Heal Your Wounded Inner Teenager (and Stop Generational Trauma) - with Tatjana Simakova

0:00 Hello, and welcome to today's episode of Thrive after 45. I'm Denise Drink Walter heart whisperer, midlife mirror and mentor Every week I am honored to share. Energy and space with inspiring guests whose stories reflect so many possibilities of thriving beyond 45. Together we'll uncover the whispers of the heart, the power of midlife transformation, and the wisdom that fuels expansion. How much of your teenage self still lives within you?

0:40 That voice that wanted to be seen, understood, or simply heard. Could it still be shaping the way you parent love and maybe even react today? My guess, Tatiana Kova believes it does. Her life's work has been. About bringing that unseen gap between the wounded teen inside of us and the one growing up, maybe even under our own roofs. Right now. Tatiana's own story is one of courage and transformation. Growing up with an alcoholic mother, navigating family separation and raising her own children without a support system gave her a deep lived understanding of what it means to heal from the inside out.

1:32 she spent. More than a decade working in complex care and private practice from Pita House, supporting those at risk of suicide and self-harm to working with HSE and Tula referred foster care cases guiding both teens and parents through some of life's toughest emotional terrain. As a psychotherapist, art therapist, and founder of the Alvis Parenting Community, Tatiana has supported thousands of families to move from emotional chaos to calm connection, helping parents re. Build communication, set those boundaries without shame heal the generational patterns that quietly shape their families.

2:21 Her message is simple but powerful when we reconnect with our inner teenager. We begin to parent and live from a place of deeper understanding. Tatiana, what a privilege to share space and time with you today. Thank you for being here. Denise, thank you very much for having me on your show. And it is my honor to be here and I'm looking forward to this's, um, chat today. Me too. As soon as we had our initial conversation and you talked about the incredible gifts that you bring to family units, to reconnect with teenagers and themselves through a journey of exploration.

3:04 All of the things that you bring to the table, we would love to hear a little bit about your story so we can understand a bit of your path that helped move you to where you are here today. Yes, of course. Um, now first of all, I, I was born and raised in Lithuania. To a Russian family and I'm living in Ireland now. Um, so that on itself is a journey. Um, my childhood. Um, I think the way I see it, it was very. Inattentive, I would say, uh, where I was left to my own devices because, um, my parents separated when I was about six years, uh, of age.

3:51 I, I think now looking back because of my mom's, um, addiction problems, right? And when my dad left, he didn't have the access to us children. So unfortunately there was a battle there where we didn't see him for a while. Um, and we're still living with my mom, right? And witnessing all the, uh, dark side of. Of, of that illness. Right. Um, I know my brother, he's four years older than me, and, um, he, he did stood up for me quite a lot. Mm-hmm. And he was protecting me from, um, he tried to protect, I mean, like he couldn't do much, but he tried to protect from witnessing too much, but mm-hmm.

4:42 Um, I think neither of us were. You know, in a safe place. Yeah. Yeah. So, and that left us growing up by ourselves. Mm-hmm. So when I'm saying that no one knew where we were from morning to evening, I know I skipped a lot of school days, um, because I just didn't feel like going to school and no one knew about it. Um, we were unattended all the time. We were. I know my brother had very bad influence, um, from his friends. I know I started going that path as well.

5:24 Mm-hmm. So, uh, when, when I was 13, and, uh, I'm very grateful for that. My dad took me in mm, into his, um, house. And I was growing there now while I was away from all the craziness of alcohol. Yeah. And, um, I still didn't get the. The nurturing side of it, because now my dad has his own trauma and sure didn't know how to express love, how to express affection. So it was very, it was safe environment, right and up, but very lonely and very um.

6:11 I don't remember ever hearing I love you. Um, or hug me or just hang out together because, you know, we like being in the same space. I always refer to it. It was quiet because we barely talked. We talked only. What is for dinner? You know, what will I buy? Sure. Is there a milk? And that's it. Right. Um, and I do think that he had a different addiction, which is, um, a TV addiction. Okay. Yeah. So as far as I remember, as I remember, my dad, he was watching tv.

