Maybe we could be each other’s soulmates… (S4 E1 "The Agony and the Ex-tacy")

00:00:01
Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Kristin Davis, and I want to know, are you a Charlotte?

00:00:11
Speaker 2: Okay, you guys, guess who I.

00:00:15
Speaker 1: To rewatch with me our producer technician extraordinaire Easton.

00:00:22
Speaker 3: Hi, Kristin, it's so great to be back.

00:00:23
Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us.

00:00:24
Speaker 3: I'm such a big fan.

00:00:26
Speaker 1: I know you're the sweetest, sweetest fan. He knows so much, you guys, he knows more than I know. I feel like, you know, like when I don't remember things, he remembers things, which is so helpful.

00:00:36
Speaker 2: And this is fun because.

00:00:37
Speaker 1: This is our first episode of the fourth season, which, as you've heard me say, I think of as an extended version of the third season. Like if you ask me about the fourth season, I just draw a total blank. But of course when I watched the episodes like these are some of the best episodes, I thought they were all in episode season three, but no, we are now in season four and we come out with.

00:00:57
Speaker 3: A bang bang, And.

00:00:59
Speaker 1: These are where both the four oh one and four oh two are both written and directed by Michael Patrick King, which is how he likes to roll and how he then ended up doing our films. And just like that we are this is the first time I believe that we're seeing him writing and directing both. So writing directing two episodes is like it's like.

00:01:18
Speaker 2: Doing a film.

00:01:19
Speaker 1: Basically, you know your prep, your post, all of the casting.

00:01:23
Speaker 2: You know you're in it.

00:01:24
Speaker 1: But that's how he loves to be, right, and he wrote such beautiful episodes and they're so different, and apparently we aired them together, which is also really smart of HBO because they are kind of different, like the Agony in the Ecstasy. The first one is a little bit more introspective, Harry's turning thirty five, she's thinking about soulmates. And then the next one is the real Me with the fashion show and the fashion roadkill, which is funnier and bigger, Like it's like a big set piece to have that fashion show in the middle of it. Right, Yes, And this one, I mean I didn't remember half of what happened.

00:01:59
Speaker 2: I was really into watching it and it was really really good.

00:02:02
Speaker 1: I did not remember that poor Carrie goes to her birthday dinner and we don't got.

00:02:08
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that part is so Harvey you carry, I know, and.

00:02:11
Speaker 1: She really takes it well. But what I remember, I'll just say this first, this is my biggot. Well, I have two memories of filming of these episodes.

00:02:23
Speaker 2: I remember.

00:02:26
Speaker 1: That I Charlotte go to Carrie's apartment when we haven't gone to her dinner. I didn't remember that we didn't make it because of there's like a New York City traffic situation.

00:02:35
Speaker 3: There's a lot of construction work on Fifth Avenue right.

00:02:37
Speaker 1: The repaving, yes, which is which is crazy and very real, like if something major like that happens, you can't get to a different neighborhood, like it's wacky unless you take the subway, which if apparently none of us were going to do, but also where Ale Cantonoreas would have been a bit of a challenge anyway to take the subway. But anyway, they don't make it, but they make it late, and then they want to go to the coffee shop. And then she's not answering her phone because she's in a dark emotional hole. She describes it, and I remember that I had to go to her apartment when she's in the shower and she had all her makeup running down her face, and you know, she was soaking wet, and it's always a big deal to get anybody wet at work, right, because you can't really recreate it, you know, right right pretty much. And I remember the stress of that and also the stress of what she was going to actually wear, right because I had to, like, you know, we had to like open the shower curtain. They do that kind of cool shot of me through the shower curtain and her through the shower curtain, and I had to open it. And we have kind of an important conversation where I'm like, we're all we want you to come, you know.

00:03:35
Speaker 2: We feel so bad it's your birthday.

00:03:37
Speaker 1: I remember that, and I remember Sarah just soaking wet and like freezing, like shivering, freezing, and I was so worried about her. I remember that, and I also remember that there was a lot of stress about the outfit that Charlotte would wear. They all go to this party and they feel like they're the only single people there, which I'm sure they were because I've had this experience, you know, many times. And then I end up going to Trey's apartment which becomes my apartment but isn't yet my apartment, and I have to wear that just for a really long time. And he also has to try to kind of have sex with me or convince me to have sex with him, and then this thing happens on the dress, and I was really stressed about what would show or whatever, how we would pull that off and not have it be revealing or uncomfortable or whatever. And then also it was freezing because we would go back to work in February. So if you notice, like Samantha has some major coats ones and we are all the rest of us are wearing a lot of leather. This is historically when pat would be getting the furs out. But I think that they didn't think that party we were going to was like fancy enough to be a fur moment, right, So we're all just wearing a lot of leather. And I still have that coat I had him wearing, like a It's a Richard Tyler leather trench, which is really.

00:04:56
Speaker 3: Pretty in terms of like when when you're filming it, are they setting it to be basically the time of year of when you're shooting it. Yeah, because it aired in June.

00:05:05
Speaker 2: Oh yes, no, we're supposed to be in June. There's always a lot of stress.

00:05:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, wow, because we're trying not to look like it's February, but New York February is completely different than New York June, and we were just always freezing, you know. It was very, very cold, but we had to wear like June type clothes, right, and luckily we would get some kind of coats, you know, because also New York fluctuates so much. But that's why we're wearing the leather, because it's kind of shiny and it has a life to it, you know. And I guess that was what was in at the time because we're still in the year now, we're in two thousand and one, got it. Oh wow, two thousand and one, Oh my god. So the other thing I remember about this in general, that wouldn't have been happening yet in February.

00:05:46
Speaker 2: The summer of two.

00:05:47
Speaker 1: Thousand and one was like the most glorious summer, and in so many ways it was like the height before the fall, you know, like every the weather was incredible, the colors were incredible, Like people were so happy and out on the street, and there were just parties everywhere. It felt like also I think because this success of the show, right, it was like busy and vibrant and you know, happening in so many ways. And then of course September eleventh. You know that all came to an end. So that's what it's like, the glory the glory times.

00:06:20
Speaker 2: Wow.

00:06:20
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was this thing about like what it must have been like in the city during that summer.

00:06:24
Speaker 1: It was beautiful, so beautiful. The city in this summer is so so beautiful. And back then, you know, it was like innocent ish in a way. I don't know how to put it, Like it's never really innocent, I guess because it's the city and there's.

00:06:38
Speaker 2: Like a lot of whatever.

00:06:40
Speaker 1: But you know, I'm sober, So it's you know, like the parties and things were more about interesting people and kind of like the fashion world, the art world, Like different mixes of people would be at New York parties, Whereas if you go to a party in LA it's probably the entertainment industry, right, But in New York you've got and then there's the tech bros. Probably not then there would be the money people, the stock guys, Wall Street people and see the Wall Street people. Definitely, but it is it is interesting there, and it was certainly interesting in those days because I feel like it was just the height of all the things, you know, like we were all going out to the beach on the weekend. You know, I rented a place. It was in the woods, just to be calm. It was beautiful, so beautiful. I know, golden days, golden days. It's crazy to think about it. Okay, let's talk about this episode, The Agony in the Ecstasy. Did you tell me that you just rewatched this, like separately, rewatched it for us.

00:07:34
Speaker 3: I had rewatched it probably a year ago.

00:07:38
Speaker 2: Oh wow.

00:07:40
Speaker 3: And and I I mean, and we'll get to it. But it's just one of those episodes that so there's so many great moments in this episode. I cried twice. I cried twice watching this last when I cried twice a year ago when when you said when Charlotte says of each other's soulmates, and you know what, I don't want to jump ahead too much, but the big moment.

00:08:08
Speaker 2: I have to say, I really liked him. He was very likable. I was happy. I felt happy for her in a good way.

00:08:15
Speaker 1: It's a good payoff. It's a good payoff that you really don't think you're gonna get. You're prepared to not get it, just like Carrie is prepared to not get it. So we'll obviously go on order. Yes, but yeah, it's a good one. I'm so glad, so nice.

00:08:30
Speaker 2: I mean, I think that.

00:08:31
Speaker 1: What I love rewatching it about that coffee shop scene, which is the birthday?

00:08:35
Speaker 2: Is it the birthday scene? Wait? No, maybe it's not. It's early, No it is, is it? Well? Okay?

00:08:41
Speaker 1: What I love is that we are all individually upset because she's upset, which I'd forgotten about.

00:08:49
Speaker 2: You know.

