May 5, 2025

053 - Animal Attack with Eric S Brown

053 - Animal Attack with Eric S Brown
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Season 2

Eric S. Brown and I discuss many animal attack horror books while also defining what the genre entails. We also talk about a book that he and I are writing together. 

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WEBVTT

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You're listening to the Weird Reader podcast, an extension of

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Jason's Weird Reads found on YouTube.

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Welcome, Hello, and welcome.

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To episode fifty three of the Weird Reads Podcast.

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Today, I have a special guest. I've had him on.

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It was fairly recently. I thought it was like a

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year ago, but apparently it was only about six months ago.

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Eric S.

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Brown joins me, and we're going to discuss animal attack

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horror books.

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This is a.

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Passion of Eric's and I was more than happy to

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have them come on and discuss these books with me.

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Eric S.

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Brown is he an American novelist known for writing science

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fiction and horror novels. He lives in North Carolina and

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he has written nearly, if not one hundred and twenty novels.

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Eric is a writing machine, and.

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I'm happy to say that I'm currently writing a book

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with him right now, and it's we're at the.

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Halfway point and it is fun.

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We talk about that a little bit in this episode,

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and we also talk about a lot of different books.

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I am not quite as versed on animal attack horror

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books as he is, but he educates me and I

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had a lot of fun talking with him, so without

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further ado, here we go. Here's my conversation with Eric

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about animal attack books.

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Hello, welcome back to Weird Reads. Today.

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I am joined by my friend Eric S. Brown, and

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today we are going to be talking about animal attack books.

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Now, this is a before actually, before we get into that.

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Can you introduce yourself quickly?

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Eric? Sure? I'm Eric CAS Brown. I'm a writer. I've

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been writing a long time. I'm mostly known for Bigfoot

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books and Bigfoot movie related stuff, but I'd write a

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little bit of everything here and there. That's pretty much.

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Me and animal attack books are They're pretty much a

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passion of yours, aren't they.

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Oh yeah, yeah. I mean I've always loved them growing up.

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But in twenty twenty three or maybe no early twenty

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twenty four, I read Paperbacks from Hell by Grady Hendrix

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and it just kind of rekindled it all for me.

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So I've been on like an animal attack reading bench

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for the last year. And actually, after reading all those books,

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I wrote my own canine attack book, Snarl, that's out

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now from Evil Cookie Publishing, and it's kind of my

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take on the dog subgenre of the animal attack subgenre.

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It's very much like Kujo meets twenty eight days later.

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Yeah, that was a fun book to read. Well, we'll

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talk about it later. That book is that book goes.

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There's one scene in there that will live rent free

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in my in my mind, it involves test in test tns.

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It's going to be in my mind for the rest

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of my life.

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Well, I don't know whether to say I'm sorry or

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thank you.

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But both both are appreciated.

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Yeah, it was an awesome book though. It's really fun.

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So how has your year been since we last talked.

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We talked about a year ago.

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Well, always busy, always busy collecting paper. Vintage horor paperbacks

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has definitely completely replaced collecting comic books in my life.

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I was a comic elector for over forty years. Now

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I just buy the occasional omnibus to read. So and

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now my living room has been taken over by horror

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paperbacks from hell. So you can't tell that from looking

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behind me. Those are still my Marvel omnibuses and Balsargalatric

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and rids Onia stuff. But trust me, the other side

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of living room looks like Grady Hendrix vomited all over

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the place, you know.

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Yeah, the comics way to put that.

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Grady Hendrix. Sorry.

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Do the comics take up a lot of space too?

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I have a second house and another town for the comics.

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Oh wow, Yeah, all the comics were here, we would

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not be able to function, So.

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That's a lot. Yeah too.

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So you've released a few new books since then, including Snarl.

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What are some of the other books that you've released.

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I've done two more big Foot books for Severn Press,

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Sasquatch Nightmare, which is kind of like night Mare on

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Elm Street meets Bigfoot War and The Sasquatch Murders, which

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is kind of a throwback to my book Manhunt. It's

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got the very serial killer versus sasquatch vibe going on,

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with a little bit of I hate the set jk.

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Rowlings Gilbriith books with the cuckoos calling. But I was

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going for that kind of vibe with one of the

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detectives because Cormeran strikes a great character. Yeah. But the

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book does focus primarily on the serial killer and the sasquatch,

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just like Manhunt.

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Dude, awesome.

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Now, before we begin, we go into the animal tack

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thing here, I get, well, we already announced it on Facebook.

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I thought we'd announced it here as well. But you

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and I are currently writing a book together. I think

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we're at the halfway mark right now.

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We are at the halfway point. Yeah, hopefully virtual high five. Yes, indeed,

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and hopefully we will fly through the rest of that

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book and it will be uh hopefully this summer. Who

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knows this the summer this fall from Evil Cookie.

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Pan Well, I wanted to thank you too for willing

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to bring me a board or on board.

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It's been a lot of so far my pleasure. I

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mean years ago, when I edited an anthology based on

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the Chud movie, you had one of the best stories

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in the book, I mean so and we became kind

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of Internet friends. So it was just a logical stept

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to say, hey, Jason, would you like to do this

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since we both like that genre.

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So thank thank you. It's it's been an awesome ride

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so far.

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Uh so animal attacks now, I have to admit I

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have read my fair share of animal attacks, but nowhere

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near where you have. I love creature features too, But

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you know, if you look at my because later on

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we're going to be talking about our honorable mentions in

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our top threes, you're going to notice that a lot

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of mine are like the mythological, mythological type creatures, not

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necessarily dogs or cats Dutch. But uh, but you know, uh,

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I admire your knowledge of animal attack books and uh

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and and I know that you've been wanting to do this,

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so so let's let's get into it.

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So what what the fine? What the fine? An animal

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attack noble? For you?

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Is it just limited to animals? Or can we add

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as I said just now, mythological creatures, creatures that are

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possibly real maybe not, you know what I mean.

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To me, I would go with just animals, plants, and insects.

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Those would be the three that constitute an animal attack.

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There can be a supernatural element in the book, but

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most of the time it's ecohara. It's some kind of

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mutation or toxic waste kind of thing, or some kind

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of disease or virus that's turned the animals against humanity,

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or just nature taking vengeance on us from destroying the planet.

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That that's the core of an animal attack book. However,

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there are very realistic ones that don't fall into that,

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like Jaws. Jaws is just a big, great white being

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itself and killing.

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Here's like I remember, I don't know if it's true

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or not. It might be it's the same with bears,

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they say once. I don't know if it's the same

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with sharks though, because sharks can't actually eat us. They

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can kill us, of course, and they can try to

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eat us, but they end up not eating us. But bears,

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they say, you know, once they get like the taste

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for human flesh, they crave it. Like do you believe

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in that? Like is that true or is it? Do

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you think maybe a myth myth on it?

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Well, you know, I can't, I would say with some animals, certainly.

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I just finished reading Killer by Peter Tonkin and Kill.

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The main character in it is a military trained killer well,

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and it definitely acquires the taste for human flesh, because

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I mean, that's just the premise of the book. It's

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trained by humans and one day it accidentally kills an

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emerald who came to check out the proper by the place,

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and it gets the taste of human flesh from him,

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and then they shoot it and face it runs all

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so it's got like this mixed mingling of oh gosh,

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humans hurt me with oh gosh, humans taste good, and

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it just it's a wild ride. I mean, Peter talking

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is probably famous for saying. Yeah. At the time Joles

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came out, he was he was already a writer and

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one of his friends said, hey, can you do better

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than Jiles? And he said, no, but I can do bigger.

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I can totally relate to that in my career. You know,

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I'm not always the better, but I strive for the bigger. Yeah.

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The Killer is one heck for read, and it's one

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of only two killer whale books that have ever been

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done in the genre to my knowledge. There's killer repeater

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talking in Orca, which there's a movie, and those are

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not the only killer whale books.

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And my wife's mom gave went into labor while watching

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the movie version of Orca.

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Oh wow, that that must have been an experience.

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Yeah, and she says that's probably why she's afraid of

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horror movies.

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Have you seen that movie?

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Or I have seen Orca, but it's been a very

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long time.

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Yeah. Yeah. So animals, why why do they attack? Is

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it just the excuse me here, is it just the

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instinctual fear of being eaten alive? Or is there something

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else to the effectiveness of animal attack horror? Why is

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it so scary?

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I think because realistically, it could happen. I mean, we

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could screw up the planet enough to the point where

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Mother Nature turns on us and just unleashes some horrible

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virus or you know, some kind of attack, and then

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you've got all the bioengineering going on today and the

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chemicals and the pollutants. I mean, it's a very realistic

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trope in that sense. So I think it's scary because

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it could be real. And especially in the case of

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animals like dogs and housecats. You know, there's this whole

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companionship friendship thing that gets turned completely on its head.

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Kujo is a great example of that. I know you're

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a fan of Kujo because Youkujo is this lovable big

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dog who would never hurt anyone, and through no fault

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of his own, he gets rabies and then he becomes

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like this vicious kill and it turns everything on its head. Yeah.

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Yeah, it's funny you bring that up because one of

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my questions here is about Disney and how Disney has

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made animals, including the ones that will kill us with

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no question ask, they've made them.

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Into these furry, companionable creatures. Do you think do you think?

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And you know you watch TikTok.

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Videos and whatnot, and maybe Facebook videos and whatnot, people

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befriending bears. Do you think this has desensitized us to

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the real threat of animals?

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Oh? Absolutely. I think in our modern culture we have,

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we're so comfortable, especially in America, you know, and probably

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Canada too. I'm assuming, yeah, that we're just cell phones

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and laptops and comfort and grocery stores, and we forget

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all about why it's like to be out there in

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the wild. So when we see a wild animal, our

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first instinct, MA, that'd be oh, that's cute, and then

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we go up and it rips its face, It rips

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our face off, you. I mean, because no matter how

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much we humanize them in our own brains, animals are

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still animals, and they're going to be driven by their

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own based instincts. And sometimes they instincts is hey I'm

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bigger than you and I'm going to eat you, or hey,

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you've intruded up on my territory and you're not supposed

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to be here, and they're not very kind about it.

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Yeah, that's absolutely true.

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I mean, you see people you see the dark side

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of that too. You see videos where people like they

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see a moose which you don't want to approach, or

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a bear and they're like, oh, I want to get

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a selfie with this animal, and they approach it and

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then the animal attacks and they're.

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00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:39.279
Like, why did it attack mes?

233
00:12:40.799 --> 00:12:43.240
Oh? Yeah, for sure. I have a book here that

234
00:12:43.240 --> 00:12:46.200
I had not planned on showing that I'm actually opening

235
00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:48.840
right now because it's wrapped up in bubble wrap, which

236
00:12:48.919 --> 00:12:52.519
is a perfect example of what we're talking about, because

237
00:12:52.559 --> 00:12:55.279
it can get very crazy in the animal attack on it.

238
00:12:56.000 --> 00:13:00.679
But this book right here, I think it's pronounced Malsam,

239
00:13:01.559 --> 00:13:05.120
is about a killer deer. Of all things. There's actually

240
00:13:05.159 --> 00:13:11.879
a deer going around, and it's it's one that's not ecohara.

241
00:13:12.080 --> 00:13:15.240
It is a Native American shaman who has this vengeance

242
00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:17.519
thing and he takes over the deer and possesses it

243
00:13:17.840 --> 00:13:19.440
and starts killing people with a deer.

244
00:13:19.799 --> 00:13:26.720
That's awesome out there, I think, honestly, we come from

245
00:13:26.799 --> 00:13:28.440
a place where we knew better.

246
00:13:31.159 --> 00:13:31.360
Oh.

247
00:13:31.399 --> 00:13:36.240
Absolutely, animals attack for different reasons, right like they're hungry,

248
00:13:36.320 --> 00:13:38.679
or they're they're defending their babies, or they're sick. But

249
00:13:39.080 --> 00:13:41.200
a lot of people don't realize that even the small,

250
00:13:41.519 --> 00:13:43.679
cute ones will attack. I have a kind of a

251
00:13:43.720 --> 00:13:46.600
funny story about a next girlfriend I was with. She

252
00:13:46.759 --> 00:13:50.200
was the type of woman who anytime she saw an

253
00:13:50.240 --> 00:13:52.080
animal on the side of the road, she'd make me

254
00:13:52.080 --> 00:13:54.000
stop the car so we could chase it off the road,

255
00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:59.159
which is honorable. But this one time, there's two beavers

256
00:13:59.559 --> 00:14:02.440
across the road. I'm assuming it was the mama and

257
00:14:02.480 --> 00:14:03.000
the papa.

258
00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:06.960
Yeah, they could be kind of vicious too, They can be,

259
00:14:06.960 --> 00:14:09.320
because we pulled over and she gets out of the

260
00:14:09.320 --> 00:14:11.519
car and she stomping her foot and she's like kissing

261
00:14:11.559 --> 00:14:14.399
at them and shoeing them with her arms, and they

262
00:14:14.440 --> 00:14:16.840
both tilted their heads at the same time and turned

263
00:14:16.840 --> 00:14:17.840
around and looked at us.

264
00:14:17.879 --> 00:14:20.360
And right then I knew something was wrong. Right, they

265
00:14:20.360 --> 00:14:23.559
didn't run right away, they were going into attack mode, certainly.

266
00:14:24.120 --> 00:14:28.200
They turned around and they charged at us, making these

267
00:14:28.240 --> 00:14:32.440
weird sounds, and I had to She panicked and tripped

268
00:14:32.440 --> 00:14:35.919
over the curb, and so she's like on the ground, squirming.

