Fatal Fortune: The Murder of Mike Williams

0:15 Hey everyone, and welcome back to Exposed Scandalous Files of the Elite. I am your host, Jim Chapman, and I am excited today because I am starting a brand news series, Fatal Fortune, will tell the stories of the wealthy and how money became the motivating factor in their death. So today I'm going to tell you the. Tragic story of the murder of Mike Williams, who was a wealthy business person in Florida. Now in the year two thousand, Mike was presumed to have drowned and been eaten by alligators of all things, due to the lack of a body ever being recovered when he went miss during a hunting trup to Lake Seminole, which is a large reservoir and it's kind of located on the Georgia, Florida state line.

1:09 Now, due only. To his mother's insistence that police continue investigating, was the case eventually reopened in ruled a homicide, which led to many years later eighteen years to be exact, that this case gets solved in those responsible being placed behind bars. So a little background on Mike. He grew up in a town called Bradfordville, Florida, which is north of the college town of Tallahassee, Florida, home of Florida State for you football fans out there. And he was raised by some amazing parents who were normal, everyday hard working people.

1:52 His mother, Cheryl Williams, she was a daycare provider. She actually ran a daycare out of her home, and his father was a greyhound bus driver. Now, it was very important to both his mom and his dad that he and his older brother they had more opportunity than the parents did growing up as all of us as parents want out of our children, and education was key. So his parents sacrificed. They saved money, They chose to live in a double wide trailer rather than building a house, and they did all this so that they could send Mike and his older brother. Nick to private school.

2:33 They felt like they could get the best education possible at a private school, and Mike excelled in high school. He was involved in all types of clubs, He played football, he was the president of the student council, all the things. In addition to that, he and his older brother worked at a grocery store after school and that helped pay for the tuition to the private school. He tells you the work ethic of he and his older brother and how they were raised. You know, you got to kind of contribute to the family. He also fell in love with hunting in high school, and in particular duck hunting, which he took up as a hobby at the age of fifteen. And it was also during these formidable years that he became in love with a girl by the name of Denise Merrill, who he would later marry. And Denise was a cheerleader, she was the homecoming queen. He was the star athlete. It just made sense that they would get together. So after high school, he attended Florida State University and he would major in political science and urban planning. And he was an absolute rock star in college. Very hard working, which is no surprise to me. That was something obviously his parents had instilled in a very early age, and he and his brother and even before graduation, he was hired by very large property appraisal group in the area. Now

4:04 the company's owner later on would say that Mike was the hardest working man he had ever seen, and that's no surprise to me. He graduates and then he marries his high school sweetheart, Denise. This was in nineteen ninety four, and they started life together. And it's hustle time for this guy. Right, You're in your early to mid twenties, you're nearly married, and it's time to bring home the bacon. And Mike was not afraid to earn it. He would often go home for dinner, then go back to the office and work for hours. He excelled quickly, and he started making money and seeing success and really no time, a quarter of a million dollars a year he was making.

4:52 Denise she was no slouch either as it relates to income, and she did well for herself. She was a CPA. And it wasn't long before he and Denise bought a house in the rich area of town, if you will. And this is in nineteen ninety nine, and that's also the same year that his daughter was born. And from all accounts, Mike. Was absolutely in love with his only daughter and he was as devoted to her as he was his work. At this point in time, life just was picture perfect for Mike. Then in the year two thousand, some heartbreak for Mike. His father passed away. He had a heart attack, and that got him thinking about how precious life was and how his family would need to be taken care of should anything happen to him, and he already had some life insurance policies, but he upped and added a few more policies, bringing his policies up to a million dollars of coverage, which that sounds like a lot, but considering how much he made per year, it kind of makes sense to me. It only replaces what the family would lose in his death for about four years if you're making a quarter million dollars.

6:10 A year now. He purchased all these policies through his best friend, Brian Winchester, and they had been bestie's pretty much forever. And not only was Brian Winchester Mike's bestie, but he and his wife Kathy had been friends and classmates with Mike and Denise throughout both high school and college, and they would get together as couples often. Mike and Brian would duck hunt together all the time, just typical best friends hanging out after marriage, et cetera. And that was the dynamic. So Mike's anniversary was on December sixteenth of the year two thousand. It was his sixth anniversary. It was a Saturday, and he and Denise, they had plans to go to nearby Apple at Chacola to celebrate, but Mike wanted to do some duck hunting that morning and it was the same morning as his anniversary, so he look.

7:11 He loved the duck hunt. He goes to his wife, he says, do you mind if I go duck hunting in the morning. I'll be home well before noon and we can get started on celebrating our sixth anniversary. So, according to Denise, on the morning of December sixteenth of two thousand, her husband wakes up early. He leaves the houses as well before dawn bowed in tow and he goes duck hunting at Lake Seminole, which if you're a duck hunter, this is what you do. You have to be ready when the sun comes up on the water because that's when the ducks wake up. So he leaves, he goes hunting. Noon rolls around that day and Mike is still not home, so Denise gets worried and she starts making calls. She calls his parents, she calls his friends trying to find out where he is, and his bestie, Brian's father actually gets wint to this and calls Brian and says Hey, man, do you know Mike is missing. He went hunting this morning, never came home.

8:19 We need to go out there and see if we can find him. And it's important to mention Brian's father had known Mike obviously as long as Brian did, and that he was like a second son to Brian's father. So they take off and they go to that lake, Lake Seminole. Brian knew where he typically hunted Mike at this lake. So they take off and when they get there, there's already a ton of people there, tons of boats in the water looking for Mike. Now, one of the concerns with what could have happened to Mike was that Lake Seminole was more dangerous than most lakes in Florida as it relates to boating accident. And that's primarily due to the fact that it is just redden with stumps.

9:04 In certain areas of Lake Seminole, it was basically dry land at one point that was intentionally made a lake for flood control, So tons of tree stumps lie beneath the surface, some of them stick. Just barely out of the surface. And as I said, a ton of people were already there when Brian and his father get there to search for Mike, and the searchers start focusing on a particular ten acres of the lake surrounded by a cove. And the reason they did that was Brian's truck was found right there at that It was kind of like a dirt path that you. Would back your boat into.

9:47 Jim, did you see what happened in Texas today? Wait before you tell me that, let me tell you what happened in New York. It cannot be as crazy as the case I told you about yesterday in Louisiana. You know what, we should do a podcast. About it, and with that we did. Crime War Weekly covers the crime news headlines that have dominated the week. We cover trending crimes from all over the country and even sprinkle in a few globally. Crime War Weekly is available now wherever you listen to your podcasts. Simply by searching Crime War Weekly or clicking the link in the description of this podcast. A helicopter is flying over the area and although it was really hard to spot, they helicopter did spot Brian's boat. It was in some grass.

10:39 It looked like it had floated into a grassy part of that section of the lake, and it was almost camouflaged in there where you couldn't see it. But they did manage to find the boat, and they found his gun, which was still in the case inside that boat. But those signs of a struggle or anything like that, I mean, zero of foul play. So what happened to Mike? Where is he? Now? Initially the thought was Michael hit a stump and he was knocked out of the boat and he had drowned. Maybe he got tangled up below the surface. Maybe he was wearing his waiters and they filled up with water and it was heavy and it pulled him down. He couldn't get him off. Any drowned, they didn't know. But one thing they did know is that if he did drown, typically the body will surface three or four days later, because as the body decomposes underwater, bodies will fill up with gas, they will actually bloat and they'll float to the surface. So that was the assumption here. However, four days later, a week later, steal, no Mike. Now there had been eighty drownings in Lake Seminole at this point, and of these drownings, all of the bodies had been found, every one of them except for Mike's. So about ten days later, searchers are scouring the lake and they do come across a camouflage hat in that lake, and that

12:09 hat was identified by Mike's bestie Brian as having belonged to Mike. So they're trying to figure out where the heck is this guy, and they're searching every inch I mean, they're taking sticks, they're sticking them in the dirt, trying to feel for a body every inch of this lake. And then the alligator theory surfaces. So a private search firm they theorize that quote. With the wildlife around, I would guess that alligators have dismembered and stored the remains in a location that we would not be able to find.

12:53 And it's important to note here that's typical with alligators. They will kill somebody, but they don't eat the body whole right there. They'll take it and store it somewhere and then they'll eat it later on, or they'll bring it back to a den, and. They typically hide these bodies. Underneath sticks and debris to where you can't find them. So that was the theory. However, there was a major issue with this theory because although alligators do not hibernate and sleep like bears do. Bears go in. A cave and they basically sleep until winter's over and then they come out. That's why they get so big and fat before they hibernate. Alligators don't do that. They pretty much have to do everything they can to regulate their body temperature.

13:45 They don't like cold weather. They've got to be able to regulate that temperature, and that forces them not to eat. Now, at the time that Mike went missing, the area was in the midst of what would be three weeks straight of below freezing and just a freezing temperatures, and it would have been unheard of, quite honestly, for an alligator to eat anything much less human at that time with it being that cold. And even if that were the case, Mike was five 'ot ten, he was one hundred and seventy plus pounds, and it would have been unheard of for an alligator to completely eat a full grown man like that with absolutely no trace of the person. You would find limbs of the person, legs, arms, whatever, none of that, no trace of Mike. Also, during this time police they started hearing a little bit of chatter and talking some people off the racker were saying, Mike was having some issues in his marriage and he wasn't happy. So some people would theorize.

14:45 That maybe he ran off and went to Mexico or something. But look, that would be totally out of character for this guy, primarily because even if he was unhappy in. His marriage, he would have never left his daughter. It's just not who this guy was. Now. In the meantime, his wife accepted that Mike was probably dead, and six months later, after he never showed up, she starts the process of having him declared legally dead. Why did she do that, Well, you have to do that to collect on life insurance policies. You have to have the individual declared legally dead by judge. In June of the following year, two thousand and one, nearly seven months after Mike's disappearance, a fisherman did come across a pair of waiters, a hunting jacket and a flashlight where searchers and divers had been looking way back in December of two thousand. Now it's interesting that the police asked the divers and searchers about did they come across any of this stuff? Obviously if they did, they would have said so, but these divers and searchers were like, I don't know how the heck that stuff popped up. We couldn't have missed that. The police examined the jacket and inside they find Ike's hunting license. They also examined the waiters and investigators discovered the waiters have no bite marks on them whatsoever.

16:09 So there goes that alligator attack theory. What the discovery of the items did do is it allowed widow Denise to now collect on his life insurance, which actually was a little more lucrative than originally thought, and paid out one point five million dollars instead of one million. And that was due to the. Policy he was going to drop for five hundred thousand dollars, but never did. Let's discuss Mike's mother, Cheryl y'all. This was just a sweet lady who had that mother's intuition that something was not right here, and she would not let this case die. As soon as she saw investigators backing off the gas, she would floor it. She would sit on major traffic areas around Tallahassee was signed asking for information on her son. She took out billboards, she went on the news. She was an absolute beast in not letting up on this, and it eventually would pay off.

17:12 In this case, in. The next five years, some interesting things would happen. Brian Mike's Besty would divorce his wife a few years later. Guess what hen Denise would marry. Once this got out of course, like many of you are probably doing right now, people's eyebrows were raised. They thought that was kind of convenient and right around this time in two thousand and four, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, they launched an investigation into the case, and they found many things that seemed off, but nothing stood out more than what was discovered when the boat was recovered. Originally, their investigation showed the engine was off, yet the gas tank was full. So if the engine had been and Mike is going across that water, he hits a stump, falls out of the boat. Investigators determined, and I agree with them on this, the boat shouldn't have turned off on its own, It should have ran out of gas. However, the gas tank was full doesn't make sense, so.

18:18 They had that. They knew that did not fit if he would have been knocked out of the boat. But much like earlier investigations, they just didn't have anything else to go on. The case just turned cold. No body made it pretty difficult to prove anything beyond the fact that Mike disappeared, and in two thousand and seven, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement actually closes the investigation and the only conclusion that they knew one hundred percent was the alligator's story was bullshit. But later that year, in October of two thousand and seven, a possible new lead emerged. Michael Williams's older brother. He finds a photograph and a serial number of a twenty two caliber Rigor pistol that once belonged to their father, so Michael inherited that. After his father had his heart attack, and after Michael was declared legally dead, the family of Michael's asked for his firearms back and that was the only one that Denise did not return. The family's thinking, hmm, I wonder if he was shot with this firearm, why was that one not returned? So they reported to police.

19:27 Police go they talked to Denise and Brian who at this time they're married, right. They talked to him. She says, I'll look for the pistol I thought I gave him all the guns. Several days later, their attorney shows up with the pistol and he gives it to the police, and the police send that off to a forensic laboratory for DNA testing, but nothing ever comes of it, no lead off of it. So by the eighth anniversary of William's disappearance, everyone pretty much had closed case. And another possible lead that proved fruitless was a self described psychic by the name of Carrie Cox. She was from Kentucky.

20:09 She had been reviewing the case and she had identified a possible location of Michael Williams's body. So she gives investigators the coordinates of a location that happened to be near a boat launch, and cadaver dogs were brought to that area. They sniffed it out, but nothing was found. And the point of telling you that is showing you the lengths that law enforcement was going to to try to solve this case. I mean, now they're following the leads of a psychic. That pretty much tells you that it had a whole lot to go off of, but they were willing to do anything to solve the case. Now, Mama Scher Williams, she's still persisting. She ain't letting up, and her efforts lead to the investigation Discovery cable channel doing a segment on Michael's disappearance, and they even did late her investigations in late twenty eleven on it, so it's getting some media coverage as well.

21:07 Now by then, Mama Cheryl she had. Become convinced police were either incompetent or not interested in solving this case. Now, in particular, she came to believe the investigation was hampered by the involvement of an agent by the name of Mike Phillips, who was a friend of Mike's and his then wife, and she was concerned because he had made a comment to her early on that Michael had probably been eaten by alligators, and Mama Cheryl, she was concerned and assumed he was working that case and thought maybe he got tunnel vision on the alligator theory.

21:47 But he later said he was never even working that case and he was merely trying to comfort her. And I don't know how he would think telling her son got ate by alligator would comfort her. I guess he was saying that so she could get some maybe in his mind, closure, whatever, But that's what happened. So, starting on New Year's Day in twenty twelve, Mama Sheryl Williams she comes up with another idea. She writes one letter a day every day to Governor Rick Scott, and she asked him to either have an agency besides the Florida Department of Law Enforcement investigate or appoint a special prosecutor to do so. Now, after it was all said and done, she had written over two hundred letters. Now here's the upsetting part. She didn't even get any acknowledgement saying they had been received. So she starts inquiring personally as to why, and when she asked, it turned out the Governor's office had forwarded them unopened to police, didn't even have the fucking common courtesy to read them, and the police they he just took him and placed him in a case file.

23:02 And she was outraged. About this, and I can't blame her. She was quoted as saying they could not have hurt me more if they had punched me in the face. Yet, despite all of this, just nothing breaking in this case. And then twenty twelve hits and at this point Denise and Brian Winchester, his bestie, they separate reportedly due to Brian's sex addiction, and then in twenty fifteen, she officially files for divorce. Why it took three years, don't ask me, but this is where everything starts to unrival. So Brian opposed the divorce initially him want anything to do with it, and he had to be ordered to comply, and as part of that order, he was required to provide an appraisal of.

23:50 The couple's home. Now, this was due in early August of twenty sixteen, August fifth to be exact. Shortly after, Denise shows up at the Sheriff's office County and boy does she have a story to tell. She said that the day when the appraisal had to be filed with the court, she left her home to drive to her job. She worked at Florida State University, and while she was talking on her phone to her sister, she saw someone climb over the back seat of her car into the front seat, and it turned out to be Brian. She said he took her phone away and he began yelling directions at her. She said, I didn't comply until he showed me a gun, and she said later that he claimed the gun was necessary since she was not taking his calls and she was blocking his text messages. Now, instead of going where he wanted her to go, she pulls into a CBS drug store, smartest thing probably she could have ever done.

24:49 And she kind of parked close to the door in the back of that CVS and Brian tells her that he's planning to kill himself with that gun, that he didn't want a divorce, he felt like he didn't have nothing to live for, you know, all the SOB story bullshit. He assured her that he did not want to kill her, and she was eventually able to calm him down and convince him to allow her to bring him back to his truck where he parked and let her go to work and they would talk about this later. That she didn't have time to talk about it right now, so he said, okay, that's fine, but get this. She pulls over to his truck to let. Him out, and he gets some stuff out of the back seat that she didn't even know he had with him.

