July 14, 2026
The Nolan Wells Investigation: Suspicious details, Misleading Photos, And A State With A Notorious History Of Racial Injustice
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RSS Feed We go in-depth into the latest information surrounding the mysterious death of a black college football player who went to an island off the coast of Mississippi to party with his white friends, and never came home. 18-year-old Nolan Wells’ body was found 2 days later in the waters near Horn Island, and while there is no suggestion of race being an issue in his death, it’s necessary to understand why his parents might not trust Mississippi authorities leading this investigation. The local sheriff immediately announced there was no foul play suspected and suggested it was an accidental drowning…. And while that may all be true, it’s important to recognize the suspicious events surrounding Nolan’s death and the notorious racial history of Mississippi.
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00:00:02
Speaker 1: Welcome everyone. I made Robock alongside TJ. Holmes, and today we're talking about what everyone is seemingly talking about, and that is what has happened to Nolan Wells, an eighteen year old college football player out partying with his friends on the fourth of July. His friends returned back to shore and he doesn't His body's found around two days later. And today we still don't know what has happened to Nolan well.
00:00:34
Speaker 2: We should find out soon enough, hopefully with a bunch of autopsies that are out there. But you said, what everybody's talking about. It seems to be what everybody's fighting about. And the fight, yes, once again, has gone in the direction of race. Look, this channel is called out of network, and now that we're out of network, we can say this that do you really expect the black parents of an eighteen year old black kid who died under suspicious circumstances to just take the Mississippi authority's word for it that your son died of an accidental drowning. No, that's that is something that needs to be said out loud. There's a reason that a black parent might not just take Mississippi's word for it that their black kid hanging out with nothing but white kids ends up dead. This could be a total accident, robes, but it's getting missed sometimes in the conversation that's being had that why did you just trust the authorities? Why does it always have to There's a reason for that that we'll get into rose, But that is where we are with this kid. Nolan Well's eighteen, good swimmer, healthy as all get out, surrounded by two hundred people dead.
00:01:44
Speaker 1: Why and no one saw how he died when he died? Why he died? That is concerning, in addition to several other issues that his parents and his parents' attorneys bring up that I think any parent, I don't care what color you are, would have questions about, meaning, why would an eighteen almost nineteen year old not have his phone with him? Why would he say, hey, friends, go leave without me, and by the way, take my phone, take the keys to my car. I'll figure out how to get a ride back. Look, could that have happened? Sure, it doesn't seem likely. And his parents don't believe that's the way he operated.
00:02:23
Speaker 2: Okay, though, okay, everybody listening knows no teenager operates by leaving their phone behind yeah.
00:02:30
Speaker 3: Sure, just take it. I'll figure it out.
00:02:32
Speaker 2: No teenage, we've been talking about that. The kids don't even go to the bathroom without their phone, So yeah, just take my phone and we're good. We'll get into what I guess how some people are explaining that, but that is inexplicable. But Nolan Wells has become Ropes like Carmelo Anthony in some ways that the crime or excuse me, excuse me, let me not say this has not been determined when Nolan Wells a crime, But there is a kid dead and the circumstances around it might not have had anything to do with race. Now the conversation about it after the fact has become about race and robes. That is where it's gotten nasty, and that is where it's gotten once again. People go into their respective corners and fighting and robes. The racial fight is not just happening in the country. It's happening, and of all.
00:03:15
Speaker 3: Places, Mississippi, it's the last place.
00:03:18
Speaker 1: No. And it's tough because look, Nolan Wells, by his friend's account, by his parents' account, was friends with everybody.
00:03:26
Speaker 3: He didn't see color.
00:03:28
Speaker 1: And I know that can be a dangerous thing, and that can be part of our conversation as well. But he was the guy that everybody loved and the guy that loved everybody, according to every single person.
00:03:39
Speaker 3: I know, when people.
00:03:40
Speaker 1: Pass everybody's nice stuff, right, they're the heroes of the world.
00:03:46
Speaker 3: They're the best thing that ever happened.
00:03:48
Speaker 1: But I actually this has actually been really interesting to hear from former educators to high school coaches, to college coaches, to friends, neighbors. They are all speaking about someone who actually was and lived a peaceful, beautiful, positive existence. And no matter what side people are on right now, and I know people have lawyered up and people aren't talking, and people are suspicious of one another, but they do share the same theme that Nolan Wells was an incredible human being.
00:04:24
Speaker 2: And right now we don't know what happened to this eighteen year old kid, where as we record as this at least recording. There are two autopsies pending, one from the medical examiner, the official one, and then an independent one that the family and their lawyers have asked for. Don't have the results of those yet. But while we're here, why we're here roped is that a kid did what a bunch of kids do on holiday weekend, especially on the fourth of July weekend, and Nolan Wells, eighteen year old kid out of Mississippi high school excuse me, college football player, young receiver, goes out with his friends on the fourth of July to a little barrier island off the coasts of Mississippi, hangs out a couple of days. He ends up missing. A couple days later, he's found dead near that same island. And this now's where the question starts. So robes that he was found on July sixth. His body was found two days after he disappeared. But we go back, and we could start with this whole thing in July third and take you through the next several days, and why, Robes, A lot of this just does not add up.
00:05:27
Speaker 1: Yes, there are a lot of questions, and the timeline will help explain why these questions are real and still pending. So on July third, Nolan Wells goes over to his parents' house and makes dinner.
00:05:40
Speaker 3: For her mom. His mom, excuse me, bake salmon.
00:05:43
Speaker 1: And it was just that's exactly what you would expect from the guy that everyone described most eighteen year old boys on going over to his parent their parents' house and making dinner for them before they're heading out with friends.
00:05:55
Speaker 2: Oh the way the story was told, he actually, uh, he knew his mom has had a tough day, he had a rough day or whatever it was, and to side to cook food for them. Awesome. For whatever reason, the story ended terribly with his death. Why does it make it worse when I heard about him cooking salmon?
00:06:11
Speaker 1: It does because because it speaks to his character and what a loss it is that this seemingly beautiful human being is no longer here.
00:06:18
Speaker 3: Because I don't know many eighteen year old guys look and I know they're out there.
00:06:23
Speaker 1: I just think there are may be few and far between who would take the time before going out for a party weekend with their friends to think of his parents and to give back to his parents, and to consider his mom's tough day ahead of what he was excited about going to do. That speaks to who he was, and so it just makes his loss feel all the more gutting.
00:06:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a little detail, and even hearing it with salmon, for some reason, right messes me up. So that was on July third. He makes dinner for his mom. His parents then goes and stays at a friend's house that night as July third, because he had plans rolled on July fourth to hop on a boat with at least three of his friends and going over to Horn Island. If you're not familiars in this southern part of Mississippi, right off the coast where they say eight to ten miles, but it's a little barrier island. But they leave from a private dock in Ocean Springs, Mississippi. Remind me, I keep messing it up. It's near seventeen miles from go Forth third.
00:07:16
Speaker 1: Fort, Mississippi. It's where my grandmother's from. Actually, so yes, the area well.
00:07:20
Speaker 2: So yes, Ocean Springs where they leave from in Mississippi. Now he goes, hangs out, he's partying with his friends, Robes on this island. Then he has seen for the last time at three pm, they say, which sounds pretty early for a July fourth, Yes, okay, So why then he was he last seen there? The story goes that he wanted to stay behind because he met some girl, wanted to hang out and was going to get a ride back with everybody else. Okay, fine, But eleven o'clock comes and his family Robes that's still not heard from him, and his friends say they hadn't heard from him either, and this is when they called His parents called his mom to say he's missing. Family reports missing that evening.
00:08:01
Speaker 1: A search starts the next day absolutely and his family starts immediately searching for him via his phone correct Life three sixty. They actually go to the island. His parents actually went to the island themselves. They are desperate to find their son. This isn't like him to not show up, to just be gone, and then even more remarkably, to not have his phone with him.
00:08:25
Speaker 3: That makes zero sense.
00:08:26
Speaker 1: But by July fifth, the Costcard actually joins in on the search and they are actively looking for this young man just about everywhere. And it isn't until July sixth, as that search continues by boat and by aircraft, the Cajun Navy got involved as well, and unfortunately, the worst case scenario, they find his body at around eight forty five in the morning in the waters off of Horn Island.
00:08:52
Speaker 2: And to give I wasn't familiar, we say Horn Island. We hear about islands. If you're not familiar down there. This is not some developed place, right, This is little stretched sand bar you could essentially describe it as.
00:09:01
Speaker 1: A party sandbar basically for kids to take their boats out. And they've been doing this all through high school. This was a familiar place his parents were used to Nolan going there with his friends and yes, kids are drinking beer, pulling up their boats. One of the friends described it as basically everyone who went to their high school and they were all a tight group. We're all on this island enjoying kind of the last bit of the holiday weekend before everybody had to go back to work or school.
00:09:27
Speaker 2: Okay, and from what I can tell, at least from the videos and the pictures we've seen, if you get an idea in your mind, you say Horn Island, it's they're not necessarily physically on some island. They're all in the water and on their boats, surrounding sandy areas for the most part. So I'm trying to give the idea rope that you can't necessarily be standing on the island in one spot and something could be happening way over on the other side that you don't see. No, everybody's collected in one spot. They're together. It's almost impossible to hide, right.
00:09:55
Speaker 1: The boats are all pulled up or anchored right offshore, and then all the kids are spilled out in waste.
00:10:02
Speaker 3: Deep water, hanging out.
