Cómo realizar un viaje astral

0:07 Tonces for everyone. Like it' s there. My name is Juan Jesús Vallejos, the journalist, writer and director of the Mystery Night program on Caracol Radio. In ancient shamans said that they were able to leave their bodies in a trance and be able to go to see a fantastic world, some in which there were angels and fairies, and also that they were able to move through the underworld doing battles even against demons. This was in ancient times. Then, already at the end of the 19th century, the beginning of the 20th century was coined the term astral journey, the ability that we have to leave our body and travel through this world and also through a multiverse. The funny thing is that the CIA, for decades, started a thing called the Stargate project and hired people who had this ability, to make astral trips and leave their bodies. The most famous of them was Ingo Swan, who worked for the gum, I repeat for decades with results that today are impossible to explain. And in the podcast you' re going to hear not only that, but we' ll also tell you techniques so that you yourselves can make and start making astral trips, so don' t lose this mystery night podcast

1:42 how to make an astraj Ingo Swan trip was a painter barely known in the United States, a restless guy who told his friends that he was given an anesthetic at three years of age and that day, in a sort of trance state, he was able to leave his body and see distant places. The point is that Ingo Swang was totally convinced that that was a fact. And it is more than then, after that experience, he had been able to do so repeatedly. This is what made it in the year nineteen hundred and seventy- two to be investigated in the American society of psychic research and what happened there was tremendously extraordinary. Imagine him in a large room sitting in Ingo Swang' s head with countless electrodes in order to measure his brain activity and on a ledge attached to the ceiling more than three meters high, he was put different objects, an umbrella, a scissors, an apple and the number

3:17 of successes that Ingo Swang began to have were something absurd. And what' s more, his brain activity around the optic nerve increased when he was in that sort of trance state. In particular, psychologists say that electrical activity around the optic nerve was beginning to be detected, smaller than normal, but with much more impulses, something really strange. The experiments carried out by Coningo Swang and the psychologists who controlled them said that in order for Ingo Swang to have that level of success it was one in forty zero. To be exact, yes, in Goswan he was not God either was able to visualize objects, but if he was put, for example, words or numbers, he was not able to see them. Those experiments drew so much attention that on June 6 of the year nineteen hundred and seventy- two. Leading all these experiments, two psychologists who also worked for the CIA, namely Russell Tark and Harold puttof well, as these two psychologists did an experiment with a magnetometer. What

4:50 they did is just as well put it in Goswan and on this occasion tell him hear you would be able to alter the magnetic field around that apparatus. And Ingo Swan said," I' m going to try and see what happens" The result was so absurd that one of the people who was controlling the experiment ran out to comment on the results, stumbled and was injured. This caught the attention of two CIA agents, from the U S Intelligence Central of the spy services, and what happened is that he was so impressed by the experiments of Ingo Swan, who was working for the CIA for decades on a project called Stargate, also controlled by the same psychologists Russell Tark and Harold Purof. And it' s very curious because the CIA agents who supervised what Ingo Swan was doing were so convinced of the capabilities that what they had to do later is even tell him to go to the planet Jupiter and tell us what' s there and describe Jupiter to them and described Mars to them and described Mars to them millions of years ago, when there was intelligent life on

6:25 the planet. It' s funny because those CIA tests started with being given a series of coordinates in the globe and since Ingo Swang didn' t fail, they never thought it was a case of super memory or given coordinates and the guy came in and said I feel cold, I see a mountain, there' s a river. I described the landscapes to them all and I was always right. So, thinking it was a case of super memory, they gave her the coordinates of an ultra- secret American base and Engo Swang described it with all luxury of detail. I repeat, he' s been working for the CIA for decades. If they enter the CIA website right now and name Inngo Swan, hundreds of declassified documents will appear about the experiments that were made with this man and it is more one that they will not find.

7:20 But what Inngoswan recounted in his autobiography, one thousand nine hundred and ninety - eight, is that the CIA asked him that in one of his altered states of consciousness he would try to tell him what was behind the OMNI phenomenon and whether there were aliens on the planet. And Ingo Swan told them that there were extraterrestrials on the planet, but in human form, that they had been able to create a fifth column here on Earth. Ingo Swan died a few years ago, but his life and history became legend. And what' s curious is that without go Swan he was able to get out of his body and see other places. It is exactly like what the shamans tell us, that our consciousness can come out of our body and travel not only through this world, but through infinity of worlds and a multiverse, a multiverse where there are angels, where there are demons, where there are beings of other dimensions, a multiverse that we want fabulous and that is totally and absolutely real.

8:48 My name is Juan Jesús Vallejo. What you want to follow me on social networks, my twitters throws Juang Vallejo, Juan j de Vallejo, on Instagram, on Facebook Juan Jesús Vallejo. And this is another mystery night show. And here what we do is mystery journalism. We put the facts on the table and you decide what' s behind it and what' s not. Like these facts that I have told you about the life of Inngosoan, a total and absolutely exciting life that opens the door for us to be travelers of a multiverse. You know that I travel as an author at the end of good, the second fortnight of the month of September of this year I will be making a trip to Egypt so that you will walk along with the Pyramids surprised by the mysteries left us by the fourth dynasty on the plateau of Giza to navigate the magical thread and walk through millenary temple that still have a magical meaning that today is valid in a journey that I assure you will be transformative and we will start without matilation. Alejandro, partner friend, how are you? Very well, Juan Geu, a greeting for you, for Richie in the controls and, of course, for all the people who consume this content through the podcast that we are posting every week through the YouTube channel of Caracol Radio. John that while doing the introduction, I imagined Ingoswan performing that experience of remote vision, trying to observe not only coordinates on the earth,

10:24 but places in the solar system, places that were later corroborated by space missions About Ingosuan some scientific discoveries were anticipated. Juan Gue, I mean that' s important to mention. So the gentleman was not only imagining it, but actually some of the information he gave later was verified by science and, above all, what you were commenting on. John, that possibility of traveling to the past to love you and observe awesome things. I mean, that' s a really wonderful thing and it shows that the mind is not only the great riddle of riddles, but that it has an unusual power. And there are some people, some initiates and people who have also achieved special training, who have been able to develop those powers and be able to gain information, see really amazing things, because wonderful. Yeah, the dengoson story is fascinating and well, it' s a very unique case. I think it' s the best known case worldwide. But what today' s program is about is astral journeys, and not only experiences get lost and see what' s in the next room or in the next building, but being able to travel through a multiverse. And it goes without saying that, in the background, this is something that appears in the majority, in the vast majority of the cultures of our planet of the world, where the shamans were able to have

11:54 that kind of experience. That is always with altered states of consciousness, consciousness, but it is something that is there that is part of our culture and also, in today' s program, if they stay to the end, they will be able to hear what techniques they have to use to try to become astral travelers, travelers of a multiverse. Well, for today' s show we have a super special interview with a good friend who' s been away for many years, who hasn' t seen and who' s written precisely a book about astral travel and how to make an astral trip. You can search in Amazon for that book if you put its name, José Gregorio González and how to make an astral journey. And the interview with José Gregorio González starts like this. The ancient Amanes said they were able to go into trance and be able to glimpse other worlds. They thought that their soul had taken your body, their body and with invisible eyes they could dive into the afterlife. For many these are within the realm of legend. However, there are another series of facts that make us reflect deeply on the subject. I don' t know if you, for example, know about a CIA project, which was the Stargate project, and that was for decades. He spent

13:26 money on different characters, one of the most famous, a man who was called ingosoam He spent money on different characters who claimed to be able to leave his body to go to other places, to other places and, besides, with a percentage of successes so huge that he made it really spend a lot of money, a lot of time and a lot of effort on this and that possibility that we can get out of our body. It opens the way to something, something tremendously important, and that is the existence of an afterlife, an afterlife where they appear multiverse, where fantastic worlds appear, a beyond where we could even glimpse what is after death, a fascinating terrain that is also known in the slang or can tell you like astral journeys, like our body leaves us and travels through that multiverse, as the ancient shamans said.

14:39 But Mr Cashette a book on this and who knows a lot more than a servant, is Mr José Gregorio González, a journalist who is right now in the Canary Islands and who did not see as twelve fourteen years or almost as I do not remember. José Gory González, a fellow friend, how he is tremendously confident that you are here on mystery night at Caracol Radio and as this is the first time you are on the show, I will ask you the question I ask to all the guests who arrive here for the first time who is José Gregorio González for the entire audience of Caracol Radio Juang. Thank you so much for the invitation. It' s a shared joy. We had each other on the radar, but it' s true that we hadn ' t agreed again and talked as complicitly as we' ve been doing recently.