25:31 What was that stuff? A tan sheet, a plastic sheet, a spray, bottle of bleach, and a tool. What do you think he had that for? He was going to kill her? Well, she drops him off. She leaves. She pulls up to a red light and he pulls up next to her, and he's profusely apologizing, and she says, no worries, I'm not going to call the police. But guess what she did up reporting this. So that's the short summary of what occurred and what she told police. Now I'm gonna give you the actual clip of the interrogation because Denise, they didn't only get this report from her of what happened to her, but they started asking her about Mike Williams's disappearance. So I'm gonna play you the entire clip. Now, it's lengthy. It's a couple of hours in length, so you can listen to this and pieces, but you have to hear the whole thing. I did edit out these silent parts, so there's no dead air in this clip. It's just the entire interrogation. Very interesting.

26:39 You have to hear it to understand what's gonna happen. Next I'm gonna play it for you, and next week I'm gonna pick up with part two of this when and you won't believe what's gonna happen. But here's that interrogation clip. Much Love, alright, what's your name? Debase Winchester? What's your birthday? Three seven to seventy? Yeah? What's your ridres five c. Rode one seven? Centennial of circle?

27:24 Yes? O eight? What's a good puble before you? Eight? Five ye row five one nine five five four or five? Alright? Man? Who? Who? What's your husband's name? Ryan bri I A and Winchester? What's his birthday? Ten twenty seven. Seventy And where's he living house? He doesn't literally any road? But I don't remember the number. Do you have a cell phone number? Eight zero five oh nine zero zero four zero?

28:04 Do you know what the company that is? A self comprovider? That's right? Alright, I know you talk a little bit too uh to be here or just give me around that. Where what happened today? We're almost in the fourth year of our separation and divorce. Another divorce date is loving Wednesday. He I'll just tell you about what happened today, mkay. So I go out to my car to go to work. I work at my cu I've turned out on like a Sippi. Road in from town. Yeah. What kind of car do you have? It's a suburban? What color? Gold? Like that old it's like two thousand two, so I try.

28:49 I I walked out of my house about nine ten. So then I pulled out on like a sippy road. I was calling my sister and this person starts. Climbing out of the very bad and I couldn't tell at first who it was, but then immediately I knew who it was. But I was screaming, and the phone helped me. I didn't know if she had picked up yet or not, so I was screaming helped me. And then he grabbed the phone, so I don't know if he turned it off. I don't know how. I never saw a phone again. But he he, you know, was up. In grabbing me and he pulled my face pretty hard, and he goes and he's cussing, you know you you will turn here, you will turn here, blah blah blah. And I kept going straight and I make us look, yeah, I didn't do what he told me to do. So then he goes, I'm gonna f be'd hurt you if you don't you turn here. And I kept going straight again and then and I turned around and like, go, what do you mean hurt me?

29:39 And he pulled. Out a gun like like i'm m not a hunting gun, but like a gun he would kill someone. Went and he put it right here in my ribs. He put it right here, and he goes with this and he pressed it in there. You will turn. Well, I kept in my head. I was like, I'm making it to CBS, cause that's our CBS, and I wish just like I'm making it to CBS. So he put it right there. I he was screaming, and so I'm I didn't know if I should join the ditch like well, I didn't know what to. Do and that I kept driving. So anyway, where was see it when this happened? Where was he did he did? He? He was over? Yeah, he he climbed it out from the back. It's too too and then a bat and then the seat and then the back. So he was in the back, I guess hiding. And then when he came out, he came up to right behind me, so like I'm driving and he's right he's right here, and and then the.

30:24 Gun's right here, so he's right here. Did you see what the gun onok? Like, like what color it was or. I mean it was dark, but it was it was like a handgun. I guess that it was. It was dark stark collar. Yeah that he. But anyway, so so then I pulled into CBS and he was like, turn here, turn here because CBS has like back parky and he took. The wheel and was trying to force it to turn and I don't know how, but I just. Like took the wheel back. I mean I t and for the fact that we didn't wreck was unbelievable. And I took it back. And I parked right at the front door in the in. The s spot that was right against the grass. So like the camera's right there, Like I knew cause I go there all the time that their camera's there. So I parked from right there at.

31:09 The front and this is the lawn on Captain's Circle and hegisoki right. So we were probably there at like nine seventeen or so, I would you know, cause probably, And so we pulled in and he said, and he keepkept saying, I just want to talk to you. I just wanna talk to you, because he's been emailing me, you know, texting me, I blocked him off everything, trying to get me. To stop the divorce. I just wanna talk to him, just want to talk to you. And then I turned around. And then go, i will talk to you from right here, cause he he was trying to get me more of the car. I'll talk to you from right here, and that's it with him. Yeah. So then he wanted me to get in the back and I said, no, I'll sit in this seat. And I was in the driver's seat the whole time, and so. He was mad. But he held on to the seatbelt cause I was I had already booked myself in from the beginning, and so he held on to the red buckle right here.

31:53 So he's like in this seat that he's leaned forward holding the seatbelt together. So I can't get out because I had a picture that I was gonna just yeah, I'm running screaming in the CBS. That's what I thought in my head. But he held me and I couldn't. I'm not sure where the gun was at that point that he was he was holding it tight and so and then he locked the doors in the new locked the doors, and then I said, I'll talk to you from right here. Well, he held the seatbult from quite or quite a while as he's screaming, and I'm just like shaking and he's told me to stop crying, that people are gonna notice, because people were coming in and out the whole time. And one lady she looked at me like, oh, she's like I was gonna stay helped, but then I was too scared, so he said he kept hold holding it. Well, finally he just kept seeing, I'm just want to talk to you, talk to me.

32:37 I just want to talk to you. So then I was just like, what do you want to talk about? What do you want to I want to talk about the divorce b apply. So as he started talking and asking me to call the divorce off, he would ease, he eased back, and he ended up sitting in that seat, you know, the one like right here, and he let go. No, he stayed in the seat behind, so like he was in this seat and I was right here so I could turn and see him. And he held the gun on the poor your okay, the. Backside, and he held the gun between he was between his legs the whole time. So that's why I didn't want to yell to the lady or any cause it was cause it was right there. So the guns staying there the whole time. He finally had like go with the seat. So I was still luckled in that I was turning. And I was like, what do you wanna talk about? So then he was like, you wanna answer my text? You wants I had to do this because you won't.

33:19 Answer my text or my calls. Please just callably divorce off. I've lost everything, you know, blah blah blah. So I ended up we were probably there, I mean, for like I felt, you know, maybe forty five minutes to an hour. So if their cameras do work, I mean, they'll see, they'll they'll see the whole thing. I would cry some and cry not and it was rain and people would come of go. But I ended up he would I mean, of course at the beginning, especially he was he was crazed. And then as we were talking, I was just kind of agreeing with whatever he was saying. And I was like, I know that you love me, and I he's recently lost his son. His son has decided to move and went away. He he had joint testody and now he doesn't. And so he said, I've lost my son, I've lost you.

34:02 I have nothing to look for. And I was like, well, Brian, you're the only one who can change. This is a side note that his son left him because he the son is seventeen now, went through his phone and Brian's fun and found out that he's been seeing prostitutes. They found the website. They know the girls have been in the house with where. Where my steps I was living, and that they've been doing drugs because there's a text about drugs back and forth, and Stafford and my step son took pictures of all the texts from Brian's phone. He took pictures of everything he found in the house. So that's all we have proof of all that. And so I just kept saying, you've got. To stop living that way. You know, you could get us all back if you'll just turn your life around, because he was a Christian at one point, and I was like, if you'll just turn out to the horse the whole time, I'm true this way, I'm buckled in.

34:44 But he's he's calm, he's calming down, and so the guns still right there, and I'm just like, what are you doing? Why are you doing this? And he's like, what am I doing? I could tell me it was. You know, and I was like, I don't know. I know you want to talk to me and that this is not the way to do it. I know, what have I done? And it's like he kind of woke up, like what have I done? What have I done? And I was like, listen, let me take you. Let's go to your dad's office. The dad owns the business. I said, let's go to your dad's office and talk to him. I said, I don't want you arrested. I don't. I just want to get past this. This can be your rock bottom. Do you think this is your rock bottom? Well, what do you think? You know? So, I mean I could tell so he was, but then that it was the gun would start there and so so I ended up convincing him, we're gonna we're gonna talk to your dad. We're gonna get through this.

35:26 We're you know, wee and I kept saying week and so. So then he called his dad on from his cell phone. Uh. Oh, By the way, the whole time he kept going through my phone because he had it trying to see if I had a boyfriend, right, which I mean I don't. He was going through my phone the whole time. But anyway, he called his dad, put his dad on the speaker. Uh and and and I didn't yell out because the gun was right there. But he he said, what are you doing? And he said, I'm going to a meeting at eleven and right and said, we'll call me when you get out. I need to talk to you. And he said okay. So I didn't yell out. I didn't say anything any hime that, and I said, let me go to work. Let me go to work. Show my face. People are gonna wonder where I'm at. You call me at work and then I'll come out and meet with you and your dad. I will not call the police. I promise.

36:09 I promised a million times I wouldn't call the police. And I said, and I'll meet you out there and we'll talk about this. This can be I didn't say a new beginning, but I said, like, you know, this can be the end of all this, you know all so but I get but he told me this truck was parked at that park. And I didn't want to go there because I knew nobody would be there this certainly, you know, and so and so. I said, your truck is. There and he said yes. And I said, well, let me just take you to your office. I'll just drop you off at your office. Well, no, I have done my truck. Ba ba blah. It was. It was just getting ridiculous to find. It was like, I'll drive you to your truck, you will get out, and then but then I said, big us up to you. I just kept saying, like you're in charge. It's up to you. But if you will get out and let me get it to work, then call me at work.

36:50 You could. My work phone is only going to have a block. Come on, I said, you can call me or you can confirm I'm there and I'll meet you and your dad later this afternoon. Okay, okay. And then then I was like, Briana got to go. So then he went from the seat to the back row and put his knees there and started pulling stuff out of the back and shoving it into a backpack. And I saw sheets, I want to say plastic. It maybe was plastic, I don't know, but it was maybe a sheet in a plastic something I don't know, but it was fabric looking. And he shoved all that in the in the backpack. Then he had a bottle which it was like you know those old timey bleached bottles that are like white with the spray thing, a huge one.

37:33 Yeah, And he. Had that put down in the backpack and then something else and I don't I when I saw the bleach, I was like, oh my god, like I just kind of lost like in my head, I kind of lost it. And so it was something else, like a tool or something, not a hammer, but something like that. I don't know. And then he shoved that in the backpack. And then I said, Brian wears the gun. I don't want the gun anywhere near me. Wears it's right here. He had it was on the floor at that point, I guess because he knocked it or something on it. But he picked it up and he put it the backpack and he zipped the back pack up, and then he opened up a little zipper of the front back pack, took his keys. Out, and then he starts crying, what have I done? What have I done? It's too late for us, and I know it's not I'll I'll just let me go to work and I'll co meet you later.

38:14 I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I know, I know. And then he opened the door himself and I never turned the car for anything. And when we read that part, and he got out and he shut the door, and then I drove off. I went down NIKASOOKI, just like I would go to work. He pulled up next to me at the light at Capitol Circle World just winded down and he. Said, I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry, and. Was crying and I said I know, and he turned right to head more and then I had I went on. So then supposedly he was. Going to his office. Where's the office out Carrie Forest Parkway. You know the address we're with the business plan out?

38:57 Yeah, it's as DA's Winchester Financial Group. And the whole time I would just praying, but. All he wanted was to talk to me, for me to call a divorce all uh oh, and and intermittently he would say he was gonna kill himself. A lot he said that because. I was like, are you planning on any of both of our lit like if as he got calmer at CBS, I said. Are you planning on you know, anything, both of our lives today? Well? Mine, I'm planning on mine. And then he could say I wanna kill my So he musta said a million times, I wanna kill myself. I've lost everything.

39:38 I reached back a couple of times at CBS and would like touch his knee, Like when I could tell that he would get calmer, I was like, I know, I knew, like so the video would probably should that. I mean, if you if there is one trying to give anything else. He say he was gonna kill himself. I didn't know if I should. I didn't plan on to come in here because I wanted to follow through with what I said. I wanted to talk with Marcus. Brian also promised he would tell us that everything and he would go away to rehab. He's supposedly being treated for sex addiction, so he said he would go away to rehab. I was gonna follow through with that because this. Is gonna make him really mad, And so I called Deborah, my sister made me call her husband, who's a policeman, and he said, you have you have to, you have.

40:21 To turn him in. But I still, I mean, I've already told you everything, mut still look at this right thing to do because it's gonna make him so mad. And then you guys can't. I can't have a twenty four policeman with me, and he's gonna where if he gets arrested. If he doesn't, he's gonna be free at some point. I have a daughter. I mean, I just it's not his star. But I just I don't know. We we can try and get him some howl. Oh, yes, that's exactly what happened. What kind of truck does he drive? My daughter actually had the exact whatever and gave it to the man downstairs. It's a GMC Sierra. It's a twenty fifteen. It's huge cab. I mean, it's a huge truck.

41:02 And it's it's like a dark gray brown color. It's a weird color almost like almost like your shirt. Yeah, and that backpack is in his truck. I know because I sa he threw it in. When he got in. It was black. Then he had the colors on. It had some white maybe like a whatever the emblem was or the name brand might have been in white. But that's and it had a out zipper, cause that's where to get his keys. What was he wearing? Okay, he he was wearing shorts and a shirt. The c a collared shirt in both. The shorts I wear navy blue for me, which like you know, longer shorts. I wanna say. The shirt was maybe a Burkeandy, I think it.

41:53 I think it was. It was dark color too, think like a Burkandy. I didn't even think about that when it was h mm, no hat he didn't never had all. He didn't net their license. Yeah, attendis shoes on? Is he a facial hair? No? Do you think you going back to his office? It's pusanbody and they then he was gonna call me to set up this meeting and I'm not there, and that's gonna make a match. So that's gonna send him to DEPS. You looking for me? Because the last time. We have a court date, which was a about three weeks ago, he showed up where's he worked at at FSU in the stadium and I pulled up to my normal spot. Well, what do you do in the CPA controller office?

42:34 Is it just one office? No, No, it's a it's a fifth floor of the of building A in the stadium. And he knows, he knows where I work. He's one of Mom's. But last time there was a court date, he shook up in the parking lot and I wouldn't. He wanted to talk to me and I wouldn't, so I just kept driving around. He kept following me. My boss ended up coming out, so he left or I called my boss and so he left. That was the only time he showed up at work under. The host Okay, alright, uh me mean one sec and I step out. You see, I have even anything else? Do you know anything right now or. Now that I'm thinking that anything else? He was very very suicidal that towards the end.

43:18 I mean he was called okay, holler, alright, well you were just woman, and I'll bear at back, niece, do you he was an all sat I had victim at the cant.

44:40 To share your self fast? Okay at the chatterm uh Paul's up there talking about the discrision and everything, and I've been in there and listening in on the interview and everything sis in a while. And just start by saying, you know, I'm really glad you're you're here and you're safe, okay, and so I'm gonna work with you, Lena. See what I can do to help you, s teenager stay safe of giving everything that's. Been wrong on so whatever. That's a lot to how's this Roman press and teacher's prey? You know you do sign out to greet me? Oh serious?

46:40 Titus, and active's all that's on the phone, and he's notifying you know what place of the situation, So I don't know where. You every way art anything that's single like or my loss is okay, Uh, it's always good one. Do you have a someone in the workplaces you can trust and if you're comfortable flooding? Know, and there's things like this going on, but just because of the nature of everything that's happened, and they are gonna just make a phone call over there to kind of be an alert. And but can I give a d ELS's name? Do they eat that hut? Or would you ever move? Yeah? Sure, that's Karla. Daniel's a dance allert never. I think he's on the phone right now.