00:08:49
Speaker 1: Could you see that when I say, like, this is a crazy idea, you guys, but maybe we could be You see that taken out of context, right, and you don't remember the bigger picture of why why I go to that place? I mean, first of all, the whole episode is an examination of soulmates and whether that's real or very annoying something like Michael Patrick is a very funny line, we'll find it, but like super annoying, like torture mechanism or whatever something like that, which I think is a really really good question that I do think about a lot still, right, But I love that she's upset because of what she's gone through on her birthday, and it's like such kind of a big admission for her to say to us that it feels bad not to have a man who cares about you, Like she feels embarrassed by that feeling, but it's obviously so incredibly relatable and sweet. And then we're all upset, and obviously we've missed her birthday dinner, and you know, all of that feeds into it, but we're upset that she's upset, and that's why I say that, which I had totally forgotten about, and it does work just so beautifully, and also for where Charlotte's at, because she thought Trey was her soulmate and he's really kind of obviously not at this point, even though she hasn't totally given up. But then she's also just said that maybe she should keep looking, and I'm like, yes, yes, you should keep looking.

00:10:03
Speaker 2: Thank God, thank god. You know this like it's one of those surprising things.

00:10:06
Speaker 1: I don't remember all this right up the storyline, right that Charlotte really had to decide. Am I still going to be hopeful? You know, even after this disappointment though it's not totally over, but you can kind of tell that it's just not like it's just not working, you know, whatever she tries doesn't work right.

00:10:26
Speaker 2: It's sad it's sad.

00:10:28
Speaker 1: Trey is a little bit sad and disappointing, but it's good that Charlotte can go through that and still say maybe he's still out there, right, Like that's pretty quick too, in a really interesting way. But I think that's also and I mean, this is obvious, but I'm gonna say it anyway because for me, I'm reliving this, right. I think it's because they don't have a great sex life. It's almost like she wasn't married. Yeah, because they're not really deeply connected, which I think is also why she can like go to his apartment and say, I have this listen, We've got to talk, and he tries to have sex with him. She's like, no, no, no, but things are worked out. Like I'm so surprised by her, you know what I'm saying. Like on the one hand, she's kind of innocent and slightly immature, and he won't talk about it, right, But on the other hand, she's trying and she's going to stick to her guns.

00:11:17
Speaker 2: But then she maybe it isn't.

00:11:19
Speaker 1: But then he you know, finishes whatever before they can start, which is again just so.

00:11:24
Speaker 2: Frustrating, and she's like, yeah, I've got to go.

00:11:26
Speaker 1: You know what I mean, like, yes, it's kind of strong, I think, yeah, you know, absolutely, it's interesting.

00:11:32
Speaker 2: I just jumped all over.

00:11:33
Speaker 1: But anyway, let's go to carry so, oh my god, I'd totally forgotten about this whole like singles made.

00:11:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's such a.

00:11:41
Speaker 1: Precursor of the apps. Yes, right, what is it? And I do think it's definitely like that. We last season we had done the speed dating, which was a very real thing in New York. I mean I remember all of our writers talking about it and I was like, I'm definitely not going to go, but I want to hear all about it.

00:11:58
Speaker 3: Right, It's such a fascinating way to meet somebody.

00:12:01
Speaker 2: It's bongers.

00:12:02
Speaker 1: But the good thing about that is that at least you're in person. Yes, so there's no pretending like the apps will like that won't be current pictures or whatever, Like they're right there and so at least you can feel a bit of a vibe. But then it's timed, So what do you actually know if they're interesting or not interesting?

00:12:18
Speaker 2: Right?

00:12:18
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, and then that's the flyer that she gets. I mean, it's so funny, like how would they know that she's single? It's so funny, and then they like single her out right, like deer single.

00:12:27
Speaker 2: It's so embarrassing and weird.

00:12:29
Speaker 1: But I also think it's so funny how when everyone's like, we're gonna fill this out. You know, it's like when your friends try to force.

00:12:36
Speaker 2: You to be on the apps.

00:12:37
Speaker 3: Yes, exactly, so much. We'll make your profile for you. Yeah, yeah, all of it.

00:12:41
Speaker 1: It's right there, the precursor, early days, early days. But I love I love the conversation about about the soulmates. I think it's so funny that Miranda thinks they don't exist. And then I also think it's so funny of course that you know, Carry thinks there's more than one, which is where I would come down, right, And then Samantha's like, well I have hundreds and it's unattainable, which I think is great, And then I think it's so sweet. I did have a weird feeling when Samantha was suggesting the birthday party. I was like, I don't remember this, which of course now I know I don't remember it because we don't show up. But also I was like, wait, I don't think Samantha is the one who should be planning the birthday party.

00:13:21
Speaker 2: You know what I mean.

00:13:23
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, because you know she's in PR. I mean, it just seems like something's gonna go awry.

00:13:29
Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know.

00:13:30
Speaker 1: And also because I didn't remember it happening, I guess because obviously it doesn't happen, which when now we know why. But also I was just like, this is so unusual. It seemed like a role switch in a way. Yeah, yeah, like a caretaking Samantha. You know what I mean, Yes, I get you, But it was adorable how she talked her into it.

00:13:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, and I.

00:13:46
Speaker 3: Did, you know, again not to jump ahead to the dinner too much, but like I liked that. It wasn't like Samantha told everybody the wrong place or it was they all had had.

00:13:56
Speaker 2: I did think it was that. I did think it was that.

00:13:59
Speaker 3: I remember thinking was that too, But then Stanford does go to the wrong restaurant he gets it was adorable. Everyone else is somewhat affected by the traffic of the construction in different ways, but it was if then offer the construction, it probably would have happened without Sanford.

00:14:14
Speaker 2: Well. The other thing is because she doesn't have her cell phone yet.

00:14:16
Speaker 3: Yes, that's and that's a funny get my cell phone a.

00:14:20
Speaker 1: Cell phone, which yes, and I think pretty soon she gets that little sparkly Schwarowski crystal cell phone that she has through the end of the show.

00:14:28
Speaker 2: I think is coming quite soon.

00:14:30
Speaker 1: But yeah, if you had had a cell phone, all of this would have been salt.

00:14:35
Speaker 3: It's like they say, what ninety eight percent of Seinfeld plots would have been solved by a cell phone.

00:14:40
Speaker 1: It's like one of the I never heard that, but that makes total sense. Yes, oh my god, the way life is changing cucu crazy.

00:14:49
Speaker 2: So we're where we've got you know, we've got Carrie.

00:14:52
Speaker 1: She's talked into a birthday party by Samantha. Then it is kind of funny how Samantha says, oh, should I invite Big And She's like, no, what do you mean He's still in London, Like she's got her whole thing. But then she's sitting in her bed waiting for the clock to hit midnight when she picks up the phone and calls Big. Very planned in her mind, very adorable also and also like that kind of thing where there has been time that's passed, so it does feel kind of fresh, like not so emotionally heavy or whatever. Yeah, that she could reach out to him. But then also you do really feel like she's so not over in any way.

00:15:35
Speaker 2: But she's fun.

00:15:36
Speaker 1: But she seems happyish right, like happy like you know what I mean, like not suffering.

00:15:41
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, exactly.

00:15:43
Speaker 2: Yes.

00:15:43
Speaker 3: When I was watching her wait for the clock to strike the night, I thought she was waiting because London is like see, I was thinking Pacific time, right, eight hours. I was like, oh, she waiting for it to be eight am when it's like a reasonable hour. And then I'm no dummy, she's waiting for it to be her birthday.

00:15:57
Speaker 1: Totally, totally, and it is kind of funny because she's so honest, like it's my birthday because it's midnight. I mean, you've totally given your whole thing away there. But that's okay, that's okay, that's all right. But I liked that, and I like, I thought it was very winning, you know, like that's Carrie at her like kind of I mean, I don't know if the Internet would agree, but you know, I like that part of Carrie where she's got a plan and she's going to execute it in a cute way. I mean, yeah, good, the whole doorway memes like I get that that if you take them out of context and chop them up of her appearing at the doorway in different outfits or whatever, that it looks very needy.

00:16:40
Speaker 2: But it was over time and it was fun.

00:16:43
Speaker 3: I love all the memes that come out Sexton the City, but I also think that they hurt the show sometimes, Like also the like biggest moving to Paris thing, Yes, like that.

00:16:52
Speaker 2: I see that, my God.

00:16:53
Speaker 3: Constantly, and I'm like, oh my god, it's not.

00:16:57
Speaker 1: It's entertaining what people do with it, right, Like if you can separate it from the actual show, like the actual what we were doing, and just look at the creativity that people use with it, I like that. But it is like like sometimes they're trying to make Carrie seem like her most narcissistic or whatever, which isn't really fair, right right, right, right right, But that's okay, that's okay.

00:17:23
Speaker 2: I get it. I get it. It's a meme. It's fine. It is what it is.

