Major Tom Schueman - Always Faithful: The Ground View Story Of An Escape From The Taliban

Jim Fuhs [00:00:03]:
For those of you that, that may not know because you're you're new to this show or whatever, you know, obviously the Marine Corps has always been a big part of my life. I, you know, I originally enlisted in high school and then, went through, Navy ROTC marine option, got commissioned in '89, retired, in actually February, so my retirement date's coming up. And it's it's funny sometimes how the marine corps is a small world, and so, one of the folks I worked with when I was at my, last duty station at the marine special operations command was, at the time, a a major, Russell Worth Parker, and he's gotten into the writing world post marine corps, and so he, you know, worked with Tom on this book. And so when I saw that, I said, hey. I'd love to get this story out because I think this is, this is very important because one of the things that we don't always realize is is one, you know, the the American, you know, fighting person does a lot for this country. Right? We've got young men and women that put their life on the line so that we can be free, and we can do things like shop on Amazon and, you know, and have our have our different perspectives, and and we do it without question. We do it, and and I think a lot of times, these folks, when they're when they're on the battlefield, they're not necessarily doing it for mom and apple pie. They're doing it to that person to their left and to their right because they want them to go home.

Jim Fuhs [00:01:40]:
And, you know, major Tom Schoeman, has been a part of this, you know, since 02/2008 is when he went to the basic school, you know, became a marine officer, and and really he's got a fascinating story because it's not your typical story. I mean, his mom didn't want him to join the marines. Right? She she didn't want to have anything to do with the military, and and god bless her. You know, Tom, I admire what your mom has done as a Chicago, police officer to help, to help raise you and your, your sibling. And so, you know, it's it's, you know, his his father, you know, was was incarcerated, in in Georgia, but they still post that time were able to to reconnect, and I I just think, you know, I have a lot of admiration for Tom in reading this book, but also as we're gonna learn about his interpreter, Zach, and that's what a lot of this is going to be about. So so this I don't spoil the whole thing, though, Chris. We probably should, should get, get Tom on here, and so, ladies and gentlemen, please welcome an American patriot active duty marine, major Tom Schoeman, the operations officer for third battalion, fifth Marines. Tom, thanks for being here today.

Tom Schueman [00:03:01]:
Hey. How are you doing? Thanks for having me.

Jim Fuhs [00:03:04]:
Yeah. So, I mean, Tom, I guess the first thing I wanna ask you is, you know, because marines don't like to write. Right? So you wrote a book about about this. I mean, this this obviously is something you're very passionate about. What made you think to to go down this route?

Tom Schueman [00:03:21]:
Sure. I first wanna address one of your comments on the opening, monologue there, like, when you said that, you know, they they preserve liberty so that we can shop on Amazon. And, it reminds me of when people say, America's not at war. America's at the, at the mall. The Marines are at war. And, and, and it's used to be this disparaging comment. And I always say, wouldn't we prefer it that way? You know, w wouldn't we, w you, do you want, what's the, what's the alternative, have America at the war? You know, it it's the very reason that we have the marines is so that America can go to the mall. I don't want my little sister at the war.

Tom Schueman [00:03:57]:
I don't want my grandma at the war. I want you know? And so so the idea is is that, we volunteer, to preserve those liberties and those freedoms so you can shop wherever you want, go wherever you want, and and and continue to live your way of life. And that, we'll we'll we'll carry the fight where where we need to. And so, I just, that that sticks out. Why why did we write the book? You know, I I I I I don't know if I'm an anomaly in terms of being a marine and who likes to write. I I have found that, more and more marines are are thinkers and and are interested in developing that, that, that legal mind. And so, there are definitely some stereotypes about Marines and, there's a bad joke about crayons, but I I'll tell you that I find more and more Marines, who are interested in reading and writing and, and, really smart. And, and so, I I had the opportunity to go to graduate school, at Georgetown.

Tom Schueman [00:04:54]:
I got to study literature. And, then I got the opportunity to teach at the Naval Academy for a couple years. And then, I got sent back to another school, the Naval War College, to get another graduate degree. So I I I had four years, so the Marine Corps was just paying me to train my brain or or help other people, read and write. And so, I have been drawn to to to writing, for sure, both professionally and and personally. I, we we wrote this book, I think, that that highlights some stories about, the heroes in our lives. And so I, I, I, I start that by talking about my mom a little bit. I have an opportunity to talk about some young men who are heroes of mine, that I served with in Afghanistan.

Tom Schueman [00:05:37]:
And then, we, we end the book talking about some heroes who, in the midst of a sea of tragedy out there outside of the airport in Kabul, there were some young men and women who held the line and and and demonstrated what it means to be no better friend all the way up until the end. And so we wanted to we wanted to kind of convey, some stuff about friendship, some stuff about promises, and, I I think that's what compelled us to to write the book.

Jim Fuhs [00:06:02]:
Yeah. And and when you talk about promises, I think that's part of the story with you and Zach, right? You when you left, right, you were you were gonna do everything you could to help him, and as things have, you know, if you wanna say, as things kind of started to fall apart as we know it in Afghanistan, right, you you kind of, you know, took to the cause of, like, hey. I I promised this guy I was gonna help him, and and you weren't you're not gonna let him down. No different than, you know, how I think most, you know, the the ethos of us as marines is, right, we we're always gonna be there for our fellow marine and help them no matter what. We don't leave anyone on the battlefield, and this is no different because Zach, and you talk about in the book, even though he's, you know, not a not a marine, he became a part of that brotherhood, and he, you know, he put his life on the line for you. I I remember reading that part where, like, you, you know, you hit that that IED and and you, like, didn't know what happened, and there he is standing over you, protecting you, when he could have very easily just taken off. And so he's a very, unique individual, and I have so much respect for for the the man that he is.

