Sept. 21, 2026
“Just Give Me One”: Patrick Clancy Hoped Baby Callan Would Survive, In First Interview Since Trial
Apple Podcasts 
Spotify 
Castro 
RSS Feed Patrick Clancy and his new wife, Dr. Rachel Danis sat down with ’60 Minutes’ Sunday in their first interview since Lindsay Clancy’s triple murder trial. Patrick said he clung to hope during the four days Callan survived after his siblings, 5-year-old Cora and 3-year-old Dawson, were found dead inside the family's home. We go over the key moments from the interview, including Patrick describing forgiving Lindsay, his panic attack during testimony, and the vile internet rumors that he killed his children, not Lindsay. His wife, Rachel joined him towards the end of the interview, confirming her pregnancy by acknowledging they are starting a new family.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
00:00:02
Speaker 1: Hey there, folks. Patrick Clancy finally speaks. This is the guy who we haven't heard from since day one and two of testimony in the Lindsay Clancy trial. Yes, her ex-husband, he is speaking. And we wonder, though, is this going to do anything to keep so many folks out there from accusing this man of murdering his own kids? And with that, welcome, everybody. I'm TJ. That's Robes. That part of it, Robes. We'll get into more of what he did here in this 60 Minutes interview. Did it help him Do you think in any way?
00:00:33
Speaker 2: I don't know that it did because look, everyone's got expectations. And I think especially as journalists who have sat down with these types of interviews, I personally had an expectation that I was going to get a little bit more from him. I, in terms of, and there were some moments where I felt connected to him and his loss and what he was going through. And I don't want to necessarily blame either the interviewer or the interviewee, but I didn't feel anything at the end of the interview. And I always would hope that I would feel like I walked away with a new insight or a new feeling about what this man has been through and who he is and what he wants the world to know. And I just was kind of left with... more questions.
00:01:23
Speaker 1: And we don't want to make sure we come across right. Not a criticism of the 60 Minutes interview in some way, but given all that we seem to know, Robes, it didn't extend my understanding necessarily. And this was the guy, is it not, that could tell us more about her and the lean-up than anybody else. And we didn't necessarily get that. Maybe that's something we wanted and they didn't necessarily want to go down that road. And look, this interview took a 12-13 minute segment. They probably had hours of Probably.
00:01:52
Speaker 2: And we don't know what the parameters were around the interview. Sometimes there will be an understanding, especially when it's someone like Patrick Clancy, who isn't accused of any kind of wrongdoing in any way. So he could say, hey, I'll sit down and talk to you, but please avoid these subjects. And because he's not somebody who needs to be questioned or we need answers from, that would be reasonable to say, we understand your pain and we're not going to We won't ask this question or we won't go there. Because I had so many questions just about his mental health, how he was feeling, how this has impacted his current relationship with his wife, how all of those questions I just I was hoping for some more in-depth emotional responses about how someone gets through the unimaginable and how someone can look forward to a new life or have hope. And I just, I guess there was just emotion that I was looking for that wasn't there.
00:02:52
Speaker 1: And he doesn't, and it's not on him necessarily, but even during testimony, we know that he was so stoic.
00:02:58
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:02:58
Speaker 1: He didn't show a lot of emotions. cracked in his voice a couple times talking about the kids, which is understandable. I'm saying his testimony and how he went about it was understandable to me. This is three years removed from the worst thing you could imagine happening to a parent. So I didn't think much of it, Robes, at the time, but that testimony is in line now, at least, with how he appeared in this interview. The same stoicism, not really an outwardly emotional guy, not even very animated in how he speaks and how he talks in robes, isn't that one of the very things that people were citing as to where, see, he's up to something. He's responsible because they point to how he was reacting.
00:03:45
Speaker 2: And you know what? He might just be numb. And it might be the only way he can talk about something so horrific is to remove himself partially from that emotion. And so he comes off as if he's reading the phone book. instead of talking about something so awful and so gutting. And so when his emotions don't match the narrative, people jump to conclusions.
00:04:09
Speaker 1: And they have. So we'll get through some of the things that certainly stood out, several highlights. Robes, I will get into his, he ended up in the back of an ambulance. None of us were aware of this. We'll explain that. Robes, the four days he had with little Callan. Um, that probably was the more, most emotional part that I heard. Also, he talked about Callan's birthday here in New York. This was fascinating to me, how he came to New York and felt, Oh wow, this is where I need to be because I can walk down the street and mourn and nobody's harassing me. Uh, we'll get into that. The forgiveness thing. Yeah, that was a big, big part. Um, and his suicidal thoughts. And you know what? We will talk about his wife, the new wife that's in here now. Uh, they got married just a few months ago.
00:04:53
Speaker 2: What?
00:04:54
Speaker 1: Correct. Um, I think it added to, she was at the end. There was something about her being at the end that took away from the emotion of the kids and it was like, and it's okay, it's about him and moving on. We are all still on the side of the kids. We are still concerned about that and maybe not so much our hearts are going out to his new family. To him, sure. There was something about the new woman. Being at the end. Nothing's wrong. Nobody did anything wrong. He got divorced and got married. Okay, fine. But there was something about her inclusion and wrapping up with her that took emotion away from me for some reason.
00:05:42
Speaker 2: I get that. And you know what? Look. and I know there's limited time on broadcast television, but I would have supported a full episode of 60 Minutes devoted solely to this, and maybe after the break come back with her. That would have felt a little bit more like you gave the proper time for Patrick to talk about the three children having to deal with this horrific murder trial and his support for his ex-wife, and then coming back after the break, having the hope be a part of it, the new beginnings, and just having us be able to maybe even cheer him on and cheer on his new family. It would have been nice. I know we all have these, and I say we journalists, and certain shows have their formulas, and I get that. I'm not saying that I know more than 60 Minutes knows on how to produce a show, but I would have sat through that entire show watching just Patrick Clancy And then having maybe the final segment with his new wife.
00:06:40
Speaker 1: And there's nothing, there's no knock against this woman. Her name is Dr. Rachel Dannis, by the way. And apologies, that sounds awful, the new wife.
00:06:48
Speaker 2: Yes, that is, I get that.
00:06:50
Speaker 1: I apologize, that sounds horrible. Her name is Dr. Rachel Dannis. And again, nothing against her. She didn't say anything wrong, do anything wrong. It was just... I guess, Robes, and two people like us, and I guess many other people out there, you follow this thing for so long, and you go on this ride of emotion, and I'm curious about her, I'm curious about their life together, but so much of this story really has to do with, I want to talk to Patrick about Lindsay, I don't want to talk to Patrick about Rachel, and kind of how it came out, and this is just, I think, maybe us being so invested in this story, but again, that's to everybody's editorial rhyme or reason for what they did there. So let's talk, we'll start here, Robes. You know what, start with the, we knew this because of the trial, but Callan, the youngest, eight months old, didn't die until several days later. And Robes, I hadn't heard this type of description about what those four days were like for Patrick Clancy.