15:28 And well, José Gregorio González is a curious person, chronically curious. I don' t want to be cured of that curiosity and my treatment is to go, in search of the mystery, read research around everything that has to do with the sphere of the paranormal, but you also play other sticks, the heterodox history, the very wide universe of beliefs, of traditions, of legends, that is, at the end of one topic, you pass on to another when you are a curious sick person who I think you also have that incurable disease in your blood and transmit it to your audience. Basically I am that And good someone who has also felt from a very young age, the vocation, the urge to tell, to communicate those things that I am so passionate about, because perhaps looking that others can also be passionate about in the same ways. And well, that has led me to touch different or move on different records. Well through books reporting in written press, which is something I' m passionate about that obviously, you' re also a race journalist in that sense. And, well, the radio, the TV, we' ve flirted with practically every genre and it' s still running a radio show. There you go and see the Canary Islands, what is the name of the radio program Samborondón chronicles in the Canary Islands Radio autonomía is

17:03 the radio station here in the Autonomous Community of the Canary Islands. And notice that I will explain previously in the name, because of course said so, people may tend to think that it is dedicated to a holy chronicles of Samborondon and in part yes, but it has an explanation. Samborondón is a ghost island, an island that appears and disappears that was represented on maps. When the archipelago was represented, Samborondón was included and there are even recent photographs of Samborondón, because let us say that it is a phenomenon that may be the product of some sort of mirage that was actually seen. In other words, there were times when up to hundreds of testimony were collected and it was so frequent that it came to reflect on the maps, expeditions were organized in their search and let' s say that it was believed to be really a territory to be discovered. Not in fact, Christopher Columbus was preparing his travels and was questioning about new lands, as he also collected testimonies about Saint Borondon.

18:08 Moreover, in some parts of America there are places that receive the name also communities that receive the name Samborondón. I think in Ecuador and some in other places too, but it came in my memory that of Ecuador and it is not clear if they receive those names carried by people from the Canary Islands who ended up in those lands making their lives and creating their home there or if also those first travelers there were also witnesses of a phenomenon similar to that that they gave them the name they brought from the Canary Islands. But it is also an additional bridge through the Ministry that unites us with all of Latin America.

18:56 Well, in the Canary Islands tremendously united with Lana a match there are many canaries living in Latin America and many American mentienos living in Canaria. Listen another day I don' t want to get out of the script even though I' m an expert on other scripts. We do a podcast and if you think about mysteries of the Canary Islands, you also have some books published about it, books that well, I say I am doing this interview with José Gregorio González because he has a book called how to make an astral trip that here in Latin America you can get through Amazon, super easy, so much the people that you live in the United States here in Colombia, because this podcast is heard throughout the continent. Then nothing, for a highly recommended book. It was not a topic that I expected from you, because I had always seen a journalist very of race, very much of investigating the sites, the steps that is happening there in the Canary Islands. You have a thousand archaeological riddles. You have pyramids from an amazing thing. How he gave you for diving in on this. How did Joseph Gregorio tell you about making a book about astral journeys? I' ve always been passionate about parapsychology.

20:04 The first books I read when I was a kid, they were for psychology. So, well, there was a phenomenon there in that fascinating universe of the powers of the mind that was especially suggestive to me, and it was that of astral projection, extracorporal experiences. That always fascinated me and in the wake of the years. That is to say, that was in my imprint since childhood, but it was because of some reports that I made about experiences close to death that I found and deepened as far as I could in this topic of the astral journey, because within those near- death experiences, with all those phases, that the audience knows perfectly well the exit of the body.

20:56 The tunnel explored all this, for let' s say that the only FAA susceptible to being explored from a scientific point of view, if corroborated was precisely that of extracorporal experience, which are those cases in which patients who are in clinical death are not only seen but, on many occasions, well many, in a percentage of cases, are able to describe what is happening in the room or the type of conversations that are taking place or what is happening outside, because on that exit outside, they remain aware of what is happening and keep memory of them. And, of course, this concrete phase of near- death experience, let' s say that you can capsulate, you can generate experiments for if it occurs obviously spontaneously, unpredictablely and accidentally that as this usually happens in the scn in near- death experiences, because you have a proof of the whole experience. And from there comes the famous project of Samparnia, with all those tables, those screens, placed in emergency zones, in terminal care, looking towards the ceiling. In case any fleet can there be those images that are randomly projected and that physically it is impossible for anyone to see because they are looking up at the ceiling on top of shelves or cupboards. So let' s say that I was fascinated both by near-

22:30 death experiences, which I deepened to the fullest and well, I researched in historical literature, myths and scientific research, both in the field of paropsycology and in the field of medical neurophysiology, to try to know everything and realize, because this book, which in the end is a synthesis of more than ten years of restlessness, well, many more than ten years, because, as I tell you, this restlessness has been with me for a long time, but actively, therefore, to explore this whole subject. And well, then, then, gathering together some techniques, which is the last part of the book, but it is the one that gives clear title, it is the one that gives title. Yes, because I mean good for people who don ' t know. Samparry is a very famous American doctor who is in New York. I think he is also a university professor, who is a gentleman who has been obsessed for many years with investigating this step right after life, after life, after life, and has done a lot of experiments and some with really fascinating results. I hope I want to say that the good thing about the book José Gregorio, which we are going to leave for the end of the interview, is that it has not remained in the theoretical part, but that, moreover, at the practical level, at the end of the interview, I repeat so that if you endure the entire podcast it will tell you what techniques there are so that you yourselves can make astral trips through your dreams in a more quotient way. I repeat that will be at the end of the interview and, anyway, what we wanted to comment on. Let

24:02 ' s start getting more into material. Historically, there are a lot of references to this kind of astral journeys. I was talking about shamanism. Here, for example, in Colombia, we have a place called St Augustine, which is a place is a necropolis, of the largest necropolis in America, where it appears in a figure where you see the representation of the shaman coming out of his body and a very famous one called The Double. Me. Many times those shamans thought that their spirit could become a jaguar and walk through the night in ancient Egypt was talked about the BA, because the K in essence, our vital essence, and the VA would be that vehicle with which we can reach the Kingdom of the Dead. How it was in ancient times this astral journey and that ability from the unfolding. Well, I understand, but it' s speculation, but I think quite reasoned that the vast majority of these experiences at the origin, when the human being begins to have a consciousness, they occur spontaneously, not production survives a trauma, because perhaps through the intake of something from some psychotropic, even accidentally, you live that experience.

25:22 And I have the impression that right in that kind of spontaneous experiences that arise when in a very remote antiquity. From there, I believe that the perception of transcendence of the human being arises. I mean, I' m convinced it' s a personal conception that religions and the perception of the spirituality of the human being, of transcendence and of survival after death has to do with astra journeys. It has to do with having experienced that experience, being outside of your body, observing and having all those sensory sensations, difficult to see ballistics, returning to your body and telling that to yours, to your community and telling them that when the body disappears something survives. I have the impression that it comes from there from those experiences in a very remote antiquity, that in principle they would be difficult to understand and understand, but that as well, that communities, that cultures develop, that thought becomes more complex, because let' s say that they are giving rise to beliefs and let' s say that to the substrate of what we will later call religion. But, who first dominates this in a conscious way, obviously, is the figure of the shaman, the sorcerer, the man of medicine you know of the woman, man or men of medicine, that is, it is they who, in an intentional way, through the use of psychotropic substances, of music, of dance, of fasting, that is, by placing the body in

26:56 extreme or exceptional situations, provoke that estio to the degree of consciousness, facilitate that click touch that switch that allows the consciousness, because in this case we are talking about consciousness, basically comes out beyond the physical body, and they become specialists. Evidently, in that universe of beliefs in which each of these figures lives, it is interpreted as an ascent or descent to heaven to hells, as a connection with the gods, with the ancestors, with the spirits of their ancestors, with their own in a more animistic environment, with the soul, with the spirit, with the consciousness of plants, of animals, of nature itself as a whole, and they become the specialists. The shamans fight battles with demons, make covenants with the gods, rescue the souls of the underworld, seek remedies for their community, for the living, and all this they do through the shamanic journey that in the end is obviously an exclusive and very intense practice of the shaman who manages it and who is not free from dangers either for him. But they become the specialists, those who have that ability and control it, but obviously spontaneously, in accidental situations where life is at extreme risk, or even the people who are born with that gift

28:30 because the traveler followed his own itinerary. Between say people give rise among those who were not shamans or followed their itinerary. So they are the first to control the experience and, as you say, they continue to do so today. But they have left an imprint, a imprint on myths, on legends, on archaeology itself. There is a very interesting theory, John, regarding the motives of the lines of naskaypa Palo. And this is a very curious thing. The journey of the shaman, which is also like the journey of mystics in religion, where they see angels, where they see demons, where they can go down to hell, where they go up to heaven. And it is curious that these figures of angels appear in America, in Africa, in Asia, in Europe, in all ancient cultures, as if really that world of angels and demons and that astral world and that world of different dimensions were totally and absolutely real. They are archetypal images juange as you said well, which are repeated in different cultures, which have been manifested in different contexts.