00:10:04
Speaker 1: Some people are on the beach, some people are in the water, some people are on the boats. But basically everyone's in the same general area, within feet or inches of one another.
00:10:13
Speaker 2: Okay, So the word from Mississippi authorities no foul play suspected.
00:10:21
Speaker 3: Immediately they say this, they have.
00:10:22
Speaker 2: No indication that anything was suspicious, And they said initially Robes that the belief was that this was an accidental drowning. So now that gets us caught up on the official word of what happened. Now, Robes, the questions come, and there's a bunch of them that make this story not make any fricking sense. It just does not. And you start number one, phone, what eighteen year old just decides, Ah, I don't need my phone.
00:10:58
Speaker 1: I think it would be a very rare exception that an eighteen year old, and frankly, any child who gets possession of a cell phone starting at age ten, eleven, twelve, they don't let those phones out of their sites. First of all, for the social aspect of it, the photo aspect of it, and yes, the.
00:11:18
Speaker 3: Communication aspect of it.
00:11:20
Speaker 1: I would think you would want your phone with you at all times to document the fun you're having to text people who maybe aren't there, who are coming to communicate. But certainly if you don't plan on going with your friends, or you plan on figuring out how to find your way home.
00:11:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, all the more.
00:11:39
Speaker 1: Reasons why you would absolutely make sure you had your phone with you so that you could text someone, communicate with someone, and make sure you have an ability to get home.
00:11:48
Speaker 2: That was the biggest WTF in the initial story. His phone. That doesn't make any sense, That does not add up. We should mention roller. I don't know if you said it earlier already His mom tracked the phone to a friend's house, right with Life three sixty. Yes, okay, but there's a little detail we could take it aside here. It didn't have this in, but there was a detail here that the mom saw Life three sixty, which is a life saver, by the way, we love this thing. She sees the phone, it's at a friend's house and tries to go retrieve it.
00:12:20
Speaker 1: Yes, I think it was a friend of the family went for them on their behalf, drove to this home where they could clearly see the phone was, and by her account, she said it took fifteen minutes and everyone going there was a bunch of people, she said, at the house, a bunch of friends all gathered there and she said, we know the phone's here.
00:12:38
Speaker 3: We can see the phones.
00:12:39
Speaker 1: Here, and she said it took them fifteen minutes to produce it. Look, maybe they couldn't find it, maybe they didn't know where it was, but clearly that is suspicious.
00:12:50
Speaker 2: So let's keep adding up those suspicious things, all right, phone, he doesn't have need to go find it takes them a mile to get it. Next thing, once she gets the phonebes mama said, this phone does not look like something that my eighteen year old child has been using. She thought that some things were deleted.
00:13:11
Speaker 3: Correct.
00:13:12
Speaker 1: So her son is an avid Snapchat user, so much so that he has two separate accounts.
00:13:17
Speaker 3: She said.
00:13:17
Speaker 1: He posts every day and especially when he's out with friends having fun. He is a Snapchat king, like he is just constantly posting videos and photos, sending messages via Snapchat. That is what he uses. She goes on to both immediately, hoping that that will help her put together a timeline or piece together what his last movements more or what his last photo was, what his last message was.
00:13:42
Speaker 3: It's wiped clean, according to her.
00:13:44
Speaker 1: She says, there isn't one photo, there isn't one video, there isn't one message, and we know by Snapchat's the way it's used. Yes, those things disappear within twenty four hours. This was well within the twenty four hours.
00:13:57
Speaker 2: Oh, so she just thought.
00:13:59
Speaker 1: It was very suspicious that it looked as though her son never once took a picture, a video, or sent any messages using Snapchat, which she said is completely out of characters.
00:14:11
Speaker 2: So that suspicious detail will lead to the question, then why would anybody need to delete something from his phone? What was on it? Keep going here. Next issue ropes have to do with contradictory stories. Friends say he was going over to hang out with the girl, girls saying he's going over to hang out with the friends and head back, which is.
00:14:31
Speaker 3: Yes, this is very confusing.
00:14:33
Speaker 1: So the friends all had the same story that he met this young girl, he was into her, and he wanted to stay back because of her look. That kind of That reads right, guys eighteen meet a girl, she's cute.
00:14:44
Speaker 2: Kind of but you y'all go back. I'll figure out how to get back.
00:14:47
Speaker 1: To the mailand they had engine trouble or some they were taking on water. That's why they said they had to leave early, at three o'clock. And that's why they claim he wasn't ready to leave yet because it was early and he met this girl.
00:14:59
Speaker 3: Yes, okay, the.
00:15:00
Speaker 1: Problem is this girl said he told me he was going back to the mainland with his friends.
00:15:07
Speaker 3: Yes, So which is it that is confusing?
00:15:10
Speaker 2: Bro Okay, that might be the details that yes, suspicious again, keep going here down the list of questions. He accidentally drowned, possibly according to the sheriff rohopes, according to the family, and according to the water that seemed unlikely given they were standing rope. This was a lot of this was knee deep water. How did he drown? And this is a kid who knew how to swim?
00:15:34
Speaker 1: Yes, he is described as an elite athlete. He's a running back. Correct for the college football team. You're sorry, wide receiver, I'm terrible.
00:15:41
Speaker 3: He's a wide receiver.
00:15:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, he's an elite athlete as a college football player. He is an avid swimmer. So this isn't somebody who didn't know how to swim, who was not you know he was. He was absolutely command of his body. Now, look, there was drinking. People were drinking beer, hanging out having fun. We get that, But how is it if he's surrounded by two hundred people, many of whom he went to high school with, who know him, How does he just drown or get swept away by the currents without anyone noticing, without anyone seeing, without anyone saying I saw it happened?
00:16:22
Speaker 3: Like, how is that possible?
00:16:24
Speaker 2: So he was in trouble, somebody would have seen somebody struggling in the water. It's just impossible.
00:16:29
Speaker 3: I don't care.
00:16:29
Speaker 1: If some people were drinking and some people were someone would have seen something. With the crowd that was there, with the videos that are online, with the photos that are out there, it absolutely truly seems impossible for someone to just slip away, never to be seen again in the middle of the day because who no one is coming forward to say they saw him past three pm?
00:16:52
Speaker 2: Correct, Oh no, that was it. And I don't even know how they have that the last time he was seeing or somebody remember seeing or has a documented something of that. Three o'clock that's very early in the day. They didn't all bounce.
00:17:03
Speaker 3: At three where they didn't go exactly where.
00:17:05
Speaker 2: Did he go that nobody saw him after three? And if he's he's drowned in this this knee deep waste deep water around here, nobody saw this guy.
00:17:14
Speaker 1: That's again, he wasn't screamingsoud, felling for help, nothing, He just disappeared.
00:17:21
Speaker 2: And two, I think you when that brought this detail to me that indicate they know he wasn't drunk. He wasn't.
00:17:28
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, the.
00:17:29
Speaker 1: Cajun Navy, the spokesperson for the Cajun Navy said that he was there. I believe or was privy to information surrounding that there was. The medical examiner of the corner they immediately look, they're awaiting final and official toxicology reports.
00:17:44
Speaker 3: But he said his.
00:17:45
Speaker 1: Alcohol level was not enough for him to be considered incapacitated or so intoxicated that he wouldn't be able to maintain his factors.
00:17:54
Speaker 2: All right, So next question, next issue we have with the account Robes, is that his body was found on July sixth. It was found Robes just north of the island, right off the island, so in that area where he was hanging out on July fourth, Robes, why with searches going on a full day on July fifth, Was that body not seen?
00:18:18
Speaker 1: That's a big question, because I know this sounds awful, but we do know that bodies that go in the water pretty quickly float.
00:18:25
Speaker 3: That is the truth.
00:18:26
Speaker 1: And maybe the only reason why you wouldn't find a body is if it got sucked away in a current in some way. Well, it hadn't clearly because he was right there. And look from the experience unfortunately that I have had personally as a crime reporter for many, many years, we would talk about and you could hear the police scanner, we've got a floater, and it was within twenty.
00:18:44
Speaker 3: Four hours the body was floating. That's just the natural gases your body produces.
00:18:49
Speaker 1: So time of death is clearly important here, and that's what an autopsy should be able to show, at least now. When you've been in the water for a long time, it also deteriorates some of that forensic evidence. But I still feel like they would be able to determine, based on stomach content and the gases in him, just how long he had been dead.
00:19:08
Speaker 2: His body decides to start floating a day later. If he was dead on the fourth.
00:19:14
Speaker 3: It was more than a day later.
00:19:17
Speaker 2: Where is the body on July fifth if it's in the water. There were planes in the air.
00:19:22
Speaker 3: As of three pm on July fourth.
00:19:24
Speaker 1: Say he somehow fell hit his head, I don't know, and got carried.
00:19:29
Speaker 3: I mean that's possible. It is possible.
00:19:31
Speaker 1: But yes, to your point, why would it take almost two days for the body to float.
00:19:36
Speaker 2: Two other major issues that make people question this story, and both of them have to do with stuff that's floating around online. We should give you heads up in a warning, be careful about stuff you see out there. It's gone haywire and the majority of things out there are not true, they're not official, so just be careful. But two of the things that are out there at robes. One of them have to do with video. Now, this video came out pretty quickly after he disappeared, but it's kind of pans the crowd and folks thought, including the attorney for the family, Bing Crump even brought this up to where they thought they heard his voice on this particular video. Heard Nolan Wells's voice, Yes.