00:07:45
Speaker 2: This was gutting to imagine what this must have been like to have had hope because he had hope. He knew immediately- that his little girl, Cora, and Dawson, the middle guy, that they were gone. And he knew that immediately. But Callan had a heartbeat, the eight-month-old. And to think that he rushed to the hospital when he knew that there was a heartbeat, he knew that his child was being airlifted, and he thought, maybe, maybe, maybe I can still have one child. And that hope for four days, he actually is grateful he had it. He was grateful he had the time with his child, hooked up to life support, thinking that maybe there was a chance.
00:08:40
Speaker 1: And the part, Robes, again, I didn't realize this, but his quote was, I really thought there was a chance that Callan would live, and I remembered thinking, just give me one, just give me one kid. And I would raise him as best I could and give him the best life I possibly could. And I could tell him about his brother and sister. To think you're in that position, like, just give me one. Like I heard him say, just that was the most emotional thing I think I've heard from Patrick Clancy at any point. Just give me one kid.
00:09:15
Speaker 2: Right. And that's so real. And that's such a real human emotion that all of us would have. And he said, I'm so grateful that For those four days that I had with him, I'm so grateful that he hung on. I said, I'm so sorry. And I got to hold him. I got to lay down next to him and he died in my arms. I mean, that to me was oof to imagine that just to be able to be with him when he died, because I think to imagine that those other two you would be in your head like I was out getting dinner. I was picking up dinner. I thought I was coming home with medicine for Cora. And you come back and they're gone and there's nothing you can do and they died. You saw them 30 minutes earlier or at least I guess earlier in the day and then you come back and to think that you had one. And I was imagining how angry, I don't know what his religious beliefs are or how he gets through and he did talk about how he didn't know that he would live to see another birthday and we'll get into that. But to think that you're praying so hard to just have one and to lose that child too, this feeling of despair and hopelessness would be overwhelming. You'd think, why? Why couldn't you just give me one?
00:10:32
Speaker 1: And I don't remember Robes, and we watched every moment of his testimony, but I don't remember detail, these details that he's talking about here that they got into. And Robes, this was the most gutting part and fascinating and you couldn't help but your heart go out to him And this is another one of those moments. Would anybody listen to this who has put up some post saying, Patrick did it. Patrick did it. Could anybody really listen to this, see this, and then still go back to your same conspiracy theory? Can you really listen to this guy and feel justified in plucking out little nuggets and blowing them up into something that's a conspiracy theory and telling the world that this guy killed his kids? After listening to this, It's.
00:11:16
Speaker 2: Tough, but I do think, unfortunately, people are judging his demeanor, his body language. He's not getting emotional. He doesn't look the way I think I would look or the way someone should look after having lived through this. But no one knows what it would be like. And, yeah, there would be a part of you that would be numb. It would have to be to survive. You would have to remove yourself in some space from it because to be that close to those kinds of emotions, I don't think you could continue. So I actually would say part of his removed demeanor is almost certainly a defense mechanism. But people choose to go to other places to describe his demeanor. But talking about Callan's birthday here in New York City, this rang true for me. I know it had to for you because New York is one of those places where you can be anonymous in the city of nine million. There are so many other people who are dealing with so many other things, celebrities and tourists. And there's just So many folks, you can cry on a city sidewalk and no one notices. And for him, that's what he needed.
00:12:21
Speaker 1: Isn't that crazy? Because he, what's the name of it? Duxbury? Duxbury in Massachusetts.
00:12:26
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:12:27
Speaker 1: Okay. You can imagine what it was like for him in that town. And everything was just a reminder of his family, of his kids. And he told the story in the 60 Minutes interview about he just happened to be passing by one of the kids' schools around the time that it would have been a drop-off and pick-up. He said he pulled over and just lost it, just cried his eyes out, and he realized, I've got to get the hell out of this town.
00:12:50
Speaker 2: That makes sense.
00:12:51
Speaker 1: Ropes, you can't function.
00:12:52
Speaker 2: You cannot.
00:12:53
Speaker 1: In that town. So he says he moves to New York. And so little Callan's birthday, his one-year birthday, right? You already buried a kid. It didn't make it to one. So the birthday's coming up. He's here in New York trying to figure out what he wanted to do in Ropes. When he said it, I'm like, oh, that makes sense because that placeâ is that for a lot of people, stopping by St. Patrick's Cathedral here in New York on Fifth Avenue.
00:13:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, he lit a candle for Callan. That sounds like the perfect thing to do, honoring his one-year birthday. And he said, this is a quote from him, I walked out on Fifth Avenue and I started crying my eyes out and nobody cared and I thought, this is where I need to be.
00:13:32
Speaker 1: What a line. Wow.
00:13:35
Speaker 2: I have cried on the city streets of New York and you can and it's kind of awesome. Nobody.
00:13:41
Speaker 1: Nobody. We'll break stride. It's just, it's just, Rose, that is such a New York thing.
00:13:48
Speaker 2: It is.
00:13:48
Speaker 1: And for us, obviously that makes sense, but to combine it there with what we've watched in the Lindsay Clancy trial. Rose, that thing right there rings so true. And it's not cold. It's not being like people don't care or uncaring. It's just.
00:14:02
Speaker 2: So much going on.
00:14:02
Speaker 1: This is that kind of city, babe. Everybody's, you don't have time to be worried about some stranger's problems as you're walking down the street. This is one place. If you've come to New York, you've probably walked past five A-list celebrities and didn't even know it.
00:14:17
Speaker 2: Correct.
00:14:18
Speaker 1: Because everybody's minding their business. Nobody's trying to get a camera and take a picture. You don't know how many times we walked past Chris Rock in Soho not too long ago. He's just passing by. Like nobody's bothering him. Nobody even knows who these folks are sometimes. He can get lost here.
00:14:35
Speaker 2: Yes, and how many times have we walked past people crying? I mean, it's just, it's one of those cities where you will see people just in every state of emotion. And there is an anonymity to it. And I just, that rang true for us both. But when he started talking about forgiving Lindsay Clancy, I thought this was actually a really poignant part of the interview where, and I didn't realize this, the interviewer asked, Has Lindsay ever asked for forgiveness? I actually want to know, has she ever said, I'm sorry? I don't know. But when it came to her forgiveness, I was surprised to hear Patrick Clancy's answer.
00:15:16
Speaker 1: And I'm not sure why. I don't know what I expected to hear. But he said, you know, she had never, has never asked him for forgiveness. Now, before we get into what he said after, did that part surprise you?
00:15:30
Speaker 2: It did.
00:15:31
Speaker 1: That she never said, I'm sorry for this?
00:15:32
Speaker 2: It did surprise me. All right. That was shocking to me. Look, and maybe perhaps that speaks to her mental state, but that would be the first thing. Obviously, the horror of it, the grief of it, but then the immediate next emotion would be to say you're sorry to the man who was their father, to the man who loved them just as much as you did.
