Sept. 13, 2025
Bring On the Mess, Miss Taylor Frankie Paul is America’s New Bachelorette
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RSS Feed It was a year ago this week, that Amy and T.J. met and sat down with Taylor Frankie Paul for her role in Hulu’s “Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.” Paul was full of energy and authenticity and impressed us with her willingness to share and learn from her mess. Many say this is nothing more than a ratings grab by Disney and ABC to save their dying “Bachelorette” franchise, and while that may be true, Amy and T.J. say they’ll be watching just like you will be! If you want to hear our original interview with Taylor Frankie Paul, we’ve just reposted it, so check out the episode before this one.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
00:00:01
Speaker 1: Hey, there, folks. It was one year ago this week. Robot and I were on our way to iHeart Studios in Manhattan to meet and interview a reality TV star, And honestly, we were excited and a little nervous to meet her because all we knew of her was what we'd seen on the show. And on the show, let's just say she's a handful. But she not just won us over, she wowed us and even warmed our hearts. Her name Taylor Frankie Paul. So imagine our delight in finding out this week she's the new bachelorette. Fellas, God bless you, and with that, welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ. What the actual hell Taylor Frankie Paul is the new bachelorette? The show is going a different direction.
00:00:52
Speaker 2: Yes, that was jaw dropping, to be honest, Yes, we loved her, and mostly because she's just her authentic, messy self and I think we all have versions of that. Hers might be a little extreme and on display for the world to see. But you are talking about a young woman, she's thirty one, who is a single mom of three kids. She has very much said, I have two baby daddies, she has one divorce, and she was made famous and kind of thrust into this reality world and offered a show because of a soft swinging situation she had with her first husband where she would have sex with friends with him having sex with their wives in beds right next to each other. So yes, this is a departure from other choices for a bachelorette.
00:01:40
Speaker 1: Okay, and look, The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives a breakaway hit on Hulu and that is how when they approached us and wanted us to possibly interview her and another cast member. We had to get caught up and we watch the show. I think yes, we had several episodes. I'm not sure if we binged it or they send us the episodes to what.
00:02:02
Speaker 3: We've sent us about.
00:02:03
Speaker 2: I think three episodes in advance of the release of the series.
00:02:07
Speaker 1: Okay, do you remember your impressions of her initially in watching the show.
00:02:11
Speaker 3: Yes, I thought she was wild. I thought she was just she was I thought she was one of those.
00:02:20
Speaker 2: Women who I probably would have veered away from because of the drama.
00:02:26
Speaker 3: She is a she.
00:02:28
Speaker 2: Attracts a lot of drama, but she's a lot of fun to be around, and she's sweet, and she's wild and crazy and all of that, but she's.
00:02:37
Speaker 3: Fun to watch. I don't know how much fun I would have thought she would have been to be friends with.
00:02:41
Speaker 1: Okay, that was impression in watching the show, and I'm with you. She was just a little Tasmanian devil to a lot of a lot of ways. And yes, there was so much drama surrounding her, whether she brought her on herself, she egged it on or whatever. When that damn studio door opened and she walked in, I am telling you, it was a whole new world and a whole new her. I'm not saying she's putting on on the show, but there is to your when we first started, an authenticity with her that actually I think is coming from a real place, a good place. She's authentic, and she's emotional because she cares so much about this or that, and yeah, she's still a young woman. She could admit some mistakes she's made and things she should have done differently. But I think the thing about her that you and I certainly appreciated and respect it was just her being authentic and didn't seem to be putting on shot, not trying to win us over in any way, and we really appreciated.
00:03:42
Speaker 2: The time we have with and I do think she was unapologetically herself and she came into the studio she I believe at that point was a year sober, because she had come off facing charges and she pleaded out in some way to aggravated assault, and that all stemmed from a very drunken evening and a fire with her baby daddy, her boyfriend who she's since broken up with. But she had hit rock bottom, so to speak, on national television, and everyone knew her mess and everyone knew her worst behavior, I guess, and was all being held against her in a lot of ways and still is for some people, I'm sure. But when you go through something like that, something of your own doing, even you have a well she had a very admirable level of humility and understanding and wisdom that she gleaned from going through all of this.
00:04:33
Speaker 3: But she also still had that spark, that energy.
00:04:36
Speaker 2: That fun, cute, sweet hopeful energy of doing better and having and enjoying her life despite all the mistake she made.
00:04:47
Speaker 3: It led her to.
00:04:48
Speaker 2: Exactly where she was right then a year ago, sitting across from us, and we both genuinely liked her, appreciated her, and were rooting for her as she left the studio.
00:04:58
Speaker 1: A joy, optimism and in someone you have to appreciate and then you throw into it. Yes, she is. She has the personality to boot. She's a hoot. So that show is a hit, hit show for Hulu, which is owned by Disney. Bachelorette is a sinking, sinking, nearly dying show. Somewhat argue on ABC, which is owned by Disney. So what should we do here, robes If we as a company have reality show gold over here and a waning reality show over here, how could we possibly make this work?
00:05:40
Speaker 3: And this is absolutely a ratings grab.
00:05:43
Speaker 2: And a lot of folks point to the fact that this is a ratings stunt because the Bachelorette and Disney, we know it well. They are a conservative brand, so to speak. And this has been a show about marriage. This has been a show that hasn't just been about entertainment or antics or drama.
00:06:06
Speaker 1: And I think I want to make sure. I think you were saying conservative terms, not politics, polactics, not pushing the envelope.
00:06:12
Speaker 3: Correct.
00:06:13
Speaker 2: This is broadcast television. This isn't cable. There aren't f bombs flying. There aren't sexual scandals.
00:06:19
Speaker 3: That are being lauded.
00:06:22
Speaker 2: This isn't that's not what this show has been about that you know, we think about reality show on Bravo or on Yes Hulu, on all of these streaming networks, you can go into a lot of extremes that ABC and Disney would never want to do.
00:06:36
Speaker 1: So this is controversies they have been at. Any time a little hint of a controversy has come up on Bachelorette, they freak out exactly.
00:06:45
Speaker 2: So they are inviting a walking controversy and certainly goes against When I say conservative, I also mean values.