00:20:17
Speaker 1: And they thought that in the video they heard Nolan Wells saying give me my effing phone, except for he used the expletive, and that now is being potentially refuted someone else coming forward saying that was my voice, not Nolan's voice.
00:20:34
Speaker 3: But it's fuzzy.
00:20:36
Speaker 1: We don't know, We don't know the truth about whose voice that was and whether or not that's what was being said. They enhanced the audio correct, so it is difficult to hear.
00:20:44
Speaker 2: So, but again that is another thing that has been used and pointing to is why this case is suspicious. The other thing being pointed to is going all around and gangbusters as of this recording is a picture allegedly robes of Nolan Wells in a pool at a pool a part, and even the attorney Ben Crump has suggested there's a picture we need to take a peacat because it appears that Nolan Wells was at a pool party that night because the picture was posted July fourth, fifth, So he looks like he's at a party. Reworld, If he's at a party the night of at a pool, that means he left the island, right.
00:21:23
Speaker 1: But then I'm looking at who all's in that pool, and there are at least twenty people in that pool, So I thought, really, all these twenty people are just keeping this secret. I mean, it's possible, I guess, But if they all were partying with him, if he left the island and he was back at someone's home that is obviously not then what his friends said happened. Obviously, then that would be a complete refutal of what his friends said happened that day. However, several news outlet's say that and the reason why it was also suspicious. By the way, yes, it was posted July fifth, but then that account was deleted, so then it looked like somebody freaked out and took it down. And that might have been the case because because people definitely honed in on that. And apparently now it appears that that picture was taken at a pool party the week before, on June twenty six, twenty seventh, I believe, and then just posted on July fifth, So it's still a question mark, but it seems as though they've been able.
00:22:19
Speaker 3: To clear that one up.
00:22:20
Speaker 2: So does it make a difference now, folks, we listed all of these things that make this story sound suspicious, but now we are getting explanations to a few of those things. You have already hit on a couple of the things that have been refuted. One that pool picture that folks have come forward and say, well, actually it was the weekend before. Also come forward in talking about the phone. Excuse me the video to do that first where he said give me my effing phone. Well, a friend has come out and done a couple of interviews and said, actually that's my voice. So someone else has come forward and taken credit for being the voice on the video that's out there said that was me yelling at some body to give me my fucking phone. It wasn't Nolan Wells. In fact, Nolan Wells wasn't even a part of that entire conversation. He wasn't in the group. So Robes if that's true, some of these things may be slowly starting to be explained away. The big one. Do you buy what they're saying about the phone? The friend has come forward and says, yes, the phone wasn't with him, And when they explained why, I thought, oh, maybe that makes sense.
00:23:28
Speaker 3: Uh.
00:23:29
Speaker 1: What I heard was that he said, we always, we oftentimes leave our phone.
00:23:33
Speaker 3: On the boat.
00:23:34
Speaker 1: Yes, we just we're in the water, leave it in the boat because we don't want to have it in our hands. We don't want to accidentally drop it, so we just leave the phone on the boat. I believe that while you're standing in waste deep water, maybe you don't want to have your phone in your hand. You can't stick it in your pocket because it could get wet. So that makes total sense. Fine, But then when you know the boat is leaving and your phone is on the boat, and your friends are on the boat, and you aren't going to have your friends or your phone with you, I think at that point you'd say, wait, before you guys leave, let me grab my phone.
00:24:04
Speaker 2: See, I'm trying to leave some space for this being an extraordinary set of circumstances. Robes. Is that possible.
00:24:11
Speaker 3: It's possible.
00:24:12
Speaker 2: People do things all the time the phone, you forgot about it. Maybe when not here hanging for two hours, I hadn't had my phone. Ah. Then I think that that well, most fans, he would go back and check the phone every so often. I just assume it's just hard to believe that this eighteen year old kid parted with his phone. It didn't think that much about his phone, and nobody. Yeah, you guys, go ahead and take off, I'll see you later. And at no point, oops, I don't have my phone, right.
00:24:38
Speaker 1: I feel like you would think that you would realize, wait, what don't I have?
00:24:41
Speaker 3: All I have was the shorts on my body and nothing.
00:24:44
Speaker 2: Literally had nothing but that in sunglasses.
00:24:47
Speaker 1: He didn't have his keys to his car, he didn't have a shirt, he didn't have his phone.
00:24:50
Speaker 3: I mean, that seems really reckless.
00:24:53
Speaker 1: Is it possible if you've had too much to drink and you just forget what you don't have? It's possible, but it seems unlike highly.
00:25:02
Speaker 2: Highly even some of these things starting to be explained away. Ro I say explained away, but given alternate explanations for why I'm trying to get on board with I'm trying to also get on board with worlds. Is it possible that there was a miscommunication with the girl and the friends, that maybe there's something that are they contradictory or just the stories aren't the timing is off, and maybe the girl is telling the truth and the friends are telling the truth.
00:25:29
Speaker 3: It's possible. Anything is possible.
00:25:31
Speaker 1: It's just at a certain point there's enough suspicion, enough like real questions, as any parent would hear everything that we just laid out and they would absolutely be demanding answers. And one of the biggest problems that the parents and their attorney have with this is how immediately, how quickly authorities rushed to judgment and just said accidental drowning most likely and no foul play.
00:25:58
Speaker 3: Now there were no physical signs harm on the body.
00:26:00
Speaker 1: They did say that that's about the only information they have.
00:26:05
Speaker 3: Told us about the condition of his body.
00:26:08
Speaker 1: But there are so many glaring inconsistencies and suspicious behavior that absolutely require answers.
00:26:20
Speaker 2: And this is going back and forth. The folks can't and again it's blown up into a racial war online with a lot of back and forth, and a lot of people are I mean, they're quick to just say make it about race. Why can't you trust the authorities? And investigation is going to come to a conclusion. Even some of the kids that have come forward said they are getting threats and that they're.
00:26:43
Speaker 3: Scared right now, death threats.
00:26:44
Speaker 1: In fact, the friend who spoke out didn't put his face in front of it, didn't give an on camera interview. He only did it by phone because he said he is afraid for his life. He said that people are threatening him and his friends who were on that boat that day, and they are actually living in fear right now.
00:27:00
Speaker 3: Robes.
00:27:00
Speaker 2: Part of that is maybe some people not remembering or understanding history. Why his family, the family of a young black man who surrounded by almost exclusively white people, died under very suspicious circumstances. Why would they not just take Mississippi's word for it. Robes history tells us exactly why. Robes is not going too far, and it's not even being offensive to say that Mississippi was the lynching capital of the United States. Damn, that's crazy to think, but it was. It quite literally was. There's a group called the Equal Justice Initiative and they have gone through and done a history of extra judicial killing killings in this country. That's a nice way of saying lynchings. It's a nice, nice way of saying mobs. Nice way of say what it extra judicial killing? Meaning you kill somebody without going through the official channels of any legal process. Yes, mob mentality and killings. Obviously, we've seen generally some history Robes they have put together. There have been forty seven hundred lynchings in the country between eighteen seventy seven and nineteen fifty. The leading states, both of our home states, essentially are on there. Georgia, Texas, Alabama, Louisiana, Arkansas. Now I did them in order from two through six. I left out number one. Robes. This is crazy Mississippi, more lynchings according to official counts, robes that are known. A plenty of stuff we will never know about, but the documented ones that they know about Mississippi leads the way. Robes more than the big populous state of Texas. Mississippi. That's history. That's history. Robes that's there. That's still a lot of people in that state will tell, well, they got they got some people still alive who can tell their grandkids about what they went through in that state. Robes. I look at this and I'm thinking my parents were kids and even in high school when a lot of stuff was going on, and they grew up in West Memphis, West Helena, all along the Mississippi Delta es. It's wild to think that we're not that far away from this stuff in this country.
00:29:43
Speaker 1: And I think that's what everyone needs to remember that. Look, Nolan Wells family isn't pointing the finger at his white friend. True, you did it, You're responsible, You're hiding something. They just want answers. But I think the white folks in that community and around the country need to understand and respect the lens through which black people see this case. In the state it's in with the authorities who are investigating, that there would be.
00:30:12
Speaker 3: A level of distrust.
00:30:14
Speaker 1: And that is just a fact, based on history, based on experience, based on your experience. It's very different than what my experience would be in Mississippi.
00:30:24
Speaker 3: It just is.
00:30:25
Speaker 1: And I think we have to acknowledge that reality, that our realities are different, our lenses are different. But history explains why, and we need to remember it. And a lot of people don't even know it.
00:30:37
Speaker 2: And it's oh, no, one, we don't know the sheriff in that county at all might be the nicest guy ever. That none You're right, bab none of the accusations. Nobody just coming out and saying you racial monsters, you killers, this is a lynching it. Nobody's saying that they're only asking for an investigation and to pump the brakes before you just come out and declare that all good. Ben Crump was the one that said it, Why don't we trust? Said, well, you got the Mississippi sheriffs in the authorities investigating the death of a black kid, and when all your potential suspects are white. Yeah, we want an independent autopicy and that makes sense.
00:31:15
Speaker 1: And look, I appreciate the fact, and I think everybody should support this independent autopsy, this independent review of what happened to Nolan Wells. And I appreciate the fact that they had his body blown to DC so that no one associated with Mississippi law enforcement had any say or any oversight in the autopsy. It's not to say that everyone in Mississippi didn't go and do things exactly by the book. Yes, it's not to say that those law enforcement officials in Mississippi aren't above board.