Tom Schueman [00:07:18]:
Sure. Another point from your opening monologue, and I was paying close attention, as as, you know, you said we don't necessarily just fight for apple pie and, whatever ideals that and and so there's a great passage in one of my favorite books that I taught at the Naval Academy, Gates of Fire, and there's a platoon commander, Dionysius, in that. And he says, forget what you think you fight for. Forget God, country, or other any other higher noble virtues that you think, that you fight for. For today, what you fight for is a man to your left and to your right, for he is everything, and everything is contained within him. And and that is when you're in the trenches, when you've got your bayonets fixed, that is truly what you are, fighting for in that moment. And and, you know, Keeping Our Promise is the book is titled Always Faithful, which is, taken from the Marine Corps' motto Semper Fidelis, which is Latin. And and so to me, it's easy to be faithful most of the time.

Tom Schueman [00:08:13]:
I think most people can be mostly faithful. I think where you wanna put the emphasis is on the semper or put the emphasis on the always. And it's rare, I think, for people to be a % faithful a % of the time. And and it's because when you're when you're tested and when you meet that adversity and when you meet those challenges, some people will abandon their post. But if Semper Fidelis is is more than a just a bumper sticker, if it's more than a catchphrase, it has to mean something has to be an ethos and a way of life. And that means, no matter what, no matter what. And so, that that's really, it's just me attempting to live this motto of, of, of what we ascribe to or what we say. And so, Zach undoubtedly did that, as you alluded to, on the battlefield with us, and and and it was it was my duty, I would honor Bound, to fulfill the promises that our nation made to him.

Jim Fuhs [00:09:09]:
I have so much admiration for that and for what you're doing right now, and so, you know, when we talked about this a little bit before the show, I mean, a lot of this, you know, it really all started with nineeleven, and we went into Afghanistan, and we did what we could to give these people a chance at a better way of life. And so it was people like Zach that, you know, as they were growing up saw this, right, we we saw, you know, we talked about, you know, Chris, you don't have daughters, so you're I I could say you're fortunate or unfortunate, but women were not allowed under the Taliban to learn. So even if it was only for a couple decades, and I love that you brought this up when we were talking earlier, They were given some opportunities that are life changing, and so even though things are changing right now, we don't know what's gonna happen. There are some Afghani women, right, because they've grown up, that were able to get education. Even men like Zach were able to get an education that they previously weren't able to do. So, you know, I I think, like, we talked I wouldn't say that this was all for naught, but I think now what you, and others and myself included would say is we do have a duty to help those that helped us, and that's part of, I think, why why you've written this book, and we're gonna talk about later on some of the things we can do to help Zac because even though Zac is here in The US right now, there is a possibility that he may not be able to stay, and and so, I just wanted to kind of hit on that a little bit, but but would love to to hear your thoughts on that, Tom.

Tom Schueman [00:10:55]:
Zach, you know, in in in 02/2001, army social forces started to show up to his province. And so he was about 11 years old, and and he saw a change in in in his province for the better. He'll, you know, you, you can read it in, in his, in his chapters, this alternating narrative between he and I, he has a chapter that I have a chapter in, and he'll say that the, the soldiers showed up, they were handing out notebooks, pens, they built schools, they built government buildings. They provided different liberties, freedoms, and opportunities that we had never experienced under the Taliban. And so Zach said, I should help. I should, I should help these guys. Not because I want to go to America, but because I want this for my country. And so Zach's service with The US Forces was never, his intent was never to do that so he can get to America.

Tom Schueman [00:11:49]:
His intent was to do that so he can have a brighter future in his own country, a country that he loves. And so, he, you know, he is a beneficiary of some of the things that were provided with the support of The US. And he was determined to provide those opportunities, throughout the the rest of this country. And so that's really what was the impetus for him to to to sign up, with us and to fight alongside us. And, and and and for a moment in time, there were glimmers of hope, and and things and the quality of life was a little bit better. And and that matters. To me, that mattered to him. And and, unfortunately, the situation changed.

Tom Schueman [00:12:32]:
He, he, he, his persecution became so oppressive, so dangerous that he, at some point in 2016 said, I don't have a hope or future here. I can't even leave my house without being the threat of being killed. The Taliban were leaving nightlife at his home. They were calling him. They poisoned him. And he said, you know, I did all this so that I could have a better future here and so that I could raise a family here, but I at this point, I'm afraid I'm going to get my head cut off if I leave my village. And so that's when he reached out to me in 02/2016 and said, hey, can you help, me, apply for this visa program? And and The US established this visa program specifically because we knew our allies would end up being persecuted. And so in order to garner their support, we said, hey, if you support us for twelve months, we'll provide you a pathway to citizenship.

Tom Schueman [00:13:27]:
There there's this visa program because we know that you will become a marked man. We know that you'll be hunted because you worked with us. And so we'll we'll alleviate that, by creating this visa program. And so twelve months handshake, contract signed, and and in Zapp's case, he ended up serving almost four years with US horses and and, but six years later, he still doesn't have his visa.