29:44 And when José Gregorio was commenting on Juan sheque clearly when talking about these astral trips we had to talk about the shamans like those first people who were that great Canal. John Ge remembered much what the Druids were doing during the Samhain, the Celtic culture that they were doing during that night, the night of the Samhaine, which would come to be October thirty- one. On November 1, Juange had the opportunity, through an altered state of conscience, to communicate with spirits with people who had already left to ask for knowledge many times to consult them about a key decision they had to make for the group. It seems fascinating to me, of course, because they also got information from that multiverse. Remember, for example, the case of billingens Hill' s hildegard, Bingen' s Garda, which entered anextasis. He said that he saw Angels and wrote music and music to the ear and flips And who we talked about last week, Juan ge Joana de arco On a Ecstasy, Yes also yes. Indeed, it is something that is repeated a lot of times today traveling through a multiverse of which we are all parts and ended an interview with José Gregorio González and he was telling us about a very curious hypothesis that there is about what the lines of Nazca really are And this has to do with astral trips. And the interview with José Gregorio González continues ah Yes,

31:18 there was a theory that I put forward the story in the book, that I could make the visions that the shamans had when they went out in astral and that they embodied it and how there could be rivalries between the shamans of different communities were like messages that the shamans themselves, in their astral journeys, could read about the territory. No. It seems to me like a story, a very supernite theory. It is not a theory that arises in an occult sphere, that is, that theristic, that would be good too, but it is a theory that arises in the field of the science of anthropology, as a possible explanation of the usefulness that they could have. This station is a figure and it is interesting to be linked to the trips of the shamans. It seems to me like a sort of curious confluence between the astral journey and the shamanism and the archaeology of Nasca. Indeed, because it is curious that it is something that is given in all cultures, that journey of the shaman to different worlds within the multiverse, to the underworld, runs to the world or to the world of the gods or others. But you said something that' s key before we get into good, I' ve got like fifteen questions here that nothing more time to ask than four. But another day it bothers you, don' t worry before we get into science and the 20th century. You said something that I think is very important altered states of conscience for people to understand, because right now we are in a normal state. But if I were dreaming, I would be in an altered

32:54 state of consciousness. If I were down hypnosis, I would be in an altered state of consciousness. If you give me an antecedent substance, I would be in an altered state of consciousness. And that seems to be the key in different culture for that outburst I was now remembering, for example, that the regent of Tibet to know where they' re going to be next to the Ilama. For example, it goes to a lake, the lake I think is called the Lao lake I remember now it goes a lake and it is in a sacred lake and it is three days without eating and the third day in its dreams is where the spirits that live in this lake tell it, so, the next of the Islama will be there in such place.

33:38 I mean, it' s like you have to look, get out of our normal state of consciousness to get us into other vericuets of reality. What that would be like. Yes, yes, yes, we speak of the projection of consciousness, basically in order to explain it in antiquity, no longer the shaman, but through millennia to the present day, when religions or different schools of knowledge, secret societies, etcetera, are configured in order to be able in some way to verbalize the projection the exit of consciousness. So let ' s say that the concept of ethereal bodies, that is, of the astral body, was created a little bit. There are philosophical movements and some religions that speak up to seven or nine bodies. The usual thing is that two three spirit soul you mentioned in Egypt before the boat. Well, I think these are intellectual forms and from every age in order to understand what this was about transcendence, what it was like to get out of the body of consciousness. In the end it is that it is nothing other than the consciousness itself that is what we project and good we understand and has some logic that in the contemplative states lasis meditation, well what it does in the sphere of

35:10 Buddhism, in others also its own, the Christian epoch of punishing the body in the conventual environment through fustigation, torture, etc, as the pain that was interpreted as a kind of good or understood at that time as a kind of distance from the physical, from the sinful to transcend at the end. That' s what it generates. They are fastings, they are states before those of conscience, as you have well indicated, it is the way in which I believe that consciousness is able to momentarily or partially disassociate itself, at least, from the physical body, from the consciousness, from this mind of the madman who leads us from one thought to another constantly and access those other realities escape from the physical body. And this happens according to the main astral travelers who have written and talked about them and as I have been able to pick up also from many astral travelers, it is quite facilitated by the state of sleep, that is, when we rest, there is obviously a physical relaxation. One part of our brain is processing, assimilating, metabolizing everything that has happened during the day, creating memories, storing on the hard drive and another part, consciousness seems to be, seems to be, according to these travelers that comes out of the body and is in other areas. We spoke before the multiverse. He is, therefore, traveling, learning, living,

36:45 experience, because I do not know visiting others we do not know very well, but those who master this technique say that we all experience astral journeys. That is good news and that through sleep we can begin to become aware of and control it. So, well, it' s an important key, which you say no. In the end I got an altered state of consciousness techniques. And here I do a little vocateo for the end you whatever you want. Yes, what I mean is that all the techniques go through the vast majority of the techniques to travel in southern go by relaxing you physically, they go by generating a state different from the ordinary, to the usual, although it is also true that there are some exceptional cases collected in the literature of the astral journey, where it occurs in circumstances as very adverse during physical activity. These are very exceptional cases, but it has also been good.

37:44 There may always be people who can experience this experience in an exceptional way, but the usual thing is that it is in these types of altered states of consciousness and without having to resort as you said to facilitate it, but through techniques, of practice of deprivations even physical, it can favor those projections. Jesus Christ himself, when he wanted to speak to his father, with the very day, went into the desert and stuck himself a lot of days without eating and without drinking. Of course, if you look at the biography of some saints or mystics, you' d get that stuff That' s it.

38:25 They listened and saw the angels or the heavenly powers. They traveled metaphorically or truly to those celestial planes through the deprivation of food, through prayer, which is a meditation, which is a meditation, indeed, and through the path of pain that we said before. I don' t obviously, I don' t recommend this and you don' t make sense today, because we know it differently, do it differently, but you raised it for those who understand what they experienced and where the roots could be to be able to experience. That doesn' t seem very symptomatic to me. This is in the realm of Christianity. There' s not a very famous case. I ' m going to look for the name so we don' t get it wrong, because it' s a lot of names from one of my favorite Southern travelers. I mean, your story is delicious. I can' t find him now, just because I' m looking for him. But well, Edward Morrell is word Model Vale. This one has a very delicious story that I tell in the book and that I then deepened even further because the Internet allows you to access digital libraries afterwards. And well, Morell wrote a book in the early 20th century of the United States, the twenty- fifth man or the twenty- fifth man, where he was his autobiography, told

39:58 his story. He hadn' t been because of these random things in life. He was a little boy, a little boy. He came into contact with a gang of outlaws who raided trains and robbed banks, and in the end he ended up being part of that gang and fate led him to prison and to be considered a very dangerous person when he had barely flirted with that world. It was a very casual thing. But, well, the thing is, he ends up in prison, in San Gintin prison. And there, obviously, because today is still happening, unfortunately. But in the past, since there was less scrutiny and torture was obviously commonplace, in addition to being a very contentious person, very demanding. And then, one way to keep quiet was to torture him and use different techniques with him and one of them was what was called the double shirt. It was a double straitjacket for white and behind. They tied him up and then they poured water and that.

