened self interest

466
00:30:20,639 --> 00:30:25,289
on their part. They don't want
to give YouTube and Spotify,

467
00:30:25,859 --> 00:30:30,599
more leverage in the worlds of
music and video correct, either.

468
00:30:30,869 --> 00:30:35,219
And so this is their way of
maintaining a fragmentation to

469
00:30:35,219 --> 00:30:39,479
Spotify and YouTube can't, can't
overcome. Well, I

470
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:43,290
Adam Curry: can already predict
what's going to happen. And I

471
00:30:43,350 --> 00:30:46,620
will make a prediction and a
recommendation. One, they're

472
00:30:46,620 --> 00:30:50,040
going to expand their own names
namespace to add transcripts,

473
00:30:50,100 --> 00:30:53,340
maybe chapters. Oh, god, oh,
yeah, they're going to add it to

474
00:30:53,340 --> 00:30:58,350
their namespace. My
recommendation would be to also

475
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:03,630
recognize the podcast namespace.
And by the way, if they do that,

476
00:31:04,590 --> 00:31:10,380
I'll start a lawsuit. I will, I
will, I will sue them. Yeah. I

477
00:31:10,380 --> 00:31:11,160
think we can't wait.

478
00:31:11,820 --> 00:31:13,080
Dave Jones: As long as they're
assholes.

479
00:31:14,790 --> 00:31:17,340
Adam Curry: illegal. It's
illegal in America to be in a

480
00:31:17,370 --> 00:31:17,700
hole

481
00:31:21,570 --> 00:31:23,370
Dave Jones: that's what I got.
That's what got Alex Jones.

482
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:23,790
Yeah.

483
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:27,960
Adam Curry: Exactly what happens
in

484
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:32,250
Dave Jones: boys what it boils
down to people, like, why do

485
00:31:32,940 --> 00:31:33,840
these just nail

486
00:31:35,130 --> 00:31:38,040
Adam Curry: we'll see, but it
will be beautiful. If they just

487
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:41,250
said, You know what, there's
this. There's hundreds of 1000s

488
00:31:41,250 --> 00:31:45,480
of feeds that have transcripts,
hundreds of 1000s of feeds that

489
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:50,370
have chapters, maybe start, you
know, easily and I understand

490
00:31:50,370 --> 00:31:53,430
they want to control the
experience. And, you know, but

491
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:57,840
play with us play with us become
our friends again. To Steve

492
00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:02,250
died, it became horrible. He
wasn't the best. He really

493
00:32:02,250 --> 00:32:06,630
wasn't. But the initial, the
initial start, the initial

494
00:32:06,630 --> 00:32:10,200
openness that Steve Jobs had,
and how can we help you guys?

495
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:14,730
How can we make this work for
you? was beautiful. And okay,

496
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:18,390
you know, yeah, so you still
started off by promoting NPR and

497
00:32:18,390 --> 00:32:26,280
PBS and BBC. It's okay. We get
it. But the his, he had a Kismat

498
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:30,030
about him. You know, he had a
Louis that he understood that,

499
00:32:30,060 --> 00:32:32,310
you know, these are the people
who are making it work. We don't

500
00:32:32,310 --> 00:32:35,910
have to do anything. We can only
benefit people want our devices.

501
00:32:36,510 --> 00:32:41,070
That's it. Anyway, we may have
done I'm getting to be as bad as

502
00:32:41,100 --> 00:32:44,790
Todd Cochran talking about
YouTube, by the way. We have I

503
00:32:44,790 --> 00:32:47,700
wish I think we should bring
them in and we're going to do a

504
00:32:47,700 --> 00:32:51,510
drinking game. Instead of a
drink every single time Todd

505
00:32:51,540 --> 00:32:54,630
Todd Cochran says YouTube you
have to boost boosts every

506
00:32:54,630 --> 00:32:57,690
single time Todd mentions
YouTube you have to is that a

507
00:32:57,690 --> 00:32:59,310
good game? Should we try that
for today?

508
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:01,620
Dave Jones: And I don't wait.
Let me refill my wallet.

509
00:33:03,660 --> 00:33:06,150
Adam Curry: Let's bring him in
because we're already way into

510
00:33:06,150 --> 00:33:09,420
their into their territory.
Welcome to the podcasting 2.0.

511
00:33:09,660 --> 00:33:13,740
board room. We have Mike Dell
and Todd Cochran from blueberry.

512
00:33:13,740 --> 00:33:15,030
Hello, gentlemen.

513
00:33:15,180 --> 00:33:16,830
Todd Cochran: Happy podcasting,
gentlemen.

514
00:33:17,010 --> 00:33:20,430
Mike Dell: Yes, it's a nice nice
boardroom. You must have

515
00:33:20,430 --> 00:33:21,030
painted.

516
00:33:21,210 --> 00:33:24,210
Adam Curry: Thank you. It smells
a bit so it's a little kind of

517
00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:27,420
freshly painted vibe. Yeah. Good
to have you guys back. It's been

518
00:33:27,420 --> 00:33:27,990
a while.

519
00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:32,670
Dave Jones: Yeah, we've been
busy. Very busy,

520
00:33:32,700 --> 00:33:35,850
Adam Curry: very busy. Very
busy. Tired, of course, is my

521
00:33:35,850 --> 00:33:39,660
crack dealer. Every single time
that new media show comes on.

522
00:33:40,410 --> 00:33:43,710
Like, I'm gonna do some crack.
I'm gonna do some crack. I'm

523
00:33:43,710 --> 00:33:45,870
gonna sit there and be
aggravated and get sick from it.

524
00:33:45,870 --> 00:33:48,690
But I want the crack. I want the
crack. But I

525
00:33:48,690 --> 00:33:51,450
Todd Cochran: could offer to
fill your Satoshi bucket today.

526
00:33:51,450 --> 00:33:54,060
But let's not talk about the
company that should not be

527
00:33:54,060 --> 00:33:54,810
talking about

528
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:58,380
Adam Curry: Good luck. Good
luck. Good luck with that. Good

529
00:33:58,380 --> 00:34:01,380
luck. Hey, I had a question for
you right off the bat. Just you

530
00:34:01,380 --> 00:34:03,660
know, since we're in the
transparency of the boardroom

531
00:34:03,930 --> 00:34:08,730
Sure. You mentioned about a
month ago I think that your

532
00:34:08,730 --> 00:34:11,790
value for value numbers you
reverse engineer it because you

533
00:34:11,790 --> 00:34:16,140
know you got a split from from
every payment that your

534
00:34:16,140 --> 00:34:19,380
customers get and you said that
podcasters had received about

535
00:34:19,380 --> 00:34:23,970
$10,000 value for value. Yep.
Which is phenomenal I thank you

536
00:34:23,970 --> 00:34:27,360
for thank you for mentioning
that number. What's interesting

537
00:34:27,390 --> 00:34:34,050
is you were talking about this
being a fraction of your ad

538
00:34:34,050 --> 00:34:36,840
numbers and then you had all
right I can't I can't tell

539
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:42,390
anybody or I can't talk about
why can't you tell us what your

540
00:34:42,390 --> 00:34:45,240
podcasts are making with
advertising is why is that a

541
00:34:45,240 --> 00:34:45,750
secret?

542
00:34:46,290 --> 00:34:48,870
Todd Cochran: My board just fire
me I'm still accountable I you

543
00:34:48,870 --> 00:34:50,610
know, there's certain things we
don't talk about.

544
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:53,610
Adam Curry: But value for value
numbers are okay but add numbers

545
00:34:53,610 --> 00:34:56,940
are not okay. Like you know,
because I talked about the

546
00:34:56,940 --> 00:34:59,940
payout I mean not not the total
amount but the payout to

547
00:35:00,450 --> 00:35:02,940
Todd Cochran: to podcast, I
suppose we could I think the

548
00:35:02,940 --> 00:35:07,290
challenge is, is that we? I
tried to be careful. Yeah, no.

549
00:35:07,290 --> 00:35:09,900
And you never know what's going
to trigger a board member to get

550
00:35:09,900 --> 00:35:13,710
upset at me. The the podcasting
2.0 stuff, they kind of let me

551
00:35:13,710 --> 00:35:17,370
run with scissors with it. I'm
sure when that

552
00:35:17,460 --> 00:35:21,690
Adam Curry: is it is 10% The
number of value for value versus

553
00:35:21,690 --> 00:35:24,030
ads? Is it less than 10%?

554
00:35:24,300 --> 00:35:27,300
Todd Cochran: I will say that
the programmatic ads is many

555
00:35:27,300 --> 00:35:32,220
multiples of value for sure.
Yeah, six times

556
00:35:32,250 --> 00:35:36,000
Adam Curry: seven. Come on. Next
question.

557
00:35:39,510 --> 00:35:41,370
Mike Dell: Todd just joined up
or something?

558
00:35:43,230 --> 00:35:46,440
Dave Jones: What did you think
about my, my apple opinion,

559
00:35:46,500 --> 00:35:47,010
Todd?

560
00:35:47,610 --> 00:35:50,730
Todd Cochran: You know? Yeah,
here's the thing about Apple.

561
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:55,530
Over the years, I've learned how
to how should we say, as Apple

562
00:35:55,530 --> 00:35:58,680
nicely for things because they
never talk whatever people say

563
00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:03,570
about Apple making a decision.
It often comes from gentle

564
00:36:03,570 --> 00:36:06,420
persuasion, say, hey, we'd love
to see you guys do this, it

565
00:36:06,420 --> 00:36:09,000
would help us this way. And then
they kind of go, Oh, that's

566
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,300
cool. They'll never they'll
never say anything committal. I

567
00:36:12,300 --> 00:36:15,870
call it contractor talk. It's
just like, you know, they're

568
00:36:15,870 --> 00:36:18,210
very, very careful. But then
every once in a while, they'll

569
00:36:18,210 --> 00:36:21,060
throw us a bone and something
shows up. And, and I kind of

570
00:36:21,060 --> 00:36:24,360
smile. And, you know, I'll
silently send off an email to,

571
00:36:24,420 --> 00:36:26,670
you know, 10, or one of the guys
or one of the folks over there,

572
00:36:26,670 --> 00:36:32,130
say, hey, thanks. And of course,
they never respond. But they do.

573
00:36:32,820 --> 00:36:33,030
But

574
00:36:33,660 --> 00:36:36,210
Adam Curry: they can't respond
either. You know, that might be

575
00:36:36,210 --> 00:36:40,350
culpable in some Whoa. But part.
It's really, it's really, it's

576
00:36:40,350 --> 00:36:46,290
really sad. It makes me sad. But
also, it just makes me want to

577
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:49,200
position them as your
granddaddies app, you know,

578
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,240
because that's what it is, at
this point. I mean, look at the

579
00:36:51,240 --> 00:36:54,810
magic of, of some of these
podcasts, apps, look at the

580
00:36:54,810 --> 00:36:58,410
phenomenal things are being
done. And by in no small part,

581
00:36:58,410 --> 00:37:02,460
thanks to blueberry. Now,
there's content that wants to be

582
00:37:02,460 --> 00:37:07,140
published. It's there, you know,
it's like, why wouldn't you want

583
00:37:07,140 --> 00:37:09,930
to take that content? It's
there. It's free.

584
00:37:10,860 --> 00:37:13,770
Mike Dell: There was, you know,
there, they are definitely what

585
00:37:13,770 --> 00:37:17,640
I call a legacy app, you know,
there. There's still a big

586
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:23,430
player, but not much changes
over there. As far as, you know,

587
00:37:23,430 --> 00:37:26,070
the customer experience, I
should say, I

588
00:37:26,070 --> 00:37:28,230
Adam Curry: think it'd be, I
mean, think about that. Because

589
00:37:28,230 --> 00:37:32,370
what what would Dave just said
that, you know, they want to

590
00:37:32,370 --> 00:37:35,040
have that competitive, and they
want to keep it fragmented. So

591
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,430
Spotify is over here. Think
about what happens the minute

592
00:37:38,610 --> 00:37:42,180
Apple says, Oh, by the way,
we've implemented all of these

593
00:37:42,180 --> 00:37:47,100
new features that are available
to you on all these podcast

594
00:37:47,100 --> 00:37:51,180
hosts and look at all the cool
stuff we have now. Spotify, you

595
00:37:51,180 --> 00:37:53,550
know, they'd be they'd be caught
with their pants down.

596
00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:56,730
Todd Cochran: If they did
announce that champagnes on me.

597
00:37:56,970 --> 00:38:01,320
So yeah, but you know that.
That's what we can hope for. And

598
00:38:01,650 --> 00:38:02,520
And how about Pocket

599
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,650
Adam Curry: Casts? What's wrong
with those people? Seriously?

600
00:38:04,860 --> 00:38:09,630
What's wrong? Matt? I don't
understand. We had meetings, we,

601
00:38:09,900 --> 00:38:13,290
we laid it out, there was
interest, we showed everything.

602
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:17,340
And then you know, it's like,
nothing, nothing. You bought a

603
00:38:17,340 --> 00:38:20,400
product? And here's a great way
to differentiate.

604
00:38:21,090 --> 00:38:22,830
Todd Cochran: Yeah, I talked to
some of their team members over

605
00:38:22,830 --> 00:38:24,990
there, too. They were talking to
us about power press a little

606
00:38:24,990 --> 00:38:26,820
bit, and then they just kind of
go silent.

607
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:32,640
Dave Jones: I think you know,
the people, the listeners do

608
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:37,170
choose podcast apps, based on
features. Like, you know,

609
00:38:37,260 --> 00:38:40,350
there's yes, there's a large
portion of podcast listeners

610
00:38:40,350 --> 00:38:43,830
that did obviously just go with
whatever the default app is.

611
00:38:44,220 --> 00:38:47,730
That's, that's that is a thing
that happens for sure. But there

612
00:38:47,730 --> 00:38:53,070
are a sizable number of of
people who they tried to take

613
00:38:53,070 --> 00:38:55,230
indica switched to a different
app. And they're like, well,

614
00:38:55,350 --> 00:38:59,160
this new app doesn't have this
feature that I have fallen in

615
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:03,210
love with on this old app. And
so like for you think about

616
00:39:03,210 --> 00:39:06,180
things like sleep timers and
stuff like that. Some people are

617
00:39:06,180 --> 00:39:10,620
really in bed, you know, they're
really attached to a particular

618
00:39:10,620 --> 00:39:15,180
feature of an app. And I feel
like if Apple started

619
00:39:15,180 --> 00:39:18,780
implementing some of these some
of the podcasting two point of

620
00:39:18,780 --> 00:39:22,230
features in a way because
otherwise if you look at it it's

621
00:39:22,230 --> 00:39:25,200
a great it's actually add the
pie Apple podcasts out is a good

622
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:30,210
app. It's a quality piece of
praise a quality product. It

623
00:39:30,210 --> 00:39:33,240
doesn't look like crap, it looks
great. If they started adding

624
00:39:33,240 --> 00:39:36,360
some of these features, it would
give people even more incentive

625
00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:40,800
not to go to youtube Spotify.
Others are there because the

626
00:39:40,800 --> 00:39:44,850
YouTube and Spotify YouTube
doesn't give a crap and Spotify

627
00:39:46,290 --> 00:39:49,560
they add features nobody cares
about you mentioned like YouTube

628
00:39:50,100 --> 00:39:54,300
Yeah, but I'm not talking Yes,
I'm

629
00:39:54,300 --> 00:39:56,610
Adam Curry: sorry. You're right.
My mistake my mistake you get a

630
00:39:56,610 --> 00:39:59,970
pat Todd is crackling though man
you got like some discharge have

631
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:02,640
Putting and I mean, that's
electrical discharge.

632
00:40:03,690 --> 00:40:07,350
Todd Cochran: Benson weird.
We're on fire here. You know I,

633
00:40:08,130 --> 00:40:12,300
Apple though they're fully about
the listener experience. And we

634
00:40:12,300 --> 00:40:14,790
understand that all these new
features are added to the

635
00:40:14,790 --> 00:40:18,660
listener experience. But they do
things their own way at their

636
00:40:18,660 --> 00:40:21,750
own pace, and they're never
committal. So your guess is as

637
00:40:21,750 --> 00:40:24,630
good as mine. But a TED in the
rest. I know you guys are

638
00:40:24,630 --> 00:40:25,920
listening. But meanwhile,

639
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,620
Adam Curry: may I make a
recommendation? Next time Apple

640
00:40:28,620 --> 00:40:31,410
decides to do something just
revolts like the removal of

641
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:39,630
email addresses and whoa, whoa.
No, stop, stop. Just we got to

642
00:40:39,720 --> 00:40:42,210
we have to start fighting back.

643
00:40:43,140 --> 00:40:47,370
Mike Dell: And as a fellow
support guy, yeah. I feel

644
00:40:48,630 --> 00:40:50,370
Adam Curry: it's, I mean, at
this point, it's gotten to the

645
00:40:50,370 --> 00:40:53,430
point where delete my podcast
from your platform, like, Okay,

646
00:40:53,430 --> 00:40:56,070
done. If someone else says it
was, if it was wrong, we'll

647
00:40:56,070 --> 00:40:57,300
bring it back. We'll bring it
back.

648
00:40:57,870 --> 00:40:59,100
Dave Jones: Fine bounds
checking.

649
00:40:59,969 --> 00:41:02,069
Adam Curry: All right, you good
done. All right, but don't like

650
00:41:02,069 --> 00:41:02,489
you

651
00:41:02,490 --> 00:41:04,710
Mike Dell: were talking about
listeners picking an app, you

652
00:41:04,710 --> 00:41:10,230
know, I, I use overcast as my
kind of daily driver. But for,

653
00:41:10,260 --> 00:41:14,460
you know, value for value shows
and all that I use pod verse and

654
00:41:14,460 --> 00:41:18,060
there's things in pod verse
that, yeah, that don't exist.