Chris Stone [00:13:52]:
Incredible. And, Major, there's a lot there's a lot of folks that are hearing some of this for the first time. You know, for those of us who, you know, have have written or have, I'm sure, have read the book, and by the way, you know, the Good Morning America story, I I dragged my wife in front of the television and I said, you you you know, hey, we we have an opportunity to interview this gentleman who's on Good Morning America, and I think you might be interested in it. And as soon as that thing was over, she was like, where's the book? I gotta read this. And it and so you you touched on a lot of things, in the book, and I think some people are like, wait, wait a minute, you're talking about this guy, Zack, like, it seems like we're we're or maybe I I don't wanna assume that people understand sort of how we got to where we, where we're at, him being the interpreter, him being a part of this, the book itself being, like you had mentioned, it starts with a chapter from from Zach, then goes to a chapter of you. So it's a point of view of of him, then a point of view of you and does that alternation. So it's just and it starts on 09:11. It starts where, you know, when where he's at and where you're at, in in high school and when this is happening and how, it unfolded and how it impacted you, a very unlikely, marine at that point.

Chris Stone [00:15:13]:
Right? Who knew that you were going to be what you were going to be, but it affected you in such a way and took you to that and then took you to what many call some of the deadliest one of the most deadliest deployments in this longest war that we've had. Right? And so I just wanna pull that context in because, you know, we're we understand that because we've read the book, but there's a lot of people that are like, wait a minute, you know, so, you know, for if you could just maybe summarize some of that stuff so we can sort of get into it in terms of, you know, the story of, of that and maybe, you know, kinda kinda talk about how Zach and you were involved in, the the time that you were together while you were there in Afghanistan?

Tom Schueman [00:16:01]:
Sure. I mean, the the origin story there is is, as you you mentioned, our path towards intersecting started on 09/11/2001. You know, I I I never had, any interest in serving. I wasn't playing with GI Joe's growing up. I didn't think, you know, I didn't have a long family history of military. I just left the Naval Academy a year or two ago where almost every every midshipman has their dad or their uncle or some kind of connection. That wasn't me. But the conclusion of 09/11 on the conclusion of that day, I was living in the age of, you could say, innocence or ignorance, and I didn't know that there were people in the world that wanted to do us harm.

Tom Schueman [00:16:44]:
And then I said, well, if there are people who want to take these liberties from us, there have to be people who defend and preserve them. You should be one of those people. And that was kind of my first step. I didn't know what that was gonna look like. I didn't know I was gonna be a marine. I I probably didn't even know that there was a marine corps. And so that that was kinda my first step. And and for Zach, it was he he had not heard much about America or didn't know a whole lot about America, but he knew he, he, he's, he talks about the shared humanity, you know, irrespective of, of religion or culture that, that we're all humans.

Tom Schueman [00:17:19]:
And he said, he, he found that tragic that, you know, many men and women went to work that day and, were, were killed. And, and, and so he said, and when he sees the soldiers show up a couple months later, and he said, these are the people that we had to get out, cater attack. Like, I, I wanna try to help. And so that's that's what put us on a path towards meeting in February. And so, we meet there as you you you referenced, it was the deadliest battlefield and the longest war of our country. It was very kinetic, extremely violent place, and most interpreters at the time are quitting. They didn't wanna stick around when they got to staying in Afghanistan. And so Zach shows up.

Tom Schueman [00:18:02]:
He's, he knows the local dialect. He speaks English very well. He's able to help me understand cultural nuances. He's helped he's able to help, mitigate some of the cultural blind spots for me. He when we enter into a village to speak with the local people, he's able to help me, read the situation and point me in a certain direction and and and direct the conversation in a way that's helpful. And so he he's doing all those kind of things, which are probably within the the billet description or the job duties of a interpreter he's translating. But, very quickly, he became so much more to the platoon, whether that's, him sprinting through a minefield to detain the Taliban commander or as we we you mentioned, when I was wounded, him being there and holding security. There's there's any number of, examples where he exceeded, his duties as an interpreter, and and that's where he really started to become part of the platoon and and and and a and a brother to us.

Tom Schueman [00:19:00]:
And, that that's kind of the the genesis there.

Chris Stone [00:19:04]:
Got it. And and, you know, technically, he wasn't trained, you know, necessarily to be soldiers. Now he was carrying a weapon, and, and so and and so talk about developing that trust with with Zach. Like, what how what what was maybe the how did you first determine, like, this is somebody that that I can absolutely trust, to be by my side to, you know, to do what we all need to do? Sure.

Tom Schueman [00:19:33]:
You know, we we I I, at that point, about two and a half years of training as an infantry marine, where, clearing trenches and doing medical training and and and doing reacting to an ambush. And so, whereas our interpreters, they're just regular Zach before that was did construction and farming, you know, and he had zero days of military training, and then he's in the middle of a firefight. That is, pretty steep learning curve. And, and most interpreters in those situations became liability. They would lay down and then you try to move and then have to go back and get them. And, but that kind of, from, from the onset was there, really right beside us. And, that trust forms shared misery builds camaraderie, you know, shared diversity builds trust. And so, the fact that he was shouldering the load, the fact that he was accepting all the same risks and really fighting step for step alongside us, that's that's what will really foster a lot of that, that that trust.

Jim Fuhs [00:20:37]:
Yeah. And I think I think that, you know, that's something too that you don't always see. I I I I remember reading in the book, it's like, I think you felt like you, you know, you struck gold, but you you know, it's like you didn't want everyone to know that you had a good interpreter because somebody else might try to take him from you, and I thought that was, you know you wanna say there's a little bit of humor in the in the book, that that's what I thought was kinda funny. It's like, hey. I got this guy that actually knows what he's doing, and I think a couple times, he says, oh, he he's doing okay, but you didn't want people to know that he was better than that.

