Starbucks Goes Small, Target Goes Bravo & Walmart's Marketplace Goes International | Fast Five

Hello and welcome to this week's Omnitalk Retail Fast 5.

I'm in my second of three weeks of Walton's European Retail conference tour, coming to you live from Amsterdam.

After having just finished up a full day at the DIY summit in Amsterdam itself.

I had planned on making this my first ever solo Fast five podcast as an experiment after the encouragement of producer Ella.

But beyond just being road weary from being in Europe for two weeks, I also came down with a nasty case of food poisoning over the weekend.

And so I just had to phone a friend to get an emergency fill in host.

And so I thought to myself, who in their right mind, in their right mind would be able to join me in Europe on my schedule with just 24 hours notice to help me out?

And then it hit me.

Ben Miller, my British mother, from my British brother, I should say from another mother, could literally help a brother out.

He came to the rescue for me, everybody, and I could not be more thankful for him.

And boy, did the two of us have a blast recording today's episode.

So I hope you enjoy it.

Thanks again to Ben for filling in in a much needed pinch.

All right, Ella, let's get to this week's teaser.

Not only are we finishing the big show, it was my last shop tour.

There is no clearer sign of a company needing a new chief marketing office.

I am, I'm in pure X Files mode.

If entertainment and shopping keep merging, are retailers eventually competing less with each other and more with Netflix, TikTok and creators for attention.

DoorDash.

It's my most used retail app.

More than Amazon, more than Walmart.

I, I don't love it.

And I'll tell you, you're gonna pee in my pool.

Ben Miller.

Okay, go ahead.

Ben Miller.

Fresh off Shop top Barcelona.

Shopdock Europe in Barcelona.

I'm curious, Ben, what does, what does the post conference recovery plan look like for you?

How long does it take to get back to normal when you put on a big, big ass show like that?

Hey Chris.

And look, thanks for inviting me on.

It's, you know, my recovery has been pretty different this time because not only are we finishing the big show, it was my last Shop Talk.

Yeah, right.

Yeah.

So after four years, after 16 shows, it was the time for me to kind of hang up and go do something.

So yesterday was actually my last day at Shop Talk.

Yesterday was your last day?

Yesterday was my last day.

I was in the office, I was with the guys.

I got a lovely send off.

It's super kind, Intuberti style.

We just Went to the pub.

Of course we did and that was great.

So my plans for today was literally to sit on the sofa all day and watch the World Cup.

But here I am talking to you, Chris, and I couldn't be happier.

Yeah, I said at the outset in the teaser, like, you're doing me a massive solid because I had a horrible case of the stomach flu and I needed help to do this week's episode.

I was going to do it solo, I was going to try and experiment, but you're here to help me out, so thank you so much, Ben.

But, but I'm curious too, like what do you got planned?

What's next for you?

Yeah, so I'm starting as of today as an independent retail analyst.

Okay.

Yeah, I'm probably going to do a bit more on grocery, which is my home, which is where I originally come from.

But it's been, look, it's been genuinely an honor and a privilege to have been kind of the retail insight guy within one of the top 10 global events businesses in the world, and in my eyes the leading brand for retail technology events.

So that's been an absolute blast.

But I just want to spend a little bit more time closer to the industry.

You know, things are moving so quick and these shows, you know, as, as you mentioned about recovery, we do five shows a year and it's a bit of a peak and trough.

So I'm looking forward to be closer to the industry 24 7.

And yeah, I've got some exciting projects that I'm working on but actually my, my eldest daughter has literally finished a radical.

So big shout out to all your parents out there who've got kids doing at the school exams, wherever they are at the moment.

So she's finished.

We're going to take a little bit of time relaxing and then going to probably start something new and exciting after the summer.

Yeah.

Wow.

And the A levels are a big deal in the uk, are they not?

Yeah, they are the go or no go for university, for college.

So it's big and everything depends on the grade.

So we've got, we've got until the middle of August now to wait to know what she does in September.

It's a wacky, a wacky system in the uk.

But it's done now.

She's finished.

She had her last exam yesterday so we both walked away together and now we can spend a bit, a little bit of time relaxing as a family.

Oh, that's awesome.

That's awesome.

So you mentioned the World Cup.

Do you have any games that you're particularly spying on today's docket.

Ben.

Oh, my God.

Chris.

England starts today.

England plays today.

What time is England on?

So 09:00'.

Clock.

UK 10:00'.

Clock, Amsterdam playing Croatia.

Having watched some pretty fantastic football over the last six or so days, I'm expecting this to be pretty dire.

We will probably scrape a nil.

Nil or a 1 nil.

And you know that that would be good.

So, so, typical British optimism.

That's how you're feeling about this?

This year's World Cup?

Better.

At least the first match.

Typical British optimism.

Oh, I think you talk to any Brit and they will simultaneously tell you two things.

One, that we are going to lose the next game and two, we're also going to win the World Cup.

The two things simultaneously happen with every English fan at the same time.

Yes, there's always that British dichotomy at play.

Whenever you talk about the World cup, we are awful.

But it is also coming home, which is, wow.

Well, I didn't realize that I've been so out of it that I'm like been.

I have.

I'm not clued into what's going on in the real world outside of what's happening in the home improvement industry in Amsterdam right this second, right outside the door of my hotel.

But yeah, man, 9 o', clock, that's like two hours from when we're recording this.

So we got to get this done, we got to get you off to that and potentially even back into the pub and having a pint and watching that with your friends and family.

So I have a very ill fitting Umbra Replica jersey to put on.

So, you know, there's things to do.

Chris.

Ill fitting Umbra replica jerseys.

All right, on that note, let's get to this week's Fast 5, which is of course brought to you with the help and support of the A and M consumer and retail group, Miracle Corso, Ocampo Capital and Valak.

In this week's Fast5, we've got news on Target sponsoring a new shoppable Bravo digital series, Walmart expanding Walmart.com to shoppers in Mexico, Dollar General introducing a new subscription program and DoorDash launching a new AI based search feature.

