Your Podcast Isn't Getting You Found. Here's How One Founder Fixed It

SPEAKER_01 0:00

That really positioned me after a short space of time as a leading expert in our industry. I've been able to somewhat even match that in a short space of time simply by podcasting.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

What is the actual practical things you're doing with your podcast episodes that actually feed the AI in a way that makes sure you get found? Yeah, so Wes Towers, founder of Uplift360 and host of Built Trusted Chosen, a show he runs to help his own trades and construction agency get found and win work.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

Always having written content off the back of a show is super important. The transcript creates a blog post. The blog post creates the social posts. So we're using websites to fuel almost to train AI about who we are. If you can publish to a Google business profile frequently, then I'm Kenny, and this is the Founder Podcast Lab.

SPEAKER_00 0:55

So was when a buyer goes searching now Google, ChatGPT, AI, how do we make sure their name pops up and there's the ones that get picked?

SPEAKER_01 1:08

It's super difficult, isn't it? Because we're living in a day and age where there's an abundance of information out there. So how on earth do you stand out above everybody else? Particularly when there's people mass-producing content at scale using AI to syndicate that message far and wide. But that's creating problems. It's it's losing its authenticity. So there's that trust that's being eroded. And so I think we're seeing trust eroded in every aspect of business and life in general. I mean, we've all read something that we don't feel as though is authentic. We think it's AI written. We've seen images that we know are not genuinely, they look real, but they're not real. Um, and videos, you know, we're having problems here in Australia with videos of politicians that are not really them saying things that they never said. So these erosions of trust in what we view online are becoming challenging. So we've got to find ways as marketers to cut above the noise and to be to build a business on trust signals is really, really important. So, what is it that you you say you bring to market that's authentically your voice? And um, that's the only way to make a distinction between yourself and everybody else.

SPEAKER_00 2:19

So you have to bring to it your authentic voice. Okay. So what does that look like practically? So what you are using specific keywords from your specific voice when you make your episodes, what how do you set that up?

SPEAKER_01 2:36

Yeah, well, for us, the way which we've set up the podcast is one vehicle for for um taking our message far and wide to to online um is to to do things that feel genuine and authentic. And that resonates with our clients and customers. So for our clients and customers, their trades, um, construction, uh uh, you know, industrial brands, things of that nature. So their down-to-earth um content is uh is what they're looking for and hungering for. And they they often are on the road a lot, uh driving around from site to site. So they have the opportunity to listen to a lot of podcasts. So the way in which I've chosen to do it, to connect with that type of person, that down-to-earth, pragmatic, hands-on, practical person, is to interview people just like them, but also to do no editing. Now, that might not be appropriate for other audiences. They want something more polished and refined, but for us and our audience, the the less refinement and polish, the better. And the other aspect of that is people know it's real because there's arms, there's ours. It's published as if live. Now we do pre-record them, but we publish them unedited. So they may as well have been live. It's just that because of our time zone, it's challenging um for other places. So we try and pick a time that's suitable for the for most people. And it goes live to LinkedIn and and Facebook and uh YouTube, and um then it gets published on all this on the audio-based um podcast as well. But I think you've got to find a way that your message is distinctly yours and for us, for the podcast point of view, is not to edit it. And then it's obviously my natural voice, but it's also the guest's natural voice as well. And that's there's resonance in that because we I think there's a um a pushback against the perfected AI, polished, refined. It's almost when when we think about artificial, we think about artificial food potentially. We know it fills our belly, but it doesn't give us nutrients. It doesn't give us sustain us. It's it's not good for us for the long term to only eat uh artificial food. Now, artificial, you know, supplements, supplements are good, they're healthy, um, but you need a sustainable uh long-term diet. And I think that's what there's a hunger for that real authentic message. And it certainly helps our uh clientele because it's how they naturally are as well. That's what they hunger for. And so you've got to you you've gotta feed people what they're hungry for and and um find find what works for your particular audience.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Okay. I'm hearing that find what works for your particular audience, what makes you authentic, and that'll give you that differentiation. Okay. Yeah. I see that.