Tom Schueman [00:21:06]:
Yeah. A a good interpreter is worth their weight in gold, and everybody's having the same struggle of of finding someone who's willing to go out on these dangerous patrols. And and what and because so few people were, what you were left with is often people who either didn't speak English or didn't speak the local dialect. So now you're kinda screwed. And so, when if word got around that, hey, we had this guy who is incredibly brave and actually really skilled linguist, you might your captain or your battalion commander or someone else, I'd say, oh, that guy's they should come work for me. And so that's what happened to us, you know, in a little shade at MARSOC. We had this great military working dog named Back and, this this this German shepherd with his, the corporal Roberts, they they find every IED and they were great. And then, the reports got around that we had this super skilled team.

Tom Schueman [00:21:55]:
And before you knew it, they got an helicopter and, went to work for somebody else. So, yeah, you had to you had to be careful.

Chris Stone [00:22:01]:
For those of you who are just joining us, so, live and, you know, or on, you know, replay, or, you know, we also repurpose this into an audio podcast later. We're speaking to Major Tom Schoeman who's written the book Always Faithful, available just recently on on Amazon. So if you come over to dealcasters.live, we've got it available, here in, in the carousel. And so, you know, Tom, I wanted to you know, I know we're jumping around timeline wise here. I'm sorry. Did I miss did I miss something funny?

Jim Fuhs [00:22:39]:
I I I, yeah, I shared something from Wirth that, he he told, he told Tom, you know, easy on the Marsauk shade, so I just thought he'd get a kick out of that.

Tom Schueman [00:22:48]:
Shot shots fired.

Chris Stone [00:22:49]:
Yeah. You guys yeah. I was

Jim Fuhs [00:22:50]:
gonna say on your stand, Chris, as that

Chris Stone [00:22:53]:
shots. Marines,

Jim Fuhs [00:22:53]:
we always like to to to I'll just say bust on each other because I have to remember where

Tom Schueman [00:22:57]:
we are.

Jim Fuhs [00:22:57]:
Hey. I want you to away.

Chris Stone [00:23:00]:
Bust away. So we we talked about, we talked a little bit about, about Dark Horse and and what what happened there. You know, can you talk about, some of the stuff, like, you know, without giving away too much, from the book, but, like, 11/09/2010, maybe a story around that?

Tom Schueman [00:23:24]:
Sure. November 9 started off pretty terribly. I'd received the news that a good friend of mine, Robert Kelly, who's also platoon commander, prior enlisted guy, he had been killed in action. So that was tough. And then one of my squads went out and, and, and a Marine on that patrol was injured. And so then they couldn't get back to the base with that Marine who was injured. The Taliban kept, ambushing them along the way. And they said, Hey, can someone throw out and help us get this guy out? And so I left with a squad, to go alleviate some of the pressure from from the the the squad with the wounded marine.

Tom Schueman [00:24:06]:
And we get we they got back, and and and as we started to head back to the base, the the patrol was ambushed. And as I converged with my sergeant, who was my squad leader, Trey Humphrey, he stepped on an IED. And and so, he was wounded. My platoon sergeant was who's right there as well. He was wounded, and I was blown up one way. And so, yeah, I I as I regained, consciousness, I I see Zach there holding security, looking out for me. I see one of my, team leaders has already stepped up and assumed all the responsibilities of of the squad leader, corporal corporal Leahy, instinctively, intuitively just stepped up and next man up. You know, that's what we train for in the marine corps, that that one pull away mentality.

Tom Schueman [00:24:48]:
And, and and and you saw, one, how well sergeant Humphrey had trained that marine to take his place, but also, just how talented that marine was that he'd already called in the medevac and was setting security and that kind of stuff. And and when I, I went over and I saw sergeant Trey Humphrey, and he was missing his leg, my my platoon sergeant was so concussed that he couldn't stand up or or get up. And these are two men who I deeply, dearly loved. And, we we got sergeant Humphrey onto the the, we call it a litter, stretcher. We got him onto the stretcher, and as we were carrying him off the battlefield, he kept turning to me and said, saying, Hey, sir, I know I'm heavy. Why don't you guys just put me down and take a break? And, it was clear he was missing. I mean, he's not in good condition, missing a leg. His other leg had been badly injured.

Tom Schueman [00:25:41]:
And, I, was saying, Humphrey, we're not going to put you down. We're going to, we're going to get you to the helicopter. And he said, no, no, sir. I know I'm heavy. Just put me down. And here's a Marine who, while he was in flight, once he got on the helicopter, he died and he had to be resuscitated. And so the, when we think of this phrase, always faithful, this is, this is the embodiment of it. It's a, it's a, it's a, it's a person who preceding their death, their thoughts are with the people around them.

Tom Schueman [00:26:14]:
And, and that's, that's, that's the Marine Sergeant. That's, that's the young Marine that that's the people that, it was important to capture the stories, to tell the stories of, of of what it actually means to be always faithful and and someone who, in the moments receiving their death, when their thoughts are not with them, but with others. It's a rare breed, but you'll find it everywhere, in the Marine Corps infantry ranks, and and I'm fortunate to have, been able to serve alongside of some of these heroes.

