Christianity and Reading Comprehension

0:02 Looking at our world from a theological perspective. This is the Theology Central podcast making Theology Central. Good afternoon everyone. It is Saturday, November the twenty third, twenty twenty four. It is currently twelve fifty two pm Central Time, and I am coming to you live from the Theology Central studio located right here in Abilene, Texas. Well. It is Saturday, and if you've been listening to me for any lengthen to any length of time, you know that I can't talk. Let me try that again. It is Saturday. And if you've been listening to me for any length of time, you know that on Saturdays I have a tendency to maybe talk about things related to hermeneutics, the church, Bible interpretation, preaching. Now, I know those topics show up all the time, but on Saturday they tend to show up because a lot of a lot of the time I'm thinking about that.

1:03 So it is Saturday, so just think about this. It will not be very long before people will wrap up their Saturday evening, their Saturday night. They will go to sleep, they will wake up tomorrow right, they'll get up, they'll get ready, they'll have some food, they'll get in a car and they will drive to a church and then they will sit down, depending on the type of seating, some type of seating in their church, and they will take their Bible. They will open it. This will happen in Sunday school classes. This will happen in the mean sanctuary for preaching, maybe for two plus hours. They will hear people teach the Bible and preach the Bible, and they're going to have their bibles open. They're going to be looking and guess what they're going to be doing as they listen to these sermons and listen to this teaching.

1:55 They are going to be making some kind of determination of whether the preaching is right or wrong, true or false, good or bad. They're going to be listening to how the scriptures are interpreted, and they're going to be determining, well whether they agree or disagree. And then when church is over, they'll get Now they may they may even start expressing themselves in church or in Sunday school. They may start expressing their interpretation. Maybe they will, maybe they will not, But in their car and the way home, there's a high probability, well, I don't agree with this, I disagree with this. I agree with this, I disagree with this, I will agree with this. Maybe they will go home and talk about it. But at some point they are going to give their opinion and their critique of what was preached. They're going to determine whether it was true or false. Now here's the question. Their ability to critique, their ability to agree or disagree with the sermon.

2:59 Is it dependent upon something that most of us may not give much thought to. In fact, in most churches, nobody says, well, wait, wait, wait, wait, before you critique, before you disagree, before you judge, before you do anything, we have to determine what your skill is, what your skill level is in this particular thing. I don't think that. The churches don't say that. The churches don't say when to wait a minute, guys, before you try to interpret the Bible, critique the Bible, judge the Bible, judge preaching, critique preaching, before you do anything, we have to be able to determine how well you do this one thing.

3:39 Churches don't do that because the assumption, especially in the non Catholic Protestant world, is that every Christian not only possesses the ability, but possesses the authority to read, interpret, and judge preaching. But does that work, especially when even society right now is acknowledging we may have a problem and an area that I think is pretty critical to this entire endeavor of biblical interpretation, this entire endeavor of Bible study or hermoneutics. I think that this is a very important thing. But society right now is like, hey, we've got a problem, a problem. In fact, just this week a podcast was discussing this problem, and this is how they began their discussion.

4:36 I'm Beth McMurtry, and I'm a senior writer at the Chronicle of Higher Education. Okay, you're a senior writer, but we're here to talk to you about reading. Why are we talking to you about reading? What's going on with reading? Or sorry? Are we starting? Are we You're just this is it? Yeah, it's so casual. Well, there's a lot. That's going on with reading. When it comes to reading. One of the things that I've been hearing a lot from a lot of different faculty members is that students simply aren't doing the reading. A lot of professors are finding that if they assign anything that's more than five or ten pages long, students tell them that they can't do it, that they get distracted, that they get exhausted, that they get lost in the reading, and then they just give up. Another element to this too, though, and one I think that is the most alarming to professors, is that students are coming to college lacking critical reading skills.

5:37 They might be asked to summarize what they've read, and they fundamentally change the meaning of it. They can't summarize it. They might be asked to compare and contrast to readings, and they simply can't do it. Did you hear that students who arrive at college now they have a hard time being able to talk about, to summarize, to explain what they're In many cases, they fundamentally change the meaning of what they have read. They can't they can't just simply read it and explain it or summarize it or even maybe comprehend it, because they fundamentally change the meaning. Meaning that there is a problem with the younger generation that's moving forward right that's entering into college in college, and this problem has been going on for a while. So these are people, some of these people have already left college. They just fundamentally can't read and comprehend what they're reading. They just can't do it.

6:32 If it's too long, they get confused, they change the meaning of it, they don't understand, they don't like the reading, they don't want to do the reading. There's a problem in the United States of America when it comes to reading and reading comprehension. Let's listen. Let's let's listen to just a little bit more of this. It's a fascinating phenomenon that we're facing. Because, yes, we assume that by the time you get to call, you know how to read. Obviously, people can still pick up a book or an article and get the gist of it. But what we're talking about now is like reading a dense or complicated or lengthy article or a textbook or novel.

7:15 That's what seems to have been feeding with this generation. Now, did you hear that we assume when they reach college they should be able to do this. I believe the church either there's something going on in the church. The church either just assumes that every single person in the pew that they can read, comprehend, and interpret, that they have the skills, they have the reading ability, they have the reading comprehension ability, that they can do it, or and I think that this is even worse. I think most churches and most Christians that carry this idea that oh, no, see, when you become a Christian, you have now supernatural ability. God's going to help you understand.

8:04 God's going to help you interpret, the Holy Spirit's going to lead you in your interpretation. So they believe the reason that most of those Christians can do it is because they either believe they just assume that everyone can read and comprehend, or they believe God himself is empowering them to do so. So there's some major assumptions going on in church. But the culture is like, we've got a problem. We've got a reading problem, we've got a reading comprehension problem. And that podcast that's an episode that was released this week. But let me tell you this problem has been discussed countless times and publications, articles, essays, you name it, studies. They're like, we've got a reading problem.

8:46 We've got a reading problem. We've got a reading problem. And I'm going to mayor's going to be my entire perspective here. You ready, if there is a reading problem outside of the church, then there is a reading problem inside the church. And if the people inside the church lack reading skills, reading comprehension skills, then you know what you end up within the church and interpretation problem. If there is a reading skill, reading comprehension problem, there will be a Bible interpretation problem, because your ability to interpret the Bible is absolutely dependent upon your ability to read.