6:51 Mm-hmm. He was watching TV while eating. He was watching TV while going to bed. So that was. I think, yeah, the way he was covering his own pain and loneliness and inability to connect. Um, so that's how, that's the environment I sure. Continued growing up. So as you can, um, imagine nurturing site wasn't there, right? Um. The worm, worm side wasn't there, you know, and I'm, I love my parents deeply. Mm-hmm. Can imagine.

7:32 I did go through a path of, excuse me, I worked through that pain. I worked right. Yeah. Uh, and it was a long path, uh, for me, but I found the way to, I never fully reconnected with my mom. Okay. Before she died, um, uh, she died two years ago. Okay. And, um, I suppose I wasn't in touch with her for many years before that. Mm-hmm. Well, in my mind and my heart, she was always there. She was always, um, she still, always with me. Mm-hmm. With my dad as adults, I, I think I had good enough relationship, but it wasn't the one where I could go.

8:20 And chat to him. Right. When me leaving in Ireland, we didn't have daily or even weekly phone calls. Mm-hmm. You know, I suppose he assumed if I'm not calling, but bad news I am. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, but in saying that, I did my best to bring my own children back to Lithuania and connect and it was important. Mm-hmm. And, um, he passed away last year and I think. The whole year before him passing. Um, we had some connection. Very quiet, though. It wasn't, uh, now I was saying that I love him, but, um, it was, the response was yes.

9:05 Right, right. Yeah. Yeah. Um, you know, so even then it was very difficult for him to say, yeah, you know, I love you back. Mm-hmm. So, um, and that this journey, um, working on my own emotions and on my own self-esteem, uh, brought me to where I am in my career. So in a way, I became. Who I really wanted to have in my life as a team, someone who I can talk to, someone who I can trust, someone who I can just drop my problems onto and, you know, feel that yeah.

9:47 Relief, um, in myself. Amazing. I can't even begin to imagine the journey that you had to take even after everything you endured during the tumultuous time, going into you breaking away and learning about more of who you are as a person and how what has happened to you isn't a reflection of you, but a reflection of those who were not able to, for whatever their reasons were that. We're not here to chat about, but what I love about what you just shared in particular is that you have such a depth of understanding of those teenage years and what is actually needed because you not only survived, but you thrived.

10:43 And look at what you are doing now. Like. My heart just goes, you know, the Grinch where his heart just goes, blows through the end with the rectangle at the end of the show. That's what's coming through for me right now because you, I I, we would love to know more about why teenage, why that, um, what's the word I'm coming up with? I'm stuck right now. Why that the stage. Stage. Yeah. Why that stage in particular? Thank you love, and I'd love to know more around the idea of art therapy and how, how that is important in the work that you do as well.

11:33 Yeah. Well, what I see is. I think the teenage years is the earliest, when we can catch and work on that trauma because children adapt, right? And for children, they adapt to any kind of environment and it becomes norm for them. So me growing up as a child, I didn't know any difference, you know? Right. That was normal for me. Um, so only growing up and seeing other families. Um, my friends' families said, oh, it doesn't have to be that, that way. Right. It can be different. Right.

12:13 So I think when we become, uh, we become, we were there as well, so mm-hmm. When we become teenagers mm-hmm. Because of their brain development, we kind of connect the dots of what happened. And then now not only we start questioning, who am I now? Right? Because that's just natural process. We start questioning, who am I now as a result of what happened to me? Mm mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. Where as a child. I mightn't have understood what was happening to me, but now I connect the dots. Love that. Mm-hmm. That's not normal.