00:31:49
Speaker 3: They very well may be.
00:31:50
Speaker 1: But given this state's history, it is understandable why this family would want an independent review.
00:31:59
Speaker 2: It's yes, it's it's it's understandable. Robes just don't give them a hard time. If they want to just trust but verify, that's okay.
00:32:07
Speaker 3: A good way to say it.
00:32:08
Speaker 2: I want to trust you, but also just want to verify. Don't be offended by that. Mississippi do better, continue to do better, continue to support, continue to be transparent about the investigation. That's a way when things come up like this, we can do better for the next one. And the next one and the next one. You can change your reputation in Mississippi, But right now it ain't happening. Robes Mississippi Burning, Mississippi Burning. Everybody knows that title that movie at this point. But Robes that case. I wanted to point this one out because that case makes the case. What was that nineteen sixty for do the math woman? How many years ago was that.
00:32:47
Speaker 3: Baby sixty sixty two?
00:32:50
Speaker 2: Don't have that right? Sixty two years ago something similar was playing out. People know it because of the movie, probably right, Gene Hackman.
00:32:59
Speaker 3: Gene Hackman, and I'm trying to remember how long ago that.
00:33:02
Speaker 2: Somewhere in the eighties when that movie was made. But the three workers, Andrew Goodman, Michael Scherner, and James Cheney, they were down there. They were recruiting and trying to get signed people up, black people up to vote, to vote. Absolutely, they disappear and are killed mob they are lynched. Kukluk clan is involved, major case Robes. Eighteen people were arrested in that case, seven were acquitted, seven were convicted, eight were acquitted, and then there were three hung juries again Mississippi Burning. This bit case eighteen arrested, seven convicted, eight acquitted, three hung juries. Here's the thing, none of them were brought on state charges. This was all federal. They eighteen arrested were arrested on federal charges. Y Robes, the eight of Mississippi refused to go after the people who lynched these three, and the federal government and Robert F. Kennedy as a Jorney general General, is the one robes that famous case of lynchings Mississippi refused to prosecute sixty two years later. Give me a break. This is why, ro that's that's that's fresh.
00:34:30
Speaker 1: That's that's fresh. Yes, Mississippi burning. And then of course Emmett Hill basically the I mean, wouldn't you say that was the final straw. That was the point at which Martin Luther King got involved, Like people started to rise up Rosa Parks just a short while after what happened to Emmett Hill. She was encouraged by what happened to him to stand up.
00:35:00
Speaker 2: But again, these cases we're talking about rot.
00:35:01
Speaker 3: Down, and I guess would be the better way to put.
00:35:04
Speaker 2: We understood you that you can you can stand up by sitting down. We understand, but you have nineteen fifty five was Emmett Till. Nineteen sixty four was Mississippi Burning. Nineteen sixty four was a simpl rights at that finally went through as well. But all of these things were leading up to that two of the most famous cases of lynchings that changed the course of history. Mississippi is sitting smack dab in the middle of them. Correct, Mississippi, this is their history. Fine, there are good people there, we understand, but there is a history there that folks, we have to remember. Emmett Till was lynched. This was a what fourteen year old boy at.
00:35:44
Speaker 1: The fourteen years old, he whistled at a white woman.
00:35:48
Speaker 3: I think he said, hey baby.
00:35:50
Speaker 1: She had this elaborate story at trial that she later recanted when she was on an adult woman about to die, said yeah, I kind of lied about the whole thing. She very much elaborated and flat out lied and said that he put his hands on her waist and whispered dirty things to her and said he had white women before. This kid is fourteen years old. He was buying bubblegum at the store. And she later again completely admitted that she lied on this stand.
00:36:17
Speaker 2: But at the time the lies worked and were fine. Even after they went to this kid's house. Robes took him from the home where he was staying with family. Family watched it happen, powerless to do anything about it. They take this kid, beat the absolute hell out of him, gouge his eyes out, shoot him.
00:36:39
Speaker 3: In the head, had barbed wire around his neck.
00:36:41
Speaker 2: Throw him in the water. Find him later, Robes and yes, his mama. God loved this woman. She's got a strengthen, a foresight, and she changed the course of history.
00:36:53
Speaker 1: She did open the casket, let everybody see what happened to her son.
00:36:58
Speaker 2: Open the cast Jesus ropes were her or do that?
00:37:02
Speaker 3: I cannot even imagine.
00:37:03
Speaker 1: Just mothers out there, imagine doing that because you knew that people needed to see what happened to your son, because and she probably knew that she wasn't gonna get justice because those killers were found not guilty by an all white, all male jury. Come on, y'all, so in Mississippi, gotta say it out loud again, folks, to just a reminder of what we're dealing with and what.
00:37:31
Speaker 2: We're talking about here is Mississippi. We're I'm not trying to take anything away from good people being there. But don't give a black family a hard time for making sure they get answers about what happened to that black baby in Mississippi. That's all. And back to yes Edgar Ray Allen, we go back to the Mississippi burning case. Rote Edgar Ray killing, Elar Ray killing what I say?
00:37:50
Speaker 3: You said Allan, but actually his name is fairly appropriate.
00:37:52
Speaker 2: Killing, yeah, killing, So we go back rope. Somebody was eventually convicted in the Mississippi.
00:37:57
Speaker 3: Burning two thousand and five, recently.
00:38:00
Speaker 2: Almost in two thousand and five. You know why because an investigator reporter went and put together all of this information essentially handed over to authorities and did the work for him. Rhaps come on, he eventually died in prison. I think you might have been close to eighty years old, but that was the only state charge. It came in two thousand and five. It's Mississippi, y'all.
00:38:23
Speaker 1: And that is an important part of the story and an important part of why Nolan Wells family is demanding answers and why everyone, no matter what your skin color is, should respect the fact that they deserve those answers, and they they get to be suspicious, they get to be distrustful of the Mississippi judicial system. Not to say that things haven't changed, not to say that there's anything untoward going on, but it's fair for them to ask questions.
00:38:55
Speaker 2: And that's okay. And what we want to do and continue to encourage folks to do here Robes is always just respect that somebody's going through an experience in this country that is different from yours. Yes, and that makes them, makes us, makes me sometimes view something coming out of Mississippi differently than you might be. Some people might go, well, why wouldn't you trust the authorities because your experience might have been that, And that's okay, but there are reasons to be distrustful. And Ropes were sitting here talking about lynchings. It seems like we've learned about this in history. This is decades ago. What was the the nineteen sixties. My parents were in I think high school seniors. Wow, Ropes in my lifetime, in my parents' lifetimes, folks were getting lynched. That's we think we're sore.
00:39:41
Speaker 1: It's recent history. We think we're so far for one generation away.
00:39:45
Speaker 2: So we mentioned the guys who were convicted, Robes, the seven convicted, and the Mississippi burning case. The most anybody got was six years in prison because they they were convicted, Robes of violating the guys writes, there was an order of charges because lynching at that time wasn't a federal crime. Wow, I'm sure they corrected that soon after, didn't they, Robes. No, folks, go look it up. Lynching became against the law as a federal crime on the federal books very recently. Rogues Joe Frickin Biden signed the Emmett Till Anti Lynching Acts into law in twenty twenty two. Yes, folks, lynching was not a federal crime until a few years ago.
00:40:39
Speaker 1: I just learned something right now. I did not know that that is appalling, Ropes.
00:40:45
Speaker 3: It's appalling.
00:40:45
Speaker 2: This is something they said literally one hundred years that had come up in some way, form or fashion, never got through. It's where we are, and it's good a reminder and maybe if nothing else, Folks, in a story like this as horrible as is, a kid has died. He you know you right, Robes, it might turn out this was a freak accident, something really weird, and it was a slipped hit.
00:41:06
Speaker 1: His head pulled out to see yes and pop back up later it was.
00:41:10
Speaker 3: I mean, we don't know.
00:41:11
Speaker 1: There are absolutely scenarios in which the kids are telling the truth, and there are just a series of suspicious things that happened that call into question what the actual series of events was. And so yes, there was space for all of it or none of it to be true. But we just need to find out.
00:41:32
Speaker 2: And when it's Mississippi, forgive us. But we really have a few more questions to ask. And if nothing else, I hope you all just ask a few more questions before you attack, or before you say, well that's not right or that's not my experience, or just give some space for history and of nothing else. Maybe Robes you said, going through here, maybe you learned some stuff. Maybe some people go, oh wow, I didn't know that. Oh wow. Maybe I'll go watch Mississippi burning. Oh wow. Maybe I'll pick up a book and read maybe all kinds of stuff. Maybe we should take an opportunity to learn a little more and get a little better and race relations.
00:42:05
Speaker 1: Absolutely, and you know the fact that death threats are being thrown around also is just an awful overreaction. And I wanted to end this with what we heard directly from Nolan Well's mom, and despite all the pain and all the suffering and all the questions she has, she actually asked for everyone to stay peaceful. That that is what Nolan would have wanted. He hated fights, he hated physical fights, she said, he hated verbal altercations. He was absolutely a peacemaker and a lover. And she said, to honor him. If you want to do right by him, do not go out and start showing how strong you are or what you think. She said, let the investigation go forward, and please, at all costs, remain peaceful, remain kind, because that's what Nolan would have wanted.