269
00:14:35.960 --> 00:14:38.679
So I had to grab her by the coat and

270
00:14:38.720 --> 00:14:43.279
she was wearing and drag her to the the car

271
00:14:43.360 --> 00:14:45.840
where she got in. And then by that time though,

272
00:14:45.879 --> 00:14:48.840
they were like there, right, And so I jumped over

273
00:14:48.960 --> 00:14:51.919
the trunk of the car like slid across it. It's

274
00:14:51.960 --> 00:14:55.919
like an action movie almost, right, Yeah. Yeah, and then

275
00:14:56.000 --> 00:14:57.480
I landed on the other side, and.

276
00:14:57.919 --> 00:15:00.720
Talking about sliding from over a car that it comes

277
00:15:00.720 --> 00:15:01.919
into my mind. Yeah.

278
00:15:01.720 --> 00:15:03.639
Yeah, I landed on the other side, jumped in the

279
00:15:04.240 --> 00:15:05.600
driver's side, and took off.

280
00:15:05.759 --> 00:15:10.120
But that was like a crazy, crazy period. Yeah.

281
00:15:10.679 --> 00:15:12.279
I have no idea what they would have done had

282
00:15:12.279 --> 00:15:14.840
they caught us, but I'm assuming that they had babies

283
00:15:14.879 --> 00:15:17.639
nearby and they weren't thinking of themselves.

284
00:15:17.639 --> 00:15:19.559
They were probably thinking of their they're young.

285
00:15:22.480 --> 00:15:24.679
But you know, we've also learned about animals and that

286
00:15:24.799 --> 00:15:29.000
that's kind of got lost, I think in the whole

287
00:15:29.039 --> 00:15:33.879
Disney and TikTok age. But we've learned a lot about

288
00:15:33.919 --> 00:15:36.720
animals and why they attack. They're not just evil. They're

289
00:15:36.759 --> 00:15:40.080
doing what they do. They're hungry, they're they're sick, or

290
00:15:40.120 --> 00:15:44.440
they're or they're protecting their babies. And I think people, yeah,

291
00:15:44.519 --> 00:15:47.039
or their territory. Yeah, it's their area. When you go

292
00:15:47.080 --> 00:15:50.360
into the woods, you're entering their territory. It's important to

293
00:15:50.399 --> 00:15:53.120
remember that. And I just kind of wanted to stress

294
00:15:53.159 --> 00:15:54.639
that because there's a lot of people out there. I

295
00:15:54.639 --> 00:15:56.919
think they might be leaving in a little bit of

296
00:15:56.960 --> 00:15:59.360
a you know, the world of fantasy.

297
00:16:00.080 --> 00:16:02.799
And now I want to Oh, you're going to say

298
00:16:02.840 --> 00:16:03.679
something I.

299
00:16:03.639 --> 00:16:05.679
Was gonna say. You get more hate mail for killing

300
00:16:05.720 --> 00:16:09.120
animal characters than you do forget for killing children, because

301
00:16:09.120 --> 00:16:11.840
we have humanized our pets so much, and there's nothing

302
00:16:11.879 --> 00:16:14.240
wrong with that. I have a dog that I completely adore.

303
00:16:14.639 --> 00:16:17.120
You know, I have a cat too, and we kind

304
00:16:17.159 --> 00:16:22.200
of get along. But you know, we're just inclined to

305
00:16:22.240 --> 00:16:24.840
think that way in terms of modern culture.

306
00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:27.960
Mm hmm. With the cat.

307
00:16:28.159 --> 00:16:30.720
You know, cats are funny creatures, like some of them

308
00:16:30.720 --> 00:16:33.279
are just violent and vile little creatures.

309
00:16:33.399 --> 00:16:36.039
That is true. I had a big main coon when

310
00:16:36.080 --> 00:16:38.399
when my wife and I first got married, named Howard

311
00:16:38.440 --> 00:16:41.919
after Howard Lovecraft. I love that cat to death. But

312
00:16:41.960 --> 00:16:43.960
the cat I have right now, her name is Blackie,

313
00:16:43.960 --> 00:16:46.200
and she is a demon. All she does is terrorize

314
00:16:46.200 --> 00:16:49.720
the dog and myself. I think that's her favorite pastime.

315
00:16:50.200 --> 00:16:51.759
She probably enjoys herself. Yeah.

316
00:16:52.000 --> 00:16:59.440
Oh yeah, yeah, so uh animal attacks uh in a

317
00:16:59.519 --> 00:16:59.960
big sin.

318
00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:02.200
Now you're kind of chiding me.

319
00:17:02.320 --> 00:17:06.359
You're like, oh, oh yeah, you have who have not

320
00:17:06.480 --> 00:17:07.359
read these books?

321
00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:11.039
But you know, honestly, most animal attack books do take

322
00:17:11.079 --> 00:17:14.680
place in that is true in the woods or in

323
00:17:14.799 --> 00:17:19.279
you know, like remote areas, but there's not as many

324
00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:22.240
big city attack.

325
00:17:22.079 --> 00:17:24.000
There's not as many, but there's still more than you

326
00:17:24.079 --> 00:17:26.599
might think there would be. As a kid, I read

327
00:17:26.640 --> 00:17:28.920
this one right here now with the toy Dragons. It's

328
00:17:28.960 --> 00:17:34.279
about albino cabans, little tiny cabans who just swarm and

329
00:17:34.400 --> 00:17:37.559
hundreds of thousands of numbers eating human flesh and the

330
00:17:37.559 --> 00:17:40.559
sewers of this giant city. I mean, I think it's

331
00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:42.960
New York. I can't remember where it's actually set, but

332
00:17:43.119 --> 00:17:45.279
I mean it is great. And then he got classic

333
00:17:45.319 --> 00:17:49.119
Maybes like Alligator, same trope, same animal there. And then

334
00:17:49.160 --> 00:17:53.400
of course you have British writer James Herbert. I think

335
00:17:53.640 --> 00:17:57.279
The Rats is set right outside of London or in London. Yeah,

336
00:17:57.279 --> 00:18:02.480
and then not layer them one second, John Howkin, he

337
00:18:02.599 --> 00:18:06.720
wrote four animal attack books. Almost all of his are

338
00:18:06.759 --> 00:18:10.640
set in urban settings. Like Bloodworm. Here London becomes like

339
00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:14.440
this post apocalyptic wasteland of biker games and people finding

340
00:18:14.480 --> 00:18:18.359
to stay alive because these giant blood worms and this

341
00:18:18.519 --> 00:18:22.000
other symbiotic insect with him just destroyed the city. But

342
00:18:22.200 --> 00:18:24.279
I mean there's a lot of urban stuff out there.

343
00:18:24.279 --> 00:18:26.400
It's just not as prevalent as you said.

344
00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:30.119
Yeah, that blood Worm book. Do you know if that's

345
00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:31.240
still in print at all?

346
00:18:31.599 --> 00:18:32.480
Either?

347
00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:36.200
I think typical it is not in print unless you're

348
00:18:36.200 --> 00:18:38.039
in the UK. I'm not sure if it's some print

349
00:18:38.039 --> 00:18:42.319
over there in the States. Here in America, copies probably

350
00:18:42.359 --> 00:18:45.400
gonna run you around seventy five bucks if you find one, wow,

351
00:18:45.720 --> 00:18:47.559
unless you have luckily find it in the wild. And

352
00:18:47.640 --> 00:18:48.839
he used bookstore or something.

353
00:18:49.319 --> 00:18:53.759
Act. She sent me three recommendations for that, I believe,

354
00:18:54.119 --> 00:18:56.559
and two of them I was able to find that

355
00:18:56.640 --> 00:18:58.960
I can read for free on my Cobo because I'm

356
00:18:59.000 --> 00:19:00.559
part of like the Cobo book Club.

357
00:19:01.200 --> 00:19:03.319
Uh, and they were both on there and they were free.

358
00:19:03.319 --> 00:19:06.799
But the other one, the Dragon one, that one is

359
00:19:06.880 --> 00:19:09.960
similar to the blood Worm. You can't find it unless

360
00:19:10.000 --> 00:19:12.640
you're willing to pay steep money. It's not available in

361
00:19:12.720 --> 00:19:13.759
ebook or anything.

362
00:19:14.440 --> 00:19:16.160
Well, I took all my money that was spending on

363
00:19:16.200 --> 00:19:19.079
comics and putting the vintage paperbacks. And that's my defense

364
00:19:19.200 --> 00:19:24.119
right there. That reminded me though I also mentioned Vespers.

365
00:19:24.559 --> 00:19:28.079
Vespers has a really really terrible movie called Bats that

366
00:19:28.200 --> 00:19:32.680
was based on interesting. Yeah, but the book is amazing.

367
00:19:32.880 --> 00:19:35.920
I mean it and it ends the big climactic scenes

368
00:19:35.960 --> 00:19:38.599
in New York with two giant bats bringing just this

369
00:19:38.839 --> 00:19:42.000
legion of bats into New York, and the climactic battle

370
00:19:42.039 --> 00:19:44.839
takes place inside of the Statue of Liberty. So I

371
00:19:44.839 --> 00:19:48.880
mean it's some must read for a Yeah, I got

372
00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:50.799
that in one of those cases that proves the book

373
00:19:50.839 --> 00:19:51.799
is better than the movie.

374
00:19:52.319 --> 00:19:54.480
Yeah, I got that one for free on my Cobo

375
00:19:54.559 --> 00:19:55.359
with that book club.

376
00:19:57.359 --> 00:19:58.160
And the other one too.

377
00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:01.279
I can't remember exactly what it was, but that one

378
00:20:01.319 --> 00:20:03.759
actually had an audiobook to it as well, so I

379
00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:05.920
downloaded both the book and the audiobook.

380
00:20:06.160 --> 00:20:09.559
Well, Domain by James Herbert is another one. I may

381
00:20:09.599 --> 00:20:12.839
mentioned it. It's post apocalyptic, though it takes place. It's

382
00:20:12.880 --> 00:20:15.240
the third book in the Rats trilogy, so it's back

383
00:20:15.279 --> 00:20:18.079
in London, but it's after a nucular war, so you

384
00:20:18.200 --> 00:20:21.160
have the Rats just coming out and fully taking over.

385
00:20:21.559 --> 00:20:25.599
And there's a graphic novel called The City that comes

386
00:20:25.680 --> 00:20:31.200
right after Domain. The novel the trilogies on novels, but

387
00:20:31.400 --> 00:20:34.319
after that there's a Part four that's a graphic novel.

388
00:20:34.880 --> 00:20:38.160
Honestly, I think it's a fun idea to have animal attack,

389
00:20:38.319 --> 00:20:41.960
especially if it's like giant mutated animals. Oh yeah, attacking

390
00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:44.119
big cities because I think.

391
00:20:44.200 --> 00:20:47.640
Most people would feel safe because of the numbers of

392
00:20:47.680 --> 00:20:49.079
people in the city.

393
00:20:49.200 --> 00:20:52.160
So if animals were to attack, you know, most people

394
00:20:52.200 --> 00:20:55.000
would be like, you know, we'll get the military on

395
00:20:55.039 --> 00:20:57.039
it or whatever, and it'll be fine. But what if,

396
00:20:57.720 --> 00:21:00.279
you know, you could obviously turn it around, make it

397
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:01.400
so it's not fine.

398
00:21:01.160 --> 00:21:04.319
Right, and not even the military is not always enough.

399
00:21:04.359 --> 00:21:07.200
I mean, if you've ever heard of guyans Guyan Smith,

400
00:21:07.240 --> 00:21:09.440
he wrote a series of books called it Attack of

401
00:21:09.480 --> 00:21:14.000
the Crabs. Yeah, yeah, those crabs. The military ain't stopping them.

402
00:21:14.680 --> 00:21:15.559
They just bounce off.

403
00:21:15.640 --> 00:21:19.160
Yeah, that's right. Yeah, the bullets bounce off.

404
00:21:19.240 --> 00:21:19.720
Yeah.

405
00:21:19.880 --> 00:21:25.119
Now, speaking of insects, you mentioned insects as part of your.

406
00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:29.839
Oh yeah, you're there's free lante of great insect books

407
00:21:29.839 --> 00:21:35.279
out there. One of my favorites is Blowfly by David Lohman.

408
00:21:35.599 --> 00:21:39.720
That it is a great insect attack book, with flies

409
00:21:39.799 --> 00:21:42.799
laying their eggs in humans and just using us as

410
00:21:42.839 --> 00:21:47.400
breeding grounds. And it's pretty deep in terms of the gore,

411
00:21:47.640 --> 00:21:52.119
not deep philosophically. Most animal attack books you go into

412
00:21:52.160 --> 00:21:54.839
them understanding they're going to be a fun, pulpy read. Yeah,

413
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:58.359
there's another one called killer Flies. It's similar to Blowflies.

414
00:21:58.440 --> 00:22:02.680
It's just just terrible, no offense to whoever wrote that.

415
00:22:04.039 --> 00:22:06.039
You mean it's terrible, Like it's not a good read

416
00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:09.279
or yeah, I mean compared to blow fine, Okay, oh

417
00:22:09.319 --> 00:22:09.640
it's not.

418
00:22:09.880 --> 00:22:14.039
And I just read an AMP book called The Colony,

419
00:22:14.279 --> 00:22:16.839
and you know, it was one of those books where

420
00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:19.480
you just want to scream with the writer because I mean,

421
00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:22.720
the concept and the plotting and the pacing was all great,

422
00:22:23.039 --> 00:22:25.160
but every time there was an antack, it was oh, I

423
00:22:25.200 --> 00:22:27.039
feel a sting. Oh, I feel a sting. Oh they

424
00:22:27.160 --> 00:22:29.920
swarmed me And there was like no detail. It was

425
00:22:30.039 --> 00:22:32.559
just like he was going, yep, they're covered in ants. Down,

426
00:22:32.640 --> 00:22:35.480
they're dead. And I was like, you're not describing the gore.