But we begin today with Starbucks claiming it could open up another 5,000 to 10,000 stores in the United States.

Headline number one is of course brought to you all with the help and support of the A and M Consumer and Retail Group.

The A and M Consumer and Retail Group is a management consulting firm that tackles the most complex challenges and advances its clients, people and communities toward their maximum potential.

CRJ brings the experienced tools and operator like pragmatism to help retailers and consumer products companies be on the right side of disruption.

All right Ben, here we go.

According to the nation's restaurant News, the NRN Starbucks believes it can, quote, get bigger by getting smaller.

Specifically, the coffee shop giant wants 5,000 more locations in the US and believes that it knows the markets where it can open those units.

But the locations it plans to open will be smaller than those it has historically opened.

At the company's investor day presentation earlier this year, Starbucks showed off one potential smaller location at about 1350 square feet which is smaller than the typical 2500 square footprint.

These shops would still have drive thrus delivery in store and mobile ordering and they would still also have seats, but they would be cheaper to build requiring half the acreage.

Brian Nicol during the presentation also did not stop at just 5,000 locations.

Quote, there's probably another 5,000 sites that we can add on top of the 5,000 that we've already identified.

And that's how you get to 10,000 additional stores in the U.S. end quote.

Ben, is Brian Nichols 5,000 plus small store strategy counter or congruent with his plans to try and re enliven the in store Starbucks experience?

It's a great question and I'm really glad we're starting here as this story.

So you know, actually to answer your question, what did I do on my first day post shop talk?

I went back and I watched the entire video of the Starbucks investor day earlier this year because I wanted to really get under the skin of this for two things.

I wanted to get a feel for the future cafe plans but I also wanted to get a feel for where they were on this idea of the third place to see if there is a right, a contradiction there.

And you know, I think we've, we've all heard Brian Nicholl talk about this in his last 18 months in charge of the company.

But this whole idea of rebuilding the third place is absolutely core to the back to Starbucks plan.

Now I was seeing, are they moving away from this?

Is there any.

No, they're talking about putting more seating in.

They talk about how the stores that they have put their better, more friendly concept they call the uplift program doing better comms.

They talk about community gathering points.

They talk about the cafe at the heart of the business.

So that's really clear when they talk about stores.

And I know it's, it's a topic that you and I have talked about, you've covered in the pod.

They are absolutely clear that their stores need to be able to deliver on what they say are their four access points.

Right.

Okay.

So their access points are the cafe.

So sit down.

This third place, it's drive through, it's mobile order and it's delivery.

You know delivery which is already a billion dollar business for them.

And they're very clear that the units must, unless it's in an incredibly high density urban environment where you can't do drive through, the units must be able to do all four.

So they're very, they're very glued to that as well.

So then they talk about 5,000 new stores with an opportunity of 10,000.

So I guess there's two things.

There's one is the wear and one is then what does a unit look like?

So for the where they're saying they're basically they're underrepresented in the middle of the country.

So they talk about the south central US and some bits of the northeast which they call that as well, which I thought was interesting.

That gets them to 5,000.

The next 5,000 locations they say is unlocking afternoon.

So they, they significantly under index sales in the afternoon.

If they can get a proposition that fits there, they can make more places hit the economics and that's how you get 5 to 10,000.

Their plan for next fiscal year, fiscal year 28 is 400 net new stores.

So this.

So there's a bit of a contradiction.

They're talking about 400 next year, but then we can see 10,000.

So.

Right.

So they're not.

It's reality now versus versus concept later.

And, and this is where it comes.

They have developed a smaller format, half the size, lower capex, less space required.

So smaller sites, smaller land.

But we haven't seen it yet.

We don't really know what it's like.

So when you add it all together there's a bit of alchemy and it's the alchemy that we haven't seen is how do you do all of those one things?

So look, I think on the Starbucks recovery turnaround right now I'm in pure X Files mode.

I am Agent Boulder.

Chris.

Chris.

I want to believe but they've got to give me more to know what they're actually doing.

So okay, so if I play that back, the, the, the, the X Files analogy is great.

But you're saying they're, we're, we're stuck a little bit in the hype cycle here.

Potentially that's one Thing I'm hearing with you, but then net net.

Do you think it's possible to have a third place experience in a 1500 square foot Starbucks store or Starbucks Cafe?

Is that, can you even conceptualize that?

In my head because I'm having difficulty,.

Yeah, I can conceptualize it because the units that we have in Europe are often smaller than US units.

So if I think of the Starbucks on my high street, it's 1500-2000 square feet.

So I can see how that can work as a third place.

It doesn't have drive thru, but Drive thru is more a site play than it is a unit play.

And obviously the level of mobile ordering and delivery is a lot less.

But they are investing in machinery.

They've got new machines that will double the speed at which espresso based drinks are made.

Look, my biggest challenge to the whole thing, and I think you and I have talked about this before, is the range rationalization is the merchants thinking is going to be required to get a range that they can put through in that space because if they continue to proliferate, then that's the time it takes and that's the more workspace required and the more ingredients.

And that's the bit I'm concerned about.

Now there is talk in the analyst presentation about being more disciplined in innovation.

I think that's probably the bit I'm yet to see in store, but I'm excited to, to hopefully see.

Obviously the other big they need to do is get their price inflation under control and that that's one thing they're not talking about yet.

Right, right.

And feels like every retailer's got that issue too to some degree.

You know, the way I, I thought the.

I, I really wanted to ask you that question to start because I think, you know, I think on the surface the idea sounds incongruent with the idea that you're going to invest in the third place because generally speaking, especially in the US a typical footprint is bigger, it's got the atmosphere, et cetera.

But as I step back from it, I think that's okay because both things can be true.

The existing store base can need a refresh and also, I might add, a jolt of employee support and inspiration, which is also a key piece of the Back to Starbucks plan that Nichols laid out.

