Canon

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welcome thinkers to season 4 episode 4

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of thinking critically a d d discussion

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as usual i wanted to have a quick update

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before this episode starts in earnest

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and today's a special one i wanted to

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shout out a listener who is a very keen

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fan of the twitch streams we're

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currently doing of the

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campaign that i'm going through right

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now i think they've tuned into every

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single one and i couldn't be happier so

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yeah shout out to very little

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intelligence on twitch thank you ever so

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much for joining us on this time loop

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journey

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and i know you're listening so enjoy the

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rest of the episode

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today's topic is

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canon

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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and today i'm joined by eli royal thank

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you ever so much for joining us today

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eli can you tell us a little bit about

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yourself i am always happy to talk about

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myself

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i'm eli royal you actually spoke to my

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older brother hunter royal pretty

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recently and hunter

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is

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my like window or was my window into

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dungeons and dragons uh when i was 10

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years old i thought he and his 17 year

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old friends were cool and i was mistaken

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but this was a fun part of it

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so i've been playing d d for d d and

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other table top games for like 20 years

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but d d is comfort food i will always be

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down to play dungeons and dragons

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awesome thank you ever so much for that

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and i would encourage everybody to check

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out that episode on relationships

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featuring hunter which was yep very very

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enjoyable so i'm expecting uh big things

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either today you know big big shoes too

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no it's definitely not the first time

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i've been compared to my older brother

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it's all good

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oh the deliberate uh

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on my part i have to say it won't happen

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again um today's topic is canon

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what does that mean to you in the d d

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and wider ttrpg framework so as a

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gm and a player canon is to me just like

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this nebulous soup of nonsense

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but

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i pay attention to the tabletop

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community a lot and i noticed that canon

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is like really important to a lot of

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people and it's popped up again recently

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because uh

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as of the time of this recording

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wizard's new book um mordecainen's

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monsters of the multiverse

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recently published and they changed a

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lot of canon they switched things around

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a lot for kobolds and goblins and orcs

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and stuff like that

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and there are a lot of people upset and

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to me canon is

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mostly whatever you need it to be

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you know d d is a storytelling game so

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if the canon doesn't fit your idea for

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the story you change the canon

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to me canon is is a very it's a very

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fluid thing and i think that's because i

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i'm a comic book nerd

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and canon means almost nothing

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well because everything gets like

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reckoned and re-build and very

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frequently they just stop talking about

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something it'll be like hey what

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happened to

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how come they never talk about uh

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gwen stacy's cloned kids that tried to

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kill peter parker it's like because they

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didn't like it so they don't talk about

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it anymore

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[Laughter]

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yeah i must admit i'm

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equal parts glad and saddened that i

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never got hugely into comic books

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because one of my friends very much is

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and it's full of like

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this that yeah if you watch any of the

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the youtubers that talk about it when

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you know about the marvel cinematic

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universe i like well from yeah issue 76

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of this you know this season uh the

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green goblin was blue for some

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inexplicable reason and this

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shade of blue on this piece of glass is

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maybe referencing that and i'm like oh

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my god that's just way too much

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yeah

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i i have friends that never really got

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into comics and they

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they love watching those shows with me

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because i will pause the show or the

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movie and be like oh well that's a fun

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reference because you know way back in

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this cartoon in like 2002 they did this

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thing and then they asked me hey when's

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your birthday i'm like i don't know i

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got rid of that information so that i

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could remember everything about the

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legion of superheroes

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that worthless information doesn't

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provide any value over there no get rid

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of it

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yeah but it is a

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i have a firm belief as an adult who has

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to pay bills that you really only get

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the one hobby

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because you can either be really into

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comic books or you can be really into d

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d

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but to be into both you've got to have a

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lot of disposable income

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and time as well

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yeah

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so

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about about canon then i wanted to say

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it is very much

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there's this weird kind of like duality

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to

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the regular definition of that word in

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dnd on the one hand you do have

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almost decades of

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established settings and law and there's

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a couple of previous episodes from

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previous seasons about like history and

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law i think are both out there where

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i talk to those guests at length about

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well back in

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addition to this world happened and

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we talk at length about how the

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additions are actually in chronological

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order in the

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forgotten realms setting

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so it's with each new addition that you

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know the setting has changed and

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this thing happened which destroyed all

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magic but then all magic came back and

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all this other kind of weird and wacky

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stuff you have all this

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baggage here and then on the same hand

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most games

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don't use any of it

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are like completely home brew so it

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doesn't

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really matter so you've got all this

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baggage here that some people are

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exceptionally passionate about

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which is fine uh but then you also have

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like my game for example i've never read

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a single

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book

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you know a single fiction piece of

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fiction

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never read any published modules never

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i you know i only know

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people like

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drizzed or whatever you know i always

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say dritzed but apparently it is

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supposed to be drizzit

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ah or i think maybe it is supposed to be

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who knows it's nonsense

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case in point i don't even know how to

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you know pronounce it i just know it by

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proxy like through

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somebody mentioning it once yeah and i'm

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running my 72 session campaign that's

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still ongoing and

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yes that just always

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when we suggested this as the topic to

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discuss i was like

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am i i'm either super qualified to talk

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about this or not qualified in the

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slightest and i'm still

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not quite sure

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it is a weird thing because i i fell

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into the trap of like ah they've changed

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this and i don't like it um when fifth

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edition came out because i loved the

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rules but i didn't like that they

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changed the core setting of d and d from

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greyhawk to faroon

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because i felt like in greyhawk things

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were a lot more fluid in what the canon

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was

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and in faroon because of the books it's

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much more strict in what the canon is

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and i didn't want to have to deal with

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people being like

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well actually orcs are this i'm like i

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don't care what orcs are i just want to

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play a big guy with green skin and tusks

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yeah

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yeah that's precisely the same to me

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like a lot of this stuff just kind of

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washes

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over me and i'm i just have this

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indifference that's like okay well in my

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setting

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x

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acts like y for z reasons anyway so it

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doesn't make a difference to me like

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it's just yeah

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yeah and i

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uh i have a homebrew setting

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called ildar the world of dragons

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and

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it is this

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thing of

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the canon of of my own world this world

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i've been writing for six years

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my brother played it and he's like hey

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this is the idea i have for my cobalt is

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that he lived in this this barony where

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dwarves are in charge and are like

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second class citizens and i'm like

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okay cool where do you want to be from

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i'll make it work i'll like that sounds

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like a fun thing to explore where do you

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want to slap it down

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and i've had gm's in the past who would

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be like

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well kobolds don't really interact with

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dwarves so i'm not sure where you would

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be from like come on man

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yeah it's a it's a make-believe world

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you can just make belief

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yeah yeah you can make it work like

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where there's a will there's a way yeah

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and especially in because my brother has

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also made

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exceptions for me

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in his setting of bueth

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uh obviously we've played a lot of games

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together

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and

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and it's because it's like

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as the gm you can change the canon to

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whatever you want it to be

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especially if it's a home brew world and

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then it really is whatever you want it

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to be and

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i think a lot of people get too caught

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up with

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but it's it's printed in a book

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and it's like i don't care that it's

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printed in a book

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yep yeah absolutely absolutely i'm i've

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i've just took out my notes for the

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season two episode one on law and it's

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literally just questions because i had

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no like no idea what i'm like what is

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this what is this what is any of this so

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i get i guess what i'm trying to get at

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is that like you never have to like

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don't assume that you need this baggage

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of knowledge of the the canon of 5th

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edition or the canon of d to be able to

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effectively run a game because you just

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kind of do what you want yeah yeah it's

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it's you're you're playing make-believe

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with your friends so

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uh

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if you need to change the rules to make

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it more fun you just change the rules

283
00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:14,240
mm-hmm

284
00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:16,880
yeah yeah well i think one of the

285
00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:18,800
one of mine player characters has just

286
00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:20,000
be rolled a new character dragonborn

287
00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:21,839
paladin

288
00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:24,399
and yes there's been the you know

289
00:10:21,839 --> 00:10:26,480
occasional dragonborn drop you know npc

290
00:10:24,399 --> 00:10:28,000
dropped in the campaign setting so far

291
00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:30,000
so there's like a precedent that they

292
00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:32,000
exist in this universe they haven't gone

293
00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,760
to any predominantly dragonborn

294
00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:34,959
settlements or anything so

295
00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:36,320
norm was a dragon ball and related to

296
00:10:34,959 --> 00:10:39,200
dragonbones before so there was never

297
00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:41,279
any huge interaction with them which was

298
00:10:39,200 --> 00:10:44,000
kind of a nice gap to then fill with the

299
00:10:41,279 --> 00:10:45,680
player together so we were like oh

300
00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:47,279
you want to have this like you want to

301
00:10:45,680 --> 00:10:49,040
come from like a clan let me let me have

302
00:10:47,279 --> 00:10:50,399
a look at the map and see where

303
00:10:49,040 --> 00:10:51,680
i can work that in and he was like oh

304
00:10:50,399 --> 00:10:52,800
what about on this island and i'm like

305
00:10:51,680 --> 00:10:54,160
yeah that actually worked really well

306
00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:55,760
you could kind of co-exist with these

307
00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:58,240
other creatures that i had planned to be

308
00:10:55,760 --> 00:11:00,560
on there and that worked really well so

309
00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:01,839
now if you know when if the players ever

310
00:11:00,560 --> 00:11:03,360
go there

311
00:11:01,839 --> 00:11:04,480
there's this pre-baked

312
00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:05,279
history

313
00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:07,360
yeah

314
00:11:05,279 --> 00:11:08,320
already already built in thanks to the

315
00:11:07,360 --> 00:11:10,959
player

316
00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:12,959
which is i'm i'm quite happy with and

317
00:11:10,959 --> 00:11:14,240
he's like super stoked that you know he

318
00:11:12,959 --> 00:11:17,120
has it he can point to the map and be

319
00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:19,600
like that's where my family are and yeah

320
00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:21,040
this that and the other and it's that's

321
00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:23,680
worked out really well

322
00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:24,720
for this campaign i've learned that one

323
00:11:23,680 --> 00:11:29,279
of the

324
00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:30,959
best things is gm to do is like have

325
00:11:29,279 --> 00:11:33,279
some cursory

326
00:11:30,959 --> 00:11:34,560
information about whatever place they're

327
00:11:33,279 --> 00:11:37,600
starting in

328
00:11:34,560 --> 00:11:39,760
or whatever place they might be going to

329
00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:41,519
and from there i just like ask my

330
00:11:39,760 --> 00:11:43,200
players like hey do you have a family

331
00:11:41,519 --> 00:11:45,440
where did you grow up or what kind of

332
00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:47,920
place did you grow up in did you have an

333
00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:49,519
idea of what the weather was like

334
00:11:47,920 --> 00:11:51,279
what's your

335
00:11:49,519 --> 00:11:52,639
favorite food

336
00:11:51,279 --> 00:11:54,639
different things like that so i can be

337
00:11:52,639 --> 00:11:56,959
like all right well your favorite food

338
00:11:54,639 --> 00:11:58,399
is sticky toffee pudding and you come

339
00:11:56,959 --> 00:12:00,399
from a very

340
00:11:58,399 --> 00:12:02,639
cold climate and

341
00:12:00,399 --> 00:12:05,120
you know rigid cash structure so you

342
00:12:02,639 --> 00:12:06,720
never really got to have any but now

343
00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:08,000
you're in an area that has it all over

344
00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:10,079
the place and you're an adventurer

345
00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:12,560
you've got money you can just buy it

346
00:12:10,079 --> 00:12:13,839
what do you do

347
00:12:12,560 --> 00:12:16,240
you're in the sticky doffy pudding

348
00:12:13,839 --> 00:12:19,040
capital of the world like

349
00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:21,519
yeah yeah you know and then i can

350
00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:23,040
take those fun little elements

351
00:12:21,519 --> 00:12:25,600
and add it in

352
00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:28,240
because like my my own homebrew setting

353
00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:30,959
where we uh our first season

354
00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:33,600
of my podcast that we played in