41:01 The effect of that is that the tissue was compressing to practically asphyxiation, but just enough for it not to die, so that it was torture and not execution. Well, because he started experimenting in those processes astral outings, that is, he started having astral journeys. He got out of the body. Of course I understand that it was a mechanism of his own conscience to escape, to escape from that double prison, which was the torture to which he was subjected. And the interesting thing, because we can think that this was a psychological resource from him to cope with the trauma. The interesting thing is that he went out, watched what happened outside the prison. He traveled to San Francisco. He was aware of events that were happening and that he later saw on the news or that someone told and met his wife in Astral, with whom he would later marry. Of course it' s a fabulous story that I love. I say the astral old man one of my favorites or the preferred one the truth, because moreover this possibly led him to see that, by checking through these experiences, that it was not only a physical body that had a transcendence, it led him to an activism and to be a person who fought for rights and the improvement of prison conditions and got it improved and changed into laws. Obviously, when he got out of jail,

42:36 he exactly made important prison changes possible And that is, he was a socially engaged person and he may be able to safely. Part of this social awareness, of this desire to generate change, also had to do with what he lived on a level of torture and with what he experienced during these tortures. Sounds like a fascinating story to me. Then, c Clondon, who was carted with him, dedicated one of his tales the traveler of the stars to his figure. It' s a very unknown story, very unknown. I did not know it clearly, of course, and moreover, with an impact that did not remain in the personal sphere, but later had a much broader echo. Well, I' ll tell you all this because you see.

43:25 There' s the torture, there' s the physical punishment that helps in this case triggers the astral journey, an ulterior state of consciousness that through the pain and all the substances that our brain generates a hephete and our brain itself gives a series of substances that uncle says this is so fucked up and so bad that I hurt from here and, indeed, your mind and soul leave there. There' s one thing I want to ask you before we move on, and that' s the next. We' re talking about extracorporeal rience, which is that I, for example, am in Bogotá. Imagine that tonight in sleep I am able to go to Sydney, Australia and see what is happening in cinema and Australia, but there are other times that this astral journey does not take us this plane of reality, but takes us to other planes where there are gods, where there are celestial beings or where there are demons I think it was correct me. If I' m wrong, elena bla vasky, the first one who starts to dig deeper and talk about this astral thing and said that there were different astral planes, she seems to be also an astral hieral life. So, how would this be from the astral plane, how could we define it, because at first glance it seems a little complex. No, yes, there are many schools of knowledge.

44:44 Tossophia is one of them and the sperioditism, for example, Cardesiano also deepened in this. That is to say, if you go to the realm of pink crosses, all the schools of hermetic knowledge have said that they have elaborated their own theory and have provided their own descriptions of what those astral planes are like. Not one but speak of several more at levels, astral levels, some lower, where we say that the worst of the worst would be those people or those beings, those vibrations that have more to do with our different, with the criminal, the criminal, with the unethical, that is, and then, obviously, there would be brighter planes, more enriching, senator planes. Depending on the school, they describe them to you in one way or another, and the key to going one place to another is how you are basically like that, how your own state is, whatever your own life, your ethics, your motivations, because they will take you to one place or another. Let' s say that it is the unwritten norm, but it is described and in which all these schools tend to, obviously, converge, are kingdoms in which depending on who describes it or the culture where it has been described, because they are inhabited by them. In the end, all those heavenly powers that can sound very familiar in the realm of Christianity,

46:15 with the Archangels, the thrones, the Angels. We see the cherubim there. We have not, for all this would respond to the inhabitants of those heavenly planes. But this is what you' re saying It' s funny. For example, that is because it seems like a lie we identify this with the subject of Christianity, the Angels and such or the demons are not in Islam, this is in Buddhism. But it is that you go to Bolivia, at the door of the sun of Tiaguanaco and the famous trumpeters appear, that they are nothing more than cherubs that are playing fanfare appear, salty beings appear, that is, this is something that would give us or would make us think that really people, when they are in this type of state, altered of consciousness and able to leave their body of alternate realities, that are alternate, but that are real also in one way or another and that at that moment they are posed to us. I wanted to comment. Yes, think that in the near- death experiences, with the subject with which we begin in some of its phases and described by thousands, I would say that tens of thousands of people who have experienced them throughout history and the world, because these figures appear in an important percentage of cases, not figures that are then identified according to culture, because as you said with angels, with geniuses, in short, with technical beings. No and as colmeng also of

47:50 many of these near- death experiences there is a final encounter so usually end a percentage of these experiences with a spiritual being, also since it identifies itself as someone of higher rank. Some, obviously, in a Christian culture, identify him with Jesus. But, obviously, it' s an interpretation of that encounter with an entity of light that usually is the one that returns you, that tells you your time has not come. Come back, you' ll still have some time to transcend. And well, yes, in a part of the astral journeys, the journey to those more magical, more heavenly, more spiritual spaces is present and, in fact, notice. There' s another curious traveler. He may be the most famous of all Robert Monroden, because he creates a high school and today he is his high school.

48:42 It continues to function and viaural sounds continue to be marketed. I think they are called facilitating these altered states of consciousness and astral projection. One, as Monroe came to describe three levels of astral travel and he experienced them all three, as he dragged back through the world in which we are that somehow he would develop you for this reality. But you' d be in astral, you' d be seeing and visiting and listening to what' s going on in this plane. A background, let' s say more, that' s something different, that could correspond to a more astral plane, where all the reality that you' re perceiving seems to belong to that ambit. There are subtleties, there are changes in textures in colors you can find yourself with spiritual sejas, as we see, as we have commented now. We didn ' t say that that would be the second kind of experience he describes, always according to him, always according to Robert Monroe' s categories. And a third that I find fascinating and curious, very surreal, that he experienced it. And when you read Monro describe this and you say everything, it ' s a maximum madness, a kind of parallel universe, where he knows what he is and he sees himself living another life, but with another aspect,

50:12 that is, he is absolutely convinced and describes it in his book. And besides, at certain times he has sexual life there, even if he has interacts, but he knows it' s him. But it is a parallel reality that is similar in certain aspects, to that he lives on a daily basis, but with changes, that is, a kind of land b that I am clear in the world of comics and how it has been taken to television and in cinema, because it is not as more remarkable, no more familiar, because we have seen it the multiverses. But when he tells it no, then how do you fit that in whether you see yourself living an area with family, that is, with another family, with another job, living in time for another life, because he tells it no and it is a story as very peculiar are the three types of levels to which, according to him his own experience, can fall on the astral journey. Or you can go or it' s a story, as I tell you, very fascinating that it' s to recapitulate. The fact that people are clear to you would basically be a world that is like the one we are in, a world where there are celestial or demonic beings and such and then a parallel reality. That would be his three universes. Yes, that' s what he experienced, what he described in his books, and of course, the part is. Let' s say the astral world. Let' s say it' s been described by other travelers and well, there' s

51:45 a little bit of trunk matter there, from the religious and heavenly or hellish planes. But of course, this third world he' s going to is like very striking, it' s like an alternative land. It reminds me a little bit of what Spiderman does or what Flash does in the same comic book or what Marvel does when they intervene and create those multiverses, those parallel worlds where there are characters identical to them, but they lead other lives. Well, this could look at you. Now that I think about it, it' s come to my mind. It could give a little sense and explanation to this story of the doubles not that a very peculiar type of casuistic, people who meet their double and momentarily and then they disappear and stay like ruminating thinking for the rest of their life. If that was real, new, it was a dream or a hallucination. Well, maybe it doesn' t have anything to do with it, but from Monroe' s vision maybe it does, it might have a lace. It' s not like in MATERAX that in the movie that, from time to time, strange things crossed me. I find these three possibilities fascinating. When you make an astral journey, an extracorporeal fi experience, pure and hard to see things that are happening in this world, enter directly a multiverse where there are fantastic beings like angels or demons and that third choice of a parallel world, which physics tells us

53:17 about these parallel universes. And I have come to read that now, with this quantum world thing, quantum gratifications and such history that when one has a very strong intention to do something, but then one language in a parallel world. If I would have a reflection, for example, I, who wanted to be a physical trainer, well I would have the tests of the National Institute of Physical Education, because imagine that I would have tried them because I would be a teacher of physical education in Spain right now, I would not be here then what that life would be like in that world. Parallel, if something else had happened before in your destination, and that' s what I think is also, apart from travel is astrales, it' s up to us to talk about destination exactly Juange and the same story of Robert Roon Row is very interesting. It turns out that this man was an entrepreneur Juange and he actually made some experiences in order to improve his memory, because to really facilitate his skills in business and he begins to live some very strange experiences.