00:06:53
Speaker 3: So you know, you've got somebody who was a.
00:06:55
Speaker 2: Swinger who actually told everyone else about her swinging. It wasn't as if she found out she decided to tell everyone about it. She's been divorced, she's been in a messy relationships, she's been arrested for a violent act and had some sort of plea deal surrounding that, and she hasn't been shy about talking about it. And she's got three children, she's a single mom. So yes, this is a massive departure and they will get a lot of eyeballs because there are huge fans of Mormon Wives, and they'll be watching just to watch Taylor Frankie Paul do her thing because she is going to be entertaining.
00:07:33
Speaker 1: And this is not a criticism of what they're doing. Now, I knock yourselves out. Do whatever you want to do when it comes to ratings, and a lot of people will say this is a brilliant idea. It does tell you we're changing the Bachelorette franchise. That's okay. They are trying to keep up the Bachelorette with streaming dating shows that have taken off and raise the bar when it comes to how RAUNCHI you can get. The Bachelorette is rated G compared to triple X of some of the stuff we're watching on streaming. Who wants to watch the Bachelorette and everybody be all sweet and get out of their limos and do all this When I can go watch these hot bodied people make out and then go fight about it. She is that and so I have no problem if they want to make the ratings grab. I am I guess disappointed because we have had a close relationship with Bachelor Nation for a long time and including a lot of people who have been on those shows in one way or anothering that we consider friends. We have actually spent a lot of time with Trista and her husband recently, like real good time to see that family unit and to hear their story about their struggles and their real love and how they have been fighting and to stay together in twenty years? How many three kids? Teenagers? All, I'm like, wow, I love that this is not a show about finding love and engagement at the end anymore. And that's okay too.
00:09:07
Speaker 2: But they're not saying that publicly. Bachelorette is not, and certainly this is a show about marriage.
00:09:12
Speaker 3: I mean, they do tout.
00:09:13
Speaker 2: The relationships and the babies that have been made in both of the franchises, So are they going to have to acknowledge here that this is about entertainment, this is less about I mean, I'm going to be the cynic here and nothing against Taylor Frankie Paul because we absolutely enjoy her, love her and wish for the best. But do you genuinely think she's on this show to find a husband?
00:09:33
Speaker 1: No, because even in the Disney press release it said she is ready to trade headline making heartbreak for hometown dates as she begins making her mark on Bachelor.
00:09:46
Speaker 2: Nation, making her mark. So they're acknowledging it in that press conference that this isn't about her trying to find love, trying to find mister Wright, We're.
00:09:56
Speaker 1: About to put on a show with somebody that you all really really like, and we know as entertaining as hell.
00:10:01
Speaker 3: That's okay, that's okay, that's okay.
00:10:04
Speaker 2: But I and you're right if the Bachelorette fan base has shrunks to such a small margin that they aren't really gonna get us say in what they'd prefer, if they'd prefer a true love story, a woman actually looking for love, a woman actually looking to settle down and find a man. And to your point that we were talking about before we jumped onto the microphones, these men, how many men are actually looking for a woman where they have to move to the state of Utah because she's made that very very clear that she will not. And I get that with her kids, and she said, because I don't have just one baby daddy, I have two baby daddies. I do not have a choice other than to live in the state of Utah. So now you're saying you're gonna get an eligible group of men who have to move to the state of Utah, who are totally okay with raising two different men's children who are very very young. One I believe her kids are one, five, and eight. And so you're juggling with two x's their kids and you have to live in Utah. How many men would run into that relationship?
00:11:05
Speaker 3: Willingly?
00:11:07
Speaker 1: You on paper would never say that's what you are looking for? Obviously, But this rose you bring up is going to be a very important point in conversation and a sensitive one around this dating show. What's wrong with dating a woman who is once divorced, has three kids, has this stuff going on to where we are, we might get some insight into saying that's okay. It's like it's okay to date someone who's been divorced, and generally we know that. But normally, and you're looking at your dating pool, that wouldn't be your first go to or you know what, it would be a turnoff if you were sitting next to someone on the first or second date. I got three kids, they're at this age two or with this guy. Another's with this guy, and I'm gonna need you to move to Utah. I'm never gonna leave here one day too. You would say no, you would say I can't sign up for this. But in this case, all of these guys know exactly what they're signing up for, which is her. The problem there is what robes are they really signing up for? Love?
00:12:13
Speaker 2: That's my point, that's my point to be stars because yes, exactly, and obviously in no way am I or you, but certainly am I because of what I just said, implying in any way that she's any less valuable as a human, as a partner. In fact, I think that sometimes when you've gone through actually not sometimes, most times, when you've gone through what she's gone through, you're going to be a better partner because you have made the mistakes and you've hopefully learned from those mistakes, or at least, if that's your goal, to constantly be in that mode of learning and evolving because of what you've been through. So I actually there's incredible value to that. My point is when you've got these twenty something year old guys, who are you know, all model good looking, the idea would be that mostly they'd be there for the Instagram followers, for the deals that you're going to get from brands. You see what's happening with Love Island and all of these shows that we have actually loved watching from the relationship standpoint, and you still do get really interesting takeaways. But the truth is, these folks all now see the business model attached to being on a reality show and even a reality dating show. It's less about the relationship and it's more about the career.
00:13:20
Speaker 1: So if we're all in on it, is it fine? I mean, they're not trying to fool us to think this is.
00:13:24
Speaker 2: All about It does take away, yes, I get it, but it does take away a little bit, like I'm less excited about watching if I know that it's all just for money and it's all just for what comes after the show. It's all about being a brand champion for whatever that makes it feel. Again, we talked about authenticity, and that's what I'm hoping from Taylor Frankie Paul that she's she's not in on it, She's just gonna be real and if she sees some guy there for the wrong reason, she's going to call them out on it, which actually will be refreshing. I do think that that is her appeal one hundred percent, and she can't deviate from that. I can't imagine she would at this point.
00:14:02
Speaker 3: Why would she?
00:14:03
Speaker 1: Now, Well, folks, if you don't believe us that this is a ratings grab, if you will, she is not the only Secret Lies of Mormon Wives star that is going to be showing up on another reality show on ABC. Will tell you who they are. Also, they have put out a call for eligible bachelors. We will read to you the casting call for the upcoming Tailey Tailey, Taylor, Frankie Paul. I'm surprised I haven't screwed that up.
