Worldbuilding

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welcome thinkers to season 4 episode 18

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of thinking critically a DND discussion

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continuing the trend this is now a video

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podcast so if you feel like it you can

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head over to my YouTube channel if you

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just search think crit DND or thinking

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critically DND you should be able to

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find me and the link will be in the

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episode description as per usual

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or on Spotify itself you should be able

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to watch this as a video on there as

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well he says fingers crossed uh so yes

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oh yes uh and you'll probably notice

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that my video in this one is a bit

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choppy I'm not sure what happened my

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frame rate was just like single digits

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for my webcam at the time so please look

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past it hopefully now you can tell I've

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improved it somewhat but yeah otherwise

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please accept my apologies and that

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isn't going to happen in future episodes

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oh and of course if you're watching the

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video you could even see now my cute

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little doggo down there hello

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and if you're listening to this on the

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day it drops then you can find me

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playing in our dungeons Dyson dudes

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stream on Sunday the

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29th if you go to twitch.tv d d n d p o

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d d n d pod you will find me and our

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lovely Liam Nathan the brigsy plan our

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remorse campaign so go ahead and check

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us out there if you want to see me as a

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player otherwise let's get on with the

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show

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thank you foreign

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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Ed by Harlan thank you ever so much for

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joining us today Harlan can you tell us

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a little bit about yourself uh thank you

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for having me uh my name is Harlan

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I live in Rhode Island in the United

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States

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I've been playing this game since 1978

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I've been a dungeon master since 1984.

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and I I think that just makes me old

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really

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experienced experience yeah yeah real

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quality experience

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when I became disabled I suddenly had a

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lot of time on my hands

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and I had a hobby sort of just waiting

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for me and I

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I just dove into it

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dove into it yeah absolutely well you

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have a wealth of experience then which

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is great for today's topic which is

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World building so what does that word

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mean to you and it is a single word

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don't add me what does that word mean to

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you

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uh in the DND and wider ttrpg framework

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uh the it's different for each World

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Builder uh from what I understand

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there's three distinct kinds of World

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building the way that I do it uh the way

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that I like to play and the way that I

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like to structure my games

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is um

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I create the scene

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and the very first scenario

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and then I just throw the characters at

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it

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so I know everything around them and

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what's happening all the NPCs what their

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accents would be what they would be

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eating what the smells would you know

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I'm more able to just react to whatever

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the characters want to do

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um because I have this philosophy of

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saying yes as often as possible so I

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just um I really designed the scene

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before I design the game

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okay so if okay so then

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when you let's define those terms then

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so we know a little bit more what you're

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saying there so when you say scene what

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would you define that as then it would

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be anything from uh

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piece of action I guess

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um anything from a good good bit of role

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play to uh combat encounter

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um I like to throw I I just call them

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Beauty encounters and I know but like

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you know you know you roll with one on a

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D6 a little random encounter well you

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roll a six on a D6 you should see how

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good looking that Vista is That's So

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Vista

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okay so I just make sure I have the

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vistas there and it's also

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it's a very cathartic Hobby

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yeah oh yes the World building aspect of

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it specifically yeah yeah it's really

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good for getting outside of myself

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yeah okay let's let's dive into that

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then specifically we'll come back to the

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other elements later but then I want to

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talk about and there's a reason why I'm

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so hot on this is because I've recently

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started looking at myself getting back

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into

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40K Warhammer right I was in it once a

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lot and I I went cold turkey and pulled

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out and yes I find myself being paused

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back in again and I'm having to remind

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myself before I go and drop way too much

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money that like

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there's a lot of painting down low and

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you're not very good at it and it takes

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a long time but I love the kind of oh if

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I take one weapon off of the air that

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gives me some points back which then

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gives that person a different Power

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which means that this that like I love

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that and of course I love having a big

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Fantasy war game because who doesn't

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that's really cool

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but what I'm getting at is then

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there's different like you can bundle it

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all in together in Warhammer but there's

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very much different like different

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pillars of that Hobby and you can be

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really really passionate about one or

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two of them and not so much about a

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third and vice versa and

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I often don't think

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like I don't think of d d in that same

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way which is my fault in that I I just

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again I maybe haven't spent enough time

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with it but I it does all get kind of

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bundled up into the one big

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flow of dming and then

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playing it's all this one big homogenous

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experience for me so it's really

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interesting to then just to come at it

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from that point of view that like no

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consider World building this like a

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self-contained activity almost you know

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uh that itself is the goal I guess maybe

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that's what I'm trying to communicate

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that like

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World building as a means to an end

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whereas it can very much be its own goal

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its own reward right that and that right

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there is why I do it I have

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discovered World Anvil and they not only

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have a SQL base that I can link

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everything to

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and keep everything together but

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um they have writing prompts

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so say I need a new character and I'm I

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can't there's something I can't

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I just can't figure out how to write

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they'll have a prompt right underneath

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the content box it's a really great

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great tool um especially so I have I

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have brain damage that's how I I'm out

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of work

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so I need that um

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that connection to be able to connect

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everything you know and it works so well

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and it's

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I've been able to start putting

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everything in it like I've I've been

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designing this world for 30 years

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I don't know I it's so cathartic I've

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got about a quarter of a million words

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into it

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excuse me yeah yeah I've been doing it

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for a while on but the the words that

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word Anvil will give you a word count

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and so I've got almost a quarter of a

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million a million words written them

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yeah

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I like to flex on people because I say

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oh I did you know I did my University

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dissertation I did 10 000 words this

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year 10 000 words that year that's just

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like nothing now that's pathetic I mean

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I'm you know this is many years though

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yeah still you know I mean oh that

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that's a that's a fun I mean even in my

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DND world that's been going on

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a good I guess if you include the first

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like beta test I ran on it like four

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years is nowhere I mean I don't know the

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number because the tools I used aren't

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that great but uh it definitely isn't

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anywhere near that so that's that's

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phenomenal

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um actually do you know what I'm lying

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to you all because I do write I used to

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write the episode Recaps and then I was

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keeping those in chronological order

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because then that kind of is a story

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written in of itself

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and at one point I did migrate them all

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into something that could count how many

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words there are and I was like holy [ __ ]

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that is actually about 10K here yeah

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yeah I thought whoa

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man when I was at Uni I was stressing so

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much about hitting that word count and

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this time I've just like done it like

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for fun

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now now I've I've um

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delegated that task to my players so

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they they ride it and then they read it

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out and I get to put my feet up uh and

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it's great now

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yeah that's a that's a good good

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practice yes yes so yeah World Anvil

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then because I have a I've heard of it

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and B I have

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I tried it briefly you know years ago I

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you know Pokemon you know you see it

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online paint your nose and have a little

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look yeah yeah I is that the one that

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you can do can you do

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um I know you can like maps and put pins

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on maps and have the text kind of pop

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out of of that yeah this was that the

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one where you can do like timelines like

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you know epochs and stuff as well

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because that's that's what originally

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drew me to it to be like at the moment

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I'm doing it Excel and it's clunky and

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doesn't really look like a timeline

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yeah it's got timelines and Chronicles

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so you can break a timeline down into

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um individual years months days

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and the chronicle is helpful if you have

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something happening over time

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so the way that I that I've written

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what's going on now I've got three

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different groups that are in the world

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at the same time working sort of towards

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the same goal just from different angles

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is that player groups yes oh yeah oh

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okay Brave yep awesome oh it's so fun

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too because they're so bloody chaotic ah

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yes of course because udm

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for one of my previous guests don't you

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I do I do Aaron yes and on his episode

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he was saying about how he well one of

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his sessions they met one of the other

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parties

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and now it's all coming together it's

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all making sense now

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yeah they um they all came together for

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sort of a desert death match at one

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point

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uh but it's more of a you know

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the writing of it for me the creating of

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the world

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and the creation of this story

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of the plot line I guess is is

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that's the big draw for me as much as I

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love playing I love playing because of

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my friends that I'm with you know it's

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not so much oh I love doing math yeah

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you know so yeah I just want to find

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00:11:41,579 --> 00:11:46,019
yeah Aaron was on uh chaos I think

277
00:11:43,680 --> 00:11:50,120
probably appropriately enough for Aaron

278
00:11:46,019 --> 00:11:54,180
uh he was and yes you are correct

279
00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:54,720
no I know you won't mind us saying that

280
00:11:54,180 --> 00:11:56,399
um

281
00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:57,660
but yes of course then I remember him

282
00:11:56,399 --> 00:11:59,339
saying about that I was jumping off a

283
00:11:57,660 --> 00:12:01,200
Airship onto another Airship or

284
00:11:59,339 --> 00:12:03,600
something and he's changing into a tree

285
00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:06,120
and all this other kind of stuff and

286
00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:08,760
again that that kind of

287
00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:10,980
multiple PC in a single world I don't

288
00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:13,500
know I'd I'd need to do some serious

289
00:12:10,980 --> 00:12:16,260
prep for that before I do when I brought

290
00:12:13,500 --> 00:12:20,459
the three groups together I also asked

291
00:12:16,260 --> 00:12:23,820
Ron from severed Sons oh yes to to be

292
00:12:20,459 --> 00:12:27,480
another DM so we had two DMS running the

293
00:12:23,820 --> 00:12:28,920
game at the same time okay okay and how

294
00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:30,300
was that stab we're gonna digress a

295
00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:32,100
little bit there but I am curious

296
00:12:30,300 --> 00:12:34,200
because on one of my previous episodes

297
00:12:32,100 --> 00:12:36,240
the end of season one live I spoke to a

298
00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:39,360
lady then and she was saying about how

299
00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:40,560
she was kind of helping to co-dm so I

300
00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:41,399
just wondered how that how that worked

301
00:12:40,560 --> 00:12:44,820
for you

302
00:12:41,399 --> 00:12:46,260
so well in this particular plate we just

303
00:12:44,820 --> 00:12:49,680
um would

304
00:12:46,260 --> 00:12:52,260
we did it over Discord we would just DM

305
00:12:49,680 --> 00:12:55,139
each other if anything strange came up

306
00:12:52,260 --> 00:12:56,940
which of course strange things came up

307
00:12:55,139 --> 00:12:59,220
because all of a sudden the tree showed

308
00:12:56,940 --> 00:13:01,860
up on one of the Airship it's an Airship

309
00:12:59,220 --> 00:13:03,779
it's going to start sinking so then you

310
00:13:01,860 --> 00:13:05,760
know he and I had to talk back and forth

311
00:13:03,779 --> 00:13:08,540
about how fast is it going to sink what

312
00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:13,139
happens if it crashes that kind of thing

313
00:13:08,540 --> 00:13:17,220
but I also am very much of the mind of

314
00:13:13,139 --> 00:13:18,240
let the players play Let Them write the

315
00:13:17,220 --> 00:13:20,940
story

316
00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:23,579
I love that I love that

317
00:13:20,940 --> 00:13:26,160
okay that's that's a good segue then

318
00:13:23,579 --> 00:13:28,500
because I wanna I am gonna put you on

319
00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:30,600
the spot now right all right because you

320
00:13:28,500 --> 00:13:32,399
said earlier how you love you know the

321
00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:34,440
World building aspect is a goal and of

322
00:13:32,399 --> 00:13:36,959
itself and you really love this you know

323
00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:39,420
this epochs and spanning and then you