54:22 The guy begins to experience extracorporeal experiences by publishing them in a book that is made bet seller in the United States and worldwide. Travel outside the body. In a thousand nine hundred and seventy- one and it literally begins to turn John into the maximum referring to the time to speak of this type of experience. No, well, a guy who got into something put a will on him and take a look. Well, then, at the end of the interview, they' re gonna tell us how to start making astral trips. So it' s time to get our batteries up and here we go on a mystery night, a journey through a fantastic multiverse that can be a multiverse full of angels, demons and creatures like fairies, a parallel world or simply move through this world the ability to leave our body. Look at this, even the CIA worked on it for decades and all this was being talked about by José Gregorio González and the interview with him continues. Ah yes, it is not that it is very curious and if we reach out to the cinema of science, fiction, indeed, Doctor Strange is the one who speaks to us, opens those plans to a multiverse or otherwise, I do not know if you have seen it the Fringe series, which for me is very good, the series Frints, which is of a scientist who works in the

55:57 CIA and taking the SD, then the guy is able to get into a parallel world where he is also. And I find it super curious. But you' ve already said one thing that I think is key. And the prologue of your book, which makes it only White alone, also mentions it as the subject of vibration, because when one enters some states of altered consciousness of conscience forgiveness, as is, for example, meditation, because I learned to do medical meditation, because that through a sound. For example, if I start repeating myself well, I take a breath that is called prana, call I stay calm, relaxed and start repeating mentally or manpa ma, not manipameon right now. If you' ve heard my voice right, what I ' m doing is I' m emitting a vibration, which is what it does is it seems like the waves in my brain throw you more inusually and then we get to that state of consciousness. I' m asking you this question that you were telling me to take care of the astral journeys, because according to what vibration are you in or how do you get into the world of demons or do you get into the world of angels? Be careful how it is about vibration and how you touch it in your book repeat the title of the book how to make an extra trip. Yes, I mention it because, evidently, it is part of the tradition and literature and of the own experience of a good handful of astral travelers that I have been able to

57:28 know personally, they support both the literature, and those that I have known directly that you have to be, that is, you have to be a person, have a personal ethic, not to say a man. Obviously, this is ideal in life for everything, for everything. Yes, it is true that no one is free from sin that circumstances may lead you at certain times to get out of a bit of an enriching positive baseline for you others. But, well, that' s already personal decisions. The truth is that, according to that literature and these travelers, if you' re in a bad mood about whether you' ve had a bad day, had a bad run, being a normal, ordinary person, the goals are extensive.

58:13 You' re where you' re sick. You just argued. Let' s say you' re a little negative or very negative. It is preferable that you do not do astral pathways, that you do not try, among other things, because it will cost you more, because your mind is going to be the madman' s mind, it is going to be very monkey ' s mind, it is going to be very active with ruminant thoughts, turning things around and it is going to be very difficult for you to achieve that altered state of consciousness. But if you make it, you' re getting angry, you' re getting sad, you' re getting discouraged, you' re getting pessimistic, no, I mean, you' re coming out just like you' re in life at the time. Then the most likely thing is that the experience is not positive, it is not enriching and it is more like the bad sensations you can have in a sleep paralysis, that anxiety, that agony, that fixia experienced by those who suffer from sleep paralysis. Or if we listen to the travelers themselves and to the literature that you encounter unpleasant things, whether they are real or not, whether they are products of your mind or whether they are or actually have a real assistance on those astral planes, then well, if it' s better that you wait for your life and your order to be better and your attitude to be much more neutral or positive. That with regard to everyday life, man, and if you' re already on a baseline, you' re a person below

59:47 a moral and unscrupulous level and you' re in the realm, in a shady sphere. Even well, I don' t know criminal. Sure, obviously, hey, you' re messing with it there. If you dedicate yourself to traveling, that is clear, that is, if you in your life are always moving in that energy, in that environment. You can' t wait and they' re a logic, you can' t expect that if your consciousness comes out to the other side and your consciousness is Greek or dark, you' re going to go to a bright place, that is, then whether they' re our mental creations that but we edict to the astral, or if they' re entities that are actually there mocking other astral travelers of your own way, because you' re going to find that, and that' s what travelers say or that literature says, what the schools of knowledge say. Therefore, generally, the extracorporal experience, the old astral, in these contemplative practices, in these schools of knowledge, in Buddhism itself, is obtained through the cultivation of virtues, practice, meditation, goodness, detachment. And these experiences or abilities are emerging, of course, almost indirectly, without seeking them. But if you' re looking for them and you ' re better off looking for them in a balanced positive key, because you ' re at risk, even if they' re mind traps, you' re at risk and you can get stuck there in that loop I' m

1:01:19 not saying that you stay in the astral, that this is a myth. I mean, there are no cases. We don' t know anyone who has this or who shares the silver cord or this kind of thing, no, but you can stay there and work, like when someone does a daughter and maybe, because they don' t have their minds focused enough and suddenly they get worked up with that and that obsession. Indeed, obsess arises obsession and is an obsession that does not leave you life look. And it' s very curious what you' re talking about here in Latin America, which, unfortunately, we have a lot of problems, for example, with drug trafficking issues and such all the rituals that are done around the north traffic so that they can pass the shipments. The other day he interviews a Colombian journalist who has made a book about the story of a witch, here who was linked to such stories are always satanic rituals in what one tries to connect with the devil, with that kind of super negative stuff, because the people who are there know that what they are doing is super negative. He' s not gonna ask the guardian angel. No. Indeed, here in Colombia he looks in the magic of esotericism. We have one thing that' s super curious. I think he' s very Colombian. Bad bad guys have a black angel at home who call him in angel angel alone, the angel just how interesting it is Yes, in black angel, which is the angel alone, which is the angel alone, That' s the one who protects you, but only to do bad things. And that' s just a black angel already ready for they' ll collect their tribute sooner or later so obvious

1:02:53 and I don' t know if any of these live on an astral trip doing some kind of that kind of ritual that sheath because you don' t know exactly what the origin of that is that I already tell you is very very Colombian. It' s worth the angel alone and it' s described in literature here, but the origin until that is unknown. It' s like crazy. Listen, José Gregorio, you' ve told us a lot of historical issues and I' d like to before you tell us about the techniques and so that we' ve forgotten, that everyone is safe there already nervous, because you tell them there is a moment. I mean, this is historic. There are Buddhist monks who start to do meditation and who have such experiences. There are the shamans, who use anteogen substances. There are, for example, ascetics who use their physical pain not to eat drink.

1:03:45 But there' s a time when science really starts getting into this. Because you told me a word I didn' t know. The virual sounds. That' s what you' ve said since now. That already sounds that would be, say, synthesize meditation, this sound that made before them of the best paméon and science begins to get into this. At what point does science start to get you into this, to get into this, which I imagine is a brutal revolution. Sure. Of course let' s say that the beginning of scientific research from when science looks at this and other paranormal phenomena, the end of the seventeenth century, the beginning of the twentieth century the moment of the closion of the incipient for psychology, was not yet called the metaphysics that they called it in France. Well, that territory of phenomena that somehow experienced a bloom thanks to spiritism, to the unique average sessions, to the great mediums that made international tours, because with the tables parblantes in the sessions. Well, obviously, that' s a very controversial terrain, because there was a lot of leverage, a lot of fraud, and it' s hard to even tell who was genuine good from who wasn' t.

1:05:03 But in that golden age of phenomena that fascinated the population so much, because they also interested in science, there was no prejudice at that time for a scientist, so that Nobel Prize winners would approach those phenomena that, occasionally, happened spontaneously, but that some psychic mediums, because they seemed able to provoke at will. And so it is at that time, late 19th century, early 20th century, when science, scientists look at that universe of the paranormal. And in that universe, for there is, obviously, also the astral projections, the extracorporal projections, the astral journey, are the projection of consciousness.

1:05:49 And they are all equivalent terms that have been coined according to the time, depending on who was investigating it or describing it. And well, one of the first sources of research, one of the first nurseries where the researchers went, was the spontaneous casuistic that was generated, for example, in the conflicts in World War I. These experiences in which mothers or wives received the astral visit of their children or their husbands, their fathers or their brothers, and then they were aware that they had died on the battlefield after a few days. It was not that last moment, that last thought, surely of that person who fell into battle, for let us say that he managed to project himself and from these cases were collected enough of dying also who described their experiences in hospitals. And that' s the first niche of cases. In addition, in quite remarkable amount that the first researchers at that time access and begin to describe the phenomenon they begin to talk about today since something is happening here. At that time it was discussed whether it was a sort of telepathic projection, that those dying people, because they projected a thought that was what the person perceived miles, thousands of kilometers, sometimes miles away, or if

1:07:24 it really was of that that we called spirit, that he managed to project moments before he died or once dead to give his last farewell. This continues to happen today. A lot of recent casuistics permanently. I' m sure the audience, a part of it, experienced this with some family member to a loved one who may have lost. Then. That' s the first place and it' s rather descriptive. At that moment, what science does is to describe what is happening spontaneously and already with the development of parapsychology, already as such more scientific has passed the years, twenty, years, thirty, years, forty. I think that will be the key story of a man named J. B Ring at Duke University, which is the one who starts everything that is modern parapsychology and which, well, although he once told it on the program for people who don' t know, a Mr J.

