Nolan Wells Investigation: Cajun Navy, Death Threats, Sealed Autopsy

0:19 Hey, everyone, Welcome back to Exposed Scandalous Files of the Elite. I am your host, Jim Chapman, and I have another update on the case of Nolan Wells. Now, we're going to move on from the Nolan Wells case at some point, but I just feel like y'all that this is too important to let lies and half truth and inn window get out there without having some sort of response to that. I'm very blessed to have a platform that a lot of people listen to, and I feel almost a responsibility to do what I can to bring you the facts as they are are right now. So I'm gonna stick with this one the full way through. I'll be releasing episodes on other topics, but when there's something to be said on this case, you better believe I'm gonna drop a podcast on it, because it's just too important to not do that. I'm not gonna turn a blind eye to people attempting to control a narrative. Now, before I go any further with what we are gonna talk about today, I want to say this, none of us, zero of us in media know what happened to Nolan Wells. As a matter of pure fact, we as media figures, we are only as good as the information that is provided to us. And I'm gonna talk a little bit about

1:50 that today because there are a lot of people out there that have expressed frustration at what the police have come out and said, which is very little, what the district attorney has come out and said, which again is very little. So we're gonna discuss that, and we're gonna discuss how it affects this case, and I'm gonna give you my personal thoughts on what I would like to see in that respect. Now, as I said in several prior episodes, the media, with the exception of a very small group, have thrown so many accusations at these boys that were with Nolan that day. Now, they don't come right out in some cases and just say, oh, these boys killed Nolan Wells. They don't do that, but you can read between lines and you can see when someone is pushing a narrative with no evidence. Now, the family of these boys and the boys themselves, they're fighting back in lawsuits themselves. And these lawsuits aren't just aimed at people very to this case. They're firing back at other podcasters for what they deem is defamation. You cannot just say something untrue that you know to be untrue about someone and think there's not going to be repercussions for that, especially in a case like this one. So I want everybody to stop and think about that for a second.

3:22 I don't think there's any debate that there are thousands and thousands of people out there that have labeled every single one of these boys involved in this, if not a killer, at least racist kids, even one who is of mixed race. He has a white side of the family and a black side of the family. His name is Traceten, and they even call him a racist, which is absolutely ludicrous. Now, I'm pretty sure it was the last episode that I talked a little bit about Nancy Grace, who again I like her. I like Nancy, I enjoy her show. But one thing when Nancy is sometimes it does appear that she gets the facts a little bit messed up, or she doesn't understand certain aspects of a case.

4:10 And look, she's extremely smart. Yes, she was a lawyer for a million years and all those sorts of things. But if you're not digging into things like river life or life on the water, and you're speaking on that you need to speak with a little bit of education about it. Now, she does do a good job of getting experts on her show to give their points, but she will say things out of her own mouth that are somewhat inaccurate or that she doesn't really understand. Now, I know, Nancy has a big crew and a big show, and look y'all, she doesn't have time to research every single thing she covers. She relies on people, producers, people like that. So I'm not throwing blame completely on Nancy, but all of us in non traditional media podcast personalities whatever, we all know at the end of the day, we better make sure we double check just about everything because we are the ones that are actually saying it. So one of the things that I'm gonna do today is I'm going to play some clips of some things that she reported and some things that she has a particular opinion of, where it appears that she may not have had all the facts, And I'm gonna give you the other side of that because a lot of people are running with her reporting. Now, I'm gonna start off with the opening of her show that aired the third of August just yesterday. As I'm preparing to record this episode,

5:41 she opens it up, and she is still harping on this audio that had come out when the boys made the emergency call that their boat was sinking. If you'll remember that part of the case, and if you haven't listened to part one and two, this may make no sense to you, So go listen to some of my prior updates first on it case. But she's harping on that continually, And I've already told you, and I'm sure you've already seen somewhere the video that exists that kind of coincides with this audio call where someone was filming these boys and there were a couple of girls on that boat as well, but somebody's filming them going about the boat and they're grabbing ropes, and remember the bilge pump had failed and that boat was sinking, and eventually they figure out we got to pull the plug and get the hell out of here. And you could see in this video they're in a panic because that boat was about to sink and they're setting it up to get towed, grabbing ropes. All that stuff. Now, just prior to that call connecting allegedly, according to people that have edited or enhanced that recording, I should say, you can hear people saying the name Nolan and is he dead, and all these sorts of things that would look real bad in reality if that was indeed what was being said now, regardless of what you're hearing, regardless of that, the existence of a video now shows Nolan nowhere in

7:14 sight when they were preparing to tow that boat off nowhere in sight. Nancy still continues to promote this audio on her episode, and she actually doubled down in this particular episode, and she has one of her own producers. One of Nancy's own producers enhanced the video as well. And I'm not going to replay audios for you of all that, because I've already done it last episode I played you, or two episodes ago I played you the full audio of that ce toe call. So I'm not going to play that again or play all this stuff that producers have enhanced. And when you enhance something, I don't care what you say. I am in this business.