48:08 Okay. I'm very worried because I promised you. I got out of it because I promised him that I would not come and the police, and I promised him that I would go straight to work, and I blocked him from all my other stuff. But he can still call my work. He was gonna call me to make sure I was there, so obviously I'm not there, which means if he called me and I wasn't there, then he's gonna start looking. He's looking for me right now, I know it, and which means he's going f SU. He's gonna look through the parking lot for my car because he knows where, and he's gonna see them. I'm not there, and so he's gonna start to get really bad again. When I left him, he wasn't crazy and mad. He was weeping and apologizing. But that's gonna set him off again. That's why I didn't even know it's coming. Here was the right I still don't know come here. It was the right thing to face, the right thing. Denise, You've done the right thing. There's nothing easy about this because you've done the right thing. But he's on the phone with f S you right now. I'm letting them know and making them aware, Okay, giving them the heads up.

49:01 So we're gonna take care of that and make sure that they they as safe as they can and let them know what's going on. And you said that Carla already knows about the history and everything. So he's on the phone with them right now. He's on the phone, I'm telling them, doing a description and everything like that. So focus. I'm gonna focus on you. And you said you have a daughter. How old is she? Seventy seventeen? Okay? Is it just you and your daughter? Okay, now, let's focus on you and your daughter right now. It's her name. Answer it answers. That's a good thing like that. But I love them. How we're gonna be staying well, I'm gonna oswalla am here. I'm gonna help you with that, okay, my first succession. One of the things that comes to mind right now is when we finish here, there's still some things that have to be done. File for an injunction. All the company you will go to the courthouse to make a file for an adjunction. Okay, I'm just gonna make this an absolute right here.

49:50 I feel that I can't. Did you ever get her first? And most people use their phones nowadays, but sometimes it's helpful to write it down. And if you watch his taper, what does that mean? The junction? And injunction is an order of protection and it's like a restraining order and it's gonna prohibit him from having any contact with you. And you can include your daughter in that. Okay, I'll go down there with you. Okay. There is a refuge house injunction assistant's office. Have you ever been in the refuge house? Okay, I'll get to that in a second. We'll take it one step at a time. The injunction assistant's office is there. They're staff with advocates just like me who can help you. And we can go there to again and get this filed. Okay, what's gonna happen is it's free.

50:33 There's no fee or anything. You fill out the paperwork. If you'll put down your information, your god are an information. Places that he's gonna be prohibited from t you know, locations, your workplace, if she's in school, we put that on there, things like that, and so we can talk about it, and we get there and then a judge will review it, and at four o'clock today you'll know whether the injunction built. The junta will grant either a temporary injunction or dismiss it. Okay, it would be pretty wild. I can't guarantee anything, but it would be pretty well for it to. Be dismiss given circumstances of view describements. So I'm gonna say, let's file for the injunction. So once that happens, we can it'll all happen today and you'll find out before five o'clock today. You can go and pick up a copy of your temporary injunction if it's granted, and keep that with you.

51:21 And then we're also gonna make copies. And give it to whoever we need to at FS, you, at your daughters, wherever she frequents, whatever we. Need, okay. And so once that temporary injunction is placed is in place, our deputies are gonna work on getting him searched. And now they have to be able to locate him in order to do that. But we're looking for him, okay, So we'll. Get him, sirve starve him with that restraining order. Yes, he will get. Served once it's a place. If gets grandy, it'll go into place, get him. Searched and become act if it did it and if the diget approved, and what do you be served today? Because if they can locate it, absolutely it would be a priority, yes to as soon as possible. That's the goal there because it'll go into effect immediately once he's.

52:03 Started with the papers. Any contact from there is gonna be a violation of that injunction that you can report and he can be charged with depending you know, of course the follow up there, but that injunction is gonna work to protect you. It's gonna no contact by. Phone, email certainly not a person, no third party contact, nothing of that. And then again the locations that are listed within, he's not gonna. Be allowed to go to f s you to your good place, you know, things like that, and we'll sit down and go over it all together while we're there. But we'll do the injunction. That's the first step. I think it's it's a restraining orders. It's gonna keep him from if he calls you once he's started with that good work, that's a violation.

52:43 And we're gonna follow up on that. Okay, So we'll do if we can. It's you know a lot of times people think that, you know, it's just a piece of paper, Is it really gonna protect me? But it really can work to protect you. And I I suggest that I think we should go to there, like I said, well or do certain things here. Yeah, it it does really will work to protect you. So we'll follow through the injunction. It's okay, So that's gonna seesaw contact from again. Okay. After that, we'll have to think about a safe play screen in estate. Well, I think my sister's husband's a policeman at tvd's. Okay, do you think his does he know that? I don't think so, because it's in montef I don't think he even has really, Okay, so he wouldn't even know where to find you or anything.

53:27 Okay, in a minute, because I don't even think his address is published. I don't think they, so I don't think. He would know, Okay, Okay, Well that's never been there, Okay, all right, and that's fine, and that I think that's a good option, especially since he's long unfortunate and you said her sister's and HER's my sister TVD. Okay, Well, I think he has a his p car park out you know that TPD car. Absolute And I don't know if there's any way just I mean, any little thing we can do. It sounds like he obviously knows what vehicle you drive when you're there, if you can maybe put your car in the garage, a caring just all these little things that we can do whatever we can to protect you, so that he wouldn't even even if he did, for some reason know this address, which we don't mind he does. He won't even see your car because that can be an identifier.

54:10 So let's part that in a garage or something like that somewhere and we're gonna stay there, kmind again, and or at least virtually we'll say that, Yeah, I brought up the Refuge House earlier, and they're the inductory assistants office that we're gonna use. But in addition to providing an injunction assistant, they're a safe shelter. You have somewhere to go. But I want you to be aware that in the event of an emergency, there is a shelter here. By the name of Refuge House, Okay, And if it came down to it, you can have It's strictly confidential. It's a safe place for you to go. It's twenty four seven operation okay. And so I can give you some information for them a contact if you wanted to, because they also do down the line. They have counseling and support groups and things like that. So it's a wide variety of services. But right now I'm thinking emergency shelter if ever again, but I'm glad.

55:00 That you have a safe place to go, especially with TPD officer. If he felt the neat we can arrange for extra patrol of his residence even and that would I mean, he's got the cruiser park in his driveway, but they could still keep an eye out, and I think that that would be considering. We're you know, local agencies that work together here. We can he'll well, once let us finds out, once he gets served, that's when that's I mean, right now, it's probably a change just looking for me. But when he finds out that he did come, that's what it's good. I mean, that's what he's gonna be really now. Well, and that's when we're gonna take steps to make sure that you're safe and that you're. Protected from him, because he's got all these emotions that he's trying to deal with and that he needs to work out, and he's gotta make that decision to help himself and get this help that he's needing before he can really start to make any progress.

55:48 And you got to worry about yourself and your daughter right now and you are still forever. Yeah, well, we'll get through this, Kay. That's why I'm here. I'm here. This doesn't end today. I'm gonna give you my number and we'll be in platch, okay, and I'll be buy your side every step of the way through this, okay. So we'll take it step by step so it's not overwhelming. And I should probably call my door's attorney and tell her she's gonna be surprised. Yeah, I was gonna ask about that, cause when we go into to file for the injunction, we could refer you for legal services. But if you can have an attorney, okay, well then yeah, I would definitely consult with Harry said her. Definitely. That's always good to make sure that she's in the loop in a winner of anything, certainly with given the circumstances.

56:31 So give her a call, okay, let her know what's going on, Okay. So so we'll just we'll leave that back there for anyway, cause we'll go to the injunction. I don't wanna okay, you know too much at one time, but we'll do the injunction. Refu chouse is available if you need it, but you find a safe place to go. So so wanna laders too. If they know they know that we're going through this monit of wars now, they they need to know what happens morning that's very that's wise of you. And you know they might be able to say do they know what kind of mutuality? Guys? Cause they'n tall and say, hey, I just saw his truck on the street, you know, I mean a pretty little thing that you can have as a one up on him. That's gonna be good. And neighbors like that, anyone you trust or as comfortable, they use right now, there's people out there who want you, even care about you, and these are the times that we use them. So if you've got neighbors that you're comfortable and know what's going on, definitely give them a call to alert them and additionally to get any help you can't from them, you know, cause I'm sure they'd be happy to Okay, and any way they can. Okay, And so you're your daughter will go with you and I'll be fine, She's okay, we'll staying with you, Okay.

57:35 Yeah. Does she work anywhere? And does she have a work place that he knows about? Okay? Mm, just well she works at Cooki's into for me, this little camp that I don't know that he knows that. Okay. Well, if there's not anything that's jumping out as. A something divergent. Y then Okay, I'm just trying to make short to you that I told them that me and everything there's I guess I could call them I think of anything else. Absolutely we can. You can certainly do that. Dinies, take your time and just gather your thoughts. Well, what do they can mean? He'll probably get started with their strange order. But then what happens was what I told him that he did, like just anything, does he. Get arrested or he's gonna he'll be detectives will come in.

58:16 He'll be able to speak to them a little bit more than. I can, but certainly this is this is an investigation and active investigation. He's gonna be worn on that. So he'll give you the details I have. But yes, this is now an open investigation. I'll say that for sure. So there will be follow up, absolutely yeah, And he'll be a little for my little more informations as to those steps specifically, and we'll bring him in here and he might be finishing up and wanting to come back in and talk to you anyway. So I just wanted to pop in and just kind of get this ad willing in. Like I said, we'll just continue to take it step by step, but today for the immediate that's what I think we need to prioritize. This. The conjunction this is, this is Brian's dad calling me. I'm not gonna get because I know they're won't. They're probably done. Now let me step out and see anything.

59:03 Hey, I'm Detective Wilkerson. They mentioned and you about processing your vehicle where this all occurred. What does time you look to be evidence where? And you know we can put it together to cars right up front, right what I need from you? That is. What's Denise Winchester. And he's texting me. I have a block, but he uses. These text apps and figures out ways to text me, and so I know he's looking for me because I was supposed to be at work and he was gonna call me at work to verify. It was at work, and okay.

59:44 That in case he's I don't know, but anyway, yeah, yeah, for sure, you can go on my car and if those cameras were working at CES, I mean that should have the whole thing. And what is he texting? You? Just worry that he would call me and you know he was okay, yeah, can I see. What he's texting now and it's from numbers that he what does please call me? And that's his cell but he I'll block him from everything, so he finds random numbers on. Tech STAPs and that was sent at one five toot one.

1:00:26 Actually that means. What that means is he's called my work. I didn't answers and now he's looking for me. And when I left him, would he lef me? He was calm because I promised him I wouldn't do this and that I wouldn't come here. And so. I mean if he gets if I s do this restrainding order and he gets served, and he's. Gonna know, Okay, what kind of vehicle is it up there? Do you have me? M it's a two thousand two gold suburban or do you call your. Clim XL mkay gold just like a like putle. Dimands from M. Let me be fear of just signing there And all that is is just consent that we're gonna And I don't know if he.

1:01:07 Had spent the night that I mean I have He just crawled right said that's what. That's perfect, Thank you. Where a couple of things real quick? How long have you had this fire? Oh? Forever. I was he in it at any telling me all were together? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. How long since it's been. Since he's been We have been separated almost four years, so he hasn't it's been a long time since he's been in it. Okay, very long, yeah, I mean at least it it was so I would say. Almost four years. If he was in the very back he crawled. Up and then sat in the seat right here, like I'm in the driver's seat, and he sat right behind the passenger seat.

1:01:47 He had one or two back seats. I just I have two two and then one row. Then you got captain seats, yeah yeah. And then and then the bay and then there's. The back too, and he sat in the seat. Never he be on the passenger So right which greenway? Look as you can greenway? Did it? It's like across from like Westminster, like kind of like Westminster is kind of right here, and it's right here, uh Fleischmann, pass Fleischman. And you turned in right there past neft. He may passed empty Mayo and I think it's right there, and you turn left to go in yes. Yeah, right yeah from d Yeah, and that's where he got out. They got into his truck with the backpack, and I didn't look back there. You know, I don't know if whatever all he had. I don't know if he got it all now, don't mkay, But I don't want keys.

1:02:39 To it or do you wanna do it now? Yeah, we're gonna get our propsing to get through it kind of rest. You crossed up the prince and stuff? And where had where did he acted up? He? I came out of the park first and turned right down Nikasuki and he came down and did the same thing. At the light at Capital Circle in Nikasoki. He pulled up beside me because I was headed my normal routine to work. He rolls with to down was crying saying I'll sorry he was, and then he turned right to him no wars which which is in the direction of his office. He cared for us. Okay, how he exit the VDA front? Oh? How did he exit my car? Uh? Uh? It from his he was he was in that seat behind the passenger seat. He put his knees up on the bench seat and started pulling stuff out.

1:03:23 And that's when I saw all this other stuff. He shoved it in the backpack, got back to his seat where he had been opened that door, And yeah, I think and to say that he would have ever been in that seat opening. That door even when we had it, when we were together, he never sat back there, so he I don't think he ever would have touched that door from the inside. And I know up what happened. Yeah, okay, if you'd be in trying to Christ together, he's very imported out in the front just right when you go out. It's just like right there, do you need my keys? Yes? Please? And I don't know how. Yeah, if we we don't minded to do it when you get it done while you're uppear instead of you have they way don't.

1:04:09 Oh, wasn't such a. Oh you know what I wanted to just I was in such a state when I got here. He must get there. I'm not very sure. Or my sister might have 'em, no, cause I do. I do remember now they made me walk it. And my sister's sitting down there in the lobby. What are you gosh, maybe she has her I can call her ack. And that's because they're not in. I mean prett easier to park. I might have just handed them to her when. I it's like a spoof number or something that's texting her weird numbers. Yeah, he's texting me and I wanted to number now, I mean just asking me to call. Let me call my sister and sere she.

1:04:53 Stuff like Keith sounds fears. Sorry, don't. Hey, I I'm still upstairs. But they be in my keys to look in my car. I don't see my keys. Do you have 'em? I mean, but remember when I, oh, you know what, I want to let him down there, when when we first met the guy downstairs. You might be into the other out out down there. It's a click or they're gonna come down and see if the down but I know, I mean they're either in the car or I thought I lock the car. I don't know 'em. No, don't work out, don't work out there fat they're d I don't know they're just wanna lookout it.

1:05:37 So I don't have 'em. I don't know it. I can't many did it? She said, I didn't know it was a diesel. Was a diesel or christ? I just hollo who it probably does hang out, hang on, I'll be right back. Hang We'll say you don't feets drunk.

1:06:27 It's awsome. I don't know that it's up that I have more stuff. It's a twenty fifteen ten GMC four door extended bed, thirty five hundred diesel. I don't know about them. It's a twenty fifteen, so they might. I'm that's also. We don't know. Wow, did y'all get in the car? Could y'all get in the car now? So she so she was trying to get the car in my car in your car?

1:07:13 You think they they should? Yeah, I think they're right there now. Alright, not you redundant, But we're just kinda gonna try and go through the story again and just try and get a little more detail and everything. So car in general, do you usually lock it at night? Do you cut it? Don't usually lock it? Did? Did you lock it last night? I thought I did, But I've changed the lots in the house like three times. He seems to find a way to get keys of mind. So he might have key I not that I know. I have a bit of mind. Are you in possession of all the keys that you know? N and I know of? But has he ever driven that truck before? He's driven it years ago? Yeah, like over four years ago.

1:07:56 And you know what I didn't get those keys change, so he might happen. Alright, did you notice anything that was different with your truck when you got into the No, not at all, kay, m Can you remember it? How did you get in? You walked out my door and I have a steple drive my car, can ms M my daughter's car in my car, So I just walked out. I go in front of it and just go round to the door. Mkay. Yeah.

1:08:36 Do you put the key in the door to use a key phone? I use a clicker to click it open. Kay. Do you remember using that click? Yeah? I did, and then I got in and sorted it. I didn't go around the. Back or do like that. Mkay. So you get in, start driving and nothing seemed out of place. Marriage weren't monk. And I call my sister cause I always going a strong way to work, and so I turned on mic Asiki Road and called her. And then when a when a vision started appearing in my mirror, I just started screaming, healthy, help me, and then he grab He came up and grabbed the phone. So, kay, and I cannot believe I didn't write the car I was. I was screaming and doing this M I I don't know how about it because it's so narrow and make as ikey read with those ditches.

1:09:28 But what was the first thing he said to you, M. Give me the fucking phone. You're gonna you're gonna go up to the roundabout, You're gonna turn You're gonna go up to the roundabout. You're gonna go around it and turn. Left, or saying it was some kind of direction, but it was definitely abut the roundabout. You're gonna up to the round about, You're gonna do whatever. And he's right in my ear and I and I was like, was he screaming? Yeah, he was screaming. Yeah, he was screaming. And and I she said, oh, not like that. And and at the round about was coming and he's like do it. He's like, you're gonna do what I say. Yeah, he's screaming, You're gonna do what I say?