9:33 That is an but nobody in the church ever wants to address this issue. But we're going to have to talk about it. We're gonna take some steps. Let's listen to just a little bit more here. And so I take it, a class that might require students to read what four or five books isn't functioning the way it used to do when I was in college fifteen years ago. You know, I think you would if you went into a college classroom today, or you looked at a college syllabus, you would probably be surprised at how little reading is assigned. I mean, professors understand that they have to kind of meet students where they are. They understand that if students are not doing the reading, they have to change things up otherwise they will have a really bad class session and they will have students who simply aren't doing the work.

10:27 So what I've been hearing from professors is, you know, maybe fifteen years ago they assigned five novels and today they're assigning one. Or they may be eliminating academic articles altogether, those really dense academic articles that we all struggled with and students simply can't read them. Reading research articles, maybe a different type of reading than you are used to. This tutorial will help you create a strategy for reading and understanding this type of information. That's crazy. They just can't comprehend it if it's a dense academic type artor they just can't do it. Well, what do you, ladies and gentlemen if they can't do that? When those individuals are sitting in the pew and they're supposed to be the ones who who hear the sermon, listen to the Bible being taught, and then, according to the non Catholic tradition, they're supposed to then say, well, this is true and this is false. Well, how can they say this is true or this is false? How can they critique? How can they judge the preaching when it's required to understand the Bible? And I'm sorry, I don't care how many times Protestants want to run around and claim, well, the Bible can be easily understood. The Bible, this is a dense, complicated piece of literature. It's a it's a complicated written text. It uses different genres, it uses all the different things going on. How to interpret it?

11:54 Give me a break. And if people can't understand certain things, but they the Church, which just assumes it doesn't matter. You can just read it. You can just read it. And we always try to act like, oh, it's easily understood by anyone. We love to play that card. Christians love to say that that's just not true. If the text is that easy to understand, then someone please explain to me why we can't agree on any interpretation. There's thousands of different groups with all different kinds of competing and contradictory interpretations. If the text is that easy to understand, then this would not be the reality. The reality would be, Oh, that text is easy to understand. The Presbyterians agree with the Baptist. The Baptists agree with the Church christ Church Christ agrees with the Charismatics. Charismatics agree with the Lutherans.

12:41 I mean, it would be just basic understanding because the text is so easily understood. Clearly, the text is not so easily understood. So the church loves to play down the complication of the how complicated the time is. The church loves to play that down. It loves to pretend that everyone has some now supernatural divine power to interpret, and nobody wants to bother to explain or at least consider. Well, wait a minute, wait a minute. If we have people who can't read and comprehend what they read and they may fundamentally change the meaning of what they're reading, ladies and gentlemen, that's that's a disaster for the church. That's a disaster for the church. And in some ways I want to kick myself because we constantly heard all of the conversations about we've got a problem. You know, why is Johnny graduating from high school and he can't read?

13:38 Why is so and so graduating from college and he can't read? There was all these discussions and articles. A lot of times it became political talking points. Oh, we're going to do this in education. We're gonna do this in education because our kids can't read. And we heard all of these discussions. Well, all of this was going on. Everyone in the church was just good, was just business as usual. Come to church, open your Bible, I'll preach, and of course you get to make the decision of whether it's right or wrong. And nobody's like, wait a minute, to out tom out. If Johnny can't read, if people are graduating from high school and college and they can't read, maybe maybe maybe instead of yelling and screaming about this from a political standpoint, we need to look at this from a church standpoint. Guys, if you can't read and can't comprehend what you're reading, then stop trying to interpret the Bible, stop critiquing, preaching, stop it. What you need to do is go back and take basic reading courses reading comprehension courses. In fact, what the church needs to do is give tests on reading and reading comprehension, and if people can't score a certain level, they should have no business interpreting the Bible or even pretending that they know what it says. Now, see to say that sounds crazy in the ears of most Christians, but it's just a logical well, it should be just a logical conclusion.

15:04 To interpret the Bible requires your ability to read it and comprehend it. So then you're a reading ability and you're reading comprehension ability. It's key, the most key thing to biblical hermoneutics. You say, what is the most important thing when it comes to biblical hermeneutics? Your ability to read and you're reading comprehension level. That's first before anything else. That's it. Now. I don't think the average creer walk around church now. I always say this, Nobody ever does it walk around with a clipboard and ask people what's you're reading comprehension level? What was the last time it was tested? Do you think you still have that same reading comprehension level? Do you have? You if I was to give you this work or this novel, or this book or this book or this book, or I give you this academic journal, could you go home and read it and bring me back and act victual interpretation explanation and you can demonstrate understanding of it. Because if you can't understand this, then you shouldn't be doing anything with the Bible. I know that sounds like a radical thought, but I don't think it is. And I think that this is a fundamental problem. Are you ready for this?

16:21 Primarily in the Protestant world? So what we're gonna do. Let's get to this whole reading comprehension thing, but let's show you why this is primarily a non Catholic Protestant problem. This is an issue if you're not a Catholic, if you are a non Catholic, Ladies and gentlemen, this is a major issue for you, and it should be a major issue for your church. But trust me, no church is gonna even care about this, right because, oh, this drives me crazy. So let's let's start here. I'm gonna I'm gonna set my Bible aside and I'm gonna pick up a different book. All right, We're gonna talk about what's in this book in just a second, but before let me kind of set this up. So we want to get to reading reading comprehension and how this impacts Bible interpretation. But we're gonna we have to systematically get there because if you're a non Catholic, it's an issue.