Jim Fuhs [00:26:42]:
Yeah. I mean, it's and it's unfortunate too because a lot of times, and and I think that's one of the reasons, like you said, you did this, that story never gets told. And and I and I think that you did these these men a great honor by, you know, remembering them, you know, because, you know, other their families are always gonna remember them, but for their families, maybe even to get a little bit more closure that knowing that someone, you know, remembers their their sons for the great men that

Tom Schueman [00:27:12]:
they were, I I

Jim Fuhs [00:27:14]:
think is is definitely something, definitely something important that we we should never lose sight of. And and that also reminds me, you're you're involved with a, with an organization. I hope I'm not gonna butcher the name, but I think it's patrol based, Abate. Is that

Tom Schueman [00:27:31]:
That's right. Right?

Jim Fuhs [00:27:32]:
Yeah. You you wanna talk a little bit about that?

Tom Schueman [00:27:36]:
Sure. I, at Georgetown, I got to study, moral injury and trauma narratives, and I looked at Homer and the Iliad and the Odyssey. I looked at the Vietnam canon of of literature and film. And, there's a lot about this this concept of moral injury or feelings of betrayal, feelings of shame, and and how that manifests in, pretty unhealthy ways. And, in April of twenty twenty, I had three Marines commit suicide. And, one of them was a particularly tough one in that he had extended for that deployment, at my request. And so when I found out, that he had passed, I started to read the VA suicide literature, the veterans administration suicide literature about what's going on here. And and what I found were was that feelings of disconnectedness and isolation are the leading proximal cause to veterans' suicide.

Tom Schueman [00:28:33]:
So veterans who are feeling alone or disconnected are the ones who are committing are, like, most likely to commit suicide. So, and then there was one other nugget in there that I found pretty interesting, and and that there was no correlation between combat veterans and suicide, that that, actually, noncombat veterans were twice as likely to commit suicide. So I said, okay. Well, what what resources are out there that are getting all veterans? If it's a veteran issue, what what resources are what resources are out there that get all veterans in community, get all veterans connected? And what I found is that, about 99% of the veterans veteran service organizations out there are allocated to about 1% of the veteran population, and that's our wounded and our special forces. Now I celebrate that. I think that, wonderful that our nation has is committed to supporting the folks who make the biggest sacrifice, our special forces guys, and and and are wounded. It's important that we take care of them. But I I I feel like there was space to maybe, open the aperture a little bit.

Tom Schueman [00:29:35]:
And, and what I found is many of these organizations, you had to check a box or jump through a hoop. You had to have a disability or disorder. You, you had to, and it was all these ways to kind of exclude you from joining into that community and getting into that connection. And, and, and to me, whatever community you're in while you serve whatever MLS, whatever air force army, national guard reserves, you were part of a tribe where everybody in that squad, in that unit was willing to die for the other person. And I, and I think that is unique. And, and I think, it, it's hard to find that level of tribe outside of the military. And so as human beings, we all have the need for connection. It's not just some military thing.

Tom Schueman [00:30:22]:
It's it I would just argue it's intensified through service. Then we're also issued a purpose, and every man needs a purpose. And and so, we say, here's your mission. And we give you a task, and we say, here's the purpose of that. Here's the why this is important. And so, it whether you're a mechanic, whether you're a truck driver, whether you're you're you're you're the chef or the communication specialist, all of us had this tribe, and all of us had some type of purpose. And so I think it's natural to struggle with that as you transition from from service. And so what I wanna do is is kinda get preemptive and proactive and say, hey.

Tom Schueman [00:30:57]:
Whether you're the PFC, private, first class, or, Air Force, or Reservist, or National Guard, if you raise your right hand, we've got a space for you within this organization. And that and we recognize that your service matters. And and and not that you're special, but that service in and of itself matters. And so what we did is we got a 350 acre 350 acre ranch out in Montana, and we said, let's do the thing that you're into, whether that's, yoga, music, art, literature, jujitsu, weightlifting. We bring folks out, and we just say, hey, so long as you served, you're in. It's free of cost. We fly you out. We pick you up, and we do the thing that you are into.

Tom Schueman [00:31:37]:
And we do that outside in nature, around a campfire, and we get back into serving and connecting and building that community again. And, undoubtedly, it has been transformational. The community that's formed out there on, on the mountain in Montana has been, it's just been nothing short of, incredible. And so I'm I'm fortunate to to to walk point or or fill a sandbag within this organization, patrol base about that.

Jim Fuhs [00:32:02]:
That's awesome. That's awesome.

Chris Stone [00:32:03]:
That's incredible. And I've, not too long ago, I went on a vacation to Montana, and that is you know, people talk about God's country. I mean, when you when you look, you know, to your left and your right, it looks like a painting. That's just a glorious, like, transcendental, like, amazing place, for, for someone to be. So it's like, you know, taking someone physically and putting them in that kind of place and and, you know, just that alone sometimes can, can do that. And I I love how you talked about purpose and you talked about community, but especially how it applies to someone who has been in the service because, like you said, it's amplified, right? It's like times, you know, however many zeros you want to put after the number one, right? You know, but now, you know, for those of us who haven't had the opportunity to serve, those things are still important. They're important for for you now, they're important for you to to look to