8:00 Marbles the audio. And when you put warding up there a transcript while the thing is playing, what do you think your brain is going to do when it here's something that says something similar to Nolan. I don't know what it says. I hear some things that when I'm looking at the transcript, I'm like, that is what it sounds like. But also have a video to reference where Nolan is nowhere on that boat. So, folks, all I'm saying here is use your common sense. It's important because a lot of this case boils down to common sense when it comes to throwing all these accusations. Don't let technology supersede your common sense. And I think a lot of that has been done in this case. For example, if you intentionally kill somebody, or accidentally kill somebody for that matter, or somebody all of a sudden dies right in front of you at that point, or you can have one of your friends at that exact point that you notice someone is dying, call the coastguard or call an emergency toe company to come to your boat because it's sinking. Are you even gonna be on the phone at that point if all of that is going on, of course not. Secondly, you have a video to compare to all this. Why is nobody talking about that? Nancy Grace and thousands of other people are running with this audio that has been henced, meaning it's been played with.

9:33 Why don't you even believe your own two eyes when you match up the video in the audio and look at these two things. And what you see in the video is everybody running around trying to get this boat tied to another boat. Nobody's waving their hands in the air or freaking out other than the fact that the boat is sinking. But they're not freaking out and looking at somebody and saying, hey are you okay? Hey, why are you not breathing? None of this is happening. Nobody's doing that. But you can't get Nancy or several of these other media personalities to even mention the video and ask the question, now, another common sensical thought here, there were seven people on that boat, y'all seven people, to my knowledge, all the age of twenty one or younger.

10:26 Two girls and five boys. The police, I assure you they have interviewed every single one of them. Matter of fact, I told you already they interviewed over sixty people. Rest assured, every single person on that boat has been approached by a police for an interview. That would be the first thing you would do in a situation like this. Do you really think, using your common sense your god given sense that all seven of these young people managed to keep the same story with police. And you may say, well, how do you know the stories were the same? Well, that one's easy, y'all, because there's been no arrest. Had those stories changed or they were not consistent one hundred percent, in my view, somebody would be arrested by now, because the truth never changes and the police know that they're good at this, y'all. You don't think the police would have talked to one of those girls or both of those girls and say, come on, you don't want to go down for something you didn't do, and you know, maybe we'll cut you a deal if you tell us what happened. This happens all the time in interrogations. I submit to you, there's no way seven people twenty one years of age or younger would be able to keep that secret when questioned by police. Folks. These are not

11:57 kids that live that life, you know what I'm saying. These are not kids that grew up dealing with the police in some sort of criminal way all of the time, and they're totally used to it, and so it doesn't even intimidate them. These are very wealthy kids. The vast majority of them, None of them that I'm aware of, have had any dealings with the police for something nefarious or criminal. They would be scared shitless. Everybody would be confessing. And when you got seven people, and incidentally, the police they can lie to you legally to try to get you to confess to something. When you got seven people, you don't think the police would say, Hey, Joe Blow in the other room has told us everything that happened and he's blaming it all on you. You don't think at that point if these people knew anything that happened to Nolan, they wouldn't spill the beans right there. They would have said anything they had to say. You're living on Mars.

13:04 If you think they could stand up to that type of pressure, Seven different people that age now lastly on that point, y'all, this recording, this tow call recording ce tow. It took place while they were trying to set the boat up to get it towed by another boat. There were hundreds of people around their boat as they were struggling to get it tied off to the other boat and get towed off of that island. If you will, you don't think of Nolan Wells was laying there dying with hundreds of people around. Everybody's on boats, everybody's got cell phones. Nobody would have seen that, taken a picture or a video, or would have showed a picture of Nolan Wells on that boat, or at least a picture of all these people panicking because of what you're allegedly hearing in the background. Common sense, y'all. So in this episode with Nancy that I referenced earlier, she had someone.

14:07 It was a podcaster apparently by the name of Teslin Faguero. I believe it is her name, and she came on the show, and I'm gonna let you listen to her take on something completely out of context. She takes it completely out of context here, and then I'm gonna add the context for you so you can see how these games are played. Well, that's what the family is saying. They don't believe he died by accident. That's the point. That's the reason why Nolan Well's mom is saying, I don't believe this. I don't believe he died by accident. Before we had the audio. The audio simply confirms that there are additional questions that needs to be asked. It wasn't just one thing they said in the audio, they said Nolan repeatedly in the audio, they said check his chest.