00:15:57
Speaker 1: It was... That was the one question that I think... It seemed like Patrick Clancy wasn't prepared for it. It seemed like in his response, and this is only me saying this in what I saw, it was the one that caused him to pause and think, wait, I don't know the answer to this. And he had to re he took a beat and you could tell him looking and then almost, Oh no, she hasn't actually is how he responded. But Ropety also said she didn't have to, she didn't need to ask him for forgiveness because as he put it, um, I already gave it to her. When it comes to forgiveness, I felt like if I didn't get there, I would be eaten up inside forever. He granted her something that she didn't ask for. He forgave the woman that killed his three babies. He's right about the forgiveness part. Robes, you have to do that for yourself. It's not for the other person. What does that say? That's where I jump to, babe. What does it tell us about her and where she is in this whole mental health crisis that many say she's still in that she hasn't she hasn't.
00:17:07
Speaker 2: Said that to him if she's never apologized or never asked for forgiveness that would speak to me very plainly to her mental health issues because a somebody who was in their right state of mind that would be a natural if not immediate response.
00:17:24
Speaker 1: Is there any way somebody's going to also look at that babe and can fairly say this speaks also to her state of mind which is not insane of a monster who killed somebody, who killed her kids, and hasn't even said I'm sorry to him.
00:17:38
Speaker 2: You could interpret it that way as well.
00:17:39
Speaker 1: I wonder. But I was shocked.
00:17:43
Speaker 2: I was too.
00:17:44
Speaker 1: When he said that. They also wrote, and we did a couple episodes on this. What is it? The shoes, her body temperature. the superficial wounds.
00:18:04
Speaker 2: The email that he sent.
00:18:06
Speaker 1: Yes. These little things that have been plucked out from that evening that the kids died. And people take one thing and say, aha, this means he killed the kids.
00:18:17
Speaker 2: And the new wife was a big part of it too. And I hate to say the new wife, but that is how she's referred to.
00:18:22
Speaker 1: But the suggestion there was that she was waiting in the wings or he was involved with her beforehand, which they explained last night. They met afterwards for sure. But Robes, it's, They had to address this part. Robes, it sounds, listening to him, not based on how he was saying it, because he never got upset. He never showed any emotion. But Robes, he described. I'm like, this has been hell for him.
00:18:46
Speaker 2: Yes, but it is interesting because of all of these deeply painful topics he's addressing and talking about. When they aren't accompanied with the emotion you expect them to be paired with, That's why people continue to attack him and accuse him and assume the worst of him because he isn't behaving. Even though his words are powerful, there isn't emotion behind those words that we would expect. And because he's so measured and so flat in how he speaks about horrific things, people get confused and they don't know how to take what he's saying Because it doesn't match what they think he should be feeling while he's saying it. Yes, it's not fair.
00:19:30
Speaker 1: But, Roms, you're not reacting the way you should. Guilty.
00:19:33
Speaker 2: Exactly. But people think they know. And that's the sad thing. But when he talked about the attacks, this is what he had to say. It is deeply harmful to the legacy of my children. I thought that was powerful. So even if, like, forget me. You're actually harming. my children's legacy you're changing what happened and it's harmful to them so if it's in defense of them which i think a lot of people are coming at it from that perspective they want justice for the kids i thought that was an interesting way to shape that but.
00:20:04
Speaker 1: Justice and legacy how is it a good legacy for right the legacy here Or it should be. We should all walk away from this having to do with what?
00:20:13
Speaker 2: Let's make sure this doesn't happen again.
00:20:16
Speaker 1: But this whole story is about postpartum depression and mental health of women. Isn't this supposed to be the legacy moving forward? Yes. Is that fair?
00:20:26
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:20:26
Speaker 1: I mean, we have to get this right.
00:20:29
Speaker 2: Okay.
00:20:29
Speaker 1: Okay. It changes the legacy of the kids if you tell me that they were killed by their dad in a secret plot because he wanted to be with a woman in New York. That is a legacy problem. He should be pissed about that. You are pissing on my kid's legacy by sitting here saying their dad killed him. That's, well, no, come on, y'all. I don't know how to talk. I try to leave room, right, for everybody having an opinion, everybody internet sleuths and doing this thing and having their hearts in the right place, but it's gone wild and unreasonable. in questioning and call it flat out. If you can come, just say, Patrick killed the kids. People are just saying it flat out. They're not saying, hmm, I wonder about or I wonder about. They're saying he's a killer.
00:21:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it ends up becoming like water cooler talk where people are joking and guessing and he needed to address this. So yes, he said, it is deeply harmful to the legacy of my children. It's a huge distraction from what really matters here. which is perinatal mental health. And it's done real harm to real people, myself included, but also others. It's painful to see and it makes it difficult to be in public. And it's possible some of those people are seeing, after seeing lie after lie after lie after lie, and they start to believe it. And that's what we're left with. Look, it's interesting. He moved to New York City for anonymity because not only could he not be reminded of all of what his children were a part of in the community was a part of. Imagine just in that small town going to pick up pizza or going to the drugstore or going to that CVS you were at, you know, that day, that fateful day. Yeah, you can understand why he would constantly be getting looks and stares and people, you know, that's a lot to bear. So to come to New York City to have a, I hate to say a fresh start, but certainly an One of anonymity. Once this trial came out and he testified and all these online folks are saying what they're saying, his face is just now as recognizable as Lindsay Clancy's. And now even in New York City, and we can see it from the pictures, paparazzi. They know where he lives now. They know where he's living with his wife. That's how it first came out that she was possibly pregnant because of paparazzi photos. So now that anonymity that he coming out of St. Patrick's Cathedral just a few months ago is gone because of this trial. It's gone.
00:22:55
Speaker 1: What do you do? Eventually this will probably slow down and the attention won't be so intense. But he's going through it once again. But Robes, I guess we didn't recognize. And we did. He was the first witness, right?
00:23:09
Speaker 2: He was.
00:23:09
Speaker 1: For the prosecution. And he was up there two days?
00:23:12
Speaker 2: He was.
00:23:12
Speaker 1: Is that right? Okay, so Robes, there was stuff. If you watched him, you would think, wow, he's holding up well.
00:23:19
Speaker 2: Yeah. He seemed, again, but that was almost to his detriment for the online votes, but he seemed measured, in control, calm, and unemotional.
00:23:28
Speaker 1: And I guess this was very surprising because we didn't know. Robes, at one point, he explained in the 60 Minutes interview, Robes, at one point, they took a break. This was around, what did he say, around the time with that 911 call Just after it was played or before?
00:23:43
Speaker 2: I think it was, I can't remember if it was before or after, but it was around that time, that very emotional time.
00:23:48
Speaker 1: And I guess, Rose, besides maybe some autopsy pictures and things, I think everyone agrees, and the public didn't get to hear it, but in that courtroom, they talked about just how difficult it was for everybody to hear that 911 call.
00:24:01
Speaker 2: Oh, the jurors were openly weeping.
00:24:03
Speaker 1: Oh, I had to take breaks a couple times.
00:24:05
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:24:05
Speaker 1: Okay. So during one of those breaks, we had, we didn't know this, But Patrick Clance, he says he went to the back row and essentially went into panic.
00:24:14
Speaker 2: He had a panic attack.
