Build New Bridges: Turning Impossible Conversations Into Connection

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0:44 Denzel Washington, Welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you to do the same. Great Welcome to the show, Doctor Doug. Thank you for having me here. I really appreciate you having me on today. I'm excited. I love looking to the bookcase behind you and all of your books there, so that's great. I keep wanting to write one, but well, I've written one book, but I'd love to write some more. Boy, I'll tell you what it's tough. It is Well, I have to say I've only written one. I'm on the second one right now, but all of those are programs i'm actually master certified in. I've been teaching all of those classes, like Crucial Conversations for more than twenty four years, so I've been doing that, but I put them back there because they're a big part of my life.

1:33 Well, that's fantastic. What I'd like you to do is kind of shared quickly your background, who you are and what your background is. Yeah, I'm Greg Stevens and I went to Baylor University, put myself through in four years, worked in a lot of different sales jobs, and in back in nineteen ninety nine, I actually started my own business where I teach communication skills. I used to teach man women relationship programs. I became a master certified and Crucial Conversations, Crucial Accountability. Did that work for about twenty four years, and then I wrote my own book and called Build New Bridges The Art of Restoring Impossible Relationships, and I released that in January of this year, twenty twenty five. This might not air until twenty twenty six. It was January twenty twenty five when I actually actually released my book, and I teach people how to have the most difficult conversations of their life.

2:32 I taught teaching crucial conversations was amazing, but I found people needed handholding to actually learn the skills. A consistency practice creates permanence in the insights you have. I find so often people have these insights, but they don't know how to make them permanent. And that's what I do with people, help them with that be able to have the most difficult. Conversations for their fantastic and you know, later on i'll share youty okay about that. But meanwhile, you who got a great story about your father and really kind. Of what led up? If I read the story right, it's kind of what led you to write your book. Is that a fair assessment?

3:15 Yes, yeah, it is. As I was teaching crucial conversations, I thought, how can I be the type of leader that practices what they teach? And I had a crazy idea to go clean up all my past relationships. So when I say clean up a past relationship, people say, what does that mean? Well, if you're walking down a hall and you had an alternative route to go to your destination rather than past that person, you took the alternative route. That was a relationship I needed to clean up, real simple litmus test. So I had a list of thirty six people on the list, and it took me about two and a half years. And the first chapter of my book is about my relationship with my father because it is the very last conversation I had after two and a half years. I put it off until I couldn't put it off anymore, and I told my mom I was finally going to have the conversation with my father. She said, and she was always my cheerleader up to that point. She said, no, you don't. She said, I'll never see you again if you have that conversation with your father. Because my father was a very strict old time Southern Baptist Hellfire and Brimstone walk up in the aisle down the off, screaming preacher, and my life was very different than that, and I wanted to come clean with my dad about my life and so but I talked with her and she said, she said, I understand why you need to have it. So I had the conversation with my dad and it didn't go well at first. Needless to say, I approached him using all

4:48 the skills I have, and at the end of me laying everything out to him, my dad looked at me straight in the face. He said, son, you're a hypocrite, You're a liar, and I never want to talk to you again. Wow. And here, and how how old were you at that time? I was thirty eight thirty eight of the time, and he looked at me when he said that. I think it was thirty eight, thirty six or thirty eight. I'm trying to remember right now, but yeah. And in that moment, everything in me said, I'm the hypocrite. You're the hypocrite, because I remembered all the things he had done, and in that moment I nearly called him a hypocrite. And we would have gotten to what we call a downward spiral.

5:32 But something stopped me, and then all of my training started to kick in, and I asked myself questions. I turned my brain back on, and I thought, you know, what is it I really want here with my father? Why did I do this in the first place. Well, I was originally doing it to be able to stand in front of a group saying I practiced this, But in that moment, I realized, like every little boy, I wanted a relationship with my father, no matter what that was. And when that hit, everything started to change. What's my I roll in this? And I realized Dad was right. I was a hypocrite to him because I would tell him to his face what he wanted to hear, and I'd live my life a different way. But I was trying to get that cleaned up. And the next question is like, why would I reasonable, rational, decent person do what he's doing right now? He's not reasonable, rational or decent.