1:08:20 Ber Rink was a psychologist and he is the one who starts the concept of modern parapsychology, where he begins to do already a whole series of super serious experiments of telepathy with some letters called Cartacene, which is a mallet of twenty- five letters and also of precognition to advance you to the future. And besides, although today much of science hates us in general. I call you here a brother- in- law towards the term cencinafil when the result episodium I stay what of the cincinnazi. Well, but let them know that the virmal Albert Einstein supported the acts experiments of j b Ring, so this gets so serious that it gets done in laboratories, in universities and even gets involved in trust. Yes, yes, yes, yes, correct, I mean, Ring himself, along with his wife Luisa or Lois, also investigated the astro journey of management. In other words, the experiences are corporal to a lesser extent that the percision is sensory or psychokinesis. Not good. It seems to me that this was what they were doing with telekinesis as coins and dice, that is, they were really boring experiments, because they were looking for a lot of results to have a statistical value. I mean, they were most tedious, but they were grains, results, of course, but just very important. Of course, they were very important for, as you

1:09:55 said, giving scientific rigor status to what so far rather descriptive case compilation and it was very difficult to work. Well, they worked with psychics, but they worked with people on foot in these experiments and well, they also researched to a lesser extent astral projection. They were one of the first, but obviously there were other authors. Tyler was one of those who collected a lot of information. Also another parapsychologist linked to society for British psychic research. I ' m thinking in name and besides, going over the list here. There were many Carrington, who wrote one of the reference books. Today you can still get that book. And then there are, then, the experiments that were carried out and in which the company finally intervened, in this case in Stanford. They called it remote vision, bounced, remote vision, which is another term. Another was the same, another way. Of course, you imagine in a lab talking about old astral, as it was more comfortable for him to talk about remote vision. But in the end it was the same.

1:11:05 It was to project consciousness to travel to remote places with coordinates given to them and to describe those subjects. What was there and there was you with a brutal l right, a funny fact that I don' t know if you know him or not. C is a project that was the Stargate project, where it brought together all this of what remote vision is. If you download it on the Internet, guess where the first experiment is in Colombia, on San Andrés Island. Ah seriously to the first is a guy who is in the United States, who is not said is crossed out the name of the sensitive one orders him to describe a place on the island of San Andrés, in Colombia, where there is an airport and the guy describes the airport with a hangar in a series of pods, at a military airport on the island of San Andrés, and described it perfectly and they are stunned. That ' s how the project starts, the Stargate project, which is one thing like super crazy good and to see what this was doing. He' s been working a long time. Note that there is a curious story related precisely to these experiments and the pentagon itself and to two researchers. It' s anecdotal, but symptomatic. At the same time, Harold Pudor and Chartar Puro are involved in everything about the zomnis and today the guy is still getting into himself, this is in the mk Ultra, also in the ultra mk exactly

1:12:38 for his first experiments, precisely for the pentagon and he was doing it. I don' t remember the cynic and I don' t know if it was whether they already worked with suan or others or Price don' t know. I want you to buy in those early experiments the untrue level was so brutal in describing secret military installations that they suspected they were spies, that is, that they were then subjected to an investigation into the psychic and the parapsychologists themselves, that they were physicists and a psychologist because they thought they had information, that is, that they had not traveled through extrasensory perception, but they were clear that it was a fraud that handled the location and the plans of ultra secret facilities. Then they had to convince the financiers themselves that they were not spies. It is also true that the United States had a lot of paranoia with the Soviets or the Chinese who could be bad or Soviet at that time, who could be with people infiltrated and in fact had it in other cases. But from there, well, when they proved their innocence, notice, they proved their innocence, because the funding increased and these kinds of experiments were developed more widely. But look, how curious, that is, the

1:14:09 level of percision was so great that it says good is that these have been there, that is to say that these have stolen the plans from us, not to say good, a very curious anecdote of all that plotting, of the starga, of the mk ULTRA, of that interest and financing, so I follow that it has always been deployed from the military sphere. Indeed, and it' s super curious. They also came to think that Hingo Swan, who is perhaps with the guy they worked with the widest, came to think that Ingo Swan had a super memory and was able to memorize all the coordinates again and the guy did not fail. It said here of a mountain. There' s a river here, until he also described to them ultra secret bases of them and said no I mean this guy is impossible to be noticed. The case of Suan is exciting because he was an absolutely exceptional psychic, an artist, an incredible painter and painted among the things he painted, some had to do with astral journeys with what he saw. Not then does he have a series of pictures of Saturn' s Jupiter landscapes, when there was not that after the photographs that began to send the waves, for they were appeared to be decals not of that which he had theoretically seen in astrales and had traveled even through the solar system. But they' re really crazy, because within the Stargate project there' s a part where I dingo Swang surprises him so much that they tell him. Okay, now you' re

1:15:41 going to go to planet Mars and tell us what happened in the past. That was an experiment funded by the American government, gentlemen, and that is that the Stargate project is crazy, but totally and absolutely real and it really did. I' m one of those who thinks that if you put a lot of money and a lot of time into this, it' s or that the results were very convincing. Alejandro Bernal how was the project star Gaek Juang, because in the early seventies, a number of researchers linked to Stanford University, Rossell Turk and Harold Pureof who you were talking about a few moments ago were the promoters of this initiative and they who sought with the Stargate project. How, through psychic abilities, to be able, in this case, to obtain information from the other great hegemonic power that existed at that time, which was the Soviet Union. Aung of course, indeed, that is because they knew that the Russians also had a program, they also had their program and they were with different psychics. For example, the most famous was Ninaculaline, exactly Juan. So, to develop this Stargate project, they set three fundamental objectives. On the one hand, they needed the economic tug, the funding had millions of dollars from the Towards to develop this. On the other hand, Juan Gin needed to have the contact and why not say it, recruit people to demonstrate those very advanced psychic skills, including Ingo Swan and a

1:17:11 character who became very famous for a few decades, Juan Genio, only in your country, in Europe and all over the world, a man named Uri Geller, who was very famous because he was able to fold covered spoons on public television, live. It was an amazing thing what this gentleman was doing He reads Uli Geller. And it turns out John that this gentleman a few years ago, through an autobiography he published, commented on how he became part of the Stargate project. In August of one thousand nine hundred and seventy- three. Geller comments that precisely in that year CIA agents contacted him, inviting him to be part of a series of tests of experiments that were carried out in the framework of this project Juange and subjected him ter from the four to the eleven of August, a full week, in the seventy- three, to a series of experiments. To Brigeller what this series of dynamics consisted of.

1:18:08 It turns out that Geller was locked in a room, his eyes were blindfolded and two rooms later, with absolutely armored doors, the agents made a drawing, asked Geller what he saw that was what appeared there. And it turns out Juange that in two of those experiences the results were impressive. On one occasion they drew a firecracker and Uri Gether said it was a cylinder from which a noise came out. He told that to the CIA agents, the agents who were hallucinated because they said, because he didn' t say exactly that it was a fart other it looked very much like what he created. Then they drew a bunch of grapes and origineler said I saw round things of purple color I had observed or at least had thrown it into the form and official opinion. And so said Urigueler Juan gel Era, that clearly this man had a proven paranormal ability, unequivocally and convincingly to power images through his psychic power. Uri Geller, a man who was part of this Stargate project initiative.

1:19:16 In a thousand nine hundred and seventy- five, Burigeler unleashed a worldwide madness, that is, with his famous program where he went out bending, spooning with his mind and people were at home and many said that he also doubled the spoon. He became famous worldwide and I believe in some of the Durigueller things, as he heard it again. So there could be a trick. But another truth is that the guy, because he' s a genius, because he' s cheating on CIA agents and these two psychologists, because I don' t think it' s easy for the title of curiosity. I was at the door of Durigueller' s house, in Jaffo, in Israel, at the door of the house and it' s funny. Well, already Jafo is right next to you the VIP is glued to Tela Vives are beautiful houses. I' d swear it' s the most expensive square meter in Israel, that' s where a house is very expensive and it ' s a museum house and when we arrived it wasn' t open.

