Adam Schaeuble’s Podcast Playbook

WEBVTT

00:00:29.971 --> 00:00:32.871
Hey everybody, welcome to Call Her Cat.

00:00:33.611 --> 00:00:38.991
Today we're taking a left turn from our usual content and diving deep with someone

00:00:38.991 --> 00:00:43.411
who has not only mastered the art of podcasting, but is teaching others how

00:00:43.411 --> 00:00:45.351
to turn their content into a real business.

00:00:45.711 --> 00:00:49.011
We are thrilled to welcome Adam Scheibley to the show.

00:00:49.611 --> 00:00:54.571
Adam is an online business coach for podcasters. He teaches simple strategies

00:00:54.571 --> 00:00:58.191
to help them grow their audience and turn their content into new clients.

00:00:58.611 --> 00:01:05.471
He's been podcasting since 2015, and he's the host of the top 100 ranked entrepreneurship

00:01:05.471 --> 00:01:08.591
podcast, Podcasting Business School.

00:01:08.791 --> 00:01:13.891
With over 1,000 episodes and more than a million total downloads in his career,

00:01:14.511 --> 00:01:17.891
he knows a thing or two about what works and what doesn't.

00:01:18.411 --> 00:01:23.651
Adam, thank you for taking the time to talk today. Kat, I'm excited to be here.

00:01:23.911 --> 00:01:27.671
I appreciate the invite. Did I miss anything in your bio that you want to add?

00:01:28.171 --> 00:01:32.351
No, that's great. I'm sure we'll dive into some different nooks and crannies

00:01:32.351 --> 00:01:34.371
of the story as we go along here.

00:01:34.511 --> 00:01:38.931
But yeah, no, I'm just excited to be here. Anytime another content creator invites

00:01:38.931 --> 00:01:40.831
me to share their platform, it's always an honor.

00:01:41.691 --> 00:01:45.951
I think I appreciate that, especially as a new podcaster myself. I appreciate that a lot.

00:01:46.871 --> 00:01:51.011
So you started podcasting in 2015. You've been doing this for a long time.

00:01:51.919 --> 00:01:56.739
What got you into podcasting? What was the initial launch point for you? Yeah, great question.

00:01:57.499 --> 00:02:01.939
And this is different for everybody. Everybody has their own little motivator

00:02:01.939 --> 00:02:05.159
where they've been thinking about podcasting for a little bit.

00:02:05.299 --> 00:02:07.719
And they've had some ideas like, ooh, that would be fun. Or I think I might

00:02:07.719 --> 00:02:10.539
be good at this type of a show.

00:02:10.839 --> 00:02:15.859
And then finally, we hit the thing that tips the scale. We go for it.

00:02:16.019 --> 00:02:19.639
And for me, I owned a fitness facility.

00:02:19.979 --> 00:02:23.099
And I was getting great results. I actually had a lot of people that wanted

00:02:23.099 --> 00:02:24.479
me to franchise the concept.

00:02:24.599 --> 00:02:28.779
And I wasn't a fan of being a boss of more people.

00:02:28.919 --> 00:02:32.459
I'm like, I've got 35 employees. I really don't. It's too much already.

00:02:33.659 --> 00:02:36.599
But I did like the idea of helping more people with my message.

00:02:36.779 --> 00:02:39.639
And I had been kicking around the idea of a podcast. I was like,

00:02:39.759 --> 00:02:41.059
you know, I'm just going to do that instead.

00:02:41.339 --> 00:02:47.559
So I launched a show in the health space and just kind of brought my version

00:02:47.559 --> 00:02:56.039
of fitness and mental health strategies and things like that to a show and started to figure it out.

00:02:56.139 --> 00:02:59.899
So that was the thing, like, it's really about helping and reaching more people.

00:03:00.079 --> 00:03:05.159
And I was interested as an entrepreneur about the online business aspect of things as well.

00:03:05.579 --> 00:03:10.379
So would you say that having had a background and already running a business,

00:03:10.539 --> 00:03:13.679
and because fitness can be, that's a lot of moving parts too with fitness,

00:03:13.999 --> 00:03:18.019
that that helps you branch off more easily into the digital world?

00:03:18.746 --> 00:03:25.206
Well, maybe. I mean, I think the main skill set that I had as an entrepreneur

00:03:25.206 --> 00:03:27.826
going into this was I had some thick skin built up already.

00:03:28.026 --> 00:03:33.386
And I realized that there would be multiple attempts at trying to figure things

00:03:33.386 --> 00:03:34.846
out. And it was going to take some time.

00:03:35.026 --> 00:03:38.846
Now, I thought taking time would be like, oh, six months.

00:03:39.046 --> 00:03:43.226
But really, it took me about three years to figure out how to do anything.

00:03:43.226 --> 00:03:47.006
So but i mean content entrepreneurship

00:03:47.006 --> 00:03:50.046
content creation you've never done anything

00:03:50.046 --> 00:03:53.086
like that before it is a foreign language it's like learning learning

00:03:53.086 --> 00:03:56.326
mandarin chinese as somebody from the midwest i'm like that's totally two different

00:03:56.326 --> 00:04:02.206
things you know and it's like i started but i call it triple zero podcaster

00:04:02.206 --> 00:04:07.326
i had obviously zero podcast listeners i had zero social media like no social

00:04:07.326 --> 00:04:11.846
media followers and i had no email list and that's that makes things quite hard because you

00:04:12.046 --> 00:04:16.406
learn how to do all of those things in addition to creating your content. Right.

00:04:17.686 --> 00:04:22.066
Now, what are some things you learned along the way about people,

00:04:22.246 --> 00:04:24.866
what people should not do when they're first starting out?

00:04:25.650 --> 00:04:30.730
So one thing I like to put out there as a caveat is that every podcasting journey

00:04:30.730 --> 00:04:34.470
is going to look a little bit different, both in like the process and also in the result.

00:04:35.190 --> 00:04:39.410
And we all have that, like the longer you're in podcasting, you'll have this

00:04:39.410 --> 00:04:43.110
friend that also is known as your annoying friend that just kind of messes around

00:04:43.110 --> 00:04:44.710
and they end up blowing up and doing great.

00:04:44.830 --> 00:04:49.030
And we, you know, like we love them and everything, but they also kind of annoy us.

00:04:49.110 --> 00:04:51.410
Like I'm working so hard and I'm getting 12 downloads an episode.

00:04:51.410 --> 00:04:55.770
And you just did some dumb TikTok video and it exploded and now your podcast is exploding.

00:04:56.270 --> 00:04:59.690
So we kind of take them out of the equation. But we look at our own journey.

