Psalm 83: How Many Parts?

0:02 Looking at our world from a theological perspective. This is the Theology Central podcast, making Theology Central. How many parts? Wait, you're telling me they're adding even more parts? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you have to be joking. Right, wait, there's now twenty parts, twenty parts? Are you no? Come on? Ok? Let me count them. Let me count them all right? You see, there's part one, there's part two. There's part three. There's Part four. There's Part five. There's part six, there's part seven, there's part eight, there's part nine, there's part ten. There's part eleven. Well, part twelve. They changed the title. Why did they change the title? Okay, now Part twelve, Part thirteen, Part fourteen, Part fifteen, sixteen, seventeen, eighteen nineteen, And just a few hours ago they added part twenty. Okay, something is going on. We need to pay attention to it now. I say all of that, but what I really need to do first and foremost is offer our introduction. Good morning everyone. It is Thursday, June the twenty seventh, twenty twenty four.

1:23 It is currently ten fifty am Central Time, and I am coming to you live from the Theology Central studio located right here in Abilene, Texas. Now, I know you may be asking parts to what, twenty parts to what? What are you referring to twenty parts of what? Well, if you remember, it was a week ago. Two weeks ago, I spent the day in my car driving different places, taking people to certain locations, waiting for them, picking up people, bringing them to a different location. I was doing a lot of driving, and so I grabbed my iPad and I'm like, okay, well i'm driving around, let's listen to some sermons on the sermons two point oh app right, because that's what we're doing in twenty twenty four. So I downloaded a number of sermons and one of those sermons was entitled the Coming Middle East War Part one, The Coming Middle East War Part one. Now, the fact that it said the Coming Middle East War, it immediately caught my attention. Right, we're doing a series on eschatology. This is about some coming Middle East war. So I'm assuming it's gonna have something to do with eschatology. Maybe I could utilize it in that series. Okay, this should be good. What do they think is the coming Middle East War? When do they think is going to happen? What scripture. Do they believe teaches this coming Middle East War? I was intrigued.

2:50 I hit play on it, and then I was really even more intrigued because the full title was Psalm eighty three the Coming Middle East War. And immediately I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute. They believe Psal eighty three teaches of a coming Middle East war in other words, coming even for us, not for the not for the original author or the original recipients, but but really future for us. In other words, it could have been future for them and now be passed for us. But no, no, no, that Psaw May three was describing a war that was well beyond the time of the original recipients and the original author. It's future for even us. And I'm like, well that that is okay. I've read Psalm eighty three so many times. Okay. So immediately, as soon as I could, I got here into the studio, we turned on the microphone, or I turned on the microphone, and I went live to tell you about the series, and I told you to go listen to it, go download it, and we started reviewing messages. We found ourselves, at least for me even more con well. I went from intrigued, interested, to confused, and just not understanding because it was a series on SSAW eighty three that coming Middle East War, but in the ones we reviewed, they never really talked about a coming Middle East war. They started talking about all kinds of things like rock music and how women dress, and it's like all this,

4:21 like what, I didn't even understand what was going on. It was so it was so confusing, right, so I decided, you know what, I told everyone, go listen to the series, download the series to see where they go with it. But I'm like, you know what, I don't understand what they're doing with SAW eighty three, but we'll start something on SAW maty three. We instead of just getting frustrated or just being you know, negative, let's be grateful that they put forth a sermon series on SAW eighty three. I don't understand what they're doing with it, but that's instead of being negative, we'll turn it into something positive and we'll put forth our own study on PSAW maty three, and we have been working on that.

5:04 We have reviewed other sermons on PSAW Maady three, which only added at least for me, more frustration, more confusion, because they like they would say one thing and I'm like, well, that's not even the way, that's not even true, and it just oh it was. So it's maddening, so maddening trying to listen to the sermons on saw Maty three. So I think we've done a pretty good job. So I kind of, you know, I'm still working on psaw Maity three at Victory Baptist Church. We'll be doing more teaching on saw Maty three next Sunday or this coming Sunday, so you know, I can, I can look at everything and go Okay. It kind of started frustrating, it kind of got confusing, but I think we're making it into something positive. And then I noticed in my my sermon's two point oh app in my feed. Well, they keep adding messages to this series. And what's weird is they changed the title. It went from Saw eighty three The Coming Middle East War for Part one, Part two, Part three, Part four, Part five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten eleven, and then with Part twelve they dropped Saw eighty three The Coming Middle East War, and then the starting part twelve it just becomes Psalm eighty three, Saw eighty three Part twelve, Saw eighty three Part thirteen, Saw eighty three Part fourteen, all the way up to what they dropped today was Part twenty. They've done twenty parts now. On one hand,

6:35 man, I'm impressed. I got nothing but respect that a church will use the technology available to them and spend twenty episodes of their podcast slash radio broadcasts to talk about Saw eighty three. I've got nothing but respect with that. For that, I'm impressed. I think that's awesome. I think that's amazing. Everyone should go listen to it. Everyone should follow the series and listen to every single message. Even if I disagree with every word that was said, I'm not saying I do, But even if I did, I still would want you to go listen to it, because that's twenty parts of you hearing someone trying to give their hypotheses, their perspective and their theory on SAW eighty three. Now and you can also be listening to my discussion on Saw eighty three, and then you get maybe two very different perspectives. You may find that frustrating, just as I get frustrated with that, but hopefully through the frustration, by the time it's all said and done, you're gonna know Saw eighty three better than you did when when twenty twenty four started, right, so hopefully we can accomplish something. But I felt like, so what do I do? I mean? I told everyone about this series right again, it's SAW eighty three. Doctor Andy Bloom is the name, and you can just if you want to find the series. The best way to find the series is just type in and the search engine on the sermon's two point oh app Saw eighty three the coming Middle East War, and then you

8:07 should be able to find it relatively quick, all right, and then you can subscribe to the whole series, and I would challenge you to listen to all of them. But I had to make a decision. So what do I do? I mean, that's the series that started everything. That's the sermons series or the podcast series that sparked our entire work on SAW eighty three. So do I just ignore it? Or do I say, well, I've already told the people about it. Do I just turn on the microphone and go, hey, guys, they're up to part twenty. Go listen, all right, thank you for listening today. I could just do a quick, like, you know, public service announcement. I could just do a you know, a FYI for your information and be done. But you know, I get frustrated with those kinds of broadcast even though I do them, because I just feel like I need to do more. So I thought, you know what, let's just grab one of them. So I grabbed or grabbed the audio of one of them. I grabbed Part five. Let's just jump to part five and see what they're doing with SAW eighty three.