355
00:12:30,959 --> 00:12:37,440
it was 30 years after the first world

356
00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:39,600
war that this world had ever experienced

357
00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:41,519
and one of the players was a veteran so

358
00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:43,279
i just let him

359
00:12:41,519 --> 00:12:44,560
fill in like oh yeah i went to this

360
00:12:43,279 --> 00:12:47,279
place and it was like this and i was

361
00:12:44,560 --> 00:12:50,000
like all right cool sure cool i try

362
00:12:47,279 --> 00:12:52,320
really hard to leave things

363
00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:54,399
uh structured enough that there's like a

364
00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:56,800
a foundation to build on but vague

365
00:12:54,399 --> 00:12:58,399
enough that the players get to decide am

366
00:12:56,800 --> 00:13:00,240
i building a house am i building a shed

367
00:12:58,399 --> 00:13:02,320
am i building a shop you know what i'm

368
00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:04,800
what am i building on this foundation

369
00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:06,800
mm-hmm yeah i think that's

370
00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:08,959
yeah i'm just thinking about another

371
00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:10,880
like there was a a more local map i had

372
00:13:08,959 --> 00:13:12,000
of an area and there was just some

373
00:13:10,880 --> 00:13:13,519
ruined

374
00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:16,079
on the map but there was some some

375
00:13:13,519 --> 00:13:17,839
iconography for some ruins or something

376
00:13:16,079 --> 00:13:19,120
and you know had the players gone there

377
00:13:17,839 --> 00:13:21,279
i would have

378
00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:23,839
spun up some side quests blah blah blah

379
00:13:21,279 --> 00:13:25,040
they never did so that's fine

380
00:13:23,839 --> 00:13:26,720
one of my other

381
00:13:25,040 --> 00:13:27,839
player characters has just

382
00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:29,600
been

383
00:13:27,839 --> 00:13:30,480
i don't know i don't spoil too much but

384
00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:32,639
is

385
00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:33,920
woken up shall we say

386
00:13:32,639 --> 00:13:35,519
and i was like oh you can you can wake

387
00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:37,519
up and that's perfect place i've already

388
00:13:35,519 --> 00:13:39,199
kind of got it ready these ruins are now

389
00:13:37,519 --> 00:13:41,120
they were just ruins before now they're

390
00:13:39,199 --> 00:13:43,360
a chapel to this god and that's where

391
00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:45,199
you wake up and that's how it's it's

392
00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:46,480
physically on the map and you can point

393
00:13:45,199 --> 00:13:49,199
to it and

394
00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:50,480
that is now that thing and it went from

395
00:13:49,199 --> 00:13:51,920
you know had the players gone there i

396
00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:54,399
would have had to find somewhere else

397
00:13:51,920 --> 00:13:56,160
but that's fine and that's

398
00:13:54,399 --> 00:13:58,320
you know it's just

399
00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:59,440
very easy if you keep things as you said

400
00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:01,360
there's a there's a fundamental

401
00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:02,959
structure there that you know of course

402
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:05,279
you're not everyone's not just floating

403
00:14:02,959 --> 00:14:07,680
in a cpc of

404
00:14:05,279 --> 00:14:09,920
nothingness yeah but

405
00:14:07,680 --> 00:14:11,760
enough structure there that you can then

406
00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:13,040
pick and drop and choose and be like oh

407
00:14:11,760 --> 00:14:14,959
yeah i did put some settlements on the

408
00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:16,079
map there perhaps that would be a good

409
00:14:14,959 --> 00:14:17,839
place for you to start oh yeah sounds

410
00:14:16,079 --> 00:14:18,880
great cool bish bash bosh everybody's

411
00:14:17,839 --> 00:14:20,480
happy

412
00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:21,440
and then suddenly overnight this has

413
00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:23,360
become

414
00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:24,639
canon and again it's so funny when i

415
00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:26,160
think about it like that because you

416
00:14:24,639 --> 00:14:30,800
have

417
00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:33,440
these adored franchises like star wars

418
00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:35,760
like a lord of the rings that have got

419
00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:38,959
decades of like super passionate fans

420
00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:42,079
decades of super detailed lore

421
00:14:38,959 --> 00:14:44,880
and then in like my campaign my cam my

422
00:14:42,079 --> 00:14:47,279
canon was set up like yesterday yeah

423
00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:49,040
and like no one else knows about it

424
00:14:47,279 --> 00:14:50,800
yeah but it's it that's that exists in

425
00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:53,920
the universe that's that's now like a

426
00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:56,160
fundamental truth of my universe i i do

427
00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:58,560
have a thing where i

428
00:14:56,160 --> 00:15:00,959
i think about it sometimes and it it

429
00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:02,399
makes me happy that uh you know

430
00:15:00,959 --> 00:15:03,920
sometimes when i think about it i'm very

431
00:15:02,399 --> 00:15:05,920
glad that

432
00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:09,199
the listenership

433
00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:10,399
of my stuff is not as big as a critical

434
00:15:09,199 --> 00:15:13,680
role

435
00:15:10,399 --> 00:15:15,839
because i would hate to listen to people

436
00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:18,000
be like well but in episode three you

437
00:15:15,839 --> 00:15:20,000
said this and in episode 92 you said

438
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:22,800
this i'm like man you cannot expect me

439
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:26,519
to remember what i said in episode three

440
00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:26,519
yep yeah absolutely

441
00:15:26,639 --> 00:15:31,199
i'm so stoked that my my players just as

442
00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:34,800
forgetful as i am yeah god god knows how

443
00:15:31,199 --> 00:15:37,279
many you know inconsistencies there are

444
00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:39,199
thrown around yeah i

445
00:15:37,279 --> 00:15:42,160
i love a note taker

446
00:15:39,199 --> 00:15:45,040
in a game i absolutely adore the note

447
00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:46,480
taker because my notes are like weird

448
00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:48,160
bullet points

449
00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:49,680
yeah yeah so sometimes i'll write

450
00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:51,600
something down and be like i don't know

451
00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:54,480
what this means i didn't write any

452
00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:56,480
context to this what is this

453
00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:58,880
but it also means that when i do write

454
00:15:56,480 --> 00:16:00,880
down like hey they really like this npc

455
00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:03,759
i wonder if i can use them to

456
00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:05,920
emotionally torment their players later

457
00:16:03,759 --> 00:16:07,279
the note taker is the one who's like

458
00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:10,000
wait a second

459
00:16:07,279 --> 00:16:11,519
that's that's our buddy from the bar who

460
00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:13,519
taught us how to play

461
00:16:11,519 --> 00:16:15,839
uh uh dragon chess

462
00:16:13,519 --> 00:16:17,350
why is he here turning us in for the

463
00:16:15,839 --> 00:16:20,240
bounty

464
00:16:17,350 --> 00:16:21,680
[Laughter]

465
00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:24,720
and then the other players go we had a

466
00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:26,399
bounty what yeah oh yeah oh man you this

467
00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:28,480
is i'm like talking to a mirror this is

468
00:16:26,399 --> 00:16:30,160
well nice because like my my games are

469
00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:32,639
exactly the same

470
00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:34,320
i haven't in one game i play in there is

471
00:16:32,639 --> 00:16:36,800
a note taker who happens to be the mom

472
00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:38,160
of the dm and before we start she said

473
00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:38,880
oh yeah let me just get all these papers

474
00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:41,040
out

475
00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:43,519
shuffling the papers and it is almost

476
00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:44,720
like a blow for blow descript like and

477
00:16:43,519 --> 00:16:46,079
then this happened and then this

478
00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:47,600
happened and then and i'm like this is

479
00:16:46,079 --> 00:16:50,480
i'm so thankful for that as a player

480
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:52,399
cause i'm like ah yeah cause i didn't

481
00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:54,959
pay attention for half an hour sorry

482
00:16:52,399 --> 00:16:57,600
whoops cardinal's sin but life is life

483
00:16:54,959 --> 00:16:59,440
and i'm so thankful for you

484
00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:01,519
that you don't you don't know

485
00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:02,880
i i will say too

486
00:17:01,519 --> 00:17:04,640
you know as more and more games are

487
00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:06,880
played online

488
00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:10,160
it is very like for me

489
00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:12,640
i almost never get to play in person

490
00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:13,439
mostly for scheduling reasons and also

491
00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:14,640
for

492
00:17:13,439 --> 00:17:15,839
other reasons

493
00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:18,240
and

494
00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:20,720
it is this thing where if i'm not able

495
00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:23,120
to just like look at somebody

496
00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:24,799
i can just drift off

497
00:17:23,120 --> 00:17:26,640
you know right now i'm i could just

498
00:17:24,799 --> 00:17:28,400
stare at the drywall and on the other

499
00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:30,160
side of my computer

500
00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:33,280
and it's like oh sorry i didn't realize

501
00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:36,080
that i just left my body for 30 seconds

502
00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:37,840
yep what happened yep yep i've

503
00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:39,280
daydreamed with the best of them i do

504
00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:42,320
think that because mentioning you know

505
00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:45,200
almost a blow-by-blow i would love

506
00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:46,880
just for the experience to play in or

507
00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:49,760
run a game for

508
00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:52,000
somebody who's like a court stenographer

509
00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,720
oh god that would be like in my head i'm

510
00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:54,799
like

511
00:17:52,720 --> 00:17:56,720
that would be fascinating

512
00:17:54,799 --> 00:17:58,880
i i would love to see

513
00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:01,120
if if they take amazing notes or if

514
00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:02,799
they're like quite a few of my friends

515
00:18:01,120 --> 00:18:05,120
are where they're like

516
00:18:02,799 --> 00:18:06,720
no i do stuff like this all day i'm not

517
00:18:05,120 --> 00:18:08,880
doing it now

518
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:10,559
yeah yeah that's my day job

519
00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:12,720
i didn't come here to take extensive

520
00:18:10,559 --> 00:18:15,039
notes i came here to be a seven foot

521
00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:17,039
tall warrior woman with a hammer

522
00:18:15,039 --> 00:18:19,679
absolutely i think that is definitely

523
00:18:17,039 --> 00:18:22,880
gonna happen that's that's why i play is

524
00:18:19,679 --> 00:18:25,200
to not be a dm basically it's almost

525
00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:28,000
it sounds weird but i play to not be a

526
00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:30,080
dm rather than just for playing in a

527
00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:31,520
weird way like i i've tested the guy

528
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,559
who's very close friend been on the show

529
00:18:31,520 --> 00:18:34,559
twice

530
00:18:32,559 --> 00:18:37,360
i'm like dude this is my like turn my

531
00:18:34,559 --> 00:18:39,440
brain off gaming so i'm sorry but

532
00:18:37,360 --> 00:18:42,799
i come here to play d and not have to

533
00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:44,320
think too hard so excuse it if i'm like

534
00:18:42,799 --> 00:18:45,520
checking out half the time and he's like

535
00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:47,280
no that's cool man

536
00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:49,440
you're just great when you

537
00:18:47,280 --> 00:18:51,120
yeah yeah he's like that's cool you know

538
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:52,720
i'm just glad you know you add value

539
00:18:51,120 --> 00:18:53,600
you're fun you're great player so i'm

540
00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:55,840
happy

541
00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:57,360
for you i'm like cool thank you oh this

542
00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:58,480
is my chill out time man

543
00:18:57,360 --> 00:18:59,760
yeah

544
00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:02,160
the last

545
00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:03,919
five or six years i've been dming way

546
00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,799
more than i've been playing

547
00:19:03,919 --> 00:19:07,280
and

548
00:19:04,799 --> 00:19:08,799
it's it's been very fun because i love

549
00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:10,799
telling stories i love getting my

550
00:19:08,799 --> 00:19:12,240
friends involved in these stories and

551
00:19:10,799 --> 00:19:14,799
like

552
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:16,880
these little drops or emotional moments

553
00:19:14,799 --> 00:19:19,280
and stuff like that

554
00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:22,480
but it's also

555
00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:25,360
like even in canon as a player

556
00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:26,799
i love i love playing big dumb

