How Podcast Guesting Helps You Fulfill Your Purpose w/ Alex Sanfilippo, Founder of Podmatch

WEBVTT

00:00:00.297 --> 00:00:07.875
Podcasting is becoming more and more popular every day, but getting on the right podcast seems to be getting harder and harder.

00:00:08.429 --> 00:00:19.353
So if you're building a brand, sharing a message, or creating something powerful, how do you connect consistently with shows that truly fit your message and help you spread the word?

00:00:19.452 --> 00:00:22.914
Well, today we're talking with Alex Sanfilippo, founder of PodMatch.

00:00:22.914 --> 00:00:36.140
And by the end of this episode, you'll know how to approach guesting on podcasts with clarity, confidence, and a strategy that helps you to spread your message, grow your platform, and fulfill your purpose.

00:00:36.140 --> 00:00:37.442
I'm your host, Alan C.

00:00:37.442 --> 00:00:43.137
Paul, and this is The God in Gigs Show, where we help you to become the creator that you were created to be.

00:00:48.453 --> 00:00:53.176
Ladies and gentlemen, Alex Sanfilippo, how are you doing my friend?

00:00:53.219 --> 00:00:55.219
Alan, it's so good to be with you here today, man.

00:00:55.219 --> 00:00:58.179
I feel like this has been a long time coming as a long-term listener your show.

00:00:58.179 --> 00:00:59.679
I don't know how many years we've been friends now.

00:00:59.679 --> 00:01:01.959
This is like a bucket list thing.

00:01:01.959 --> 00:01:04.878
So I'm just glad to be here today with you and everybody who's checking us out.

00:01:04.878 --> 00:01:06.409
I truly have reached a pinnacle.

00:01:06.409 --> 00:01:06.728
Yes.

00:01:06.728 --> 00:01:10.992
Once Alex has been on my show after he's like, okay, so I always do.

00:01:10.992 --> 00:01:11.153
Yeah.

00:01:11.153 --> 00:01:13.584
We got to get all the bro stuff out in front, right?

00:01:13.584 --> 00:01:15.245
So that we don't waste people's time.

00:01:15.245 --> 00:01:20.179
But yes, like from creating a brand, like that's where I start, brother.

00:01:20.179 --> 00:01:21.799
I go back to your creating a brand.

00:01:21.799 --> 00:01:24.102
I'm not sure how I found your show.

00:01:24.102 --> 00:01:26.493
Like for real, like that's the marketing for you, right?

00:01:26.493 --> 00:01:31.927
Like I'm not sure how it popped up on my feed, but it was like, okay, this guy gets to the point.

00:01:32.909 --> 00:01:33.890
It goes right for it.

00:01:33.890 --> 00:01:35.891
And I'm learning every single episode.

00:01:35.891 --> 00:01:38.981
And then your work ethic just shamed me.

00:01:38.981 --> 00:01:43.233
Like how, how is he putting out so many episodes?

00:01:43.233 --> 00:01:46.183
Like one after the other, after the other is just nailing it.

00:01:46.183 --> 00:01:53.986
So I was already a fan long before we became friends and then our wives and just getting to hang out at pod fest and things like that.

00:01:53.986 --> 00:02:01.147
So let's, you know, we can start there before we get into like all the serious questions, like just the community, man, like just talk a little bit about.

00:02:01.147 --> 00:02:08.987
and your feelings, your desire to see your relationships build off of what's happened.

00:02:08.987 --> 00:02:09.508
I guess what?

00:02:09.508 --> 00:02:11.283
How long have you been in podcasting now?

00:02:11.783 --> 00:02:14.132
I actually started my first show in 2014.

00:02:14.132 --> 00:02:18.747
The dates get blurry, Alan, you know how that goes, right?

00:02:18.747 --> 00:02:22.019
Zach, as you get older and this show, the episodes pile up.

00:02:22.019 --> 00:02:25.423
But yeah, so we're talking like at the time of recording over 11 years.

00:02:25.423 --> 00:02:34.161
So just give me a quick, like, man, how much this community meant for you over the last, how's it changed over the last 11 years Yeah, for sure.

00:02:34.161 --> 00:02:38.771
And I'll keep this centered on the podcasting side of things just so it can kind of stay like at that level.

00:02:38.771 --> 00:02:46.995
uh Outside of podcasting, I'm super grateful uh to have an incredible wife and to have just an incredible community, which I actually found through church small groups.

00:02:46.995 --> 00:02:53.864
And that was kind of connected to my very first podcast is my wife and I, started leading a bunch of like the small group leader team.

00:02:53.864 --> 00:02:54.887
It was for a young adult ministry.

00:02:54.887 --> 00:02:59.198
It was called sub 30 at church celebration church in Jacksonville, Florida.

00:02:59.198 --> 00:03:01.455
And so we were like leading that and there was like questions that were coming up.

00:03:01.455 --> 00:03:06.495
So I was like, I'm going to build a a podcast because I do like to talk and I don't get a whole lot of opportunities.

00:03:06.495 --> 00:03:12.794
So I kind of build a podcast to just be a continuation of some of the education training that we had going on with the groups and stuff like that.

00:03:12.794 --> 00:03:14.194
So that was like my introduction to it.

00:03:14.194 --> 00:03:16.995
So how to get really great built-in community with that.

00:03:16.995 --> 00:03:29.854
And still this day, if I look back to that time of my life, many of my just most solid friendships I still have today were found or founded within small groups of just people showing up and us getting to meet each other.

00:03:29.854 --> 00:03:31.258
So I'm really grateful for that.

00:03:31.258 --> 00:03:34.118
And that was my introduction to podcasting as well.

00:03:34.118 --> 00:03:40.079
And kind of to flip it to the podcasting community side of things, Alan, I had no idea in 2014 that anyone else was podcasting.

00:03:40.079 --> 00:03:40.718
I'm be real.

00:03:40.718 --> 00:03:45.459
Like I had heard like the celebrity shows, a few of them are out there, but I was like, there's not a community around this.

00:03:45.459 --> 00:03:47.679
And it was years later that I found out there was.

00:03:47.679 --> 00:03:54.679
You referenced creating a brand, which was my show for people who wanted to leave a nine to five job, become a successful entrepreneur and like kind of how to do that.

00:03:54.679 --> 00:03:55.558
And it wasn't me training.

00:03:55.558 --> 00:03:57.371
So I don't want to sound like some sort of guru.

00:03:57.371 --> 00:03:59.610
I was bringing people on who had successfully done that.

00:03:59.610 --> 00:04:01.871
At that point, I was still in a corporate job myself.

00:04:01.871 --> 00:04:04.730
But I started doing that that show got a lot of recognition.

00:04:04.751 --> 00:04:10.691
And a lot of my friends that were like outside of the church space started like just poking fun because that's what you do when you have close friends, right?

00:04:10.691 --> 00:04:11.850
They kind of poke fun at you.

00:04:11.850 --> 00:04:14.371
And so podcasting was still dorky back then.

00:04:14.411 --> 00:04:17.050
So I had one of my buddies who was always giving me a hard time about it.

00:04:17.050 --> 00:04:20.271
He's like, you're to go to that nerdy podcasting conference in Orlando?

00:04:20.271 --> 00:04:20.810
And I just laughed.

00:04:20.810 --> 00:04:22.690
was like, oh, whatever dude, there's not a podcasting conference.

00:04:22.690 --> 00:04:23.670
He's like, yeah, there is.

00:04:23.670 --> 00:04:24.511
I saw an ad for it.

00:04:24.511 --> 00:04:27.338
And I was like, No, dude, there's definitely no podcasting conferences.

00:04:27.338 --> 00:04:28.358
And he like found it, pulled up.

00:04:28.358 --> 00:04:28.817
He's like this.

00:04:28.817 --> 00:04:30.966
I was like, this is next week.