00:17:34
Speaker 1: Hi, everybody, let's do our Hyundai hot take for the Agony and the Ecstasy episode four oh one. This one was a toughie, but I'm going to go with Carrie in the middle of Fifth Avenue late at night on her birthday, dropping her birthday cake into the freshly repaved pavement that she has also walked through while the guys who are the construction crew scream at her, and then she goes the wrong way, and then she goes back, and then she drops the cake, and then she tries to scoop the cake up, and her purse is open but it doesn't spill, and her dress almost flashes the guys, and then she's trying to pick up the cake with the cardboard and it's just so classic Sarah Jessica talent, like talent on talent on talent, physical talent, her vulnerability, but also being funny and so charming and funny and so real, and oh, I just love it. And it's just Sarah Jessica at her best and Michael Patrick writing for Sarah Jessica to do her best work, so celebrating iconic moments, bold moves and unforgettable style, just like Hyundai. So then we I had fully forgotten about the fact that so with this repaving of Fifth Carrie walks into it with her birthday cake that she's had to buy at El Cantonoi, which is a great restaurant that we all still love. And then she gets she walks through the newly paved street, and these really making guys are yellinger. I mean, look, I've been yelled at in many ways by many construction guys in New York.

00:19:15
Speaker 2: It is a thing.

00:19:16
Speaker 1: But like they get so into it, I know.

00:19:21
Speaker 2: They go on and on and on.

00:19:22
Speaker 1: And then she goes and they're like no, all the other way. And then she tries and then drops the cake. And then she's trying to pick the cake up with the cardboard, like why leave the cake there?

00:19:32
Speaker 2: Like it's such a mess. But it's such like.

00:19:35
Speaker 1: Sarah Jessica's super talents are on display there. She's vulnerable, she's doing her incredible physical activity that she's just.

00:19:45
Speaker 2: So great at.

00:19:46
Speaker 1: But also she's funny somehow within all of that vulnerability and upset.

00:19:50
Speaker 3: Yes, yes it is. It's such a funny moment. But I was so sad for her at the same time, balancing those two emotions. And then when she leans they were to pick the transcuot the cake up, her purse is open and I'm like, oh no, her purse is gonna empty.

00:20:03
Speaker 2: House, I know.

00:20:04
Speaker 1: And then at one just to like cover like she's in like a weird squat just like cut, like there's.

00:20:08
Speaker 2: So many things going on. Yes, oh my god.

00:20:11
Speaker 1: And the funny thing is, as an actor, you could have made that easier, but Sarah Jessica will never make it easier.

00:20:17
Speaker 2: She'll ask for more props.

00:20:19
Speaker 1: Like she's so skilled at it and she knows that the way to do it well is to make it hard. And she can also always match her actions, which is impressive, right, But that watching I was like, the bag is open, the skirt is up, the heels are are they sinking into the street? Like I was so concerned on so many levels. And then I was like, leave the cake, Leave the cake. I'd forgotten all of this, And I think that should be a meme. I don't know if it is, but I think that should be a meme of like, your day's going horribly wrong. Right, your day has gone really horribly wrong, and your birthday cake that you have alone as you're walking down the street is now in the newly paved fifth Avenue.

00:20:59
Speaker 3: Before she gives the uh, or before she's told she has to pay for the cake, when she's sitting in the restaurant, she thinks everyone's late. She doesn't, she doesn't been there that long, thinks everyone's late, and then they bring another cake out for somebody else. That part got me because it's a very big cake and they're bringing to a table of two people.

00:21:18
Speaker 1: Tell that, but there's like ten people bringing the cake, so it's like a surprise.

00:21:22
Speaker 2: But where are all those people gonna sit meat?

00:21:24
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was confused, but it was I think this might have happened to Michael Patrick. I feel like there's an actual story that relates to this that they used.

00:21:33
Speaker 2: And we'll have to ask him when he comes back.

00:21:35
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, I do think there's a real story, which is just, of course, so sad, so sad to think about. I know, birthdays are so funny because you really, like, you know, you get built up in such ways. I mean, I'm ancient, right, so I don't really care about my birthday, but my kids really really care.

00:21:52
Speaker 2: But we were supposed to have a call and I was picking up my own birthday cake, and it did make me laugh. I didn't remember this episode, but I was.

00:22:00
Speaker 1: I guess I'm driving to pick up my own birthday cake so that my kids will be disappointed. I know, it's kind of silly, but whatever whatever makes it kids happy, it's good, right, Okay, So she's I also love that the little thing she wears on her head, and then you know that she's getting really despondent when she takes that little velvet.

00:22:18
Speaker 2: Whatever the heck you would call that off her head.

00:22:20
Speaker 1: Which also, I feel like it's been a while since Carrie's wearing a hat. Yes, Like I don't know how why they gave up on the hats, but I love to see a hat come back, because you know what makes her happy, right, And then she takes it off and she's just playing with the velvet thing. You know, she's just like, oh, I'm so despondent, I can't even wear my hat, which is sad. So then she gets home and there's fourteen messages, and then we hear everyone's different version of where they are and why they didn't make it. And for Stannie, is it some you know, Mexican restaurant.

00:22:50
Speaker 2: Or something.

00:22:52
Speaker 1: Really funny, really really funny. I hadn't remembered any of that, but I did remember that. Then Charlotte, I have a key, and I let myself and she's in the shower and her best carriage like majorly dramatically down her face. I was like, wow, so impressive and very sweetly, thank goodness, I come and convince her to come to the coffee shop.

00:23:12
Speaker 2: Thank God. Right, this is the.

00:23:14
Speaker 1: Kind of friend we all need, Yes, definitely, And we get down there, and this is when I say, maybe we can be each other's soulmates, and then we could let men be these great nice guys to have fun with. Good calls Charlotte, Thank goodness, A very deep insight on Charlotte's part.

00:23:33
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, one of the iconic section of the entire show Sex and the City. That is one of those I know.

00:23:39
Speaker 1: And it's so funny because I thought we were on this stoop when I said it.

00:23:43
Speaker 2: I don't know what I.

00:23:44
Speaker 1: Thought, Like I get the different important things mixed up sometimes, you know, And I hadn't remembered that it was in this context. But leading up to it, I was wondering, wait, am I about to say it? I wasn't sure. But like Samantha is even upset, like everyone's upset because Carrie's upset, and because Carrie admits that it feels really bad not to have a guy who thinks she's special on her birthday, which is just kind of baneful, but I want to be like it's oh.

00:24:10
Speaker 2: It's okay, Carrie.

00:24:13
Speaker 1: So then we have this amazing, you know, kind of bonding situation at the coffee shop and she's walking home in a different cape. I believe we have two capes in this episode. It's pretty exciting, pretty exciting times.

00:24:25
Speaker 2: We're walking home and.

00:24:26
Speaker 1: She looks pretty happy, which I was really happy about, right, Like she's to the place of like, yes, the day took twist and turns or whatever, but I'm happy, which is so great. And that's when she sees Big Scar and BIG's driver Raoul smoking.

00:24:40
Speaker 2: His cigarette and it is adorable. And I had forgotten the balloons come out. Yeah, it was really charming. And then at the end of the show, I think we do a photo shoot with Ellen von Arnworth where we had Sarah walking across the bridge. Maybe it was for the last season. She's walking the Brooklyn Bridge with balloons.

00:25:03
Speaker 1: And I took pictures of it myself, like personal pictures, and I sent her one in a frame one time. Yeah, yeah, and I think they're red and I had not remembered that there was a reason why or whatever, you know, And it's a very very charming scene. And you know how I have mixed feelings about Big but he was at his most charming and kind of like adorably like on the one hand, suite that he brought champagne and he brought balloons and he would kind of know what she would need, right. And on the other hand, she doesn't know how old he is because apparently he hasn't told her, which is interesting.

00:25:37
Speaker 3: There was I was looking online and some people are saying that like he he references it or in an earlier episoit like she does know. Oh, I guess he references it earlier. I don't know, but someone tell us, yeah, yeah, I don't know. That's interesting.

00:25:50
Speaker 1: I mean, remember how we don't know his whole name either till the end, but then you don't know if she knew. We just don't say it, right, Like there's mysteries about it, right, which I think is good.

00:26:01
Speaker 2: I like that because this is TV.

00:26:03
Speaker 1: One of the things that I think about when I watch it back is like, you know, in the year two thousand and one, like what was on regular television sitcoms? You know, not that there's anything wrong with them, they're hard to do, right, but like friends, was on, you know, Seinfeld, I think was done by this point.

00:26:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to say like.

00:26:24
Speaker 3: Gilmour Girls had just started, Yes.

