Nov. 5, 2026
BREAKING: Actor Russell Brand Found Guilty Of Rape And Sexual Assault
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RSS Feed After a four-week, highly publicized trial, a London jury delivered guilty verdicts for actor and comedian, 51-year-old Russel Brand. It took jurors 8 hours to find Brand guilty of one count of rape and three counts of sexual assault, they found him not guilty on two other rape charges and not guilty of attempted indecent assault. Brand was immediately remanded into custody after being denied bail and could face up to life in prison when he is sentenced on Monday.
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00:00:02
Speaker 1: Hey there, folks. We thank you for being here. We're just getting word that superstar, international superstar, cross-pond superstar, Russell Brand, has been found guilty of rape and sexual assault, and he could be going to prison for a long, long time. Thank you, everybody, for being here. I'm TJ. That's Robes. What's the best way? I tried to really sum up, certainly here in the U.S., what he means as a superstar. But he is one that did make his way across the pond and found some pretty good success here in the U.S., yes?
00:00:37
Speaker 2: He had a very good run. He started out as a comedian, and he was always a comedic actor. But if anyone loves the movie Forgetting Sarah Marshall the way I did, that is where he really catapulted into fame.
00:00:50
Speaker 1: Is there anything bigger that he has done, in the U.S. at least, movie-wise, that is bigger than that one?
00:00:57
Speaker 2: I would say the fact, well, his amazing performance in Forgetting Sarah Marshall in 2008, by the way, sorry about that. He started dating Katy Perry, remember that. So that also put him in a certain level of celebrity because he was photographed everywhere with her.
00:01:13
Speaker 1: 100% forgot they dated.
00:01:15
Speaker 2: Yes, and he also hosted the 2008 and 2009 MTV Video Music Awards.
00:01:21
Speaker 1: What was the movie he did with Jonah Hill? Remember he was like, get him to the Greek or something?
00:01:26
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, there was something like that, too.
00:01:28
Speaker 1: He had a few, but again, maybe it's because we loved it so much. That was a standout performance in Forgetting Sarah Marshall.
00:01:34
Speaker 2: He was remarkable in that film, regardless of what you think of him now or given his reputation these days, because honestly, he's shifted from being a comedic actor to like a stand-up comedian, to actually being a fairly prolific YouTuber. He's described, I think the New York Times described him as a popular conspiracy-minded YouTuber. He has 6.1 million subscribers.
00:02:01
Speaker 1: Conspiracy-minded YouTuber, okay. A little religious stuff thrown in there, right?
00:02:07
Speaker 2: Correct, correct. On YouTube now, I believe it's weekly with his wife and the mother of his three children. He puts on a Sunday service. So yes, he is very vocal about his renewed Christian faith. I believe he was baptized just a couple years ago in the middle of all of these allegations. But these allegations, and now they're convictions, will go through because he was found guilty on some and not guilty on others. But all of these allegations reportedly allegedly took place during that period of time where he catapulted to fame. And that is a part of this story. These all happened between 1999 And 2009, the prosecutor put it like this. Brand used his influence, status, and fame to exploit and sexually offend against women. As his profile grew, so too did his sense of entitlement.
00:03:00
Speaker 1: Robes, I didn't see an accusation that came before this particular period of time. They talk about him like famous... they flipped a switch and he became a monster.
00:03:11
Speaker 2: Exactly. And all of these, if you read, and we're not going to get into some of these details, but it all came out in court, six women got on that stand and testified against him about what they say happened to them. Some of them were brief, shockingly quick sexual assaults that they said that it was over before they even realized it had begun. Some of these took place in bathrooms, on the sets of of certain projects. It was bizarre, and it did feel like he was just using his fame to kind of get off, basically.
00:03:45
Speaker 1: You said shockingly quick. Some of the locations were shocking.
00:03:48
Speaker 3: Yes.
00:03:48
Speaker 1: Some of the, and you hear rape and sexual assault. Not that there's a run of the mill when Robes, but some of the details they talk about here are not what we're used to hearing when we hear about sexual assaults and rapes. Now, again, want to spare a lot of these details.
00:04:05
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:04:05
Speaker 1: But Ropes, this is some... It sounds like wild man behavior.
00:04:13
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:04:14
Speaker 1: You know what it sounds like, Ropes? It sounds like that crazy character from Forgetting Sarah Marshall. Remember? He was an overly sexed, still for some reason, as the character only. He was talking about things that for you and I should seem... wild and sexually deviant. And he was talking about them as matter of fact in the movie. He was, again, the role, hilarious. Robes, it reads with the real life guy.
00:04:44
Speaker 2: It was almost art imitating life. But there was nothing funny about what these women were claiming he did to them. And yes, some of these encounters, at least the rape charge, began consensually. but ended very much so non-consensual, basically on where he took the sex act. Now, this is pretty dramatic. As we're recording this, this literally just happened in a London courtroom, but Russell Brand was taken into custody. He was denied bail because he is considered a flight risk because he does have significant means. And he is facing sentencing in a matter of days. And the judge told him to expect significant custodial time.
00:05:35
Speaker 3: Okay, that can mean a lot of things if you're that criminal.
00:05:46
Speaker 1: Significant could be three years. It could be five. We're talking ten years. Because potentially, Rob, these charges, these convictions do carry potentially a life sentence.
00:05:57
Speaker 2: Yes, one count of rape in the UK can, the maximum is life behind bars. So the judge will have some leeway, but let's just go over what the jury unanimously decided. And this was after two days of deliberations, eight hours of deliberations, the jury found him guilty of one count of rape Three counts of sexual assault. They found him not guilty on two other counts of rape and one count of attempted indecent assault. So it was a bit of a split verdict. There were seven charges against him in total. He was found guilty of four of them.
00:06:35
Speaker 1: Seven charges, six women in these accusations. Is that right?
00:06:38
Speaker 2: Correct. And this was nearly a month-long trial where prosecutors laid out each one of these episodes, that's what they called them, where each of these women, these six women, talked about what they say Russell Brand did to them, and this was, yes, over a period of about 10 years. Again, 1999 to 2009. This all came about, by the way, because of broadcasters or journalists. There was an investigation in 2003, a joint one by several different publications, and I think it was a television, a popular television program along with several newspaper articles, but they had four women detail what they claim happened to them at the hands of Russell Brand. Interestingly, none of those women were involved in the trial, but that reporting emboldened or encouraged these other six women to come forward and tell police about what happened to them.
00:07:35
Speaker 1: How many times we see that? Someone sees it on TV and go, wow, that sounds really familiar. That happened to me too. I'm not alone. You think immediately about the, what, Is it the Tate brothers?