00:14:36
Speaker 3: You mentioned that she actually has three first names. That's unusual Taylor and confusing Paul.
00:14:42
Speaker 1: But yeah, we'll tell you what the casting call actually says. Stay here all right, back now, folks. They are yes, taking a shot at, so say Robe, saving the Bachelorette franchise. They have now cast Taylor Frankie Paul of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, no doubt the breakout star of that show. She is now the Bachelorette. The mother of three is going to be the new Bachelorette. Clearly, Rose, you know what the Bachelorette franchise. I didn't realize how much it has been hurting in recent seasons to the point this year is the first time and the second time in its entire history, they didn't air it during the summer. I didn't realize The Bachelorette is a summer thing. They moved it from the lineup this year.
00:15:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, Paradise didn't do well either, which is a spinoff that I have liked over the years.
00:15:41
Speaker 3: So they have been struggling.
00:15:43
Speaker 2: And just to get an idea of the reaction from some of the fans, who most people believe more are fans of the Secret Wives of Mormon Wives Secret Lives of Mormon Wives than they are of The Bachelorette. But one fan on ex roate ABC and Hulu ate that casting up another did that did make the tectonic plates below me shift, Like people are really excited. Quite possibly one of the smartest moves in reality television.
00:16:09
Speaker 3: Space I've seen in years.
00:16:10
Speaker 2: So from a marketing standpoint, this is full excitement. I mean, people are like they cannot wait to see because they believe they're going to be watching a train wreck on broadcast TV in a storied franchise that hasn't really had anyone quite like Taylor Frankie Paul No, and all.
00:16:29
Speaker 1: Of and this is not an insult in any way, but are very much put together young ladies who have been the head of that franchise. I can't remember a lot not watching the seasons, but I mean a lot of them came through the studio, a whole bunch of.
00:16:46
Speaker 3: Rachel Lindsay a friend of ours.
00:16:48
Speaker 1: Rachel, but I mean I can't compare even knowing Lindsey or Rachel. As well as we know her personally, we party with her. I haven't seen her be as wild as no, no, no, no Tuesday morning, you know.
00:17:02
Speaker 2: No, it was more about representation and she was, oh yeah, no. This this is a massive departure.
00:17:08
Speaker 1: When you say most of the bachelorettes, again not to be offended, are very much put together, buttoned up, very professional, very I.
00:17:17
Speaker 3: Would use the word wholesome.
00:17:19
Speaker 2: Okay, fine, I mean I hate to say that, but I would say that would be the image that ABC and Disney have put out with the bachelorettes. They've chosen have been relatively wholesome, wifey material, like that's what they have been putting up as their poster woman for the Bachelorette up until now.
00:17:39
Speaker 1: So in that regard. I do like the idea of putting someone up who is not in line with that idea, that mindset perfection is still wify material. I like that idea.
00:17:54
Speaker 2: I do too, because perfect is unattainable. Perfect is sometimes you know, I guess who was interesting to try and watch. But then it also I think as young women. I watched the show a couple of times with my girls many many years ago when they were little, and sometimes I kind of got icky, feeling like it was this fairy tale, like Cinderella's looking for her prints, and it had that kind of a feel to it.
00:18:15
Speaker 3: So for that, I do love that Taylor Frankie Paul.
00:18:19
Speaker 2: Is a modern day woman in the sense that she has made mistakes. She's not apologizing for her mistakes. She's owning them, she's learning from them, and she's sharing them. So we all maybe feel a little less shitty about the decisions we've made in our lives. I mean, we all live in glass houses exhibit A right here. I appreciate people who've been through stuff and aren't shying away from it, but are leaning into it.
00:18:44
Speaker 3: And she's one of them.
00:18:45
Speaker 1: And so yes, we talked about Yes, the Bachelorette franchise has been struggling in recent years with ratings, to the point some thought the show might actually go away last Now, I was going to ask you, you said you used to like the Bachelor in Paradise franchise to watch a bachelorrette? Why did you fall?
00:19:00
Speaker 3: Because it got boring? Boring, it got boring, and I just didn't like.
00:19:04
Speaker 2: The truth is, I actually do believe that some of the competing relationship shows on streaming services are just far more interesting and new and exciting.
00:19:13
Speaker 3: And who how's this going to work?
00:19:15
Speaker 1: As so high and sexy and drama filled.
00:19:17
Speaker 2: And you only have so much free time, and so yeah, I'm going to go where the entertainment is versus something that seems kind of old and stale and unattainable in a way.
00:19:27
Speaker 1: Is there drama on Bachelor and Bachelor just who.
00:19:30
Speaker 2: They're going to choose and whether or not they made the right choice because that person really loves someone not really not really no, well yes.
00:19:39
Speaker 1: Disney also has made a decision to put two other stars from Secret Lives of Mormon Wives on an ABC show, Dancing with the Stars, Whitney Levitt Gene Affleck. Excuse me, jen Affleck are going to be competing there, so they have an absolute juggernaut, and so they're trying to find a way to use those women on Mormon Wives to bost other properties. And here they are two of their biggest shows of the past quarter century. Now haven't those shows been around twenty plus yeah, seasons.
00:20:08
Speaker 2: At this point, it's clear they are on a marketing move to try and boost ratings, because you know, it doesn't matter what you do if no one's watching.
00:20:15
Speaker 3: And that's kind of where they are right now.
00:20:16
Speaker 2: And to the point where Taylor Frankie Paul if you read some of her or listen to some of her interviews, she was even surprised. She didn't think she was going to be chosen. She thought, why would anyone want to date me? I mean, that sounds awful, but she was kind of saying, I get it, like, I'm not exactly ooh, let me bring her home to mom kind of material. So she was a little worried about hometown dates and what all that was going to be like.
00:20:39
Speaker 3: She just thought she was.
00:20:41
Speaker 2: Shut shocked that they chose her, and it seemed genuine when she said that, I mean, we.