00:24:16
Speaker 1: Yeah.
00:24:16
Speaker 2: And they said he actually got put into the back of an ambulance. They offered him medication. And he ended up just saying, I've got to go back in. I've got to finish this. I can't have this mental break right now. So it's just a reminder what people put on the outside, what they show in their face, what they show in their voice. He was probably so.
00:24:39
Speaker 2: Seemingly disengaged from his emotions because he had to be when he was up on that stand. He had to be, he had to compartmentalize or he wouldn't have been able to do what he did.
00:24:50
Speaker 1: That is just another example. Man, y'all please give people a break.
00:24:53
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:24:54
Speaker 1: Well, just another example, a guy that everybody's calling a monster, right? On the stand, they take a break. This guy you're talking shit about is literally in an ambulance during a break in his testimony. brought his ass back out, and continued to testify, not emotional enough for some. And so we're going to call him a killer. He was in an ambulance, and they were trying to give him medicine and take him to the hospital, and he said no. He was going to finish his testimony. Robes, all we saw was the guy on the stand. That's the guy you all are saying, or some people are saying, not emotional enough. He just got out of an ambulance, and you didn't know it, and you're talking shit about him.
00:25:33
Speaker 2: Exactly. And so, yes, when you see someone and you see him again, seemingly unemotional in this interview, just a reminder, people mask their pain in different ways. And some people have to not be connected to that physical part of the emotion. They have to remove themselves. And to that point, he said, I didn't think I'd live to see my 35th birthday and I was completely fine with it.
00:25:56
Speaker 1: That sentence, when you stop, I didn't think I'd live to see my 35th birthday, period. I mean, that's stunning. That's shocking. That lets you know where he is. He delivered that last part, and I was completely fine with it in such an emotionless, matter-of-fact way. I was completely fine with that. Like, wow, that's where he was. He didn't care.
00:26:15
Speaker 2: He didn't care.
00:26:15
Speaker 1: He didn't care. These folks, I cannot imagine. Again, we've talked about some stuff. We've gone through publicly intense scrutiny and whatnot. Nobody was calling us a killer.
00:26:28
Speaker 2: No. Of your own children. When you've lost something that most of us can't imagine, and I think most of us would say, you've had your three children murdered by the person you slept in bed with every night. How do you get up in the morning? How do you find the will to survive? How do you actually want to continue living? So the fact that he goes to New York City and ends up meeting this woman in a run club. So he's running, he's finding an outlet. He meets someone, I can understand. Yes, to have someone along with you in that journey, to have someone help you, to maybe even have someone share that grief with you, who are we to say that isn't exactly what he should have done, needed to do, and that was right for him. And so just to have her brought into some of this, there are all of these, just because he moved on so quickly, Maybe it was his lifeline. Maybe if he hadn't met Rachel Danis, maybe he wouldn't have lived to see his birthday. You know, I mean, I just think instead of making somehow her some negative figure, like she might have saved him.
00:27:48
Speaker 1: What is it? And help me. Again, I always say you read more of that stuff than I do. What is the criticism of her? What's coming her way? What are you trying to say? What does she do?
00:27:58
Speaker 2: They just believe that they knew each other while he was still married to Lindsay. They're acting as if they're treating her as if she's the other woman. When he met her a little less, I guess almost exactly a year from the death of his children. January of 2024 is when they met at the run club. A year had gone by. He meets this woman. She sees a picture of the kids on his phone because he has it on his phone. his main phone. And he said, who are those cuties? I believe is what she said. And he just said to her, they're dead.
00:28:31
Speaker 1: And. Well, that was an interesting story to hear. They said they were at the coffee shop checking out. They were at the counter and she happened to see the kids. So she just asked to think, right. He's walking around.
00:28:42
Speaker 2: They're just friends.
00:28:43
Speaker 1: Anonymity. Yeah. This man is walking around at that time. It was 2024. He's got three dead kids on his phone, on his background. Walking around, carrying out his day robes. And she sees it. She didn't know to think anything of it. She knows the guy and is not aware of his story at that point. To the point she has no problem to say, oh, who are those three?
00:29:04
Speaker 2: Who are those cuties? Thinking he's probably, she said she figured that they must be back in Massachusetts because she knew where he was from and probably thinking it was a divorce. And ex-wife has the kids in the Boston area and he's here in New York. That's not an uncommon story. So that's where her head went. But to think that she, you know, wasn't scared away by that, I mean, that has to be something that's fairly traumatic. I don't know if they were dating. I don't think they were dating yet. I think they were just friends and friendly and meeting and met up at this coffee shop. But, you know, that is a uh, a, a huge weight that you take on when you befriend someone like that and then choose to be in a relationship with them. So I think instead of the sad thing is instead of them being supported and applauded for being able to, to be each other's support system and to move on and be able to not move on, but to move with this grief together. That is something that should be applauded. That's something that should be supported. That's something that I would think we would all hope someone could find and be able to cling to. And we should celebrate that instead of tear them down.
00:30:12
Speaker 1: You said support, applaud, celebrate. Even if you don't want to do that, just leave them the hell alone. You don't have to support them. You don't have to be happy about it. Okay, then you're not in the game. Why do you still need to send something their way? And she is, we couldn't tell for sure, which they did acknowledge. Only in the 60 Minutes piece, the way they put it is starting a family. But they didn't get into too many details.
00:30:37
Speaker 2: They just confirmed because, again, the paparazzi photos, she is clearly pregnant. We don't know how far along she is. We don't know when the baby's due date is. And obviously now, given all of this attention, I'm sure there's some concern about the safety of their family and the safety of their child. And so, look, I feel for them and what it must be like to be in this spotlight that they never wanted to be in. And instead of, again, getting the support, they're receiving criticism and certainly even death threats at this point.
00:31:10
Speaker 1: I don't know if we'll hear from him again. He had to. Well, he didn't have to, but he chose to do one. One sit-down, one big one. They chose to have her a part of it. They didn't have to do that. So I don't know what this will do to what's out there. Will it change the narrative? Maybe things will just calm down and slow down once the story starts to fade and it's not in our face every day the way it was.
00:31:31
Speaker 2: But unfortunately for them, the story is still continuing. If there had been a verdict... And that verdict would have stood, then maybe there could be some closure, but now we don't know. Is there going to be another trial? Is there going to be a deal made? What's going to happen to Lindsay Clancy? So until that is settled, it's still going to be what folks are talking about for a little bit of time to come. And certainly, I mean, I can't even imagine knowing. I mean, she's a fertility doctor. She knows probably a lot of folks to have this baby in privacy, but just to have to navigate that on top of all the headlines. It's hard enough giving birth and having a new baby and just to have it under these circumstances with this spotlight. That's got to be pretty tough for them. So I'm sure going and doing this interview, they were hoping to put to bed some of the constant headlines that are on them about them.
00:32:26
Speaker 1: All right, folks. But as always, just be kind in your commentary. Nothing wrong with an opinion. Nothing wrong with engaging in this conversation. But I think all of us know the limits. We all generally know what we should and shouldn't be saying. And folks cross that line every day for whatever reason.