00:07:46
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:07:47
Speaker 1: Isn't that how some of that came about?
00:07:49
Speaker 2: Sean Diddy Combs.
00:07:51
Speaker 1: One lawsuit. We see this, and it's remarkable. Robes, four women in that documentary, right, that the journalist did.
00:07:58
Speaker 2: Correct.
00:07:58
Speaker 1: And another six. Totally different women. Robes, that suggests potentially... How many other victims are out there? And I know police are looking at other, but Rose, you got 10 women already.
00:08:13
Speaker 2: Correct. And after the verdicts were read, London police, their spokesperson came out and told reporters, by the way, we've already questioned Russell Brand about two more accusations of rape. So this is far from over. And by the way, also should note, Russell Brand currently is also facing a pretty serious civil lawsuit here in the United States, also filed in 2023. There's a reason in 2023, all of this came out because that is when that reporting came out in that collaborative investigation by journalists. And now all of these women came forward. So a woman here in New York actually said on the set of the, I never saw this rom-com, Arthur. But she details a sexual assault that she claims happened in the bathroom on the set. She was an extra. She was a film extra on the set here in New York City. And right out of that lawsuit, plaintiff alleges that during the July 2010 filming of Arthur, Brand exposed himself in front of the cast and crew, later followed her into the bathroom, sexually assaulted her while a crew member guarded the door. So this woman's accusing not just Russell Brand, but several people on the set for allowing, or being complicit at least, in allowing the sexual assault to happen. But that detail sounds very familiar. It's a very familiar mode of operation that several of these other women also detailed. It sounds like almost the exact same scenario.
00:09:45
Speaker 1: Robes, bathrooms and dressing rooms. A lot of this is bathrooms and dressing rooms.
00:09:49
Speaker 2: Yep.
00:09:52
Speaker 1: Robes, it just reads. It all goes in line. Look, he has denied the allegations. What does he keep saying? I was promiscuous.
00:09:59
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:09:59
Speaker 1: I was wise. That's how he defended himself, but I've never heard... You know what? How close has he gotten to saying that, well, maybe I was a little too much or a little too... Any acknowledgement that someone could have misinterpreted the interaction?
00:10:15
Speaker 2: The only thing... The word he used was... So he took the stand, by the way, which is pretty remarkable in this criminal trial. He took the stand and his wife took the stand. Those are the only two people who took the stand in his defense. He claims he couldn't get anyone else to defend him because he is considered a pariah. No one will touch him. And so even though he could have had people, no one was willing to do it because these days no one wants to defend somebody who's accused of sexually assaulting women. But he claimed on the stand, he admitted to jurors that he misused his fame to get sex, but he always obtained consent. He said, I know what no means. But, so in the victim who accused him of rape, which he was convicted for, he admits to having sex with her. And she admits to having vaginal sex with him. But it's when things went in another direction where she said she begged and pleaded for him to stop. She describes being physically injured, bleeding, and he claims that she never said no.
00:11:24
Speaker 1: They're telling two totally different stories about that because she's not just saying I said no. She's saying she repeatedly almost, I don't know how far to take it, but wrote it was clear according to her.
00:11:39
Speaker 2: She was crying. She was pleading.
00:11:41
Speaker 1: What was happening to happen. And this was the young lady I have right, had a, what was it, a week prior, had a sexual encounter with him, a threesome.
00:11:48
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:11:48
Speaker 3: Right?
00:11:48
Speaker 1: She admits to all this. Obviously, she felt good enough about that experience to go back and be in private with him, one-on-one. And that's when this other thing happened.
00:11:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think, honestly, for me, as a woman, that makes her all the more credible. She's acknowledging she wanted to have sex with him. There were consensual acts that they did together. Yeah. But that when she said no to a very specific act, it's anal sex. When she said no to that, he would not take no for an answer. And it was violent. And what she describes is pretty horrific. She says she was physically in pain. She was bleeding. She was pleading for him to stop. Please stop. Please stop.
00:12:29
Speaker 1: Again, the rules, I assume, the laws are the same there as they are here. Meaning, it doesn't matter if it started as consensual sex. A woman at any point. Has the right to say no.
00:12:39
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
00:12:39
Speaker 1: Done. I don't want to do this anymore. At that point, the consent is over and it is a sexual assault. So, again, that part of the story or anyone thinking, well, she went there and she was willing and then she didn't. No, no, no, no. This is and the jury has now or the court there has now determined that her story is credible.
00:12:58
Speaker 2: Absolutely. And so now, these aren't just allegations, these aren't just charges, these are absolute convictions. And look, they don't mess around in the UK. Usually when we have a sentencing hearing, sometimes it's months after the jury returns a verdict. This is going to be a matter of days. And as we mentioned, one rape conviction can carry a life sentence. They say the typical sentencing for one rape conviction is anywhere from four years to 19 years. Though I wonder, with this judge... the publicity surrounding this particular case and the fact that there are obviously multiple women here and there are more allegations potentially pending. We've got issues over here in the United States as well. I wonder if the judge is going to take all of that into consideration and if he's going to make a point because people are watching.
00:13:57
Speaker 1: Well, yes, I hear that, but Robes, if nobody was watching, don't you still need to make a point? This is a guy, Robes, he's been convicted of some counts, but there is a stack of accusations against this guy. So it's not just a matter of Robes trying to look like you're tough on a celebrity. Robes, you have to protect the public. Won't a judge, won't a court take that into consideration? This guy, Rose, based on the behavior, at least that's alleged, is a menace to society. He's a menace to women, according to these allegations and now convictions. And he did it over a stretch of time like that. How could you be lenient? How could a judge be lenient? And I'll go on the lighter end. I don't know what they're going to do and the factors they have to consider. But, Rose, and there's more coming? I can't imagine. Again, you said the rape conviction carried, what did you say, typically is what?
00:14:53
Speaker 2: Four to 19 years.
00:14:54
Speaker 1: Okay, now what about the sexual assault convictions, right? Those are years attached to that. Potentially robes. This guy's looking at a long time.
00:15:01
Speaker 2: I mean, look, he's 51 years old. So say the judge doesn't give him life, gives him 19 years, and then you add the sexual assault convictions. I mean, you're looking at decades behind bars for Russell Brand, and that will essentially be a life sentence when you get to a certain age. I mean, he's 51 years old. At what point, he's got three young children with his wife. His wife was on the stand saying, he's a wonderful father. He's a devout Christian, all of that. That all can be true. He may have changed his life around. Maybe he did change his ways. However, and we've talked about this plenty, we've covered enough cases. We know this for a fact. I doubt it's any different across the pond. But when you have a convicted person refusing to admit guilt, that is absolutely taken into consideration when sentencing comes. And right now, Russell Brandt, has vehemently denied and continues to deny that he ever raped anyone, that he ever did anything without consent. He said he always got consent. He was very specific in describing the fact that he knows what no means and that he always had consent, and none of this was done without anyone's consent.