14:50 In the audio, they said is he dead? In the audio? And also notice this, Nancy, did you notice that the operator also said is anybody breathing? Who says it? What operator says? Who all is breathing on the boat. If you listen to my podcast that I dropped just a few days ago, I covered the entire seed toe call that she's referring to. But I'm gonna isolate just the part she discussed here, and I'm gonna let you listen to the full context the stuff she didn't say prior to this. Oh right, How many adults and children on board? No, there's no children, So is there anybody on board? How many adults?

15:35 Sir? That was the question? Hello? Can you hear me. Jump in while you're doing. Hello? Sir? Hello, yep. I just need you to answer these questions so I can get you over to the captain. How many adults on board? Very adults on board? There's nobody on board the boat? No, no, here is over the age of twenty one, sir. That was not the question. Is there a person. Is there a person, a living individual on the boat? Hello? Is there a living person? Someone breathing on the boat?

16:15 Is there anybody on the boat? There, there's lots of people breathing on the boat. Oh right, how many people? Sir? Like seven? So there you have it, y'all. It's called context. The reason she said is anybody breathing on the boat is because she asked this boy three or four times how many people were on the boat. And it's obvious you can tell just by the way that he's talking that this guy may have had one too many Miller lights, right, so he's having trouble comprehending exactly what she's saying to him. And this operator may have been being a little sarcastic by saying how many people are breathing on the boat?

16:59 I mean, you could tell she was getting frustrated because he couldn't answer her question, clearly due to likely some alcohol consumption. That's my thought process. But that is also how people twist this entire scenario this podcast that Nancy had even doubled down on that statement and theorized that maybe the operator overheard the kids saying all of these nefarious things about Nolan, and then inferred that when the operator said, is anybody breathing? She said that because she could hear people, meaning the operator could hear people in the background talking about Nolan wells, is he dead? And all this stuff. That was the inference that this person made.

17:48 That is freaking ridiculous, y'all. It's pushing a narrative. So now you have the full context of what she said, and it makes a little bit more sense. And it wasn't because she heard something going on in the background. You don't think if this operator heard something like that in the background, she wouldn't have followed up with what's going on in the background? Is somebody dying? I hear a lot of people in the background saying somebody's dying. Of course she would, And this operator definitely would have mentioned that when she called another dispatcher to get a toe out to these boys. She would have said, Hey, I think something's going on because I heard stuff in the background. We heard that whole conversation. None of that ever came up with this operator. You don't think the police would have known that and already talked to this operator.

18:44 Of course they would. Y'all are being sold wolf tickets right now, you shur guy, given sense, But let's move on from that. Another thing brought up during this particular episode of Nancy's podcast was the autopsy report which he's currently undersealed. Now, this is not out of the ordinary at all by any way, shape or form. Yes, autopsy reports are typically public record, but it's common, as a matter of fact, very common that until a grand jury is convened to find out if there's evidence of anything that occurred outside of an accidental death that was at the hands of nobody, like a drowning or a car wreck or something like that, a grand jury has to determine whether there's been any foul play. In the end, it's common for these autopsy reports to be sealed so that information doesn't get out to the public and tainked the jury pool. So I'm gonna let you listen to this next clip of Nancy speaking to Joseph Morgan. Now, Joseph Morgan is a stud he's an expert on all things detective work. Really like this guy, and he breaks down why the report may have been sealed in this club, And as I said, I couldn't agree with him more.

20:06 I've never known an autopsy report not to be a public record unless they're claiming ongoing investigation. How common is that that the medical examiner is ordered not to release the autopsy? Why is the autopsy being kept secret? Because it's continued investigation. They're going to go to grand jury with this. I can tell you that. I'll bet you dollars to donuts if that's the case. We see it with We saw it with Hoefor right, we didn't have it there, We don't have it with Charlie Kirk. You know that's an ongoing event. This is being investigated, and you know the point of contact. Here is an interesting situation here because you have the state Medical Examiner, but you also have a county corner. The state medical Examiner provides a service to the county corner Corner is an elective official. He does not do these autopsies, and so the coroner is going to be the gatekeeper relative to any kind of document. But with that said, under state I think under state to statute, the DA, the prosecutor they can say, look, you're going to hold off on releasing this report. So it's being held at this point in time. Now, the reports that we're hearing are saying that it is complete. Now what does that mean? Well, if you have a complete autopsy report, that means safety itox.

21:36 They've probably got histology, which is going to be the tissue studies, and they actually have the anatomical autopsy report that has been completed. I think the question is, and this goes back to you, my friend, is that if this is going to be a grand jury thing, when is it going and when is the medical examder going to be called and summoned to speak to this. That's what everybody's going to be hanging on in my. Opinion, No j just Scott, you mentioned the talks report, that's a blood panel done. Was he drinking? Was he using drugs? A lot has been made, witnesses stating no one was drunk, Okay, does that really change anything? Does that change anything unless he died of acute alcohol poisoning, because I guarantee you ain't anybody on that boat that's afraid of a cocktail. Okay, So if he was drinking, what difference does that make?