557
00:19:25,360 --> 00:19:29,360
characters

558
00:19:26,799 --> 00:19:31,679
but at the same time i as a player love

559
00:19:29,360 --> 00:19:34,000
paying attention because to go back to

560
00:19:31,679 --> 00:19:35,120
canon in a session

561
00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,880
canon is

562
00:19:35,120 --> 00:19:38,559
established you know well you said the

563
00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:40,400
room had this

564
00:19:38,559 --> 00:19:42,160
yes so the room has this right and it's

565
00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:44,240
like yeah okay and then i'll be like all

566
00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:45,760
right well if the room you said the room

567
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:46,960
has chandeliers are they tied up

568
00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:48,799
somewhere i'm gonna lure this guy

569
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:51,120
underneath it and cut the rope

570
00:19:48,799 --> 00:19:52,559
do some wild [ __ ] using the cannon

571
00:19:51,120 --> 00:19:53,919
that's established in the setting and

572
00:19:52,559 --> 00:19:56,160
that's

573
00:19:53,919 --> 00:19:58,320
so like as a player i tend to pay a lot

574
00:19:56,160 --> 00:20:01,280
of attention to what's going on because

575
00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:02,960
i want those moments of like

576
00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:04,480
ah

577
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:07,230
you thought i wasn't paying attention

578
00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:09,520
because my character is a meat head

579
00:20:07,230 --> 00:20:12,159
[Laughter]

580
00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:14,559
they're the aha a factor yeah yeah it's

581
00:20:12,159 --> 00:20:16,799
all about uh i

582
00:20:14,559 --> 00:20:19,360
a lot of my players

583
00:20:16,799 --> 00:20:21,360
can be very like oh man i did not see

584
00:20:19,360 --> 00:20:23,760
that coming but i've played with them

585
00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:25,360
for so long that i generally can predict

586
00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:27,679
what's gonna happen

587
00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:30,559
but i i do have one player that i almost

588
00:20:27,679 --> 00:20:32,320
never get to play with and it is a shame

589
00:20:30,559 --> 00:20:34,799
because it is what i imagine having me

590
00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:37,039
as a player is like they just have no

591
00:20:34,799 --> 00:20:39,770
respect for the villains and everything

592
00:20:37,039 --> 00:20:42,240
they try is insane and then they succeed

593
00:20:39,770 --> 00:20:43,600
[Laughter]

594
00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:45,200
have you got

595
00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:46,240
give me one example

596
00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:49,120
um

597
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:50,880
so one that wasn't insane it was just a

598
00:20:49,120 --> 00:20:53,120
a moment of how

599
00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:56,159
had i never thought about this

600
00:20:53,120 --> 00:20:57,840
yeah is uh it was a modern superhero

601
00:20:56,159 --> 00:20:59,200
setting and i was like i'm gonna have

602
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,200
them do some sleuthing they're gonna

603
00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:03,120
have to look up whatever thing

604
00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:04,640
you know find try and track down

605
00:21:03,120 --> 00:21:07,360
information about this person and they

606
00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:08,880
go i'm gonna check their facebook

607
00:21:07,360 --> 00:21:10,720
what yeah

608
00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:12,480
they probably have a facebook right i'm

609
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:14,000
gonna go check it is it private

610
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,960
and i'm like

611
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:17,679
okay

612
00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:19,919
i can't i can't say no you don't check

613
00:21:17,679 --> 00:21:22,240
their facebook and they're a college

614
00:21:19,919 --> 00:21:23,679
student of course they have a facebook

615
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:26,640
yeah so

616
00:21:23,679 --> 00:21:27,600
that was very much so a i

617
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:29,520
this should have been something i

618
00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:30,480
predicted but then like not respecting

619
00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:32,960
villains

620
00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:34,559
i had a villain start monologuing and

621
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:35,520
this player just goes

622
00:21:34,559 --> 00:21:37,039
uh

623
00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:38,400
i'm sorry to interrupt but in the middle

624
00:21:37,039 --> 00:21:40,320
of their monologue can i just hit him

625
00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:42,080
with a rock

626
00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:43,919
at least they apologize for interrupting

627
00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,360
yeah you know they're polite enough to

628
00:21:43,919 --> 00:21:47,120
be like i know you have a moment here

629
00:21:45,360 --> 00:21:49,120
but my character really would interrupt

630
00:21:47,120 --> 00:21:51,440
their monologue to hit them with a rock

631
00:21:49,120 --> 00:21:53,919
yeah that's fair go ahead and do it

632
00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:57,200
yeah you're wait you're way too kind

633
00:21:53,919 --> 00:21:59,600
because i'm i've planned my

634
00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:01,600
big bads monologue and

635
00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:03,200
he he's getting it

636
00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:04,880
they're going to be in an anti-magic

637
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,240
zone they're going to be in a silent

638
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,480
zone they're going to be in the darkness

639
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:10,080
zone like they can't speak they can't

640
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:12,480
move their hands there's no magic they

641
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:14,720
can cast they don't get to do anything

642
00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:16,080
whatever contrived indiana jones style

643
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:18,159
trap has to happen to put them in that

644
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:21,039
situation it's happening

645
00:22:18,159 --> 00:22:23,360
just so he can speak for two minutes

646
00:22:21,039 --> 00:22:26,799
to do anything to have that monologue

647
00:22:23,360 --> 00:22:29,200
happen i am lucky enough that my regular

648
00:22:26,799 --> 00:22:30,880
players i i'm usually

649
00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:33,120
i'm usually successful enough in

650
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:34,320
creating enough awe in the build-up to

651
00:22:33,120 --> 00:22:35,919
the speech

652
00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:37,919
that they're too focused on what i'm

653
00:22:35,919 --> 00:22:41,039
saying to even think about interrupting

654
00:22:37,919 --> 00:22:42,880
me yeah which is fun but

655
00:22:41,039 --> 00:22:46,559
talking about like contrived traps and

656
00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:47,840
stuff uh another thing that i've done

657
00:22:46,559 --> 00:22:49,600
occasionally

658
00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:50,960
i should do it more because it's very

659
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:52,240
helpful

660
00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:54,559
is

661
00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:56,240
you know to take it back to cannon

662
00:22:54,559 --> 00:22:58,000
the next door the players go through is

663
00:22:56,240 --> 00:22:59,679
gonna have the dragon behind it it

664
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:02,480
doesn't matter if they go left or right

665
00:22:59,679 --> 00:23:04,880
the next door has the dragon behind it

666
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:06,480
and that's another

667
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:08,480
there's this level of like well the

668
00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:10,640
cannon is concrete the next door has the

669
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:12,559
dragon behind it but the cannon is also

670
00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:15,120
nebulous because it doesn't matter which

671
00:23:12,559 --> 00:23:17,280
door they go through yeah

672
00:23:15,120 --> 00:23:19,360
they're quantum quantum dragon in this

673
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:20,960
instance yeah you know uh i was about to

674
00:23:19,360 --> 00:23:22,720
say chekhov's dragon and that's not

675
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:24,400
right

676
00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:26,000
if only if you'd set up a dragon ahead

677
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:28,240
of time you'd like some dragon scales

678
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:29,679
then perhaps yeah

679
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,679
yeah if they saw it flying through the

680
00:23:29,679 --> 00:23:35,120
air then it's chekhov's dragon

681
00:23:31,679 --> 00:23:36,720
yeah yeah i i wanted to say earlier

682
00:23:35,120 --> 00:23:38,400
about

683
00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:40,400
i know we've talked quite a little bit

684
00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:42,880
now about note takers and stuff and how

685
00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:44,400
we're in love with them however my my

686
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:46,799
group of players doesn't

687
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:48,320
really happen to have one of those

688
00:23:46,799 --> 00:23:51,120
for whatever reason none of them have

689
00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:52,720
volunteered to do so so i i'll do the

690
00:23:51,120 --> 00:23:54,640
session recap

691
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:56,159
and i will frequently remind them of

692
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:58,000
things and i just wanted to give an

693
00:23:56,159 --> 00:23:58,960
example because

694
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:00,559
i think

695
00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:02,799
it can help other dm's who have been in

696
00:24:00,559 --> 00:24:05,120
this situation so i'd had

697
00:24:02,799 --> 00:24:07,360
one npc who's like

698
00:24:05,120 --> 00:24:10,000
kind of morally

699
00:24:07,360 --> 00:24:12,159
gray he's a bit of a hand handyman quote

700
00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:13,679
unquote so he knows people he can get

701
00:24:12,159 --> 00:24:15,120
you things but

702
00:24:13,679 --> 00:24:16,400
he's typically

703
00:24:15,120 --> 00:24:18,480
you know

704
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:21,120
lawful at least

705
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,159
when in sunlight yeah

706
00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:23,039
um

707
00:24:22,159 --> 00:24:25,200
you know he's not evil he's not

708
00:24:23,039 --> 00:24:27,200
murdering people but he's just like oh i

709
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:29,120
can you know i know somebody you can

710
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,440
sell that to that kind of thing with

711
00:24:29,120 --> 00:24:32,960
yeah you know he had a 280 a family name

712
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:34,159
and a first name that's fine blah blah

713
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,279
blah players are on the other side of

714
00:24:34,159 --> 00:24:37,679
the world

715
00:24:35,279 --> 00:24:40,000
and they meet somebody who has similar

716
00:24:37,679 --> 00:24:42,480
mannerisms and shares that family name

717
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:44,320
now granted it was

718
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:47,120
several sessions since they'd last

719
00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:49,520
spoken to the first npc maybe 10 no

720
00:24:47,120 --> 00:24:50,480
maybe about six sessions i would say

721
00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:53,440
and

722
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:55,520
which would make that one two three four

723
00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:58,240
ten twelve weeks

724
00:24:55,520 --> 00:25:00,400
you know in real world time between

725
00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:02,320
having as human beings had that thought

726
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:04,240
in their brain so when i was like he

727
00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:06,720
looks like this and you when they asked

728
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:09,230
him his name he drops this name

729
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:10,480
and they're like okay cool

730
00:25:09,230 --> 00:25:12,159
[Music]

731
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:14,000
that could have been a really good you

732
00:25:12,159 --> 00:25:15,840
know plot thread to pull on there to be

733
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:17,760
like oh do you happen to be related to

734
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:20,240
and because none of my players have a

735
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:22,400
dedicated note taker or

736
00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:23,600
particularly keen on that side of the

737
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,279
game it just

738
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:27,200
you know nothing came of it yeah now not

739
00:25:25,279 --> 00:25:29,600
necessarily meaning nothing might ever

740
00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:31,279
never come of it but in that instance it

741
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:33,760
was one of those times as a gm you just

742
00:25:31,279 --> 00:25:36,640
kind of have to go fine that's that's

743
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:38,320
life that's just the how it is today and

744
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:40,240
the only reason i bring up

745
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:42,080
that anecdote is for that reason to to

746
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:44,400
tell people like that's just that's

747
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:46,400
gonna happen yeah and not to not to get

748
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:48,159
upset about it because

749
00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:49,919
it happens all the time

750
00:25:48,159 --> 00:25:52,400
what i find myself doing a lot in those

751
00:25:49,919 --> 00:25:54,640
situations is being like well remember

752
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:56,320
you did meet somebody in such and such

753
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,919
place that had a very similar name and

754
00:25:56,320 --> 00:26:00,000
mannerisms

755
00:25:57,919 --> 00:26:03,200
like i will just completely circumvent

756
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:06,400
the i'll be like no no no

757
00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:08,880
sirs or madames or the aliens

758
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:11,120
this is a thing you can pull on

759
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:11,919
if you choose to

760
00:26:11,120 --> 00:26:14,000
yes

761
00:26:11,919 --> 00:26:15,360
yeah i'm always in two minds and i don't

762
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,960
think i'll ever

763
00:26:15,360 --> 00:26:19,039
be you know in a position where i feel

764
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:21,200
confident enough either way to beat to

765
00:26:19,039 --> 00:26:23,360
pull that trigger and be like

766
00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:25,440
i'm going to tell you or you remember or