6:19 But that's not what the question is about. It's about turning your own brain back on. And I realized the reason he's acting that way is he's fearful. He feels like a failure. Right now is my father and as my minister all my life. And then what do I need to do right now to actually move toward what I want? I knew what I needed to do, and I looked at him, and all my preparation went out the door, but my heart came out. I looked at him and said, Dad, you're right, I am a hypocrite to you. Mom knows what I do, my family knows, all my friends know. I live my life out in the open. I've kept it from you because I was worried you want to disown me, and I can see I was right right now, but that's not what I want.

7:02 I said, you said you'd stay an entire week, you just got here. Would you give me just three more days? But if you stay those three days, we have to talk about everything we kept from each other. So if we never see each other again in this lifetime, at least we will know who we were to each other. My dad looked at me. He's crying. He said, son, it won't make a bit of difference, but I'll give you the three days. Then I never want to see your face again. I can't look at you right now. You make me sick. He walked out the door and slammed the door. So that was that conversation. But he came back in about two hours later after driving around and sat down and said, let's do this talking thing.

7:43 So that was my audience. But over the next three days we talked about everything that really mattered, and it was the first time I ever had a connection with my father, and I was so happy because after three days, I thought, Wow, this is amazing. I've got the relationship with my father I've always wanted. And the next morning I woke up and he's standing at the door with his luggage. He said, well, I'm gonna go. I told you i'd gone after three days, and my heart sunk. I said, okay. I walked him out the door, and he throws his luggage in the trunk, closes it, looks me dead in the eye, says nothing gets in his car. He drives away and he dies three years later. Now the reason I start that with a book because when you show up for your conversations that I teach you can never change the other person. All you can do is do your best. But I also found out that day, when you do your best, you have no idea what can show up and happen. Because that car stopped about halfway down the street. It sat there, A second backed up pulled in. My dad got out, came running to me, hugged me and cry and he says, son, I love you, and I like you. I like the man you become.

8:53 He said, honestly, I always wanted you to be a preacher. You like to party way too much for that, he said. I always me about the alcohol. But he said I'd like to start this relationship you're talking about. And once you get several days ago as a conversation, now it's a relationship. And before my dad passed away, he and I became amazing, amazingly closed, great friends. Everything was said, there was real completion, and it was interesting because my dad told me one time. I said, Dad, here's I would like to tell our story to people, and here's how I'd like to tell it. And I told it to him, just like I told you today, and he looked at me and said, son, I'm not that way anymore.

9:36 And when I consistently tell people when I'm working with them, you have no ability to change another person. But if you change how you do things, they may have to change how they engage with you. And that's your real power. Most people get in these situations with people they want to blame them, They want to see them as the problem. I see each interaction like that as my ability and chance to grow to get better, to be able to speak into their listening. It's a hard thing to speak into someone else's listening because you've got to consider their view, their judgments, how they view the world, and understand love them through that care for him because they're just a hurting soul just like you are.

10:18 So I have a very personal question for you. So as you as you made that difference in your relationship with your dad, and that relationship change, and you saw your dad change with his behavior towards you, did you see his behavior change towards his congregation or towards other people or was he still the same SOB that you had experienced as a preacher. Yeah, I saw him. I always. Here's what it was interesting. My dad always loved other people at a level that he knew how to connect. I believe that's where I got my understanding of how to connect with people. It was just his own kids. He didn't My mom even said, she said, son, your father was a great husband. He was just a terrible father. But you look at his parents and I understood why. But one of the things I do love is my father. Even when he could he had cancer, he couldn't get out and talk to people, he called people every day and said he went through you know, they had a small congregation, but he went every week. He called everyone in his in his congregation to be able to engage with well.