And then the second thing is longer term, Starbucks also potentially does need a new format to spread out operational demand as well as tap into new markets.

Because the demand, especially with mobile order and drive thru, is just getting too high at many of these locations.

But with that said, Ben, and I'm gonna let everyone in on a little inside baseball here.

The thing that really frustrates me though is when he made, when he was touting the.

Or I don't know if it was him or somebody else in their, in one of their reports, the amount of delivery that they're doing.

And I wrote an article for Forbes saying, well, that's a testament to the fact that, you know, maybe you don't need that third place experience for the average Starbucks, for the average Starbucks customers.

Maybe it's not that important when you see delivery growing the way that it is.

And I immediately got a call from their comms team and I spent an hour, you know, on the phone with them debating.

Basically my point was like, okay, you can say you're always going to put chairs and seating in your cafes, but can't you just at least tell me you're leaving the option open to go down that road?

And so this tells me that you probably still are hedging that way, especially Ben, if you, as someone that follows this industry as closely as you do, is also saying this sounds like a little bit of hype.

You don't know what to believe.

And it's kind of X File ish as well.

So I don't know.

That's, that's the one.

Just misgiving I have about this is like it doesn't, it doesn't feel like everything is being as transparent as it could be.

But you know, time will tell.

But do I think it's a bad strategy?

I don't think I do.

I think it's smart.

But there are inconsistencies in the logic that are worth pointing out, which is why, why, why we started Omni Talk to begin with was to call things out when things just aren't making sense and aren't lining up.

But Ben, what do you think?

Yeah, and I think that's where it's incredibly exciting.

You can see the logic.

Yeah, you can see the numbers.

Look, all credit to Brian and the team.

The comps are at plus 4% having been at, yeah.

High single digit negatives before they join.

So yeah, the team are in, the team are improving, the install standards are getting better and maybe they have, as a team seen something to be able to drive some efficiencies out the back office and the way that they were.

They've got, look, they've got an almost new executive team, they've got a new coo, they've got a new cmo.

So maybe they've seen something and then hopefully they'll invite the analyst community, we'll get to see these smaller stores and then you can see how they've pulled it off.

It's just the unknown makes you curious at the moment.

Yeah.

And to your point, with all those mobile orders coming in and drive through orders coming in, maybe you don't, don't need as much seating space in the store too, you know, and you can still have a vision that still, that's still complements the third place idea.

Yeah, that's a great point.

Yeah.

Okay, Chris, let's move on.

Let's move on to headline number two.

And this headline is brought to you by Miracle, the catalyst of commerce.

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All right, Chris, headline number two.

Target is to sponsor a first of a kind shoppable Bravo digital series.

Okay.

According to Chainsaw Age, Target will be the exclusive retail sponsor of a digital series inspired by the format of Bravo's popular show.

Watch what Happens live with Andy Cohen.

The series, titled Shop what Happens is a weekly summer theme series that brings together some of Bravo's best known figures for conversations, games and cultural commentary spanning fashion, entertainment, beauty, travel, swim and seasonal trends.

QR codes will enable seamless shopping directly from Peacock on living room devices, while Text to shop and Click to Shop functionality will allow fans to instantly shop the featured Target items they see across the PeaceRock mobile app, YouTube, tick tock and Instagram.

So, Chris, this is also the A M. Put you on the spot question.

It's one for you this week.

And here it is.

Okay, if entertainment and shopping keep merging, are retailers eventually competing less with each other and more with Netflix, Tick Tock and creators for attention?

And what's the future scenario?

That sounded ridiculous yesterday.

Like that probably did.

That could feel plausible tomorrow.

Why, why do I always.

First of all, why do I always get these questions the least opportune time for me?

I'm like 36 hours after a stomach bug and I got to answer this question.

Oh my God.

All right.

But I do love the question because it's prediction.

It's basically asked me to put my prediction hat on, which I absolutely love.

That's always a fun thing to do.

And I'm guessing, Ben, that on this new, this new show, this new Bravo series, there won't be a lot of replica tight fitting English jerseys that are being showcased on said program.

At least, at least, let's hope not for the sake of fashion.

But, but, but before I get the headline, the other thing I do have to say is I think between this headline and we can go into this too if you know, depending on where the discussion takes us but between this headline, because I don't think this headline is that cool.

I think it's kind of like okay, yeah, not surprised you're doing this.

The first of its kind is a little bit itchy in some ways and the fact that they just, the Target just went back to the Isaac Mizrahi well tells me that there is no clearer sign of a company needing a new chief marketing officer.

Not even a new one needing to, to place one.

They haven't had one for a considerable amount of time than, than Target.

Like they're desperately in need of that.

Because I just, I can't get my head around, you know, promoting this move and then also, you know, the going back to the retread that was, you know, that last popular back in 2005.

But with that said, I just had to get that off my chest.

Ben, I think, you know, I, I think, I think this, this, this is, I don't see this idea in terms of what A M is talking about.

I don't see when I step back from everything, I don't see what's going on here at an industry wide level as revolutionary.

I see it all as just a new form of television and where we as consumers get advertising.

Retailers, retailers have always competed for attention.

That's not new and that's kind of stated in the A and M put you on the spot question.

So but like it's not new and is the competition any greater than it was in the days of cbs, abc, NBC, even the BBC where you're from?

Ben, I doubt it.

And it's probably even less competitive if you think about it.

So where the money is going to be made is in who can control or who can acquire both.

Both the distribution and the product.

So we already know Amazon has this right.

Amazon has a leg up.

Walmart bought Vizio.

Why Target, just to go back to this, since Target's the headline, why they didn't ever lever up and buy TikTok or even make a play for TikTok publicly is beyond me.

Just even get some cache for the brand.

But you know, to me, if I had to step back and think about what's out there that I'm not seeing around the Corner, I think YouTube, YouTube seems like the platform with all the AI enhancements that Google's putting towards things with additional partnerships that could come into play to unlock something new and interesting.