SPEAKER_01 5:17

It's the same thing when we're working with our clients. You know, we do website, we're a digital agency. That's the business. We run the podcast, I run the podcast as a as a vehicle to to um get found and trusted and chosen. Um the the show is called Built Trusted Chosen because we work with uh those types of businesses who build something typically. So the um, yeah, but the way in which we work with our clients is exactly the same. So, and you can capture so much just by you know recording conversations with your your customers and clients and then taking that transcript. And it can be powerful in capturing how they authentically show up on site. So you want you don't want a mismatch between how you market and how they show up as a real business. It needs to be consistent, you know. So if there's a mismatch, people will feel as though something's not quite right and the sale is far uh more difficult to close. So getting everything aligned in that way is really helpful. And AO is powerful at that because we can capture the Zoom call where you zoom for the uh meetings and take that transcript and repurpose it in so many ways. We could create blog posts, we can create a style guide for their writing because we're capturing their words and their voice. Now it'll be slightly more refined than what they might speak. For example, there might not be swear words that a lot of these guys might be swearing. Uh, us Aussies like the occasional uh profanity. So we would refine it down from that aspect, but it's still authentically them.

SPEAKER_00 6:45

So you're saying your guests are you said potential clients and customers?

SPEAKER_01 6:50

Sometimes, yeah, not always. We're just looking for a quality, um, someone who can provide some value to the audience. And so it's for trades and construction people, and so that could come in a whole broad range of things. So it might be a a business coach who specializes in that field or an accountant, or you know, there's all sorts of different things, you know, some automation-based people. Um, so they're more collaborative, potential collaborative partners for us. But I never kind of try and focus on the end sale. I just try and produce the most powerful podcast we can and know that the the guests will certainly share it. If it's a great podcast, they will share it to that network, and that's the power of it. So they need opportunity to promote their business in a gentle way so it doesn't sound like a just one massive sales pitch to get that balance right. They need to see value in it so they share it to their world. They might have, you know, thousands of people connected on social media, and so then they're doing the marketing for us because they're seeing my face and our brand and everything show up in all the right places.

SPEAKER_00 7:59

So it seems that you have very particular guests that will speak in the way that resonates with your customer avatar that allows people to who those customer avatars, when they're searching, trying to solve a particular problem, they find your podcast, they relate to what's the conversation is, and that's how they resonate with you and come back around. Is is that what's happening?

SPEAKER_01 8:29

Yeah, that's for the most part, that's the the major benefit. Also, it's just for if no one were to tune into our shows, obviously they they do, but if no one tuned into a particular podcast, if I've learned something about our audience and market, a a greater need, it might be and might not be a need that we necessarily serve, but I'll hear on the ground what's actually happening. So I just interviewed a guy a couple of days ago, it hasn't been published yet, but um the learnings, he was talking about the finance aspect of building um major construction projects. And so it wasn't a world I was fully familiar with. I had an understanding of residential loans because I've been through that process myself, but I didn't understand the commercial zones, uh uh commercial um finance requirements and so on for massive buildings to find out, you know, how they've got to pre-sell for for us in Australia, and it will be slightly different to other places, but they need to pre-sell a whole bunch. If they're building an apartment building, they need to pre-sell a whole bunch before they can get the finance from the from the bank, because the bank wants to know how you're gonna be able to get enough cash flow uh to make this thing happen. And so, and then some of the changes and nuance, things are changing all the time. So it just keeps me really connected and understanding what my target audience is going through. And sometimes that information is beneficial, just on a relational aspect. So if I'm just having a chat, because the stronger the connection you can create, um the better. So just having a chat to some of these builders potentially, it's going to be helpful to understand the pain they're going through right now because things are changing politically and the um and so on. So, you know, different challenges that I'm just aware of, and it might help us market to them for them as well. But um, it's building my base knowledge. That's even if no one tuned into a show, and of course, other people tune in because they're getting the same benefits as I do as the host.

SPEAKER_00 10:21

So you're like also secondary benefit of the show is just generally getting market research so that you better understand your customer avatar, better understand what's happening in the field. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

Yeah, it's really it's a really interesting thing. I know other podcasts have different strategy, and that's perfectly fine. They have a different method. There's so many different ways. You know, most people would probably edit at least the ums and ahs out and that sort of thing, but for us, that's not kind of what we're going for. Um, because these are tradies. We call them here in a in a Australia tradies, so tradespeople, trade uh, and you know, construction. They might be other, they might be within these companies, not actually on the tools, but that that part of that world. So um yeah, it's it's been really helpful to have that. And also it saves work on my side, which is a massive benefit and our team to um because when do you start and stop? If you're gonna edit things, it's so difficult because you start editing and then you um then you find you you just don't know where you quite stop. It's just a massive task. So it just goes out as if it's live.