00:20:44
Speaker 1: Have to be open to this. It's just and this is not an insult to her, But these suitors. You go to a guy and say, hey, there's a woman you might be interested in. You're going to ask Okay, tell me about her. She's adorable, she's this tall, dark hair. What does she do? She's on this reality show. She has cameras falling around all the time. Oh is that right? Oh she's divorced. She's got one divorce and she's got she got three kids, two with the husband and one with another guy. Okay, so I'll get one other thing. He has an arrest record. She was charged with the domestic violence incident. Most of the charges would drop. She just she just was played guilty to the aggravated assault charge. But other than that, great girl.
00:21:26
Speaker 3: I get it.
00:21:27
Speaker 2: And by the way, you said all that, now reverse it. What if the bachelor had that on his resume?
00:21:33
Speaker 1: What a domestic violence charge to baby Mama's.
00:21:36
Speaker 2: Yes, would he be would he be given the opportunity to be the bachelor?
00:21:41
Speaker 1: He would not? That would be an absolute uproar. We get that the standard is different. I'm not going to challenge it. Fine, but there is a reality here that I am not criticizing that. I am not actually saying she shouldn't be the Bachelorette. I just understand that this is going to be a different show. It's not the Bachelorettible, it's not finding love, is not getting down one knee at the end. Because also it's how long will they shoot the show over? Is it four months or six months? I'm not sure, but it's months. Yes, it could be as low as three, but as many as six. Is that enough time? You're going to bring the man into the home with your with your children, with your kids, and I think in a normal dating scenario you wouldn't do that. I don't know how she's going to handle the kids on the show.
00:22:23
Speaker 2: She doesn't have her kids on the show. At least she doesn't have the older two, Okay, on the show. She does not put them on the show.
00:22:31
Speaker 3: We know of them.
00:22:31
Speaker 2: She puts them on our social media, but obviously that's an agreement she has with her ex husband. I'm guessing where she has chosen not to or is required not to have them on Mormon Wives. So I'm sure we won't see them on the Bachelor. But it's a reality of her life that whoever this guy is would have to accept, and she said that is the number one thing she says she's looking for in a man is how he treats other people. But right there is how he's going to treat her children. Obviously.
00:23:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's it. It's just and a lot of guys are signing up. And I wanted to mention that the they're casting right now, but the casting call they've now put it in the hands of the same folks who do the Bravo shows. They've changed. They have brought in the people who cast. Yes, the real house who cast those shows are now casting.
00:23:19
Speaker 2: So it's casting instead of contestants. I mean that really is now probably a better way to put it. I'm just saying, because you're not asking for contestants who want to be her fiance or even her husband.
00:23:30
Speaker 3: They're looking for casting tomato tomata.
00:23:33
Speaker 1: Isn't that just something they say? But to your point there, I'm now looking down at the exact text of what they sent out as a casting call, and it does say now casting single men for the Bachelorette Season twenty two with Taylor Frankie Paul. If you or a friend are interested, email Wildside that blah blah blah, blah blah blah blah blah, and be sure to mention wildside media preferred you. Yeah, so it's they're casting.
00:23:59
Speaker 3: I mean, I guess do they? Oh I don't know this.
00:24:01
Speaker 2: I don't remember because, honestly, to the credit of ABC, Disney all of that in their marketing team, I don't remember actually knowing whether or not. And we were at ABC's we were in Bachelor Nation and promoting this through Good Morning America for years and years and years. But I guess do they always put out who the bachelorette is and like dangle her and say hey, if you want to be cast on the.
00:24:24
Speaker 3: Show with her?
00:24:25
Speaker 2: Or do they do it all at the same time. Do they cast men who want to find love and cast the bacherette all the same time or is this different where they're now dangling literally the bachelorette.
00:24:35
Speaker 1: We should know this. I should know this because usually you know what's what? Aren't Usually we find out about the new bachelor or bachelorette right after the other show. It's the one who ends up in sealing.
00:24:47
Speaker 3: Oh, you're right.
00:24:47
Speaker 2: So the contestants or now cast members know who the bachelorette is ahead of time, so they can decide, Hm, that's somebody who I might want to date.
00:24:56
Speaker 1: So it's rare that they have a contestant that comes from outside Bachelor.
00:25:00
Speaker 3: That makes sense.
00:25:01
Speaker 1: I think Matt was from outside. He hadn't been on a preview.
00:25:04
Speaker 3: He's best friends with Tyler. Is it Tyler? What's his name? Matheson?
00:25:09
Speaker 1: Tyler?
00:25:10
Speaker 2: No, I'm getting messed up now, Cameron Tyler, Cameron Cameron Matheson and Tyler Cameron Cameron, matthes he's from the soaps.
00:25:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love him, He's great, love, we love him. Sorry I got those names confused, But.
00:25:26
Speaker 2: That's how Matt came in because he was on the show because he was best friends with the Bachelor.
00:25:30
Speaker 1: But it's rare to get someone from out. Yes, technically he was from but yet she is from completely outside.
00:25:35
Speaker 3: Wait, well but she's in. She's in the ABC family, the Hulu family.
00:25:40
Speaker 1: I think there's a great opportunity here. I do think it's great. I think she is great, a woman who's made some mistakes. You can have all kinds of feelings about her. She is a polarizing figure, but she is authentic and I think just from our impressions of her, which are just a couple of hours we got this being with her was a delight and authentic person who's is in the right place, who's made some mistakes, who can admit that, and I just I'm absolutely rooting for but I'm also rooting for what a lot of she represents. This is before me getting cynical, but what it represents to show that, yes, most people are out there trying to date with a divorce on the resume, with the kids at the house, juggling a career or whatever else. I am excited about what that can say.
00:26:23
Speaker 3: I agree with you.
00:26:24
Speaker 1: I am excited about it. And they're going for the ratings way up. Fine. I just hope it doesn't turn into a circus.
00:26:30
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what, that's a really good point.
00:26:32
Speaker 2: I hope it really does show that so many of us are not we didn't get it right, we aren't perfect, and we're still looking for love and we're still worthy of love. And so I think that could be a cool I hope part of this season. And by the way, just in case, I want to let you guys know, if you just look back, I believe it'll be the previous episode from this one. We actually reposted our interview from exactly one year ago this week with Taylor Frankie Paul, before all the Bachelor announcement, before actually she even became the star that she is now. So if you want to hear for herself for yourself who she is and who she was a year ago before all of the fame really followed, encourage you to check that out so you kind of really get to see her and meet her the way we did. So thank you for listening to us.