00:26:26
Speaker 1: Like everybody loves Raymond, like things like that were on, right, So this was very very very different, you know, very very different, and I think important, Like like on television, they wanted you to explain things, and I think what was nice is that our writers had the nerve, you know, the strength to be like, we're not going to explain that, and we're not going to explain these people's parents, and we're not going to show where they came from. We're not going to talk about it. We're not going to tell you how old Big is, and you know, so many different things.

00:26:56
Speaker 3: Yes, right, and that's why that's one of many reasons I love this show, and like and Sopranos is the same thing they give. They treat the audience with respect and like the audience are intelligent people that can think about what's happening.

00:27:07
Speaker 2: And you don't need to be like I just spoon feeding.

00:27:11
Speaker 3: The ham fisted exposition just kills me in movies and television drives me crazy. I agree, and and this is just so nice to I.

00:27:19
Speaker 2: Agree, But I do think too.

00:27:20
Speaker 1: If you think about it, I think, like, yes, streaming has upended our business but also allowed so many more shows like that to exist, you know, yes, because people are going to find their show that they like, right, So like you can, like I haven't. Pluribus seemed really upsetting to me, so I didn't continue watching it. But like they just throw you right in. Yeah, there's no explanation. You're just like, Okay, we're in a lab. There's a pandemic. I don't know what's happening, right, Like, I mean, yeah, I like that. That's that's bold and brave. It was too anxiety provoking for me to get through, but that that's me. That's on me, not on them, right, you know what I mean? But I think that that actress is great. But I love to look back, and I'm reminded of the times so much when I'm looking at it, because New York looks so different and so charming and small in a weird way.

00:28:07
Speaker 2: Right.

00:28:08
Speaker 1: And also I technically know how many years ago it was because obviously I'm alive then.

00:28:13
Speaker 2: And I'm alive now, right. But on the other hand, it's timeless.

00:28:17
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's timeless I think because we didn't do all those things, you know, because we didn't overly explain. We didn't like there's still things like that she doesn't have a cell phone. There's things that tell tell us that it was the year two thousand and one, but not overly. So yes, yeah, absolutely, it's interesting. It's interesting to look at Yeah, yeah, okay, so we're we're what were your thoughts about Carrie here when she's talking about soulmates? You that you are happily married and have found your soulmate. Which do you think about this conversation.

00:28:47
Speaker 3: I'm in the camp that there are there you can have multiple soulmates. I don't think everyone just has a wine. Me too, because I always think it's funny to think, like, isn't that crazy that there's one person who's meant for you and they went to your college, you know, like.

00:29:02
Speaker 2: Crazy?

00:29:03
Speaker 3: Absolutely, But but I do believe in you know, when I got married, we had a friend of ours read that I'm trying to remember the name of it. There's like a Greek story about the gods split the man was too powerful and they splut him into two like that, and then they spend the eternity looking for your other half. I like the idea of a soulmate. I do think you can have more than one. And I think that when you I think it's abundantly clear to one, when you meet that person that unlocks that part of you. I mean, it's that's how I feel any my own experience that.

00:29:44
Speaker 2: M gosh, that's interesting to think about. That's well put.

00:29:49
Speaker 1: I think that's really nice, and I think that's really incredible that you feel that way.

00:29:56
Speaker 3: I'm very lucky though.

00:29:57
Speaker 2: You're very lucky for sure. I mean.

00:30:02
Speaker 1: It's interesting because I know when I was younger. When I was younger, though, I was kind of cynical about relationships, which I know is weird because I play Charlotte, right, But like I was like, I'm never getting married, I'm never doing this, I'm never doing that because I don't know. I just felt like there was so much pressure on everybody, you know, and I didn't want to do that, right. And I didn't like the idea that you would be with someone because you felt like you should. I felt like you should want to be with that person and that person should want to be with you, not because like you're going to fit into some traditional convention, you know.

00:30:40
Speaker 2: But I do think I don't know if I really believed in soulmates. I'm not sure that I did.

00:30:47
Speaker 1: Like, like, I don't know that I've ever said like I met X person and they unlocked, But I don't know that I've ever felt that way, which is interesting. I've definitely felt passionately, passionately in love. But I mean, I'm pretty much on life, you know what I'm saying, Like I'm an open, open, open person. But then you can find that person that gets you yes in a really unique way, which is powerful, very much like when they understand you. But that doesn't really mean it's going to work out, you know, which is always my thing that I come back to.

00:31:18
Speaker 2: But I'm really happy for you that it's working out.

00:31:20
Speaker 1: I'm happy for everyone else that is working out for And the only thing I want to say is that I hope that it like I do feel. And this is now from you know, being older, like my friends who are in relationships that I admire long term you know, marriages and whatnot. It takes work, yeah, you know, like it might have been so magical and amazing and easy in the beginning, but like at a certain point that's not going to be how it is exactly right, and then like do you love that person and care about your relationship enough that you're going to work on it? And that has to be true for both people.

00:31:54
Speaker 3: And this might be kind of out there, but Donna Hue Phil Donna Hue and his wife wrote a book about Marlo Thomas Thomas who was mentioned in this episode Wheels within Wheels. They wrote a book about their long marriage and they bring up the there's like a stat that I don't even know if this is true or not, but that all of your cells in your body regenerate after seven years. I think you're biologically a completely different person, right, So, like they were saying, like every seven years we do like a major check in with each other, like change have we grown?

00:32:31
Speaker 2: That's so cool.

00:32:31
Speaker 3: I think about that all the time.

00:32:33
Speaker 2: That's impressive.

00:32:34
Speaker 1: Yeah, see, that's amazing. That's very amazing. And I think that those kinds of things are the things that we should be holding up in culture to say like, oh, look, this is what it takes.

00:32:43
Speaker 2: Yes, right, Like.

00:32:44
Speaker 1: You can't just coast exactly, you know, you have to think about like what am I doing here?

00:32:49
Speaker 2: Have I grown? Have I not grown? Could I grow more? Should I ask? My partner, what they think, you know, like different things.

00:32:55
Speaker 1: That and that's for men and women everybody, right, Yep, it's interesting to think about anyways.

00:33:00
Speaker 2: Enough about that, but I do think I.

00:33:02
Speaker 1: Do think that people really do torture themselves over this idea of soulmates. Absolutely, and it can be a harmful ideal that you're somehow trying to live up to or whatever. I don't even know, you know, like that something's going to be like hing, you know, that's your soul mad you know what?

00:33:23
Speaker 2: Like yeah, I know.

00:33:24
Speaker 3: I always think about people that meet someone and they're everything is perfect, but then there's like one like like there's one glaring issue or something and they're like, oh, this is is this personal macelemated? If they were, they wouldn't have this part of them.

00:33:38
Speaker 1: But see this issue with this is what's ever going to be perfect?

00:33:44
Speaker 2: Perfect? Right? See, Like that's where I get hung up.

00:33:48
Speaker 1: Because in me and but this is my whole problem is like I think I can work with anything, right, I'm like, that's okay, I can deal like that crazy thing. I can do with that crazy thing because the vibe is so good. No, that's a terrible idea. Yes, a terrible idea. This is why I'm single. Well, it's one of the reasons i'm single. I have like so much room for everybody's stuff. It's bad bad don't have too much room. Yes, I mean, that's one thing I like about Charlotte.

00:34:15
Speaker 2: And I did just see something that the day on Instagram because everyone's always well not everyone, but like people on my feed because obviously I do. This podcast someone was talking about how Charlotte knew what she wanted and she held onto her standards, but she wasn't afraid to try, right, so she dated so many people, yes, and was like, you know, she'd get upset like, oh, this one wants me to do this and I don't know if I should.

00:34:40
Speaker 1: And then this one wants to do this, I don't know if I should, and you know, there was all that, but then also pretty quick she'd be like, yeah, no, I'm not going to do that.

00:34:46
Speaker 2: You know what I mean, like pretty quickly without being particularly crushed, Like I don't think that. Charlotte was like it's me, Yeah, it's me, I'm the problem.

00:34:55
Speaker 1: She wasn't really doing that, which I think is impressive, very much sir right, But I didn't really I don't know that I realized that at the time. Like the strength of her you know, it's good, it's good. I like it looking back, it's very interesting. And then also like we're talking about, like we'll get to the tray of it all, but you know the fact that she's intact, she's gotten the thing, she's gotten married, it's not going great.

00:35:21
Speaker 2: And is she going to torture herself? No, it's kind of amazing. You think she'd be home just sobbing.

00:35:29
Speaker 3: Yes. No, she is very open to being separated and potentially says when.

00:35:35
Speaker 1: We go back to the city, we should take time off because he's just playing that tennis and he won't talk to her. You know, it's interesting.

00:35:42
Speaker 2: No, Charlotte's super fascinating. I think all of the characters are super fascinating.