1:10:10 And or I'm gonna hurt you. And then I said, what do you mean. Hurt me? Or hurt I set it back like hurt me or something. And he goes with this and then that's when he that's when he put he just like shoved the gun. Oh, but you know what when he was trying to get the phone cause I had it over here. He grabbed it, but he also grabbed my face because I remember it hurt. He was like and it was like he grabbed the phone, but he also got part of my maybe my cheek or something because he grabbed it cause he grabbed it. If you're driving, how did rich it cross? It was behind from behind because it because it was like this, It came like this that me, so it was from behind.

1:10:51 But yeah, he was screaming because they you're gonna do what I say, You're gonna turn here. And then when I when I didn't know what he said the first time, that's when he got the gun and held it right he shoved it in me and my ribs because I could feel it my ribs and he just shoved it there. He said do it, turn here, and I kept going and do it. I can't it's not front. You guys can't believe it. And because I knew CBS was right there and it was like that was Michael with CBF and so then so then he just starts screaming there for in my ear. What do you do? What do you think I'm not gonna you know do He didn't say, do you think I'm not gonna use this? But he was just just being very threatening and. You thought you would use it? Yeah? Yeah? And then can you describe the gun at all? I mean?

1:11:32 And he said, doc collar, But did it look? Was it squares? Was it right? The end? The end of it, like where I guess the bullet will come out, was real tiny, and it was a circle. And then and then it's not how all things are, don't know. But then but then if you kind of went back from it, then it was flat in a circle. But I mean, but I just remember seeing the hole I guess so where the bullet will come out, and it was real small. The hole was real small. And then how long? You know? How long that on? It was like a cause he could all burn. It looked to me like just like a hand. Do you know the difference between we're vulbro on a semi automatic pistol? No ya, If you show me pictures, I might, I might cons tell you more.

1:12:13 They know how long it was? It felt like it fit. It felt like it was maybe the size because I felt like it was all there in my ribs. Does he oh, how do you know if he owns any going. No, I mean he's a hunter, but I that's not a honting gun that I would. Ever seen a rifle. Oh okay, what because I said, where did you get that gun? Because he collects guns, he he hunts and he but I was like, cause when we got Calmer, I was like, what where is that gun? Where did you get that gun? And he said, I got the gun to kill myself. That's exactly what he said. But I don't know the man or how or I don't know. I've never seen him before. Okay, this was a sway automatic that he's talking about him?

1:12:57 No, I don't know. It wasn't matter for sure. Again that's just general. Yeah, but it definitely wasn't that. It didn't have that spending, mkay. It was closer to this, but it was fatter it like this part, this part was fatter, mkay. Yeah, I mean there's there's a whole batch of different variations. It was just bad like. But it definitely wasn't that silver kind. It was no silver on a yeah, and I just color wise, I mean, there's it was more it none of that, but it was kind of more of that. It was more kind of like that the the part that I guess you would hold it was pretty thick cause I could feel it. I don't know, but he said I got it to kill myself, so maybe he boren't recently.

1:13:41 I have no idea. The said to show it to your side. Do you have any. Injuries that you know? Don't? I mean, I my ribs are right here and I felt it in rows, but I don't. I mean, it doesn't hurt when I do that, so I'm sure. I mean that there wouldn't be anymore. Kay before you leave it, won't you do? Chill that? Okay? Okay? Well, and the only other place you grabbed up, told him was when he reached behind me to get the phone out of my hand. He like pulled like right here, but it heard of the time, but it isn't. Okay. So you get to the CBS, yes, And when we pull in, you're kind of like you go down this little hill to go around to the front. And when we got right here, he goes turn and he took the wheel because he was He took the wheel and tried to get me to turn right there.

1:14:21 Where just the trees are. And I don't know how I did it, but I was like, I guess because I was down here, and I just did it back. And again, the fact that there were no cars coming or. Going was a miracle. But I just did it back. And I knew because I knew in my head I was going to that spot. And so when I did that, and then I pulled up and I just parked and turned it off, and I knew I'd go there all the time. And it says cameras whatever, and they's like, okay, we're here. You were going to back up. When you're gonna and and he before he kept saying I just wanted. He's screaming, I just want to talk to you. I'll talk to you, and so I so I turned around and I said, I'll talk to you from right here. This is one day I'll talk to you from. And I screamed it at it so we were parting. It was right like the front, like the door. The door's right here. Of course our hell we'll call it missus CBS. If I were a pall her, Actually this is making sukey.

1:15:09 And then like you said, the rightwood comes in. There like this. It was around. And he tried to get me to go in here to park okay, and I did it, and I went all the way round. The front door is there, and I know this parking, yeah. I thought, yes, and the good there's grass right here and I was in this spot, the first spot right there. Okay, so you were right there, right up against the store and the walkway to the store, I guess ye, on the corner of. The building, M right there and the doors right there. Said really, there's only probably two spots, and then the front door so that people were coming and going, and he kept telling me to stop crying. That people were but it was raining too, so it wasn't that like a people didn't have a clear view. At one point a lady pulled him right here and I, oh, she loved me. And I almost said helped me, But at that point the gun was between his legs, like right there, so I didn't.

1:15:51 I didn't do anything. Okay, Yeah, I was parked right there the whole time. And it was a good forty five minutes at least. Or we just talked, did he was he scared me in the whole time? No, I mean to I said, well the pot first time, because he was so mad that I did that. He stood he kind of was. I don't know if he was on his knees or what, but he held the seat belt together where I couldn't the red and where the red thing is. He just held it so I couldn't maybe cause I was gonna get out and run in, but I couldn't do that. And yeah, he was just serening and I was shaking, but I was trying to act like I wasn't scared.

1:16:33 But and then it took about. He just kept you to god. Sall, Hey, do I keep piet? Oh, let me wait till he steps set here. And that's funny. Some of the parts we'll get to order go into a little bit more detail. So I got to go. When did you ask? I forgot? I was asking him his demeanor? Oh yeah, So yeah, at first he was mad. He's he was like holding this the whole time, and he just kept saying, no, Rimber, I just wanna talk to you.

1:17:13 You ignore my text you ignore my emails. I just wanna talk to you. We have a court date at coming up Wednesday. I just wanna talk to you. And so I was just like, what what do you wanna talk about? And I'm right here, I'll talk to you. What do you wanna talk about? And so the more he wouldn't say anything. So the more I kept saying that I'm ready to talk to you anyway, he would. I could tell he was getting calm or he didn't have that crazy, but he was getting calmer, and he would. He ended up sitting in a seat. I had the gun between his legs. It wasn't touching him, and it was between his legs the whole time. And then he did let go, and I ended up telling him at one point, I said, Brian, you let go of my seatbelt a while ago, and I haven't. I could get out. I could, but I'm not. I'm listening to you. I'm talking like I kept kind of I do it so but ain't myself. Yeah, he did end up he kind of still kind of sat on the edge of the chair and look.

1:17:58 Around, but he was st I I think he had been drinking or something, because he seemed he just seemed I'm gonna obviously off but I don't know. I just felt like maybe he'd been drinking a high or something. It was that kind of smell type. I don't know. I have no idea does he ever acted like that before. I've never seen him to that extent. No, I mean he had completely lost it, and he. Kept saying, I've lost everything, I've nothing to live for. It many times, I'm gonna kill myself. Why shouldn't I have nothing to live for? Did he tell you how I was gonna do that or where is no? But he said he bought the gun to do it. I think he was gonna do it right there, or he wanted to do it there, because he said something about that. I said, as he got calmer, I said, did you actually plan to kill both of us today?

1:18:44 Like we were just having a conversation? Goes? Well, me and I go, and I didn't ask any further, but he said, but no, he never but pulling all that crap out of the back, I have no idea. Well what color were the sheets? A light light light? I mean even maybe even like this color, like a light tan, you know, not not like the door, but more like this. Okay, I think there was. Some plastic involvement. Okay, so he strut upon and stuff, but I didn't know anything was back there. I think it was like a sheet this color, and then I think there I think you know how you can hear like I think there was some plastic maybe like you were used to paint, like you know, you put on the floor to pay, something like that.

1:19:34 Maybe a plastic sheet, like a plastic bag. The sheet was a sheet. The sheet was like this color and it was a sheet. But I remember now that when he grabbed it, it was more it was too and I think this one had a noise to it. It was something. It was different, but it was also around the same color. Yeah, it did. It looked like a sheet too, but I think it I think it might have been some type of plastic. But I don't know. I mean that was I mean, I didn't know anything was back there when I I was like, oh my, you know, and he just he d I guess he had to do that twice, okay, and then started shoving it in that backpack. But that there was something different besides. Just the bed sheet. Now, can you explain that? Describe that bottle a little better.

1:20:15 Oh yeah, I mean it's like kind of there's old fashioned bleach where the bottle was like probably that tall, fat and then skinny, you know, and then it was clear you could see there was clear inside of it. And then it had the spray with the big nozzle. So it's just like I would call it a bleach bottle, but it didn't say a brand name. It was actual, like could you tell if it was a label on I didn't see one. It looked like, yeah, nothing you would buy, like it did our brand on it or anything like that. So it rocks. It didn't say anything. Was it just kind of like a spray bottle. It was a spray bot it was. It was like a kind of like an industrial spright. There was liquid in it. But again I I think it's bleached, but I don't could you tell what color it was? It w everything, everything was white and light.

1:20:57 So I immediately if you saw you say it was leach bottle, you know, like, but I didn't smell it. Or tape, you know. I think it was a bleach bottle, pretty sure, Okay. And then something else that I can't remember. I wish I could remember. And again, it wasn't a hammer, but it it was something like that. It was fatter it it was fatter than a hammer, and it was about. The length of a hand hammer. But I have no idea he did it so fast. I have no idea what that was. I don't know. And then at that point, I said, where's the gun cause he's shoving all the stuff in the backpack and he was like right here, and it was at his feet and he picked it up, put it in there too, on the top, and then zipped it, s unzipped the SI the little pocket got his keys.

1:21:41 And that did he send anything out for that? Yeah? Did you sorry? He was so sorry, and I kept saying I won't tell me when I won't put the lease. It was fine. It's just gold to stay with you, is what. It's a gold to stay with you. Oh yeah, he wants me to call a divorce on yeah? He and and and he said he got he did all that because I have blocked him from everything, and so he does try to communicate with me, and I don't communicate back. And so this is why he said he had to do this to give me a talk. Where is he living on the other landing road? We own two comes and he said that one. I'm trying to think he said any more about killing himself A cause I said, I go, are you you're for sure you really want to die today? And he said ninety I was ever ninety five o'ka n ninety eight percent. It was something, you know, and I said, we love You're not sure, you know, don't do it?

1:22:48 Don't you know? I won't tell anyone. I don't want you know. He definitely, he said he's been He said he's been thinking about it for a long time, killing himself. What what would Len do this to. Wanna kill himself? Because I mean, our marriage is over. He has a son with another wife and she's left him to live with his mom full time, so he's lot recently, he's so he lost him so he says. He has nothing left now it's a business doing. I guess. Oh oh. And also his mom found out within the past two to three weeks that she has cancer. That was something else. Yeah, yeah, and he did say that I'm gonna lose my mom in a year. I've lost you, I've lost you know, staff, my son. Yeah, that's I'm I didn't forget about that, but that's a current thing. And apparently it's pretty bad that his dad has also called me and wants me to call him, which I'm not going to. But that's just interesting because I just wonder, you know, if Brian went actually told of everything or what the cause My plan was to go out there and talk with him today.

1:24:06 But obviously I'm not compt to know where do you usually park on campus? Right? They're doing construction, major construction on the stadium, so it's in the back park. But I mean, I don't even know how to tell you, Like the the stadiums here, there's that like statue, you know, with the statue of the front, uh huh. And so our parking is like over here. So I'm usually like in the back because they actual construction crap. All up here. That's that big block they go back towards an scree, yes exactly. But he knows that too when he showed up there a couple of weeks ago. When the last corn date was, and Carlington knows where you park where?

1:24:50 Yeah? Yeah? Oh? Any any at the end, you I didn't mean to scare you. I did. I just wanted to talk to you. He was very weepy and apologetic at it. When he got out of the car. I only talked about it as clothing. MM. I wish I could you said it was a collared shirt. It definitely was like a polo shirt. Yeah, I d definitely like that. But I mean, I'm pretty positive he's sitting up there at work right now. Oh no, no, no, he's probably looking for me now cause I didn't each of the phone. I don't know alf you send navy shorts with the cardinal shorts?

1:25:32 Noah, now just they would just be no positive sports time. And your know what colored senters shoes were. They were a dark colored brust You remember if he did say I've got to get rid of the stone. He did say that. I don't know why if you say. That towards the end, maybe as he was even tapping it up. I don't think I asked him a question on that, but he he's mumbled something like that. But the minute he finds out that I came here, he's gonna lose it like again. And that's when I'm that's why I didn't wanna come.

1:26:16 Well, he did the right thing. It's I like that, because what am I gonna do when I leave here that lady's gonna take me get a restraining order? He's not gonna pay attention to it. And then what's gonna happen like other than that anything? What do you mean, like, well he don't get arrested or I mean, is he just gonna I mean I just I just don't know. Ye, if he finds out today, I thought a restraining order, that's it. And you say I'm army cause. He he'll be so mind alright, and that lot of there's a lot of different things. I mean, yes, you're all looking at criminal charges at the same time, we're also worried by's welfare. Yes, yes, so you know there's always be correct, there's always an option. I agree with that. And like I said, was everything that happened, yes, I mean the rest is very likely. But again, if if he's.

1:27:07 Arrested, they can't get him that mental health yes, help treatment, you know, if we have enough to arrest him and the rest is gonna be done over a Maker Act due. To the charges. But the jail is a receiving facility in those cases where they can into the mental health treatment. If it goes to court, I mean, they're gonna they'll try and get him some help. There are options that the court can make him get smelt. I know you say he's gonna go in the rehab to the cork in order rehab, Okay, alright, and again that's all I can't tell you that it's gonna happen. But I have seen times where the court orders rehab is part of probation or whatever, and that they'll work all that out. I think that's getting a little ahead of us right now.

1:27:49 With his diachology, you're saying that's odd. Would you be willing to do a control call too? It is bad to see if the dead says anything, or to Brown himself. Oh my gosh, Brian's gonna ask me immediately, where are you? Why are you not at work? So? And then his dad, I don't know. I mean, you know what I'm saying, like, I'm not gonna stand at the SHARE's apartment. Alright, Well, it's hardly if you ask him where you're at. All you gotta do is tell him you had to get go somewhere by yourself and think, yeah, I don't. I really don't wanna make contact with him. I mean, unless y'all be it necessary.

1:28:33 Well, it's your option if he if he if he told his dad what took place, and his dad is checking on you and expresses he explained it to him or whatever, then we've got uh that information that he's told somebody else. If he wands up sitting here having a conversation with you about it. That's just more evidence per se the corroborating your story about what took place. I think Marcus is calling me just to set that conversation up, because Brian really didn't wanna tell his dad in the details. He he wanted to. Tell him that he reached he ruck bottom, stuff like that, but he didn't wanna tell him the details because because his dad is so upset about the mom and there or if he kept bringing that up.

1:29:22 That they are going through that. So he didn't want to tell his dad. So I don't I don't think calling his dad. I'm h probably a hundred percent sure he didn't tell him all the details. So it's not like Marcus would repeat him all back to me, because I'm pretty it was gonna take me going there and me basically. Making him do it. And the reason he would do that is because he would think I would call them the worse off when we would get back together. In the end, him calling me, he's just gonna be where are you? What are you doing? He's gonna wanna set up that meeting with Marcus. I don't know, Oh my god, I don't know, because I don't want I don't want to make him more mad before he even finds out, you know what I'm saying. And the point would be to try to get him to say stuff like and to find.

1:30:18 Out where he is. If if he was bound up telling you wanna meet you prior to going there, and we. Could try to have people in that area whenever he arrives, not somewhere necessarily that he out at that second, but even if he did put it where a so other road and said I'm a capital circle and putting into the CBS anything like that would give us an idea of where his location. It's cause the FSUO police already have the information and we've got the information out. Our thing now is to locate him, checking on his welfare, uh as you say, Cause we don't. It would just be beneficial to did locate him, do you know?