00:04:30.966 --> 00:04:32.471
I was like, yeah, a hundred percent.

00:04:32.471 --> 00:04:35.101
I'm going, I didn't know there was like people who podcast, right?

00:04:35.101 --> 00:04:37.754
Like I thought it was us like hiding in a dark room.

00:04:37.754 --> 00:04:38.843
Not wanting people to know who we are.

00:04:38.843 --> 00:04:39.345
Right.

00:04:39.345 --> 00:04:42.505
So, um, right.

00:04:42.505 --> 00:04:43.677
So that's it.

00:04:43.677 --> 00:04:46.978
So anyway, long story short, I go to that event and that's actually the event.

00:04:46.978 --> 00:04:51.730
I don't think we met that year, that first year, but that was at podfest and it was in Orlando, Florida.

00:04:51.730 --> 00:04:52.211
And what do know?

00:04:52.211 --> 00:04:53.723
There was a podcasting community.

00:04:53.723 --> 00:04:58.314
So I, uh grateful to have had just really strong, faith-centered friendships in my life.

00:04:58.314 --> 00:05:00.514
And here I was with my creative endeavors.

00:05:00.514 --> 00:05:05.946
It kind of felt a little bit siloed, although I was very bold about my faith any chance I got the opportunity to share it.

00:05:05.946 --> 00:05:13.487
um But here I finally met other people in the space and I quickly just fell in love with podcasting.

00:05:13.487 --> 00:05:24.271
I fell in love with what it was and it really deeply hit a core belief of mine and a conviction that God has put in my heart, which is to give a voice to people they don't have a voice.

00:05:24.411 --> 00:05:26.391
and many of which being believers.

00:05:26.391 --> 00:05:34.394
If I go back to that first podcast I had, the faith-based one, I started posting it everywhere and at first it got a lot of traction.

00:05:34.394 --> 00:05:45.896
And I don't mean to bring up the changes on social media, the political stuff that comes with it, but I can remember one day thousands of people every day were engaging with the podcast and then woke up one day and it went to zero.

00:05:46.057 --> 00:05:47.456
And I was like, what happened?

00:05:47.456 --> 00:05:49.778
Like did I miss up a connection somewhere?

00:05:49.778 --> 00:05:55.420
No, it turns out any social feed I was sharing it on just decided like no more No more Christian stuff, right?

00:05:55.420 --> 00:05:57.632
Like if it was about that, that needs to go away.

00:05:57.632 --> 00:06:03.954
And I know a lot of people say like, that didn't really happen and stuff, but like at that point I had a really big website with tens of thousands of people visiting every day.

00:06:03.954 --> 00:06:09.095
And most of the traffic was driven straight from social media, from groups and stuff like that, like all the platforms.

00:06:09.095 --> 00:06:10.865
And so I have like all the data to prove it.

00:06:10.865 --> 00:06:12.795
Like something switched overnight.

00:06:12.795 --> 00:06:14.175
It wasn't like a gradual switch.

00:06:14.175 --> 00:06:17.016
was that today it works, the next day it didn't.

00:06:17.016 --> 00:06:23.725
And so like going back to that, just desire got my heart to give a voice, to help people find their voice and to be able to get it out there.

00:06:23.725 --> 00:06:27.396
I realized that podcasting is one medium that people cannot cancel.

00:06:27.396 --> 00:06:37.059
And it's one of the reasons it's been really not loved by most of the big social platforms because they feel like, we can't control this thing called RSS, which is the technology it's built on.

00:06:37.119 --> 00:06:39.560
Therefore, we're just going to say it's bad, right?

00:06:39.560 --> 00:06:42.581
Like it's bad because we can't put our parameters on it.

00:06:42.581 --> 00:06:44.341
We can't control it the way we want to.

00:06:44.341 --> 00:06:47.271
And so I really decided to double down on podcasting.

00:06:47.271 --> 00:06:48.415
That's how I really was.

00:06:48.415 --> 00:06:51.202
That's why I was really excited to get into the community because I was like, man, I can help.

00:06:51.288 --> 00:06:52.069
be part of the voice.

00:06:52.069 --> 00:06:59.730
Like not that I'm the only solution out there or the one at the top of this thing or anything like that, but I'm doing my part every day to help just the one person I know I can help.

00:06:59.730 --> 00:07:01.702
And that's a bit of a long winded answer, Alan.

00:07:01.702 --> 00:07:03.257
I hope I wasn't too all over the place.

00:07:03.257 --> 00:07:04.377
you weren't all over the place.

00:07:04.377 --> 00:07:14.386
This is exactly why I love just digging in and immediately starting with what is on our hearts, which is relationship, community, building something.

00:07:14.386 --> 00:07:32.449
You answered the question before and even had the chance to ask it, which was now that you have been inside the podcasting industry, you've seen the data, you have been in the trenches with these podcasters, helping them find guests, helping them connect through PodMatch, helping them through your speaking and your coaching and all this other stuff.

00:07:32.593 --> 00:07:34.644
And I was going to ask what you already answered it.

00:07:34.644 --> 00:07:35.834
What is gravity?

00:07:35.834 --> 00:07:37.016
What is pulling you more?

00:07:37.016 --> 00:07:40.086
The medium itself, the met the methods, right?

00:07:40.086 --> 00:07:42.247
All this stuff or the message.

00:07:42.247 --> 00:07:53.112
And I think what you just said answered the question, which it sounds like the message of owning your content, having a voice, not being able to be cancelable.

00:07:53.112 --> 00:07:53.973
Right.

00:07:53.973 --> 00:08:08.286
Uh, a friend, Adam Curry calls RSS rock solid signal because it can't be taken away because it exists in this place where Again, thank goodness for now, no one else has any ability to be the gatekeepers of it.

00:08:08.286 --> 00:08:20.771
So just tell me, is that the pool, like still, after all the stuff you learned, it's still about the message of giving people that voice to say what their faith says, whatever that is that God put in their heart?

00:08:21.019 --> 00:08:23.658
You know, thanks for giving me the opportunity to clarify this, Alan.

00:08:23.658 --> 00:08:36.578
think it's really important because if you look at what I do, that show creating a brand has been sunset, the faith-based one has been sunset as well, and now my show is called Podcasting Made Simple, which focuses on, and you're actually one of the favorite guests of all time on the show, by the way.

00:08:36.658 --> 00:08:39.058
I need to make sure I grab a link, we need to put a link to that for people to hear.

00:08:39.058 --> 00:08:42.119
It's really, really good, but I digress.

00:08:42.119 --> 00:08:44.479
Anyway, but the whole idea is that is the education side.

00:08:44.479 --> 00:08:50.958
then, so my show, Podcast Made Simple, and then my company, Podmatch, which is a service that automatically connects podcasts, guests, and hosts for interviews.

00:08:50.958 --> 00:08:54.399
I would say it works like a dating app, instead of connecting for dates, connecting for podcast interviews.

00:08:54.399 --> 00:08:58.671
If you look at what I'm doing, the assumption is my focus is the tactics.

00:08:58.671 --> 00:09:03.110
My focus is the, the analytic side, like the education side.

00:09:03.110 --> 00:09:04.202
And I love all of that.

00:09:04.202 --> 00:09:05.023
Don't get me wrong.

00:09:05.023 --> 00:09:06.643
That is just my mechanism though.

00:09:06.643 --> 00:09:14.306
My end goal, my route, what I really want is to give a voice to people and help them be able to find their own superpower, what they can communicate.

00:09:14.306 --> 00:09:18.606
And if it's okay, Alan, I'd love to just kind of share my heart behind that, even if that's all right for just a second here.

00:09:18.606 --> 00:09:25.543
um When I was podcasting early on, I didn't know if anyone was listening.

00:09:25.543 --> 00:09:29.602
know how like it kind of everyone, everyone like at church and the small group people, they're like, oh, it's great.