00:16:14
Speaker 1: 51, no, but this was happening while he was in his early 30s?
00:16:17
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:16:20
Speaker 1: My goodness. And we have been following this. But we haven't been following it like they have in the UK. I mean, Robes, I don't know how to compare. There are very few from the UK that come over and have this type of success. He is a superstar over there. I mean, it's nothing else. He is a superstar over there. We know him here. This story has been front page for weeks and weeks and weeks. This story is going bananas across the pond right now. It is. And he is, as we speak, in custody. He, as we speak, may never get out of custody, Robes. They're holding him. Yeah, you said they don't mess around over there. Yeah, we'll see you on Monday. He's going to be sentenced. And what was the argument? They said, please, let him go home and say bye to his kids.
00:17:09
Speaker 3: Correct.
00:17:11
Speaker 1: If that gives you any indication, Robes, the judge's response to that, if that gives you any indication about how lenient they plan to be, don't expect it.
00:17:19
Speaker 2: And look, this is somebody who hasn't been in custody all the while. Like most people, I would say most ordinary folks who were charged with this series of a crime would not have had the ability to come back and forth and be, the fact that he was even given that leniency during trial is one thing, but now that he's been convicted, it makes perfect sense that he is going to remain behind bars.
00:17:43
Speaker 1: They won't, I didn't see the ages on the kids, but they won't even let him go home and say bye to his kids. They asked for bail. They asked for that specific thing. Like, let's appeal to the heartstrings here of the court. Just let him go say bye to his kids.
00:18:02
Speaker 2: Nope.
00:18:03
Speaker 1: Kept him in custody.
00:18:04
Speaker 2: Exactly. And this will be interesting because, yes, Russell Brand has been dealing with these allegations for several years now. But if you remember, I'm curious if anyone's going to say anything. Do you remember President Trump, Megyn Kelly, Tucker Carlson? There were several conservative pundits who were very outspoken, who absolutely rushed to his defense and said this was a witch hunt, just like he has called it as well. I wonder where those voices will be now that these convictions have now come down.
00:18:34
Speaker 1: I missed something in that. When did he become like a... Are they just friends of his? They ran in the same circles? I was surprised to see. And I think they will tell you this had to do with some other allegations. You know, it might have had to do with the documentary, right? Or the press thing.
00:18:50
Speaker 2: Correct. It was the investigation that happened in 2023. The Times of London, the Sunday Times, and then a prominent British TV program. That's when they put out this big investigation where they had these four women who were able to remain anonymous. make these allegations against Russell Brand, and he completely denied all of them. And they did, yes. There were several folks who rushed to his defense. He, in later years, in past years, has become a conservative commentator.
00:19:19
Speaker 1: Okay, so that's why.
00:19:20
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:19:20
Speaker 1: Okay. What is the, where do we just say the, who said it? It was the Amy Acton, Vivek Ramaswamy race in Ohio. When the whole ad came out, who was the conservative person that was dismissive of Amy Acton's experience as a child and being raped by her stepfather by saying, yeah, you know, liberal women just like to accuse people of sexual assault. There was a, what is this thing that, why?
00:19:52
Speaker 2: It's like the anti me too movement. It's that there are several people who believe that there are lots of women out there who just can't wait to jump on the, I was a victim to train. And look, there are always, there are always going to be outliers and it's incredibly frustrating to as a woman because obviously rape is massively underreported and you can see because yes, women are then questioned. Their actions, their previous sexual history, how they dress, how they act, how they react to their abusers, all of that then becomes public fodder, you're scrutinized, you're not believed. So yes, I understand the Me Too movement arose out of that we have to start believing women but there are still those who believe there was an overcorrection And they think that there are so many women out there just to bring down the man, just to take down someone. They didn't like the way you looked at me, or I didn't like what you said to me, or I don't like that. I didn't get that part. So watch me take you down. I do think there are people who want to believe that women are out to get men. I do think that. And there are people who perpetuate that.
00:21:01
Speaker 1: But you come out and publicly defend this type of thing. I don't know what their relationships are with him and they, Felt he was a good guy and needed to be defended in that way. But I don't know. It's just a weird... It is.
00:21:15
Speaker 2: I agree.
00:21:15
Speaker 1: Thing to automatically jump on and defend. Well, you know what? It's a matter of, oh, he's conservative. We'll defend him. Maybe it's just that simple. Maybe it's nothing more than that.
00:21:23
Speaker 2: He was touting his Christian faith. He was touting his conservative beliefs. He spoke to people, and it resonated with them. And look... He has 6.1 million subscribers. He has 10 million followers on X. It's like one of those things where I'm not trying to compare him to the Tate brothers, but there is this strange reaction to really bad behavior And it's like manosphere-esque type of behavior where you've got maxing like clavicular where you just have a group of people who defend uber-masculine behavior even if it's at the expense of women and then blame women for complaining about having regrets for having sex with someone. I mean, I think they're just trying to decriminalize rape in a weird way that it's somehowâ it's a gray area and no one really knows what happened. No, actually a jury unanimously found Russell Brand guilty of rape after listening to these women testify on the stand. And look, are there women out there who don't tell the truth, who might use rape as a power play?
00:22:36
Speaker 3: Sure.
00:22:36
Speaker 2: I'm sure that that has happened obviously, but it is so rare. What's sad is that women, because of that, don't report this type of thing. And so, yes, when you see that someone else has been brave enough to say, this happened to me, it does empower you as a woman to say, well, hell yeah, it happened to me too. That's how you stop monsters. And honestly, when you read what Russell Brand was convicted of, he is a monster who abused his power and treated women like objects who were there to make him feel good at their expense.
00:23:21
Speaker 1: Look, it's hard to read these accusations, and it's hard to understand the behavior. It's hard to, look, I never met this man. We all, in the industry we work in, we interview a lot of celebrities, but I never interviewed him, never been in the same room with him, don't know anything about him other than that movie, to be quite honest with you. But, Rose, the stuff they describe is monstrous. It just is. I don't know what defense there can be of it. He is a convicted rapist. As we sit here. And that is just what it is. He has a right to appeal. I'm sure he'll fight this as hard as he can. But, but, but Ray Rose, at what point do you, we now know of at least 12 women. Yeah.
00:24:03
Speaker 2: Right.