00:27:20
Speaker 3: Everyone. I made me Roebuck alongside TJ. Holmes. Have a great day, everybody,
Speaker 1: Hey, there, folks. It was one year ago this week. Robot and I were on our way to iHeart Studios in Manhattan to meet and interview a reality TV star, And honestly, we were excited and a little nervous to meet her because all we knew of her was what we'd seen on the show. And on the show, let's just say she's a handful. But she not just won us over, she wowed us and even warmed our hearts. Her name Taylor Frankie Paul. So imagine our delight in finding out this week she's the new bachelorette. Fellas, God bless you, and with that, welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ. What the actual hell Taylor Frankie Paul is the new bachelorette? The show is going a different direction.
00:00:52
Speaker 2: Yes, that was jaw dropping, to be honest, Yes, we loved her, and mostly because she's just her authentic, messy self and I think we all have versions of that. Hers might be a little extreme and on display for the world to see. But you are talking about a young woman, she's thirty one, who is a single mom of three kids. She has very much said, I have two baby daddies, she has one divorce, and she was made famous and kind of thrust into this reality world and offered a show because of a soft swinging situation she had with her first husband where she would have sex with friends with him having sex with their wives in beds right next to each other. So yes, this is a departure from other choices for a bachelorette.
00:01:40
Speaker 1: Okay, and look, The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives a breakaway hit on Hulu and that is how when they approached us and wanted us to possibly interview her and another cast member. We had to get caught up and we watch the show. I think yes, we had several episodes. I'm not sure if we binged it or they send us the episodes to what.
00:02:02
Speaker 3: We've sent us about.
00:02:03
Speaker 2: I think three episodes in advance of the release of the series.
00:02:07
Speaker 1: Okay, do you remember your impressions of her initially in watching the show.
00:02:11
Speaker 3: Yes, I thought she was wild. I thought she was just she was I thought she was one of those.
00:02:20
Speaker 2: Women who I probably would have veered away from because of the drama.
00:02:26
Speaker 3: She is a she.
00:02:28
Speaker 2: Attracts a lot of drama, but she's a lot of fun to be around, and she's sweet, and she's wild and crazy and all of that, but she's.
00:02:37
Speaker 3: Fun to watch. I don't know how much fun I would have thought she would have been to be friends with.
00:02:41
Speaker 1: Okay, that was impression in watching the show, and I'm with you. She was just a little Tasmanian devil to a lot of a lot of ways. And yes, there was so much drama surrounding her, whether she brought her on herself, she egged it on or whatever. When that damn studio door opened and she walked in, I am telling you, it was a whole new world and a whole new her. I'm not saying she's putting on on the show, but there is to your when we first started, an authenticity with her that actually I think is coming from a real place, a good place. She's authentic, and she's emotional because she cares so much about this or that, and yeah, she's still a young woman. She could admit some mistakes she's made and things she should have done differently. But I think the thing about her that you and I certainly appreciated and respect it was just her being authentic and didn't seem to be putting on shot, not trying to win us over in any way, and we really appreciated.
00:03:42
Speaker 2: The time we have with and I do think she was unapologetically herself and she came into the studio she I believe at that point was a year sober, because she had come off facing charges and she pleaded out in some way to aggravated assault, and that all stemmed from a very drunken evening and a fire with her baby daddy, her boyfriend who she's since broken up with. But she had hit rock bottom, so to speak, on national television, and everyone knew her mess and everyone knew her worst behavior, I guess, and was all being held against her in a lot of ways and still is for some people, I'm sure. But when you go through something like that, something of your own doing, even you have a well she had a very admirable level of humility and understanding and wisdom that she gleaned from going through all of this.
00:04:33
Speaker 3: But she also still had that spark, that energy.
00:04:36
Speaker 2: That fun, cute, sweet hopeful energy of doing better and having and enjoying her life despite all the mistake she made.
00:04:47
Speaker 3: It led her to.
00:04:48
Speaker 2: Exactly where she was right then a year ago, sitting across from us, and we both genuinely liked her, appreciated her, and were rooting for her as she left the studio.
00:04:58
Speaker 1: A joy, optimism and in someone you have to appreciate and then you throw into it. Yes, she is. She has the personality to boot. She's a hoot. So that show is a hit, hit show for Hulu, which is owned by Disney. Bachelorette is a sinking, sinking, nearly dying show. Somewhat argue on ABC, which is owned by Disney. So what should we do here, robes If we as a company have reality show gold over here and a waning reality show over here, how could we possibly make this work?
00:05:40
Speaker 3: And this is absolutely a ratings grab.
00:05:43
Speaker 2: And a lot of folks point to the fact that this is a ratings stunt because the Bachelorette and Disney, we know it well. They are a conservative brand, so to speak. And this has been a show about marriage. This has been a show that hasn't just been about entertainment or antics or drama.
00:06:06
Speaker 1: And I think I want to make sure. I think you were saying conservative terms, not politics, polactics, not pushing the envelope.
00:06:12
Speaker 3: Correct.
00:06:13
Speaker 2: This is broadcast television. This isn't cable. There aren't f bombs flying. There aren't sexual scandals.
00:06:19
Speaker 3: That are being lauded.
00:06:22
Speaker 2: This isn't that's not what this show has been about that you know, we think about reality show on Bravo or on Yes Hulu, on all of these streaming networks, you can go into a lot of extremes that ABC and Disney would never want to do.
00:06:36
Speaker 1: So this is controversies they have been at. Any time a little hint of a controversy has come up on Bachelorette, they freak out exactly.
00:06:45
Speaker 2: So they are inviting a walking controversy and certainly goes against When I say conservative, I also mean values.
00:06:53
Speaker 3: So you know, you've got somebody who was a.
00:06:55
Speaker 2: Swinger who actually told everyone else about her swinging. It wasn't as if she found out she decided to tell everyone about it. She's been divorced, she's been in a messy relationships, she's been arrested for a violent act and had some sort of plea deal surrounding that, and she hasn't been shy about talking about it. And she's got three children, she's a single mom. So yes, this is a massive departure and they will get a lot of eyeballs because there are huge fans of Mormon Wives, and they'll be watching just to watch Taylor Frankie Paul do her thing because she is going to be entertaining.