17:18 And here's the reason why. And the Protestant non Catholic Christianity there is no magisterial authority, there is no magisterium and a non Catholic Christianity reality, there is no true church authority. I know Christians will say, no, pastors have authority, church has authority. Just stop that nonsense. If you're a non Catholic, you can pretend all day the church has some authority. You know it's not true. I know it's not true. Everyone knows it's not true. It's just something we say because in no functional way does it really have authority. The end of let me stress that the individual and non Catholic Christianity is understood to not only have the ability, but the authority to interpret the Bible and judge the preaching. They are seen as being. Not only that, they have a responsibility to try to determine if what is preached is true or false. If they feel it's wrong, they can leave the church and possibly attempt to have the pastor fired or removed, or they can just go start another church. Now, in non Catholic Christianity, we say, and everyone says, that the scriptures are the

18:49 final authority. But in a real practical way and a real functional way, it's the individual and they're in interpretation. That is the real authority. That I cannot stress that. I think that that's the way it functions, That's the way it really works. Now, if we were to look into the Catechism of the Catholic Church. Let me show you their approach. Catechism of the Catholic Church, page thirty nine. I'll start in paragraph eighty four. All right, this is in a section entitled the Interpretation of the Heritage of Faith, paragraph eighty four. The apostles entrusted the sacred deposit of the faith. That's what it's called, the sacred deposit of the faith. And this is sacred scripture and tradition, and they entrusted this to the whole of the Church. So in the Catholic way of thinking, the sacred scripture, tradition that is given to the church. All right, Now, in a non Catholic Protestant world, we kind of seem to look at it. It was given to the individual. We kind of focus on the individual. Now, they go on to say, by adhering to this heritage, the entire Holy People, united to its pastors, remain always faithful to the teaching

20:21 of the Apostles, to the brotherhood, to the breaking of bread, and to the prayers. So in maintaining, practicing and professing the faith that has been handed on, there should be a remarkable harmony between the bishops and the faithful. So the way it should work is the bishops, the spiritual leaders, and the church members. There should be unity. There should be why because this was all the sacred deposit was given to the church, and the church now has this leadership which is supposed to interpret the sacred deposit, and the faithful are supposed to be submit and follow it.

21:02 So in their system you have truth given to the church. The Church has the authority to interpret that truth, and the faithful submits to the church. Therefore there should be unity. The next paragraph is para, paragraph eighty five, and heading of it is the Magisterium of the Church. Paragraph eighty five. The task of giving an authentic interpretation of the Word of God, whether in its written form or in the form of tradition, has been entrusted to the living teaching office of the Church alone. Now that's the Catholic system.

21:48 Let me read that to you again. The task of giving an authentic interpretation of the Word of God, whether in its written form or in the form of tradition, has been entrusted to the living teaching office of the Church alone. It's the church. They have the authority them alone to offer an authentic interpretation of the Word of God, or to the authentic interpretation of both tradition and the Word of God. They have the authority. Now in the non Catholic world, we say absolutely not, you don't have the authority. And what do we say, Look, I don't care how we want to try to make it sound nice.

22:32 What we say is I have the authority me as an individual. It's God's word for me. I get to read it, and then I get to judge the church. I get to determine if that church is true, or that pastor is true, or that pastor is true. I get to judge. I have the authority. I have the responsibility as the individual to interpret the Word of God and then critique and judge, and just go listen to any group of non Catholics. They'll be like, this pastor is wrong, this pastor is an idiot, he's wrong, he's a heretic. Just get on get on YouTube, listen to Christian podcasts, listen to preachers. Preachers will say this preacher is wrong, and that preacher will say that preacher is wrong, and then the people in the comment section will say they're both wrong. I'm right because it's individual, individual, individual, individual individual. The Church doesn't have the authority, There is no magisterial authority. That authority, now in the non Catholic mindset, has been given to the individual. Let me read this entire paragraph again. The task of giving an authentic interpretation of the Word of God, whether in its written form or in the form of tradition, has been entrusted to the living teaching office of the Church alone. It's authority in this matter is exercised in the name of Jesus Christ.

23:51 This means that the task of interpretation has been entrusted to the bishops the Communion, in communion with the successor of Peter, the Bishop of Rome. And if we turn the page, then we go to page eighty or not page eighty eight, paragraph eighty eight, we read this. The Church's magisterium exercises the authority it holds from Christ to the fullest extent when it defines dogmas. That is, when it proposes in a form obliging the Christian people to an irre Basically, they have to. They have no choice but to adhere to the dogma. It's irrecable, it's irre, irreversible.

24:36 They it cannot be changed. It has to be adhered to, all right, then, and they have to adhere to these truths contained in divine revelation or when it proposes a definitive way truths having a necessary connection with these. Basically, it's the church who defines dogma, and when it defines dogma, it's irrevocable. You can't change it. You have to follow it. It's the church who interprets. It's the church who defined. So in the Catholic system, the church interprets, and then the church defines what the dogma is, and then you, as the faithful, you have to follow and submit to it.

25:16 Now there's a lot more there. I kind of paraphrase some of that, but you get the basic idea. That's from the Catholic Catechism. That's the Catholic system. That's the Catholic system. Now, non Catholics, we rejected. No magisterial authority. The church does not have the authority. No, the individual does. Remember, the entire Protestant Reformation wasn't one church fighting another church. It was one man saying the church is wrong, and then everyone was like, yeah, the church is wrong. And then what happened. Then they're like, well, Luther you're wrong. And then people are like, no, you're wrong, and then you're wrong. And then this group formed, and this group formed, and this group form and this group said that group is wrong, and then well it's not stopped since then.

26:04 Now within non Catholic Christianity, there's this affirmation, there's this cry, this this is almost a cliche at this point where we say scripture alone, sola scriptra, and this is where we claim that the Scripture is the final and ultimate authority and matters of faith and practice. You've probably have heard that the Bible is the final authority in faith and practice. Now, the practical outworking of this idea of sola scriptra often the majority of the time, all the time, it shifts the authority really to the individual interpreter. We say scripture is the authority, but really your interpretation becomes the final authority. My interpretation becomes the final authority. Let's let's let's see how this this shape takes shape. Let's see how this would break down scripture as the final authority. Again, that's kind of the rallying cry, that's kind of the battle cry. That's kind of it's almost a cliche. It's kind of a slogan. That's the that's the concept. The scripture is the final authority. But in I think it's only in theory. Sola scriptura in theory holds that the

27:39 Bible alone is the ultimate authority, not a magisterium or a church or tradition. Now, this principle arose primarily during the Reformation as a rejection of what reformers saw is the overreach of the Roman Catholic Church's magisterium. Hey, the and the and and the Reformation. They're like, hey, the magic it's exercising too much authority. It has too much authority. It's an overreach. We've got to push back. Sola scripta, the scriptures are the authority. In theory, it sounds good. The scriptures are the authority, not the Church. So scripture is the final authority. I think in theory it sounds good, right, the Bible, not the pope, the Bible not the Church.