11:31 And the reason I asked that is because as I interviewed a lot of people, I think one of the points that has really hit me strongly, and particularly for people who are in really difficult relationships. You know, you with your dad, but many times it's spouses, and you know, I need to change my spouse. I need to make them this way, I need to make them that way. And kind of the whole concept that we've talked about is that as you change and as you develop those skills of communication, of conversation and all of that, all of a sudden, many many times, maybe higher percentage than not, that person for some reason changes without going through that whole process of personal transformation and so forth. Have you seen that happen with the folks you work with every single time?

12:24 Yeah, because there's a there's a connection that happens. Doesn't mean they do everything differently, but how they engage with the other person. There's also what I found is when someone has the courage to step up, there's a compassion and understanding that happens on the other side. Most people when I work with them, I don't want to have this conversation. I don't either. I want what's on the other side of the conversation. It's always hard. And but the question is are you trading your piece or what you think is comfort? Because I've seen people put up conversations for two, five, even ten years, and at the end of it, if they're going to get forward, they've still got to go have that conversation. I'd rather have a fifteen minute to two hour conversation with someone than live with that for ten years. And well, you too, Yeah, what you typically find is you to answer your question, doctor Doug is yeah, because there's something that happens in that interaction. There's a human thing that goes on. And there's what I found is there's a realization of hope where there wasn't hope before.

13:35 Well, and you know, we're going to get into a lot of these concepts of how do you have a better conversation and how do you change that relationship I'd shared with you before we actually came on the show that I have. I have kind of a fun story growing up. My children experienced this with me their parent. Years into it, I realized I really started looking at communication and one of the things I realize is that words are so important, the words. That we use. And so I would teach my children, and I would do this too, is that if I used the word that I thought maybe they didn't understand, I would say, here's what that word means to me, okay. And so I was talking to my daughter the other day and she was telling me about a trip she went on with one of her girlfriends. Now, she's, you know, twenty eight years old, but when she was in high school she had this number of friends, but this particular one, it was kind of a rough, rough relationship.

14:40 Going on and on. But anyway, this other weekend, she headed down to southern Utah with them, and they were going down and she got into a conversation and she used the word and she says, well, let me explain what that means. And the other her friend, it just got so upset, and my daughter says, what is wrong? She says, you have done this to me your whole life. You think I'm stupid, and therefore you define words that you think I don't understand. And so she got in the whole thing about me. Her dad had just literally taught the kids, you need to define these words because people will misunderstand or not understand, and part of communication is making sure that they truly.

15:28 Understand what you're saying. Absolutely, And it's interesting because she was doing that to be clear, and it was still unclear because the person made it mean something different. She made it mean I'm stupid, and that's just it. In the absence of information, we make it up. So she makes up each time she's defining it. And I love that you did that with your kids, because so often I define this one way, you might define it another, and if we don't have that, there's no c your message. Well so often and and it really made a difference for them. Yeah, she says, oh, absolutely, it. Changed their whole conversation and to some degree their relationship just it was a four or five hour drive, so.

16:15 They had a chance to talk a lot. Well, but I love that. But here's what's also amazing. She never knew that her friend felt like that until she said it. That's right. We assume so much in our relationships that it's it's it's amazing we get across our message at all because we make so many assumptions and we don't set up what those words mean, what what our what our intention is behind it, and then we leave so much open for people to read it. The wrong way. Well, and you know, as you talk about these relationships that you had to go back and repair, how many of those relationships it went bad were a result of communication.

17:04 Well, i'd say they were all resolved, and but no, no, no, it would not resolved the result of well, the result oh or the results of poor communication. Oh, I'd say every one of them because because because that's just it, I didn't know how to communicate during tough times, I would typically shut down, walk away. A lot of them were people I had ghosted because I didn't know how to have the conversation. Others were conversations that I had attacked people I tend to go on the attack or or shut down, which we all do under address until we understand how to manage those emotions in that moment.