00:32:47
Speaker 2: And it has real-life impact.
00:32:48
Speaker 1: It does. But, folks, just wanted to get you caught up. Yeah, we were highly anticipated. We couldn't wait to hear from Patrick Clancy, given how closely we watched this case. But he has spoken. So, folks, we always appreciate you spending a little time with us on behalf of my dear Robes. I'm TJ. Talk soon.
Speaker 1: Hey there, folks. Patrick Clancy finally speaks. This is the guy who we haven't heard from since day one and two of testimony in the Lindsay Clancy trial. Yes, her ex-husband, he is speaking. And we wonder, though, is this going to do anything to keep so many folks out there from accusing this man of murdering his own kids? And with that, welcome, everybody. I'm TJ. That's Robes. That part of it, Robes. We'll get into more of what he did here in this 60 Minutes interview. Did it help him Do you think in any way?
00:00:33
Speaker 2: I don't know that it did because look, everyone's got expectations. And I think especially as journalists who have sat down with these types of interviews, I personally had an expectation that I was going to get a little bit more from him. I, in terms of, and there were some moments where I felt connected to him and his loss and what he was going through. And I don't want to necessarily blame either the interviewer or the interviewee, but I didn't feel anything at the end of the interview. And I always would hope that I would feel like I walked away with a new insight or a new feeling about what this man has been through and who he is and what he wants the world to know. And I just was kind of left with... more questions.
00:01:23
Speaker 1: And we don't want to make sure we come across right. Not a criticism of the 60 Minutes interview in some way, but given all that we seem to know, Robes, it didn't extend my understanding necessarily. And this was the guy, is it not, that could tell us more about her and the lean-up than anybody else. And we didn't necessarily get that. Maybe that's something we wanted and they didn't necessarily want to go down that road. And look, this interview took a 12-13 minute segment. They probably had hours of Probably.
00:01:52
Speaker 2: And we don't know what the parameters were around the interview. Sometimes there will be an understanding, especially when it's someone like Patrick Clancy, who isn't accused of any kind of wrongdoing in any way. So he could say, hey, I'll sit down and talk to you, but please avoid these subjects. And because he's not somebody who needs to be questioned or we need answers from, that would be reasonable to say, we understand your pain and we're not going to We won't ask this question or we won't go there. Because I had so many questions just about his mental health, how he was feeling, how this has impacted his current relationship with his wife, how all of those questions I just I was hoping for some more in-depth emotional responses about how someone gets through the unimaginable and how someone can look forward to a new life or have hope. And I just, I guess there was just emotion that I was looking for that wasn't there.
00:02:52
Speaker 1: And he doesn't, and it's not on him necessarily, but even during testimony, we know that he was so stoic.
00:02:58
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:02:58
Speaker 1: He didn't show a lot of emotions. cracked in his voice a couple times talking about the kids, which is understandable. I'm saying his testimony and how he went about it was understandable to me. This is three years removed from the worst thing you could imagine happening to a parent. So I didn't think much of it, Robes, at the time, but that testimony is in line now, at least, with how he appeared in this interview. The same stoicism, not really an outwardly emotional guy, not even very animated in how he speaks and how he talks in robes, isn't that one of the very things that people were citing as to where, see, he's up to something. He's responsible because they point to how he was reacting.
00:03:45
Speaker 2: And you know what? He might just be numb. And it might be the only way he can talk about something so horrific is to remove himself partially from that emotion. And so he comes off as if he's reading the phone book. instead of talking about something so awful and so gutting. And so when his emotions don't match the narrative, people jump to conclusions.
00:04:09
Speaker 1: And they have. So we'll get through some of the things that certainly stood out, several highlights. Robes, I will get into his, he ended up in the back of an ambulance. None of us were aware of this. We'll explain that. Robes, the four days he had with little Callan. Um, that probably was the more, most emotional part that I heard. Also, he talked about Callan's birthday here in New York. This was fascinating to me, how he came to New York and felt, Oh wow, this is where I need to be because I can walk down the street and mourn and nobody's harassing me. Uh, we'll get into that. The forgiveness thing. Yeah, that was a big, big part. Um, and his suicidal thoughts. And you know what? We will talk about his wife, the new wife that's in here now. Uh, they got married just a few months ago.
00:04:53
Speaker 2: What?
00:04:54
Speaker 1: Correct. Um, I think it added to, she was at the end. There was something about her being at the end that took away from the emotion of the kids and it was like, and it's okay, it's about him and moving on. We are all still on the side of the kids. We are still concerned about that and maybe not so much our hearts are going out to his new family. To him, sure. There was something about the new woman. Being at the end. Nothing's wrong. Nobody did anything wrong. He got divorced and got married. Okay, fine. But there was something about her inclusion and wrapping up with her that took emotion away from me for some reason.
00:05:42
Speaker 2: I get that. And you know what? Look. and I know there's limited time on broadcast television, but I would have supported a full episode of 60 Minutes devoted solely to this, and maybe after the break come back with her. That would have felt a little bit more like you gave the proper time for Patrick to talk about the three children having to deal with this horrific murder trial and his support for his ex-wife, and then coming back after the break, having the hope be a part of it, the new beginnings, and just having us be able to maybe even cheer him on and cheer on his new family. It would have been nice. I know we all have these, and I say we journalists, and certain shows have their formulas, and I get that. I'm not saying that I know more than 60 Minutes knows on how to produce a show, but I would have sat through that entire show watching just Patrick Clancy And then having maybe the final segment with his new wife.
00:06:40
Speaker 1: And there's nothing, there's no knock against this woman. Her name is Dr. Rachel Dannis, by the way. And apologies, that sounds awful, the new wife.
00:06:48
Speaker 2: Yes, that is, I get that.
00:06:50
Speaker 1: I apologize, that sounds horrible. Her name is Dr. Rachel Dannis. And again, nothing against her. She didn't say anything wrong, do anything wrong. It was just... I guess, Robes, and two people like us, and I guess many other people out there, you follow this thing for so long, and you go on this ride of emotion, and I'm curious about her, I'm curious about their life together, but so much of this story really has to do with, I want to talk to Patrick about Lindsay, I don't want to talk to Patrick about Rachel, and kind of how it came out, and this is just, I think, maybe us being so invested in this story, but again, that's to everybody's editorial rhyme or reason for what they did there. So let's talk, we'll start here, Robes. You know what, start with the, we knew this because of the trial, but Callan, the youngest, eight months old, didn't die until several days later. And Robes, I hadn't heard this type of description about what those four days were like for Patrick Clancy.
00:07:45
Speaker 2: This was gutting to imagine what this must have been like to have had hope because he had hope. He knew immediately- that his little girl, Cora, and Dawson, the middle guy, that they were gone. And he knew that immediately. But Callan had a heartbeat, the eight-month-old. And to think that he rushed to the hospital when he knew that there was a heartbeat, he knew that his child was being airlifted, and he thought, maybe, maybe, maybe I can still have one child. And that hope for four days, he actually is grateful he had it. He was grateful he had the time with his child, hooked up to life support, thinking that maybe there was a chance.