00:04:59.810 --> 00:05:02.390
We don't compare results to somebody else's because that's just poison.

00:05:03.710 --> 00:05:08.590
But that's one tip is like, as you're going into this, your journey is your journey.

00:05:08.630 --> 00:05:13.630
And you can't compare a health podcast to a business podcast or a super small

00:05:13.630 --> 00:05:16.670
niche podcast to a giant broad niche podcast.

00:05:16.850 --> 00:05:23.290
Or if you're somebody triple zero status like I was when I started to Joe Rogan,

00:05:23.350 --> 00:05:27.770
who has a podcast studio, a full-time team and millions of dollars of support.

00:05:27.890 --> 00:05:29.690
Like you just can't compare those two things.

00:05:29.830 --> 00:05:32.970
So it's probably the most important tip I could give people is just like,

00:05:33.550 --> 00:05:35.570
hunker down and think about your own journey and focus on that.

00:05:35.670 --> 00:05:39.750
Put the blinders on and go, this is going to take however long it needs to take.

00:05:40.050 --> 00:05:45.050
And if your kind of motivational big why behind this is bigger than the combined

00:05:45.050 --> 00:05:48.570
force of all the why nots, when it gets really tough, then you'll keep going.

00:05:48.570 --> 00:05:50.530
So that's one thing to think about.

00:05:51.050 --> 00:05:53.370
The other thing you always have to think about content-wise,

00:05:53.850 --> 00:05:58.070
across the board, the most important rule is, what is my audience getting out of this?

00:05:59.690 --> 00:06:00.570
So, like...

00:06:00.993 --> 00:06:04.513
Obviously, we like creating content, we like putting stuff out there,

00:06:04.573 --> 00:06:07.873
but the audience won't grow if they aren't seeing value out of it,

00:06:07.913 --> 00:06:11.273
because there's a lot of options out there for people to plug us into their

00:06:11.273 --> 00:06:13.213
earbuds on their morning walk or whatever.

00:06:13.533 --> 00:06:17.773
So we have to bring value and we have to keep trying to increase that value

00:06:17.773 --> 00:06:19.753
and also increase our skill set along the way.

00:06:19.753 --> 00:06:25.613
You won't be perfect podcaster, you know, a plus person at episode seven,

00:06:25.613 --> 00:06:30.533
but you should be a little bit better at episode a hundred than you are at episode seven.

00:06:30.693 --> 00:06:33.873
That's, that's a valid, you know, metric to kind of compare and contrast.

00:06:34.373 --> 00:06:39.433
And then I've done, I think I added up the other day, I was over 1,400 episodes between my shows.

00:06:40.033 --> 00:06:44.873
Yeah. So I've had a lot of practice at this and I tell people like,

00:06:44.933 --> 00:06:47.133
don't go back and listen to my first hundred episodes because they're pretty

00:06:47.133 --> 00:06:48.753
terrible. Like they're not good at all.

00:06:48.893 --> 00:06:52.093
So don't, don't do that. Don't torture yourself by listening to those.

00:06:52.633 --> 00:06:56.733
But now I can flip on the mic and I can do some good stuff. I can do some damage.

00:06:56.933 --> 00:06:59.113
So I think those are a few of the basic things.

00:06:59.353 --> 00:07:01.513
Just, it's going to take time.

00:07:01.773 --> 00:07:03.773
You have to compare your own journey to your own journey.

00:07:04.913 --> 00:07:08.753
And if I kind of go next level, I'm a, I'm a big fan of a weekly cadence.

00:07:08.973 --> 00:07:14.133
I'm really big on that. And I realized some people are doing this very, very, very part time.

00:07:14.293 --> 00:07:17.653
And the best they can do is one a month or whatever. And I'm like,

00:07:17.773 --> 00:07:21.113
you do that, but have a goal of how can I get more efficient?

00:07:21.233 --> 00:07:23.933
Because these same people, a lot of times, like I can only do it one a month

00:07:23.933 --> 00:07:27.373
because it takes me 10 hours to edit a 30 minute show.

00:07:27.513 --> 00:07:29.693
And I'm like, do we see the problem here?

00:07:29.853 --> 00:07:33.673
Like you're spending way too much time editing your show.

00:07:34.153 --> 00:07:37.693
Have you ever heard of something called AI that can edit your show for you?

00:07:38.413 --> 00:07:43.133
But like looking at the actual problem behind why we aren't able to release

00:07:43.133 --> 00:07:50.833
a weekly content because weekly content is really magical because of the competition factor.

00:07:51.193 --> 00:07:55.913
And, you know, we're both audio primary or audio-only podcasters.

00:07:56.633 --> 00:07:58.893
There's a little special sauce with the audio because...

00:07:59.787 --> 00:08:03.867
People can take us on the go and they are doing other things when they're consuming our content.

00:08:04.047 --> 00:08:08.327
So I want to get in their life rhythm where like, if you're a regular listener

00:08:08.327 --> 00:08:11.687
of my show, podcasting business school, new episode comes out every Tuesday.

00:08:11.887 --> 00:08:15.007
You can count on that. So you're like, Oh, Tuesday during my lunch,

00:08:15.007 --> 00:08:18.327
I always listen to Adam's show or Tuesday when I'm, you know,

00:08:18.727 --> 00:08:24.347
doing leg day at the gym, then I'm listening to Adam's show or picking up my kids or whatever.

00:08:24.547 --> 00:08:29.127
And I don't want to skip weeks and give people a reason to listen to someone

00:08:29.127 --> 00:08:30.747
else's show. and then forget about my show.

00:08:30.887 --> 00:08:34.827
So I'm big on showing up weekly. That'd be kind of a next level beginner strategy.

00:08:36.007 --> 00:08:41.147
Now, you're just a fan of one episode a week because sometimes you'll see podcasters

00:08:41.147 --> 00:08:44.267
who do like a bonus episode or whatever.

00:08:44.487 --> 00:08:46.227
You're just strictly just a one episode a week.

00:08:46.467 --> 00:08:51.207
Yeah, I mean, I think there are opportunities in different situations where

00:08:51.207 --> 00:08:52.547
you can do multiple episodes a week.

00:08:53.307 --> 00:08:57.287
I've done up to three episodes a week. For a long time, I did two episodes a week.

00:08:58.047 --> 00:09:00.947
One has become a sweet spot for me in the last year

00:09:00.947 --> 00:09:04.627
especially i've gotten better at kind

00:09:04.627 --> 00:09:10.247
of reading the room a little bit and trying to think through my my audience

00:09:10.247 --> 00:09:17.347
and your consumption perspective and going okay cat listens to my show guess

00:09:17.347 --> 00:09:24.527
what cat listens to five other shows also so if i am giving her three or four episodes a week,

00:09:25.309 --> 00:09:30.389
is she really going to listen to all of that content? And what's the sweet spot?

