Rewiring Safety: Somatic Healing

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My evaluator who diagnosed my autism like officially she said a quick like definition

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of autism is easy things are hard and hard things are easy,

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and that I think captures like oh complexity is like yes it's energizing to me like,

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talking to somebody's you know somatic part from when they were five years old

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that wants to make sure that they're safe.

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That feels like so straightforward. And I'm all in.

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Very, very special guest today. Their name is Gazit Haya Nkosi.

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They are an autistic AFAB trans non-binary Jewish mystic and somatic coach specializing

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in the safe and sound protocol and somatic parts work.

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They are dedicated to supporting neurocomplex individuals who have felt stuck

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in traditional modalities.

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They help others move beyond reactivity and disassociation.

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Having personally navigated decades of deep, complex struggle,

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they are honored to guide others through a life they love in all its complexities,

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a journey they truly consider a miracle.

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I believe this conversation is going to be amazing. So thank you for joining us, Gazit.

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And that was a very brief overview of who you are as a person.

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So are there any gaps you'd like to fill in that I missed? No,

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it was so beautiful. Did you write that?

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Yeah, yeah, I worked a little bit on that.

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I would love for that to be my bio in other places. I'm like,

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I don't think that I wrote this, and I love the way you framed that. Thank you.

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Oh, you're welcome. You're such a cool individual and you have all these amazing titles and.

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And I wanted to try to come up with something that felt like it encompassed

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a little bit of you, even though it's brief.

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Wow. Yeah, I feel really seen in a way that I rarely feel. So thank you for

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taking the time and thoughtfulness to put that together. I feel so honored.

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You're welcome. I'm so happy that you like that.

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You're welcome. You're welcome.

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And because you have so much to go over. and you're, you know,

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when I was reading a little bit about you, there's so much we could dive into.

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And what I'd like to start with, just to help me and my audience to kind of

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lay the groundwork for some things, I was hoping you could give us some,

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maybe some definitions or explanations of some words,

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such as like neurodivergent, neurocomplex.

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I guess we'll start there and go from there. Yeah, for sure.

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Sure. I think the world is really trying on words right now to try to capture

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our emerging understanding of.

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What this group of humans who may have previously been called anything from,

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too sensitive and dramatic to, you know, autistic and any of the other like

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slurs that we may have heard about people who don't do the thing that mainstream society asks us to do.

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And I'm so grateful to be alive in this time where folks are trying to create

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words that are not stigmatizing, that can capture the complexity,

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of this group of humans that from, you know, growing research we know are neurologically

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wired in a different way than other folks.

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I really appreciate this new concept of neurotypes, which holds that there are

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just different types of neurological wiring that we have within our species.

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And we can look at that without the pathologizing model that may have previously

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been used. So, you know, folks have tried this word neurodivergence.

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It's still positioned as other, right?

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So diverging from what is typical and the like counterbalance to that is often

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neurotypical, neurodivergent.

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And then we have this umbrella term that folks use, neurodiversity,

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which just says that, you know, neurodiversity means everybody. Right.

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So that's an effort, you know, that's on the like newer end,

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but sort of coming into mainstream that recognizes maybe it's,

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different, but maybe not like a difference versus disorder.

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So it's moving in that direction of less pathologizing, but still othering.

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Still holds this like typical. I think that's something that we struggle with

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in our language and as humans is not creating a duality.

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So neurocomplexity is something that I picked up from Lindsay McAereth,

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who's a very fascinating thinker, sub-stack writer, psychologist, incredible human,

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who is trying to invite in even less othering even less pathologizing and acknowledging

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that there's complexity,

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in neurotypes that can be both disabling in terms of how society treats us and can also be.

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All other things that are different but can sometimes be more of a privilege,

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like giftedness falls under her umbrella of neurocomplexity.

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So she's just sort of capturing an even broader, like we all have different nervous system wiring.

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And my interest in both of those words and in that whole world

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is as someone who was told that I was too sensitive and that I needed to like

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try harder to get on board with being how everybody else was and who failed

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miserably and felt sincerely sorry,

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and deeply ashamed and very sort of all-encompassing guilt and,

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you know, sort of living my life as an apology and then even moving towards

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an attempt to end my life.

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After that, it really became important to me to find and understand ways where

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it could be okay for me to stay on the planet, even if I was unable to do what was expected of me.

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And so that journey has brought me to the place where understanding how the

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nervous system works in an unconscious way has allowed me to start to separate

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out some of that blame and shame,

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about how my body interacts with the world and to bring in some acceptance around

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sort of how it's not a choice for me.

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It just is how my body is wired.

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And the neat overlay there is that sort of my neurodivergence and my queerness,

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both invite me into that same conversation. So it feels pretty like whoever

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planned this thing wanted me on this path.

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And they gave me multiple ways to be like, you can't do it. You can't do it.

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And we're gonna, we're gonna figure out that that's okay.

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How now i've always like i've always struggled with this how sensitive,

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became used in such a negative connotation you know like it was so bad to be

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sensitive or to feel things so deeply or to be in touch with how others feel or.

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Where where do you think we got lost and how we started using that language

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like negatively Absolutely.

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You know, the creation of,

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white supremacy and chattel slavery alongside sort of imperialism,

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colonialism, those were spaces and times where the,

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sensitivity, which,

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you know, was prior to that associated with spiritual leadership. Yeah.

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Was separated out, you know, in order to create white supremacy and slavery,

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we needed to create a structure of domination and patriarchy was a result of that.

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And so we need to find a way to decrease folks' access to spiritual power.

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And that is our sensitivity, our intuition, our feelings, our inner guidance, our compassion,

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our ability to take the perspective of others, all of those are a way to align

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people with their individual power,

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and a way to decrease their ability to be controlled by a dominating authority.

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And so, you know, embedded into patriarchy,

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and white supremacy is the need to disconnect people from what then became called

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feminine, which is where we get the misogyny and the sexism appears, right?

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We create a gender binary, we align this spiritual empowerment embodiment with

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the feminine, which is now,

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under the domination of that, which is going to disconnect us from our sense of self.

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And now sensitivity becomes a threat to our ability to be dominated.

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And the, you know, sort of wisdom of that system is that it uses our genetic

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wiring to need to belong to the group against us.

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So when we want to control others, we disconnect them from self and we tell

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them they'll get kicked out of the group, right? And pretty quickly,

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that's an effective strategy to make sure that they'll stay under our control.

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And that's so sad. I mean, that's putting it mildly, but it's very sad because.

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We're here we're supposed to be here for each other not necessarily making a

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divide and often it feels we're creating a bigger divide among everybody just

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trying to exist under systems,

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that you know are are are sworn to protect us but are mostly failing us at the moment yeah,

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and even if You can apply that same grief to the experience of those folks who

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were trying to figure out how to dominate someone else in order to feel safe.

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Right. All of that comes from insecurity and domination is not unique to the human species.

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You know, having to grapple with a pressure and a threat around survival in

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being alive creates the need for violence.

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And I think there's a lot of grief that is unprocessed around living on a planet

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where survival is threatened in such a way that we do,

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need violence in order to try to preserve that survival.

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No, I agree with you. And, you know, every time I seem to turn around,

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there's, I see more people, you know, struggling to get through the day, you know,

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just very, just struggling just with trying to.

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They hear, stay present, and their nervous system is just, there's so much stimulation

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to it, which does not help from everywhere.

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And so as you approach your work, your nervous system informed approach,

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how do you approach it as someone who is, would you consider yourself highly sensitive?

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Yes. How do you approach your work if you are in that space of being highly sensitive?