00:35:46
Speaker 1: That's the other thing I think when I look back, especially on like really meaty episodes like these two that we start the fourth season with, all the characters are fascinating. Yes, I mean it's really good writing.

00:35:58
Speaker 3: It's incredible. They're so multi dimensional. There's so many different parts of them that everyone can relate to.

00:36:06
Speaker 1: And somehow, somehow we let it breathe, like like we don't have enough time, like when you think about everything that happens in each episode and they're not that long, but there's breath in it.

00:36:17
Speaker 2: There's like time for you to kind of be with them. It's interesting. I don't know how we did it. It's hard to do.

00:36:26
Speaker 1: But okay, let's move on from Carrie to poor Charlotte. Poor Charlotte, Oh my gosh.

00:36:31
Speaker 2: She's at that party.

00:36:32
Speaker 1: Man, she talks that woman's ear off because the person says, where's your husband?

00:36:37
Speaker 2: It would make me laugh in a way though.

00:36:39
Speaker 3: It was I love that moment. It is, yes, it's like it I feel bad for Charlotte, but it's so it's so funny and it's like delivered so well, thank you, and I just I love the two women don't talk.

00:36:53
Speaker 2: Don't talk to her, I know. And then poor Charlotte.

00:36:55
Speaker 1: But it's interesting because like I would be like really devastated if I heard someone say that.

00:37:00
Speaker 2: Charlotte's just kind of like oh, and then she.

00:37:03
Speaker 1: You could see the wheels turning and then she's like, oh, I need to go to trays and I've got my list right and I'm wearing this dress that I remember there being.

00:37:10
Speaker 2: That was what I was gonna say earlier.

00:37:11
Speaker 1: I'm not sure if I spit it out because I go to the party, then I go to Tray's, then we end up having this like weird you know, makeout session in the hallway, right, And there's a lot of stress about what that dress would be and it ends up I think it's blue marine as the brand is like this little polka dot, you know, polka dot.

00:37:28
Speaker 2: It's very Charlotte. It's navy. But there's a lot of stress like was it dressy enough for the party? Was it?

00:37:33
Speaker 1: Like it was a lot of one of those outfits. And because I wear it like the whole episode almost, you know, till the the end Carrie's birthday, and I think I have it hanging in my closet, which because it's very wearable, you know, though in reality, I can't really wear polka dots because they're so Charlotte, like unless I want to be unless i'm you know, like at a workie kind of a thing.

00:37:54
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:37:55
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like if you got a Starbucks like that, it's like Charlotte's here.

00:37:58
Speaker 2: Yeah you would not. I would not.

00:38:00
Speaker 1: And they're also kind of fancy, right, so it's not my Starbucks where but I do think I have that one hanging because I did really like it. But when I go to Trey's and I'm banging on the door, I didn't remember what happened. I was really hoping we were going to have some good sex.

00:38:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, but no, no, so sad.

00:38:17
Speaker 3: So I think back to Kyle said like, oh, I you know, when they pitched me the character, it's like, oh, he's a doctor, like you know, he tells that story and then oh, and then you find out he's in potent or whatever, like the high than the low. And I was thinking about this moment because you're banging on the door. He comes down the hall. He's got his robe up and he looks great, like yeah, he's got absolute ye. I'm like, oh my god, Kyle, He's like yeah. And then and then it ends with him prematurely.

00:38:46
Speaker 2: Sad, so incredibly sad.

00:38:49
Speaker 3: Right, Charlotte may get you a hanky, I.

00:38:51
Speaker 2: Know, I know.

00:38:53
Speaker 1: And then and then I just look at him like and there's some voiceover about how he always has good man. It's really tragic, it is, And if I were Charlotte, I would be way more upset.

00:39:08
Speaker 2: But it's good that she's not right.

00:39:10
Speaker 1: It's good that she's just like, well I tried it and it didn't work, or maybe I should still try it. But also it's so cute that she's got her list, you know, like she's trying trying.

00:39:20
Speaker 3: We can't talk about my list if you have a boner.

00:39:22
Speaker 1: I think that was a Yes, that's definitely definitely what she said. It's like high school, but that's okay, you know what I mean, Like it's funny in a way, like the innocence, but then also they just don't have the skills.

00:39:33
Speaker 2: Yes, you know, and he doesn't really want to talk.

00:39:36
Speaker 1: And she's trying to say, like, but you know, is it because we're not married and because I'm unattainable and he's just.

00:39:42
Speaker 2: Like, I don't know, you know, he's like he is a little frustrating. Yes, we're going to talk about.

00:39:58
Speaker 1: The Fryer now, which I think we're still trying to find Cossus Mandelora.

00:40:02
Speaker 2: I really hope we find him. I love him. He's incredible.

00:40:06
Speaker 1: I really one hundred percent thought that Samantha was going to seduce friar fuck as she calls him, but I apparently.

00:40:16
Speaker 3: Know No, he maintains his vows, which is impressive.

00:40:21
Speaker 1: Okay, and I really like this change, like to see Samantha really going after it. You don't even saying like shifting or game depending on that. He hasn't really like succeeded yet, you know, he hasn't bitten yet, right, And she changes it up and she goes and she takes the canned goods, and I mean he's just so beautiful, you know, to look at that, you totally get. And I think the unobtainable thing is also part of it for her, right, and he's got his you know, beautiful brown friar.

00:40:51
Speaker 2: Outfit on her robe. I guess right.

00:40:54
Speaker 1: It's all very very likable, and it's so interesting that he doesn't compromise at all.

00:41:02
Speaker 2: I liked it very much.

00:41:03
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's kind of like a Mandela effect for me. I really could have if you hook me up to a light attector. I watched this episode a year ago, I would have been like, oh, yeah, they have sex, like definitely.

00:41:11
Speaker 1: I know, because I just don't think we're ever used to Samantha not succeeding, you know what I mean, it just doesn't really happen. And also like Costas is just so sexy also that you that's part of it. I think is that you kind of it's like tangible, and I think that's her, that's Samantha's feeling, you know. Also, so she thinks she's going to succeed and that's why she goes to a master base for two and a half hours or whatever she says hysterical, But yeah, she doesn't, which is really nuts. And I did have part of me where I was wondering, like did we ever have an alternate ending?

00:41:45
Speaker 2: Like was this always the way? I'm not sure.

00:41:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, we have to ask Michael Patrick and or a Costas mandalor so Costas if you can hear us, please please come on. He's out in the world working somewhere.

00:41:56
Speaker 2: I don't know. We're trying to find him because he's great. And wait, were you telling me? So? What is his other thing?

00:42:02
Speaker 1: I knew him already, but I can't remember how. But I knew him already before he was on the show, but I can't remember why or how.

00:42:09
Speaker 3: He's in two of the Saw movies, if not three. He's at least wait, he's not the killer.

00:42:16
Speaker 1: Well what, I've never seen a Saw movie.

00:42:20
Speaker 3: He is a detective in Saw four or five, and I believe six is a detective. He is a detective, but the detective gets seduced by the power this killer has. Yes, I'm sorry if I'm spoiling Saw four for you better.

00:42:37
Speaker 2: Wow, she's in multiple multiple he didn't know this. This is interesting.

00:42:42
Speaker 3: Because the the jig Saw killer in Saw hunts down people that don't appreciate the life they've been given, and then he puts them in these traps and like, how how far will you go to live? Like, you know, you have to dig a there's a lock around you and the key is behind your eyeball.

00:42:59
Speaker 2: And that's horrible.

00:43:02
Speaker 3: Also, Costas plays a detective who sees it as a way to like extract justice on people that the system has, like, oh, this person killed a child and gone away with it. Okay, yeah, I'm gonna get it.

00:43:17
Speaker 2: I get it.

00:43:18
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's gruesome.

00:43:20
Speaker 2: It's so interesting.

00:43:21
Speaker 3: But I remember so vividly watching Saw and going that's friar.

00:43:28
Speaker 1: Well, that's why we need to talk to Costas, like what was it like to play friar fuck and then have people talk to you?

00:43:34
Speaker 2: I mean, because that is a really different role on our show, so different, very different.

00:43:39
Speaker 3: He can be such a tough, brooding guy in the saw movies and then he's this like sexy cool man of God in uh Insex and the City.

00:43:46
Speaker 2: I mean he was on something.

00:43:47
Speaker 1: I because when during the nineties when I was trying to work, I came across so many people, right, like so so so many people, and I definitely knew Castus and I just can't remember he.

00:43:57
Speaker 3: Was on picket Fences and this was a great show.

00:44:01
Speaker 1: But I wasn't on pick Up then, So I just I don't know where I met him, but I met him somehow. I knew him so nice, super nice guy. So I'm happy that he's out there working somewhere. I need an update. Costas, please come on and give us an update. Yeah, it is pretty funny when Samantha goes and talks to us about how she masturbated for two and a half hours or whatever, and then everyone has to discuss who they masturbate to. And the Russell Crowe moment.