9:07 We reviewed, I believe part one. In part two we kind of, at least for me, I became kind of frustrated. So then we just left it. Let's jump to part five and kind of see what's going on. I mean, they go twenty parts on it. So I'm fascinated because if you look at SAW eighty three, like, I don't know, how do you get I mean, I don't know, twenty parts. There's a lot of it that's pretty straightforward. I don't know, there's eighteen verses, so they've got more parts than there are verses. Well, okay, what that makes some sense? Right? Okay, because your introductory material in SAW eighty three could take up two messages, right, you know, background, historical, context, outline, which we've done all of that. Now the weird part though. Remember when we started reviewing their part one and Part two, they didn't provide an outline. Really, they didn't provide any historical context.

10:09 They it was really their whole approach has been I just don't understand their approach. But that's okay, that's okay. I don't have to understand it. So let's at least I mean, I just feel like we have to kind of revisit and see what they're doing. Right, So we've reviewed part one and two, so that means we're skipping three and four. We're just going to jump to five and we're just going to see what's going on. We're just gonna see, all right, we're just going to do this in real time. I don't know what's about to happen. Maybe this will be beneficial, maybe we'll not. Do I need to read Psaw eighty three to you? Do I need to read Psalm eighty three to you? Or do you remember it? Let me read it to you really quick? Saw eighty three a song a psalm of asaf right. Do not keep silent, Oh God, do not hold your peace, and do not be still, Oh God, for behold your enemies. Make a tumult, and those who hate you have lifted up their head. They have taken crafty counsel against your people and consulted together against your sheltered ones. They have said, come, let us cut them off from being a nation, that the name of Israel may be remembered no more. For they have consulted together with one consent, they form a confederacy against you, the Tints of Edom and the Ishmaelites, Moab and the Hagrites Gibal emmon Ammelek Felistia with the inhabitants of Tire. Assyria also has joined with them. They have helped the children of Lot deal with them,

11:43 as with Midian, as with Cicera, as with Jabin at the brook of Kishan, who perished at Indore, who became as refuge on the refuse on the earth. If I don't lose my voice, make the nobles like Oreb and like zeb Yet, all their princes, like Zeba and Zalmuna, who said, let us take for ourselves the pastures of God for a possession. Oh my God, make them like the whirling dust, like the chaff before the wind, as the fire burns the woods, as the flame sets the mountains on fire. So pursue them with your tempest and frighten them with your storm. Fill their faces with shame, that they may seek your name, O Lord, let them be confounded and dismayed forever. Yes, let them be put to shame and perish, that they may know that you, whose name alone is the Lord, are the most high over all the earth.

12:48 Now we have worked on this chapter, I feel like for Sola, so many hours have been dedicated to it. The main thing I want to continually to point out is Psal three is clearly the psalmist is speaking of a situation that is occurring at that time. There is a there is a threat at that time. So Asaf composes a communal lament to cry out to God that they are confused, they're worried. They I mean they are they are possibly fearful of their situation, and they're asking God to stop being silent to intervene, because obviously this implies God had been silent, he had not intervened, and they are gravely concerned. And Asaf is kind of like the worship leader, and he composes this communal lament. Remember we had a sermon that tried to say that This was fulfilled in second Chronicles twenty, but that began to kind of fall apart. In fact, the pastor said that King Jehosephact called in Asaf. Well, we know that that's just absolutely not true because Asaf was dead. So a lot of this sermons. One of the things that's been frustrating is a lot of the sermons we've listen to on SAW eighty three, there's just no way to look. I just have to say this, They've just been absolutely factually an error. They've made claims about some of these groups or some of these people that was just absolutely not true. Like

14:18 they completely just fraudulent information. There's no way they get around it, just fraudulent information. In many cases, they wouldn't even cite a source, and then many of the sources they cited, you're like, where where did you found a website called what we? And then you would just look up any kind of more respected resource and it would completely contradict what they said. It's been very frustrating right to hear such bad information. So I don't know what else to do. Like, I know we're focusing on Joshua one eighth this week, but I feel like we have to go back. I feel like we have to, don't we, right, I mean, we got to go go back to this sermon series that sparked this entire discussion. They're up to part twenty. We've got to revisit it. So we're gonna go back to their part five again. We reviewed part one and two. We're skipping three and four. We're just jumping to five. I have no idea what they're gonna be discussing. We're just gonna jump in and see where we are.

15:22 Okay, Now, I have listened to a little bit of this, so to be fair, I do know what they start discussing at the beginning. I do know what they start discussing at the beginning, all right, Yeah, which I'm not gonna mention, but I will put it this way. I was a little confused again and just like what I don't understand? So are you ready for this? Here we go. This should be interesting. I know it's Joshua one eight, but we're gonna interrupt our Joshua one eight to go figure out how many parts? Wait twenty? Okay, what's going on? Let's go back to part five and see what was happening. Here we go the word is a lamp onto my feet and a light onto my path. This is Garynron welcoming you to the Lamp and Light broadcast coming to you from the studios of Central Baptist Church in Beautiful O'calla, Florida.