427
00:22:35.920 --> 00:22:38.079
I mean, isn't that your job? Aren't you getting paid

428
00:22:38.079 --> 00:22:38.319
for that?

429
00:22:39.000 --> 00:22:40.720
That's the fun part, right.

430
00:22:42.400 --> 00:22:44.000
Right, Yeah, that's.

431
00:22:43.759 --> 00:22:44.400
The fun part.

432
00:22:45.079 --> 00:22:48.559
Have you ever attempted a writing or using insects in

433
00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:51.039
your own writing? I can't remember if you have or not.

434
00:22:52.119 --> 00:22:56.440
Oh gosh, yes, Well I've worked with sever Press for

435
00:22:56.480 --> 00:22:59.839
probably more than fifteen years. And after I read slither

436
00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:03.440
Ed Lee that that is a great worm book, I really,

437
00:23:04.079 --> 00:23:06.799
really wanted to do a worm book, and sever Press

438
00:23:06.839 --> 00:23:09.279
was like wormstone sale, so they had me write a

439
00:23:09.359 --> 00:23:12.240
jungle adventure book. I think it was called The Lost

440
00:23:12.319 --> 00:23:16.160
Relic that might be the one that but I snuck

441
00:23:16.200 --> 00:23:18.720
worms into it and made worms like part of the

442
00:23:18.799 --> 00:23:22.279
Jungle Adventure and the climact with the evil love Crafty

443
00:23:22.319 --> 00:23:24.920
and force because I was like, I just got rite

444
00:23:24.960 --> 00:23:28.160
some worms, so and they didn't get too mad, so I.

445
00:23:28.759 --> 00:23:30.559
Was gonna say that they give you the side eye.

446
00:23:31.680 --> 00:23:34.480
They they're like, yeah, you got we got worms in here.

447
00:23:34.599 --> 00:23:34.799
Eric.

448
00:23:35.839 --> 00:23:39.920
I was like, yeah, well, yeah, I think worms should

449
00:23:39.920 --> 00:23:43.799
sell a bit more because that they're they're kind of gross, right, yeah.

450
00:23:43.839 --> 00:23:47.720
I mean, and there's a classic seventies movie called Squirms Squirm,

451
00:23:47.759 --> 00:23:50.480
which is probably like the only killer worm cinema that's

452
00:23:50.559 --> 00:23:53.279
actual worms. Now, of course there's trimmers, but that's a

453
00:23:53.319 --> 00:23:57.240
whole other thing than earthworms or the little parasitic worms.

454
00:23:57.759 --> 00:23:59.519
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

455
00:23:59.559 --> 00:24:02.359
I actually just finished a book about worm, not worms,

456
00:24:02.400 --> 00:24:04.960
but by the Sisters of Slaughter.

457
00:24:05.039 --> 00:24:08.759
Have you read them at all? No? It's it's called

458
00:24:09.039 --> 00:24:10.759
Janitors Versus the Undead.

459
00:24:11.559 --> 00:24:11.759
Oh.

460
00:24:11.799 --> 00:24:14.599
I saw your post about it, I think, but I

461
00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:15.759
have not read it.

462
00:24:15.880 --> 00:24:19.440
And it's it's little parasitic worms that create the zombies.

463
00:24:19.240 --> 00:24:24.200
And yeah, kind of kind of it's like that meeting

464
00:24:24.440 --> 00:24:28.640
Return to the Living Dead, and it's it's absolutely awesome.

465
00:24:28.680 --> 00:24:30.000
I highly recommend it.

466
00:24:30.079 --> 00:24:33.160
But it's not necessarily an animal attack book unless you

467
00:24:33.200 --> 00:24:34.759
can consider the parasites.

468
00:24:34.799 --> 00:24:36.519
But it's it's a lot of fun.

469
00:24:36.960 --> 00:24:40.799
It's definitely down our alley with the golore and the nastiness.

470
00:24:41.640 --> 00:24:44.599
What you know, it's probably one of those things that

471
00:24:44.640 --> 00:24:47.119
starts to line whether it's animal attack or zombie and

472
00:24:47.160 --> 00:24:48.680
there are a lot of things like that. Yeah, we

473
00:24:48.799 --> 00:24:51.799
just mentioned that the creeps, and I mean so, I

474
00:24:52.039 --> 00:24:54.960
guess it depends on how much they focus on the

475
00:24:54.960 --> 00:24:56.119
parasitic organism.

476
00:24:56.400 --> 00:24:58.920
Yeah, you know, honestly, I might put it in that

477
00:24:59.039 --> 00:25:01.880
because the parasit worms are a big part of it

478
00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:05.319
and it's described in a lot of detail.

479
00:25:05.559 --> 00:25:08.880
So yeah, you can probably toss it in the animal

480
00:25:08.920 --> 00:25:11.640
attack genre and it'd be fine. Just lump in the

481
00:25:11.680 --> 00:25:12.440
insects side.

482
00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:15.079
Yeah, it's a it's a lot of fun though, and

483
00:25:15.119 --> 00:25:18.200
it's funny too at points, So what.

484
00:25:18.759 --> 00:25:24.640
I'm sorry off Kingdom Kingdom of Spiders with William Shatner's

485
00:25:25.440 --> 00:25:28.039
Attack movie from the seventies if you've heard of it, haven't.

486
00:25:28.359 --> 00:25:30.880
If you haven't seen it and you like Shatner, I mean,

487
00:25:30.880 --> 00:25:35.799
it's Shatner and his most Shatner spiders. So and there's

488
00:25:35.799 --> 00:25:38.759
a book of it too, there's a novelization, and I

489
00:25:38.880 --> 00:25:41.880
highly recommend either. If you like Can't Be Can't Be Horris.

490
00:25:42.160 --> 00:25:43.359
What does the name of that again?

491
00:25:43.559 --> 00:25:44.720
Kingdom of Spiders?

492
00:25:44.799 --> 00:25:46.160
Kingdom of Spiders?

493
00:25:46.359 --> 00:25:50.279
Awesome guy like Shatner. Otherwise you're just gonna not not

494
00:25:50.400 --> 00:25:51.160
really get it.

495
00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:56.960
Yeah. Do you feel like that movie was tailored for him? Oh?

496
00:25:57.119 --> 00:26:00.559
Gosh, I don't know. Maybe he just got the script

497
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:03.839
and said this is for me, you know, Yeah, who knows.

498
00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:07.079
But I mean he does not get more Shatner than

499
00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:10.519
that movie. Take Captain Kirk and multiply by ten and

500
00:26:10.559 --> 00:26:11.759
it's it's hilarious.

501
00:26:12.279 --> 00:26:13.680
Yeah.

502
00:26:13.720 --> 00:26:16.039
So I want to know what type of animals do

503
00:26:16.079 --> 00:26:18.759
you think make the best animal attack books.

504
00:26:19.559 --> 00:26:23.000
Well, I'm gonna say definitely not snakes. I personally have

505
00:26:23.039 --> 00:26:25.160
a phobia snakes, I have since I was a kid.

506
00:26:25.200 --> 00:26:28.720
In every snake book I've read today, I've read like Rattlers,

507
00:26:28.880 --> 00:26:33.200
The Mountain King, a couple others, and the snake books

508
00:26:33.200 --> 00:26:36.240
for whatever reason, seemed to go off the rails on

509
00:26:36.400 --> 00:26:39.480
sex instead of gore and animal attack stuff. And you're like,

510
00:26:40.039 --> 00:26:42.839
wait a minute, I thought there were snakes killing people.

511
00:26:42.920 --> 00:26:45.160
I don't really care who you're sleeping with or what

512
00:26:45.240 --> 00:26:47.799
you're doing. But you know, so far, I've yet to

513
00:26:47.799 --> 00:26:49.079
find a great snake book.

514
00:26:49.359 --> 00:26:52.160
I wonder if it's the uh, you know, the phallic

515
00:26:52.279 --> 00:26:54.319
sort of creature who.

516
00:26:54.160 --> 00:26:58.039
Knows as a symbol for sex. But yeah, I there

517
00:26:58.039 --> 00:27:00.599
should be snake books worth without all that, right, like

518
00:27:01.160 --> 00:27:02.880
you know, just tied some variety.

519
00:27:03.839 --> 00:27:07.960
Yeah, and you know, my snake limiting is limited because

520
00:27:07.960 --> 00:27:10.880
that is my personal phobia. So who knows. Maybe there's

521
00:27:10.920 --> 00:27:13.960
some great masterpieces out there. I just have not made

522
00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:16.480
it too yet. I will tell you the Curse Too

523
00:27:16.799 --> 00:27:20.079
is probably the definitive in terms of my own personal

524
00:27:20.079 --> 00:27:24.519
horror snake movie. I mean, it's no relation to Curse One.

525
00:27:24.640 --> 00:27:27.759
Curse one was adaptation of HBO Lovecraft's Color Out of Space,

526
00:27:27.839 --> 00:27:30.519
but Curse two had a guy who was bitten by

527
00:27:30.559 --> 00:27:33.680
like a mutated radioactive snake and one of his arms

528
00:27:33.720 --> 00:27:36.359
becomes a snake, and at the end of the movie,

529
00:27:36.440 --> 00:27:38.759
a snake crawls out of his mouth and that it

530
00:27:38.920 --> 00:27:41.519
terrified me so much as a child that I mean,

531
00:27:42.839 --> 00:27:44.920
it just took the phobia as I already had and

532
00:27:44.920 --> 00:27:47.640
made them worse. But that was a horrific movie.

533
00:27:48.000 --> 00:27:50.160
I was gonna ask if maybe that was the source

534
00:27:50.319 --> 00:27:50.880
of your.

535
00:27:51.960 --> 00:27:55.000
The source was running around in under Rus Superhero under

536
00:27:55.039 --> 00:27:56.720
Rus when I was probably like four or five and

537
00:27:56.759 --> 00:27:58.720
standing on the head of a copperhead and having it

538
00:27:58.759 --> 00:28:00.200
strived at me as I ran away.

539
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:01.400
Oh damn yeah.

540
00:28:01.440 --> 00:28:03.319
And then my grandmother came out and killed it, put

541
00:28:03.319 --> 00:28:05.920
its body on the steps at her house, and it,

542
00:28:06.319 --> 00:28:09.400
of course it was gone because you know the neurological stuff,

543
00:28:09.400 --> 00:28:12.279
and snakes carry on for a while after you kill them,

544
00:28:12.319 --> 00:28:15.519
so its body had wandered off, and who knows it

545
00:28:15.559 --> 00:28:18.119
was always coming back for me. That's terrifying.

546
00:28:19.759 --> 00:28:22.400
That would terrify me too. I imagine where you live,

547
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:24.559
though you probably have a lot of snakes, don't you.

548
00:28:26.039 --> 00:28:29.079
More than I would like. The house I currently live in,

549
00:28:29.680 --> 00:28:33.599
we had one coming through a window about three four

550
00:28:33.720 --> 00:28:36.400
years ago and it wrapped itself around the curtain bar,

551
00:28:37.279 --> 00:28:39.519
all the curtains, and we were watching TV in the

552
00:28:39.559 --> 00:28:41.559
living room when we heard something fall and let the

553
00:28:41.640 --> 00:28:44.200
kitchen area where it came in and we walked in

554
00:28:44.200 --> 00:28:47.000
there and there was this gigantic, like five six foot

555
00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:50.519
black snake. Just wrap the curtain rod and we walk out.

556
00:28:51.240 --> 00:28:54.519
Yeah, talk about animal attack and real life.

557
00:28:54.839 --> 00:28:57.519
My wife will not let me live down the fact

558
00:28:57.519 --> 00:28:59.440
that I was on top of the sofa screaming like

559
00:28:59.480 --> 00:29:03.000
a baby. She dealt with it. But yeah, you know,

560
00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:05.960
I save her from spiders all the time, so she

561
00:29:06.039 --> 00:29:08.480
owed me that snake. That's my story and I'm sticking

562
00:29:08.519 --> 00:29:08.720
with it.

563
00:29:09.559 --> 00:29:10.480
Yeah.

564
00:29:10.559 --> 00:29:13.559
Do you have like favorites though? Favorite types of animals

565
00:29:13.559 --> 00:29:14.880
for an animal attack book?

566
00:29:16.079 --> 00:29:16.559
Uh?

567
00:29:16.640 --> 00:29:19.720
You know, I like them all. Dogs are probably my

568
00:29:19.799 --> 00:29:22.960
favorite because I've read, I own like all the dog

569
00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:25.279
books except for maybe one or two, and there's quite

570
00:29:25.279 --> 00:29:29.200
a few of them. But something about dogs because when

571
00:29:29.200 --> 00:29:31.440
I was a kid, I was afraid at dogs. I

572
00:29:31.480 --> 00:29:35.000
spent all my life except for like the last two years,

573
00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:37.400
hating dogs. So I got the dog I currently have,

574
00:29:37.480 --> 00:29:40.799
and she changed my view on all dogs. So dogs

575
00:29:40.799 --> 00:29:45.359
are the probably a different way the scariest to me,

576
00:29:46.039 --> 00:29:49.440
because I mean they are kind of killing machines, nothing

577
00:29:49.480 --> 00:29:51.680
compared to a house cat, which we will get into

578
00:29:51.720 --> 00:29:56.720
when we get to our favorite books. But dogs can

579
00:29:56.759 --> 00:29:59.440
be pretty vicious and they're loud and they snarl and

580
00:30:00.119 --> 00:30:02.160
that no novel pitch there from my home book. But

581
00:30:02.240 --> 00:30:03.720
you know, dollars just streaked me out.