Jim Fuhs [00:33:04]:
to be a part of

Chris Stone [00:33:06]:
community, to take care of yourself so you're not in a situation where you're struggling with your mental health. And I love that you're shining a light on that for everyone, but especially for those that, are are you know, have been a part of the service. And and, you know, it's incredible that you said that because I think for someone like myself and probably most others, it's the ones that were in combat that you would think would be just most traumatized or maybe have that that sort of feeling, but it's not. It's it's just in general, which is which is incredible. Any reason why you think that is just because it's like once they get into the the real the sort of the the other world or whatever that that is just not the way it was? Or

Tom Schueman [00:33:50]:
Sure. You know, combat has a general stigma and negative connotation that surrounds it. I I would say that, undoubtedly, there's a thing called post traumatic growth that you experience while you're in combat, and that that that the adversity and the hardship that you experience in heart, in combat, are educational. And that that you can learn more in in just sixty seconds in a firefight than you can maybe in, you know, a decade of of of study. And so there's so many lessons that you can learn while you're under fire and while you're in that experience that, actually, they refine your soul, they refine your character, and and that, for me, I I am I've got to a place of gratitude and growth from those experiences in combat that that I I'd say, you know, I'm thankful that I that I had that hardship and that I wouldn't be the man that I am without it. So, really, they I think they actually combat often helps you build resilience in your in your character. And and so, that that that's that's part of it. And then and then and then the other part might be is just that there's not the same resources allocated to those who haven't gone to combat.

Tom Schueman [00:34:56]:
And so maybe the the combat veteran is able to tap into a larger resource network, which then maybe mitigates some of the the the the risk factors, whereas the the noncombat veterans are just expected to say, hey. You know, everything's fine. And, again, it's it's it's that it's that transition. It's an identity crisis. I wore a uni we we all wear a uniform where over our left heart, it says US Marine, US Navy, US Army. Right? And so and we're indoctrinated into this culture. But there's no when you transition, you're just handed a piece of paper, and you're told you're not that person before. And there's no indoctrination into the the civilian sector.

Tom Schueman [00:35:33]:
And so I I think there's a natural kind of, soul searching and identity crisis that occurs upon transition for every service member, irrespective of if they're in combat or not anything combat.

Jim Fuhs [00:35:46]:
Yeah. I would I would agree. I I think even for me, Chris, like I've told you, it's like being retired almost thirteen years, it's like you kind of go through that struggle of, like, you know, I don't wanna go around telling people, like, you know, oh, you know, I'm a retired marine owner. You know, it's like I I just want people to accept me for me, but then that time in the service is always a part of you. It shaped you. You know, going to Parris Island and, you know, for for thirteen weeks and then going through, you know, OCS and and the basic school, you know, that is that is something that shaped me and molded me. The people I served with that, you know, had my back and vice versa is always gonna be a part of me. You know, in fact, sometimes it's not even so much that you miss the service.

Jim Fuhs [00:36:29]:
You miss the friendships. You miss that connection, and I think that's where sometimes people struggle because it's like they may not have been in combat, but now they don't have that group of people that they can fall back on, and and I think that's that's very interesting. I I did not know that part of it, Tom. I always thought it was more related to the, you know, the folks that were, you know, was more combat related, but, you know, that definitely veteran suicide is a huge problem. But but I did wanna go back to part of the reason we wanted to have you on here is let's talk about the challenge that Zach is having and how and how we can help there and and maybe let people know what exactly is going on with with the Zach who, you know, as far as I'm concerned, he served not only his country, but he served our country and what he did with, with the marines for for those years.

Tom Schueman [00:37:23]:
Undoubtedly, he served our country. I mean, some there are Americans who are alive today, me one of them, because of of Zach's service to our country. So, again, in 02/2016, his his persecution became so intense that he can no longer pursue a life in Afghanistan, which, I think that was a horrible realization for him, someone who had invested so much in his country's future to to not be able to to try to enjoy that. And so he started this visa application in 02/2016, and and we spent the next twelve months sending letters and and revising the application, and we made no progress. None. And so after a year of trying to do appeals and and everything that we could, Zach said, you know, I I I've gotta try to figure out, how I'm gonna continue my life here because it's clear that no matter what we try to say or do, it's not gonna work out. And so it it's which is very frustrating because the requirement for this visa program was twelve months. And we put this visa program in place for people like Zach who were being persecuted.

Tom Schueman [00:38:29]:
And so the idea is you serve with The US, we do a handshake, and we say, because of the service and because we know you'll be persecuted for it, we'll provide you a pathway to citizenship. And Zach did his part. He did almost four years, and and then we we weren't honoring our part of that deal. And and and so Zach and I stayed in touch, but then when the announcement was made that we would withdraw from Afghanistan by the end of last summer, that that announcement was made in April. I, I put out just a call to help on social media, and I said, hey. Here's this guy who's done incredible stuff for our country. He's he rates this visa. Can anybody help me get him the visa? Because if he if he doesn't, he's gonna be killed.

Tom Schueman [00:39:11]:
And there's an incredible wave of support, bipartisan, both parties, Republican, Democrat, throwing their way behind this, highest levels of media were were backing us. And, and, and despite this massive, wave of support, we, we actually didn't make any progress through the system. And, and so Zach, when, when it became apparent that the Taliban were going to take Afghanistan, I said, Hey, you gotta get to Kabul and you gotta get to the airport and we've gotta figure out a way to get you out. And so the book Chronicles, this experience of him leaving Kunar, going to Kabul and then, his three attempts to, at the airport and, and, and just him leaving Kunar, I think in and of itself is a, it's a really, heroic act on his behalf to, to say goodbye to his mother, to his family, knowing that he will likely never see them again on a hope and a dream of providing a safe and secure future for his children. I think that, that, you know, giving his nieces and nephews a kiss goodbye. I mean, that must, that in and of itself, I think, was, an incredibly courageous and hard decision. And then what he experienced in Kabul as the, as the government collapsed was, I mean, harrowing. And, in in the book, we chronicle the three different attempts, for him to escape out of the airport.