17:44 So some of them, also, Doctor Doug, were I didn't even need to I didn't even need to hear from the other person. I needed to just say what I never said. Many times, someone who had to come to go to someone and see, you know, there there's probably even not an issue on your end. If there was, I'd love to hear it. But there's something I never said, and I needed to be able to say it. You don't need to fix anything right now, but would you could I bend your ear for a minute. Yeah, And then I'd go through and say what I never said. They go, oh, I never wanted you to feel that way. I understand that was going on with me. But what happened was I let it go after that. So how many times in those broken relationships when you were able to resolve some of that, did you find that they didn't feel like it was a broken relationship and they were surprised that you walked away or were they all as broken, you know it, wanted to be away from you as much as you wanted to be away from them.

18:43 It is probably about thirty percent of the people that I had gone to that they didn't even know there was an issue and it was all in my head that it had happened. And then also probably another twenty to thirty percent where it was a different issue for them they saw something completely different. So there's all this miscommunication going on and things not being said, and that's just what do we do. We simmer those things. And how you know is look at where your complaints are around people. If you've got complaints around people, you've got something that needs to be cleaned up well. And you know, I'm so impressed that you are a certified behavioral analyst and I am too. And we were talking about this before we came on the show, But you use the disc test and one of the things I worked with my kids initially, and then as I was working with other people, I used it too. But one of the things I said to them after I started getting feedback from them, saying, Dad, you know, I don't like the way you're talking to me. And so as I started to do a little bit of research and finally got into this whole behavioral aspect and personality evaluations, I realized that I'm a strong personality. I'm very much at that time. At least I've changed. But I was HIGHD with some c very analytical, and my children I had one son that was that way, but my other children were very.

20:11 Much right brain. So they were extrovert eyes, right brain and so on and so forth. And so what I found was that I had to actually stop and start to listen, and so I would actually sit down with them when we started a conversation earth they came to me with a question or he wanted to talk, I say, Okay, do you want me to listen or do you want my opinion? And most of the time is that I just want you to listen. And as I did that, then you know, would get into some good conversations. But what have you found? How important is it that people understand, particularly whether you're in these deep relationships, whether children's, spouse, you know, special other person. How important is it in your mind that they that we understand and how they would like to be spoken to. Oh.

21:03 I think it's a huge part because it allows if you want to really communicate something, you have to consider how the other person understands. Just me speaking doesn't communicate what that understanding. So until I get that connection of understanding, and part of that means I need to understand, I need to be able to speak into a way that you do. So an extrovert, there's so many different things than an introvert. An introvert feels like you're pushing it on them. An extrovert needs to understand and need to back off a little pull in, use more data on these things, because if I want that person to hear what I'm saying, or I'm just talking at a wall.

21:44 Also in communication. As doctor Doug I found there are foundational things, and I think the foundation things are psychological safety, respect, and purpose. Those are the foundation about building and you have to have that. Then I consider the disc or Myers Briggs all that that's the framework of how the house is built. You can have all you think about. That's the details of it. So we all need a firm human foundation. We need that respect, we need that trust, we need that common purpose for that foundation. But then if I really want to make a beautiful relationship, just like a beautiful home, I pay attention to the structure, how it's built out here as well.

22:29 So you've studied it extensively. I've studied it extensively. We both used it in working either with companies or whatever. But with the normal couple who's never looked at it before, how do you teach them to learn to communicate with each other in a way that is considerate, that is kind, and you're actually communicating with someone in the way they wish to communicate. Yeah, there's a couple of things. I think the first thing is to take responsibility. I find in couples you've got to be responsible for where you are. Part of that is saying, you know what, I didn't know how to do this. Okay, just owning that I didn't know how to be the husband or wife or whatever that spouse looks like I didn't know how to communicate a certain way, and then give yourself forgiveness for that. Then what do you do? What do you want to learn?