Like my brain got thinking about this like you know, or is getting thinking about this like, you know, is there an exclusive distribution partner for YouTube, you know, so you can have the confidence in getting the products you want on time with the return policies that you want.

I mean those are the ideas that I think haven't been explored yet.

Where commerce and you know, media attention capture start coming together.

That's the best way I can answer this question at this point in time.

But what do you think?

I'm curious.

Where does your head go in answering the A and M put you on the spot question this week, Ben?

Yeah, I love the fact we're talking about it this week because it feels a bit like a primer ahead of can and the Festival of Creativity next week.

So you know our news feeds, our in our LinkedIn is going to be full of announcements from Cat and and I think that's becoming increasingly the place where advertisers and creatives meet.

Just today I was reading that Albertons Media creative have been working with P and G to, to look at kind of shortfall entertainment that is then.

I mean it doesn't sound hugely different to Walmart's Add to Heart and you know that died a pretty quick death so but they're going to bring that into the in store environment and they're working with a brand so I think, I think we're going to look, we're going to see a whole stream of these sorts of news over the next 7, 10, 14 days and they're really hard to judge creatives if you haven't actually seen the output because trying to describe a creative idea on paper you don't quite know.

I think the difference here is for this, this new initiative from Target you can see what it is.

The first, the first episode is live.

So I watched that as well this afternoon.

So the first realization I really quickly came to was I am not its target market.

Chris.

Right.

Without a doubt.

No it really wasn't the Starbucks analyst presentation.

I can assure you of that.

I wanted to be intrigued and to like it.

It was, it was sort of like the ghost of QVC meets reality tv.

It wasn't great but then I'm not the shopper.

It was celebrity content with a few and would you like to buy this fitted in so it didn't have the, the shop the look of something like, you know, like to know it which is really established.

You can, you can buy from your favorite creators or influencers there.

It was much more promoting the Bravo celebrities and their series is with a few products thrown in.

So, you know, look, I didn't love it as a piece of creative and I think it's is much more.

Takes me back to the conversation where you started on Target.

And I think for me, when I look at Target, I look at three things that I think they should be working on.

Number one is the install standards, the supply chain to drive the availability and the team being motivated behind it.

And that's the first one to give Fidelki and the team some credit.

We've seen improvements on that over the last six months and the latest results show, you know, a ways to go.

But, but we've seen some stuff.

The second bit, and as you just talk towards that is, is the merchants, is the merchandising, is these exciting products that you want coming in.

And I think there's some ways to go on that.

And then the third is brand and storytelling.

Right.

And this is where if you look at what Richard Dixon has done with Gap, got the excitement back into that brand through fantastic creative, through, through great use of media and entertainment and through telling stories.

And when Target at its best, it does the same.

And this activation is not that.

And I would much rather see them investing in building that cachet for the brand again.

Yeah, it's really great to hear you say that.

And I'm kind of fortuitous that I luckily had you on the show this week too, because, like, you know, it's interesting to hear someone aligned with, you know, the thinking around Target, particularly on the branding side, because, yeah, when I listen to you describe the experience to me with the merchant hat, that sounds, that sounds to me just like when we would try to pitch getting my beach towels on Oprah's Favorite things back in 2007.

It's a really hard way to make money consistently over time because people will get bored of being pitched to with that type of, with that type of theater, as you described it to me, Ben.

And so that's why I think, like, you've got to work harder like you could.

And this isn't cheap.

I gotta think doing a program like this is not cheap.

You're probably better off giving more incentives to the average influencer to just come into your store and promote your products.

But that starts with having great products on your shelves that you want to promote and then making it easier for people to buy them at the end of the day through a very seamless inspiration.

Discover process to buy process too, which is also something Target, you know, needs to work on.

So, so, yeah, so I think that's, I, I 100% agree with you and I thought you articulated that one really well.

Thank you.

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All right, headline number three.

Headline number three.

Walmart expands Walmart.com access to shoppers in Mexico.

According to the Retail Insight Network, the rollout enables customers in Mexico to buy goods across various categories, including clothing, home goods and electronics, directly through Walmart.com orders placed will be processed through Walmart's existing fulfillment network in the US with international carriers handling shipping and customs clearance.

The company said that estimated duties, taxes and fees will be worked out and shown at checkout so customers can see the full cost before finalizing their purchases.

Walmart also indicated that it intends to roll out international shipping to other markets as well going forward.

Oh, yes.

Scale of 1 to 10, how much do you like the expansion of Walmart.com into Mexico?

Yeah, so it's a, it's a straight 10 for.

Is it the principle and the direction.

But I.

For the boldness.

For the boldness, yep.

But there's also, there's.

The execution is about a six at the moment.

So let me explain for why there's really clear momentum in cross border marketplaces at the moment.

It was one of the really interesting themes that we covered at Shop Talk Europe.

We had Kaufland, part of the Svart Group, that's Europe's biggest retailer, announcing they're expanding their marketplace across Europe at the show.

Walmart were there and I'll come back to what they were doing at the European show and you see they were talking about how the latest generation of tools and how AI is helping to remove some of the historic barriers for cross border, whether that's translations or dealing with the tariffs.

So it's a big dream for Walmart.

You've talked about this on the show.

I've heard you talk about it before.

The marketplace is such an important part of Walmart's flywheel of growth at the moment.

And by going to Mexico.

Mexico's a country of 130 million people.

Fantastic.

Where they already have incredible Brand presence, incredible reputation.

So amazing.

Yeah way to go to drive that, drive that flywheel the bit that and I think this is really important, this is really important for everyone to pay attention to.

They're driving that expansion by the Walmart.com marketplace than the US marketplace pushing that in Mexico.

Walmart they make it already has a marketplace but they're saying actually we want to take the.com marketplace.

So it is that global marketplace idea which Amazon already has and the Walmart press release just has this line at the end.

It's slightly sinister if you're a competitor expands the plans to expand to a digital market in the future.

I mean that the gauntlet fairly laid down.