SPEAKER_00 11:29

So you have this you have this branding thing where it you change SEO search engine optimization to search everywhere optimization. What is the main difference between normal SEO and what you were seeing with search everywhere optimization? And how does someone apply it?

SPEAKER_01 11:49

Yeah, yeah. And so for those that so just to set it up in case people aren't aware, SEO search engine optimization was an attempt to show up in Google and other search engines as highly as you could for as many phrases as you as you could. So typically um it might be Plumber Melbourne. So the service you provide all the product plus the location if it's geographically um bound, and most um service businesses are um, or certainly our clients are, uh, you know, they can only serve people they can get to. So that's kind of key words in the way which search engine optimization worked for many years, but now search everywhere optimization because people aren't researching just on Google anymore. Oftentimes, if they're ready to buy, they still use Google because they're looking for the best option to buy that thing. But when they're in the research phase, they're more likely, uh they might use Google still, some people will, but they're more likely to use their preferred AI platform because they can have and there's the AI mode in in uh Google as well. But they may jump into uh, you know, ChatGBT if that's that's one of the most popular and have a conversation. They're conversational um platforms. So the search everywhere optimization is about showing up in all these places. Obviously, social media is a is a is an aspect too, but I feel like the trajectory is moving more and more toward AI. So we're optimizing the content um so it shows up in all the right places in large language models to get your brand found. Back in the day, you used to create backlinks. So a backlink was a link from another website to yours. And as long as it was a quality website referencing your website, then it would act like a little vote of confidence. These days you don't even need the backlink because these are large language models, they understand context, they just recognize the brand mention or they rent they they find my personal brand, which I'm the it's a founder-led business. So if they they might be um looking for a service offering that we provide or a solution, we're thinking about websites in a different way. So we're using websites to fuel almost to train AI about who we are. And obviously, you want um that that's the pivotal uh key where you control your own website, but also you want your message far syndicated far and wide. So that's why podcasting is so powerful. You know, it's a collaborative process. In in this podcast, it's you and I, it's speaking, and then we share it to our networks. So you're multiplying your reach instantly at low cost. The cost is your time, of course, and the cost is potentially feeling embarrassed. Certainly, when I started podcasting, I was overwhelmed, I didn't know how to speak. Um, it was a scary thing. And I think that's what holds people back from starting a podcast or even guesting. So I think you you got to pay the price of embarrassment, maybe, that you might feel, um, that reluctance to hide behind the screen and put yourself out there. I think those that are prepared to um build a personal brand and leverage that personal brand into their company brand are going to be the big winners in the future because it's humanizing our messaging and our brand. And that's realistically all we'll be left with to just differentiate. We all kind of rise to the, you know, to the same level um with all the same tools. Eventually, everyone's gonna have these perfect AI tools that do it almost everything for you. What is it that's gonna make you set apart from the rest and distinctive and unique and to keep your business viable? That's the human aspect and the emotional intelligence and relating to people and understanding them at a deep level. That's what we've got to build.

SPEAKER_00 15:20

Quick one and then back to the episode. If you're a founder with a show that's already handed off to a freelancer, an editor, a team, but you're still chasing down files, approving clips, and keeping things on schedule, stop that now. That's not your job. You're supposed to be working on the business. The podcast is supposed to help feed the business. ProPod Concierge, you record, we handle the rest. Right now, we're taking on a handful of founders for a full free month. In exchange, all we ask is honest feedback or testimonial if we knock it out of the park. If that's too much of a commitment for you, we can start with one episode. And if you like that, we can move to a full free month. After that month, if you want to continue with paid, that's up to you. It's not required. Now, this isn't for everyone. If you are editing yourself still, and you just want to delegate this out to a cheap editor, skip this. Only a handful of seats are available. Once we run out of seats, you would be put on a wait list. If you're interested, go to propodconteers.com and apply, or hit the link in the show notes. Now back to the episode. So big on branding, having the podcast, have that emotional context, having that personal connection with the audience, and being able to put that widespread through the podcast. Now, creating that, putting that out there, getting over the hurdle, getting the podcast out there. Cool. When they put the podcast out there, what's the difference between someone's podcast that gets found in the context searches of AI and the ones that don't?

