Presence, Work, and AI: Stories Beyond Location

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Find yourself in.

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Thank you for joining the Hope
and Possibilities podcast.

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I'm Nola Simon, and today I wanna
talk about my theory about presence.

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So I, long story short, I
had applied for a TED Talk.

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It was actually Global TED
Talk, which I've never actually

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seen them do that before.

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And.

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Spoiler alert, I didn't get chosen
because honestly, there were only

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10 people out of all of North
America who would've been chosen.

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And then what happens is there's,
various different locations around

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the world, and then each person who
wins in each particular location and

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goes to Tet in Vancouver in 2026.

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Odds were never in my favor, but I applied
just because I wanted to at least put

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the Saudi out there in the universe.

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And I thought Ted was actually
a good place to start because

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if I got it, that's great.

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And if I didn't, it at least gave
me an excuse to actually start.

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Publicly talking about the idea.

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So essentially what the idea is that
we need to really look at the way that

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we talk about work and how the stories
that we tell are embedded in presence.

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Because quite honestly, if I look
back at the way that my career has

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evolved, when I tell stories of
success, a lot of the stories of success

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that I have are not actually based.

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On location because the work
that I did was really never

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in person.

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My clients were always like, somewhere
between 1500 and 3000 kilometers away

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because I was based in Toronto and the
majority of the time my clients were in

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the US they weren't even the same country.

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So the.

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Success that I have that was
directly related to the work

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that I was responsible for.

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It happened in the ether on
a phone call, in a webinar.

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I did get to visit some clients,
but the majority of the time that I

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was with that company over 17 years.

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I didn't actually meet the majority of
my clients, and the majority of the work

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that I did was done over computer, over
phone, and it wasn't directly in person.

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So this is where I tell stories
about my work and my success

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in a very different way.

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I don't really talk about the fact,
that I was based in a cubicle and that

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I was surrounded by 60 other people.

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In a department of 300 because most of the
time those people were irrelevant to me.

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We had two meetings that we had to
attend each month, and I would have

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coaching session here and there with
my manager, and the majority of the

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time I was on my own talking to clients
over the phone or using the computer,

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and the rest of the people in the
department weren't really relevant

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to the way that I actually function.

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And even if I did have to ask for
help, I wasn't really asking for

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PE help from the people around me.

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I was still going to other departments
and most of the time using technology

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to, to do that interaction.

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So I tell stories about my work
success in a very different way.

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I don't talk about body language.

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I don't talk about, what I wore
that actually was influential.

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I don't talk about, how it felt
to walk into a room and present.

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And the change that I did, because
honestly, when I did do those

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types of presentations, I was

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virtual.

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I did one leadership presentation.

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They were all in a conference room
because they had been selected to

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actually be part of the leadership team.

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I had actually been declined
from that particular opportunity.

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Two core, two or three cohorts be before
that, and I was asked to speak to them,

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but it was something that I did virtually.

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So I talk about my successes in
a very different way because I

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haven't found in person to be

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where my career really
evolved and developed.

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Honestly, even with
podcasting, it's not in person.

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A lot of times I don't
even have the cameras on.

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It really depends on the guest.

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A lot of what I've done
is all been audio, right?

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But I know that certain people
make choices based on the fact that

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they are valued in a different way.

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They, perceive themself
in a different way.

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So I'm gonna tell you two stories.

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So one is of my coach.

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She does a lot of work,
asynchronous, asynchronously.

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She does a lot of work over
the phone using technology.

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But recently what last year, she
actually decided to go back to work

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in person because she's someone who
values being recognized for her energy.

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And so she felt that by
working at home, she wasn't.

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Necessarily being seen as a whole
person and her influence and her impact

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was being reduced because she was at
home and couldn't necessarily bring

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everything to each moment that she had.

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To interact with people.

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And so she wasn't, she might've
been having impact and value to

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the people that she was impacting,
but she felt she could do more.

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And it was more about how it felt
to her on a regular day, daily basis

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because her days were the same and
she wasn't necessarily seeing a whole

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lot of people and everything would
wrap up by four o'clock, four o'clock,

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and they would have dinner and.

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A lot of times she felt that no one
had actually witnessed her energy.

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So going back in person allowed
her to have that visibility to be

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witnessed in a way that she felt
was missing in her day-to-day life.

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And I understand that with her
also, she lives in a city and can

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actually walk into the downtown core.

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So it's not like it's a significant
commute for her to actually rejig her life

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and actually go back to work in an office.