16:18 Lamp and Light is a ministry taking a book of the Bible, verse by verse, teaching as it is to men as they are, without compromise or apology, speaking the truth and love, and our purpose is to give the lamp and light to all. Yesterday, in our study of Psalm eighty three, doctor Bloom was explaining where the word rapture came from. Okay, a couple of things. First of all, you should subscribe to them. You should follow it, right I think. I mean, I love the fact that this church has basically a radio program. They have their own studio, and they're putting out this content day in and day out where they're going through basically, you know, scripture. I love that. I got nothing but respect for that. I may disagree with some of their perspectives, but I just love when churches are using technology that is available to them to get their teaching, to get their perspective, to get their hypotheses on scripture out there so that the rest of us can be challenged by it. I mean, look what they've started by using their technology. They've started our lengthy discussion on Psaw eighty three. So there's nothing. I've got nothing but positive to say about everything that they're doing. My only issue is I just don't understand from a hermeneutical perspective, from an exegetical perspective, how they're handling the text.

17:41 And when they just tell me that we're getting ready to talk about the rapture, I'm even more confused. Where is the rapture in Psalm eighty three? Like, I don't understand, I don't understand. I don't think I've heard a sermon yet where I understand what in the world they're doing with Saw eighty three. I'm just like, as as frustrated as I am with all the sermons on Joshua one to eight, it may be even more confusing and confound at least Joshua one to eight, that's almost every at least all the sermons are in agreement that they all handle it basically the same way. I think the way they handle it is as a travesty. Okay, but at least there's consistency. What frustrates me with Saw eighty three is like this pastor says, no, it was fulfilled in second chronicles, and this pastor says, no, it was nineteen sixty seven, No, it was nineteen forty eight.

18:33 No, it's coming, And it's like, wa, wait what wait, what is happening here? You know, when you have a pastor telling you that King JOSEPHACT called an Asaf, well that's frustrating considering Asaf was dead. Okay, that's really frustrating. So when you just and when they start saying, well, this represents this country and you start looking up things like that is not even one, that's not even a little bit accurate. Those things drive me crazy. So now, how did they get to a discussion about the rapture in saw maty three? I am so confused. I am so confused. But hey, you know, let's let's learn a little bit about the rapture if you if you, I know, in eschatology there are those who hold the one and there are those who don't. I'm not here to get into a rapture debate. I'm trying to get into a hermoneutical discussion.

19:25 How in the world. Did you get to the rapture and saw eighty three that was currently talking about a conflict that was happening at the time of Asaf who was the worship leader mainly during the king of the time of David into the reign of Solomon. So I don't know he's talking about a situation at that time. I don't, I don't, I don't understand. All right, but here we go. Let's resume with that discussion today. Now here's our teacher and pastor, doctor Andy Bloom addition for the ble yes, and I do find it. Look, their intro is awesome, their intro is well produced. Whoever produced their intro, it's great. The voiceover is good, the music is good. But and the Bible says, and the Bible says, ladies and gentlemen, that should be all you care about is what does the Bible say? And we determined what the Bible says by the words that are used. And we understand the words that are used first based off their historical context, then their textual context, and then the actual just the way you understand words, definitions and how they're structured and put together.

20:51 So I love that the Bible says, as the song goes there, that's amazing. We should care about what the Bible says. What I am perplexed by is how everyone goes to Saw eighty three and seems to find something that I don't think the Bible actually says. That is where I'm confused. But let's let's see what happens here. But there is a tribulation that is going to come upon this earth. So now the Christians will be caught up, and what we call is the rapture. Now I've had men try to argue with me and say, well, the word rapture is not in the Bible.

21:36 And where the word raptor comes from, you see, it's actually in first Thessalonians. We read they'll be caught up. Caught up is a Greek word that has the idea of snatched out. The Latins changed tried to change things a little bit, and so they use the word raptura, which is the same definition though of caught up. Is just like they're trying to translated into their language. But no, it's not in English rapture, but it is got the right terminology caught up because we're caught up. How in a moment in the twinkling by at the last trump, for the trump shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible. Yes, a rapture is coming.

22:19 It could be at any moment. As a matter of fact, I'm recording this right now. But to be quite honest with you here it is the second to the last day of February of twenty twenty four. And there may be people out there that we'll never get to hear it, or they'll hear it. But we've been raptured out maybe the day before the day after, and you've been left behind station on automatic played that sermon there will be a war with Russia and that coming tribulation. Okay, now, remember this is a part of a series on Psaw eighty three. So we got a rapture. I know we got a coming war with Russia. I ladies and gentlemen, I just don't know what to say. I'm gonna let this.

23:17 I mean, obviously we're gonna finish this. I'm just perplexed. How what has any of this got to do with Psalm eighty three. I'm just don't understand Psalm eighty three. Remember this entire thing started because I was confused by when it said Saw maity three, the coming Middle East War. Now it's Saw eighty three, the coming rapture, Saw eighty three, the coming war with Russia. I just don't I am just perplexed. But maybe maybe maybe I'm allowing my past confusion to impact my present listening. So I need to just let this play out, see how this dive, because maybe it's all going to make sense here in a minute. And not only that, that's at the beginning, by the way, and near the end, a military campaign that is headed towards armageddon when the kings of the East, I believe that those are the Asian Eastern countries are coming in at them. You and I, if you're saved. When I say you and I, I'm saying I'm saved, You're saved, You and I we will return with Jesus Christ at the end of the tribulation. It's so, how does Psalm eighty three

24:52 lead to dealing with basic elements of a certain system of eschatology? This sounds like a basically premal, dispensational view of eschatology. How does Saw eighty three lead to this discussion? I just don't understand. He's mentioned the tribulation he's mentioned the rapture, a coming war with Russia and then a battle of armageddon with it. I think he said the Asian and Eastern countries. Okay, what has this got to do with Asaff composing a lament to express the feelings and the situation of the time in which Asaf lived that. There's nothing here that makes it prophetic. It's not a prophetic psalm. It's a communal lament.

25:37 I'm just baffled by this. I think everyone classifies Saw eighty three as a lament som not as a prophetic psalm. I don't think it's predicting, it's describing the emotions and the concerns of a real threat at that time. Now again, I've given everyone the opportunity, right, Remember when we were trying to at least we entertained the concept that maybe Saw eighty three, while some said Second Chronicles twenty is the fulfillment of Saw eighty three, and that started kind of that didn't really make sense. It didn't really I don't think it really fit because especially if they said that Acef is alive during the time, which we found out is completely not true. But we tried to connect it to Second Chronicles twenty. I gave everyone opportunity to send me a chart comparing a contrasting second Chronicles twenty with Saw eighty three. All right, everyone had that opportunity. I've also given everyone the opportunity to find me a new Testament passage that quotes Saw eighty three, or at least references Saw eighty three as it then points to something future. Nobody has provided that as of yeat.