655
00:41:18,060 --> 00:41:21,510
Exactly. You know, exactly. I
have auto playlists. And it's

656
00:41:21,510 --> 00:41:24,840
really hard. To do that in
covers,

657
00:41:24,870 --> 00:41:27,270
Adam Curry: all I do is I just
pick it, I pick an app and I

658
00:41:27,270 --> 00:41:32,370
just promote it on no agenda
promoting podcast guru now. It's

659
00:41:32,370 --> 00:41:35,640
taking away actual Apple market
share no problem.

660
00:41:36,090 --> 00:41:38,370
Todd Cochran: It's just like
podcasters move into different

661
00:41:38,370 --> 00:41:41,340
podcast hosts, they don't once
they get into a podcast, so so

662
00:41:41,340 --> 00:41:44,040
pretty comfortable on a small
percentage might move at some

663
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:47,850
point is something really
supercharges them. But listeners

664
00:41:47,850 --> 00:41:51,000
the same way they get an app,
they get comfortable. So what I

665
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:53,370
really go after those brand new
listeners saying, Hey, if you're

666
00:41:53,370 --> 00:41:56,130
new, you know, go over there to
podcast apps.com and grab

667
00:41:56,130 --> 00:41:58,560
yourself a new modern podcast
app, they don't know any

668
00:41:58,560 --> 00:42:00,390
difference. Training from

669
00:42:00,450 --> 00:42:04,200
Adam Curry: I agree, that's the
most not to call yourself

670
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:07,320
previously on the training
business that we don't train our

671
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:13,620
audiences. But it makes sense to
just say, hey, use this app,

672
00:42:13,620 --> 00:42:18,930
because it's, and I think still,
one of the top reasons to use a

673
00:42:18,930 --> 00:42:23,220
modern podcast app is pod ping.
Like how many people are like,

674
00:42:23,550 --> 00:42:27,450
Yo p will be posting screenshots
on acts like oh, great show,

675
00:42:27,450 --> 00:42:30,450
look at this art, and people go,
Hey, man, it's still not an

676
00:42:30,450 --> 00:42:34,680
apple. And I was like, Well,
yeah, because Apple doesn't

677
00:42:34,680 --> 00:42:38,280
implement the the beautiful pod
ping system, which is their free

678
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:41,880
for use. A Todd will save the
mice.

679
00:42:42,060 --> 00:42:44,610
Dave Jones: Why do you think
that is that people don't switch

680
00:42:44,610 --> 00:42:48,570
podcasting hosts more often?
Because you're obviously right,

681
00:42:48,570 --> 00:42:51,240
it's a small percentage that
makes this switch. And then you

682
00:42:51,240 --> 00:42:54,930
have people that switch and this
switch back? Like, what do you

683
00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:57,810
is it that they just come
forward the UI with the payment

684
00:42:57,840 --> 00:42:59,700
with the way the payments work?
Like what do you what do you

685
00:42:59,700 --> 00:43:00,510
think that's all? Well,

686
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:03,000
Todd Cochran: oftentimes, and
Mike can probably speak this

687
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:06,630
more than I can, they will leave
us because they've been told by

688
00:43:06,660 --> 00:43:09,990
a advertising agency, they have
to host a specific platform and

689
00:43:09,990 --> 00:43:13,500
say, well, we'll leave the
lights on for you and about 75%

690
00:43:13,500 --> 00:43:18,510
of them come back. But those
that come to us are our Georgia

691
00:43:18,540 --> 00:43:21,870
technical podcasters podcasts
that understand all of these

692
00:43:21,870 --> 00:43:27,150
features. So again, it goes back
into literally educating

693
00:43:27,150 --> 00:43:30,450
podcasters about these features
that that are now being

694
00:43:30,450 --> 00:43:33,270
available to them and how it can
make how and we have to just

695
00:43:33,270 --> 00:43:36,300
continue to press that story at
least at blueberry and and that

696
00:43:36,300 --> 00:43:39,300
word Buzzsprout and RSS blue and
everyone else this our job is to

697
00:43:39,300 --> 00:43:44,190
talk about these new these new
great features but you know when

698
00:43:44,190 --> 00:43:46,680
Mike has to teach someone how to
right click their mouse that

699
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:48,030
tells you why they don't move

700
00:43:48,150 --> 00:43:52,410
Adam Curry: Sure. And what what
percentage of your customers do

701
00:43:52,410 --> 00:43:55,620
you think are using really using
the 2.0 features and know their

702
00:43:55,620 --> 00:44:01,230
habit and and are actively
engaged in in even telling

703
00:44:01,230 --> 00:44:04,860
people about modern podcast apps
is it best subtenants More

704
00:44:04,860 --> 00:44:07,770
Mike Dell: and more I've noticed
you know I'm getting more

705
00:44:07,770 --> 00:44:10,650
questions I know what do I do
for this you know I've I've

706
00:44:10,650 --> 00:44:15,090
shown people how to do value for
value and you know live God

707
00:44:15,090 --> 00:44:20,670
bless you they put a whole
network on that's live 24/7 And

708
00:44:20,700 --> 00:44:23,700
I put that lit tag in there for
him or helped him do it and

709
00:44:23,970 --> 00:44:25,920
they've been getting a lot of
traction with that

710
00:44:28,410 --> 00:44:31,230
Todd Cochran: I should run the
numbers but again I would say

711
00:44:31,230 --> 00:44:32,820
sub 10% For sure you know

712
00:44:32,879 --> 00:44:37,289
Mike Dell: it's not much more
than that Yeah. If that yeah, it

713
00:44:37,289 --> 00:44:40,709
new incoming customers I know so
yeah, in fact people moving to

714
00:44:40,709 --> 00:44:44,609
us there's a higher percentage
because the you know we do get

715
00:44:44,609 --> 00:44:48,479
some moves big specifically
because of these features

716
00:44:49,020 --> 00:44:51,360
Dave Jones: in his that come in.
I'm guessing that's coming into

717
00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:55,800
like podcasts mirror and podcast
and power press more than

718
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:57,000
blueberry proper are

719
00:44:57,690 --> 00:44:59,970
Mike Dell: good, you know a
little of everything you know

720
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:04,050
lot of the mirror the new mirror
customers are are there for that

721
00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:09,000
reason. But, you know, just it
could be their way or publisher

722
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:10,980
system or how's that? How's

723
00:45:10,980 --> 00:45:12,960
Adam Curry: it going in general
podcast mirror? Do you? Are you

724
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:14,070
seeing uptake of that?

725
00:45:14,670 --> 00:45:17,490
Todd Cochran: Yeah, we're
seeing. I ran revenue report on

726
00:45:17,490 --> 00:45:20,760
it the other day, and I'm pretty
happy with month one. And the

727
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:24,000
goal, I have a goal number, you
know, in the first quarter on

728
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:26,100
it, so we'll see where we hit.
And we're, you know, we're

729
00:45:26,100 --> 00:45:29,730
watching where people are coming
from and we have had some

730
00:45:29,730 --> 00:45:30,960
SoundCloud people move.

731
00:45:30,989 --> 00:45:34,829
Adam Curry: Yeah, good. Good. I
love that you have that guy.

732
00:45:35,310 --> 00:45:37,530
Todd Cochran: But but mere Yeah,
they're mirroring there's,

733
00:45:37,530 --> 00:45:37,890
there's

734
00:45:37,890 --> 00:45:40,710
Adam Curry: no, yeah, yeah. And
do they do use the value tags?

735
00:45:40,710 --> 00:45:42,000
Or the what are they using it
for?

736
00:45:42,030 --> 00:45:44,130
Todd Cochran: Yeah, they're
using the value tag. So you

737
00:45:44,130 --> 00:45:47,400
know, it's and again, it's, it's
really about word of mouth of

738
00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:50,970
getting that information out
there. Because, again, you

739
00:45:50,970 --> 00:45:54,270
probably have 99.9% of people
that put stuff on SoundCloud,

740
00:45:54,270 --> 00:45:57,300
they had no clue what value for
value is. So

741
00:45:57,510 --> 00:46:00,090
Adam Curry: what I'm seeing is
everybody needs if you have a

742
00:46:00,090 --> 00:46:02,580
musician in your life and
artists in your life, and you're

743
00:46:02,580 --> 00:46:05,910
listening, and you know what's
going on, you know, these are

744
00:46:05,910 --> 00:46:08,940
the people you need to help and
it's very effective. I mean, I

745
00:46:08,940 --> 00:46:15,030
saw Steve Webb, who's an OG God
caster, onboard, like four

746
00:46:15,030 --> 00:46:18,510
different artists. And yeah,
he's walking them through it,

747
00:46:18,510 --> 00:46:22,410
you know, he's like, Okay,
here's your, here's your wallet.

748
00:46:22,410 --> 00:46:25,080
And he sets it up for him and
does all that stuff. And you

749
00:46:25,080 --> 00:46:28,770
know, and he's helping them with
either but I think actually

750
00:46:28,770 --> 00:46:31,740
helps them with music side
project, or I don't know why he

751
00:46:31,740 --> 00:46:38,130
was putting off maybe RSS blue.
And the and you can I get I get

752
00:46:38,130 --> 00:46:40,860
emails like, hey, you know, this
guy helped me and I'm seeing the

753
00:46:40,860 --> 00:46:45,030
stuff come in, and like, this is
cool. It's like, they're really

754
00:46:45,030 --> 00:46:49,650
blown away. That that just you
know, something's happening.

755
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:53,340
They're seeing something
something's returning. And it's,

756
00:46:53,370 --> 00:46:56,550
it's beautiful. When when people
just see that and feel good

757
00:46:56,550 --> 00:46:57,180
about it.

758
00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:00,629
Todd Cochran: Yeah, Steve is in
my email every once awhile

759
00:47:00,629 --> 00:47:04,649
saying, hey, when's value time
split? And so where am I? I am

760
00:47:04,709 --> 00:47:05,789
I'm getting grumpy

761
00:47:07,590 --> 00:47:11,130
Adam Curry: about them. Release.
Release. Release time.

762
00:47:12,030 --> 00:47:16,410
Dave Jones: They can't let me so
but Buzzsprout released pod

763
00:47:16,410 --> 00:47:21,690
roll. today. Are you are y'all
doing pod roll?

764
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:25,080
Todd Cochran: We're doing we're
doing pod roll. We're doing

765
00:47:25,080 --> 00:47:27,630
Valley time split. We're doing
remote item. What else are we

766
00:47:27,630 --> 00:47:32,130
doing? Okay. I think there was
one more Yeah, fourth,

767
00:47:32,370 --> 00:47:34,350
Mike Dell: block block. We're
doing the bottle.

768
00:47:34,470 --> 00:47:37,560
Dave Jones: Okay. Yeah, cuz,
because but because the pod roll

769
00:47:38,010 --> 00:47:42,300
tag is like, I'm, I'm just
chomping at the bit for this.

770
00:47:42,300 --> 00:47:42,990
Because that,

771
00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:46,050
Adam Curry: that's that that's
the of the discovery mechanism

772
00:47:46,050 --> 00:47:46,830
we're looking at, right,

773
00:47:47,010 --> 00:47:50,310
Dave Jones: man, it's just gold,
it's the discovery gold, like

774
00:47:50,310 --> 00:47:55,470
the, the the listener side of
the equation is more difficult.

775
00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:59,490
Because apps don't want to
share, you know, listen, even

776
00:47:59,490 --> 00:48:01,800
and not they have this weird
thing. They don't want to share

777
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:06,030
it anonymized listener open, you
know, feed lists and things like

778
00:48:06,030 --> 00:48:09,450
that. And plus, you know, it's a
little clouded too, because you

779
00:48:09,450 --> 00:48:13,620
have all these feeds that people
subscribe to, that they never

780
00:48:13,620 --> 00:48:16,770
really listened to anymore. So
they're just like, they may be

781
00:48:16,770 --> 00:48:18,930
in their feed list, but they
hadn't listened to the show in

782
00:48:18,930 --> 00:48:25,710
five years. So like to be able
to get podcasters to, to go

783
00:48:25,710 --> 00:48:28,560
through and say, Hey, these are
the shows I recommend, even if

784
00:48:28,560 --> 00:48:31,830
it's their own shows, I mean,
doesn't matter. You know, or

785
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:36,930
even if the podcast hosting
company says, here's 510 15

786
00:48:36,930 --> 00:48:40,710
great shows that we recommend
from our net from our network of

787
00:48:40,710 --> 00:48:45,720
shows. Like, to me that is a
strong signal of that I want to

788
00:48:46,050 --> 00:48:50,670
use for discovery. Yeah, I want
to push that out in an API, that

789
00:48:50,670 --> 00:48:55,320
we're where podcast app 2.0 apps
can grab it, and have an instant

790
00:48:55,320 --> 00:49:01,230
way of having some clean, very
usable recommendations to start

791
00:49:01,230 --> 00:49:01,320
with.

792
00:49:01,739 --> 00:49:04,739
Adam Curry: I'd love to have it
in sovereign feeds. Even though

793
00:49:05,189 --> 00:49:05,699
even though

794
00:49:06,540 --> 00:49:10,680
Todd Cochran: the we got a demo
on Wednesday of everything,

795
00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:14,040
except for Valley time split. So
now the Dev is working on that.

796
00:49:14,040 --> 00:49:17,340
So I don't know if we're gonna
release pod roll and remote item

797
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:20,250
first, and then very time split.
I don't know what how they're

798
00:49:20,250 --> 00:49:23,340
gonna sequence it out. But I
made a couple of weeks. I'm got

799
00:49:23,340 --> 00:49:24,090
my fingers crossed.

800
00:49:24,150 --> 00:49:26,400
Dave Jones: Sweet, sweet.
Awesome. Yeah, I'm looking

801
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:26,610
forward

802
00:49:26,610 --> 00:49:28,440
Mike Dell: to that. And we got
to get back to the top of that

803
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:29,340
list, you know.

804
00:49:31,980 --> 00:49:33,840
Dave Jones: stopped trying to
compete with Samsung, I think

805
00:49:33,870 --> 00:49:35,880
that's possible.

806
00:49:36,870 --> 00:49:38,460
Adam Curry: But you know, it's
what I love that what's

807
00:49:38,460 --> 00:49:42,570
happening is we're seeing more
it's small right now, of course,

808
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:46,560
but I truly believe the music.
The value for value music

809
00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:51,210
podcasts is a category and it's
a category that will bring in

810
00:49:51,210 --> 00:49:56,040
people, new people. It'll bring
in existing people like Cody

811
00:49:56,040 --> 00:50:00,000
from Kerrville. It'll bring in
you know, it'll enable people

812
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:03,630
Hold to just play a song, I
think particularly for hosts as

813
00:50:03,630 --> 00:50:08,130
the music look up stuff, which
seems to be the way to go, you

814
00:50:08,130 --> 00:50:11,550
know, even just for people to,
you know, to even just discover

815
00:50:11,550 --> 00:50:15,600
music, I mean, ln beats all this
stuff, this is going to happen.

816
00:50:15,690 --> 00:50:19,380
I mean, it's it's unseen. I've
never seen this much enthusiasm

817
00:50:19,560 --> 00:50:23,070
of people who are willing to sit
down and break their brain

818
00:50:23,070 --> 00:50:26,250
trying to figure out how does
this work? What do I do? I want

819
00:50:26,250 --> 00:50:29,880
to do it, how do I how do I make
this work within the interface

820
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:34,560
or whatever? It's, it's, I think
it is a will be a boon for

821
00:50:34,560 --> 00:50:37,500
podcast hosts? Yes, let's get
you to the top.

822
00:50:37,859 --> 00:50:40,739
Todd Cochran: You know, our, our
challenge is always we have two

823
00:50:40,739 --> 00:50:44,099
development tracks, we have to
update power press. And then we

824
00:50:44,099 --> 00:50:46,379
also have to update our
dashboard. So we actually have

825
00:50:46,379 --> 00:50:48,329
to do twice the work to deploy

826
00:50:48,419 --> 00:50:51,749
Mike Dell: an eternal level
mirror now so the area

827
00:50:51,780 --> 00:50:57,690
Dave Jones: mirror to Yeah, that
is your, um, I'm going to I want

828
00:50:57,690 --> 00:51:02,070
to ask this general question
about your hosting customers.

829
00:51:02,820 --> 00:51:06,240
When or not, maybe not, it's not
your customers on ask about

830
00:51:06,240 --> 00:51:11,580
your, the feeds in the podcast
that you host. Do you have a

831
00:51:11,580 --> 00:51:17,040
sense for? What what would be a
breakdown? If you had to just

832
00:51:17,040 --> 00:51:22,170
guess of people that just do
podcasts like this couple of

833
00:51:22,170 --> 00:51:29,040
people talking? People that do
more highly produced podcasts?

834
00:51:29,610 --> 00:51:33,600
People that do maybe audiobooks?
Like? What do you think the

835
00:51:33,600 --> 00:51:37,920
brain? What is your sense of the
breakdown of how your podcast

836
00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:42,300
base at blueberry? What is the
types of content they're being

837
00:51:42,300 --> 00:51:42,810
put out?

838
00:51:43,469 --> 00:51:47,399
Todd Cochran: Oh, they're
definitely either solo, or have

839
00:51:47,399 --> 00:51:51,239
a guest or they're two hosts and
have a guest. It's really good.

840
00:51:51,239 --> 00:51:54,929
And we've never really ran the
numbers that way. I often look

841
00:51:54,929 --> 00:51:58,619
at it as a split between what we
call dashboard customers and

842
00:51:58,619 --> 00:52:01,859
those who are in power press
that runs about 70 3070 to the

843
00:52:01,859 --> 00:52:07,859
power press side, and not all
those hosts with us. So I don't

844
00:52:07,859 --> 00:52:10,469
know, Mike, you talk to the
customers every day what what I

845
00:52:10,469 --> 00:52:11,129
would say?

846
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:16,470
Mike Dell: I would say probably
80 to 85% are hobbyist

847
00:52:16,470 --> 00:52:20,730
podcasters is what I call that,
you know, aren't really that

848
00:52:20,730 --> 00:52:23,310
interested in making money. I
mean, yeah, a little a little

849
00:52:23,310 --> 00:52:27,000
going out to dinner money be
good, but that's not their main

850
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:32,580
focus. And then, you know, we
got another 10 or 15% that are,

851
00:52:32,730 --> 00:52:36,180
you know, more serious about it
and trying to make a living and

852
00:52:36,180 --> 00:52:40,890
her try, you know, are doing it
for some corporate reason, or

853
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:42,330
government debts reason.