1:20:15 And at the door of the house he has a giant sculpture. I don ' t know, like, 12 or 14 meters. It' s a folded spoon. That' s how he knows it' s the home of the person brand, Origaller' s personal brand. But the star Gate project was a real madness and lasted many decades and characters like Riguel like Ingostente were there and with a lot of successes and impressive. Exactly juang Urigeller also from this Pandora' s box, because he said he didn' t only do it if one of other important intelligence centers, such as the Busat, had their own psychic research programs. What happens is the Mozat are much more professional. If they don' t find out exactly. It' s basically the best chis kids, the best secret service in the world. That' s not sorting anything. And we were talking about the Star Gate project, a CIA project that recruits people with special qualities, and one of the most we could say they were looking for was remote vision. Ingo Swan worked for them for decades and even Uri Geller himself, people who were able to unfold and see things that were in far away places. Do not go because in this piece of interview that is missing, in addition, they will tell us techniques

1:21:48 to make an astral trip, so that you can become travelers of a multiverse, and the interview with José Gregorio González continues like this. We are not fighting here for Gregorio González and I don' t mean, and he described that there were very high anthropomorphic beings on Tuesday of five hundred million years ago and that there was life and oceans. And such a good thing that we really know from science that if so, there was ocean and so on today there are still ice left on planet Mars. But it really had to be something fascinating because they got convinced on foot that he hears this guy is able to get out of his body and see other things, because we already curl up the curl, we send them through the solar system and he gives us information about what' s out there, what' s out there, that is, it' s a freak thing. Well, it' s an example of the broad spectrum that encompasses this phenomenon of astral travel. Let' s say it' s clearly this term astral journey. I don' t think it has contributed in recent years to giving it respectability and to seeing how deep it is, because people see it as more esoteric, more than really, that it even has a scientific backing, which is the great thing about your book that you put in it. So that scientific repla is a label that has a raison d'être at the time when it was coined, Not if that time from where the schools of knowledge, the hermetic schools, had a great impulse and they called it so, not also as homage debtors

1:23:21 of a millennium tradition. But of course, the terms more talk about projection of consciousness or extracorporal, because perhaps it can be more correct, even today. But, well, I' m sorry that the old astral label is and with that we have to handle ourselves and, in fact, the book uses it. But it can lead to deception, it can lead to error for those who do not deepen, because they can, as you say, think that this is something that is part of the last, of esotericism. When it really moves in areas ranging from neurophysiology, medicine, the realm is military. Well, it has very significant, very broad repercussions. Yes, indeed, and I' m telling you, the experiments on the gum made it clear that, gentlemen, we' re not clear about the mechanism, but this works. There are people who are able to train their minds so much that, indeed, they are able to go out and go to physical places on those other worlds that I would call astrals within a multiverse, because there would be much more complex. Hey, we' ve got ten minutes of interviews left, and then what' s already been promised. It' s debt or if you won' t want an insulted one in the comments here on YouTube that you can' t even imagine how we can make astral trips, what techniques are used or what techniques forgiveness you recommend to us And

1:24:55 besides, you don' t recommend them, but you describe them also in the book so that people say hey I' m going to try to have an astral trip, try to be one of trying to move around the multiverse notice. Before I answer that, I' m looking for a dat dale looks very eye- catching to me from another great parapsychologist who was Scott Robo. Your books seem very curious to me and you can get many of them second hand. One American who was also in everything dedicated and I think he is one of the best, a great divulgator, and he also participated in developing experiments with astral projection and in some used animals, even in others used beams of light and travelers. They also worked with Shuan, with pris and with some others. And this is interesting because it gives us clues how from that astral projection you can influence the physical world, which is a very curious story. There are no witnesses who claim to have seen southern and traveling projections until they have interacted with people who are awake then they developed several experiments and in one of those experiments, the one that was projecting in astral managed to divert the trajectory from a ray of light. From one light they are laboratories of laboratory functions and in other experiments with animals in particular, they worked with

1:26:26 a snake. They were able to influence, that is, the snake was reacting defensively and preparing for the attack. When the astral traveler was from the astral including the snake, i e wow, I was seeing it I was sensing it, i e, obviously, when it deviates from light there is some kind of force. Some kind of force is being exerted on the path of light, but in the other case we don' t know if I was seeing or perceiving it in some way, but it generated an effect. Then they are very resounding experiments, also in the scientific field and with instruments and with non- suggestive beings, in this case animals, which show that something was happening, that something was actually being produced. And well, and with respect to techniques, watch that we don' t have problems, that doesn' t give you good. I understand, that I understand, I assume already this we will see in the comments today successively, that a part of your audience already controls the phenomenon. So they are travelers and they pass it clear form, that they are spontaneously at best, maybe from birth or to root some event or have learned it, they have developed the technique And the good news is that, according to the experience according to the data, because surely all or almost all of them experience them spontaneously during sleep, but they do not remember. Okay, they don' t remember. Then there

1:27:57 are techniques to connect with that, remember it and handle it something very similar to a lucid dream, but with its nuances. Okay, then. All the recommended techniques go through the relationship of whether to practice relaxation, you have to place yourself in a context, in an environment where you can relax, where you can spend fifteen minutes, half an hour, a quiet hour. Evidently, the ideal is when you' re sleeping, because you know you ' re going to have a much wider time frame. But if we want to practice it outside of that the dream, because we have to choose a comfortable place, where there are not going to be slammed air currents that close the window, where no one will enter in unexpectedly, that will stand out, where we do not have distracting noises, you know a suitable temperature, that is, the place that we would choose to relax and to sleep.

1:28:58 That each one adapts little to its resource and to the environment in which you are. We can use some kind of music. That goes a little bit to the taste of all these piural sounds that I think is sure to be good. Of course that makes it easy to sound by mouth save you part of this tour using good incense which can help everyone relax in its fundamental. Then it all happens in that phase, one by learning to get physically relaxed, really notice that, from the somatic point of view, your body is relaxed, that you are able to leave it behind, that you have no discomfort, that you are not feeling the weight on a certain part, or that it squeezes a garment or things of these. That is to really relax, because with a countdown, little by little breathing well, there are many techniques deep breathing relationship the flame that you can look for on YouTube, which is very faci clear, any technique of this is fundamental. That, that ' s a pillar of astral travel and altered states of consciousness in general.

1:30:06 A second fundamental pillar is also visualization. We have to learn to visualize. We have to learn to visualize and that is also facilitated by the state of relaxation, that is, we have to because many of the techniques pass by to see you, to imagine you in certain situations and of course, for that we have to have a capacity to visualize trained. Not to say that if I tell you I imagine an apple, you see an apple and you don' t see anything else that happens often. I imagine an apple and you imagine a pineapple, or you imagine a car, or you imagine the neighbor or neighbor that you like a little bit, that is, you have to learn to visualize, because the techniques happen, because you see yourself coming out of your body, because you see yourself floating, that is, in these first moments, in that second phase, which is visualization, Once you are relaxed, you have to imagine, visualize how it enters, for example, in some techniques, a beam of white light that invades you, that covers your whole body, that impregnates you and that you separate. You have to go visualizing this, that separates your physical body, your consciousness, your double astral, For example, even the level of visualization can be so precise that you can imagine this at the cellular level, even at the organ level or at the level of parts of the body, That is, that you see how that detachment is produced and it takes shape a kind of double more

1:31:44 solid or subtler, more luminous or denser, more like you as a double as it is or in a more silent way. But you have to imagine that, which is a very important second phase. Then, from this moment on, it depends on the author. Some recommend that you imagine a kind of trapdoor in your skull, in your mind, a kind of window through which you go peeking goes somehow escaping or coming out that double. That would be a possibility. Other authors suggest that when you imagine that double, I am making the gesture here that they are not seeing, but well, they have to imagine one hand over another how they separate and the double is detached from the physique. That is another technique, that is, that second phase of pure visualization and imagination. And from practice, that is, from actually getting a deep relaxation and if altered state of consciousness and control, that is, having the attention in visualization. There will come a time when you will experience and each person may vary, but they are usually frequent symptoms or signs.