00:44:25
Speaker 2: What did you think of that?

00:44:27
Speaker 3: I wrote? I was taking notes last night. I wrote down Russell Crowe. Lol, that's what I wrote. Do I love these moments where you're like, oh, yeah, he was like one of the They also say George Clooney as that comes up of course, you know, Russell crow is like, oh he's I know, was this had Gladiator come out?

00:44:44
Speaker 2: I think it's Gladiatord time. We should check when did the Gladiator the first Gladiator?

00:44:49
Speaker 3: Just those two thousand maybe.

00:44:50
Speaker 1: I mean, because yeah, this is two thousand and one, it would have makes sense. We used to see a lot of Russell Crowe too, in the awards and whatnot. One time I was on a talk show when he was there. It might have been kne He was very nice to us. His ex wife loved the show, so he was always very complimentary. And there's other stories, but I really shouldn't tell you, but very nice, very very nice, very nice, very nice, very interesting man.

00:45:19
Speaker 2: Very interesting man, very interesting.

00:45:21
Speaker 1: Yes, Hannah doesn't have anything to say, Wendy, Gladiator come out two thousand?

00:45:25
Speaker 2: You were right, very good, very good. Easton Christ knows everything you dot.

00:45:30
Speaker 1: I do remember that there was some discussion about who we should say. Really yeah, I think there was another time where we had to say somebody, and there was a discussion also to make sure that we were all cool and we were kind of all putting in our two cents or whatever.

00:45:45
Speaker 2: You know.

00:45:45
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting though, because Charlotte doesn't say anything about Russell Crow.

00:45:50
Speaker 3: No, she has one person in mind. I know, I really, I just want to play it really quick. I love the sweater you're wearing at that scene thought lunch.

00:46:00
Speaker 2: It's like a.

00:46:00
Speaker 3: Pink Oh, it's bright.

00:46:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, what the heck was it? Yeah? You're so funny.

00:46:04
Speaker 1: I told you I wore a sweater for you today because I knew I was trying to do, because I do think of you. When I picked my sweaters, I was wondering to myself, what the heck am I wearing? It is the most thickest, like pink chunk of school or whatever crashed me or I.

00:46:19
Speaker 2: Don't know what it is. I don't own it.

00:46:21
Speaker 1: I was wondering because usually Pat would put me in like super tight things, you know.

00:46:27
Speaker 2: But I think that was a coffee shop.

00:46:29
Speaker 1: And sometimes if you have a coffee shop and you don't have a scene before it or write after it, that's the only time you'll wear it. So it's more about the pop of color in the mix, because you have to think about how everyone's outfits go together, which is a whole situation obviously, and other people might have scenes before or after, right, So if I was only at the coffee shop, then it would only matter that I had a bright color on. But to me, you know what I was thinking when I saw At first, I was seeing what the heck am I wearing? Then I was like, that's very very chunky. Then I thought to myself, this is confusing because is that pink a pink that a winter would wear. Because there's a lot of debate in my own head and also on Instagram about whether I'm a winter or.

00:47:06
Speaker 2: Like an autumn, I want to say, I'm.

00:47:09
Speaker 1: Very confused, very confused, And when I get dressed to come on the podcast, I'm like, I don't know what colorwhere?

00:47:15
Speaker 2: Because yeah, I used to think I was a winter.

00:47:17
Speaker 1: Like my whole life, I thought I was a winter and I could wear solid white. But then they're telling me, no, no, don't wear solid white. So then I'm supposed to wear not solid white. But I don't think it looks great.

00:47:28
Speaker 2: What do you think these are the present estions?

00:47:32
Speaker 3: It's so I'm really I mean, the whole winter, autumn, summer thing, it's it's it is challenging. Is I think this pink looks great on you?

00:47:43
Speaker 2: Okay?

00:47:44
Speaker 3: The sweater you have on also looks great on you. I'm not washed out, No, no, not at all.

00:47:48
Speaker 2: Okay.

00:47:48
Speaker 3: I think if you've been wearing like like I'm wearing a white right and it looks.

00:47:52
Speaker 2: Good, you might be a winter or maybe an autumn. I don't know.

00:47:58
Speaker 3: There are people that do these analysis, that's their job. Yes, yeah, we should get you to one of those people.

00:48:03
Speaker 2: Well, they have done a thing on me. This is why I'm confused.

00:48:06
Speaker 1: Right, they have done a little video. I saved it so that I could reference it.

00:48:10
Speaker 2: Do you know what I mean? Pat Field?

00:48:13
Speaker 1: I don't think that Pat and Molly ascribe to this, okay. And I talked to my stylis, Samantha McMillan also, and she said that she thinks it's interesting, but that sometimes they're wrong, which I also do agree with, because sometimes they'll do people like from an award show, and they'll have what they wore and then they'll color it a different color that they think would be better for them, and they'll be like, see, isn't that better, and you're like, no, it's not better?

00:48:37
Speaker 2: Like no, right, Like they don't generally like black.

00:48:41
Speaker 1: Only winters should wear black, And I really think I'm a winter And if you are going to tell me that I cannot wear black, I may ignore you. You know what I'm saying, like you can't take her black from us, like it's just wrong, you know, like it's upsetting. But when we get into the other colors, I am open, right, So, like sometimes with the podcast, I try different colors, but because we have our beautiful lights on us and everything, I'm not sure that it's the best way to tell. I've been trying some fall colors lately because this one woman did like, oh, Kristen Davis, and they said, Kristin Davis can pull off a lot of colors and she can dip into winter. I don't know what she said, but she basically said that I should not wear silver, and I should not wear black, and I should not wear white.

00:49:23
Speaker 2: I was just like, what silver.

00:49:26
Speaker 3: I guess I get black looks so good on you though, thank you about so much, especially thinking back to there's so many great Charlotte black dress moments.

00:49:35
Speaker 2: I know, I know, but this is the other thing that I will say and then we can get off this topic because I'm not sure if people care about this or not, but it does. It does.

00:49:45
Speaker 1: My problem is that once it gets in your head. Then when you look at things, you're like, oh, no, is this my color or not? Like it's stressful, right, yes, whereas you would just normally just pick what you felt like wearing, you know, and I do have many colors, Like in terms of the sweaters to wear into the podcast, I've got many a sweater because I'm always cold, right, So it's really like a conundrum. But basically, some of those black dresses that I have are very open net, right, so it's not right up by my face. And I might be tan because we usually film all summer, and even though obviously you're supposed to wear your sunscreen and not get tan, I would eventually get tan. And I don't know that that's the best way to judge right now. To me, I love black and I'm always gonna wear black. I don't really care who tells me not to write. My bigger question is like white off white, I don't know, right, And then like the other like dusty colors or no, or the bright pink like you're saying you like this bright pink, right, It's interesting.

00:50:40
Speaker 2: I don't know. But I also I'm just so curious if anyone wants to.

00:50:44
Speaker 1: Tell me if this makes it into our podcast, Do you guys believe in the color seasons?

00:50:49
Speaker 2: What do you think?

00:50:50
Speaker 1: Please let me know because I'm super curious. All right, let's talk about Miranda.

00:50:54
Speaker 2: All Miranda is just adorable, just adorable.

00:50:59
Speaker 1: She kind of doesn't have like a pressing pressing storyline here, but yet I really loved it because she's at the party where we're all single, and she starts telling jokes, not that unlike what Charlotte does, though I guess Charlotte's not even trying to be funny, She's just rambling, right, But Miranda tries to tell jokes and Carrie's like oh, And then they go out on the street and Carrie's like, what was that? And she says, well, I'm just trying to avoid the pity party. And then Carrie calls her Shecky, which I don't know if people know that this like a Shecky Green was like a vaudeville comedian, right, probably a reference people aren't gonna get.

00:51:36
Speaker 2: But she calls her shecky, which is adorable.

00:51:38
Speaker 1: And then later on Miranda runs into this other lady on the street who you know, also just so blatantly like are you dating anyone, And I mean it seems funny when you see it in the show, but people are like this, Yeah, I mean it's kind of unfair in a way.

00:51:54
Speaker 2: You know.

00:51:54
Speaker 1: It's also like when people go like, well, what do you do? You know, like like the other day I took Jemma somewhere. She's fourteen years old, but she doesn't she looks older, right, and some stranger was like, you know, what.

00:52:04
Speaker 2: Do you want to study in college? And she was like and then she's like marine biology, which.

00:52:09
Speaker 1: Was so cute, but you know that pressure of like having to explain yourself on the spot and like these kind of big questions.

00:52:15
Speaker 2: You know.