00:07:33
Speaker 1: And this is not a criticism of what they're doing. Now, I knock yourselves out. Do whatever you want to do when it comes to ratings, and a lot of people will say this is a brilliant idea. It does tell you we're changing the Bachelorette franchise. That's okay. They are trying to keep up the Bachelorette with streaming dating shows that have taken off and raise the bar when it comes to how RAUNCHI you can get. The Bachelorette is rated G compared to triple X of some of the stuff we're watching on streaming. Who wants to watch the Bachelorette and everybody be all sweet and get out of their limos and do all this When I can go watch these hot bodied people make out and then go fight about it. She is that and so I have no problem if they want to make the ratings grab. I am I guess disappointed because we have had a close relationship with Bachelor Nation for a long time and including a lot of people who have been on those shows in one way or anothering that we consider friends. We have actually spent a lot of time with Trista and her husband recently, like real good time to see that family unit and to hear their story about their struggles and their real love and how they have been fighting and to stay together in twenty years? How many three kids? Teenagers? All, I'm like, wow, I love that this is not a show about finding love and engagement at the end anymore. And that's okay too.
00:09:07
Speaker 2: But they're not saying that publicly. Bachelorette is not, and certainly this is a show about marriage.
00:09:12
Speaker 3: I mean, they do tout.
00:09:13
Speaker 2: The relationships and the babies that have been made in both of the franchises, So are they going to have to acknowledge here that this is about entertainment, this is less about I mean, I'm going to be the cynic here and nothing against Taylor Frankie Paul because we absolutely enjoy her, love her and wish for the best. But do you genuinely think she's on this show to find a husband?
00:09:33
Speaker 1: No, because even in the Disney press release it said she is ready to trade headline making heartbreak for hometown dates as she begins making her mark on Bachelor.
00:09:46
Speaker 2: Nation, making her mark. So they're acknowledging it in that press conference that this isn't about her trying to find love, trying to find mister Wright, We're.
00:09:56
Speaker 1: About to put on a show with somebody that you all really really like, and we know as entertaining as hell.
00:10:01
Speaker 3: That's okay, that's okay, that's okay.
00:10:04
Speaker 2: But I and you're right if the Bachelorette fan base has shrunks to such a small margin that they aren't really gonna get us say in what they'd prefer, if they'd prefer a true love story, a woman actually looking for love, a woman actually looking to settle down and find a man. And to your point that we were talking about before we jumped onto the microphones, these men, how many men are actually looking for a woman where they have to move to the state of Utah because she's made that very very clear that she will not. And I get that with her kids, and she said, because I don't have just one baby daddy, I have two baby daddies. I do not have a choice other than to live in the state of Utah. So now you're saying you're gonna get an eligible group of men who have to move to the state of Utah, who are totally okay with raising two different men's children who are very very young. One I believe her kids are one, five, and eight. And so you're juggling with two x's their kids and you have to live in Utah. How many men would run into that relationship?
00:11:05
Speaker 3: Willingly?
00:11:07
Speaker 1: You on paper would never say that's what you are looking for? Obviously, But this rose you bring up is going to be a very important point in conversation and a sensitive one around this dating show. What's wrong with dating a woman who is once divorced, has three kids, has this stuff going on to where we are, we might get some insight into saying that's okay. It's like it's okay to date someone who's been divorced, and generally we know that. But normally, and you're looking at your dating pool, that wouldn't be your first go to or you know what, it would be a turnoff if you were sitting next to someone on the first or second date. I got three kids, they're at this age two or with this guy. Another's with this guy, and I'm gonna need you to move to Utah. I'm never gonna leave here one day too. You would say no, you would say I can't sign up for this. But in this case, all of these guys know exactly what they're signing up for, which is her. The problem there is what robes are they really signing up for? Love?
00:12:13
Speaker 2: That's my point, that's my point to be stars because yes, exactly, and obviously in no way am I or you, but certainly am I because of what I just said, implying in any way that she's any less valuable as a human, as a partner. In fact, I think that sometimes when you've gone through actually not sometimes, most times, when you've gone through what she's gone through, you're going to be a better partner because you have made the mistakes and you've hopefully learned from those mistakes, or at least, if that's your goal, to constantly be in that mode of learning and evolving because of what you've been through. So I actually there's incredible value to that. My point is when you've got these twenty something year old guys, who are you know, all model good looking, the idea would be that mostly they'd be there for the Instagram followers, for the deals that you're going to get from brands. You see what's happening with Love Island and all of these shows that we have actually loved watching from the relationship standpoint, and you still do get really interesting takeaways. But the truth is, these folks all now see the business model attached to being on a reality show and even a reality dating show. It's less about the relationship and it's more about the career.
00:13:20
Speaker 1: So if we're all in on it, is it fine? I mean, they're not trying to fool us to think this is.
00:13:24
Speaker 2: All about It does take away, yes, I get it, but it does take away a little bit, like I'm less excited about watching if I know that it's all just for money and it's all just for what comes after the show. It's all about being a brand champion for whatever that makes it feel. Again, we talked about authenticity, and that's what I'm hoping from Taylor Frankie Paul that she's she's not in on it, She's just gonna be real and if she sees some guy there for the wrong reason, she's going to call them out on it, which actually will be refreshing. I do think that that is her appeal one hundred percent, and she can't deviate from that. I can't imagine she would at this point.
00:14:02
Speaker 3: Why would she?
00:14:03
Speaker 1: Now, Well, folks, if you don't believe us that this is a ratings grab, if you will, she is not the only Secret Lies of Mormon Wives star that is going to be showing up on another reality show on ABC. Will tell you who they are. Also, they have put out a call for eligible bachelors. We will read to you the casting call for the upcoming Tailey Tailey, Taylor, Frankie Paul. I'm surprised I haven't screwed that up.
00:14:36
Speaker 3: You mentioned that she actually has three first names. That's unusual Taylor and confusing Paul.