00:42:52
Speaker 2: Ah, this is one A lot of people are following. We will follow. We will see what. I guess, what coms where we go, what's next, and hopefully our robes. I always hope that we can come out of these things and in some way better off than we were when we went in. But it feels, man, these growing pains are tough. They are some tough growing pains because right now we're back to hating each other and throwing accusations and just tribalism. Right we've gone back into our corners, come out and fight. They would go back into them, but I wanted to keep an eye on folks. We appreciate you as always spending a little time with us on behalf of my dear Amy. I'm TJ.
00:43:30
Speaker 3: Holmes.
00:43:31
Speaker 2: See soon.
Speaker 1: Welcome everyone. I made Robock alongside TJ. Holmes, and today we're talking about what everyone is seemingly talking about, and that is what has happened to Nolan Wells, an eighteen year old college football player out partying with his friends on the fourth of July. His friends returned back to shore and he doesn't His body's found around two days later. And today we still don't know what has happened to Nolan well.
00:00:34
Speaker 2: We should find out soon enough, hopefully with a bunch of autopsies that are out there. But you said, what everybody's talking about. It seems to be what everybody's fighting about. And the fight, yes, once again, has gone in the direction of race. Look, this channel is called out of network, and now that we're out of network, we can say this that do you really expect the black parents of an eighteen year old black kid who died under suspicious circumstances to just take the Mississippi authority's word for it that your son died of an accidental drowning. No, that's that is something that needs to be said out loud. There's a reason that a black parent might not just take Mississippi's word for it that their black kid hanging out with nothing but white kids ends up dead. This could be a total accident, robes, but it's getting missed sometimes in the conversation that's being had that why did you just trust the authorities? Why does it always have to There's a reason for that that we'll get into rose, But that is where we are with this kid. Nolan Well's eighteen, good swimmer, healthy as all get out, surrounded by two hundred people dead.
00:01:44
Speaker 1: Why and no one saw how he died when he died? Why he died? That is concerning, in addition to several other issues that his parents and his parents' attorneys bring up that I think any parent, I don't care what color you are, would have questions about, meaning, why would an eighteen almost nineteen year old not have his phone with him? Why would he say, hey, friends, go leave without me, and by the way, take my phone, take the keys to my car. I'll figure out how to get a ride back. Look, could that have happened? Sure, it doesn't seem likely. And his parents don't believe that's the way he operated.
00:02:23
Speaker 2: Okay, though, okay, everybody listening knows no teenager operates by leaving their phone behind yeah.
00:02:30
Speaker 3: Sure, just take it. I'll figure it out.
00:02:32
Speaker 2: No teenage, we've been talking about that. The kids don't even go to the bathroom without their phone, So yeah, just take my phone and we're good. We'll get into what I guess how some people are explaining that, but that is inexplicable. But Nolan Wells has become Ropes like Carmelo Anthony in some ways that the crime or excuse me, excuse me, let me not say this has not been determined when Nolan Wells a crime, But there is a kid dead and the circumstances around it might not have had anything to do with race. Now the conversation about it after the fact has become about race and robes. That is where it's gotten nasty, and that is where it's gotten once again. People go into their respective corners and fighting and robes. The racial fight is not just happening in the country. It's happening, and of all.
00:03:15
Speaker 3: Places, Mississippi, it's the last place.
00:03:18
Speaker 1: No. And it's tough because look, Nolan Wells, by his friend's account, by his parents' account, was friends with everybody.
00:03:26
Speaker 3: He didn't see color.
00:03:28
Speaker 1: And I know that can be a dangerous thing, and that can be part of our conversation as well. But he was the guy that everybody loved and the guy that loved everybody, according to every single person.
00:03:39
Speaker 3: I know, when people.
00:03:40
Speaker 1: Pass everybody's nice stuff, right, they're the heroes of the world.
00:03:46
Speaker 3: They're the best thing that ever happened.
00:03:48
Speaker 1: But I actually this has actually been really interesting to hear from former educators to high school coaches, to college coaches, to friends, neighbors. They are all speaking about someone who actually was and lived a peaceful, beautiful, positive existence. And no matter what side people are on right now, and I know people have lawyered up and people aren't talking, and people are suspicious of one another, but they do share the same theme that Nolan Wells was an incredible human being.
00:04:24
Speaker 2: And right now we don't know what happened to this eighteen year old kid, where as we record as this at least recording. There are two autopsies pending, one from the medical examiner, the official one, and then an independent one that the family and their lawyers have asked for. Don't have the results of those yet. But while we're here, why we're here roped is that a kid did what a bunch of kids do on holiday weekend, especially on the fourth of July weekend, and Nolan Wells, eighteen year old kid out of Mississippi high school excuse me, college football player, young receiver, goes out with his friends on the fourth of July to a little barrier island off the coasts of Mississippi, hangs out a couple of days. He ends up missing. A couple days later, he's found dead near that same island. And this now's where the question starts. So robes that he was found on July sixth. His body was found two days after he disappeared. But we go back, and we could start with this whole thing in July third and take you through the next several days, and why, Robes, A lot of this just does not add up.
00:05:27
Speaker 1: Yes, there are a lot of questions, and the timeline will help explain why these questions are real and still pending. So on July third, Nolan Wells goes over to his parents' house and makes dinner.
00:05:40
Speaker 3: For her mom. His mom, excuse me, bake salmon.
00:05:43
Speaker 1: And it was just that's exactly what you would expect from the guy that everyone described most eighteen year old boys on going over to his parent their parents' house and making dinner for them before they're heading out with friends.
00:05:55
Speaker 2: Oh the way the story was told, he actually, uh, he knew his mom has had a tough day, he had a rough day or whatever it was, and to side to cook food for them. Awesome. For whatever reason, the story ended terribly with his death. Why does it make it worse when I heard about him cooking salmon?
00:06:11
Speaker 1: It does because because it speaks to his character and what a loss it is that this seemingly beautiful human being is no longer here.
00:06:18
Speaker 3: Because I don't know many eighteen year old guys look and I know they're out there.
00:06:23
Speaker 1: I just think there are may be few and far between who would take the time before going out for a party weekend with their friends to think of his parents and to give back to his parents, and to consider his mom's tough day ahead of what he was excited about going to do. That speaks to who he was, and so it just makes his loss feel all the more gutting.
00:06:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a little detail, and even hearing it with salmon, for some reason, right messes me up. So that was on July third. He makes dinner for his mom. His parents then goes and stays at a friend's house that night as July third, because he had plans rolled on July fourth to hop on a boat with at least three of his friends and going over to Horn Island. If you're not familiars in this southern part of Mississippi, right off the coast where they say eight to ten miles, but it's a little barrier island. But they leave from a private dock in Ocean Springs, Mississippi. Remind me, I keep messing it up. It's near seventeen miles from go Forth third.
00:07:16
Speaker 1: Fort, Mississippi. It's where my grandmother's from. Actually, so yes, the area well.
00:07:20
Speaker 2: So yes, Ocean Springs where they leave from in Mississippi. Now he goes, hangs out, he's partying with his friends, Robes on this island. Then he has seen for the last time at three pm, they say, which sounds pretty early for a July fourth, Yes, okay, So why then he was he last seen there? The story goes that he wanted to stay behind because he met some girl, wanted to hang out and was going to get a ride back with everybody else. Okay, fine, But eleven o'clock comes and his family Robes that's still not heard from him, and his friends say they hadn't heard from him either, and this is when they called His parents called his mom to say he's missing. Family reports missing that evening.
00:08:01
Speaker 1: A search starts the next day absolutely and his family starts immediately searching for him via his phone correct Life three sixty. They actually go to the island. His parents actually went to the island themselves. They are desperate to find their son. This isn't like him to not show up, to just be gone, and then even more remarkably, to not have his phone with him.
00:08:25
Speaker 3: That makes zero sense.
00:08:26
Speaker 1: But by July fifth, the Costcard actually joins in on the search and they are actively looking for this young man just about everywhere. And it isn't until July sixth, as that search continues by boat and by aircraft, the Cajun Navy got involved as well, and unfortunately, the worst case scenario, they find his body at around eight forty five in the morning in the waters off of Horn Island.
00:08:52
Speaker 2: And to give I wasn't familiar, we say Horn Island. We hear about islands. If you're not familiar down there. This is not some developed place, right, This is little stretched sand bar you could essentially describe it as.
00:09:01
Speaker 1: A party sandbar basically for kids to take their boats out. And they've been doing this all through high school. This was a familiar place his parents were used to Nolan going there with his friends and yes, kids are drinking beer, pulling up their boats. One of the friends described it as basically everyone who went to their high school and they were all a tight group. We're all on this island enjoying kind of the last bit of the holiday weekend before everybody had to go back to work or school.
00:09:27
Speaker 2: Okay, and from what I can tell, at least from the videos and the pictures we've seen, if you get an idea in your mind, you say Horn Island, it's they're not necessarily physically on some island. They're all in the water and on their boats, surrounding sandy areas for the most part. So I'm trying to give the idea rope that you can't necessarily be standing on the island in one spot and something could be happening way over on the other side that you don't see. No, everybody's collected in one spot. They're together. It's almost impossible to hide, right.
00:09:55
Speaker 1: The boats are all pulled up or anchored right offshore, and then all the kids are spilled out in waste.
00:10:02
Speaker 3: Deep water, hanging out.
00:10:04
Speaker 1: Some people are on the beach, some people are in the water, some people are on the boats. But basically everyone's in the same general area, within feet or inches of one another.
00:10:13
Speaker 2: Okay, So the word from Mississippi authorities no foul play suspected.
00:10:21
Speaker 3: Immediately they say this, they have.
