10 Secrets About Church

0:02 Looking at our world from a theological perspective. This is the Theology Central podcast making Theology Central. Good morning everyone. It is Monday, February seventeenth, twenty twenty five. It is currently ten forty five am Central Time, and I am coming to you live from the Theology Central studio located right here in Abilene, Texas. Now, I don't know for you when you first walked into a church. I don't know if you grew up in the church and so you just was always around church culture, church people, church events, going to church, youth group, all just all of the things that make up church. You it may just be a part of your life. You don't really know a life of anything different. Others may you may have walked into church the first time, maybe as a teenager, maybe as an adult. So for some of you you may not be able to answer this. Others of you you may be very quick to answer this. What was like for you? What were the things about church that either kind of shocked you, surprised you confused you you were like, wait, I did because maybe you had kind of an idea of what church was going to be like and then maybe you found out it wasn't quite like that. I mean, were you kind of what was the first thing that kind of shocked you or or surprised you or confused you.

1:31 What was the first time Maybe even if you grew up in it, maybe at some point you were kind of like, I don't think this is what church was supposed to be, or this is not the way I think it should be. What was that first thing for you? Now for me, I'm trying to think where because I had just, you know, very brief encounters with church, you know, kind of growing up, I didn't have a lot. My first when I really kind of entered church was after I became a Christian as a teenager, and a couple of things that kind of shocked me about church was well, one when my you know, when my mother was in the hospital dying, and then I got in trouble for not at not mowing the lawn of the church. That was a little shocking. The way people kind of handled that.

2:22 You kind of realize people were kind of selfish, they were self centered sometimes that their way of supposedly offering comfort was a little bit confounding and confused. You notice that that churches seemed to be somewhat I don't know if I like the term. It's like this group seems still like this, and this group seems to like this and possible, you know, fighting within the church. That kind of surprised me a little bit. I think I was somewhat shocked to find that. You know that if you put if you take everyone in church and you put them in a room where everybody's you know, having food eating, that a lot of the conversations that it's not really about doctrine, theology, the sermon, the Bible. It's about all kinds.

3:06 It's just about normal stuff. Their job, this hunting trucks, or their kids, their grandkids, like just normal stuff. Because in my mind, oh, these people are passionate about the Word of God. They care about doctrine, they care about theology. So I was somewhat surprised by that. I mean, I was obviously extremely shocked and surprised. I've told the story countless times when the pastor's wife smashed the window out of the front door of the house I was in because I was listening to foreigner and pulled me out by my ear and told me I couldnot have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ by listening to that kind of music. That whole story was crazy. Now I know, I'm not going into all the details of what happened, but it was nuts. So oh I time seeing a teenage girl who had become pregnant put behind the pulpit to offer an apology to everyone for becoming pregnant, but the teenage boy was nowhere to be found. Some of those situations we're kind of bizarre. I've said some really weird things in churches that kind of shocked me. Now again, I may have been naive, right, I may have approached it thinking, oh, it's going to be like this, and what you ultimately realize Ultimately Now, some people's theology doesn't want to admit this is the church is filled with sinners.

4:24 Right. We may be Christians, but we are still sinners. As much as Christians don't like to admit that. We like to no, no, no, we are all new creatures of the old is gone. Everything is new. We've been set free from the power of sin. Basically, we can be holy. The reality is, if you're involved in church, you see they are a center. They are a ciner. I'm a sinner. They do this, they do that, they say this. There's backstabbing, there's gossip, there's slander, there's complaining. There's people basically playing a political game to get power, to get influence. They're trying to take over this this they're waiting for it to get this person out so they can do this all. I mean, it's just as sinful and as ungodly as basically any other institution. I know we don't want to admit that. I know we don't want to admit that, but I think that's the way we have to approach it now. The reason I'm asking these questions and talking about all of this is earlier this morning, I came across a YouTube video purely by accident, I was. I was there checking make sure there was no comments or anything on any of you know, our content that we uploaded YouTube. I was making sure someone you know, hadn't said anything rude or you know, anything along those lines.

5:40 And I guess the algorithm, you know, said hey, you should watch this, and it was the name of the video is it's not was it is ten secrets pastors don't want you to know about church. Ten secrets pastors don't want you to know about church. Now, that's that that that type of video title is perfect for YouTube. I was watching a Christian YouTuber the other day or about a week ago. He was kind of complaining and kind of frustrated with Christian YouTube, thinking about quitting it because all the videos. If you're if you're gonna have a video that's gonna be successful on YouTube in the Christian world, it's got to be it's gotta be something about shocking and this has been revealed. It's always got to be some kind of sensational title. It can't just be my teaching on first Peter chapter one, verses one through four. No no, no, no, no no, that's not going to get that many views. It can't be a discussion about the hypostatic union. No no, It's going to be shocking secrets about the hypostatic union. And you got to have, you know, the little thumbnail artwork of someone looking shocked or or some expression of surprise on their face.

6:52 And it's going to be hidden secrets discovered. This found this, you know, exposed the hair receipt of this. Taylor Swift is satan. You know, it's gonna be some kind of sensational thing and then you'll get all the clicks and all the downloads, which just kind of shows you the mentality. I don't know of a lot of the Christian world, but I know the same thing to be true in Christian podcasting. If I want to get the downloads, if I want to get the streams, I just need to have a title that's like shocking this that oh talk about whatever the controversial. Chase the controversy. Chase the controversy. Be first with the controversy and then or create the controversy, especially if you can like call someone else, call some other minister out by name, and then they respond to you.

7:39 It's kind of like the same thing happens in rap music, right if you're if you are Kendrick and Drake and you call each other out, well, then everyone's like, oh, so what are they gonna say, Oh, let's go listen to their song? Are they responding, Oh, now they've got a song? And then well, ultimately both people just make more money. Well in the Christian world, some in Christian podcasting world, Christian YouTube world, the same thing can happen. So the tile fits the typical algorithm that the Christian YouTube world wants. Ten secrets, Oh we got secrets. These are things pastors don't want you to know about church, all right, So I mean it got my attention. So what we're gonna do is we're going to review this. I have not listened to any of it. I have no idea of these are interesting secrets?