1:33:02 You' re going to experience two things, two or three things. First, a vibration. If your body vibrates, we remember what we talked about before the property. There' s like some sort of acceleration and you ' re gonna notice that that' s different from something natural. You' re gonna recognize it as something distinctive and a buzz is a kind of sound. Some describe it as an engine, as something that goes like accelerating exactly something like that. Then they are two of the signs of what in other contexts, such as epilepsy or sleep paralysis, is usually called aura. Not to say not esoteric laura as with colors, but the most medical term, so let' s say that they are the signals for you to be prepared, because that acceleration and that vibration seem to be symptoms of the unfolding.

1:34:04 And it is important to be very attentive to that Juange, because it comes next, there comes a key phase, a key moment, that is, if you overcome it, you will have a traveler at that moment and if you are not going to return as a massace to your body. There' s a time when this is so cooled down and intensified so much, that there' s like a click in which you see yourself and out, that is, you' re already seeing yourself and there that moment is key. There you panic the most absolute, that is, the error, the terror in the vast majority of people, what there is at that moment and my own experience has little to do with that now, if there is a moment, I tell you, because everything you have read in literature, everything that others have told you, is of no use. You' re facing the most. You looked like death. If at that moment you' re seeing yourself outside and you' re seeing your conscience, your common sense, your reason, your intellect, your culture, you' re telling you, but let' s see. This can' t be. This can' t be. I' m dead, I' m dead. And that' s where you panic. You know the panic in anxiety, I mean, my mother, I mean, that she groans dead, that I didn' t want to die, I mean I want to go back, I don ' t want to go back. So that moment I tell you, I count it with other people so that you' re ready, so that I manage it, so that you calm down, so that I breathe that you haven' t died, that is, it' s fair that' s

1:35:34 what you' re looking for. That' s why you' ve been training for days so you can get it, I mean, stay calm because you come back as soon as you want, that is, to the veversity of thought. But since you' re out and you' ve done it, Jolinés, you have to get over that moment to be able to enjoy that first experience, because the panic that you live makes many people immediately come back, that is, enter your body abruptly and jump in You know your body even reacts with a small tremor, like an even physical jump, which is real, that is, and then that feeling, that fear, makes it difficult for next occasions. Not because good already, but good if you get over it. You' re at the key moment to be able to travel, explore your surroundings. I didn' t risk you at that first moment getting too far away. There, you are far away, that is to say, take confidence and try to touch something, that is, to approach a place where you know your own body, to observe your own experience of observing you, to say it is different, to see you in a mirror, then good. You can even try to see if you have a body. You know if there' s a mirror nearby, you know, all this kind of stuff can be done in this first or second experiences for

1:37:06 you to gain insecurity and apart from there, you can get away now. But you have to be constant. It has to be constant and in the case of sleep, it is programming. Programming, I mean I want to wake up. This is a pure and hard psychological technique for many things. I don' t want to wake up? When I' m naked, when I' m projected, when you' re dating, I want to wake up. And this is programming. You know, and based on forcing it, that is, programming you, the time will come when you' re going to be conscious, not then clear to the first occasions that you ' re conscious. Anyway, it' s hard for you to realize that you' re aware and that you' re not still in a dream that you think you are. Well, then. This is a matter of practicing it, being persevering, not being in an eternity, that is, if to you at two or three weeks you do not experience any result leave them, it is not your moments your phenomenon changes technique, but both the first of relaxation visualization and that of dreams, this usually results, that is, ten days, fifteen days, if you are persevering, and you have to take into account the fear, in the first case and in the second case, that dream component that can lead you to think that it is a dream then ready to take. There you have to wake up at that moment and there are differences between the lucid sleep and the astral journey, which will not

1:38:39 give you time to count. But there are some very recent studies in Argentina that, in addition, have found differences in the emotional burden, of some experiences and of others, in the patterns that follow at the brain level, some experiences and others. I mean, it' s good that these are some of the techniques I' m counting on in the book. There' s another extreme. Not as a good thing, I included them in a descriptive way like eating or eating dinner or having something very salty without drinking water. And then, right now we' re going to force the physical. This technique was used a lot at the beginning of the 20th century and apparently gave results in a persevering and recurring way, because it was interpreted as the thirst you experienced leading you to unfold in search of water. It said at night, then it was an extreme way to force him. Listen to the secretory. It doesn' t give me time anymore, because I' m not going to finish the interview and I don' t want to edit anything at all. I want to insert the inte. Dude, you don' t know how happy it has made me to meet you again after a decade, you and me dating Canaria in Colombia, ten zero kilometers from your house, and know that here you have your house in a short while. I hope we can see each other either in Madrid, or take a little trip to the Canary Islands, which I haven' t been there for a long time. I wish you well, you' re a crack man. Anything

1:40:11 would make you feel better about some other interview. Of course, I would like to recommend the book by José Gregorio González. How to make an astral journey. Your conclusion and your closings, José Gregorio. Well, I' ll see this, but it' s because of you that I feel an extraordinary affection, a great admiration. I hope soon the virtual. It helps, obviously, but I hope that soon we can have a hug. And well, beyond all that we have commented, the great message and the great value of the phenomenon that we have talked about is that it gives us clue about our transcendence and to have clue that we are transcendent beings, that we are something more than this, that we experience, that it is very good and that we must enjoy it and experience it to the fullest. It is also an invitation to cultivate ourselves and to do a little better with the environment, with those around us and with ourselves, thinking that everything we do in this life has an echo in eternity and in a multiverse. José Gregorio González, a fellow friend, a strong hug and many thanks, a Ford hug, friend, what a brutal interview, because the theme is astral travel.

1:41:23 We repeat the name of the book How to make an astral journey by José Gregorio González Editorial Luciernaga. You have it on Amazon here, all over Latin America. But the research done to Joseph Gregory is great, because it opens up to us a whole world, not only extracorporeal appearances, but it is also talking to us about near- death experiences, how they relate to this, how we are really travelers of a multiverse and when our life ends, we go from universe to universe to universe. He' s talking to us that our consciousness is beyond our body. And what hit me the most about parallel worlds, our life in a parallel world and being able to see that.

1:42:13 I would love to keep the technique and see if we always start practicing a little bit at the Jandra Barna No Mara Villa. From that juange about what you commented about the relationship of astral journeys with near- death experiences. A few days ago, Juange reported on a study conducted by Zamparni, one of the major references to near- death NDEs worldwide, where he conducted a study with five hundred and seventy- six Juange patients and twenty percent of them, who were living cardiopulmonary resuscitation, that is, had clinically dead. Exactly Juange, they had near death experiences from where he rents twenty percent quite high percentage. Juanje and what Samparnia says right now, because it was an investigation that was made of two thousand seventeen, two thousand twenty before the pandemic.

1:43:01 It is that for him it is not a hallucination, it is not a trap of the mind Champarney uses that question, that literary figure Juanse, but clearly is a true experience. People whose consciences come out of the body and are able to describe medical procedures, details of the continuances, of the doctors, conversations of the same and others. Something amazing and total and absolutely real, and it' s that death is nothing more than a step into our life, it' s not an end. And all this that we have talked about today takes us back to the time of the Thamans, where these men were able to get out of their bodies to get into a magical world of angels, demons, fairies and beings of other dimensions. Alejandro varnal Neo inclusion of your close friend a wonderful journey, Juan Ge, through I believe that one of the most interesting themes also in the world of mystery that had asked us in the comments. We had always been told to talk about astral travel and how good to approach it from a journalistic point of view. But I research, Juan very interesting the exercise we did with José Gregorio González and I keep something you said. I think it' s a journey through dimensions, a multidimensional journey. When we talk about this type of experiences related to

1:44:32 astral trips, make it interesting to know your experiences and if you can share it with us or if you have already made experiences of astral trips, share it there through chat, in the comments on YouTube, because Juan and I want to read them and I can follow them on social networks, through Twitter, Instagram and tiktok in arroba a bernal pres with s Many thanks, friend, because tell you what I say many times that we redraw the limits of reality. One thing is what we see, what we touch on empirically, and another thing is the world of consciousness and the spiritual, because I do believe in that multiverse. I do believe that we have a soul, a consciousness that is immortal, that lives in a multiverse where there are forces, dark and light forces, so when they come out of their bodies, if they do this kind of technique, always look for the light and why not that fascinating parallel world where another I have another life that is possibly fascinating and never forget that we live in a magical world because it is full of mystery