1:30:59 I mean, have y'all checked him at his work in the parking lot to see if he's there. Way, we've got. People checking cause I think, I mean, I think that's where he's not. We'll just think about it. I don't think about if you can think if you much. Then, but one of our biggest goals is to be able to locate right right right, right, Well. If they find out, if you can't find out from those people, if he's Chuck is at work, cause that's what I'm thinking. I'm really thinking that is there cause he thinks coming there later time? What time even, isn't it? Yeah? He would think anyway, y yeah, if. You can find that out, alright.

1:31:40 I'm just I've told this story a million times. I want a few more times. Are they going through my par now? They were saying to du yeah, Yan Janna want to get key transl Ansley is at j us in his house. So but Brian would never know where I been is right now, I'm assuming Brian's at work. He's He's called me, his das called me. Did you answer the phone or text me? Did he say rip call? What he say say? He he has to use apps text STAPs on his phone because I I've blocked so many numbers from him.

1:32:21 So this must be another text staff number. And he sent this that and that's his celf and that was around one. You think that's him? That is Ymberships. He's tell he's telling me a town is real? At what want refence him? But I think I think it's I think you'll find at truck at work. I don't. I don't know if any Sich called for you. But Marcus Marcus said, says, please call me at one thirty, but I don't wanna call him. They I I don't know why he's calling me. I don't know if Marcus would be He think he taught to Marcus. Well, Brian said, I convinced him like someone had to know what he had done for us to tell Marcus because he wouldn't turn in that reise someone else would know.

1:33:05 And then he said he'd I don't want to tell hibou the gun. I don't wanna tell. I'll just tell him that I hit right, But like he didn't wanna tell him the details. That I wanted him to tell. So the fact when he's calling me, Brian might have said something, but I know he didn't tell him the details. He wouldn't unless I was there, and I made him that. Kathy mentioned, should I tell Marcus? Let me ask Kathy want we. Don't They have not found Brian yet? Oh they haven't. What time is it? I sent John Barns over to your mom's U and I think they told Donnys a little bit. Well, if you did show up at worked like you were supposed to, and he knows you're not there, right, Where's he gonna go? Yeah, the only place I knew that he knows the common would be Johnny's. So John Barrage is there. She no one can get the john.

1:33:48 He trying to get her lead and go over your grandparents to stay there, but she won't leave the house. I think he's probably driving around looking for me cause he thinks I'm supposed to be at work. Cause I told him when I was going to check to work, he could call me on the. Work phone to confirm it and then I would meet him at Marcus later today at at his office. That's how we left Thectary Forest office. Now, Mark said north. Ann Prest, Yes, and he said that he would that we would talk to his dad together. That's how we leved to. What dah, what did he pull out back in the corners for?

1:34:31 And now he told them Then he told me, yeah, I didn't know anything was back there, and he got he got his knees. Into the like that seat and started pulling stuff out and from the great back mm that's where he was hiding. And so he pulled it back up. He pulled. It was loose stuff like he pulled you know what. He might have slept there last night and that's why she was there. I don't know. I don't know how long he didn't, but he but he pulled out that she that was like this color, and then he pulled out something else cause it took him. It was heavy, So I that's why I think it was some type of plastic. I'm pretty sure it was pulled all that out, shoved all that in this backpack, and then pulled something else out.

1:35:11 And again I don't know what it was. It was bigger than a hammer, wider than a hareer, but I don't know what it was. Put that in there. And then there was this bottle like this big of like industrial bleach, like a bob and he pulled that out. And put that in there. And then when he turned around and sat down and said, where's the gun cause he was about to get out, and he goes right here, and it was on the floor. He picked it up, put that on top, and then sipped it up and then was un zipped a little tiny pocket that I could see that was right here and guns kisa. So he told you he was there. Can kill himself. This morning he told me that he had nothing else to live for and that he wanted to kill himself. He told me that many times. He told me he bought the gun to kill himself. Cause I said, where did you get this gun? Because I've never seen a like a gun that you would kill people with. You know, he's just got the hunting guns, And he said, I bought it to kill myself.

1:35:56 What do you think he wrong on other stuff, for I had. No idea because at one point I asked him, I said, did you really plan on to day being in the day that you would both die? And he said, well me, but then when I saw that other stuff, that doesn't make sense, so I don't That's what. He said, Denise. He was going to kill you, and for whatever reason he didn't go through with it. He brought that stuff you usede to cover his tracks. And I'm sorry. You know that I love you and I would never let anything happen to you. But I'm not gonna sit here and sugarcoat stuff you. You did the right thing by all this. The Denise, he was gonna kill you. Well then, well then when he finds out after four o'clock that there's a restraining order. He's gonna know that. I told that he's gonna.

1:36:37 Come for me. Well, hopefully I'll kill himself. I don't want to worry about it. Okay, he's had control of you for years and years and years. He has ruined your life. You and that are the same age. But y'all sure don't look at it has eaten at you and eating at you and I I couldn't say anything. I talked to one one time and said, we need to talk to Denise. Then he wouldn't do it, he said, I'm just flash. He didn't go crazy. Okay, but you've been living in a crazy life forever and he finally had enough to get out. I know, I know, Denise, he did it, and you know exactly what I'm talking about. I don't think you had anything ever whatsoever to be held that over your head forever. And he was gonna do it again.

1:37:21 He wasn't gonna kill himself, de niece. He was gonna kill you so that you didn't talk about him later. That is the truth. I've been in this too long. I've talked to everybody I know over the years, for fifteen years about how and what we could do. Fifteen years ago, he walked in told you he had done something, didn't he? Oh, Denise, Oh you haven't got he is. This is not going the way. Okay, he's going to kill you. He's either gonna kill himself because he got no other avenue, but he gonna try and control you. He's gonna try to stop people from talking about what he did. You say, No, I don't. Would he would he go get Ansley and hold Ansley and call you and say do what I say? Would he kill Annsley?

1:38:15 Would he? I don't. I don't think he could killed me. The only person that's importing to him is him. He didn't bring that crap to kill himself and bury himself. He'd already to kill you and bury you. Give him the problem cause he knows he's got a problem. He didn't stay any of that. This is not how divorce is getting. What did he ever say to you back then? Back then about mine? Oh? I never had any reason to believe that he would do that. I d I mean what I never would have believed the only what you do? You remember the time what took Atlanta when you had a boyfriend up there and he showed up with a gun. Yeah, what makes you think he wouldn't do something to la?

1:38:59 I guess because. Not now, but he and obviously this doesn't He loves the Lord. He was a Christian, That's why I married him. He was doing prison ministry. I was doing prison ministry. I had no reason. And I've never seen him like this. I've never seen him like this, Sadden. This way fourteen years ago, any Land. Not like this. This was different. This was very different. This took it to a whole another. Knowing what you know over fifteen years, do you think he would do something like knowing what you know now? Because it took me a long time ride, I said.

1:39:39 No, no, no, no, no, not what you even after today, even after everything that he said to me today, I do not believe. I know, I don't and I don't believe he was there to hurt me. He said, over and over. I want to kill myself. I don't want to leave. I'm so miserable. I have nothing to live for. It's brought plastic and implement to bury you. And you think he can hurt you. I just I guess. I I can't believe it. And he didn't say I mean he had the gun on me. But he didn't always say. Sensor to hurt me, right, he did say that. He screamed that, Yeah, that's what. We can't put it back in the bottle. No, okay. And there's no amount of counseling that's gonna help him. He's not gonna he was never normal. He's never gonna return to whatever he was.

1:40:34 The only thing that's gonna work out is you testify and he goes to prison, and he goes to prison for at least the period of time, and maybe it's five, ten, fifteen years, but at some point he may get back out. Okay, if he kills himself, we'll problem solved. But you can't. I don't believe it. I believe he has something to do in life. I absolutely believe it. I I do not that that that this what you're talking about, has nothing to do with tonight. Tonight is what I'm worried about. When to keep when I go fi this, he's gonna. Know, well, he's gonna know no matter what, because he's going to jail to day. If we buy me until we find you. You think you're in danger, yeah, you think Handsy's in danger? Yeah? And I don't know the Stafford and me and Ansell. Yeah, okay, because he drive around.

1:41:18 With a gun. Hey, no one wants to hurt himself. He would hurt anything, would he wants. He wants me to stop the divorce. That's what he kept saying. I have nothing to look for if you fall through with this, I have nothing. To look for. Could it's not like he can't be back together? Well, and that's what he wants. And that's pretty much what I had to I didn't say that, but I pretty much had to say, we'll meet with Marcus. This could I didn't say at the beginning, I said, this could be your. Rock bottom and this could be you know all that I said, all that I didn't say I would call it the divorce. Do you think he would really kill himself? Yeah, He's threatened it so many times. To me, I believe you know enough about he said something.

1:42:02 He alluded to something. Why not with his money and his youth, move on to something else. What is so important about keeping the niece, which which he has, Because you're going to say something that he has said in the past, and this is by being married to is the one way he can keep control of that even if it's a little something he has said something to you that he said at some point about then I would really have to. To think about it, because I don't he he's sleeping with all the prostitutes, he is doing all that. I I mean, I've always thought that he wanted to stay with me because of money, because he can do his hunting leases and live his life large because of money.

1:42:49 And honestly, this divorce that you said at today is gonna bury him. And it is because he's gonna lose the office building that we own together and he's gonna lose his home. And so to me, that's that That's what always made sin, That's what makes sense to me is money. And and then he has the prostitutes and then he still has me. That that's what he wants. And that's why he was saying that that he's not at the office right now. And I'll eat their sure not if be worthy, it'd already have him by now. But what are they gonna do. They're gonna arrest him, yeah, and like and say these are charge charges? Yeah, Like what would that be? Right? I would think kidnapping would be pretty serious charge.

1:43:30 They'll be a charge, yeah. At some point you'll have to do before and maybe a judging jury and play this out for them too. But just like I don't do anything here, just like I diden, Yeah, these are guys are just getting the information to get uh a report generated, maybe a warp of the rest, okay, and that's the right thing to do. But you, yeah, you may have to relive this again in front of strangers. I j I really wanna get through tonight, and I wanna get through knowing that he knows. And then I'm still a lot. Well, we're gonna keep you a lot and not anything happen to you, live with you forever. That's true. When you have to, you have to live with me until he's either in jail or dead. He is threatened. I stayed with him so long before we separated because he would threatened suicide all the time, and he knew that would get me, and it got me every time.

1:44:14 So he's been threatening suicide for over five years. I think people that threaten suicide don't. Do it, so I don't. I don't think he's gonna do it. If he he would have done it today, if he was today, I can't. I can't. I just can't. What do you think he preserved to do? W I mean what he said, which was ju he wants to talk me out of the divorce. That's what he kept saying, screaming, what'd he tell you to turn? You remember when you left? What he keepkept saying? You're gonna go to the roundabout and you're gonna and I think he said he kept I think he kept saying turn left, and I never would the roundabout, I don't. I think he wanted to be a go like.

1:45:01 I don't know he he said, sound like you're gonna go to the roundabout because you could only turn right there. But I think he wanted me to go. I felt like he wanted me to go because when we first went out, he wanted me to turn left, like by Westminster. So he came out of your house, he wanted you to turn left. Well, I was already I'll make a Siokie road when he appeared, and and so I was probably halfway in the roundabout. And then he kept wanting me to turn left and I wouldn't, and then he said you're and that's when he put the gun to me. He said, you're gonna go to the roundabout. And you're gonna I. I think he wanted me to take it, and then I I don't know, maybe he said right at that point, but he wanted me to get off of that road and go this way, which would be just hoist the ER's day. I go, where's the sat and Extina SIPs and that's up oh A twelve north of town.

1:45:47 Mm, that's it's off Millernig Road. And then it's Scrunts Rubber. But he humps right there off the neigh road. But yeah, he kept wanting me to turn ruch that he had been in my house because he said things that he wouldn't have known me without have been in my house. And I have changed changed three times. I've changed him three times, and it doesn't matter. It's too easy to get him. And I just feel like this restraining order's not gonna stop him. An alarm system at my house isn't gonna stop him. What's gonna stop him? Well, I guess if he kills himself and I don't have to worry, that's a good one that I don't.

1:46:30 I just don't think he's going to. All this stuff are restaining order put him to jail or doing nothing, which is gonna stop him. Well, I'm I'm here trying to do something. I still don't feel right about it. My mind feel right about him. Because I know what's gonna happen when he finds out, He's gonna be mad. And when he left me, he was calm, he was crying, he was sorry, he was I can deal with that. I can't deal with the other. It's I've never seen him like this, never l he was often. I mean he was crazy. I've never seen him like this. I'm sure it's different now it was, but go back to Atlanta.

1:47:11 Yeah, yeah, but when I think about that now compared. To this, that was what within that was in the first two years of my disaperience. Probably. Two to three I would say, I'm not positive that, I would say a company three. But yeah, but this doesn't hold a candle. But driving all the way to Atlanta because you're hanging out to some guy m and then he he confronted. That guy with the gun, right, Well, he always said he had one. No one ever saw it, but I didn't. I mean I didn't show it to me. I mean I never saw it. And the guy that we never saw it. But that's what, Yeah, he. Threwn that over and over. I mean that was this was this was different.

1:47:54 And I've never seen a gun like that. I've never Oh. And he did say I've got to get rid of this gun. He didn't say that, And I don't know cause I said the where did you get that gun? And he said I bought it to kill myself. And then at the end, when he was getting ready to get out of a car, after he had everything. Together, he said, I got to get heard of this gun. And I didn't say. I didn't let me call it that. He did say that, and I doesn't know what that means. He didn't do it. I mean, it's m He held it and he had it between his lags the. Whole time on the seat. What about that? If if Deborah were sitting here and you were sitting here, and when she told you that I had done all this, what would you tell them?

1:48:45 Run? Would you tell her to don't worry about it? Yeah, I'm not gonna go forward. I fel bad. If you shouldn't do anything, He'll get better. No, No, cause it's not how rational people act, and those people do not get better. And if you she sat there and told you that he brought miss Queen and this is crazy. Okay, Coolly, that is crazy. Do you understand it's crazy? You gotta be able to see it from out here? But I did. I mean, he was not there to kill himself. The threat to kill myself was to get you to do what he wanted to do to do. He's so crazy that he believed you should believe. You wouldn't tell anybody that he kidnapped you. I promised him. I know, n y, that's how crazy he is. Are you kidding me? You say anything you did, you did it right, you handle it perfectly. Should never do what he says by fear life and go to a FA and you got him to calm down and you got that he did. Yeah, he like believe he had to believe. Think how crazy is if I were in that frame of mind, never told me about until like now you think I would good for that?

1:49:47 Yeah? Well, if I'm in that frame of mind, I mind be cause I am totally off my rocker. Well he's yeah, cause he still has his little time. Believe it's a little cause that's all he wants is he to stay with him. But he will never be wrong. He's not normal. And I'm sure if you think about the last fifteen years, there had been tons of yeah, abnormal things. I mean, I I know you didn't tell me about any of 'em. In terms of I heard a little bit, like the the gun thing in Atlanta. I heard about that, But other than that, I've heard nothing until the last year. You said to brand him an email about how terrified you are of you You knew a year ago.

1:50:27 But yeah, during you mean the year ago, like from like what since we've been separated? Yeah, he said, I don't even how long it was separated. Well, he grabbed me the last day and that's why I picked him out that that was almost four years ago. He grabbed me four years ago during that. Was the last day that he lived with me. Now you ever hit you, well, I mean that that was the worst that it died physically, like he just like threw me against the ball. Did you talk you were tired of the craft? Yeah? No, he was wanting da He all of all the issues we've had all during the marriage have to do with sexual issues, and he like, now he's using prostitutes and that's what he wanted. He I married him because he was living for the Lord and was a Christian and it was everything that I had ever wanted. That slowly, within about the first year, he stopped doing my studies.

1:51:12 He stopped doing everything, and then it then it that way and it was all sexual related. He's a commerce he's a con man. But that's what the fight was about. And then I was going through counseling at the church, so I drove, I ran out of the house and drove to their office. The people, the elder and his wife, and so they know all of that situation. He broke all my stuff. He it was awful. But that was the last day he lived with me in November first, only four years, so it's probably about three and a half years ago. He hasn't lived here in three and a half years. M And see, I didn't even know until I guess it's been a year whatever. You sent that email to the EPRA, Dianna, and I don't know if I scott it. But that's almost been four It was November first, it's almost spent four years.