8:23 Are there? Are these just ridiculous things? Are they? Are they legitimate claims? Are they full? I don't know. I don't know what we're gonna say, but I do agree that I think I don't know if we call them secrets. I think there's a lot of things when you enter into the church that can be somewhat shocking or surprising going. I didn't really think it would be this way. I didn't think it would go down this way. And I really started learning. I started really beginning to understand how messed up the church can be when I started talking to different pastors. In fact, the one that opened my eyes the most was he was a chad. When I was in the United States Air Force stationed at Dias Air Force Base, the chaplain at the time, I would go to lunch with him, we would hang out some. He went through I mean, the reason he was a chaplain is he never wanted to be a pastor again, because he told all of these stories of things that happened when he was a pastor, and I was like, what in the world what was going I mean, it was crazy stories. And then I've heard other pastors tell stories that are just absolutely crazy. Charles Stanley has the famous story that it was a business meeting and he got punched by a deacon, and I'm like, what in the world was going on. I've heard other even people from my church, some of their stories. When my church first started the church, some of the other people had come

9:55 from that church that it became so like contentious and divisive that they tried to come to church and they had armed guards at the door not letting them in. And You're like, you hear these stories and You're like, what in the world was going on? What was happening in churches? But I see now philologically, I'm much better prepared to understand it. There was a time I didn't understand it, especially when I was extremely into lordship. It'd be like, well, nobody is saved, nobody in the church is saved. Well, if you keep going that direction, sooner or later you're gonna have to acknowledge that you're not saved. Right now, since I've kind of moved away from that understanding, my perspective is a little bit easier now. It's a little bit easier to process. The church is made up of sinners and they still sin, and that sin shows itself in church all the time, all the time, and that the people in the church, no matter how godly they try to pretend they want what they want, they're gonna get what they want. And if they don't get what they want, either they're getting read of view, or they're leaving okay, or they're going to divide the entire church.

11:03 People are selfish, self centered, and it's and they it's just it's a mess. It's but in some ways we should expect that. So I'm saying all of that to say that what he thinks are secrets, I don't know how secretive they're going to be, and I don't know if they're going to prove what he I'm assuming he's going to try to use this to try to prove something. It may only prove that your theology needs to acknowledge that. Yes, and my position, I'm a new creature. Old things are passed away, all things have become new, but in practice, I'm still very much a sinner, and so are you, and sinners sin, and that sin manifests itself and countless ways, even within church culture. So that's that's the starting point I want to get through. I don't know if we'll get through old ten secrets these. It's only eleven minute video, so I think we should be able to get through ten.

12:01 You know, we're not going to get through all ten, right, because I should have labeled this part one, because there's just no way, right, because I'm going to start talking about each one and that'll probably be forty five minutes. Are you ready? What do you think Number one is? What do you think? What do you think? What's your prediction? What do you think is the first secret? This video is going to say, here's a secret about the church that pastors don't want you to know. I'm going to guess. I'm going to bet it's going to be something like the church is a business and they don't want you to know it's a business. I bet it's going to go something like that. That's my guess. I could be wrong.

12:43 What do you think? Let's find out? Here we go, Christians, if your pastors were completely honest with you about how church works, you'd probably walk away. And okay, wait, that's coming out the gate fast, right, that's coming out to get hot. Right. So hey, Christians, if you knew certain things that your pastors don't want you to know, if you knew the things your pastor knows, you'd probably walk away and never come back to church. Do you think that's true? I'm just curious what would be the what would be the tipping point for you that you would just like, you know, I'm done with the entire you know, institution of the church as far as like a physical place, a building, I'm done with that.

13:27 I'm done with that. Is there a tipping point for you? For some people? I don't think there is. I think it doesn't matter what the church does, and doesn't matter what they discover, what they find out. That may be done with that church, but they're going to go find another. Now. Is there a tipping point for you? You're like, I'm done, I'm just done with the whole thing. Is there a tipping point for you? Let's start that over again. Yeah, we're not going to get too far, are we? All right? Let's start again? Right here we go. Christians, if your pastors were completely honest with you about how church works, you'd probably walk away. And that's exactly why they're not telling you the full truth. Pastors are trained not just in theology, but also on how to sell their church. It's a business, and that's not even the worst part. It's a system designed to keep people in line, keep the money flowing in, and to keep you from questioning too much. And I know this because I used to be one of them. I stood on the platform week over week, believing that I was doing the work of God. But looking back, I realized how much I kept hidden, sometimes because I was trained to and sometimes because I didn't even recognize the problems myself.

14:34 Now here's the irony. When I was. Ordained, I actually believed that we were about to fix the world, like we were Batman swooping in to save Gotham. But in reality, it turns out we were more like the Kardashians, busy brand building, thriving on drama, and selling illusions for ratings. So today we're counting down the top ten things pastors don't want you to know about church. Wow, he's coming in strong there, He's coming in very strong. He mentioned a business like right, right, I mean, right out right out of the gate. Now, I do believe though a little bit of what he's saying here to this, I'm gonna try to I'm gonna try to look at this from on one hand, I'm gonna be critical and try to and try to look at it from a thiological perspective. This is theology central. But I'm also gonna try to look at it from the side of what being a pastor, right, and what you kind of experience.

15:30 So I'm gonna I'm gonna try to offer maybe that perspective as well. So I will say this that that analogy that when you get ordained, you think you're gonna fix the world, you're gonna be like Batman. You know you're gonna you're gonna come, come, come in and basically save Gotham. There is a little bit of truth to that, right When you when you feel called to the ministry, you get kind of excited, right, You get like, oh, yes, I'm gonna dedicate my life to doctrine, to theology, to church history. I'm gonna dedicate my life life to studying the Bible, and then I'm gonna preach it. And then, at least in my mind again, because I didn't have a lot of that history with the church, I still was under this impression that if you show up at church and you're ready and you're ready to teach, and you're ready to study and you're ready to dig into scripture, that the people are going to eat it up. They're gonna want more. They're gonna want more, and they're gonna show up Sunday school. They're gonna show up Sunday morning.

16:24 They're gonna show up Sunday night. They're gonna be their Wednesday. They're gonna be there and they're gonna be asking for more services, and they're gonna want to talk about doctrine. They're gonna want to talk about theology. And it's gonna be all these people with the same pursuit to learn the Bible, and they're gonna be hungry for it, and they're gonna care more. They don't care about anything else, they don't care about activities and all that. They just want the scriptures. And you think you're gonna be and it's gonna be amazing. They're gonna be calling you for spiritual advice and spiritual counsel and you're gonna be able to help them, and they're gonna be they're gonna be asking you theological questions, and you have this vision of what it's going to be and then you kind of get there and you're like, this, what just happened here?

17:07 What is going on? And then people you find out people don't like this, and they don't like this, and they don't want this, and they don't like this, and I don't like when you do this, and then you're like, for crying out loud, and then you start realizing my entire, my entire understanding of what this was going to be like, it's not what it's like. And then, and I always say this, I was always in a unique position, right. I was in a unique position right from the very beginning. I mean I had problems right from the word go, right right from the word go. And I remember the first major meeting, I basically looked at I look, they were trying to pay me. I'm like, no, you're not paying me another cent. I don't want your money because you're not gonna hold it over my head. Because it was almost you could almost hear the implication basically, we pay you, we own you. And I'm like, no, no, no, You've got the wrong guy. You're not gonna pay amy, and you sure don't own me, and you sure are not gonna tell me what I can and can't do.