22:35 It all boils down to a grand jury is going to be convening on this, and you don't want it out there until that happens. Now, I want to answer Nancy's question that she had at the end of that club, which was what difference does his blood alcohol level make? Meaning no one wills and I can answer that one quickly. I'm not even going to spend a lot of time on it. Have you ever tried to swim in an ocean when you ship faced? It's not easy. Hell, I've been drunk and went and put my feet in the waves and fell over before. Imagine trying to be upright and waiting in chest deep water, ship face drunk, trying to balance yourself as your feet are below you and you're trying to feel for the ocean floor. Think about that. Hell, yeah, it's important what his blood alcohol level was set it before.

23:31 And I'll say it again, Nancy apparently is more of an indoor girl. I would imagine to say a statement like that, But I'm gonna Takehi one step further. I'm not interested at all in the blood alcohol content that comes out with this report, because honestly, it's meaningless. I told you a couple of episodes ago. Your blood alcohol content is naturally going to rise as part of the decomposition process, know them well, wasn't found for two days. He could have not had any drinks and he's going to show a high blood alcohol content. He could have had a ton of drinks and he's going to show a high blood alcohol content. Really, all we have to go on to determine how much he was drinking are the witnesses that encountered him that day and were with him that day, and they all say, like everybody else that was around him, that he was drinking heavily. So I'm not putting any stock into what that side of the report comes out with, because science tells me he would show a high blood alcohol content regardless. But another thing you heard in that statement given by Joseph Morgan was that he would be interested in the drug aspect of that report. He actually said if anybody had given knowing anything, it would be interesting to know of that, and so do I. I'm very interested in that because

25:02 the drugs in his body, they're not going to be affected by decomposition. If he had any sort of drug in his body, it's gonna show up on that report. I'm gonna be real interested in the drug aspect of this report. So the next point I want to bring up that I've had a lot of questions message to me on my social media about this and this as well. If nobody had done anything wrong, then why is a grand jury going to be convened at some point during this case? And I'm gonna start this off by saying, I don't know if anybody's done anything wrong. I'm not saying Nolan wasn't killed. I'm not saying that he drowned.

25:43 I'm not saying he didn't get drunk and passed out and just fell in the water. I wasn't there. I have no direct knowledge. I'm looking at this case from everything that has been presented to me, and it's my belief these boys have nothing to do with it based off of what I have seen, like the video that shows them tying off the boat. And I've listened to all these boys when they were interviewed by Officer Tatum and a no bullshit when I see it, I like to think, and I don't think they're feeding anybody a bunch of bullshit. I have common sense and I know there's no way seven people could keep this thing a secret for this long. No way. But I'm not saying somebody else hadn't killed him. I'm not saying he didn't drown.

26:32 I'm not saying he didn't have something else happened to him until that report comes out, and that is why the report is so important on the autopsy. Till that comes out, we can only speak on the information we have. All of that being said, the question was asked to me, why is a grand jury being convened if nobody's done anything wrong, And the answer to that is, it's state law that one has to be convened unless it's a situation where someone died of natural causes like a heart attack or something that's totally obvious something of that nature, or a car accident where it's obvious someone died in that car accident. In this case is you don't have to convene a grand jury. But Mississippi state law says that outside those parameters, you have to convene a grand jury, present the evidence to them, and then upon that presentation of the evidence, they'll look at that case and they'll decide whether there's any evidence to move forward with charging someone with a crime. Now, typically this isn't necessary in situations where you have someone ribe a bank, for example, and shoot somebody, because there's enough evidence there for the police to make an arrest right off the bat, and that should tell you a lot about this case because there's been no arrest because they're convening a grand jury now because they have to. But it should also tell

28:03 you there's not enough evidence to even make an arrest, so they're gonna put it in the hands of grand jury to basically say, yes, there's enough evidence we see something here to charge somebody or know we think Nolan Well's drowned. Essentially. Now, another update that I want to bring you on this case, and that is as soon as I recorded my last episode. It always works like that, right as soon as I recorded it. When you know the same day that that episode dropped the United Cajun Navy releases. I guess you would call this. A lot of people are calling it an investigative report, but I listened to an interview yesterday where they're saying that's not what it is because they're not investigators. Essentially, what they did was they curated a lot of like social media tips that had been sent to them, and they made a report out of it. But I'm gonna tell y'all, I don't know what exactly you would call it. I'm not even sure why they released it. Really, I guess this is standard procedure for them and y'all. Incidentally, the Cajun Navy, United Cajun Navy is about five minutes from where I record. They're in Baton Rouge. But they release a report, and let me tell you, this thing is twenty six pages long. And as many reports that I have read in seven years that I've covered true crime on a podcast, in the forty plus years that I've spent research in true crime, I have never come across