28:27 The Bible not the magisterium. Everyone will say amen to that. Everybody will like, hey, that sounds so good. But here's the problem where you have this slogan scriptura, this idea of scripture alone. It sounds good as a theory, but here's what happens. You have the slogan, you have the theory, but then you have. Us. We step in and within Protestantism it emphasizes what is known as the priesthood of all believers based off one Peter two nine, and this seems to imply that every Christian has access to the scriptures and the Holy Spirit that supposedly guides their understanding. This almost kind of a democratic approach, This democratization of the Bible. Well, it kind of leads to, well, it grants individuals responsibility to discern things and discern truth and discern error and teaching. So basically it goes to hey, sola scripture. But at the same time, it's like, wait, the priesthood of all believers.

29:50 Every believer has the authority, and every believer has the power and the ability to interpret the truth and interpret error and to know true the falsehood because we not only do we have the authority because we are a priest, but we also have the Holy Spirit and dwelling us, guiding us and lighting us. Teaching us is the way it would be taught. So we don't need the church, you just need you as the individual. Now we'll say, well, we still need the church, and we still need gifted teachers because God gave them to the church. We can say that all day, but in reality, if the individual has the authority and has the ability to interpret the Bible for themselves, you can you can get paid lip service that well, no, no, no, we need the church.

30:36 You can say that, but who then judges what is preached? It's the people in the pew. And if the people in the pew are supposed to be the one judging what is preached, then the people in the pew don't really need the people who are preaching, since they're the one judging them. Right, You can't say, the people in the pew you need these teachers, but you're supposed to judge these teachers. Well, and bay ba, I'm supposed to judge these teachers. I don't need them because I'm the one who's judging, so I'm really the one in the authority. It becomes this kind of nonsensical system. So we have Scripture as final authority, we have the role of the individual.

31:16 Then and then everything begins to fall apart, which then leads to well, what is the practical authority? Does this not lead to the practical authority of the individual. See in practice, not in theory, but in practice, the individual Christian becomes the functional authority because they decide whether they agree with the sermon or doctrine. They decide whether to remain a part of a particular church or leave, and they decide whether a pastor or a teacher is faithful to scripture. They make those decisions. Every individual does, Hey, I agree with that sermon er. I don't agree. Hey, I'm gonna stay in this church or I'm gonna leave this church, and I believe that pastor or teacher is faithful not faithful to the scripture. If they disagree, what do they do?

32:03 Well? They leave, they find a new church. They may even start in their own church, which has led to the increasing numbers of denominations and independent churches. So, in a practical way, the individual, because we have replaced the magisterium, and you can see it this way, we've replaced one pope with millions of popes. Every individual is their own magisterium, their own pope, and they get to determine what it's true or false. Now you can see now why in our system, why reading and reading comprehension now becomes more important than in any other system, because if the individual is going to be read, is going to be judging and making these determinations, then they have to be able to demonstrate that they have the reading ability and the reading level and the reading comprehension level in order to pull this off, or it's all just fraudulent. Now, the way Protestants get around as we go with the Holy Spirit gives me the power the Holy Spirit helps me understand, which I think is the most fraudulent claim that you can make, because it's easily to prove that that's not true.

33:14 You can take people saying the Holy Spirit helps me understand you. Okay, well here's this text. Please explain to me in this text you know that why is there this textual variant? Why does it say this in the Greek? What is the Greek saying here? What is the Hebrew saying here? And you can just ask them basic theological questions like okay, you've got the Holy Spirit. Go and they look at you and they can't answer any of the questions. Wait, I thought you had the Holy Spirit. Just tell me the answer. These are basic questions you may get in a hermeneutics class. Go, you've got the Holy Spirit and they can't. But yet they'll tell you you're wrong, You're wrong, You're wrong. Well wait, wait, so you can just tell me that I'm wrong, claiming that the Holy Spirit told you that I'm wrong, Meaning then your interpretation is infallible. Okay, there's just so many problems with it. So this leads to the problem of subjectivity.

34:05 So we start with in a sense, the claim scripture alone. But then we step in. And when we step in, because of being the priesthood of all believers and claiming the Holy Spirit gives us the power. Well, now we start giving our own thoughts. Well, this leads to the authority of the individual, which this leads to the problem of subjectivity. Without a central interpretive authority like the Catholic Magisterium, interpretation of scripture can vary wildly widely. Individuals then bring their own bias, their own culture, their own context, and their own presuppositions to the text. And what does this lead to? This is not even a theoretical What does it lead to? It leads to contradict reinterpretations. Do we have that in Christianity? Check check check check check check check, confusion about which interpretation is correct? Do we have that check check check, check check. Division within churches and denominations, do we have that check check, check, check, check, check, check, check, check, check and double check. So what do you what do you do here? What do you do now? Some will say, well, well, what we need is community and accountability. That's sometimes the

35:37 Protestant answer, right. So, while Protestant theology emphasizes the individual ability to interpret scripture, it will also try to stress well, wait a minute, wait a minute, we need the church community. We need the church community. It provides accountability, it provides correction. Now, in theory, the church as a collective body under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, is supposed to help safeguard against extreme or erroneous interpretations. However, in practice, the communal authority often gives way to individual autonomy. I mean, you can the reason we say, oh we need the church, we need the church, we need the church, we need the church, is because, well, you got to have people coming to church so that they give money, so that you can pay all that money for the buildings and for the salaries. So we say we need the church.