854
00:52:42,360 --> 00:52:45,510
Dave Jones: So there's just some
some folks that solo or some

855
00:52:45,510 --> 00:52:48,240
folks talk in or maybe a guest
interview show,

856
00:52:48,300 --> 00:52:50,610
Adam Curry: I bet you How about
your corporate a bit corporate

857
00:52:50,610 --> 00:52:53,190
is bigger than we think over
there. Yeah, we have

858
00:52:53,190 --> 00:52:54,570
Todd Cochran: a huge corporate,

859
00:52:56,250 --> 00:52:58,350
Mike Dell: corporate and some
government entities

860
00:52:58,380 --> 00:52:59,280
universities,

861
00:52:59,310 --> 00:53:01,830
Adam Curry: is that is that
usually private feeds or is it

862
00:53:02,220 --> 00:53:04,560
like internet type stuff? No, we

863
00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:08,220
Todd Cochran: have DOJ, we have
Senate House Representatives

864
00:53:08,250 --> 00:53:12,090
Voice of America. We got it. And
there's a pile. There's our

865
00:53:12,090 --> 00:53:16,710
pile. Yeah. Bunch. Most most of
those are public podcasts. Let's

866
00:53:16,710 --> 00:53:17,520
get DOJ

867
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:20,070
Adam Curry: on value for value.
That would be

868
00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:23,760
Mike Dell: why not Oh, VOA
should do it.

869
00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:28,140
Adam Curry: Propaganda arm of
the US government. Why not? Let

870
00:53:28,140 --> 00:53:30,120
them promote something for us
for a change?

871
00:53:30,150 --> 00:53:33,360
Todd Cochran: You want an eye
opener? They have an incredible

872
00:53:33,570 --> 00:53:35,610
large number of shows. I mean, I
know I

873
00:53:35,610 --> 00:53:37,800
Adam Curry: know. They're doing
Oh, I knew that. Yeah, for sure.

874
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:40,020
You know, you could also tell
them like this is a great way to

875
00:53:40,020 --> 00:53:42,450
track stuff you know, this is a
great way to see who's really

876
00:53:42,450 --> 00:53:45,420
listening percentage but

877
00:53:45,630 --> 00:53:48,210
Mike Dell: it was it was a list
might close to 400 shows like

878
00:53:48,210 --> 00:53:52,260
yeah, right close to 400. And I
bought war my elbow pushing the

879
00:53:52,260 --> 00:53:54,030
monster on the desk getting them
set up.

880
00:53:55,260 --> 00:53:58,740
Dave Jones: Is it the Department
of jet US Department of Justice?

881
00:53:58,920 --> 00:53:59,040
They're

882
00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:03,960
Adam Curry: paying the rent
Nice. government paying nice.

883
00:54:04,200 --> 00:54:07,230
Dave Jones: A the DOJ is already
selling Bitcoin. So they've got

884
00:54:07,260 --> 00:54:08,130
they've got away

885
00:54:10,530 --> 00:54:12,120
Adam Curry: their confiscated
Bitcoin. What

886
00:54:12,120 --> 00:54:13,260
Mike Dell: if we get a little
hobby?

887
00:54:14,040 --> 00:54:16,830
Dave Jones: Is this justice.gov?
Is that what we're talking

888
00:54:16,830 --> 00:54:17,910
about? Because

889
00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:21,450
Todd Cochran: I don't I don't
look up there. We just they just

890
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:22,530
have justice.com?

891
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:25,680
Dave Jones: Yeah. Okay. So you
don't look at it because you

892
00:54:25,680 --> 00:54:28,350
don't want anybody to know that
you're Googling for justice.

893
00:54:29,220 --> 00:54:29,640
Justice.

894
00:54:31,980 --> 00:54:33,180
Adam Curry: That many podcasts.

895
00:54:33,780 --> 00:54:35,970
Todd Cochran: You guys said
something earlier that you guys

896
00:54:35,970 --> 00:54:38,700
said something earlier that
triggered me the ipv6 you want

897
00:54:38,700 --> 00:54:39,270
to talk about that?

898
00:54:39,270 --> 00:54:42,930
Adam Curry: Yeah, I do. Kind of.
Yeah, yes. Yes. Yes. So the

899
00:54:42,930 --> 00:54:43,290
challenge

900
00:54:43,290 --> 00:54:46,440
Todd Cochran: with ipv6 is
originally ipv6 was designed

901
00:54:46,440 --> 00:54:50,700
that everyone would get an ipv6
for life. Well, yeah. gonna

902
00:54:50,700 --> 00:54:55,140
happen and now they matter of
fact, they those ipv6 addresses

903
00:54:55,140 --> 00:55:00,090
get reassigned. I mean, like, it
could be every 10 minutes. You

904
00:55:00,090 --> 00:55:04,770
get a new ipv6 extension. But
what we've found, and I think

905
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:07,680
I'm not an expert, Dave, you can
correct me if I'm wrong. I call

906
00:55:07,680 --> 00:55:15,150
him ochils. The if you have
like, the fourth, Octo, that's

907
00:55:15,150 --> 00:55:19,290
the one updates like rapidly,
and but the three prior articles

908
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:21,090
do not. So did I say that?

909
00:55:21,570 --> 00:55:24,690
Dave Jones: Yeah, yeah, that's
the first do the first section

910
00:55:24,690 --> 00:55:28,260
is the ASN and then everything
else 228 bit address?

911
00:55:28,710 --> 00:55:30,510
Todd Cochran: Yeah, so the if
you had like,

912
00:55:30,510 --> 00:55:39,240
2001 2001 2001 1000, the 1000
changes and 807 65 Boy 43 on a

913
00:55:39,600 --> 00:55:44,430
daily, really regular basis. But
those first three, pretty much

914
00:55:44,430 --> 00:55:47,220
lock in those don't move too
much. So yeah, it's gonna, it's

915
00:55:47,220 --> 00:55:49,770
going to change the Istat
systems quite a bit.

916
00:55:50,430 --> 00:55:53,070
Dave Jones: And that's, I mean,
that's mostly mobile right now.

917
00:55:53,100 --> 00:55:53,490
Yeah, the

918
00:55:53,489 --> 00:55:56,519
Adam Curry: road has three
mobile needs, they have to move

919
00:55:56,519 --> 00:55:59,189
to ipv6.

920
00:55:59,550 --> 00:56:01,980
Todd Cochran: It's mostly
outside the United States to its

921
00:56:01,980 --> 00:56:06,180
UC Asia is picked up by V six,
huge. I mean, it's, you know,

922
00:56:06,180 --> 00:56:09,420
because I'd be before there. If
you didn't have an ipv4 block,

923
00:56:09,420 --> 00:56:10,710
you know, you can't get them no
more.

924
00:56:11,340 --> 00:56:12,540
Adam Curry: Right. Yeah. Right.

925
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:15,180
Dave Jones: Yeah, and that's
gonna I mean, all of these

926
00:56:15,180 --> 00:56:19,740
things, like, I mean, it's just
the, the way that the, the,

927
00:56:19,800 --> 00:56:22,530
it's, we've been talking about
this lately, the podcast

928
00:56:22,530 --> 00:56:25,440
industrial complex, really is
just the digital advertising

929
00:56:25,470 --> 00:56:31,440
industry. And they, they're
clueless about how to get off

930
00:56:32,070 --> 00:56:35,460
being so dependent on IP
addresses. Because this this is

931
00:56:35,460 --> 00:56:39,630
going it's the writing has been
on the wall for so long. And all

932
00:56:39,630 --> 00:56:42,810
they do is just gripe about it.
They have, they have no actual

933
00:56:42,810 --> 00:56:43,590
solutions.

934
00:56:43,650 --> 00:56:46,050
Todd Cochran: They kick the can
down the road. But I know from

935
00:56:46,050 --> 00:56:49,140
discussions I've been in with
the IB, and so forth, there are

936
00:56:49,170 --> 00:56:50,400
people that are panicking.

937
00:56:51,150 --> 00:56:54,930
Dave Jones: Yeah, they shouldn't
be panicking. Because the, the,

938
00:56:55,080 --> 00:56:57,300
in the specifically I was
talking about the IB at their

939
00:56:57,300 --> 00:57:01,470
last conference, the keynote,
Nga was just talking about he

940
00:57:01,470 --> 00:57:05,490
was just bitching the whole time
about about Apple private relay

941
00:57:06,510 --> 00:57:07,080
didn't know

942
00:57:07,410 --> 00:57:09,150
Adam Curry: what keynote was,
what keynote was

943
00:57:09,630 --> 00:57:11,820
Mike Dell: released in Chrome
two.

944
00:57:13,500 --> 00:57:15,750
Dave Jones: Yeah, and this is
going to become more and more of

945
00:57:15,750 --> 00:57:19,800
a thing. Where, because if you
think you can, you don't even

946
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:24,900
have to, you don't even have to
think very hard about it. If you

947
00:57:24,900 --> 00:57:32,190
just look at Apple, Google and
Microsoft, you can you can know

948
00:57:32,190 --> 00:57:35,940
ahead of time that they're not
going to want to let that data

949
00:57:35,940 --> 00:57:39,630
escape. They want to use it. But
they're not going to want to let

950
00:57:39,630 --> 00:57:44,790
third parties use it. And so it
just embed the hooves them to

951
00:57:44,790 --> 00:57:48,690
put some sort of wrapper around
the content that goes across

952
00:57:48,690 --> 00:57:51,960
their platform, so that they're
the ones that get the benefit of

953
00:57:51,960 --> 00:57:56,730
being able to see it. But then
it also but then when it exits

954
00:57:56,760 --> 00:58:00,870
onto the open internet, all
that's gone. So there's just no,

955
00:58:00,900 --> 00:58:03,600
there's not going to be oh,
there's no way to stop this

956
00:58:03,600 --> 00:58:07,860
train in the UK. If you're, you
know, so you have to start doing

957
00:58:07,860 --> 00:58:11,040
the difficult work. I think
that's what this all boils down

958
00:58:11,040 --> 00:58:12,660
to honestly, it's just laziness.

959
00:58:12,930 --> 00:58:15,660
Adam Curry: Is this this is
Dave, is this not the very

960
00:58:15,660 --> 00:58:20,070
reason why Google is going for
the VPN, so that they still will

961
00:58:20,070 --> 00:58:24,240
be able to track the ads. Isn't
that the that has to be the

962
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:27,270
nobody else will be able to?
Well, no, but they don't care.

963
00:58:27,300 --> 00:58:31,650
So but they're gonna give you a
free VPN, basically, I guess, as

964
00:58:31,650 --> 00:58:34,500
a part of your experience, and
you'll get used to it and you'll

965
00:58:34,500 --> 00:58:37,680
like it. And it'll be fast and
reliable. And you'll feel good.

966
00:58:37,920 --> 00:58:41,340
But then they they and only they
will be able to track the the

967
00:58:41,340 --> 00:58:44,010
advertising that runs through
it. I presume that's why they're

968
00:58:44,010 --> 00:58:44,760
doing this.

969
00:58:45,150 --> 00:58:46,710
Todd Cochran: Now it's so
crooked

970
00:58:46,710 --> 00:58:49,500
Mike Dell: in my or maybe maybe
they'll try to sell it back to

971
00:58:49,500 --> 00:58:51,240
the advertisers. How about

972
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:56,100
Adam Curry: this idea? It's a
it's a very old idea. But maybe

973
00:58:56,100 --> 00:59:02,070
it's time to consider. So we
have this wonderful system, we

974
00:59:02,070 --> 00:59:04,800
know exactly when someone's
listening down to the minute.

975
00:59:05,280 --> 00:59:09,060
And if you gave your listeners
the opportunity, but if I said,

976
00:59:09,090 --> 00:59:12,330
All right, you know what, I want
to try something, I'm gonna give

977
00:59:12,360 --> 00:59:16,470
you all a wallet, then here's an
app with a wallet and start

978
00:59:16,470 --> 00:59:23,460
using this. And by turning it on
and sending me one Satoshi view

979
00:59:23,460 --> 00:59:25,650
will be signaling to me that
you're interested in

980
00:59:25,650 --> 00:59:28,560
advertisements that I select for
you. So I'm just I'm turning

981
00:59:28,560 --> 00:59:31,470
that model on its head now
instead of interruption based,

982
00:59:31,770 --> 00:59:35,400
instead of forcing in your face.
I like ads. I mean, there's

983
00:59:35,430 --> 00:59:37,320
there's lots of shows where I'm
like, oh, I want I want to hear

984
00:59:37,320 --> 00:59:40,770
the ads that you have if you the
podcasts are selected them for

985
00:59:40,770 --> 00:59:44,460
me. And that doesn't mean that I
don't necessarily want I mean, I

986
00:59:44,460 --> 00:59:48,810
might want to an insurance
company ad, but okay. And then

987
00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:53,430
for every ad that I listened to,
you'll actually cut me in on

988
00:59:53,430 --> 00:59:58,620
that. Yeah, and then and the
advertisers have to be in this

989
00:59:58,620 --> 01:00:01,320
as well. I think there's a way
that we can do this because we

990
01:00:01,320 --> 01:00:06,870
have this mechanism, which shows
the attention is there that the

991
01:00:06,870 --> 01:00:09,540
play button has been pressed
that someone is listening in

992
01:00:09,540 --> 01:00:13,260
real time. I mean, it. And I
understand this. There's ways to

993
01:00:13,260 --> 01:00:18,150
game the system. But I feel like
there's something in there that

994
01:00:18,150 --> 01:00:21,630
enough people would probably it
would jack, your CPM rates up to

995
01:00:21,630 --> 01:00:25,290
150. Believe me, if she if you
could use that, look, I've

996
01:00:25,320 --> 01:00:27,960
proven these people want to hear
your ad, they're listening to

997
01:00:27,960 --> 01:00:30,450
your ad. Is there something
there? Do you think that would

998
01:00:30,450 --> 01:00:31,620
ever be possible?

999
01:00:31,950 --> 01:00:33,840
Todd Cochran: Oh, there's
something there because they're

1000
01:00:33,840 --> 01:00:36,090
so hardcore on attribution right
now.

1001
01:00:37,980 --> 01:00:39,660
Mike Dell: For value for
attributes, and that's what

1002
01:00:39,660 --> 01:00:42,210
Adam Curry: I'm talking about.
But you determine what the

1003
01:00:42,210 --> 01:00:46,500
attributes are. I determine what
I'm going to send along, I can

1004
01:00:46,500 --> 01:00:50,220
be completely anonymous, I can
give you my email address, and

1005
01:00:50,250 --> 01:00:53,340
all this stuff can can be sent
in the to V record, I see Alex

1006
01:00:53,340 --> 01:00:57,210
gaze, rolling his eyes. But all
of that can. Maybe me, maybe

1007
01:00:57,210 --> 01:00:59,760
it's time to talk about his
guaranteed payment record or

1008
01:00:59,760 --> 01:01:03,030
whatever. I'm just thinking some
payment tokens. Can we get out

1009
01:01:03,030 --> 01:01:06,540
ahead of this? Because I'm not
anti advertising at all?

1010
01:01:07,440 --> 01:01:10,380
Todd Cochran: Adam? So do you
want to get back on the media

1011
01:01:10,380 --> 01:01:13,230
buyer training, go to New York
and start briefing him because

1012
01:01:13,260 --> 01:01:16,560
I'm sad, this is what's going to
take it's going to take someone

1013
01:01:16,560 --> 01:01:19,620
going to them and saying, okay,
hey, we got a new way of doing

1014
01:01:19,620 --> 01:01:23,400
attribution. And do you want on
this on this train? I'm sure

1015
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,940
some would say yes. But you
know, we have a hard night hard

1016
01:01:26,940 --> 01:01:29,880
enough time telling them. You
know, the story we've been

1017
01:01:29,880 --> 01:01:31,560
telling them for 19 years. You
bet.

1018
01:01:31,590 --> 01:01:33,930
Adam Curry: Yeah. But listen, I
come into the room. And the

1019
01:01:33,930 --> 01:01:37,830
first thing I say is, do you
know who your daddy is? And then

1020
01:01:37,860 --> 01:01:40,260
we're done. And that's, that's
it? We're good. We're good.

1021
01:01:41,040 --> 01:01:43,260
Dave Jones: I'd rather just see
it fail because it's fun or for

1022
01:01:43,260 --> 01:01:43,620
the show.

1023
01:01:45,660 --> 01:01:50,460
Adam Curry: No, I'm not anti
advertising. I enjoy hearing

1024
01:01:50,460 --> 01:01:53,460
certain ads. And it should be a
way to turn it off to like, you

1025
01:01:53,460 --> 01:01:56,490
know, for some reason, Spotify
still gives me ads, even though

1026
01:01:56,490 --> 01:01:59,190
almost subscribe for premium
subscriber, whatever it does is

1027
01:01:59,190 --> 01:02:03,000
still get ads. And I'm not
interested in Joe Rogan's ads,

1028
01:02:03,299 --> 01:02:05,729
Mike Dell: I'm not gonna gotta
pay Joe, though. So they have to

1029
01:02:05,729 --> 01:02:07,139
do something. Well, but you

1030
01:02:07,140 --> 01:02:11,280
Adam Curry: had, something has
to give, because the system is

1031
01:02:11,280 --> 01:02:16,260
broken, the gatekeepers idea is
broken. We broke that it's done.

1032
01:02:16,260 --> 01:02:19,440
It's over that that's not going
to, you know, this is nonlinear

1033
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:23,760
media. I read by heard on pod
news that now what is it to

1034
01:02:23,760 --> 01:02:26,700
audio boom, we have 1 billion
impressions. Well, there goes

1035
01:02:26,700 --> 01:02:31,260
your CPM rate. Yeah, yeah,
hello, that's obvious.