1:51:53 But was in that the emails last year wasn't like within the last year. What made you send an email? I guess I need to see it cause I don't. I don't remember the details surrounding it. I don't know if he had did what he had done. But but again there's if anything happened to me, Brian did it. I don't know. I have to like it cause I'm not specipally where you're talking about this, because we haven't lived together in almost four years. And he would try to get me to cont to talk with him and stuff, and we did counseling, we did everything that he he. Was never genuine with it, and it never worked. And then I and then I got an attorney last August, which we're still fighting because he won't just okay, and we have another corking Wednesday.

1:52:39 But even you told me y that's what he was. Tryna taught me out of the Wednesday thing cause it's a new dead deadline that he's not gonna make. What makes him what? Why would he be so financial destitue? I mean Marcus would take care of him, Yeah, but he's. That Marcus is taking care of Jennifer and all four of her kids because of her husband m So he's doing the mortgage he I mean, he's doing everything for her. He's at an age where he should be retired, but his wife found out this month that she has to do or cancer, so he's dealing with that. I mean, he basically would. Just throw money at Brian all these years, but now and lately, if I don't, I get the impression that that has been cut off, especially since when Stafford found all this information out about what he was doing with the prostitution and drugs. We believe that Marcus cut him off at that point. So I think there's a lot of And he kept saying that in the car to day financial pressures. He kept talking about I'm losing it.

1:53:29 He said, I have people money all over count He did say that I just remember that and that. Might have to do with the drugs. That might have to do with the prostitutes and the drugs, but he said that today. So he's definitely money hurting. But once you're divorced, like the office building, y'all had an to praise, it'll need to be bought by one or the other. But either way, half the proceeds to each. That doesn't sound like I'm financial destitute. You how to be getting least something out of that? Yeah, and then the house what does the praise that? Well, I don't know they're doing the doubt appraise on Now the home appraisal that he lives in is both of our home, but he refuses to let them do the appraisal, so that hasn't been done yet. But the business makes money. But when I had the appraisal walk through it, I did notice that there were a lot of empty spaces.

1:54:15 And Brian's really good at the office and he's good at getting people to rent and stuff, and it's it didn't seem. Like it was how it used to be in the previous years. But I haven't been a part. Of that business in the year, so I mean we financial destiny. She's like you trying to tell you he would he was gonna come into some money at the end of the divorce. It would be something left year. It wasn't, but it but it sounded to me like he had it owed out like he he did say he was like, I owe you money all over like thousands. He kept saying thousands. So I don't know. I don't know if she's walking out, but I'm thinking it might have to do with drugs. Because some of those te Stafford has pictures of all the text on his phone with these girls and the drugs and all that kind of stuff. And this girl is ordering stuff because me and Kathy had to google what even she was talking about.

1:55:00 And so that Brian was either getting him. What did you about? Uh? We talk all us. She knows every single thing. I mean, when when does Stafford find out about It's been probably six weeks to two months ago, and he left told Marcus. We told Marcus and showed him everything, and then Marcus went to Brian's. House got all stuff or step out and Stufford hadn't been back and he hadn't talked to him since. So that's a huge pressure on Brian too, because to me, he wants his son, but he didn't stop worn around, which is interesting. But and so all I know his mom getting cancers brand new. I won't talk to him. Stafford won't talk to him. I mean, this is all the stuff he listed out, list the reasons why he hadn't to go to such extremes to get.

1:55:45 Me to talk to him. You think he was just gonna killed you sep the fortune and the him. I don't. I still don't want. I don't have my mind wrapped around the fact that he was gonna kill me, so I can't really answer. I don't know. I'm this. These are just all the things that he saying. I don't I don't know. I don't know, but I know, Hay, the. Grace of God, I got out there. I'm scared of does for tonight you stay with us? But a lady there's a lady that said we were gonna file a restraining order today. But I don't even know what time it is. I don't know if we were like this and which three, I don't know how long that takes. I don't know that would long with the beads to do. Do you think that I'll get it? People get its people, But it's a piece of people, I know.

1:56:28 And then what then they go show him? They they're gonna they're gonna arrest him for kidnapping this morning, and it's gonna be charged. N I wait, Well, I don't know that. I don't know all the details. All I get is a little bit you gave me, and uh, from what you've told me, that's what it sounds like. It could be something a little bit different, but it's domestic, so it's gonna be very serious. For I'm a judge. He's not gonna get out any time, and it's a day or two uh to see a judge. But at some point we got to bake on. He is gonna get out, Yeah, you know, And that's why don't wanna come. What are the choice do you have? I guess I was hoping Marcus was gonna solve it all. Marcus got so much oft laers like to see he's already cut him off. Then maybe he finally realizes that it's time to quit helping him.

1:57:13 Mm, but I need to t I need to tell my attorney what happened today. She doesn't know. But but yeah, so what's your f So finish that sentence you said? So he will probably get arrested and then he'll get out in a couple of days. Then what uh they'll end up uh save attorney will uh by all the charges against him for whatever they end up the charge is, and then it'll drag. Out for some time. It won't be quick. Oh right, but during all that time, what about me? What about Ansley? That's right, and that's why you have to go through with it. They may do electronic monitoring on him. I mean they maybe they'll pick it up bond. But it's never been any trouble, you know, they put a bond.

1:57:54 Bond just means a promise to show up at court, and it doesn't mean that I can't go out and kill you, right, Okay, think about that doctor of the right on. He's living with dad. So in the meantime you have to be worried about the isy where she goes to school starting back. You gotta tell him school what's going on so that they can watch out for her, and uh make sure that she's always got somebody around and she's never going home alone. May have to find something to rent or you actually stay with me, a Debora. There's plenty of rent we can work around. He doesn't know where I live. Could he find out absolutely? And I know all the places that he can that he's gonna come to. Don't know where it's perfectly safe, but it's probably the safest, but I can think at least there's always someone there. And Deniece, now I'm bringing my fanid to it. Parker endeavorah or we love you. I don't want anything to happen to you more inestly alright, So I'm willing to accept that risk, and it's it's more real to me than anybody, because we see all the time has happened here, tass. This is not a human being who loves people, who cares about people, react or behave. This is about power, This is about money and Denise, you've got to get in your head. Did see because he didn't hurt you? Well you think, well, there's some good in him. There's not. For whatever reason, he backed off the day okay, and Pansy would have had no mother and no father.

1:59:23 And I think you did because I told him pretty much what he wanted to hear. That's the onlyest. I don't know how he talked your way out of him, but get you to listen or didn't listen to him and drove to the CBS. Probably saved your life. You'd gone where you wanted to go and there was no one around. I don't think you can talk to you about it. Who even buried you somewhere and you had never been found? Who was just in my head? To get to CBS. I'm like, I had to get to CBS. It was so weird enough to me, him bringing those things, hiding in the car, directing you, and he had it thought out. MM is right? Okay, and and I know I keep telling you about it that I'm telling you he killed Mike and he did it for you because he wanted you. And I know that's hard, and I know it hurts, but by God, I'm telling you that's what happened. How old was Ansley then? Huh?

2:00:16 At the beat? Not even the years? He didn't care. I saw it, Devah, and I saw Mike the Mica form with Ansley at the mall, and that's the last time I ever saw him. He didn't care about you. He didn't care about Ansley. He only cares about himself. He made Mike disappear, and he was gonna make you disappear today. And you have got to get that in your head. You don't ever have to tell me or anybody else about it, but at some point it needs to come out, because he did it. I am telling you, I don't think you had anything to do with it, but he held that over you, and I'm sure at some time he told you something. And I'm not trying to kick up he says, I don't think you did anything, Denise, but I'm telling you he killed Mike and he was gonna kill you, gonna make you go away. You need to hear that.

2:01:08 You need to hear it a lot. You were going to die today. You got lucky. Okay, next time it might be he catches Ansy and you and he kills asy and tell you just to hurt you. And if you think he's not capable of that, think about the man who brought something to bury you with, who brought plastic, who brought bleach to cover his tracks. That why doesn't make sense. He's nuts. He killed your husband. Okay, if he is nuts that crazy, then again what I can't have an officer live with me twenty four seven? I can't. I'm about safe to get.

2:01:48 Up to prison for murder. You'll never see him again. He killed Mike, and he buried Mike. We're no one can rEFInd him. That is the truth. I'm wondering if he was thinking to the same place today that he bury Mike. Cause he's done it before. You have to wrap your mind around it. And he's that is what he has done, and he's willing to do it again. He is going to kill you. Think about he went through he slept in your car and waited for you. But I don't think he slept I think any of the time. He wasn't watching you. That's just he watched Mike. I'll watch him stay in that office every night till eleven o'clock at night, all the time. Mike was so predictable.

2:02:30 I ever every now that I talked to him, and then I wouldn't get to talk to him. So predictable. Yeah, he waited for him. That day was it? He was missing for five or six hours, Bryan, the day of well a lot of people know missing. Yeah, and that's when he killed Mike. Sitting here today, you don't think he could come. Mike, the person that I saw today is a person I don't know that person. You saw it, and he could come, I couldn't he that person could and he did, and that's who he was. Then he has conned you to new end. It's not your fault.

2:03:14 I mean, that person today could have done anything and anything. Why, it's not the person that I married, It's not the person that I. Knew, It's not the person he knew. Okay, everyone has their private side difference. Okay, yes he has two different personalities. But yeah, this person today could have done anything and still could. I guess because this person who saw this could become like.

2:04:00 Ll and you going to killing me? Cause the person you saw me is the same person you're married. It's just there's two different people. And he when he's nick what he wants, he's all nice. Yeah, yeah, I don't know if he what we're talking about, Nace. I would never tell that one, or your mom or anybody. This is just for me and you, my star. I would never tell that. But were you sleeping with Brian the day of life disappirit No, it didn't happen ntil later No, yeah, well, but he wanted you to to, no doubt about it.

2:04:45 I just can't. I can't even imagine. And I've never seen a person like this day. Saw him in Atlanta. He's aversion, right, yeah, a version that's pretty good on. You, right. And and and this is why I didn't wanna do it this way, this is why we I didn't wanna set him off and make him mad in coming here. He knows he can't trust me because I promised him ever whenever I wouldn't do this. And that's why, yes, he would kill you. Yeah, well to get out of this situation. Yeah, I mean there was a gun there. I guess it. Never I guess I just believed him that he was gonna kill himself.

2:05:30 I don't know. But but the point is when he finds out, he's gonna be really mad. That's the point. And that's why I didn't wanna do it this way. What do you think he's gonna say when they find me. I don't know if he had the step still, and I really not think he can say, well, he put the backpack in the truck, then he got in the truck, but. I don't know. He he mentioned getting rid of the concer, he could get rid of everything. I don't know.

2:06:12 I don't know. But if the CBS cameras were working, I was right here. I mean, they can see what all happened. A couple of times that I reached over room and. Like touch his knee, like I mean, I was really like, I will promise you, I will not I like, I really wanted what you did. I mean, I wanted him to believe me. After you go out and he wants to believe he wants it to be like it was. And I'm sure at some point he was that part of the conversation when the solet's just make it like it was. He just he just wanted me to call. It a word someone. And the deadline's coming. And the last time the deadline came, he k. Shut up at an office and just kind of like followed me around the parking lot, yelling out the window that he wanted to talk to. And I wouldn't. Exactly like I said, I get a third person from Deborah two days after it's happened.

2:06:56 And well she didn't wanna take about across the tu stuff cause she said he report it or something cause she didn't. I guess she didn't tell you about that in the dr in the draws whatever that is. Well, that's not my problem. I don't. That's these people have to feel it that uh this is my sister in law. Don't have to worry about it. But do you like it's Friday? Right? It is? So if they're still if we do go to to restraining murder and he does find out about it before. But whatever they stop doing at out of pop. Get arrested up the yes, Okay, that's that's gonna happen as soon as they're not. They're everybody ever, everybody is looking forward right now? You think I need to call it anyway?

2:07:43 I know, so when they finally all arrested. Yes, yes, and he's either gonna break down and I'm an emotional wreck and I did it. I'm sorry, or the other side of him is gonna come out and go, she's crazy. I never did such a thing. You're insane. I would never do such a thing. Over what, I've got plenty of money, how to get the new truck you's got. Yeah, that's always been interesting to me because we've always had older cars, always paid for me cash, never had payments. I assumed it was part of his mid life crisis where he's doing these prostitutes and wants part of his image. But where he got the money from. For me, the person that I knew to get a mortgage for a car or whatever, would never do that, like, so, so you had to have to catch I'm thinking that we either either he had they catch it. I don't think he did it, but that he's now living this life where he has payments and stuff like it's j That's just not how we lived. And so it's just a whole n different Another area that's so different from how cause I'm assuming he m has a monthly payment, which we.

2:08:41 Would never do. So that was just another way that he's just living this other lifestyle. That Stafford ended up finding out about, Thank goodness, cause we would have never known. He he says, I been d He's been doing it since I foiled in August, and he said he started in September, and Stafford didn't find out. Until a couple maybe two months ago, six weeks ago. This rain would look through a stong mm. He said. He was actually really odd and it had been for a while and for some reason it was there for some reason. It was all mocked and he went through it. And that's not Stafford's personality. Stafford took screenshots of everything. I mean, he was so smart, and he told Kathy about.

2:09:24 It, and he told Kathy about it. He waited two weeks and every time Brian was gone, he would go through the house and take pictures of stuff he would find. And two weeks in and he told Kathy, I know something about Brian and I need to tell you it tones littles, And we had no idea. Didn't see he didn't He didn't even care about his little So he did cause he's doing that stuff in his own house. Stop these people. He owe his money too, they'd call home evasion, but they come in and kicked the door in. Ton't shoot anybody or anything. Taking Stafford hostage because he knows two thousand dollars. It's like he kind of it's like he's lost his mine because the horn. They they came to his house. Stopford pictures of them in the house. The bossas juice oh posuits in his house from his phone, from Brian's phone.

2:10:08 Yeh, Stephan's got at all. Where's Kathy house? It all didn't He just said the chre anymore. He that all. I don't think it reads. One thing he told me today was he was he has nothing to lose. That's when he kept saying, I'm nothing to lose. I'm nothing to lose. But then but he calmed down when he loved he was crying. I'm so sorry. I was so sorry. Years ago, when Mike Phillips and this guy's a deftly wanted to talk to you and Brian, y'all went talk to why not. I talked to Mike. I I talked to Mike. But they wanted to come in and do an interview, and they y'all didn't do it. We did two interviews.

2:10:49 We we did interviews with like, not local people. It was like federal people. I did one, he did one, and I think we did another one, but that it was always in an attorney's office, M and I and. I don't remember. My Phillips came to my house one time and I talk him there, but this the official ones were with federal people, and it was more than one with a lawyer with a at an attorney's office, and they were corded at. All from whatever your attorney or prime's attorney. Well, I mean he's an attorney who is friends with the Winchesters. Who set that up, who set up the meeting the well who said that lawyer? Oh, I would guess Marcus, because he's in that same little area where they all worked together.

2:11:34 I don't know. I don't really remember, but I do remember the location of the of the interviews were at the attorney's office, which is the same parking lot as Winchester. Financial Group, cause I remember having to go there twice, I think, or three times. When all they ask you, do you remember did y'all talk to 'em? Yeah? Yeah, we answer all these questions. I think there's a. Recording. I don't know. I don't remember. I don't remember, but I know it was definitely more than once, cause I think it was like me separate him, separate and thus together. Maybe that was it, but and I remember the location that that's what I remember.

2:12:17 And I and if Mike and then had contacted the attorney and asked him if we would meet with him, he might have said now. But I don't remember saying that no to mine, cause I remember him coming to the house talk to him. I know, I'm just saying that could have happened because. I but I but Mike, I mean, would come to the house. So I don't know. I don't remembout that all that. I don't remember, but it should be record somewhere. I can't believe. It was happened. An answers so upset, m m I just want us to be safe. You and I know what your house, you are. But other than that, I mean, we go.