12:54 I want answers. And um, I do find that, um, a lot of the times trauma resurface at that stage. Okay, perfect. So while working with children, of course it is very important, um, but you can't. Push the trauma into boxes and put it away while they're still young. Sure. Where teenage years, you can try and do that. But that's my, you know, favorite line. And I say to every client of mine, every teenager that I work with, no matter what, we will achieve. During our work, before they get into a serious relationship, they need to go back to therapy and work on that again.

13:43 Right. As adults then. So I think it's a kind of stage work, uh, or work love that, that you do in stages. Because when they're team, there's only so much they can understand still. They're still not adults. Their brain is still not developed, so they will. Again, make boxes and make understanding of whatever happened to them, um, to a certain degree, right? Mm-hmm. And then they start developing more and specifically know before entering any relationship they need right. Do again. And that's my belief.

14:23 That's what I do think is beneficial for them. And a, and art therapy. How, how? What's the beauty in art therapy that you find in your work? It's the mess, isn't it? There we go. We, I think now, first of all, it's almost a medium where a teen, they don't have to look me in the eyes. Yes. You know, because when we sit in front of each other, it's very unnatural environment. Uh, naturally we wouldn't sit in front of each other, stare at each other and say, okay, tell me everything what you feel.

15:07 Right? And here they, they kind of ask to sit down in front of a therapist, look them in the eye, um, and mm-hmm. They don't know that person, first of all. Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. And pour all of their pain out. Yes. So that might be difficult. So Art, uh, gives this opportunity while creating something and concentrating on whatever it is, doodling. Um, they keep talking to me. Sure. So that's, that's one way of using art. Um, another way we live in a very structured world. Yeah. Um, you know, at school they have.

15:48 Whatever time in your country is, you know, they have say nine to four o'clock, half past four. Right. Um, they have their classes, they come back home. They do either their after school activities or homework. Mm-hmm. So it's very structured. There is Right. Little kind of flexibility. Mm-hmm. And I think art can provide that. It can provide just mess. And put them to be messy and not to worry, to make that mess on the table. And I say it straight away, don't worry about my table. Yeah. Don't worry about my, uh, walls. It's fine. It can be.

16:28 Love it. And, um, especially nine, 10 years of age children, they love just pouring paint. Yeah. And testing it. You know, slime is another thing again, it's um mm-hmm. Sensory activity that, um, relaxes them and allows them to open up a bit more. Yeah. To me it also seems like it is an outlet, um, and brings in the. Ability to play without, you know, it has to look like this, right? So get to play with it and just release stuff that's sitting in there that needs to get released in a way that's non-confrontational, non-judgmental, just free.

17:16 I love that. Absolutely. Absolutely love that. Getting out of the box and getting out schedules and you know, yeah. That's the world. They can create anything, um, and they can be anything. Mm-hmm. In that moment. Mm-hmm. So it's very empowering. Love that. Yeah, love that. Um, I wonder if you could tell us a little bit about your community. I love the name. Um, I, I, I'm gonna spell it for the audience because it's very unique. Um, it's Salva, S-A-L-V-U-S parent.

17:59 P-A-R-E-N, capital, T-E-E-N-G, parenting. I love that. Tell us about what the intent of that community is, if you don't mind. Yes, yes. And I did want, uh, to have that teen in the name. So, um, it's out there, it is about, um, now it becomes not directly about a four. Teenagers. Right. It's more for the parents of teenagers. Yeah. Yeah. Um, because you know, I mentioned before I wanted to become the person who I needed Yeah.

18:40 Growing up. But with this community, I wanted to become the person for the parents who needs a little bit support, who needs a little bit of, um, connection and learning and, um. You know, that's the idea. Okay. Now the, the platform is at its baby stage. Sure. Um, but it's up and running. Love it. You know, there are a lot of free resources. Mm-hmm. Um, there are, um, some paid resources, but the idea is sure that we can't wear a child, um, by ourselves. We need a village.