767
00:26:23,360 --> 00:26:26,960
you know i i always

768
00:26:25,440 --> 00:26:28,880
it you know i feel

769
00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:29,840
damned either way here

770
00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,600
yeah

771
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,279
but that is absolutely a viable way to

772
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:34,880
do it is to be like

773
00:26:33,279 --> 00:26:36,720
well okay in this instance let me help

774
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:38,880
you out here but it was it was such a

775
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:40,320
trivial npc that i didn't deem it

776
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,760
necessary i guess at that time yeah i've

777
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:43,760
done that in the past where it's like

778
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:44,720
yeah this would have been fun but meh

779
00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,200
it's not

780
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:48,159
important necessarily

781
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:51,039
yeah and

782
00:26:48,159 --> 00:26:52,640
what i tend to do a lot is

783
00:26:51,039 --> 00:26:53,840
i'll be like okay well your character's

784
00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,919
a wizard

785
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:57,760
they have a really high intelligence

786
00:26:55,919 --> 00:26:59,279
i think you would remember this and

787
00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:00,559
that's how i phrased it i think you

788
00:26:59,279 --> 00:27:02,240
would remember that you encountered

789
00:27:00,559 --> 00:27:03,600
somebody with very similar mannerisms a

790
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:06,080
few months ago

791
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:07,200
yeah absolutely and and when i do it

792
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:09,679
that way

793
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:11,360
i think of it as being more

794
00:27:09,679 --> 00:27:13,760
accommodating to my players because some

795
00:27:11,360 --> 00:27:15,520
of my players have you know 80d which

796
00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:17,919
messes with your

797
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:19,679
memory so they might be taking notes but

798
00:27:17,919 --> 00:27:21,200
they don't remember all the notes that

799
00:27:19,679 --> 00:27:22,960
they took

800
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:24,559
uh so if there's not something about

801
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:27,760
this person that immediately sparks a

802
00:27:24,559 --> 00:27:30,000
memory they don't remember it yeah no

803
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:32,000
absolutely it's a fine line for both

804
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,840
players and the gm's to be

805
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,960
you know there's an onus on both parties

806
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,320
there yeah

807
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:38,159
meet in the middle and do a little bit

808
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:40,320
of a dance around what we do know what

809
00:27:38,159 --> 00:27:42,480
we don't know and my guys don't have a

810
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,440
wizard they don't have a

811
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:45,120
you know

812
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:47,200
who's dumped all their points into

813
00:27:45,120 --> 00:27:49,600
intelligence they don't have that

814
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:50,799
vehicle right which is funnily enough

815
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:52,960
the character that i play in one of the

816
00:27:50,799 --> 00:27:55,840
games i play and i'm a wizard who has

817
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:57,520
pushed 20 intelligence as soon as

818
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:59,200
mechanically possible because that was

819
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:01,760
this whole stick and i'm

820
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:03,520
several times the vehicle for the dm the

821
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:05,200
exposition machine which i'm totally

822
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,720
happy with i know that that's

823
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:08,960
you know a vehicle that's sometimes

824
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:10,320
necessary and i'm like yeah that's fine

825
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:11,760
let my boy quinn

826
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,279
just extol

827
00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:15,600
exposition for the next 10 minutes

828
00:28:13,279 --> 00:28:16,480
that's fine i've had moments myself

829
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:19,360
where

830
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,880
as a gm i'll just be like

831
00:28:19,360 --> 00:28:23,679
i don't think there's any reason your

832
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:25,440
character would know this

833
00:28:23,679 --> 00:28:27,440
uh and if the player disagrees i'm i'm

834
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,960
more than willing to hear them out but

835
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:31,279
usually my players are like you know it

836
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:33,200
sounds right and as a player i've

837
00:28:31,279 --> 00:28:35,039
forgone rolling

838
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,840
uh a knowledge skill check because i'm

839
00:28:35,039 --> 00:28:38,640
like

840
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:40,640
there is no way my character knows this

841
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:41,760
yeah there's no way that this character

842
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:44,880
knows

843
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:47,760
anything specific about blue dragons

844
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:49,120
yeah i'm not gonna roll that's a really

845
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:50,480
you've just made me think we're really

846
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,480
good

847
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:54,159
i'm super intelligent um no that came

848
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,600
out wrong

849
00:28:54,159 --> 00:28:57,679
i've thought of a really good thing you

850
00:28:55,600 --> 00:29:00,799
know it's made me think like

851
00:28:57,679 --> 00:29:02,960
i've been uh guilty of this before of

852
00:29:00,799 --> 00:29:04,480
getting the players to roll to buy time

853
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:06,159
essentially so the moment a player is

854
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:07,679
like what would what would my character

855
00:29:06,159 --> 00:29:09,679
know about this i'm like oh roll me

856
00:29:07,679 --> 00:29:11,840
history just to buy some time

857
00:29:09,679 --> 00:29:14,480
essentially as either gm rattle through

858
00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:16,399
god what do they know but i think i

859
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:18,640
think in reality those roles should

860
00:29:16,399 --> 00:29:21,039
probably be less frequent than they

861
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:22,159
perhaps are certainly in my game in that

862
00:29:21,039 --> 00:29:23,840
it's it's

863
00:29:22,159 --> 00:29:25,679
i think it's probably more binary and

864
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:26,880
it's probably only the niche things

865
00:29:25,679 --> 00:29:29,760
where you have

866
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:31,679
the need for a sliding scale i would say

867
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:32,720
so what i guess what i'm getting at is

868
00:29:31,679 --> 00:29:34,080
like don't

869
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:36,559
and it's it's a topic i've covered on

870
00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:38,640
several episodes before like just tell

871
00:29:36,559 --> 00:29:40,399
the players there's often a desire to be

872
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:42,640
like i hold all the cards you know

873
00:29:40,399 --> 00:29:44,159
nothing i know everything because that's

874
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:46,399
kind of what the story needs to make it

875
00:29:44,159 --> 00:29:48,159
interesting and exciting but

876
00:29:46,399 --> 00:29:50,080
less damage

877
00:29:48,159 --> 00:29:51,440
pretty much no damage has ever been done

878
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:54,000
by just being like no you know this

879
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,840
about blue dragons because of a summer

880
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:58,399
school you went to and that's fine like

881
00:29:55,840 --> 00:30:00,320
there's no yeah i do this thing where i

882
00:29:58,399 --> 00:30:03,520
use um

883
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:05,919
passive perception as my like

884
00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:09,039
base there where i go okay it i think it

885
00:30:05,919 --> 00:30:11,520
would be a dc 15 to know that

886
00:30:09,039 --> 00:30:14,000
blue dragons are

887
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:16,240
commonly blue dragons are willing to

888
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:18,000
converse with people they're not always

889
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:21,760
just out to kill you and eat you yeah

890
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:23,279
attack on sight and your arcana or your

891
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:24,240
history

892
00:30:23,279 --> 00:30:26,080
skill

893
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:30,080
is a plus eight

894
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:32,080
so on an average roll you know this

895
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:34,960
and that's usually what i use as my

896
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:37,600
basis on that as i try and think

897
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:39,039
on an average roll would they know this

898
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,159
and if the answer is no then i'll have

899
00:30:39,039 --> 00:30:42,320
them roll

900
00:30:40,159 --> 00:30:44,159
if the answer is yes then i just tell

901
00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,760
them

902
00:30:44,159 --> 00:30:48,159
and that i think actually ties into the

903
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:50,399
discussion of canon where it's like

904
00:30:48,159 --> 00:30:52,320
as a player deciding what would your

905
00:30:50,399 --> 00:30:53,760
character reasonably know is this

906
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:56,080
something that your character might have

907
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:58,240
just heard in conversation or gotten

908
00:30:56,080 --> 00:31:00,640
bored and read a book about because like

909
00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:02,399
as a person i know a lot of weird and

910
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:03,760
varied information

911
00:31:02,399 --> 00:31:05,440
but there's still a lot of stuff where

912
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:07,679
i'm like i have no idea what this is i

913
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:09,840
don't i don't know what this means

914
00:31:07,679 --> 00:31:11,679
and i don't think that were somebody

915
00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:13,679
playing me as a character

916
00:31:11,679 --> 00:31:15,120
i don't think that they would like roll

917
00:31:13,679 --> 00:31:15,919
to see if they knew that they'd just be

918
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:17,200
like

919
00:31:15,919 --> 00:31:19,200
no how

920
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:21,039
he doesn't know how to do heart surgery

921
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:24,159
he doesn't know how that [ __ ] works

922
00:31:21,039 --> 00:31:25,679
sure i i know the principle but i don't

923
00:31:24,159 --> 00:31:28,000
know any of the specifics why would i

924
00:31:25,679 --> 00:31:32,399
roll for that oh i wouldn't trust me to

925
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:34,159
do it yeah i wouldn't trust me to do it

926
00:31:32,399 --> 00:31:35,200
and i i do have a firm belief when it

927
00:31:34,159 --> 00:31:37,519
comes to

928
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:39,600
because this thought came to me is um

929
00:31:37,519 --> 00:31:42,000
when it comes to canon

930
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:44,840
i don't care what it says in the book

931
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:47,840
but i do care what we have said at the

932
00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:49,840
table so i'm fine with changing canon

933
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:51,200
when it a changing canon that's been set

934
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:52,720
at the table if it's like well now

935
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:54,880
you're in this place that you've only

936
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:56,720
ever heard about nobody none of you have

937
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,240
ever actually been here

938
00:31:56,720 --> 00:32:00,480
and now you're finding out that all the

939
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:02,640
stories you heard were wrong

940
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:03,760
they were made up or propaganda or

941
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,360
something

942
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:07,279
but i do

943
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:09,200
like without a reason i don't like to

944
00:32:07,279 --> 00:32:12,080
change the canon

945
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:15,039
after it's been established in game

946
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:17,360
yes once we have said the words

947
00:32:15,039 --> 00:32:19,360
in a a a different system than d d that

948
00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:20,640
i'm playing right now they use the word

949
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,159
fiction

950
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,120
in that once you have established

951
00:32:22,159 --> 00:32:24,960
fiction

952
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:28,080
you should stick to that fiction there

953
00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:28,960
there should be a reason that it changes

954
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,679
yeah

955
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:33,440
now sometimes i have in the past changed

956
00:32:31,679 --> 00:32:34,720
that reason by just saying

957
00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:37,519
um

958
00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:39,039
is is are any of us having fun with this

959
00:32:37,519 --> 00:32:40,240
yes this particular tidbit of

960
00:32:39,039 --> 00:32:42,640
information

961
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:44,480
no okay don't i'm gonna change it is

962
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:46,799
that cool with everybody

963
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:48,880
yeah yeah absolutely absolutely like

964
00:32:46,799 --> 00:32:50,320
honest mistakes or okay this isn't

965
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:52,240
really working because nobody's having

966
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:53,840
fun they're the two instances when it's

967
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:55,600
probably okay to be like you know what

968
00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:58,080
that was a mistake let's mix it up a

969
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,440
little bit yeah and all of this you know

970
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:02,000
all this talk about rolling and stuff is

971
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:05,360
all about how to communicate the canon

972
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:07,840
of the setting to the players via their

973
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:09,200
player characters which is wrought with

974
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:10,640
pitfalls because

975
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,919
you're trying to filter through two

976
00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:13,519
layers of

977
00:33:11,919 --> 00:33:15,200
understanding and knowledge with maybe

978
00:33:13,519 --> 00:33:17,039
some randomness thrown in so it is a

979
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,039
tricky you know topic definitely worthy

980
00:33:17,039 --> 00:33:20,480
of discussion and

981
00:33:19,039 --> 00:33:22,000
i wanted to embellish a little bit and

982
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:23,600
say

983
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:25,600
if you do roll

984
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:27,440
often for those kind of things like what

985
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:29,120
would i know about this kind of red wine

986
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,760
i'm drinking and where it's coming from

987
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:33,679
yeah maybe if it's you know you could

988
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:36,720
roll for that that might be fun