18:05 Like I definitely pushed back on that strongly. Right, So I was in a position where I didn't need it, right. I was by vocational. My full time job was the military. My livelihood was in the military, so I could push back. But man, can you imagine you dedicate your life, you go to Bible College, you go to seminary, you're ready, you come swooping in, You're gonna save Gotham, and then almost immediately you're punched in the face and like, back off. This is the way it's going to be. And you've then begin to realize, wait, I gotta choose my battles here, or I'm gonna lose my job, or I'm gonna lose people. If you lose people, then you lose money, and then they can't pay you. And so then you're faced with a very ugly reality at that very moment, what do I do here? Everyone? People in the pukes are what you should just be bold and you should stand for God, and God will take care of you. It's easy for you to talk big when your livelihood is not directly connected to it. So yeah, I think you get there.

19:05 I think you have this impression of how it's going to be, and I think this is where the problems begin. Right the pastor has this, I mean, think about this. The pastor has felt this call to be in ministry. They've spent their life now getting trained, Bible, college, seminary, depending how much education they've got. They spent you know, months, years of their lives thinking and dreaming of what it's going to be like to be a pastor, preparing, preparing, studying, writing sermons, thinking about the sermons they want to preach, that their whole life is committed to that. And then they get there. But the people in the pew, they're just like, this is just another church service. You're just another pastor. It's just another sermon. It's just another Bible study.

19:53 Now for the pastor, no, no, no, this is a sermon. This is a Bible study like they're coaching it four different then the person, especially if you've grown up in the church, you're just like, you're just another guy with another sermon. I've heard a million of them, and now I'm going to hear a million one, right. You know, It's like I think that they're already sets up a difference there, and I always try to explain the difference from behind the pulpit versus sitting in the pew. There is always a difference, and I think that difference creates some of the problems the pastor sees it one way, and then the pastor has to begin to kind of WHOA I've got to manage my expectations here, and he says, he says pastors are trained not only in theology or in preaching, but also in selling the church. Well, I can say, in all everything I've ever done and all of my schooling, I don't think I was ever taught to sell the church. I think there was always sometimes some courses available and maybe how to do this or how to do that, but I didn't care about I wanted to take more courses on theology or church history for the Bible states, something along those lines. But I think I think, I think, I don't know if you're necessarily trained in selling the church, but I think you catch on really quick that you got to figure out how to sell the church. You have to kind of figure out how to build the brand. You have to kind of figure out how to market the church. Why, because one there may be expectations by people in the pew, whether they say it or not. If the church isn't growing,

21:25 if people aren't coming in, they have a tendency to start thinking, well, the church is dead, the church is dying. I don't feel revival, maybe because the pastor is not spiritual enough. Then there's almost this unspoken rule that you're the problem. You're the problem, this church is dying. God is not moving. You're and and then you they will point the fingers. They won't point the fingers at them, they'll point the fingers at the pastor. And then and then and well then if the church isn't growing and people are start to leave, well then you know, then finances become a problem. So then you have to kind of figure out how to build the brand, how to market the church, and inevitably what happens. And I know people don't like to acknowledge this. Evangelistic campaigns. Are they truly motivated because you care about people's soul? Or are they motivated because you care about those empty pews? And what that represents now that motive it's hard to determine, right.

22:29 There can be a part of it that it's a good motive, but there can be this other, unspoken motive that no one wants to talk about. We got to get people here, because if we don't, we're in trouble, right, So we'll start this over and let it play. And that's kind of his introduction, and then he's going to start with the first secret that pastors don't want you to know. Here we go, Christians. If your pastors were completely honest with you about how church works, you probably walk away. And that's exactly why they're not telling you the full truth. Pastors are trained not just in theology, but also in how to sell their church. It's a business, and that's not even the worst part. It's a system designed to keep people in line, keep the money flowing in, and to keep you from questioning too much. And I know this because I used to be one of them. I stood on the platform week over week, believing that I was doing the work of God. But looking back, I realized how much I kept hidden, sometimes because I was trained to and sometimes because I didn't even recognize the problems myself. Now here's the irony. When I was ordained, I actually believed that we were about to fix the world, like we were Batman swooping in to save Gotham. But in reality, it turns out we were more like the Kardashians, busy brand building, thriving on drama, and selling illusions for ratings.

23:49 So today we're. Counting down the top ten things pastors don't want you to know about church, and trust me, if church goers knew these things, a whole lot more would be empty. Let's get started, so number ten, Church is a business, not a ministry. Churches love to brand themselves as spiritual homes, places of worship where the focus is on faith, community, worship, and prayer. But behind the scenes, churches are structured more like businesses than sanctuaries. They rely on a steady stream of revenue, they market themselves, and they have clear financial incentives to grow their congregations. The moment money is involved, it stops being a simple place of worship and starts functioning like a corporation with tax exemptions. Pastors may not call themselves CEOs, but they manage their churches like CEOs, overseeing budgets, payrollet building expansions, and even marketing strategy strategies to draw in new members.

24:45 This isn't to. Say that every church is a money hungry empire, but the reality is without money, churches cannot operate, and that financial dependence shapes every decision they make. From the messages they preach to the programs they find. Notice how the humble pastor's face is plastered on billboards, newsletters, and social media ads. They make Apple's marketing team look reserved. Turns out, if you can't hook new fish, the donation pund goes dry real quick. Now, there's a lot of truth there behind the scenes. It is a business. There's no way to get around it. It's a business. You got to have money because it costs money to keep the building going. You gotta keep new people coming in because you got to keep the donations flowing. And like it or not, it does shape everything.

25:39 Look a pastor that first of all, you got to kind of figure out your lane. So you got to figure out your theological team. You got to figure out which what your theological team is. Right. Once you figure out your theological team, you cannot veer, you cannot swerve from that. It's not a place for studying and questioning and struggling and trying to figure it out. No no, no, no no no no no, no no no. You've got to stay on brand. You got to stay on message, you got to stay on point. Right. Hey, we're this kind of church. We don't veer all you have to say because you're gonna tick someone off. And you tick someone off, they leave, Boom, there goes another donation. Boom, someone else leaves, there goes more donations. Once the donation starts going with, then guess what. Now you don't have money to market.

26:21 Now you don't have money to promote, or you have to start cutting staff, or you don't have this, or you don't have that. And if you don't have the money, then it all begins to fall apart. There's no way to get you and say people say, well, what do you do? Well? I think you first just have to acknowledge money is essential and then have to be honest with your motivations. Okay, are we trying to get more people because we care about souls or because we care about donations. It's hard for someone to admit that. Am I preaching and really struggling with the text because that's what we're supposed to do. Or am I avoiding it because well, I'm gonna take some and so off. I'm gonna take so and so off. Look, when I start, I can go back from my own experiences when I when I started kind of moving away from lordship, I'm beginning to call into question some of it and started trying to go with a proper distinction between law and gospel.

