Aug. 5, 2026

Nolan Wells Investigation: Cajun Navy, Death Threats, Sealed Autopsy

Nolan Wells Investigation: Cajun Navy, Death Threats, Sealed Autopsy
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Season 1
In this episode, Jim Chapman breaks down the updates that have occurred over the past few days regarding the investigation into the death of Nolan Wells. Including new audio released of several threats on the life of witnesses leading to (3) arrests so far. The Cajun Navy releases a report that sheds no new light on what happened to Nolan Wells. Nancy Grace doubles down on the enhanced audio of the sea-tow call (and Jim doubles down on debunking it) and Jim also explains why keeping the autopsy report sealed is necessary to avoid tainting a grand jury pool.
On July 4, 2026, Nolan Wells, an 18-year-old Ocean Springs, Mississippi native and incoming freshman football player at Southwest Mississippi Community College, joined a group of friends for a boat trip to Horn Island, a wilderness barrier island off the Mississippi Gulf Coast. Thousands of people were on the island that day. According to his friends, the boat began taking on water that afternoon. They say Nolan chose to stay behind talking to a young woman while they returned to the mainland. His phone made it back. He did not.

Timestamps:
03:49 Nancy Grace Doubles Down
13:58 Why Context Matter
18:52 Why The Autopsy Is Sealed
22:43 Blood Alcohol Content
25:17 Why A Grand Jury May Convene
28:19 Cajun Navy Report Needs Elon Musk
30:46 Threats Against Family Go Public
35:09 Dan Abrams Weighs In
43:48 What Could Break The Case

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WEBVTT

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Hey, everyone, Welcome back to Exposed Scandalous Files of the Elite.

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I am your host, Jim Chapman, and I have another

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update on the case of Nolan Wells. Now, we're going

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to move on from the Nolan Wells case at some point,

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but I just feel like y'all that this is too

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important to let lies and half truth and inn window

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get out there without having some sort of response to that.

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I'm very blessed to have a platform that a lot

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of people listen to, and I feel almost a responsibility

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to do what I can to bring you the facts

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as they are are right now. So I'm gonna stick

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with this one the full way through. I'll be releasing

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episodes on other topics, but when there's something to be

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said on this case, you better believe I'm gonna drop

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a podcast on it, because it's just too important to

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not do that. I'm not gonna turn a blind eye

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to people attempting to control a narrative. Now, before I

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go any further with what we are gonna talk about today,

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I want to say this, none of us, zero of

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us in media know what happened to Nolan Wells. As

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a matter of pure fact, we as media figures, we

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are only as good as the information that is provided

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to us. And I'm gonna talk a little bit about

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that today because there are a lot of people out

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there that have expressed frustration at what the police have

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come out and said, which is very little, what the

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district attorney has come out and said, which again is

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very little. So we're gonna discuss that, and we're gonna

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discuss how it affects this case, and I'm gonna give

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you my personal thoughts on what I would like to

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see in that respect. Now, as I said in several

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prior episodes, the media, with the exception of a very

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small group, have thrown so many accusations at these boys

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that were with Nolan that day. Now, they don't come

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right out in some cases and just say, oh, these

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boys killed Nolan Wells. They don't do that, but you

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can read between lines and you can see when someone

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is pushing a narrative with no evidence. Now, the family

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of these boys and the boys themselves, they're fighting back

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in lawsuits themselves. And these lawsuits aren't just aimed at

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people very to this case. They're firing back at other

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podcasters for what they deem is defamation. You cannot just

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say something untrue that you know to be untrue about

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someone and think there's not going to be repercussions for that,

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especially in a case like this one. So I want

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everybody to stop and think about that for a second.

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I don't think there's any debate that there are thousands

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and thousands of people out there that have labeled every

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single one of these boys involved in this, if not

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a killer, at least racist kids, even one who is

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of mixed race. He has a white side of the

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family and a black side of the family. His name

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is Traceten, and they even call him a racist, which

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is absolutely ludicrous. Now, I'm pretty sure it was the

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last episode that I talked a little bit about Nancy Grace,

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who again I like her. I like Nancy, I enjoy

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her show. But one thing when Nancy is sometimes it

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does appear that she gets the facts a little bit

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messed up, or she doesn't understand certain aspects of a case.

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And look, she's extremely smart. Yes, she was a lawyer

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for a million years and all those sorts of things.

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But if you're not digging into things like river life

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or life on the water, and you're speaking on that

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you need to speak with a little bit of education

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about it. Now, she does do a good job of

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getting experts on her show to give their points, but

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she will say things out of her own mouth that

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are somewhat inaccurate or that she doesn't really understand. Now,

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I know, Nancy has a big crew and a big show,

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and look y'all, she doesn't have time to research every

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single thing she covers. She relies on people, producers, people

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like that. So I'm not throwing blame completely on Nancy,

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but all of us in non traditional media podcast personalities whatever,

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we all know at the end of the day, we

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better make sure we double check just about everything because

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we are the ones that are actually saying it. So

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one of the things that I'm gonna do today is

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I'm going to play some clips of some things that

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she reported and some things that she has a particular

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opinion of, where it appears that she may not have

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had all the facts, And I'm gonna give you the

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other side of that because a lot of people are

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running with her reporting. Now, I'm gonna start off with

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the opening of her show that aired the third of

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August just yesterday. As I'm preparing to record this episode,

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she opens it up, and she is still harping on

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this audio that had come out when the boys made

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the emergency call that their boat was sinking. If you'll

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remember that part of the case, and if you haven't

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listened to part one and two, this may make no

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sense to you, So go listen to some of my

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prior updates first on it case. But she's harping on

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that continually, And I've already told you, and I'm sure

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you've already seen somewhere the video that exists that kind

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of coincides with this audio call where someone was filming

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these boys and there were a couple of girls on

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that boat as well, but somebody's filming them going about

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the boat and they're grabbing ropes, and remember the bilge

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pump had failed and that boat was sinking, and eventually

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they figure out we got to pull the plug and

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get the hell out of here. And you could see

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in this video they're in a panic because that boat

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was about to sink and they're setting it up to

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get towed, grabbing ropes. All that stuff. Now, just prior

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to that call connecting allegedly, according to people that have

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edited or enhanced that recording, I should say, you can

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hear people saying the name Nolan and is he dead,

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and all these sorts of things that would look real

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bad in reality if that was indeed what was being

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said now, regardless of what you're hearing, regardless of that,

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the existence of a video now shows Nolan nowhere in

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sight when they were preparing to tow that boat off

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nowhere in sight. Nancy still continues to promote this audio

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on her episode, and she actually doubled down in this

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particular episode, and she has one of her own producers.

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One of Nancy's own producers enhanced the video as well.

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And I'm not going to replay audios for you of

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all that, because I've already done it last episode I

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played you, or two episodes ago I played you the

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full audio of that ce toe call. So I'm not

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going to play that again or play all this stuff

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that producers have enhanced. And when you enhance something, I

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don't care what you say. I am in this business.

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Marbles the audio. And when you put warding up there

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a transcript while the thing is playing, what do you

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think your brain is going to do when it here's

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something that says something similar to Nolan. I don't know

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what it says. I hear some things that when I'm

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looking at the transcript, I'm like, that is what it

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sounds like. But also have a video to reference where

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Nolan is nowhere on that boat. So, folks, all I'm

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saying here is use your common sense. It's important because

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a lot of this case boils down to common sense

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when it comes to throwing all these accusations. Don't let

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technology supersede your common sense. And I think a lot

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of that has been done in this case. For example,

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if you intentionally kill somebody, or accidentally kill somebody for

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that matter, or somebody all of a sudden dies right

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in front of you at that point, or you can

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have one of your friends at that exact point that

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you notice someone is dying, call the coastguard or call

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an emergency toe company to come to your boat because

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it's sinking. Are you even gonna be on the phone

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at that point if all of that is going on,

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of course not. Secondly, you have a video to compare

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to all this. Why is nobody talking about that? Nancy

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Grace and thousands of other people are running with this

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audio that has been henced, meaning it's been played with.

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Why don't you even believe your own two eyes when

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you match up the video in the audio and look

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at these two things. And what you see in the

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video is everybody running around trying to get this boat

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tied to another boat. Nobody's waving their hands in the

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air or freaking out other than the fact that the

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boat is sinking. But they're not freaking out and looking

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at somebody and saying, hey are you okay? Hey, why

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are you not breathing? None of this is happening. Nobody's

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doing that. But you can't get Nancy or several of

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these other media personalities to even mention the video and

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ask the question, now, another common sensical thought here, there

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were seven people on that boat, y'all seven people, to

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my knowledge, all the age of twenty one or younger.

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Two girls and five boys. The police, I assure you

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they have interviewed every single one of them. Matter of fact,

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I told you already they interviewed over sixty people. Rest assured,

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every single person on that boat has been approached by

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a police for an interview. That would be the first

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thing you would do in a situation like this. Do

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you really think, using your common sense your god given

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sense that all seven of these young people managed to

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keep the same story with police. And you may say, well,

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how do you know the stories were the same? Well,

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that one's easy, y'all, because there's been no arrest. Had

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those stories changed or they were not consistent one hundred percent,

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in my view, somebody would be arrested by now, because

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the truth never changes and the police know that they're

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good at this, y'all. You don't think the police would

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have talked to one of those girls or both of

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those girls and say, come on, you don't want to

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go down for something you didn't do, and you know,

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maybe we'll cut you a deal if you tell us

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what happened. This happens all the time in interrogations. I

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submit to you, there's no way seven people twenty one

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years of age or younger would be able to keep

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that secret when questioned by police. Folks. These are not

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kids that live that life, you know what I'm saying.