00:09:29.602 --> 00:09:29.783
It's great.

00:09:29.783 --> 00:09:30.423
I'm like, okay, cool.

00:09:30.423 --> 00:09:33.743
Like I never heard from anyone that like, didn't know already knew what I was doing.

00:09:33.743 --> 00:09:38.202
And I know where I get this email one day from this, this, this woman, I don't even remember her name.

00:09:38.202 --> 00:09:39.503
Um, she didn't want to connect.

00:09:39.503 --> 00:09:43.822
She just wanted to share her experience based off something that I had said on the podcast.

00:09:43.822 --> 00:09:51.020
She mentioned that she had been in an abusive relationship for seven years and never could find a way to get free of it.

00:09:51.020 --> 00:09:56.485
And something I said, which was not on that topic at all, but something I said caused her to finally realize it.

00:09:56.485 --> 00:10:04.270
And when she emailed me, this was like many months later, she had like basically moved out, got a new job, like moved to a new place.

00:10:04.270 --> 00:10:05.971
basically her life had turned around completely.

00:10:05.971 --> 00:10:08.192
And she was just saying, like, God used you for that.

00:10:08.192 --> 00:10:09.684
And I just wanted to say thank you.

00:10:09.684 --> 00:10:10.644
And that was it.

00:10:10.644 --> 00:10:12.576
I responded to something nice, never heard back again.

00:10:12.576 --> 00:10:13.386
That was fine.

00:10:13.386 --> 00:10:14.447
Like I didn't need to, right?

00:10:14.447 --> 00:10:15.778
Didn't need to go any deeper into that.

00:10:15.778 --> 00:10:20.860
But I was like, Whoa, that's I could podcast forever from that one story.

00:10:20.860 --> 00:10:24.321
is there like, don't, I don't know if I ever need to hear anything else.

00:10:24.321 --> 00:10:25.162
And here's what I realized.

00:10:25.162 --> 00:10:27.470
I'm like, I know that I didn't say, I went back and listened to the episode.

00:10:27.470 --> 00:10:32.293
I'm like, I didn't say anything like out of this world that no one had ever said before.

00:10:32.293 --> 00:10:32.825
Right.

00:10:32.825 --> 00:10:38.687
But what I realized, and I'll use this story of in my own life of this is sometimes people need your voice.

00:10:38.687 --> 00:10:41.368
And I'm not just talking to Alan, talk to everyone who's hearing this today.

00:10:41.368 --> 00:10:46.110
Sometimes people need your voice to say something in a certain way to actually make it click.

00:10:46.110 --> 00:10:48.890
And the example I can give is one of my brothers love him to death.

00:10:48.890 --> 00:10:51.402
um He hasn't had the best relationships in his life.

00:10:51.402 --> 00:10:54.394
And I've given him lot of relationship, relationship advice over the years, right?

00:10:54.394 --> 00:10:56.575
And I tell him, I tell him like, blah, blah, blah, blah, like, right?

00:10:56.575 --> 00:10:58.296
I feel like I'm just keep on saying the same thing.

00:10:58.296 --> 00:10:59.996
And I know it's really good advice.

00:10:59.996 --> 00:11:00.878
Never takes any of it.

00:11:00.878 --> 00:11:06.171
And then one day, this is years ago, this kid comes up and he goes, dude, I just got the best advice ever about relationships.

00:11:06.171 --> 00:11:07.380
Like, really, what was it?

00:11:07.380 --> 00:11:11.744
He proceeds to say exactly what I've been telling him for years, right?

00:11:11.744 --> 00:11:18.326
I wanted to punch the kid in the face, but somebody else said it slightly different in a way that it actually clicked.

00:11:18.445 --> 00:11:21.777
And the thing is, that's why I think that every unique voice matters.

00:11:21.777 --> 00:11:23.599
Like many of us, might be saying, we're in the faith.

00:11:23.599 --> 00:11:24.897
There's so many pillars of the faith today.

00:11:24.897 --> 00:11:27.741
Like I can't share anything that TD Jakes can't share.

00:11:27.741 --> 00:11:30.244
can't share anything that this individual can't share, right?

00:11:30.244 --> 00:11:36.087
Like there's all these names, but the reality is your voice might be the only one that makes it click for somebody.

00:11:36.087 --> 00:11:41.432
Like that woman that I shared about and like my brother when someone else shared something I had been sharing for years, right?

00:11:41.432 --> 00:11:46.274
That's what I believe in is helping make that voice get heard in the world.

00:11:46.274 --> 00:11:52.461
And yes, I focus on the tactics, but really my passion, my heart is let's get these voices heard and elevated throughout the world.

00:11:53.019 --> 00:12:26.648
So said so well and the verse immediately comes to mind my friend is Paul talked about this right Paul watered uh I Paul planted Apollo's watered but God gave the increase and that's the key and I love the fact that you have So clear a goal of a why you sent out a message to many of us Christian podcasters inside a pod match even a little while ago and I still see people commenting that are saying thank you for giving me the the encouragement to say what I need to say and not pay so much attention to the stats and the downloads.

00:12:26.648 --> 00:12:32.864
And I am fighting that same battle that every single content creator is fighting against the algorithm, right?

00:12:32.864 --> 00:12:34.495
The evil algorithm.

00:12:34.495 --> 00:12:38.067
And yet that why is what keeps us going.

00:12:38.067 --> 00:12:43.582
And I'm so glad you said that from someone again, who's knee deep in the data all the time.

00:12:43.582 --> 00:12:44.823
And yet you've got that message.

00:12:44.823 --> 00:12:49.128
But I want to make sure I link into something you just said about voices.

00:12:49.128 --> 00:12:50.899
because we are podcast hosts, right?

00:12:50.899 --> 00:12:57.510
We're on this side of the mic, we're producing, we're creating, but many, many, many, many, many more people are on the other side.

00:12:57.510 --> 00:12:59.851
They have a message, but they don't have a show.

00:12:59.932 --> 00:13:04.494
And I, even I, you and I talked about this, even off the air about where's our focus.

00:13:04.494 --> 00:13:09.076
And I want more people to have that voice and to pick up the mic and create shows, but many of them won't.

00:13:09.076 --> 00:13:14.717
Many of them got in the guest community or just saying, hey, I'm a painter, I'm an artist, I'm a musician, I'm a singer.

00:13:14.717 --> 00:13:16.139
That's what I want to do.

00:13:16.239 --> 00:13:18.676
But now we have this mic.

00:13:18.676 --> 00:13:22.956
on the other side where people are asking them to share their message.

00:13:22.956 --> 00:13:29.056
So what would be your first message to anyone that's thinking, no, I don't need to share my message on the podcast.

00:13:29.056 --> 00:13:30.135
I don't need to be a guest.

00:13:30.135 --> 00:13:31.836
There's too many people out there sharing it.

00:13:31.836 --> 00:13:33.216
Everybody wants to be a guest.

00:13:33.216 --> 00:13:34.336
No one's going to want to hear my voice.

00:13:34.336 --> 00:13:40.735
What would be that first thing to get them like number one into the whole point of why you should be a guest on the podcast?

00:13:41.030 --> 00:13:42.221
It's all about adding value.

00:13:42.221 --> 00:13:43.953
It's all about serving other people.

00:13:43.953 --> 00:13:50.278
I think back to one of my guests who was reluctant to come to my show because he had never been on one before and didn't think he had a message to share.

00:13:50.278 --> 00:13:54.101
He came on and shared in an extremely just beautiful way.

00:13:54.101 --> 00:14:00.226
And it was one of my most impactful episodes I'll say I ever had from somebody who's like, I don't really have anything to share.

00:14:00.226 --> 00:14:02.609
And people did not agree with him on that, right?

00:14:02.609 --> 00:14:06.773
Like, obviously, like the data analytics showed the amount of comments I received, the amount of people trying to reach out to him.