989
00:33:33,679 --> 00:33:38,799
but if that happens a lot then it

990
00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:41,440
kind of lessens the impact of other

991
00:33:38,799 --> 00:33:44,159
roles and don't forget it's also a d20

992
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:45,919
it's also the same check to find out

993
00:33:44,159 --> 00:33:48,399
whether you stab something yeah which

994
00:33:45,919 --> 00:33:50,480
has a lot of impact and if you start

995
00:33:48,399 --> 00:33:52,240
lessening that impact by being like you

996
00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:54,240
know this cheese is blue because it's

997
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,919
grown in the mountains

998
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:58,159
and the same role two seconds later is

999
00:33:55,919 --> 00:33:59,440
to stab somebody it's like okay that

1000
00:33:58,159 --> 00:34:00,720
that stab roll should have been like a

1001
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,720
really really really input whoa he's

1002
00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:04,240
rolling a dice to stab

1003
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:05,840
but you're also using the same

1004
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:07,760
importance to find out where blue cheese

1005
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:10,079
is from it's like well it kind of

1006
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:11,599
muddies the water a little bit yeah so

1007
00:34:10,079 --> 00:34:13,440
yeah i would say save those you know

1008
00:34:11,599 --> 00:34:16,000
make make rolling

1009
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:17,359
impactful it should be for those like

1010
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,960
you know this this this about blue

1011
00:34:17,359 --> 00:34:21,119
dragon but maybe you don't know whether

1012
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:23,040
they'll kill you on site maybe that bit

1013
00:34:21,119 --> 00:34:26,000
yeah should be the role just to be like

1014
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:27,760
okay well how well yeah yeah i think

1015
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:29,119
we have to be oh you grew up

1016
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:30,320
blue dragons in this setting

1017
00:34:29,119 --> 00:34:33,119
traditionally

1018
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:34,399
live in arid climates you grew up in an

1019
00:34:33,119 --> 00:34:35,839
arid climate

1020
00:34:34,399 --> 00:34:38,159
you know that

1021
00:34:35,839 --> 00:34:40,240
they spit lightning and you've heard

1022
00:34:38,159 --> 00:34:42,879
that they're completely immune to

1023
00:34:40,240 --> 00:34:43,839
lightning and i was like all right

1024
00:34:42,879 --> 00:34:46,159
cool

1025
00:34:43,839 --> 00:34:49,280
that makes sense but you might have only

1026
00:34:46,159 --> 00:34:51,440
ever heard that they kill you on sight

1027
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,240
and use your bones you pick their teeth

1028
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:53,839
and

1029
00:34:52,240 --> 00:34:56,240
you know the reality might be that they

1030
00:34:53,839 --> 00:34:57,200
don't give a [ __ ] about you at all

1031
00:34:56,240 --> 00:34:59,599
yeah

1032
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:01,359
yeah yeah i do like those kind of if

1033
00:34:59,599 --> 00:35:02,560
they roll low for example then you can

1034
00:35:01,359 --> 00:35:04,480
feed them and be like oh yeah you

1035
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:05,280
remember hearing like a bard's tale that

1036
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:07,680
they

1037
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:09,200
will throw you into the magma and pick

1038
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:10,560
out all your bones and stuff but it was

1039
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:12,720
just like

1040
00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:14,720
exaggeration for stories purposes like

1041
00:35:12,720 --> 00:35:17,839
and they're actually totally chill yeah

1042
00:35:14,720 --> 00:35:19,440
yeah and i was thinking about you know

1043
00:35:17,839 --> 00:35:21,839
mentioning the roles

1044
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:24,560
because you're you're right the roles

1045
00:35:21,839 --> 00:35:26,400
help establish this canon of what the

1046
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:27,920
characters know

1047
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:30,000
depending on the role but it can also

1048
00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:31,760
like a perception check is a this is

1049
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:34,560
what you perceive about your

1050
00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:36,480
surroundings and stuff like that

1051
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:38,800
and yeah i don't think

1052
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:40,480
unless they were in an entirely new area

1053
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:42,079
i don't think i would ever

1054
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:44,800
have a player role

1055
00:35:42,079 --> 00:35:46,720
to like identify this wine

1056
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:50,079
if they had established as part of the

1057
00:35:46,720 --> 00:35:51,680
canon that oh no my my character loves

1058
00:35:50,079 --> 00:35:53,440
wine they love learning about it they

1059
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:54,480
know all about how it's made and all

1060
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:56,880
these different things because they find

1061
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:58,960
it fast the science behind winemaking is

1062
00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:00,560
fascinating to them and then i'm like

1063
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:01,680
yeah okay well you recognize these

1064
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,920
things

1065
00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:05,760
so without rolling you would assume

1066
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:07,520
these things and then i leave it to the

1067
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:09,680
player do you want to roll to see if you

1068
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:11,280
can like be more confident

1069
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:13,040
in this or do you think your character

1070
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:14,960
would just be like ah i know enough

1071
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:15,920
about wine to know what this is

1072
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:16,960
yeah

1073
00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:20,079
yeah

1074
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:21,520
that reminds me of i had a guest on that

1075
00:36:20,079 --> 00:36:23,760
i think it was peach garden games and

1076
00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:27,359
they were talking about their magic

1077
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:29,680
system and their ttrpg they've made and

1078
00:36:27,359 --> 00:36:32,480
the whole premise of casting spells is

1079
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:34,880
like this negotiation between the dm and

1080
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:37,359
the player so there's quite a lot of

1081
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:38,960
trust inherent in the system it is this

1082
00:36:37,359 --> 00:36:41,119
two-way street of well if i do this how

1083
00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:42,960
much is it's going to cost me oh it'll

1084
00:36:41,119 --> 00:36:44,320
cost you x but if you

1085
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:46,160
if you don't make it turn the enemies

1086
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:48,079
upside down then it will only cost you y

1087
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:51,119
which is a bit less oh yeah okay that's

1088
00:36:48,079 --> 00:36:52,800
that's fine i liked that idea of

1089
00:36:51,119 --> 00:36:54,240
like dynamic negotiation and you can

1090
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,240
have that in that setting you've just

1091
00:36:54,240 --> 00:36:57,599
described with the player character

1092
00:36:56,240 --> 00:36:59,119
there and also in other ones we've

1093
00:36:57,599 --> 00:37:01,119
discussed around like

1094
00:36:59,119 --> 00:37:02,400
well you tell me how would you know

1095
00:37:01,119 --> 00:37:03,839
about this

1096
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:06,240
and there's not maybe maybe i went to

1097
00:37:03,839 --> 00:37:07,680
school here and studied for 15 years and

1098
00:37:06,240 --> 00:37:09,680
then the dm can go well actually you're

1099
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:11,599
only 20 years old so 15 years of

1100
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:13,920
studying doesn't really

1101
00:37:11,599 --> 00:37:15,520
you know add up here maybe let's let's

1102
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,960
tailor that though

1103
00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:19,839
were you left at the steps of this

1104
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:21,760
library and raised inside of it

1105
00:37:19,839 --> 00:37:22,760
yeah in the in the blue dragon section

1106
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:24,000
and you weren't allowed to leave

1107
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:25,839
[Laughter]

1108
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:28,000
i've said things like that to players

1109
00:37:25,839 --> 00:37:30,240
before and then immediately said i'm not

1110
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:32,000
saying no

1111
00:37:30,240 --> 00:37:33,920
i'm saying this is the realistic

1112
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:35,680
situation in which this would be what

1113
00:37:33,920 --> 00:37:37,760
you've just said would be true

1114
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:40,720
does that fit

1115
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:42,640
can you make that work

1116
00:37:40,720 --> 00:37:44,800
but i do like that negotiation that back

1117
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:46,240
and forth of like yeah okay

1118
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:48,240
tell me you know when would you have

1119
00:37:46,240 --> 00:37:49,520
learned about this and if maybe the

1120
00:37:48,240 --> 00:37:52,240
player's not so confident or they can't

1121
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:53,760
think of anything then i'm happy and

1122
00:37:52,240 --> 00:37:56,400
competent enough for improvisation to be

1123
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:58,640
like oh perhaps you did you know you

1124
00:37:56,400 --> 00:38:01,520
during your travels you met this person

1125
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:03,680
or you did study here for a year and

1126
00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:04,720
you majored in blue dragons just for

1127
00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:06,000
sake of

1128
00:38:04,720 --> 00:38:08,160
just for the fun

1129
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:10,800
yeah exactly there is that two-way

1130
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:12,079
street negotiation of china understand

1131
00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:14,079
the canon

1132
00:38:12,079 --> 00:38:15,599
of the universe

1133
00:38:14,079 --> 00:38:18,079
yeah and

1134
00:38:15,599 --> 00:38:20,480
there's this very

1135
00:38:18,079 --> 00:38:24,800
very fun thing for me

1136
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:27,520
because for for most of my dnd career

1137
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:29,599
it was kind of rare to encounter a gm

1138
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:30,880
who thought the same way i did and that

1139
00:38:29,599 --> 00:38:33,119
i am

1140
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:35,200
my player my pc's

1141
00:38:33,119 --> 00:38:37,119
biggest fan

1142
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:40,000
whenever i make a game

1143
00:38:37,119 --> 00:38:43,440
my characters are the heroes

1144
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:46,160
or at the very least the protagonist

1145
00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:47,520
you know i will bend and break the rules

1146
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:49,680
left and right

1147
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:51,520
usually without telling them that i'm

1148
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:53,520
bending and breaking the rules

1149
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:55,280
to make whatever cool thing that they're

1150
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:59,119
envisioning happen

1151
00:38:55,280 --> 00:39:00,400
yeah and i'm i'm so happy to see that

1152
00:38:59,119 --> 00:39:03,680
uh

1153
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:05,680
so many people are really embracing that

1154
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:07,839
because like i said for

1155
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:09,359
a good 10 years of me playing d d i

1156
00:39:07,839 --> 00:39:10,560
didn't have a lot of experience with

1157
00:39:09,359 --> 00:39:12,000
that

1158
00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:14,400
but i

1159
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:16,320
was very much so like no this is what i

1160
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:18,240
what are you talking about you did a

1161
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:20,560
[ __ ] awesome thing you should i i'm

1162
00:39:18,240 --> 00:39:23,440
gonna reward you for it yeah and i think

1163
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:26,160
that also is like there is a

1164
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:28,240
a weird version of canon

1165
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,920
that ties into like the tone of the

1166
00:39:28,240 --> 00:39:32,720
story

1167
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:36,480
because if the tone of the story is very

1168
00:39:32,720 --> 00:39:38,720
gritty and real and the world is hard

1169
00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:40,720
and things don't always work out even

1170
00:39:38,720 --> 00:39:41,760
when you do everything right

1171
00:39:40,720 --> 00:39:45,280
then

1172
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:47,359
to be you know deus ex machina a thing

1173
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:48,640
to save the player's life

1174
00:39:47,359 --> 00:39:49,920
you know i don't really feel like it

1175
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:53,560
fits in the cannon that you've already

1176
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,560
established exactly

1177
00:39:57,250 --> 00:40:03,920
[Music]

1178
00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:06,079
so i was going to ask oh do you have any

1179
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:08,960
kind of interesting tidbits of canon

1180
00:40:06,079 --> 00:40:11,440
like any you know accidental or humorous

1181
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:13,760
things that are now like as we discussed

1182
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:15,560
like part of the part of the fiction or

1183
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:18,160
this like

1184
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:20,560
unchangeable fiction of your setting

1185
00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:21,760
my absolute favorite one

1186
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:24,720
ironically has nothing to do with

1187
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:27,119
dungeons and dragons but it is um

1188
00:40:24,720 --> 00:40:28,240
i was running a western game

1189
00:40:27,119 --> 00:40:29,760
and

1190
00:40:28,240 --> 00:40:33,280
i needed a name

1191
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:34,880
at random and i came up with

1192
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:36,720
anger boston

1193
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:38,800
amazing it was from a random name