324
00:13:36,959 --> 00:13:40,620
know a huge world and then on the other

325
00:13:39,420 --> 00:13:42,600
hand you've also said you know let the

326
00:13:40,620 --> 00:13:44,700
players write the story and the reason

327
00:13:42,600 --> 00:13:47,519
why I want to ask you about how you

328
00:13:44,700 --> 00:13:50,220
manage those sometimes two opposing

329
00:13:47,519 --> 00:13:51,980
forces is because that's often a problem

330
00:13:50,220 --> 00:13:56,100
that a lot of newer

331
00:13:51,980 --> 00:13:58,740
DMS have is that how do I let go of my

332
00:13:56,100 --> 00:14:01,440
creation almost certainly how I feel

333
00:13:58,740 --> 00:14:03,120
sometimes so how do you approach that on

334
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,339
these such you know these Grand vast

335
00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:07,740
scales of a quarter of a million words

336
00:14:05,339 --> 00:14:10,040
like how do you manage that with the

337
00:14:07,740 --> 00:14:14,279
players I find a good group of people

338
00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:17,220
yep and then I look forward to whatever

339
00:14:14,279 --> 00:14:21,660
the hell it is that they do

340
00:14:17,220 --> 00:14:25,260
I love the Elegance that that game with

341
00:14:21,660 --> 00:14:28,800
Aaron and plume just for example he

342
00:14:25,260 --> 00:14:32,700
he he had been dead broke he came into

343
00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:35,180
like 10 000 gold all at once and he put

344
00:14:32,700 --> 00:14:41,220
it all on black

345
00:14:35,180 --> 00:14:43,579
lost it did not care yeah you know and

346
00:14:41,220 --> 00:14:46,079
it was just so hilarious

347
00:14:43,579 --> 00:14:48,060
I think I love the Elegance of that that

348
00:14:46,079 --> 00:14:50,579
answer you know like so you know it

349
00:14:48,060 --> 00:14:52,380
would be very easy to be to go off into

350
00:14:50,579 --> 00:14:55,740
the Academia of like

351
00:14:52,380 --> 00:14:57,180
do this do that and 80 and 20 and all

352
00:14:55,740 --> 00:14:59,100
this other stuff but I think that answer

353
00:14:57,180 --> 00:15:02,100
of like find a group good group of

354
00:14:59,100 --> 00:15:06,720
players is literally the Silver Bullet

355
00:15:02,100 --> 00:15:09,540
of pretty much in 99 of of TT RPG

356
00:15:06,720 --> 00:15:11,880
questions uh I know I am exceptionally

357
00:15:09,540 --> 00:15:14,699
fortunate to have found three groups of

358
00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:17,399
good players that I same same here same

359
00:15:14,699 --> 00:15:19,980
here very very fortunate indeed because

360
00:15:17,399 --> 00:15:23,699
you obviously there's it's it's hard

361
00:15:19,980 --> 00:15:26,279
harder and and harder obviously to be

362
00:15:23,699 --> 00:15:29,279
clear there are no you know

363
00:15:26,279 --> 00:15:30,839
they're infrequently is it a bad game

364
00:15:29,279 --> 00:15:31,800
it's just not a game for for you

365
00:15:30,839 --> 00:15:33,000
although people you're not playing with

366
00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:34,680
you don't Vibe with and that's totally

367
00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:37,079
okay and that's you know

368
00:15:34,680 --> 00:15:38,639
time to to find a different game

369
00:15:37,079 --> 00:15:42,600
until you strike gold it's just that

370
00:15:38,639 --> 00:15:43,940
yeah as I said um exceptionally lucky to

371
00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:48,600
yeah

372
00:15:43,940 --> 00:15:52,579
but these just good people to begin with

373
00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:55,760
and then they're amazing players

374
00:15:52,579 --> 00:16:00,199
they should not be alive right now

375
00:15:55,760 --> 00:16:03,180
their characters should not be around

376
00:16:00,199 --> 00:16:04,860
so in that case then

377
00:16:03,180 --> 00:16:07,019
well let me let me reframe the question

378
00:16:04,860 --> 00:16:10,560
then actually let me let me let me put

379
00:16:07,019 --> 00:16:13,579
myself out there first so for my big 90

380
00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:16,860
plus session three-year going campaign

381
00:16:13,579 --> 00:16:18,120
with varying players of some of and

382
00:16:16,860 --> 00:16:19,680
another ones just dropped out recently

383
00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:21,779
unfortunately due to life matters which

384
00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:25,320
again is totally okay so that brings us

385
00:16:21,779 --> 00:16:28,019
back down to four players going forward

386
00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:29,639
the way I do it right is I've got a big

387
00:16:28,019 --> 00:16:32,699
bad that's fine

388
00:16:29,639 --> 00:16:34,740
they have a plan that is

389
00:16:32,699 --> 00:16:36,120
kind of in motion

390
00:16:34,740 --> 00:16:36,779
I don't know I don't want to say too

391
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,639
much

392
00:16:36,779 --> 00:16:41,880
the players can kind of pick and choose

393
00:16:38,639 --> 00:16:43,680
their way to

394
00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:45,839
getting mcguffins that will help them

395
00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:47,459
against the big bad

396
00:16:45,839 --> 00:16:49,079
and then each of those macguffins is

397
00:16:47,459 --> 00:16:50,940
kind of a self-contained

398
00:16:49,079 --> 00:16:52,800
story with the beginning and the middle

399
00:16:50,940 --> 00:16:54,300
and an end

400
00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:56,399
so that that's the that's the

401
00:16:54,300 --> 00:16:59,100
overarching like

402
00:16:56,399 --> 00:17:00,660
story there's a big bad

403
00:16:59,100 --> 00:17:03,300
he's got some

404
00:17:00,660 --> 00:17:06,299
Eldritch unknowable mischievous scheme

405
00:17:03,300 --> 00:17:07,500
probably maybe who knows is a baddie but

406
00:17:06,299 --> 00:17:08,939
that's all that that's all they need to

407
00:17:07,500 --> 00:17:09,900
know at this point

408
00:17:08,939 --> 00:17:12,360
um

409
00:17:09,900 --> 00:17:14,220
and I guess I'm answering the own

410
00:17:12,360 --> 00:17:15,360
question here by saying I haven't gone

411
00:17:14,220 --> 00:17:16,559
into that much detail yet because you

412
00:17:15,360 --> 00:17:19,500
guess you don't need to until you get to

413
00:17:16,559 --> 00:17:21,120
that point but uh and yeah each

414
00:17:19,500 --> 00:17:23,100
individual chapter as I'm calling them

415
00:17:21,120 --> 00:17:25,679
an arc or book

416
00:17:23,100 --> 00:17:28,980
um is its own beginning in middle of an

417
00:17:25,679 --> 00:17:30,840
end and how I do those is I kind of

418
00:17:28,980 --> 00:17:33,480
start with a

419
00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:35,100
conceit or a cool idea like wouldn't it

420
00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:38,039
be cool if they went to a place and X

421
00:17:35,100 --> 00:17:39,360
was happening and it caused why and then

422
00:17:38,039 --> 00:17:41,700
it all just

423
00:17:39,360 --> 00:17:44,100
kind of explodes out from there so

424
00:17:41,700 --> 00:17:46,200
that's that's how I tend to do it and

425
00:17:44,100 --> 00:17:49,020
then although obviously the DM's in

426
00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:51,120
control and there's a bunch of actors

427
00:17:49,020 --> 00:17:52,799
and by actors I mean in the scientific

428
00:17:51,120 --> 00:17:54,360
term in this kind of bubble there are

429
00:17:52,799 --> 00:17:55,740
things happening and people with goals

430
00:17:54,360 --> 00:17:56,640
objectives and stuff but it's a closed

431
00:17:55,740 --> 00:17:58,440
system

432
00:17:56,640 --> 00:18:00,480
the way I see it in my head is that the

433
00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:03,059
players come in and they they are the

434
00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:06,900
the external agents that come in and

435
00:18:03,059 --> 00:18:09,240
have the agency to go and do

436
00:18:06,900 --> 00:18:11,940
and then change things more than the

437
00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:13,620
average person can inside that bubble so

438
00:18:11,940 --> 00:18:15,840
things are happening in a bubble they

439
00:18:13,620 --> 00:18:20,039
come in and that's when

440
00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:21,960
we divert from the true thread of time

441
00:18:20,039 --> 00:18:24,419
that would have happened if they if the

442
00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:27,480
players hadn't been there so the

443
00:18:24,419 --> 00:18:29,039
benefits of that for me at least are

444
00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:31,020
that

445
00:18:29,039 --> 00:18:32,520
I'm not like the whole point is that the

446
00:18:31,020 --> 00:18:33,960
you know the players of these agents of

447
00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:36,780
chaos that can come in and have the

448
00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:39,059
agency to go and change the future in in

449
00:18:36,780 --> 00:18:40,679
a way in a weird sense the more I'm

450
00:18:39,059 --> 00:18:42,299
explaining it the more I'm like

451
00:18:40,679 --> 00:18:44,400
have a predestined future and the

452
00:18:42,299 --> 00:18:45,660
players or like I like Time Travelers

453
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,280
almost they're like changing the course

454
00:18:45,660 --> 00:18:48,780
of history but in fact they're not

455
00:18:47,280 --> 00:18:50,940
because it hasn't really happened yet

456
00:18:48,780 --> 00:18:55,200
it's only happened in my head I've gone

457
00:18:50,940 --> 00:18:57,360
like way Naval gazing right now you've

458
00:18:55,200 --> 00:19:00,120
just you just human me as I slipped into

459
00:18:57,360 --> 00:19:01,100
like this the spiral of God what am I

460
00:19:00,120 --> 00:19:03,860
doing here

461
00:19:01,100 --> 00:19:06,360
no that was great

462
00:19:03,860 --> 00:19:08,220
so how does that how does that align

463
00:19:06,360 --> 00:19:11,340
with like you uh and there are other

464
00:19:08,220 --> 00:19:15,419
other better ways to do it there but so

465
00:19:11,340 --> 00:19:19,559
I do it by uh it's different per per big

466
00:19:15,419 --> 00:19:23,100
Baddie uh the one at the moment has

467
00:19:19,559 --> 00:19:24,780
usurped hell as medeas is a bartender in

468
00:19:23,100 --> 00:19:28,860
a little town out west

469
00:19:24,780 --> 00:19:30,260
and so she's already been working

470
00:19:28,860 --> 00:19:33,720
towards the power

471
00:19:30,260 --> 00:19:35,600
vast organization her plans are already

472
00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:40,740
in motion

473
00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:43,860
and then the players find out oh [ __ ] I

474
00:19:40,740 --> 00:19:47,160
better go stop this or she's gonna do

475
00:19:43,860 --> 00:19:49,380
what you know things like that she

476
00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:50,700
kidnapped in entire Village's worth of

477
00:19:49,380 --> 00:19:53,039
people

478
00:19:50,700 --> 00:19:54,900
so she could put him in her Tamarind

479
00:19:53,039 --> 00:19:57,780
trees which

480
00:19:54,900 --> 00:19:58,919
eat the people transfer it and it's a

481
00:19:57,780 --> 00:20:01,559
thing

482
00:19:58,919 --> 00:20:03,900
um but they were like what they she did

483
00:20:01,559 --> 00:20:06,179
what and so they went and raided her

484
00:20:03,900 --> 00:20:09,660
yeah it's um

485
00:20:06,179 --> 00:20:12,720
it's more like that you know so when

486
00:20:09,660 --> 00:20:15,059
they come upon the scene is there's just

487
00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:19,140
already something happening