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You mean how do I take care of my nervous system when I'm around folks who are struggling? Yeah.

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Yeah. It's interesting to me.

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For whatever reason, when I'm in a sincere, deep, open, honest,

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vulnerable, one-on-one interaction, it is not taxing to my nervous system.

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When I am in more of a like grocery store like how like how to,

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pay and say thank you and say just enough but not too much or at a soccer game

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where my kid is playing and I'm

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supposed to be paying attention but also chit-chatting but also like not,

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that is five minutes of that could drain me more than six hours of one-on-one clients.

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And I think that has to do with my nervous system knowing that the one-on-one

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conversations where people are absolutely in their,

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as close as they can come to their authenticity, they're in the sort of like

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most vulnerable version of what most of us do is when we're in therapy, right?

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That my nervous system is like, no one's lying no one's masking like we're relaxed

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we're to be honest we don't have to perform,

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right and when I'm out in the world doing something that my nervous system is like what is this for,

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right like what what is the goal of this and I'm like I have no idea.

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It's like I don't know my um the evaluator who diagnosed my autism like officially,

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she said a quick like definition of autism is easy things are hard and hard things are easy,

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and that I think captures like oh complexity is like yes it's energizing to me like,

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talking to somebody's you know somatic part from when they were five years old

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that wants to make sure that they're safe,

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that feels like so straightforward and i'm all in and my whole system is energized

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and then like i said trying to figure out what to say to the lovely 80 year

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old man that i pass every day on my walk it's like oh.

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Every day all i usually end up saying is like wow the weather right and then,

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and it's okay but that takes like a year off my life every time,

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i feel you about the grocery store because that's one of my least favorite places

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to go like i can't even lie like i just i just it's so overwhelming yeah,

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because there's so much like you have to be present in like 18 different directions.

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Yeah. Putting your money away. I'm like, how would I?

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How would I? How could I? I like just hold it all out and ridiculous until I

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get outside. And then I take a deep breath and I like sit down and figure out how to put it all back.

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Yeah, that's totally what I do. I just like, yeah. Oh, it sounds like me.

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I didn't want to know what it looked like sometimes at the grocery store.

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You know what I mean? And because it's just it's such an overwhelming experience sometimes.

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Yeah and you know the they have the the self-service registers and the regular registers,

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what do i do yeah it's just like the poor like 80 year old guy and then like

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when you're doing this work you know when you're present and you're connected with somebody,

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that sounds like it's very soothing to your nervous system you can lock in with

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someone because you're kind of working on the same thing at the same time and

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they've invited me to do that,

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right they've asked me to And when I'm out in the world, I go to the same places

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because my system doesn't know where else to go.

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And people are like, I did not invite you to do this. Please stop. Right.

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So, yeah, I feel like I have a permission slip. I feel like everybody's on board

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with what's happening. They've signed up for me.

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I'm a lot. That's why I like podcasts, too. I'm like, you have invited me.

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So I have permission to be me.

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Right. Exactly. I don't feel like I have that in the rest of the world.

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Yeah, that's that's hard. And, you know, when I was reading early about what

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you do, you have this nice little video, like on your profile, which is so helpful.

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And it was explaining a little bit what you do, the safe and sound listening protocol.

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And I was really excited because I had never heard of it until you were speaking of it. And it's passive.

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And I was wondering if you could dive into a little bit about that.

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Because it sounded really interesting and from what you were saying,

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really helpful, really healing.

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Yeah, it's pretty awesome because it's one of the very few modalities that don't

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require a cognitive aspect, right?

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So it's really just coming under the brainstem through the auditory canal with

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altered or filtered music.

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So the frequencies have been changed in such a way that the inner ear muscle

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and the vagus nerve are sort of invited to change their pattern,

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to move back into the rhythm of connecting with safety, which a lot of our vagus

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nerve, which is the primary aspect of the autonomic nervous system.

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People may have heard it called the ANS or the parasympathetic system.

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Which is that mechanism within us that helps us to shut down

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if something's dangerous, play dead, helps us to go into fight or flight if

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we need to do that, and then also connects us with rest and digest.

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When we over time repeatedly, the nervous system's job is to check if there's safety or danger.

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And it'll sort of like set a domino chain reaction based on that perception

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when it perceives danger, danger, danger, danger over time, you know,

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sort of from day one of being born into, you know, a loud, crazy.

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Hospital room and then your parents dysregulated because they haven't slept

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and then your siblings are screaming and then you have to go to kindergarten and you don't,

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feel safe and you know just you'd get told to sit still when you need to wiggle

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you can't go to the bathroom all these things over time our nervous system can

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just decide not to check in,

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if it's safe or dangerous anymore and just stick with danger,

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when we feel safe we can reach for connection with others when we're feeling

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like it's not safe we go into protection mode.

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And that's where a lot of us can end up in long-term defense states.

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And that can show up as depression or anxiety or addiction, all sorts of things,

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right? Pretty much anything in the DSM is like a nervous system that is not

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checking in with safety regularly.

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And so Stephen Porges came up with this idea of polyvagal theory, which basically, like,

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expands the traditional understanding of the parasympathetic to include this

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idea that we can also go to ventral, which is where we feel safe enough.

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We can connect with others and we can connect with rest and digest.

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And he experimented with using this filtered music to invite that vagus nerve

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to reconnect with ventral,

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to sort of like get that system back to its original design where we're checking

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in with safety regularly,

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and why it's so awesome that it's passive is because even though our society

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thinks that we do everything through our brain.

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It's actually like 88 percent of physiological activity including behavior language

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all these things emotions is nervous system first,

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and then brain so it's bottom up you may have heard it,

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all right yes yes top down is cognitive to body that's only about like 12 to

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20 percent if you're being generous.

00:21:36.171 --> 00:21:42.748
So most of us are trying to control our body with only 20% access,

00:21:43.192 --> 00:21:45.682
not realizing that our body's controlling us.

00:21:46.263 --> 00:21:52.221
So when we try to do talk therapy, or we try to do even 12 steps,

00:21:52.221 --> 00:22:00.311
or any of those more cognitive based modalities, we're really fighting against our body.

00:22:00.653 --> 00:22:09.635
And when we can invite in that sort of re-bringing back to the design for the vagus nerve.

00:22:10.012 --> 00:22:19.591
We can get our body on board with us, and then we can use our cognition to get that 80-20 in a rhythm.

00:22:20.131 --> 00:22:24.891
So all of my work can be done without the SSP, but.

00:22:25.847 --> 00:22:30.897
But with the SSP, for those who qualify, who are good candidates,

00:22:31.333 --> 00:22:38.534
it really can help that system get moving because a lot of times that body is

00:22:38.534 --> 00:22:40.204
just like, I don't care what you tell me.

00:22:40.524 --> 00:22:43.044
I'm not going anywhere. This is so dangerous. Right?

00:22:43.584 --> 00:22:48.614
Right. A little help. It can be like I like to describe to my clients.

00:22:48.614 --> 00:22:52.084
It's like walking down the airport by yourself. You can get there.

00:22:52.084 --> 00:22:59.174
But the SSP is like a moving sidewalk. It's just a little bit of support and

00:22:59.174 --> 00:23:02.444
it can make a really big difference for folks, myself included.

00:23:02.444 --> 00:23:11.430
I came to it first as a client and I was so astonished that I decided to become a provider.

00:23:12.661 --> 00:23:16.768
Because you highlighted something that I think is important.

00:23:17.320 --> 00:23:21.679
Even if the therapy is great, talk therapy is wonderful, but it can be exhausting.