00:52:16
Speaker 3: Yeah, I always was because that's the way I seen in TV a lot, like oh, you've seen anybody, and like, I've never once asked someone that, because I feel like it's very.

00:52:24
Speaker 2: I agree personal, I agree.

00:52:27
Speaker 3: Something this is embarrassing because something I learned I should not be doing because it went poorly for me. Was I was hanging out with a friend I hadn't seen in a long time, and he had brought his girlfriend. They've been dating for about I think a year, right, We're hanging out. There's the three of us, and then I go, so, do I hear wedding bells? I thought it would be a fun cute thing, and it was so funny. It was so poorly and it does matter or she I could tell immediately this is a topic of contention between them, and he was like not quite. Yeah, it's kind of awful getting, you know, just figuring. And I was like, oh man, And I told my wife fat and she's like, you should not say that.

00:53:08
Speaker 2: No, no, no. It's also just like, don't ask people where they're having children.

00:53:11
Speaker 3: Yes, exactly.

00:53:12
Speaker 2: This is what happens in the show, which I thought was so great.

00:53:14
Speaker 1: So the woman who asked Miranda, will are you dating anyone? Miranda says, what about you and Joe or whatever his name is. You've been married for what? And she goes, oh, five years. I'm sure you're gonna excuse me, I'm sure you're gonna ask me where the children are. And then Miranda has this moment of like, oh, everyone's got their thing, and I'm gonna laugh because I'm going to be kind, which is so nice because everyone's got their insecurities about what your expectations are and they're just trying to get in front of that and like do a song and dance if that's what they've got to do, you know what I mean, Because it's just a lot of pressure to have to explain yourself all the time.

00:53:51
Speaker 3: Yes, it is. Uh the part where Carrie when she and Carry on the street and Carry's like, so what was that about? I thought that was weird you to react that way. Oh really, because I during that moment when Miranda's telling you that she was so funny, right, and so charming, and I was like, oh my god, I want to be in this conversation.

00:54:12
Speaker 2: I want to be at the steally and we do all kind of do that a fair amount. I did think that as well.

00:54:17
Speaker 1: But I also did think about the fact that Miranda is sometimes just like painfully honest, right, Like she doesn't always care about other people's feelings. And that's what I thought was different in a way, because like if you think about how Miranda is with just the friends is different than how Miranda is with like strangers, right or not that the people at the party were strangers, but like they're not the girls, right, So like she's one way with us where she just tells her things, or like when when we're all talking about the soulmates, and she's just sitting there, you know, like you just have to look at her face. You don't even have to hear her say anything. You know what she's going to say.

00:54:54
Speaker 2: She's just like, ah, yeah, and she because she's freely just going to say her truth.

00:54:58
Speaker 1: Right, So I think that's what it partly is. But I do know what you're saying, and that like Carrie does clock it in kind of a big way. But I think that's really Miranda's only storyline. So that's why that's happening, right, That makes.

00:55:12
Speaker 2: Sense sense, right, right, right? Because I did kind of go like, what's going on here?

00:55:15
Speaker 1: But I also I think the important thing, and of course this is because of my own singleness.

00:55:22
Speaker 2: Right.

00:55:23
Speaker 1: It's so amazing what we're saying about being single and the expectations that you're not going to be single and the pressure that everyone everywhere puts on everyone because of society's expectations. Right, And this is a million, hundred years ago, and I do think I don't know for.

00:55:40
Speaker 2: Sure, if every was here, we'd ask her. I do think that there's less pressure now, Like someone was telling me, Oh, Mary Beth, remember when Mary Beth came on, She was like I keep telling everyone about how I want a boyfriend, and they keep telling me I'm crazy, and I was like, good for them, and she's like, no, but I want a boyfriend.

00:55:56
Speaker 1: Like for the young people now, at least some of them, the expectation is that you won't be doing that, right, that you're going to be out and with your friends and having fun and pursuing whatever you're pursuing in your job or whatever, I guess, which is also interesting. Then there's a whole like being embarrassed to have a boyfriend thing that went on this past past year, which was super fascinating because if a woman was on at least on social media, like it was definitely a social media centered conversation, right, like if you were showcasing the boyfriend, that that was kind of almost like a lesser than position, you know what I mean, like giving away your power, I guess, which super super interesting, very much so. But I do feel in my own life and of course this could just be because I'm so used to this for like ever, right, I do feel like the assumption is why, like why are they single?

00:56:53
Speaker 2: Like what is going on that they would be single? Right?

00:56:55
Speaker 1: Like there's a weird question mark over your head if you're single, which is so stressful.

00:57:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't like it. Help me either, No, I don't like it.

00:57:16
Speaker 3: I did like this moment with this other person who starts talking about the inscreens about not having children because my wife, like, we have decided we're not going to have children, my wife and I.

00:57:27
Speaker 2: And do you tell people this, like if you're at a dinner party or something, do you talk about it if they ask us?

00:57:31
Speaker 3: Yeah, like we don't hide it. But then it also is it's it's awkward because you know.

00:57:40
Speaker 2: People try to convince you otherwise they.

00:57:42
Speaker 3: Do, they do, and keep saying like, oh, you would change your mind after it happens, right, and you know, and then it.

00:57:49
Speaker 2: Goes that doesn't make sense.

00:57:51
Speaker 1: No, that's not the way we should be going about this.

00:57:57
Speaker 2: No, you should have your total freedom not to be having children.

00:58:01
Speaker 1: I think it's very very respectable what I'm saying, Like like more people in some ways should be choosing this.

00:58:10
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that's kind of where I'm at. And it's hard to because I also don't drink. And I kind of rendo this too when I talk about that, Like if people ask you about that and you say oh, I'm not gonna have kids or I'm not I don't drink. Then they sometimes they interpret that as like, oh, well, you're not going to like me because I have children or I drink.

00:58:30
Speaker 2: They might that's true, and so it's it's it's.

00:58:32
Speaker 3: A really awkward thing sometimes, but everyone's living their own life.

00:58:37
Speaker 1: But also, I mean, this is what's so interesting too about people, right, like like that you know, if you choose something slightly different, right, like just slightly different, Like it's not that like there's a lot of people who don't drink. So you realize this as you go through life not drinking, right, but it's not the norm norm you know. So like if you're in an event or whatever, like most people are there drinking. You know, that's just how it is. That's what they do. That's what they like to do. More power to them, right, that's just.

00:59:08
Speaker 2: Not me and that's not you.

00:59:09
Speaker 1: But then that's so one thing is kind of interesting, right, Like they might go like, oh, that's interesting, Like you can tell on their face how they are going to feel. But then if they hear too, they're just like, oh, what do you know what I mean? Like, oh, now for me, I go, that's super doubly interesting. Let's hear about this, or maybe let's just think that's an interesting guy, because then like do you have to explain yourself because that's also awkward, right, like having to go into it, do you know what I mean?

00:59:34
Speaker 2: Awkward? Like you shouldn't have to do that.

00:59:36
Speaker 1: But then also I think that's really interesting and I think it's interesting also that people wouldn't automatically think, well, that's an interesting.

00:59:42
Speaker 2: Person, do mean? Right?

00:59:45
Speaker 1: Right?

00:59:45
Speaker 2: It is.

00:59:46
Speaker 1: I think that social norms are fascinating, and I think that they change very slowly, right, So like we might hope that they're changing, or think maybe because of social media that they're changing, but they really just change really really slow.

01:00:00
Speaker 2: But like you remember when we were.

01:00:01
Speaker 1: Talking to Jenny Biggs and she was saying when she wrote the episode about Miranda buying her apartment, that that was based on Jenny's story, and I was saying, look, I've gone through this myself, where like you're just having to check boxes. Like even with my kids who are in school, you know, I'm a single parent, right, All the school forums have two parents and they get very upset if both people don't sign because they don't want a divorced couple, for instance, to somehow leave out the other divorced person, right, but you have to like jump through hoops if you're a single parent to be like no, no, I am the only responsible person. Like it's it's just so not the default, right, Anything that's not the default is like it's a whole drama. And they don't ever think about you because you're the norm not the norm, right, You're the exception to the norm. But it's very interesting and somewhat you know, annoying. But then like with Jenny talking about the single women buying houses, now that's the single biggest group of house buyers, single women.

01:00:57
Speaker 2: So that's twenty five years. But yeah, yep, right, in took twenty five years, but yay.

01:01:03
Speaker 1: And then also I think the marriage you know, like when we did that Time magazine cover, which would have been like two thousand and one or two or something like that, maybe three or four, I don't know, but early two thousands, who needs a husband?

01:01:14
Speaker 2: That was shocking, right, That's why they put it on the cover.