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These are not kids that grew up dealing with the

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police in some sort of criminal way all of the time,

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and they're totally used to it, and so it doesn't

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even intimidate them. These are very wealthy kids. The vast

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majority of them, None of them that I'm aware of,

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have had any dealings with the police for something nefarious

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or criminal. They would be scared shitless. Everybody would be confessing.

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And when you got seven people, and incidentally, the police

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they can lie to you legally to try to get

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you to confess to something. When you got seven people,

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you don't think the police would say, Hey, Joe Blow

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in the other room has told us everything that happened

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and he's blaming it all on you. You don't think at

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that point if these people knew anything that happened to Nolan,

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they wouldn't spill the beans right there. They would have

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said anything they had to say. You're living on Mars.

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If you think they could stand up to that type

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of pressure, Seven different people that age now lastly on

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that point, y'all, this recording, this tow call recording ce tow.

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It took place while they were trying to set the

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boat up to get it towed by another boat. There

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were hundreds of people around their boat as they were

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struggling to get it tied off to the other boat

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and get towed off of that island. If you will,

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you don't think of Nolan Wells was laying there dying

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with hundreds of people around. Everybody's on boats, everybody's got

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cell phones. Nobody would have seen that, taken a picture

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or a video, or would have showed a picture of

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Nolan Wells on that boat, or at least a picture

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of all these people panicking because of what you're allegedly

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hearing in the background. Common sense, y'all. So in this

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episode with Nancy that I referenced earlier, she had someone.

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It was a podcaster apparently by the name of Teslin Faguero.

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I believe it is her name, and she came on

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the show, and I'm gonna let you listen to her

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take on something completely out of context. She takes it

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completely out of context here, and then I'm gonna add

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the context for you so you can see how these

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games are played.

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Well, that's what the family is saying. They don't believe

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he died by accident. That's the point. That's the reason

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why Nolan Well's mom is saying, I don't believe this.

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I don't believe he died by accident.

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Before we had the audio. The audio simply confirms that

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there are additional questions that needs to be asked. It

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wasn't just one thing they said in the audio, they

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said Nolan repeatedly in the audio, they said check his chest.

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In the audio, they said is he dead? In the audio?

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And also notice this, Nancy, did you notice that the

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operator also said is anybody breathing?

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Who says it?

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What operator says?

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Who all is breathing on the boat. If you listen

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to my podcast that I dropped just a few days ago,

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I covered the entire seed toe call that she's referring to.

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But I'm gonna isolate just the part she discussed here,

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and I'm gonna let you listen to the full context

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the stuff she didn't say prior to this.

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Oh right, How many adults and children on board? No,

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there's no children, So is there anybody on board? How

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many adults?

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Sir?

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That was the question? Hello? Can you hear me.

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Jump in while you're doing.

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Hello? Sir?

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Hello, yep.

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I just need you to answer these questions so I

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can get you over to the captain. How many adults

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on board?

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Very adults on board?

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There's nobody on board the boat?

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No, no, here is over the age of twenty one, sir.

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That was not the question. Is there a person. Is

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there a person, a living individual on the boat?

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Hello?

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Is there a living person? Someone breathing on the boat?

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Is there anybody on the boat?

264
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There, there's lots of people breathing on the boat.

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Oh right, how many people?

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Sir?

267
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Like seven?

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So there you have it, y'all. It's called context. The

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reason she said is anybody breathing on the boat is

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because she asked this boy three or four times how

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many people were on the boat. And it's obvious you

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can tell just by the way that he's talking that

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this guy may have had one too many Miller lights, right,

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so he's having trouble comprehending exactly what she's saying to him.

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And this operator may have been being a little sarcastic

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by saying how many people are breathing on the boat?

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I mean, you could tell she was getting frustrated because

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he couldn't answer her question, clearly due to likely some

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alcohol consumption. That's my thought process. But that is also

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how people twist this entire scenario this podcast that Nancy

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had even doubled down on that statement and theorized that

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maybe the operator overheard the kids saying all of these

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nefarious things about Nolan, and then inferred that when the

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operator said, is anybody breathing? She said that because she

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could hear people, meaning the operator could hear people in

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the background talking about Nolan wells, is he dead? And

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all this stuff. That was the inference that this person made.

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That is freaking ridiculous, y'all. It's pushing a narrative. So

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now you have the full context of what she said,

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and it makes a little bit more sense. And it

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wasn't because she heard something going on in the background.

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You don't think if this operator heard something like that

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in the background, she wouldn't have followed up with what's

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going on in the background? Is somebody dying? I hear

295
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a lot of people in the background saying somebody's dying.

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Of course she would, And this operator definitely would have

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mentioned that when she called another dispatcher to get a

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toe out to these boys. She would have said, Hey,

299
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I think something's going on because I heard stuff in

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the background. We heard that whole conversation. None of that

301
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ever came up with this operator. You don't think the

302
00:18:39.960 --> 00:18:43.839
police would have known that and already talked to this operator.

303
00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:47.880
Of course they would. Y'all are being sold wolf tickets

304
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right now, you shur guy, given sense, But let's move

305
00:18:52.319 --> 00:18:55.640
on from that. Another thing brought up during this particular

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episode of Nancy's podcast was the autopsy report which he's

307
00:19:00.279 --> 00:19:03.920
currently undersealed. Now, this is not out of the ordinary

308
00:19:04.440 --> 00:19:08.440
at all by any way, shape or form. Yes, autopsy

309
00:19:08.559 --> 00:19:12.640
reports are typically public record, but it's common, as a

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matter of fact, very common that until a grand jury

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is convened to find out if there's evidence of anything

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that occurred outside of an accidental death that was at

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the hands of nobody, like a drowning or a car

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wreck or something like that, a grand jury has to

315
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determine whether there's been any foul play. In the end,

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it's common for these autopsy reports to be sealed so

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that information doesn't get out to the public and tainked

318
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the jury pool. So I'm gonna let you listen to

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this next clip of Nancy speaking to Joseph Morgan. Now,

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00:19:52.000 --> 00:19:55.920
Joseph Morgan is a stud he's an expert on all

321
00:19:56.039 --> 00:19:59.599
things detective work. Really like this guy, and he breaks

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down why the report may have been sealed in this club,

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And as I said, I couldn't agree with him more.

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I've never known an autopsy report not to be a

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00:20:09.920 --> 00:20:15.079
public record unless they're claiming ongoing investigation. How common is

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that that the medical examiner is ordered not to release

327
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the autopsy? Why is the autopsy being kept secret?

328
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Because it's continued investigation. They're going to go to grand

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jury with this. I can tell you that. I'll bet

330
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you dollars to donuts if that's the case. We see

331
00:20:32.400 --> 00:20:35.480
it with We saw it with Hoefor right, we didn't

332
00:20:35.519 --> 00:20:38.200
have it there, We don't have it with Charlie Kirk.

333
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You know that's an ongoing event. This is being investigated,

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00:20:44.799 --> 00:20:49.000
and you know the point of contact. Here is an

335
00:20:49.000 --> 00:20:53.039
interesting situation here because you have the state Medical Examiner,

336
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but you also have a county corner. The state medical

337
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Examiner provides a service to the county corner Corner is

338
00:21:00.519 --> 00:21:04.240
an elective official. He does not do these autopsies, and

339
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so the coroner is going to be the gatekeeper relative

340
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to any kind of document. But with that said, under

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00:21:12.440 --> 00:21:17.000
state I think under state to statute, the DA, the

342
00:21:17.079 --> 00:21:20.119
prosecutor they can say, look, you're going to hold off

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on releasing this report. So it's being held at this

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point in time. Now, the reports that we're hearing are

345
00:21:27.759 --> 00:21:31.480
saying that it is complete. Now what does that mean? Well,

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if you have a complete autopsy report, that means safety itox.

347
00:21:36.880 --> 00:21:39.279
They've probably got histology, which is going to be the

348
00:21:39.319 --> 00:21:44.240
tissue studies, and they actually have the anatomical autopsy report

349
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that has been completed. I think the question is, and

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this goes back to you, my friend, is that if

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this is going to be a grand jury thing, when

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is it going and when is the medical examder going

353
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to be called and summoned to speak to this. That's

354
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what everybody's going to be hanging on in my.

355
00:22:00.960 --> 00:22:03.759
Opinion, No j just Scott, you mentioned the talks report,

356
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that's a blood panel done. Was he drinking? Was he

357
00:22:07.039 --> 00:22:13.000
using drugs? A lot has been made, witnesses stating no

358
00:22:13.039 --> 00:22:17.440
one was drunk, Okay, does that really change anything? Does

359
00:22:17.519 --> 00:22:22.559
that change anything unless he died of acute alcohol poisoning,

360
00:22:22.799 --> 00:22:28.119
because I guarantee you ain't anybody on that boat that's

361
00:22:28.160 --> 00:22:31.839
afraid of a cocktail. Okay, So if he was drinking,

362
00:22:32.359 --> 00:22:34.480
what difference does that make?