00:09:30.489 --> 00:09:35.829
So for me, I'm big on newsletters as well. And I've got a thriving news email list.

00:09:36.369 --> 00:09:40.729
So I was like, let's back down from two a week to one a week.

00:09:40.769 --> 00:09:45.269
And then I want my newsletter to kind of be that other half of the weekly content that's unique.

00:09:45.429 --> 00:09:48.369
It's different than my show. I'm big on that as well, like two different things.

00:09:49.289 --> 00:09:52.989
And that way you have A plus B equals C. You got two things that,

00:09:53.469 --> 00:09:56.229
add value and they can consume those in

00:09:56.229 --> 00:09:59.749
different ways as well so that's what's

00:09:59.749 --> 00:10:02.569
worked really well for me other people they're like

00:10:02.569 --> 00:10:05.309
i really want to establish a lot of expert positioning or i love doing

00:10:05.309 --> 00:10:08.089
interviews i'm like okay let's do a solo episode every week

00:10:08.089 --> 00:10:11.249
and interview every week or you know whatever so it's not

00:10:11.249 --> 00:10:14.129
like set in stone across the board for every podcaster but i

00:10:14.129 --> 00:10:16.789
think we have to look for the minimum effective dose that's the

00:10:16.789 --> 00:10:19.529
key thing is like what what are my

00:10:19.529 --> 00:10:23.909
audience members going to be able to consume and if

00:10:23.909 --> 00:10:27.089
i were to go fewer would would

00:10:27.089 --> 00:10:29.809
that work would that work for me would that work for them so it's just something

00:10:29.809 --> 00:10:34.329
to consider now you touched on something that that some people have like very

00:10:34.329 --> 00:10:38.729
strong opinions on which is just being an audio only podcast and some people

00:10:38.729 --> 00:10:43.449
who and video editing can take you a long time especially if you're just doing

00:10:43.449 --> 00:10:45.649
it solo or another person,

00:10:45.909 --> 00:10:49.769
what was the deciding factor for you to go on the audio?

00:10:50.939 --> 00:10:56.859
Okay. So for me personally, and this isn't prescription for everybody,

00:10:57.119 --> 00:11:01.179
but you know, in my opinion, you can always add video.

00:11:01.399 --> 00:11:04.599
I think a lot of people should just start audio because you have to learn how

00:11:04.599 --> 00:11:08.159
to do things. That's kind of like training wheels on a bicycle.

00:11:08.399 --> 00:11:12.399
Like we're not just going to jump into a mountain bike and go riding down mountains.

00:11:12.539 --> 00:11:16.499
Like that's, that's a lot of preparation for that. That's kind of like what video content is.

00:11:17.179 --> 00:11:20.599
So I think it's a good idea to start audio only.

00:11:20.719 --> 00:11:26.659
For me, I've dabbled in audio for a decade or in video for a decade,

00:11:26.659 --> 00:11:30.839
and I've never gotten traction with it. I'm like, I've given this 10 years.

00:11:30.979 --> 00:11:34.359
I really don't need to give it any more years of my time.

00:11:34.799 --> 00:11:38.519
I've given it a solid shot and like YouTube, I try all the different things.

00:11:38.639 --> 00:11:40.959
I'm like, YouTube shorts. All right. Lives. Okay.

00:11:41.679 --> 00:11:45.619
Posting natively on YouTube. Okay. And all I get is angry teenager comments

00:11:45.619 --> 00:11:48.319
telling me, you know, bro, you suck.

00:11:48.439 --> 00:11:51.239
I'm like, okay thanks you know get off my lawn

00:11:51.239 --> 00:11:56.599
and like that's that's all i got the minimal growth but like but yet with the

00:11:56.599 --> 00:12:01.139
audio show like one of the things i'm most proud of is i started in health space

00:12:01.139 --> 00:12:05.699
took that show past half a million downloads completely different niche podcasting

00:12:05.699 --> 00:12:09.359
business school business show past almost 700 000 downloads now it's like,

00:12:10.068 --> 00:12:13.688
That I'm really, really proud of that. And that is working.

00:12:14.088 --> 00:12:17.748
So why not focus more on what is actually working than bang my head against

00:12:17.748 --> 00:12:22.828
the wall going, oh my gosh, I got to figure out YouTube because all the experts

00:12:22.828 --> 00:12:27.468
say that you have to have video content and video is killing audio and all this other stuff.

00:12:27.568 --> 00:12:30.248
I'm like, what's the reality that I'm experiencing?

00:12:30.808 --> 00:12:36.228
And I can, you know, I can record, I do a lot of solo episodes and they're about 20 minutes long.

00:12:36.368 --> 00:12:39.668
So I can record three of those in an hour and everybody else is editing

00:12:39.668 --> 00:12:42.308
for six hours on video i'm like yeah i don't know

00:12:42.308 --> 00:12:45.588
i like being a dad and a husband also so like i

00:12:45.588 --> 00:12:49.128
gotta have some time other than video editing it's

00:12:49.128 --> 00:12:51.848
about balance you don't just want to spend your life on a computer your

00:12:51.848 --> 00:12:54.488
whole time exactly and one thing that i

00:12:54.488 --> 00:12:57.708
like about you is that you're not necessarily about

00:12:57.708 --> 00:13:00.668
more social media you are more

00:13:00.668 --> 00:13:03.368
streamlined with your approach you're not like on

00:13:03.368 --> 00:13:06.288
tiktok you're not on all these other things you just

00:13:06.288 --> 00:13:10.148
you're specifically on threads is that correct yeah yeah it's

00:13:10.148 --> 00:13:13.188
weird right like i'm like the black sheep of the social media

00:13:13.188 --> 00:13:16.308
herd everybody's like must do

00:13:16.308 --> 00:13:19.608
video fear of missing out must be everywhere

00:13:19.608 --> 00:13:22.968
that's the thing like that's the strategy be everywhere and

00:13:22.968 --> 00:13:26.088
i'm just like how does this make sense for anybody like

00:13:26.088 --> 00:13:29.068
the only thing that makes sense is like oh now i see why

00:13:29.068 --> 00:13:32.188
you know the stat is i think 17 only

00:13:32.188 --> 00:13:35.168
17 percent of podcasters make it to episode 10 this is

00:13:35.168 --> 00:13:38.548
probably why we're trying to spend hours on video and

00:13:38.548 --> 00:13:41.268
it really like we end up throwing up in our mouth a little

00:13:41.268 --> 00:13:44.248
bit every time we single time we have to edit a video after like video

00:13:44.248 --> 00:13:47.708
three and then we're trying to be everywhere on social media and we're getting

00:13:47.708 --> 00:13:51.948
mean teenager comments everywhere or no comments and we're going well i'm spending

00:13:51.948 --> 00:13:59.108
80 hours a week on my show and nothing's working i quit episode six versus let's

00:13:59.108 --> 00:14:02.268
just do low-hanging fruit let's find that minimum effective dose.