23:26 What do you want that relationship to look like? And part of the first steps I tell on every relationship is defined to the other person, how you to show the other person, how you define respect because respect is individually defined, and that is the core foundation. Because doctor Doug, you want me to treat you with respect from how you define it, not how I define it. That's right, So I need to know how you define it. We're assuming we know, and most of the time we get it right, but there's details we don't. The other great question is how do you know when you're not being when you know you're not being respected, Oh, when you roll your eyes, when you walk away, when you raise your voice. All of these things are a mirror because we do not see our own behavior and those relationships.

24:15 But that's the first part. You've got to own. Hey, I haven't gotten this right to this point. That's why we're here. Because there's a quote I live my life by, and it's everything in my life I create, promote, or allow. So if my relationship is on the rocks, I'm responsible for that. I'm responsible for that part. Now does a person have responsibility, Yes, but I can't take their responsibility. Have to own my own first. I find when I own my own and manage it and say, you know what, I'm going to get better. The other thing I find so often people want to go from zero to perfection, that doesn't happen. It takes time to build those skills, it type takes time to heal some of those damage that's been It's a consistent practice, and so you've got to get serious about working on yourself. I find when I work on myself rather than on my spouse or my significant other, things start to really change. But if I'm expecting them to do something in that process, even to me working on it, I can't work on it.

25:19 So they'll stick around. I have to work on it for myself. Any stories other than the one about your dad, do you have some stories that you could share with people who have been really struggling and how you literally help them and what steps they had to take in the end result. Yeah, one of my favorites was in the last chapter, and I'll share it because it's one of the most powerful ones. I had a woman in class. She came up to me. She said, you know, I have a difficult conversation I need to have with my ex mother in law. I said, well, tell me about it. She goes, well, the last time she goes. She used to be very close to me. I got divorced, and the last time we talked I was two half years ago, and during that time, the last thing I told her was You'll never effing see your grandkids again. That's what she told her.

26:11 And she said, that's the last time I talked to her. So I've got some work to do. So we sat down and worked on the conversation, did everything we needed to do, and she said she was going to go have it. And usually I don't call people, but she never called me back, and so I called her about two weeks later and said, hey, did you have the conversation? If so, how to go She goes, well, no, I didn't have it. I said, Can I ask why you were so excited? She said, well, my friends got together and they said, well, the guy you talked to, he probably had good intentions, but he just doesn't know what he's talking about. He doesn't understand your situation. And I said, wow, you've got great friends. I said, next time you see him, hug him and give him a kiss. She said, what I said, here's the thing. They care about you, but they don't know what you know. They have no idea what you know. They didn't sit through that class, they didn't practice it. So the question is do you want to have the conversation or do you want to let it go? And she thought for a second. She goes, I really want to have the conversation. So I said, let's practice again and get prepared. And she said, I kind of know how these things go. So I said, when you say this, this is probably going to be your action. What do you do? And I drilled her on it. She goes, get back to my best intent. Okay, stop everything, get back to your best intent. She did it.

27:31 She said it was a two and a half hour conversation and she said at the end there were hugs, tears and healing and she said it was like you were right there every time that She said something I knew where to go with it, and she said, now my kids will be able to see their grandmother. I have let all that go. And what I love was her last thing. She said, said, now I have to go throw up because these things are tough. I love how honest that was. It's like, h that's one of the worst experiences I've ever had. But again, I don't want to go through that. I don't want to do that. But what I want is what's on the other side.

28:12 And here's the thing that was more than seven years ago, and those kids have gotten to be with their grandmother through all the holidays, through birthdays, through everything else. That was restored because a mother really cared about her kids. She cared about her life, and she cared about the people in it. And she said, now it's an amazing relationship. Again things they never thought could happen well. And I would assume in your book that you talk about some specific things. Is that fair to say? So people get your book thing read? So what I want you to do is share a little bit of that today. And so, what are some of the steps if I'm in a really bad relationship, say with a brother, what are the steps that I need to take to repair that and redevelop at least a good communicative relationship.