27:16 The writing was on the wall. I knew I was going to lose people. I knew I was going to lose people. And over time, you just just you You're not allowed to do that. You have to stay. This is what we are. And there's no room for any type of intellectual growth. There's no growth philologically. You just all you got to do is just keep saying what you're supposed to say. And and now everyone in the pew will be like, we're hungry for the word of God. We want to study. No, they don't. They just want to hear what the philological system that they have chosen. And so and so. If you care about money, well you got to get be careful. Are you going to take people off? You got to give people what they want. You got you and you. And it means if you need a little bit of entertainment, if you need a little bit of programs, if you need a little of this, you need a little of that. You got to make sure you have a good balance and a good mix to keep the So much of the church structure is there to keep the people happy, because if the people aren't happy, what is almost inevitably the first thing they do when they're not happy, They stop giving money. They don't give money, the church goes away. And I've said it so many times.

28:28 The reality is it's a business. And if we're really honest about the business of it, I call it. That's where I really get frustrated, because if it's a business, then look at what you're actually getting for the money it takes to keep that business operating. Right, If it's a business, what are you getting from that business? What two sermons a week if you're lucky, maybe three sermons a week if you're lucky. For now, look at how much money it takes to keep the church operating, and look what you're actually getting the quality of preaching, the depth of the preaching. Is it really a place where there's great learning? Now, because in many cases you can take the entire year of sermons from any church, and I challenge you to do this. I mean, we're only in February of twenty twenty five right now. Church, go to go to your church and start asking people about all the sermons preached in twenty twenty four. Do they even remember any of them? What was the most significant thing?

29:31 There's a high probability that don't have a clue. So all of those sermons were preached in twenty twenty four, nobody even remembers them, nobody even cares. But look at how much money it took to keep the building operating. But what what did everyone get for all the money spent? What? What did you? Did you have some fun time at a pot luck? Or did you have They may remember the little activities more than they remember any of the actual teaching. It's hard enough to get people to remember what you preached two weeks ago. It's hard enough to get them to remember what you preached a month ago. But look at how much money it took to keep the church operating for that month. Now, I've been very critical of that, right because I know that for what it takes to operate a church for a year. You give me the budget of almost any church. You hand that to me, give it to me what it would take to keep most churches going for a year. I guarantee you I will produce five hundred times the amount of content that they can even come close to producing.

30:37 I'll be on the air morning, afternoon, evening. Okay, I mean give me a break. One person with a microphone and a computer and an internet connection that can can produce far more teaching, far more preaching, and far more any It can can do anything else. When people say, well there's not a personal connection. What personal connection that you go sit in the pew and you don't remember the sermon that was preached a week later? Oh wow, what great personal connection. So I mean like, it's a business. There's no way to get around it. It's a business.

31:20 You say, well, there's no way to fix that. There really isn't. But I think what we have to do is then be honest with Because it's a business, everything is tainted to some level. But let's look at number nine. Your tithes don't go where you think they do. Pastors love to emphasize the importance of tithe and claiming it's a direct act of faith and that the money is used to support the church's mission. But let's be real, most of your tithe goes towards salaries, maintenance, and operating calls. While some churches do charitable work, the bulk of their funds are spent keeping the organization afloat, covering things like staff salaries, including the pastor's paycheck, which can sometimes be quite significant, but also mortgage or rent for the church, building utilities, maintenance renovations, and of course marketing campaigns to attract new members. Meanwhile, very little actually makes its way to the poor and needy.

32:19 Churches that push tithing the hardest tend to be the ones most focused on sustaining their own institution, not on helping their communities. It's like donating to a charity that promises to save endangered pandas, but ninety percent of the funds go to pende costumes for the staff and building plush office spaces. Then they hand out three granola bars to a homeless guy, snap of picture and call it outreach. Man, he's going in hard. Well, that's kind of what I was just saying. You took take how much money it goes to keep that building going. All the funds coming in is to keep the building going. The funds coming in. I know we're saying, well, we tie that we give money because you know, we're worshiping God, and we turn it into we phrase it, we wrap it up in this robe of self righteousness and worship and giving to God. But you're giving to keep a building operating.

33:18 You're giving money to keep the building going, to pay staff, to buy curriculum or whatever the case may be, to upkeep to the ac the heat, the lights, the church sign and marketing. Now what are you getting from all that money that goes in? Again, It's almost like I've talked about this before and I don't think anyone's ever taken me up on it, But I mean anybody listening can do it. Contact your church and say, hey, can I have the financials for last year and just look for twenty twenty four how much money came in, how much money did it cost to go through this? And then you sit down and you can look on the church website, you can look wherever how many sermons did it actually get for that much money, How many Bible studies were there, and what was the depth of that teaching?

34:15 What was the significance of that teaching. Now you may say, well it Dea doesn't matter because I got to go to the potluck and then we had this, and then we had this, and we had this, and maybe all those other things are worth that much money to you. Maybe it is, and that's great. If you feel that you're getting your money's worth, then okay. But if the church is really supposed to be about a place where saints are equipped, where teaching is king, or preaching and teaching and theology is king, I will argue in many cases, the people give money to keep the church operating and then they get most of their spiritual nourishment their theology, and they're teaching from something outside other than their church.

34:58 So you're paying all the money for the church to operate, Well, you're taking well, you're getting actually spiritually fed by other ministries that you don't give to them. But you're giving to the church just to keep the building going. But you actually have to go somewhere else to get spiritually fed. That's that's great. So what is the money going to? So it's a business. And then most cases, so number ten was it's a business, and number nine was in most cases, your money's not going to where you think it's going. It's going to just keep the institution operating because it's a business. What do you think? Number eight is? Number eight.

35:38 Most pastors doubt but can't admit it, believe it or not. Many pastors experience doubt about their faith, but they can't afford to be honest about it. If a pastor publicly questions God's existence, the Bible's reliability, or key theological concepts, they risk losing their influence, their job, their congregation, and even their reputation. Instead, they bury their doubts and continue preaching, even if deep down they no longer believe what they're saying. This creates a culture of performance rather than genuine belief, where pastors feel trapped in their roles, unable to leave even if they no longer believe. They might spend years secretly questioning their faith, all while standing in front of a congregation preaching certainty. I can remember late night google binges myself about fossil evidence and contradictions in scripture, and then waking up Sunday morning to deliver a message on unwavering faith, talk about living a double life.

36:33 Number Yeah, the church is a place for performance. You can't be brutally honest. In many cases, you can't be nobody really can't. Everyone's got to put on their little robe of self righteousness as, oh, we're all doing great, we're all overcoming, we're all victorious. Everything certainty, certainty, certainty, certainty, certainty, certainty. And you can't, of course, you can't challenge any fill a lot, you can't. You gotta just gotta give the people what they want. They don't want to hear any doubt. They don't want to hear anything. And I think to me that calls that demonstrates a weak faith. I've said it before. A faith that cannot be questioned, a faith that cannot be challenged, a faith that you never struggle with, is not really a faith. It's just you playing dress up.