00:23:22.705 --> 00:23:24.923
Because I've been in times like, why are you here? I'm like,

00:23:24.923 --> 00:23:27.953
I don't know. You know, because you're just like, you're exhausted.

00:23:28.993 --> 00:23:32.993
I mean, like, it's still hard to be on the planet. Yeah. I mean,

00:23:33.793 --> 00:23:35.081
pick a reason. I don't know.

00:23:35.331 --> 00:23:39.708
Like, it's just, you know, so it's to hear of a therapy that is,

00:23:40.334 --> 00:23:44.646
you know, doesn't require you to necessarily be in motion and really have that,

00:23:45.116 --> 00:23:47.153
be like online, for lack of a better word.

00:23:47.438 --> 00:23:49.406
Yeah. It's very refreshing.

00:23:50.060 --> 00:23:53.781
And I'm curious what that feels like. Like as you're going through it,

00:23:54.153 --> 00:23:56.069
like as you're going through these sessions.

00:23:56.574 --> 00:24:00.913
So you can think about it a little bit like massage, right?

00:24:01.313 --> 00:24:10.107
So massage is passive and we can have moments in massage where it's good, uncomfortable.

00:24:10.664 --> 00:24:14.803
Like, oh yeah, right there. Oh, it hurts, but keep going. Right.

00:24:15.429 --> 00:24:19.053
Or we can have moments in massage where we're like, no, stop.

00:24:19.053 --> 00:24:22.076
That hurts. That's not, that's not awesome.

00:24:22.186 --> 00:24:25.930
Right. So we're still engaged. We're not like in the other room,

00:24:26.488 --> 00:24:29.135
right? We're feeling it. We're noticing it.

00:24:29.436 --> 00:24:34.253
We're checking in with ourselves. We're having cues from our somatic sensation

00:24:34.253 --> 00:24:36.363
about what feels good, what doesn't feel good.

00:24:36.363 --> 00:24:43.533
We're navigating how to take care of the parts who are scared to say that doesn't feel good.

00:24:43.533 --> 00:24:47.223
You know, some of us will like do this through a whole massage because we're

00:24:47.223 --> 00:24:49.343
like, I don't really like it, but I don't want to say anything.

00:24:49.343 --> 00:24:53.063
So I want to upset them and I'm supposed to like it. So I'm just going to like

00:24:53.063 --> 00:24:56.457
finish for the next hour. Right. Right.

00:24:57.351 --> 00:25:03.222
And that happens with SSP. We work a lot in the beginning on like,

00:25:03.222 --> 00:25:08.172
is it okay to say, ouch, that hurts me to stop? Right?

00:25:08.705 --> 00:25:14.392
Is it okay to go, actually, I know we just started, but I have to pee. Right?

00:25:16.543 --> 00:25:20.842
I know that it's a part of a massage, but my jaw hurts when I put my face in

00:25:20.842 --> 00:25:23.091
the thing. So is there any other options? Right?

00:25:23.463 --> 00:25:29.052
So we're working at the beginning really with those parts who have been trained

00:25:29.052 --> 00:25:32.617
to like never voice that you have a body or discomfort

00:25:32.983 --> 00:25:39.222
because the SSP will provide us with opportunities to notice that those physical sensations.

00:25:39.222 --> 00:25:43.375
And then we're going to be working with the parts who are scared to share those.

00:25:43.759 --> 00:25:49.893
So learning how to pause the music is like a huge focus in the beginning.

00:25:50.992 --> 00:25:58.122
And once people get into knowing how to pause then the pause becomes an invitation

00:25:58.122 --> 00:26:02.344
like oh what were you noticing we get to take care of that sometimes it's like

00:26:02.484 --> 00:26:04.614
oh i don't know i got a little nauseous,

00:26:05.230 --> 00:26:08.283
and then we get to say okay let's watch watch the nausea,

00:26:08.934 --> 00:26:14.812
right what happens with it and sometimes neurosuction which is just our nervous

00:26:14.812 --> 00:26:18.972
system's job is to scan the environment for threat, sometimes it's based on

00:26:18.972 --> 00:26:21.138
a threat that's not relevant to us.

00:26:22.172 --> 00:26:24.157
But that's relevant epigenetically.

00:26:24.852 --> 00:26:31.385
So at least seven generations back, we have stored data about threat. Oh, wow. Uh-huh.

00:26:32.017 --> 00:26:37.448
And so it could be that great, great, great grandma, you know, ate a chip and choked.

00:26:37.756 --> 00:26:43.372
And so when we smell chips, we may get a little like tension in our throat, right?

00:26:43.372 --> 00:26:49.032
And we don't ever have to know that grandma had that happened if we're able

00:26:49.032 --> 00:26:54.741
to stay with it and be with it and sort of check the facts. So we let that sensation come up.

00:26:55.334 --> 00:27:01.319
And we go okay it's there it's there okay now it's a little bit less.

00:27:01.976 --> 00:27:09.502
Okay now it's all gone and i'm okay versus a lot of us have learned like a lot

00:27:09.502 --> 00:27:13.152
my throat is tight oh god does that mean i don't like chips oh god something's

00:27:13.152 --> 00:27:16.622
wrong oh i have a throat chakra issue oh i have a,

00:27:17.185 --> 00:27:22.931
i need to go see a ENT right and then we snowball it and now that turns into

00:27:23.209 --> 00:27:27.732
you know could be like a long-term anxiety connection around that so we're going

00:27:27.732 --> 00:27:29.292
to start to learn how to like

00:27:29.732 --> 00:27:36.159
watch the wave of a nervous system I call it raising its hand it'll raise it

00:27:36.438 --> 00:27:40.106
right it'll go hey I smell chips for the nervous system it's very neutral,

00:27:40.635 --> 00:27:45.122
right smell chips and that used to be a threat and then we go all right i'll

00:27:45.122 --> 00:27:48.464
check it out right sort of like when the fire alarm goes off,

00:27:48.940 --> 00:27:53.262
if we're awake and we know nothing's wrong and we hear it we're like okay thank

00:27:53.262 --> 00:27:57.832
you for letting me know i'll go check the stove and then we sort of stay calm

00:27:57.832 --> 00:28:01.506
we're like okay i'm gonna take the pan outside oh yeah okay i burnt the pancakes,

00:28:01.982 --> 00:28:07.632
and the opportunity with the ssp is to start to like get that confidence and

00:28:07.632 --> 00:28:11.412
that trust that the nervous system can raise its hand it can sound the alarm

00:28:11.412 --> 00:28:15.381
and we can go okay yeah let's take a moment let's check in,

00:28:16.077 --> 00:28:19.549
versus most of us right we either snowball or we go,

00:28:20.727 --> 00:28:25.422
shut up and we take the battery out of the fire alarm right we're like i'm in

00:28:25.422 --> 00:28:27.807
a meeting i can't hear that right now stop it.

00:28:29.369 --> 00:28:33.992
So we're inviting back in that like oh hey thanks for letting me know what's

00:28:33.992 --> 00:28:39.882
going on and explore it and then come back to the music right we start to get

00:28:39.882 --> 00:28:43.875
a little more confidence and trust with that body mind connection,

00:28:45.388 --> 00:28:52.272
so it's not completely passive but we don't have to do anything for the listening,

00:28:52.858 --> 00:28:57.793
no something is definitely being done you know as you're talking it to it as you're talking about it,

00:28:58.988 --> 00:29:03.012
and i can see where this would be important for things like you know trauma

00:29:03.012 --> 00:29:09.717
recovery you know emotional safety because i just suggested like the chip incident

00:29:10.100 --> 00:29:13.972
or like we were just talking about the grocery store Or, you know.