29:06 So the first step I tell every one of my people's take responsibility again, Like I said, you're responsible for where it is. Now, what is it you want out of the interaction? Do you want them to admit they're wrong? Do you want a relationship? What do you want that relationship to look like? Why are you spending the time to do this? And people say, well, I care about them? Why you haven't talked to him in years? What's really going on? It's like I miss them. Wow, that's beautiful. Start with that, Start with why you want this? The reason I'm talking about this own your part side of the street. First, you might say, you know, I didn't know how to handle these conversations, so I ghosted you, I didn't talk to you, or last thing I yelled was this. That's not what I wanted. Own that on your side of the street. When you do that, it allows them space. The other thing I tell them, doctor Doug, is you can't expect anything from them. You can't expect them to want to engage with you after you have to just do this for yourself. The only thing you can do is handle your own vessel. You're in. What am I responsible for? They're going to have whatever reaction they have. And what I've also found out to Doug, when you go through this process, many times the person doesn't get that reaction from the person. It happens later many times because what happens is have you shown up as your best self in that conversation. When people show

30:38 up as the best self, that message resonates after you're gone, and it percolates in the person and they begin to see their behavior for the first time because they can't blame you anymore, just like you've been blaming them. They've been blaming you, and you're both right about what you're blaming each other for. But when you show a different behavior, they can't do that because all of a sudden, it's like, well, they didn't do that that time. They didn't do that, They didn't raise their voice, they didn't walk away, they were compassionate. What did I do? Typically I find it's a couple of weeks, but some people will to actually call back. I've seen it just recently, a person with their sister and it blew up. They never thought it was possible and then when they came to me and they said, yeah, it didn't go like I wanted. I said, did you do your best? And she thought about it she goes yeah, I said, how do you feel about that? Strong?

31:32 I feel good about it. Great. Then you've done your best. You can't expect anyone. But about three weeks later, she gets the phone call, Hey, I didn't like our last conversation. Would I'd like to talk to you again. Now they've got a relationship again. But is it perfect? No, But they're talking, they're engaging, they're building something on something they didn't have, And so I think that's the key. You've got to get that foundation. Most people won't want to talk about the issue that happened. They're not talking about the deeper issue about what kind of relationship do you want to have? What kind of how do we want to show respect each other? Do you want to be in relationship with me? If so, why or why not?

32:14 Let's talk about those things rather than you did this or I did this. Those are surface level issues. The deeper issues. Don't want to open myself in my heart up to you. Don't want to do that. So I know a lot of people that are listening. Your parents have children different ages. Doesn't matter what age they are, they're still children. There are there certain skills and different ways to fix relationship with children and to communicate them with them so that you don't ruin the relationships in the first place. And is it different than working with say an adult or with a parent or is it all the same principles.

32:57 I think at the heart of it, it's all the same principles, but how you approach it can be very different depending on the person. I find with parents and children, the biggest thing is the children. The parent wants the child to be a certain way, and you represent the family or you're a part of me, and the child's job is to break away from the family. So there's always going to be that conflict because they're trying to find themselves. They can't find themselves unless they're separate. But can you separate without the drama or the breakdown? And so I find most of the time it's truly listening and accepting the kid for who they are, not who you want them to be or the life you think they should have. That's a hard thing because think about your life. Did you want anyone to tell you how to live it or make the decisions that they wanted.

33:52 Think about how you probably challenged your parents with that because you're trying to find your way as well. So it needs a listening and a level of acceptance. And you're welcome as a parent to say this concerns me. I love you, but fear jumps in and we either attack or control or try to do something else, or our fear shuts us down and we avoid a conversation about what all that looks like, and have we really talked about what our deeper core relationship is. I also find that many times you have seasons of your life. I think if you're talking to your kids, you should have conversations and agreements about what it looks like when they're in junior high when it changes when they get to high school. You need to have conversations about what that relationship is going to look like in that, then when they get to college, then when they get married, then when they have kids. It goes throughout the different seasons.