00:14:06.773 --> 00:14:09.754
Like no one agreed with the notion of I didn't have anything to share.

00:14:09.754 --> 00:14:11.645
And I think that that's the case for most of us.

00:14:11.645 --> 00:14:12.816
We do have a message.

00:14:12.816 --> 00:14:15.475
It might not mean that we need to be on a podcast every day.

00:14:15.475 --> 00:14:18.126
It might not mean we need to go on multiple shows.

00:14:18.126 --> 00:14:26.669
There's all these different things it could or could not mean, but the reality is I think at least once getting your message out there to the world so that you can share that for a long time, right?

00:14:26.669 --> 00:14:27.817
This is legacy building stuff.

00:14:27.817 --> 00:14:29.500
Like these episodes never go away.

00:14:29.500 --> 00:14:31.360
That's a beautiful thing to be able to have.

00:14:31.360 --> 00:14:35.201
And who knows what you might discover about your voice when you get into that.

00:14:35.201 --> 00:14:38.777
You might hear from people saying, wow, I didn't know that and I needed that.

00:14:38.777 --> 00:14:40.389
Maybe that means try it again, right?

00:14:40.389 --> 00:14:43.630
But I do always say like, listen, having a show isn't for everybody.

00:14:43.630 --> 00:14:46.594
If you feel like, hey, there's something here I really want to, by all means do it.

00:14:46.594 --> 00:14:47.955
There needs to be more podcasts out there.

00:14:47.955 --> 00:14:50.677
If you're like, maybe I just want to share once, be a guest.

00:14:50.677 --> 00:14:52.589
I think it's a really great thing to do.

00:14:52.884 --> 00:14:53.703
I love it.

00:14:53.703 --> 00:14:57.303
yeah, I think about number one, said about people's voice.

00:14:57.303 --> 00:15:00.163
That's one of the first things we all struggle with, whether you're a guest or a host.

00:15:00.163 --> 00:15:04.244
We were just laughing about one of our friends who has an amazing podcast voice.

00:15:04.244 --> 00:15:06.844
sounds like he should be on radio and on the TV stuff.

00:15:06.844 --> 00:15:09.303
And we were like, oh, I wish I could have that kind of voice.

00:15:09.903 --> 00:15:17.703
What are some of the things again, cause you literally created a platform where hosts can connect with guests.

00:15:17.864 --> 00:15:22.519
So I've gotten all the pitches I've heard from so many people.

00:15:22.519 --> 00:15:28.845
And there are the pros and the cons, the good and the bad of sharing what your message is.

00:15:28.845 --> 00:15:30.716
So what would be some of those tips?

00:15:30.716 --> 00:15:32.567
I know that this is an easy one for you.

00:15:32.567 --> 00:15:34.590
This is kind like a softball because you see this all the time.

00:15:34.590 --> 00:15:47.009
But again, someone's listening for the first time, maybe in my community, who's just never said, Hey, well, what are the A, B and C's of approaching somebody looking for someone that aligns with your message and sharing it?

00:15:47.009 --> 00:15:52.135
So what are those couple of tips that you would give someone who's now saying, okay, all right, I hear you, Alex, I should be on the show.

00:15:52.135 --> 00:15:55.885
But other than joining pod match, what's the next step?

00:15:55.907 --> 00:15:58.477
Yeah, I maybe don't even recommend joining pod match from day one.

00:15:58.477 --> 00:16:03.230
Like if you're just going to do one show, I don't think that that would, I'm not trying to push any people away from my own product, right?

00:16:03.230 --> 00:16:07.293
But like just being real, I think that there's some things you should do before that.

00:16:07.634 --> 00:16:14.888
First off, just, I know I don't go too deep in the data, but like there is an industry report that I helped develop which shows the ratio of guests and hosts.

00:16:14.888 --> 00:16:22.682
And at any given point right now, at time recording this, there's a 41 to one ratio, 41 people trying to be a guest to every one show that's in existence.

00:16:22.761 --> 00:16:24.076
It's out of balance.

00:16:24.076 --> 00:16:25.607
It doesn't mean you can't do this.

00:16:25.607 --> 00:16:28.869
It just means you have to be willing to do something that other people won't be willing to do.

00:16:28.869 --> 00:16:32.129
To me, step one is, is why do you want to do it?

00:16:32.470 --> 00:16:35.360
And I'll tell you this because Alan and Alex said so is not a good enough.

00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:35.730
Why?

00:16:35.730 --> 00:16:38.630
Like there needs to, it needs to go far beyond that.

00:16:39.851 --> 00:16:40.532
Right.

00:16:40.532 --> 00:16:44.173
I'm telling you right now, any host he says to me like, who the heck is Alex Sanfilippo?

00:16:44.173 --> 00:16:44.413
Right.

00:16:44.413 --> 00:16:46.964
And who, who's this Alan Paul guy?

00:16:46.964 --> 00:16:47.163
Right.

00:16:47.163 --> 00:16:51.023
Like people are going to be like, listen, I can't have you on the show for that.

00:16:51.023 --> 00:16:52.982
Like you need to have a why that goes deeper than that.

00:16:52.982 --> 00:16:54.302
And that's going to go to your core.

00:16:54.302 --> 00:16:56.783
I recommend grabbing pen and paper and writing down.

00:16:56.783 --> 00:16:58.003
Why do I want to be on a podcast?

00:16:58.003 --> 00:16:59.403
What message do I have to share?

00:16:59.403 --> 00:17:01.363
And who is it really for?

00:17:01.403 --> 00:17:05.682
So why and what, and then who is that going to be for?

00:17:05.682 --> 00:17:13.022
And what that means is like, you might not know exactly who's listening, but you can look at a show and kind of see, you get a pretty good idea of who's probably listening to it.

00:17:13.022 --> 00:17:18.702
Is that a line going back up that trail to your why, to how you're going impact them, to who they are?

00:17:18.702 --> 00:17:19.923
Like you want to really look at this.

00:17:19.923 --> 00:17:22.444
And to me, that is absolute step one.

00:17:22.484 --> 00:17:26.846
Right along with that is doing your research, your preparation before you even reach out.

00:17:26.846 --> 00:17:36.833
And then after you reach out as well, but before you even reach out, like looking around a little bit, so many people today, what they do with this huge out of balance ratio we have, they just look for the biggest shows.

00:17:36.833 --> 00:17:39.733
And so there's many ways you can sort by biggest shows, top of the charts.

00:17:39.733 --> 00:17:43.016
That's the show I need to be on without even listening, without having any clue.

00:17:43.016 --> 00:17:45.202
They just say, big audience, I need to do it.

00:17:45.202 --> 00:17:48.608
And the reality is podcasting just doesn't really work like that.

00:17:48.795 --> 00:17:52.555
The best way I can describe it is a podcast is like people sitting in seats.

00:17:52.555 --> 00:17:56.674
So the listeners are people sitting in seats and the host and the guests are sitting on stage.

00:17:56.674 --> 00:17:58.755
You don't need a massive room for it to be valuable.

00:17:58.755 --> 00:18:00.974
You just need it to be the right room.

00:18:00.994 --> 00:18:02.914
just, it's gotta be the right spot, right?

00:18:02.914 --> 00:18:13.855
If you go to a room with 10,000 people and you're sitting on stage, but it's all homeschool moms looking for ways to better their kids' education and you talk about luxury cars, you're on the wrong stage.

00:18:13.855 --> 00:18:16.696
It'd be better to go into a room with a hundred CEOs, right?

00:18:16.696 --> 00:18:22.090
that are looking for their next cool hobby or investment and you're talking about luxury cars to them, which room is more valuable?

00:18:22.090 --> 00:18:23.531
One has 10,000, one has a hundred.

00:18:23.531 --> 00:18:26.414
The room with a hundred is more valuable for you because it's unique.