00:14:42
Speaker 1: But yeah, we'll tell you what the casting call actually says. Stay here all right, back now, folks. They are yes, taking a shot at, so say Robe, saving the Bachelorette franchise. They have now cast Taylor Frankie Paul of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, no doubt the breakout star of that show. She is now the Bachelorette. The mother of three is going to be the new Bachelorette. Clearly, Rose, you know what the Bachelorette franchise. I didn't realize how much it has been hurting in recent seasons to the point this year is the first time and the second time in its entire history, they didn't air it during the summer. I didn't realize The Bachelorette is a summer thing. They moved it from the lineup this year.
00:15:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, Paradise didn't do well either, which is a spinoff that I have liked over the years.
00:15:41
Speaker 3: So they have been struggling.
00:15:43
Speaker 2: And just to get an idea of the reaction from some of the fans, who most people believe more are fans of the Secret Wives of Mormon Wives Secret Lives of Mormon Wives than they are of The Bachelorette. But one fan on ex roate ABC and Hulu ate that casting up another did that did make the tectonic plates below me shift, Like people are really excited. Quite possibly one of the smartest moves in reality television.
00:16:09
Speaker 3: Space I've seen in years.
00:16:10
Speaker 2: So from a marketing standpoint, this is full excitement. I mean, people are like they cannot wait to see because they believe they're going to be watching a train wreck on broadcast TV in a storied franchise that hasn't really had anyone quite like Taylor Frankie Paul No, and all.
00:16:29
Speaker 1: Of and this is not an insult in any way, but are very much put together young ladies who have been the head of that franchise. I can't remember a lot not watching the seasons, but I mean a lot of them came through the studio, a whole bunch of.
00:16:46
Speaker 3: Rachel Lindsay a friend of ours.
00:16:48
Speaker 1: Rachel, but I mean I can't compare even knowing Lindsey or Rachel. As well as we know her personally, we party with her. I haven't seen her be as wild as no, no, no, no Tuesday morning, you know.
00:17:02
Speaker 2: No, it was more about representation and she was, oh yeah, no. This this is a massive departure.
00:17:08
Speaker 1: When you say most of the bachelorettes, again not to be offended, are very much put together, buttoned up, very professional, very I.
00:17:17
Speaker 3: Would use the word wholesome.
00:17:19
Speaker 2: Okay, fine, I mean I hate to say that, but I would say that would be the image that ABC and Disney have put out with the bachelorettes. They've chosen have been relatively wholesome, wifey material, like that's what they have been putting up as their poster woman for the Bachelorette up until now.
00:17:39
Speaker 1: So in that regard. I do like the idea of putting someone up who is not in line with that idea, that mindset perfection is still wify material. I like that idea.
00:17:54
Speaker 2: I do too, because perfect is unattainable. Perfect is sometimes you know, I guess who was interesting to try and watch. But then it also I think as young women. I watched the show a couple of times with my girls many many years ago when they were little, and sometimes I kind of got icky, feeling like it was this fairy tale, like Cinderella's looking for her prints, and it had that kind of a feel to it.
00:18:15
Speaker 3: So for that, I do love that Taylor Frankie Paul.
00:18:19
Speaker 2: Is a modern day woman in the sense that she has made mistakes. She's not apologizing for her mistakes. She's owning them, she's learning from them, and she's sharing them. So we all maybe feel a little less shitty about the decisions we've made in our lives. I mean, we all live in glass houses exhibit A right here. I appreciate people who've been through stuff and aren't shying away from it, but are leaning into it.
00:18:44
Speaker 3: And she's one of them.
00:18:45
Speaker 1: And so yes, we talked about Yes, the Bachelorette franchise has been struggling in recent years with ratings, to the point some thought the show might actually go away last Now, I was going to ask you, you said you used to like the Bachelor in Paradise franchise to watch a bachelorrette? Why did you fall?
00:19:00
Speaker 3: Because it got boring? Boring, it got boring, and I just didn't like.
00:19:04
Speaker 2: The truth is, I actually do believe that some of the competing relationship shows on streaming services are just far more interesting and new and exciting.
00:19:13
Speaker 3: And who how's this going to work?
00:19:15
Speaker 1: As so high and sexy and drama filled.
00:19:17
Speaker 2: And you only have so much free time, and so yeah, I'm going to go where the entertainment is versus something that seems kind of old and stale and unattainable in a way.
00:19:27
Speaker 1: Is there drama on Bachelor and Bachelor just who.
00:19:30
Speaker 2: They're going to choose and whether or not they made the right choice because that person really loves someone not really not really no, well yes.
00:19:39
Speaker 1: Disney also has made a decision to put two other stars from Secret Lives of Mormon Wives on an ABC show, Dancing with the Stars, Whitney Levitt Gene Affleck. Excuse me, jen Affleck are going to be competing there, so they have an absolute juggernaut, and so they're trying to find a way to use those women on Mormon Wives to bost other properties. And here they are two of their biggest shows of the past quarter century. Now haven't those shows been around twenty plus yeah, seasons.
00:20:08
Speaker 2: At this point, it's clear they are on a marketing move to try and boost ratings, because you know, it doesn't matter what you do if no one's watching.
00:20:15
Speaker 3: And that's kind of where they are right now.
00:20:16
Speaker 2: And to the point where Taylor Frankie Paul if you read some of her or listen to some of her interviews, she was even surprised. She didn't think she was going to be chosen. She thought, why would anyone want to date me? I mean, that sounds awful, but she was kind of saying, I get it, like, I'm not exactly ooh, let me bring her home to mom kind of material. So she was a little worried about hometown dates and what all that was going to be like.
00:20:39
Speaker 3: She just thought she was.
00:20:41
Speaker 2: Shut shocked that they chose her, and it seemed genuine when she said that, I mean, we.
00:20:44
Speaker 1: Have to be open to this. It's just and this is not an insult to her, But these suitors. You go to a guy and say, hey, there's a woman you might be interested in. You're going to ask Okay, tell me about her. She's adorable, she's this tall, dark hair. What does she do? She's on this reality show. She has cameras falling around all the time. Oh is that right? Oh she's divorced. She's got one divorce and she's got she got three kids, two with the husband and one with another guy. Okay, so I'll get one other thing. He has an arrest record. She was charged with the domestic violence incident. Most of the charges would drop. She just she just was played guilty to the aggravated assault charge. But other than that, great girl.