00:08:40
Speaker 1: And the part, Robes, again, I didn't realize this, but his quote was, I really thought there was a chance that Callan would live, and I remembered thinking, just give me one, just give me one kid. And I would raise him as best I could and give him the best life I possibly could. And I could tell him about his brother and sister. To think you're in that position, like, just give me one. Like I heard him say, just that was the most emotional thing I think I've heard from Patrick Clancy at any point. Just give me one kid.
00:09:15
Speaker 2: Right. And that's so real. And that's such a real human emotion that all of us would have. And he said, I'm so grateful that For those four days that I had with him, I'm so grateful that he hung on. I said, I'm so sorry. And I got to hold him. I got to lay down next to him and he died in my arms. I mean, that to me was oof to imagine that just to be able to be with him when he died, because I think to imagine that those other two you would be in your head like I was out getting dinner. I was picking up dinner. I thought I was coming home with medicine for Cora. And you come back and they're gone and there's nothing you can do and they died. You saw them 30 minutes earlier or at least I guess earlier in the day and then you come back and to think that you had one. And I was imagining how angry, I don't know what his religious beliefs are or how he gets through and he did talk about how he didn't know that he would live to see another birthday and we'll get into that. But to think that you're praying so hard to just have one and to lose that child too, this feeling of despair and hopelessness would be overwhelming. You'd think, why? Why couldn't you just give me one?
00:10:32
Speaker 1: And I don't remember Robes, and we watched every moment of his testimony, but I don't remember detail, these details that he's talking about here that they got into. And Robes, this was the most gutting part and fascinating and you couldn't help but your heart go out to him And this is another one of those moments. Would anybody listen to this who has put up some post saying, Patrick did it. Patrick did it. Could anybody really listen to this, see this, and then still go back to your same conspiracy theory? Can you really listen to this guy and feel justified in plucking out little nuggets and blowing them up into something that's a conspiracy theory and telling the world that this guy killed his kids? After listening to this, It's.
00:11:16
Speaker 2: Tough, but I do think, unfortunately, people are judging his demeanor, his body language. He's not getting emotional. He doesn't look the way I think I would look or the way someone should look after having lived through this. But no one knows what it would be like. And, yeah, there would be a part of you that would be numb. It would have to be to survive. You would have to remove yourself in some space from it because to be that close to those kinds of emotions, I don't think you could continue. So I actually would say part of his removed demeanor is almost certainly a defense mechanism. But people choose to go to other places to describe his demeanor. But talking about Callan's birthday here in New York City, this rang true for me. I know it had to for you because New York is one of those places where you can be anonymous in the city of nine million. There are so many other people who are dealing with so many other things, celebrities and tourists. And there's just So many folks, you can cry on a city sidewalk and no one notices. And for him, that's what he needed.
00:12:21
Speaker 1: Isn't that crazy? Because he, what's the name of it? Duxbury? Duxbury in Massachusetts.
00:12:26
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:12:27
Speaker 1: Okay. You can imagine what it was like for him in that town. And everything was just a reminder of his family, of his kids. And he told the story in the 60 Minutes interview about he just happened to be passing by one of the kids' schools around the time that it would have been a drop-off and pick-up. He said he pulled over and just lost it, just cried his eyes out, and he realized, I've got to get the hell out of this town.
00:12:50
Speaker 2: That makes sense.
00:12:51
Speaker 1: Ropes, you can't function.
00:12:52
Speaker 2: You cannot.
00:12:53
Speaker 1: In that town. So he says he moves to New York. And so little Callan's birthday, his one-year birthday, right? You already buried a kid. It didn't make it to one. So the birthday's coming up. He's here in New York trying to figure out what he wanted to do in Ropes. When he said it, I'm like, oh, that makes sense because that placeâ is that for a lot of people, stopping by St. Patrick's Cathedral here in New York on Fifth Avenue.
00:13:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, he lit a candle for Callan. That sounds like the perfect thing to do, honoring his one-year birthday. And he said, this is a quote from him, I walked out on Fifth Avenue and I started crying my eyes out and nobody cared and I thought, this is where I need to be.
00:13:32
Speaker 1: What a line. Wow.
00:13:35
Speaker 2: I have cried on the city streets of New York and you can and it's kind of awesome. Nobody.
00:13:41
Speaker 1: Nobody. We'll break stride. It's just, it's just, Rose, that is such a New York thing.
00:13:48
Speaker 2: It is.
00:13:48
Speaker 1: And for us, obviously that makes sense, but to combine it there with what we've watched in the Lindsay Clancy trial. Rose, that thing right there rings so true. And it's not cold. It's not being like people don't care or uncaring. It's just.
00:14:02
Speaker 2: So much going on.
00:14:02
Speaker 1: This is that kind of city, babe. Everybody's, you don't have time to be worried about some stranger's problems as you're walking down the street. This is one place. If you've come to New York, you've probably walked past five A-list celebrities and didn't even know it.
00:14:17
Speaker 2: Correct.
00:14:18
Speaker 1: Because everybody's minding their business. Nobody's trying to get a camera and take a picture. You don't know how many times we walked past Chris Rock in Soho not too long ago. He's just passing by. Like nobody's bothering him. Nobody even knows who these folks are sometimes. He can get lost here.
00:14:35
Speaker 2: Yes, and how many times have we walked past people crying? I mean, it's just, it's one of those cities where you will see people just in every state of emotion. And there is an anonymity to it. And I just, that rang true for us both. But when he started talking about forgiving Lindsay Clancy, I thought this was actually a really poignant part of the interview where, and I didn't realize this, the interviewer asked, Has Lindsay ever asked for forgiveness? I actually want to know, has she ever said, I'm sorry? I don't know. But when it came to her forgiveness, I was surprised to hear Patrick Clancy's answer.
00:15:16
Speaker 1: And I'm not sure why. I don't know what I expected to hear. But he said, you know, she had never, has never asked him for forgiveness. Now, before we get into what he said after, did that part surprise you?
00:15:30
Speaker 2: It did.
00:15:31
Speaker 1: That she never said, I'm sorry for this?
00:15:32
Speaker 2: It did surprise me. All right. That was shocking to me. Look, and maybe perhaps that speaks to her mental state, but that would be the first thing. Obviously, the horror of it, the grief of it, but then the immediate next emotion would be to say you're sorry to the man who was their father, to the man who loved them just as much as you did.
00:15:57
Speaker 1: It was... That was the one question that I think... It seemed like Patrick Clancy wasn't prepared for it. It seemed like in his response, and this is only me saying this in what I saw, it was the one that caused him to pause and think, wait, I don't know the answer to this. And he had to re he took a beat and you could tell him looking and then almost, Oh no, she hasn't actually is how he responded. But Ropety also said she didn't have to, she didn't need to ask him for forgiveness because as he put it, um, I already gave it to her. When it comes to forgiveness, I felt like if I didn't get there, I would be eaten up inside forever. He granted her something that she didn't ask for. He forgave the woman that killed his three babies. He's right about the forgiveness part. Robes, you have to do that for yourself. It's not for the other person. What does that say? That's where I jump to, babe. What does it tell us about her and where she is in this whole mental health crisis that many say she's still in that she hasn't she hasn't.