00:18:26.414 --> 00:18:32.959
You can only determine this by doing your research and research does not mean looking for the top charts, finding the biggest show saying that's the one.

00:18:33.267 --> 00:18:35.183
Alan, I got to ask you any thoughts on this before?

00:18:35.183 --> 00:18:37.768
Cause I have more to share, but I'm just wondering like any thoughts on this?

00:18:37.768 --> 00:18:41.432
like as soon as you started talking about the difference between that room, right?

00:18:41.432 --> 00:18:42.992
The right room.

00:18:43.374 --> 00:18:46.153
And so that'd be my one thing to say to everybody that's like looking at it.

00:18:46.153 --> 00:18:50.634
Again, I get these same pitches where they're blanket, they're cookie cutter.

00:18:50.634 --> 00:18:51.614
They're like, oh, here's a show.

00:18:51.614 --> 00:18:52.993
He must want them on.

00:18:53.054 --> 00:18:57.269
And I'm like, no, you did not listen to my show.

00:18:57.269 --> 00:18:58.590
I am not a good fit for you.

00:18:58.590 --> 00:19:01.373
And then my best thing is to say no.

00:19:01.413 --> 00:19:01.854
Right.

00:19:01.854 --> 00:19:08.298
That's the crazy thing is like, I'm trying to do them a favor by helping them narrow down their pitches and not go to the wrong room.

00:19:08.298 --> 00:19:11.382
Cause my room is the wrong room for many of these people that are looking.

00:19:11.382 --> 00:19:19.278
But if you're the right person and you're the right connection, man, that can elevate both my show and the person that's coming on my show.

00:19:19.278 --> 00:19:19.919
That's what it is.

00:19:19.919 --> 00:19:21.250
It's really like a mutual thing.

00:19:21.250 --> 00:19:22.691
I think, does that make sense?

00:19:22.691 --> 00:19:26.114
It's a mutual thing where you realize that, Hey, we're both getting value out of this.

00:19:26.114 --> 00:19:30.316
And then when you lead with that, you lead by as like we both say, serve first.

00:19:30.336 --> 00:19:39.121
If you want to serve that person, that host, I believe that, yeah, then you're going to get a lot more people who are saying, yes, I'd like you to be on my show and you're going to feel better at the end of it.

00:19:39.121 --> 00:19:41.000
So yeah, so those are my thoughts when you said that.

00:19:41.000 --> 00:19:42.521
Yeah, that's so good.

00:19:42.521 --> 00:19:50.226
I recently wrote for an article for Forbes about being a guest on a podcast and you referenced the idea of saying no and I think that applies to both sides.

00:19:50.226 --> 00:20:05.615
One of my main points was as a podcast guest when you start doing well and hosts see that you share it and stuff like that, more hosts want you on and I really honed in on the point of saying no is really important when it's the wrong show and it's interesting because the Forbes editorial team did not agree with that.

00:20:05.615 --> 00:20:06.445
Like this doesn't make sense.

00:20:06.445 --> 00:20:08.436
You want to get on all of them, you want to get on more of them.

00:20:08.436 --> 00:20:10.096
I'm like, no, you want to get on the right ones.

00:20:10.096 --> 00:20:10.936
I'm like, read what I said.

00:20:10.936 --> 00:20:15.817
Like it's about the right shows because you will burn yourself out being on a hundred thousand different shows.

00:20:15.817 --> 00:20:16.297
Right.

00:20:16.297 --> 00:20:26.557
And the reality is there's probably only 10 or 20 that you need to be on within the next year or a couple of years that really make a difference and move the needle and matter because it's the space where your voice will get heard.

00:20:26.557 --> 00:20:29.336
And so I love that you brought up that idea of saying no.

00:20:29.336 --> 00:20:34.636
And I think it's a really important, it's important for both sides of the microphone to help each other stay focused.

00:20:34.636 --> 00:20:36.957
A no is, is not a rejection.

00:20:36.957 --> 00:20:38.157
It's a redirection.

00:20:38.157 --> 00:20:38.671
Mmm.

00:20:38.671 --> 00:20:43.326
many of us, need to think about the word no, and we hear it because you will as a podcast guest, you could do everything right.

00:20:43.326 --> 00:20:47.131
And in a minute, I'll share about even a great pitch that I use to build a reach out.

00:20:47.131 --> 00:20:49.722
I still hear no, but I just remember it's not a rejection.

00:20:49.722 --> 00:20:50.483
It's a redirection.

00:20:50.483 --> 00:20:51.905
It means I went to the wrong show.

00:20:51.905 --> 00:20:54.898
Even though did my research, there's something about it that wasn't going to be right.

00:20:54.898 --> 00:20:57.221
It's better to go on to the right show instead.

00:20:57.574 --> 00:21:01.728
And not just a no redirection could be just not the right time, right?

00:21:01.728 --> 00:21:03.220
It could be just not the right time.

00:21:03.220 --> 00:21:08.882
Like we need to be aware that our message may not be the right one at that particular time or that right fit.

00:21:08.882 --> 00:21:09.821
But I love this.

00:21:09.821 --> 00:21:14.824
I want you to share a little bit because we are talking to a lot of our fellow believers, right?

00:21:14.824 --> 00:21:26.041
there is a something we have to say out loud, which is just because you are a Christian and your beliefs are Christian does not mean you need to be on every Christian podcast.

00:21:26.041 --> 00:21:27.573
I think it goes it goes hand in hand.

00:21:27.573 --> 00:21:36.464
I think it needs to be said in this form because I think there's an assumption that, if I have the same faith, I think the same thing that they think that then their message is my message.

00:21:36.684 --> 00:21:39.675
Again, y'all, it's not always the case.

00:21:39.675 --> 00:21:42.050
Can you speak to that a little bit in terms of just again, like.

00:21:42.050 --> 00:21:50.310
being a little more specific about those of who think, well, if their message is my message, it must be that I need to be connected with them and on every platform.

00:21:50.310 --> 00:21:55.259
I've, again, I've seen many shows that I realized I'm not aligned with them just because we have the same faith.

00:21:55.410 --> 00:21:59.833
Yeah, it's insightful to notice that because I think that many of us, that's the core of our life.

00:21:59.833 --> 00:22:03.556
So we identify that, hey, if it's Christian, I'm in, right?

00:22:03.556 --> 00:22:09.944
And the reality is that's not a bad perspective to have, but we do need to look more narrow, more niche, okay?

00:22:09.944 --> 00:22:11.250
Because like that can go a lot of ways.

00:22:11.250 --> 00:22:13.923
Like there are Christian shows about overcoming grief.

00:22:13.923 --> 00:22:16.224
There are Christian shows about being an athlete.

00:22:16.224 --> 00:22:19.866
Well, if you're only one or the other, then both shows aren't good for you, right?

00:22:19.866 --> 00:22:21.778
And so that's a perfect example of that.

00:22:21.778 --> 00:22:23.410
Now, I think it really does matter.

00:22:23.410 --> 00:22:26.851
uh An example, I recently had somebody reach out to me like I'm a believer.

00:22:26.851 --> 00:22:28.500
My show is called podcasting made simple.

00:22:28.500 --> 00:22:31.172
It is about being a better podcast guest or podcast host.

00:22:31.172 --> 00:22:38.575
And she had a uh really, um really motivating story about how she came to the faith and how it like really turned her life around.

00:22:38.575 --> 00:22:40.128
And she wanted to share my podcast.

00:22:40.128 --> 00:22:44.105
And I just said, Hey, like, I know we're both believers and she knew I was she kind of brought that up.

00:22:44.105 --> 00:22:48.077
So she did her time to research and like, but it won't resonate with my audience.

00:22:48.077 --> 00:22:49.801
Like that's not who I speak to.

00:22:49.801 --> 00:22:51.162
And she was really upset about it.