00:21:26
Speaker 3: I get it.
00:21:27
Speaker 2: And by the way, you said all that, now reverse it. What if the bachelor had that on his resume?
00:21:33
Speaker 1: What a domestic violence charge to baby Mama's.
00:21:36
Speaker 2: Yes, would he be would he be given the opportunity to be the bachelor?
00:21:41
Speaker 1: He would not? That would be an absolute uproar. We get that the standard is different. I'm not going to challenge it. Fine, but there is a reality here that I am not criticizing that. I am not actually saying she shouldn't be the Bachelorette. I just understand that this is going to be a different show. It's not the Bachelorettible, it's not finding love, is not getting down one knee at the end. Because also it's how long will they shoot the show over? Is it four months or six months? I'm not sure, but it's months. Yes, it could be as low as three, but as many as six. Is that enough time? You're going to bring the man into the home with your with your children, with your kids, and I think in a normal dating scenario you wouldn't do that. I don't know how she's going to handle the kids on the show.
00:22:23
Speaker 2: She doesn't have her kids on the show. At least she doesn't have the older two, Okay, on the show. She does not put them on the show.
00:22:31
Speaker 3: We know of them.
00:22:31
Speaker 2: She puts them on our social media, but obviously that's an agreement she has with her ex husband. I'm guessing where she has chosen not to or is required not to have them on Mormon Wives. So I'm sure we won't see them on the Bachelor. But it's a reality of her life that whoever this guy is would have to accept, and she said that is the number one thing she says she's looking for in a man is how he treats other people. But right there is how he's going to treat her children. Obviously.
00:23:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's it. It's just and a lot of guys are signing up. And I wanted to mention that the they're casting right now, but the casting call they've now put it in the hands of the same folks who do the Bravo shows. They've changed. They have brought in the people who cast. Yes, the real house who cast those shows are now casting.
00:23:19
Speaker 2: So it's casting instead of contestants. I mean that really is now probably a better way to put it. I'm just saying, because you're not asking for contestants who want to be her fiance or even her husband.
00:23:30
Speaker 3: They're looking for casting tomato tomata.
00:23:33
Speaker 1: Isn't that just something they say? But to your point there, I'm now looking down at the exact text of what they sent out as a casting call, and it does say now casting single men for the Bachelorette Season twenty two with Taylor Frankie Paul. If you or a friend are interested, email Wildside that blah blah blah, blah blah blah blah blah, and be sure to mention wildside media preferred you. Yeah, so it's they're casting.
00:23:59
Speaker 3: I mean, I guess do they? Oh I don't know this.
00:24:01
Speaker 2: I don't remember because, honestly, to the credit of ABC, Disney all of that in their marketing team, I don't remember actually knowing whether or not. And we were at ABC's we were in Bachelor Nation and promoting this through Good Morning America for years and years and years. But I guess do they always put out who the bachelorette is and like dangle her and say hey, if you want to be cast on the.
00:24:24
Speaker 3: Show with her?
00:24:25
Speaker 2: Or do they do it all at the same time. Do they cast men who want to find love and cast the bacherette all the same time or is this different where they're now dangling literally the bachelorette.
00:24:35
Speaker 1: We should know this. I should know this because usually you know what's what? Aren't Usually we find out about the new bachelor or bachelorette right after the other show. It's the one who ends up in sealing.
00:24:47
Speaker 3: Oh, you're right.
00:24:47
Speaker 2: So the contestants or now cast members know who the bachelorette is ahead of time, so they can decide, Hm, that's somebody who I might want to date.
00:24:56
Speaker 1: So it's rare that they have a contestant that comes from outside Bachelor.
00:25:00
Speaker 3: That makes sense.
00:25:01
Speaker 1: I think Matt was from outside. He hadn't been on a preview.
00:25:04
Speaker 3: He's best friends with Tyler. Is it Tyler? What's his name? Matheson?
00:25:09
Speaker 1: Tyler?
00:25:10
Speaker 2: No, I'm getting messed up now, Cameron Tyler, Cameron Cameron Matheson and Tyler Cameron Cameron, matthes he's from the soaps.
00:25:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love him, He's great, love, we love him. Sorry I got those names confused, But.
00:25:26
Speaker 2: That's how Matt came in because he was on the show because he was best friends with the Bachelor.
00:25:30
Speaker 1: But it's rare to get someone from out. Yes, technically he was from but yet she is from completely outside.
00:25:35
Speaker 3: Wait, well but she's in. She's in the ABC family, the Hulu family.
00:25:40
Speaker 1: I think there's a great opportunity here. I do think it's great. I think she is great, a woman who's made some mistakes. You can have all kinds of feelings about her. She is a polarizing figure, but she is authentic and I think just from our impressions of her, which are just a couple of hours we got this being with her was a delight and authentic person who's is in the right place, who's made some mistakes, who can admit that, and I just I'm absolutely rooting for but I'm also rooting for what a lot of she represents. This is before me getting cynical, but what it represents to show that, yes, most people are out there trying to date with a divorce on the resume, with the kids at the house, juggling a career or whatever else. I am excited about what that can say.
00:26:23
Speaker 3: I agree with you.
00:26:24
Speaker 1: I am excited about it. And they're going for the ratings way up. Fine. I just hope it doesn't turn into a circus.
00:26:30
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what, that's a really good point.
00:26:32
Speaker 2: I hope it really does show that so many of us are not we didn't get it right, we aren't perfect, and we're still looking for love and we're still worthy of love. And so I think that could be a cool I hope part of this season. And by the way, just in case, I want to let you guys know, if you just look back, I believe it'll be the previous episode from this one. We actually reposted our interview from exactly one year ago this week with Taylor Frankie Paul, before all the Bachelor announcement, before actually she even became the star that she is now. So if you want to hear for herself for yourself who she is and who she was a year ago before all of the fame really followed, encourage you to check that out so you kind of really get to see her and meet her the way we did. So thank you for listening to us.
00:27:20
Speaker 3: Everyone. I made me Roebuck alongside TJ. Holmes. Have a great day, everybody,