26:49 I've given everyone the opportunity to test these theories and to prove them. I just I'm just I don't get We just read Psalm eighty three. I'm I'm just sitting here looking at this, all right, So maybe I don't know. Maybe this will all make sense in a second, and we will actually touch down on this earth with him when he comes. When he's coming back, we call that time when he comes back and actually touches the earth the second Coming. The Rapture yourself, is not the second Coming. It's our going to him. But when he comes back with us, that is the second coming, because it's his second coming in human form to this earth.

27:45 The Rapture is not the second Advent, because well, we meet him in the clouds and we don't touch earth when we're caught up and he meets us there. He's not coming down touching the earth. He's meeting us in the clouds. Now, we mentioned the Russian War, and we've mentioned the war at the end of the tribulation, the Battle of Armageddon. It is coming. We can see it. Just you can read your newspapers, you can watch your evening news, and you can just see these things lining up, and you can see newspeople that just I just have to say this.

28:37 I have been hearing that it's lining up. That just look at the news and you can see it happen, it's about to happen, or it's developing. I've been hearing that basically my whole life. Even before I became a Christian, I started hearing things about it. I remember as I was pretty young, and I don't even know how I stumbled upon this book. I wasn't a Christian, didn't really have any connection to church, but I love to read. So I stumbled upon a book called like the Sign of the Times or something like that, and it was like, Hey, all the signs are lining up, and okay. Then I become a Christian in the eighties. I heard it. I heard it in the nineties, I heard it in the two thousands, I heard in the twenty tens, and now it's twenty twenties and I'm still hearing it. At this point, it's lined up like fifty thousand times. Okay, So but all right, that's okay.

29:29 So now maybe what he's going to do is there's a war with Russia and then there's a war at the end Armageddon. Now is he going to then show us where Psawm eighty three this war fits in to this? These two wars, They've got a war with Russia and a war at the end. The war with Russia, I think he says happens before the tribulation, right, so it happens before the tribulation. Where does Psawm eighty three? Is this an additional war? Where does this fit in? Maybe that's why he's dealing with eschatology. Is he's trying to put this in some kind of chronological order. Okay, that could be interesting. I don't know what he would base it off of. I definitely don't know how any of this comes from Psalm eighty three. But if he believes Psalm eighty three is a future war, then maybe he's going to show us where it fits in the chronological map of eschatology. All right, let's see then maybe then we're gonna get to Psalm eighty three here, and this will make some kind of sense.

30:27 Are doing their best to try to confuse you with it and avoid a lot of the things that are going on. But Psalm's twenty three deals with yet another war. Ten nations are he says Psalm twenty three, He meant Psalm eighty three. So Psalm eighty three deals with another war. So we got the war with Russia. I'm assuming it sounds like he said before the tribulation, we got a war at the end. I'm assuming of the millennial Kingdom if I understand his eschatology correctly. And somewhere there's a third war, and that's Psalm eighty three. So he's again. Now maybe maybe in some of the early parts he proved it, but in part one or part two he never even I never really talked about it. So I but okay, I'm just gonna I was just gonna go along, right, Okay, there's a coming war, and Saw eighty three describes it. Let's see where he places it in the chronological order of end time. Events are listed in this condition.

31:33 Some have tried to well to tie this war with the events that have happened in our past, in the past history of the Earth. Okay, now that is true. Some try to connect Saw mayighty three to Second Chronicles twenty, which would be our past. It would be future for or Asaf. It would be future for the people, but it would be passed for us. Now, I don't know. I don't think that works. I just don't think it works really well. But okay, we can put forth out as a hypothesis PSAW eighty three is a prediction of Second Chronicles twenty.

32:19 I just don't think it works very well, but okay, all right, And again, why it's a lament. It's not prophesying something, it's describing a current situation. To me, it would have made more sense of Second Chronicles twenty provide us the historical context of SA eighty three. The only problem that doesn't work because Asaf is dead before the events of Second Chronicles twenty happens, so therefore it would have to be a prediction. All right. Some then say that it was a future. It's still passed for us, but it's in the more modern past, and he's gonna outline some of the other options that are presented by or by some people, at least put forth.

33:00 However, those things did not happen in the manner in which Psalms eighty three tells us. See, God's not trying to elk to win us, He's not trying to mislead us. In the word of God. He's preserved so that we would have it to know and understand these things. And so in Psalms eighty three really lays out for us what God's going to do. Now I searched. Okay, Now what's interesting, See, I think what he's referring to is some people try to connect Psalm eighty three maybe to nineteen sixty seven, maybe nineteen forty eight, so that would be passed for us.

33:49 He doesn't seem to agree with any of that. So he would clearly disagree with the second Chronicles twenty theory, the nineteen forty eight theory of the nineteen sixty seven theory. And I don't know how prevalent nineteen forty eight or nineteen sixty seven would be, would would be prevalent, how prevalent those theories would be but he's rejecting any theory that puts it past for us. He rejects. Now, my, what's interesting is I don't understand why there's a theory at all. Why can't Psalm eighty three simply be a a communal lament, which it's classified as, is at least classified as a lament. Why can't it simply be a lament of the psalmist lamenting to God based on a current situation that was happening at that time? Is it? Why do we have to look to any future anything? Why don't we Why do we have to make this prophetic? What is there in the text that makes us think, oh, this is predicting something. Why wouldn't we just say this is describing something. It's not predicting something. But that's that's what I need. Like if if, if all the arguments are this is predicting this, or this is predicting this, and everyone's got their theory on what it's predicting, why is there so much a desire to make this a predictive or prophetic psalm and not simply a descriptive psalm describing the emotions and the concern and the fear and the trust in God and a very difficult circumstance that has outlined for us in