Yeah.

So that's the 10 I actually spent some time with the Walmart Marketplace team last week in Barcelona.

You know they're expanding in Europe and it's a sourcing hub, you know so they're opening opportunities but this is something that vendors really need to clearly pay attention to.

You know you might have a 1p relationship already with Mexico and now there's this 3p relationship to the marketplace.

So which one might bit of Walmart you're dealing with?

So vendors need to think really carefully about that.

And for consumers the import bit will add significant costs, right?

Yeah.

Depending on your category import from the US into Mexico is anywhere from 0 to 35%.

That's dangerous for consumers to see these extra charges added on.

It's dangerous for Walmart and their price leadership proposition to suddenly hit it be.

So they've got to be, they've got to be really mindful of that.

I don't love the cx Chris.

The fact that you've got a Mexican website for Walmart and then you've got to go on.com it's that's difficult, that's not seamless.

And then when it comes to seamless I the bit that is always difficult with cross border and market places is returns especially if they're not going through the main Mexican business and and Walmart I've not seen them talk about that.

So there's some friction and that friction is hard my friend when you're up against Ricardo Libre who are really good at what they do.

So they are the dominant marketplace in Mexico.

They've got the logistics, they've got the network, they've got the returns, they've got the price point.

So look, I get it, there'll be work to do to make it a success.

Can Walmart got it in them to make it a success?

Yes, but it's Not a home run from day one in my eyes.

Yeah, there, there are operational issues that you have, you have to think through and you have to solve.

And I agree that the dissonance with the two websites is probably the thing that drives me the crazy the most.

The part about the price transparency and the impact on price perception.

I can even remember back to my days when Target was experimenting with international expansion.

And like, I was never a big, that was never a big concern of mine.

I think if you're transparent at checkout and in terms of where, and maybe that's also why you have a separate website because then it kind of filters out that noise too.

Now that I'm saying this out loud, I think it's pretty obvious when you say like, you know, duty, I'm making this up.

But duty charges, you know, a hundred dollars.

Like, you know, that's pretty, you know, that can be shown pretty clearly and you could make that even more big and pronounced than you would in your typical, you know, checkout experience if you wanted to.

So like, unless let's give credit to Walmart on that point.

Correct, because they are, they are calculating the exact duty and import charges and displaying them.

Right.

The standard model is that you'd almost pay a sort of a retainer, a deposit that then gets actually worked out when the calculations are done.

But Walmart have been able to build the tech to do it in the moment on the website.

So that's a do cap to that one.

Right.

And so when you think about a marketplace transaction in particular like Walmart, you're not holding the inventory.

You, your price, your reg price is going to be consistent with your low price promise and then the consumer's just going to understand in theory that, you know, there are these charges added on top and it's going to be shipped from a marketplace vendor.

So it's on the customer ultimately if they want to buy it or not.

And Walmart doesn't lose anything.

So for me, I think it's a 10 out of 10 too.

I'm a little less concerned about the operational dynamics, I think, than you are, Ben.

And I think it goes back to something actually.

I shared last week on social media, which was, you know, my biggest takeaway from Shop Talk Europe in the interview I had with Peter Wood of All Saints is he said the job of the CFO is to ask what you kind of just said, which is to ask what can go wrong.

Right.

And how do we ameliorate what can go wrong?

But the job of the CEO is to ask what can go right.

And that is what I think Walmart has done a tremendous job doing, or that's the mindset they've had.

They've done a tremendous job of keeping over the past eight, eight to 10 years or so is saying what can go right and let's try to go after it until someone proves that we can't because the opportunity is substantial.

You talked about the size of the Mexican market.

You talk about a global marketplace and what that affords, particularly in the way of retail media too.

They're also just the week before rolling out Walmart plus to Canada.

Why?

Because these are software solutions.

Ultimately at the end of the day and the margin on a software on software is much higher than the margins that they're going to get from selling more products.

So like it's just a smart move that scales so easily if you can get knock all the pins out of the way that are potentially keeping you from doing it.

But that's what I love about Walmart's leadership and I hope they continue to do that.

And I think more retailers would be smart to take a page out of Peter Wood's book in Walmart's book too,.

Which beautifully brings us on to headline number four, Chris, because I'm so interested if you think this is something that's going to go right or going to go wrong.

So headline number four though is brought to you by Ocampo Capital.

Ocampo Capital is a venture capital firm founded by retail executives with the aim of helping early stage consumer businesses succeed through investment and operational support.

So learn more@ocampo capital.com.

So headline number four, Chris.

Dollar General plans to introduce a new pilot subscription program.

So according to Google, by way of various sources, and while specific pricing and exact rollout dates have not been finalized, Dollar General Membership is expected to offer exclusive discounts, special deals and added convenience for frequent shoppers.

The news comes after CEO Todd Vasos recently told analysts that the company was seeing a major shift in the type of shoppers frequenting its stores.

This is a quote we are seeing customer penetration growth across low, middle and high income segments as customers across all income cohorts seek value at increasing rates.

Notably, he went on across his cohorts, the largest increase in customer count came from the highest income segments, those who earn more than US$100,000 annually.

So Chris, super interested to hear your thoughts on this one.

Do US consumers need another Walmart plus like subscription program and do they need it from Dollar General?

Oh wow.

I think wholeheartedly yes, I Think this is a great move by Dollar General.

I'm all for this, especially, especially when you're just talking about a pilot stage.

Right.

And I think it'll end up rolling out too.

I really do, Ben, and it's for all the reasons I said before.

It's basically like it's a no risk pilot idea.

Like if you get people to pay for it, great.

If you don't, you shut it down.

Or even if you get a few people that pay for it, it doesn't really cost you that much to run it once you have the program established and in place.

So it's great profit if it works.

And here's the other point I'd make and I think this is really important, like Dollar General has an advantage in its locations and where they are that it should be able to command additional value for those locations.

It's the retailer, when you stop and think about that is closest to the entire US of anybody, including Walmart, including Amazon.