363
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It all boils down to a grand jury is going

364
00:22:38.640 --> 00:22:42.119
to be convening on this, and you don't want it

365
00:22:42.160 --> 00:22:44.880
out there until that happens. Now, I want to answer

366
00:22:45.279 --> 00:22:48.079
Nancy's question that she had at the end of that club,

367
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which was what difference does his blood alcohol level make?

368
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Meaning no one wills and I can answer that one quickly.

369
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I'm not even going to spend a lot of time

370
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on it. Have you ever tried to swim in an

371
00:23:00.640 --> 00:23:04.759
ocean when you ship faced? It's not easy. Hell, I've

372
00:23:04.759 --> 00:23:07.240
been drunk and went and put my feet in the

373
00:23:07.279 --> 00:23:11.839
waves and fell over before. Imagine trying to be upright

374
00:23:12.039 --> 00:23:17.920
and waiting in chest deep water, ship face drunk, trying

375
00:23:17.960 --> 00:23:21.920
to balance yourself as your feet are below you and

376
00:23:21.960 --> 00:23:27.079
you're trying to feel for the ocean floor. Think about that. Hell, yeah,

377
00:23:27.119 --> 00:23:31.000
it's important what his blood alcohol level was set it before.

378
00:23:31.000 --> 00:23:34.279
And I'll say it again, Nancy apparently is more of

379
00:23:34.279 --> 00:23:37.279
an indoor girl. I would imagine to say a statement

380
00:23:37.440 --> 00:23:40.160
like that, But I'm gonna Takehi one step further. I'm

381
00:23:40.160 --> 00:23:43.799
not interested at all in the blood alcohol content that

382
00:23:43.839 --> 00:23:48.000
comes out with this report, because honestly, it's meaningless. I

383
00:23:48.079 --> 00:23:52.039
told you a couple of episodes ago. Your blood alcohol

384
00:23:52.119 --> 00:23:56.440
content is naturally going to rise as part of the

385
00:23:56.559 --> 00:24:02.200
decomposition process, know them well, wasn't found for two days.

386
00:24:02.599 --> 00:24:06.000
He could have not had any drinks and he's going

387
00:24:06.079 --> 00:24:09.920
to show a high blood alcohol content. He could have

388
00:24:09.960 --> 00:24:12.119
had a ton of drinks and he's going to show

389
00:24:12.519 --> 00:24:16.680
a high blood alcohol content. Really, all we have to

390
00:24:16.720 --> 00:24:19.519
go on to determine how much he was drinking are

391
00:24:19.559 --> 00:24:22.920
the witnesses that encountered him that day and were with

392
00:24:23.079 --> 00:24:26.880
him that day, and they all say, like everybody else

393
00:24:26.960 --> 00:24:31.000
that was around him, that he was drinking heavily. So

394
00:24:31.079 --> 00:24:34.920
I'm not putting any stock into what that side of

395
00:24:34.960 --> 00:24:38.880
the report comes out with, because science tells me he

396
00:24:38.920 --> 00:24:43.559
would show a high blood alcohol content regardless. But another

397
00:24:43.599 --> 00:24:46.880
thing you heard in that statement given by Joseph Morgan

398
00:24:47.359 --> 00:24:51.079
was that he would be interested in the drug aspect

399
00:24:51.079 --> 00:24:54.599
of that report. He actually said if anybody had given

400
00:24:54.759 --> 00:24:58.119
knowing anything, it would be interesting to know of that,

401
00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:02.400
and so do I. I'm very interested in that because

402
00:25:02.519 --> 00:25:05.079
the drugs in his body, they're not going to be

403
00:25:05.160 --> 00:25:09.400
affected by decomposition. If he had any sort of drug

404
00:25:09.680 --> 00:25:12.640
in his body, it's gonna show up on that report.

405
00:25:12.799 --> 00:25:16.799
I'm gonna be real interested in the drug aspect of

406
00:25:16.880 --> 00:25:19.119
this report. So the next point I want to bring

407
00:25:19.240 --> 00:25:22.960
up that I've had a lot of questions message to

408
00:25:23.079 --> 00:25:26.440
me on my social media about this and this as well.

409
00:25:26.920 --> 00:25:30.319
If nobody had done anything wrong, then why is a

410
00:25:30.319 --> 00:25:33.400
grand jury going to be convened at some point during

411
00:25:33.440 --> 00:25:35.640
this case? And I'm gonna start this off by saying,

412
00:25:35.759 --> 00:25:39.279
I don't know if anybody's done anything wrong. I'm not

413
00:25:39.319 --> 00:25:43.240
saying Nolan wasn't killed. I'm not saying that he drowned.

414
00:25:43.839 --> 00:25:46.480
I'm not saying he didn't get drunk and passed out

415
00:25:46.599 --> 00:25:49.599
and just fell in the water. I wasn't there. I

416
00:25:49.640 --> 00:25:53.440
have no direct knowledge. I'm looking at this case from

417
00:25:53.559 --> 00:25:57.519
everything that has been presented to me, and it's my

418
00:25:57.720 --> 00:26:02.079
belief these boys have nothing to do with it based

419
00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:05.160
off of what I have seen, like the video that

420
00:26:05.240 --> 00:26:08.160
shows them tying off the boat. And I've listened to

421
00:26:08.160 --> 00:26:11.720
all these boys when they were interviewed by Officer Tatum

422
00:26:12.039 --> 00:26:14.519
and a no bullshit when I see it, I like

423
00:26:14.640 --> 00:26:19.119
to think, and I don't think they're feeding anybody a

424
00:26:19.160 --> 00:26:22.960
bunch of bullshit. I have common sense and I know

425
00:26:23.079 --> 00:26:26.200
there's no way seven people could keep this thing a

426
00:26:26.240 --> 00:26:29.039
secret for this long. No way. But I'm not saying

427
00:26:29.079 --> 00:26:31.839
somebody else hadn't killed him. I'm not saying he didn't drown.

428
00:26:32.200 --> 00:26:34.480
I'm not saying he didn't have something else happened to

429
00:26:34.559 --> 00:26:38.480
him until that report comes out, and that is why

430
00:26:38.640 --> 00:26:42.759
the report is so important on the autopsy. Till that

431
00:26:42.880 --> 00:26:46.519
comes out, we can only speak on the information we have.

432
00:26:46.799 --> 00:26:49.759
All of that being said, the question was asked to me,

433
00:26:50.119 --> 00:26:53.559
why is a grand jury being convened if nobody's done

434
00:26:53.599 --> 00:26:56.960
anything wrong, And the answer to that is, it's state

435
00:26:57.079 --> 00:27:00.920
law that one has to be convened unless it's a

436
00:27:00.960 --> 00:27:05.480
situation where someone died of natural causes like a heart

437
00:27:05.519 --> 00:27:09.039
attack or something that's totally obvious something of that nature,

438
00:27:09.160 --> 00:27:12.640
or a car accident where it's obvious someone died in

439
00:27:12.680 --> 00:27:15.599
that car accident. In this case is you don't have

440
00:27:15.680 --> 00:27:20.000
to convene a grand jury. But Mississippi state law says

441
00:27:20.039 --> 00:27:24.000
that outside those parameters, you have to convene a grand jury,

442
00:27:24.440 --> 00:27:29.680
present the evidence to them, and then upon that presentation

443
00:27:29.839 --> 00:27:32.680
of the evidence, they'll look at that case and they'll

444
00:27:32.720 --> 00:27:36.920
decide whether there's any evidence to move forward with charging

445
00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:41.000
someone with a crime. Now, typically this isn't necessary in

446
00:27:41.119 --> 00:27:44.559
situations where you have someone ribe a bank, for example,

447
00:27:44.599 --> 00:27:48.079
and shoot somebody, because there's enough evidence there for the

448
00:27:48.119 --> 00:27:51.359
police to make an arrest right off the bat, and

449
00:27:51.400 --> 00:27:54.920
that should tell you a lot about this case because

450
00:27:54.920 --> 00:27:59.839
there's been no arrest because they're convening a grand jury

451
00:27:59.839 --> 00:28:03.559
now because they have to. But it should also tell

452
00:28:03.599 --> 00:28:06.799
you there's not enough evidence to even make an arrest,

453
00:28:07.119 --> 00:28:09.240
so they're gonna put it in the hands of grand

454
00:28:09.319 --> 00:28:13.880
jury to basically say, yes, there's enough evidence we see

455
00:28:13.880 --> 00:28:17.640
something here to charge somebody or know we think Nolan

456
00:28:17.680 --> 00:28:21.960
Well's drowned. Essentially. Now, another update that I want to

457
00:28:21.960 --> 00:28:24.759
bring you on this case, and that is as soon

458
00:28:24.799 --> 00:28:27.599
as I recorded my last episode. It always works like that,

459
00:28:27.799 --> 00:28:30.640
right as soon as I recorded it. When you know

460
00:28:30.799 --> 00:28:35.319
the same day that that episode dropped the United Cajun

461
00:28:35.480 --> 00:28:38.920
Navy releases. I guess you would call this. A lot

462
00:28:38.960 --> 00:28:42.039
of people are calling it an investigative report, but I

463
00:28:42.119 --> 00:28:44.680
listened to an interview yesterday where they're saying that's not

464
00:28:44.720 --> 00:28:48.720
what it is because they're not investigators. Essentially, what they