00:14:02.488 --> 00:14:09.828
So for me on social media, again, I've given it a solid decade and it was my health audience.

00:14:10.798 --> 00:14:13.698
I built a really thriving community on Instagram.

00:14:13.858 --> 00:14:16.818
I did really well there and all the right things were happening.

00:14:16.978 --> 00:14:19.918
So I'm like, okay, podcasting business school, let's build on Instagram.

00:14:20.138 --> 00:14:21.658
Let's kind of focus on that. Let's do a little TikTok.

00:14:21.978 --> 00:14:24.898
Let's do a little bit of, I mean, I've tried Pinterest. I've been on LinkedIn.

00:14:24.998 --> 00:14:31.238
Like I've given it effort and it just didn't click until I got on threads and

00:14:31.238 --> 00:14:35.318
like for like about 18 months now, like when I post on threads,

00:14:35.518 --> 00:14:38.618
I get engagement. I get comments. I get new followers every single day.

00:14:38.958 --> 00:14:42.178
I get new podcast listeners every day. I get new email list subscribers every

00:14:42.178 --> 00:14:44.718
day. I get clients, you know, at least every week.

00:14:45.298 --> 00:14:50.678
And I'm like, okay, why do I need to be on Instagram?

00:14:50.838 --> 00:14:54.218
Why do I need to be on like learning other languages when this language is working

00:14:54.218 --> 00:14:55.138
really, really well for me?

00:14:55.458 --> 00:15:00.518
So maybe just as I'm 45 years old and I was like, as I get more seasoned and

00:15:00.518 --> 00:15:03.498
like, I just, I felt like I didn't get smart until like a year ago.

00:15:03.638 --> 00:15:04.758
And I'm like, okay, now I'm intelligent.

00:15:06.538 --> 00:15:10.878
I'm going to quit wasting my time. I finally grew up my brain region and let's

00:15:10.878 --> 00:15:14.338
do what actually makes sense, which is for me, less but better.

00:15:15.200 --> 00:15:18.980
And do you think sometimes content creators can be too many places?

00:15:19.180 --> 00:15:21.920
Like you can oversaturate yourself in all these channels?

00:15:22.380 --> 00:15:24.820
Yeah, and just spread yourself thin, especially if you're a solopreneur.

00:15:25.240 --> 00:15:28.260
Yeah. You know, because the be everywhere strategy works.

00:15:28.460 --> 00:15:34.940
Everybody's like Gary V. That's the big one. Or what's the, Hormozy, the Mr.

00:15:35.340 --> 00:15:39.760
Nasal Strip, flannel shirt, nasal strip, mullet, and backwards hat, you know.

00:15:40.160 --> 00:15:44.540
So I dressed up as Alex Hormozy for Halloween a couple years ago.

00:15:44.540 --> 00:15:46.480
And I was just shucking million dollar books.

00:15:46.700 --> 00:15:51.300
But like, those are the two guys. See, be everywhere. They're famous and rich. Yes.

00:15:51.520 --> 00:15:57.320
But guess what? They have teams. They have multi-million dollar advertising budgets.

00:15:57.700 --> 00:16:01.700
They've got like all this stuff didn't just like happen.

00:16:02.300 --> 00:16:09.020
You know, Gary V blew up on Twitter first and then he added a podcast and then

00:16:09.020 --> 00:16:10.760
like everything started to grow out of that.

00:16:10.860 --> 00:16:13.700
Now he's everywhere. you know pat

00:16:13.700 --> 00:16:16.900
flynn people like this like they didn't just start out like i'm creating

00:16:16.900 --> 00:16:19.860
content everywhere and it's all successful that doesn't happen

00:16:19.860 --> 00:16:22.980
so when we

00:16:22.980 --> 00:16:27.720
start as a content creator as podcasters especially i don't think we can model

00:16:27.720 --> 00:16:32.540
our game plan after alex hormosi or gary v because that just isn't going to

00:16:32.540 --> 00:16:38.080
work and or even worse all these people have talking with their friends shows

00:16:38.080 --> 00:16:41.460
and like we're gonna be like the breakfast club or we're gonna be like.

00:16:42.513 --> 00:16:47.073
Insert famous actors talking to each other. Like, guess why that works? They're famous actors.

00:16:47.333 --> 00:16:51.733
It's not because just because they're good looking and interesting people,

00:16:51.913 --> 00:16:54.193
like I'm good looking. My friend's good looking. We're funny.

00:16:54.653 --> 00:16:57.773
We're going to blow up. We're going to be sponsored by underwear companies and

00:16:57.773 --> 00:17:03.513
mattress companies and mushroom tea companies in no time. And then they're really

00:17:03.513 --> 00:17:05.773
sad face when that doesn't exactly work out.

00:17:06.153 --> 00:17:09.813
No, no. And I think sometimes people, sometimes

00:17:09.813 --> 00:17:12.673
they get into a podcast thing it's going to be an easy way to get

00:17:12.673 --> 00:17:16.093
revenue because i've heard that a bunch of times that

00:17:16.093 --> 00:17:18.753
is as you've illustrated it took you what three years to

00:17:18.753 --> 00:17:22.213
get monetized i made 37 total

00:17:22.213 --> 00:17:25.673
dollars in my first three years which was you

00:17:25.673 --> 00:17:30.253
know off of mushroom coffee affiliates so that was yeah so if you're thinking

00:17:30.253 --> 00:17:34.253
of like you're just going to jump in and start making thousands of dollars it's

00:17:34.253 --> 00:17:38.893
not going to happen no there's no going viral in podcasting and there's no like

00:17:38.893 --> 00:17:44.933
get rich quick strategy unless you are that person that is just.