36:28 But this is where it's contradictory. Oh you need the church, you need these gifted men of God who've been equipped by God to preach the word of God. But we believe in the priesthood of all believers, and you, as an individual, has the ability and the authority and the power of God and to interpret the Bible for yourself. And you're supposed to judge whether what is preached is true or false. But you need the church. You need the church. Why don't you need the church. Well, you've got to have a place to come so that you can use your ability to determine what has preached is true. Or that's why you need the church. You need a church where you can come tell people that they're wrong. Now, a lot of people just show up and they just take whatever they hear and just believe it. But that's not really Protestant, is it. That sounds very Catholic. See many individuals within the Protestant world, they kind of treat their favorite preacher or their favorite denomination just like the magisterium of the Catholic Church. They're not gonna go check everything, they're not going to read everything, they're not verifying everything, they're not looking up the Greek and the Hebrew and what the Church Father. They're not checking any They just go get their little sermon and then that's great. They're not doing even half the work that would really be required if they were really doing their job. So this leads to the functional reality. What ultimately happens is you have individual interpretation becomes the practical authority. It is a

38:00 well documented critique of Protestantism. What I am giving you is a well documented critique. It's led to the fragmation, the fragmentation of the entire Protestant world and to tens of thousands of denominations, and it underscores this issue. When you see all of these different groups and all these contradictory messages, then what I'm saying is not theoretical, it's practical reality. This entire system is a total mess. Even when you have individuals that claim to submit to scripture, their interpretation of scripture effectively becomes the authority. They say, no, it's the Bible. No, it's your interpretation of the Bible.

38:47 That's why it drives me crazy. I can go to the Christian post, any Christian website. You got these Christian Well, the Bible says well, the Bible says no, your interpretation of the Bible says, because the person you just said was wrong, they reading the same Bible reading and they're telling you that you're wrong. So who's right? Well, the Bible says no, your interpretation of the Bible says, and you're judging that person based off your interpretation. He's judging you based off his interpretation. And there's a high probability neither of you have the reading a level of reading comprehension ability that you should even be making an interpretation. But this is the Protestant world. Welcome to the chaos, and brace the contradiction, Embrace how convoluted it all is, and enjoy yourself. Just get a coffee, sit back and watch.

39:39 This individualism has led to nothing but significant division and disagreement. That's what it's led to. I mean, we have to just admit that this has led to nothing but division and disagree and spiritual anarchy is just insane, and we have wit If you think about twenty twenty four listening to all of these sermons, how many times have I been sitting here going what is this? I don't even know what's going on. Our entire discussion about false comfort is because I'm so sick of people taking Isaiah chapter forty, verse one and making it about us, taking Jeremiah, making over and over and over. Oh so, how many times have I just lost my ever living mind? And it's and I try to say, it's not even about disagreement, it's about what in the world is happening to the text of scripture. But it doesn't matter what happens to the text of scripture because anyone can interpret it any stinking way they want. There's nothing stopping them. Because the authority is the individual. Without a higher church authority, accountability often depends on local church structures, which are insufficient or inconsistent. Well, not only that, who cares what the local church says.

41:04 The local church can say I'm sorry, Tom, you're wrong, and Tom can be like, yeah, but I read the Bible and the Holy Spirit led me to tell me that you guys are wrong. I'm gonna go start another stinking church. I'm gonna go to another church. You're wrong. And they're like, no, you're wrong, No, you're wrong, No you're wrong. Who's stinking cares? Everyone thinks they're right. What even difference does it make? The claim that scripture is the final authority? Basically becomes a hollow claim. If the interpretation of scripture is left entirely to subjective judgment, scripture is the final authority, is it? Really, it's just a slogan.

41:47 It's just a bumper sticker cliche, because it's really left to subjective judgment, subjective interpretation, practical sense, the individual becomes the real authority. In Protestantism, solo scriptor may remain the principle, but the outworking of that principle relies heavily on individual interpretation, which leads both to freedom. That's the good thing, you're free, but it leads to fragmentation. This tension is intrinsic to Protestantism, and it continues to shape its theology, and it continues to shape its practice. And that's what we see. Ladies and gentlemen, Welcome to the thunderdome where we fight and argue and whoever gets the biggest following. Well, now they're right.

42:50 I mean, look at MacArthur. He's got to be right. I mean he's got a study Bible, he's got all these books, he's got a big church. Oh wait wait wait no, no, no, no, this pastor is right. No, this pastor is right and then everyone people online, we're like, oh, no, Joelstein's an idiot, he's not right. No, Mark Driscoll's not right, no Magarth, And everyone picks their side, and then everyone thinks that they're right, and everyone is arrogant and prideful, and we condemn and we're judgmental because we all think we're right. And why do we think we're right? Because the final authority is not the Bible, it's not even God, it's us. We are our own little gods, our own little popes, our own little magisterium. And we get to tell everyone else that they're wrong. And we say, the Bible says you're wrong. No, your interpretation of the Bible says they're wrong. Now, just think in this system where it becomes individualistic, then it's almost like the individual has to be able to read. The individual must have reading comprehension skills so that it can understand a dense text, so it can understand something that can be very complicated, convoluted.

44:05 It has all kinds of different literary genres. There's different historical context, there's grammar, there's syntext, there's all these things. If they can't figure out these principles. Why should they even be able even think that they can interpret it? You know why, because you become a Christian, they hand you a Bible and they basically you can read it, you can interpret it, and God will help you interpret it. Go forth. Oh yeah, and you you have to determine who's preaching the truth and who's preaching a lie. Go forth and do it. You can do it. Oh, we don't care if you can read. We don't even care if you're reading comprehension? Is that a fourth grade level? We don't care, because you can do it. And so they take off and they're like this person is right and this person's wrong, or they just get manipulated and saying just trust me your pastor well, then that kind of negates the entire Protestant Reformation and this whole idea that the Holy Spirit is the one that guides individuals today. Look, it is completely inconsistent with the widespread disagreement among Christians on essential non essential doctrines. If you just look at it logically, this claim is ridiculous. Many Christians will affirm that the Holy Spirit helps believers understand scripture. This is often interpreted as the spirit illuminating the meaning of the text to the believer. That's the claim. I was taught that.