00:29:15.562 --> 00:29:20.879
I can understand how this could over time give people their life back in a lot of ways.

00:29:21.842 --> 00:29:27.016
Yep. The pieces that have sort of been evidence-based in the research in terms

00:29:27.016 --> 00:29:31.920
of outcomes are reduced sensory sensitivities and increased social engagement.

00:29:32.472 --> 00:29:37.716
So we see that, you know, all of us know that in the middle of the night,

00:29:38.136 --> 00:29:41.104
one sound could make us pretty startled.

00:29:41.896 --> 00:29:47.506
That in the daytime might be no biggie. So we can sort of tell how our nervous

00:29:47.506 --> 00:29:51.196
system affects the same input.

00:29:51.516 --> 00:29:56.646
And so as the nervous system becomes more connected with you and trusting you,

00:29:56.646 --> 00:30:01.736
then the sensory stuff is a little less intense for the nervous system, if you will.

00:30:02.212 --> 00:30:06.816
And then social, again, if we're stuck in that protection mode,

00:30:06.816 --> 00:30:11.377
we're going to have the social engagement system, as they call it, turned off.

00:30:11.702 --> 00:30:14.723
So it's like, no, I'm not going to reach out to anybody, right?

00:30:15.026 --> 00:30:20.606
But as we come back into being able to toggle between safety and danger,

00:30:20.606 --> 00:30:24.996
between connection and protection, when we see people, we can go,

00:30:25.356 --> 00:30:27.522
oh, let me check in with my body.

00:30:28.155 --> 00:30:32.136
Okay, actually, I think I could connect here, you know.

00:30:32.696 --> 00:30:36.859
And so we see it make a pretty big difference in people's lives,

00:30:37.207 --> 00:30:46.050
even without a whole lot of needing to sort through past trauma or talk a whole lot about.

00:30:47.065 --> 00:30:51.436
Your week or dynamics that are going on in relationships, anything like that.

00:30:51.436 --> 00:30:53.336
It can have a pretty big impact. pact.

00:30:54.536 --> 00:30:59.816
I can see where it would, you know, and I can understand also why individuals

00:30:59.816 --> 00:31:03.934
may come to you with modalities that maybe haven't been as helpful,

00:31:04.509 --> 00:31:07.533
you know, because they haven't been able to tap into,

00:31:08.289 --> 00:31:11.637
you know, the deeper layers that they need to tap into.

00:31:12.716 --> 00:31:14.905
And is this a,

00:31:15.697 --> 00:31:21.097
Is this a practice that has to be continued once the person starts through the

00:31:21.097 --> 00:31:21.961
remainder of their life?

00:31:22.553 --> 00:31:26.917
I know the timeframe on which you'll see relief will vary, but does it need

00:31:26.917 --> 00:31:31.837
to continue for, you know, once they start it, they have to continue it even

00:31:31.837 --> 00:31:33.447
on like a therapeutic pace?

00:31:34.105 --> 00:31:39.587
So the listening is not required to be continued. Some people do touch in with

00:31:39.587 --> 00:31:47.197
it as like a maintenance or a booster, but the lifestyle does need to be brought in in a daily way.

00:31:47.197 --> 00:31:50.787
I think the recovery world is a world that models that well,

00:31:50.787 --> 00:31:55.797
you know, sort of when you stop using, it doesn't mean you're done, right?

00:31:55.797 --> 00:32:02.387
We're still inviting in the lifestyle. So the lifestyle of checking in with your body,

00:32:02.724 --> 00:32:07.047
responding to and taking care of your body, you know, prioritizing

00:32:07.338 --> 00:32:13.234
regular eating, sleeping, movement, connection with creativity,

00:32:13.520 --> 00:32:18.169
connection with mindfulness, which just means chucking in with your senses,

00:32:18.528 --> 00:32:20.392
you know, connecting with,

00:32:20.891 --> 00:32:29.436
understanding a sort of communication, boundaries, all of that becomes very, very much,

00:32:30.005 --> 00:32:34.157
how you would maintain what you gained from the SSP.

00:32:34.457 --> 00:32:41.735
So I often give people at And the analogy of like, if you went and did six months of, you know, really,

00:32:42.269 --> 00:32:46.407
excellent work with the physical therapist and got yourself,

00:32:46.407 --> 00:32:50.887
you know, feeling really confident in being able to use your body in the way

00:32:50.887 --> 00:32:53.133
that you want to, and then you just,

00:32:53.668 --> 00:32:56.837
stopped and you didn't do any of the exercise they did.

00:32:59.196 --> 00:33:04.487
In a couple of weeks, the benefits would go away, right? Right.

00:33:04.882 --> 00:33:10.206
So it's like that. We're inviting in. We're sort of reestablishing like you

00:33:10.206 --> 00:33:11.316
would with physical therapy.

00:33:11.316 --> 00:33:15.556
We're getting you back to a place where that injury is not impacting you so

00:33:15.556 --> 00:33:20.556
much. But we do need to do the upkeep and create a lifestyle of taking really

00:33:20.556 --> 00:33:25.684
good care of our physical body, which is not something our culture encourages.

00:33:26.322 --> 00:33:28.018
No, no, it is not.

00:33:29.867 --> 00:33:34.547
It is not. And you highlighted a word that I think often gets,

00:33:34.987 --> 00:33:37.535
say, kind of abused a little bit. That's the word boundaries.

00:33:38.307 --> 00:33:42.101
Boundaries are a negative thing.

00:33:42.530 --> 00:33:46.519
And they're not because as you stated, once you do all this work,

00:33:47.081 --> 00:33:52.335
you have to reinforce the work, some of which through boundaries.

00:33:53.326 --> 00:33:59.687
And how difficult can that be for individuals who are not used to setting boundaries

00:33:59.687 --> 00:34:01.366
or don't know how to set boundaries?

00:34:01.506 --> 00:34:04.547
Some of us, including myself, are just like, what?

00:34:04.965 --> 00:34:09.807
Yes. Yes. I mean, I think it starts with we don't even understand what that word means.

00:34:10.573 --> 00:34:15.597
Right. Most of us have been taught that a boundary means you tell somebody else

00:34:15.597 --> 00:34:17.417
what to do and what not to do.

00:34:18.517 --> 00:34:23.071
And that's actually not a boundary. That's a demand or a request,

00:34:23.327 --> 00:34:24.662
depending on how it's given.

00:34:25.318 --> 00:34:29.837
If I tell someone else what to do with their behavior, I'm either requesting

00:34:29.837 --> 00:34:31.930
or demanding that they change.

00:34:32.493 --> 00:34:37.630
A boundary is only ever about my own behavior.

00:34:38.526 --> 00:34:48.781
So let's say, I don't know, What's an example of if I don't want a certain person to call me, okay,

00:34:49.580 --> 00:34:54.409
and I say, don't call me anymore, and then they call me,

00:34:55.387 --> 00:34:59.771
many people will describe that situation as they crossed my boundary.

00:35:00.988 --> 00:35:08.768
Okay. But actually what happened is I made a request and they did not accept the request. Right.

00:35:10.496 --> 00:35:15.278
That's all that happened there. Right. So a boundary in that scenario would

00:35:15.278 --> 00:35:19.938
be to say, hey, friend, I want to let you know that I'm not going to be answering

00:35:19.938 --> 00:35:21.241
your phone calls anymore.

00:35:21.890 --> 00:35:27.868
And I wish you all the best. Okay. The friend calls and I put it to voicemail

00:35:28.188 --> 00:35:30.096
or I may choose to block their number.