19:21 Mm-hmm. So I'm creating that village and it is ever growing, uh, village of not only parents, um, where yes, parents can connect among themselves there. They can ask questions, but also I am inviting professionals. Nice, nice of all walks to share their work, um mm-hmm. And to share their knowledge. And again, we are. They're together learning from each other. I'm learning from other experts. I'm learning from other parents as well. I'm a parent myself. And um, there is a lot of knowledge and it is growing, which is brilliant and people have interest in that.

20:05 There is a yes. I'm very excited. It's a couple of months old only, and, um, love that, hoping to grow it into something really big and powerful. I, I have no doubt. In my mind, my body, my heart, and my soul, that it will grow exponentially. The work I've done in the past as an educator and as a, in my early, um, parts of the coaching career that I'm creating in the journey that I'm on there is. Such a thirst for parents to connect with their children, and the world is changing exponentially and um, parents are getting blocked all the way around and they don't know if they're blocking themselves or what's going on.

20:55 So I'm. So grateful that A, it's in the early stages and b, I know it's going to grow. I know there is such a need out there for the work that you're putting into that community. Is it available worldwide to our listeners? It is absolutely worldwide. Anyone can connect. Perfect. Anyone can download the resources. It's um, okay. It's, it's ama and this is amazing that anyone can join. Yeah. You know, anyone can be from any part of the world. Yes. And share their experiences. I think it's, it's fascinating. Um, it's lovely. It's so powerful and empowering.

21:36 So we will have all this information in the show notes For sure. So that people can access that information. Thank you. I'm, I just love the idea and I love that you just. Let's go. That's, that's my girl. We can think all day long and nothing happens, but, and like you say, I don't know, this is kind of my vision. If we don't even start, we can't. Get moving on any of it. So thank you for, for putting that together and love the title, love Parenting. Oh, thank you so much. Love that. It's brilliant. Yes. Um, I would absolutely love to know, and it might not be the right kind of question, but I'm.

22:23 Pop it in here anyway. Yes, of course. What do many or most parents get, quote unquote wrong about teenage behavior and how can they shift that without losing connection? Yes. Now, first of all, no one is doing anything wrong. Okay. We are all just human beings. And it's not about pointing the finger. Yeah. It's not about, you know, we're not feeling as, as parents. Um, but it's to understand that. When we change something in our reactions, they have no choice but change as well.

23:08 And a very common thing that I see with parents is if you imagine when a child is small, child is here. Um, I dunno, are we, are you going to leave a video or is it just um, a voice? We do, we do voice and video so we can explain what you're doing in your, with your hands as we go. Thank you. Because I have it on both platforms, podcast and YouTube, so, yeah. Okay. It depends on our listeners. Perfect. I'll try and explain it, um, verbally as well. So. When a child is small, we tend to tell them what to do and talk to them kind of from up and down, right?

23:48 Right. You go and do this and this is right and this is wrong. And we are telling them right as they grow. They, we kind of need to be on more equal than, okay. And it doesn't mean that we, we give all the power and all the decisions to them because they're not ready for that yet. But instead of telling them what to do, we need to start asking questions, what do you think you would like to do? Or, um, what do you think the consequences of this choice are going to be? So it's not only giving them. And our, um, authenticity, right?

24:29 Mm-hmm. But it's also teaching them make their own decisions. Mm-hmm. Not based on someone told me to do that, but based on their own thinking. Right. Because af and that's why we need that stage to separate from us, right. And learn, make to make mistakes while in the safety of the parents. Yes. 'cause they make mistake mistakes. They're going to make mistakes. They're going to fall and we are there to catch them and say, mm-hmm. Okay, let's fix this together. Right. And I love the question, um, what, what came of that situation for you?

25:13 What did you come out with that come out of that with? What's the learning that if you ever have that circumstance again? What would you do the same? What would you do differently? Why? Why not? Exactly Right. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you know, you notice the minute you say to the, uh, teenager, go and do something or don't do something, they're going to do the opposite. They're going, put the hand, don't talk to me. You don't know. Fine. I don't know. You tell me what you think. Yeah. Yeah. You tell me what you know, let's kind of chat about it. Yeah. And when we don't push our own agenda onto them mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. They tend to open up. Right.