488
00:20:15,059 --> 00:20:20,940
there's already something going on yeah

489
00:20:19,140 --> 00:20:23,220
I guess what I've

490
00:20:20,940 --> 00:20:26,760
I did as well I think that really helps

491
00:20:23,220 --> 00:20:29,220
also Galvanize the party and new players

492
00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:31,559
by having that like oh something's

493
00:20:29,220 --> 00:20:35,039
already happening so you're kind of got

494
00:20:31,559 --> 00:20:36,660
the stream is Flowing it's a metaphor

495
00:20:35,039 --> 00:20:38,220
that has just appeared into my head

496
00:20:36,660 --> 00:20:39,960
instead of like plunking the players

497
00:20:38,220 --> 00:20:41,400
into a lake you're plunking them into a

498
00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:43,740
river and there's a bit of a current

499
00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:46,440
that's like yeah you've got the the

500
00:20:43,740 --> 00:20:49,260
width of the river but like you're going

501
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:52,860
in a you're going and things are moving

502
00:20:49,260 --> 00:20:55,980
in this particular direction yeah

503
00:20:52,860 --> 00:20:58,020
okay that's a great metaphor I was

504
00:20:55,980 --> 00:21:00,919
hoping you you weren't going to be like

505
00:20:58,020 --> 00:21:05,220
what the [ __ ] are you talking about

506
00:21:00,919 --> 00:21:07,500
now that's a great metaphor if you I I

507
00:21:05,220 --> 00:21:09,240
almost went off on a tangent I apologize

508
00:21:07,500 --> 00:21:10,440
no please go what what do you think I've

509
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:12,179
just been doing for five minutes please

510
00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:14,840
please go this was gonna be about

511
00:21:12,179 --> 00:21:18,000
electrical current and how

512
00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:21,960
the voltage is the river and the

513
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:23,880
amperages yeah yeah yeah yeah so it

514
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:25,860
really is it's a good metaphor in that

515
00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:27,960
it just makes a lot of sense and a whole

516
00:21:25,860 --> 00:21:29,640
lot of different levels yeah I'm

517
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,020
absolutely familiar with the voltage

518
00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:32,640
current amps or the other one they use

519
00:21:31,020 --> 00:21:34,500
is like the width of the pipe and the

520
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:36,659
flow of the water through the pipe yeah

521
00:21:34,500 --> 00:21:39,120
yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah familiar

522
00:21:36,659 --> 00:21:43,140
familiar with that one and I also don't

523
00:21:39,120 --> 00:21:46,860
have my expectations for the end set in

524
00:21:43,140 --> 00:21:49,799
stone they could lose

525
00:21:46,860 --> 00:21:51,960
yeah and in this particular case if they

526
00:21:49,799 --> 00:21:54,900
lose the primordial Annihilation is

527
00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:58,320
going to consume everything

528
00:21:54,900 --> 00:22:02,340
so that is I mean I completely agree

529
00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:04,140
I've yes if they go most common the most

530
00:22:02,340 --> 00:22:07,500
likely pass they're going to end up in a

531
00:22:04,140 --> 00:22:09,720
confrontation with the big bad and yes

532
00:22:07,500 --> 00:22:12,120
you can bet that he's going to have his

533
00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:13,919
monologue come have a high water I'm

534
00:22:12,120 --> 00:22:15,120
going to mute them all on Discord if I

535
00:22:13,919 --> 00:22:17,100
have to but he's gonna have his damn

536
00:22:15,120 --> 00:22:18,799
monologue I'll meet them in game and in

537
00:22:17,100 --> 00:22:22,620
real life

538
00:22:18,799 --> 00:22:25,140
but then following that like they they

539
00:22:22,620 --> 00:22:26,820
could absolutely lose like for sure like

540
00:22:25,140 --> 00:22:29,220
I'd kind of

541
00:22:26,820 --> 00:22:31,919
be reticent to play in it to be a player

542
00:22:29,220 --> 00:22:34,740
and a campaign if I knew oh okay like if

543
00:22:31,919 --> 00:22:37,799
it got to a point where it was down to a

544
00:22:34,740 --> 00:22:39,600
final swing and oh I'd be like I know

545
00:22:37,799 --> 00:22:41,000
the DM's just going to give us this oh

546
00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:43,200
okay well

547
00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:44,640
like that's it's over it's over now

548
00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:46,260
before we haven't before we've even

549
00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:48,900
rolled the last dice which is to me the

550
00:22:46,260 --> 00:22:50,880
whole point of the game you know so

551
00:22:48,900 --> 00:22:53,460
I I want that last roller dice to be

552
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:57,299
like oh my God this is make or break

553
00:22:53,460 --> 00:23:00,480
like that those are the right clenching

554
00:22:57,299 --> 00:23:02,520
yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I mean we we've

555
00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:04,320
had them on a micro scale and the the

556
00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:06,059
campaign that I play and then

557
00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:08,820
there's another podcast that dungeon

558
00:23:06,059 --> 00:23:10,080
size and dudes guys where

559
00:23:08,820 --> 00:23:11,820
yeah it's not something like big like

560
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,720
world ending events but in the micro of

561
00:23:11,820 --> 00:23:14,820
like

562
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:17,460
I could save my my fellow party member

563
00:23:14,820 --> 00:23:19,380
here or you could die if I don't get

564
00:23:17,460 --> 00:23:20,940
this Misty step off properly or I take

565
00:23:19,380 --> 00:23:22,380
an opportunity attack from the Mystic

566
00:23:20,940 --> 00:23:23,640
you know from moving away and then that

567
00:23:22,380 --> 00:23:25,620
will be the one that knocks me down like

568
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:27,419
those there the bits that are like you

569
00:23:25,620 --> 00:23:28,500
remember they're like knocked in your

570
00:23:27,419 --> 00:23:30,900
head

571
00:23:28,500 --> 00:23:32,940
um and that's why I love the idea of

572
00:23:30,900 --> 00:23:34,140
you know in the world you build there

573
00:23:32,940 --> 00:23:37,620
being

574
00:23:34,140 --> 00:23:40,200
the the chance to fail I guess to get

575
00:23:37,620 --> 00:23:43,320
real like and there's plenty of chances

576
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:45,240
to fail too because you know the big bad

577
00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:48,179
there's all kinds of little beds

578
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:50,580
underneath her hmm and not all of those

579
00:23:48,179 --> 00:23:53,220
little bads are dumb they're not just

580
00:23:50,580 --> 00:23:55,740
gonna show up to a battle

581
00:23:53,220 --> 00:23:58,039
and be like let's fight they're gonna

582
00:23:55,740 --> 00:24:02,400
use the terrain to their advantage yeah

583
00:23:58,039 --> 00:24:03,900
if their Hideout is a warehouse

584
00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:06,419
they're going to know everything about

585
00:24:03,900 --> 00:24:08,220
the warehouse yes yes is there anything

586
00:24:06,419 --> 00:24:10,080
like

587
00:24:08,220 --> 00:24:12,539
you know criminal they're going to look

588
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:17,640
and figure out how to defend it how to

589
00:24:12,539 --> 00:24:20,039
how to see if somebody's coming uh you

590
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:21,720
know just like defenses alerts yeah

591
00:24:20,039 --> 00:24:23,640
there would be all kinds of different

592
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:26,940
things set up it wouldn't just be them

593
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:28,260
in a back room playing cards I love this

594
00:24:26,940 --> 00:24:29,700
because I can see I can see it even

595
00:24:28,260 --> 00:24:32,159
though we're separated by thousands of

596
00:24:29,700 --> 00:24:33,659
miles I can see the the diamonds in your

597
00:24:32,159 --> 00:24:35,520
eyes when you're talking about that

598
00:24:33,659 --> 00:24:36,960
stuff I can see that's why you love the

599
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:39,120
world building because you're having

600
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:40,320
those thoughts now of being like Oh and

601
00:24:39,120 --> 00:24:41,460
what if they set up you know they had a

602
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,380
century and they'd know that there's

603
00:24:41,460 --> 00:24:45,120
like a trapdoor between these two rooms

604
00:24:43,380 --> 00:24:47,760
that they could you know they they turn

605
00:24:45,120 --> 00:24:49,380
around a stack of you know boxes and

606
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,520
they'd just disappeared but it's because

607
00:24:49,380 --> 00:24:52,620
they've gone through a secret entrance

608
00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:55,559
that only they know like that that is

609
00:24:52,620 --> 00:24:58,200
again for me as well that is

610
00:24:55,559 --> 00:24:59,640
I love the anticipation almost you know

611
00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,799
of those

612
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:03,659
those kinds of oh I've set this thing up

613
00:25:01,799 --> 00:25:04,919
I'm so looking forward to what the

614
00:25:03,659 --> 00:25:07,740
players are going to do with it like

615
00:25:04,919 --> 00:25:09,539
they go one way or the other I said

616
00:25:07,740 --> 00:25:13,260
warehouses that's because I just did

617
00:25:09,539 --> 00:25:16,440
that yeah it was just on the top of my

618
00:25:13,260 --> 00:25:20,400
mind I love doing that yup this is here

619
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:20,400
it is right here go

620
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:26,640
I've got in in my game a good example of

621
00:25:23,820 --> 00:25:28,140
that is uh if at least I say myself is I

622
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:31,080
I think I mentioned it on the previous

623
00:25:28,140 --> 00:25:33,120
show sorry listeners uh my party have

624
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:34,460
got a group of doppelganger not literal

625
00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:36,480
doppelgangers it's not like

626
00:25:34,460 --> 00:25:38,760
doppelganger's TM stat block I mean

627
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:40,740
people that look like them they're but

628
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,360
they're racing class swapped it was

629
00:25:40,740 --> 00:25:45,240
meant to be a goof it turned into like

630
00:25:42,360 --> 00:25:47,340
oh no this is now like a straight up

631
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:49,380
story beat instead of a Goliath

632
00:25:47,340 --> 00:25:51,419
Barbarian it's a Goliath Rogue and

633
00:25:49,380 --> 00:25:53,039
instead of the elf Road gets a total

634
00:25:51,419 --> 00:25:56,460
Rogue and they're all kind of exchanged

635
00:25:53,039 --> 00:25:59,279
up and down all the names are anagrams

636
00:25:56,460 --> 00:26:01,559
somewhat easier to anagram out uh but

637
00:25:59,279 --> 00:26:03,179
one of the players was called Smith and

638
00:26:01,559 --> 00:26:06,720
I didn't have a whole lot to work with

639
00:26:03,179 --> 00:26:09,120
so that became Tim or Tim as we like to

640
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:13,020
say now anyway

641
00:26:09,120 --> 00:26:14,159
the the focal point of the two groups is

642
00:26:13,020 --> 00:26:15,720
because I wanted to focus on this one of

643
00:26:14,159 --> 00:26:17,100
the players a human warlock so that's

644
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,440
the only combination that wasn't swapped

645
00:26:17,100 --> 00:26:22,620
to highlight the players this is his

646
00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:24,299
kind of backstory thing so there's a