29:36 a report in my life as hard to understand as this report. I mean, you have to be Eli Musk. I ain't kidding you to understand this thing. It's twenty six pages of calculus. What I can tell you about that report was there's nothing in it at all that pertains in any way to having any questions that answered as of how Nolan Wells died what happened to him. There's none of that. And the question they ask is a question everyone is asking since the beginning of this case, and that was where was Nolan from three o'clock to four point thirty. Nobody can seem to give that answer, including the Cajun Navy, which is not surprising because they didn't get involved until after he was missing. Now, if the United Cajun Navy CEO or whoever's in charge, wants to come on the podcast and discuss the report, you're like five minutes from me. Give me a call, shoot me a message. I'd be glad to have you on the show, and maybe you can make sense of this because I can't even report on it. I can't even understand this thing. It's so non user friendly, I guess unless you're someone in that industry. Also on the Officer Tatum show, they released some pretty disturbing threats that were recorded regarding the family of Warren, one of the people involved in this case. Remember, his stepmother is a judge, his dad is a doctor. Officer Tatum released some threats

31:06 and I want you to hear them because I want you to grasp how disturbing some people are. And this is something in the last episode I spent some time covering, and I told you about all the crazies that are out there and all the people that think the shit is funny and doing absolutely nothing to help Nolan Wells, and I hope they know that it's coming. Look, you're gonna get caught. No matter how slick you think you are. These folks are all gonna get tracked. And they're making threats against a sitting judge and a judge's family. You think people are just gonna let that slide. They're not quit with the threats. It's not helping anybody. But I want you to listen to this.

31:58 I'll try right now. Your son is a piece of and he's about to get all the way up right now. You use a punk. They're just like your son. Give kim. You guys are gonna get her coming to you. I know he killed that little kid man. You guys, aren't your wife? Call you racist? Pieces of all? You Now, I'm gonna play the next one. No answer the phone. You you, you, you and your folks think y'all lass so smart, so sleep. Your son's gonna get the worst of it. And he know it, he know it. He ain't y'all ain't safe. Y'all can't say that little y'all can't say y'all self. But you know you know it's coming. It's real coming.

32:51 It's real coming. As sons and them gonna disable their account and all this utter. Bruce Dag they know what's going on, they know what they did, they say what they. For a reason. They lord though for a reason. They don't follow this ad for a reason they know yore scared things of their phone because you know what's going on, and nobody scared of y'all White on Jesus a face, y'all, ain't nobody worried about tell you, ain't nobody scared about your job, but it'll be worried about their boy. God, I promise you something gonna happen to his if I don't get to nobody else get to his. Some I'm gonna happen to you. And you might want to go and block me because I saw the God. I'm gonna car you off on every day until they come clean.

33:31 I'm talking about some mold. This your old scary white absolutely sick. And here's one where Warren's dad answers the fine Hello. Hello, I'm not speaking with Benjamin Ester. Who's this? You and your son gonna die a little bro? Ain't your wife for what y'all did? Now? Why did I just play y'all all those thoats? Other than the fact that people need to see how serious this is, I play them because there are a lot of comments. My guess the side that doesn't agree with me reporting what I perceive to be the truth. They say the only victim in this case is know them Wells, and originally I would agree with that. However, it's people that have hate in their heart to this extent that are creating victims far reaching just know them Wells. When you're accused of something like murder and you didn't do it, you become a victim as well. When you're threatened with your life, your kid's life, those people become a victim.

34:46 The fact of the matter is Knowing well should have been the only victim in this case. But hateful, horrible people are creating victims everywhere now. And it's a shame because I say say it at the end of every episode I've done on this and that is I want justice for Nolan Wells and this ain't the way to get it. It's divisive bullshit. Now I'm gonna end this one with some hope for you. They're not everyone out there, and I know it seems like it, but not everyone out there is not using their common sense. And one of those people that I've really enjoyed hearing his take on this case, and we agree in a lot of areas.

35:31 Is Dan Abrams. Now you may not be familiar with Dan. He's a television host and recently he went on another guy's podcast that I really like, and that is Stephen A. He goes on steven A's show and he gives his take on this case, and I enjoyed it so much that I want you to be able to enjoy it too. So I'm going to end the episode by playing the full clip of Dan Abrams on stephen a show talking about this case. It's only about twenty minutes in length, but I think you'll really enjoy it. So after I end this episode, you're gonna hear that full clip. Every night, y'all.

36:13 I pray for justice for Nolan Wells, and every night I pray for his family to find peace. And that is a fact. Until next time. For exposed scandalous files of the Elite, I'm your host, Jim Chapman. Much Love. My guest is an attorney, a legal commentator, and the founder of the Law and Crime Network, a multi platform digital and cable television network that specializes in live gabbl to gavel court room coverage, high profile, criminal trials and expert legal commentary. Please welcome to the show to one and only Dan Abrams. Dan, how are you, sir? Good to see how's everything.