465
00:28:48.759 --> 00:28:52.680
did was they curated a lot of like social media

466
00:28:52.759 --> 00:28:55.839
tips that had been sent to them, and they made

467
00:28:55.880 --> 00:28:58.599
a report out of it. But I'm gonna tell y'all,

468
00:28:58.880 --> 00:29:01.440
I don't know what exactly you would call it. I'm

469
00:29:01.480 --> 00:29:05.119
not even sure why they released it. Really, I guess

470
00:29:05.319 --> 00:29:08.799
this is standard procedure for them and y'all. Incidentally, the

471
00:29:08.880 --> 00:29:12.440
Cajun Navy, United Cajun Navy is about five minutes from

472
00:29:12.480 --> 00:29:16.039
where I record. They're in Baton Rouge. But they release

473
00:29:16.279 --> 00:29:19.440
a report, and let me tell you, this thing is

474
00:29:19.519 --> 00:29:23.880
twenty six pages long. And as many reports that I

475
00:29:23.920 --> 00:29:28.119
have read in seven years that I've covered true crime

476
00:29:28.240 --> 00:29:31.119
on a podcast, in the forty plus years that I've

477
00:29:31.160 --> 00:29:35.759
spent research in true crime, I have never come across

478
00:29:36.039 --> 00:29:39.839
a report in my life as hard to understand as

479
00:29:39.880 --> 00:29:42.519
this report. I mean, you have to be Eli Musk.

480
00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:46.599
I ain't kidding you to understand this thing. It's twenty

481
00:29:47.079 --> 00:29:50.880
six pages of calculus. What I can tell you about

482
00:29:50.880 --> 00:29:54.640
that report was there's nothing in it at all that

483
00:29:54.759 --> 00:29:59.680
pertains in any way to having any questions that answered

484
00:29:59.720 --> 00:30:03.079
as of how Nolan Wells died what happened to him.

485
00:30:03.079 --> 00:30:06.079
There's none of that. And the question they ask is

486
00:30:06.079 --> 00:30:09.720
a question everyone is asking since the beginning of this case,

487
00:30:10.119 --> 00:30:13.160
and that was where was Nolan from three o'clock to

488
00:30:13.240 --> 00:30:16.319
four point thirty. Nobody can seem to give that answer,

489
00:30:16.480 --> 00:30:19.680
including the Cajun Navy, which is not surprising because they

490
00:30:19.680 --> 00:30:23.440
didn't get involved until after he was missing. Now, if

491
00:30:23.480 --> 00:30:27.559
the United Cajun Navy CEO or whoever's in charge, wants

492
00:30:27.640 --> 00:30:30.680
to come on the podcast and discuss the report, you're

493
00:30:30.799 --> 00:30:33.119
like five minutes from me. Give me a call, shoot

494
00:30:33.160 --> 00:30:34.960
me a message. I'd be glad to have you on

495
00:30:35.000 --> 00:30:37.160
the show, and maybe you can make sense of this

496
00:30:37.680 --> 00:30:39.960
because I can't even report on it. I can't even

497
00:30:40.039 --> 00:30:44.400
understand this thing. It's so non user friendly, I guess

498
00:30:45.079 --> 00:30:49.519
unless you're someone in that industry. Also on the Officer

499
00:30:49.680 --> 00:30:54.759
Tatum show, they released some pretty disturbing threats that were

500
00:30:54.799 --> 00:30:58.720
recorded regarding the family of Warren, one of the people

501
00:30:58.920 --> 00:31:02.240
involved in this case. Remember, his stepmother is a judge,

502
00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:06.880
his dad is a doctor. Officer Tatum released some threats

503
00:31:06.920 --> 00:31:09.559
and I want you to hear them because I want

504
00:31:09.599 --> 00:31:14.079
you to grasp how disturbing some people are. And this

505
00:31:14.119 --> 00:31:17.799
is something in the last episode I spent some time covering,

506
00:31:18.000 --> 00:31:20.920
and I told you about all the crazies that are

507
00:31:20.960 --> 00:31:24.000
out there and all the people that think the shit

508
00:31:24.240 --> 00:31:28.920
is funny and doing absolutely nothing to help Nolan Wells,

509
00:31:29.400 --> 00:31:33.400
and I hope they know that it's coming. Look, you're

510
00:31:33.440 --> 00:31:37.039
gonna get caught. No matter how slick you think you are.

511
00:31:37.640 --> 00:31:43.039
These folks are all gonna get tracked. And they're making

512
00:31:43.279 --> 00:31:49.920
threats against a sitting judge and a judge's family. You

513
00:31:50.000 --> 00:31:52.880
think people are just gonna let that slide. They're not

514
00:31:53.640 --> 00:31:57.000
quit with the threats. It's not helping anybody. But I

515
00:31:57.039 --> 00:31:58.079
want you to listen to this.

516
00:31:58.319 --> 00:32:02.119
I'll try right now. Your son is a piece of

517
00:32:03.039 --> 00:32:06.960
and he's about to get all the way up right now.

518
00:32:07.000 --> 00:32:13.720
You use a punk. They're just like your son. Give kim.

519
00:32:14.160 --> 00:32:16.799
You guys are gonna get her coming to you. I

520
00:32:16.839 --> 00:32:20.039
know he killed that little kid man. You guys, aren't

521
00:32:20.799 --> 00:32:25.720
your wife? Call you racist? Pieces of all?

522
00:32:25.799 --> 00:32:29.519
You Now, I'm gonna play the next one.

523
00:32:29.720 --> 00:32:32.480
No answer the phone. You you, you, you and your

524
00:32:32.480 --> 00:32:37.960
folks think y'all lass so smart, so sleep. Your son's

525
00:32:37.960 --> 00:32:40.119
gonna get the worst of it. And he know it,

526
00:32:40.559 --> 00:32:43.440
he know it. He ain't y'all ain't safe. Y'all can't

527
00:32:43.440 --> 00:32:46.720
say that little y'all can't say y'all self. But you

528
00:32:46.839 --> 00:32:49.920
know you know it's coming. It's real coming.

529
00:32:51.039 --> 00:32:51.720
It's real coming.

530
00:32:52.359 --> 00:32:55.440
As sons and them gonna disable their account and all

531
00:32:55.559 --> 00:32:58.880
this utter. Bruce Dag they know what's going on, they

532
00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:00.640
know what they did, they say what they.

533
00:33:00.720 --> 00:33:01.279
For a reason.

534
00:33:01.440 --> 00:33:02.640
They lord though for a reason.

535
00:33:02.720 --> 00:33:05.000
They don't follow this ad for a reason they know

536
00:33:05.759 --> 00:33:08.279
yore scared things of their phone because you know what's

537
00:33:08.319 --> 00:33:12.079
going on, and nobody scared of y'all White on Jesus

538
00:33:12.400 --> 00:33:15.400
a face, y'all, ain't nobody worried about tell you, ain't

539
00:33:15.440 --> 00:33:17.440
nobody scared about your job, but it'll be worried about

540
00:33:17.440 --> 00:33:20.000
their boy. God, I promise you something gonna happen to

541
00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:22.880
his if I don't get to nobody else get to his.

542
00:33:23.119 --> 00:33:26.480
Some I'm gonna happen to you. And you might want

543
00:33:26.480 --> 00:33:27.839
to go and block me because I saw the God.

544
00:33:27.880 --> 00:33:30.799
I'm gonna car you off on every day until they

545
00:33:30.799 --> 00:33:31.319
come clean.

546
00:33:31.920 --> 00:33:32.839
I'm talking about some mold.

547
00:33:32.880 --> 00:33:39.000
This your old scary white absolutely sick. And here's one

548
00:33:39.279 --> 00:33:43.799
where Warren's dad answers the fine Hello.

549
00:33:44.920 --> 00:33:47.640
Hello, I'm not speaking with Benjamin Ester.

550
00:33:48.160 --> 00:33:48.559
Who's this?

551
00:33:50.720 --> 00:33:52.440
You and your son gonna die a little bro?

552
00:33:53.160 --> 00:33:55.440
Ain't your wife for what y'all did?

553
00:33:56.559 --> 00:33:56.680
Now?

554
00:33:56.759 --> 00:34:00.240
Why did I just play y'all all those thoats? Other

555
00:34:00.279 --> 00:34:02.640
than the fact that people need to see how serious

556
00:34:02.680 --> 00:34:06.359
this is, I play them because there are a lot

557
00:34:06.400 --> 00:34:09.920
of comments. My guess the side that doesn't agree with

558
00:34:10.039 --> 00:34:13.559
me reporting what I perceive to be the truth. They

559
00:34:13.599 --> 00:34:17.039
say the only victim in this case is know them Wells,

560
00:34:17.320 --> 00:34:22.599
and originally I would agree with that. However, it's people

561
00:34:22.639 --> 00:34:26.920
that have hate in their heart to this extent that

562
00:34:27.000 --> 00:34:32.320
are creating victims far reaching just know them Wells. When

563
00:34:32.320 --> 00:34:36.239
you're accused of something like murder and you didn't do it,

564
00:34:36.960 --> 00:34:42.000
you become a victim as well. When you're threatened with

565
00:34:42.159 --> 00:34:46.360
your life, your kid's life, those people become a victim.