00:22:51.162 --> 00:22:55.301
She's like, like you don't, you're not going to give a platform for people to share their, their testimonies.

00:22:55.301 --> 00:22:59.041
And I was like, yeah, sure it did.

00:23:00.402 --> 00:23:03.281
It, it, listen, it turned into a good conversation back and forth.

00:23:03.281 --> 00:23:07.882
And I was just kind like, listen, like that, that's not what my, that's not what God gave me on a platform for.

00:23:07.882 --> 00:23:09.481
Like there are places you can do that.

00:23:09.481 --> 00:23:12.261
Even on pod match, there are plenty of places where that is very appropriate.

00:23:12.261 --> 00:23:13.721
It's what they're looking for.

00:23:13.721 --> 00:23:25.684
If I have this person that is not saved and I can teach them how to get a better microphone to sound better as a podcast guest, I now have a little bit of influence with them so that they may be interested in hearing my faith.

00:23:25.684 --> 00:23:30.709
But if I tell them, I got the right microphone choice for you, but first you gotta listen to this, this Testament of how someone found Jesus.

00:23:30.709 --> 00:23:33.632
I am, I am losing that credibility.

00:23:33.632 --> 00:23:38.896
And so like you said, like we've to be somewhat strategic as believers in today's world, especially.

00:23:38.896 --> 00:23:40.117
We need to gain influence.

00:23:40.117 --> 00:23:42.019
However, God gives us the way to do that.

00:23:42.019 --> 00:23:44.711
Podcasting is the lane that he has given me.

00:23:44.806 --> 00:24:15.605
Influence in and so I use that and eventually my faith always comes up because I told God from day one any platform I'm on I'm going to mention you even if it's for a brief moment However, I can work it and I'm going to today Alan you made it very easy for me to do that But normally I do have to like actually work for it and some people don't appreciate that that sometimes the host and that's why I'll keep it really short really brief in a way that doesn't offend anybody But I get the opportunity to just plant that seed right now And so I know there's a long-winded answer, but listen, not all podcasts are created equal.

00:24:15.605 --> 00:24:18.776
Even if the foundational level, your faith is the same.

00:24:18.836 --> 00:24:27.357
I would just instead recommend encouraging them, leaving that show review saying, Hey, like I'm not going to be the right fit as a guest, but I wanted to acknowledge Alan.

00:24:27.357 --> 00:24:28.459
I heard your podcast.

00:24:28.459 --> 00:24:30.118
left it a five star rating and review.

00:24:30.118 --> 00:24:31.288
That's how you can impact.

00:24:31.288 --> 00:24:31.980
That's how you can help.

00:24:31.980 --> 00:24:37.881
And the reality is opening up that communication might actually lead you to someone like Alan saying, Hey, yeah, you're right.

00:24:37.881 --> 00:24:40.721
Not a good fit for me, but my friend so-and-so.

00:24:40.721 --> 00:24:42.289
might really like to talk to you.

00:24:42.289 --> 00:24:45.182
And you don't do it for that reason, but like, let's build each other up.

00:24:45.182 --> 00:24:46.434
Let's do it that way.

00:24:46.434 --> 00:24:50.555
Well, no, I mean, you don't do it for that reason, but it is 100 % a biblical principle.

00:24:50.555 --> 00:24:53.194
It is true that he who waters will be watered, right?

00:24:53.194 --> 00:24:56.914
He who refers to the refresh, be not weary in well-doing, but in due season you'll reap.

00:24:56.934 --> 00:25:00.035
All these things are about, yes, it's the golden rule.

00:25:00.035 --> 00:25:03.154
so business do it, we do it all the time, Alex.

00:25:03.154 --> 00:25:07.115
Like, I don't think we need to shy away from the both and.

00:25:07.115 --> 00:25:11.234
Yes, you're serving others by saying, hey, I wanna promote your podcast.

00:25:11.234 --> 00:25:12.075
I wanna help you out.

00:25:12.075 --> 00:25:13.555
I don't wanna be the person on the show.

00:25:13.555 --> 00:25:20.042
I want to be a servant and like, hey, promote it, share it with other people, and maybe they do know somebody, right?

00:25:20.042 --> 00:25:20.823
They do know somebody.

00:25:20.823 --> 00:25:29.942
I'm very aware that my relationships and my network has built beyond my own capacity because I served first, because I want to help other people like you, man.

00:25:29.942 --> 00:25:31.262
Like, this is what I'm talking about.

00:25:31.262 --> 00:25:36.803
Like, when I see something that pod matches happen, I'm always going to be the number one cheerleader, but it's not because I want to know the people you want to know.

00:25:36.803 --> 00:25:39.962
It's because you have an amazing message and amazing product.

00:25:39.962 --> 00:25:42.522
That being said, I'm also very aware.

00:25:43.138 --> 00:25:48.378
that I want to be in rooms with people who I do want to learn from and impact.

00:25:48.378 --> 00:25:50.739
So I don't think, I think a lot of times we do get into that.

00:25:50.739 --> 00:25:55.858
And this is kind of like in the weeds of like the ethics of podcasting, but it's true.

00:25:55.858 --> 00:25:58.538
Like I think you can live on both sides.

00:25:58.538 --> 00:25:59.919
You can say, I want to serve.

00:25:59.919 --> 00:26:01.318
And you can be very aware of that.

00:26:01.318 --> 00:26:04.278
Hey, if I serve well, God's going to bring that back to me.

00:26:04.278 --> 00:26:05.419
I don't know who I'm going to meet.

00:26:05.419 --> 00:26:08.858
I don't know what connection is going to be made, but I know this is the way to do it.

00:26:08.858 --> 00:26:12.982
The way to do it is to serve first and then wait for the opportunities to come my way.

00:26:12.982 --> 00:26:14.303
versus trying to engineer them.

00:26:14.303 --> 00:26:16.093
I think it's just a different mentality.

00:26:16.425 --> 00:26:18.266
Yeah, I totally agree you on that.

00:26:18.266 --> 00:26:25.645
think that's hard for us to do, I encourage everyone here in this, rewind this a little bit.

00:26:25.645 --> 00:26:26.566
That's old school.

00:26:26.566 --> 00:26:27.586
Hit back a couple of times.

00:26:27.586 --> 00:26:28.346
30 second part, right?

00:26:28.346 --> 00:26:29.506
I said rewind.

00:26:29.546 --> 00:26:34.086
Go back a few times and listen that again, because there's a really powerful message there for us all.

00:26:34.086 --> 00:26:38.883
that's just good wisdom that's going to serve you long-term in and out of podcasting.

00:26:38.883 --> 00:26:39.462
Absolutely.

00:26:39.462 --> 00:26:45.482
And I just want to point to you in terms of your quarterly event is a perfect example of this.

00:26:45.482 --> 00:26:51.063
Because when you do those quarterly events, I see you next to people that I'm like, how does he know that person?

00:26:51.063 --> 00:26:53.643
How does it, and I know you never angled for this.

00:26:53.643 --> 00:27:00.522
These are real relationships that now they are a podcast guest, you're a host on their show, you're guest on their shows and so on.

00:27:00.522 --> 00:27:03.502
But these are all authentic relationships that you built over time.

00:27:03.502 --> 00:27:06.686
And then again, we mentioned like you've been doing this since 2014.

00:27:06.686 --> 00:27:10.359
and you've built other things in terms of ministries, built on relationships.

00:27:10.359 --> 00:27:12.621
So it's just a natural thing.

00:27:12.621 --> 00:27:16.109
So I think when they rewind it, they'll hear the heart of that.

00:27:16.109 --> 00:27:20.446
We're talking about relationships and they naturally build value over time, like whether you like it or not.

00:27:20.446 --> 00:27:22.157
That's just the way that it works.

00:27:22.157 --> 00:27:23.338
So I love this.