582
00:30:04.319 --> 00:30:08.359
Yeah, dogs are like one of my favorite animals for pets.

583
00:30:08.400 --> 00:30:12.960
But you know, like TikTok and whatnot, often forget you know,

584
00:30:13.279 --> 00:30:15.240
if you watch I watch a lot of TikTok videos,

585
00:30:15.240 --> 00:30:17.359
and I watch all the cute dog videos and whatnot,

586
00:30:17.440 --> 00:30:20.640
but they leave out the scary dogs because there's plenty

587
00:30:20.680 --> 00:30:20.880
of those.

588
00:30:20.960 --> 00:30:24.720
Yeah, that might be an aspect of why they're so scary,

589
00:30:24.799 --> 00:30:27.960
because they're man's best friend and we totally forget that.

590
00:30:28.359 --> 00:30:31.920
You know, there's still animals and given the right circumstances,

591
00:30:31.960 --> 00:30:33.759
even your precious baby can turn on you.

592
00:30:34.200 --> 00:30:34.559
Yeah, you know.

593
00:30:35.240 --> 00:30:35.319
So.

594
00:30:36.200 --> 00:30:38.640
Actually, my grandmother she had this dog. It was like

595
00:30:38.680 --> 00:30:40.240
a toy something or other.

596
00:30:40.240 --> 00:30:41.960
It was a small dog, and she walked it every

597
00:30:42.079 --> 00:30:45.720
night and she was attacked by another dog which mauled,

598
00:30:46.160 --> 00:30:48.839
knocked her over, and mauled her dog to death. This

599
00:30:48.920 --> 00:30:51.240
is when I was like a kid, I was like

600
00:30:51.640 --> 00:30:55.200
three or four, and she couldn't do anything about it.

601
00:30:55.240 --> 00:30:57.960
Like if it was me walking it now, I would

602
00:30:57.960 --> 00:30:59.839
probably be able to defend that little dog.

603
00:31:00.079 --> 00:31:02.400
She couldn't and it was like killed right in front

604
00:31:02.400 --> 00:31:05.519
of her. And that's awful, right, Like.

605
00:31:05.799 --> 00:31:08.240
It's terrible and it's sad, but it's also nature that

606
00:31:08.279 --> 00:31:09.240
we have to live with.

607
00:31:09.680 --> 00:31:13.240
It's something that happens, and I think we need to remember.

608
00:31:13.400 --> 00:31:15.039
I keep going back to this, but I think we

609
00:31:15.039 --> 00:31:21.000
need to remember that, all right. So I want to

610
00:31:21.039 --> 00:31:24.279
know something because I once wrote a short story about

611
00:31:24.400 --> 00:31:28.039
a cute animal that became violent, and I submitted it to.

612
00:31:29.559 --> 00:31:31.799
A critique website. I don't know if you ever heard

613
00:31:31.839 --> 00:31:33.240
of critters dot org.

614
00:31:35.440 --> 00:31:38.359
Maybe at some point my career kind of sounds familiar,

615
00:31:38.519 --> 00:31:41.039
but I'm always be kind of a loner, you know.

616
00:31:41.680 --> 00:31:43.720
Yeah, I don't even know if they're still out there.

617
00:31:43.759 --> 00:31:46.160
But when I was young, I was in the HWA

618
00:31:46.279 --> 00:31:49.200
or as an associate member before my career took off,

619
00:31:49.200 --> 00:31:52.279
for maybe about a year or less, and I hated it.

620
00:31:52.319 --> 00:31:54.920
There was too much politics and backstabbing and you couldn't

621
00:31:54.920 --> 00:31:57.519
trust anybody, and oh, yeah, you know, and then I

622
00:31:57.559 --> 00:32:00.279
tried to I thought about joining the science fiction because

623
00:32:00.279 --> 00:32:02.599
I way qualified for that, and people were like, oh,

624
00:32:02.640 --> 00:32:04.039
you need to, and I was just even though the

625
00:32:04.039 --> 00:32:06.559
science fiction people are a whole lot nicer than the

626
00:32:06.559 --> 00:32:09.119
hard people, and there's not as much backstabbing. I guess

627
00:32:09.160 --> 00:32:11.279
I've always just been a loner. I mean, so I

628
00:32:11.559 --> 00:32:14.000
don't really do critique groups or writers' groups or even

629
00:32:14.039 --> 00:32:15.640
join the organizations apparently.

630
00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:17.319
Yeah, well this.

631
00:32:17.440 --> 00:32:22.400
I submitted that story to critters for feedback right, and

632
00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:26.119
a lot of people who who critique the story for me,

633
00:32:26.200 --> 00:32:29.119
they went on about how you can't make a fliffy

634
00:32:29.359 --> 00:32:34.000
animal like a like a bunny rabbit scary, and that

635
00:32:34.119 --> 00:32:36.160
really stuck with me. I don't know why, but you know,

636
00:32:36.240 --> 00:32:40.720
there's some example in children's fiction where are scary?

637
00:32:40.839 --> 00:32:41.000
Right?

638
00:32:41.240 --> 00:32:44.519
Like you clearly haven't read The Folly by David Ann.

639
00:32:45.279 --> 00:32:48.880
It is about genetically engineered rabbits to eat people. It's

640
00:32:48.920 --> 00:32:49.839
a very famous.

641
00:32:49.599 --> 00:32:54.720
Mesh, but it gets really, really weird at the end.

642
00:32:55.119 --> 00:32:57.279
I won't spoil it for you, but it goes beyond

643
00:32:57.440 --> 00:33:00.920
just the bunny rabbits. But you get lucky. You can

644
00:33:00.960 --> 00:33:04.759
probably find a second printing on eBay for around thirty bucks.

645
00:33:04.799 --> 00:33:08.279
But that first print that's pictured in paperbacks from Hell,

646
00:33:08.319 --> 00:33:09.839
I've been looking for a year and I've never seen

647
00:33:10.000 --> 00:33:13.519
on the market anywhere. Yeah, because the second print just

648
00:33:13.559 --> 00:33:15.359
has like a forest is to cover. But the first

649
00:33:15.359 --> 00:33:18.880
one actually has like this stilly eyed blood dripping from

650
00:33:18.880 --> 00:33:21.920
its mouth. Rabbit and yeah, it just doesn't.

651
00:33:21.599 --> 00:33:27.079
Exist, which you know it should, it should, it should.

652
00:33:27.559 --> 00:33:30.880
But I was wondering, how, you know, gaining from your

653
00:33:30.920 --> 00:33:34.200
expertise here, how would you go about making like a

654
00:33:34.240 --> 00:33:37.680
cute little animal like a hamster or something into a

655
00:33:37.680 --> 00:33:38.880
scary monster.

656
00:33:40.960 --> 00:33:42.759
I want to erase the.

657
00:33:43.720 --> 00:33:46.759
Let's do hamsters no pressure at all, no pressure at all.

658
00:33:47.000 --> 00:33:52.079
You know, make it make a hamster scary Eric, Well

659
00:33:52.200 --> 00:33:53.359
might need you know, a.

660
00:33:53.319 --> 00:33:55.599
Few more gallons of coffee before you know what.

661
00:33:56.640 --> 00:33:57.839
I think I can sure.

662
00:33:57.640 --> 00:34:00.319
There's a way. I'm sure someone did it. At some point.

663
00:34:00.880 --> 00:34:03.079
It will be done. I think I can do it

664
00:34:03.119 --> 00:34:04.720
every animals, because.

665
00:34:04.440 --> 00:34:07.880
Anyone who's owned hamsters has pets know that they can

666
00:34:07.920 --> 00:34:09.920
be little, nasty little beasts.

667
00:34:10.239 --> 00:34:11.800
They will bite.

668
00:34:12.760 --> 00:34:15.800
I actually had I just just go with the lats

669
00:34:15.840 --> 00:34:19.239
formula and have them swarm you. Right, Yeah, you don't

670
00:34:19.280 --> 00:34:25.280
want to be stormed by that's for sure. Yeah.

671
00:34:25.599 --> 00:34:26.519
Uh do you? Uh?

672
00:34:26.679 --> 00:34:27.559
What do you think about?

673
00:34:27.679 --> 00:34:31.800
Like symbolism that can be used in animal attack books,

674
00:34:32.199 --> 00:34:37.039
Animals often represent humanity, spheres of the untamed wild, loss

675
00:34:37.079 --> 00:34:40.280
of control, or even societal pressures.

676
00:34:40.960 --> 00:34:45.880
Oh yeah, I mean, I mean most animal attack books

677
00:34:45.920 --> 00:34:48.599
are just pulpy fiction for the fun of it and

678
00:34:48.639 --> 00:34:51.639
for the gore. But I mean there's most of them,

679
00:34:51.920 --> 00:34:54.159
well not most, but a lot of them have a

680
00:34:54.239 --> 00:34:57.440
clear eco message too, about hey, we're screwing up the

681
00:34:57.480 --> 00:34:59.920
planet and if we don't stop screwing up the planet,

682
00:35:00.079 --> 00:35:02.519
we are severely gonna pay for it. You know, whether

683
00:35:02.559 --> 00:35:06.760
it's animals, plants, or insects. That that is a reoccurring

684
00:35:06.880 --> 00:35:11.239
constant theme in this specific subgenre. But you know, it

685
00:35:11.360 --> 00:35:13.880
also gets into you can go with trust issues when

686
00:35:13.880 --> 00:35:16.840
you're coming down to the dog stuff, you can go

687
00:35:16.920 --> 00:35:21.400
with you know, the just the humane answer more. I

688
00:35:21.440 --> 00:35:22.280
can't talk.

689
00:35:23.599 --> 00:35:24.840
Morning, and I'm having.

690
00:35:24.719 --> 00:35:28.760
Trouble, but anyhow, you know, I mean, there's lots of

691
00:35:28.800 --> 00:35:33.960
themes that can be explored, but I'm gonna go with

692
00:35:33.960 --> 00:35:36.400
the eco when being the prevalent one, because.

693
00:35:36.679 --> 00:35:37.199
A lot of sense.

694
00:35:37.280 --> 00:35:39.880
Yeah, especially when it comes to like mutations and whatnot,

695
00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:43.800
and toxic waste, toxic waste by the way, and the.

696
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:47.000
Fear of losing our civilization as we know it. You

697
00:35:47.000 --> 00:35:49.159
know that going back to the wild and just how

698
00:35:49.239 --> 00:35:50.440
scary the wild is.

699
00:35:51.840 --> 00:35:54.760
Yeah, And before I move on to your own work

700
00:35:54.840 --> 00:35:56.679
within this, you mentioned plants.

701
00:35:57.039 --> 00:35:59.639
That's something I didn't think of. Can you give some

702
00:35:59.719 --> 00:36:05.840
examples of plant attack? Now? I know some myself, but

703
00:36:06.800 --> 00:36:08.079
I want your expertise on that.

704
00:36:08.199 --> 00:36:10.599
Harry Adam Smith I think that's his name, wrote a

705
00:36:10.639 --> 00:36:13.400
book called Fungus and that that is a great book.

706
00:36:14.320 --> 00:36:19.880
They have the Triffids, classic definitive, Yeah, classic definitive plant

707
00:36:19.880 --> 00:36:24.599
attack book, but Fungus is horrific because yeah, it's not

708
00:36:24.719 --> 00:36:28.119
the fungus so much actively attacking you like an animal.

709
00:36:28.199 --> 00:36:32.440
It's growing on you and eating your flesh on you

710
00:36:32.960 --> 00:36:38.199
and turning you into this mindless plant zombie. And it's

711
00:36:38.320 --> 00:36:39.079
just a cool book.

712
00:36:39.239 --> 00:36:41.639
I mean. And who's the author of that again?

713
00:36:41.920 --> 00:36:45.559
I think it's Harry Adam Knight. I think.

714
00:36:47.639 --> 00:36:48.159
Awesome.

715
00:36:48.760 --> 00:36:50.840
Did you hear any of plant books. I think there's

716
00:36:50.880 --> 00:36:53.880
one called Dust that's fairly more modern, but I can't

717
00:36:53.880 --> 00:36:57.519
remember who wrote it. And if if I stepped away

718
00:36:57.519 --> 00:37:00.000
from my screen, I could go tell you a lot more,

719
00:37:00.199 --> 00:37:02.039
but I'm not leaving my screen.

720
00:37:02.639 --> 00:37:05.880
Yeah, did you know have you ever heard about the

721
00:37:05.960 --> 00:37:11.679
zombie ants where fungus control like kills and then yeah,

722
00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:15.079
the zombie or the ants. That's terrifying on its own.

723
00:37:15.159 --> 00:37:16.480
That's the fungus thing, right, But.

724
00:37:17.079 --> 00:37:17.360
I mean.

725
00:37:18.840 --> 00:37:22.559
That specific premise, though I don't recall which one it is, right.

726
00:37:22.519 --> 00:37:26.679
Yeah, but that's that's real life stuff, man, that's terrifying fungus.

727
00:37:26.920 --> 00:37:29.599
Fungus is both helpful to us, but it can also

728
00:37:29.880 --> 00:37:32.360
you know, kill us.

729
00:37:34.639 --> 00:37:35.000
Okay.

730
00:37:35.039 --> 00:37:37.519
So I wanted to talk about Snarl a little bit

731
00:37:37.559 --> 00:37:41.159
because that was a passion projects of yours. But there's

732
00:37:41.199 --> 00:37:44.239
some interesting things in that, and we kind of brushed

733
00:37:44.280 --> 00:37:47.280
upon this already, so I guess maybe I should skip that,

734
00:37:47.360 --> 00:37:50.119
but I wanted to talk about, you know, how we've

735
00:37:50.119 --> 00:37:52.440
made things to Disney, but I wanted to talk about

736
00:37:52.440 --> 00:37:54.760
your because you kind of go into it in your

737
00:37:54.800 --> 00:37:59.280
introduction about dogs and the possibility of dog attacks, and

738
00:38:00.599 --> 00:38:02.559
would you like to talk about that a little bit more.