566
00:34:46.639 --> 00:34:49.360
The fact of the matter is Knowing well should have

567
00:34:49.559 --> 00:34:54.199
been the only victim in this case. But hateful, horrible

568
00:34:54.239 --> 00:34:58.960
people are creating victims everywhere now. And it's a shame

569
00:34:59.159 --> 00:35:01.960
because I say say it at the end of every

570
00:35:02.119 --> 00:35:05.039
episode I've done on this and that is I want

571
00:35:05.199 --> 00:35:09.159
justice for Nolan Wells and this ain't the way to

572
00:35:09.280 --> 00:35:13.719
get it. It's divisive bullshit. Now I'm gonna end this

573
00:35:13.800 --> 00:35:17.400
one with some hope for you. They're not everyone out there,

574
00:35:17.440 --> 00:35:19.920
and I know it seems like it, but not everyone

575
00:35:20.719 --> 00:35:24.519
out there is not using their common sense. And one

576
00:35:24.519 --> 00:35:27.920
of those people that I've really enjoyed hearing his take

577
00:35:28.039 --> 00:35:31.280
on this case, and we agree in a lot of areas.

578
00:35:31.480 --> 00:35:35.400
Is Dan Abrams. Now you may not be familiar with Dan.

579
00:35:35.559 --> 00:35:39.519
He's a television host and recently he went on another

580
00:35:39.599 --> 00:35:43.360
guy's podcast that I really like, and that is Stephen A.

581
00:35:43.880 --> 00:35:47.280
He goes on steven A's show and he gives his

582
00:35:47.599 --> 00:35:50.599
take on this case, and I enjoyed it so much

583
00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:52.760
that I want you to be able to enjoy it too.

584
00:35:53.159 --> 00:35:56.239
So I'm going to end the episode by playing the

585
00:35:56.280 --> 00:36:01.679
full clip of Dan Abrams on stephen a show talking

586
00:36:01.719 --> 00:36:04.639
about this case. It's only about twenty minutes in length,

587
00:36:05.039 --> 00:36:08.000
but I think you'll really enjoy it. So after I

588
00:36:08.119 --> 00:36:13.000
end this episode, you're gonna hear that full clip. Every night, y'all.

589
00:36:13.239 --> 00:36:16.960
I pray for justice for Nolan Wells, and every night

590
00:36:17.400 --> 00:36:20.800
I pray for his family to find peace. And that

591
00:36:21.199 --> 00:36:28.159
is a fact. Until next time. For exposed scandalous files

592
00:36:28.199 --> 00:36:31.559
of the Elite, I'm your host, Jim Chapman. Much Love.

593
00:36:32.320 --> 00:36:35.719
My guest is an attorney, a legal commentator, and the

594
00:36:35.800 --> 00:36:39.679
founder of the Law and Crime Network, a multi platform

595
00:36:39.760 --> 00:36:44.119
digital and cable television network that specializes in live gabbl

596
00:36:44.199 --> 00:36:48.039
to gavel court room coverage, high profile, criminal trials and

597
00:36:48.239 --> 00:36:51.440
expert legal commentary. Please welcome to the show to one

598
00:36:51.440 --> 00:36:53.639
and only Dan Abrams. Dan, how are you, sir? Good

599
00:36:53.639 --> 00:36:54.800
to see how's everything.

600
00:36:54.519 --> 00:36:56.639
Going, Steven A great to be with you.

601
00:36:56.920 --> 00:36:58.599
Appreciate it. Man, Let's get right to it.

602
00:36:58.639 --> 00:37:00.760
I mean, the Nolan Wells cases taking on a life

603
00:37:00.760 --> 00:37:02.320
of his own, still very much in the news for

604
00:37:02.440 --> 00:37:04.119
those who haven't been following the case.

605
00:37:04.400 --> 00:37:06.000
Just want to throw this stuff out there and then.

606
00:37:06.000 --> 00:37:08.199
Wells was an eighteen year old college football player from

607
00:37:08.199 --> 00:37:10.880
Ocean Springs, Mississippi. On July fourth, he and a group

608
00:37:10.920 --> 00:37:13.840
of friends traveled by private boat to Horn Island and

609
00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:17.599
uninhabited Barrier Island off the coast of Mississippi. Wells was

610
00:37:17.639 --> 00:37:21.000
the only black person on the boat. According to reports,

611
00:37:21.280 --> 00:37:23.519
he was last seen on the island around three pm.

612
00:37:23.559 --> 00:37:27.639
His friends returned to the mainland without him. Dan, First

613
00:37:27.639 --> 00:37:29.840
things first, do I have that right? Or as new

614
00:37:29.880 --> 00:37:32.760
information has been gathered, at least that part is wrong.

615
00:37:32.840 --> 00:37:33.880
What can you tell us? No?

616
00:37:33.880 --> 00:37:37.559
No, Look, there's a lot that we don't know still,

617
00:37:37.599 --> 00:37:39.679
but we know a lot actually, you know, Like I

618
00:37:39.719 --> 00:37:41.760
hear everyone saying, you know, we don't know, we don't know.

619
00:37:41.760 --> 00:37:43.960
It's true. There's some things we don't know, but there's

620
00:37:43.960 --> 00:37:46.880
actually a lot we do know about what happened.

621
00:37:46.920 --> 00:37:50.159
You know, we know the people who were on the boat,

622
00:37:50.239 --> 00:37:53.000
we know about the other friends. And that's kind of

623
00:37:53.239 --> 00:37:55.679
one of the biggest things to me about this case,

624
00:37:55.760 --> 00:38:00.079
right is when you have probably seven people who were

625
00:38:00.119 --> 00:38:03.480
on the boat, if there was something that happened there

626
00:38:04.280 --> 00:38:09.039
and somebody's trying to hide it, seven people together aren't

627
00:38:09.079 --> 00:38:11.239
going to be able to keep that a secret.

628
00:38:11.840 --> 00:38:15.320
They're going to be able to figure out what happened if.

629
00:38:15.199 --> 00:38:18.719
There was something that we don't know yet, or there

630
00:38:18.760 --> 00:38:23.800
was something nefarious, and one of those seven people is

631
00:38:23.880 --> 00:38:28.000
going to come forward and tell the truth. So that's

632
00:38:28.039 --> 00:38:31.119
one of the reasons why I'm waiting to see is

633
00:38:31.159 --> 00:38:32.079
there any conflict.

634
00:38:32.079 --> 00:38:33.639
Now, I don't mean about small stuff.

635
00:38:33.679 --> 00:38:36.039
I don't mean about you know, was it you know

636
00:38:36.159 --> 00:38:39.440
two thirty two versus two thirty five. Yeah, I'm talking

637
00:38:39.480 --> 00:38:41.840
about the big picture stuff, like, you know, why did

638
00:38:41.840 --> 00:38:46.079
he get off the boat, what happened afterwards? If something happened,

639
00:38:46.719 --> 00:38:49.679
those seven people aren't going to be able to keep

640
00:38:49.760 --> 00:38:52.440
giving consistent stories.

641
00:38:52.480 --> 00:38:54.159
And that's one of the things I want to see

642
00:38:54.199 --> 00:38:54.719
as we move on.

643
00:38:54.880 --> 00:38:56.519
So Dan, What I would ask you first things.

644
00:38:56.559 --> 00:39:01.280
First, have is it a situation where all seven hasn't

645
00:39:01.280 --> 00:39:05.280
been interview haven't been interviewed as of yet, or is

646
00:39:05.320 --> 00:39:08.119
it that there's been no conflict in the evidence that

647
00:39:08.159 --> 00:39:08.719
they've provided?

648
00:39:08.800 --> 00:39:12.719
Right, good question. Right, We don't know. Right now.

649
00:39:12.920 --> 00:39:17.519
The authorities smartly are not getting into the details of

650
00:39:17.719 --> 00:39:21.480
exactly who they've talked to, what they've done. Now, the

651
00:39:21.480 --> 00:39:24.920
families of the friends and the people who are on

652
00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:29.480
that boat are saying, we're cooperating and there has been

653
00:39:29.519 --> 00:39:32.880
nothing that we have heard so far that suggests they

654
00:39:32.960 --> 00:39:37.360
haven't been cooperating with the investigation. And you know, that's

655
00:39:37.400 --> 00:39:41.840
when I immediately start getting suspicious, is when people stop cooperating

656
00:39:42.239 --> 00:39:46.000
with the investigation. As far as we know, that hasn't

657
00:39:46.039 --> 00:39:49.119
happened here. But you're right to ask, is there a

658
00:39:49.159 --> 00:39:52.280
conflict in their stories? We don't know at this point.

659
00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:55.400
There's been nothing to indicate that up to this point.

660
00:39:55.519 --> 00:39:59.800
The sheriff initially, you know, I'm sorry, the sheriff initially

661
00:39:59.800 --> 00:40:04.519
say investigators did not suspect foul play, but the cause

662
00:40:04.559 --> 00:40:09.880
and manner of death remained undetermined. Can you explain why

663
00:40:09.920 --> 00:40:13.760
it's remained undetermined? To this point, it's been weeks.

664
00:40:13.639 --> 00:40:15.599
Right, I mean, look, you want to do the autopsy

665
00:40:15.679 --> 00:40:19.360
before you officially announced, and the autopsy has been done,

666
00:40:19.880 --> 00:40:23.320
but they just haven't announced yet exactly what the results were.