647
00:26:22,620 --> 00:26:28,080
human warlock in the other group and he

648
00:26:24,299 --> 00:26:30,059
is like a mirror of and I I love playing

649
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:32,520
it because that guy is is charismatic in

650
00:26:30,059 --> 00:26:34,919
life he's charismatic a character

651
00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:36,480
very annoying character very like I'm

652
00:26:34,919 --> 00:26:38,460
the leader everyone listen to me I'm the

653
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,539
best la la la you're all my peons and

654
00:26:38,460 --> 00:26:41,340
you'll do what I say and everyone

655
00:26:39,539 --> 00:26:42,900
follows me and they all kind of humor

656
00:26:41,340 --> 00:26:45,720
him and put up with him so I loved

657
00:26:42,900 --> 00:26:47,159
playing a foil to that because I know

658
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,640
the players are like oh my God there's

659
00:26:47,159 --> 00:26:49,640
two of them

660
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:54,059
um

661
00:26:51,900 --> 00:26:56,159
and he can be insufferable like that's

662
00:26:54,059 --> 00:26:58,980
that's his whole shtick both him and his

663
00:26:56,159 --> 00:27:00,419
his copycat anyway

664
00:26:58,980 --> 00:27:03,480
the two parties are traveling together

665
00:27:00,419 --> 00:27:06,600
and I had a great idea that wouldn't it

666
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:08,840
be fun if one of the other party

667
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:11,340
they didn't like their human warlock

668
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:13,740
quote-unquote leader in fact they were

669
00:27:11,340 --> 00:27:16,140
like we kind of had enough of this [ __ ]

670
00:27:13,740 --> 00:27:18,360
so in the night they approached one of

671
00:27:16,140 --> 00:27:20,100
the player characters who had who had

672
00:27:18,360 --> 00:27:22,320
exhibited interest or exhibited like

673
00:27:20,100 --> 00:27:25,260
disdain for the for their equivalent

674
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:26,880
human Warlock and this this NPC was like

675
00:27:25,260 --> 00:27:29,279
hey

676
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:31,980
have you heard of a Bard's Tale

677
00:27:29,279 --> 00:27:33,840
called strangers on a wagon

678
00:27:31,980 --> 00:27:35,700
and I was lucky that the player is

679
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,779
familiar with the film strangers on the

680
00:27:35,700 --> 00:27:39,179
train

681
00:27:36,779 --> 00:27:40,860
and they were like yes I've heard that

682
00:27:39,179 --> 00:27:42,840
in a bar somewhere

683
00:27:40,860 --> 00:27:44,279
and this NPC was like well if you're

684
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:46,020
just in case you're not familiar there's

685
00:27:44,279 --> 00:27:47,159
a situation where two individuals you

686
00:27:46,020 --> 00:27:49,200
know they have a they have a problem

687
00:27:47,159 --> 00:27:50,460
with each with their own third party and

688
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:52,140
they they come to an agreement where

689
00:27:50,460 --> 00:27:54,299
they they help each other out with this

690
00:27:52,140 --> 00:27:56,400
problem and there's plausible

691
00:27:54,299 --> 00:27:57,419
deniability and Alibis and all this kind

692
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:59,700
of stuff

693
00:27:57,419 --> 00:28:02,159
not all of us are super happy with our

694
00:27:59,700 --> 00:28:03,120
named of the human warlock I get the

695
00:28:02,159 --> 00:28:04,679
impression that all of you are happy

696
00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:06,840
with your human Warlock

697
00:28:04,679 --> 00:28:07,799
do you wanna do you want to agree do you

698
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:09,659
want to do something do you want to come

699
00:28:07,799 --> 00:28:11,460
to an agreement and that was it that was

700
00:28:09,659 --> 00:28:13,320
all I had in my head that was a setup I

701
00:28:11,460 --> 00:28:15,120
want to ask that question to one of the

702
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:16,340
players and see how far they're willing

703
00:28:15,120 --> 00:28:20,340
to push

704
00:28:16,340 --> 00:28:22,320
that party Dynamic to be like

705
00:28:20,340 --> 00:28:22,580
oh that would be interesting to see what

706
00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:25,020
happens

707
00:28:22,580 --> 00:28:26,640
[Laughter]

708
00:28:25,020 --> 00:28:28,919
and that's pretty much where we left

709
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:30,659
where he left it I said the NPC said you

710
00:28:28,919 --> 00:28:32,700
know if you agree

711
00:28:30,659 --> 00:28:34,020
like give me this you know where a

712
00:28:32,700 --> 00:28:35,880
corsage or you know give me a special

713
00:28:34,020 --> 00:28:37,559
sign tomorrow morning when we when we

714
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:39,299
set out adventuring and then I'll know

715
00:28:37,559 --> 00:28:43,200
and I'll

716
00:28:39,299 --> 00:28:45,179
I'll do my part of the deal basically uh

717
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:47,580
and then I met with the player today and

718
00:28:45,179 --> 00:28:48,659
he was like oh I don't know what to do I

719
00:28:47,580 --> 00:28:50,279
think might be cool if I do this but

720
00:28:48,659 --> 00:28:52,919
maybe I'll do this and this that and the

721
00:28:50,279 --> 00:28:55,980
other so yeah uh that whole anecdote was

722
00:28:52,919 --> 00:28:57,419
just to say like I I didn't like

723
00:28:55,980 --> 00:28:59,039
he could agree to it he could not agree

724
00:28:57,419 --> 00:29:01,860
to it he could backstab he could double

725
00:28:59,039 --> 00:29:03,960
backstab and do a whole Switcheroo and

726
00:29:01,860 --> 00:29:06,299
the whole thing could go crazy but just

727
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:08,940
posing the question I think maybe the

728
00:29:06,299 --> 00:29:11,159
best way to say this is as a as a World

729
00:29:08,940 --> 00:29:14,279
Builder yes you need to kind of have the

730
00:29:11,159 --> 00:29:16,919
fluff and have a world to live in but a

731
00:29:14,279 --> 00:29:18,480
lot of the job is posing questions

732
00:29:16,919 --> 00:29:23,159
would you would you would you agree with

733
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:26,100
that I sure would yes like how how could

734
00:29:23,159 --> 00:29:29,100
you kill with cuteness

735
00:29:26,100 --> 00:29:31,559
so that came up one time I've got these

736
00:29:29,100 --> 00:29:37,140
little little furry cute little balls

737
00:29:31,559 --> 00:29:38,880
that have no absolutely no use that

738
00:29:37,140 --> 00:29:41,480
anybody can tell they bounce around like

739
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:43,340
super balls and they go

740
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:46,260
[Music]

741
00:29:43,340 --> 00:29:49,559
uh nobody's been able to figure out what

742
00:29:46,260 --> 00:29:51,779
they do except multiply

743
00:29:49,559 --> 00:29:53,100
okay when you look away from them you

744
00:29:51,779 --> 00:29:55,799
know if there's one there you look away

745
00:29:53,100 --> 00:29:58,320
you look back this too oh

746
00:29:55,799 --> 00:30:01,500
you look back again there's four

747
00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:03,779
so it's a whole Compound thing and like

748
00:30:01,500 --> 00:30:06,360
I yeah I'm gonna I'll come back to plume

749
00:30:03,779 --> 00:30:10,500
so these things filled up a mine cart

750
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:13,700
that they were in trying to survive on a

751
00:30:10,500 --> 00:30:15,840
trek through an underground system

752
00:30:13,700 --> 00:30:18,020
what the hell are we gonna do with these

753
00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:18,020
things

754
00:30:18,779 --> 00:30:23,820
it was um

755
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:26,120
yeah all kinds of stuff posing questions

756
00:30:23,820 --> 00:30:28,799
that's a beautiful way to put it man

757
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:30,899
and then straight up that's legit I just

758
00:30:28,799 --> 00:30:35,820
thought that as I was halfway through my

759
00:30:30,899 --> 00:30:39,059
verbal Spiel like yeah that's a good way

760
00:30:35,820 --> 00:30:42,419
to put it what how what would happen if

761
00:30:39,059 --> 00:30:44,520
um yeah yep and I I can trust her again

762
00:30:42,419 --> 00:30:46,399
like we said earlier on like I'm lucky

763
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:48,659
that I can trust the players that

764
00:30:46,399 --> 00:30:50,220
especially the human warlock play he's

765
00:30:48,659 --> 00:30:53,580
very much like

766
00:30:50,220 --> 00:30:55,559
a slave to the to the the story right so

767
00:30:53,580 --> 00:30:57,720
he's he's more than happy to be like

768
00:30:55,559 --> 00:31:00,600
yeah if he dies he dies like that's

769
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:02,340
great that's what I want the story to be

770
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:03,779
like that like please don't pull your

771
00:31:02,340 --> 00:31:06,659
punches down though

772
00:31:03,779 --> 00:31:08,399
so I'm very happy that if he's like oh

773
00:31:06,659 --> 00:31:12,000
[ __ ] I'm getting betrayed by my own

774
00:31:08,399 --> 00:31:14,880
party this is sick like yeah I'm gonna

775
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:17,700
fight to the death as my character but

776
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:20,140
as me I'm like fully on board this is

777
00:31:17,700 --> 00:31:27,469
great like please kill him

778
00:31:20,140 --> 00:31:27,469
[Music]

779
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,679
yeah

780
00:31:32,180 --> 00:31:37,080
[Music]

781
00:31:33,679 --> 00:31:39,720
yeah and to use the whole um

782
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:42,659
train anecdote I'm starting a murder

783
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:44,760
mystery in a couple of weeks

784
00:31:42,659 --> 00:31:45,720
with some good players really good

785
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:46,559
people

786
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:51,899
um

787
00:31:46,559 --> 00:31:55,020
and it's it involves a luxury train

788
00:31:51,899 --> 00:31:57,240
you know again this is this is not a

789
00:31:55,020 --> 00:32:01,980
brand spanking new

790
00:31:57,240 --> 00:32:03,740
idea there are boats involved there are

791
00:32:01,980 --> 00:32:06,659
luxury coaches

792
00:32:03,740 --> 00:32:12,779
you know but it's it's it's all about

793
00:32:06,659 --> 00:32:14,520
this luxury ride and the man who owns it

794
00:32:12,779 --> 00:32:17,520
was killed

795
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:19,020
right so the party's job the party has

796
00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:22,940
been hired

797
00:32:19,020 --> 00:32:22,940
to solve the mystery

798
00:32:23,220 --> 00:32:27,840
so

799
00:32:24,779 --> 00:32:33,240
just from experience

800
00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:35,840
I have an independent investigator

801
00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:35,840
available

802
00:32:36,179 --> 00:32:42,299
so when things are missed for too long

803
00:32:38,820 --> 00:32:44,640
yeah we can bump things along in the

804
00:32:42,299 --> 00:32:47,399
right direction yeah the only words

805
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:49,919
bringing to mind is legally but you know

806
00:32:47,399 --> 00:32:52,500
part of the story without without

807
00:32:49,919 --> 00:32:55,320
yeah in in Universe rather than like the

808
00:32:52,500 --> 00:32:58,200
hand they've got yeah right right yeah

809
00:32:55,320 --> 00:33:01,140
yeah I mean it's it's that is you know

810
00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:03,059
absolutely necessary for two reasons one