1036
01:02:31,529 --> 01:02:33,449
Todd Cochran: I think you're on
this stuff that I'm gonna have

1037
01:02:33,449 --> 01:02:35,129
to grind to that, you know

1038
01:02:35,130 --> 01:02:38,580
Adam Curry: what, I'll tell you
something. And I have enough

1039
01:02:38,580 --> 01:02:42,180
shows that I could do this with,
I'd be very interested in giving

1040
01:02:42,180 --> 01:02:45,900
it a shot that I'd be interested
in. And yeah, I'll go to New

1041
01:02:45,900 --> 01:02:49,680
York with you. And I'll go in
front of up to one trip in front

1042
01:02:49,680 --> 01:02:53,880
of the media buyers. And if we
can really show an example of

1043
01:02:53,880 --> 01:02:56,310
how it would work. You know, of
course, the CPM rate would have

1044
01:02:56,310 --> 01:02:59,430
to be outrageous. That's right.
And it will have to send value

1045
01:02:59,430 --> 01:03:04,530
back to the people who are self
identifying that I think there's

1046
01:03:04,530 --> 01:03:09,600
something there, I really do.
That's if people know that I am,

1047
01:03:09,630 --> 01:03:12,900
because already, that's a lot of
podcasts, I don't want that ad,

1048
01:03:12,900 --> 01:03:17,040
I don't want that. I don't want
that. So if I'm in charge of

1049
01:03:17,220 --> 01:03:20,310
selecting the ads, just as I'm
in charge of my topics, or

1050
01:03:20,310 --> 01:03:23,310
whatever else, and people trust
me, they're listening to me for

1051
01:03:23,310 --> 01:03:25,950
that reason. And if they say, I
love you out on what I don't

1052
01:03:25,950 --> 01:03:28,260
want to hear it, then don't
attribute yourself you won't get

1053
01:03:28,260 --> 01:03:31,500
you won't hear anything. But if
you do, then you're gonna get

1054
01:03:31,500 --> 01:03:34,230
the ad, and you're gonna get a
token of appreciation back,

1055
01:03:34,230 --> 01:03:37,020
we're gonna send some value back
for you. Thank you for being a

1056
01:03:37,020 --> 01:03:38,010
part of the system.

1057
01:03:38,520 --> 01:03:40,470
Todd Cochran: It's it's
definitely something that's got

1058
01:03:40,470 --> 01:03:43,290
me thinking here. So yeah,

1059
01:03:43,739 --> 01:03:46,199
Dave Jones: you're right, Todd,
but because the attribution

1060
01:03:46,199 --> 01:03:50,129
piece, that attribution piece
tells me that there's a problem.

1061
01:03:50,699 --> 01:03:54,359
The fact that everybody is now
that was at BetterHelp, is now

1062
01:03:54,359 --> 01:03:58,949
forcing all all their people to
use a tracking pixel. You know,

1063
01:03:58,979 --> 01:04:02,279
this is becoming more of a
thing, we hear more and more

1064
01:04:02,279 --> 01:04:05,729
shows talking about how their
advertiser reached out and told

1065
01:04:05,729 --> 01:04:08,309
them they want them to start
using track tracking pixel

1066
01:04:08,310 --> 01:04:12,060
Adam Curry: and Dave, check it
out. With value for value, you

1067
01:04:12,060 --> 01:04:15,300
just add a split to the
advertiser, they can track it,

1068
01:04:15,300 --> 01:04:18,420
then there's no third party.
It's it's the listener

1069
01:04:18,420 --> 01:04:22,830
determines. Everybody knows the
people who are involved in in

1070
01:04:22,830 --> 01:04:25,680
the in the agreement, it's an
open agreement

1071
01:04:25,680 --> 01:04:28,830
Dave Jones: and pixel it's a
tracking Satoshi it's a it's a

1072
01:04:28,830 --> 01:04:29,610
track oshi

1073
01:04:31,380 --> 01:04:35,460
Todd Cochran: backtracks once
trucks he goes, that's nice. It

1074
01:04:35,460 --> 01:04:39,570
goes back to one simple thing.
It's the problem we've had since

1075
01:04:39,570 --> 01:04:42,510
the beginning, did they listen?
Because we don't have the

1076
01:04:42,510 --> 01:04:45,330
clients I don't that's all it
is. That's what they're trying

1077
01:04:45,330 --> 01:04:47,220
to get the answer did that
person

1078
01:04:47,670 --> 01:04:50,550
Adam Curry: and would also
removed the data brokers because

1079
01:04:50,580 --> 01:04:53,190
you know, what people really
want is that why do they want

1080
01:04:53,190 --> 01:04:57,900
your IP address? That's very, we
know what curry does look at all

1081
01:04:57,900 --> 01:05:00,360
this traffic that he's looking
at what he's doing. Oh, See what

1082
01:05:00,360 --> 01:05:04,620
he does? Oh, he, he sends
traffic to American express.com

1083
01:05:04,980 --> 01:05:06,870
Oh, this is where guy now,

1084
01:05:07,890 --> 01:05:11,580
Mike Dell: things get things get
big enough though even that much

1085
01:05:11,580 --> 01:05:13,800
data who's gonna sift through
all that stuff?

1086
01:05:15,120 --> 01:05:18,330
Adam Curry: Well, the Oracle,
they have a whole business and

1087
01:05:18,330 --> 01:05:21,090
they have a whole business doing
that they sell your time and

1088
01:05:21,090 --> 01:05:21,930
time again,

1089
01:05:22,170 --> 01:05:24,000
Dave Jones: I'll tell you
exactly where it gets super

1090
01:05:24,000 --> 01:05:29,400
creepy for me in we had a local,
we had a local special election

1091
01:05:29,400 --> 01:05:36,600
because the house the Alabama
State House and see that from my

1092
01:05:36,600 --> 01:05:40,380
district that I live in, the guy
got kicked out for corruption.

1093
01:05:40,380 --> 01:05:44,910
So they had a special election.
And it was between two people.

1094
01:05:45,390 --> 01:05:50,850
And the that now the district
that I live in, is the most

1095
01:05:50,850 --> 01:05:54,600
crazy drone district you've ever
seen in your life? I mean, it

1096
01:05:54,600 --> 01:05:59,670
looks like, you know, it looks
like a spiral graph. It is crazy

1097
01:05:59,700 --> 01:06:04,410
all over the place. It makes no
sense. So the only way that you

1098
01:06:04,410 --> 01:06:08,850
would determine. So I'm watching
YouTube and watching a YouTube

1099
01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:12,990
video on my phone. And I started
getting ads for one of the

1100
01:06:12,990 --> 01:06:17,430
candidates from House District
55. Which is my district. The

1101
01:06:17,520 --> 01:06:21,810
only way that you would know
that, that I should get that ad

1102
01:06:22,590 --> 01:06:27,270
is if you know how your mind
Xact if you know my exact house

1103
01:06:27,270 --> 01:06:30,300
address this tied to my IP
address at that moment, and

1104
01:06:30,300 --> 01:06:33,150
Adam Curry: that's so that's so
well known Dave. Yeah, no.

1105
01:06:33,149 --> 01:06:36,119
Dave Jones: And so I'm like, but
it's most of the time you get

1106
01:06:36,119 --> 01:06:40,019
like local ads for car
dealerships and things like

1107
01:06:40,019 --> 01:06:45,119
this. And it doesn't really, it
doesn't show you how creepy the

1108
01:06:45,119 --> 01:06:48,839
tracking is. But then every now
and then you'll get something

1109
01:06:48,839 --> 01:06:52,709
like that. And you're like, oh
my god, they know exactly who I

1110
01:06:52,709 --> 01:06:54,569
am and where I live. Yeah, like
the

1111
01:06:54,570 --> 01:06:58,530
Todd Cochran: day that it creeps
you out day they know who and a

1112
01:06:58,530 --> 01:07:04,080
household listen to an ad. Okay,
so that's, that's, that's the

1113
01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:07,710
crazy part. But I saw some demos
before that. I mean, really,

1114
01:07:07,740 --> 01:07:10,530
this is why we are hardcore
privacy, blueberry, I would

1115
01:07:10,530 --> 01:07:12,150
never employ any of that.

1116
01:07:13,739 --> 01:07:18,269
Mike Dell: That's so creepy.
There's a new version of Wi Fi,

1117
01:07:18,449 --> 01:07:23,339
where they're able to map out
the inside of your house, using

1118
01:07:23,369 --> 01:07:24,449
your Wi Fi router.

1119
01:07:24,480 --> 01:07:27,510
Adam Curry: Yeah, exactly. See
where you're walking? Yeah.

1120
01:07:28,140 --> 01:07:32,160
Well, no, you need what you need
as an anchor club advertiser to

1121
01:07:32,160 --> 01:07:36,270
do this, you know, fast moving
consumer goods type type deal.

1122
01:07:36,570 --> 01:07:40,140
And someone who's willing to try
it with you, you could, I guess

1123
01:07:40,170 --> 01:07:43,140
probably the smartest way to do
it is to be nice to team up with

1124
01:07:43,140 --> 01:07:46,980
an advertising agency and make
it there when you know, cut them

1125
01:07:46,980 --> 01:07:50,070
in for their for their 15% or
whatever it is, you know, their

1126
01:07:50,100 --> 01:07:54,270
their media buy fee. But I think
there's I've been in this

1127
01:07:54,270 --> 01:07:57,840
business. And I understand I
understand it. And I also

1128
01:07:57,840 --> 01:08:04,830
understand that there is a real
need for first of all this a

1129
01:08:04,830 --> 01:08:09,960
desirable audience is it just is
it you could think about it, you

1130
01:08:09,960 --> 01:08:14,130
can say, how about this, along
with my payment record, I'm

1131
01:08:14,130 --> 01:08:17,940
gonna leave that open for Alex
guys to develop. It would say

1132
01:08:17,970 --> 01:08:23,880
I'm interested in political ads.
I'm interested in food ads, you

1133
01:08:23,880 --> 01:08:26,760
know, you could tick some boxes,
use the Google topics thing,

1134
01:08:26,790 --> 01:08:27,480
whatever. It's

1135
01:08:27,540 --> 01:08:28,230
Dave Jones: a good list,

1136
01:08:28,260 --> 01:08:32,610
Adam Curry: you can use all of
that it's time. The only problem

1137
01:08:32,610 --> 01:08:36,930
here is we're treating our
listeners are our troops and

1138
01:08:36,930 --> 01:08:42,000
customers as dirt as stupid dirt
like you don't count Shut up.

1139
01:08:42,180 --> 01:08:45,660
You're not supposed to know what
we're doing with you. Ah, we're

1140
01:08:45,660 --> 01:08:49,170
gonna throw this in your face.
You're stupid dirt. We don't

1141
01:08:49,170 --> 01:08:52,620
care about you. And if you
because people are smart people

1142
01:08:52,620 --> 01:08:54,630
like oh, right, you know, hey,
look, give me a little bit of

1143
01:08:54,630 --> 01:08:59,880
value back for letting you this
has always been the dream, opt

1144
01:08:59,880 --> 01:09:03,270
in, it'd be great. Okay. I mean,
I've heard all of these, there's

1145
01:09:03,270 --> 01:09:06,540
been so many different versions
of this, but we actually have

1146
01:09:06,540 --> 01:09:11,310
one. And we have, you know,
16,000 feeds that are using it.

1147
01:09:11,310 --> 01:09:17,340
And I would presume most of them
are active. So, let's just do

1148
01:09:17,340 --> 01:09:20,370
times 10. Just to make it
simple. That's how many

1149
01:09:20,370 --> 01:09:22,980
listeners there are. It's
probably a lot more than if

1150
01:09:22,980 --> 01:09:26,850
people have the opportunity to
opt into something and I get 10x

1151
01:09:26,850 --> 01:09:30,750
on my SAT that I send or
whatever it is. I think I think

1152
01:09:30,750 --> 01:09:34,260
people would be amenable to it
because they people want to

1153
01:09:34,260 --> 01:09:37,050
learn things they really do and
you wouldn't have to be so

1154
01:09:37,050 --> 01:09:38,940
insulting with your ads either.

1155
01:09:39,930 --> 01:09:42,150
Dave Jones: Okay, I'm I'm
allowed to talk about YouTube

1156
01:09:42,150 --> 01:09:47,580
retards. Not at this hour. I'm
going to toss this as an ally.

1157
01:09:47,730 --> 01:09:51,180
Adam Curry: Let me just answer
one thing Ice Cube soup. It's

1158
01:09:51,180 --> 01:09:55,290
less creepy because they don't
have your IP address. They only

1159
01:09:55,320 --> 01:09:59,310
have what you just give them.
Well let me spin on a lightning

1160
01:09:59,310 --> 01:10:02,010
payment is an animus there's no
way to track where that came

1161
01:10:02,010 --> 01:10:06,330
from. So it turns the creepy
upside down. Go ahead, Dave.

1162
01:10:07,320 --> 01:10:10,500
Dave Jones: So I still just
don't think that YouTube is a

1163
01:10:10,500 --> 01:10:14,070
profitable company. I'm with
you. And I don't think they're

1164
01:10:14,070 --> 01:10:17,850
profitable. I think they make
tons of revenue. And I don't, I

1165
01:10:17,850 --> 01:10:20,820
don't see that they've made it.
If they've made any profit it

1166
01:10:20,820 --> 01:10:23,640
has, it's so small that they're
not willing to talk about it

1167
01:10:23,640 --> 01:10:26,640
publicly, because they don't
release the numbers. And if

1168
01:10:26,640 --> 01:10:33,510
that's the, if that's true, then
there that is the largest walled

1169
01:10:33,510 --> 01:10:37,980
garden of digital advertising
that exists. It is a completely

1170
01:10:37,980 --> 01:10:42,660
captured platform, it has no
competitor, YouTube, on the

1171
01:10:42,660 --> 01:10:47,100
video side of things is it has
no competition. And if they

1172
01:10:47,100 --> 01:10:51,750
can't even make a decent profit
or any profit at all, then this

1173
01:10:51,750 --> 01:10:55,020
is not this is not a this is not
a workable system. Now their

1174
01:10:55,020 --> 01:10:55,530
overhead

1175
01:10:55,530 --> 01:10:57,600
Adam Curry: is huge. The
overhead is huge. And you know,

1176
01:10:57,600 --> 01:11:01,470
you have to just the ingest, and
the transcoding of all those cat

1177
01:11:01,470 --> 01:11:05,340
videos. But even then, it's you
know, think about it just think

1178
01:11:05,340 --> 01:11:09,360
about, think about the Lightning
Network, just as an opt in

1179
01:11:09,390 --> 01:11:14,610
identification system. And who
said this, Spencer says his

1180
01:11:14,640 --> 01:11:17,790
people love getting 14 SATs a
day from fountain when they

1181
01:11:17,790 --> 01:11:20,700
don't get it. They're all up in
the telegram screeching about

1182
01:11:20,700 --> 01:11:24,480
it. Yeah. People like getting
stuff for free. You know, that

1183
01:11:24,480 --> 01:11:28,470
one of the the most tried and
trued ways of getting someone to

1184
01:11:28,470 --> 01:11:31,740
respond to a piece of mail you
get in the mailbox, if someone

1185
01:11:31,740 --> 01:11:35,880
says here's $1. And they put $1
bill in there, it works. It's

1186
01:11:35,880 --> 01:11:37,170
still working radio

1187
01:11:37,170 --> 01:11:38,190
Mike Dell: stat system.

1188
01:11:39,360 --> 01:11:44,970
Adam Curry: The river, yeah.
Yeah, for the Arbitron ratings.

1189
01:11:46,170 --> 01:11:51,030
But what's beautiful is there
are tons of SDKs. There's all

1190
01:11:51,030 --> 01:11:56,130
kinds of, there's all kinds of
programming bits and bobs around

1191
01:11:56,220 --> 01:12:02,070
for anybody to implement this
into any system, any system. And

1192
01:12:02,070 --> 01:12:04,470
then, you know, people can
maintain their own wallet, they

1193
01:12:04,470 --> 01:12:08,220
can maintain, you know, and it
can just be an app means it

1194
01:12:08,220 --> 01:12:12,300
maybe it's just the advertising
app, you know, all of this stuff

1195
01:12:12,300 --> 01:12:15,840
is totally possible. If we, if
we take it, if we look at the

1196
01:12:16,110 --> 01:12:19,500
value for value as a
identification mechanism, or an

1197
01:12:19,500 --> 01:12:23,880
opt in mechanism for a second
instead of as, as a payment

1198
01:12:23,880 --> 01:12:26,760
mechanism. The thing I see it,

1199
01:12:27,450 --> 01:12:30,420
Todd Cochran: you know, I the
company that shall be not named

1200
01:12:30,450 --> 01:12:34,830
and you know, they're raising
their prices for ad free. Yeah.

1201
01:12:35,280 --> 01:12:40,260
And that's going global. At the
same time. You know, I know

1202
01:12:40,260 --> 01:12:43,230
Adam, you can roll your eyes on
some of this, but the AI search

1203
01:12:43,230 --> 01:12:47,400
is going to change Google's
complete model on display

1204
01:12:47,400 --> 01:12:48,900
advertising, and

1205
01:12:49,170 --> 01:12:51,150
Adam Curry: they're gonna lose
more money, they're gonna lose

1206
01:12:51,150 --> 01:12:53,820
more money, because it's very
expensive to have everybody

1207
01:12:53,820 --> 01:12:56,280
using that kind of CPU power.

1208
01:12:56,520 --> 01:12:59,130
Todd Cochran: And at the same
time, I'm afraid those of us

1209
01:12:59,130 --> 01:13:03,150
that have our own dot coms or FB
work that much harder to be to

1210
01:13:03,150 --> 01:13:05,670
be found, because I think
searches is about to be

1211
01:13:05,670 --> 01:13:07,170
completely destroyed. Now may

1212
01:13:07,170 --> 01:13:09,570
Adam Curry: ask your question
about this. Do you really

1213
01:13:09,570 --> 01:13:13,200
believe most people find
podcasts because of a search?