00:35:30.723 --> 00:35:36.908
Right right i have made a decision about me i am choosing not to be in communication

00:35:36.908 --> 00:35:41.348
with them anymore i'm going to take responsibility for that if they come and

00:35:41.348 --> 00:35:45.258
knock on my door every day i can make decisions about you know do i want,

00:35:45.769 --> 00:35:51.248
to change my locks do i want to get law enforcement involved do i want to move etc,

00:35:52.173 --> 00:35:58.608
always focused on my responsibility now people who are violent.

00:36:00.117 --> 00:36:06.368
Are in the world, as we acknowledged at the beginning, sometimes we can do everything

00:36:06.368 --> 00:36:11.388
we can to take care of our own boundaries and a violent person may continue

00:36:11.388 --> 00:36:14.412
to impact us. And that's when we need to reach out for help.

00:36:15.792 --> 00:36:21.358
So if we're unable to maintain our own boundaries because of the violence of

00:36:21.358 --> 00:36:25.288
someone else, that is when we want to reach out for support,

00:36:25.288 --> 00:36:29.001
whether it be physical or mental health support right right,

00:36:29.840 --> 00:36:33.798
as you mentioned in the beginning there are resources out there there's crisis

00:36:33.798 --> 00:36:38.938
for people in the u.s we have 988 that you can reach out to they're a great

00:36:38.938 --> 00:36:42.868
starting point you can text or call them they can direct you to,

00:36:43.328 --> 00:36:49.250
domestic violence services or child protective services whatever it is that you may need um,

00:36:50.132 --> 00:36:52.002
but ultimately you know.

00:36:52.922 --> 00:36:56.674
Outside of those situations where we need to ask for help,

00:36:57.533 --> 00:37:02.662
boundaries are our responsibility and how do we set them and how do we learn

00:37:02.662 --> 00:37:09.885
how to set them is tricky because it's not just a now situation.

00:37:10.001 --> 00:37:15.277
It is impacted by all of our previous life experience

00:37:15.591 --> 00:37:21.992
of it being harmful to take care of ourselves and giving ourselves the opportunity

00:37:21.992 --> 00:37:26.349
through, you know, my favorite modality is the somatic parts work.

00:37:26.637 --> 00:37:31.972
Because so much of our childhood stuff gets stored in the body and is stored

00:37:31.972 --> 00:37:34.090
in a vacuum of space and time.

00:37:34.375 --> 00:37:38.315
So those parts believe that if we say to the friend,

00:37:38.745 --> 00:37:43.262
hey, I'm not going to come to the hangout or what have you, that we're going

00:37:43.262 --> 00:37:47.792
to be locked in a room or we're not going to get dinner or love is going to

00:37:47.792 --> 00:37:49.752
be removed from us, right?

00:37:49.752 --> 00:37:54.992
Those parts don't know that we're an adult and that we're not going to be punished

00:37:54.992 --> 00:37:59.722
and that if someone tries to punish us, we'll take care of ourselves and remove

00:37:59.722 --> 00:38:01.376
ourselves from that situation.

00:38:01.782 --> 00:38:08.352
So really learning how to set boundaries is less about learning the words that

00:38:08.352 --> 00:38:12.157
you would use and more about taking care of the,

00:38:12.657 --> 00:38:17.620
parts of yourself that feel like it's not safe to even consider doing that.

00:38:18.342 --> 00:38:20.762
Because the words aren't so important, Right.

00:38:20.762 --> 00:38:28.312
Once once our parts trust us that we are the adult who's in charge now and that

00:38:28.312 --> 00:38:33.953
we will take as best care of ourselves as we can and that, you know,

00:38:34.435 --> 00:38:39.590
life involves pain and loss and we don't need to try to avoid it.

00:38:39.909 --> 00:38:45.442
Right. Then the words sort of become less important. It becomes a little bit easier.

00:38:45.762 --> 00:38:50.931
And depending on our capacity day to day, we may be able to.

00:38:51.536 --> 00:38:55.496
Hold those boundaries for ourselves when we're tired and overwhelmed,

00:38:55.496 --> 00:39:01.376
and it's a person that, you know, is really complicated in terms of the history,

00:39:01.376 --> 00:39:04.286
then we may see we have less ability.

00:39:04.286 --> 00:39:07.896
And then we get to just sort of take care of ourselves and love ourselves and

00:39:07.896 --> 00:39:15.150
grieve, right? And say, gosh, it makes so much sense that you weren't able to say no to this person.

00:39:15.995 --> 00:39:19.211
And I love you. And I'm going to be with you. And I'm really sorry.

00:39:19.211 --> 00:39:22.863
And we'll try again next time right or we'll bring that to therapy next week,

00:39:23.432 --> 00:39:27.838
right i love that's like the i think that's the best explanation of boundaries that i've heard,

00:39:28.494 --> 00:39:35.716
um because as you as often as it's presented is it's like a it's like a big thick wall you know,

00:39:36.456 --> 00:39:41.913
like it's it's not done out of love or or care for ourselves it's like you know

00:39:42.203 --> 00:39:47.516
you're bad i'm good that's kind of what it's right you know and the way you're

00:39:47.516 --> 00:39:49.738
framing is it's more about me,

00:39:50.290 --> 00:39:53.886
you know has nothing to do with you it's about where I stand on certain things

00:39:53.886 --> 00:40:00.596
that I can tolerate or accept and what I can't and I can do it lovingly I don't have to be aggressive or,

00:40:01.406 --> 00:40:05.576
mean about it and I think that that's important because boundaries don't have

00:40:05.576 --> 00:40:10.625
to be like in your face about it you know yeah yeah.

00:40:11.629 --> 00:40:16.129
More than once I've been on the phone with someone and realized that I didn't

00:40:16.129 --> 00:40:21.271
have the capacity to act according to my values because I was too dysregulated.

00:40:21.949 --> 00:40:27.699
And I've said, Hey, I'm noticing that my body really can't do this right now.

00:40:27.699 --> 00:40:32.752
I'm feeling shaky or I'm feeling like I might say something I don't mean.

00:40:33.245 --> 00:40:37.929
And I'd like to end the conversation. And that other person goes nope we're

00:40:37.929 --> 00:40:39.489
gonna keep talking we gotta do,

00:40:40.149 --> 00:40:45.819
that and i have in those circumstances said i really hear you and i'm really

00:40:45.819 --> 00:40:50.980
sorry but i'm not able to continue the conversation so i am gonna hang up the phone,

00:40:51.586 --> 00:40:58.075
right and then i do so right and that is like you said just a caring for myself,

00:40:58.563 --> 00:41:04.685
just you know i really like to encourage folks that i am not going to help you calm down.

00:41:05.705 --> 00:41:13.590
But I am going to help you be honest about your capacity with yourself and with others.

00:41:14.238 --> 00:41:21.512
Right. Because there are times when all that our body can do is lash out or lash in.

00:41:22.046 --> 00:41:29.795
And in those moments, we can learn how to take ourselves aside and minimize

00:41:29.795 --> 00:41:32.098
harm when possible. Right.

00:41:32.930 --> 00:41:40.250
Like, can being honest with ourselves, can that act alone help our nervous system? Oh, my gosh.

00:41:41.025 --> 00:41:50.175
Yes. The nervous system, it's a lie detector, first and foremost, right? I love that. Yes.

00:41:50.378 --> 00:41:54.335
All you have to do is there's something called muscle testing.

00:41:54.335 --> 00:41:55.509
You've maybe heard of it.

00:41:55.916 --> 00:42:01.755
You just, you know, lift up someone's arm and have them say, you know, I'm 46.