00:17:07
Speaker 2: Said that to him if she's never apologized or never asked for forgiveness that would speak to me very plainly to her mental health issues because a somebody who was in their right state of mind that would be a natural if not immediate response.
00:17:24
Speaker 1: Is there any way somebody's going to also look at that babe and can fairly say this speaks also to her state of mind which is not insane of a monster who killed somebody, who killed her kids, and hasn't even said I'm sorry to him.
00:17:38
Speaker 2: You could interpret it that way as well.
00:17:39
Speaker 1: I wonder. But I was shocked.
00:17:43
Speaker 2: I was too.
00:17:44
Speaker 1: When he said that. They also wrote, and we did a couple episodes on this. What is it? The shoes, her body temperature. the superficial wounds.
00:18:04
Speaker 2: The email that he sent.
00:18:06
Speaker 1: Yes. These little things that have been plucked out from that evening that the kids died. And people take one thing and say, aha, this means he killed the kids.
00:18:17
Speaker 2: And the new wife was a big part of it too. And I hate to say the new wife, but that is how she's referred to.
00:18:22
Speaker 1: But the suggestion there was that she was waiting in the wings or he was involved with her beforehand, which they explained last night. They met afterwards for sure. But Robes, it's, They had to address this part. Robes, it sounds, listening to him, not based on how he was saying it, because he never got upset. He never showed any emotion. But Robes, he described. I'm like, this has been hell for him.
00:18:46
Speaker 2: Yes, but it is interesting because of all of these deeply painful topics he's addressing and talking about. When they aren't accompanied with the emotion you expect them to be paired with, That's why people continue to attack him and accuse him and assume the worst of him because he isn't behaving. Even though his words are powerful, there isn't emotion behind those words that we would expect. And because he's so measured and so flat in how he speaks about horrific things, people get confused and they don't know how to take what he's saying Because it doesn't match what they think he should be feeling while he's saying it. Yes, it's not fair.
00:19:30
Speaker 1: But, Roms, you're not reacting the way you should. Guilty.
00:19:33
Speaker 2: Exactly. But people think they know. And that's the sad thing. But when he talked about the attacks, this is what he had to say. It is deeply harmful to the legacy of my children. I thought that was powerful. So even if, like, forget me. You're actually harming. my children's legacy you're changing what happened and it's harmful to them so if it's in defense of them which i think a lot of people are coming at it from that perspective they want justice for the kids i thought that was an interesting way to shape that but.
00:20:04
Speaker 1: Justice and legacy how is it a good legacy for right the legacy here Or it should be. We should all walk away from this having to do with what?
00:20:13
Speaker 2: Let's make sure this doesn't happen again.
00:20:16
Speaker 1: But this whole story is about postpartum depression and mental health of women. Isn't this supposed to be the legacy moving forward? Yes. Is that fair?
00:20:26
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:20:26
Speaker 1: I mean, we have to get this right.
00:20:29
Speaker 2: Okay.
00:20:29
Speaker 1: Okay. It changes the legacy of the kids if you tell me that they were killed by their dad in a secret plot because he wanted to be with a woman in New York. That is a legacy problem. He should be pissed about that. You are pissing on my kid's legacy by sitting here saying their dad killed him. That's, well, no, come on, y'all. I don't know how to talk. I try to leave room, right, for everybody having an opinion, everybody internet sleuths and doing this thing and having their hearts in the right place, but it's gone wild and unreasonable. in questioning and call it flat out. If you can come, just say, Patrick killed the kids. People are just saying it flat out. They're not saying, hmm, I wonder about or I wonder about. They're saying he's a killer.
00:21:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it ends up becoming like water cooler talk where people are joking and guessing and he needed to address this. So yes, he said, it is deeply harmful to the legacy of my children. It's a huge distraction from what really matters here. which is perinatal mental health. And it's done real harm to real people, myself included, but also others. It's painful to see and it makes it difficult to be in public. And it's possible some of those people are seeing, after seeing lie after lie after lie after lie, and they start to believe it. And that's what we're left with. Look, it's interesting. He moved to New York City for anonymity because not only could he not be reminded of all of what his children were a part of in the community was a part of. Imagine just in that small town going to pick up pizza or going to the drugstore or going to that CVS you were at, you know, that day, that fateful day. Yeah, you can understand why he would constantly be getting looks and stares and people, you know, that's a lot to bear. So to come to New York City to have a, I hate to say a fresh start, but certainly an One of anonymity. Once this trial came out and he testified and all these online folks are saying what they're saying, his face is just now as recognizable as Lindsay Clancy's. And now even in New York City, and we can see it from the pictures, paparazzi. They know where he lives now. They know where he's living with his wife. That's how it first came out that she was possibly pregnant because of paparazzi photos. So now that anonymity that he coming out of St. Patrick's Cathedral just a few months ago is gone because of this trial. It's gone.
00:22:55
Speaker 1: What do you do? Eventually this will probably slow down and the attention won't be so intense. But he's going through it once again. But Robes, I guess we didn't recognize. And we did. He was the first witness, right?
00:23:09
Speaker 2: He was.
00:23:09
Speaker 1: For the prosecution. And he was up there two days?
00:23:12
Speaker 2: He was.
00:23:12
Speaker 1: Is that right? Okay, so Robes, there was stuff. If you watched him, you would think, wow, he's holding up well.
00:23:19
Speaker 2: Yeah. He seemed, again, but that was almost to his detriment for the online votes, but he seemed measured, in control, calm, and unemotional.
00:23:28
Speaker 1: And I guess this was very surprising because we didn't know. Robes, at one point, he explained in the 60 Minutes interview, Robes, at one point, they took a break. This was around, what did he say, around the time with that 911 call Just after it was played or before?
00:23:43
Speaker 2: I think it was, I can't remember if it was before or after, but it was around that time, that very emotional time.
00:23:48
Speaker 1: And I guess, Rose, besides maybe some autopsy pictures and things, I think everyone agrees, and the public didn't get to hear it, but in that courtroom, they talked about just how difficult it was for everybody to hear that 911 call.
00:24:01
Speaker 2: Oh, the jurors were openly weeping.
00:24:03
Speaker 1: Oh, I had to take breaks a couple times.
00:24:05
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:24:05
Speaker 1: Okay. So during one of those breaks, we had, we didn't know this, But Patrick Clance, he says he went to the back row and essentially went into panic.
00:24:14
Speaker 2: He had a panic attack.
00:24:16
Speaker 1: Yeah.
00:24:16
Speaker 2: And they said he actually got put into the back of an ambulance. They offered him medication. And he ended up just saying, I've got to go back in. I've got to finish this. I can't have this mental break right now. So it's just a reminder what people put on the outside, what they show in their face, what they show in their voice. He was probably so.
00:24:39
Speaker 2: Seemingly disengaged from his emotions because he had to be when he was up on that stand. He had to be, he had to compartmentalize or he wouldn't have been able to do what he did.