37:19 Church is where everyone goes to play dress up. You play dress up as a kid, and then you become a Christian and you play dress up by going church is just where we play church. It's like playing house. We all dress up and play our parts and play our role, and we all sound so oh this and God and this and whatever. Nobody can be the real them can be there. You can't really talk about your real struggles with sin. You're real now, I understand there's a time and place. I'm not saying everybody walks into church and starts confessing all of their vile sin. I'm saying, though, we could be a little bit more honest. You don't have to confess everything, but you can be more honest that, hey, we're sinners, your sinners were I said, always like those bad people out there, we can be like, well, we're not so good in here either. We got our own doubts, we got our own struggles, we got our own our own questions, and you know, and it's also it would be more refreshing of people. You know this text. I struggle with this. This makes no sense. What is going on? Now?

38:24 You do that enough, you'll lose people in your church. You can't do that. Can't do that. You gotta walk the party line. It's not a place for the church is not a place for people who struggle. It's not a place for people who doubt. It's not a place for sinners. Now, one of the things most refreshing about being just a podcaster is I can offend people and take people off, but I can be real. I mean, I mean, what was it a couple of days ago? I don't remember a couple of weeks ago. Whenever I said I'm a degenerate, right that I can acknowledge I'm a sinner, I'm a degenerate, I can I can acknowledge my struggles and my doubts, I can ignore. I can say whatever I want in a podcast, right, people may stop listening. But okay, now again, if I really if now, if I if I really felt like, man, i gotta use this podcast to make money, I gotta make a certain amount of money or I'm in trouble, well, then guess what it would impact podcasting as well. I mean the same, the same problem can happen in podcasting as well.

39:33 Then you play the part. You gotta play the part. And I think many Christian podcasters who who find their their audience and and keep saying the company line, they tend to do better. I tend to offend anyone and everyone. People who are reformed. I tick off people are not reformed. I take off all millennial lists, I take off dispensation lists. I tick off. It doesn't matter. I take off everyone because I'm not going to be beholden to a company line, a party line. I don't care. I'm my job is supposed to be trying to figure this out. And what I try to do is like I'm just a sinner with a microphone trying to figure this out. I got questions, I got doubts. Sometimes it makes sense. Sometimes I don't have any clue. I don't understand what's going on. I said before, my problems begin with these words. Everybody knows where I'm turning. In the beginning. God created the heaven and the earth. That's where I'm all my problems begin.

40:31 Because as soon as I'm like, wait, wait, wait, wait, that God who's about to create is all knowing and all powerful, and I know exactly how this world's going to turn out, and I want to scream at the text, don't don't do it, don't create? Why are you going to create? And what? Wait? Wait wait, before you even created the world, did you already create this person named Satan, this angelic being named Satan? And who and I can go through all of my questions and all of my doubts, and all my philosophy and my struggle struggle, struggle, struggle, struggle, struggle, struggle, and then and then I talk about my struggle with prayer. Oh, you want me to pray about this situation? So you want me to pray to the very God who didn't who allowed the situation? You want to pray? You want me to pray to the very God who didn't intervene to stop the situation. He allowed the situation, and depending on your theology, he decreed the situation. But now I'm supposed to pray to him about the situation. Well, if he didn't do anything to stop it, if he didn't do anything to intervene, why am I praying to him now?

41:22 What he's going to intervene after the fact. You know, a plane crashes, we'll pray for the family members, pray, pray for the survivors, But we're gonna pray to the God who didn't do anything to stop the plane from crashing. How do we understand that? Say, I'm not supposed to see in church, I can't say that. Well, in my church, I can because there's nobody left, right, But if the church had one hundred people, I could not say that because I would probably lose twenty five fifty in a Sunday And I can't really even say it in a Christian podcast because I'm gonna lose fifty percent of my audience doing that. So church becomes a place where everyone dresses up and pretends. In many cases, the pastors have to be has to be the great pretender. Was that Jackson Brown who did that song?

42:17 I think? All right, I think it was Jackson Brown, the great Pretender? I'm almost positive. Okay, you can check my musical knowledge there. I think it was Jackson Brown. All right, But I digress, I digress, right. So the point is, yeah, and I think a lot of people in the pew the same way. They feel like they can't really be real, they can't be truthful. Now, originally small groups was supposed to be the solution. You're around a small group of people whom you can trust, and you can be real and you can be genuine. Maybe there's some small groups out there like that. But if you have to have the small group where you can be real and genuine, then why are we paying all this money to keep the church operating when we and small groups all already are confounding and confusing. We spend all of this money to keep the building operating, but then we meet in small groups outside of the church. Well, why are we paying all the money to get the building operating? Okay, all right, so yeah, that's a whole different thing. But all right, let's see what next. The next one is.

43:20 Seven. Church leadership is a boys club. Despite the modern push for gender equality, church leadership remains overwhelmingly male dominated. Many churches still refuse to allow women to service pastors or whole leadership positions. Even in churches that claim to be progressive, women often find themselves stuck in subordinate roles, expected to support men rather than lead alongside them. The Bible is often used as justification for this, citing versus about women being submissive or women being seen as the weaker vessel. But let's be honest, this is about maintaining control. Keeping leadership male centered insures that power stays in the hand of men, preventing challenges to the traditional hierarchy. You know, there's nothing like a progressive church that puts women on the women's committee to decorate, cook and occasionally read announcements. But heaven forbid, they speak from the platform with actual authority, equal rights, more like equal pop luck contributions.

44:20 Now, that gets into a whole philological dispute and Bible interpretation, because I think we can pretty much agree, whether you like it or not, the Bible seems pretty clear that it's men who are supposed to be called the ministry. Men are supposed to be the pastors. Whether you like that or not, that does seem to be the Biblical model. All right. Now, we could argue, you know that, you could have some arguments there, but you know, I don't think calling it a boys club. I don't think first that's not a secret. That's not some secret pastors don't want you to know. I mean, that's right out there in the open. It's not like, hey, pastors don't want you to know these secrets, and if you knew these secrets, you would not come back to church. Everyone knows that for the most part, churches believe and mail leadership within the church. I mean, I think that that's pretty much a given. I don't think that's a secret. And we could, well, we could spend a couple of hours trying to debate that philologically and biblically, but you would have a hard time going to the Bible going mmm. I think within the church it does seem to be pretty much that way.

45:25 You could challenge some of those texts, maybe, but you're gonna have a hard time there. All right, let's go to the next one, number six. The church thrives on guilt and fear. Ever wonder why so many church messages focus on sin, judgment, and hell. It's because fear, guilt, and shame are powerful motivators. If people feel like they're constantly failing, they'll keep coming back for forgiveness and guidance. And if they fear punishment, whether in the form of hell fire or social rejection, which is also a form of social life version by the way, they'll comply with whatever the church tells them to do. This is why messages about love and grace are often paired with warnings about sin and damnation, warnings about missing the mark. It keeps people emotionally dependent on the church, making them less likely to leave. It's like a soap opera plot device keep the audience hooked with a cycle of danger and rescue, sin and salvation so that they never miss an episode. The only difference is in church, you're both the guilty sinner and the audience.