811
00:33:01,140 --> 00:33:04,980
point-and-click and adventure games have

812
00:33:03,059 --> 00:33:07,500
been doing it for decades of like use

813
00:33:04,980 --> 00:33:09,240
the hint system and we'll put a glitter

814
00:33:07,500 --> 00:33:09,899
around the item that you need to click

815
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:13,620
on

816
00:33:09,899 --> 00:33:16,140
that's because because point two

817
00:33:13,620 --> 00:33:18,179
is that nothing is less fun certainly as

818
00:33:16,140 --> 00:33:20,940
players than just being like

819
00:33:18,179 --> 00:33:22,140
what what's like completely pulling

820
00:33:20,940 --> 00:33:24,179
blanks

821
00:33:22,140 --> 00:33:26,760
without even a thread like that well

822
00:33:24,179 --> 00:33:28,080
everything just kind of stops and I've

823
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:29,760
been there as a DM I've gone through

824
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:31,620
that pain of sitting there and being

825
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:32,880
like God what do I do nothing's

826
00:33:31,620 --> 00:33:34,200
happening and they're all getting bored

827
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,360
and they're all getting like frustrated

828
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:38,700
and but but I can't just tell them the

829
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:41,100
answer because then I've like and I've

830
00:33:38,700 --> 00:33:43,620
been there in it is it that is one of

831
00:33:41,100 --> 00:33:45,720
the trickier predicaments for a DM to

832
00:33:43,620 --> 00:33:46,860
find themselves in because they are torn

833
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:48,240
between

834
00:33:46,860 --> 00:33:49,679
oh I should just tell them because now

835
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:51,360
they're frustrated and rule number one

836
00:33:49,679 --> 00:33:53,159
is don't have frustrated players should

837
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:54,779
be having fun but then oh God rule

838
00:33:53,159 --> 00:33:56,779
number two is like don't take away their

839
00:33:54,779 --> 00:34:00,539
agency and oh God

840
00:33:56,779 --> 00:34:03,600
what do I do right right

841
00:34:00,539 --> 00:34:07,980
I throw a lot of um there's this big

842
00:34:03,600 --> 00:34:10,440
Global organization not Global even say

843
00:34:07,980 --> 00:34:12,899
there's just a organized crime in in the

844
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:14,700
city yeah they're going to make mistakes

845
00:34:12,899 --> 00:34:17,339
they're going to have guys that are

846
00:34:14,700 --> 00:34:19,379
pissed off at other guys and they're

847
00:34:17,339 --> 00:34:22,200
going to have guys that and and people

848
00:34:19,379 --> 00:34:24,659
that just go to the cops

849
00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:28,260
because they're pissed off at something

850
00:34:24,659 --> 00:34:29,760
so when it would stall I would throw a

851
00:34:28,260 --> 00:34:34,200
mistake at them

852
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:37,980
oh you know like a disgruntled Postman

853
00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:40,260
or something yeah you know and then he

854
00:34:37,980 --> 00:34:42,839
he walks by muttering something and

855
00:34:40,260 --> 00:34:46,320
they're like oh

856
00:34:42,839 --> 00:34:48,540
yeah that's fantastic throw like

857
00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:51,119
throw a mistake at them again because

858
00:34:48,540 --> 00:34:52,740
it's totally believable and in universe

859
00:34:51,119 --> 00:34:54,480
and

860
00:34:52,740 --> 00:34:57,180
most players probably wouldn't even spot

861
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:58,140
that use of that particular DM's toolkit

862
00:34:57,180 --> 00:34:59,460
of

863
00:34:58,140 --> 00:35:01,320
giving them a little nudge in the right

864
00:34:59,460 --> 00:35:04,800
direction because it is so innocuous to

865
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:06,839
be like oh [ __ ] there wow okay there's a

866
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:08,040
little something for us to uh to get our

867
00:35:06,839 --> 00:35:09,599
teeth into

868
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:11,400
right right

869
00:35:09,599 --> 00:35:13,760
you know somebody that's like I'm gonna

870
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:16,800
go over here and Mudder

871
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:20,300
that sounds suspicious to me that sounds

872
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:24,500
like something's going on yeah right

873
00:35:20,300 --> 00:35:24,500
I should follow him yeah

874
00:35:25,619 --> 00:35:29,960
I'm doing crime uh yeah

875
00:35:31,339 --> 00:35:36,900
black and white striped t-shirt yeah a

876
00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:38,940
whole lot yeah

877
00:35:36,900 --> 00:35:40,920
one thing I did want to talk about in

878
00:35:38,940 --> 00:35:43,380
today's discussion and we're kind of

879
00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:45,859
with that last example we're kind of

880
00:35:43,380 --> 00:35:48,960
moving in that direction

881
00:35:45,859 --> 00:35:50,460
is a lot of one of my friends he

882
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:53,040
especially when we talk about video

883
00:35:50,460 --> 00:35:54,900
games he is a sucker for environmental

884
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:56,640
storytelling and I'm like yeah but the

885
00:35:54,900 --> 00:35:57,960
rest of the game's like crap just

886
00:35:56,640 --> 00:36:00,240
because they've got like a teddy bear on

887
00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:03,740
a chair it doesn't suddenly elevate it

888
00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:06,000
to Golden Globe level but that's his

889
00:36:03,740 --> 00:36:08,579
that's the thing he's after

890
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:10,440
environmental storytelling so for the

891
00:36:08,579 --> 00:36:12,359
kind of things like the division video

892
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:14,820
games are very

893
00:36:12,359 --> 00:36:16,920
um uh you know I've got a lot of of that

894
00:36:14,820 --> 00:36:18,480
like there'll be corpses in a certain

895
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:20,700
place and like fall out there's a lot of

896
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:22,260
it too where there's like the bones of

897
00:36:20,700 --> 00:36:23,700
somebody in the bath or there'll be a

898
00:36:22,260 --> 00:36:25,800
couple in bed next to each other and

899
00:36:23,700 --> 00:36:27,839
you're like oh this is a story that's

900
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:29,700
being told to me just statically in the

901
00:36:27,839 --> 00:36:32,280
environment rather than Exposition

902
00:36:29,700 --> 00:36:33,780
through talking NPC or something and

903
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:35,940
I've been trying to think in preparation

904
00:36:33,780 --> 00:36:39,180
for today's episode

905
00:36:35,940 --> 00:36:41,040
what other equivalences in

906
00:36:39,180 --> 00:36:43,859
teaching apogees when you're trying to

907
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:45,900
weld build how to do them you know

908
00:36:43,859 --> 00:36:48,119
successfully or subtly I guess is

909
00:36:45,900 --> 00:36:50,520
probably a better way to do it because

910
00:36:48,119 --> 00:36:52,500
a difficulty certainly I I've had less

911
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:53,820
so now I've got more experience with my

912
00:36:52,500 --> 00:36:57,180
players and they've got more experience

913
00:36:53,820 --> 00:36:59,760
but certainly earlier on is that

914
00:36:57,180 --> 00:37:01,980
everything the DM describes is a clue

915
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:03,900
and suddenly we have to chase that White

916
00:37:01,980 --> 00:37:06,960
Rabbit until the end of the Earth when

917
00:37:03,900 --> 00:37:10,440
it was actually just a white rabbit you

918
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:12,839
know yeah so how can you have or do you

919
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:14,880
have any tips or advice for building

920
00:37:12,839 --> 00:37:17,579
that those worlds that are interesting

921
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:19,680
and diverse and dynamic and fulfilling

922
00:37:17,579 --> 00:37:20,640
and have a lot of Storytelling just

923
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:23,640
because

924
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:25,200
the all the postmen walk with a limp

925
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:27,660
because

926
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:28,500
some weird historical reason why you

927
00:37:27,660 --> 00:37:31,320
know like

928
00:37:28,500 --> 00:37:33,119
without them being like wait a minute

929
00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:35,579
maybe with a postman a part of some

930
00:37:33,119 --> 00:37:37,920
secret limp walking cult that have

931
00:37:35,579 --> 00:37:40,020
sacrificed their leg to summon a demon

932
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:41,460
and suddenly I mean to some people

933
00:37:40,020 --> 00:37:44,040
that'll be like oh yeah great let's do

934
00:37:41,460 --> 00:37:47,400
that but sometimes you you know a stick

935
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:50,520
is just a stick yes

936
00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:53,280
in cities a lot of the times I use

937
00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:55,980
street food ah

938
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:58,920
and not curious enough now I'm talking

939
00:37:55,980 --> 00:38:03,240
about something that they freaking know

940
00:37:58,920 --> 00:38:05,280
is not a clue you know it's just some

941
00:38:03,240 --> 00:38:07,440
guy selling

942
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:10,440
whatever he's selling yeah it depends on

943
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:12,960
the city that yeah of course but uh yeah

944
00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:15,599
I'll use

945
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:18,960
but I I know what you're saying so I I

946
00:38:15,599 --> 00:38:22,320
think what I do is I over explain maybe

947
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:25,440
over over describe

948
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:27,119
I try to I try to set up you know what

949
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,800
what it smells like with the sounds

950
00:38:27,119 --> 00:38:31,260
outside are

951
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:35,040
which is not anything

952
00:38:31,260 --> 00:38:35,820
original no but if I if I go on about it

953
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:38,940
for

954
00:38:35,820 --> 00:38:42,060
like two whole minutes

955
00:38:38,940 --> 00:38:44,160
hey no it's not a white rabbit yeah I I

956
00:38:42,060 --> 00:38:46,800
think in your defense I think it's much

957
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:49,500
harder to over describe than it is to

958
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:51,900
under describe I know again again that's

959
00:38:49,500 --> 00:38:53,520
a very classic like you go into a room

960
00:38:51,900 --> 00:38:55,140
it's got red walls and there's a couple

961
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:57,180
of chairs and tables

962
00:38:55,140 --> 00:38:58,380
that it that could do with a little bit

963
00:38:57,180 --> 00:39:00,240
more embellishment of like the

964
00:38:58,380 --> 00:39:01,920
floorboards Creek when you walk in and

965
00:39:00,240 --> 00:39:03,599
there there's like a musty smell in the

966
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:05,880
air and you can see like damp on the

967
00:39:03,599 --> 00:39:08,040
walls like from condensation and that

968
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:09,480
and that that kind of stuff so yeah I

969
00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:11,640
think it's it's a lot

970
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:12,900
easier should I say to under describe

971
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:15,480
than it is to over describe so I

972
00:39:12,900 --> 00:39:17,460
wouldn't I wouldn't feel too bad about

973
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,980
that

974
00:39:17,460 --> 00:39:21,240
yeah I'm just because I I've I've had it

975
00:39:19,980 --> 00:39:24,119
before where you just want to bring in

976
00:39:21,240 --> 00:39:26,520
some goofy NPC and suddenly they're like

977
00:39:24,119 --> 00:39:29,520
The Beatles and end all and

978
00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:31,320
the story just either is now completely

979
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:33,240
different or whatever which I guess you

980
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:35,280
know I'm it sounds like I'm making an

981
00:39:33,240 --> 00:39:37,079
hour to be a bad thing but

982
00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:38,760
you can't always have every NPC there

983
00:39:37,079 --> 00:39:41,280
and interact with B

984
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:42,250
a person of interest sometimes they are