00:42:01.992 --> 00:42:05.775
So have me say I'm 10 years old and someone tries to press my arm down and it'll

00:42:05.775 --> 00:42:10.926
just go right down and I hold my arm up and say I'm 46 and it'll stay firm,

00:42:11.885 --> 00:42:15.665
and you can test that with a friend it's harder to do on yourself but that's

00:42:15.665 --> 00:42:17.770
what polygraphs are based off of,

00:42:18.765 --> 00:42:23.033
the nervous system is just like you're lying and it'll go.

00:42:25.665 --> 00:42:30.765
Heartbeat diarrhea it has to that's true it,

00:42:31.632 --> 00:42:35.899
So, yes, being honest with yourself, even if you can't say it to the other person.

00:42:36.276 --> 00:42:39.572
If someone's like, hey, I really want you to come to my birthday party.

00:42:39.572 --> 00:42:41.790
And I'm like, I am so peopled out. Right.

00:42:42.150 --> 00:42:46.472
And I go, oh, my gosh, I'd love to because I'm scared to say no.

00:42:46.892 --> 00:42:51.561
Right. Even just telling myself, hey, I know that we don't want to go.

00:42:52.188 --> 00:42:56.930
I know that you are done with people. I also know that you're scared to say no.

00:42:57.407 --> 00:43:02.102
And I get both of those things. and I know that the scared to say no is winning

00:43:02.102 --> 00:43:06.812
tonight and that that's really a bummer and so I am going to take such good

00:43:06.812 --> 00:43:09.605
care of you and tomorrow we're not going to leave the house,

00:43:10.382 --> 00:43:13.792
right and tonight I'm going to,

00:43:14.432 --> 00:43:19.572
you know you don't have to say anything you can just sit in a corner and just

00:43:19.572 --> 00:43:26.302
drink your your coke and you know just mellow out and and tonight we'll watch three hours of your,

00:43:26.842 --> 00:43:32.322
favorite show right I can write all of that and that in and of itself even though

00:43:32.322 --> 00:43:36.838
you're going to the party it'll totally change the way you experience it,

00:43:37.600 --> 00:43:41.920
I love that I love that you practice like talking to your nervous system like

00:43:42.123 --> 00:43:47.312
you're I mean you are connected and it's I think it's like listen like tonight

00:43:47.312 --> 00:43:51.358
we really have to do this but tomorrow we can do something totally about you.

00:43:52.716 --> 00:43:59.392
Yes my nervous system knows that on wednesday i am chaperoning for my kids middle

00:43:59.392 --> 00:44:02.225
school trip to six flags yikes,

00:44:02.909 --> 00:44:09.550
okay that was like the worst case scenario on every front for my blessed nervous system right,

00:44:10.532 --> 00:44:16.072
and i'm like i am asking so much of you i know it's going to be so hard and

00:44:16.072 --> 00:44:20.879
this is really something that I want to give to my kiddo.

00:44:22.852 --> 00:44:27.259
I am going to let you just flop,

00:44:28.202 --> 00:44:33.341
next weekend, right? Nothing, nothing, right?

00:44:33.841 --> 00:44:41.232
And in preparation, like I'm not going to his soccer game the night before, right?

00:44:41.232 --> 00:44:44.222
So I'm saying no to something so I can say yes to something.

00:44:44.222 --> 00:44:51.726
And that makes a world of difference. Just being in conversation like you would with a friend, right?

00:44:51.934 --> 00:44:57.162
To navigate to where, cause we can't, we can't just avoid everything that our

00:44:57.162 --> 00:45:01.382
nervous system doesn't like, right? Yeah, no, I can't. Being honest with it

00:45:01.382 --> 00:45:04.262
and saying, hey, I know you really don't like this.

00:45:04.662 --> 00:45:07.652
I'm going to ask you to get up early in the morning, but I'm going to put you

00:45:07.652 --> 00:45:13.062
to bed early tonight, right? All the ways that we can be in actual,

00:45:13.528 --> 00:45:17.652
you know, respectful, honest, open relationship.

00:45:17.919 --> 00:45:22.020
And when our nervous system says, hey, it's been too much. It's not working for me anymore.

00:45:22.655 --> 00:45:26.762
Yeah. Then we get to take responsibility for our life circumstances,

00:45:26.762 --> 00:45:31.052
is you know it may be that Wednesday night I'm having a conversation with my

00:45:31.052 --> 00:45:35.392
nervous system my nervous system says we're we can't ever do this again and

00:45:35.392 --> 00:45:37.300
I'll say okay thanks for letting us try,

00:45:38.182 --> 00:45:42.918
thanks for letting us yeah and I and I will not do that again and I'm so sorry thank you.

00:45:43.902 --> 00:45:47.062
I can relate to what you're saying because I've been there because my son I've

00:45:47.062 --> 00:45:52.702
gone on like field trips with him and you know he's older now and so it's not

00:45:52.702 --> 00:45:55.014
as much but I remember like going to like,

00:45:55.750 --> 00:45:59.270
just all these different like like Six Flags was one of them I think and there's

00:45:59.270 --> 00:46:01.741
these different like water parks and things and I'm like,

00:46:02.374 --> 00:46:07.210
there's like 18 of you and there's 10 parents that I have to try to figure out

00:46:07.210 --> 00:46:13.010
how to talk to yeah and teachers and I can't go on the rides because my nervous system's like no no,

00:46:13.650 --> 00:46:20.114
so I can like I can totally relate to what you're saying like you know how Wednesday at Six Flags was,

00:46:20.740 --> 00:46:27.310
is gonna be just a lot yeah and I encourage folks because we can't avoid any,

00:46:27.790 --> 00:46:32.080
you know, taxing of our nervous system, I like to really focus on how do we

00:46:32.080 --> 00:46:34.470
resource before, during, and after, right?

00:46:34.470 --> 00:46:39.256
So like I said, I'm taking things off my list tomorrow, the day before,

00:46:39.493 --> 00:46:42.355
so that I can go into it more resourced.

00:46:42.605 --> 00:46:48.060
During, I have already told myself, I don't have to try to corral or correct

00:46:48.060 --> 00:46:49.786
or protect any of the kids.

00:46:50.961 --> 00:46:55.632
I'm going to be just sort of checked out in terms of I'm not going to tell them not to run.

00:46:55.898 --> 00:46:59.341
I'm not going to tell them where to be. I'm just going to if the teachers are

00:46:59.341 --> 00:47:01.581
like, gosh, that chaperone is doing nothing. I'm going to be like,

00:47:01.581 --> 00:47:03.658
uh-huh, doing nothing. Right.

00:47:04.205 --> 00:47:07.371
Put me in the list doing nothing. So I already told my system I don't have to

00:47:07.371 --> 00:47:09.921
do that. I'm going to wear earplugs the whole day.

00:47:10.581 --> 00:47:15.059
I'm going to it's charging right now. I'm going to wear a little fan around my neck.

00:47:15.344 --> 00:47:20.761
Yes. I've already decided that I'm going to have an icy cup of lemonade or whatever I want.

00:47:20.761 --> 00:47:26.061
All day I can refill it as many of it as I want even if it costs $40 because

00:47:26.061 --> 00:47:31.099
I'm gonna keep myself cool I'm gonna take lots of bathroom breaks I'm not going on any rides.