00:24:04
Speaker 1: Six from the case, the four from the media investigation and two more.
00:24:09
Speaker 3: Two more.
00:24:10
Speaker 1: That's, that's 12 women at least. And I'm supposed to sit here and go, eh, let's hear them out.
00:24:16
Speaker 2: Yeah. And at least is the point because the London police made it clear while they do have, yes, these two other women who have come forward, they also made it very clear this remains an open investigation and have asked other women, if you've had an experience, come forward. We're listening.
00:24:34
Speaker 1: If that was 12, 15 years ago, wrote so many women wanted to get this behind them. This is a part of their lives. They struggled to possibly move on and to have to come back. Maybe and talk about this again. I get it. These six women did come forward, but I could understand why if there are more out there, why they wouldn't want to come forward, why they wouldn't want to come forward and be accused of right and being examined for their behavior. And why were you here?
00:25:01
Speaker 2: Right?
00:25:01
Speaker 1: A lot of this was hookups and they were excited to be with this superstar.
00:25:05
Speaker 3: Yes.
00:25:05
Speaker 1: All these things.
00:25:06
Speaker 2: Again, at the height of his fame, but they weren't expecting to be groped, like pushed up against a wall. I mean, a lot of the allegations are that he was grabbing breasts and butts and sticking his head in women's crotches, like just really gross, vile behavior that people just, and look, people had to turn their heads and look the other way. And Look, men like this don't operate in a vacuum. I mean, people do look the other way. And if this was happening on movie sets, this, I mean, one of the alleged sexual assaults actually were in the MTV offices. Like, these were in, like, corporate offices on movie sets. And so, look, this is... This is incredibly disturbing. And you have to think what could have happened, what would have happened if these journalists hadn't done these investigations and hadn't convinced these women to bravely come forward and tell their stories. And even though they weren't the ones that ended up putting him on trial, it led to the convictions that we saw in London on this day.
00:26:16
Speaker 1: That media investigation, it was 2023? 2023, yes. This is fairly quick, you could argue then, Rose.
00:26:22
Speaker 2: Very quick. And look, rape cases... are among the hardest to prove, because oftentimes it's he said, she said. Two people, there aren't cameras, there usually aren't witnesses, oftentimes there isn't physical evidence, and a lot of times women have misgivings and are slow to come forward and to describe what happened to them, and all of that leads to making it be very difficult to actually successfully prosecute a case like this.
00:26:51
Speaker 1: What do women do first after something like this? They ask themselves, right?
00:26:54
Speaker 2: What did I do wrong? Did I make him think that this was okay? Did I lead him on? Did I not say no forcefully enough? And then usually you end up telling a friend and you end up, yes, and that absolutely is what happened in these cases. And then you just bury it. You repress it. You feel guilty about it. You feel shame surrounding it. So look, anytime something like this happens, I do think it empowers women to know that you can and will be believed. But unfortunately, it does take a lot of courage to come forward in a lot of these cases, especially with someone as popular, as powerful, as even beloved. I mean, look, after forgetting Sarah Marshall, I thought he was one of the most talented, authentically funny actors I had ever seen.
00:27:45
Speaker 1: What do you do with that? It takes away from you. You go back and you view that time in his life and the Times where you were laughing at him and entertained by him and rooting for him and even seeking out his content. Rose, forgetting Sarah Marshall, I don't know about how to watch that movie again. He, what's her from Frozen?
00:28:05
Speaker 2: Kristen Bell.
00:28:05
Speaker 1: Kristen Bell, right?
00:28:06
Speaker 2: Love her.
00:28:07
Speaker 1: They were together. Rose, that was a hilarious duo in this movie.
00:28:11
Speaker 2: They were amazing. They played off each other perfectly. Perfectly.
00:28:15
Speaker 1: Yes, I know.
00:28:16
Speaker 2: And I actually own that movie. I've probably watched it a dozen times at least. And you're right. I don't know that I could watch it again because it just isn't going to feel the same. I thought it was really interesting, too, when we talk about the victims. The prosecutor, I appreciate what the prosecutor said in closing arguments, said that these women... None of them sought the limelight. None of them sought any kind of publicity. None of these women had anything to gain except some closure. Russell Brand didn't listen when I said no. He didn't listen. He didn't care. He just kept going until he achieved his ultimate aim.
00:28:56
Speaker 1: And ejaculated.
00:28:57
Speaker 2: Like what came out in court was just this ruthless, like he even told one woman who was bleeding to clean up the mess, according to her testimony, and just walked out. I mean, when you think about it from that perspective, not only was he convicted of these heinous acts, but just his attitude and reaction to them, it was like, you are worthless.
00:29:17
Speaker 1: And look, we have to say, look, he is a, he's kind of a harsh guy just by his personality, his persona. He's kind of in a what's the right way to say it? Not an aggressive guy. He's kind of deadpan, but he's very direct. He's very blunt.
00:29:35
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like, take me or leave me. He's very much like, I'm not pretending to be anything other than what I am.
00:29:40
Speaker 1: He's not warm.
00:29:41
Speaker 2: No.
00:29:42
Speaker 1: And that's okay. It's part of his shtick.
00:29:45
Speaker 2: Yes, but it's interesting because his attorneys, this really stood out to me too, his attorneys in their way of trying to convince the jury that, yeah, you might not like him to what you're saying. You might not like his attitude or how he operates. It doesn't make him a rapist. Living a highly promiscuous life is entirely lawful, however morally distasteful you may find it, his lawyer said. Even being manipulative. in the pursuit of consensual sex is completely lawful. And that's what the defense tried to argue. They said that there was no evidence that he was some kind of psychopath who rapes people and thinks it's normal. He behaved normally during and after all of these rapes. And that tells you what you need to know. So they're just saying, yes, he's gross. Yes, he's manipulative. Yes, he was promiscuous. Yes, he was sexually insatiable. but it doesn't make him a rapist.
00:30:38
Speaker 1: Is his lawyer's last name Agnafillo?
00:30:40
Speaker 2: Right? I mean, it was very similar to what we heard.
00:30:42
Speaker 1: That's the Diddy defense. Yeah. He's into the freaky stuff, but that doesn't make him a criminal.
00:30:47
Speaker 2: It does seem to be the go-to when you're trying to defend somebody who is morally reprehensible.
00:30:52
Speaker 1: It's a bad behavior. Yeah, he wasn't good to women.
00:30:54
Speaker 2: He's not illegal, just morally reprehensible.
00:30:57
Speaker 1: Even not a good boyfriend. It's not illegal. So when you are in the position, you have to make that argument. You might be in trouble.