25:54 It's very interesting, um, what you're sharing, because I think one of the key pieces is as your child grows mm-hmm. So does the parent. So the parenting needs to match the, the skill and not just the skill, but the ability of the child need, right. Of the child. Yeah. So one thing, I remember my early years of teaching, and I've always kept it as a, an anchor for me. Sometimes I would fail and I would absolutely put my flag up going, yep, that was my fault. Um, but.

26:35 Uh, the more they, the more our children grow into teenagehood, what we tend to do as parents is clamp down further. What we need to do is pull back further and give them more autonomy. Yeah. And our natural tendency is to keep them safe. And so we're gonna restrict and put the, you know, curfews on and this and that and the other thing. But in reality we need to change that and move. Away from the, um, put'em in the box. Yes. And like you said, be there for the safety net when things fall apart. Yeah. Right.

27:15 Yeah. That's it. Because the, the tighter we hold them, the more likely they will go somewhere else. Mm. And find that, um, approval or, or that, you know, I am good enough. From somewhere else. And usually that, you know, someone else is, um, bad influence. Right. People that are not good for them. Yeah. But they feel accepted there. Yes. Where in the family they feel well. My mom, my dad don't agree with me. They're constantly at me. They're constantly nagging. They're constantly, you know, wanting something from me instead of saying, you know, seeing me and seeing the changes in me.

27:58 Yes, yes. I have one kind of metaphor for, for this kind of parenting journey. Yes. Which I would like to share. Please do. And uh, you know, imagine when a child is born a baby and we're holding them, we have the whole, the power. Over them, right? We decide where to put them. We, the power is in our hands, and then they start crawling. So they're kind of moving away a bit, a little bit further away from, from us. Then they start walking, they move further away again, then they go to a crash, then they go to school. And again, that distance constantly, uh, being, um.

28:38 They're constantly growing, right? Right. They go for further away from us all the time, but then they know they come back and we are there. Right. Love that. And when teenagers, we need to give that power back to them and they will go away as far as they need, but we are always there for them to come back. Um, and then, you know, as adults, they will always, yeah. Yeah. Or if we don't give them that space, they mightn't come back. Yeah. Or they've back very rarely. So, you know, by letting them go, we are actually allowing for them to come back.

29:18 Thank you for that. And I love this metaphor. It's um, mm-hmm. It's beautiful. And for me it just, it shows Yeah. What we need to do during every stage. Yeah. And, and with that example that you shared that I can, you can visualize, you know, there they are. As a baby, I'm putting you here. That's my decision. 'cause you can't do anything other than that. Right. Like that. And as. The child keeps growing. They get, they get a further distance, they get more expansion. So thinking of it in that way will help us as parents. With the teen teaming is maybe going not so well.

30:01 Think about what you are doing. Are you going back to the baby stage? But they are. Six two or is it Right. So thank you for that example, because that's something we can actually crosscheck in our mind. When things aren't going well, we can do, oh, wait a minute, am am I giving that expansion or am I trying to hold them physically and I, that's not working clearly. Exactly. After all, we need to teach them not to need us. Yeah. Oh. You know, that's the hardest part of, um, our role as parents is, you know, to make sure that they don't need us and they're independent enough and they can live without us.

30:46 And thank you for that, and I'm smiling ear to ear today as we're recording this. It's actually my birthday. Happy birthday. Thank you. I have a son who's in Portugal. On his 30th birthday, he decided to do a big trip with his girlfriend, our daughter and son-in-law and baby. Um. Messaged me from West Coast, like five hour flight away. Um, my husband who isn't with me this week'cause he's away, but he messaged first thing, like, what I think is so beautiful is that they don't need me, but they love me to the depths of the earth and back.