00:47:32.840 --> 00:47:37.611
I'm gonna sit down as often as possible and I'm gonna bring a little backpack

00:47:37.611 --> 00:47:41.771
with a book so that if there is any sitting with other adults I'm gonna be like

00:47:41.771 --> 00:47:43.138
I'm just gonna read for a little bit,

00:47:43.762 --> 00:47:48.451
yeah no I love it I love how you like you prep yourself yeah coping ahead they

00:47:48.451 --> 00:47:53.191
call it yeah and like I wish as adults that became more normalized because you

00:47:53.191 --> 00:47:56.748
think of how much we we prepare our children that's right,

00:47:57.253 --> 00:48:00.581
but we've kind of forgotten about like ourselves in the mix that,

00:48:01.703 --> 00:48:06.421
we still have a nervous system to maintain and we have to be there for our children

00:48:06.421 --> 00:48:11.101
as you know as you understand that's right and And they're going to be witnessing

00:48:11.101 --> 00:48:14.619
us having moments throughout life and it happens.

00:48:14.985 --> 00:48:19.315
But it's probably a lot scarier when they see it repeatedly.

00:48:20.020 --> 00:48:25.678
Absolutely. Yeah. And we get to model for them that they can take care of themselves

00:48:25.840 --> 00:48:29.770
down the line. They don't have to fall into this like strange,

00:48:30.043 --> 00:48:33.253
I don't have any feelings. I became a robot when I became an adult.

00:48:36.720 --> 00:48:42.958
I do want to ask you, is this work for children as well or is it mostly recommended for adults?

00:48:43.450 --> 00:48:50.712
Yep, I do work with children, teens, and adults. It is sort of like allowed two years and up.

00:48:51.223 --> 00:48:56.646
Oh, okay. At FSP, we don't work with infants or early toddlers.

00:48:57.005 --> 00:49:01.094
It's just what it's been studied to be safe with. So two and up.

00:49:01.507 --> 00:49:08.609
For me, I only work with kids once I've worked with their parents because I find that,

00:49:09.262 --> 00:49:12.452
No fault of their own. A lot of parents have learned through this culture that

00:49:12.452 --> 00:49:18.656
they're supposed to push and control and fix their kids, which works against what I'm inviting in.

00:49:19.822 --> 00:49:23.851
So if I'm inviting the kid to learn how to listen to their body and to pause

00:49:24.287 --> 00:49:29.582
when their nervous system raises its hand and to not finish if their body's

00:49:29.582 --> 00:49:33.072
not up for it, and then their parents are going, you have to finish it.

00:49:33.072 --> 00:49:34.122
Keep that headphones on.

00:49:36.302 --> 00:49:41.402
It can be a little tricky and a lot of times parents are less concerned about

00:49:41.402 --> 00:49:47.922
their kids behavior once the parent has learned about their own nervous system because they

00:49:48.342 --> 00:49:51.742
might be in a lot of games of what I call nervous system ping pong you know

00:49:51.742 --> 00:49:55.862
I'm stressed so now you're stressed so now I'm stressed so now you're stressed

00:49:56.182 --> 00:49:58.401
and we support the parents oftentimes

00:49:58.738 --> 00:50:04.020
they're not so worried about their kids because it was mostly their own stress.

00:50:05.369 --> 00:50:12.902
But it has been very supportive for kids, especially kids who are neurodivergent or neurocomplex.

00:50:13.824 --> 00:50:19.482
Lots of good research that's been done around that. And the SSP can be used,

00:50:19.482 --> 00:50:24.162
I use it with somatic parts work, but it can be used with other modalities as

00:50:24.162 --> 00:50:27.224
well. It's not considered a standalone treatment.

00:50:27.982 --> 00:50:34.452
So psychologists, social workers, and licensed counselors and coaches can use

00:50:34.452 --> 00:50:42.712
it with, you know, IFS, parts work, DBT, CBT, whatever their primary modality is.

00:50:43.177 --> 00:50:49.782
Occupational therapists can use it alongside. Oh, nice. Yes, it's wonderful with OT.

00:50:50.222 --> 00:50:58.622
So any kind of, you know, feeding therapy or fine motor therapy or sensory support,

00:50:58.622 --> 00:51:02.582
you know, balance. Physical therapists can use it. Speech pathologists use it.

00:51:02.582 --> 00:51:05.016
I'm actually trained also as a speech pathologist.

00:51:05.486 --> 00:51:12.271
Oh, wow. So it can be used in support of many different modalities.

00:51:12.989 --> 00:51:16.239
That's beautiful because it's not like one or the other. That's right.

00:51:16.239 --> 00:51:19.718
That's right. You know, you can use it with, and I love that you have,

00:51:20.393 --> 00:51:26.219
that you, you ask the parents to take part in their own healing versus saying,

00:51:26.219 --> 00:51:28.989
you know, just fix my child, you know,

00:51:29.689 --> 00:51:32.769
you know, because even if you, even if you do work with a child,

00:51:33.216 --> 00:51:37.498
if the home isn't safe and parents aren't healing, it's not.

00:51:37.911 --> 00:51:40.767
Yeah. Yeah. So this, that's beautiful. And I love that.

00:51:41.458 --> 00:51:46.809
And I do, I do want to ask you about this beautiful quote that you have on your

00:51:47.149 --> 00:51:48.997
on your profile by Rumi. I loved it.

00:51:51.083 --> 00:51:56.331
Out beyond wrongdoing and right doing, there is a field. I'll meet you there.

00:51:57.001 --> 00:52:04.309
What does that mean to you? Ah, it just feels like everything washes away and

00:52:04.309 --> 00:52:07.909
my whole system just opens up to,

00:52:09.029 --> 00:52:16.949
letting go of this blame and shame and, you know, you're right or you're wrong,

00:52:16.949 --> 00:52:21.149
you're sinful or you're saved, you're good or you're bad.

00:52:21.965 --> 00:52:32.061
And offers us that reclamation of the truth of our actual physiology,

00:52:32.373 --> 00:52:34.817
which is that when we're scared,

00:52:35.502 --> 00:52:37.261
we do a few things.

00:52:38.852 --> 00:52:40.338
When we feel safe,

00:52:41.284 --> 00:52:44.691
We do all the things that we call good, right?

00:52:45.068 --> 00:52:55.024
And so if we can come back to the idea that the nervous system is just showing

00:52:55.364 --> 00:52:57.090
if someone feels safe or scared,

00:52:57.653 --> 00:53:01.914
in their behavior, then we can let go of the rightness and wrongness.

00:53:01.914 --> 00:53:07.664
And we can come into this new field of possibilities where we can understand

00:53:07.664 --> 00:53:11.848
each other, we can support each other, we can take care of each other,

00:53:12.243 --> 00:53:17.284
rather than rewarding or punishing each other for things that really we can't

00:53:17.284 --> 00:53:19.319
take credit for. Right? Right.

00:53:20.555 --> 00:53:23.853
And it's such a beautiful quote. And I love that quote.

00:53:24.369 --> 00:53:31.043
Yeah. Rumi's one of my favorites. A mystic who also was a pretty nervous system informed.

00:53:31.964 --> 00:53:37.162
Yeah, I mean, every time I read one of their quotes, it's like,

00:53:37.499 --> 00:53:41.974
it always hits when I need it to hit. I don't know. I just always find it when I need to find it.

00:53:42.498 --> 00:53:46.694
An extraordinary quote, for sure. Yes, and that one, I think,

00:53:46.694 --> 00:53:50.387
is going to be one of my new favorites. I'm big on quotes. Quotes are, like, my thing.

00:53:50.763 --> 00:53:56.044
So, like, I love that I found, like, a really beautiful quote. So glad.

00:53:57.050 --> 00:53:59.598
Is there anything that you'd like to leave us with today?