46:36 Now we could get into do you think the church uses guilt and shame and sin as almost a tool to keep you or control you. I know people have made that accusation. I don't think there's any question that if you listen to sermons all the time, We've discussed it all the time. It's very much, a very much a moralistic message. Do this, don't do this, do this, don't do this. Bet some of you are doing this. Some of you are doing this. Some of you need to stop doing this. You need to do this more. You need to do this more, You need to do this more. Andevitably, whatever your failures are, whatever your weaknesses are, almost inevitably, I think this is almost true. You're almost always pointed to in some ways the church as the thing that will help you. You need to get plugged into a small group. You need to make sure you're showing up to church, and some of it. Maybe then outside of church, you need to be memorizing your Bible, you need to be studying your Bible. But they'll still kind of point you to the church as the thing that will help you do these things. So I don't think it's I don't think it's inaccurate to say the church thrives on moralistic messages where you are made to feel guilty, shame and condemned, and then in many ways you're pointed to going to church, more, praying, more, reading your Bible, more, doing more as the ultimate solution. Rarely are you pointed to the imputed righteousness of Christ. Rarely are you pointed to that. You're almost always pointed into four or five steps of things you need to do, and almost I think most of the time the church

48:08 is kind of connected to those things, if not explicitly connected to those things. So do you think the church, how do you think the church uses this cycle? Preach a sermon, this is what you should be doing. You're not doing it. You should be doing this. You're probably guilty of this. You're not doing this. You're not doing this. You're not doing this. You should be doing this. You should be doing this. Now here's a solution, And almost inevitably, it's it's about doing things. It's not your hope is the imputed righteousness of Christ. It's and you doing or stop doing things. I think that they're I don't know if I would frame it just the way he did, but I think there's a little bit of I think there's something to that. Number five. Most church growth is just people switching churches.

48:52 Churches love to brag about growth, but. Here's the truth. Most new members aren't actually new believers. I've been sounding this alarm for a little while now. They're just Christians moving from one church to another church. And most times they're not even good Christians. But pastors measure success by attendants. But what they don't tell you is that many churches actively recruit from other congregations rather than bringing in people who weren't already believers. They rely on reshuffling the same pool of Christians rather than converting new members. Churches with the best music, entertainment, and social programs tend to win the battle for members, but in reality, very few churches are actually growing the Christian faith. Most are just competing for the same market. They might as well hand out transfer forms at the door. You know, please tell me about your seven most recent churches number.

49:47 There's a lot of truth to that. There's a lot of truth to that, right, I mean, in most cases, people coming to your church are coming from the people who come to your church are coming from another church. And many cases they'll talk about how the previous church didn't do this and didn't do this and do this, and they're coming to your church. Now, what you should just be prepared for is all the things they're saying they're coming to your church for. Pretty soon they're gonna then be complaining about you and go to another church. But that's how it kind of works. And I've told the story before, right, And maybe my perception is not completely accurate, and maybe my perception is not completely fair. But I remember receiving a phone call that a new pastor was in town and he was calling all the pastors to go to lunch with them, right, And I was like, Oh, this is kind of cool. I've never met you know, maybe I could become friends with a pastor.

50:39 That would kind of be cool, because I always felt throughout my Christian life that I was always kind of excluded from other pastors, Right, I like, I just never really fit in in that world, right, And I'm like, okay, this could be we go out to lunch too, So so we went to lunch. He asked me all kinds of questions about my church, questions about my church, about the people, about the attendance, all these kinds of questions, right, And I remember when it was over, I'm like I kind of felt, kind of felt a little weird, and I'm like, well, you know, that's cool, and I think he said, you know, we'll get together again. I never heard from him again ever. They never called me back, never invited me to another meal, nothing, never heard from him again. But every single person who's left my church, guess where they went to that church. Maybe it's just a coincidence. I don't know. He came in, got all the info, and then every single person who left came to him, came to him. I'm like, I don't know.

51:46 Maybe it's a coincidence. Maybe not. I don't know. It just felt weird. Whether you like it or not, that's the way it works. This church is going great, everyone's building it up. It's great, and then for whatever reason, things start going a little south. People get disgruntled, people get disillusioned, and then they go to another church, and then that's the next big church. And then some churches can maintain that being the big kid on the block for a long time. But so much of it is just transfer. People go from here and they go to here, and they go to here, and why why do people go from this church to another church to another church? Because they go to church to get what they want.

52:26 They are self centered and they're going to go to church to get what they want. If they don't get what they want, they'll go somewhere else to get what they want, which then calls into question what church is even about in the first place. What you should pass around is like, hey, go ahead and put in the offering plate your five things that you're not happy with and the five things you want us to do, and we'll make sure we'll get right on it. Because this is burger king. We do it your way right away. We got to keep you happy. And every single time I've had those conversations where people call or complain or say, oh, I've got to you know, of course, if I get a call on a Monday, it's never oh I want to talk about the sermon. Nobody ever cares to talk. No, no, no no.

53:07 If you get the call, almost inevitably it's going to be a complaint, a problem. And so many times that I would say to people, so let me get this right. If I do what you want, what if the people across from the pew don't like it? They never have an answer. They'll be like, well, I'm not telling you what to do. Yeah, you're telling me what to do. That's why we're having this meeting. You don't like what I do, you want me to change it, but you don't care if the people across the pew may not like what you want, you don't care, because all he cares about your stinking self. I think the biggest secret about being a pastor of the people in the pew don't want to know is that the people in the pew can almost destroy your entire enjoyment of ministry. That's the reality of it. I think that's another good thing about just doing a podcast is oh, yeah, you'll get the emails, you'll get the comments on YouTube, whatever. Because again, in many cases, if your livelihood is not connected to it, then you were above it that you can rise above it.

54:09 You're you're not both pulled into it. But if your livelihood is connected to it, I mean, that's like a knife in the heart. That's like, oh, no, what's going to happen now, Oh, we're going to lose people. I'm getting ready to lose people. And almost inevitably, you know, after you have those meetings, you know they're gone. They may be here for another month, but they're gone two months, three months, you almost know the writing's on the wall and you're like, okay, whatever, just lost another family. That's great. Sometimes it happens so quick you don't even know what happened. You're like, I don't even know what happened. They're just not coming back. Sometimes they don't even bother to give you an explain. Sometimes they just not show up and they don't even bother to tell you anything. They just leave. In some ways great, but you know they don't even It can be crazy the way it works. So I mean there's a yeah, yeah, we can get into a lot of that that. When it comes to churches, it's just people going from one church to another church. And what you have to ask yourself is they always will frame it that they left that church because that church was bad. That church did this, and that church did that, and that church did this. There was a time I would be like I would eat that up, like, oh man, those churches are all messed up. Well, I'm glad you're here now. It's kind of like, oh, really they did all of that? Could you give me the I'm gonna look that up and see if I can find when did they preach that sermon and said that, When did they do that? You almost want to call the other church and go, hey, these people are saying some pretty

55:40 messed up stuff about you, because in many cases, I sometimes now question the legitimacy of what you're being told, because I know that once they leave my church, they're going to be telling the next church all the things I supposedly did wrong. So every pastor should just catch on whatever they tell you about why they left. You kind of want to just be like, maybe you should just go back and try to fix it, because I doubt I'm going to do any better. Right, It's almost like now I'm like, oh, that's all they did. Well, wait, you're coming here, I'm gonna do I'm going to do one hundred times worse than that. Now, when you're young, you're like, no, no, I'm I'm going to provide you a good place. But now you kind of realize, no, I actually you don't want to come here. I'm far worse than your last church. Your last pastor is one hundred times better than I am. He's more godly, he's more spiritual, he's more compassionate. Go back, go back, This is the wrong place, that's what you almost want to say.