739
00:38:04.400 --> 00:38:08.719
Oh gosh, yeah, I'm holding upside down here. Star was

740
00:38:08.800 --> 00:38:11.480
indeed a passion project for me because you know, as

741
00:38:11.480 --> 00:38:14.480
a kid, I was attacked by a dog, not as

742
00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:17.440
viciously as the copyhead thing, but you know, my grandmother

743
00:38:17.480 --> 00:38:19.920
had a big dog and it was just so huge

744
00:38:19.960 --> 00:38:22.239
it would come like roll me over. And why it

745
00:38:22.280 --> 00:38:25.000
wasn't actually aggressively attacking me. You know, as a little kid,

746
00:38:25.039 --> 00:38:27.280
you can't tell the difference and there's a big dog

747
00:38:27.440 --> 00:38:30.320
in your face, and you know, movies like Kujo and

748
00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:35.719
stuff really drive that point home. And yeah, not liking

749
00:38:35.800 --> 00:38:39.079
dogs for the bulk of my existence on this planet

750
00:38:39.159 --> 00:38:42.880
and finding them either scary or evil, you know, and

751
00:38:43.000 --> 00:38:45.800
reading all the animal attack stuff that I have in

752
00:38:45.840 --> 00:38:48.199
the last year, I really wanted to write a book

753
00:38:48.239 --> 00:38:51.199
that was dogs, kind of like when I did Bigfoot War.

754
00:38:51.400 --> 00:38:55.679
You know, a Bigfoot War comes from me having nightmares

755
00:38:55.679 --> 00:38:58.800
about sasquash from living in this rural area of North

756
00:38:58.800 --> 00:39:00.480
Carolina and thinking he was going to come through my

757
00:39:00.519 --> 00:39:02.679
bedroom window and smash through the wall like the Kool

758
00:39:02.679 --> 00:39:06.280
Aid Man and just tear me apart and snarl. Is

759
00:39:06.320 --> 00:39:08.679
kind of my take on my childhood fears of dogs,

760
00:39:08.679 --> 00:39:13.000
but amped up. You know, it's not rabies. The rabies

761
00:39:13.079 --> 00:39:15.639
is sick and vicious, but this one's actually a bio

762
00:39:15.679 --> 00:39:19.119
weapon that functions much like the rage virus in twenty

763
00:39:19.159 --> 00:39:23.599
eight days later, and it just drives all the cadines

764
00:39:23.639 --> 00:39:27.440
into this feral attack mode and you get all these

765
00:39:27.480 --> 00:39:34.800
horrific scenes of people's pets turning on them. And yeah,

766
00:39:34.800 --> 00:39:37.599
I really, I won't lie. When I was writing Snarl,

767
00:39:37.719 --> 00:39:40.360
I went back when I finished it, I went back

768
00:39:40.400 --> 00:39:42.639
to the beginning and went through every scene and tried

769
00:39:42.639 --> 00:39:44.639
to make it gorrier than the first time I wrote.

770
00:39:45.119 --> 00:39:47.480
And that is the first time I've ever done that

771
00:39:47.519 --> 00:39:52.360
in my career. So Snarl, Lord Willing is the goriest

772
00:39:52.360 --> 00:39:54.800
thing I've ever written. It's probably not because I've written

773
00:39:54.880 --> 00:39:57.519
so many books in the last twenty some years, but

774
00:39:58.039 --> 00:40:00.280
it was the one I put the most effort into

775
00:40:00.360 --> 00:40:02.880
being the most visceral, disgusting thing that I could, because

776
00:40:02.920 --> 00:40:05.800
I really wanted to hit the eighties vibe. And I

777
00:40:05.840 --> 00:40:07.840
don't know if you're aware of this, but like in

778
00:40:07.960 --> 00:40:10.440
a lot of animal a tactbooks in the eighties, whether

779
00:40:10.559 --> 00:40:14.119
it was Killer Moss like in the Block by Mark

780
00:40:14.239 --> 00:40:18.039
Saunders or Dog books, you have all this visceral attack

781
00:40:18.119 --> 00:40:21.000
of the genitals and all these private area parts. They're

782
00:40:21.079 --> 00:40:24.360
just kind of like, ah, you know, for a little

783
00:40:24.360 --> 00:40:26.239
of that with Snarl, not not as bad as the

784
00:40:26.239 --> 00:40:28.639
eighties books, but I wanted it to feel very much

785
00:40:28.760 --> 00:40:30.639
like an eighties read when he picked up a Snorrol,

786
00:40:31.199 --> 00:40:34.400
and I wanted it to be an homage to paperbacks.

787
00:40:33.880 --> 00:40:35.960
From hell I.

788
00:40:36.000 --> 00:40:38.840
As I mentioned earlier, there's an intestine scene in there

789
00:40:39.079 --> 00:40:44.440
and involving a dog and the woods, and that's going

790
00:40:44.480 --> 00:40:46.360
to live rent free in my mind for a long time.

791
00:40:47.199 --> 00:40:49.679
You know, Lucio Folshi was known as the King of

792
00:40:49.719 --> 00:40:53.000
eyeball gore in Italian cinema. And one thing I get

793
00:40:53.039 --> 00:40:55.920
a lot in my feedback from readers is, at at

794
00:40:55.920 --> 00:40:58.000
some point in my career, I think I'm becoming like

795
00:40:58.119 --> 00:41:01.000
the people think, I have this upset session with guts

796
00:41:01.000 --> 00:41:05.199
and intestines because there's so much intestinal gore in my books,

797
00:41:05.239 --> 00:41:08.199
and I just like tearing open the stomach, you know,

798
00:41:08.320 --> 00:41:11.320
for that effect and doing all these crazy horrible things there.

799
00:41:11.639 --> 00:41:14.000
So I guess it full she was the eyeball king,

800
00:41:14.039 --> 00:41:19.400
I'm apparently becoming the guts king. It's kind of just wrong,

801
00:41:19.760 --> 00:41:22.480
but I'm going rung with it because it's my job.

802
00:41:22.599 --> 00:41:27.119
So yeah, Well, intestines are fun to play with in books.

803
00:41:28.119 --> 00:41:32.360
You're going to see in books. You know in real

804
00:41:32.400 --> 00:41:37.960
life too, that's gross, but you're gonna you're gonna see.

805
00:41:38.320 --> 00:41:41.360
You're going to see some intestines in my latest installment.

806
00:41:41.400 --> 00:41:45.519
In her book there, I'm just gonna warn you, but

807
00:41:45.639 --> 00:41:47.360
it was Snarl was a lot of fun to read.

808
00:41:47.400 --> 00:41:50.000
As I mentioned, do you remember the actual seed that

809
00:41:50.079 --> 00:41:53.280
spawned it? Was it your I guess it was your fear.

810
00:41:53.039 --> 00:41:55.360
Of of dogs? And yeah, yeah it was.

811
00:41:55.559 --> 00:41:58.960
It was not licking dogs for all those years. And uh,

812
00:41:59.119 --> 00:42:01.119
you know, and I Will really wanted to play on

813
00:42:01.280 --> 00:42:05.559
that how much society puts dogs above of children in

814
00:42:05.599 --> 00:42:08.320
some cases at this point, and how for some people

815
00:42:08.519 --> 00:42:12.280
dogs are their children, and how much we've humanized canines.

816
00:42:13.280 --> 00:42:16.039
I wanted to strip some of that away and show

817
00:42:16.079 --> 00:42:20.440
what canines actually could be in a very fearful manner.

818
00:42:20.800 --> 00:42:24.800
Like there's one scene in the book where this lady

819
00:42:25.119 --> 00:42:26.960
was just driving down the road in her car and

820
00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:30.239
her little poodle hops up and like rips out her

821
00:42:30.320 --> 00:42:31.840
throat and the car crashes.

822
00:42:32.440 --> 00:42:33.360
I remember that scene.

823
00:42:34.320 --> 00:42:36.559
Yeah, well it's not a huge scene, you know, it

824
00:42:36.679 --> 00:42:39.079
speaks to the core of what I was trying to

825
00:42:39.119 --> 00:42:41.800
do with Snarl, and how that even though we love

826
00:42:41.880 --> 00:42:47.000
them and they love us, they're still animals. And in

827
00:42:47.039 --> 00:42:50.280
the case of Snarl, again, it's a virus type thing,

828
00:42:50.639 --> 00:42:53.199
not them turning on us just out of instinct, But

829
00:42:53.320 --> 00:42:56.440
it shows what could happen even out of instinct if

830
00:42:56.440 --> 00:42:57.320
we did something wrong.

831
00:42:57.800 --> 00:43:02.639
Yeah, so, and that book Grim as well, but I

832
00:43:02.679 --> 00:43:03.599
love it.

833
00:43:03.599 --> 00:43:04.719
It's one of my favorites.

834
00:43:05.039 --> 00:43:06.119
Well, thank you, thank you.

835
00:43:06.760 --> 00:43:09.599
All right, So I think we're Do you have anything

836
00:43:09.599 --> 00:43:12.000
else you want to add to animal attacks?

837
00:43:12.039 --> 00:43:13.519
Anything that I might have missed?

838
00:43:14.840 --> 00:43:17.679
No, No, you have mentioned doing our top three, so

839
00:43:17.760 --> 00:43:19.239
I am prepared for that.

840
00:43:20.039 --> 00:43:22.760
Do you have honorable mentions as well?

841
00:43:23.920 --> 00:43:27.119
Well? Honorable mentions? I will have to think about that

842
00:43:27.159 --> 00:43:29.960
as we're going here, But I will tell you in

843
00:43:30.119 --> 00:43:33.679
Paperbacks from Hell, Grady Hendrix mentions a book called The Cats,

844
00:43:33.920 --> 00:43:37.119
which was written by Nick Sherman. And I will tell you,

845
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:40.119
if you've never read an animal attack book, Cats is

846
00:43:40.280 --> 00:43:44.519
not that bad. It's decent. But if you really want

847
00:43:44.559 --> 00:43:47.519
a cat book, I'm getting the wrong book picked up here.

848
00:43:48.119 --> 00:43:52.159
You need to read clawl. This takes place on a

849
00:43:52.199 --> 00:43:55.800
small secluded Idam island where the people can't get off

850
00:43:55.840 --> 00:43:59.599
the island during the storm. And it's a fishing island

851
00:44:00.039 --> 00:44:03.079
where cats have just been let loose to breed and

852
00:44:03.119 --> 00:44:08.119
breed and breed. And there it is a small town

853
00:44:08.159 --> 00:44:11.599
overrun by cats. And of course it has your typical

854
00:44:11.960 --> 00:44:15.360
cats eat a baby trope that was in the eighties horra,

855
00:44:15.480 --> 00:44:20.880
But I mean it's visceral, it's action packed, it's apocalyptic feeling,

856
00:44:21.360 --> 00:44:23.920
and it just blows the heck out of Nick Shermond's

857
00:44:23.920 --> 00:44:26.920
The Cats. I mean Jack Younger, I think that's the

858
00:44:26.960 --> 00:44:30.800
author's name, just did a master work of cat fiction here.

859
00:44:31.599 --> 00:44:35.280
That's awesome. I have a few here.

860
00:44:35.679 --> 00:44:39.480
I wanted to talk about Meg by Steve Alton. That

861
00:44:39.519 --> 00:44:42.360
book is a lot of fun, and they, of course

862
00:44:42.360 --> 00:44:44.639
they made that into a movie. It's about the megalodon

863
00:44:45.480 --> 00:44:49.599
shark not being extinct after all, and of course attacks

864
00:44:49.639 --> 00:44:55.880
like an underwater science type station. I watched the movie

865
00:44:55.920 --> 00:44:58.360
first and then I went back and read the book

866
00:44:58.519 --> 00:45:00.159
and I just had a lot of fun with it.

867
00:45:01.920 --> 00:45:04.480
You know, it's not very gory, though it's I guess

868
00:45:04.519 --> 00:45:06.519
it would be hard to be gory, But the book

869
00:45:07.039 --> 00:45:11.519
goes into more of the killings like that the movie

870
00:45:11.559 --> 00:45:14.760
only touches upon, Like when the megalodon reaches the beach

871
00:45:15.639 --> 00:45:16.239
in the movie.

872
00:45:16.280 --> 00:45:18.480
They not always not to have the go the gorse

873
00:45:18.599 --> 00:45:22.000
is an added bonus sometimes, oh for sure, yeah yeah,

874
00:45:22.039 --> 00:45:24.880
But like when the megalodon reaches the beach in the movie,

875
00:45:24.880 --> 00:45:25.440
I don't even know.

876
00:45:25.480 --> 00:45:27.519
If it does reach I can't remember but I know

877
00:45:27.599 --> 00:45:30.000
it does in the book, and it gets pretty nasty

878
00:45:30.039 --> 00:45:32.960
there a bit, but it's just a fun book.

879
00:45:35.280 --> 00:45:37.119
The next one I have here, I don't know if

880
00:45:37.159 --> 00:45:38.079
it counts.

881
00:45:37.800 --> 00:45:41.039
Because it's it's like a beast that doesn't actually exist,

882
00:45:41.159 --> 00:45:43.880
but I put it here anyway because it reminds. It

883
00:45:43.920 --> 00:45:46.960
has that animal attack feel to it, and that's Croda

884
00:45:47.000 --> 00:45:51.840
by El. Going back, this book has some pretty interesting.