Tom Schueman [00:40:43]:
And when I kind of for for context, I think any parent that's trying to take small kids to the airport know it's it's tough. Now now now you've got four kids under the age of five. That's really tough. Now you gotta walk to the airport with four kids under five and your four bags. Very, very tough. Now there's also a hundred thousand people at that airport all trying to get at the same time, where where children were actually being trampled. I I mean, and and so, as a dad, everything in you as a dad is to protect and provide. And now you're bringing your children into this chaos where kids are getting trampled.

Tom Schueman [00:41:22]:
Now you add in the fact that his children were seeing people get killed with machine guns. And so you add all that in and you can imagine, how trying that must have been for Zach in those moments to, to, to, to just, and all he wanted, what we all want is a, is an opportunity, security for our family. And and so, it's truly a testament to his, his dedication to his children, to his family, to to to get them out of that, and and into a better life. And and the book chronicles, just how harrowing those escape attempts were and his ultimate rescue.

Chris Stone [00:42:04]:
And so now as as Jim had mentioned, he is still without, without a visa. And in in in the seemingly, like, I don't know what word, ridiculous, like red tape or whatever that's preventing this, from happening, I think when people are hearing the story that that you have to share, reading this book, you know, I know that the the first inclination for for myself, for my wife, other people that I've talked to about it is, well, what can I do? Right? What you know, here I am just, you know, person x in, you know, city y and, you know, whatever. This is this is impacting me. What can I do? Is there something that that, that someone who's listening right now and and, you know, if buying the book is is something that does help, cool, but and and certainly, it is available here on Amazon, but what else what else can people do? Is it is it writing letters to, you know, to their to their congresspeople? Is it, you know, maybe talk a little bit about what someone can do that hears the story that's impacted by it.

Tom Schueman [00:43:17]:
Yeah. I mean, I think we should all feel some righteous indignation, about the way that we're treating our allies. It's if you look at historically, we've always relied upon our allies to help us fight when wherever we go to fight. And if you look to the future, we'll undoubtedly need our allies again. And and so, you've gotta keep your promises to them. It it's we're not asking for anything. We're not asking for a special exception for Zach. We're we're just asking to honor the contract that we made with him.

Tom Schueman [00:43:51]:
The the the the terms of the deal are are very clear in black and white, and Zach upheld it as part of that contract. And so if we're not a nation who honors our promises, for a nation who leaves our allies, we'll find it very difficult to be succeed in the next big fight. And and and if history tells anything, there will be the next big fight. And so, I I think what we can do is is demand, some accountability for the people who make these promises and say, hey. What are we doing to support the 87,000 Afghans who were eligible for this visa, who applied for it, and are still in Afghanistan? And what are we doing for the ones that are here who still haven't had it approved? I think those are fair questions to ask of of of folks.

Chris Stone [00:44:35]:
How many, how many besides Zach, are are there estimated that are they're in the sort of in his kind of situation?

Tom Schueman [00:44:44]:
Yeah. In terms of how many in the The US, I don't know. I know there's a figure out right now that that 87,000, SIV applicants are still in Afghanistan. Many of them have already been executed. And, not only is it the 87,000, but the the the program includes immediate failings, so wife and children. And so when you when you add in that now when you add in that figure, it it balloons up to about a 50,000 folks who should be afforded an come to this country based on their service, based on their now persecution because of that service. That's that's kind of the the figure we're looking at.

Jim Fuhs [00:45:20]:
And and now specifically for Zach, you've got a GoFundMe set up to kinda help, with some of the cost involved because, like, you know, immigration lawyers aren't free, things of that nature. What what else you know, should we write our congress you know, our senators and local congressmen? Do you think that's gonna help? I mean, what you know, because I'm I'm sure like you, you know, Tom, I wanna know what can I do to fix the problem? Right? Because, you know, sometimes you feel like, you know, if I'm talking to the wrong person, nothing's gonna get done, and, no. I'll go I'll go over their head.

Tom Schueman [00:45:53]:
Sure. You know, Zach is living in a one bedroom apartment, in San Antonio with his five children and his wife. He works hanging drywall for, twelve hours a day, six days a week at a cancer hospital. So he's doing what immigrants have always done in this country and has taken the tough job. They've helped, continue to build this this great country that we live in. And so we wanna continue to support him in any way that we can. One one way is obviously financially. One way is to to to buy the book.

Tom Schueman [00:46:22]:
One way might be the GoFundMe. But, I mean, look, we have a moral obligation to con to keep pressing this issue. And so you you should use all paths and means tools available to continue to say, how are we honoring this this moral obligation that we have to these folks?

Chris Stone [00:46:44]:
Yeah. Definitely. So we we are on Amazon. So, they tell us, you know, not to, not to promote other sites, and GoFundMe would be one of them. But, on the other places, we do have in the show notes, the direct link to the GoFundMe if if this is, touching you. So, and if you are on Amazon and once the show's over and you're done shopping on Amazon, feel free to to type help zach.dealcasters.live, and that'll take you to the GoFundMe. But while you're on Amazon, if you go to alwaysfaithful.dealcasters.live, make sure you pick up the book Always Faithful. You know, we said that you're the author, but it's actually coauthored and it is an it's a really interesting I don't think I've ever read a book, Major, where it's, you know, it's alternating between two voices, chapter to chapter.