00:17:46.013 --> 00:17:48.893
Masterful at sales i've seen a few of those pop through whether you

00:17:48.893 --> 00:17:51.673
like you and a lot of people like oh you still eyes

00:17:51.673 --> 00:17:55.073
to Eskimo whatever like that like legitimate

00:17:55.073 --> 00:17:57.833
like you come from a sales background and you

00:17:57.833 --> 00:18:01.493
are really good like i knew one guy that started a regional

00:18:01.493 --> 00:18:04.773
based show went out and sold sponsorship to local

00:18:04.773 --> 00:18:08.393
businesses and got six figures and

00:18:08.393 --> 00:18:11.353
he had like no no downloads yet or anything just because

00:18:11.353 --> 00:18:14.693
he's really really really good at sales that's an

00:18:14.693 --> 00:18:20.253
anomaly that is a major major outlier for most people like if you want sponsors

00:18:20.253 --> 00:18:28.593
here's a scary number and i think it's only getting worse sponsors in my experience

00:18:28.593 --> 00:18:32.793
will not talk to you unless you're doing at least 20,000 downloads a month.

00:18:33.233 --> 00:18:38.893
All right. So if you're really seeing one episode a week, that's about 5,000 per episode.

00:18:39.921 --> 00:18:43.321
80% of podcasters don't even do 1,000 downloads an episode.

00:18:43.961 --> 00:18:47.761
So the numbers don't add up. And there's a little thing called CPM,

00:18:47.941 --> 00:18:51.101
cost per mil. This is the sponsorship pay rate.

00:18:51.461 --> 00:18:56.501
So what that means is cost per mil, mils is, I don't know, Latin for 1,000 or

00:18:56.501 --> 00:19:00.001
Mandarin Chinese for 1,000. I don't know. I don't know what language it comes from.

00:19:00.181 --> 00:19:06.141
But cost per mil, cost per 1,000 downloads, a sponsor will pay you between $18 and $25.

00:19:07.421 --> 00:19:12.461
Let's run the numbers. only 20% of podcasters do a thousand downloads an episode.

00:19:12.761 --> 00:19:17.861
And then for those 1000 downloads, a sponsor will pay them between 18 and $25.

00:19:18.901 --> 00:19:24.241
This is trash. As my 15 year old son will say, dad, that's trash.

00:19:24.481 --> 00:19:30.061
Like it's not great. That's why all these, you know, these famous celebrity

00:19:30.061 --> 00:19:33.981
people, they're doing 500,000 downloads an episode.

00:19:34.221 --> 00:19:36.861
Guess what? That works out for them. The numbers work for them,

00:19:37.001 --> 00:19:40.221
not for normal person, Adam guy over here.

00:19:40.961 --> 00:19:45.721
That's why I like to convert listeners into paying clients where I create content

00:19:45.721 --> 00:19:48.581
that calls to a certain type of person with a certain type of pain point.

00:19:48.721 --> 00:19:51.381
I teach them how to start solving those pain points. And guess what?

00:19:51.781 --> 00:19:55.821
You can invest in my programs, products, and services, and I can help you solve those even faster.

00:19:56.821 --> 00:20:04.681
That's so much easier to monetize. That's such a lower audience growth point. That's why I teach.

00:20:05.640 --> 00:20:08.700
Is that why you started the podcasting business school? Yeah.

00:20:08.960 --> 00:20:14.420
Yeah. I mean, that's the whole methodology behind what I've been teaching since

00:20:14.420 --> 00:20:17.520
2018 on, on podcasting business school.

00:20:17.660 --> 00:20:20.800
And it's, I'm out there just connecting with podcasters like yourself,

00:20:20.960 --> 00:20:24.020
trying to kind of pull them over that, that giant wall.

00:20:24.180 --> 00:20:27.040
Like I'm just reaching over and pulling people over that, that mud run wall

00:20:27.040 --> 00:20:29.940
that, you know, that you, you get, if you guys have ever done a mud run,

00:20:30.060 --> 00:20:32.440
there's always that one, like wall that's too tall.

00:20:32.560 --> 00:20:34.680
You can't get over it by yourself. You have to have somebody pull you over.

00:20:34.680 --> 00:20:37.440
And that's kind of like what monetizing your podcast is like.

00:20:37.700 --> 00:20:40.320
And I'm sitting on top of that sucker and I'm just pulling people over going,

00:20:40.380 --> 00:20:44.160
listen, I know you want to get mushroom coffee sponsorships.

00:20:44.260 --> 00:20:48.060
You get some of that athletic greens cash, like your favorite podcaster,

00:20:48.140 --> 00:20:50.460
Tim Ferriss or Lewis Howes. But guess what?

00:20:50.780 --> 00:20:55.320
It's not going to work. Let's go get some clients for you or do paid communities or something.

00:20:55.320 --> 00:20:59.760
It's just like i see podcasters replacing

00:20:59.760 --> 00:21:03.080
their income leaving their nine to five and

00:21:03.080 --> 00:21:06.480
they're doing 500 to 700 downloads

00:21:06.480 --> 00:21:12.340
an episode that's a nice little sweet spot that's doable and we can't even get

00:21:12.340 --> 00:21:16.620
an underwear company to pay us 18 at that standpoint but i got people replacing

00:21:16.620 --> 00:21:21.800
their job income and going full time that's just the difference on how the system

00:21:21.800 --> 00:21:23.080
the two separate systems work.

00:21:24.260 --> 00:21:29.360
Do you think it's important when somebody like an aspiring podcaster starts

00:21:29.360 --> 00:21:31.600
to have their own definition of what success looks like?

00:21:32.782 --> 00:21:37.482
Yes. Yeah. I mean, it goes back to my first point of we can't compare our journey to anybody else's.

00:21:37.782 --> 00:21:41.442
And I've been doing this long enough. I talked to a lot of my listeners.

00:21:41.442 --> 00:21:45.742
I do coaching episodes and stuff where I'm almost becoming a part of the problem

00:21:45.742 --> 00:21:49.082
because people have, I've got 614 episodes of my show.

00:21:49.262 --> 00:21:53.202
There are people who listen to hundreds of them and they start to come up with

00:21:53.202 --> 00:21:58.402
like their Adam rules of like, I know you say to do this, but I'm doing this slight variation.

00:21:58.502 --> 00:22:03.442
I'm like, listen, that is totally fine. I'm not going to like ring my Game of

00:22:03.442 --> 00:22:05.742
Thrones bell of shame at you or anything like that.

00:22:05.862 --> 00:22:09.142
Like you didn't follow my perfect podcast naming protocol, shame.

00:22:09.522 --> 00:22:12.922
Like everybody's journey is going to be a little bit different.

00:22:13.462 --> 00:22:17.102
And we do have to start setting our own unique goals as you alluded to there, Kat.