34:47 But we make assumptions about our relationship that it's the same way. It's not. It's constantly grows. I'm not the same person I was six months ago, but we treat everyone else like that's the way they are or that's the way they need to be. When we can let that go and start working on this all of a sudden, I finally we work on ourselves. We learn how to speak into someone else's listen well. And you know, as you get into that, I think part of the challenge, and you kind of alluded to it, how do parents finally get to the point where they understand that, you know, what your way is not necessarily the right way for me, And you know, it's just like you went with your dad, you know, I mean here he is that you know, that preacher, that whole thing, and you're not living that way and you know, and yet, how how do you help individuals to be able to learn respect, understanding, non judgment, and getting rid of that ego that has to say I'm right and you're wrong.

35:53 Yeah, it's a great question. I go back to the fundamentals. It's go and sit down and talk about respect, talk about your ego, talk about the things you fear, talk about the things it's an awkward conversation. I actually have these groups of master teams I walk people through. In my latest one, I had a priest who was taking my class to be a better communicator, and he said, Greg, he said, even having conversations about respect with people, because I have them sit down and do that, he said, it's awkward. And I'm a priest think about that because most people say, oh, I know to do that, I don't really know. Many people have sat down and said, let's talk about what respect looks like. Let's look at that.

36:41 You start to talk about the core issues, you're going to start to get a core conversation. But we spend so much time up here on the surface that we are scared to go down to that deeper level. But I also say, that's a skill level you need to have to do it effectively. That's why I do what I do, because it's like people will tell you go have the conversation, but most people don't teach you how to. There's a skill set. When you know how to, your confidence would grow. I'll say this, it makes you more effective in the conversation. It doesn't take away. You'll have the same fear today tomorrow that you would have if I learned all the skills. That doesn't go away. It's always going to be there.

37:25 Well, and you know in today's culture and what's going on in the United States particularly, and I think it's all over the world, but we're so aware because of media and everything else. And I have seen people who were very close friends and are no longer friends at all because their political beliefs are one way, maybe their religious beliefs have gone a different way. They have these philosophical differences, and yet these were people who were really good friends. How do you help them to understand how to have conversations and communication in a way that rather than destroying the relationship or just walking away because you can't stand the conversations and their beliefs, to having something that you can find some commonality and maintain that relationship and that respect without losing.

38:23 Yeah, and you're so right. I think with social media and everything, we've got a dopamine rush around almost anything we look at anymore, and it's about being right at that core issue. We have this insatiable need to be right, and that's what people are talking about when they're separated in their spirituality or their politics. They're showing that need to be right and be seen. And that's the core thing underneath it when you really think about because the philosophy of it? Again, is the surface when you really think about it. If two plus two equals four, I don't need to defend any Think about that for a second. I don't need to defend anything. It's that fear I need to be seen and I don't care if it's spiritual, I don't care if it's politics. Here's what I do.

39:11 If I see a different view than someone, I see the passion. I say, you know what, I love to talk about this, But before we do, what is your intention to discuss in discussing this with me? Is your intention to get me to run over to your side? Is it to make me wrong, show that you know more than me, you know, shame me? Or is it to try to find a real understanding? Is it to try to lift each other up? What is your intention in talking about this with me? Second thing, before we talk about what we have our differences, let's talk about for ten minutes about what we have in common. I love that's interesting. People don't know how to respond and the whole When I've done this on every political conversation, people stop talking about politics and we get into talking about or how we're together. It's a much stronger it's amazing.

40:04 We might be different. Let's say twenty percent of our politics. That means eighty percent of everything else we have in common. But we're focusing on our differences. That's like looking at the negative thing of everything. Let's look at the positive and you'll get more positive. Look at the negative, you get more negative. Oh, I think that's a great approach. But I didn't. I sat there. I thought I was the same way. I doubt. I was like, I don't want to shy away from conversations. I will talk about anything, but rarely what is your intent. Let's talk about what we have in common. All those other things start to go fade away because you're getting the real needs met. Other stuff is fear I'm smarter than you, I'm better.