00:31:03
Speaker 2: Yes. And that certainly was the case for the Russell Brand defense team. And yes, we'll keep watching this one because there is more to come, not just with sentencing, but also with new accusers and perhaps even more on the horizon. So we always appreciate you. Thank you. As always, I'm Amy. That's TJ. We'll see you soon.
Speaker 1: Hey there, folks. We thank you for being here. We're just getting word that superstar, international superstar, cross-pond superstar, Russell Brand, has been found guilty of rape and sexual assault, and he could be going to prison for a long, long time. Thank you, everybody, for being here. I'm TJ. That's Robes. What's the best way? I tried to really sum up, certainly here in the U.S., what he means as a superstar. But he is one that did make his way across the pond and found some pretty good success here in the U.S., yes?
00:00:37
Speaker 2: He had a very good run. He started out as a comedian, and he was always a comedic actor. But if anyone loves the movie Forgetting Sarah Marshall the way I did, that is where he really catapulted into fame.
00:00:50
Speaker 1: Is there anything bigger that he has done, in the U.S. at least, movie-wise, that is bigger than that one?
00:00:57
Speaker 2: I would say the fact, well, his amazing performance in Forgetting Sarah Marshall in 2008, by the way, sorry about that. He started dating Katy Perry, remember that. So that also put him in a certain level of celebrity because he was photographed everywhere with her.
00:01:13
Speaker 1: 100% forgot they dated.
00:01:15
Speaker 2: Yes, and he also hosted the 2008 and 2009 MTV Video Music Awards.
00:01:21
Speaker 1: What was the movie he did with Jonah Hill? Remember he was like, get him to the Greek or something?
00:01:26
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, there was something like that, too.
00:01:28
Speaker 1: He had a few, but again, maybe it's because we loved it so much. That was a standout performance in Forgetting Sarah Marshall.
00:01:34
Speaker 2: He was remarkable in that film, regardless of what you think of him now or given his reputation these days, because honestly, he's shifted from being a comedic actor to like a stand-up comedian, to actually being a fairly prolific YouTuber. He's described, I think the New York Times described him as a popular conspiracy-minded YouTuber. He has 6.1 million subscribers.
00:02:01
Speaker 1: Conspiracy-minded YouTuber, okay. A little religious stuff thrown in there, right?
00:02:07
Speaker 2: Correct, correct. On YouTube now, I believe it's weekly with his wife and the mother of his three children. He puts on a Sunday service. So yes, he is very vocal about his renewed Christian faith. I believe he was baptized just a couple years ago in the middle of all of these allegations. But these allegations, and now they're convictions, will go through because he was found guilty on some and not guilty on others. But all of these allegations reportedly allegedly took place during that period of time where he catapulted to fame. And that is a part of this story. These all happened between 1999 And 2009, the prosecutor put it like this. Brand used his influence, status, and fame to exploit and sexually offend against women. As his profile grew, so too did his sense of entitlement.
00:03:00
Speaker 1: Robes, I didn't see an accusation that came before this particular period of time. They talk about him like famous... they flipped a switch and he became a monster.
00:03:11
Speaker 2: Exactly. And all of these, if you read, and we're not going to get into some of these details, but it all came out in court, six women got on that stand and testified against him about what they say happened to them. Some of them were brief, shockingly quick sexual assaults that they said that it was over before they even realized it had begun. Some of these took place in bathrooms, on the sets of of certain projects. It was bizarre, and it did feel like he was just using his fame to kind of get off, basically.
00:03:45
Speaker 1: You said shockingly quick. Some of the locations were shocking.
00:03:48
Speaker 3: Yes.
00:03:48
Speaker 1: Some of the, and you hear rape and sexual assault. Not that there's a run of the mill when Robes, but some of the details they talk about here are not what we're used to hearing when we hear about sexual assaults and rapes. Now, again, want to spare a lot of these details.
00:04:05
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:04:05
Speaker 1: But Ropes, this is some... It sounds like wild man behavior.
00:04:13
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:04:14
Speaker 1: You know what it sounds like, Ropes? It sounds like that crazy character from Forgetting Sarah Marshall. Remember? He was an overly sexed, still for some reason, as the character only. He was talking about things that for you and I should seem... wild and sexually deviant. And he was talking about them as matter of fact in the movie. He was, again, the role, hilarious. Robes, it reads with the real life guy.
00:04:44
Speaker 2: It was almost art imitating life. But there was nothing funny about what these women were claiming he did to them. And yes, some of these encounters, at least the rape charge, began consensually. but ended very much so non-consensual, basically on where he took the sex act. Now, this is pretty dramatic. As we're recording this, this literally just happened in a London courtroom, but Russell Brand was taken into custody. He was denied bail because he is considered a flight risk because he does have significant means. And he is facing sentencing in a matter of days. And the judge told him to expect significant custodial time.
00:05:35
Speaker 3: Okay, that can mean a lot of things if you're that criminal.
00:05:46
Speaker 1: Significant could be three years. It could be five. We're talking ten years. Because potentially, Rob, these charges, these convictions do carry potentially a life sentence.
00:05:57
Speaker 2: Yes, one count of rape in the UK can, the maximum is life behind bars. So the judge will have some leeway, but let's just go over what the jury unanimously decided. And this was after two days of deliberations, eight hours of deliberations, the jury found him guilty of one count of rape Three counts of sexual assault. They found him not guilty on two other counts of rape and one count of attempted indecent assault. So it was a bit of a split verdict. There were seven charges against him in total. He was found guilty of four of them.
00:06:35
Speaker 1: Seven charges, six women in these accusations. Is that right?
00:06:38
Speaker 2: Correct. And this was nearly a month-long trial where prosecutors laid out each one of these episodes, that's what they called them, where each of these women, these six women, talked about what they say Russell Brand did to them, and this was, yes, over a period of about 10 years. Again, 1999 to 2009. This all came about, by the way, because of broadcasters or journalists. There was an investigation in 2003, a joint one by several different publications, and I think it was a television, a popular television program along with several newspaper articles, but they had four women detail what they claim happened to them at the hands of Russell Brand. Interestingly, none of those women were involved in the trial, but that reporting emboldened or encouraged these other six women to come forward and tell police about what happened to them.
00:07:35
Speaker 1: How many times we see that? Someone sees it on TV and go, wow, that sounds really familiar. That happened to me too. I'm not alone. You think immediately about the, what, Is it the Tate brothers?
00:07:46
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:07:47
Speaker 1: Isn't that how some of that came about?
00:07:49
Speaker 2: Sean Diddy Combs.
00:07:51
Speaker 1: One lawsuit. We see this, and it's remarkable. Robes, four women in that documentary, right, that the journalist did.