56:38 Before worship. Music is designed to manipulate you. The emotional high people feel during worship isn't divine, it's a calculated technique. Churches use repetitive lyrics, rising melodies, and atmospheric lighting to create an altered state of mind, making attendees more emotionally. Receptive to the messaging. Now, this is a form of the designed to make you feel connected to God, when it's really just a psychological response to sound, rhythm, and community studies have shown that the same emotional responses occur at secular concerts and political rallies. It's not divine intervention, it's human psychology at work. And sure we called it the Holy Spirit. But if you swapped out the lyrics for R and B love songs, you'd see the same tears, same goosebumps. The difference no altar call out of Beyonce concert, contrary to popular Christian conspiracy.

57:31 Three, it's true, man, A lot of things in church are just straight manipulative. The way the sermons are done, that little sad illustration at the end right to get everyone crying to come to the altar. Singing certain songs a certain way at a certain time. You know when you do when you're going to do the altar call, then you you know, you play a certain hymn a certain way, or you may sing a cappella or you may do an instrument. Right. Yeah, the lighting, the staging, the way the pastors bring the message to our emotional dramatic climax. Okay, all everything, it's manipulative. It's one of the things I loathe about church camps. Let's take the kids, let's remove them from their you know, normal environment. We're gonna isolate them. We're gonna separate them, isolate them, and then in doctrinate them and manipulate them. And you'll get sometimes at church camp, all the teenagers they're hugging and crying, oh and yeah, and then they come home and then they get hit in the face with reality and look what happened. Well, you've been emotionally manipulated for a week. You were separated, you were isolated, you were indoctrinated, you were manipulated. That's what happened. That's called church camp. Well, churches could do the same thing isolated. That may not be the isolation, but it's still the manipulative techniques and we'll say, oh, I felt God, you felt the human structure of manipulation,

59:03 and you don't get it. And I've been into some of those churches with the lighting. You're like, what is this? What is this a church or a nightclub? What is this? All? Right? Go, let's finish this up. Your pastor has more power over you than you think. Many pastors go beyond spiritual guidance and seek to control your personal decisions, from who you vote for to who you love to how you parent. This isn't just advice. It's social pressure disguised as doctrine. Some churches even shun members who step out of line, using ostracization as a means of control. If you challenge the pastor's authority or question a doctrine, you may find yourself quietly pushed out or publicly shamed. It's not just faith, it's a power structure designed to maintain order and compliance. I once tried to post a very neutral comment on a controversial topic, and next thing I knew, I was hauled into several spiritual concern meetings with church leaders. They were more upset about my differing opinion than they would have been if I had robbed a bank that speaks volumes number two. Oh.

1:00:14 I could go into stories about being called into those meetings, as many pastors try to exhort a great amount of power over the people, a lot of control. I was called into those meetings constantly when I was an independent fundamental Baptist in Nebraska. Those meetings were crazy, the control. You can't do this, you can't do this, you can't do this, you can't do this, you can't do this. Why are you doing this? Why are you doing this? And it was. Control, control, control, control. When you then call out the controlling nature of it that it's almost like a cult, well then you're done, and then you're finished. And then while I can go through all the stories of everything that happened there, that thing fell apart, that ended in such a disaster, and what happened. I was not excommunicated.

1:01:00 I wasn't said that I committed some sin, but everyone was told to break fellowship with us and no longer to have anything to do with us. Even though I did not commit a specific sin. I was dangerous. I was, and so we had to leave that church, and everyone there was supposed to no longer have contact with us, and break off all contact. I mean, what an amazing, wonderful Christian experience that was. Even though I was warned by a man in the church that hey, the pastor is coming for you, and he's he said, he's going to squash you like a bug. He's coming to destroy you, and I'm warning you. And then when the pastor came and tried to destroy me and squashed me like a bug, and then I ended up, you know, basically leaving the church because everything blew up. That man who knew what was happening, knewing I was being set up, knew he went silent and didn't tell the rest of the church.

1:01:48 Oh wait, actually the pastor told me he was coming for Trevor. He no, no, no, no, no, no, no, left that all left that all blank. It didn't didn't bother to didn't bother to say a word. You gotta love that. You gotta love that protect it himself, didn't bother to stand up and protect me. I got called into those meetings, and some of those meetings are crazy, the way they go down. Two. Christianity survives because of indoctrination. Most believers didn't choose Christianity, they were born into it. Churches know that if kids aren't indoctrinated early, they're far less likely to adopt religious belief later in life.

1:02:29 This is why many churches. Are very glad to support other fantasy and fairy tale characters, because they know it all works together for their good. That's why youth ministries exist, not to teach kids how to think, but to go ahead and tell them what to think. From a young age. Children are conditioned to accept religious teachings as fact, discouraging critical thinking about their faith. Without this early reinforcement, Christianity would struggle to sustain itself. Some of my earliest memories are coloring pictures of out of the Bibles, such as Noah's Ark, but never quite allowed to ask, so wait, God drowned everybody else. That's kind of extreme, isn't it. It just gave me more crayons and told me to thank God for his mercy.

1:03:13 Isn't it beautiful? How they love to have us painting as children acts of well you know that, all right? And before we get to number one. And I would say, the church is great even for adults, teaching them want to think, not how to think, because if you start thinking, and you start questioning, and you start challenging, Christianity will push you out so fast. You're not supposed to do that, right, You'll listen to a sermon. I was listening to a sermon this morning. In fact, I'm gonna probably do a podcast about it. Where they were like, we are free from the power of sin.