2:13:05 To work, we go to school, and a piece of paper, an injunction or electronic monitoring doesn't stop me from sitting in a park a lot wait for you to kill you. So what we're really gonna do? You gonna go forward with this and make sure that you continue tell him the story and don't back off of him. Yeah, and don't let him manipulate you into backing the way. You're not testifying, cause you're he's gonna take it all the way. But I told everything exactly how it happened. I did not exaggerate our line. I don't think you. I'm glad you called me. I'm glad you didn't do what you told him you were gonna do, because seemed like a k I don't know how you got away a day. I just kept praying.

2:13:49 I don't know you got a way. But in your mind, every time you think about feeling sorry for him, I want you to think about what he did, what he brought with him, and how Catholic he was. Mkay, you just got very very fortunate today. I do that, but I just don't wanna go through that ever again. That's why I gotta keep going forward on this. And if you think about things and the way so I know it's hard. I I just I can't leave the mic thing along because I'm telling. You peace, I'll I'll started thinking about people. But only did that. He choreographed the recovery of his waiters.

2:14:30 I was there for t a week and and maybe that's what the f the Friday is that I'm controuble for that. Well, that's his doing. He did that, mkay. But I'm telling you he is so. He is a corper. He killed my and I'm pretty sure the reason he's gonna kill you to days he was afraid he was gonna do or say something or I had speculation. And yeah, the financial is a big part of it. I think it's a way bigger than just the financial, cause he had plenty of resources. He was gonna get money from the house, and get money from the the business being sold, a rentful the whole in the hearts. It wasn't just to take all that from you. It's great, I guess.

2:15:13 I first just have to. Can you just sure that he that he was would have hurt would have killed me today? Do you know what I'm saying? Like cause I just never but you're right, why would. Yeah? I mean, I see you kill myself, you don't come back to well, if you come back to me, it's all said. Good. If you don't come back to me, I'm gonna take you out in the woods. I'm the hole. I'm gonna kill you. And no one's ever gonna find you, and I can't prepare to make sure that no one ever found out you did it. If they if they go through the backpack, can can you tell me, like what exactly was an it? Like? I mean, I know for sure there were a sheet in it, but I wanna know exactly. I know I know for surely around the fact that it wasn't he wasn't there to hurt some today.

2:15:55 Well then I thought, well, maybe he was just sleeping and needed a sheet to sleep with, ye, or you. Didn't go to sleep at midnight waiting for you. He shoved shortly before him, I'll be while still dark, stuff through the backyard, got in your car and sat there waiting for you, right fraud all that stuff, mkay, And I have no doubt they did it the same way with the Mike. He cain't prepared bleached. Yeah, I just like television or Google or anything else. He's done this before, he knew what to do. They found nothing when Mike disappeared. Nothing. That is unbelievable. He's calculating he's cold. I don't. I I hate to know the competition between him and mind.

2:16:39 I'm sure it was at gunpoint, but Mike thinking he's a friend. But there's no doubt there was a confrontation. Never do you think Mike came to the home for lunch that day? How you think Mike came home for lunch that day? Came home for lunch? Yeah? I don't, I know, No, I. Don't, I don't know. I remember it was are you a three trip the next day? The next day? I remember that. I don't. I don't remember l I don't remember lunch. But I just do you think Mike would have come home from ketch 'em to have lunch that day? I have no idea. I don't have to look back up my nose and stuff. I don't even remember. I just remember he had we had d I always assumed it happened. But I always assumed that he got Mike at the office. I mean, I would always see my I weren't Mini back then, either tendnce ey or something, and I would always see mike' sitt up there working, and every now and then maybe once 'em off that stopped in, or ketch him on his way out or whatever, see hello. But uh, I always thought that that's where it got me. But the timeline is a match up.

2:17:44 He was missing there in the day. Mike wasn't seen. Her other day, bron Uh. I remember being home with Amsley and making phone claws. I remember her crib, she. Had a crib. It was a Friday, right, But I remember that he. Was supposed to be there cause we were gonna go and the babysitter was coming here. Do you know what's coming? I don't. I don't. I don't thought it was just Saturday. I haven't, but I remember making calls and holding her and she was a baby, But I don't I talk to. I just always wondered where and what now? But it certainly wasn't the late look telling it was not supposed to go. Like I'm out said, I didn't find out.

2:18:35 I'm sorry about that much. I don't want to do. I don't know any though now he was He was hanging in the morning and he was gonna go with a friend he had from work, a young kid. I can't think of his name right now. He's moved to Jacksonville. I don't, but but I need to wreck your mind around that because I'm telling you he s southside looking in. He was a part of that. And uh, today was just an extension of who he is. He's not a friend to kill someone. And why he didn't kill you today it was maybe it's a public place, or maybe you get the right chord with it. Maybe you said exactly what he wanted to hear. I I was saying, you know, well, I think it's more it was where it was, and he doesn't wanna get caught and he wants to live. He wants to keep them what he's doing.

2:19:22 Well, that's why I don't thing he's get killing some long. Yeah, there's no ways to kill himself unless it gets cornered and realize it's not that it's over for me. Yeah, I don't think. But he didn't come there to kill himself this morning, and it wasn't gonna be kill myself and or kill you and kill myself, cause why would he bring the up poots to bury you and cover up his tracks. He was there to murder you. That's how horrible thing to think about. And that's the truth. H You need to I know and knowhow and what you're saying made his total suits Yeah, makes total sent keet throw off your morning, your owner. Well, then that makes me even more scared. It should be scared. I'm scared. I mean, there is no safe place for us. We're gonna stay together. That's why there's a copy in Johnny's house now used to stay might think that That's the only thing I gotta think of, is where would you go when he'll find you at work? It would be Johnny's And she's sure to meet us, And you have to decide how much you're gonna tell her. She really needs to know the whole thing, which I hated to do to her. I might kill her. I don't do it, but she needs to be aware if at some point not not everyone's gonna be around her back like we are, right, and who's just stopping from taking Johnny indirecting you?

2:20:40 And as far as the divorce goes, we have a deadline up ones day for stuff that he's not gonna do. And so. With that, I should just keep pursuing that. Just keeping why would you not? I I don't, I don't know, mad and then more stop adding on to it. But yeah, I mean, uh yeah, if. He's in jail, could different any bad text you? M M. I know Dianna's been I hope they do. I don't want to get the keys I hope. They got in the car and got whatever they needed them out of there. Dina said a thought, did he do this to put out the court dates so he could be declared and confident?

2:21:25 I don't do answer. You tell me what do you think you did? What do you do you think you do it to be? I think I mean as these court dates have loomed, that's when he's appeared. Normally, he just I guess, goes about doing his prostitute things. But he appears in my life when a court date loombs, like last time he shot up at work and this. Time way more extreme. He did this. I tie it to these court dates because it get as the court dates come, it gets closer. Closer, tivity officially over. That's what I tied it to. And I figured he might show up at where just cause I knew a courtinate was coming. But I would never never fetch you're this.

2:22:07 And I want to go ahead and tell the Leafers and the Martins and the Rays because they know everything they know about the prostitute. They know everything up to now, so I wanna update them and give a description of the truck. And just don't like that. The can you now wrap it around your head. What he was gonna do. To me? I guess, so so why, yes, you gotta understand I wouldn't like to, you know, I wouldn't you. Go about wrong to Then he didn't do it because there's no kill eatings. But he didn't do it because.

2:22:49 I told him that. I didn't tell him. We can move on from this. But basically I kind of just agree with whatever. Yeah, let me go out next. See you they want to do about being jump show and all that stuff. See if they Yeah, I don't wanna wait too long and not be able to do it. I mean, it's three fifteen. There's a timeframe and get it done no matter what. And then do you think they they were gonna go through the car and I guess if you grow print and stuff, I don't know know they were. They probably will swap for DNA if you touched the seatbelt, because this thing will be I wasn't there. Oh he he hasn't been in that car now, yeah, uh for almost four years, right, so the DNA doesn't last that long.

2:23:35 So yeah, they'll probably be able to swap. And that where the seatbelt goes in where the red thing is. I mean he held on to that for a long time, so that shit. But I did use it time buckle, you know, so I had Okay, that's right, I told him everything. If you will not locked the doors last night, I don't know, but when I started thinking about it, you know, he did have a set of keys to that car, so I always locked the car. So I'm probably hunt like ninety something that's tried. I did, but each I never thought to re keep the car. So there's a possibility what he want to do and what things done. About and you're back Hurst, Oh yeah, it would be better. It's a normal thing. Has he has he uh takes any more that?

2:24:19 Yeah, just the one. That is justin alright, let me go see what they're doing. Thy right, how you're doing? Yeah? How are you? We have never met none of his like the baby and you knowing do you know that name at all? Mm? Okay, I'm with the Florida Department was doing foresaw Mkay. I've literally known you and I've known your family for many, many, many many years. Okay. The reason I say that is in I've been looking into Mike's disappearance, Okay, literally dissected as much as I could about you, you know, where it was in your family Ryan, Mike and you know his family and the family when your you and Mike were together, Okay, worked with a lot of people, you know, trying to figure out the whole scenario of his disappearance and had to go back and literally reinvestigate a lot of things that was investigated before.

2:25:43 Okay. And again I had to go back to Yell's marriage and what were you doing during those times? Or you knew in job wise and Mike you know, and Mike's employer, the whole works, Okay, what y'all own? What you didn't known? And this has been an ongoing process for a long time. And I and you need to understand that. Kay. You know, I used to know the you know, the uh your your your gate code by heart and doing it in your neighborhood. I know your house very well. You know. I know when you took the carpet on. The whole works, you know, and then a whole lot I don't know. Okay, please understand that.

2:26:25 Talking about that hardwood floors. Er you name it, I know a good it, Okay, Okay, I I wanna talk to you about a couple of things and maybe you can fill in a couple of gaps for me? Can can you do that for me? Then? Okay? Obviously I I had raised it. I'm here. I I knew about what happened today, okay, And like the other officer said, you're gonna have to it's gonna have to sink in to today was gonna be your last day. Please let that sink in. I mean, he didn't have sh eats to sleep on, you know, tonight or the night before the night after, he had plastic, and he had some other object. And what was that other object he had? Could you tell? Can you describe it.

2:27:14 It was? I mean it was like maybe why it wasn't a hammer, but it was kind of that size and maybe wider. I don't I have no shovel. I know, it wasn't a show. I mean it was like a lot. I mean, it definitely wasn't a shovel, but it was about the side the length of like a hammer that it would but it seemed to be fatter the way that he grabbed it. But I haven't no, Well, you. Were going towards CBS. It's what I can understand. He wanted to tray around, go. The other way. He kept saying, go to the roundabout, and I think he was wanting me to go back, but I wasn't really listening. I was maybe, but I wasn't really listening. I was just trying to get to CBS. What do you think my experience had?

2:27:57 Oh, I I have no idea. Maybe he speculations on that on. Where he's buried, veriod. I mean, I believe. You don't really believe he he died it on the lake? I do? Why? I just I just always have that's what I believe, and I have from when he was saying round about I have. I don't know. I talked with the last two people, and I can't remember if he wanted me to turn. Left or right? No, no, no, no, that's something I'm talking about. Uh. Why do you think Mike perished in the lake? I just cause he didn't. He didn't die late Cemole, Okay, I don't.

2:28:39 That's what I've always believed. That's what I believe in. Why I've never been proven anything different? I don't, Well, is there been any proof he really if he would have perished in that lake, he would have been found. Mkay. Here's never been a person that has fallen over or whatever that they've been effects are from coming. That's literally it's it's it's some possibility that he'd done in that lake. I guess to that that's just what I believe. Really, Yeah, well, I mean you you knew all the information about you know, what was recovered. Out there and all that, right, my dad would keep me updated.

2:29:20 Yeah, yeah, you had this big monster search and none of that in the layer. It just appears, I mean that, you know that kind of lead investciators go in different directions than what they insally thought. Okay, uh, I mean I was even curious. I mean I I recovered the cargo I used to have it during that time. I got from a junk yard in Alabama, brought it back a care and toward a park. The little boat that Mike had, a. Little de new boat. I found the old red bought a sella, brought it back just I just wanted to be at a goud like that. You know, there's a whole lot of stuff you don't have a whole knew what we looked at, and we've we've certainly come to the conclusion that Mike did not again perish or die on Lake seminal. Okay, please understand that, you know, we've kind of tried to what's you know, what's been going on in y'all's lives again before Mike disappeared all the way till now. Okay, we knew about the divorced stuff, you know, we knew about people living in different places at the home works talked to Kathy. She proba didn't take that well, she may have yeah, yeah, okay, alright, And and you seem to say you have a clue that were happening to Mike?

2:30:40 Were you and were you? And I guess you Mike, Kathy and Brian y'all are pretty close before Mike disapeared, right, Yeah, yeah, how close were y'all? I mean I would say we talked pretty much every day. We were very close. Yeah, I'm still very close with Jathy. Yeah, I did that. I again, we researched, you know, trips y'all east to make Tormlando and some other stuff. Apparently you are really close, mkay, you don't want'll talk about. I don't we? Yeah, me and Kathy still, she's texting me right now. So we're still very close, mkay. If I say, we're totally aware of all the bid the videos. You probably know what I'm talking about. If you say what the videos, I would have to stay them.

2:31:22 Well, I mean that's not gonna happen. But you you're clueless. When I say videos, I don't. Yeah, you you Kathy and Bryan, I would have to stay him. Yeah, you're you have dog what I'm talking about? You say you didn't forgot to see it. Now I'm just I'm just starting to feel very uncomfortable, Okay, But. Well, I I'm I've got uncomfortable for a long time because we needed some things on this case, right, and we were hoping one day that either Brian or you maybe you could fill in some of the gaps there pulling the piece of a post, right. But I guess right now I will. I need to focus on this and what happened this morning, and I wanna get this restraining order done by five o'clock.

2:32:03 And I want, I mean, I want me and my daughter to be safe. And that's well, there's there's no doubt that Brian's gonna be located and put in jail, so I would imagine he's not going to immediately be banned out under the circumstances and the crimes that he has committed. Okay, I don't know. I don't know. I just want to get this restrained ord and so that I can have a little peace, yeah, for tonight with my daughter. That's that's one of them. Is Well if he is, if he is arrested, you know the next few hours, which I'm sure is gonna happen. You know, Leanna County is very good about finding people and kind of Oh that's gonna happen. When Brian is arrested, which will happen. He is going to probably provide another side of whatever happened today. You are this way?

2:32:49 Yeah, Yeah, I have no idea what he's going to say. Well, that's what people usually did. They they give a uh, they're side of something. Let's scare that. Yeah, I don't know. What. I don't know what he's gonna say. Have no idea. Yeah, what if he starts talking about the past, way in the past, and he. Might I I don't know, I have no idea what he's gonna say. Yeah, and what I do you no, what if he starts talking about what if he starts talking about those disappearance of of Mike. I hope he admits this morning. I hope he admits what he did if he talk if they ask him about Mike, I have no idea, and then we'll see.

2:33:36 Yeah, well, has Katy ever talked about Mike's disappearance or not Mike's but Bride's disappearance. Did they Mike disappeared? I don't. I don't remember, and I remember that I have to, I can. I can text her right now. I don't know. Yeah, Okay, I'll hear from you, mkay. You I mean you knew, I mean, Ryan just disappear. I don't I Kansy's ever talked about that. Shou. I have to talk with her. But again, I r I really, I want to focus on this and if you, I mean, well this is what you wanna talk about. Well this is that's the same today. You know, it's kind of a done deal. You know, we know what have but it's gonna be a verifar of the video and all that, whether whether Bride admits to what he did to you today. He I mean, he did it right, I mean, and once they arrest him, I'm sure they don't find some of the things that you talked about.

2:34:32 I hope that's that's kind of a bum deal, okay, but obviously thanks, and things have been building for a a long long time. We've been separated for a long time ago. But for me again, I want to follows. You're standing on her before three thirty, so I mean before five, So I don't know this three thirty right now. I just wanna make sure that I have time to do that. Now. Well, I know what tongue is, I know the other also talk to you a lot of different things I care about. Bust me can go hunger everything, Okay. I wish I could just get some feeling some of the pieces of the puzzle. I'd venture to get it from you, then from Brian, cause when he's a wrestlent I've talked time too.

2:35:15 That's fine. I don't wanna see what he says, conkay, he may see something you don't want to hear. I don't know. Well, I have no idea, you have no no clue, not a clue. I don't even always gon say about this morning. Well, uh, you know the f this morning's a done deal. Okay, you know we we know what happens. You told us, And again it's gonna be a pretty good video and I'm sure that they're gonna find us in the things that you talked about. So that's that's kind of that's solid, so to speak. Okay, I think it was my I phone we heard, and that's funny. Met your coin and just your wife.