1214
01:13:13,740 --> 01:13:15,300
Todd Cochran: Do well, we know
that we know that

1215
01:13:15,330 --> 01:13:18,510
Adam Curry: what's not What do
you know what? What is? So it's,

1216
01:13:18,960 --> 01:13:19,830
it's definitely

1217
01:13:19,830 --> 01:13:21,930
Todd Cochran: not number one.
It's, you know, it's me telling

1218
01:13:21,930 --> 01:13:26,790
my friend about podcasting. 2.0
Yes, but what happens, and I can

1219
01:13:26,790 --> 01:13:32,580
only use my show my tech show as
a as the example. I pick up of a

1220
01:13:32,580 --> 01:13:35,400
percentage of people that come
to the website, because they

1221
01:13:35,400 --> 01:13:38,310
have landed there because I've
optimized the search results,

1222
01:13:38,370 --> 01:13:41,370
and being able to be from my
episodes for that episode be

1223
01:13:41,370 --> 01:13:44,880
found. But again, it's it's a
long term gameplay, it's it's

1224
01:13:44,880 --> 01:13:49,200
like, it's not the 1% No, not at
all.

1225
01:13:49,230 --> 01:13:52,200
Adam Curry: It's not the most.
This is why, and let's go right

1226
01:13:52,200 --> 01:13:55,890
back to pod roll. Let's go right
back to remote items to the

1227
01:13:55,950 --> 01:14:02,550
interconnected RSS. Web of
content that Dave is baking up

1228
01:14:02,580 --> 01:14:08,160
API's for. This is the future of
discovery. The discovery is I

1229
01:14:08,160 --> 01:14:12,210
heard it on a podcast. This is a
piece from a podcast, my app

1230
01:14:12,210 --> 01:14:16,050
lets me tap in. This is the best
place to discover stuff. And

1231
01:14:16,050 --> 01:14:20,430
it's not just search. It comes
from recommendations, it comes

1232
01:14:20,430 --> 01:14:25,170
from linked content, the way the
web has always worked. That's,

1233
01:14:25,470 --> 01:14:27,270
that's what is the discovery
mechanism.

1234
01:14:27,300 --> 01:14:30,390
Todd Cochran: Anytime I
recommend a show in my podcast,

1235
01:14:30,450 --> 01:14:32,880
you know, I have audience
members say hey, thanks for the

1236
01:14:32,880 --> 01:14:36,330
recommendation. So it's same
thing with the pod roll if I if

1237
01:14:36,330 --> 01:14:39,060
I had 10 shows I said these the
shows that I listened to that I

1238
01:14:39,060 --> 01:14:41,940
love. If my audience loves and
trust me, they're gonna go try a

1239
01:14:41,940 --> 01:14:42,450
few of them.

1240
01:14:42,810 --> 01:14:46,170
Adam Curry: Allow me to give
everybody an example. I was

1241
01:14:46,170 --> 01:14:52,530
listening to my buddy Cody. And
he's tied into the music scene

1242
01:14:52,530 --> 01:14:56,430
in a way I had no idea I thought
he was you know, kind of a rock

1243
01:14:56,460 --> 01:15:00,480
popular rock guy, but he seems
to be very clued in and He plays

1244
01:15:00,480 --> 01:15:04,590
a song I'm like this is a great
song. You know what, I'm going

1245
01:15:04,590 --> 01:15:10,440
to play it for y'all right now
with a value time split watch it

1246
01:15:10,440 --> 01:15:14,790
show up in the chat room boost
them vertigo kid very

1247
01:15:14,790 --> 01:15:16,920
appropriately titled pirate
radio

1248
01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:32,010
it's dance break on podcasting
2.0.

1249
01:16:42,120 --> 01:16:42,720
Todd Cochran: Candles

1250
01:16:49,110 --> 01:16:49,920
Unknown: in the show?

1251
01:19:41,880 --> 01:19:46,290
Adam Curry: lot of booths thanks
everybody. Vertigo kid pirate

1252
01:19:46,290 --> 01:19:50,040
radio just to prove we can still
put something on the top of the

1253
01:19:50,040 --> 01:19:50,460
charts

1254
01:19:53,760 --> 01:19:56,280
Dave Jones: on the top but what
do we have top

1255
01:19:56,280 --> 01:20:01,260
Adam Curry: 175 to 142 today top
140 Does it update every minute?

1256
01:20:01,260 --> 01:20:05,400
How often does it update? Our
Oh, every hour? Okay, yeah.

1257
01:20:06,509 --> 01:20:10,079
Dave Jones: I've got a whole box
of butterfly bandages and

1258
01:20:10,109 --> 01:20:12,539
smelling salts here. So I may
have showed up with these

1259
01:20:12,629 --> 01:20:15,209
because I thought we were going
to talk about alternate the

1260
01:20:15,209 --> 01:20:16,829
alternate feed alternate
enclosure. I'm

1261
01:20:16,830 --> 01:20:22,110
Adam Curry: sorry, I you know,
I, I here's the gavel. Okay, go

1262
01:20:22,110 --> 01:20:22,350
ahead.

1263
01:20:24,180 --> 01:20:28,800
Dave Jones: So, you've laid down
the the gauntlet, Todd said,

1264
01:20:29,430 --> 01:20:35,550
alternate enclosure? Hell no.
The the, but there's, there's

1265
01:20:35,550 --> 01:20:42,120
decent discussion about. So your
your, I will let you have

1266
01:20:42,120 --> 01:20:49,170
opening comments. To say why you
think this is a no, a no, no do

1267
01:20:50,280 --> 01:20:54,360
Todd Cochran: so it's simple. I
understand the reason that you

1268
01:20:54,360 --> 01:20:57,420
did alternate enclosure, I
understand completely understand

1269
01:20:57,420 --> 01:21:02,820
the argument. But we have
trained podcasters for 19 years,

1270
01:21:03,990 --> 01:21:08,280
to ensure that they have a
listing on Apple podcasts, or

1271
01:21:08,280 --> 01:21:11,550
their audio and video podcasts
that they have to have to RSS

1272
01:21:11,550 --> 01:21:16,350
feeds. And no matter hate to say
it, no matter what we do, it'll

1273
01:21:16,350 --> 01:21:24,120
be a cold day in hell, before
Apple will implement alternate

1274
01:21:24,120 --> 01:21:29,160
enclosures. So we have a simple
fix. Our and Mike actually came

1275
01:21:29,160 --> 01:21:35,610
up with this idea, just allow us
to add a remote item that is an

1276
01:21:35,610 --> 01:21:39,720
alternate enclosure as an
alternative. For those of us

1277
01:21:39,720 --> 01:21:42,060
that are not going to implement
alternate clicks, what will

1278
01:21:42,060 --> 01:21:46,740
happen is if if I tell podcaster
today, okay, so you got an audio

1279
01:21:46,740 --> 01:21:50,490
podcast, you got a video podcast
and in you go ahead and put your

1280
01:21:50,490 --> 01:21:53,760
media file in for a one you put
your media file and three other

1281
01:21:53,760 --> 01:21:57,630
do all your media data. Now, you
need to do that work twice. By

1282
01:21:57,630 --> 01:22:00,600
putting it for your audio feed,
you need to put your video feed

1283
01:22:00,600 --> 01:22:03,930
and for your video feed you need
to put your audio con, it's very

1284
01:22:03,930 --> 01:22:08,880
It just adds work, where I can
haven't set a remote item one

1285
01:22:08,880 --> 01:22:13,560
time they're done. And from that
point forward, you will know

1286
01:22:13,560 --> 01:22:18,300
that geek News Central has a
video feed on this other feed

1287
01:22:18,690 --> 01:22:23,280
without me ever having to do
double the work and do double

1288
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:26,100
the posting because I'm going to
do I may continue to post my

1289
01:22:26,100 --> 01:22:30,090
episodes the way they are now.
So that they can be compatible

1290
01:22:30,090 --> 01:22:33,900
with all the non podcasting 2.0
stuff. I understand what

1291
01:22:33,900 --> 01:22:36,810
podcasting 2.0 So we can do that
we can have the best of both

1292
01:22:36,810 --> 01:22:39,840
worlds and all it takes is a
remote item saying alternate

1293
01:22:39,840 --> 01:22:41,850
enclosure, boom, we're done.

1294
01:22:42,240 --> 01:22:44,970
Mike Dell: And I'm not totally
against altered enclosure but,

1295
01:22:45,570 --> 01:22:50,250
you know, additive to this would
be alternate feed that gives you

1296
01:22:50,250 --> 01:22:54,750
the option to do it alive you
know and that's more compatible

1297
01:22:54,780 --> 01:22:55,380
way.

1298
01:22:55,620 --> 01:22:57,060
Todd Cochran: Yeah, that's what
it should have been alternate

1299
01:22:57,060 --> 01:22:59,220
feeds excuse me, not alternate
enclosure.

1300
01:23:00,540 --> 01:23:02,340
Adam Curry: Okay, I understand.
Now I understand what you're

1301
01:23:02,340 --> 01:23:06,690
saying. So what you're saying is
create two feeds but implemented

1302
01:23:06,690 --> 01:23:10,500
for podcasting 2.0 apps as a
remote item, so people don't

1303
01:23:10,500 --> 01:23:13,740
have to subscribe to something
additionally, they can select

1304
01:23:13,740 --> 01:23:16,860
that the app would know and
would select it internally,

1305
01:23:17,160 --> 01:23:19,260
Todd Cochran: it would without
having to actually do the

1306
01:23:19,260 --> 01:23:21,750
alternate enclosure because
we're going to just continue to

1307
01:23:21,750 --> 01:23:24,870
do enclosures like they've
always ever been. It was it was

1308
01:23:24,870 --> 01:23:28,080
decided a long, long, long long
time ago that there would not be

1309
01:23:28,080 --> 01:23:31,320
two enclosures in a single feed
I know things change podcasting

1310
01:23:31,320 --> 01:23:35,040
2.0 has changed that. But if I
can have a podcast alternate

1311
01:23:35,040 --> 01:23:37,830
feed and the remote item, you'll
know what my alternate beat is

1312
01:23:37,830 --> 01:23:40,800
Nick could only it could also be
lower bandwidth, alternate

1313
01:23:40,800 --> 01:23:44,040
language, video, whatever we
want to come up with.

1314
01:23:45,150 --> 01:23:48,210
Adam Curry: You know, I was I
was very anti your thinking and

1315
01:23:48,210 --> 01:23:51,810
but now I understand what you're
saying is like give the the two

1316
01:23:51,810 --> 01:23:55,500
point the modern apps, the
capability to make the switch

1317
01:23:55,500 --> 01:24:00,660
with the existing subscription
by just saying Oh, check it out.

1318
01:24:00,660 --> 01:24:03,300
There's an alternate there's a
remote item here, this is for

1319
01:24:03,300 --> 01:24:03,840
video.

1320
01:24:05,910 --> 01:24:09,300
Todd Cochran: And it will allow
the podcasting 2.0 apps to see

1321
01:24:09,300 --> 01:24:14,100
those of us that just stay on
the one enclosure per deed

1322
01:24:14,130 --> 01:24:17,760
model. That ability to say okay,
this show has five extra

1323
01:24:17,760 --> 01:24:18,660
alternate beans.

1324
01:24:18,870 --> 01:24:21,150
Dave Jones: Okay, let me okay,
let me let me ask questions.

1325
01:24:21,780 --> 01:24:29,310
Just q&a. So, this really your
main concern is alternate and

1326
01:24:29,310 --> 01:24:36,900
closure as a video audio mix.
You're I'm assuming that you're

1327
01:24:36,900 --> 01:24:42,240
not opposed to alternate
enclosure for those specific use

1328
01:24:42,240 --> 01:24:47,550
cases where people need a lower
bandwidth version of the same

1329
01:24:47,550 --> 01:24:51,750
media type. So you would have
the standard you know 96 or

1330
01:24:51,750 --> 01:24:58,110
128k. mp3 delivered through the
enclosure and then possibly

1331
01:24:58,110 --> 01:25:05,490
inserting like a Every low bit
rate source for like, chi iOS

1332
01:25:05,490 --> 01:25:09,210
phones or something like that as
odd as an alternate audio

1333
01:25:09,570 --> 01:25:11,070
downgrade, so to speak.

1334
01:25:11,340 --> 01:25:12,810
Todd Cochran: Now, that at all?

1335
01:25:13,109 --> 01:25:16,079
Mike Dell: Yeah, there's no
reason why we can't have both.

1336
01:25:16,109 --> 01:25:16,859
That's the thing.

1337
01:25:17,549 --> 01:25:19,769
Adam Curry: You want to keep
your existing customers who have

1338
01:25:19,769 --> 01:25:22,559
two separate feeds, and you want
to keep them that way, because

1339
01:25:22,559 --> 01:25:24,359
you've trained them that way.
And I presume you're also

1340
01:25:24,359 --> 01:25:26,399
getting paid for two accounts.
Maybe I'm wrong.

1341
01:25:28,080 --> 01:25:30,000
Mike Dell: You're not all
hosting with us. But yeah,

1342
01:25:30,300 --> 01:25:33,330
Adam Curry: okay. All right.
Well, that's understandable. And

1343
01:25:33,330 --> 01:25:36,540
I honestly sounds like a pretty
good use of remote item.

1344
01:25:37,590 --> 01:25:43,560
Dave Jones: Well, okay, so the
question to the is this a

1345
01:25:43,560 --> 01:25:48,990
problem that can be solved with
just software so that somebody

1346
01:25:49,020 --> 01:25:53,040
uploads? A, they have their
audio feed, they have their

1347
01:25:53,040 --> 01:25:57,450
video feed, just in the audio
feed, as when they post to the

1348
01:25:57,450 --> 01:26:02,490
video feed? The audio of the two
can cross pollinate? enclosures?

1349
01:26:02,490 --> 01:26:03,150
Yes, yeah.

1350
01:26:03,330 --> 01:26:06,840
Mike Dell: Well, we do that.
Together. We do that with power

1351
01:26:06,840 --> 01:26:11,700
press already. You can have one
blog post, and put as many media

1352
01:26:11,700 --> 01:26:16,740
files in different channels,
which is different feeds as you

1353
01:26:16,740 --> 01:26:20,850
want. Okay, so it keeps the
workload down when you're doing

1354
01:26:20,850 --> 01:26:23,190
audio video, the same show,

1355
01:26:23,580 --> 01:26:27,150
Adam Curry: right, so remote
item on the video feed can point

1356
01:26:27,150 --> 01:26:29,550
to the audio feed Dave? Sure.

1357
01:26:29,850 --> 01:26:30,690
Mike Dell: And vice versa.

1358
01:26:31,620 --> 01:26:34,170
Dave Jones: Right, I guess what
I'm saying is if the alternate

1359
01:26:34,440 --> 01:26:41,130
if adding a video source to the
audio feed, is is more work?

1360
01:26:41,700 --> 01:26:46,470
Could you take away the work? By
doing it for them when they do

1361
01:26:46,500 --> 01:26:48,180
when they're already doing the
work?

1362
01:26:48,570 --> 01:26:51,480
Todd Cochran: Yeah, well, what
will happen is, is again, this

1363
01:26:51,480 --> 01:26:54,180
will be a set and forget, we'll
just say to Hey, do you want

1364
01:26:54,180 --> 01:27:00,030
your video feed to be a remote
item in your audio feed, and

1365
01:27:00,030 --> 01:27:02,430
I'll click the button one time
and what we'll include it

1366
01:27:03,180 --> 01:27:05,910
forevermore, and it'll just
happen when they publish the

1367
01:27:05,910 --> 01:27:08,250
episode shows like Mike said,
when people at least in our

1368
01:27:08,250 --> 01:27:11,370
system, when they published,
when I push publish an episode

1369
01:27:11,370 --> 01:27:14,850
of Geek News Central, I do one
blog post, but there's two feeds

1370
01:27:14,850 --> 01:27:16,830
tied to the blog. So it's

1371
01:27:16,830 --> 01:27:22,050
Adam Curry: really it's really
using a modern system to fix a

1372
01:27:22,050 --> 01:27:26,580
legacy problem. Because there's
already so many video feeds that

1373
01:27:26,580 --> 01:27:29,460
people have created. In
addition, I presume, in addition

1374
01:27:29,460 --> 01:27:33,000
to their audio feed. So you
implement the ultimate

1375
01:27:33,000 --> 01:27:37,950
enclosure, which will be the way
for the way forward personally,

1376
01:27:37,950 --> 01:27:40,620
I think, but you can also do it
this way.

1377
01:27:41,880 --> 01:27:44,070
Todd Cochran: Yeah, there's no
item would be for folks like us

1378
01:27:44,070 --> 01:27:46,890
that don't want to retrain our
audience. And again, the and

1379
01:27:46,890 --> 01:27:49,500
then that will allow the apps to
pick either or,

1380
01:27:50,010 --> 01:27:52,710
Mike Dell: then in theory, you
could have it so that it does

1381
01:27:52,710 --> 01:27:53,280
both.

1382
01:27:53,970 --> 01:27:56,040
Adam Curry: That's what I'm
saying. Yeah, it can, it can be

1383
01:27:56,040 --> 01:27:59,580
either been an alternate
enclosure, or it can be a remote

1384
01:27:59,580 --> 01:28:02,790
item, alternate feed, which is
video or audio or

1385
01:28:03,180 --> 01:28:05,610
Mike Dell: all those antique
apps working, you know,

1386
01:28:05,610 --> 01:28:06,930
backwards compatibility.

1387
01:28:08,040 --> 01:28:12,780
Dave Jones: So there's, you did
not propose an actual tag spec.

1388
01:28:13,080 --> 01:28:15,720
You just proposed it as an idea.
Yeah. So

1389
01:28:15,720 --> 01:28:18,630
Mike Dell: it's an idea. I'm not
a bride a dove. So I

1390
01:28:18,630 --> 01:28:20,910
Dave Jones: went, you know, I
went looking for prior art in

1391
01:28:20,910 --> 01:28:24,960
this pod in a pod love has an
alternate feed specification

1392
01:28:24,960 --> 01:28:30,990
going back to like 2012. It uses
the atom link thing, which is,

1393
01:28:33,720 --> 01:28:35,550
you know, they're gonna get
pissed off, because we already

1394
01:28:35,550 --> 01:28:37,230
were in swap chapters on him.