00:24:50
Speaker 1: That is just another example. Man, y'all please give people a break.
00:24:53
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:24:54
Speaker 1: Well, just another example, a guy that everybody's calling a monster, right? On the stand, they take a break. This guy you're talking shit about is literally in an ambulance during a break in his testimony. brought his ass back out, and continued to testify, not emotional enough for some. And so we're going to call him a killer. He was in an ambulance, and they were trying to give him medicine and take him to the hospital, and he said no. He was going to finish his testimony. Robes, all we saw was the guy on the stand. That's the guy you all are saying, or some people are saying, not emotional enough. He just got out of an ambulance, and you didn't know it, and you're talking shit about him.
00:25:33
Speaker 2: Exactly. And so, yes, when you see someone and you see him again, seemingly unemotional in this interview, just a reminder, people mask their pain in different ways. And some people have to not be connected to that physical part of the emotion. They have to remove themselves. And to that point, he said, I didn't think I'd live to see my 35th birthday and I was completely fine with it.
00:25:56
Speaker 1: That sentence, when you stop, I didn't think I'd live to see my 35th birthday, period. I mean, that's stunning. That's shocking. That lets you know where he is. He delivered that last part, and I was completely fine with it in such an emotionless, matter-of-fact way. I was completely fine with that. Like, wow, that's where he was. He didn't care.
00:26:15
Speaker 2: He didn't care.
00:26:15
Speaker 1: He didn't care. These folks, I cannot imagine. Again, we've talked about some stuff. We've gone through publicly intense scrutiny and whatnot. Nobody was calling us a killer.
00:26:28
Speaker 2: No. Of your own children. When you've lost something that most of us can't imagine, and I think most of us would say, you've had your three children murdered by the person you slept in bed with every night. How do you get up in the morning? How do you find the will to survive? How do you actually want to continue living? So the fact that he goes to New York City and ends up meeting this woman in a run club. So he's running, he's finding an outlet. He meets someone, I can understand. Yes, to have someone along with you in that journey, to have someone help you, to maybe even have someone share that grief with you, who are we to say that isn't exactly what he should have done, needed to do, and that was right for him. And so just to have her brought into some of this, there are all of these, just because he moved on so quickly, Maybe it was his lifeline. Maybe if he hadn't met Rachel Danis, maybe he wouldn't have lived to see his birthday. You know, I mean, I just think instead of making somehow her some negative figure, like she might have saved him.
00:27:48
Speaker 1: What is it? And help me. Again, I always say you read more of that stuff than I do. What is the criticism of her? What's coming her way? What are you trying to say? What does she do?
00:27:58
Speaker 2: They just believe that they knew each other while he was still married to Lindsay. They're acting as if they're treating her as if she's the other woman. When he met her a little less, I guess almost exactly a year from the death of his children. January of 2024 is when they met at the run club. A year had gone by. He meets this woman. She sees a picture of the kids on his phone because he has it on his phone. his main phone. And he said, who are those cuties? I believe is what she said. And he just said to her, they're dead.
00:28:31
Speaker 1: And. Well, that was an interesting story to hear. They said they were at the coffee shop checking out. They were at the counter and she happened to see the kids. So she just asked to think, right. He's walking around.
00:28:42
Speaker 2: They're just friends.
00:28:43
Speaker 1: Anonymity. Yeah. This man is walking around at that time. It was 2024. He's got three dead kids on his phone, on his background. Walking around, carrying out his day robes. And she sees it. She didn't know to think anything of it. She knows the guy and is not aware of his story at that point. To the point she has no problem to say, oh, who are those three?
00:29:04
Speaker 2: Who are those cuties? Thinking he's probably, she said she figured that they must be back in Massachusetts because she knew where he was from and probably thinking it was a divorce. And ex-wife has the kids in the Boston area and he's here in New York. That's not an uncommon story. So that's where her head went. But to think that she, you know, wasn't scared away by that, I mean, that has to be something that's fairly traumatic. I don't know if they were dating. I don't think they were dating yet. I think they were just friends and friendly and meeting and met up at this coffee shop. But, you know, that is a uh, a, a huge weight that you take on when you befriend someone like that and then choose to be in a relationship with them. So I think instead of the sad thing is instead of them being supported and applauded for being able to, to be each other's support system and to move on and be able to not move on, but to move with this grief together. That is something that should be applauded. That's something that should be supported. That's something that I would think we would all hope someone could find and be able to cling to. And we should celebrate that instead of tear them down.
00:30:12
Speaker 1: You said support, applaud, celebrate. Even if you don't want to do that, just leave them the hell alone. You don't have to support them. You don't have to be happy about it. Okay, then you're not in the game. Why do you still need to send something their way? And she is, we couldn't tell for sure, which they did acknowledge. Only in the 60 Minutes piece, the way they put it is starting a family. But they didn't get into too many details.
00:30:37
Speaker 2: They just confirmed because, again, the paparazzi photos, she is clearly pregnant. We don't know how far along she is. We don't know when the baby's due date is. And obviously now, given all of this attention, I'm sure there's some concern about the safety of their family and the safety of their child. And so, look, I feel for them and what it must be like to be in this spotlight that they never wanted to be in. And instead of, again, getting the support, they're receiving criticism and certainly even death threats at this point.
00:31:10
Speaker 1: I don't know if we'll hear from him again. He had to. Well, he didn't have to, but he chose to do one. One sit-down, one big one. They chose to have her a part of it. They didn't have to do that. So I don't know what this will do to what's out there. Will it change the narrative? Maybe things will just calm down and slow down once the story starts to fade and it's not in our face every day the way it was.
00:31:31
Speaker 2: But unfortunately for them, the story is still continuing. If there had been a verdict... And that verdict would have stood, then maybe there could be some closure, but now we don't know. Is there going to be another trial? Is there going to be a deal made? What's going to happen to Lindsay Clancy? So until that is settled, it's still going to be what folks are talking about for a little bit of time to come. And certainly, I mean, I can't even imagine knowing. I mean, she's a fertility doctor. She knows probably a lot of folks to have this baby in privacy, but just to have to navigate that on top of all the headlines. It's hard enough giving birth and having a new baby and just to have it under these circumstances with this spotlight. That's got to be pretty tough for them. So I'm sure going and doing this interview, they were hoping to put to bed some of the constant headlines that are on them about them.
00:32:26
Speaker 1: All right, folks. But as always, just be kind in your commentary. Nothing wrong with an opinion. Nothing wrong with engaging in this conversation. But I think all of us know the limits. We all generally know what we should and shouldn't be saying. And folks cross that line every day for whatever reason.
00:32:47
Speaker 2: And it has real-life impact.
00:32:48
Speaker 1: It does. But, folks, just wanted to get you caught up. Yeah, we were highly anticipated. We couldn't wait to hear from Patrick Clancy, given how closely we watched this case. But he has spoken. So, folks, we always appreciate you spending a little time with us on behalf of my dear Robes. I'm TJ. Talk soon.