It has 20,000 locations, particularly in the rural areas, the rural communities where Amazon particularly is not, as you know, is not able to reach as easily.

So yes, I mean, Dollar General, if anyone should have a subscription program, because they should be able to command that additional value for the service they could provide with same day delivery even faster than same day delivery to their customers that want it.

And that's the key thing, is how many people want it.

And I don't think you're ever going to find out if until you try.

So again, I'm going back on the stump of what can go right.

And if this goes right, it's a huge boon for Dollar General.

Okay, well, in which case I will happily come in with the what could go wrong.

Okay, I, I don't love it.

And I'll tell you, you're gonna pee in my pool.

Ben Miller.

Okay, go ahead.

I, I, I am, I am, I am.

Don't love it.

Yeah, look, Dollar General is starting to progress, perform okay again at the moment.

Yeah, you know, they've not had a great run, but you know, they're seeing 3 to 4% growth.

And, and they've done that, Chris.

They've done that by going back to the fundamentals.

They've rolled back some programs, they've just focused on the basics and there is a, there is a coming back to one of the big trends that we've been talking about for a while, which is the mixed signals that are coming out of the US consumer at the moment.

I find this a bit of a worry.

The Dollar General is Seeing growth across all segments because that signposts that there are more people in the US Economy who are struggling right now.

Now, for Dollar General, this is super important because if you think about the core Dollar General customer, when times are bad and their income is contracting, where can you go?

They can't trade down, they can't trade down, they buy less items.

So for dg, actually it's really important that they can bring more people in at those times to keep, to keep their business going.

I don't really buy into the importance of $100,000 households to them because I'm pretty sure it's a very small base.

So proportionately.

Okay, great, we're seeing that.

But the DG model is about simplicity, Chris, and it's about walking in no matter who you are.

Democratized and you're going to get a good deal.

You're going to get the best possible price.

Adding in the extra complexity of a membership program requiring subscription, requiring something to pay for up front to be able to get those good prices is, I'm not sure that's in keeping with the Dollar General brand.

I'm not sure it's necessarily what their shoppers are looking for.

Walmart and Amazon can get away with it because the they is so compelling.

Everything they put the program.

But this is, but this is the.

Okay, well that's what can go wrong.

So what can go right?

Let's find out.

Yeah, I'm chopping at the bit to retort.

Let's go.

Tell me everything I've seen wrong.

No, no, you go, you go.

You got more, you got more.

You go.

No, it's really hard to know what the value props going to be.

So what are they going to put into that deal and how much are they going to charge for it?

Because if it's, if the answer isn't we're putting a lot in and we're charging not a lot for it, then I'm worried.

Right, right.

Okay, so here's my retort, Ben, here's my retort.

So my retort is all those arguments you made were the same arguments people were making against Walmart doing Walmart plus to begin with.

If you look back, if you rewind in history, whenever they announced that program, which I don't even remember when it was, now, those are the exact same arguments.

And so the question I would have though is couldn't the same rationale hold true for Walmart in terms of, for Dollar General, in terms of the fact that, you know, people are more squeezed, everyone at different income Stress is starting to move down.

So people that want same day delivery or want to leverage Dollar General for even cheaper options but get the same day of delivery benefits or even less delivery, depending on how they do it again could potentially gravitate downward.

And also the other factor here, which Walmart has been, I don't want to say open, but it's been pretty transparent in like how, how it's being talked about anyway is like the reason people are signing up for Walmart plus is many of them don't have to go in a Walmart store.

So if you want to get the value of Dollar General without going to Dollar General Store because you do happen to make a certain income level, but you are feeling the pinch and you don't want to talk about it publicly, this could have some, some hooks for you too.

So that's where I think those are all the what ifs I think that are really out there when you start drawing the comparison analogies.

Because I think economics shows over time people always gravitate towards the lowest price.

So who's to say, you know, there isn't some segment of the population that is monetarily valuable that want same day delivery from the Dollar General product assortment that lives in its, you know, in its arena every single day.

And I think that's the big ask, because drawing a comparison between DG and Walmart, they're merchandising the brands that are available and the products that they can are very different.

I, I hear that's the one hang up.

But that's the stretch.

You got to prove it out with the assortment, right?

You got to prove it out that the assortment provides enough of a hook to make the subscription and the delivery tie ins valuable.

Right?

But that, and that's why you pilot it, right?

So like, I mean, I think so if that.

With that said, Ben, would you definitely warrant a pilot or would you be like so skeptical of the operations that you wouldn't pilot?

Because I think there are some things that if you're skeptical enough, you don't even go pilot stage.

I could pilot it, but you would do it.

Small geography, low risk, and you keep it really isolated because the last thing that DG business needs is disruption.

Just as it's getting the machine going again and just as it's been able to reduce complexity.

So as long as you can prevent the contagion without sounding CFO negative about it.

Yeah, you run that pilot.

Yeah, yeah.

It's an interesting point too because the other thing that's happening in the background is they have a new CEO coming in, you know, and I want.

And.

And they've got a new format coming that they're talking about in the same announcement that they talked about the subscription.

So JJ Fleeman's coming in as the CEO as well.

So like you wonder how on board he is with this.

You got to think he is because there's been a long transition period.

But these are big moves to your point.

And so do you want them right now?

I think those are questions well worth having in the boardroom.

All right.

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That's V E L O Q.com headline number five.

DoorDash has launched an AI based app search feature.

According to Chainstore Age, DoorDash is enabling natural language search in its iOS app.

The on demand delivery platform is introducing Ask Doordash, a new artificial intelligence enabled way for customers to search the app in their own words.

Shoppers can tap the ask button in the search bar and tell DoorDash what they want to eat, share a recipe link or cookbook photo, or even describe the reservation they're looking for to get personalized results in seconds.

Ben, how significant is it that DoorDash has launched its own AI based search experience?

Are you looking at this announcement any differently because it's DoorDash?