00:07:58
Speaker 2: Correct.
00:07:58
Speaker 1: And another six. Totally different women. Robes, that suggests potentially... How many other victims are out there? And I know police are looking at other, but Rose, you got 10 women already.
00:08:13
Speaker 2: Correct. And after the verdicts were read, London police, their spokesperson came out and told reporters, by the way, we've already questioned Russell Brand about two more accusations of rape. So this is far from over. And by the way, also should note, Russell Brand currently is also facing a pretty serious civil lawsuit here in the United States, also filed in 2023. There's a reason in 2023, all of this came out because that is when that reporting came out in that collaborative investigation by journalists. And now all of these women came forward. So a woman here in New York actually said on the set of the, I never saw this rom-com, Arthur. But she details a sexual assault that she claims happened in the bathroom on the set. She was an extra. She was a film extra on the set here in New York City. And right out of that lawsuit, plaintiff alleges that during the July 2010 filming of Arthur, Brand exposed himself in front of the cast and crew, later followed her into the bathroom, sexually assaulted her while a crew member guarded the door. So this woman's accusing not just Russell Brand, but several people on the set for allowing, or being complicit at least, in allowing the sexual assault to happen. But that detail sounds very familiar. It's a very familiar mode of operation that several of these other women also detailed. It sounds like almost the exact same scenario.
00:09:45
Speaker 1: Robes, bathrooms and dressing rooms. A lot of this is bathrooms and dressing rooms.
00:09:49
Speaker 2: Yep.
00:09:52
Speaker 1: Robes, it just reads. It all goes in line. Look, he has denied the allegations. What does he keep saying? I was promiscuous.
00:09:59
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:09:59
Speaker 1: I was wise. That's how he defended himself, but I've never heard... You know what? How close has he gotten to saying that, well, maybe I was a little too much or a little too... Any acknowledgement that someone could have misinterpreted the interaction?
00:10:15
Speaker 2: The only thing... The word he used was... So he took the stand, by the way, which is pretty remarkable in this criminal trial. He took the stand and his wife took the stand. Those are the only two people who took the stand in his defense. He claims he couldn't get anyone else to defend him because he is considered a pariah. No one will touch him. And so even though he could have had people, no one was willing to do it because these days no one wants to defend somebody who's accused of sexually assaulting women. But he claimed on the stand, he admitted to jurors that he misused his fame to get sex, but he always obtained consent. He said, I know what no means. But, so in the victim who accused him of rape, which he was convicted for, he admits to having sex with her. And she admits to having vaginal sex with him. But it's when things went in another direction where she said she begged and pleaded for him to stop. She describes being physically injured, bleeding, and he claims that she never said no.
00:11:24
Speaker 1: They're telling two totally different stories about that because she's not just saying I said no. She's saying she repeatedly almost, I don't know how far to take it, but wrote it was clear according to her.
00:11:39
Speaker 2: She was crying. She was pleading.
00:11:41
Speaker 1: What was happening to happen. And this was the young lady I have right, had a, what was it, a week prior, had a sexual encounter with him, a threesome.
00:11:48
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:11:48
Speaker 3: Right?
00:11:48
Speaker 1: She admits to all this. Obviously, she felt good enough about that experience to go back and be in private with him, one-on-one. And that's when this other thing happened.
00:11:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think, honestly, for me, as a woman, that makes her all the more credible. She's acknowledging she wanted to have sex with him. There were consensual acts that they did together. Yeah. But that when she said no to a very specific act, it's anal sex. When she said no to that, he would not take no for an answer. And it was violent. And what she describes is pretty horrific. She says she was physically in pain. She was bleeding. She was pleading for him to stop. Please stop. Please stop.
00:12:29
Speaker 1: Again, the rules, I assume, the laws are the same there as they are here. Meaning, it doesn't matter if it started as consensual sex. A woman at any point. Has the right to say no.
00:12:39
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
00:12:39
Speaker 1: Done. I don't want to do this anymore. At that point, the consent is over and it is a sexual assault. So, again, that part of the story or anyone thinking, well, she went there and she was willing and then she didn't. No, no, no, no. This is and the jury has now or the court there has now determined that her story is credible.
00:12:58
Speaker 2: Absolutely. And so now, these aren't just allegations, these aren't just charges, these are absolute convictions. And look, they don't mess around in the UK. Usually when we have a sentencing hearing, sometimes it's months after the jury returns a verdict. This is going to be a matter of days. And as we mentioned, one rape conviction can carry a life sentence. They say the typical sentencing for one rape conviction is anywhere from four years to 19 years. Though I wonder, with this judge... the publicity surrounding this particular case and the fact that there are obviously multiple women here and there are more allegations potentially pending. We've got issues over here in the United States as well. I wonder if the judge is going to take all of that into consideration and if he's going to make a point because people are watching.
00:13:57
Speaker 1: Well, yes, I hear that, but Robes, if nobody was watching, don't you still need to make a point? This is a guy, Robes, he's been convicted of some counts, but there is a stack of accusations against this guy. So it's not just a matter of Robes trying to look like you're tough on a celebrity. Robes, you have to protect the public. Won't a judge, won't a court take that into consideration? This guy, Rose, based on the behavior, at least that's alleged, is a menace to society. He's a menace to women, according to these allegations and now convictions. And he did it over a stretch of time like that. How could you be lenient? How could a judge be lenient? And I'll go on the lighter end. I don't know what they're going to do and the factors they have to consider. But, Rose, and there's more coming? I can't imagine. Again, you said the rape conviction carried, what did you say, typically is what?
00:14:53
Speaker 2: Four to 19 years.
00:14:54
Speaker 1: Okay, now what about the sexual assault convictions, right? Those are years attached to that. Potentially robes. This guy's looking at a long time.
00:15:01
Speaker 2: I mean, look, he's 51 years old. So say the judge doesn't give him life, gives him 19 years, and then you add the sexual assault convictions. I mean, you're looking at decades behind bars for Russell Brand, and that will essentially be a life sentence when you get to a certain age. I mean, he's 51 years old. At what point, he's got three young children with his wife. His wife was on the stand saying, he's a wonderful father. He's a devout Christian, all of that. That all can be true. He may have changed his life around. Maybe he did change his ways. However, and we've talked about this plenty, we've covered enough cases. We know this for a fact. I doubt it's any different across the pond. But when you have a convicted person refusing to admit guilt, that is absolutely taken into consideration when sentencing comes. And right now, Russell Brandt, has vehemently denied and continues to deny that he ever raped anyone, that he ever did anything without consent. He said he always got consent. He was very specific in describing the fact that he knows what no means and that he always had consent, and none of this was done without anyone's consent.