00:22:17.162 --> 00:22:23.562
I mean, this is a great question because we go, okay, I'm doing 39 downloads an episode right now.

00:22:23.902 --> 00:22:29.962
I, you know, next benchmark, a hundred, you know, Like, that's like a hundred

00:22:29.962 --> 00:22:32.282
people showing up to listen to you speak is awesome.

00:22:32.822 --> 00:22:36.502
39 is awesome. It'd be like, I want to double that. I want to get closer to

00:22:36.502 --> 00:22:40.642
a hundred. Okay. That's my next benchmark. And you just got to pin your ears back and focus on that.

00:22:41.822 --> 00:22:47.062
Or, you know, I like really setting 1000 true fan goals. And I encourage my

00:22:47.062 --> 00:22:49.042
listeners and clients to do this in three areas.

00:22:49.202 --> 00:22:53.202
So I'm like, I think that even if you're a smaller niche podcast,

00:22:53.202 --> 00:22:56.142
we can still gun for a thousand

00:22:56.142 --> 00:22:59.802
downloads an episode event like down the road that's a great very doable

00:22:59.802 --> 00:23:02.682
goal and by the way if you do a thousand downloads per

00:23:02.682 --> 00:23:05.762
episode regularly you are in the top 20 percent of

00:23:05.762 --> 00:23:10.062
podcasters as far as downloads go so that's cool so that's that's one 1,000

00:23:10.062 --> 00:23:14.562
true fans there i like to get people a thousand on their email list and get

00:23:14.562 --> 00:23:18.102
at least one social media platform you have a thousand followers there like

00:23:18.102 --> 00:23:23.702
that's those are nice i mean very doable i've seen very not my clients,

00:23:23.822 --> 00:23:26.782
of course, but like mediocre people out there, like getting to those numbers.

00:23:26.922 --> 00:23:29.722
So I'm like, okay, if they can do it, we can all do it.

00:23:29.962 --> 00:23:36.602
And so I like, you know, people do ask me, what's good? What should I shoot for? And again.

00:23:37.716 --> 00:23:41.316
Everybody's journey is is unique to each their own goal-wise but

00:23:41.316 --> 00:23:44.136
here's some ones that just kind of like i'll put those

00:23:44.136 --> 00:23:47.436
numbers out there from like here's some things that are possible that

00:23:47.436 --> 00:23:50.936
are because that's part of it for a lot of people like i

00:23:50.936 --> 00:23:53.576
don't know what's possible should i be shooting for you know

00:23:53.576 --> 00:23:56.476
fame and fortune and six months and or like

00:23:56.476 --> 00:24:00.876
what do i do the journey just has so many vague points

00:24:00.876 --> 00:24:03.636
and variables that it helps just have a

00:24:03.636 --> 00:24:06.436
little bit of clarity and that's why i try to give people some benchmarks i'm

00:24:06.436 --> 00:24:09.156
like here's where you're at here's the next thing to go just focus on that you're going

00:24:09.156 --> 00:24:11.796
to be good i i was listening to one of your

00:24:11.796 --> 00:24:15.456
episodes yesterday about newsletters because you're big on newsletters and the

00:24:15.456 --> 00:24:21.376
way you use them is is really interesting can you touch on that a little bit

00:24:21.376 --> 00:24:27.436
yeah so again another way that i'm weird and different in the industry the standard

00:24:27.436 --> 00:24:30.496
is i'm a podcaster i put out a weekly podcast.

00:24:30.916 --> 00:24:36.436
I also have a quote unquote newsletter that is basically a, either a transcript

00:24:36.436 --> 00:24:39.836
of my podcast or just a promotional email for my podcast. That's,

00:24:39.836 --> 00:24:41.096
that's like industry standard.

00:24:41.536 --> 00:24:44.836
Yeah. And then people wonder why their email open rate kind of sucks.

00:24:44.896 --> 00:24:48.056
Like people are like, I don't like getting promotional emails,

00:24:48.056 --> 00:24:51.776
you know, like I want to open things that are of value.

00:24:51.956 --> 00:24:56.036
So my philosophy is I put out a podcast episode every Tuesday.

00:24:56.176 --> 00:25:00.436
It's on one topic, my Thursday podcasting business school newsletter will be

00:25:00.436 --> 00:25:01.516
on a completely different topic.

00:25:01.776 --> 00:25:05.836
Now, I do mention my latest episode, it's like a two-liner towards the end.

00:25:05.956 --> 00:25:08.296
Like, hey, if you haven't listened, here's why you should go check it out.

00:25:08.856 --> 00:25:13.316
But it teaches, I write for an hour when I make that newsletter on a totally

00:25:13.316 --> 00:25:16.596
different topic because I want people to consume both. I want them...

00:25:17.956 --> 00:25:22.336
It was weird at PodFest, I missed this past year's PodFest, but two years ago,

00:25:22.356 --> 00:25:27.636
I had more people come up to me and go, I read your newsletter than I listened to your podcast.

00:25:27.936 --> 00:25:32.876
And I was at, I was a featured speaker at a podcasting convention and people

00:25:32.876 --> 00:25:35.256
are talking about my newsletter more often. And I was like, that's interesting.

00:25:35.536 --> 00:25:39.236
And I see more people convert into being clients as well.

00:25:39.376 --> 00:25:43.476
So I really started doubling down on not only building that newsletter list,

00:25:43.596 --> 00:25:47.716
but also just the content and the value add and the strategy behind that.

00:25:47.916 --> 00:25:51.796
Because I just think that when people are listening to podcasts or doing something

00:25:51.796 --> 00:25:56.136
else, they're less likely to take action, like buying something or signing up for a discovery call.

00:25:56.316 --> 00:25:59.596
When people are reading a newsletter, that's a little bit more of a captive

00:25:59.596 --> 00:26:03.996
eyes on a screen audience. And we're used to clicking on eyes on screen links

00:26:03.996 --> 00:26:07.296
and buying things or going down a rabbit hole.

00:26:07.516 --> 00:26:10.956
So that's become a very, very important part of my strategy.

00:26:11.236 --> 00:26:15.816
And I, and to make that work at all, I have to incentivize people to want to

00:26:15.816 --> 00:26:18.576
open those emails and, and read those.

00:26:18.696 --> 00:26:21.536
And I burned the ships. I got rid of all my other lead magnets.

00:26:21.616 --> 00:26:25.756
I don't talk about, there's no other way to get on my email list than to subscribe to my newsletter.

00:26:26.596 --> 00:26:31.476
And it's really worked. Like I, since I, everybody's like, you're an idiot.