36:54 Going, Steven A great to be with you. Appreciate it. Man, Let's get right to it. I mean, the Nolan Wells cases taking on a life of his own, still very much in the news for those who haven't been following the case. Just want to throw this stuff out there and then. Wells was an eighteen year old college football player from Ocean Springs, Mississippi. On July fourth, he and a group of friends traveled by private boat to Horn Island and uninhabited Barrier Island off the coast of Mississippi. Wells was the only black person on the boat. According to reports, he was last seen on the island around three pm. His friends returned to the mainland without him. Dan, First things first, do I have that right? Or as new information has been gathered, at least that part is wrong. What can you tell us? No? No, Look, there's a lot that we don't know still, but we know a lot actually, you know, Like I hear everyone saying, you know, we don't know, we don't know.

37:41 It's true. There's some things we don't know, but there's actually a lot we do know about what happened. You know, we know the people who were on the boat, we know about the other friends. And that's kind of one of the biggest things to me about this case, right is when you have probably seven people who were on the boat, if there was something that happened there and somebody's trying to hide it, seven people together aren't going to be able to keep that a secret. They're going to be able to figure out what happened if. There was something that we don't know yet, or there was something nefarious, and one of those seven people is going to come forward and tell the truth. So that's one of the reasons why I'm waiting to see is there any conflict.

38:32 Now, I don't mean about small stuff. I don't mean about you know, was it you know two thirty two versus two thirty five. Yeah, I'm talking about the big picture stuff, like, you know, why did he get off the boat, what happened afterwards? If something happened, those seven people aren't going to be able to keep giving consistent stories. And that's one of the things I want to see as we move on. So Dan, What I would ask you first things. First, have is it a situation where all seven hasn't been interview haven't been interviewed as of yet, or is it that there's been no conflict in the evidence that they've provided? Right, good question. Right, We don't know. Right now.

39:12 The authorities smartly are not getting into the details of exactly who they've talked to, what they've done. Now, the families of the friends and the people who are on that boat are saying, we're cooperating and there has been nothing that we have heard so far that suggests they haven't been cooperating with the investigation. And you know, that's when I immediately start getting suspicious, is when people stop cooperating with the investigation. As far as we know, that hasn't happened here. But you're right to ask, is there a conflict in their stories? We don't know at this point. There's been nothing to indicate that up to this point.

39:55 The sheriff initially, you know, I'm sorry, the sheriff initially say investigators did not suspect foul play, but the cause and manner of death remained undetermined. Can you explain why it's remained undetermined? To this point, it's been weeks. Right, I mean, look, you want to do the autopsy before you officially announced, and the autopsy has been done, but they just haven't announced yet exactly what the results were. As you know, the family also did its own autopsy, which isn't as effective as the first one, right because they're getting it afterwards. But there have been autopsies, and we're going to have to see what the results of that are.

40:39 But you know, and I heard you. Talking about this before, about the fact that the police and the authorities came out early on and said, you know, we don't suspect foul play. And I get it, right, in a perfect world, knowing what this case has become, it would have been better if they hadn't said that. But I will also tell you then, in almost every case where the authorities don't necessarily suspect a crime, they come out and say it. They say, look, you know, we arrived at the home, the guy had a heart attack. We don't suspect foul play, right, And we don't all go wait, what why are you saying that? Now? Why aren't you waiting for an investigation? We just say okay, got it.

41:21 Now. The problem that can occur in some cases. Will be Wait a second, the authorities said early on that there was no foul play, and now my client is being tried for this case. What happened? That's the danger for the authorities. But I will tell you it is not out of the ordinary for the authorities to come out and make that kind of, you know, somewhat declarative statement. What about your thoughts as it pertains to the impact civil rights attorney Benjamin Crump and his presence. It could be an our shop and given the eulogy at the funeral, it could be the family, you know, sort of inviting them to ingratiate themselves into the mix in some capacity.

42:09 What about their presence, if nothing else than the kind of impact that could have on the reluctance of the police to come out already and tell you what the autopsy has revealed. Well, I don't think that their presence is going to lead the authorities to be reluctant. I would judge them more on their actions than their presence, right, And look, I'm concerned. I don't like the fact that Ben Crump is holding press conferences with the families of other young black men who they claim have been mistreated or ignored in some way by the local authorities, right, I don't think that's helpful in the context of this investigation. Let's stick to the facts here, Let's stick to the case here.