1395
01:28:37,260 --> 01:28:40,590
Todd Cochran: But Davey, you're
already re going to revise

1396
01:28:40,590 --> 01:28:44,520
remote items so that anything in
the remote item is going to have

1397
01:28:44,550 --> 01:28:49,200
a type. So why don't you just
make this a new type gear that

1398
01:28:49,200 --> 01:28:51,090
goes along with that revision?

1399
01:28:51,750 --> 01:28:56,220
Dave Jones: Yeah, and I'm just,
I'm just thinking, I would read

1400
01:28:56,250 --> 01:29:01,140
I think long term, looking at in
the future, and importing the

1401
01:29:01,140 --> 01:29:05,070
atom namespace into the unknown.
It's done a lot. But, you know,

1402
01:29:05,070 --> 01:29:08,160
the whole, the whole goal for
the podcast namespace is to get

1403
01:29:08,250 --> 01:29:11,400
is to have something that's
holistic and self contained. You

1404
01:29:11,400 --> 01:29:16,290
know, I hate to bring in a spec
and say, Okay, well, yeah. Okay,

1405
01:29:16,290 --> 01:29:18,990
now go get the Adam namespace
and do it this way. Like, this

1406
01:29:18,990 --> 01:29:22,800
just doesn't seem to be there
doesn't seem to be fitting this

1407
01:29:22,800 --> 01:29:26,430
and I'm not seeing this
alternate feed used very much.

1408
01:29:26,820 --> 01:29:30,240
Same this this goes back to
potluck chapters. Now, I love

1409
01:29:30,240 --> 01:29:34,020
those. I mean, I really love
what pod love does, except, you

1410
01:29:34,020 --> 01:29:37,710
know, the chapter spec that they
that they invent, it just never

1411
01:29:37,710 --> 01:29:40,860
got any traction. And it's the
same it seems to be the same

1412
01:29:40,860 --> 01:29:42,810
thing with their alternate feeds
back and it's like

1413
01:29:42,810 --> 01:29:45,060
Mike Dell: our namespace didn't
get a whole lot of traction

1414
01:29:45,060 --> 01:29:47,040
either other than amongst Yeah,
yeah,

1415
01:29:47,070 --> 01:29:49,500
Adam Curry: there's one reason
why you know who your daddy is.

1416
01:29:49,530 --> 01:29:51,450
I mean, that's why you got to
know your daddy.

1417
01:29:54,090 --> 01:29:57,420
Dave Jones: So if you get some,
I'm just thinking, you know, I

1418
01:29:57,600 --> 01:30:02,280
don't want to just willy nilly
Throw away prior art. But there

1419
01:30:02,280 --> 01:30:07,020
just doesn't seem to if it's not
used, I don't see that as very

1420
01:30:07,020 --> 01:30:08,040
much of a big deal.

1421
01:30:08,070 --> 01:30:10,650
Todd Cochran: James is throwing
his headset down right now. So I

1422
01:30:10,650 --> 01:30:15,120
wouldn't, I wouldn't get rid of
all no closure. No, no, of

1423
01:30:15,120 --> 01:30:16,140
course not. No,

1424
01:30:16,530 --> 01:30:19,950
Adam Curry: I think this is. But
I love this idea because it's a

1425
01:30:19,950 --> 01:30:23,940
complete valid use of the remote
item, which is really from for

1426
01:30:23,940 --> 01:30:28,920
me, the remote item is the
future of RSS, podcasting, and

1427
01:30:28,920 --> 01:30:33,780
RSS in general, the remote item
is critical, critical to

1428
01:30:33,780 --> 01:30:37,710
everything we're going to do
moving forward. It's just, it's

1429
01:30:37,710 --> 01:30:43,290
beautiful. You know, once we get
the tools in, where I mean, even

1430
01:30:43,320 --> 01:30:46,050
playing a clip from we talk
about it, but we don't actually

1431
01:30:46,050 --> 01:30:48,510
have an interface or anything.
If I play a clip from a

1432
01:30:48,510 --> 01:30:51,660
different podcast, boom, remote
item, all of this stuff should

1433
01:30:51,660 --> 01:30:57,990
should be, it should be part of
our normal workflow. And

1434
01:30:57,990 --> 01:30:58,620
crickets,

1435
01:30:59,010 --> 01:31:01,140
Todd Cochran: you know, the
remote item, that remote item

1436
01:31:01,140 --> 01:31:05,790
piece, really, I made my whole
dev team listen to the last

1437
01:31:05,820 --> 01:31:08,340
podcasting to Pinocchio from
about the 45 minute mark,

1438
01:31:08,340 --> 01:31:11,070
because, people but yeah, you
guys,

1439
01:31:11,100 --> 01:31:14,700
Mike Dell: you know, you don't
like namespace, namespace? You

1440
01:31:14,700 --> 01:31:15,450
beautifully

1441
01:31:15,450 --> 01:31:19,620
Todd Cochran: explained. Me?
Somehow I'm given feedback

1442
01:31:19,620 --> 01:31:21,570
today. I don't know what's going
on. I'm gonna have to check the

1443
01:31:21,570 --> 01:31:28,170
knobs. It basically is a I think
it is I think this remote item

1444
01:31:28,170 --> 01:31:29,400
is the key to a lot of stuff.

1445
01:31:30,870 --> 01:31:34,170
Dave Jones: It finally brings in
links. Yeah, which, which is

1446
01:31:34,170 --> 01:31:37,830
what makes the web the web and
what makes it decentralized.

1447
01:31:38,100 --> 01:31:40,710
Because if you don't have
linkage between between

1448
01:31:40,710 --> 01:31:45,060
different pieces of content,
then you don't have you don't

1449
01:31:45,060 --> 01:31:49,710
have a truly decentralized way
to crawl from one place to

1450
01:31:49,710 --> 01:31:54,000
another. So the remote Adam just
is it allows you to do what the

1451
01:31:54,000 --> 01:31:57,930
web's done is it links things
together. So like, I heard James

1452
01:31:57,930 --> 01:32:03,840
on pod news, weekly review,
asking, what is, you know,

1453
01:32:03,840 --> 01:32:07,530
what's the point of putting the
data and say it that way? Um, he

1454
01:32:07,530 --> 01:32:10,890
said it better than that. But he
didn't understand necessarily

1455
01:32:10,890 --> 01:32:17,070
why we were putting the value
time splits in the API

1456
01:32:17,070 --> 01:32:21,780
responses. And it's for this
reason is because once you see

1457
01:32:21,840 --> 01:32:26,850
it, now you have linkage. So I
can say, okay, here is a value.

1458
01:32:26,940 --> 01:32:31,830
Here's eight, a feed that also
has links to other feeds the

1459
01:32:31,830 --> 01:32:34,530
same things is the same thing
with POD roll. Yeah, here's a

1460
01:32:34,530 --> 01:32:37,680
feed that now links to other
feeds. When you when you begin

1461
01:32:37,680 --> 01:32:42,210
to build this web Oh, man
showed? Yeah, like now you've

1462
01:32:42,210 --> 01:32:47,400
got real. So the whole reason
you can't do proper podcast,

1463
01:32:47,790 --> 01:32:53,190
excuse me proper searching and
podcast is because so Google

1464
01:32:53,190 --> 01:32:57,750
PageRank. Google PageRank is
built on inbound links. That's

1465
01:32:57,780 --> 01:33:02,340
always been the core of PageRank
is you can look at how many

1466
01:33:02,340 --> 01:33:06,810
links point to to a source to
determine some desert term, it's

1467
01:33:06,810 --> 01:33:10,590
a measure of its popularity or
its relevance. Pocket, there's

1468
01:33:10,590 --> 01:33:14,820
no way to do that in podcasting.
There's no there's not. But now

1469
01:33:14,820 --> 01:33:18,810
you can if you have remote
items, you can have this notion

1470
01:33:18,810 --> 01:33:26,610
of inbound links. If if 100
podcasts reference, a remote

1471
01:33:26,610 --> 01:33:32,160
item pointing to new media show,
well, then that's a really good

1472
01:33:32,160 --> 01:33:34,770
indicator that there's something
going on and new media show that

1473
01:33:34,770 --> 01:33:37,470
should up its game in the
Discovery Trail.

1474
01:33:37,860 --> 01:33:40,230
Todd Cochran: If you go back to
the blog days, we all had blog

1475
01:33:40,230 --> 01:33:43,500
roles on her website, because
it's the folks that we read. And

1476
01:33:43,500 --> 01:33:46,350
that was our that was our signal
that we thought this is a good

1477
01:33:46,350 --> 01:33:49,260
source of content, always.
inbound links to

1478
01:33:49,260 --> 01:33:50,100
Mike Dell: stuff we liked

1479
01:33:50,310 --> 01:33:52,200
Adam Curry: is the is the
current implementation.

1480
01:33:52,200 --> 01:33:54,720
Buzzsprout is doing a pod roll.
They're doing that as a remote

1481
01:33:54,720 --> 01:33:59,070
item Dave? Remote item type
equals pod roll.

1482
01:33:59,820 --> 01:34:02,400
Dave Jones: Yeah, it was it's
the pod roll tag with the remote

1483
01:34:02,400 --> 01:34:03,960
item as a child. Yeah. Okay.

1484
01:34:04,019 --> 01:34:07,109
Todd Cochran: All right. And I
like what they did over there,

1485
01:34:07,109 --> 01:34:09,269
if you went look at their
interface, the page and how

1486
01:34:09,269 --> 01:34:12,149
they're displaying that to
listeners, and then you know,

1487
01:34:12,149 --> 01:34:14,819
that's the first step. And then
the apps are going to be able to

1488
01:34:14,819 --> 01:34:18,629
surface that to listeners as
well within the app, keeping

1489
01:34:18,629 --> 01:34:21,659
them in the app. This is it's
this is beautiful. There's gonna

1490
01:34:21,659 --> 01:34:21,809
be

1491
01:34:21,810 --> 01:34:23,610
Adam Curry: a developer out
there who's going to create the

1492
01:34:23,610 --> 01:34:26,910
pod browser, even though I hate
to put your word pod but pod

1493
01:34:26,910 --> 01:34:29,850
browser is going to be an app
where you just go from one to

1494
01:34:29,850 --> 01:34:33,150
the next from a song to this to
that to a lecture to whatever to

1495
01:34:33,150 --> 01:34:36,780
a book. I can, you know, we need
the hosting companies to add the

1496
01:34:36,780 --> 01:34:38,190
interfaces, but we'll get there.

1497
01:34:39,810 --> 01:34:40,560
Dave Jones: Yeah, we'll get
there.

1498
01:34:42,300 --> 01:34:44,400
Mike Dell: But I think a lot of
this is, you know, going to get

1499
01:34:44,400 --> 01:34:48,300
away from apps in general, but
you know, there's things get

1500
01:34:48,480 --> 01:34:51,630
cranked down tighter and
tighter. It's gonna move a lot

1501
01:34:51,630 --> 01:34:56,100
of this stuff's gonna move to
the just the plain old web. You

1502
01:34:56,100 --> 01:34:56,640
know, as far as

1503
01:34:57,300 --> 01:34:58,380
Todd Cochran: our PWA is

1504
01:34:58,410 --> 01:35:03,570
Mike Dell: PWA To You know,
because at some point, you know,

1505
01:35:03,600 --> 01:35:07,920
Apple's gonna say, well, we
don't like, x or whatever, and

1506
01:35:08,190 --> 01:35:09,480
they're out of the app store.

1507
01:35:10,620 --> 01:35:13,020
Dave Jones: Yeah. Well, yeah,
well, that yeah, that's that's

1508
01:35:13,020 --> 01:35:16,500
in that, you know, we are
inevitable. We gotta you know

1509
01:35:16,500 --> 01:35:21,060
what, what we got from Mitch
this past week was that some was

1510
01:35:21,060 --> 01:35:28,560
the podcast or had complained to
Apple's App Store, about Mitch

1511
01:35:28,560 --> 01:35:32,850
having one of their podcasts on
his app. Like they didn't go

1512
01:35:32,850 --> 01:35:38,250
throughout, you know, they they
complained to app review or not.

1513
01:35:38,250 --> 01:35:43,350
Yeah, yeah. And so they and then
Apple reached out to Mitch and

1514
01:35:43,350 --> 01:35:46,200
was like, Hey, we got a
complaint that you have

1515
01:35:46,770 --> 01:35:50,670
unauthorized content on your
app. And it was a big, it was a

1516
01:35:50,670 --> 01:35:51,600
big pain in the butt.

1517
01:35:51,809 --> 01:35:55,469
Adam Curry: Yeah. By the way,
Andrew Gromit. This is for you,

1518
01:35:55,469 --> 01:36:02,159
brother. There's your project.
The pod, pod browser. Good idea.

1519
01:36:02,249 --> 01:36:05,429
PWA pod browser, pod attitude.

1520
01:36:05,970 --> 01:36:08,520
Todd Cochran: There's a product
we offer to our podcasters. It's

1521
01:36:08,520 --> 01:36:11,070
called Quick Links. And it's
basically the ability for them

1522
01:36:11,070 --> 01:36:14,040
to kind of have a link tree type
of page just kind of shows up

1523
01:36:14,040 --> 01:36:17,250
other stuff. We're going to add
pod roll to that in various

1524
01:36:17,250 --> 01:36:19,290
different places within the
platform. Oh, yeah.

1525
01:36:19,380 --> 01:36:24,690
Adam Curry: I'm sure pod page
will roll it out. Sure. The this

1526
01:36:24,690 --> 01:36:29,070
is good stuff. I don't know
where to go from here. So we

1527
01:36:29,070 --> 01:36:31,920
thank some people because I've
just been getting lots and lots

1528
01:36:31,920 --> 01:36:34,440
and lots of booster grams. I
want to give a couple of top

1529
01:36:35,160 --> 01:36:38,790
2100 SATs from Macintosh. Can I
throw something out? Please? No.

1530
01:36:38,820 --> 01:36:43,020
And the next boost I'm sorry. As
a podcaster an avid listener, I

1531
01:36:43,020 --> 01:36:46,950
want one thing to whomever needs
to hear this app dev app

1532
01:36:46,950 --> 01:36:50,970
developers, I believe stop the
futzing around, implement cross

1533
01:36:50,970 --> 01:36:56,610
app comments. The other podcast
2.0 Abs are not your enemy. If

1534
01:36:56,610 --> 01:36:59,250
anyone has an enemy it is Apple
and Spotify and such it will

1535
01:36:59,250 --> 01:37:01,500
make a huge difference in
developing communities and

1536
01:37:01,500 --> 01:37:04,530
creating a better experience. I
have no interest in hacks to

1537
01:37:04,530 --> 01:37:07,140
make this stuff work as Nike
says just do it. Thanks,

1538
01:37:07,200 --> 01:37:12,540
Macintosh. There's your listener
feedback. Thank you Macintosh

1539
01:37:12,570 --> 01:37:16,050
10,000 SATs from Sam Sethi
coming through on that pod fans.

1540
01:37:16,620 --> 01:37:20,640
Loving this. Loving this
alternate enclosure chat. We

1541
01:37:20,640 --> 01:37:23,190
already support the alternate
enclosure and pod fans and

1542
01:37:23,190 --> 01:37:27,330
support video but remote item is
good to support legacy feeds and

1543
01:37:27,360 --> 01:37:30,180
and it's going to be the way
forward as we just discussed.

1544
01:37:31,080 --> 01:37:36,270
Salty crayon freedom boost 1776
boosting is loving. Yes it is.

1545
01:37:36,930 --> 01:37:43,440
Another 10,000 from Sam Ceci Sam
Sethi pod fans. Is your

1546
01:37:43,440 --> 01:37:46,830
advertisement from Sam Sethi for
today. Pod fans was the first to

1547
01:37:46,830 --> 01:37:49,800
support the pod roll and we have
created an admin for creators to

1548
01:37:49,800 --> 01:37:52,800
build their own pod roll while
we wait for host to catch up

1549
01:37:52,830 --> 01:38:00,180
indeed. Very good. big proponent
of the pod roll 20,000 SATs from

1550
01:38:00,180 --> 01:38:04,260
Absa verdient we're all pirates.
Yes, thank you. I was for the

1551
01:38:04,260 --> 01:38:10,530
pirate song. And then we have
Max space Luke 50,000 SATs this

1552
01:38:10,530 --> 01:38:13,920
is this is my second booster
Graham Ever After sending one to

1553
01:38:13,920 --> 01:38:16,800
Chris at Linux unplugged on the
Jupiter broadcasting network

1554
01:38:17,220 --> 01:38:20,220
from Chris's unfilter show and
did Chris hit me in the mouth on

1555
01:38:20,220 --> 01:38:24,240
unfiltered way out as a place we
could go now that unfilter was

1556
01:38:24,240 --> 01:38:28,650
no more I'm a total fanboy for
no agenda. And now of course

1557
01:38:28,650 --> 01:38:31,890
that leads to podcasting 2.0 and
Mo facts and boosted Graham both

1558
01:38:31,890 --> 01:38:35,430
thanks for you all Adam, David,
the whole team do for everybody

1559
01:38:35,460 --> 01:38:39,150
that what you do for everybody
day in day out? Go podcasting.

1560
01:38:39,330 --> 01:38:43,710
Thank you. Sam Sethi is feeling
flushed today. Another 10,000.

1561
01:38:44,730 --> 01:38:49,050
No tracking set needed. We have
time listed, percent completed

1562
01:38:49,050 --> 01:38:51,990
and value paid. The advertiser
puts in a budget and the

1563
01:38:51,990 --> 01:38:54,900
negative set flows goes from the
advertiser to the listener. We

1564
01:38:54,900 --> 01:39:00,270
already do this with trailers.
Yeah, there's pod fans specific

1565
01:39:00,270 --> 01:39:04,860
to pod fans. Yeah, any app can
do this. I just think we're

1566
01:39:04,860 --> 01:39:10,320
thinking more of it on a bigger
basis. But Sam, another 10,000.