1:03:56 You've been set free from the power of sin. The power of sin's been broken in your life. You're set free. And I wanted I was trying to raise my hand, of course, and I'm listening to it online. I wanted to raise my hand. Who wha wa, Wait a minute. If I'm free from the power of sin, then i can be perfect, right, Because if I'm free from the power, if something is holding me back from perfection, then I'm not free. So am I free? Or am I not free? I cannot be perfect. I can't be holy as God is holy. So there's got to be a reason I can't be whatever's the thing keeping me back. You can't tell me I'm free from the very thing keeping me from being perfect. So clearly I'm not free from the power of sin unless you're talking about the power of sin from a positional perspective. So you're not able to challenge that. When pastors say, oh, if anyone's in crisis, a new creature. Old things passed away, all things have become new. You can like, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. If that's true, then there should be no sin. So maybe that's true. Positionally, you're not supposed to challenge that the story of Noah Noah in the Ark, I mean, come on, Noah's Ark, I mean, come on that. You talk about a story we want to in church? We painted at Oh look there's mister and missus know us standing on the deck of the boat with a giraffe behind him, smiling with a rainbow over it, and every oh, it's beautiful.

1:05:06 We don't show all the dead bodies floating in the water. Hey, you know Abraham and Sarah. What a story? Well how about Hagar? What? What? What went down there? I don't know if that was like there's some very messed up things. But we're not supposed to talk about that. We're not supposed to challenge that. Churches teach people what to think, they don't teach them how to think. Because if they taught them how to think, problems would begin to emerge. You begin to question things. You begin to question this, and you begin to question that, and you're like, well, I don't know if that makes any sense. Shhh, we don't think here, We just accept Here.

1:05:54 If you like what I do and want to show you support, click the light button, subscribe to the channel, hit the alert note of cation bell, and if you can, please share this to your social media. That's how we can continue to make a difference. Now on with number one on our list. The church needs you more than you need it. Without your money, attendance, and loyalty, the church ceases to exist. It tells you that you need it for morality, purpose and salvation. The truth is the church is dependent on you, not the other way around. And once you realize that, you're free. At the end of the day, church isn't about truth. It's about control. Pastors won't admit that because their entire livelihood depends on people staying in the system. But you don't have to.

1:06:39 You can think for yourself. You can walk away, and when you do, you'll realize you never needed the church to begin with. The minute you say, actually, I'm good without Sunday morning guilt trips and enforced tithes is the minute you discover a whole world of authenticity, autonomy, and agency. There you have it. Those are the ten secrets. Now you can agree or disagree. Do you agree that the church needs you more than you need the church? Well? Now again, if you're in a sacramental system, you desperately need the church. You desperately need the church. Right, But if you're not in a sacramental system, do you need the church or does the church need you? Well, considering an every time I've asked this question, go back and look at your Christian life. What was the source of most of your spiritual growth? Where you learn the most, You've been taught the most. Almost every single case, people don't point to their local church. Now they may point to another church, so then okay, but they're not even members of that church. In many cases, they're not even supporting that church financially. So in many cases, the churches people go to, they give their attendance, they give their loyalty, and they give their money. That's not the place they're even getting spiritually fed. The places that spiritually fed them.

1:07:59 They don't get anything from the people. So then does that church? So how does that even work? So the church needs you because you show up, they need of tendance, and you give your money too, and you give your loyalty to and you volunteer for and you help with. Well, then that great. They get all of your attention, they get all of your money, they get all of your loyalty because they need you. But obviously you don't need it because you're getting all of your spiritual food, nourishment, teaching, discipleship elsewhere. And that interesting. Now I can get frustrated by that because in many cases you provide hour after hour after hour after hour after hour after hour after hour after hour after hour, hour hour aft hour of teaching and you're like, oh, okay, great, I'm providing it. But those those institutions get all the support. That sometimes can be a little like how does that supposed to actually work?

1:08:54 I don't have any good answers there, but what it may demonstrate I think whats the point is how much do you need it? How much do they need you? Because I mean, let's just be honest. In twenty twenty five, come on, let's just be honest. Not nobody wants me to say this, but let's be honest. You could stop going to your church at this very moment, you can make a decision. You're never going back to your church. You know what. You would still have access to a lifetime of sermons, devotionals, Bible study, philologicals. You would not lose one thing other than maybe the social aspects of it. Now, you may need it for the social aspect, so maybe you do need the church more than it needs you if you need the social aspect. But if it's for doctrine, theology, teaching, Bible study, give me a break. First of all, the church is probably not even providing you that much, so you don't need them they need you. Do you realize all the stuff you have available to you on the palm of your hand. I mean again, just take the sermon's two point Oh app now those are churches, yes, so then you would need those churches. You don't need your church. Then it becomes all kind of convoluted and mixed up, right, Well, those are the ten secrets pastors don't want you to know. Again the name of the video.

1:10:24 It's on YouTube. Ten secrets pastors don't want you to know about church? All right, and yeah, you should look it up and then you can see. I'm not saying I agree with everything he has. I'm not he Definitely he's selling some merch. I can tell you that selling a hoodie for forty nine dollars in one sense trust issues. Then he has a think Responsibly a T shirt for twenty dollars, and a think responsibly or responsibly not responsibly responsibly and blue for nineteen ninety nine. So I didn't look at all of their So he's created his own marketplace. He's got a book. He's got a book out let.

1:11:07 Stee here if I can get to it. He's got a book he out Yeah, it's called The Black non Believer next Door, An Ex Pastor's Journey, Volume one, All right, what does it mean to question the very beliefs that shaped your identity? Black non Believers next Door dives into the deeply personal story of a black man's journey from the heart of faith to a life defined by self discovery, honesty, and the courage to live authentically. Right. So it's his story of going from pastor to an ex pastor. Obviously, it sounds like he may have just completely walked away from Christianity. Possibly he may now have just completely denied Christianity. So obviously his time in church did not go very well. Now what most Christians will do will just discount it so well, he was never a believer in the first place, so who cares next, let's move on. But sometimes listening to someone who's been in it, and you can some of those criticisms I think are legitimate criticisms. All right, there you have it.

1:12:12 Those are the ten Secrets. You can look up the book. You may want to read it. You can get it for it's eleven ninety nine for the kindle in nineteen ninety nine and paperback. It's kind of expensive considering the books is only one hundred and eighteen pages, but still maybe interesting to pursue. And again you can look up. You can look up the video on YouTube. Ten secrets pastors don't want you to know about church. He's got other videos here as well. I'm not going to see here and look through all of his library, but you can look and see if he offers any other criticisms. It's always I always find it interesting to hear an ex pastor's perspective because in many cases their criticisms are based here's what we have to do. We may not agree with say they're deny I love Christianity, or they're walking away from Christianity. I can understand why we would not agree with that, but that doesn't mean we don't listen to the essence of the criticism, because there may be something in that criticism that we do need to face ourselves and go, well, you know, there's a little bit of truth there, not saying it should lead us to his ultimate conclusion. But I mean, come on, I do believe the church needs to start teaching people how to think, not just what to think, because critical thinking is clearly lacking, and we hear that sometimes in sermons where you're just like, what is happening here? This is a mess? What is going on here? So all right, I'll stop there. I didn't think I made it through all ten. I'm glad I did instead of breaking it

1:13:44 up into multiple parts. Thank you for listening. Everyone, have a great day. Now go think God bless