667
00:40:23.320 --> 00:40:26.119
As you know, the family also did its own autopsy,

668
00:40:26.519 --> 00:40:30.880
which isn't as effective as the first one, right because

669
00:40:30.880 --> 00:40:34.960
they're getting it afterwards. But there have been autopsies, and

670
00:40:35.039 --> 00:40:37.880
we're going to have to see what the results of

671
00:40:37.920 --> 00:40:38.880
that are.

672
00:40:39.199 --> 00:40:40.079
But you know, and I heard you.

673
00:40:40.360 --> 00:40:43.639
Talking about this before, about the fact that the police

674
00:40:43.719 --> 00:40:46.159
and the authorities came out early on and said, you know,

675
00:40:46.239 --> 00:40:48.280
we don't suspect foul play. And I get it, right,

676
00:40:48.639 --> 00:40:51.880
in a perfect world, knowing what this case has become,

677
00:40:52.519 --> 00:40:55.440
it would have been better if they hadn't said that.

678
00:40:55.719 --> 00:40:59.599
But I will also tell you then, in almost every

679
00:40:59.639 --> 00:41:05.199
case where the authorities don't necessarily suspect a crime, they

680
00:41:05.199 --> 00:41:07.679
come out and say it. They say, look, you know,

681
00:41:07.920 --> 00:41:10.000
we arrived at the home, the guy had a heart attack.

682
00:41:10.440 --> 00:41:13.000
We don't suspect foul play, right, And we don't all

683
00:41:13.039 --> 00:41:16.199
go wait, what why are you saying that?

684
00:41:16.320 --> 00:41:16.599
Now?

685
00:41:16.760 --> 00:41:20.000
Why aren't you waiting for an investigation? We just say okay,

686
00:41:20.559 --> 00:41:20.960
got it.

687
00:41:21.800 --> 00:41:26.239
Now. The problem that can occur in some cases.

688
00:41:27.039 --> 00:41:31.360
Will be Wait a second, the authorities said early on

689
00:41:32.039 --> 00:41:34.719
that there was no foul play, and now my client

690
00:41:35.559 --> 00:41:38.159
is being tried for this case.

691
00:41:39.159 --> 00:41:41.719
What happened? That's the danger for the authorities.

692
00:41:41.719 --> 00:41:43.360
But I will tell you it is not out of

693
00:41:43.360 --> 00:41:47.079
the ordinary for the authorities to come out and make

694
00:41:47.159 --> 00:41:50.519
that kind of, you know, somewhat declarative statement.

695
00:41:51.239 --> 00:41:54.199
What about your thoughts as it pertains to the impact

696
00:41:54.280 --> 00:41:59.119
civil rights attorney Benjamin Crump and his presence. It could

697
00:41:59.159 --> 00:42:01.840
be an our shop and given the eulogy at the funeral,

698
00:42:02.000 --> 00:42:05.000
it could be the family, you know, sort of inviting

699
00:42:05.039 --> 00:42:09.119
them to ingratiate themselves into the mix in some capacity.

700
00:42:09.440 --> 00:42:13.159
What about their presence, if nothing else than the kind

701
00:42:13.159 --> 00:42:16.840
of impact that could have on the reluctance of the

702
00:42:16.880 --> 00:42:19.719
police to come out already and tell you what the

703
00:42:19.760 --> 00:42:21.039
autopsy has revealed.

704
00:42:21.559 --> 00:42:23.800
Well, I don't think that their presence is going to

705
00:42:24.000 --> 00:42:27.679
lead the authorities to be reluctant. I would judge them

706
00:42:27.679 --> 00:42:31.039
more on their actions than their presence, right, And look,

707
00:42:31.119 --> 00:42:34.159
I'm concerned. I don't like the fact that Ben Crump

708
00:42:34.519 --> 00:42:38.920
is holding press conferences with the families of other young

709
00:42:39.000 --> 00:42:43.559
black men who they claim have been mistreated or ignored

710
00:42:43.639 --> 00:42:46.519
in some way by the local authorities, right, I don't

711
00:42:46.519 --> 00:42:50.519
think that's helpful in the context of this investigation. Let's

712
00:42:50.519 --> 00:42:54.039
stick to the facts here, Let's stick to the case here.

713
00:42:54.800 --> 00:42:56.880
I get it that.

714
00:42:56.920 --> 00:43:02.119
The family, Nolan's family wants more answers. I do not

715
00:43:02.360 --> 00:43:05.960
hold anything they do or say against them for wanting

716
00:43:06.039 --> 00:43:09.639
to say, Hey, I'm not satisfied with what we have

717
00:43:09.800 --> 00:43:10.239
so far.

718
00:43:10.480 --> 00:43:11.039
I got it.

719
00:43:11.519 --> 00:43:14.239
But when Ben Crump starts bringing in other cases and

720
00:43:14.280 --> 00:43:19.039
suggesting implicitly not explicitly, that this is a racial case,

721
00:43:20.199 --> 00:43:21.280
I don't think that's helpful.

722
00:43:22.079 --> 00:43:22.639
I just don't.

723
00:43:23.599 --> 00:43:25.719
Dan Abram's right here with yours truly, Steven.

724
00:43:25.760 --> 00:43:27.599
There, I want to know, is there are presently enough

725
00:43:27.639 --> 00:43:30.760
evidence even to call this a potential homicide?

726
00:43:30.800 --> 00:43:31.559
And your estimation.

727
00:43:31.679 --> 00:43:34.679
I'm asking that question obviously, because when you strip away

728
00:43:34.719 --> 00:43:38.599
to social media theories, whatever that suggests foul play, what doesn't,

729
00:43:38.639 --> 00:43:41.760
Whatever the case may be, I'm asking you personally, is

730
00:43:41.800 --> 00:43:45.960
there presently enough evidence, according to what you've heard, to

731
00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:47.760
call this a potential homicide?

732
00:43:48.840 --> 00:43:51.559
Again, a potential a homicide would mean a death at

733
00:43:51.559 --> 00:43:54.360
the hands of another, right, doesn't have to mean a murder.

734
00:43:54.480 --> 00:43:55.599
Could just mean a death at the.

735
00:43:55.559 --> 00:43:59.960
Hands of another right and a potential homicide.

736
00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:02.719
Look, I haven't seen in the.

737
00:44:02.679 --> 00:44:07.960
Public realm any evidence that indicates that this was a homicide.

738
00:44:08.480 --> 00:44:11.599
When you throw in the word potential, what am I

739
00:44:11.639 --> 00:44:12.159
going to say?

740
00:44:12.719 --> 00:44:13.440
Is it possible?

741
00:44:13.559 --> 00:44:13.840
Yeah?

742
00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:17.360
I want the investigation to continue. You know, I watched

743
00:44:17.360 --> 00:44:20.320
your interview with Nancy Grace, my old friend Nancy Grace

744
00:44:20.440 --> 00:44:22.239
and I used to co host the show together. I've

745
00:44:22.239 --> 00:44:25.480
known her for thirty years maybe more. And you know,

746
00:44:25.800 --> 00:44:27.920
she said, well, you know, I want to make sure

747
00:44:27.920 --> 00:44:31.159
they don't close down the investigation. And you said, well,

748
00:44:31.239 --> 00:44:34.719
who's suggesting that they closed down the investigation? And that

749
00:44:34.800 --> 00:44:38.280
was the right question, which is, no one who is

750
00:44:38.639 --> 00:44:42.599
actively involved in this is saying let's shut down the investigation.

751
00:44:43.039 --> 00:44:45.639
That's not a real thing. That's just like setting up

752
00:44:45.639 --> 00:44:48.599
a straw man so you can knock it down. They should,

753
00:44:48.719 --> 00:44:52.960
of course, they shouldn't end the investigation. This investigation should

754
00:44:53.000 --> 00:44:57.360
be thorough and it should be transparent. It's really important

755
00:44:57.639 --> 00:45:00.599
that we get details. And that's not the case with

756
00:45:00.639 --> 00:45:04.440
every investigation, right As you know, in a lot of investigations,

757
00:45:04.480 --> 00:45:06.960
the authorities want to keep things close to the vest

758
00:45:07.039 --> 00:45:11.599
particularly if no one is charged. You know, they don't

759
00:45:11.599 --> 00:45:13.480
want to say, well, we looked at this lead and

760
00:45:13.519 --> 00:45:16.639
that could you know, implicate this person, but we didn't

761
00:45:16.679 --> 00:45:18.960
turn anything up with it. In a case like this,

762
00:45:20.079 --> 00:45:24.079
high profile as it is, with the racial undertones, I

763
00:45:24.119 --> 00:45:26.559
think the authorities are going to have to be transparent

764
00:45:27.320 --> 00:45:29.639
at some point. It doesn't have to be today, and

765
00:45:29.800 --> 00:45:32.079
it doesn't have to be tomorrow, but at some point

766
00:45:32.239 --> 00:45:34.800
are going to have to be transparent, not just about

767
00:45:34.800 --> 00:45:37.880
their findings, but about how and why they came to

768
00:45:37.920 --> 00:45:38.559
those conclusions.

769
00:45:38.599 --> 00:45:41.639
Dan Abrams at this particular moment in time, not speaking definitively,

770
00:45:41.719 --> 00:45:44.639
but obviously we haven't heard anything about a distress call.