1567
01:39:10,320 --> 01:39:13,080
We'll take as many 10,000 sat
booster grants from us. You want

1568
01:39:13,080 --> 01:39:16,050
Sam? I'll keep reading them.
Adam, we have created that ad

1569
01:39:16,050 --> 01:39:19,350
model. Do you want to demo we
already we are ready to release

1570
01:39:19,350 --> 01:39:22,740
it. We will use negative SATs
with value time splits to pay

1571
01:39:22,770 --> 01:39:26,190
users to listen to ads and split
the payment to podcast creators.

1572
01:39:26,280 --> 01:39:32,040
If you skip you get nothing.
Yeah. Yes. And I'd love to see

1573
01:39:32,040 --> 01:39:36,540
if it works. Because then we can
do it from a more decentralized

1574
01:39:36,540 --> 01:39:39,120
way and not just one app that
does I think that's perfect,

1575
01:39:39,390 --> 01:39:46,230
unless I'm misunderstanding and
interesting to the value times

1576
01:39:46,230 --> 01:39:50,370
that you put you put that in on
top of the feed. We'll have to

1577
01:39:50,370 --> 01:39:51,750
get some information from Sam.

1578
01:39:52,140 --> 01:39:54,420
Dave Jones: Yeah, we need Sam
back on the show anyway, yeah,

1579
01:39:54,420 --> 01:39:58,800
Adam Curry: we do. We do. If he
but then you know he'll have two

1580
01:39:58,800 --> 01:40:02,130
booths during his own show
otherwise we know we don't have

1581
01:40:02,130 --> 01:40:06,360
the income. We guess it's better
than I'm Sam on remote taking a

1582
01:40:08,430 --> 01:40:13,140
nice row of ducks 22,222 from
salty cray on how to pod sage

1583
01:40:13,140 --> 01:40:16,020
slash pod father putting
together a value for value music

1584
01:40:16,020 --> 01:40:19,470
podcast is a lot of fun and a
lot of work but I'm having a

1585
01:40:19,470 --> 01:40:22,860
blast doing it. I was able to
use the magic wallet switching

1586
01:40:22,860 --> 01:40:26,310
technology with RSS blue for my
first show. I found out from

1587
01:40:26,310 --> 01:40:28,860
Dobby Das, I was the first
person to use it in that way. I

1588
01:40:28,860 --> 01:40:31,680
love it. Thanks for putting in
all the backend work so we can

1589
01:40:31,680 --> 01:40:36,090
create these podcasts and it's
the upbeats podcast. Well Don't

1590
01:40:36,090 --> 01:40:39,750
thank us ma'am. There's there's
a whole crew of gypsies out

1591
01:40:39,750 --> 01:40:41,250
there who are responsible for
this.

1592
01:40:41,669 --> 01:40:43,919
Dave Jones: And we can say that
we've been given authors we have

1593
01:40:43,949 --> 01:40:45,659
yes from the actual jibs from
the

1594
01:40:46,110 --> 01:40:53,040
Adam Curry: actual gypsy says
it's okay. Eric p p 33,333. We

1595
01:40:53,040 --> 01:41:02,220
have su pipe pipe CD 4444 sets
freedom eagles. Sir TJ the

1596
01:41:02,220 --> 01:41:07,050
wrathful with 1953 Guru is
great, please you want to see

1597
01:41:07,170 --> 01:41:10,830
yes, he's on podcast guru. No
bad signal for any apps for me

1598
01:41:10,830 --> 01:41:15,060
today. They normally work in pod
verse and Guru and addicts. And

1599
01:41:15,060 --> 01:41:18,540
I just got it to if Guru can
make it so I can share playlists

1600
01:41:18,540 --> 01:41:22,290
and it controls like shuffle and
repeat for all when music is

1601
01:41:22,290 --> 01:41:25,620
playing. Oh baby, go podcasting.
Alright, stay off the pipe. TJ

1602
01:41:25,650 --> 01:41:31,770
thanks 71 from anonymous using
pod verse love in the boardroom.

1603
01:41:32,430 --> 01:41:35,820
And I think that's it. That's
what we have so far. You want to

1604
01:41:35,820 --> 01:41:39,030
read what we have. What's coming
during the week Dave?

1605
01:41:39,390 --> 01:41:42,630
Dave Jones: Dow it gets pay pals
in this one ought to be

1606
01:41:42,630 --> 01:41:47,100
familiar. Because it's $250 from
blueberry podcasting our very

1607
01:41:47,100 --> 01:41:51,570
own 20

1608
01:41:51,570 --> 01:41:54,570
Adam Curry: is blades on am
Paula thank you. Blueberry.

1609
01:41:54,570 --> 01:41:57,360
Podcasting. Thank you. Thank you
fellas. Thank you guys. It's

1610
01:41:57,360 --> 01:41:57,750
really good

1611
01:41:57,750 --> 01:41:59,730
Todd Cochran: to hit your API
more we need to send you some

1612
01:41:59,730 --> 01:42:00,060
money.

1613
01:42:01,860 --> 01:42:07,590
Dave Jones: My API get it we've
got to speak the devil Franco

1614
01:42:07,590 --> 01:42:11,370
Celerio we talked about gas
medic earlier $100 back

1615
01:42:13,830 --> 01:42:17,580
Adam Curry: thank you Franco
supporting everything. We

1616
01:42:17,580 --> 01:42:19,110
support each other. I love it.

1617
01:42:20,100 --> 01:42:24,360
Dave Jones: And we've got a $25
debt no note between $5 donation

1618
01:42:24,360 --> 01:42:27,420
from Brian Mosier. I don't know
who that is. So thank you,

1619
01:42:27,420 --> 01:42:27,930
Brian.

1620
01:42:28,770 --> 01:42:29,580
Adam Curry: We appreciate it.

1621
01:42:30,780 --> 01:42:36,750
Dave Jones: Brian, appreciate
that. You got to note shoot me

1622
01:42:36,750 --> 01:42:41,550
one more we did get some boosts
we got 10,000 sets from Star I

1623
01:42:41,550 --> 01:42:46,290
think star is associated with
the web's podcast Right. to I

1624
01:42:46,290 --> 01:42:48,630
think that's I think that's you
know Whitney Webb

1625
01:42:49,560 --> 01:42:52,860
Adam Curry: oh sorry. Yeah,
she's Whitney Webb Yeah, she

1626
01:42:52,860 --> 01:42:55,440
produces Yes. Okay. Yeah, good
1000

1627
01:42:55,440 --> 01:42:58,110
Dave Jones: says from store said
Table of Contents sanity

1628
01:42:58,110 --> 01:42:59,040
restored laws.

1629
01:42:59,070 --> 01:43:02,040
Adam Curry: Yeah, I noticed a
number of apps actually handled

1630
01:43:02,040 --> 01:43:03,570
Table of Contents properly.

1631
01:43:04,440 --> 01:43:09,180
Dave Jones: Oh, yeah. Those it's
it's happening. Yeah. Pod father

1632
01:43:09,180 --> 01:43:11,220
asks and people give you

1633
01:43:11,490 --> 01:43:13,860
Adam Curry: Well, I only got one
message this week from one

1634
01:43:13,860 --> 01:43:19,680
person who said chapters are
messed up that's a good sign.

1635
01:43:19,710 --> 01:43:21,390
But yeah, they sent me a
screenshot I don't know what the

1636
01:43:21,390 --> 01:43:23,520
app to show what app is it
showing what app that is so we

1637
01:43:23,520 --> 01:43:27,750
can work on it. Thank you. Thank
you Dev is perfect. I love it

1638
01:43:28,620 --> 01:43:33,960
Dave Jones: up in 1984 4000 says
two fountains that being able to

1639
01:43:33,960 --> 01:43:37,710
remove booths from Chapter image
would be a welcome feature I

1640
01:43:37,710 --> 01:43:40,050
mainly listen to booster green
ball either while at work or

1641
01:43:40,050 --> 01:43:44,040
when driving if I hear an artist
like I like I just screenshot

1642
01:43:44,040 --> 01:43:46,620
the chapter art and then look
them up later my free time. Oh

1643
01:43:46,620 --> 01:43:47,220
that's a good idea.

1644
01:43:47,250 --> 01:43:49,380
Adam Curry: Well right now
depending on the app you use,

1645
01:43:49,380 --> 01:43:54,660
you can just go into the podcast
guru it's the V for V logo it

1646
01:43:54,660 --> 01:43:58,290
gives you all the songs right
there so you can play them boost

1647
01:43:58,290 --> 01:44:02,340
them screen them I think save
them soon fountain does this

1648
01:44:02,370 --> 01:44:04,620
that's the way to go. Yeah, it
saves your screenshot

1649
01:44:06,390 --> 01:44:09,480
Dave Jones: Jean Everett 3333
through fountain he says got a

1650
01:44:09,480 --> 01:44:13,020
hard agree I don't want anything
but the podcast are displayed I

1651
01:44:13,020 --> 01:44:15,540
really do not like the booths
popping up in place of art cover

1652
01:44:16,620 --> 01:44:25,440
well, so here's we have talked
about this gene been and Franco

1653
01:44:25,440 --> 01:44:29,760
had a discussion on email that I
was included in about

1654
01:44:29,790 --> 01:44:31,470
Adam Curry: back back channeling

1655
01:44:31,590 --> 01:44:38,760
Dave Jones: back you know Jean
beanies back Chandler you back

1656
01:44:38,760 --> 01:44:45,960
channeling from the from the
lander, Jimmy Carter. So, he's

1657
01:44:46,020 --> 01:44:53,220
he said, if you have a chapter
that has an image, this table of

1658
01:44:53,220 --> 01:45:02,160
contents equals false. Do you
still include The chapter title

1659
01:45:03,840 --> 01:45:08,670
along with displaying the
chapter or do you just display

1660
01:45:08,670 --> 01:45:12,480
the current chapter title?
Should the titled also be

1661
01:45:12,480 --> 01:45:15,120
hidden? If it's Table of
Contents faults?

1662
01:45:15,509 --> 01:45:16,589
Adam Curry: Oh, good question, I

1663
01:45:16,590 --> 01:45:19,830
Dave Jones: guess. And I'm not
talking about in the chapter

1664
01:45:19,830 --> 01:45:24,000
list I'm gonna be played on the
display. Hmm. And I kind of

1665
01:45:24,000 --> 01:45:29,880
think it should because you may
it may be a link but that's but

1666
01:45:30,840 --> 01:45:33,120
I think that's a point of
clarification that we need

1667
01:45:33,120 --> 01:45:33,840
people to

1668
01:45:34,080 --> 01:45:38,610
Adam Curry: Dred Scott literally
just a yes no. What is that? He

1669
01:45:38,610 --> 01:45:42,660
says he's the chapter title
should be easy. Yes. No. chapter

1670
01:45:42,660 --> 01:45:47,850
title should be shown. I think
the chapter title. So if it's a

1671
01:45:47,850 --> 01:45:52,320
boost, should it? Should it have
a chapter title if it's not a

1672
01:45:52,350 --> 01:45:53,340
TOC?

1673
01:45:53,940 --> 01:45:57,030
Dave Jones: Well, I'm gonna say
this. I mean, Dred Scott is the

1674
01:45:57,060 --> 01:46:01,200
previous chapter Meister Yeah,
he's the chief chapter

1675
01:46:01,200 --> 01:46:05,640
architect. And I mean, when he
speaks, we listen that that

1676
01:46:05,670 --> 01:46:09,690
counts for much weight so I'm
gonna say yes, no.

1677
01:46:12,450 --> 01:46:16,800
Adam Curry: If TOC false chapter
title and link need to be shown.

1678
01:46:17,070 --> 01:46:19,830
He does. Yeah, okay. Okay. All
right. All right. Well, there

1679
01:46:19,830 --> 01:46:26,460
you go. What IMHO it is your H
O. U R. H O chapter Whoa it's

1680
01:46:26,460 --> 01:46:26,670
your

1681
01:46:28,050 --> 01:46:32,340
Dave Jones: it's your it's just
your Oh Your opinion is Oh,

1682
01:46:33,480 --> 01:46:38,280
Chapter ho Great show the cert
okay sir truck driver 3333

1683
01:46:38,280 --> 01:46:41,400
through fountain says if you
look at the times when booths

1684
01:46:41,400 --> 01:46:44,580
come in after show is uploaded
you can use that info to see

1685
01:46:44,580 --> 01:46:47,520
when listeners actually listened
assuming they boost while

1686
01:46:47,520 --> 01:46:50,220
listening that's trackable info
for listener demographics it

1687
01:46:50,580 --> 01:46:55,410
absolutely yes. And well
anonymized. Be mozzie Brian

1688
01:46:55,410 --> 01:46:58,950
mozzie says 44/44 of fountain he
says don't love the boost images

1689
01:46:58,950 --> 01:47:02,340
but don't hate them. Talk the
toggling would be appreciated,

1690
01:47:02,490 --> 01:47:09,480
or at least reduced duration
agree 6969 from ASA doesn't he

1691
01:47:09,480 --> 01:47:14,460
bought verse. Hey, Adam. Okay,
drunk drink. Quick drunk a gram

1692
01:47:14,460 --> 01:47:16,740
asking, what is V for Vela?

1693
01:47:17,670 --> 01:47:19,890
Adam Curry: gotta read a drunk.
Drunk.

1694
01:47:20,610 --> 01:47:23,490
Dave Jones: Yeah. Have the as
had been my people have said to

1695
01:47:23,490 --> 01:47:27,570
value splits for covers samples.
Are we still the persecuted

1696
01:47:27,570 --> 01:47:31,050
minority doomed to be mocked by
the people who would keep us on

1697
01:47:31,050 --> 01:47:31,920
our knees?

1698
01:47:32,820 --> 01:47:33,990
Adam Curry: What is he asking?

1699
01:47:34,410 --> 01:47:36,810
Dave Jones: I don't know. He
said drunker Graham.

1700
01:47:37,320 --> 01:47:40,650
Adam Curry: Thanks for more, do
more. Drink more. Send more.

1701
01:47:43,229 --> 01:47:45,779
Dave Jones: Roy ROI ROI is bad.
Roi. scheinfeld

1702
01:47:46,410 --> 01:47:48,720
Adam Curry: ROI. There you go.
What does ROI say?

1703
01:47:49,050 --> 01:47:52,290
Dave Jones: 543213. Bracy. Just
says Dave, please check your

1704
01:47:52,290 --> 01:47:52,860
telegram.

1705
01:47:54,330 --> 01:47:55,830
Adam Curry: That's the way
that's the way to get our

1706
01:47:55,830 --> 01:47:56,580
attention.

1707
01:47:57,090 --> 01:47:59,160
Dave Jones: That's a way to get
a boost. This is a good boost

1708
01:47:59,160 --> 01:48:03,300
strategy. Just don't ever check
my email or telegram. And then

1709
01:48:03,300 --> 01:48:05,520
make people boosts me to promote
me to check it. I

1710
01:48:05,520 --> 01:48:08,100
Adam Curry: had a quick back and
forth with Roy. And they're

1711
01:48:08,100 --> 01:48:11,550
starting on wallet switching
technology for the breeze app

1712
01:48:11,550 --> 01:48:16,080
next week. Sweet. Yes. Nice.
Nice. I'm very appreciative of

1713
01:48:16,080 --> 01:48:18,750
that. Because, you know, they're
focusing much more on being an

1714
01:48:18,750 --> 01:48:24,660
SDK company. And I said, Hey,
man, just so you know, I use the

1715
01:48:24,660 --> 01:48:30,540
breeze app as my actual payment
app. That's my app. So I love

1716
01:48:30,540 --> 01:48:34,110
it. And I'd love to be able to
still listen to podcasts on it

1717
01:48:34,110 --> 01:48:36,990
with music. It's because I got a
lot of dough sitting in my

1718
01:48:36,990 --> 01:48:38,730
wallet there. Want to give it
away.

1719
01:48:39,180 --> 01:48:43,890
Dave Jones: But to do dope, Jean
been 2020 to speak of the devil

1720
01:48:43,980 --> 01:48:47,430
cast ematic he says do any app
support playing any of the list

1721
01:48:47,430 --> 01:48:51,990
of medium feeds full of remote
items yet? AKA feeds like you

1722
01:48:51,990 --> 01:48:57,000
described for Ainsley? I don't
think I'm going to assume that's

1723
01:48:57,000 --> 01:49:00,420
one of Stephen B's apps does
because his apps do everything

1724
01:49:00,420 --> 01:49:06,090
so but he would have to tell us
which one I'm thinking LNBs

1725
01:49:06,090 --> 01:49:08,910
probably does. But Stephen will

1726
01:49:10,140 --> 01:49:13,830
Adam Curry: that's an app I
actually use me to I mean I just

1727
01:49:13,830 --> 01:49:19,140
pop it open and just hit play on
some top item and it responds

1728
01:49:19,140 --> 01:49:24,330
beautifully again, I see a lot
of disconnects from from Aldi

1729
01:49:25,320 --> 01:49:27,330
which sucks because you know,
like, oh, how long has it been

1730
01:49:27,330 --> 01:49:28,530
disconnected? You know?

1731
01:49:29,100 --> 01:49:31,230
Dave Jones: And then maybe the
nature of PW A's two.

1732
01:49:32,670 --> 01:49:35,070
Adam Curry: All right, we need
some info on that. Yeah,

1733
01:49:35,250 --> 01:49:38,520
Dave Jones: the anonymous 5000
SATs through pod verse. Add

1734
01:49:38,520 --> 01:49:45,660
luchar is the stumbling block,
though does cast. But add luchar

1735
01:49:45,660 --> 01:49:49,560
is the stumbling block thou dost
cast before thy brother when

1736
01:49:49,560 --> 01:49:54,090
thou does fail to return value
for his works. Calculations 3333

1737
01:49:58,410 --> 01:50:00,360
Adam Curry: No false idols here.
A

1738
01:50:01,350 --> 01:50:04,170
Dave Jones: mere mortals podcast
or buddy Karen 2020 through

1739
01:50:04,170 --> 01:50:07,260
fountain nice, thank you. Thanks
for the chat tips very helpful.