885
00:45:53.679 --> 00:45:56.400
Gore to it. Like I am a bit of a gorehound.

886
00:45:56.400 --> 00:45:58.400
When I go into these books, I'm reading them because

887
00:45:58.400 --> 00:46:01.559
I want. I want to be uh, I want I want,

888
00:46:01.760 --> 00:46:04.440
I want the gore. Honestly, I want the fun, and

889
00:46:04.480 --> 00:46:05.599
this one has some of that.

890
00:46:06.320 --> 00:46:08.639
He's a brilliant writer. I would admit I haven't read

891
00:46:08.679 --> 00:46:09.840
that one, but he's a brilliant writer.

892
00:46:10.119 --> 00:46:12.719
Sure Quota is awesome. I highly recommend it.

893
00:46:13.400 --> 00:46:18.320
And one of mine if you're good ahead. So when

894
00:46:18.320 --> 00:46:21.920
I first started reading Animal Attact books, right after paperbacks

895
00:46:21.920 --> 00:46:24.599
from Hell, this book here is the one I started with,

896
00:46:24.960 --> 00:46:26.599
trying to get it close to the cameras who you

897
00:46:26.599 --> 00:46:29.679
can see all the little bats on the color. Yeah,

898
00:46:29.719 --> 00:46:33.880
so this is about yes night Wing. There's a movie

899
00:46:33.920 --> 00:46:36.000
of it. The movie does not do the book justice

900
00:46:36.039 --> 00:46:38.599
in any form of fashion. The movie is actually kind

901
00:46:38.599 --> 00:46:41.039
of slow. It's a cult classic, but it's not one

902
00:46:41.079 --> 00:46:42.920
I can just say, yeah, you need to go watch

903
00:46:43.039 --> 00:46:46.960
Night Wing. But the book is amazing and it yes,

904
00:46:47.039 --> 00:46:51.159
it's about rabid bats spreading rabies across the entire state,

905
00:46:51.519 --> 00:46:56.119
but the core of the book is its characters. It

906
00:46:56.199 --> 00:47:01.800
is focused on indigenous Native American people and their culture.

907
00:47:02.239 --> 00:47:05.639
I think it's the Hoppy Tribe, but I can't. I

908
00:47:05.639 --> 00:47:09.719
can't remember. I've read it so many times. But anyhow,

909
00:47:10.480 --> 00:47:14.079
it kind of talks about how, you know, white cultures

910
00:47:14.159 --> 00:47:16.920
taking over Native American culture. And the whole premise of

911
00:47:16.920 --> 00:47:20.480
the story is a Native American shama and who decides

912
00:47:20.519 --> 00:47:22.719
that the world needs to be wiped out and only

913
00:47:22.760 --> 00:47:25.679
his people survive, so he kills himself in a big

914
00:47:25.800 --> 00:47:30.079
ritual to summon all these bats. That's the premise of

915
00:47:30.079 --> 00:47:33.239
the attack. And you have the other main character is

916
00:47:33.280 --> 00:47:36.679
a Native American who's in position of law enforcement and

917
00:47:36.760 --> 00:47:40.480
he's the only one who really understands what's going on

918
00:47:40.840 --> 00:47:45.079
with the bats and the curse. The shaman has a summoned.

919
00:47:45.400 --> 00:47:50.880
But it is an intense character book. You will love

920
00:47:50.960 --> 00:47:54.360
the characters and the characters make the story. Yeah. It

921
00:47:54.400 --> 00:47:56.480
breaks my heart to say this when talking about animal

922
00:47:56.519 --> 00:47:58.920
attack books, but with night Wing it's the characters who

923
00:47:58.960 --> 00:48:01.039
make the story. Animals in the door.

924
00:48:01.440 --> 00:48:01.679
Yeah.

925
00:48:01.719 --> 00:48:03.760
So it was a very moving one for me, and

926
00:48:04.119 --> 00:48:05.760
like I said, it was the first one that read

927
00:48:05.800 --> 00:48:07.679
when I really got heavily back into it and it

928
00:48:07.840 --> 00:48:10.440
just blew me away. I was like, Wow, this guy

929
00:48:10.440 --> 00:48:13.800
can ride. Is Martin Cruise Smith. By the way, he's

930
00:48:13.840 --> 00:48:16.360
famous for like Gorky Park and a lot of other books,

931
00:48:16.360 --> 00:48:19.320
but to me, not with his masterpiece.

932
00:48:20.039 --> 00:48:21.159
Is that Cruise with a Z.

933
00:48:22.159 --> 00:48:25.599
It is Cruise with a Z. Martin Cruz Smith, Cruz Smith.

934
00:48:26.960 --> 00:48:27.400
Uh.

935
00:48:27.559 --> 00:48:31.239
My next honorable mention. Here is a very thick book.

936
00:48:31.559 --> 00:48:35.280
It's a it's a it's a doorstopper. It's The Terror

937
00:48:35.480 --> 00:48:36.519
by Dan Simmons.

938
00:48:36.880 --> 00:48:37.599
Oh.

939
00:48:37.840 --> 00:48:40.480
Of course this is about the Franklin Expedition. Uh.

940
00:48:41.039 --> 00:48:43.639
And it sort of goes into maybe what happened, of

941
00:48:43.679 --> 00:48:47.079
course it's it's not what happened, but it's it's a

942
00:48:47.119 --> 00:48:49.840
fun take on it. And there's a giant polar bear

943
00:48:49.960 --> 00:48:54.960
in it that's a definitely a mythological type of creature,

944
00:48:55.039 --> 00:48:58.559
but it's still taking out the crew and It's just

945
00:48:58.599 --> 00:48:59.559
a lot of fun reading it.

946
00:48:59.639 --> 00:49:01.679
I've talked about it quite a bit here.

947
00:49:02.360 --> 00:49:05.880
It is a beautiful historical read. I mean, I'm a

948
00:49:06.079 --> 00:49:09.440
sucker for period piece and Simmons is a great writer anyhow,

949
00:49:09.440 --> 00:49:13.360
So I absolutely absolutely agree that Terror is.

950
00:49:15.960 --> 00:49:18.079
A fantastic Yeah.

951
00:49:18.239 --> 00:49:21.840
I don't know if people would totally see what major tops, Yeah,

952
00:49:21.880 --> 00:49:23.280
I don't. I don't know if people would think of

953
00:49:23.280 --> 00:49:25.440
it as an animal attack book, but there's definitely that

954
00:49:25.519 --> 00:49:26.079
element in.

955
00:49:26.039 --> 00:49:30.239
There probably, I mean, there's elements of it, but that's

956
00:49:30.280 --> 00:49:32.480
not what the book is, is how it would go.

957
00:49:32.519 --> 00:49:35.440
There's definitely elements that come across as an animal tack book,

958
00:49:35.480 --> 00:49:38.480
but but it's not officially in that genre.

959
00:49:39.239 --> 00:49:43.199
So yeah, do you have any other honorable mentions?

960
00:49:43.800 --> 00:49:46.360
What else? Since we were going in top three? One

961
00:49:46.400 --> 00:49:50.320
that actually scared the heck out of me and bothered

962
00:49:50.360 --> 00:49:52.719
me as a human being was Slime by John Howck,

963
00:49:52.760 --> 00:49:54.800
and I did not pull my copy of it. But

964
00:49:54.920 --> 00:50:00.400
it is about killer jellyfish. And most of of these

965
00:50:00.440 --> 00:50:02.440
animal attack books are set in Europe because you know,

966
00:50:02.519 --> 00:50:05.239
that's where the big trend was, but they actually the

967
00:50:05.320 --> 00:50:08.119
jellyfish go from the salt water to the fresh water

968
00:50:08.239 --> 00:50:11.280
and later on in the book. So just kind of

969
00:50:11.320 --> 00:50:16.400
like in that famous Sean Hudson Slugs where people are

970
00:50:16.559 --> 00:50:19.039
ingesting the slugs and it's killing them. The same thing

971
00:50:19.079 --> 00:50:22.400
happens with jellyfish and slime, and it's as gory as

972
00:50:22.400 --> 00:50:25.920
slugs is, and as iconic of animal attack book as

973
00:50:25.960 --> 00:50:30.000
slugs is. Slime is far more disturbing. It was how

974
00:50:30.039 --> 00:50:31.199
can at his best?

975
00:50:31.960 --> 00:50:32.360
Awesome?

976
00:50:33.599 --> 00:50:38.239
All right, right, do you have any other honorable mentions

977
00:50:38.280 --> 00:50:40.079
or should we move on to the top three?

978
00:50:40.880 --> 00:50:44.679
Oh? I just did my top three.

979
00:50:44.760 --> 00:50:46.199
Yeah, okay, okay, yeah, I'll go.

980
00:50:46.599 --> 00:50:50.039
Back Younger night Wing by Martin Cruse Smith and Slime

981
00:50:50.079 --> 00:50:52.320
by John Holkins for my top three. So I was

982
00:50:52.360 --> 00:50:54.559
going in and I apologize.

983
00:50:56.719 --> 00:51:00.000
I'll go into my top three. Then at number three

984
00:51:00.239 --> 00:51:02.639
I have The Only Good Indians by Stephen Graham Jones.

985
00:51:03.079 --> 00:51:07.000
This is I think, a brilliant take on the slasher genre,

986
00:51:07.880 --> 00:51:12.480
but it's also a person taking on the form of

987
00:51:12.559 --> 00:51:19.840
an animal to get the revenge of something that happened

988
00:51:19.920 --> 00:51:23.400
during a hunting expedition that a young that a group

989
00:51:23.440 --> 00:51:27.639
of indigenous friends went on. If you know anything about

990
00:51:27.719 --> 00:51:31.639
indigenous peoples when they hunt, they often do it respectfully.

991
00:51:32.760 --> 00:51:36.480
When they kill an animal, they use the entire bodies,

992
00:51:36.480 --> 00:51:42.159
and they also thank the animal for you know, giving well,

993
00:51:42.559 --> 00:51:46.639
they apologize to the animal and they're thankful for what

994
00:51:46.679 --> 00:51:50.719
they get. But during this hunting expedition, things go out

995
00:51:50.719 --> 00:51:53.280
of control. I'll leave it at that, and sort of

996
00:51:53.320 --> 00:51:55.880
like the spirit of these animals take the form.

997
00:51:56.320 --> 00:52:03.559
Of this crazy and spooky looking woman with an elkhead that,

998
00:52:03.760 --> 00:52:06.599
like Greeks, havoc on these four friends. And it split

999
00:52:06.679 --> 00:52:09.000
up into like four or five different parts, so you

1000
00:52:09.039 --> 00:52:13.800
could read it as a collection of stories. It's not

1001
00:52:14.280 --> 00:52:18.360
necessarily linear, but there's some pretty creative kills in this

1002
00:52:18.440 --> 00:52:22.239
book and it's one of my favorites. By Stephen Graham Jones.

1003
00:52:22.440 --> 00:52:24.840
Stephen Graham Jones is on my read list for this year.

1004
00:52:24.880 --> 00:52:27.599
So many people was told he's fantastic, that his work

1005
00:52:27.679 --> 00:52:30.400
is fantastic, and I've looked him up and he seems

1006
00:52:30.440 --> 00:52:33.639
like a great person from his interviews. So hopefully I

1007
00:52:33.719 --> 00:52:36.840
will get to experience that one soon. And on a

1008
00:52:36.960 --> 00:52:40.360
side note, you know you couldn't tell it from looking

1009
00:52:40.400 --> 00:52:43.360
at me. I'm as white as you know. Why comes

1010
00:52:43.400 --> 00:52:46.559
as a southern redneck guy, But if you go back

1011
00:52:46.679 --> 00:52:49.880
enough generations in my family my however, many times great

1012
00:52:49.920 --> 00:52:55.559
grandfather back was actually a fairly famous Native American indigenous

1013
00:52:55.639 --> 00:52:59.800
medicine man shaman who traveled this region where I still live,

1014
00:53:00.320 --> 00:53:05.000
you know, like helping people. Yeah, maybe that's part of

1015
00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:08.239
my why. Yeah, because I'm a fan of indigenous culture,

1016
00:53:08.480 --> 00:53:11.360
because I think they've got a much more grip on

1017
00:53:11.400 --> 00:53:13.960
what's going on than we do at times with nature.

1018
00:53:15.440 --> 00:53:22.400
So that hopefully no when thinks I'm culturally appropriating, you know,

1019
00:53:22.920 --> 00:53:25.199
when I say I don't even know what I'm saying,

1020
00:53:25.239 --> 00:53:26.000
just edit that out.

1021
00:53:27.360 --> 00:53:29.320
If it's in your blood, it's in your blood right,

1022
00:53:30.280 --> 00:53:32.119
and you have appreciation for.

1023
00:53:32.880 --> 00:53:36.760
I truly appreciate indigenous Native American cultures where I'm trying

1024
00:53:36.760 --> 00:53:37.719
to come from, I.

1025
00:53:37.679 --> 00:53:38.519
Have the same thing.

1026
00:53:38.599 --> 00:53:41.599
I truly appreciate, and I like learning about it too.

1027
00:53:41.840 --> 00:53:43.280
I've read a few books.

1028
00:53:44.480 --> 00:53:45.960
Both fiction and nonfiction.

1029
00:53:46.880 --> 00:53:51.639
It's it's a very rich tapestry of culture that I

1030
00:53:51.639 --> 00:53:56.239
think is is deeper than our own. And we could

1031
00:53:56.400 --> 00:53:59.119
probably make an episode of that all on its own.

1032
00:53:59.480 --> 00:53:59.920
Oh yeah.