771
00:45:44.719 --> 00:45:47.400
We haven't heard too much about phone records. We haven't

772
00:45:47.440 --> 00:45:50.760
heard too much about witness testimony or forensic testing. Even

773
00:45:50.800 --> 00:45:55.639
though there's been two separate autopsies, both haven't revealed anything concrete.

774
00:45:55.719 --> 00:45:58.480
One was by the you know, the regular examiner, and

775
00:45:58.519 --> 00:46:01.039
then the other was by an examiner you know, hired

776
00:46:01.039 --> 00:46:03.880
by the family. One was with his neck his throat

777
00:46:03.920 --> 00:46:05.920
in place, the other was without it. This is the

778
00:46:06.000 --> 00:46:09.079
kind of stuff that we've read up about. I'm wondering

779
00:46:09.199 --> 00:46:13.119
what could break this case conceivably in your estimation, what

780
00:46:13.199 --> 00:46:14.800
is it going to take for this case to be

781
00:46:14.880 --> 00:46:17.920
broken and for us to reach a point where we're

782
00:46:18.000 --> 00:46:20.119
able to provide some level of a conclusion.

783
00:46:20.800 --> 00:46:21.800
It's a really good question.

784
00:46:21.880 --> 00:46:24.519
Look first, let me say this if you if you're

785
00:46:24.519 --> 00:46:26.960
gonna ask me, what is the thing I'm most focused

786
00:46:26.960 --> 00:46:29.519
on and most concerned about in the context of this

787
00:46:29.599 --> 00:46:35.599
investigation in terms of potential wrongdoing, etc. I want to

788
00:46:35.599 --> 00:46:39.199
know about Nolan's phone, right, Why did he leave his phone?

789
00:46:39.360 --> 00:46:41.559
You know, the idea that he goes he's going to

790
00:46:41.599 --> 00:46:43.880
stay on the island without his phone. That's a one

791
00:46:43.960 --> 00:46:48.559
question that's always kind of made me think, huh, what

792
00:46:48.599 --> 00:46:52.320
was happening there? But again, that doesn't you know, that

793
00:46:52.360 --> 00:46:57.159
doesn't implicate anyone in terms of moving forward. I'm going

794
00:46:57.239 --> 00:46:59.440
to be looking at witness testimony and we talked about

795
00:46:59.440 --> 00:47:03.079
this at the OUTO said, I want to know are

796
00:47:03.119 --> 00:47:07.760
there inconsistencies in anything that the people who are on

797
00:47:07.840 --> 00:47:12.480
that boat are saying about why they left him. Now,

798
00:47:13.119 --> 00:47:15.679
let's take it a step further. Let's even assume for

799
00:47:15.719 --> 00:47:19.400
a moment that there are Let's assume for a moment

800
00:47:19.760 --> 00:47:23.920
that the authorities somehow conclude that he was left there

801
00:47:24.679 --> 00:47:27.440
and he wanted to come back on the boat. Right,

802
00:47:28.000 --> 00:47:30.400
Let's say that there was a conflict. Again, we don't

803
00:47:30.400 --> 00:47:31.079
know any of this, but.

804
00:47:31.079 --> 00:47:35.880
Let's just hypothetically say that even if that happens, that.

805
00:47:35.760 --> 00:47:40.239
Doesn't mean that there was a murder or a homicide, right.

806
00:47:40.480 --> 00:47:43.440
That could just mean they got in a fight or

807
00:47:43.480 --> 00:47:47.920
an argument and something else happened to him on the island.

808
00:47:48.079 --> 00:47:48.320
Right.

809
00:47:48.760 --> 00:47:52.960
But it is important going back to your question to

810
00:47:53.079 --> 00:47:57.719
find out what are the witnesses saying. Is there a conflict?

811
00:47:58.960 --> 00:48:01.400
You know, we've now we now know about the woman

812
00:48:01.480 --> 00:48:04.400
who you know, he was talking to on the island,

813
00:48:04.639 --> 00:48:06.039
apparently nineteen year old woman.

814
00:48:06.039 --> 00:48:07.559
We've heard from her as well.

815
00:48:08.480 --> 00:48:11.800
That's important, But as we move forward, I don't think

816
00:48:11.840 --> 00:48:16.920
it's going to be you know, the medical examiner is interesting, right,

817
00:48:17.159 --> 00:48:19.800
and and people get very focused on this, but they

818
00:48:19.960 --> 00:48:22.480
medical examiners can also take you down a rabbit hole

819
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:27.679
where you may get obsessed with like little questions about

820
00:48:27.760 --> 00:48:32.719
things that in the end aren't really gonna be dispositive

821
00:48:33.000 --> 00:48:34.480
of what happened to Nolan.

822
00:48:35.079 --> 00:48:36.519
You're gonna need something more.

823
00:48:36.559 --> 00:48:39.360
You're gonna need some sort of witness and considering you're

824
00:48:39.360 --> 00:48:42.440
talking about people where it started as I guess, you

825
00:48:42.480 --> 00:48:45.239
know twenty or twenty four people. You've got tons of

826
00:48:45.239 --> 00:48:52.639
people on Horn Island. There's got to be eyewitnesses accounts

827
00:48:53.239 --> 00:48:58.840
that are gonna help either be consistent and show that

828
00:48:59.119 --> 00:49:02.039
probably nothing bad happened or otherwise.

829
00:49:02.280 --> 00:49:05.480
One friend claimed Wells chose to stay behind to talk

830
00:49:05.519 --> 00:49:08.239
to that girl you just alluded to. Wells family strongly

831
00:49:08.280 --> 00:49:11.920
disputes the stating they raised him to never separate from

832
00:49:11.960 --> 00:49:12.559
his group.

833
00:49:12.840 --> 00:49:13.800
To that, you say, what.

834
00:49:14.400 --> 00:49:16.440
Well, I don't know how his family would know whether

835
00:49:16.480 --> 00:49:18.000
he did or didn't do it, you know, I mean,

836
00:49:18.039 --> 00:49:19.760
like you know, I also saw a friend of his

837
00:49:19.920 --> 00:49:21.639
say right that he wouldn't.

838
00:49:21.360 --> 00:49:22.719
Have let you know, they don't know.

839
00:49:22.920 --> 00:49:25.760
I mean that that's great to talk about what someone's

840
00:49:25.800 --> 00:49:30.280
general proclivities are, but the bottom line is, yeah, I would.

841
00:49:30.039 --> 00:49:33.199
Tell you where I raised my suspicion.

842
00:49:33.800 --> 00:49:38.039
If it's true that he let the boat leave but

843
00:49:38.199 --> 00:49:42.000
his cell phone was on the boat, I mean, swait

844
00:49:42.039 --> 00:49:45.559
a minute. I don't know any teenagers that don't let

845
00:49:45.639 --> 00:49:48.960
some get away their phone their very line of communication.

846
00:49:49.079 --> 00:49:52.480
Considering the world that we live in today, how attached

847
00:49:52.559 --> 00:49:55.440
kids are to their phones, that's their sole.

848
00:49:55.280 --> 00:49:56.440
Line of communications.

849
00:49:56.679 --> 00:50:00.480
In most instances, whether it be via text, messages, calls, emails,

850
00:50:00.480 --> 00:50:03.599
et cetera. I find that very difficult to believe that

851
00:50:03.679 --> 00:50:06.880
you just let the boat go away with your phone

852
00:50:06.920 --> 00:50:08.679
on it, and.

853
00:50:08.599 --> 00:50:12.960
You have to believe that, again, following on what you're saying,

854
00:50:13.039 --> 00:50:16.360
that he forgot it right as opposed to like intentionally

855
00:50:16.440 --> 00:50:20.119
left it. But look, I said to you at the outset,

856
00:50:20.320 --> 00:50:24.880
what's the one thing that gives me pause? Right, it's

857
00:50:24.920 --> 00:50:28.639
that that's the one thing that's so far. Again, that

858
00:50:28.639 --> 00:50:31.119
doesn't mean there won't be more things, because we don't

859
00:50:31.159 --> 00:50:33.000
know about a lot of the things. A lot of

860
00:50:33.079 --> 00:50:35.480
them haven't been made public, but other things that have

861
00:50:35.599 --> 00:50:39.679
been made public. That's a that's a bigger concern to

862
00:50:39.760 --> 00:50:42.719
me than hearing family or friends saying, well, he's not

863
00:50:42.840 --> 00:50:43.360
the kind.

864
00:50:43.159 --> 00:50:45.480
Of guy who would blank right right.

865
00:50:45.960 --> 00:50:49.800
I'm focused on what is the evidence here, and that's

866
00:50:49.800 --> 00:50:52.360
a piece of evidence here that you just cite.

867
00:50:52.599 --> 00:50:53.320
Before I move on.

868
00:50:53.440 --> 00:50:58.159
Is my very last question on this right now, you're

869
00:50:58.239 --> 00:51:02.280
looking for what what is Dan Abrams looking to find out?

870
00:51:02.360 --> 00:51:05.039
Looking to see that will get us closer to a

871
00:51:05.159 --> 00:51:09.400
resolution involving this case. Is a testimony from the police.

872
00:51:09.440 --> 00:51:12.000
As a testimony from the family, What is it that

873
00:51:12.039 --> 00:51:14.239
you're looking to find out? What should we all be

874
00:51:14.320 --> 00:51:16.079
waiting for right now as a priority.