00:10:22
Speaker 2: No indication that anything was suspicious, And they said initially Robes that the belief was that this was an accidental drowning. So now that gets us caught up on the official word of what happened. Now, Robes, the questions come, and there's a bunch of them that make this story not make any fricking sense. It just does not. And you start number one, phone, what eighteen year old just decides, Ah, I don't need my phone.
00:10:58
Speaker 1: I think it would be a very rare exception that an eighteen year old, and frankly, any child who gets possession of a cell phone starting at age ten, eleven, twelve, they don't let those phones out of their sites. First of all, for the social aspect of it, the photo aspect of it, and yes, the.
00:11:18
Speaker 3: Communication aspect of it.
00:11:20
Speaker 1: I would think you would want your phone with you at all times to document the fun you're having to text people who maybe aren't there, who are coming to communicate. But certainly if you don't plan on going with your friends, or you plan on figuring out how to find your way home.
00:11:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, all the more.
00:11:39
Speaker 1: Reasons why you would absolutely make sure you had your phone with you so that you could text someone, communicate with someone, and make sure you have an ability to get home.
00:11:48
Speaker 2: That was the biggest WTF in the initial story. His phone. That doesn't make any sense, That does not add up. We should mention roller. I don't know if you said it earlier already His mom tracked the phone to a friend's house, right with Life three sixty. Yes, okay, but there's a little detail we could take it aside here. It didn't have this in, but there was a detail here that the mom saw Life three sixty, which is a life saver, by the way, we love this thing. She sees the phone, it's at a friend's house and tries to go retrieve it.
00:12:20
Speaker 1: Yes, I think it was a friend of the family went for them on their behalf, drove to this home where they could clearly see the phone was, and by her account, she said it took fifteen minutes and everyone going there was a bunch of people, she said, at the house, a bunch of friends all gathered there and she said, we know the phone's here.
00:12:38
Speaker 3: We can see the phones.
00:12:39
Speaker 1: Here, and she said it took them fifteen minutes to produce it. Look, maybe they couldn't find it, maybe they didn't know where it was, but clearly that is suspicious.
00:12:50
Speaker 2: So let's keep adding up those suspicious things, all right, phone, he doesn't have need to go find it takes them a mile to get it. Next thing, once she gets the phonebes mama said, this phone does not look like something that my eighteen year old child has been using. She thought that some things were deleted.
00:13:11
Speaker 3: Correct.
00:13:12
Speaker 1: So her son is an avid Snapchat user, so much so that he has two separate accounts.
00:13:17
Speaker 3: She said.
00:13:17
Speaker 1: He posts every day and especially when he's out with friends having fun. He is a Snapchat king, like he is just constantly posting videos and photos, sending messages via Snapchat. That is what he uses. She goes on to both immediately, hoping that that will help her put together a timeline or piece together what his last movements more or what his last photo was, what his last message was.
00:13:42
Speaker 3: It's wiped clean, according to her.
00:13:44
Speaker 1: She says, there isn't one photo, there isn't one video, there isn't one message, and we know by Snapchat's the way it's used. Yes, those things disappear within twenty four hours. This was well within the twenty four hours.
00:13:57
Speaker 2: Oh, so she just thought.
00:13:59
Speaker 1: It was very suspicious that it looked as though her son never once took a picture, a video, or sent any messages using Snapchat, which she said is completely out of characters.
00:14:11
Speaker 2: So that suspicious detail will lead to the question, then why would anybody need to delete something from his phone? What was on it? Keep going here. Next issue ropes have to do with contradictory stories. Friends say he was going over to hang out with the girl, girls saying he's going over to hang out with the friends and head back, which is.
00:14:31
Speaker 3: Yes, this is very confusing.
00:14:33
Speaker 1: So the friends all had the same story that he met this young girl, he was into her, and he wanted to stay back because of her look. That kind of That reads right, guys eighteen meet a girl, she's cute.
00:14:44
Speaker 2: Kind of but you y'all go back. I'll figure out how to get back.
00:14:47
Speaker 1: To the mailand they had engine trouble or some they were taking on water. That's why they said they had to leave early, at three o'clock. And that's why they claim he wasn't ready to leave yet because it was early and he met this girl.
00:14:59
Speaker 3: Yes, okay, the.
00:15:00
Speaker 1: Problem is this girl said he told me he was going back to the mainland with his friends.
00:15:07
Speaker 3: Yes, So which is it that is confusing?
00:15:10
Speaker 2: Bro Okay, that might be the details that yes, suspicious again, keep going here down the list of questions. He accidentally drowned, possibly according to the sheriff rohopes, according to the family, and according to the water that seemed unlikely given they were standing rope. This was a lot of this was knee deep water. How did he drown? And this is a kid who knew how to swim?
00:15:34
Speaker 1: Yes, he is described as an elite athlete. He's a running back. Correct for the college football team. You're sorry, wide receiver, I'm terrible.
00:15:41
Speaker 3: He's a wide receiver.
00:15:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, he's an elite athlete as a college football player. He is an avid swimmer. So this isn't somebody who didn't know how to swim, who was not you know he was. He was absolutely command of his body. Now, look, there was drinking. People were drinking beer, hanging out having fun. We get that, But how is it if he's surrounded by two hundred people, many of whom he went to high school with, who know him, How does he just drown or get swept away by the currents without anyone noticing, without anyone seeing, without anyone saying I saw it happened?
00:16:22
Speaker 3: Like, how is that possible?
00:16:24
Speaker 2: So he was in trouble, somebody would have seen somebody struggling in the water. It's just impossible.
00:16:29
Speaker 3: I don't care.
00:16:29
Speaker 1: If some people were drinking and some people were someone would have seen something. With the crowd that was there, with the videos that are online, with the photos that are out there, it absolutely truly seems impossible for someone to just slip away, never to be seen again in the middle of the day because who no one is coming forward to say they saw him past three pm?
00:16:52
Speaker 2: Correct, Oh no, that was it. And I don't even know how they have that the last time he was seeing or somebody remember seeing or has a documented something of that. Three o'clock that's very early in the day. They didn't all bounce.
00:17:03
Speaker 3: At three where they didn't go exactly where.
00:17:05
Speaker 2: Did he go that nobody saw him after three? And if he's he's drowned in this this knee deep waste deep water around here, nobody saw this guy.
00:17:14
Speaker 1: That's again, he wasn't screamingsoud, felling for help, nothing, He just disappeared.
00:17:21
Speaker 2: And two, I think you when that brought this detail to me that indicate they know he wasn't drunk. He wasn't.
00:17:28
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, the.
00:17:29
Speaker 1: Cajun Navy, the spokesperson for the Cajun Navy said that he was there. I believe or was privy to information surrounding that there was. The medical examiner of the corner they immediately look, they're awaiting final and official toxicology reports.
00:17:44
Speaker 3: But he said his.
00:17:45
Speaker 1: Alcohol level was not enough for him to be considered incapacitated or so intoxicated that he wouldn't be able to maintain his factors.
00:17:54
Speaker 2: All right, So next question, next issue we have with the account Robes, is that his body was found on July sixth. It was found Robes just north of the island, right off the island, so in that area where he was hanging out on July fourth, Robes, why with searches going on a full day on July fifth, Was that body not seen?
00:18:18
Speaker 1: That's a big question, because I know this sounds awful, but we do know that bodies that go in the water pretty quickly float.
00:18:25
Speaker 3: That is the truth.
00:18:26
Speaker 1: And maybe the only reason why you wouldn't find a body is if it got sucked away in a current in some way. Well, it hadn't clearly because he was right there. And look from the experience unfortunately that I have had personally as a crime reporter for many, many years, we would talk about and you could hear the police scanner, we've got a floater, and it was within twenty.
00:18:44
Speaker 3: Four hours the body was floating. That's just the natural gases your body produces.
00:18:49
Speaker 1: So time of death is clearly important here, and that's what an autopsy should be able to show, at least now. When you've been in the water for a long time, it also deteriorates some of that forensic evidence. But I still feel like they would be able to determine, based on stomach content and the gases in him, just how long he had been dead.
00:19:08
Speaker 2: His body decides to start floating a day later. If he was dead on the fourth.
00:19:14
Speaker 3: It was more than a day later.
00:19:17
Speaker 2: Where is the body on July fifth if it's in the water. There were planes in the air.
00:19:22
Speaker 3: As of three pm on July fourth.
00:19:24
Speaker 1: Say he somehow fell hit his head, I don't know, and got carried.
00:19:29
Speaker 3: I mean that's possible. It is possible.
00:19:31
Speaker 1: But yes, to your point, why would it take almost two days for the body to float.
00:19:36
Speaker 2: Two other major issues that make people question this story, and both of them have to do with stuff that's floating around online. We should give you heads up in a warning, be careful about stuff you see out there. It's gone haywire and the majority of things out there are not true, they're not official, so just be careful. But two of the things that are out there at robes. One of them have to do with video. Now, this video came out pretty quickly after he disappeared, but it's kind of pans the crowd and folks thought, including the attorney for the family, Bing Crump even brought this up to where they thought they heard his voice on this particular video. Heard Nolan Wells's voice, Yes.
00:20:17
Speaker 1: And they thought that in the video they heard Nolan Wells saying give me my effing phone, except for he used the expletive, and that now is being potentially refuted someone else coming forward saying that was my voice, not Nolan's voice.
00:20:34
Speaker 3: But it's fuzzy.
00:20:36
Speaker 1: We don't know, We don't know the truth about whose voice that was and whether or not that's what was being said. They enhanced the audio correct, so it is difficult to hear.