1033
00:54:00.400 --> 00:54:05.920
The eighties animal tags genre was rampant with indigenous vengeance stories,

1034
00:54:06.360 --> 00:54:09.440
and a lot of them had no idea about the

1035
00:54:09.480 --> 00:54:12.480
culture they were writing about. They were just running on stereotypes,

1036
00:54:12.519 --> 00:54:15.119
and I mean, I'm sure it gets pretty insulting, but

1037
00:54:16.079 --> 00:54:18.159
you know, at the same time, there were a few

1038
00:54:18.800 --> 00:54:21.880
that were written by actual Indigenous people, even in the

1039
00:54:21.920 --> 00:54:24.480
eighties that they're just fantastic books.

1040
00:54:24.679 --> 00:54:27.280
Also in the nineties, that's when Al going back I believe,

1041
00:54:27.320 --> 00:54:32.599
started writing, and his books are really good. I maybe

1042
00:54:32.599 --> 00:54:35.119
should even put that in my It was hard making

1043
00:54:35.159 --> 00:54:39.239
my top three. I'm just gonna say that I went

1044
00:54:39.280 --> 00:54:42.440
with only Good Indians because that story is it's a

1045
00:54:42.480 --> 00:54:45.840
little bit deeper and more in depth than Croda was.

1046
00:54:46.800 --> 00:54:48.400
But Crota was a lot of fun and there's a

1047
00:54:48.440 --> 00:54:51.119
lot of great characterization in that as well.

1048
00:54:51.840 --> 00:54:57.480
But my number two goes to Devolution by Max Brooks.

1049
00:54:57.880 --> 00:54:59.800
I have never read that when I did not know

1050
00:54:59.880 --> 00:55:04.159
that one existed actually until you mentioned it.

1051
00:55:04.159 --> 00:55:07.039
It's really good. It takes you know, you know World

1052
00:55:07.039 --> 00:55:07.400
War Z.

1053
00:55:08.280 --> 00:55:12.119
That, Yeah, it's it's a similar concept where it's like

1054
00:55:12.239 --> 00:55:13.039
found footage.

1055
00:55:14.920 --> 00:55:16.280
The found footage being.

1056
00:55:16.280 --> 00:55:18.760
This this group of people are living in a cabin

1057
00:55:18.880 --> 00:55:21.679
for a certain period of time and a volcano blows

1058
00:55:21.920 --> 00:55:26.519
near them, and that drives First of all, the volcano

1059
00:55:26.559 --> 00:55:31.400
blowing traps them where they are, and it drives all

1060
00:55:31.440 --> 00:55:35.280
the animals out their way, and this includes a family

1061
00:55:35.400 --> 00:55:40.559
or a group of sasquatch who began attacking their cabin.

1062
00:55:41.000 --> 00:55:44.119
And so later on, after all the debris has been

1063
00:55:44.239 --> 00:55:48.639
filtered through and they find uh that these people are

1064
00:55:48.679 --> 00:55:51.599
missing or maybe it's even they find their bodies. I

1065
00:55:51.599 --> 00:55:54.480
can't remember that. But they find like the records of

1066
00:55:55.079 --> 00:55:57.480
what they kept while they were being attacked. And it's

1067
00:55:57.559 --> 00:56:02.719
a very awesome book. It's like, uh, it's like adrenaline,

1068
00:56:02.760 --> 00:56:05.800
you know. It's uh, once it gets going, it's cass

1069
00:56:05.960 --> 00:56:07.960
kind of like a slow start to it where they're

1070
00:56:08.000 --> 00:56:10.800
like admiring nature and stuff and that I have to

1071
00:56:10.840 --> 00:56:12.840
admit that that part kind of annoyed me a little

1072
00:56:12.840 --> 00:56:14.199
bit because it just goes on and on.

1073
00:56:14.639 --> 00:56:17.800
But uh, but once the attack starts.

1074
00:56:18.199 --> 00:56:23.360
It gets very relentless and the the intensity just remains

1075
00:56:23.880 --> 00:56:26.880
throughout until the rest for the rest of the novel.

1076
00:56:27.320 --> 00:56:28.719
So I highly recommend that.

1077
00:56:30.159 --> 00:56:33.119
And my my number one is a book.

1078
00:56:33.159 --> 00:56:37.440
I I'm a big Stephen King fan, and uh, but

1079
00:56:37.519 --> 00:56:40.840
I'd never read Kujo because the idea of reading Kujo

1080
00:56:40.920 --> 00:56:41.519
scared me.

1081
00:56:43.599 --> 00:56:46.039
Because I knew how it ended. I know.

1082
00:56:46.199 --> 00:56:47.519
Yeah, the movie changes that.

1083
00:56:47.760 --> 00:56:48.920
Yeah, the movie changes that.

1084
00:56:49.239 --> 00:56:52.440
But that's what I was afraid of reading, especially after

1085
00:56:52.519 --> 00:56:56.760
I had my son, right, But I ended up tackling

1086
00:56:56.800 --> 00:56:58.320
it anyway last.

1087
00:56:58.119 --> 00:57:01.280
Year and I absolutely adore this or oh my god.

1088
00:57:01.679 --> 00:57:05.000
Of course it's Stephen King, right, But what you get

1089
00:57:05.079 --> 00:57:09.079
is you get like a family drama that's completely hijacked

1090
00:57:09.079 --> 00:57:14.360
by a rabid dog. And my biggest complaint about this

1091
00:57:14.400 --> 00:57:16.800
book is the ending kind of drags out too long.

1092
00:57:17.039 --> 00:57:20.719
He creates his tension and he holds onto.

1093
00:57:20.480 --> 00:57:22.400
It for maybe just a little too long, but it

1094
00:57:22.519 --> 00:57:27.159
ends up going where it goes, and it's it's not

1095
00:57:27.239 --> 00:57:29.599
quite as tragic as I thought it would be, although

1096
00:57:29.639 --> 00:57:33.960
it is. I'm gonna spoil it here, so anyone who

1097
00:57:34.000 --> 00:57:36.800
hasn't read Koujo and doesn't want to be spoiled, fast

1098
00:57:36.840 --> 00:57:40.800
forward maybe a minute or two. But I thought that

1099
00:57:40.880 --> 00:57:44.400
the boy was going to die via the dog, like

1100
00:57:44.559 --> 00:57:47.440
finally getting him into its maw. And the reason why

1101
00:57:47.440 --> 00:57:48.880
I was, like, you know, when it comes to like

1102
00:57:48.920 --> 00:57:51.559
maybe a book that you would write if you know

1103
00:57:51.920 --> 00:57:54.880
when kids are being killed, it's more in a fun way.

1104
00:57:55.280 --> 00:57:57.320
But I knew that Stephen King would make it personal,

1105
00:57:57.639 --> 00:58:01.400
personable somehow, sort of like pet cemetery right, And I

1106
00:58:01.480 --> 00:58:04.440
was afraid of tackling like getting attached to the boy

1107
00:58:04.719 --> 00:58:08.480
and feeling like their family on their own, you know,

1108
00:58:08.599 --> 00:58:11.519
humanizing the kid to death and then having the dog

1109
00:58:11.639 --> 00:58:14.880
molum to death. But the way he actually does die

1110
00:58:15.000 --> 00:58:20.719
is is quite more simple than that. It's dehydration, and

1111
00:58:21.599 --> 00:58:23.960
it's tragic still, but it's not as violent as I

1112
00:58:23.960 --> 00:58:24.599
thought it would be.

1113
00:58:24.679 --> 00:58:26.960
But still this book, it's kind of makes it more

1114
00:58:26.960 --> 00:58:31.360
poignant for sure. Yeah, but the book is.

1115
00:58:33.079 --> 00:58:35.599
It's it's funny that he doesn't remember writing it because

1116
00:58:35.599 --> 00:58:37.800
he was so drunk when he wrote it.

1117
00:58:38.719 --> 00:58:41.239
But it's like I wish, I wish I.

1118
00:58:41.239 --> 00:58:46.119
Had that sort of brain power because because if you're

1119
00:58:46.239 --> 00:58:49.280
that blackout drunk while writing a book and.

1120
00:58:49.239 --> 00:58:51.920
It's still that good, it's like nobody can do that.

1121
00:58:52.039 --> 00:58:55.960
Not well, King is like Lovecraft. He he is a brilliant,

1122
00:58:56.079 --> 00:59:00.840
brilliant writer and just not a great person. But that's

1123
00:59:00.960 --> 00:59:03.559
just my opinion, mind you, but brilliant, right, not a

1124
00:59:03.559 --> 00:59:06.800
great person. And as an alternative to Kujo, I've got

1125
00:59:06.800 --> 00:59:09.199
to mention this book. It probably should have been in

1126
00:59:09.199 --> 00:59:12.920
my top three, but it's man Stopper by Douglas Borton.

1127
00:59:13.840 --> 00:59:17.559
This book is about four attack dogs who are trained

1128
00:59:17.599 --> 00:59:22.039
to kill people by a corporation, a corporation that trains

1129
00:59:22.239 --> 00:59:26.039
security dogs, and the truck carrying them to wherever they've

1130
00:59:26.079 --> 00:59:28.199
been sold to rex and they get loose in a

1131
00:59:28.239 --> 00:59:31.559
small town and their work as like this highly trained

1132
00:59:31.639 --> 00:59:35.800
military pack, just tearing everybody apart, and half the book

1133
00:59:35.880 --> 00:59:39.599
probably sold from the perspective of the dogs. There's a

1134
00:59:39.639 --> 00:59:42.800
Doverman pincher named Razor, and if you read this book

1135
00:59:42.800 --> 00:59:44.800
and you don't fall in love with Razor, there's something

1136
00:59:44.800 --> 00:59:48.679
wrong with you as a human being. But anyhow, I mean,

1137
00:59:48.760 --> 00:59:51.400
after reading that book, it's not only my favorite dog

1138
00:59:51.480 --> 00:59:54.079
attack book, but it really wanted me to get It

1139
00:59:54.119 --> 00:59:56.320
really made me want to get a Doberman pincher because

1140
00:59:56.320 --> 00:59:59.800
that's why Razor is. And my wife, unfortune she loves dogs.

1141
01:00:00.079 --> 01:00:02.280
She had some trauma with a Doberman as a child,

1142
01:00:02.400 --> 01:00:03.800
so as you was like, you were never getting it.

1143
01:00:04.679 --> 01:00:10.960
But I mean, The Man Stopper is a fantastic dog

1144
01:00:11.199 --> 01:00:14.440
book if you're looking for a dog breed that's alternative

1145
01:00:14.480 --> 01:00:17.599
to Kujo. There's no poignant death of a small child

1146
01:00:17.639 --> 01:00:21.480
from dehydration, but there's a lot of emotional stuff with

1147
01:00:21.559 --> 01:00:24.639
the dogs because it's not the dog's fault that they're

1148
01:00:24.679 --> 01:00:26.519
they've been trained to do this, and you kind of

1149
01:00:26.519 --> 01:00:29.719
have a dog perspective on what's going on in Man.

1150
01:00:30.519 --> 01:00:34.039
And my message about be wary of animals, it really

1151
01:00:34.039 --> 01:00:38.239
all goes down to the training. I don't think any

1152
01:00:38.280 --> 01:00:40.599
dog breed is inherently evil.

1153
01:00:41.800 --> 01:00:45.280
It again goes back to what the the breed like.

1154
01:00:45.400 --> 01:00:49.119
I'm going obviously going into some breeds that have been banned,

1155
01:00:51.719 --> 01:00:54.039
and it's not the dog's fault. It's that they're often

1156
01:00:54.159 --> 01:00:59.440
used for fighting and and and that's obviously wrong for

1157
01:00:59.519 --> 01:01:03.440
so many But you get these people who train dogs

1158
01:01:03.480 --> 01:01:08.360
to fight illegally, and then they don't like leash their dogs,

1159
01:01:08.840 --> 01:01:11.119
and then of course the dogs go out and attack people.

1160
01:01:12.920 --> 01:01:15.079
But it all comes down to training. If we could

1161
01:01:15.119 --> 01:01:18.440
just take care of our animals to be loving creatures.

1162
01:01:18.440 --> 01:01:21.159
But then there's also the idea that some animals aren't

1163
01:01:21.199 --> 01:01:23.599
just like they're kind of like humans, they're just not.

1164
01:01:23.599 --> 01:01:27.599
Righting the head. Doberman's are a breed that's very stereotyped

1165
01:01:27.760 --> 01:01:30.760
as being a super aggressive killer dog because they are

1166
01:01:31.440 --> 01:01:34.239
used so much by security firms and the police and

1167
01:01:34.280 --> 01:01:37.840
military as attack dogs, just like German Shepherds, and they're

1168
01:01:38.199 --> 01:01:41.960
both highly intelligent breeds, so I mean, yeah, I mean

1169
01:01:42.000 --> 01:01:44.800
whether or not they are. My wife swears that they're vicious,

1170
01:01:45.480 --> 01:01:48.239
but like I said, bad experience with him. But I

1171
01:01:48.559 --> 01:01:50.320
would hope that, you know, if they were raised in

1172
01:01:50.360 --> 01:01:52.599
a kind of loving environment, you could have a wonderful

1173
01:01:52.880 --> 01:01:54.840
pet Doberman, which I will never be allowed to have.

1174
01:01:57.360 --> 01:01:59.519
Well, they look scary too, right, they do.

1175
01:01:59.719 --> 01:02:01.079
They're sleek and beautiful.

1176
01:02:01.440 --> 01:02:04.880
I think often they're used as like hounds of Hell

1177
01:02:05.119 --> 01:02:07.239
in movies. If you're going to have like a hound

1178
01:02:07.280 --> 01:02:09.800
of Hell, it's got to be a Doberman with the with.