985
00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:44,119
just a dude

986
00:39:42,250 --> 00:39:47,520
[Laughter]

987
00:39:44,119 --> 00:39:50,900
just a tailor Justin Taylor yeah his

988
00:39:47,520 --> 00:39:54,180
name's birth Bert the tailor

989
00:39:50,900 --> 00:39:56,760
but yeah that is that is something I

990
00:39:54,180 --> 00:39:58,020
struggle with still to this day not as

991
00:39:56,760 --> 00:40:00,780
much as I said but there's still

992
00:39:58,020 --> 00:40:03,060
instances when I'm like

993
00:40:00,780 --> 00:40:04,500
it's just a dude of the family like who

994
00:40:03,060 --> 00:40:06,180
doesn't want to

995
00:40:04,500 --> 00:40:07,320
speak to random strangers on the street

996
00:40:06,180 --> 00:40:09,540
because

997
00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:11,460
that's kind of sensible especially when

998
00:40:09,540 --> 00:40:13,320
they're armed to the teeth he's not

999
00:40:11,460 --> 00:40:14,700
hiding anything he just doesn't want to

1000
00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:18,119
tell you about his life story and that's

1001
00:40:14,700 --> 00:40:20,160
it uh and those that that is that is

1002
00:40:18,119 --> 00:40:22,320
tricky um I'm trying to think of any

1003
00:40:20,160 --> 00:40:24,900
advice I can give off the top of my head

1004
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:27,540
for DMS you might be in that in that

1005
00:40:24,900 --> 00:40:29,040
situation of course if you if you wanna

1006
00:40:27,540 --> 00:40:30,720
if you do find yourself in that

1007
00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:32,640
situation have you ever found yourself

1008
00:40:30,720 --> 00:40:35,280
in that or do you just as you said it

1009
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:38,579
you just embrace the where where oh no I

1010
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:41,940
find myself in it I still even

1011
00:40:38,579 --> 00:40:44,700
even trying to avoid it I still end up

1012
00:40:41,940 --> 00:40:45,240
in the middle of it

1013
00:40:44,700 --> 00:40:47,880
um

1014
00:40:45,240 --> 00:40:50,400
so they were just I I don't know

1015
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:53,520
um there's times that I just improvised

1016
00:40:50,400 --> 00:40:55,260
yeah and my players help with that a lot

1017
00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:57,180
too because

1018
00:40:55,260 --> 00:41:00,300
if they're even if they're following a

1019
00:40:57,180 --> 00:41:02,280
white rabbit it's fun they're doing

1020
00:41:00,300 --> 00:41:06,300
they're just doing something hilarious

1021
00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:11,640
yeah and then once that plays out they

1022
00:41:06,300 --> 00:41:14,520
run into a mistake I of course yeah yeah

1023
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:17,220
you know quick follow that lady so they

1024
00:41:14,520 --> 00:41:19,220
go running down an alley following some

1025
00:41:17,220 --> 00:41:21,599
drunk lady yeah and there you go

1026
00:41:19,220 --> 00:41:24,599
smashing into

1027
00:41:21,599 --> 00:41:27,180
Reza the brainlesses

1028
00:41:24,599 --> 00:41:31,440
prize picture window whatever whatever

1029
00:41:27,180 --> 00:41:34,260
yeah you know and oh we're back in the

1030
00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:37,579
story now yes you know we found

1031
00:41:34,260 --> 00:41:37,579
ourselves back here yeah

1032
00:41:37,740 --> 00:41:42,720
yeah okay okay do you have any any other

1033
00:41:41,099 --> 00:41:44,280
examples of that like environmental

1034
00:41:42,720 --> 00:41:45,720
storytelling those little tidbits like I

1035
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:49,079
said like all the postman limp because

1036
00:41:45,720 --> 00:41:51,960
of XYZ like do you have any examples of

1037
00:41:49,079 --> 00:41:54,480
that or maybe heavy thoughts on

1038
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:57,300
good ways to

1039
00:41:54,480 --> 00:42:00,060
yeah bring them in and now thinking like

1040
00:41:57,300 --> 00:42:02,400
all Postman limp is a bloody great

1041
00:42:00,060 --> 00:42:04,160
one to have I can't think why they do

1042
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:07,099
just

1043
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:12,660
that is a good one yeah

1044
00:42:07,099 --> 00:42:16,680
I try to meet the NPCs each have some

1045
00:42:12,660 --> 00:42:19,320
kind of an idiosyncrasy oh everybody's

1046
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:21,140
got something [ __ ] up about him you

1047
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:24,300
know and

1048
00:42:21,140 --> 00:42:26,220
so this dude is no different or this

1049
00:42:24,300 --> 00:42:28,140
lady here is no different

1050
00:42:26,220 --> 00:42:31,200
you have no idea what she went through

1051
00:42:28,140 --> 00:42:33,119
this morning yeah she's out of coffee

1052
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:35,339
you know

1053
00:42:33,119 --> 00:42:38,460
this this could wind up being fun let's

1054
00:42:35,339 --> 00:42:41,160
see what happens when plume talks to her

1055
00:42:38,460 --> 00:42:42,560
and she's all catty back at him yeah

1056
00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:46,140
yeah yeah

1057
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:48,420
I do I do I do like again that's that's

1058
00:42:46,140 --> 00:42:50,040
a teaching element I have for newer

1059
00:42:48,420 --> 00:42:52,500
players is like

1060
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:54,540
just because this person's being grumpy

1061
00:42:52,500 --> 00:42:56,579
doesn't mean that they're like the enemy

1062
00:42:54,540 --> 00:42:57,960
it just means that they miss their alarm

1063
00:42:56,579 --> 00:43:00,060
and are like late for work and they're

1064
00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:02,880
like sorry guys I can't talk because I'm

1065
00:43:00,060 --> 00:43:05,520
gonna miss the train boss has been an

1066
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:06,960
ass yeah bring down my neck I got

1067
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:09,000
deadlines to me and you're now talking

1068
00:43:06,960 --> 00:43:11,060
about where to find Bandits like [ __ ]

1069
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:13,920
off I'm kids do

1070
00:43:11,060 --> 00:43:17,760
[Laughter]

1071
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:20,040
I'm doing for at the moment there's a

1072
00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:23,099
battle where the capital city is just in

1073
00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:26,280
the middle of being destroyed okay so

1074
00:43:23,099 --> 00:43:29,220
there's some environmental storytelling

1075
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:30,660
going on there I guess you would call it

1076
00:43:29,220 --> 00:43:34,200
in um

1077
00:43:30,660 --> 00:43:36,660
I mean it's it's been it was invaded by

1078
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:38,339
Cobalt and then it was invaded by Orcs

1079
00:43:36,660 --> 00:43:41,640
And then it was invaded by Kraken

1080
00:43:38,339 --> 00:43:43,800
because the big bad wants this place

1081
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:46,260
destroyed okay they're having a bad day

1082
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:48,420
yeah they have been having a couple of

1083
00:43:46,260 --> 00:43:51,000
bad days in a row right two of the three

1084
00:43:48,420 --> 00:43:54,240
parties are in the city

1085
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:57,060
okay and with what's happening to the

1086
00:43:54,240 --> 00:43:59,579
city and to the buildings around I'm

1087
00:43:57,060 --> 00:44:03,480
sort of telling each of them what's

1088
00:43:59,579 --> 00:44:05,880
happening with the other it's fun ah

1089
00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:06,960
this uh you know it explodes right next

1090
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:08,579
to you

1091
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:11,220
you're lucky you didn't get hit in the

1092
00:44:08,579 --> 00:44:13,079
head with a flying brick what what do

1093
00:44:11,220 --> 00:44:14,280
you mean

1094
00:44:13,079 --> 00:44:16,020
and that's because the other players

1095
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:18,720
have done something weird and wacky

1096
00:44:16,020 --> 00:44:20,940
right yeah yeah yep

1097
00:44:18,720 --> 00:44:23,880
yeah and

1098
00:44:20,940 --> 00:44:24,720
I love it when they do it I I don't I

1099
00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:26,760
don't know

1100
00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:29,280
I know that there are some people who

1101
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:31,800
get no no that's not the story that's

1102
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:34,619
not how the story goes and I I just I'm

1103
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:38,060
the opposite of that [ __ ] my story right

1104
00:44:34,619 --> 00:44:38,060
up try come on

1105
00:44:38,660 --> 00:44:45,720
that that Immortal tug of war between

1106
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:48,240
the story and the players and sometimes

1107
00:44:45,720 --> 00:44:52,020
they end up on the same side and it's a

1108
00:44:48,240 --> 00:44:54,420
wonderful residence and other times very

1109
00:44:52,020 --> 00:44:57,680
much not so and you're playing tug of

1110
00:44:54,420 --> 00:44:57,680
war and they're playing hopscotch and

1111
00:44:57,900 --> 00:45:01,140
okay

1112
00:44:58,740 --> 00:45:03,660
I mean I'm on point with my analogies

1113
00:45:01,140 --> 00:45:07,819
and metforms I gotta say this episode

1114
00:45:03,660 --> 00:45:07,819
um I'm very happy

1115
00:45:08,220 --> 00:45:13,380
because if you're playing tug of

1116
00:45:10,079 --> 00:45:15,119
hopscotch that could be yeah yeah boom

1117
00:45:13,380 --> 00:45:17,160
we've just done once in World building

1118
00:45:15,119 --> 00:45:19,619
that's a new game that people play in

1119
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:22,079
these worlds it must be a tabaxi game

1120
00:45:19,619 --> 00:45:24,119
right

1121
00:45:22,079 --> 00:45:26,520
dude that that just reminds me of when

1122
00:45:24,119 --> 00:45:28,319
like in popular culture and television

1123
00:45:26,520 --> 00:45:30,300
and stuff where they'll have a game but

1124
00:45:28,319 --> 00:45:32,400
they've like sci-fied it like in Star

1125
00:45:30,300 --> 00:45:35,160
Trek when they've got chess but it's in

1126
00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:38,060
3D and it's like whoa this is a space

1127
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:40,740
chess uh

1128
00:45:38,060 --> 00:45:42,540
like that's that's like what we're doing

1129
00:45:40,740 --> 00:45:45,540
we're like needlessly complicated

1130
00:45:42,540 --> 00:45:45,540
hopscotch

1131
00:45:45,900 --> 00:45:50,599
it's like tug of war and Hopscotch but a

1132
00:45:48,540 --> 00:45:53,040
lot more difficult to understand

1133
00:45:50,599 --> 00:45:56,339
right because we're gonna throw some Red

1134
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:58,260
Rover Red Rover in there just right in

1135
00:45:56,339 --> 00:46:00,980
the middle but only for like five

1136
00:45:58,260 --> 00:46:00,980
minutes yeah

1137
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:04,980
um

1138
00:46:02,280 --> 00:46:07,440
I wanted to ask about a lot of

1139
00:46:04,980 --> 00:46:10,500
when people when people typically talk

1140
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:12,720
about like well building uh they we to

1141
00:46:10,500 --> 00:46:15,300
go back to world and full

1142
00:46:12,720 --> 00:46:17,819
there is a lot of like

1143
00:46:15,300 --> 00:46:20,640
what do the gods do and how does magic

1144
00:46:17,819 --> 00:46:22,200
work and how many gods do I have and

1145
00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:24,119
what's then they they walk about and