This is a really significant story to pay attention to because of the fact that theme, the broader theme it speaks to, that's what makes it so important.

It's a theme that I'll go further.

If you look after E commerce at a retailer or consumer brand, this is the the most significant thing you should be paying attention to right now.

And that is how customers are searching for your brand and searching your site and how you are being discovered by query engines.

Yeah, because that's what it's all about.

A really smart global digital commerce leader told me recently that winning in E commerce is a game of mastering changing algorithms.

And all the data that I'm seeing right now is that users are rapidly adopting kind of these conversational natural language approaches to search, which is changing all of our known algorithms.

So there's two big implications of that.

One is how your product gets shown in the results.

So that's AO and geo.

But secondly, if you acknowledge that you must Enable your users to have the ability to ask longer context based questions on your site.

For me, this is becoming table stakes.

And genuinely, I mean that, I mean that table stakes for retailers.

So, you know, with Google's AI overviews, with Gemini, you know, Amazon rolling out Alexa for shopping, which is on his way to becoming the primary way that shoppers are navigating Amazon or just good old chatgpt, the switch to context based questions is happening really, really, really quickly.

So if retailers and platforms like DoorDash and DoorDash, such a significant platform for people to find, discover and buy products through, if they don't keep up on their owned properties, they're going to lose out really quickly.

Really quickly.

So I think the move from interesting test and learn to table stakes is happening so quickly and I think we just see more and more and more announcements like this.

Yeah, it's interesting too because Kroger and Wegmans I think actually sent this off to a third party to do for their website too, which I think is an interesting little coinky dink here in terms of how people are handling this.

I talked about that with Shelly Huff.

Is this something so core to the user experience, which it sounds like you're probably in that camp bend, that it's probably not, not something you would outsource to a third party, is that right?

No, I, I'm all in.

I think this is, this is how people will search your website.

Yeah.

So if you're not ready for that, they'll go onto other tools and third party tools instead.

Right.

And you got to figure out how to make it work for you in the long term.

The adoption curve is federation.

Yeah.

It's not.

Yeah.

The.

Look, let's go back a couple of years or even longer when the idea of voice search was being discussed.

The big proponents of voice search were always saying that it's the natural way to communicate.

And what Google has done is it's forced us to take a natural way to communicate and squeeze it down into three words to go into a search bar.

So look, okay, talking to a machine did not get the traction that some people who were investing in it thought it was going to.

But that idea that we would rather express a concept using more words than have to have an idea and then translate it into what a Google prompt might be, Google has said to us, you don't need to do that anymore.

So if you're not getting your website ready to not have to do it anymore, you're going to miss out.

Yeah.

So.

So 100% agree with that.

I think there's another layer to this story, even More so with DoorDash in particular.

Ben, I'm curious what you think about it, like, so I agree with you.

I think this is a very significant announcement.

I think it's very significant partly because DoorDash is the one making it.

Because DoorDash, as we've talked about many times on this show, it's my most used retail app.

I use it for retail consumer experiences more than any other app out there, more than Amazon, more than Walmart.

And the reason for that is it's kind of the Swiss army knife of retail right now.

So Gen AI to me, if I'm drawing an analogy, as you drew the X Files analogy, Gen AI search to me is like whoever added the corkscrew for the first time to my Swiss army knife.

It was cool.

It was cool before with just the knives, the toothpicks, even the tweezers.

But now I've got the corkscrew, right?

And so that opens up a whole new realm of experiences for me when I think about this inside of the Swiss army knife, that is DoorDash already.

Because let's not forget, Ben, Jordache is already a marketplace.

So it's doing this in a marketplace versus doing it on a branded site.

So it's more akin to Amazon, but its marketplace has different dynamics than Amazon's because you could also order food for it or order other services as well.

So who's to say, like, if I just get crazy here, start thinking long term, who's to say you can't start comparison shopping in that marketplace more easily than you could now, as you're envisioning it, who's to say you couldn't start making restaurant orders based on budget comparisons?

Like saying, hey, I only want to spend $50 on my dinner tonight for my family of four.

What are my best options?

If that is enabled in this or it gets better over time, that is going to spur more and more usage, which, as we know more and more usage has so many one plus one equals three benefits to the platform itself.

So that's what I think is.

Is really fascinating here is DoorDash has been quietly building a very formidable app that can hold its own in a lot of ways.

Yeah, completely agree, completely agree.

All right, Ben.

Well, let's go to the Lightning Round to close out the show and to make sure you get to see England's soccer match on time.

In the fame 1980s movie, American Flyer, Kevin Costner plays a mustachioed competitive cyclist opposite Radon Chong.

And believe it or not, then I had to look up how to spell mustachioed.

It was really fun word to spell.

I know you have no doubt, like producer Ella never seen this movie.

I just know that.

And I know producer hasn't either.

So I'm not even going to ask her.

But as an avid cycling fan, which I know you are, what is one misgiving you would have about Mr. Costner in this role?

You are right.

I am an avid cycling fan.

I love my road cycling.

In fact, one of the leaving gifts that my lovely former colleagues at Shop Tour got me was a Lego racing bike.

Oh, wow.

Which obviously I didn't make today because I was busy watching the Starbucks investor video back, but, you know, later on this week I'm going to do that.

So Kevin Costner.

Look, Kevin Costner is a fit, healthy guy, but he's obviously cast by somebody who's clearly never looked at what a professional cyclist look like, because Kevin Costner's like 6:1.

He's.

He's 80 plus kilos.

Professional cyclists are incredibly slim because it all comes from power to weight ratio.

You want to go up a hill quick, you've got to reduce the weight and you've got to increase the power.

So, you know, 65 kilos is a good weight for a racing cyclist and they can be a lot less than that.

So, yeah, Mr. Costner would not get very far in a professional peloton, I can assure you that.

So, so you are selling the casting of Kevin Costner in a cycling movie.

That's basically what you're saying.

You.

You would not buy it one bit whatsoever.