SPEAKER_01 17:05

Yeah, it's real, and that's the that's the key, isn't it? Because we all hear stats about podcasts that that start and only last a few um episodes potentially, or maybe, you know, half a year, whatever it is, and then they feel as though they're not getting the traction they need. I think you've got to get past, you've got to break through that and build your audience slowly. The um what I've found is as more and more guests have come on board and they share their their show with other people, then the the audience is slowly building. We've found most of our audience is on Spotify. So they're listening. And I assume, I don't know, I haven't got data on it, but I would I would gather because our audience is in the car a lot of the time, driving from site to site, they're just listening. And that that goes to the the length of show as well, as is about 30, 40 minutes maybe. So they can listen to it as they're going around in their day-to-day, it's not too long. Um, and the I mean, if you want to stand out, it's incredibly difficult to be Joe Rogan or to um, you know, be the diary of a CEO with that level of audience and influence. Uh it would be lovely if we could. But what we can do is be really niched and specific. If there's an audience that's not really well served, um that you and it relates to what you do, um, if you can find that connection, you can be a really great voice for a specific niche. People looking for specific information. You know, as we as we develop shows, some of the older shows get um still get lot lots of views because I think people are looking for that particular topic. And so, you know, getting out, getting it out there, and it's it's not my topic, it's the guests' topic, but I'm unpacking it for them in a way that's practical for me as well. And we'll touch on my business, our business um loosely as well. So, you know, um, yeah, it just builds momentum. I think people have got to stick it out. It's it's not a shiny bullet that's going to get instant results unless you're already somewhat famous. I wasn't. Um, but you've yeah, you've got to be really specific and niche. If you're so if you're serving a particular type of person, the avatar, then you've got the potential to grow your audience massively.

SPEAKER_00 19:18

So you're saying that the difference is the intention and specifics uh niche wise of the topics.

SPEAKER_01 19:28

Yeah. Yeah, that's right. I mean, so just to think about something that's a potentially a a boring topic, like accounting. Like it's kind of a boring, unless, of course, you've got a particular accounting need right there and then. And so um our our audience is global. We'll share things that are specifically local, but in the context of how it might apply to other places as well. But we've had massive tax reform um on investment properties. And so that impacts a lot of our audience because they're building these investment homes and so on. And so to get um information out that's relevant and topical right there and then, people are looking for it because they don't know what it means. They don't know what it's gonna mean to their uh, you know, even you know, there's been uh lots of political opinion shared by some politicians about less migration. And that's gonna create headaches for our client, our clientele and our audience because they need these people as workers. Also, these people coming in create more demand for all sorts of things, you know, more roads, better facilities, more hospitals, more homes, um, all these things that are impacting their world. So if we get people in guesting on relevant things right there and then, then people are searching for it and they'll find us. And it's um just connecting us in a relevant way.

SPEAKER_00 20:51

Is that a very intentional thing where you're looking at the topics that are current and finding and asking questions or finding guests that can answer that specific question? Or is that something that just happens naturally?

SPEAKER_01 21:06

It's a bit of both. So sometimes I'll just have guests on because they're a great guest and they've they've been around the circuit of guesting a lot and they speak well and it's relevant to our audience. So I just take them no matter what their topic is, even if it's a topic we've covered slightly before, we'll we'll unpack it in a different way. Everyone's got their own flavor. But sometimes when there's something super relevant, um then I go find someone who's who's I know can talk about that. And so we had a great guy on there, he was specializing in demographics and so and population and talking about some of the um changes in the in the environment and the landscape here in terms of population and what's likely to happen as a consequence of all of that. So that was super relevant. I didn't have anyone in my world who could speak to that, but I found what seemed to be the very best um that I could find here, and I just Hit him up on LinkedIn and said, Hey, love your material, what you what you're saying. I'd love you on our podcast. This is our audience. Uh, would you be prepared to do so? And he he did that. And it was it was wonderful. Um, particularly the reels that we got off the back of that, the the shorts, they seem to do better than the podcast itself. Um, so he just had some really great, you know, phrases and things that, you know, were really relevant in the in the short form. So that's the added benefit. We created the long form podcast, but the but that what we created off the back of that was even more powerful in in his instance. It's not always that way.

SPEAKER_00 22:36

I like that example where you had that you had that one person who had the knowledge on that particular topic, and they were able to give you some reels that really stood out. Now, back to SEO. What is the actual practical things you're doing with your podcast episodes that actually feed the AI in a way that makes sure you get found in these searches?