1146
00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:26,280
they visit people or they are not and

1147
00:46:24,119 --> 00:46:28,680
they never do anything and they're very

1148
00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:30,720
big big picture higher level stuff now

1149
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:32,040
I've got to think in your quarter of a

1150
00:46:30,720 --> 00:46:33,660
million words you've got to have

1151
00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:36,240
something on

1152
00:46:33,660 --> 00:46:39,000
magic and the Gods

1153
00:46:36,240 --> 00:46:41,460
so I was wondering like why did you pick

1154
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:44,700
the route you picked did you

1155
00:46:41,460 --> 00:46:46,319
reuse or use the the standard Pantheon

1156
00:46:44,700 --> 00:46:48,540
did you make your own because I know a

1157
00:46:46,319 --> 00:46:51,839
lot of people find that quite an

1158
00:46:48,540 --> 00:46:55,880
interesting part of it I use the

1159
00:46:51,839 --> 00:46:58,280
standard Pantheon with the few additions

1160
00:46:55,880 --> 00:47:01,200
saw them

1161
00:46:58,280 --> 00:47:03,359
the long and short of it is the world

1162
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:07,319
that everybody lives on

1163
00:47:03,359 --> 00:47:09,119
was populated by refugees from Earth

1164
00:47:07,319 --> 00:47:12,599
and then there were a couple of

1165
00:47:09,119 --> 00:47:14,040
catastrophes like um mass extinction

1166
00:47:12,599 --> 00:47:16,980
events

1167
00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:18,240
and Society has to rebuild and during

1168
00:47:16,980 --> 00:47:22,560
those

1169
00:47:18,240 --> 00:47:24,300
you know DNA splits off races split on

1170
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:28,619
but also

1171
00:47:24,300 --> 00:47:30,540
the way the multi-planar weave is set up

1172
00:47:28,619 --> 00:47:33,660
where they are it's all smashing

1173
00:47:30,540 --> 00:47:37,560
together on their material plane

1174
00:47:33,660 --> 00:47:39,180
so there's a lot of weird stuff going on

1175
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:43,800
yoester

1176
00:47:39,180 --> 00:47:47,220
the fertility goddess just walks around

1177
00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:50,040
and just lives with the dwarves and has

1178
00:47:47,220 --> 00:47:53,040
a party every night that they drink a

1179
00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:54,839
lot of beer wine women in a song man you

1180
00:47:53,040 --> 00:47:57,180
know it's more of this whole thing yeah

1181
00:47:54,839 --> 00:47:59,520
and that's that's because you know

1182
00:47:57,180 --> 00:48:01,619
they're all come crashing together

1183
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:03,900
and they see different aspects of

1184
00:48:01,619 --> 00:48:05,819
themselves you get different gods that

1185
00:48:03,900 --> 00:48:07,920
are fighting with each other because

1186
00:48:05,819 --> 00:48:09,780
they don't like their other aspect

1187
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:13,740
and then it all

1188
00:48:09,780 --> 00:48:17,339
just boils down into there's a bunch of

1189
00:48:13,740 --> 00:48:19,260
different Cults you know yeah there's

1190
00:48:17,339 --> 00:48:21,900
there's some

1191
00:48:19,260 --> 00:48:26,160
sort of the biggest change to the

1192
00:48:21,900 --> 00:48:30,240
pantheon would be that agma is the head

1193
00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:31,980
of it so okay God of knowledge right so

1194
00:48:30,240 --> 00:48:36,240
he's

1195
00:48:31,980 --> 00:48:38,220
sort of Top Dog yeah yeah yeah yep he's

1196
00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:39,599
the big dog in the neighborhood

1197
00:48:38,220 --> 00:48:41,760
um is there is there a reason why you

1198
00:48:39,599 --> 00:48:44,700
made that decision because the people

1199
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:46,700
that are saving the world so to speak

1200
00:48:44,700 --> 00:48:52,319
are are um

1201
00:48:46,700 --> 00:48:54,720
librarian monks rat cool very very 40K

1202
00:48:52,319 --> 00:48:57,060
Warhammer so I'm on board it's called

1203
00:48:54,720 --> 00:48:58,380
the order of agma and they're involved

1204
00:48:57,060 --> 00:49:00,480
in everything

1205
00:48:58,380 --> 00:49:03,000
right yeah

1206
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:04,380
okay yes I I only off I'd like I didn't

1207
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:05,579
know that beforehand only off commented

1208
00:49:04,380 --> 00:49:07,619
like where the gods are walking around

1209
00:49:05,579 --> 00:49:09,480
and stuff and it is like I don't mine

1210
00:49:07,619 --> 00:49:11,819
aren't like that so it is cool

1211
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:14,760
to to obviously speak to somebody who is

1212
00:49:11,819 --> 00:49:16,800
and then while you were talking it made

1213
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:18,000
me come from different aspects and stuff

1214
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:20,700
and

1215
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:22,319
in my world the gods are like how would

1216
00:49:20,700 --> 00:49:24,240
the be the best way to put them like um

1217
00:49:22,319 --> 00:49:27,180
you know Greek or Roman they are

1218
00:49:24,240 --> 00:49:28,740
powerful humans I think is maybe you

1219
00:49:27,180 --> 00:49:30,960
know a way to describe it they they

1220
00:49:28,740 --> 00:49:33,119
still have like they still fall in love

1221
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:34,859
they still have arguments and stuff like

1222
00:49:33,119 --> 00:49:37,140
that they still like have very human

1223
00:49:34,859 --> 00:49:38,700
traits that just can sling lightning

1224
00:49:37,140 --> 00:49:40,200
bolts as well that that kind of very

1225
00:49:38,700 --> 00:49:41,819
typical Gods I think there is something

1226
00:49:40,200 --> 00:49:45,020
that I want to try

1227
00:49:41,819 --> 00:49:47,579
around having Gods be

1228
00:49:45,020 --> 00:49:51,000
personifications of

1229
00:49:47,579 --> 00:49:53,400
an emotion so like there's no Rhyme or

1230
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:55,619
like anger for example it's just

1231
00:49:53,400 --> 00:49:57,240
literally like I'm just angry like

1232
00:49:55,619 --> 00:50:01,200
there's no you can't I don't go around I

1233
00:49:57,240 --> 00:50:03,060
don't have fun they don't poke fun it

1234
00:50:01,200 --> 00:50:06,599
Achilles in his heel and stuff like that

1235
00:50:03,060 --> 00:50:09,119
no I'm just I'm just the you know anger

1236
00:50:06,599 --> 00:50:10,859
given form and I don't I can't be like

1237
00:50:09,119 --> 00:50:12,599
reasoned with and neither can happiness

1238
00:50:10,859 --> 00:50:14,940
because happiness is just like the same

1239
00:50:12,599 --> 00:50:16,440
thing you know I'm just well building

1240
00:50:14,940 --> 00:50:18,060
off the top of my head now but I think

1241
00:50:16,440 --> 00:50:20,819
there's something to say for for like a

1242
00:50:18,060 --> 00:50:23,280
Pantheon like that where it is just like

1243
00:50:20,819 --> 00:50:25,980
they are Gods but a very different way

1244
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:27,900
like it's just we pray to happiness

1245
00:50:25,980 --> 00:50:29,400
because everyone wants to be happy but

1246
00:50:27,900 --> 00:50:31,319
obviously there's there's very much a

1247
00:50:29,400 --> 00:50:33,359
downside if you

1248
00:50:31,319 --> 00:50:34,859
I like drunk on happiness then you can't

1249
00:50:33,359 --> 00:50:37,440
have the other range of emotions and

1250
00:50:34,859 --> 00:50:38,819
stuff like that I I I personally think

1251
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,740
that thing I've just improvised right

1252
00:50:38,819 --> 00:50:42,839
now off the top of my head could be uh

1253
00:50:40,740 --> 00:50:46,260
it could be an interesting world to play

1254
00:50:42,839 --> 00:50:49,140
around with I had deities that were um

1255
00:50:46,260 --> 00:50:50,460
intelligent shades of light at one point

1256
00:50:49,140 --> 00:50:53,760
okay

1257
00:50:50,460 --> 00:50:56,460
and I I like the idea of the elemental

1258
00:50:53,760 --> 00:50:59,700
deities living in the element

1259
00:50:56,460 --> 00:51:01,740
you know um tolkien's omo the god of the

1260
00:50:59,700 --> 00:51:03,720
sea wasn't just the god of the sea

1261
00:51:01,740 --> 00:51:05,760
anywhere there was water he had like

1262
00:51:03,720 --> 00:51:09,420
from from what I understand he had an

1263
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:12,780
influence and so I I run it that way you

1264
00:51:09,420 --> 00:51:15,119
know I if you know if it's a sea god

1265
00:51:12,780 --> 00:51:18,000
there's a lot of ocean-going Adventures

1266
00:51:15,119 --> 00:51:19,559
in in my world I think that might be

1267
00:51:18,000 --> 00:51:22,380
because there was a lot of ocean going

1268
00:51:19,559 --> 00:51:24,240
in in my own personal world yeah you

1269
00:51:22,380 --> 00:51:26,220
write what you know you know yeah

1270
00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:28,200
absolutely absolutely wow you've just

1271
00:51:26,220 --> 00:51:30,180
stumbled onto a huge well-building tip

1272
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:32,940
like at the 11th hour right well you

1273
00:51:30,180 --> 00:51:35,940
know that's great

1274
00:51:32,940 --> 00:51:37,559
so they do so you know the deities of

1275
00:51:35,940 --> 00:51:40,920
the sea super

1276
00:51:37,559 --> 00:51:43,319
powerful ocean creatures a couple of

1277
00:51:40,920 --> 00:51:47,099
ships that were mimics

1278
00:51:43,319 --> 00:51:48,970
that were set forth by yukatella you

1279
00:51:47,099 --> 00:51:51,480
know look what I can do

1280
00:51:48,970 --> 00:51:55,440
[Laughter]

1281
00:51:51,480 --> 00:51:58,440
great fourth and create chaos yeah yeah

1282
00:51:55,440 --> 00:52:01,500
I need to like the way I did my my

1283
00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:02,940
current Pantheon very vanilla I I played

1284
00:52:01,500 --> 00:52:05,640
it absolutely safe and I just took a

1285
00:52:02,940 --> 00:52:08,099
subset of like Forgotten Realms

1286
00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:10,680
law and we're like here's the seven main

1287
00:52:08,099 --> 00:52:12,119
ones I think three of those were derived

1288
00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:14,640
from the players giving me their

1289
00:52:12,119 --> 00:52:17,599
backstory isn't me going [ __ ] Raven

1290
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:20,579
Queen right there in it now

1291
00:52:17,599 --> 00:52:24,720
in the universe let me find a pigeonhole

1292
00:52:20,579 --> 00:52:29,280
to squeeze that in uh yeah

1293
00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:31,140
the Storm King what yeah

1294
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:32,460
yeah because it was yeah funny you

1295
00:52:31,140 --> 00:52:34,260
should mention that because one of the

1296
00:52:32,460 --> 00:52:37,680
players his first character was a storm

1297
00:52:34,260 --> 00:52:41,040
sorcerer yeah sorcerer storm sorceress

1298
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:43,500
origin and he'd done some Googling and

1299
00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:44,579
came back with Talos as the god of