00:20:44
Speaker 2: So, but again that is another thing that has been used and pointing to is why this case is suspicious. The other thing being pointed to is going all around and gangbusters as of this recording is a picture allegedly robes of Nolan Wells in a pool at a pool a part, and even the attorney Ben Crump has suggested there's a picture we need to take a peacat because it appears that Nolan Wells was at a pool party that night because the picture was posted July fourth, fifth, So he looks like he's at a party. Reworld, If he's at a party the night of at a pool, that means he left the island, right.
00:21:23
Speaker 1: But then I'm looking at who all's in that pool, and there are at least twenty people in that pool, So I thought, really, all these twenty people are just keeping this secret. I mean, it's possible, I guess, But if they all were partying with him, if he left the island and he was back at someone's home that is obviously not then what his friends said happened. Obviously, then that would be a complete refutal of what his friends said happened that day. However, several news outlet's say that and the reason why it was also suspicious. By the way, yes, it was posted July fifth, but then that account was deleted, so then it looked like somebody freaked out and took it down. And that might have been the case because because people definitely honed in on that. And apparently now it appears that that picture was taken at a pool party the week before, on June twenty six, twenty seventh, I believe, and then just posted on July fifth, So it's still a question mark, but it seems as though they've been able.
00:22:19
Speaker 3: To clear that one up.
00:22:20
Speaker 2: So does it make a difference now, folks, we listed all of these things that make this story sound suspicious, but now we are getting explanations to a few of those things. You have already hit on a couple of the things that have been refuted. One that pool picture that folks have come forward and say, well, actually it was the weekend before. Also come forward in talking about the phone. Excuse me the video to do that first where he said give me my effing phone. Well, a friend has come out and done a couple of interviews and said, actually that's my voice. So someone else has come forward and taken credit for being the voice on the video that's out there said that was me yelling at some body to give me my fucking phone. It wasn't Nolan Wells. In fact, Nolan Wells wasn't even a part of that entire conversation. He wasn't in the group. So Robes if that's true, some of these things may be slowly starting to be explained away. The big one. Do you buy what they're saying about the phone? The friend has come forward and says, yes, the phone wasn't with him, And when they explained why, I thought, oh, maybe that makes sense.
00:23:28
Speaker 3: Uh.
00:23:29
Speaker 1: What I heard was that he said, we always, we oftentimes leave our phone.
00:23:33
Speaker 3: On the boat.
00:23:34
Speaker 1: Yes, we just we're in the water, leave it in the boat because we don't want to have it in our hands. We don't want to accidentally drop it, so we just leave the phone on the boat. I believe that while you're standing in waste deep water, maybe you don't want to have your phone in your hand. You can't stick it in your pocket because it could get wet. So that makes total sense. Fine, But then when you know the boat is leaving and your phone is on the boat, and your friends are on the boat, and you aren't going to have your friends or your phone with you, I think at that point you'd say, wait, before you guys leave, let me grab my phone.
00:24:04
Speaker 2: See, I'm trying to leave some space for this being an extraordinary set of circumstances. Robes. Is that possible.
00:24:11
Speaker 3: It's possible.
00:24:12
Speaker 2: People do things all the time the phone, you forgot about it. Maybe when not here hanging for two hours, I hadn't had my phone. Ah. Then I think that that well, most fans, he would go back and check the phone every so often. I just assume it's just hard to believe that this eighteen year old kid parted with his phone. It didn't think that much about his phone, and nobody. Yeah, you guys, go ahead and take off, I'll see you later. And at no point, oops, I don't have my phone, right.
00:24:38
Speaker 1: I feel like you would think that you would realize, wait, what don't I have?
00:24:41
Speaker 3: All I have was the shorts on my body and nothing.
00:24:44
Speaker 2: Literally had nothing but that in sunglasses.
00:24:47
Speaker 1: He didn't have his keys to his car, he didn't have a shirt, he didn't have his phone.
00:24:50
Speaker 3: I mean, that seems really reckless.
00:24:53
Speaker 1: Is it possible if you've had too much to drink and you just forget what you don't have? It's possible, but it seems unlike highly.
00:25:02
Speaker 2: Highly even some of these things starting to be explained away. Ro I say explained away, but given alternate explanations for why I'm trying to get on board with I'm trying to also get on board with worlds. Is it possible that there was a miscommunication with the girl and the friends, that maybe there's something that are they contradictory or just the stories aren't the timing is off, and maybe the girl is telling the truth and the friends are telling the truth.
00:25:29
Speaker 3: It's possible. Anything is possible.
00:25:31
Speaker 1: It's just at a certain point there's enough suspicion, enough like real questions, as any parent would hear everything that we just laid out and they would absolutely be demanding answers. And one of the biggest problems that the parents and their attorney have with this is how immediately, how quickly authorities rushed to judgment and just said accidental drowning most likely and no foul play.
00:25:58
Speaker 3: Now there were no physical signs harm on the body.
00:26:00
Speaker 1: They did say that that's about the only information they have.
00:26:05
Speaker 3: Told us about the condition of his body.
00:26:08
Speaker 1: But there are so many glaring inconsistencies and suspicious behavior that absolutely require answers.
00:26:20
Speaker 2: And this is going back and forth. The folks can't and again it's blown up into a racial war online with a lot of back and forth, and a lot of people are I mean, they're quick to just say make it about race. Why can't you trust the authorities? And investigation is going to come to a conclusion. Even some of the kids that have come forward said they are getting threats and that they're.
00:26:43
Speaker 3: Scared right now, death threats.
00:26:44
Speaker 1: In fact, the friend who spoke out didn't put his face in front of it, didn't give an on camera interview. He only did it by phone because he said he is afraid for his life. He said that people are threatening him and his friends who were on that boat that day, and they are actually living in fear right now.
00:27:00
Speaker 3: Robes.
00:27:00
Speaker 2: Part of that is maybe some people not remembering or understanding history. Why his family, the family of a young black man who surrounded by almost exclusively white people, died under very suspicious circumstances. Why would they not just take Mississippi's word for it. Robes history tells us exactly why. Robes is not going too far, and it's not even being offensive to say that Mississippi was the lynching capital of the United States. Damn, that's crazy to think, but it was. It quite literally was. There's a group called the Equal Justice Initiative and they have gone through and done a history of extra judicial killing killings in this country. That's a nice way of saying lynchings. It's a nice, nice way of saying mobs. Nice way of say what it extra judicial killing? Meaning you kill somebody without going through the official channels of any legal process. Yes, mob mentality and killings. Obviously, we've seen generally some history Robes they have put together. There have been forty seven hundred lynchings in the country between eighteen seventy seven and nineteen fifty. The leading states, both of our home states, essentially are on there. Georgia, Texas, Alabama, Louisiana, Arkansas. Now I did them in order from two through six. I left out number one. Robes. This is crazy Mississippi, more lynchings according to official counts, robes that are known. A plenty of stuff we will never know about, but the documented ones that they know about Mississippi leads the way. Robes more than the big populous state of Texas. Mississippi. That's history. That's history. Robes that's there. That's still a lot of people in that state will tell, well, they got they got some people still alive who can tell their grandkids about what they went through in that state. Robes. I look at this and I'm thinking my parents were kids and even in high school when a lot of stuff was going on, and they grew up in West Memphis, West Helena, all along the Mississippi Delta es. It's wild to think that we're not that far away from this stuff in this country.
00:29:43
Speaker 1: And I think that's what everyone needs to remember that. Look, Nolan Wells family isn't pointing the finger at his white friend. True, you did it, You're responsible, You're hiding something. They just want answers. But I think the white folks in that community and around the country need to understand and respect the lens through which black people see this case. In the state it's in with the authorities who are investigating, that there would be.
00:30:12
Speaker 3: A level of distrust.
00:30:14
Speaker 1: And that is just a fact, based on history, based on experience, based on your experience. It's very different than what my experience would be in Mississippi.
00:30:24
Speaker 3: It just is.
00:30:25
Speaker 1: And I think we have to acknowledge that reality, that our realities are different, our lenses are different. But history explains why, and we need to remember it. And a lot of people don't even know it.
00:30:37
Speaker 2: And it's oh, no, one, we don't know the sheriff in that county at all might be the nicest guy ever. That none You're right, bab none of the accusations. Nobody just coming out and saying you racial monsters, you killers, this is a lynching it. Nobody's saying that they're only asking for an investigation and to pump the brakes before you just come out and declare that all good. Ben Crump was the one that said it, Why don't we trust? Said, well, you got the Mississippi sheriffs in the authorities investigating the death of a black kid, and when all your potential suspects are white. Yeah, we want an independent autopicy and that makes sense.
00:31:15
Speaker 1: And look, I appreciate the fact, and I think everybody should support this independent autopsy, this independent review of what happened to Nolan Wells. And I appreciate the fact that they had his body blown to DC so that no one associated with Mississippi law enforcement had any say or any oversight in the autopsy. It's not to say that everyone in Mississippi didn't go and do things exactly by the book. Yes, it's not to say that those law enforcement officials in Mississippi aren't above board.
00:31:49
Speaker 3: They very well may be.
00:31:50
Speaker 1: But given this state's history, it is understandable why this family would want an independent review.
00:31:59
Speaker 2: It's yes, it's it's it's understandable. Robes just don't give them a hard time. If they want to just trust but verify, that's okay.
00:32:07
Speaker 3: A good way to say it.