1194
00:40:36,720 --> 00:40:40,720
generator of like protestant names of

1195
00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:43,200
that time

1196
00:40:40,720 --> 00:40:45,920
and the name alone just ended up

1197
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:48,640
creating this npc that

1198
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:51,040
the players loved he was just this

1199
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:52,720
bar brawling lunatic

1200
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:54,480
who thought that the players were kind

1201
00:40:52,720 --> 00:40:57,599
of fun to have around so he would be

1202
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:59,280
willing to help them out most times

1203
00:40:57,599 --> 00:41:02,240
and originally

1204
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:04,400
he wasn't supposed to be jovial or nice

1205
00:41:02,240 --> 00:41:06,480
or any of that stuff but the players

1206
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:08,400
loved his name so much that i changed

1207
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:10,319
the fiction

1208
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:13,080
before it was established

1209
00:41:10,319 --> 00:41:14,400
and in other cases i've had

1210
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:17,760
[Music]

1211
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:20,640
but i've had other moments where

1212
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:22,720
like on ildar establishing

1213
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:23,920
by accident that

1214
00:41:22,720 --> 00:41:26,640
um

1215
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:29,200
sometimes dragons will just like

1216
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:30,160
lay down somewhere and take a nap

1217
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:31,760
yeah

1218
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:34,880
and

1219
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:36,560
i made a joke that you know it's it's

1220
00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:38,720
not unheard of for a road to be

1221
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:41,200
temporarily rerouted because the dragon

1222
00:41:38,720 --> 00:41:43,440
might be asleep for the next 10 years

1223
00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:45,200
it's like a snorlax it's like

1224
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:46,319
it's like hey are you gonna wake up the

1225
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:48,440
five-ton

1226
00:41:46,319 --> 00:41:50,560
fire-breathing lizard to make the move

1227
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:52,480
[Laughter]

1228
00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:54,560
but it was like a little throwaway joke

1229
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:56,800
but my players just kept running with it

1230
00:41:54,560 --> 00:41:59,040
and i was like okay it's canon the

1231
00:41:56,800 --> 00:42:00,800
reason you don't see dragons all over

1232
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:03,200
the place is that

1233
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:04,880
like crocodiles they might eat up a

1234
00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:06,160
bunch of food and then just take a nap

1235
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:07,200
for a week

1236
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:08,160
um

1237
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:09,920
there's

1238
00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:10,960
all around the globe they're asleep

1239
00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:12,800
somewhere but there's because they're

1240
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:14,640
just like in sleep in random places as

1241
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:17,520
well there's not flying overhead all the

1242
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:19,040
time yeah and in my setting it's like oh

1243
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:20,880
well when you're the most powerful

1244
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:22,160
mortal creature

1245
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:24,000
of course you're just gonna sleep

1246
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:26,079
wherever you feel like it

1247
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:29,040
yeah top of the food chain damn right

1248
00:42:26,079 --> 00:42:30,720
yeah you know oh i'm the most powerful

1249
00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:32,240
like i'm the biggest thing i'm the most

1250
00:42:30,720 --> 00:42:33,359
powerful thing i'm the most magical

1251
00:42:32,240 --> 00:42:35,599
thing

1252
00:42:33,359 --> 00:42:37,760
uh yeah

1253
00:42:35,599 --> 00:42:39,520
amazing yeah and it's like i've

1254
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:41,440
established canon in the past where i

1255
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:43,520
wanted to have a fun

1256
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:46,240
non-combat

1257
00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:49,280
encounter where it was combat but the

1258
00:42:46,240 --> 00:42:52,079
goal was not to end it in fighting

1259
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:55,760
where uh the players

1260
00:42:52,079 --> 00:42:59,280
were trying to stop a tarasque

1261
00:42:55,760 --> 00:43:00,880
and they were like level 10

1262
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:04,319
and it was only fun because they

1263
00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:06,560
couldn't do enough to the tarasque to

1264
00:43:04,319 --> 00:43:08,160
make it pay attention to them

1265
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:09,680
yeah so it wasn't attacking them or

1266
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:11,200
anything but they were it was like

1267
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:12,720
cutting this swath through the

1268
00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:15,359
countryside

1269
00:43:12,720 --> 00:43:18,240
and i had laid these little clues and

1270
00:43:15,359 --> 00:43:21,760
finally the bard figured out that oh

1271
00:43:18,240 --> 00:43:24,319
i can play a lullaby on my flute

1272
00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:27,359
and put this tarasque back to sleep

1273
00:43:24,319 --> 00:43:29,359
and so then it was canon that's like hey

1274
00:43:27,359 --> 00:43:31,520
sometimes you can just

1275
00:43:29,359 --> 00:43:33,900
sing a little lullaby and help that

1276
00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:38,240
gigantic murder baby go to sleep

1277
00:43:33,900 --> 00:43:40,400
[Laughter]

1278
00:43:38,240 --> 00:43:41,920
and then that just is now just a sleep

1279
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:43,359
there on the landscape for the next

1280
00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:44,800
millennia

1281
00:43:43,359 --> 00:43:47,040
yeah yeah well and that was part of it

1282
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:49,680
too was that it it this whole

1283
00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:51,920
stone and earth and town had grown up

1284
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:52,960
over the turresque

1285
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:54,720
and

1286
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:56,560
nobody remembered it being there it had

1287
00:43:54,720 --> 00:43:58,480
been so long

1288
00:43:56,560 --> 00:44:00,560
oh and it's just so they

1289
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:02,880
that's great i was thinking more like an

1290
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:04,319
area 52 thing where it'd be like

1291
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:06,160
nobody's allowed to go near because you

1292
00:44:04,319 --> 00:44:07,440
might wake it up but in this case that

1293
00:44:06,160 --> 00:44:09,359
yours is way better

1294
00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:11,440
well and the way i imagine is that it

1295
00:44:09,359 --> 00:44:13,599
probably started off that way but it was

1296
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:15,920
just asleep for 2 000 years and a bunch

1297
00:44:13,599 --> 00:44:17,359
of land grew up over top of it and

1298
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:18,800
people just went hey look at that real

1299
00:44:17,359 --> 00:44:20,160
big hill

1300
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:22,400
yeah

1301
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:22,830
i bet we could build a town on it

1302
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:25,280
yeah

1303
00:44:22,830 --> 00:44:26,240
[Laughter]

1304
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:27,680
my

1305
00:44:26,240 --> 00:44:29,040
my one is

1306
00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:33,200
and i think i have mentioned it before

1307
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:37,280
on the show um but the players were

1308
00:44:33,200 --> 00:44:39,520
walking out of a major city and because

1309
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:43,839
certainly in the earlier days they are

1310
00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:46,560
foolish and um just neglected to like

1311
00:44:43,839 --> 00:44:47,760
buy horses or just pay for

1312
00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:50,560
a coach

1313
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:52,240
um so they were just canvassing

1314
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:54,800
passers-bys that are going into this

1315
00:44:52,240 --> 00:44:57,040
quite major city for being like hey

1316
00:44:54,800 --> 00:44:58,800
wanna carry us with you in the back of

1317
00:44:57,040 --> 00:45:00,560
your van

1318
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:03,359
and um

1319
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:05,200
they met the first person and this was

1320
00:45:03,359 --> 00:45:06,880
hands up a little bit part of me being

1321
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:08,800
like let me

1322
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:10,400
show that it isn't just always going to

1323
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:12,800
be like someone's magically just going

1324
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:14,240
to come up and be like hey yeah i can

1325
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:16,000
take you and it

1326
00:45:14,240 --> 00:45:18,960
happens to be within your budget isn't

1327
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:22,160
that convenient um so i had the first

1328
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:23,280
one be like a farm owner and these are

1329
00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:25,040
typical

1330
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:27,040
you know farmland surrounding a major

1331
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:28,480
city that are just the life and blood

1332
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:29,599
you know every morning they go in sell

1333
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:30,800
the produce and come out in the

1334
00:45:29,599 --> 00:45:32,400
afternoon and

1335
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:33,520
you know it's it's very i want you know

1336
00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:35,920
very uh

1337
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:38,240
very important part of the economy

1338
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:41,359
so they were like hey you've got a nice

1339
00:45:38,240 --> 00:45:43,119
wagon fancy taken us three days out of

1340
00:45:41,359 --> 00:45:44,400
town to go to some other place and he

1341
00:45:43,119 --> 00:45:46,800
was like uh

1342
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:49,599
yeah i can do that but it will cost you

1343
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:51,920
like 400 gold and they were like whoa

1344
00:45:49,599 --> 00:45:54,079
what why why is it so expensive and he's

1345
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:56,000
like well the cost of running the farm

1346
00:45:54,079 --> 00:45:58,480
and need to get more labor in and you

1347
00:45:56,000 --> 00:46:00,480
know lost lost trade would be this you

1348
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:02,240
know 12 gold a day plus you know of

1349
00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:04,400
course the rental of the carriage and my

1350
00:46:02,240 --> 00:46:06,160
time and i you know my wage is 20 gold a

1351
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:07,440
day so

1352
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:09,920
that adds up

1353
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:11,599
so now the running joke is like

1354
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:13,599
why are we bothering adventuring when we

1355
00:46:11,599 --> 00:46:15,440
can just be farmers yeah

1356
00:46:13,599 --> 00:46:17,920
like that is their

1357
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:19,440
anytime money comes up they're like oh

1358
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:21,119
if i knew we were farmers and i'm like

1359
00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:22,319
yeah okay through gritted teeth yeah i

1360
00:46:21,119 --> 00:46:24,079
might have

1361
00:46:22,319 --> 00:46:25,680
added a couple of zeros on by accident

1362
00:46:24,079 --> 00:46:28,000
because i was didn't i just made the

1363
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:29,599
numbers up on the fly and yeah it was

1364
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:32,400
probably more than it should have been

1365
00:46:29,599 --> 00:46:34,640
in the grand scheme of things but

1366
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:35,839
so now it's just like oh you know any

1367
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:36,720
rich person they meet they're like oh

1368
00:46:35,839 --> 00:46:37,520
did you

1369
00:46:36,720 --> 00:46:40,319
you

1370
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:42,640
you're a farmer no this person's royalty

1371
00:46:40,319 --> 00:46:45,520
next person are you a farmer no

1372
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:47,359
this person's like a criminal right okay

1373
00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:48,720
the the kind of my universe is that yeah

1374
00:46:47,359 --> 00:46:50,480
farmers are like

1375
00:46:48,720 --> 00:46:52,000
the richest people in the world and just

1376
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:53,599
making honest living off the land and

1377
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:55,280
they are just

1378
00:46:53,599 --> 00:46:58,000
although they're toiling in the fields

1379
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:59,839
they go home to like these luxurious

1380
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:01,839
gold-plated mansions because they've

1381
00:46:59,839 --> 00:47:04,400
just got so much money

1382
00:47:01,839 --> 00:47:06,560
that does make me think um

1383
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:08,240
a piece of cannon whenever i run d d

1384
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:10,720
that is

1385
00:47:08,240 --> 00:47:12,480
is always a hard line

1386
00:47:10,720 --> 00:47:13,839
whenever i run a game and i never really

1387
00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:16,400
thought that that's what it was before

1388
00:47:13,839 --> 00:47:17,599
because it's never been challenged

1389
00:47:16,400 --> 00:47:20,160
is that

1390
00:47:17,599 --> 00:47:22,160
most people quit adventuring

1391
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:24,079
at like level three

1392
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:26,640
yeah and it's because they usually have

1393
00:47:24,079 --> 00:47:29,359
acquired so much money by level three

1394
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:31,280
that they can pretty much just retire

1395
00:47:29,359 --> 00:47:33,200
yeah so the only people who keep

1396
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:34,319
adventuring are people who have this

1397
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:36,960
like

1398
00:47:34,319 --> 00:47:38,640
mission that they're on or

1399
00:47:36,960 --> 00:47:40,000
just i've had a player who's like no my

1400
00:47:38,640 --> 00:47:41,599
character

1401
00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:43,119
you know my eighth level character kept