45:37 I was taught about inspiration. I was taught taught about preservation, but I was also taught about illumination and how the Holy Spirit illuminates us. But if the Holy Spirit is truly leading all Christians and their interpretation, then logically all believers should arrive at the exact same conclusion. The reality is Protestants, Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, every other group have significant doctrinal differences despite claiming to follow the Holy Spirit's guidance. Within just the Protestant world alone, there are thousands of denominations, each holding different interpretations of scripture. Even within individual congregations, disagreements on theology practice at the theology and practice is common. Now, why why do we have all of this issue? If the Holy Spirit is supposedly guiding, well, some will say, well, wait wait, wait, wait wait wait, the Holy Spirit's doing the guiding, the Holy spirits doing the illuminating. However, the disagreements and all of these problems result from not the Holy Spirit's failure, but from human fallibility, our biases, our cultural influences, and our sinful tendencies distort our ability to correct the scripture, to correctly interpret scripture. Just think about how ridiculous that sounds. Well, the Holy Spirit's the one who does it. But because of all of these problems, Well, we're fallible, and we have biases and cultural influence and

47:10 sinful tendencies, and this distorts our ability to interpret the scriptures correctly. Well, if all of that's working against us, then why do we ever think we're ever going to get it right in the first place? And not only that, and if it can override the Holy Spirit's help, then what chance do we have. The Holy Spirit's like, I want to help you, understand, but I'm sorry your biases, your sinful inclinations. You're oh, it's too great for me to help you. Well, then if then the Holy Spirit's useless in that particular scenario. Oh, the Holy Spirit's like, I still want to help you, but I can't. Others argue, well, wait, wait, wait, it's the Holy Spirit doesn't promise to lead all believers into identical interpretations, but rather to guide them and their personal walk with God. What does that even mean? Oh, the Holy Spirit's helping you, but I mean he's not going to give everyone the same interpretation. Are you are you nuts? That doesn't make any sense. So these explanations for trying, Well, the Holy Spirit's there, but well he doesn't give everyone the same interpretation, or well, well well he can't overcome your biases, and well then there's no point ladies and gentlemen. Now, I think if anyone just looks at it logically, that the promises about guiding and all of this was directed at the apostles and the early church leaders and context a passage like John sixteen thirteen refers to the Spirit guiding the apostles and writing

48:42 and preserving inspired scripture rather than providing an infallible guide for individual believers. Today, I think it's absolute. There's no other way to get around it. These promises are for the apostles. It's for those who wrote the New Testament, not for us. So if the individual, think of it this way. So if it's the individual, oh think of it. Let me state it another way. So if it's not the church. In other words, we reject the magisterium, reject the pastor's with the church's authority. So let's do that.

49:27 No magisterium, no church's authority. And if it's not the Holy Spirit that's leading and guiding us, then it's the individual. And if it's the individual, and yet, we have studies that indicate around seventy percent of the population, if not more, have a reading and reading comprehension level that is at a sixth grade level or below. That would lead the major problems, and it could possibly explain all the disagreements, all the confusion, and all the overall chaos when it comes to Bible interpretation. If interpretation is primarily a human endeavor rather than a direct, uniform guide by the Holy Spirit, well then guess what the varying capacities of an individual, The very capability of an individual to understand the Bible text becomes the critical factor. So the critical factor, then if it's not the church, it's not the magisterium, it's not the Holy Spirit, it's the individual. And well, then, ladies and gentlemen, your ability to read and comprehend that's the key. That's the critical issue. It's not anything it's not anything else, it's your ability to read. Studies indicate

50:58 that a significant percentage of people read at a sixth grade level or below, and this highlights some foundational issues. The Bible, even in modern translations, contains complex literary forms. It contains historical references, It contains philological concepts, it contains ancient cultural context. If readers struggle to comprehend even a straightforward text, interpreting scripture accurately becomes even more challenging. Most people today can't even comprehend and read a basic, straightforward text.

51:39 They cannot you give, There's been study after study that will give them, like a newspaper article, and the individuals can't determine which part of the of the of the story is opinion, which part is fact based. They don't know if it's first hand information secondhand information. They don't know how to verify. They're just lost in a sea of words. They don't know what to do. But yet they can come to church, open up a Bible, and start arguing with everyone. Think of the complexity of the Bible. You've got language in vocabulary. Biblical language often uses metaphors, idioms, and ancient phrasing that requires careful study to understand. Just think of historical context. Many passages of the Bible depend on knowledge of ancient Near Eastern or Greco Roman culture, which most readers lack. That information philological death. The Bible deals with profound concepts salvation, gray, sin, sanctification that require more than a surface level reading to even begin to grasp.

52:43 Look at all the variety. When it comes to genre, the Bible includes poetry, prophecy, narrative, apocalyptic literature, epistles, each requiring a completely different interpretive approach. Anyone with a lower reading comprehension level these complexities will easily lead to misinterpretation or oversimplification. They will either oversimplify the passage or completely misinterpret the passage or change its intended meaning. And we see this happen twenty four hours a day, seven days await, seven days a week within Christianity, and nobody wants to address the elephant in the room. So what are the implications of this, Well, it's going to lead to subjectivity, right.

53:28 Individuals are likely to impose their own understanding, biases, and experiences onto the text, especially when they lack the tools for critical interpretation. If they don't have the tools as to whatever they says, well, we'll teach them Bible study. No, you've got to stink and teach them how to read and how to comprehend what they read. Before you even get to Bible study. There's no point teaching Bible study if they can't read and comprehend what they read. So then guess what this leads to? Now? Know it does? It lead to subjectivity? It leads to are you ready over reliance on pastors and teachers? See, those who may feel unequipped are like, wow, this is all complicated. They just will lean heavily on a pastor, a denominational leader, or a certain philological brand, a certain theological system, and then they just stay comfortably there. They're gonna They're never gonna go contrary to that. And what else does this lead to? Well, if you have varying levels of comprehension and interpretive skills, well, that could easily explain why we have disagreements over everything. And this is prevalent within Christianity.

54:45 So then what does that? What do we do with this? Well, Biblical interpretation then requires a level of literacy. Did you hear that Biblical interpretation requires a level of literacy. You cannot do biblical interpretation without a certain level of literacy. You also have to have certain critical thinking skills that goes beyond basic reading comprehension and without these skills, individuals will miskey points, are completely interpret passages of scripture out of context. There is a certain level of critical thinking, a certain level of reading, and a certain level of reading comprehension that is required before Bible interpretation can take place.