42:54 I get it that. The family, Nolan's family wants more answers. I do not hold anything they do or say against them for wanting to say, Hey, I'm not satisfied with what we have so far. I got it. But when Ben Crump starts bringing in other cases and suggesting implicitly not explicitly, that this is a racial case, I don't think that's helpful. I just don't. Dan Abram's right here with yours truly, Steven. There, I want to know, is there are presently enough evidence even to call this a potential homicide? And your estimation. I'm asking that question obviously, because when you strip away to social media theories, whatever that suggests foul play, what doesn't, Whatever the case may be, I'm asking you personally, is there presently enough evidence, according to what you've heard, to call this a potential homicide?

43:48 Again, a potential a homicide would mean a death at the hands of another, right, doesn't have to mean a murder. Could just mean a death at the. Hands of another right and a potential homicide. Look, I haven't seen in the. Public realm any evidence that indicates that this was a homicide. When you throw in the word potential, what am I going to say? Is it possible? Yeah? I want the investigation to continue. You know, I watched your interview with Nancy Grace, my old friend Nancy Grace and I used to co host the show together. I've known her for thirty years maybe more. And you know, she said, well, you know, I want to make sure they don't close down the investigation. And you said, well, who's suggesting that they closed down the investigation? And that was the right question, which is, no one who is actively involved in this is saying let's shut down the investigation.

44:43 That's not a real thing. That's just like setting up a straw man so you can knock it down. They should, of course, they shouldn't end the investigation. This investigation should be thorough and it should be transparent. It's really important that we get details. And that's not the case with every investigation, right As you know, in a lot of investigations, the authorities want to keep things close to the vest particularly if no one is charged. You know, they don't want to say, well, we looked at this lead and that could you know, implicate this person, but we didn't turn anything up with it. In a case like this, high profile as it is, with the racial undertones, I think the authorities are going to have to be transparent at some point. It doesn't have to be today, and it doesn't have to be tomorrow, but at some point are going to have to be transparent, not just about their findings, but about how and why they came to those conclusions.

45:38 Dan Abrams at this particular moment in time, not speaking definitively, but obviously we haven't heard anything about a distress call. We haven't heard too much about phone records. We haven't heard too much about witness testimony or forensic testing. Even though there's been two separate autopsies, both haven't revealed anything concrete. One was by the you know, the regular examiner, and then the other was by an examiner you know, hired by the family. One was with his neck his throat in place, the other was without it. This is the kind of stuff that we've read up about. I'm wondering what could break this case conceivably in your estimation, what is it going to take for this case to be broken and for us to reach a point where we're able to provide some level of a conclusion.

46:20 It's a really good question. Look first, let me say this if you if you're gonna ask me, what is the thing I'm most focused on and most concerned about in the context of this investigation in terms of potential wrongdoing, etc. I want to know about Nolan's phone, right, Why did he leave his phone? You know, the idea that he goes he's going to stay on the island without his phone. That's a one question that's always kind of made me think, huh, what was happening there? But again, that doesn't you know, that doesn't implicate anyone in terms of moving forward. I'm going to be looking at witness testimony and we talked about this at the OUTO said, I want to know are there inconsistencies in anything that the people who are on that boat are saying about why they left him. Now, let's take it a step further. Let's even assume for a moment that there are Let's assume for a moment that the authorities somehow conclude that he was left there and he wanted to come back on the boat. Right, Let's say that there was a conflict. Again, we don't know any of this, but.

47:31 Let's just hypothetically say that even if that happens, that. Doesn't mean that there was a murder or a homicide, right. That could just mean they got in a fight or an argument and something else happened to him on the island. Right. But it is important going back to your question to find out what are the witnesses saying. Is there a conflict? You know, we've now we now know about the woman who you know, he was talking to on the island, apparently nineteen year old woman. We've heard from her as well. That's important, But as we move forward, I don't think it's going to be you know, the medical examiner is interesting, right, and and people get very focused on this, but they medical examiners can also take you down a rabbit hole where you may get obsessed with like little questions about things that in the end aren't really gonna be dispositive of what happened to Nolan.

48:35 You're gonna need something more. You're gonna need some sort of witness and considering you're talking about people where it started as I guess, you know twenty or twenty four people. You've got tons of people on Horn Island. There's got to be eyewitnesses accounts that are gonna help either be consistent and show that probably nothing bad happened or otherwise. One friend claimed Wells chose to stay behind to talk to that girl you just alluded to. Wells family strongly disputes the stating they raised him to never separate from his group. To that, you say, what. Well, I don't know how his family would know whether he did or didn't do it, you know, I mean, like you know, I also saw a friend of his say right that he wouldn't.

49:21 Have let you know, they don't know. I mean that that's great to talk about what someone's general proclivities are, but the bottom line is, yeah, I would. Tell you where I raised my suspicion. If it's true that he let the boat leave but his cell phone was on the boat, I mean, swait a minute. I don't know any teenagers that don't let some get away their phone their very line of communication. Considering the world that we live in today, how attached kids are to their phones, that's their sole. Line of communications. In most instances, whether it be via text, messages, calls, emails, et cetera. I find that very difficult to believe that you just let the boat go away with your phone on it, and.