35:21 the very Psalm itself. I just don't understand. In preparation of Psalms eighty three, I searched authors of the present day, authors of times past, perhaps even the century past or more, to search this out, to prepare for this passage. There are some very very interesting passages, yet a great I guess you might just say a great array of ideas, and sometimes people believe what I've got to come up with an idea to explain this. We want people to understand it, not be confused. Well, I can understand that we don't want to confuse people with our preaching, but we don't want to change the story. We don't want to change what God has said try to people. Help people think what we think instead of what God is trying to tell him there and so we need to do what God says and take his word accordingly. What's fascinating is even he admits there's all kinds of theories, all kinds of theories from the past of the brain. Why my thing is, Why is there so many theories? Saw eighty three Asaf composes a lament that says God, we need you to act because we have a current

36:54 situation. This is the current situation. These enemies are coming together to wipe us off the face of the earth. The enemies are listed for us, eat them, the Ishmaelites Moab. The hagwrites gayball ammon emmelech Felicitia with the inhabitants of tire Assyria has also joined with them. They have helped the children of Lot. They are clearly listed. All of those enemies that are listed would have been present at that very time. Okay, So like the text and the language it's used. It's using things describing the present. It's describing enemies that would have been enemies at the present. There is nothing here that makes me like I need fifteen theories to figure out the when the win is at that time? I said, this is what I'm so confused by.

37:54 How did this become so convoluted and so complicated. Look, if we can't figure out psaw eighty three, ladies and gentlemen, what hope do we have to figure out literally anything in our bibles? I am so perplexed by this. Always the word of God is context. Will agree with what it is saying, okay, so this chapter is showing for us a war that could happen before the rapture or immediately after the ractor. So all right, so he said, the context will agree basically with the content. Well, the context I just don't. And so the next thing, you know that this is talking about a war that could happen before the rapture or immediately after the rapture. So wait a minute, so is it before the rapture? We don't know. We just know it's future on the basis of what why does this have to I don't understand. I don't understand. Maybe maybe he's getting ready to make it make sense, right, Maybe maybe it's getting ready to make sense because you know, he thinks this is going to be before or after. I mean that that's it could be before the rapture, all right, I just okay, all right, let's just let's just see what happens

39:32 before the tribulation. Now, remember the tribulation does not start with the rapture. The rapture is before the tribulation, but the tribulation starts when the Antichrist, the world leader. Other places, he's called the Beast, and that's probably a better name than Antichrist. He is anti Christ, but he's the Beast is where he's referred to more often. But it confirms that Beast confirms a covenant with Israel and that will start the seven years. That could be the day of rapture. It could be a few years after the rapture.

40:27 We don't know. The Bible doesn't give us clarity on that, but we do know that's what happens. And this war could happen before the rapture, after the rapture. Well, if this war could happen before the rapture, then it could have happened during the time of asaff because that would be before the rapture. Right, it could have happened in second Chronicles twenty because that's before the rapture. It could have happened in nineteen forty eight because that's before the rapture. It could have happened in nineteen sixty seven because that's before the rapture. So once you say it could happen before the rapture, then why does it have to be future for us? Why couldn't it be passed because that would still be before the rapture. Once you make it like well, it could happen before the rapture, then it could have happened in our past, it could happen in our present, or it could happen in our future.

41:38 But that just opens up the window it could happen. It could have happened like I don't even know how that narrows anything, or it could happen after the raptor what happens after the rapture? Well, then well you know it has not occurred yet. But if you don't know if it's before or if you don't know if it's after, then I then, to me, this is just why, like why would you say the Bible I don't understand. Why wouldn't you just say it it is describing a situation at the time of ACEF. I don't. Okay, maybe it's going to make sense. Maybe, Okay, at least he's getting to the actual concept. Remember in part one, Part two, I was getting frustrated because like they never really actually discussed it. At least now in part five, we're getting somewhere.

42:23 Now we have at least something that we can be like, Okay, here's his hypothesis, here's my hypothesis. My hypothesis now is we tried the Second Chronicles hypotheses right, and because the pastor said that Jason, that Jehosaphat called in Asph, I was like, well, if acefh was alive at the time, and we found another a couple of other resources that tried to make the same claim, I was like, well, then saw maybe three the historical context of Second Chronicles twenty that makes it simple. That fixes all of the problems. But then while we found out all the pastors and resources saying Aceph was alive was only off by a few decades agay, So then that completely fell apart. So now my hypothesis is simple. Psaw eighty three is describing a situation at the time of Asaph. Figure out when he lived.

43:15 This event that's being described occurred during that time, and he composed a communal lament for the people to lament to God based on the situation they were currently experiencing. The end. It'll be before the tribulation, that's this earth. Okay. So it sounds like he's saying it could be before the rapture, it could be after the rapture, but it will be before the tribulation.

43:58 So it could be before the rapture, after the rapture, but before the tribulation. I hope that narrows it down for you and what some people are trying to do on this earth. Now, the wars spoken of in our text is different than the Russian coalition that comes at the beginning. Notice first the verse. Let's look at the identity of this coalition of nations, okay, of nations in verse six and on through verse awly, because the nations all surround Israel. Verse six shows us Edom. The geographic location of Edom should be what the world is trying to identify, as well that of the Palestinians. Okay, Now wait a minute, he's connecting the geographical area of Edom to the Palestinians. All right, we got to do a little bit of work. Okay, So a couple of things here. First of all, at this time, when Asaf writes Psalm eighty three, Eatam obviously were