00:26:31.816 --> 00:26:35.956
You don't do, you don't do lead magnets. You don't have a scorecard. You don't have a funnel.

00:26:36.536 --> 00:26:39.316
And I was like, i don't know about you all

00:26:39.316 --> 00:26:43.896
but like i'm not that person like yes i want this scorecard and then please

00:26:43.896 --> 00:26:47.776
deliver 47 emails and try to sell me something that costs eight thousand dollars

00:26:47.776 --> 00:26:53.416
every third email you know said nobody ever like that's that's the that's the

00:26:53.416 --> 00:26:57.276
thing i'm like am i the only one that thinks logically about you know blasting

00:26:57.276 --> 00:26:58.796
people with all these emails and everything,

00:26:59.396 --> 00:27:03.216
but yeah that's worked tremendously well for me i've doubled my email list size

00:27:03.216 --> 00:27:07.476
in about a year just by focusing on the newsletter. Who would have thought?

00:27:08.716 --> 00:27:12.256
No, but I like the way you do it because you're not just bombarding people with

00:27:12.256 --> 00:27:15.656
the same information. You're giving them the new information. Yeah.

00:27:15.996 --> 00:27:18.636
You know, you're not because how many emails do we get a day?

00:27:19.388 --> 00:27:24.448
And, yeah, you know, and so I like that strategy because you're giving them

00:27:24.448 --> 00:27:27.828
something new, not just regurgitating the same thing because they already know

00:27:27.828 --> 00:27:29.048
where to find your podcast.

00:27:29.788 --> 00:27:34.048
Exactly. And so you're giving them something new and different to look forward

00:27:34.048 --> 00:27:38.288
to opening from you with like a little, hey, by the way, about my episode.

00:27:38.768 --> 00:27:40.228
That's the strategy. You nailed it.

00:27:40.808 --> 00:27:46.288
Now, I am curious, like, you're a busy guy. You do the podcasting.

00:27:46.388 --> 00:27:47.268
You do the business school.

00:27:48.068 --> 00:27:50.908
You have a family. what do you do

00:27:50.908 --> 00:27:53.708
when you're not doing all this like how do you like

00:27:53.708 --> 00:27:57.128
rewind how do you relax how do you find balance

00:27:57.128 --> 00:28:00.648
with all this stuff yeah well the

00:28:00.648 --> 00:28:03.428
nice thing about the way i've built my business is i've

00:28:03.428 --> 00:28:07.968
got a three-day work week and really it's like two and a half days because and

00:28:07.968 --> 00:28:12.568
what i do is i full day tuesday and then half days on wednesday thursday friday

00:28:12.568 --> 00:28:16.068
so i'm actually working four days of the week but if you add it all together

00:28:16.068 --> 00:28:19.108
it's about two and a half days i'm like you're like one of the last things i'm

00:28:19.108 --> 00:28:22.648
doing on a friday boom we're done i'm off off to the gym but for me,

00:28:23.228 --> 00:28:26.468
i'm heavily invested in being a dad i'm heavily invested in being a husband

00:28:26.468 --> 00:28:31.008
a friend i've got lots of hobbies i go work out like i'm obsessed with like

00:28:31.008 --> 00:28:33.508
all the 45 year old man health hacking

00:28:33.508 --> 00:28:38.228
things and i wrote about that my newsletter the other day i was like.

00:28:39.678 --> 00:28:42.658
Maybe this is TMI, but I was like, I'm standing completely naked in front of

00:28:42.658 --> 00:28:46.958
my red light, sipping mushroom coffee. I think I'm listening to many health podcasts at this point.

00:28:47.398 --> 00:28:50.158
Like that's, I do all those things. I love reading.

00:28:50.318 --> 00:28:54.338
I'm reading an 800 page book about Abraham Lincoln right now called team of

00:28:54.338 --> 00:28:56.658
rivals. And I'm obsessed with it. It is so good.

00:28:57.718 --> 00:29:02.538
You know, just like, I'm big on consuming content, getting outside.

00:29:02.738 --> 00:29:06.718
Like I'm learning how to like garden and grow flowers and stuff that just doesn't make any sense.

00:29:06.918 --> 00:29:11.158
Like, like even like 10 year ago, me would be making fun of me right now.

00:29:11.338 --> 00:29:15.358
All the, all these like, like, bro, you're growing flowers.

00:29:15.578 --> 00:29:18.318
I still do squats, man. I still do squats and deadlifts.

00:29:19.258 --> 00:29:20.598
It's all good. Never skip leg

00:29:20.598 --> 00:29:25.518
day. But no, like I, like the coolest things in my life are my children.

00:29:25.658 --> 00:29:29.418
Like they just seeing them grow up and,

00:29:29.618 --> 00:29:32.798
you know, my son just started high school this year and

00:29:32.798 --> 00:29:36.258
my daughter's doing amazing things both athletes it's like watching them do

00:29:36.258 --> 00:29:41.938
their thing i'm like this is like crazy cool to sit back and watch them do their

00:29:41.938 --> 00:29:46.558
thing and i'm i'm a big fan that's one of my goals this year is and going forward

00:29:46.558 --> 00:29:52.618
is like to not miss their games and anything like that like i have designed my business my and my.

00:29:54.038 --> 00:29:57.078
Schedule around being able to show up for them and

00:29:57.078 --> 00:30:00.158
and help them out with their workouts and coach teams

00:30:00.158 --> 00:30:03.398
and and be at games and make meals and

00:30:03.398 --> 00:30:06.098
pick up drop off from school all that stuff that's i keep

00:30:06.098 --> 00:30:09.818
i keep pulling i'm i'm more busy i'm busier

00:30:09.818 --> 00:30:14.378
on my non-work days than i am on my work days that's just from all the all the

00:30:14.378 --> 00:30:18.918
family stuff that's nice though because it seems like you streamlined your business

00:30:18.918 --> 00:30:23.118
where it fits your life not where you work your life around your business but

00:30:23.118 --> 00:30:27.418
you work your business around your life yeah there are there are like electric

00:30:27.418 --> 00:30:29.778
fence boundaries on my schedule and.

00:30:30.778 --> 00:30:39.358
That's a big deal if you don't do that you're all the stuff will creep in and

00:30:39.358 --> 00:30:41.798
like three of my favorite books are,

00:30:42.569 --> 00:30:46.129
I'll talk about this. So one of them is called The One Thing by Gary Keller

00:30:46.129 --> 00:30:49.569
and Jay Papasan. There's another one called Essentialism, Greg McKeown.

00:30:50.049 --> 00:30:55.029
And then the third one is, I'm looking at my bookshelf, 10X is Easier Than 2X

00:30:55.029 --> 00:30:57.689
by Dan Sullivan and Benjamin Hardy.