00:27:23.338 --> 00:27:30.865
I want to ask you before we keep going about some of the specifics of your journey, because we talked a lot about podcasting.

00:27:30.865 --> 00:27:34.432
We talked a lot about how people should be able to find guests, but...

00:27:34.432 --> 00:27:37.675
That I did read some things about you, man, that I did not realize.

00:27:37.675 --> 00:27:42.789
Like I did not realize that at one point you had this massive blog.

00:27:42.923 --> 00:27:58.143
Um, I did not realize, knew I heard about your time in the aerospace industry, but just realizing that again, we're talking to some people who are navigating that between creator, leaving behind some things, some things and pushing their message forward.

00:27:58.143 --> 00:28:03.146
So I just wanted you to encourage somebody who might be right around that fence of.

00:28:03.265 --> 00:28:08.900
God's putting something in my heart to share, but it doesn't necessarily align with what I'm doing right now.

00:28:08.900 --> 00:28:20.199
Because that first show they might be showing up on might be the one where they're finally showing up and saying, wait a minute, I'm not just this corporate thing or this particular parent or whatever, but I'm also this.

00:28:20.199 --> 00:28:26.473
So talk a little bit about how you made that transition from just worker, just employee to a creator.

00:28:26.473 --> 00:28:28.575
And when you started sharing your message.

00:28:28.584 --> 00:28:32.857
Yeah, first off, there was a lot of overlap and I think that that's okay.

00:28:32.857 --> 00:28:43.826
I think that many of us, desire this clean break of like I left corporate, became a full-time creator, but the reality is it's very, very rare that that happens and that might not even be the best way for it to happen.

00:28:43.826 --> 00:28:45.268
That's almost kind of like winning the lottery.

00:28:45.268 --> 00:28:48.441
Like you might not build the discipline that you need along the way if you win the lottery.

00:28:48.441 --> 00:28:49.541
saying it's a terrible thing, right?

00:28:49.541 --> 00:28:54.596
But like you're not going to build the discipline of understanding how to manage finances and things like that.

00:28:54.596 --> 00:28:56.807
And the same is true as a creator.

00:28:56.807 --> 00:28:59.660
Sometimes with the overlap, teaches you to learn to be efficient.

00:28:59.660 --> 00:29:10.465
If you had no job, no income, and somehow you start making money as a creator or just like happened overnight, you're still going to probably be fairly inefficient because you have so much time on your hands.

00:29:10.465 --> 00:29:12.627
So for me, I'm actually grateful of the overlap.

00:29:12.627 --> 00:29:14.538
So I did 15 years in the aerospace industry.

00:29:14.538 --> 00:29:19.471
And before someone thinks I did anything cool, I was not an astronaut, was not a skydiver and was not a fighter pilot.

00:29:19.471 --> 00:29:23.653
I worked at a aerospace company that focused below the atmosphere on parts manufacturing.

00:29:23.653 --> 00:29:27.576
And I worked my up to the C-suite level, that company really enjoyed that job.

00:29:27.757 --> 00:29:33.561
On the side of it for the last eight years that I was at that company, I started building a blog.

00:29:33.561 --> 00:29:43.809
And so just on the side, it was my creative element because what I just mentioned, that job I had, very analytical, very administrative, very like management type stuff, right?

00:29:43.809 --> 00:29:46.112
Like corporate America to a T.

00:29:46.112 --> 00:29:47.513
And again, I loved it.

00:29:47.513 --> 00:29:48.634
It was not...

00:29:49.114 --> 00:29:51.224
scratching the itch of creativeness, right?

00:29:51.224 --> 00:29:53.096
Like I just didn't really have that opportunity.

00:29:53.096 --> 00:29:59.357
So I started that blog going back to when I was leading small groups with my wife at church.

00:29:59.357 --> 00:30:02.896
And the blog was basically where the podcast was born from as well.

00:30:02.896 --> 00:30:09.823
And the whole idea was just helping believers get closer to Jesus who were struggling or people maybe they weren't even following Jesus yet to be able to find Jesus.

00:30:09.823 --> 00:30:11.784
And like that was the whole idea around it.

00:30:11.784 --> 00:30:13.044
And it did really well.

00:30:13.044 --> 00:30:14.605
It started with just me writing.

00:30:14.605 --> 00:30:17.442
And at first I was writing five days a week because I loved it so much.

00:30:17.442 --> 00:30:18.125
Wow.

00:30:18.125 --> 00:30:19.345
See what I said about the work ethic?

00:30:19.345 --> 00:30:20.189
Let me say the work ethic.

00:30:20.189 --> 00:30:21.491
See, that's what I'm telling you, man.

00:30:21.491 --> 00:30:24.018
Like, nobody outworks you, bro.

00:30:24.018 --> 00:30:26.314
Five days a week, I'm struggling to get two days a week.

00:30:26.314 --> 00:30:29.394
Well, just so you know, I ended up doing once a month.

00:30:29.493 --> 00:30:32.233
So I worked my way down to once a month.

00:30:32.493 --> 00:30:32.973
No problem.

00:30:32.973 --> 00:30:34.473
That was my good cadence.

00:30:34.574 --> 00:30:38.794
we kind of, I say we, was me and then Alicia started helping my wife.

00:30:38.794 --> 00:30:42.334
And then we brought on three other people to help run it.

00:30:42.393 --> 00:30:50.513
And long story short, we ended up with over 140, somewhat, believe it was 140 different authors that were using it, publishing on it and all writing content.

00:30:50.513 --> 00:30:51.814
And that's why I dropped down to once a month.

00:30:51.814 --> 00:30:54.346
That was my slot that I was given from the team.

00:30:54.346 --> 00:30:56.385
But my slot also came with a podcast episode.

00:30:56.385 --> 00:31:00.945
So I was doing one podcast episode per month and one blog post per month and they were connected every month.

00:31:00.945 --> 00:31:02.586
And I really enjoyed that.

00:31:02.586 --> 00:31:03.766
It was really great for me.

00:31:03.766 --> 00:31:10.705
And ultimately that's what led me to launching Creating a Brand, which led me the opportunity to be able to speak on stages about podcasting.

00:31:10.705 --> 00:31:12.405
It was a long play.

00:31:12.405 --> 00:31:19.405
mean, I wanted to leave corporate years before I did, but I didn't actually leave until December 7th, 2020.

00:31:19.405 --> 00:31:20.842
And I left.

00:31:20.842 --> 00:31:23.432
On my own accord, I was doing really well at the company.

00:31:23.432 --> 00:31:25.884
It was actually my best year I ever had there, which was really cool.

00:31:25.884 --> 00:31:34.047
But I just realized that this opportunity to now serve and support creators had been presented and I had worked really efficiently.

00:31:34.047 --> 00:31:36.769
So I was like, man, I'm sure I can do with a little bit more hours, right?

00:31:36.769 --> 00:31:39.288
I learned to be efficient.

00:31:39.490 --> 00:31:40.865
that's kind of the journey for me.

00:31:40.865 --> 00:31:45.991
I'll tell you what, I knew that God called me that corporate job, but I also knew he called me to be that blogger.

00:31:46.152 --> 00:31:48.423
And at that point, he had me doing both.

00:31:48.423 --> 00:31:55.276
And we can look at scripture and see that there's some very iconic people in our faith that had more than one thing going on.

00:31:55.276 --> 00:31:57.126
They weren't always full-time missionaries, right?

00:31:57.126 --> 00:32:00.660
Like they had things going on that God just put them in that season.

00:32:00.660 --> 00:32:04.374
And there was a time and season for doing both and doing one or the other.

00:32:04.374 --> 00:32:10.058
And so I think that we just need to be, we don't, shouldn't grow weary of doing good in those areas.

00:32:10.058 --> 00:32:12.480
Be good at both things if you feel that you have that.

00:32:12.480 --> 00:32:15.041
And at the same time, those things can feed each other.