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For me, hearing the story, if I was
going to do the same thing and say

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I wanted to have a more in-person
impact and be able to walk into the

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types of corporations that would be
looking for my types of skillset, I

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still have a two hour commute each way.

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So the value that I place on
actually walking into an office.

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Is impacted by that.

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So there has to be
something really motivating.

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What am I getting out of it that's beyond
paycheck, beyond rewards and recognition.

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That intrinsically makes me
feel that work has value and I

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can't do it in any other way.

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The bar is much higher for me than it
is for somebody who happens to live.

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Close to the downtown core.

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But I also had a friend, and again it's
about how their perceived physically,

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the coach was a better energy.

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The friend that I'm gonna tell
you about, she was extremely tall.

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She was almost six feet.

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She was very voluptuous and she had.

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Red hair and she was loud and she
was fun and she liked to laugh.

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And again, that energy that
she brought in person, she was

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recognized in a certain way.

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Whereas when you're working from
home and the Zoom screen, all those

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boxes are all the same size and
you have no control about where you

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end up and how you're perceived.

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And if you're on mute and you
know how people are actually.

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Reacting to you.

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It's very different, right?

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Like people, she walks into a room
and people immediately look up and she

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feels that she's got impact, right?

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I, we were friends.

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She was almost six foot
tall and I'm five foot one.

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I don't have that sort
of impact physically.

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I walk into a room and my hair's
been white for a very long time.

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White hair.

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My hair is not actually white because of
age, it's because of Wardenberg syndrome,

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but there's an association with that.

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So me walking into a room, I am short.

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I have white hair and the impression
that I give in person is often devalued.

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Because of societal norms, in terms
of ageism and possibly even misogyny.

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Now obviously she had the misogyny
aspect available to her as well too.

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It's not necessarily just related to me
but it's that pretty privilege, right?

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That energy that.

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Perception that in person you
have a certain impact on the

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way that people value you and.

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Your presence, how you look, how
you feel, the energy you bring,

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all of that really impacts it.

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So I've got this theory that if
you are someone who's actually used

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to impressing people because of
how you look, how you make people

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feel the energy that you you bring.

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And you are used to people reacting to you
in a certain way and recognize you, you

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in a certain way, because of your physical
presence, you have a harder time adapting

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to actually working from home because that

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impact is filtered by technology.

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On the Zoom screen,
everybody's the same height.

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People always think that
I'm taller than I am.

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Because most of the time they've only met
me over the phone or on technology, right?

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I have a personality that
translates well virtually.

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I know how to make my presence known.

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I know how to make an impact with force
or personality, with how I speak, with

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how I. Get people to listen to me and
pay attention to me, that ability to

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build visibility remotely is something
that I've developed over the years.

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I don't rely on physical presence
because quite honestly, I've had

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better success doing it virtually
the majority of my career, right?

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So this is something that I think,
is unacknowledged by people when

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they're debating whether in person or
virtual is the best scenario because

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quite honestly, it depends on the
person and their individual skills,

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abilities, but also their individual
version of presence and the stories

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that they tell themselves related
to how they actually make an impact.

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If you are used to making an impact
because of your energy, you might

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be able to adopt that in the virtual
world, but it's harder, right?

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If you are used to people noticing
how tall you are, how ous you are,

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you know how loud your laugh is
that's something that you might be

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able to convey on a screen, but.

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It's harder, right?

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Again, it's what gets noticed
without actually being verbalized

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without actually being.

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Made concrete.

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So that impact of body language
again, it can be conveyed on a screen.

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This is where, movies and videos and
everything that we watch virtually as well

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too, obviously gets conveyed on a screen.

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But in a corporate environment
that reliance on body language

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isn't necessarily as explicit,
isn't as necessarily as put in

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the forefront as your presence is.

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So how do you still make
that impression without being

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explicit about the changes there?

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Because everything also is filtered
through professional behavior and

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what does that look like, right?

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Like the stories that are told in
Hollywood and music videos and all

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that stuff, they tend not to be.

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They tend to be very different types
of stories that you would actually

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be telling in corporate, right?

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They've got a lot of emotion, they've
got a lot of dependence on relationship.

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There's a sexuality to it that's
usually hopefully not ev present

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in corporate environments, right?

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Because you wanna make sure that,
everybody feels safe, right?

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But this is the type of thing
that I think needs to be.

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Discussed and we need to develop language
about how we actually talk about that.

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And this is where autonomy comes into
play as well too, is people aren't

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necessarily resisting the office because

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they just want to be contrary.

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They might be adapting to the office.