55:28 But the church doesn't care about this. So what would this then mean that what we need in churches. I hate to say this, we need a class on reading, reading, comprehension, and critical thinking. The church has to pick up where the educational system has failed. If the educational system, because the church, when we look at people, there's an assumption that they have a certain level of reading that I mean, we don't think about it, we don't talk about but that we are operating under an assumption that they can. Well they don't. They can't. Every study in the world says otherwise, especially here in the United States of America, where we fall behind many nations. Now you can turn this into a political point and yell and scream and wanting the government to fix the educational system. The church has to start fixing the educational system, saying, hey, for a new Believer's class, what we're going to do for the first six weeks is reading, reading, comprehension and critical thinking skills. Well, when do we get to the Bible when you can figure these things out kind of like the karate kid, when do I get to actually paunch kin? Well, after you wax on and wax off and you do this and you do that. Wait, I want to learn how to fight. You got to do these things first. Well, I want to learn how to read the Bible. Well, you will after you learn how to read. I want to learn how to interpret the Bible. Well, when you can interpret Animal Farm or nineteen eighty four Lord of

57:01 the Flies, or I can go through a number of a famous novels. If you can't interpret these novels, you can't do this. And I guarantee you you can go to church and hand some of these people these novels. Their interpretation of them would be a train wreck of epic proportions. You could take Shakespeare, Edgar Allan Poe, you could take famous novels, Moby Dick, Lord of the Flies, nineteen eighty four. I mean I go through I could go through a number. I have a list of them that you almost like. And if the people in the church cannot interpret those novels, they have no business anywhere near the Bible. They shouldn't even get within a thousand miles of it. Now, guess what if you'll look at this problem wells, does this not explain the misunderstanding of key doctrines that it often stems from a shallow or incore reading of scripture. For instance, many interpret promises meant for specific audiences like Israel as universally applicable to all Christians.

58:09 How many times do you hear this? We've been seeing this when in Isaiah forty Hey you've got pastors. No, that stinking promises not for you. But hey, guys, it's all for you. No, it's not. That's shallow reading, poor reading, comprehension. Just everything about it is wrong. Guess what else this leads to. It leads to doctrinal confusion. It leads to basically a never ending amount of personal opinions. When the emphasis is on individual interpretation. Well, guess what. It leads to diverse and conflicting views, and these arise when individuals approach the text without adequate tools of knowledge. You know what else this will lead to. It will lead to a more emotional, mystical approach. Those who lack interpretive skills will substitute emotion or spirituality spiritual impressions for proper exegesis, which only makes the problem worse. So if you take the combination of low comprehension levels, a lack of hermeneutical training, and individual responsibility for interpretation, it will lead to the rise of contradictory teaching and doctrines, a focus on just

59:39 the plain reading of the text that ignores deeper context, and it will lead to division within and between churches as people interpret scripture differently based on their understanding. So how do you fix this? Well, you almost need the church to say, hey, guys, we need to be humble here. We got to be able to face ourselves and go, man, you know what, I never was great at reading and reading comprehension, and I really, you know, they could hand me certain works by maybe Shakespeare or this, and I had no clue what was going on. Maybe I should be careful about how much I think I know about the Bible. Maybe a little bit of humility would go a long way. Maybe we could hand people I don't know to kill a mockingbird, animal Farm, Lord of the Flies, The Scarlet Letter, Moby Dick, Crime and Punishment, A Heart of Darkness, Pride and Prejudice nineteen eighty four, Paradise, Loss, the Road, Ts Eliott's The Wasteland, William Blake's Song of Innocence and Experience. All of these works require all kinds of different comprehension, skills and ability. They require a lot

1:01:10 of effort and a lot and and if you can't do and a lot of these people who are sitting in the pew, they'll tell you I didn't read this in school. I didn't read, I didn't do book I didn't do my book reports, I got the cliff notes I watched they bragged about how much they did not read. And yet they'll be right there telling you this is what the Bible means. Stop it. You didn't even you couldn't even read that novel. And you're gonna tell me what ezekiels about, what Isaiah's Just stop it. It's ridiculous, ladies and gentlemen. The Protestant system leads to this critique.

1:01:51 No magisterium, not the church. The individual. The individual has the authority, The individual has the ability, and it's the individual rul's responsibility to critique what is being preached. Okay, all right, that's right, understand it gotcha all right? Solo scriptur. Well, let's be honest, it's the it's the individual's interpretation. It's not solo scripture. It's the individual's interpretation. Let's just be honest. We don't have thousands of churches. Every individual becomes their own church, their own pope, their own magisteria. All right. So if it's the individual, we just got to admit that. I know, we don't like to admit that. And we'll play all the little games you want to play about the church having the authority whatever. You can play those games.

1:02:32 It comes down to the individual. Well, then if it comes down to the individual, then what is going to be required. Now we can play the game saying, well, the Holy Spirit leads to interpreting, but that the Holy spirit's not doing that. Because it was, we wouldn't have all of these problems. So it comes down to the individual. If it comes down to the individual, Before the individual picks up a Bible, opens it and says this is what it says, this is what it means, and that's wrong, and that's wrong, and that's wrong, that's wrong, they have to be able to demonstrate a certain level of reading comprehension and reading ability, or it's a free for all. Now, I know that's not going to be popular. They said, well, how does that even work practically? While churches start teaching reading comprehension critical thinking. See, I know this sounds crazy, but it's just it's the logical conclusion. Now, why did I bring this up? Because in a sermon that we reviewed on Hebrews chapter six, the pastor mentioned this about reading and reading comprehension. Right he meant, and he even acknowledged.

1:04:04 He said his statistics were not exactly right, but he said, how many people read it? I think it was at third grade level? He gave? It was it was. It was a crazy number he gave. But even he acknowledged we got a problem here. Now. I thought it was funny because the way he handled Hebrew sixth, to me, seems to completely ignore the historical context and some of the basic critical thinking and reading comprehension skills that would be required to understand Hebrews chapter six. But I digress. The point is he mentioned the problem. Now he didn't mention what the solution was. Nobody mentions what the solution is, because the solution really would be like, whoa, we need to slow down here. We we just like, hey, here's a Bible, go go go well handing put person a book and they can't understand it. It would be, it would be, It would be fascinating to me just walk into churches and hand people some of these famous novels and say, okay, come back and we'll talk about it. One.