50:08 You have to believe that, again, following on what you're saying, that he forgot it right as opposed to like intentionally left it. But look, I said to you at the outset, what's the one thing that gives me pause? Right, it's that that's the one thing that's so far. Again, that doesn't mean there won't be more things, because we don't know about a lot of the things. A lot of them haven't been made public, but other things that have been made public. That's a that's a bigger concern to me than hearing family or friends saying, well, he's not the kind. Of guy who would blank right right. I'm focused on what is the evidence here, and that's a piece of evidence here that you just cite.

50:52 Before I move on. Is my very last question on this right now, you're looking for what what is Dan Abrams looking to find out? Looking to see that will get us closer to a resolution involving this case. Is a testimony from the police. As a testimony from the family, What is it that you're looking to find out? What should we all be waiting for right now as a priority. So if we could see the case file, right, I think the thing that I'd be looking for most are the witness accounts. I'd want to hear and see what did different people say about why Nolan didn't come back on the boat. But again, as I said to you before, that's only one piece of this, right, Meaning, even if there was an issue about him coming back on the boat, it doesn't mean that anybody on that boat killed him, right, I mean, that's still a separate question. So even if that happened, I still am looking to see there any people who are on Horn Island who can give relevant eyewitness accounts to this that can help move this case forward in one way or.

52:04 Not, based on your level of expertise and who you're connected to. Any reason to be suspicious about the investigators. We are talking about a black kid, we are talking about Mississippi. But in the same breath, we want to be feared of law enforcement and we want to we want to make sure that we don't cast dispersions of guilt upon somebody, and we have no evidence of that whatsoever. Yeah, I look, I'm sorry that this has become a racial case. You know, you get it, right, is only black kid on the boat, Mississippi history, et cetera. But you know, on the flip side of this, you hope what was actually the case was that you know, white kid had black had black friend, black friend, black kid had white friends. Right, Like, that shouldn't be like an issue, right, It's it's sort of incredibly sad that the fact that you know, black kid and white friends is an issue out there.

52:59 We get why it can be. But I'm gonna say to people, and I'll say it to you, which is I hope we can stay focused on the evidence and. Not turn this into a racial case. And that's why when you asked me earlier about Ben Crump, you know, I don't have a problem with Ben Crump, per se. I do have a problem when he starts linking it to other cases and suggesting that this is of particular concern because of race. And let's give them, let's give them the benefit of the. Doubt for now. If it turns out that, you know, look what we've seen in the Savannah in this, in the Nancy Guthrie case, right, we gave the authorities the benefit of the doubt. Now that we've seen what happened in that case, we know they screwed a lot of things up, all right.

53:47 They deserve the. Benefit of the doubt to begin with, But as we've now seen they made a lot of mistakes. In the vast majority of investigations, that's not the case. So I'm not going to presume that. The authorities are doing anything wrong until I see evidence of wrongdoing. Dan Neighbrams. Appreciate you, man, appreciate the education and enlightenment. Thank you so much. Man, I want to learn about this stuff. He was the person that I thought would be perfect for this. Thank you so much. On man, steven A. Always great to see you. You're same here, buddy, Thank you so much. Talk to you later. Well you heard what he had to say, makes a lot of sense. You know them wells God, bless your soul. We got to find out get to the bottom of it. Indeed, there may not have been any criminal activity, or there may have been. The fact of the matter is that what's unacceptable is that the stuff is still up in the air, that we don't know anything, that we haven't heard from the police at that particular moment in time.

54:41 And we need to we need to hear. We need to hear what the autopsy reports revealed, We need to hear what the investigation has revealed. It needs to be a bit more open to the public because it just seems incredibly, incredibly suspicious. I've been watching a bevy of people talk about this, you know, from all spectrums, all over the place, and people have their opinions. Officer Tatum inter view a couple of these folks, and you know, talk about the evidence that he's accumulated. And I know a lot of people have been getting on them, but he's been on the case and been talking to some people. He's talked to more people than most people have talking to that have talked to about the Nolan Wells case. Give him credit for that. In the end, we got to get to the bottom of this. You got to find out what's up. It's necessary because an eighteen year old kid, black kid Mississippi. And that's not to say that if it was not if he was not black, it wouldn't matter, because I'm not trying to go there.

55:28 That's not true. That's not what I'm saying. But when you have a black kid that support portedly was by himself, and he's in Mississippi and this is the kind of stuff that has happened to him or potentially it has to be investigated. There is no way around that whatsoever. The way it goes just got to be real and honest about that. That's it for this Addison A straight shooter til next time, everybody. Wednesday Night Straight Shooter which George Truly stephen A Serios six and Potis Radio Channel one twenty four from six p m to eight p m East instead the time. Don't miss it until then. I'm out, peace and love,