Chris Stone [00:47:36]:
It was just so so that's that's really interesting because it's like you get to the end of one chapter and you're compelled, but then it's like, oh, wow. This is a different viewpoint from Tom. This is a, you know, a different viewpoint from, from Zach. So I thought that was a that was a really, you know, cool, original, creative way of putting the book together for sure. Plus, you only have to write half of it. Right?

Tom Schueman [00:47:59]:
Yeah. Well, we as, we mentioned upfront, we also had the the support of of Worth even if he's coming in the comments, talking a little trash. But, I I think I think it was, it's important for the American public to receive the education that Zach provides in his chapter. And so it's something that has been part of our collective conscious for the last twenty years at this Afghanistan, you know, this some somewhere, something over there. And and and to have, rather than me, a guy who spent about seventeen months there, say, hey. Here's what this country is all about. You've got a guy who was born there, raised there, spent his whole life there, invested everything he could into the success of this country. And so to me, it it it makes a lot more sense to to have that perspective there so that we can really get a a much fuller, and a much deeper picture of what this country was all about.

Tom Schueman [00:48:54]:
And and and Zach paints it in many ways as a just a beautiful beautiful place with a beautiful culture. And so I think that's, that's part of what makes this book unique is that you get that, other lens, that other perspective into into Afghanistan.

Jim Fuhs [00:49:09]:
Yeah. Yep. Very true. And, Tom, you you have, you have an Instagram account, right, that, that people can can follow you on, I think?

Tom Schueman [00:49:18]:
Sure. And and that's where we started this appeal. When I was at Georgetown, I I did a capstone project where I was, trying to work through these trauma narratives that that were around veterans and and work through some of the mental health stuff, with all kind of part of this capstone project in Georgetown. And and as you know, there's, where where when someone is ambushed, the the specific point of the ambush is called the kill zone. And so I I thought, we've gotta be more resilient because everybody experiences the ambush. Like Chris was talking about, everybody has that need for tribe and purpose. It's it's a universal mankind need. And and everybody, not just Veterans, end up having a traumatic experience happen in their life.

Tom Schueman [00:50:00]:
Everybody has that ambush, whether it's a car accident, cancer, and some something unexpected happened. And and you're going to have to figure out how you're gonna deal with that. And so I started this page, Killzone, to kind of say, how can we we be more resilient when the ambushes happen? And then how can we find that pathway to recovery? Because it if it hasn't happened already, it is going to happen. And so that that ambush is is coming to to us all and probably more than one. And so, I wanted to kind of, have some discourse in and around, resiliency recovery, the mental health aspect. And so that's where this, page, kill zone kill, k I l. Z zero n three, came from. And and I chronicled Zach's escape attempts there last year, and it and it definitely, amplified, the issue that we were we were experiencing there.

Tom Schueman [00:50:50]:
And so that's that's where I kinda, still keep updates about that and about what's going on, on that page.

Chris Stone [00:50:58]:
Awesome. You

Jim Fuhs [00:50:59]:
know? So, yeah, make sure you follow that, folks. We're gonna add that in the comments as well for for those of you that, that use Instagram. You know? It it is a it is a thing outside of Facebook. Tom, I, you know, I can't can't thank you enough for taking the time to be with us today. I, you know, I hope that, this is able to help as part of this journey to get, Zach, you know, back, you know, able to stay here and not have to worry about what's next for him and his family. You know, and, you know, I know right there, I say, I I wanna I wanna thank you for everything you've done as a marine and wanna wish you continued success in, whatever you're pursuing next in your career here. I know I guess I I guess you might be up for lieutenant colonel soon, I'm thinking, or getting getting close to those times.

Tom Schueman [00:51:46]:
Yep. And thank you for your service and everything you've done, and thank you both for having me. Yep. Thank you. Super fun.

Chris Stone [00:51:51]:
Appreciate it, major. Yes, sir. And there's a yeah. I should make mention there's a ton of people here in the chat that are are fans of yours, Major Tanya. Dawn, thank you for chiming in. She's, she's got all kinds of feels here, here in the chat. Jarhead 6 rides. Our friend also, Maureen, says Semper Fi ra Here, Jarhead Six Rides.

Chris Stone [00:52:14]:
That's Fabian. He'll watch the replay later. Apparently, he was live streaming on Amazon during I mean, what are you thinking? I mean, this is like your show, Fabian. And tons of other, great, Chaz here. So, again, make sure you pick up the book Always Faithful, The Story of War in Afghanistan, the Fall of Kabul, and the Unshakable Bond Between a Marine and the Interpreter, Zach. And, again, thank you, both of you gentlemen for your service. Major, thank you for joining us today on the show, and, as always, folks, don't fear the gear.

Jim Fuhs [00:52:52]:
Thanks for listening to Dealcasters. Congratulations. You've taken another step forward in your content creation journey. Please don't forget to hit the subscribe or follow button here in your favorite podcast player so you can be reminded every time we drop an episode.

Chris Stone [00:53:09]:
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Jim Fuhs [00:53:29]:
If you have questions about this episode or have something you want us to review, you can also email us at dealcasters@dealcasters.live. Thanks again for listening, and you know the deal. Don't fear the gear.