1740
01:50:07,500 --> 01:50:09,930
I've also been slightly
disappointed with Buzzsprout

1741
01:50:09,930 --> 01:50:13,500
adoption of new tags, even ones
they asked for aka pod roll.

1742
01:50:13,500 --> 01:50:16,590
Well, they fixed it. They do.
And that problem is solved

1743
01:50:16,590 --> 01:50:19,050
that's the whole reason I moved
my shows to them was for the

1744
01:50:19,050 --> 01:50:22,410
exciting new things. The same
reason I'm now moving Show's

1745
01:50:22,410 --> 01:50:24,870
over to blueberry. Viva tags.

1746
01:50:25,200 --> 01:50:26,430
Adam Curry: Viva la tags

1747
01:50:27,120 --> 01:50:30,900
Dave Jones: as I've had beers
with Tom and he said they've got

1748
01:50:30,930 --> 01:50:34,350
they've been backed up with a
big projects. I think they're

1749
01:50:34,350 --> 01:50:38,850
gonna think they're gonna start
coming out soon. Cool. Yeah.

1750
01:50:40,020 --> 01:50:45,660
Let's see we got 5150 from
Orange frog. Did you get down?

1751
01:50:46,140 --> 01:50:48,180
non-stories again?

1752
01:50:48,450 --> 01:50:49,890
Adam Curry: I've seen orange
frog

1753
01:50:50,580 --> 01:50:52,740
Dave Jones: bounced into breeze
again for this past week's

1754
01:50:52,740 --> 01:50:55,590
listening time. Always a delight
to jump into different podcast

1755
01:50:55,590 --> 01:50:57,000
apps. Thanks. Yeah, yeah, it's

1756
01:50:57,000 --> 01:50:57,600
Adam Curry: a great app.

1757
01:50:59,100 --> 01:51:02,040
Dave Jones: Oak man delimiter
comma street blogger 30 215

1758
01:51:02,040 --> 01:51:06,030
through fountain. He says Howdy,
Dave and Adam. Please invite

1759
01:51:06,030 --> 01:51:11,190
your listeners to visit my blog
at www dot CSB dot lol for my

1760
01:51:11,190 --> 01:51:15,960
cartoons with buffoons into
follow me on Twitter slash x et

1761
01:51:16,230 --> 01:51:21,960
et Cie SB just three letters C S
and B. I will follow back yo

1762
01:51:22,260 --> 01:51:25,950
Adam Curry: sbsp Yo, yo back at
you, brother. Thank you

1763
01:51:25,979 --> 01:51:28,919
Dave Jones: we we got some
monthlies thanks. Call Mr.

1764
01:51:28,919 --> 01:51:32,849
Bulger cousin mother's you got
to pay dragon cat was it $5 That

1765
01:51:32,849 --> 01:51:37,769
you had Pharaoh at $22.20. We've
got a Cameron rose at $25. Thank

1766
01:51:37,769 --> 01:51:43,889
you. A Scott Jalbert at $12. And
Speak of the devil Brendan at

1767
01:51:43,889 --> 01:51:51,089
pod pod page $25. New media
that's Marcus lindskog at $1.

1768
01:51:51,089 --> 01:51:53,429
And Mark Graham was $1. And
that's our group.

1769
01:51:53,460 --> 01:51:55,980
Adam Curry: Oh, thank you all so
much value for value is the name

1770
01:51:55,980 --> 01:51:58,020
of the game. If you want to
learn more about add value for

1771
01:51:58,020 --> 01:52:03,120
value dot info value number four
value dot info. It even has some

1772
01:52:03,120 --> 01:52:05,640
handy guides there. If you want
to learn about it. We appreciate

1773
01:52:05,820 --> 01:52:08,160
everything that you send us it
keeps the machine running it

1774
01:52:08,160 --> 01:52:11,670
keeps a nice, a nice buffer for
us in case we hit some harder

1775
01:52:11,670 --> 01:52:14,970
times so we can keep everything
running. Keep the podcast index

1776
01:52:14,970 --> 01:52:18,930
alive. And of course, everything
that we have in Satoshis goes on

1777
01:52:18,930 --> 01:52:22,140
to the node and we use that for
liquidity for anybody who needs

1778
01:52:22,140 --> 01:52:25,650
it just hit me up. Adam
mccurry.com or Adam at podcast

1779
01:52:25,650 --> 01:52:29,910
index dot social. And if you
want to give us some Fiat fun

1780
01:52:29,910 --> 01:52:32,940
coupons always appreciated as
well go to podcast index.org

1781
01:52:32,940 --> 01:52:36,510
down at the bottom. Big red
buttons one for tally coin. I

1782
01:52:36,510 --> 01:52:39,840
know we we did it seems like
there was another tally coin

1783
01:52:39,840 --> 01:52:45,570
that came in on the last show.
Because one was 95,564 from

1784
01:52:45,570 --> 01:52:51,420
chimp. And then there was a
211,273 from anonymous. Oh, I

1785
01:52:51,420 --> 01:52:54,810
don't think we mentioned the
anonymous. Oh, thank you for

1786
01:52:54,810 --> 01:52:55,320
that.

1787
01:52:55,530 --> 01:52:59,100
Mike Dell: Thank you latterly
Anonymous is from pod vs.

1788
01:52:59,100 --> 01:53:01,650
Because every time it
disconnects, you got to put your

1789
01:53:01,650 --> 01:53:02,550
name in there again.

1790
01:53:02,790 --> 01:53:05,220
Adam Curry: I was that true?
Yeah. That's

1791
01:53:06,720 --> 01:53:07,440
Mike Dell: earlier that was

1792
01:53:08,310 --> 01:53:11,130
Adam Curry: oh, I didn't know
that. Oh, interesting.

1793
01:53:12,270 --> 01:53:14,460
Dave Jones: Bug. I bet Mitchell
fix. Go. Yeah.

1794
01:53:16,050 --> 01:53:18,660
Adam Curry: I love Mitch is
like, hey, you know what, when

1795
01:53:18,660 --> 01:53:22,590
did this happen? When did we do
this? He's been so busy. It was

1796
01:53:22,590 --> 01:53:24,510
dinging is that you Todd? Who's
dinging?

1797
01:53:24,570 --> 01:53:25,410
Todd Cochran: I'm sorry.

1798
01:53:25,620 --> 01:53:28,020
Adam Curry: All right. You've
been craquelin and all kinds of

1799
01:53:28,020 --> 01:53:31,920
there's something weird with
your your setup, which is odd.

1800
01:53:32,070 --> 01:53:33,330
I'm not sure. Well, When

1801
01:53:33,390 --> 01:53:34,110
Dave Jones: is Halloween?

1802
01:53:34,800 --> 01:53:36,960
Mike Dell: Not how was a full
moon a couple of days ago.

1803
01:53:37,680 --> 01:53:41,760
Adam Curry: That'll do it every
single time. So anything you

1804
01:53:41,760 --> 01:53:44,550
guys want to share with us
before we before we leave? And

1805
01:53:44,550 --> 01:53:47,100
by the way, thank you for being
here in in the boardroom. We

1806
01:53:47,100 --> 01:53:48,330
always appreciate you here.

1807
01:53:48,900 --> 01:53:50,640
Mike Dell: Yeah, my pleasure.
For sure.

1808
01:53:51,479 --> 01:53:54,119
Todd Cochran: We got one thing
you know, Dave, last week or

1809
01:53:54,119 --> 01:53:57,869
week before he said there was
you aren't ready to go to war. I

1810
01:53:57,869 --> 01:54:02,549
think what we need to do is
battle armor up because Nick

1811
01:54:02,549 --> 01:54:05,399
Adams, right, you know, every
time and I'm gonna say it. So

1812
01:54:05,399 --> 01:54:08,789
get your boost ready? Anytime
someone says they have a YouTube

1813
01:54:08,789 --> 01:54:15,449
podcast boost, you immediately
asked them either in a comment

1814
01:54:15,569 --> 01:54:19,019
or wherever he says, Okay, where
can I find you on a podcast app?

1815
01:54:19,769 --> 01:54:23,009
And if they look at you weird,
then say, Hey, I'm not going to

1816
01:54:23,099 --> 01:54:26,219
listen to your show until you're
in a podcast app. And and maybe

1817
01:54:26,219 --> 01:54:30,359
we'll get these folks over some
time to understand that they

1818
01:54:30,359 --> 01:54:35,879
need an RSS feed. Oh, good. And
I've been telling my audience

1819
01:54:35,909 --> 01:54:38,609
the same thing. You know, I
actually said my auntie to

1820
01:54:38,609 --> 01:54:41,549
someone tells you they've got a
podcast on the name that won't

1821
01:54:41,549 --> 01:54:46,499
be named. Ask them if that you
know if they're on a podcast app

1822
01:54:46,529 --> 01:54:50,399
because you want to subscribe.
And if they don't then maybe at

1823
01:54:50,429 --> 01:54:54,179
least trigger them to say oh,
what is this RSS thing? So maybe

1824
01:54:54,179 --> 01:54:56,369
we can do it subtly without
having to beat them over the

1825
01:54:56,369 --> 01:54:57,089
head with a hammer.

1826
01:54:57,990 --> 01:54:59,580
Dave Jones: I think you're I
think you're right. Because I

1827
01:54:59,580 --> 01:55:04,260
mean that Here's the whole
thing. The whole thing is, I'm

1828
01:55:04,260 --> 01:55:08,010
of the opinion that the whole
YouTube thing in general is a

1829
01:55:08,010 --> 01:55:12,780
scam cooked up by the by the
PSE. I agree because the the

1830
01:55:12,780 --> 01:55:17,370
whole, you read these, read
these studies, and they say,

1831
01:55:17,850 --> 01:55:20,490
YouTube is the biggest app for
podcasts for people listening to

1832
01:55:20,490 --> 01:55:25,470
podcasts. And then you read the
next study that says, we know

1833
01:55:25,470 --> 01:55:28,890
how many podcasts how many
popular podcasts are on YouTube,

1834
01:55:29,220 --> 01:55:34,620
like five. Now, these obviously
don't mesh. So somebody's lying

1835
01:55:34,620 --> 01:55:37,770
here. Because if you can't find
any of your podcasts on YouTube,

1836
01:55:37,770 --> 01:55:41,610
but your YouTube is the biggest
thing for podcasting, I'm just

1837
01:55:41,610 --> 01:55:43,110
gonna have to call bullshit on
that.

1838
01:55:45,150 --> 01:55:49,260
Mike Dell: The average person
doesn't know the difference.

1839
01:55:49,500 --> 01:55:53,400
Today, I was physical therapy.
And I, you know, I told him, you

1840
01:55:53,400 --> 01:55:55,320
know, he asked me what I do for
a living. It's I worked for a

1841
01:55:55,320 --> 01:56:00,780
podcast company. Oh, I watch a
lot of podcasts. And I know he

1842
01:56:00,780 --> 01:56:04,530
wasn't talking about, you know,
wasn't talking about an actual

1843
01:56:04,560 --> 01:56:06,270
RSS feed video.

1844
01:56:06,840 --> 01:56:08,670
Todd Cochran: So I follow a
couple of YouTube channels that

1845
01:56:08,670 --> 01:56:12,390
have so called podcast and I've
sent them a note said, Hey, I

1846
01:56:12,390 --> 01:56:16,530
can't find you on my podcast app
where you guys had and they they

1847
01:56:16,530 --> 01:56:19,620
finally responsive. What do you
mean? And I told him so it's

1848
01:56:19,620 --> 01:56:22,500
again, I think it's a crater
site it's a little education

1849
01:56:22,680 --> 01:56:24,600
listeners are gonna do with
listeners are going to do But

1850
01:56:24,600 --> 01:56:28,560
may we get the the what I would
call from a white term Akamai,

1851
01:56:28,560 --> 01:56:32,100
the smart listeners to be able
to start to help us in this

1852
01:56:32,100 --> 01:56:32,610
crusade?

1853
01:56:33,030 --> 01:56:35,580
Dave Jones: And let me tell you
why. Let me tell you tell you

1854
01:56:35,580 --> 01:56:40,830
why that matters. in the broader
sense for for for things like

1855
01:56:40,830 --> 01:56:45,330
this show and for the podcast
community is that these studies

1856
01:56:45,360 --> 01:56:49,410
that are show that are trying to
conflate YouTube with

1857
01:56:49,410 --> 01:56:53,940
podcasting, though, they be sure
the listeners are going to do

1858
01:56:53,940 --> 01:56:57,150
what they're going to do. But
these studies are aimed at pot

1859
01:56:57,210 --> 01:57:01,980
the podcast, quote unquote,
industry. Yes. And it is it is

1860
01:57:01,980 --> 01:57:07,410
convincing podcasters of
something that is not accurate.

1861
01:57:08,100 --> 01:57:12,750
It's telling a lie to the people
who are actually doing

1862
01:57:12,750 --> 01:57:17,250
podcasting. No other industry
does this. No other industry

1863
01:57:17,310 --> 01:57:22,800
tries to convince its members
that the thing that they are is

1864
01:57:22,800 --> 01:57:26,850
not what they are. And we
listen, this doesn't work,

1865
01:57:27,330 --> 01:57:29,970
Adam Curry: except in the pharma
industry.

1866
01:57:33,000 --> 01:57:35,730
Todd Cochran: We should not be
fooled, we should not be fooled,

1867
01:57:35,730 --> 01:57:39,900
they are trying to lock us back
into walled gardens. I have to

1868
01:57:39,900 --> 01:57:40,560
remember that

1869
01:57:40,620 --> 01:57:45,390
Adam Curry: all right. So here's
my recommendation. Stop talking

1870
01:57:45,390 --> 01:57:50,520
about them. Stop talking about
this only behooves them this is

1871
01:57:50,520 --> 01:57:53,970
the divide and conquer strategy
which is as old as the road to

1872
01:57:53,970 --> 01:57:59,520
Rome. Stop talking about them.
That's it You know you want to

1873
01:57:59,520 --> 01:58:03,090
talk about that. I've nothing to
say the here's my i This is my

1874
01:58:03,090 --> 01:58:06,060
podcast app. This is what I use.
This is what I like about it.

1875
01:58:06,360 --> 01:58:10,770
And here's the other podcast
apps I use as the podcast

1876
01:58:10,770 --> 01:58:14,820
industrial complex is designed
to have you Todd specifically

1877
01:58:14,820 --> 01:58:19,440
you talk about this stuff. And
the more you talk about it the

1878
01:58:19,440 --> 01:58:20,580
more interest there is

1879
01:58:21,060 --> 01:58:24,120
Todd Cochran: no I definitely
have been super positive to help

1880
01:58:24,120 --> 01:58:24,360
that.

1881
01:58:25,050 --> 01:58:32,370
Adam Curry: But it doesn't
Alright, Thank you Mitch D for

1882
01:58:32,400 --> 01:58:35,730
5000 SATs. He says anonymous
bugs should be fixed in the next

1883
01:58:35,730 --> 01:58:39,570
release been talking with CSP
about it's 7777 from Mike

1884
01:58:39,570 --> 01:58:44,070
Newman, who sent us a Tod you to
boost our morale. And then we

1885
01:58:44,070 --> 01:58:49,560
got to 23,456 satoshi 23456 Was
that you again Mike says

1886
01:58:49,740 --> 01:58:51,720
boosting MC boost boost armor up

1887
01:58:52,530 --> 01:58:54,000
Mike Dell: that wasn't me. Oh,
that's

1888
01:58:54,000 --> 01:58:56,130
Adam Curry: injured. How that
doesn't happen often you get

1889
01:58:56,130 --> 01:58:59,130
armor up to in a row. Well,
thank you for anonymous or

1890
01:58:59,130 --> 01:59:04,920
someone who's who had a name but
the budget to anonymous. Just

1891
01:59:05,070 --> 01:59:09,030
and there's Dred Scott 23456
Dang it pod verse change my

1892
01:59:09,030 --> 01:59:13,920
boost MC boost. donemus. There
you go. He's up to 50,000. All

1893
01:59:13,920 --> 01:59:16,680
right. Hey, we got to stop doing
this. People are sending us too

1894
01:59:16,680 --> 01:59:20,610
many Satoshis. Gentlemen, thank
you both very much for being in

1895
01:59:20,610 --> 01:59:22,860
the board. And we always
appreciate you having you here.

1896
01:59:22,860 --> 01:59:25,050
And thank you for all that
you're doing to move the needle

1897
01:59:25,050 --> 01:59:28,530
forward. I think you're really
smart. Because I know Todd, you

1898
01:59:28,530 --> 01:59:31,380
had a revelation. This was about
a year and a half ago. And I'm

1899
01:59:31,380 --> 01:59:34,650
very glad you followed your your
gut instinct on this. I think

1900
01:59:34,650 --> 01:59:37,590
it's bids and made a huge
difference. And Mike thank you

1901
01:59:37,800 --> 01:59:45,720
for for the yeoman's job that
you do with teaching everybody

1902
01:59:45,720 --> 01:59:50,070
this all of the individuals who
who show up at your door wanting

1903
01:59:50,070 --> 01:59:53,250
to know which mouse button to
click to what is value for

1904
01:59:53,250 --> 01:59:58,020
value. I know it's not easy. I
know it's not easy to export.

1905
01:59:59,430 --> 02:00:01,530
Alright everybody Thank you
everyone in the chat room. Thank

1906
02:00:01,530 --> 02:00:05,160
you everyone to podcasting next
out social, your board meeting.

1907
02:00:05,430 --> 02:00:08,820
We will return next week on
Friday again if Tiny Tim is

1908
02:00:08,820 --> 02:00:10,710
alive, we'll see you then
everybody.

1909
02:00:28,650 --> 02:00:32,550
Unknown: You have been listening
to podcasting 2.0 to visit

1910
02:00:32,550 --> 02:00:39,990
podcast index.org For more
information do you know who your

1911
02:00:39,990 --> 02:00:40,680
daddy is?