SPEAKER_01 23:02

Yeah, so always having written content off the back of a show is super important. And so it might be for us, we'll take the transcripts, and we've got some great prompts to to um promote the show. We don't we don't figure out the title of the show but before the show. We have a rough idea, obviously, of what we're gonna cover. But off the back of, you know, some great prompts. We take the transcript, the text, and make make some things that we can share on the on the as a blog post about the show. Um and it's all written content is so so much easier for the the tools, AI tools to digest right now. Now it's perceivable eventually that they'll um be able to make the use of videos more powerfully. And and obviously the in YouTube there's a transcript aspect that you can get as well. But the written content, it's just easier for them to digest, the AI platforms. They're large language models, they're looking for content, they're looking looking for information. So you've got to give it in a way which is useful and practical so it can be found. And naturally, we don't think about keywords in the same way we used to. So back in the day, you'd try and cram in the keywords in all the right places, and there was clever ways to do it to structure up the content so it'd get found. But it's far more sophisticated than that. If it reads well, if it's useful for end human user, it's likely to help your um SEO search everywhere optimization because they're they're large language models, they understand the context and nuance. And so it's about publishing it in a way that it's it's unique, it's something that's distinct. And just because it's off the back of a natural conversation, it will naturally be unique and distinct because they'll touch on things in a certain way that that creates relevance. So that's it's really, really helpful.

SPEAKER_00 24:53

So you're taking the transcript and you're having specific prompts with AI to generate what blog posts or descriptions. What exactly are you generating?

SPEAKER_01 25:06

Yeah, the blog post is a is a big thing because we want the our website to be the the focus, like the pillar of truth for our company and brand. So that's the priority. So that's what we can publish within the website, which is really, really helpful. But then of course, we we want to get found in places where people are naturally anyway in social media. So taking the um, so what happens is the transcript creates a blog post. The blog post creates the social posts. And so I don't do that for myself, but the team does it. But there's prompts to do that. So there's prompts to take the transcript to the blog post, there's prompts to take the blog posts to social platforms, and that gets uh syndicated far and wide with um, we use Publa as the tool we prefer to share the social media posts. And simply because Publa, and there might be others that do it now, but when we chose Publa, it goes to Google, your Google business page, which is super helpful because Google loves anything in their ecosystem. So if you can publish to to the Google, your Google business profile frequently, then Google love it. So it's all helping to gear, earn trust in Google. We're still really adamant that Google is a real priority to rank highly, because that's oftentimes when someone's ready to part way with money, that's oftentimes where they go. They do the research elsewhere, but when they're ready to buy something, they're still going to check out your website, particularly if it's a higher investment. You know, if they're buying a $5 widget, yeah, sure, they might buy it straight on social. That's cool. But if they're spending thousands of dollars on something, you know, their dream home, they're going to check out everything they possibly can about the company, check the credibility, authenticity, reliability. You know, lots of businesses go out of business, particularly in the construction world. Unfortunately, there's challenges. So yeah, driving people back to a website is really important.

SPEAKER_00 26:58

So you got the transcript, you have a prompt that per turns it into a blog post, and you have the prompts that turn the blog posts into social posts using Publr, which is beneficial specifically for Google business, right? Because you still see the strong priority in making rankings on Google. I see.

SPEAKER_01 27:43

And so part of the big challenge about creating content is the speed and the complexity it can be. So I think getting it out there is the priority for us. And so some reels don't do very well and some do, but we've just streamlined everything to get it out there. And the social media platforms are really clever at showing up the right information to the people that might engage with it anyway. So we leave it to the tools themselves to show what they what they wish to show to the you know the various audiences.

SPEAKER_00 28:18

I think I'm starting to see the structure. I think I see how this whole thing is being put together. Now, when someone starts to implement like the SEO, they they're specific about the topics, their guests, they then take that transcript and they put it through AI, get these prompts, and put these things everywhere in the right way. How long before someone actually sees some sort of business outcome from like this podcast and setting it up this way?

SPEAKER_01 28:54

Yeah, great question. So it it does take time. We've only started the podcast at the start of the year, so you know, six months or so in. Um, yeah, so it's been powerful in anyone who searches my name or our company name, we're just mentioned all over the place now for relevant, you know, for our niche. I was at the at the bar with my my mate, who's uh he's quite known in our in Australia. He was he was you know famous, I guess, industry famous, uh, for what he did. And we said, hey, who's more famous out of you and me right now? And so we we we looked on ChatGPT and we also looked at Google AI and um just to see what it would say about us. And you know, the it was powerful. It it really positioned me after a short space of time as a leading expert in our in our industry. And so that's after six months, and it's only going to increase as more and more shows go out there. So he had legitimate old school fame, I suppose you would say, in a business context. Um, but I've been able to somewhat even match that in a short space of time simply by podcasting. But the business outcome of that is, you know, even people reaching out to be on the show, you know, they're reaching out to be on the show because there's, you know, benefit to them right away. But also they're likely to be a potential customer most of the time. So not that we only take on potential clients and customers, but people reaching out, they have a reason to come to us. And so that creates more relationships and conversations and gets us known uh far and wide.