875
00:51:16.519 --> 00:51:19.639
So if we could see the case file, right, I

876
00:51:19.679 --> 00:51:22.119
think the thing that I'd be looking for most are

877
00:51:22.159 --> 00:51:26.239
the witness accounts. I'd want to hear and see what

878
00:51:26.280 --> 00:51:30.679
did different people say about why Nolan didn't come back

879
00:51:30.679 --> 00:51:32.760
on the boat. But again, as I said to you before,

880
00:51:33.519 --> 00:51:38.360
that's only one piece of this, right, Meaning, even if

881
00:51:39.119 --> 00:51:42.079
there was an issue about him coming back on the boat,

882
00:51:42.840 --> 00:51:46.880
it doesn't mean that anybody on that boat killed him, right,

883
00:51:47.119 --> 00:51:50.679
I mean, that's still a separate question. So even if

884
00:51:50.679 --> 00:51:54.480
that happened, I still am looking to see there any

885
00:51:54.559 --> 00:51:59.280
people who are on Horn Island who can give relevant

886
00:51:59.360 --> 00:52:03.440
eyewitness accounts to this that can help move this case

887
00:52:03.519 --> 00:52:04.400
forward in one way or.

888
00:52:04.400 --> 00:52:06.480
Not, based on your level of expertise and who you're

889
00:52:06.519 --> 00:52:10.000
connected to. Any reason to be suspicious about the investigators.

890
00:52:10.239 --> 00:52:12.119
We are talking about a black kid, we are talking

891
00:52:12.159 --> 00:52:14.599
about Mississippi. But in the same breath, we want to

892
00:52:14.599 --> 00:52:16.719
be feared of law enforcement and we want to we

893
00:52:16.760 --> 00:52:18.960
want to make sure that we don't cast dispersions of

894
00:52:19.000 --> 00:52:22.840
guilt upon somebody, and we have no evidence of that whatsoever.

895
00:52:23.119 --> 00:52:26.480
Yeah, I look, I'm sorry that this has become a

896
00:52:26.559 --> 00:52:31.559
racial case. You know, you get it, right, is only

897
00:52:31.639 --> 00:52:35.960
black kid on the boat, Mississippi history, et cetera. But

898
00:52:36.559 --> 00:52:39.519
you know, on the flip side of this, you hope

899
00:52:39.559 --> 00:52:43.280
what was actually the case was that you know, white

900
00:52:43.360 --> 00:52:46.599
kid had black had black friend, black friend, black kid

901
00:52:46.679 --> 00:52:50.440
had white friends. Right, Like, that shouldn't be like an issue, right,

902
00:52:51.280 --> 00:52:55.639
It's it's sort of incredibly sad that the fact that

903
00:52:55.840 --> 00:52:58.920
you know, black kid and white friends is an issue

904
00:52:59.079 --> 00:52:59.559
out there.

905
00:52:59.599 --> 00:53:01.400
We get why it can be.

906
00:53:02.079 --> 00:53:05.000
But I'm gonna say to people, and I'll say it

907
00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:07.960
to you, which is I hope we can stay focused

908
00:53:08.079 --> 00:53:09.920
on the evidence and.

909
00:53:09.800 --> 00:53:11.559
Not turn this into a racial case.

910
00:53:11.800 --> 00:53:15.159
And that's why when you asked me earlier about Ben Crump,

911
00:53:15.800 --> 00:53:17.400
you know, I don't have a problem with Ben Crump,

912
00:53:17.480 --> 00:53:20.079
per se. I do have a problem when he starts

913
00:53:20.119 --> 00:53:24.480
linking it to other cases and suggesting that this is

914
00:53:25.239 --> 00:53:30.320
of particular concern because of race. And let's give them,

915
00:53:30.440 --> 00:53:31.800
let's give them the benefit of the.

916
00:53:31.719 --> 00:53:32.440
Doubt for now.

917
00:53:32.599 --> 00:53:34.840
If it turns out that, you know, look what we've

918
00:53:34.840 --> 00:53:38.559
seen in the Savannah in this, in the Nancy Guthrie case, right,

919
00:53:39.039 --> 00:53:41.800
we gave the authorities the benefit of the doubt. Now

920
00:53:41.840 --> 00:53:44.159
that we've seen what happened in that case, we know

921
00:53:44.639 --> 00:53:47.159
they screwed a lot of things up, all right.

922
00:53:47.559 --> 00:53:48.440
They deserve the.

923
00:53:48.400 --> 00:53:51.960
Benefit of the doubt to begin with, But as we've

924
00:53:52.039 --> 00:53:55.360
now seen they made a lot of mistakes. In the

925
00:53:55.440 --> 00:53:59.079
vast majority of investigations, that's not the case.

926
00:53:59.599 --> 00:54:01.960
So I'm not going to presume that.

927
00:54:01.840 --> 00:54:05.360
The authorities are doing anything wrong until I see evidence

928
00:54:05.400 --> 00:54:05.920
of wrongdoing.

929
00:54:06.360 --> 00:54:09.400
Dan Neighbrams. Appreciate you, man, appreciate the education and enlightenment.

930
00:54:09.440 --> 00:54:11.039
Thank you so much. Man, I want to learn about

931
00:54:11.039 --> 00:54:12.920
this stuff. He was the person that I thought would

932
00:54:12.960 --> 00:54:14.239
be perfect for this. Thank you so much.

933
00:54:14.280 --> 00:54:16.440
On man, steven A. Always great to see you.

934
00:54:16.440 --> 00:54:18.360
You're same here, buddy, Thank you so much. Talk to

935
00:54:18.400 --> 00:54:20.400
you later. Well you heard what he had to say,

936
00:54:20.719 --> 00:54:23.320
makes a lot of sense. You know them wells God,

937
00:54:23.320 --> 00:54:25.880
bless your soul. We got to find out get to

938
00:54:25.880 --> 00:54:28.519
the bottom of it. Indeed, there may not have been

939
00:54:29.840 --> 00:54:32.559
any criminal activity, or there may have been. The fact

940
00:54:32.559 --> 00:54:34.880
of the matter is that what's unacceptable is that the

941
00:54:34.880 --> 00:54:36.559
stuff is still up in the air, that we don't

942
00:54:36.599 --> 00:54:40.079
know anything, that we haven't heard from the police at

943
00:54:40.079 --> 00:54:41.480
that particular moment in time.

944
00:54:41.320 --> 00:54:42.840
And we need to we need to hear.

945
00:54:42.920 --> 00:54:44.960
We need to hear what the autopsy reports revealed, We

946
00:54:44.960 --> 00:54:47.679
need to hear what the investigation has revealed. It needs

947
00:54:47.679 --> 00:54:49.400
to be a bit more open to the public because

948
00:54:49.400 --> 00:54:52.880
it just seems incredibly, incredibly suspicious. I've been watching a

949
00:54:52.920 --> 00:54:56.639
bevy of people talk about this, you know, from all spectrums,

950
00:54:57.000 --> 00:55:00.559
all over the place, and people have their opinions. Officer

951
00:55:00.599 --> 00:55:03.039
Tatum inter view a couple of these folks, and you know,

952
00:55:03.159 --> 00:55:05.760
talk about the evidence that he's accumulated. And I know

953
00:55:05.800 --> 00:55:07.320
a lot of people have been getting on them, but

954
00:55:07.599 --> 00:55:09.559
he's been on the case and been talking to some people.

955
00:55:09.599 --> 00:55:11.599
He's talked to more people than most people have talking

956
00:55:11.639 --> 00:55:13.559
to that have talked to about the Nolan Wells case.

957
00:55:13.599 --> 00:55:15.920
Give him credit for that. In the end, we got

958
00:55:15.920 --> 00:55:17.599
to get to the bottom of this. You got to

959
00:55:17.599 --> 00:55:21.320
find out what's up. It's necessary because an eighteen year

960
00:55:21.320 --> 00:55:24.800
old kid, black kid Mississippi. And that's not to say

961
00:55:24.840 --> 00:55:26.880
that if it was not if he was not black,

962
00:55:26.920 --> 00:55:28.840
it wouldn't matter, because I'm not trying to go there.

963
00:55:28.920 --> 00:55:30.400
That's not true. That's not what I'm saying.

964
00:55:30.880 --> 00:55:33.119
But when you have a black kid that support portedly

965
00:55:33.280 --> 00:55:35.920
was by himself, and he's in Mississippi and this is

966
00:55:35.960 --> 00:55:39.079
the kind of stuff that has happened to him or

967
00:55:39.119 --> 00:55:43.039
potentially it has to be investigated. There is no way

968
00:55:43.239 --> 00:55:48.760
around that whatsoever. The way it goes just got to

969
00:55:48.760 --> 00:55:51.039
be real and honest about that. That's it for this

970
00:55:51.039 --> 00:55:54.800
Addison A straight shooter til next time, everybody. Wednesday Night

971
00:55:55.800 --> 00:55:58.559
Straight Shooter which George Truly stephen A Serios six and

972
00:55:58.559 --> 00:56:01.360
Potis Radio Channel one twenty four from six p m

973
00:56:01.400 --> 00:56:02.880
to eight p m East instead the time.

974
00:56:02.920 --> 00:56:06.039
Don't miss it until then. I'm out, peace and love,