00:30:58.129 --> 00:31:03.549
And like those three books, I invested in Dan Sullivan's program.

00:31:03.689 --> 00:31:04.749
He was my coach for seven years.

00:31:04.909 --> 00:31:09.229
And like the first thing he taught me was taking days off and like how to effectively

00:31:09.229 --> 00:31:14.469
not work and track those non-work days. And I know that my non-work days need

00:31:14.469 --> 00:31:16.729
to be between 160 and 200 days a year.

00:31:16.829 --> 00:31:21.329
And if I do that, I'm going to make more money than if I'm working 365 days a year.

00:31:21.669 --> 00:31:24.249
So a little bit of rewiring went on during that time.

00:31:24.889 --> 00:31:28.889
And that's a hard concept because a lot of people are taught to work more,

00:31:29.009 --> 00:31:31.109
work harder, work faster, work longer.

00:31:31.709 --> 00:31:36.069
And you see so many people just burning themselves out, especially on social

00:31:36.069 --> 00:31:39.629
media, because they're not ingesting anything other.

00:31:40.909 --> 00:31:44.229
Yeah yeah that's absolutely right as you

00:31:44.229 --> 00:31:46.969
seem like your life is very fulfilling or the gem you have a

00:31:46.969 --> 00:31:50.369
family you know you have your mushroom coffee you know

00:31:50.369 --> 00:31:55.489
i make jokes about mushroom coffee is there

00:31:55.489 --> 00:32:02.689
any last words of wisdom or tips you can leave us with today well i think i

00:32:02.689 --> 00:32:05.649
briefly mentioned it earlier but like whether you're a content creator or you're

00:32:05.649 --> 00:32:08.489
trying to get healthy or you're trying to improve your life or relationship

00:32:08.489 --> 00:32:13.169
the whole thing for me has been like the why versus the why not equation.

00:32:13.389 --> 00:32:16.469
Like what's the reason you want to actually do this?

00:32:16.869 --> 00:32:20.529
And is that bigger than all the combined force of all the why nots?

00:32:20.569 --> 00:32:22.389
Cause all the why nots are going to happen all at once.

00:32:22.569 --> 00:32:25.269
And if those are bigger, they're going to win and you're going to quit.

00:32:25.429 --> 00:32:28.789
And with content creating, with podcasting.

00:32:29.705 --> 00:32:34.105
Like the attrition rate is so ginormous. Only 5% of us make it to a hundred

00:32:34.105 --> 00:32:36.545
episodes. How many episodes you at Kat? Where are you at right now?

00:32:37.005 --> 00:32:41.345
Like 21. Boom. Gotta get to a hundred. Being that 5%. I'm gonna,

00:32:41.345 --> 00:32:42.565
I'm gonna, I'm gonna be watching you Kat.

00:32:42.665 --> 00:32:46.205
I'm gonna be supporting you. So like that's, but that's just like,

00:32:46.305 --> 00:32:48.365
it's just getting the reps in.

00:32:48.705 --> 00:32:52.725
When I hire, when new clients hire me, I go, okay, first hundred episodes,

00:32:52.945 --> 00:32:54.125
you learn how to be a podcaster.

00:32:54.305 --> 00:32:56.645
Like you don't even know how to be a podcaster until you've done a hundred because

00:32:56.645 --> 00:32:57.705
you're gonna screw things up.

00:32:58.125 --> 00:33:00.725
You're gonna find things you like. You're going to find things that you're like,

00:33:00.825 --> 00:33:03.565
oh, I hope no one ever listens to that one.

00:33:04.205 --> 00:33:07.245
And then you start to kind of get your cadence.

00:33:07.445 --> 00:33:11.945
And you're like, this is who I am as a content creator. Here's what I like talking

00:33:11.945 --> 00:33:13.725
about. And here's who I like talking to.

00:33:13.965 --> 00:33:18.285
Here's what I like learning about. And you just start to kind of grow this new

00:33:18.285 --> 00:33:21.145
skin. And you're like, ah, this is me as a content creator.

00:33:21.305 --> 00:33:24.845
So I think you're doing an awesome job. Oh, thank you. For your audience,

00:33:25.745 --> 00:33:27.605
like watch Kat's journey.

00:33:27.805 --> 00:33:31.025
Like she is on this journey. she's going to get the 100 plus episodes and you

00:33:31.025 --> 00:33:35.225
know keep bringing value you've asked amazing questions today this was a great

00:33:35.225 --> 00:33:39.365
interview so uh i'm all i'm all frothed up and fired up now like,

00:33:40.005 --> 00:33:42.645
i gotta go make my kids lunch and i'm like they're gonna be like what's wrong

00:33:42.645 --> 00:33:45.225
with dad i just did a podcast interview with my friend cat.

00:33:47.405 --> 00:33:51.465
No i love it thank you for the for the boost of confidence i appreciate that,

00:33:52.425 --> 00:33:57.225
and i think you left us with a lot of good stuff today and i've enjoyed talking to you,

00:33:57.745 --> 00:34:00.965
and i think you touched on a lot of good points which isn't

00:34:00.965 --> 00:34:04.525
specifically how to make money on podcasts because i

00:34:04.525 --> 00:34:08.805
think you got to enjoy what you do and then the money will will come over time

00:34:08.805 --> 00:34:13.145
yeah but it's it from my perspective you get into just for money you're going

00:34:13.145 --> 00:34:18.845
to be very disappointed very quickly um yeah yeah if you get in to be rich and

00:34:18.845 --> 00:34:22.845
famous it's probably not gonna work out so well no no but thank you so much

00:34:22.845 --> 00:34:24.305
adam for talking with us today,

00:34:25.005 --> 00:34:28.025
I don't want to take up too much more of your time I know you've got a gym to get to,

00:34:28.905 --> 00:34:32.325
lunches to make especially if it's Friday I want you to enjoy your Friday,

00:34:33.792 --> 00:34:37.972
And I want to remind everyone to check out Adam's podcast, Podcast Business

00:34:37.972 --> 00:34:41.732
School, and his website. Sign up for his email. Find him on threads.

00:34:42.492 --> 00:34:45.852
His insights, game-changing. He did a lot for us today.

00:34:46.552 --> 00:34:49.532
Everything will be in the show notes. Thank you so much for listening.

00:34:49.832 --> 00:34:53.452
Thank you so much for the conversation, Adam. I appreciate it.

00:34:55.092 --> 00:34:58.112
And that's all we have time for today. Thanks, Kat. Thank you.