45:32 the descendants of Esau, who held a long standing rivalry with the Israelites. That places them obviously in that very timeframe. So we don't need to look for them anywhere else. But he says, Itaedom are connected to the Palestinians. All right, So I'm gonna I'm gonna do a little I'm gonna do a little work here because I'm a little confused by this. All right, all right. Itatam is mentioned as one of the nations in a list of enemies that are conspiring against Israel. Itedom was an ancient kingdom located south of the Dead Sea, inhabited by the descendants of Esau, the brother of Jacob Israel. The Edomites were historical enemies of the Israelites, so again they fit perfectly in Psaumiti three and the historical context. I don't know why we're but how do we connect edom with the Palestinians. The modern day Palestinians are not direct descendants of the ancient Edomites. The Palestinians are an Arab people who live in the region for centuries, and their identity is linked to the broader Arab and Islamic culture. The connection between the ancient Edomites and modern Palestinians is not a direct ethnic or historical line of descent. When interpreting biblical passages like Psalmiti three, is important to consider the historical contexts of the ancient nations mentioned and their religion and ship with Israel at that time. The mention of Edom in this song refers to a specific nation that was hostile to Israel in antiquity,

47:06 rather than a direct reference to a modern ethnic group like the Palestinians. So there's like a warning, don't do that. He just immediately connected Edom to the Palaestinians. He did so by the geographical region. Like, I don't, how do how do you? How do you accomplish this? So I'm gonna, I'm gonna do some searching here. I'm gonna do that. I'm doing live research on the air because I'm just I'm perplexed. I am so confused by so much of this, right because we've had other pastors make claims about the Palestinians or the phil the Philistines, and like some of the things we've we've looked up other things and just was absolutely not true now here. I don't know how you're connecting Edom with the Palestinians. I don't understand this, all right, So I'm gonna say, what was the geographical location of Edom? All right? I'm gonna, okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna do a search for the geographical region of edomypt Edom was an ancient kingdom region located in the southern part of modern day Jordan and extending into parts of present day Israel. The territory of edom was situated to the southeast of the Dead Sea, bordered by Moab to the northeast and the Arabian Desert to the south and east. The geographical features of the Edamite region included rugged mountain terrain, deep

48:40 valley's rocky landscape. The ancient city of Petra, known for its impressive rock cut architecture, was a notable city within the Edamite territory. Edam was a significant was significant in ancient history, with its people known as Edomites, playing a role in trade routes, conflicts, and interactions with neighboring kingdoms and in such as Israel and Assyria. The region has rich historical archaeological significance, offering insight into the culture and the civilization of the ancient Near East. It sounds like that's a large area. So I don't know, because it's a large area. If we have Palestinians in that area today we say that's somehow connected to eat them, Like, I don't understand how you even pull that off.

49:22 Okay is the Okay, it's the location of the modern day Palestinians connected to the to the Thank God, I'm doing some searching if I can spell right, I don't know why it won't let me. Why is it doing that? Okay, there we go. Okay. I hate when it tries to do autocurre. Now I know what I'm typing. I don't need you to correct it for me, but sometimes I do need it to correct it for me because the way I was spelling Palestinians, I needed it to help me. All right, Okay, okay, here we go. Let's see here. I'm gonna do a search. I'm just perplexed by this. How do you get Eatom to the Palestinians. I don't understand. Okay, the modern day Palestinians are not directly connected to the ancient kingdom of Edom in terms of direct geographical location. The historical territortory of Edom was primarily located in the southern part of modern day Jordan, while the Palestinians are situated in the region west of the Jordan River, encompassing the West and Gaza Strip. So immediately they say there's no connection. So I this is what's driving me crazy about Psaum eighty three. Every time I listen to a sermon and I hear a claim, and we do five minutes of research, we find out that the

50:53 claim doesn't seem to hold any water, or it seems to be contradicted. Well, the area what's occupied by Etom and the modern day Palestinian territories are not the same. They are located in relatively close proximity within the broader Middle East region. Okay, well, so I I I don't understand. I don't understand. He just makes it like, well, eatum is well, the geographical location is the Palestinians. And then we do five seconds of research, and I like, wait, there's no connection between eat them and the Palestinians. There's no direct lineage, lineage, and there's no direct connection even in the geographical locations. The geographical locations were different. They're they're connected within the modern the broader region of the Middle East. So I mean, like I I don't understand. I don't understand. Okay, all right, but let's let's see what else is said here. So so but like, so you see, do you see how crazy? Instead of just saying, well, eat them, we're enemies of Israel at the time Saw eighty three was written, so therefore it's describing a current situation. Somehow we're gonna take at them and then try to connect them to the modern day Palestinians. But based off what wild speculation. I don't understand that Herman Nutic, my Herma Nudic would be like, well, we know who the Anamites are. They were an enemy to Israel at this time. We know exactly, So there's why am I looking for something else? The Ishmaelites are the Arabs, that would

52:32 include Moab and Amon. Okay, So now he says, the Ishmaelites are the Arabs. Okay, Okay, I'm gonna type it this way. Okay, let's see if we can get some information here. All right, And this may be true, but at this point I don't know, all right.

53:13 The term Ishmaelites historically referred to the descendants of Ishmael, who is the son of Abraham and Hagar and the biblical narrative, Ishmael is considered a figure of significance in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, with his descendants traditionally associated with the Arab peoples, and contemporary understanding the term Ishmaelite is not commonly used to refer to modern day Arabs. Instead, the term Arabs is widely used to describe the people inhabit the Arab world, our region that includes countries in the Middle East and North Africa. Where a spot where where is spoken at where where you basically have a common spoken language. All right. So, while there may be historical connections between the Ishmaelites and modern day Arabs, the term Arab is more commonly used to denote the people of the Arab world today, reflecting the contemporary cultural, linguistic and ethnic identities. All right, so there is some connection there, right, So at least when I that's not one of those I just have to immediately go you know, there's no connection.

54:09 But the Ishmaelites at the time like if we go back here, okay, hang, I'm going to go back to my list of all the enemies and we go back because I have them saved here? Where do I have them saved here? Where do I have them save? Right? So, so Idam was descendants of Esau, who had a long standing rivalry with the Israelites, which would have been true in Saw eighty three. Ishmaelites descendants of Ishmael often associated with the nomadic tribes in the region that would have been present at the time of psawm eighty three. I don't need to connect them to anything in the modern time. I just need to know that they were existing at the time of Saw eighty three. If they're existing at the time of Saw eighty three and they are known for conflict with Israel, ladies and gentlemen, why am I looking for a future fulfillment when the text screams that it's referring to a situation was happening at that time of the Bible days verse seven, and today we call this place Jordan. The Hagarens an Amlek in verse seven are the land that is now occupied by Egypt. Okay, now we've got another claim here. Okay, the Hagarens. He's using the King James.