00:16:14
Speaker 1: 51, no, but this was happening while he was in his early 30s?
00:16:17
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:16:20
Speaker 1: My goodness. And we have been following this. But we haven't been following it like they have in the UK. I mean, Robes, I don't know how to compare. There are very few from the UK that come over and have this type of success. He is a superstar over there. I mean, it's nothing else. He is a superstar over there. We know him here. This story has been front page for weeks and weeks and weeks. This story is going bananas across the pond right now. It is. And he is, as we speak, in custody. He, as we speak, may never get out of custody, Robes. They're holding him. Yeah, you said they don't mess around over there. Yeah, we'll see you on Monday. He's going to be sentenced. And what was the argument? They said, please, let him go home and say bye to his kids.
00:17:09
Speaker 3: Correct.
00:17:11
Speaker 1: If that gives you any indication, Robes, the judge's response to that, if that gives you any indication about how lenient they plan to be, don't expect it.
00:17:19
Speaker 2: And look, this is somebody who hasn't been in custody all the while. Like most people, I would say most ordinary folks who were charged with this series of a crime would not have had the ability to come back and forth and be, the fact that he was even given that leniency during trial is one thing, but now that he's been convicted, it makes perfect sense that he is going to remain behind bars.
00:17:43
Speaker 1: They won't, I didn't see the ages on the kids, but they won't even let him go home and say bye to his kids. They asked for bail. They asked for that specific thing. Like, let's appeal to the heartstrings here of the court. Just let him go say bye to his kids.
00:18:02
Speaker 2: Nope.
00:18:03
Speaker 1: Kept him in custody.
00:18:04
Speaker 2: Exactly. And this will be interesting because, yes, Russell Brand has been dealing with these allegations for several years now. But if you remember, I'm curious if anyone's going to say anything. Do you remember President Trump, Megyn Kelly, Tucker Carlson? There were several conservative pundits who were very outspoken, who absolutely rushed to his defense and said this was a witch hunt, just like he has called it as well. I wonder where those voices will be now that these convictions have now come down.
00:18:34
Speaker 1: I missed something in that. When did he become like a... Are they just friends of his? They ran in the same circles? I was surprised to see. And I think they will tell you this had to do with some other allegations. You know, it might have had to do with the documentary, right? Or the press thing.
00:18:50
Speaker 2: Correct. It was the investigation that happened in 2023. The Times of London, the Sunday Times, and then a prominent British TV program. That's when they put out this big investigation where they had these four women who were able to remain anonymous. make these allegations against Russell Brand, and he completely denied all of them. And they did, yes. There were several folks who rushed to his defense. He, in later years, in past years, has become a conservative commentator.
00:19:19
Speaker 1: Okay, so that's why.
00:19:20
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:19:20
Speaker 1: Okay. What is the, where do we just say the, who said it? It was the Amy Acton, Vivek Ramaswamy race in Ohio. When the whole ad came out, who was the conservative person that was dismissive of Amy Acton's experience as a child and being raped by her stepfather by saying, yeah, you know, liberal women just like to accuse people of sexual assault. There was a, what is this thing that, why?
00:19:52
Speaker 2: It's like the anti me too movement. It's that there are several people who believe that there are lots of women out there who just can't wait to jump on the, I was a victim to train. And look, there are always, there are always going to be outliers and it's incredibly frustrating to as a woman because obviously rape is massively underreported and you can see because yes, women are then questioned. Their actions, their previous sexual history, how they dress, how they act, how they react to their abusers, all of that then becomes public fodder, you're scrutinized, you're not believed. So yes, I understand the Me Too movement arose out of that we have to start believing women but there are still those who believe there was an overcorrection And they think that there are so many women out there just to bring down the man, just to take down someone. They didn't like the way you looked at me, or I didn't like what you said to me, or I don't like that. I didn't get that part. So watch me take you down. I do think there are people who want to believe that women are out to get men. I do think that. And there are people who perpetuate that.
00:21:01
Speaker 1: But you come out and publicly defend this type of thing. I don't know what their relationships are with him and they, Felt he was a good guy and needed to be defended in that way. But I don't know. It's just a weird... It is.
00:21:15
Speaker 2: I agree.
00:21:15
Speaker 1: Thing to automatically jump on and defend. Well, you know what? It's a matter of, oh, he's conservative. We'll defend him. Maybe it's just that simple. Maybe it's nothing more than that.
00:21:23
Speaker 2: He was touting his Christian faith. He was touting his conservative beliefs. He spoke to people, and it resonated with them. And look... He has 6.1 million subscribers. He has 10 million followers on X. It's like one of those things where I'm not trying to compare him to the Tate brothers, but there is this strange reaction to really bad behavior And it's like manosphere-esque type of behavior where you've got maxing like clavicular where you just have a group of people who defend uber-masculine behavior even if it's at the expense of women and then blame women for complaining about having regrets for having sex with someone. I mean, I think they're just trying to decriminalize rape in a weird way that it's somehowâ it's a gray area and no one really knows what happened. No, actually a jury unanimously found Russell Brand guilty of rape after listening to these women testify on the stand. And look, are there women out there who don't tell the truth, who might use rape as a power play?
00:22:36
Speaker 3: Sure.
00:22:36
Speaker 2: I'm sure that that has happened obviously, but it is so rare. What's sad is that women, because of that, don't report this type of thing. And so, yes, when you see that someone else has been brave enough to say, this happened to me, it does empower you as a woman to say, well, hell yeah, it happened to me too. That's how you stop monsters. And honestly, when you read what Russell Brand was convicted of, he is a monster who abused his power and treated women like objects who were there to make him feel good at their expense.
00:23:21
Speaker 1: Look, it's hard to read these accusations, and it's hard to understand the behavior. It's hard to, look, I never met this man. We all, in the industry we work in, we interview a lot of celebrities, but I never interviewed him, never been in the same room with him, don't know anything about him other than that movie, to be quite honest with you. But, Rose, the stuff they describe is monstrous. It just is. I don't know what defense there can be of it. He is a convicted rapist. As we sit here. And that is just what it is. He has a right to appeal. I'm sure he'll fight this as hard as he can. But, but, but Ray Rose, at what point do you, we now know of at least 12 women. Yeah.
00:24:03
Speaker 2: Right.
00:24:04
Speaker 1: Six from the case, the four from the media investigation and two more.
00:24:09
Speaker 3: Two more.
00:24:10
Speaker 1: That's, that's 12 women at least. And I'm supposed to sit here and go, eh, let's hear them out.