1:05:07 I doubt that many of the wouldn't even bother to read it because I don't like to read. Okay, Well then it's just well, then why did you pick a religion where the entire revelation is in written form? That makes no sense to me? But okay, okay, all right, But if they will read it, many of them come back, well, I didn't get this, or I didn't understand this, or I didn't understand this. Yeah, but you're the one who tells me that Romans means this, or Isaiah means that. You're the one who argues all the time, but yet you can't interpret that novel. Or your interpretation of that novel is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard in the history of humankind, because that's no idea. What the nobody in history thinks that that's what the novel is talking about. The author himself says, that's not what the novel is about. You've completely misinterpreted it, and just and you can. I look, I've watched pastors talk about some rock song, you know, and they'll they'll they'll quote the lyrics, and you'll just be like, oh, out loud. They don't even understand what the lyrics are about. They do not understand what the lyrics are about. This is the most embarrassing.

1:06:06 Yet they're supposed to preach to me the Bible, yet they can't understand a pop song. They can't understand a classic rock song. The lyrics are too complicated for them. But they're supposed to be interpreting to me the Book of Isaiah, and I've watched that happen a thousand times. Pastors will mention some lyric and I'm like, dude, that's it's not what the song is about, man. And then you talk to Christians about sometimes basic pop songs, basic classic rock songs, and you'll just listen to people the congregation like that's not what the song? Do you not know what? Or just listen to them talk about a movie and you'll be like that's not what. Never mind, if you can't interpret a movie, if you can't interpret a pop song, if you can't interpret a famous novel, you think you can interpret the Bible because the Church has this weird mentality that you the Bible's easy to understand.

1:07:02 Which that falls apart. We wouldn't have all these different denominations or they just assume that everyone has the power of God, God is leading their interpretation. Well, that wouldn't lead to again, all of these denominations and nobody agree. So something's wrong. Well, what's wrong is nobody bothered to address the real issue reading comprehension, Reading, reading comprehension and critical thinking. Now, he said, well, where do you fit in there? I don't know. I know that I have to constantly every day try to improve my reading every day, have to try to improve my reading comprehension, and every day I have to try to improve my critical thinking skills every single day, every single day. And if I don't, then my ability to interpret the Bible will not get any better? Am I better now than I was? I feel?

1:07:56 I am? Am I a million miles away. Yes, I don't think I could ever be. I mean, I would really I would to be honest, I would have to even dedicate more work and time to maybe doing you know, reading books about how to improve your reading comprehension, reading books about critical thinking skills. What are those critical thinking skills? How to develop them? How to see you know, logic and logical fallacies? What are the key logical fallacies? Am I committing a logical fallacy? Am I committing a critical thinking fallacy? Like just knowing about these things? Reading about these things? But you know what it requires is us to humbly go, Hey, here's how I've tried to do this, even with James. Here's my hypothesis. I'm not saying that I'm right, but here's my hypothesis. I try to say that all the time. Here's here's how I'm going to interpret this today. And what do I always say? How I interpret a text today is irrelevant come tomorrow, because I will study the text again and never rely on previous understandings. Right. Why we say when we come to a text, everything you've ever learned about the text before should be thrown out because you've got to start again.

1:08:56 Why because you have to acknowledge your comprehension and your reading ability and your interpretations are fallible. They are flawed. We are not infallible. And you do not interpret text based off your favorite theologies, your favorite philological team. You don't look at a text based off reform theology non reform theology. You look at the text for the text. So we have to address this issue. We had to. I went through a lot of that way quick, and I think I messed up a couple of words. I think I messed up one word in the I think I missed up I messed up one word in the Catechism.

1:09:50 I can't remember what the word was, but I messed up one word there. And then the democratization of Bible interpretation, I think, I think i'm that word. There's probably two or three words I messed up there. But see there's my reading ability right right, And I know I have if someone say, well, if you were to point out your your your weaknesses reading ability right and and this way, I was taught to read basically whole language, right. You you look at a word, you know, learn what that word is, and then that's the way you say it. And I was not. I was not taught phonetically right, So when I look at a word I'm almost If I don't know the word, I'm incapable of being able to break down the word until I hear it. Once I hear it, then I'll just remember, Oh, that's what it was. That's how I learned. Oh, here's a word symbolism. Okay.

1:10:35 At first I would have been like size, Okay, someone tells me what the word is. Okay, oh, symbolism, okay, guy, and I'll just remember it like I can remember it. But if I come across a word that I haven't stated in a long time, I know that I lack. See that's a that's a flaw in me. Now I can, I can. I can read really, And another flaw with me is speed reading. Right. I do a lot of speed reading. So that's great, that's a good ability to have. But when you speed read, you just kind of like you're not necessarily getting every single word right. You kind of learn these little tricks to just go here, here, here, here, here, okay. God, I can get you the basic meaning, but I may miss some details. I'm good at seeing the big picture, sometimes I will miss details, right, So like sometimes in a novel, I will be horrible at remembering. So who is the main character. I will I'll be trash it remembering some details, right, But you asked me the big picture, the meaning of it, the interpretation of it. I got you there. Now we're in my will house. You asked me some basic questions. You may even come to the conclusion I didn't read the book. I'll be like, wait, who is Johnny?

1:11:40 What? Wait? What? What? Now? You can say, but I'll say, well, this represents this, and this meant this, and so I know that there's like sometimes I need to slow down, get better at being able to figure out what the words mean. Read every single things I know I have to do. I know and I and I'm not going to fix them today or tomorrow. All I can do is be We've got to be aware of where our our our weaknesses are and acknowledge that when we come to the Bible. But we've got a problem, ladies and gentlemen and the p and just think about it. If the current generation who's in college can't read, they're going to be the church members of the future. They're going to be the pastors, they're going to be the biblical teachers.

1:12:33 If they're reading. Comprehension is poor. Now the church is in trouble in the future unless the church decides we're going to fix this. We're going to address reading, reading comprehension, and critical thinking. You say, well, is that really the church's job. Well, if the church churches can have pot looks and all the other ridiculous things that they do, I think they could do reading, reading comprehension a lot, and thinking skills. If you can have game night, fun night, banquet night, and all the other nonsense churches do, I think we should do that. Now. The thing is, you have reading comprehension night. I do. Anyone's going to show up, but they'll also be the same people who don't show up will tell you what the Bible means. It doesn't mean, so go figure. All right, thanks for listening everyone, have a great day. God bless