00:54:01.811 --> 00:54:06.274
Yeah, just that I think there's infinite possibilities wherever you are,

00:54:06.274 --> 00:54:07.564
no matter how hopeless it,

00:54:09.632 --> 00:54:14.070
We are all capable of creating a life that is really worth living.

00:54:14.708 --> 00:54:20.885
And worth living may not match what society has told you is successful,

00:54:21.558 --> 00:54:25.533
but I've come to really believe that successful is not necessary.

00:54:26.218 --> 00:54:30.455
That worth living is always possible. And it may look a lot different,

00:54:30.571 --> 00:54:32.252
but everyone's capable of it.

00:54:32.252 --> 00:54:36.872
And if I could find a life that was worth living, really anybody could.

00:54:38.312 --> 00:54:43.822
There was no hope for me well now look at the life that you're living you're

00:54:43.822 --> 00:54:49.102
helping I'm incredibly grateful yeah and all the beautiful work that you're

00:54:49.102 --> 00:54:52.479
doing I mean come on that's amazing,

00:54:53.825 --> 00:55:00.122
it's unbelievable to me just totally extraordinary and you must get I imagine

00:55:00.122 --> 00:55:03.008
it must fulfill you on a very deep level the work that you do,

00:55:04.419 --> 00:55:14.077
it is just words can't really touch on how extraordinary it feels to,

00:55:15.313 --> 00:55:22.223
be living in an experience where I do get feedback that people say I am anywhere

00:55:22.223 --> 00:55:26.824
from neutral to positively impacting their life.

00:55:27.288 --> 00:55:33.273
Whereas the first 35 years of my life, I only heard that I was making people's lives harder,

00:55:34.498 --> 00:55:42.013
that I was a burden, that I was only going to make people's lives worse and

00:55:42.333 --> 00:55:46.015
i so believed that and i was so sorry,

00:55:46.509 --> 00:55:53.771
and i really really didn't want to be hurting people but i couldn't figure out how not to um.

00:55:55.733 --> 00:56:04.363
So this feels like a totally bizarre our alternate reality and there is really

00:56:04.363 --> 00:56:07.575
not an hour that goes by where I am not like,

00:56:08.667 --> 00:56:10.310
are you kidding me?

00:56:11.633 --> 00:56:17.727
I can't believe it. I feel so privileged and grateful.

00:56:18.793 --> 00:56:23.593
I'm happy that you get to have this experience now versus the first 35 years

00:56:23.593 --> 00:56:28.603
where you felt you know all the all the ickiness all the heaviness you know,

00:56:29.271 --> 00:56:33.143
thank you not everybody gets that you know there's plenty of people that their

00:56:33.143 --> 00:56:38.613
whole lifetime is going to be that and and that's really the people that I want

00:56:38.613 --> 00:56:42.344
to know it is possible it is possible and,

00:56:43.124 --> 00:56:49.793
there's no one who's too far gone and there's no one who's fatally flawed um,

00:56:50.549 --> 00:56:58.133
everyone is so precious and if there is no one else who believes that i believe

00:56:58.133 --> 00:57:04.063
that about every single human on the planet so i love you all wherever you are.

00:57:06.454 --> 00:57:09.171
I feel like you're the human version of like a warm chocolate chip cookie.

00:57:10.660 --> 00:57:14.384
That's amazing. Like I feel like that's the best compliment I can give you.

00:57:14.709 --> 00:57:16.946
That is a high compliment.

00:57:18.099 --> 00:57:20.666
Like, you know, like the fresh cookies, you get them out of the oven.

00:57:21.106 --> 00:57:24.666
You know, they have like this beautiful, like, you know, your house smells,

00:57:24.666 --> 00:57:25.942
your apartment smells wonderful.

00:57:26.342 --> 00:57:28.693
You know, just take a bite and it's like your whole day is good now.

00:57:28.966 --> 00:57:31.226
You know, you know. Thank you.

00:57:31.886 --> 00:57:34.144
You're welcome. That's incredible.

00:57:34.886 --> 00:57:37.586
I just that's what I feel like that's what I feel like you're like the human

00:57:37.586 --> 00:57:42.726
and I I know people don't like often to be compared to food but oh I feel honored.

00:57:43.586 --> 00:57:48.426
I'm seeing the like glistening chocolate that's like still intact and the beautiful

00:57:48.426 --> 00:57:51.146
little shape totally melty,

00:57:51.846 --> 00:57:58.646
yes the perfect crispy edge and the yes the goldenness and the chewiness and

00:57:58.646 --> 00:58:04.276
the saltiness and the sweetness thank you you're welcome and thank you for for

00:58:04.276 --> 00:58:06.836
joining us today what a privilege,

00:58:07.492 --> 00:58:10.806
there was such a beautiful conversation you shared so much about your important

00:58:10.806 --> 00:58:14.046
work your vital work for all of us not just for you

00:58:14.466 --> 00:58:18.996
or or your clients but for all of us and this is work that is accessible to

00:58:18.996 --> 00:58:24.026
everybody it really is yeah the ssp is not required you know coming back into

00:58:24.026 --> 00:58:27.631
that relationship with your body it's something that everyone can do it's free,

00:58:28.078 --> 00:58:33.446
and i've got loads of nervous system exercises on my youtube channel that are

00:58:33.446 --> 00:58:40.594
free please take advantage of them if it if it's right for you take what you like and leave the rest,

00:58:41.365 --> 00:58:46.415
Yeah, it's accessible for anyone. Breathing, movement, vocalization,

00:58:46.415 --> 00:58:50.171
and mindfulness. That's all we need. And it's all free.

00:58:50.670 --> 00:58:55.045
I love that. And your website is beautiful, too. There's a nice course online

00:58:55.045 --> 00:58:58.085
as well that you have on your website as well. Yeah.

00:58:59.041 --> 00:59:03.045
So, yeah, please check out Gazee. She has a wonderful YouTube channel,

00:59:03.425 --> 00:59:06.925
website. And I'm going to put all that in the show notes as well. Yeah.

00:59:07.596 --> 00:59:11.525
Yeah, thank you for being an incredible guest. and I thank you for taking the

00:59:11.525 --> 00:59:15.305
time I know your day was really busy today so now we can let you go get some

00:59:15.305 --> 00:59:22.185
rest and thank you to your nervous system for allowing me to interview it for a little bit,

00:59:23.445 --> 00:59:28.305
thank you for inviting me what a joy this was fun, I really enjoyed this I've

00:59:28.305 --> 00:59:33.087
been looking forward to this interview and it's a very nice way to end the evening so thank you.

00:59:34.533 --> 00:59:40.515
And please look up Gazi, a wonderful human look into her look into their work

00:59:40.515 --> 00:59:42.564
I should say I'm sorry and,

00:59:43.225 --> 00:59:47.457
you know it may be for you and I don't see why it's not for everybody honestly,

00:59:48.096 --> 00:59:52.681
and you know look into it and like she said it's like they said it's not one or the other,

00:59:53.343 --> 00:59:56.704
you can you can you can you can pair it with something else,

00:59:57.596 --> 01:00:01.905
absolutely and if anyone just wants to chit chat with me or ask me any questions

01:00:01.905 --> 01:00:06.275
or tell me their story I have a link on there to book a free call and it doesn't

01:00:06.275 --> 01:00:10.148
have to be just about working with me you could just say hi,

01:00:11.165 --> 01:00:15.495
i love that you're gonna say hi i love that so much and so and so thank you

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everybody for for joining and listening to us today chat um and check out our

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link tree in the show notes for clips and updates,

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and you'll please remember that you know you don't have to carry where you came

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from you know keep telling your story,

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and you never know who you're gonna help and we will see you all next time.