1179
01:02:09.800 --> 01:02:14.039
The clipped tears and the clip tail, and you know,

1180
01:02:14.119 --> 01:02:16.079
it just looks like an evil dog right there.

1181
01:02:16.119 --> 01:02:20.679
But often they're just little cuddle bums, like like any poodle.

1182
01:02:20.760 --> 01:02:23.320
Right, going back to the greed thing, I think part

1183
01:02:23.320 --> 01:02:25.880
of that is what makes Quto work so well. Yeah,

1184
01:02:26.000 --> 01:02:28.639
the Saint Bernard, Yeah, because you don't typically think of

1185
01:02:28.679 --> 01:02:30.239
the Saint Bernard as the attack dog.

1186
01:02:33.880 --> 01:02:35.920
They're giant dogs, but they're.

1187
01:02:36.000 --> 01:02:38.920
Very kind of cute, lovable dogs.

1188
01:02:39.039 --> 01:02:42.440
Yeah, exactly, absolutely, And.

1189
01:02:42.480 --> 01:02:44.800
Would they rescue dogs at one point?

1190
01:02:44.599 --> 01:02:46.119
I think they were used for that.

1191
01:02:46.760 --> 01:02:50.159
Yeahs like Warner Brother cartoons, or there's Saint Bernards that

1192
01:02:50.199 --> 01:02:52.159
carry the little keg under their neck and the Arctic.

1193
01:02:52.320 --> 01:02:53.119
Yes, exactly.

1194
01:02:53.760 --> 01:02:56.280
I think King used the Saint Bernard in order to

1195
01:02:56.440 --> 01:03:00.039
like subvert the the expectation of that, right.

1196
01:03:01.079 --> 01:03:04.079
And it works brilliantly. I mean the movie version.

1197
01:03:03.840 --> 01:03:07.000
The dog just looks almost possessed, right, It's like it

1198
01:03:07.039 --> 01:03:08.840
gets all gray and covered in mud.

1199
01:03:08.920 --> 01:03:11.760
And speaking of dog attack books, I've got to throw

1200
01:03:11.760 --> 01:03:14.000
in one more, and that's The Pack. I think the

1201
01:03:14.039 --> 01:03:18.000
writer's David Fisher. It actually predates Kujo, and it is

1202
01:03:18.039 --> 01:03:22.239
a fantastic book and I'm gonna spoil it for you

1203
01:03:22.880 --> 01:03:25.960
because it's worth being spoiled for. Okay, it was written

1204
01:03:26.000 --> 01:03:30.400
in the seventies, yet a time where women don't quite

1205
01:03:30.480 --> 01:03:32.840
have everything they do today in terms of their riots

1206
01:03:32.880 --> 01:03:37.360
and how our cultural culture sees them. But in the Pack,

1207
01:03:37.519 --> 01:03:41.480
it's not the gun loving hunter brother, or the tough,

1208
01:03:41.679 --> 01:03:45.320
gnarly grandfather, or even the dad who saves the day.

1209
01:03:45.760 --> 01:03:49.079
In the Pack, it's the mom who steps up and

1210
01:03:49.119 --> 01:03:52.519
saves the survivors of the family from the dogs. And

1211
01:03:53.360 --> 01:03:57.440
I mean, to me, that was a very awesome thing

1212
01:03:57.920 --> 01:04:00.280
to be in that time period and have and a

1213
01:04:00.360 --> 01:04:05.280
strong female character who wasn't there for political reasons so much.

1214
01:04:05.360 --> 01:04:07.639
It's just it was realistic that the mom was gonna

1215
01:04:07.639 --> 01:04:10.559
be the one who saved your children, you know. And yeah,

1216
01:04:10.800 --> 01:04:15.360
that book just struck me as an often an underlooked

1217
01:04:15.639 --> 01:04:19.880
book that is a good representation of women as something

1218
01:04:19.960 --> 01:04:23.320
other than a screaming trope, you know, like you know

1219
01:04:23.360 --> 01:04:25.559
what I mean, the fall Down Girl, the girl who's

1220
01:04:25.599 --> 01:04:28.639
running and falls down, the Serial kill one movie. Yeah,

1221
01:04:28.880 --> 01:04:30.880
it's the mom taking charge of going you ain't eat

1222
01:04:30.960 --> 01:04:31.400
my kids.

1223
01:04:34.880 --> 01:04:39.519
You know. Mom's in the human animal kingdom can.

1224
01:04:39.440 --> 01:04:44.360
Be very, very very protective of their their kids, just

1225
01:04:44.400 --> 01:04:45.119
like beavers.

1226
01:04:46.119 --> 01:04:47.480
You don't want to mess with the mom.

1227
01:04:48.840 --> 01:04:52.840
Actually, it just struck me as a very you know,

1228
01:04:53.199 --> 01:04:57.440
ahead of its time novel because it is the female

1229
01:04:57.480 --> 01:05:01.079
protagonist who steps up at you well, I mean, the

1230
01:05:01.079 --> 01:05:03.480
female character steps up and save s the dame becomes

1231
01:05:03.519 --> 01:05:05.239
the main character of the book.

1232
01:05:05.719 --> 01:05:07.199
Yeah, and that's The Pack.

1233
01:05:08.079 --> 01:05:10.840
The Pack. Yep, there was a movie made in the seventies.

1234
01:05:11.119 --> 01:05:14.320
I think the name is David Fisher. It's spelt with

1235
01:05:14.320 --> 01:05:21.000
the Sea, I think. Okay, there are two books called

1236
01:05:21.039 --> 01:05:23.280
The Pack. The other one is written by guy named

1237
01:05:23.400 --> 01:05:27.199
Essex and I think that's his last name. And while

1238
01:05:27.239 --> 01:05:29.880
it is also a good book, it's not to me

1239
01:05:30.199 --> 01:05:34.159
as cultural culturally important as the pack. I mean, it

1240
01:05:34.239 --> 01:05:36.639
wasn't carrying that kind of a message, but and it

1241
01:05:36.679 --> 01:05:39.159
has kind of a weak ending. But the other pack

1242
01:05:39.239 --> 01:05:42.400
by Essex is also worth reading. It's just not as

1243
01:05:42.440 --> 01:05:45.079
amazing as Fisher's awesome.

1244
01:05:45.679 --> 01:05:49.119
Are there any more books you'd like to discuss.

1245
01:05:49.880 --> 01:05:55.079
Or have we I think we've covered a lot.

1246
01:05:56.880 --> 01:05:57.480
I think we have.

1247
01:05:57.800 --> 01:06:01.320
Yeah, yeahs immediately to mind.

1248
01:06:01.880 --> 01:06:05.920
All right, So I think I think we've we've nailed this,

1249
01:06:05.920 --> 01:06:08.639
this topic of animal attack. I want to thank you

1250
01:06:08.679 --> 01:06:16.119
for coming on and sharing your expertise with this and uh.

1251
01:06:14.960 --> 01:06:18.880
Yeah, so uh I think that's it. If you're done, Yeah,

1252
01:06:18.880 --> 01:06:19.320
I'm good.

1253
01:06:19.719 --> 01:06:21.320
Thank you for having me on the show. I really

1254
01:06:21.360 --> 01:06:22.199
appreciate it.

1255
01:06:22.559 --> 01:06:25.440
All right, And as always, you're always invited to come back.

1256
01:06:25.519 --> 01:06:29.480
Just let me know and we'll schedule something in the future.

1257
01:06:29.880 --> 01:06:32.360
And I'm sure that we will keep the viewers posted

1258
01:06:32.559 --> 01:06:35.639
on our collaboration and when it comes out this fall summer,

1259
01:06:35.880 --> 01:06:39.400
because it absolutely fun Animal Attacker, all.

1260
01:06:39.320 --> 01:06:41.599
Right, and thank you again for everything.

1261
01:06:42.400 --> 01:06:48.480
Thank you, Jason, and.

1262
01:06:54.360 --> 01:06:54.800
I want to.

1263
01:06:54.800 --> 01:06:58.400
Thank Eric for coming on the show, and for uh,

1264
01:06:58.639 --> 01:07:03.239
you know, just being my friend, and also for co

1265
01:07:03.280 --> 01:07:08.119
writing an animal attech book asking me to come along.

1266
01:07:08.239 --> 01:07:10.360
It's a funny story. People might think that I was

1267
01:07:10.400 --> 01:07:12.840
bugging him to do this, but no, he would He

1268
01:07:12.880 --> 01:07:15.920
bugged me. He wanted me to do this with him,

1269
01:07:16.519 --> 01:07:19.840
and that took me by surprise. He actually brought that up.

1270
01:07:19.880 --> 01:07:22.400
I think it was late twenty twenty four. He was like,

1271
01:07:22.400 --> 01:07:25.159
we should write a story together, and I was like, really,

1272
01:07:25.639 --> 01:07:28.119
I didn't think he actually wanted to do that. I

1273
01:07:28.199 --> 01:07:32.039
think he was just being nice and so I was like, yeah, sure,

1274
01:07:32.079 --> 01:07:34.920
we'll do that sometime. Just let me know when you're ready.

1275
01:07:35.000 --> 01:07:39.400
And it took a few months, but he was finally like,

1276
01:07:39.440 --> 01:07:41.719
all right, let's get this thing going. Do you have

1277
01:07:41.760 --> 01:07:43.719
any ideas where would you like? Where would you like

1278
01:07:43.760 --> 01:07:46.519
to go? And so I shot him an idea and

1279
01:07:46.840 --> 01:07:52.400
we've gone with it. And that's something I was not expecting.

1280
01:07:52.639 --> 01:07:55.519
It came out of left field, but I'm very happy

1281
01:07:55.760 --> 01:07:56.800
that it has happened.

1282
01:07:57.800 --> 01:07:59.000
It's going to be a lot of fun.

1283
01:07:59.360 --> 01:08:04.480
If you and gory animal attack stories, this one will

1284
01:08:04.519 --> 01:08:07.639
be right up your plate. I would say it's probably

1285
01:08:07.719 --> 01:08:10.360
a little on the extreme side here, and there, and

1286
01:08:10.719 --> 01:08:14.920
that's perfectly fine. I know there's an audience for it.

1287
01:08:15.000 --> 01:08:18.119
I am one of those audiences. I like fun, gory books,

1288
01:08:18.159 --> 01:08:21.279
but I you know, obviously I like the serious books

1289
01:08:21.279 --> 01:08:24.439
to the slow burns. But I am a man of

1290
01:08:24.600 --> 01:08:28.279
many tastes. So thanks again to Eric, and thank you,

1291
01:08:28.600 --> 01:08:31.640
dear listener, for listening. I can't tell you how much.

1292
01:08:31.720 --> 01:08:33.359
I appreciate you. Guys.

1293
01:08:34.319 --> 01:08:36.640
If you want to help support the show, if you

1294
01:08:36.640 --> 01:08:39.239
want to support what I'm doing here, you can do

1295
01:08:39.319 --> 01:08:42.479
so for free. It's very easy, and as I just said,

1296
01:08:42.560 --> 01:08:44.800
it's free. All you have to do is go on

1297
01:08:44.880 --> 01:08:49.079
to Spotify and rate the show, or you can go

1298
01:08:49.119 --> 01:08:52.920
to and this more than fifty percent of my audience

1299
01:08:53.119 --> 01:08:58.960
are Apple listeners, so they listen to my podcast mostly

1300
01:08:59.000 --> 01:09:03.439
on Apple. So if you could go there and rate

1301
01:09:03.479 --> 01:09:06.199
the show and give it a review. If I get

1302
01:09:06.279 --> 01:09:11.279
enough of those, then Apple and Spotify both know how

1303
01:09:11.319 --> 01:09:14.119
to share my show with other people who might like it,

1304
01:09:14.680 --> 01:09:17.560
and that helps the show grow. I would love to

1305
01:09:17.600 --> 01:09:23.039
see this show become bigger than it is and to

1306
01:09:23.079 --> 01:09:26.199
reach a wider audience, and I hope that you would

1307
01:09:26.279 --> 01:09:29.800
want to help me in that venture as well. So

1308
01:09:30.199 --> 01:09:33.840
until next time, I hope that you all are having

1309
01:09:33.880 --> 01:09:36.800
a fantastic week. And I should mention before I go here,

1310
01:09:36.880 --> 01:09:40.159
there's going to be an extra episode tomorrow, and that

1311
01:09:40.319 --> 01:09:43.800
is my conversation with Michael David Wilson on his latest book,

1312
01:09:43.920 --> 01:09:47.960
Daddy Boy Daddy's Boy. It releases tomorrow as of the

1313
01:09:48.079 --> 01:09:52.279
drop time or date of this episode, so that's Tuesday,

1314
01:09:52.319 --> 01:09:55.119
May sixth, and you will also be able to listen

1315
01:09:55.199 --> 01:09:58.960
to Michael David Wilson and me discuss many things tomorrow.

1316
01:09:59.520 --> 01:10:03.359
We talk about a lot of stuff, including his latest book,

1317
01:10:03.880 --> 01:10:06.720
Daddy's Boy. It was a fantastic conversation. I was so

1318
01:10:06.880 --> 01:10:10.439
happy to talk to him for a second time as well.

1319
01:10:10.520 --> 01:10:13.439
So go do all the things.

1320
01:10:13.560 --> 01:10:16.520
Please do all the things, and I will catch you

1321
01:10:16.560 --> 01:10:19.960
guys next time. But until then, keep being weird, my friends,

1322
01:10:20.680 --> 01:10:24.359
because being weird in today's world is so very important.

1323
01:10:25.000 --> 01:11:11.479
And I I'll catch you guys in the next episode.