40:45 We have to do things my way. What you find throughout history life happens because of opposites, because those things actually mold us to get prepared for the next thing. But if we constantly say it just has to be my way, were dumbing ourselves down. There's value in one of the exercises I have my people do in the master teams is actually find someone who believes differently than political, differently than them politically or spiritually or whatever a key thing, and then they just have to go and listen to understand. They can't give their point of view. I want you to really understand why that person thinks what they think. They'll let you know when they're done. And it's amazing the connection that happens, because some of the people come back and say, that person called me three days later and then wanted to hear what I thought. They wanted to do the exercise with me, because it's really There's a guy named Daryl Davis. I don't know if you've ever heard of him. Check him out on YouTube. He's an amazing He reaches people through listening, through understanding them.

41:46 He's got an amazing story. He's been on sixty Minutes a couple of times. Well, and I think you've hit on the key, and I appreciate what you've said, because the whole key is to seek to understand. And you know, when someone will just sit back and really want to understand and ask question, I'm not sure I understand that exactly. Can you explain that a little bit more to me? And so forth, When they seek to understand, that just brings up the whole level of a relationship because now they know you really want to understand rather than I'm right, you're wrong, et cetera. Yeah, and doctor Doug, I love that because to understand you have to listen and have a lot of people that come to me say, oh, I'm a really good listener. Well, you know what you don't get to say where you're a good listener other people, other people. Here's the thing you'll find out if you're a good listener or not.

42:37 Don't ask it. Don't tell people a good listener. If you're a good listener, you'll hear it at least once a week because it's so rare, because Pete, when you truly listen to someone and they're just like, wow, you listen really well. If you're getting that once a week from people you're around, you're probably a good listener. But if you're not getting that, you should be a check. It should be a check. It really should be. So I would assume a lot of this information and detail is in your book. Yes, Yes, how do people find your book? Yeah, it's called Build New Bridges The Art of Restoring Impossible Relationships. And they can go on Amazon anywhere anywhere books are sold Barnes and Noble, they're all there. Uh and uh, it's interesting because I put my life into it.

43:27 I put all that information. Uh, you can read it and practice it, you'd have the skills. But I find sometimes people need a handholder, they need a coach. Find a coach work with them on this. Make sure. Most people talk about success, They think about money, they think about a lot of different things. I think about success and relationship. Well, what about your website. How do people find you? Yeah, it's uh, just go to Alignment dash resources dot com. Alignment dash Resources dot com. Don't forget the Dash and we talk about our Master Team programs. We have programs for new program coming up for emerging leaders. We're working with a younger generation to teach them the skill sets most executives today are having. They typically say I wish I would have learned this twenty years ago. So we're doing that, trying to help those people getting out of college or in their gap year to understand to set themselves apart. But my whole goal in all of this is to help people have more deep, meaningful relationships, have the joy that comes with that.

44:33 Well, and what would be your final message to the audience today. My final message would be, it's not impossible. Sometimes we think of a relationship as being a conversations being impossible. That's a limited belief, it's not true. But if you learn the skills you work on yourself, you do all the different things. You can do things you never thought you could. So your relationship's not impossible. Well, your job's not impossible. The things you see. There is possibility in every space as you begin to understand what you're doing around it and accept it. It's a limiting belief. Do not believe that thing that says it's impossible.

45:14 Oh I love it. Thank you so much, Greg, and thank you. And I'm just fascinated about your book. I think that's got to be incredible. Folks. I hope you've enjoyed this and go get that book because I guarantee you we all need help in our communication. Anyways, Thanks so much, folks, thanks for listening. I hope you'll join it again soon. And as usual, this is doctor Doug saying, now, mistake