2:35:58 I okay, sorry, they're right, But I guess what I'm saying is about the my situation that you wanna talk about. I don't. I don't wanna talk about this right now. Mm I would you talk about later? I I don't wanna talk about this right now. I wanna get this settled first. This is subtle. It's not subtled to me though I have not gone down. I have not father restrained the owner. And that's what is pressing on me so bad. So I understand that you wanna talk about this, but this is what I wanna do. This is what I has to be done. Yeah, you got you today, you got some time. Worms was done alright? Well you know why, Uh it's so important you talk to you. I like, I mean, this is I mean, this was your h this was your husband.

2:36:45 He's simply vanished. Hopefully he's so an interest in that. Well, again, this is my priority right now, and I'm just I'm not comfortable talking about this right now. This I've had an unbelievable day and let me, this is is just all too much right now. I just I really want to focus on it. It has it sunkn that you literally saved your. Own life today. But all I know is I was praying. He did the right thing coming here, you know that. I mean, we'll see. I don't things really seeing him. I consider what he had in the vacu your vehicle, you know that's a clue.

2:37:30 That's just it was the best I could And well you did, you did. You save your life. I just want that now. I just want my daughter to continue to say and that That's why I'm so worried about this. That's why I can't even focus on that, because I just all I'm focused on is us and getting through this night. When he's gonna find out that I told after I promised him open over and over that I wouldn't tell me one and when he finds. Out, well, when somebody does this to you, and and as a gun involved, they can't really expect you just to know that what. But I had set up where I went to Tony Wine and I would meet him. Later in the day. Well, yeah, I were saying every thing because literally at that point you had to say something again, had to keep saying this, but it's true to save your.

2:38:11 Life, right, and it worked and he, you know, I guess, agreed to that and then left, and then I was supposed to meet him and his dad about now today to talk about it. He does advise you be to do something very very horrible. Okay, yeah, I mean there's no angel whatever he did that, okay, yeah, and he's stuck in your vehicle and there he was. He didn' knock on your door saying let's talk about it. All right, look what he did, I mean, and I guess that that's just I still was kidding. Well, you're gonna have to believe that you're alive right now, all right?

2:38:53 I'm kind. Yeah, absolutely, and he's gonna be I should have some very very serious charms. Do you know the procedure as far as like when I file this, if he's already arrested, I mean, then he's just arrested, but then when he'll get out like tomorrow, right or I mean, I don't know how it worried. About bomb you're gonna put on so it depends on no. Yeah, but what he's out, he can just do whatever. Right, I mean, well, let's hope he doesn't do whatever. I hope he's finally sunk in. He's screwed up, and you're gonna go through the court stuff and hopefully that'll sink into that he's kind.

2:39:37 I'm just worried about that long period of time where I know, like if he gets arrested, it won't be a court date for a long time, and it's that time. I'm worried about. That's where he's out knows that I told, you. Can't be that stupid or to think that you're not gonna tell. I'm just I'm just worried about that time in between. And I'm worried about me and my daughter and where we're gonna live and how avery we. Say, I mean, I don't even have a dog. Yeah. Well, what what we have seen, We've we've seen a sight of like my life and Brian that we knew was there and it's surfaced again. Okay, cause again we've kind of tracked his history and we also know, you know, Mike vanishes so.

2:40:26 Well, I myself have never seen anything like what I saw this morning. Never well what about it? Like l what about the of this? It wasn't a person, but it was that was on a whole. This took it to a whole other that was nothing compared to this. But when he left up, when he got out of the. Truck, he was crying, I'm so certain to like that calm, not that person anymore. That's how I left him, and that's how I wanted to stay. And then me coming here and finding this in him finding out. That's the way he wanted to stay. You really think he would never explode like this again. I would have never thought he would have done this. So I don't have it, No, I have no. I mean, obviously he's capable of what he did today, cause he did it.

2:41:08 So do you think he's responsible for license EPARs? I do not, and I never have. I would have never married him if I thought that, I would've never wanted so bad to have children with him. I would've I mean, in my mind and in my heart. No. From David is my brother in law. He was just sitting here talking to me about trying to get me to understand that you know that my life was in danger today and then having me to look back on that whole situation now from a different point of view, and. I'm definitely gonna do that. But do I believe right here in this moment that he had anything to do with that? Absolutely not?

2:41:50 What did? Yeah? Does that mean that I'm not gonna. Process this and then go back to Of course I am, but I but I've got I've got processes first, and I know you understand that. Sure, well, process this place when you when you find time to come back, you need to process a whole lot about whatever happened, because in studying this whole situation, we knew that one day it would be a blow up. We predicted that. Tell it there. Well, I don't think it's finished yet as far as people talking about different.

2:42:30 Things, No, but I just mean between me and him this morning was a blow up. Yeah it was. And the y at the end, I'm selling a rock American. But I hope, hope it is sinking in how about it could have been? I think I'll take some time that I'm realizing. The jabs of what could have happened to you know, when you have care of that stuff and I have a gun in sleep with that or whatever, I already say something that you told me either the sheets were used, we used, we'd used for sleep or whatever. Nah, I don't think so you don't have plastic in quarter or there or.

2:43:16 Two was for And again I hope that, I hope that that pack still there. I hope they can the whoever or the police can pull it out and see exactly. You know what I'm saying, because I it was a it was a turn, you know, a couple of glimps of this, and that was it. But I I'm pretty sure I'm right, but I did I would like to know myself, did I see this right? Did I? You know what I mean? Like what was in there? I wanna I would like to know. Uh, we'll find him, just to confirm they when they find him, I'm sure that they'll eventually get to whatever there was. H I hope. So let's just nest down the road. I hope. So I just want everything to think in about I'm not to say enough concerned about as I am, but you're alive, right, I'm tall. I'm talking about the other right, cause a whole lot of people in some closure in that right we all think we've got a pretty idea of what happened, what the whole scenario was. Mkay, you need to done that, mkay.

2:44:17 So and I will. I'll go, I'll get through this and then rethink everything again. I've never seen anybody this way that he was this morning, and I've never definitely never seen. Him this morning, just all that. He was just going crazy. He was crazy. Well, i'm'na go out with find somebody to share theirselves to trade care of the others. That strain your orders. But okay, thank you, But I want, I wanna, I want, I Wan'm gonna leave on this note. I was hoping you could fill in some of the pieces of that puzzle. You haven't we arrest Brian he might.

2:44:57 Mkay, yeah, of the morning. Uh just think about what you said. All right, at least till I'll sleepy to find something to tick. Thank you. They were they able to get in the car, do

2:49:51 you know in the car? Yeah? That process? Okay, you talking a less earlier. Yeah, I'm anxious about I really want father streaming or whatever. Mkay, cause it's Friday and there's well they it's at the court house now and there's a ton of problem. He's in custody. Oh yeah, we having. It's a getting in junction. You'll get to the court house to or to the jail tomorrow morning at eight o'clock and you fill out the paperwork. Melissa's that she'll meet you, and oh, well, my my. Brother in law can go. She doesn't really have to. My brother in law's uplace, so he can go with the Okay, eight am at that jail?

2:50:32 Correct? Where is that right behind us? Oh? On a if you go down further on a half yard huh, you'll see the entry main interest to the jail. Okay, So I file the injunction there. Correct. You can fill out the paperwork and everything, cause they do first appearance over there and then that's at the time that the judge or you will will meet you. Okay, okay, okay, alright, ohky, this is Melissa's information and that the information she left for you is my Do. I need to tell her that she doesn't need to come in. Eight or oh? Okay? If you decide you wanna all her for her cell phone numbers on the back and if you're needing. M as far as the injunction goes, that you explain to you what if you do?

2:51:16 Kay, You'll basically write a little story about what took place and why you need an injunction. He'll be served unless he depending on what the bond is, he he'll probably be served out of the jail. They don't know abouy it before he gets out, probably with but you'll fill out an affidavit of why you need it and the little story about what happened today or anything else that you wanna put in there for the past or in the past four years. The judge review that, they'll be your hearing within fifteen days. First you'll get a temporary injunction. They'll be hearing within fifteen days, which would be decided to say his side of the story, and the judge will decide at that time whether to continue.

2:51:58 The injunction or not. Okay, okay, contribute all that stuff. Okay, do you have any questions for us at this time? Can you tell me? Did was he at work? Did you find him at work? Or can't tell him? They leete they find him in the parking. Lot at work. Okay, okay, So they arrested him and charged him with what. Well, right now, I think I's doe for a few things as far as discus, as far as charges come out, I can call. You unless you if you do. But uh, well, we're gonna con complete the investigation and see what all the charges we have cause we do have to there's no we don't believe there's more. Want story to everything and with uh but based on what you described, we've got I saw from the bar and bost In prisons.

2:52:45 Okay, it's. You eat this stuff about because he is actively using prostitutes and up and we have text messages and stuff from his own phone where it's like proof. Do you need any of that or that's not important? No, you know at this point the as far as all the other stuff, uh, where you'd be a good thing to go through with your whatever you're going through with the earrings, the court and everything. Mkay. That's more so for that type of stuff and to get in with him being so if he got arrested and went to. Jail, to the jail. No, he's not in jail yet. Oh, well did they arrest him or what what did they do in the parking lot? Right? H h they bought him back here he's he's in this building and then what will happen. We're gonna interview him based on everything that took place, kay, and then we'll go forward there with the investigation.

2:53:35 Like you said, we can call you and let you do the outcome cause we're also uh still looking for the stuff he described that. Came out to you, mkay when he So he's here in the building and y'all talk to him, But then will he just leave? Now he'll be going next door more than much. He'll be going to the jail, and then I'll be there at a to turn in big Basically it's paperwork right that I'll be doing laurow at eight. Yeah, you'll fill it out and the judge we're viewing everything at tomorrow. Okay, Well, I are you gonna shop with him? Are you gonna be one of the ones to review him? Oh? I just I mean I hope he I hope he tells the truth. But I mean, if he doesn't, I've told everything that not actually everything that happened exactly how it happened.

2:54:15 I mean, the only proof I guess. Would be that CDs camera, you know, other than he said she said, And then hopefully they could find out that's pack with all that stuff, isn't it? That's what her before? But I didn't every single thing I said was true and it was not excaggerated, and we'll just see what he says. Mkay. Why I don't let you remember that we're graduated together. What's your name, Brian Bishop? Oh my god? You said so there's stuff that they're talking to you. About about Mike. Really you think so? I mean, I mean after talking with do you know David McCraney, he wasn't here. He's my bird grandma. Yeah. He gave me a lot to think about it. It's just overwhelming, though, I tell you, it's just this this morning, this person I've never seen him before, and to have to come to terms with what could have happened this morning, I just like I I can't even process that verbally yet, not much less inside. And then to go back and think about all those times and all that you know that stuff. Yes, I'm going to. I have to. I mean I have to because I saw someone that I've never seen before and.

2:55:25 It's been not displayed to you for all this time, and there's no telling them what will happen next time because they lived as a uh coore order. For uh for. Once it gets boy'll do no contact order still say get the injunction. Okay, cause that covers both similar but the one, if it continues, it can build me up to a fellow. But uh, the like I said, we can call you un lets you know what's going on. But the chorias are right. Everything else the information pack has different stuff if you have if uh, but as far as the other goes you, whatever happened to Mike, you don't want that saying thing to happen.

2:56:14 Oh right, I mean I felt so impression it this morning. Oh we've known each other, we had seen each other, We known each other and wan talk stuff you describe he was getting out of the back did. Not sound good at all at all. No, that and I never it never dawned on me until David started saying why would he? You know, why would and it just it all everything David said to make perfect sense. And that's very scary. Yes. Can I ask you this though? Can you said, he's here, he's gonna be interviewing stuff, so for sure he'll go over to the jail and spend the night there or not for sure? Like you just don't know. I mean I just kind of wonder where it's gonna because give me. That is that's my masking everything on our investigation morning morning, cause we did have we you have a deputy at CBS, so okay, one of the detectives went there episode. We're we're taking multiple steps to do.

2:57:06 The charge, okay, And I mean I'm gonna I know David hurt his family. I'll let us stay with him, you know, this weekend. I can't live with him forever, but I just I have to get to a point. Where means, if my daughter we feel safe and I do not feel safe. Well, if if at all you knew something about Mike with him and that information was able to come out and he was charged with's a he. Wouldn't for getting up, then me and David already discussed that he has threatened suicide so many different times. I don't think people that threaten suicide fault at thri In other words, I don't think he's gonna commit suicide.

2:57:46 A lot of times it is a threat. Sometimes, Uh, people that are threaten it for years WI end up doing it out for it. So I I mean, I didn't even know coming here was the right thing to do, that thing. To do, I didn't. I mean, I just feel like it if you didn't report this to us today and the same exact thing happened tonight or. Tomorrow, right, we wouldn't you had any idea of what took place right this morning? Right right? And yes, absolutely, no two ways about it. And if. You hadn't, there's no tone what I mean he does in your vehicle? How scared. I'll begin with it.

2:58:29 But now like that visual, I mean it, just like you can trying to think about Mike right now, I just can't because all I can see in the rear view mirror is that image of I mean, it was terrifying. I'm sure I cannot believe I didn't write the car. I mean I can't. I won't make a sticky road, you know, the little in the ditches and how much so I can't believe I didn't write the car. I've never been so scared in mind. And I can tell you from doing this pretty much regratuated and don't get any better. So they come in here. What's the right units? Absolutely whenever the wad to troups some things with with the mester about lots of different things.

2:59:12 She don't wanna go into a relationship or get married because somebody's already beat them. That's like throwing a frog in hot water. It's gonna jump out, right, So you get in liqui warm water and he gets turned up. They don't never go about and that. On ends up burning you because you don't realize how it's happening so quick, whatever the time frame it takes to do mm. So, the best I can do for my safety and my daughters is to file this thing in the morning at AID, correct. I mean, I'll hear it from you guys, I guess, and then stay with my brother one his wife it's Dethorah Deborah Maryland. Stay with them and then what I mean, that's what I'm saying, Like I go to work my day as they start school.

2:59:56 It's just it's very scary and we don't know. I'm guns, we don't do even have a dog. Like you're not a security system. One thing you consider. Now they you're talking earlier about having to change the locks and lunch and everything else. Security system would be Dotte. No, I'll definitely do. That so much if you yeah, as far as anything else, if you hear something suspicious outside, see something suspicious, oh, I'm in. Atall neighbors too, cause. That we'll respond that's while we responded to prowers it was a raccoon.

3:00:41 Or if we'll respond, can y'all it's. A gated community, Can y'all get in? Like can you get in without knowing the gate code? Or it's called Mediatt Plantation off the make Asiki Road, you can get in? I could. I just want to make sure I could. Well, I mean, I don't know how, don't know what's gona happening. Because if you guys talk to him at w what at whatever point he gets to walk out of the jail, that's when I mean I need to know because that's when I need to be on high I hurt. You know what I'm saying, Like, that's I need to know that. And I don't know that I'm gonna know where that. Package you give you. I think there's a part of vine in there. That's what explains body ah, a part of a uh. Yeah, which is uh yeah, and it tell you kind of do stuff to be notified. Oh okay, okay, oh good alright, Well then I'll do that for sure because at that point, whene where that time comes, that's.

3:01:28 When it's gonna be the matters at me. You know what I'm saying, cause I promised him I wouldn't do this. That's one of the reasons I got out. Now, Like I said, if he had something to do with the other. Which obviously there's obviously that man. Think so. So I can't remember his name? Oh yeah, yeah, I know, but I just think you help. Feels a bit long day. But if him going out on these charges and yeah, I compared to that in the charges a big difference, huge difference, that would be a no bond. I understand.

3:02:09 Okay, al right, I appreciate it. Okay, but you but you won't be here to see him tonight. You won't that other people will bring him. Oh I've already seen him. Oh you have just in passing. Oh but okay, cause I'm seem to say, why is it easier? Okay, so say cause you told me what he's saying. Okay, but yeah, I mean again, I hope that he tells the truth, but I don't know. I have no idea what he's in saying. Good, but I have told the truth and that's all I can do. Right, that's it. And pray Okay, definitely, Now are they done? What's my car? And they needed to do stuff with my mar done. Was that, I think, walk you down through it okay,