31:28 And there's nothing more. Beautiful than that. They know I will always be there for them as the mom. They know Dad will always be there for dad as dad, but just to have that kind of a response. It's not a special birthday, it's 62. It's not a big, you know, it is a big deal. 'cause 62, I'm so fortunate to see. But at the same time, what a gift. Um, I received more than anything that anybody could buy. Just having those resp, those messages come into me this morning just meant the world, you know, how beautiful it was. You look fantastic for your age.

32:09 Well, thank you. And I think you did a great job as a mom. Um, you know, not going, because I think a lot of, um, people would go, but this is my birthday. You know, why aren't you here? Why aren't you, um, you know, well, they're not here this year. They will be there next year. Or maybe they were there last year. So they have their own lives as well. Yes. And they make decision and they come back to you. Yes. Not because they feel I have to, but because they feel I want to. Yeah. And that kind of, um, connection is much stronger, is much more enjoyable and much more fun. It's, it's incredible.

32:50 Thank you for that. Because what I find is that, um, any time we get to be together. It is not a miracle, but it feels so beautiful. You know, it's, it is such a, such a beautiful time. And when we're in the room, we're in the room. Right? Which is absolutely, yes. It's a blessing That's so special. It's so important to learn how to be in the room with so many. Adults, and they are adults now, they, they're your children. But we need to find a way to connect with those adults, not as, you know, parent child when they're adults, but as two adults, right?

33:36 Yeah. You know, and that is, you did something very right there and you managed to do that, and you manage to connect with them. Well, it's been a, it's been a journey and it hasn't always been easy, I can tell you that, believe that. But it's been right, but it's been worth every penny. So is there anything in particular, I wanna shift it back to you as we depart. Is there anything in particular you would love to share with our audience? A nugget, an extra, if I could tell you anything about parenting, teenagers relationships. You've given us so much already.

34:17 I think, you know, start with yourself. Mm. Uh, you know, stop expecting for them to change and, you know, sometimes parents would come fix them. Picks the child, you know, um, no, let's start with ourselves and they will follow because they still copy paste everything from us, all the coping mechanisms, all the, how we treat ourselves, how we treat others, how we see the world. Um, they do copy paste and they esp. Esp, they mightn't show it when they're teenagers, right? Yeah. They'll say. You don't know anything. You kind of remember that. And as adults, they will come back and they will do exactly the same thing.

35:02 You know why, um, children of alcoholics tend to, uh, use the same copies? Mm-hmm. Coping strategies is, you know, oh, I'm feeling very stressed. Uh, you know, let's have a glass of wine. Right. Because they don't know how to do it otherwise. So, um, and that's what the parenting, the Selfless Parenting Community is about. You know, let's start with ourselves and see, uh, what traumas we bring from our childhood. Mm-hmm. Um, what kind of negative beliefs we can change in ourselves. Yeah. And, uh, you know, you, you want me to wait for long and you will see the change in your children.

35:43 It's so true. We talk about this on the show all the time because the foundational component is do this for you, by you because of you. And when you do this for you, the ripple effect is magnified more than your brain can even imagine, and you will see it in ways that you can't even create in your mind's eye because it's way bigger than that. Yes, I do. I do believe in that. Um, yeah, for sure. What a treat, what a treasure you are to be here sharing this conversation.

36:25 I know that my audience is grateful for the tips, the strategies, the thinking, the seeds you planted for all of us. Thank you. Continue to grow audience because. You have the power, it's up to you. And when we start with ourselves, everything changes, like Tatiana said, and I'm witness to that. I can, you've heard my stories. If you've listened to the show, if you haven't, keep listening. Follow, share. Like make sure you give reviews. That gives us more exposure. We can get this information out to more women to show the beautiful life that can happen as we thrive after 45.

37:13 Thank you again, Tatiana, for being here and sharing with us today. Beautiful. Denise, thank you so much for this opportunity. I really enjoyed as I, as I knew I would and I really enjoyed. Um, your energy is amazing and uh, what you are doing is amazing. Spread the world, the word to the world.