01:01:17
Speaker 1: Right, But now you know the rates of first of all, divorced women who don't remarry, which I love so much, super interesting but then also just people waiting to get married, you know, women not marrying, Like there's many many options now that are much more prevalently happening, which is great because everyone should get to choose exactly.

01:01:36
Speaker 2: You should take the pressure off.

01:01:38
Speaker 3: We've come a long way. We sell a lot of Yes, more tracking us, but yes, I'm yeah, when you think about in the twenty five years, how we look at those things, it's it's incredible.

01:01:48
Speaker 1: I know, it is incredible. It is interesting because sometimes you feel like if you're in one of those moments, like we're having to fill out the forms, or when someone's like, what do you mean you don' when I have children, like people really do have their own like it's there. It says more about them than it is about you, right, But like they get panicked confronted, you know what I mean, with something different, right, and it says like in their mind you can see like what does this say about my choices?

01:02:13
Speaker 2: Right?

01:02:14
Speaker 1: But when you're in those moments, you do feel like nothing's ever changing. You're like, oh my god, it's exhausted. But I do think things are changing slowly, right. Yeah, it is interesting though, but I love, I love That's what I love. I love when it's rare that all characters in the show are single, and I do love it.

01:02:33
Speaker 2: I mean, it.

01:02:34
Speaker 1: Makes sense that it doesn't last forever because also that would be weird also, right, and you do want people to try things out. But I love that we start this season with everyone, you know, pretty much single. I mean, Charlotte's still not totally unhooked from Trey, and obviously Carrie emotionally is not unhooked from Big. But Miranda seems to not even.

01:02:52
Speaker 2: Be remotely thinking about Steve, which is interesting because we know it's going to happen, and of course Samantha's free because that's how showays is. But I liked it.

01:03:02
Speaker 1: I liked it, and it made me think, like this, this is why the show is so unique, you know, and that it can talk about this stuff like we were like when Carrie says to mind and we were the only people in there who were single.

01:03:12
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, yeah, it's interesting.

01:03:16
Speaker 3: I just want to shout out Yule Vasquez. He plays the agent that Samantha is talking to at the party. Yeah, and he's like just kind of being like typical, like you know, like nineties like agent. Yeah. So he and Sara Jessica were in a show together.

01:03:31
Speaker 2: I know he looked familiar.

01:03:33
Speaker 3: He was called Divorce.

01:03:34
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah he was a divorce.

01:03:36
Speaker 3: Yes he was. Oh my god, I recognized him from Seinfeld? No way, Yes, who.

01:03:40
Speaker 2: Does he play on Seinfeld?

01:03:42
Speaker 3: He he shows up like in three or four episodes. But there's there's these two characters that are there are these very fabulous game men, but they're they're they're described as street tufts, like they're like kind of like they there's a part where Kramer is supposed to be watching Elaine's armoir on the street and they.

01:03:59
Speaker 2: All remember this.

01:04:01
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then they also they do the Aids walk and Kramer won't wear the ribbon. Oh my god, those guys.

01:04:09
Speaker 2: That's really funny.

01:04:10
Speaker 1: I knew he looks so familiar, but I couldn't. I couldn't think of who he was. That's really interesting. Great eyebrows, Yeah, definitely definitely. I also thought like, has he been on the show before? That was what went through my He looks so familiar. That's interesting. Also, I was like, oh my god, I'm so scared like that, that kind of aggressive agent. I'm just like, oh lord, oh lord, no, Lord, no, I also thought he was going to be like a finance bro, but no, he was an agent.

01:04:35
Speaker 2: He was a TV agent. I fucking love it that guy, right, that was funny. That was really funny.

01:04:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, sometimes when we have our little party scenes, there are people that I'm like, I know that person.

01:04:45
Speaker 2: I know that person. I don't know how I know them, you know.

01:04:48
Speaker 3: Yes, it's a great showcase for the character actors to come on.

01:04:51
Speaker 1: Definitely, and also sometimes there are people that we just know from the peripheral world of New York, which is fun.

01:04:58
Speaker 2: All right.

01:04:59
Speaker 1: The agony in the I feel like there's things we missed. But wait, do we did fully discuss the end scene, so basically remind me how it ends with Big. So he's there, he's likable, he's come to deliver her birthday balloons in champagne. They have a very sweet time, but then she just gets out of the car.

01:05:17
Speaker 3: Right, yes, And that is something I love about this is that he doesn't have He's not like, come on, carry, let's go out, let's go out dancing or something.

01:05:26
Speaker 2: No.

01:05:26
Speaker 3: No, he is just coming by to celebrate her birthday, give her champagne, give her balloons, and then be gone. He wants to celebrate her, which is nice, no expectations for her. Yeah, and I just think after the night she's had, yes, such a great little moment.

01:05:41
Speaker 2: And as we haven't seen him in a while, right, Like I can't remember when we last saw him. It was a while, Yeah, is it when they fell in the in the in the in the pond in the park. Think I think so too. Oh that's good, that's very good.

01:05:53
Speaker 1: That's very good because yeah, he's going to move to London, yeah, right at that time. But I also love when he asked her in the car, did you have a good day, and she says, yes, that was so great. So I was like, see, that's maturity. No one ever talks about Carrie's maturity. But look, there's a mature moment. You know, she had a great day because she went through all the different things and then she ended up with her friends, and then she was content walking down the street and then here he was a surprise, just like it should be, you know, like just to cherry on top. It was interesting though, because in the sound you know, voiceover, doesn't she say something about like calling back to Charlotte saying then they can just be nice guys that we have fun with yeah, And I'm like, well, that's not a good description of bit but okay, I mean he was nice in that car scene, but you know what I mean, that's not I wouldn't think of him in that category. But that's okay, that's okay, that's me nitpicking. But I did think, like, just as a beginning of a season, how incredible, like Michael Patrick King, Oh my god, it's.

01:07:00
Speaker 3: A grand slam right out of the Gates train season.

01:07:03
Speaker 1: And I tried to figure out if this is when he wins his first individual Emmy, but I don't think it is. But I do think I need to figure out better because we win our Emmy for the show.

01:07:20
Speaker 2: In September of two thousand and one because it was the Emmys that we called the semi Emmys because they didn't happen on time because we had declared war in Iraq.

01:07:30
Speaker 1: Oh and we felt like that would be weird to have the award show and then when we had it, only Kim and I are there to get it. So it's just Kim and I holding the Emmy together, no one, no one else is there because we lived we were I think she was living in la I think she was living in La so both both she and I are there. I don't know if Michael Patrick's there. He's not in the pictures with us for some reason, which would imply he wasn't there. But if we wanted to, that would mean we did win for season three, which aired in two thousand, because there's all a little delay, you know what I mean, like you qualify the season before, right, but amazing that this is the season that we come on with you know in the season that we're gonna win. And I also think in my mind that's why season three and season four are mashed together, because I also think we made so many and I think that this is when, like the show in general, it was almost a year round job, right because we had the Golden Globes and the winner, we had the this, we had the that, there was this event, there was that event. I mean, maybe it really wasn't, but in my mind and I think I I think I might have. Maybe this is when I went to Canada and worked with Rob Low. I can't remember, but like you would do things in between, right, but I can't remember what it would it would have been, like you were trying to get little jobs in between that you would you know, could do make extra money or whatever and you know, hopefully have some fun. But then you just had like you know, the Golden Globes are like there were just big things that you were just living the whole year.

01:08:57
Speaker 2: Yeah, based on something going on.

01:08:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, which was so much fun and so great, so so so great. But I think that's why, like the whole like the season three, season four in my mind are one.

01:09:07
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, there's not really a break but a glory, a glorious season, a very long and glorious season, but quite amazing to look back and realize that this is Michael Patrick really coming into to his own in terms of like directing, writing both of them. It's pretty major. And he's so incredibly talented that he can do that and do it well.

01:09:30
Speaker 3: I mean, he's just he's one of the brilliant minds of television.

01:09:33
Speaker 1: It's I know it, I know, I know, I know, I know. I can't wait for the comeback. It's going to be super interesting. Also, we got to get him back.

01:09:41
Speaker 2: On the pod.

01:09:42
Speaker 1: We got to get him back over here. We have many questions. We're going to write them down and try to remember them all, all right, thank you Easton.

01:09:49
Speaker 2: I'm not even gonna ask you for your Charlotte because we've asked you.

01:09:51
Speaker 1: Oh yes, you should just come up with a surprise answer for us one time.

01:09:57
Speaker 3: No, I'm not.

01:09:58
Speaker 2: Ah, you're adorable. Thank you for being with us. You always have such good insight.

01:10:02
Speaker 3: It's so fun.

01:10:03
Speaker 2: I'm glad. Yeah, yeah, yeay. Thank you everybody for joining us. And are you a Charlotte?