55:38 The new King James has hag rights. Okay, hang on, let me go here. I'm going to go back to my list of all of them in my own research. All right, So the Hagwrights, possibly a reference to a group of nomads are descendants of Hagar all right. So I'm gonna have to just do a little work here, right, Okay, in some this is all happening in real time. Okay, that's okay, Because what I want to show you is this is almost what you have to I hate to say this, this is almost what you have to do when listening to preaching. You almost have to just hit pause and go look things up. Because we have demonstrated clearly in our study of Psalm eighty three, how many of these sermons have just made utterly completely fraudulent and fake claims like asof being alive and the events of second Chronicles twenty We went, I went along with that theory until I kept I kept going, it doesn't make sense, and I kept checking and checking, and then finally go, no way, there's just no way, and then no, no, there's no he was dead. So and then all these claims about we just saw about Edom that's just not factually correct. So now we've got the hag rights that represents Egypt, all right, So and I'm gonna put in Psalm eighty three, verse six, the hag rights. Okay, there's my autocorrect wanting to fix that

57:13 because it doesn't like the word hagwrights. The hag rights are mentioned is modern day Egypt the geographical location of the ancient hag Rights. All right, let's see what we can find here, ladies and gentlemen, let's see what we can find. The hag Rights mentioned Insaw eighty three six, where a nomadic people lived in the region east of Israel during ancient times. They are believed to have to have a tribe or a group of people that may have roamed across very areas in ancient Near East. While the specific geographical location of the ancient hag Rights is not definitively known, some historical and biblical scholars have suggested they may have had connection to the region of the Arabian Desert or the area east of the Jordan River. Modern day Egypt, situated south of Israel, is not typically associated with being the geographical location of the ancient hag Rights.

58:28 The hag Rights were more commonly linked to regions closer to the eastern borders of ancient Israel, rather than territory of Egypt. It is important to note that historical and geographical interpretation of ancient peoples like the Hagwrights can vary, and there may not be a precise contemporary equivalent to their specific location In modern times. I know, shocker, right. Maybe because there's no way to connect it to a modern situation. Is because Psaun eighty three was not telling you to go look for their modern connection. It was telling you that during the time of Asaf, there was a confederacy of nations that was coming against Israel, and Asaf composed a communal lament to cry out to God. And this is that lament. It has nothing to do with the future, had everything to do with that historical setting. But once again, he just said the hag wrights, that's Egypt. He just says it dogmatically. There's nothing dogmatic about any of this. The atom situation just seems completely wrong. The hag rights in Egypt seems at least questionable at best. We remember that Hagar was from Egypt, and when we see Gebel in verse seven, that would be part

1:00:02 of the Jordan, or it could be part of Lebanon. It's as I would study the scholars, they seem to be divided on Okay, wait a minute here, Okay, yeah, Hagar he calls Hagar was indeed from Egypt. All right, so that part is true, but that has nothing to do with the geographical location of the Hagrides they were a nomadic tribe. That was all okay, all right, And then he says the scholars are divided.

1:00:43 Well, the scholars may be divided because nobody should be trying to connect these historical situations to future nations. For some, I hate to say it, at this point, I feel that this is accurate, some made up story of a future war that I don't think Some eighty three has anything to do with which it is. They argue about, well, which is it? You know, is it Jordan? Is it this other place? Is it this? What is it? But the one thing we can say now I'll simply said this way, either way it is. It surrounds Israel, and Israel's fits right into the coalition's desires. The Philistines, of course, represented by Gaza, and we think of Hammas. Okay, wait, now the Philistines is Gaza? Okay? Oh man, this I am trying my best to follow all this. Is there any connection between the ancient biblical Philistines

1:02:14 and modern day Gaza? All right? Let me see if we if there may be, this one is accurate. Oh okay, now this one is Oh, maybe we're onto something here. There is a connection between the ancient biblical Philistines and the modern day Gaza Strip. The Philistines were an ancient people who lived in the region as as Philistia, located along the southern coast of modern day Israel and the Gaza Strip. The city of Gaza was one of the five primary cities of the Philistine uh Panopolis, along with Ashkalon, Ashtod, Akron, and goth There was significant center of Philistine culture and power during Biblical times. All right, so hey that no one, We actually have connection, ladies and gentlemen, we actually have a connection. This one seems to be accurate. Great, but guess what if I just go back to my list of everything I studied. Let me go back to my list.

1:03:16 Hang on, if I can find all my notes? I got my notes scattered in so many different places. Felictia inhabitants of the Philistine region, known for their conflicts with Israel throughout history. Guess what they would have been an enemy of Israel during the time of Psalm eighty three UK. So like, I uh, like, why are we connecting it to something modern when it was clearly this is describing a situation at that time. I am still there's not been given any textual justification for this wild speculation and this attempt to connect it, and so far this is the only connection that seems to have any ground and possible fact. It's interesting that rarely do you have a day go by that you hear something not going on in that area in attacking Israel, and the world is media and so forth does everything to make Israel at fault, even though these people come in and they murder babies in front of their parents, they take videos of killing them, and the world is supposed to agree that they're right, even though they use their own children and other children to be their blocking areas so that when the enemy is shooting, they take all the bullets, they take all the things, these children and women, and just telling you what kind of men they are, if we can call

1:04:49 them a man. So the early part of this seventieth week that Daniel calls it that, well, Israel just basically traded over one thousand terrorists for one of their soldiers back in twenty ten. I have no idea what any of this has to do with PSAU eighty three. I am literally about a future war that could happen before the rapture could happen after the rapture, but before the tribulation. Now we're talking about current situation and Gaza and the Palestinians and Hamas, and I don't understand. I don't understand, just to get them back, and a lot of people said, man, not have done that.