00:32:08
Speaker 2: I want to trust you, but also just want to verify. Don't be offended by that. Mississippi do better, continue to do better, continue to support, continue to be transparent about the investigation. That's a way when things come up like this, we can do better for the next one. And the next one and the next one. You can change your reputation in Mississippi, But right now it ain't happening. Robes Mississippi Burning, Mississippi Burning. Everybody knows that title that movie at this point. But Robes that case. I wanted to point this one out because that case makes the case. What was that nineteen sixty for do the math woman? How many years ago was that.
00:32:47
Speaker 3: Baby sixty sixty two?
00:32:50
Speaker 2: Don't have that right? Sixty two years ago something similar was playing out. People know it because of the movie, probably right, Gene Hackman.
00:32:59
Speaker 3: Gene Hackman, and I'm trying to remember how long ago that.
00:33:02
Speaker 2: Somewhere in the eighties when that movie was made. But the three workers, Andrew Goodman, Michael Scherner, and James Cheney, they were down there. They were recruiting and trying to get signed people up, black people up to vote, to vote. Absolutely, they disappear and are killed mob they are lynched. Kukluk clan is involved, major case Robes. Eighteen people were arrested in that case, seven were acquitted, seven were convicted, eight were acquitted, and then there were three hung juries again Mississippi Burning. This bit case eighteen arrested, seven convicted, eight acquitted, three hung juries. Here's the thing, none of them were brought on state charges. This was all federal. They eighteen arrested were arrested on federal charges. Y Robes, the eight of Mississippi refused to go after the people who lynched these three, and the federal government and Robert F. Kennedy as a Jorney general General, is the one robes that famous case of lynchings Mississippi refused to prosecute sixty two years later. Give me a break. This is why, ro that's that's that's fresh.
00:34:30
Speaker 1: That's that's fresh. Yes, Mississippi burning. And then of course Emmett Hill basically the I mean, wouldn't you say that was the final straw. That was the point at which Martin Luther King got involved, Like people started to rise up Rosa Parks just a short while after what happened to Emmett Hill. She was encouraged by what happened to him to stand up.
00:35:00
Speaker 2: But again, these cases we're talking about rot.
00:35:01
Speaker 3: Down, and I guess would be the better way to put.
00:35:04
Speaker 2: We understood you that you can you can stand up by sitting down. We understand, but you have nineteen fifty five was Emmett Till. Nineteen sixty four was Mississippi Burning. Nineteen sixty four was a simpl rights at that finally went through as well. But all of these things were leading up to that two of the most famous cases of lynchings that changed the course of history. Mississippi is sitting smack dab in the middle of them. Correct, Mississippi, this is their history. Fine, there are good people there, we understand, but there is a history there that folks, we have to remember. Emmett Till was lynched. This was a what fourteen year old boy at.
00:35:44
Speaker 1: The fourteen years old, he whistled at a white woman.
00:35:48
Speaker 3: I think he said, hey baby.
00:35:50
Speaker 1: She had this elaborate story at trial that she later recanted when she was on an adult woman about to die, said yeah, I kind of lied about the whole thing. She very much elaborated and flat out lied and said that he put his hands on her waist and whispered dirty things to her and said he had white women before. This kid is fourteen years old. He was buying bubblegum at the store. And she later again completely admitted that she lied on this stand.
00:36:17
Speaker 2: But at the time the lies worked and were fine. Even after they went to this kid's house. Robes took him from the home where he was staying with family. Family watched it happen, powerless to do anything about it. They take this kid, beat the absolute hell out of him, gouge his eyes out, shoot him.
00:36:39
Speaker 3: In the head, had barbed wire around his neck.
00:36:41
Speaker 2: Throw him in the water. Find him later, Robes and yes, his mama. God loved this woman. She's got a strengthen, a foresight, and she changed the course of history.
00:36:53
Speaker 1: She did open the casket, let everybody see what happened to her son.
00:36:58
Speaker 2: Open the cast Jesus ropes were her or do that?
00:37:02
Speaker 3: I cannot even imagine.
00:37:03
Speaker 1: Just mothers out there, imagine doing that because you knew that people needed to see what happened to your son, because and she probably knew that she wasn't gonna get justice because those killers were found not guilty by an all white, all male jury. Come on, y'all, so in Mississippi, gotta say it out loud again, folks, to just a reminder of what we're dealing with and what.
00:37:31
Speaker 2: We're talking about here is Mississippi. We're I'm not trying to take anything away from good people being there. But don't give a black family a hard time for making sure they get answers about what happened to that black baby in Mississippi. That's all. And back to yes Edgar Ray Allen, we go back to the Mississippi burning case. Rote Edgar Ray killing, Elar Ray killing what I say?
00:37:50
Speaker 3: You said Allan, but actually his name is fairly appropriate.
00:37:52
Speaker 2: Killing, yeah, killing, So we go back rope. Somebody was eventually convicted in the Mississippi.
00:37:57
Speaker 3: Burning two thousand and five, recently.
00:38:00
Speaker 2: Almost in two thousand and five. You know why because an investigator reporter went and put together all of this information essentially handed over to authorities and did the work for him. Rhaps come on, he eventually died in prison. I think you might have been close to eighty years old, but that was the only state charge. It came in two thousand and five. It's Mississippi, y'all.
00:38:23
Speaker 1: And that is an important part of the story and an important part of why Nolan Wells family is demanding answers and why everyone, no matter what your skin color is, should respect the fact that they deserve those answers, and they they get to be suspicious, they get to be distrustful of the Mississippi judicial system. Not to say that things haven't changed, not to say that there's anything untoward going on, but it's fair for them to ask questions.
00:38:55
Speaker 2: And that's okay. And what we want to do and continue to encourage folks to do here Robes is always just respect that somebody's going through an experience in this country that is different from yours. Yes, and that makes them, makes us, makes me sometimes view something coming out of Mississippi differently than you might be. Some people might go, well, why wouldn't you trust the authorities because your experience might have been that, And that's okay, but there are reasons to be distrustful. And Ropes were sitting here talking about lynchings. It seems like we've learned about this in history. This is decades ago. What was the the nineteen sixties. My parents were in I think high school seniors. Wow, Ropes in my lifetime, in my parents' lifetimes, folks were getting lynched. That's we think we're sore.
00:39:41
Speaker 1: It's recent history. We think we're so far for one generation away.
00:39:45
Speaker 2: So we mentioned the guys who were convicted, Robes, the seven convicted, and the Mississippi burning case. The most anybody got was six years in prison because they they were convicted, Robes of violating the guys writes, there was an order of charges because lynching at that time wasn't a federal crime. Wow, I'm sure they corrected that soon after, didn't they, Robes. No, folks, go look it up. Lynching became against the law as a federal crime on the federal books very recently. Rogues Joe Frickin Biden signed the Emmett Till Anti Lynching Acts into law in twenty twenty two. Yes, folks, lynching was not a federal crime until a few years ago.
00:40:39
Speaker 1: I just learned something right now. I did not know that that is appalling, Ropes.
00:40:45
Speaker 3: It's appalling.
00:40:45
Speaker 2: This is something they said literally one hundred years that had come up in some way, form or fashion, never got through. It's where we are, and it's good a reminder and maybe if nothing else, Folks, in a story like this as horrible as is, a kid has died. He you know you right, Robes, it might turn out this was a freak accident, something really weird, and it was a slipped hit.
00:41:06
Speaker 1: His head pulled out to see yes and pop back up later it was.
00:41:10
Speaker 3: I mean, we don't know.
00:41:11
Speaker 1: There are absolutely scenarios in which the kids are telling the truth, and there are just a series of suspicious things that happened that call into question what the actual series of events was. And so yes, there was space for all of it or none of it to be true. But we just need to find out.
00:41:32
Speaker 2: And when it's Mississippi, forgive us. But we really have a few more questions to ask. And if nothing else, I hope you all just ask a few more questions before you attack, or before you say, well that's not right or that's not my experience, or just give some space for history and of nothing else. Maybe Robes you said, going through here, maybe you learned some stuff. Maybe some people go, oh wow, I didn't know that. Oh wow. Maybe I'll go watch Mississippi burning. Oh wow. Maybe I'll pick up a book and read maybe all kinds of stuff. Maybe we should take an opportunity to learn a little more and get a little better and race relations.
00:42:05
Speaker 1: Absolutely, and you know the fact that death threats are being thrown around also is just an awful overreaction. And I wanted to end this with what we heard directly from Nolan Well's mom, and despite all the pain and all the suffering and all the questions she has, she actually asked for everyone to stay peaceful. That that is what Nolan would have wanted. He hated fights, he hated physical fights, she said, he hated verbal altercations. He was absolutely a peacemaker and a lover. And she said, to honor him. If you want to do right by him, do not go out and start showing how strong you are or what you think. She said, let the investigation go forward, and please, at all costs, remain peaceful, remain kind, because that's what Nolan would have wanted.
00:42:52
Speaker 2: Ah, this is one A lot of people are following. We will follow. We will see what. I guess, what coms where we go, what's next, and hopefully our robes. I always hope that we can come out of these things and in some way better off than we were when we went in. But it feels, man, these growing pains are tough. They are some tough growing pains because right now we're back to hating each other and throwing accusations and just tribalism. Right we've gone back into our corners, come out and fight. They would go back into them, but I wanted to keep an eye on folks. We appreciate you as always spending a little time with us on behalf of my dear Amy. I'm TJ.
00:43:30
Speaker 3: Holmes.
00:43:31
Speaker 2: See soon.