Absolutely not.

But, yeah, but Chris, I want to stay with sports for question number two, because as we talked about, it is the opening week of the FIFA World cup after.

And look, admittedly thoroughly impressive, 4:1 win in their opening match for the USA.

Where for you, Chris, where would a USA World cup overall victory sit in the Walton Ranking of sports, sports and teams that you care or literally couldn't care less about.

Oh, wow.

You know, if the US won the World Cup, I think it would probably be the number two sporting achievement of my lifetime.

From a US fandom perspective, number one would still have to be defeated the USSR in the 1980 Olympics, just because of the symbolism of the Cold War and everything.

Yeah, but I think winning the World cup would be.

Would be right up there, man.

Like I. Yeah, I remember making a joke with somebody back in the day.

I said, like, the U.S. will win the World cup before Ireland did.

I think I made a bet with that person too, who shall remain nameless, but I think I did.

And so, I don't know, I'm feeling like I. I feel like the odds of that are better, but I don't want to get too hyped up on one.

One good victory to start the tournament, especially when the tournaments at home as well, because we've seen that, that happen and go the other way.

And the US team has a.

Has a history of letting people down as well.

Ben.

All right.

If George Clooney had his way getting back to some British lighting round questions, he'd hand the keys to James Bond's Aston Martin over to British actor Callum Turner.

Do you agree with Mr. Clooney in his choice?

Well, I agree that this is a franchise that really does need some new life.

Yes.

That is for sure.

Yeah.

Daniel Craig's looking a little long in the tooth, you know, not that he wants to do it again anyway.

And it's a real shame.

I think there was a moment when it looked like Idris Elba was going to be the next Bond and I would.

I mean, Stringer Bell is James Bond.

That would have been so cool.

Yeah.

So I would have been all in for that.

Callum Turner.

Why not?

If it gets Dulippa to the theme tune, then I'm in.

Right, yes.

Good call, man.

Right, Chris, question number four, Last question for you.

You are in the middle of your European grand tour.

The classic Berlin currywurst I recommended was quite clearly a flop.

So what is the best thing that you've eaten while you've been over here this year?

That's right.

I forgot the last time you were on the show, you recommended that I eat that in Berlin.

And yeah, it was, it was probably the worst thing I had on my entire trip that week.

And I also told another friend, acquaintance of ours too, was on that set, that same conference, and he tried it and had the same sentiment that I did.

But anyway, you know, the best thing I had on this trip was I went to San Sebastian with my wife and we went to a high end, two star Michelin restaurant.

Because San Sebastian is known as, like, just the food mecca of the world.

And it's.

It's incredible.

Like, I can't believe that this, that it's taken me long, this long, to get to San Sebastian.

But it's called Amelia.

I can't remember the chef's name, I'm just blanking on it right now.

But it was so incredibly impressive from start to finish.

Like, it was actually a speakeasy you went in and then they only served 12 people in the whole restaurant.

It was a very personalized, very intimate experience, very quiet experience too.

And it was just very special.

And she and I will always remember it.

So, yeah, that would be my answer, Ben.

But sadly.

Sadly or not sadly, there was not any currywurst on the menu.

There was nary a curry to be found at Amelia.

All right, producer Ella, let's bring you in here.

I'm curious, what headline won today's show?

Are you going with Starbucks again?

Because that's kind of where you tend to roll.

No.

You're shaking your head no.

Where are you going today then?

How could I not pick Doordash?

Oh, wow.

I love the angle they're coming in from and I feel like grocers should really take this idea and run with it, especially the conversational approach.

And it made me think about, I recently did a pickup order from Aldi and of course I do my five minute, like, run through my fridge, run through my pantry.

Right.

And as you're doing that, you're making this list in your head and then you go back to the app and you type it all in, trying to remember maybe you're going back to the fridge.

Right.

And the idea of either using a third party, Ben, like you were saying of me, just like talking to my phone and making that list for me, or.

Or like what Doordash is doing, just doing that in app.

Like all of these, these apps should be doing this because it just saves me time and I'm already making that list in my head already.

So I think this is just an easy winner this week.

Wow.

Okay, so you're really liking this idea too and you like particular that it's DoorDash as well.

All right, I'm shocked.

I'm shocked.

You are like the biggest Starbucks drinker in the world.

What do you think?

Can you envision going and sitting down in a 1500 square foot Starbucks store, too?

A Starbucks cafe, too?

That's the one question I have for you before we close out the show.

Yeah, I mean, Chris, I'm going to stick to what I've said from the beginning.

I love a coffee experience and I love every aspect of it, from the mobile to sitting in the store.

Honestly, sometimes I don't even care what it looks like.

I love sitting and drinking my coffee, so I'm all for it.

And I love Starbucks.

You don't care.

As long as you got the coffee in hand, you're happy.

That's kind of how I am too.

Actually, yeah, I think you're right.

You're right.

All right, on that note, happy birthday today to Will Forte, Greg Kinnear, and to the man who starred in quite possibly one of the worst sequels ever made, Speed two, Jason Patrick.

And remember, if you can only read or listen to one retail blog in the business, make it Omnitalk.

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Ben, I used to ask you this question, but you did, and you were working at Shop Talk.

You're no longer at Shop Talk.

You did me a solid, so I'm going to ask you anyway.

If people want to get in touch with you, found you really interested, engaging and want to pick your brain on anything, what's the best way for them to do that now?

Amazing.

I am LinkedIn.

Just look me up.

Ben Miller.

I think it's Ben Miller, retail, on LinkedIn.

Drop me a note if.

I'm sorry if I delayed.

Sorry, I'm just finishing my Lego and I'll get back to you really quickly,.

All right?

I can.

I. I need a.

You got to send out a picture that at some point.

Maybe that.

Maybe that's a good LinkedIn post.

You and your.

You and your new bicycle pen.

All right?

Until next week, on behalf of all of us at Omnitalk Retail, go England.

And as always, be careful out there.