00:24:16
Speaker 2: Yeah. And at least is the point because the London police made it clear while they do have, yes, these two other women who have come forward, they also made it very clear this remains an open investigation and have asked other women, if you've had an experience, come forward. We're listening.
00:24:34
Speaker 1: If that was 12, 15 years ago, wrote so many women wanted to get this behind them. This is a part of their lives. They struggled to possibly move on and to have to come back. Maybe and talk about this again. I get it. These six women did come forward, but I could understand why if there are more out there, why they wouldn't want to come forward, why they wouldn't want to come forward and be accused of right and being examined for their behavior. And why were you here?
00:25:01
Speaker 2: Right?
00:25:01
Speaker 1: A lot of this was hookups and they were excited to be with this superstar.
00:25:05
Speaker 3: Yes.
00:25:05
Speaker 1: All these things.
00:25:06
Speaker 2: Again, at the height of his fame, but they weren't expecting to be groped, like pushed up against a wall. I mean, a lot of the allegations are that he was grabbing breasts and butts and sticking his head in women's crotches, like just really gross, vile behavior that people just, and look, people had to turn their heads and look the other way. And Look, men like this don't operate in a vacuum. I mean, people do look the other way. And if this was happening on movie sets, this, I mean, one of the alleged sexual assaults actually were in the MTV offices. Like, these were in, like, corporate offices on movie sets. And so, look, this is... This is incredibly disturbing. And you have to think what could have happened, what would have happened if these journalists hadn't done these investigations and hadn't convinced these women to bravely come forward and tell their stories. And even though they weren't the ones that ended up putting him on trial, it led to the convictions that we saw in London on this day.
00:26:16
Speaker 1: That media investigation, it was 2023? 2023, yes. This is fairly quick, you could argue then, Rose.
00:26:22
Speaker 2: Very quick. And look, rape cases... are among the hardest to prove, because oftentimes it's he said, she said. Two people, there aren't cameras, there usually aren't witnesses, oftentimes there isn't physical evidence, and a lot of times women have misgivings and are slow to come forward and to describe what happened to them, and all of that leads to making it be very difficult to actually successfully prosecute a case like this.
00:26:51
Speaker 1: What do women do first after something like this? They ask themselves, right?
00:26:54
Speaker 2: What did I do wrong? Did I make him think that this was okay? Did I lead him on? Did I not say no forcefully enough? And then usually you end up telling a friend and you end up, yes, and that absolutely is what happened in these cases. And then you just bury it. You repress it. You feel guilty about it. You feel shame surrounding it. So look, anytime something like this happens, I do think it empowers women to know that you can and will be believed. But unfortunately, it does take a lot of courage to come forward in a lot of these cases, especially with someone as popular, as powerful, as even beloved. I mean, look, after forgetting Sarah Marshall, I thought he was one of the most talented, authentically funny actors I had ever seen.
00:27:45
Speaker 1: What do you do with that? It takes away from you. You go back and you view that time in his life and the Times where you were laughing at him and entertained by him and rooting for him and even seeking out his content. Rose, forgetting Sarah Marshall, I don't know about how to watch that movie again. He, what's her from Frozen?
00:28:05
Speaker 2: Kristen Bell.
00:28:05
Speaker 1: Kristen Bell, right?
00:28:06
Speaker 2: Love her.
00:28:07
Speaker 1: They were together. Rose, that was a hilarious duo in this movie.
00:28:11
Speaker 2: They were amazing. They played off each other perfectly. Perfectly.
00:28:15
Speaker 1: Yes, I know.
00:28:16
Speaker 2: And I actually own that movie. I've probably watched it a dozen times at least. And you're right. I don't know that I could watch it again because it just isn't going to feel the same. I thought it was really interesting, too, when we talk about the victims. The prosecutor, I appreciate what the prosecutor said in closing arguments, said that these women... None of them sought the limelight. None of them sought any kind of publicity. None of these women had anything to gain except some closure. Russell Brand didn't listen when I said no. He didn't listen. He didn't care. He just kept going until he achieved his ultimate aim.
00:28:56
Speaker 1: And ejaculated.
00:28:57
Speaker 2: Like what came out in court was just this ruthless, like he even told one woman who was bleeding to clean up the mess, according to her testimony, and just walked out. I mean, when you think about it from that perspective, not only was he convicted of these heinous acts, but just his attitude and reaction to them, it was like, you are worthless.
00:29:17
Speaker 1: And look, we have to say, look, he is a, he's kind of a harsh guy just by his personality, his persona. He's kind of in a what's the right way to say it? Not an aggressive guy. He's kind of deadpan, but he's very direct. He's very blunt.
00:29:35
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like, take me or leave me. He's very much like, I'm not pretending to be anything other than what I am.
00:29:40
Speaker 1: He's not warm.
00:29:41
Speaker 2: No.
00:29:42
Speaker 1: And that's okay. It's part of his shtick.
00:29:45
Speaker 2: Yes, but it's interesting because his attorneys, this really stood out to me too, his attorneys in their way of trying to convince the jury that, yeah, you might not like him to what you're saying. You might not like his attitude or how he operates. It doesn't make him a rapist. Living a highly promiscuous life is entirely lawful, however morally distasteful you may find it, his lawyer said. Even being manipulative. in the pursuit of consensual sex is completely lawful. And that's what the defense tried to argue. They said that there was no evidence that he was some kind of psychopath who rapes people and thinks it's normal. He behaved normally during and after all of these rapes. And that tells you what you need to know. So they're just saying, yes, he's gross. Yes, he's manipulative. Yes, he was promiscuous. Yes, he was sexually insatiable. but it doesn't make him a rapist.
00:30:38
Speaker 1: Is his lawyer's last name Agnafillo?
00:30:40
Speaker 2: Right? I mean, it was very similar to what we heard.
00:30:42
Speaker 1: That's the Diddy defense. Yeah. He's into the freaky stuff, but that doesn't make him a criminal.
00:30:47
Speaker 2: It does seem to be the go-to when you're trying to defend somebody who is morally reprehensible.
00:30:52
Speaker 1: It's a bad behavior. Yeah, he wasn't good to women.
00:30:54
Speaker 2: He's not illegal, just morally reprehensible.
00:30:57
Speaker 1: Even not a good boyfriend. It's not illegal. So when you are in the position, you have to make that argument. You might be in trouble.
00:31:03
Speaker 2: Yes. And that certainly was the case for the Russell Brand defense team. And yes, we'll keep watching this one because there is more to come, not just with sentencing, but also with new accusers and perhaps even more on the horizon. So we always appreciate you. Thank you. As always, I'm Amy. That's TJ. We'll see you soon.