1402
00:47:41,599 --> 00:47:45,680
adventuring because they're a little bit

1403
00:47:43,119 --> 00:47:48,480
of an adrenaline addict yes yeah you

1404
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:50,559
know the adrenaline of it is a huge

1405
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:53,200
thing they couldn't they couldn't give

1406
00:47:50,559 --> 00:47:54,240
this up mm-hmm and i it was it's just

1407
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:56,800
interesting that what you said there

1408
00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:59,760
really made me realize oh there is there

1409
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:03,920
are certain like hard lines i have

1410
00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:03,920
of no this is canon

1411
00:48:04,079 --> 00:48:08,800
this is carved in stone

1412
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:10,319
it is easy for newer characters to you

1413
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:11,520
know while you're adventuring it's very

1414
00:48:10,319 --> 00:48:13,920
easy to answer that question i want to

1415
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:15,680
make it rich cool fine let's go and play

1416
00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:18,160
d d and that's fine but yeah at a

1417
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:20,319
certain level there is a case of like

1418
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:22,319
you can't use that anymore because just

1419
00:48:20,319 --> 00:48:23,200
to have the experience that you have to

1420
00:48:22,319 --> 00:48:26,000
be

1421
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:27,839
level eight implicitly required a

1422
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:29,599
thousand gold's worth of training or a

1423
00:48:27,839 --> 00:48:32,720
thousand goals worth of materials at

1424
00:48:29,599 --> 00:48:35,200
some point so like you you're already

1425
00:48:32,720 --> 00:48:36,480
pretty good or i guess pretty old and at

1426
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:39,359
which point you're starting to push the

1427
00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:40,800
other line of like

1428
00:48:39,359 --> 00:48:43,359
you know are you physically capable of

1429
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:45,200
adventuring depending on the lineage of

1430
00:48:43,359 --> 00:48:48,720
the race of course i do also love

1431
00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:51,680
playing a real old guy i i played a um a

1432
00:48:48,720 --> 00:48:54,319
cleric with a criminal background

1433
00:48:51,680 --> 00:48:57,119
who had gotten back into adventuring

1434
00:48:54,319 --> 00:48:58,400
because his wife had died of old age so

1435
00:48:57,119 --> 00:49:00,400
he was like

1436
00:48:58,400 --> 00:49:02,800
pushing 75

1437
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:04,319
yeah he was just a real old guy who's

1438
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:05,760
like well i might as well go back to

1439
00:49:04,319 --> 00:49:08,400
adventuring

1440
00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:10,480
yeah yeah that's so so deep and rich

1441
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:12,960
like my current my super intelligent

1442
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:14,960
wizard is a young guy but because i

1443
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:16,240
wanted that naivety you know you know

1444
00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:17,200
that age when you just think you know

1445
00:49:16,240 --> 00:49:18,640
everything and you're better than

1446
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:20,480
everyone else that was the kind of

1447
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:21,920
character i wanted to play

1448
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:23,440
but the next character i play would

1449
00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:25,599
definitely be

1450
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:28,319
an older like i'm getting too old for

1451
00:49:25,599 --> 00:49:29,520
this [ __ ] kind of thing like that is i'd

1452
00:49:28,319 --> 00:49:30,960
also love and there's so much depth

1453
00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:32,640
there to be like well why do you keep

1454
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:34,160
doing it old man

1455
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:35,520
well let me think of an appropriate

1456
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:37,599
backstory too

1457
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:40,160
yeah for this particular character it

1458
00:49:37,599 --> 00:49:41,680
was well you know my fam my kids are all

1459
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:43,680
grown

1460
00:49:41,680 --> 00:49:45,839
uh my wife's gone there's just not

1461
00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:47,359
really anything left for me to go back

1462
00:49:45,839 --> 00:49:49,040
to

1463
00:49:47,359 --> 00:49:51,359
and this is exciting it's a good way to

1464
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:52,960
spend my time i get to help people if i

1465
00:49:51,359 --> 00:49:54,240
feel like it

1466
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:56,160
and then the benefit of playing an old

1467
00:49:54,240 --> 00:49:58,240
character is you can just make up

1468
00:49:56,160 --> 00:50:00,319
whatever kind of nonsense adventures

1469
00:49:58,240 --> 00:50:01,839
they might have previously been on

1470
00:50:00,319 --> 00:50:06,400
uh this particular character he was like

1471
00:50:01,839 --> 00:50:09,280
level five um but i would

1472
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:10,319
play off like he used to be like level

1473
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:12,319
10.

1474
00:50:10,319 --> 00:50:16,559
yeah but because he got older and got

1475
00:50:12,319 --> 00:50:16,559
out of practice he lost levels

1476
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:20,559
which which makes sense i do i do like

1477
00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:22,319
that idea of i was just thinking as you

1478
00:50:20,559 --> 00:50:23,920
were speaking there of like

1479
00:50:22,319 --> 00:50:26,240
playing an older

1480
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:27,920
character but a you know a level equal

1481
00:50:26,240 --> 00:50:29,440
to with these younger people that does

1482
00:50:27,920 --> 00:50:31,599
beg the question of like well what have

1483
00:50:29,440 --> 00:50:33,280
you been doing for 50 years but i kind

1484
00:50:31,599 --> 00:50:35,520
of love the idea of maybe they were

1485
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:36,480
professional at it at one point then

1486
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:38,240
they did

1487
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:39,520
a more mundane life and then now they've

1488
00:50:38,240 --> 00:50:40,480
come back and it is like you know if

1489
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:41,839
you're

1490
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:43,119
if you're coding or you know a

1491
00:50:41,839 --> 00:50:44,880
programmer or something and you

1492
00:50:43,119 --> 00:50:46,240
programmed on like version two of a

1493
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:47,839
certain library

1494
00:50:46,240 --> 00:50:49,520
and then you come back maybe five ten

1495
00:50:47,839 --> 00:50:50,960
years later now we're on version seven

1496
00:50:49,520 --> 00:50:52,240
and all the like the algorithms are

1497
00:50:50,960 --> 00:50:53,359
different the libraries you have to use

1498
00:50:52,240 --> 00:50:55,839
the different all this other and you'd

1499
00:50:53,359 --> 00:50:57,040
be like how do i even begin to adopt

1500
00:50:55,839 --> 00:50:59,440
these new yeah

1501
00:50:57,040 --> 00:51:01,760
these new practices particular i think

1502
00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:04,800
that particular game

1503
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:06,559
his thing was the joke i i as a player

1504
00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:08,160
made was that

1505
00:51:06,559 --> 00:51:09,920
yeah he's a little bit lower level

1506
00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:10,890
because he was 10th level in fourth

1507
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:14,160
edition

1508
00:51:10,890 --> 00:51:16,319
[Laughter]

1509
00:51:14,160 --> 00:51:17,920
he was 10th level in in third editions

1510
00:51:16,319 --> 00:51:20,640
but it's been so long that he's fifth

1511
00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:22,880
level now yeah yeah i just i just like

1512
00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:24,640
the idea of being like

1513
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:25,760
you know because uh there's such a good

1514
00:51:24,640 --> 00:51:27,359
character development there though if

1515
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:30,559
you had if you had say for example like

1516
00:51:27,359 --> 00:51:32,319
two rogues one very old who's who's

1517
00:51:30,559 --> 00:51:34,319
come back into it and a younger one

1518
00:51:32,319 --> 00:51:35,440
who's you know like fresh-faced learning

1519
00:51:34,319 --> 00:51:37,200
everything

1520
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:39,200
you know straight

1521
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:41,200
absorbing all this knowledge

1522
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:43,440
and the old man to be like oh i didn't

1523
00:51:41,200 --> 00:51:45,359
do very good here because now you guys

1524
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:46,720
can like

1525
00:51:45,359 --> 00:51:48,640
there's this way of doing things like

1526
00:51:46,720 --> 00:51:50,240
you can use spells now like how do you

1527
00:51:48,640 --> 00:51:51,440
do that oh come on old man that's like

1528
00:51:50,240 --> 00:51:52,880
come on granddad that's what we do all

1529
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:54,720
the time here watch this press the

1530
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:57,440
digitation like we're all arcane

1531
00:51:54,720 --> 00:51:57,440
tricksters now

1532
00:51:57,599 --> 00:52:01,760
let me show you how it's done now oh you

1533
00:51:59,440 --> 00:52:03,680
do you use two daggers cool cool okay we

1534
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:05,520
never used to do that back in my day

1535
00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:06,880
yeah it wasn't this well back in my day

1536
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:09,200
the style was to wear an onion on your

1537
00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:11,520
belt

1538
00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:14,160
but yeah like even that character i

1539
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:15,680
played him as very lackadaisial uh

1540
00:52:14,160 --> 00:52:19,200
almost reckless

1541
00:52:15,680 --> 00:52:21,839
because he was like i'm so old

1542
00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:24,319
i might die in my sleep

1543
00:52:21,839 --> 00:52:27,520
yeah let's have some fun let's get wild

1544
00:52:24,319 --> 00:52:27,520
yeah let's go crazy

1545
00:52:27,760 --> 00:52:32,319
he was very much so this like i love

1546
00:52:29,839 --> 00:52:34,079
adventuring with you guys maybe a dragon

1547
00:52:32,319 --> 00:52:35,760
will eat me tomorrow

1548
00:52:34,079 --> 00:52:38,720
yep

1549
00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:40,559
i i played him as very laissez faire

1550
00:52:38,720 --> 00:52:42,160
yeah yeah but there's so much there's

1551
00:52:40,559 --> 00:52:44,160
such a richness there to have because

1552
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,440
you could have him be like

1553
00:52:44,160 --> 00:52:46,720
obviously depending on the tone and the

1554
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:48,160
style of the campaign and whether player

1555
00:52:46,720 --> 00:52:49,200
wants to take a character like that but

1556
00:52:48,160 --> 00:52:51,119
of course you could always have them be

1557
00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:52,559
like you're my new family and now i've

1558
00:52:51,119 --> 00:52:54,240
found another reason to live there's

1559
00:52:52,559 --> 00:52:56,800
some character development for you like

1560
00:52:54,240 --> 00:52:58,559
that's really wholesome and sweet and

1561
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:59,680
it's that's you know there are the

1562
00:52:58,559 --> 00:53:00,960
reason why we're talking about these old

1563
00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:02,720
characters is

1564
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:04,079
the implication that they have in

1565
00:53:02,720 --> 00:53:06,640
universe

1566
00:53:04,079 --> 00:53:09,359
50 years of canon for that particular

1567
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:10,480
character and how just about to say

1568
00:53:09,359 --> 00:53:12,640
that

1569
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:13,520
when you have an older character if the

1570
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:15,920
game

1571
00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:17,920
especially if the campaign is primarily

1572
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:19,599
taking place in one kingdom

1573
00:53:17,920 --> 00:53:22,000
well that character's 60 years old

1574
00:53:19,599 --> 00:53:24,319
they've lived through a lot that has

1575
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:26,960
happened in that one kingdom

1576
00:53:24,319 --> 00:53:29,520
so as a gm that character really would

1577
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:31,040
become this exposition dump for me

1578
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:33,359
because they were there

1579
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:35,520
yeah no you know this it affected your

1580
00:53:33,359 --> 00:53:37,680
town when this changed

1581
00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:39,200
yeah yeah you you were out of a job

1582
00:53:37,680 --> 00:53:40,720
because they changed the the law or

1583
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:42,559
something and now that's why everything

1584
00:53:40,720 --> 00:53:45,040
is the way it is

1585
00:53:42,559 --> 00:53:46,640
ah amazing cool well thank you very much

1586
00:53:45,040 --> 00:53:48,400
is there is anything we haven't covered

1587
00:53:46,640 --> 00:53:50,960
yet that you wanted to talk about

1588
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:54,559
no cause i think we talked about how

1589
00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:56,640
canon is whatever you feel like it being

1590
00:53:54,559 --> 00:53:58,480
it's so cheap we got we got out of this

1591
00:53:56,640 --> 00:54:01,280
topic well easy by just saying it is

1592
00:53:58,480 --> 00:54:03,520
whatever you want it to be

1593
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:04,960
been a four minute episode