SPEAKER_00 30:31

Can you give me one example of a person finding you and becoming a customer, maybe a guest and then the customer, just one solid example that led from oh, the podcast SEO to I have this outcome of a customer?

SPEAKER_01 30:47

Yeah, the um the the one we launched a website maybe a month ago now, and they'd listened to lots and lots of podcasts. We haven't guessed, we they requested to be a guest, we haven't been able to align our calendars quite yet. They will be eventually, but um they reached out as to to want to be on the show, but they also said, Hey, and by the way, we we are ready to redo our website. I said, Well, when are you doing that? And they said, Well, we've already got a couple of proposals in. Um, do you want to do one? I said, Yeah, of course we'll do that. So we did that quickly and got the job and and and actually have launched that website. So that came in, might have been the first two or three months of having the show on. He'd, for whatever reason, seen um, and it's a weekly show, um, he'd he'd bumped into it somehow, I would assume through socials initially, um, then listened to some shows and um wanted to be a guest. We got the website, we want him as a client even before he's been on the show. I think he'll be a great guest as well. That's that's why he reached out, but the other benefits were were just natural.

SPEAKER_00 31:54

So he found you through the socials somehow. All your work with the SEO, he came across you. He then reached out and was looking to, he was looking to be a customer, honestly, first, right? And then you asked him, did you also want to be a guest? Is that is that right?

SPEAKER_01 32:13

No, no, he he reached out to be a guest initially, and then it was almost like, oh, by the way, we what do you do? You do websites, oh we we need, we're getting quotes right now for our website. So it was the opposite. He was wanting to be, he reached out to be a guest, and then he said, Oh, by the way, there's a website to do. Of course we want to, of course we want to do your website. So um, you know, it's it won't always be that way. It'll be different ways. It's just about building trust in in the industry you serve. So the more they can see me show up, I I uh I go to um various networking groups, you know, almost for fun, but also you build connections and potentially grow the business as a business development tool. But I do it also for just for fun, you know, to go out and see people because sometimes I feel like I'm locked behind my screen far too much. And it's it's a it's remarkable. Those that are in the trades, construction, industrial kind of businesses, they're fully aware of all the of all the publishing we're doing through the podcast. And it's remarkable how they've found it, even without me directly going to find these people. They they recognize me. Um, but those that are not in our world in that industry, that they've never seen anything. So it's really phenomenal to have that influence. And um, it's almost like they start to know, like, and trust you before you even met, which is really powerful. You know, the the goal of marketing is to to get that to happen. So it's a great marketing endeavor and it works naturally with who I am and and what I do, you know, out there in the field as well.

SPEAKER_00 33:51

Final question was in 60 seconds, can you explain how someone listening right now who has a podcast and has this business, the podcast is promoting the business, how can they imply SEO going into the next episode? What's what is the one move they need to make?

SPEAKER_01 34:13

Yeah, so think about think about the things in which people might be searching for to find a business just like yours. And if you can make shows around that topic, that's that's ideal. But even if it's just loosely related to what you do, because eventually, I mean, we can have so many shows about website building, and that's bit massive part of the business, but it becomes bland and boring all the same. So think about some of the phrases and the needs that your target audience has. So the the greater the need, the greater the solution you can provide to that need. And income always follows solutions to the problem. So find a great need, get a great solution to that need, and you can do that through a podcast in certain terms of content. And um, income follows, it always does. Income follows value.

SPEAKER_00 35:03

Find a great need, find a great solution, package that into the podcast. Gotcha. All right. That being said, thank you for being on the show, Wes. I highly appreciate it. This was a good conversation.

SPEAKER_01 35:16

Yeah, it's been brilliant. Anyone listening this far, they should definitely give it a like and a follow and a share. Think about someone who might benefit from it personally and and share it directly to them, you know, on an SMS or a messenger, whatever you want to do.

SPEAKER_00 35:30

I agree. Everyone listen to Wes. All right. This has been the Founder Podcast Lab. See you in the next episode.