1300
00:52:43,500 --> 00:52:46,559
storms or something and I was like okay

1301
00:52:44,579 --> 00:52:48,300
right he is now in it I guess I gotta

1302
00:52:46,559 --> 00:52:50,720
start putting his uh religious

1303
00:52:48,300 --> 00:52:54,000
iconography around just uh you know yeah

1304
00:52:50,720 --> 00:52:57,240
I mean that kind of built itself in that

1305
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:58,859
way uh because I was like they've given

1306
00:52:57,240 --> 00:53:00,300
me a bunch and the the interesting thing

1307
00:52:58,859 --> 00:53:03,480
there is that and I think I have

1308
00:53:00,300 --> 00:53:05,819
mentioned it on the show before where we

1309
00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:09,440
had one with the cleric it was death

1310
00:53:05,819 --> 00:53:12,480
domain I think and had Merkel as his

1311
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:13,859
deity who was like the Lord of Bones and

1312
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:15,359
the god of death and then of course we

1313
00:53:13,859 --> 00:53:18,480
had the Raven Queen

1314
00:53:15,359 --> 00:53:22,140
uh hex blade warlock who is also kind of

1315
00:53:18,480 --> 00:53:24,660
dabbling in spirits in the afterlife and

1316
00:53:22,140 --> 00:53:25,920
where place people go to die and that

1317
00:53:24,660 --> 00:53:27,180
kind of stuff so I was like oh hey this

1318
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:28,619
is a good opportunity to have those two

1319
00:53:27,180 --> 00:53:31,200
fighting for

1320
00:53:28,619 --> 00:53:32,640
control of the afterlife essentially

1321
00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:34,920
completely

1322
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:36,960
you know separate from the main quest

1323
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:39,000
it's just

1324
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:41,160
these two gods are now like well no we

1325
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:43,200
want to we want to manage ourselves we

1326
00:53:41,160 --> 00:53:44,700
want to be the new management of you

1327
00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:45,839
know Under New Management side and flips

1328
00:53:44,700 --> 00:53:47,099
over the door and it's like well now

1329
00:53:45,839 --> 00:53:48,420
they all go to the shadow fell and they

1330
00:53:47,099 --> 00:53:52,760
don't go to this weird

1331
00:53:48,420 --> 00:53:54,900
Gothic skull Cathedral because that's

1332
00:53:52,760 --> 00:53:56,940
scary [ __ ]

1333
00:53:54,900 --> 00:54:00,059
right

1334
00:53:56,940 --> 00:54:01,859
I like throwing dude like in Hell

1335
00:54:00,059 --> 00:54:04,319
they're reading hell right now for

1336
00:54:01,859 --> 00:54:06,359
different things that they need and uh

1337
00:54:04,319 --> 00:54:09,619
on the seventh level

1338
00:54:06,359 --> 00:54:13,619
I set up the whole Carnival

1339
00:54:09,619 --> 00:54:15,619
with different uh games and prizes and

1340
00:54:13,619 --> 00:54:18,420
yeah there's

1341
00:54:15,619 --> 00:54:21,020
and when I made the map is all you know

1342
00:54:18,420 --> 00:54:24,900
the tea cup ride

1343
00:54:21,020 --> 00:54:28,680
there yes and I just love the idea of

1344
00:54:24,900 --> 00:54:31,920
the hurdy gerties playing and like imps

1345
00:54:28,680 --> 00:54:34,260
walking around and yeah some Arch Devil

1346
00:54:31,920 --> 00:54:37,380
comes walking down Main Street or

1347
00:54:34,260 --> 00:54:40,440
something yeah little thing of popcorn

1348
00:54:37,380 --> 00:54:43,079
oh shoot I was gonna say the I love I

1349
00:54:40,440 --> 00:54:45,059
love how casual there's been a couple of

1350
00:54:43,079 --> 00:54:47,040
instances tonight where you've just been

1351
00:54:45,059 --> 00:54:49,140
you've just so casually dropped in like

1352
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:50,640
a nightmare situation oh they're raiding

1353
00:54:49,140 --> 00:54:52,800
hair right now

1354
00:54:50,640 --> 00:54:54,359
um in the same way that I dropped in

1355
00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:55,260
that guy was late for his train and I'm

1356
00:54:54,359 --> 00:54:57,599
like yeah those two things are quite

1357
00:54:55,260 --> 00:54:59,640
vastly different though

1358
00:54:57,599 --> 00:55:02,520
like the other one oh so they've been

1359
00:54:59,640 --> 00:55:06,059
you know besieged by this this and this

1360
00:55:02,520 --> 00:55:07,140
I'm like yeah that's that's pretty bad I

1361
00:55:06,059 --> 00:55:09,359
think you can tell that you've written

1362
00:55:07,140 --> 00:55:11,940
uh so much you have for your world just

1363
00:55:09,359 --> 00:55:13,260
from the the laissez-faire attitude

1364
00:55:11,940 --> 00:55:17,180
towards

1365
00:55:13,260 --> 00:55:17,180
hypocritical events that

1366
00:55:19,319 --> 00:55:21,359
is there anything you want us to talk

1367
00:55:20,400 --> 00:55:23,400
about that we might have missed so I

1368
00:55:21,359 --> 00:55:26,339
haven't got got around to yet

1369
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:29,579
not that I can think of

1370
00:55:26,339 --> 00:55:33,480
no I just it was a fun conversation

1371
00:55:29,579 --> 00:55:35,940
good good that's what I like to hear

1372
00:55:33,480 --> 00:55:38,640
well uh in that case then is there

1373
00:55:35,940 --> 00:55:40,740
anything you would like to plug or

1374
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:43,559
promote oh I'm not selling anything just

1375
00:55:40,740 --> 00:55:45,960
come visit me on Twitter at Oni Harlan

1376
00:55:43,559 --> 00:55:47,300
it's o-g-n-i

1377
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:48,900
and

1378
00:55:47,300 --> 00:55:52,079
h-a-r-l-e-n

1379
00:55:48,900 --> 00:55:55,020
yep thank you as usual that link will be

1380
00:55:52,079 --> 00:55:56,819
in the episode description do check him

1381
00:55:55,020 --> 00:55:58,380
out uh you can go check Aaron out as

1382
00:55:56,819 --> 00:55:59,880
well who was on as I said the chaos

1383
00:55:58,380 --> 00:56:01,319
episode so if you want to go and hear

1384
00:55:59,880 --> 00:56:02,880
the other side you've heard from the DM

1385
00:56:01,319 --> 00:56:05,160
no if you want to go in here from one of

1386
00:56:02,880 --> 00:56:06,480
the players and hear how he really is

1387
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:10,380
you can go and listen to the chaos

1388
00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:12,900
episode otherwise the only thing left to

1389
00:56:10,380 --> 00:56:14,099
say is thank you so much Harlem for

1390
00:56:12,900 --> 00:56:16,020
joining us today

1391
00:56:14,099 --> 00:56:19,380
thank you for having me

1392
00:56:16,020 --> 00:56:21,240
good yeah my pleasure absolutely uh it's

1393
00:56:19,380 --> 00:56:24,359
been it has been a lot of fun it's

1394
00:56:21,240 --> 00:56:26,220
always fun to to have these shoot the

1395
00:56:24,359 --> 00:56:29,900
[ __ ] sessions with another DM where it's

1396
00:56:26,220 --> 00:56:32,460
just like oh you did that that's so cool

1397
00:56:29,900 --> 00:56:34,920
I think that's why I find this this

1398
00:56:32,460 --> 00:56:37,380
podcast so interesting really

1399
00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:39,180
you're doing this very well Danilo oh

1400
00:56:37,380 --> 00:56:40,440
thank you thank you you're plugging me

1401
00:56:39,180 --> 00:56:41,480
now that's not that's not part of the

1402
00:56:40,440 --> 00:56:44,880
scheme

1403
00:56:41,480 --> 00:56:46,819
this this podcast it's kind of thinking

1404
00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:49,319
critically

1405
00:56:46,819 --> 00:56:50,900
thank you well thank you for that plug

1406
00:56:49,319 --> 00:56:53,760
as well

1407
00:56:50,900 --> 00:56:56,040
uh thank you uh to everybody for

1408
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:57,599
listening at home

1409
00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:59,760
as mentioned everything's in the episode

1410
00:56:57,599 --> 00:57:02,520
description so please do go check that

1411
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:06,480
out otherwise thank you all for

1412
00:57:02,520 --> 00:57:08,400
listening and good night good night

1413
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:11,579
and now it's time for the patreon shout

1414
00:57:08,400 --> 00:57:15,119
outs thank you to Joe from the fourth

1415
00:57:11,579 --> 00:57:17,520
leg podcast again two-time guests of the

1416
00:57:15,119 --> 00:57:19,619
show and the fourth leg is a ttrpg

1417
00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:22,619
podcast all about giving new GMS a leg

1418
00:57:19,619 --> 00:57:25,380
to stand on please go and check them out

1419
00:57:22,619 --> 00:57:27,780
at the fourth leg on Twitter

1420
00:57:25,380 --> 00:57:30,119
thank you to optional rule a two-time

1421
00:57:27,780 --> 00:57:32,359
guest of the show and a very insightful

1422
00:57:30,119 --> 00:57:34,319
and knowledgeable source of information

1423
00:57:32,359 --> 00:57:37,319
please check them out at

1424
00:57:34,319 --> 00:57:37,319
www.optionalrules.com

1425
00:57:37,500 --> 00:57:43,079
huge huge huge thank you to a great

1426
00:57:40,619 --> 00:57:45,359
friend of the show Matthew Perkins who's

1427
00:57:43,079 --> 00:57:47,579
out there making hilarious and

1428
00:57:45,359 --> 00:57:49,619
educational Dungeons and Dragons content

1429
00:57:47,579 --> 00:57:51,359
please go and check out his stuff at

1430
00:57:49,619 --> 00:57:53,819
Matthew perkins.net where you can find

1431
00:57:51,359 --> 00:57:55,319
links to all of his socials and all of

1432
00:57:53,819 --> 00:57:57,059
his content including his own patreon

1433
00:57:55,319 --> 00:57:59,940
which I would very much encourage you to

1434
00:57:57,059 --> 00:58:01,920
check out thank you to matchstreet at mp

1435
00:57:59,940 --> 00:58:02,640
street88 on Twitter for supporting the

1436
00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:04,079
show

1437
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:06,740
if you need support running your

1438
00:58:04,079 --> 00:58:08,579
personal or business schedule head to

1439
00:58:06,740 --> 00:58:10,260
virtuletimehustle.com or on Instagram

1440
00:58:08,579 --> 00:58:12,599
make that difference between should do

1441
00:58:10,260 --> 00:58:14,160
and done was it better with support from

1442
00:58:12,599 --> 00:58:16,260
cat who will help you get back that

1443
00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:17,880
essential time you've been searching for

1444
00:58:16,260 --> 00:58:19,859
if you would like to support what we do

1445
00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:22,200
and get four shout outs a month head

1446
00:58:19,859 --> 00:58:24,059
over to patreon.com thinking critically

1447
00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:27,920
or you can just buy me a coffee at

1448
00:58:24,059 --> 00:58:27,920
kofi.com thinking critically

1449
00:58:28,060 --> 00:58:50,229
[Music]