1594
00:54:03,520 --> 00:54:08,960
yeah

1595
00:54:04,960 --> 00:54:08,960
yeah cool uh all right bye everyone

1596
00:54:09,119 --> 00:54:14,079
no i you know i didn't have

1597
00:54:11,680 --> 00:54:15,440
in my notes or prep for this episode

1598
00:54:14,079 --> 00:54:17,839
anything about

1599
00:54:15,440 --> 00:54:19,760
the canon of particular characters which

1600
00:54:17,839 --> 00:54:21,839
is stupid because that's a huge huge

1601
00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:24,720
huge piece for many players around the

1602
00:54:21,839 --> 00:54:26,240
table and how to hook that into the

1603
00:54:24,720 --> 00:54:27,920
canon of the universe that you're going

1604
00:54:26,240 --> 00:54:29,119
into so i'm very glad that we covered

1605
00:54:27,920 --> 00:54:32,000
those topics

1606
00:54:29,119 --> 00:54:33,920
uh organically uh with with plenty of

1607
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:36,640
examples so thank you

1608
00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:38,480
oh i i actually should say um

1609
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:40,160
a a specific phrase

1610
00:54:38,480 --> 00:54:41,920
that i had meant to say and completely

1611
00:54:40,160 --> 00:54:44,559
forgot about is that

1612
00:54:41,920 --> 00:54:46,559
for gm's and players it is very easy to

1613
00:54:44,559 --> 00:54:48,240
get very precious about the canon of

1614
00:54:46,559 --> 00:54:49,680
your world or the canon of your

1615
00:54:48,240 --> 00:54:51,920
character

1616
00:54:49,680 --> 00:54:53,359
and it's very important that you don't

1617
00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:55,040
do that

1618
00:54:53,359 --> 00:54:57,920
allow change

1619
00:54:55,040 --> 00:55:01,839
be open to change of the canon for your

1620
00:54:57,920 --> 00:55:03,760
character or your world

1621
00:55:01,839 --> 00:55:06,160
yeah yeah as you just said that's for

1622
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:08,160
both yeah players and gm's it is a very

1623
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:10,240
much a two-way street the nature of the

1624
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:12,880
game is a two-way street it's this

1625
00:55:10,240 --> 00:55:13,920
negotiation so yeah it absolutely stands

1626
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:15,440
to reason

1627
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:17,040
there's that i think one one thing to

1628
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:19,760
add on that actually is

1629
00:55:17,040 --> 00:55:22,319
one of the players in my game he has

1630
00:55:19,760 --> 00:55:23,599
he has read some fiction he has read

1631
00:55:22,319 --> 00:55:25,520
some

1632
00:55:23,599 --> 00:55:27,599
what are they called the

1633
00:55:25,520 --> 00:55:29,520
uh

1634
00:55:27,599 --> 00:55:32,400
there's like a sect of like kind of

1635
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:34,960
clandestine roguish people who go and

1636
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:36,240
send messages around the world and i

1637
00:55:34,960 --> 00:55:37,839
think

1638
00:55:36,240 --> 00:55:39,520
i think they're called the harpers

1639
00:55:37,839 --> 00:55:40,799
that's it i know it's h i was gonna say

1640
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:42,240
open hand for some reason though the

1641
00:55:40,799 --> 00:55:43,280
harpers thank you i described it well

1642
00:55:42,240 --> 00:55:44,720
enough that you knew what i was talking

1643
00:55:43,280 --> 00:55:46,559
about which i'm happy enough that we got

1644
00:55:44,720 --> 00:55:48,480
there yeah so he's like all in for the

1645
00:55:46,559 --> 00:55:49,920
harpers so when he's been reading up on

1646
00:55:48,480 --> 00:55:51,760
that he's

1647
00:55:49,920 --> 00:55:53,920
i i picked up when he was talking to the

1648
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:55,760
dm he was like oh well i had read that

1649
00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:58,240
they'd started in this city which of

1650
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:59,440
course doesn't exist in my dm's world so

1651
00:55:58,240 --> 00:56:01,040
there was an interaction at some point

1652
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:02,720
where the dm was i can't

1653
00:56:01,040 --> 00:56:04,880
i can't fit in like a whole city and all

1654
00:56:02,720 --> 00:56:07,280
this baggage that in this you know 400

1655
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:08,640
page novel that you've read but

1656
00:56:07,280 --> 00:56:10,960
let me bring in harper's in a different

1657
00:56:08,640 --> 00:56:11,920
way and maybe you started on this island

1658
00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:13,280
because

1659
00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:16,240
that's a bit of a blank slate for this

1660
00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:18,240
precise reason so it is very much that

1661
00:56:16,240 --> 00:56:20,480
they both you know compromised a little

1662
00:56:18,240 --> 00:56:22,480
bit to bring that character to life and

1663
00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:24,319
is now very much a part of the world and

1664
00:56:22,480 --> 00:56:26,160
has all this baggage and all this you

1665
00:56:24,319 --> 00:56:27,520
know he's been chased by his legacy and

1666
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:28,880
all this other kind of stuff so it is

1667
00:56:27,520 --> 00:56:30,640
yeah thank you for bringing that up it's

1668
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:31,839
very very important point

1669
00:56:30,640 --> 00:56:33,119
is there anything you would like to

1670
00:56:31,839 --> 00:56:36,880
promote

1671
00:56:33,119 --> 00:56:39,520
um yes i do an actual play podcast

1672
00:56:36,880 --> 00:56:42,119
called we play rpgs

1673
00:56:39,520 --> 00:56:44,880
we just finished a

1674
00:56:42,119 --> 00:56:46,960
110 episode long

1675
00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:50,000
d d campaign

1676
00:56:46,960 --> 00:56:51,760
and on march 15th we will be releasing

1677
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:54,000
episodes for a

1678
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:56,240
teenage superhero game

1679
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:59,079
we also do bonus stuff

1680
00:56:56,240 --> 00:57:00,640
if any of your listeners want to head to

1681
00:56:59,079 --> 00:57:02,240
weplayrpgs.com

1682
00:57:00,640 --> 00:57:03,359
uh they can find out how to support us

1683
00:57:02,240 --> 00:57:04,960
they can listen to some of the other

1684
00:57:03,359 --> 00:57:06,559
shows that we've done that aren't part

1685
00:57:04,960 --> 00:57:08,559
of our main feed

1686
00:57:06,559 --> 00:57:11,359
and i myself

1687
00:57:08,559 --> 00:57:13,760
am in the process of making

1688
00:57:11,359 --> 00:57:16,160
dice i'm getting all my molds finished

1689
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:18,559
up at the moment awesome so if anybody

1690
00:57:16,160 --> 00:57:21,280
wants to follow me

1691
00:57:18,559 --> 00:57:22,960
for dice making they can find me like on

1692
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:26,240
instagram or or

1693
00:57:22,960 --> 00:57:29,200
facebook at grumpy badger dice and i

1694
00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:30,160
also make uh do commissions for cosplay

1695
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:32,119
props

1696
00:57:30,160 --> 00:57:34,079
so if they want to head to royal

1697
00:57:32,119 --> 00:57:36,160
artisanprops.com they can

1698
00:57:34,079 --> 00:57:38,079
find that stuff oh your fingers are many

1699
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:39,839
pies i'm definitely gonna follow the uh

1700
00:57:38,079 --> 00:57:41,359
the dice one at the moment that's

1701
00:57:39,839 --> 00:57:43,359
something that's very cool to me so no

1702
00:57:41,359 --> 00:57:44,880
that's that's very cool and you've

1703
00:57:43,359 --> 00:57:46,880
you've also inadvertently put me in my

1704
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:48,079
place because often when i tell people

1705
00:57:46,880 --> 00:57:50,480
yeah i'm running my own homebrew

1706
00:57:48,079 --> 00:57:52,400
campaign and you know next week it's

1707
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:53,920
session 72 you most people are like oh

1708
00:57:52,400 --> 00:57:56,480
wow fair play and then you're just here

1709
00:57:53,920 --> 00:57:58,960
casually dropping like 110 or something

1710
00:57:56,480 --> 00:58:00,050
yeah i've done a 115 hours of this game

1711
00:57:58,960 --> 00:58:02,400
yeah it's cool

1712
00:58:00,050 --> 00:58:04,240
[Laughter]

1713
00:58:02,400 --> 00:58:05,760
um otherwise the only thing left to say

1714
00:58:04,240 --> 00:58:07,280
is thank you ever so much eli for

1715
00:58:05,760 --> 00:58:08,960
joining us today that was great thank

1716
00:58:07,280 --> 00:58:11,359
you so much for having me thank you

1717
00:58:08,960 --> 00:58:12,960
everyone two four listening oh is that

1718
00:58:11,359 --> 00:58:14,960
thank you everyone to listening at home

1719
00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:17,040
stupid you think after how many episodes

1720
00:58:14,960 --> 00:58:20,160
i get it right thank you everybody at

1721
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:22,400
home for listening to today's episode

1722
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:25,280
all those links to all

1723
00:58:22,400 --> 00:58:26,640
of eli's various avenues will be in the

1724
00:58:25,280 --> 00:58:29,440
episode description i would encourage

1725
00:58:26,640 --> 00:58:31,760
you all to check them out

1726
00:58:29,440 --> 00:58:33,520
otherwise thank you all for listening

1727
00:58:31,760 --> 00:58:35,119
and good night

1728
00:58:33,520 --> 00:58:38,160
and now it's time for the patreon shout

1729
00:58:35,119 --> 00:58:41,280
outs thank you to robert hartley

1730
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:44,240
dm for viva la dirt league and writer on

1731
00:58:41,280 --> 00:58:45,760
the d d logic web series

1732
00:58:44,240 --> 00:58:48,559
i would encourage everybody to check him

1733
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:49,599
out at robert hartley gm on twitter and

1734
00:58:48,559 --> 00:58:51,839
twitch

1735
00:58:49,599 --> 00:58:54,319
thank you to optional rule a two time

1736
00:58:51,839 --> 00:58:57,040
guest of the show and a very insightful

1737
00:58:54,319 --> 00:58:58,319
and knowledgeable source of information

1738
00:58:57,040 --> 00:59:01,319
please check them out at

1739
00:58:58,319 --> 00:59:01,319
www.optionalrule.com

1740
00:59:01,760 --> 00:59:07,040
huge huge huge thank you to a great

1741
00:59:04,559 --> 00:59:09,520
friend of the show matthew perkins who's

1742
00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:11,920
out there making hilarious and

1743
00:59:09,520 --> 00:59:13,720
educational dungeons and dragons content

1744
00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:15,440
please go and check out his stuff at

1745
00:59:13,720 --> 00:59:17,839
matthewperkins.net where you can find

1746
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:19,359
links to all of his socials and all of

1747
00:59:17,839 --> 00:59:21,040
his content including his own patreon

1748
00:59:19,359 --> 00:59:22,880
which i would very much encourage you to

1749
00:59:21,040 --> 00:59:25,760
check out

1750
00:59:22,880 --> 00:59:27,680
thank you to matt street at mpstreet88

1751
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:28,960
on twitter for supporting the show

1752
00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:31,960
if you need support running your

1753
00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:34,160
personal or business schedule head to

1754
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:35,839
virtualtimehustle.com or on instagram to

1755
00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:37,920
make that difference between should do

1756
00:59:35,839 --> 00:59:39,680
and done boss it better with support

1757
00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:42,000
from cat who will help you get back that

1758
00:59:39,680 --> 00:59:43,520
essential time you've been searching for

1759
00:59:42,000 --> 00:59:45,359
if you would like to support what we do

1760
00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:48,079
and get four shout outs a month head

1761
00:59:45,359 --> 00:59:49,599
over to patreon.com thinking critically

1762
00:59:48,079 --> 00:59:53,590
or you can just buy me a coffee at

1763
00:59:49,599 --> 01:00:00,610
kofi.com thinking critically

1764
00:59:53,590 --> 01:00:19,839
[Music]