1:06:02 Many of these I guess you might say these terrorists are guilty of murder. This is your radio pastor, pastor Andy Bloom saying. And that's the end of part five. The good thing about Part five is now we're actually getting into well I can't even call it justific Well, no, I can call it. It's their justification for saying PSAWM eighty three. This is the justification we have heard. I'd have to go back and listen to part three and four to see if I missed something. All right, so maybe I miss something. But the justification provided in part five is this. These nations listed and Psalm eighty three, six, seven, and eight based off wild speculation, in many cases incorrect understanding. These nations are cannected with modern nations.

1:07:00 Therefore, Saw eighty three is talking about a future war. But again, if you say it can have it happens. It can happen before the rapture, then why is it necessarily future for us? It could have already happened. In fact, I think this war did and Saw eighty three during the time of Asaf when he composed the lament to express the emotion of that time. So that's even confusing. But I mean, that's such a while. And look, if you're gonna connect it to modern nations, you've got to be one thousand percent accurate in all of your dogmatic assertions that it's connected to these people. He got one right, one who just seemed like a complete, utterly not true, the other one very questionable to almost not true, and then the third one, okay, relatively, that one seemed to one hundred percent factual. That's not that's not how we do hermeneutics. The text clearly is describing a situation at that occurred right then. So the lesson of Saw Maty three can't be there's a coming war. The lesson of Ssaw eighty three has to be these people crying out to God in a lament based off the situation that they were feeling that they were experiencing. What can we learn from that? Now? I put forth some ideas and lessons and the

1:08:31 message that I've been preaching on p Saw eighty three. You can go back and listen. This one is just I'm just I don't get it. But I want you to go listen to everything they make it your priority today. Go listen to everything they did on SAW eighty three. Look, you can tell how short these messages are. They're only about six to ten minutes long. You can fly through these things. You can just fly through them. You can finish them all today. I want someone to finish all twenty today, all right, and then email me telling me what you think of their twenty parts. And if there's something you're like, you've got to hear Part sixteen, just tell me. Okay, Part six I don't even need the timestamp. We'll just review the entire part because I want I want to get well one. I want you to hear their perspective. I want you to hear their perspective. I am grateful for their perspective because it's challenging me to spend more time on SAW eighty three than I've ever considered in my entire life.

1:09:28 And I've worked on SAW eighty three multiple times in different like educational situations, seminary Bible, college Bible institutes. But I mean, I don't think I've ever spent this much time, So I'm grateful for their perspective because it's challenging us. I'm just confused by the hermineutical approach. I just don't get it from a hermaeutical perspective. And that's okay, we can disagree. You as the listener, you benefit because you get to hear two radically different approaches. So this is a positive thing. I don't want it to be a negative thing, all right. So here's what you need to do. Look up Psalm eighty three, the Coming Middle East War, and you should be able to that'll get you to the series, all right. If you cannot find the series, I will. In fact, what I will try to do is I think I can say, yeah, I can share the entire series. I will send out a link. I will send out a link to the entire series if you have the Church one app. If you don't have the Church one app, I really don't know why. It's really kind of offensive. Why wouldn't you download the Church one app? Because then you can listen to me live and you can get notifications sent out when I send out notifications, and you'll know whenever I upload new stuff. Right, So, go to the Apple App Store the Google Play Store, do a search for Church ohne Church O n E. Once you download the app, do a search for Theology Central, make us your chosen broadcaster. Boom. You now have the Theology Central app and you'll get the notification and just a few minutes with the link of the series that we are referring to. Right,

1:11:01 you also want the Sermon's two point oh app downloaded? All right? You definitely want that app as well, Sermon's two point oh and Church one. You want both of them, all right, So I will do that, and then I want you to go listen to them all I really do. Look, I'm not this is not one of the situations like I think I'm better than them. I just don't understand their perspective. I don't get it. But I want you to hear their perspective because then hopefully it will challenge you to do your own study and your own research. Right. So far, any of the sermons we listen to on PSAW eighty three, they were all maddening, kind of like the same thing that's happening with Joshua one to eight, and these are hermeneutical disputes. These are hermeneutical disagreements. Right, it's nothing personal hermeneutical issues. And that's okay. The only the way you have hermin Like one of the best parts of even a hermoneutics class is where you struggle with Okay, if they interpret it this way, well, why should we interpret it this way? Okay, what's our steps, what's our methods? We're going to you that those discussions about hermeneutics is that I mean, you have comparing a contrasting approaches. Sometimes it is the most beneficial.

1:12:11 So you're getting to hear like, here's how one side handled saw Maty three, here's how on another side. You may have a completely different hermautic and a different approach. I would love to hear your approach. If you want to share it, you can email me news if at yahoo dot com, that's news I f at yahoo dot com. And once again, we've gone over an hour. We've gone over an hour, so hopefully you benefit all the work. Look, trust me, I didn't want to necessarily do that, but I just felt like, if they're cute, continuing to work on the series. I can't just I want people to know. Look, they're putting in, They've done twenty parts. They're putting in the work. I want that work to be listened to. I want you to go. I want you to go listen to their hermeneutical work. I really do. I'm not being sarcastic. I obviously am conflicted. I don't understand, but that's okay, that's okay. I want I want their work to be heard.

1:13:09 I want their work to be listened to. So go download all twenty and if you're driving around today, just go through one after another afternoon, just start with part one and just go through them all Part one, Part two, Part three, Part four, Part five, Part six. And if you're listening to them today, keep giving me updates. You're in part one, you're part four, Part five? Where are you at? What are you hearing? Give me minute by minute? Be my reporter. All right, report your pross your progress through this series, because yeah, I'm I'm just not understanding from all my study and hermoneutics, I am just baffled on this. I'm baffled at all the preachers who try to make this something other than saw maybe three, Like why does it have to be anything other than Asaf. The worship leader composed a lament to express the fear, concern, and work and doubt and panic of the people during his time. The end that seems so simple. I don't know. Thanks for listening. Everyone, have a great day. Go listen. I'll send the link out in just a minute, all right, God bless