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And working from home actually
helps them avoid things that

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are detrimental to the work.

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For example, if people don't know
that my hair is white and I don't

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tell them, nobody ever knows, right?

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Only when they see me or they
see a picture of me would

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they actually even know.

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A lot of times people
mistake me for blunt, right?

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It creates a whole different story than
when you actually see me in person, right?

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That storytelling that underlies
our reputations, how we're

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perceived, really makes an impact.

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And so when there's autonomy,
where does what fuels the work?

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I might choose something.

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That's very different from somebody
who actually feels that their

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energy, their physical perception,
their physical presence really

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is what fuels the work, right?

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Because we're doing
work in different ways.

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We're using our influence in different
ways, and that I think is part of the

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story that gets overlooked because.

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If you look at the reports in terms
of the height of CEOs and if you've

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ever had the pleasure of walking
into a sales conference where it's

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dominated by men, especially in the
Midwest US and everybody's over a six

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foot four and you walk in and it's
like a sea of suits with shoulders

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that are a foot taller than you are.

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Your understanding of how you make
an impact in that audience is going

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to be very different if you're
five foot one versus six foot.

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If your energy is not necessarily
that of an extrovert, but of an

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introvert or an ambivert, and you
need time to actually recharge after

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you've actually been super social,
how you make an impact and how that.

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Changes your energy, that's
going to be very different.

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And this is where, for years, for decades,
honestly, we've had to work in person.

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And the people who have

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personalities and energy that's
less suited to that extroversion,

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that has always had pri priority.

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We've had to adapt.

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We haven't had a choice.

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What's happened with the whole work
from home and working virtually

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and working from anywhere,
whatever you wanna call it, is.

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Those people, which I am myself,
am included in those people.

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We've seen that we can make an impact
in different ways that doesn't drain us.

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So we have options that we've never had
to be able to do the work that is work

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that we're perfectly capable of doing,
but in a way that doesn't drain us.

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So that's another aspect as well too.

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And that's where the agency
and the autonomy to work in

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a way that fuels the work.

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It is really honestly individual, and

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that's an aspect that we
haven't talked about either.

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And then you add in ai, how
does this really impact thing?

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The interesting thing about AI is that
we have this perception that AI might

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really just come in and start doing work
the way that humans would do that work.

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We don't understand AI enough, but
there are, stories dating back to

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like when IBM was running artificial
intelligence and doing chess with

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computers, so they would pit humans
against computers and how Big Blue would

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actually play chess against a human.

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They, the computers play chess
entirely different from the way

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humans do because they look at.

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All of the games that have ever been
played to look for the optimized

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moves, whereas a human doesn't
have the brain capacity to do

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that at a really quick pace, and
humans never play chess like that.

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So how does AI really impact
how the work gets done?

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The work that some people feel
depends on presence might be

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done completely different.

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When you've got AI involved and presence
is not really the focus of anything

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because you're using an AI agent that
doesn't actually have physical form.

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So that's another aspect of the
storytelling as well too, is you know,

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this is the way it's always been done.

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This is how people feel about it.

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Add in ai.

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And how does physical presence

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either become less
important or more important?

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That's another aspect that I need to
explore as well too, and I think this

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is a fascinating way to think about
what the future of work is going to

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be like and how we influence that.

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And what we're drawn to will
be very different based on

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how we prefer to work and what
opportunities are available to us.

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So anyways, that essentially is
the Ted Talk idea that I had in

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mind, and I will be fine tuning
that and looking for more stories.

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I'd love to have people submit stories
to me about, either the fact that you.

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The way that they've worked in
person really makes a difference.

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And this is why explaining it,
because honestly, I'm fascinated to

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see what the biases are there, right?

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Because there's bias one way or another.

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So what is the commonality?

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I'd love to see more stories
that you explain your success

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stories, but focus on.

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How the location, the presence, who was
around you, how those factors really

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either made or break or broke the
success, and how you tell those stories.

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It would be fascinating to know.

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So if you want to email me, it's
Nola, sorry nola@nolasimon.com.

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It's on my website.

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If you find you can't find it,
but it's www.nolasimon.com.

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Again, email is nola@nolasimon.com and
I'd love to hear your stories of success,

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specifically focusing on location and
what you are either able to achieve in

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person or what working virtually and
removing the physical presence as a

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factor really allowed you to do that.

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You weren't able to get
accomplished in person.

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So either story is something that
I'm interested in reading about.

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I'd love to collect those, so
if you are interested in sharing

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with me, that'd be great.

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Find yourself in.