00:32:15.262 --> 00:32:19.006
I was able to build 140 plus person multi-author blog.

00:32:19.006 --> 00:32:20.787
because of my experience in corporate.

00:32:20.787 --> 00:32:21.925
Like it taught me to do that.

00:32:21.925 --> 00:32:26.989
I was able to go to the marketing team, my corporate job with some really cool, unique ideas because of what I was learning from blogging.

00:32:26.989 --> 00:32:28.000
See how they fed each other.

00:32:28.000 --> 00:32:35.575
And I think for all of us, that opportunity is there if we don't allow ourselves to kind of be jaded by one of them, right?

00:32:35.575 --> 00:32:37.115
Like, or like dislike one of them.

00:32:37.115 --> 00:32:41.288
Like we gotta learn that if God's place is here, let's do the best we can on both sides.

00:32:41.810 --> 00:32:42.780
I couldn't say it better.

00:32:42.780 --> 00:32:50.053
And the reason why I wanted to make sure you said that is because I feel like we are being pulled into this hustle mentality of, like you said, you got to leave your job.

00:32:50.053 --> 00:32:53.374
If you really have faith, you'll leave everything behind and you'll jump into this.

00:32:53.374 --> 00:33:02.336
uh even when we're talking about the podcast and like, well, you can make a million dollars like Joe Rogan if you just drop it all and leave it like, no, that's not what we're trying to say.

00:33:02.336 --> 00:33:10.403
Especially to those of you who are thinking about sharing your message more, becoming a guest, maybe even thinking about making your own show eventually.

00:33:10.403 --> 00:33:11.803
This is the kind of thing we're talking about.

00:33:11.803 --> 00:33:13.883
It's not one or the other.

00:33:13.883 --> 00:33:16.282
It's not all or nothing.

00:33:16.282 --> 00:33:21.942
So I feel like hearing your story and seeing where you're at really helps them see like, okay, this is a long play.

00:33:21.942 --> 00:33:24.022
I love that word that you said.

00:33:24.022 --> 00:33:28.083
It's a long-term strategy and God is playing chess and not checkers.

00:33:28.083 --> 00:33:37.522
So he's gonna put those plays people in place to help you step by step, by step, by step, by step to slowly amplify the voice and the message that you have.

00:33:37.522 --> 00:33:39.553
So now man, we could talk for...

00:33:39.553 --> 00:33:49.566
Hours on this stuff, but I do want to kind of make sure we leave a couple of those uh next steps because you mentioned about Clarifying your why?

00:33:49.566 --> 00:33:56.989
Clarifying your message making sure, know why you're reaching out to certain shows Yeah, you know, actually, I think there might be one thing that we should curry for that.

00:33:56.989 --> 00:33:57.489
That's okay.

00:33:57.489 --> 00:33:59.749
Like the, actual pitch itself.

00:33:59.829 --> 00:33:59.990
right.

00:33:59.990 --> 00:34:04.910
These six steps down, because this is actually you reaching out to the host, which is going to be required.

00:34:04.910 --> 00:34:08.224
Like we're in, we, if Listen, if we don't ask, we don't get the opportunity usually.

00:34:08.224 --> 00:34:11.396
So um these are the six things I suggest doing, write them down.

00:34:11.396 --> 00:34:12.668
Number one is to keep it short.

00:34:12.668 --> 00:34:17.793
uh There's so many long-winded pitches these days and AI makes it really long-winded.

00:34:17.793 --> 00:34:18.893
What's the old saying?

00:34:18.893 --> 00:34:21.775
I didn't have time to write you a short email, so I wrote you a long one.

00:34:21.856 --> 00:34:25.360
And the reality is the shorter it is, typically the better it is.

00:34:25.360 --> 00:34:26.742
So keep it really short.

00:34:26.742 --> 00:34:28.983
The first thing is to lead with value after that.

00:34:28.983 --> 00:34:30.235
So step one, keep it short.

00:34:30.235 --> 00:34:31.565
Step two, lead with value.

00:34:31.565 --> 00:34:38.226
All that means is don't go straight to, want to be a guest because I have a book, because I have a message, because I heard from Alan that I need to be a guest on a podcast, right?

00:34:38.226 --> 00:34:39.405
Like don't do that.

00:34:39.405 --> 00:34:40.525
Start off with doing your research.

00:34:40.525 --> 00:34:43.065
Like I talked about and say, Hey, loved your show.

00:34:43.065 --> 00:34:45.505
Absolutely loved the way that you share and like this.

00:34:45.505 --> 00:34:50.106
And what I suggest doing is go to Apple podcasts and leave a five star rating review and just attach it there.

00:34:50.106 --> 00:34:51.146
Keep it short again.

00:34:51.146 --> 00:34:52.865
Hey, loved your show, left you a five star rating review.

00:34:52.865 --> 00:34:53.846
Here it is.

00:34:53.846 --> 00:34:55.766
You have everyone's attention at that point.

00:34:55.766 --> 00:34:57.766
Step three is make a meaningful request.

00:34:58.045 --> 00:35:00.224
A request would just be, I'd like to be on your podcast.

00:35:00.224 --> 00:35:12.664
A meaningful request means telling them, hey, I've got a story about transformation my own life I think would really resonate with your listeners because you have these other episodes I think were really good on a similar topic and it looks like they got good traction.

00:35:12.664 --> 00:35:13.664
However you want to say it, right?

00:35:13.664 --> 00:35:15.286
The idea is make a meaningful request.

00:35:15.286 --> 00:35:18.829
The host isn't saying, okay, you want to on the podcast and I'll get to figure out what you're going to talk about.

00:35:18.829 --> 00:35:21.052
No, do that work for them upfront.

00:35:21.052 --> 00:35:23.172
Number four is to offer credibility.

00:35:23.434 --> 00:35:29.277
In my mind, I think a lot of us we want to send our resume, but the highest form of credibility is who they know that you know.

00:35:29.550 --> 00:35:43.949
So example, if I reach out to a friend of Alan's and I want to be on their podcast, I'm simply going to say, here's a picture of Alan and I, when you get to hang out at least once a year, sometimes two or three times a year at different conferences, you can ask more about me because I know that you are really close as well.

00:35:43.949 --> 00:35:46.150
Most people are instantly like, cool, you're in.

00:35:46.150 --> 00:35:48.190
I trust Alan, I trust Alex now.

00:35:48.190 --> 00:35:50.230
And so offering credibility is who they know that you know.

00:35:50.230 --> 00:35:52.789
You can even go to social media, see who you have your friends in common with.

00:35:52.789 --> 00:35:55.318
If there's no one you haven't come with, do you like the same TV shows?

00:35:55.318 --> 00:35:56.929
Is your book of the Bible the favorite one, right?

00:35:56.929 --> 00:35:59.842
Like anything like that that builds a connection is huge.

00:35:59.842 --> 00:36:02.063
Number five is to mention sharing the episode.

00:36:02.063 --> 00:36:02.974
I always try to mention this.

00:36:02.974 --> 00:36:03.911
Hey, I'd love to be a guest.

00:36:03.911 --> 00:36:07.429
I'm going let you know I'll create a blog post on my website linking to your episode.

00:36:07.429 --> 00:36:10.271
And I'd love to share it on social media anytime you tag me as well.

00:36:10.291 --> 00:36:12.793
And the last thing here is just to make it easy to say no.

00:36:12.793 --> 00:36:16.606
You want to open a dialogue that, like I said earlier, like no, it's not a rejection.

00:36:16.606 --> 00:36:17.306
It's a redirection.

00:36:17.306 --> 00:36:20.360
And typically, as Alan said, it just means not right now.

00:36:20.360 --> 00:36:21.981
So you want to give them the option to respond.

00:36:21.981 --> 00:36:23.753
I always just say, Hey, no worries either way.

00:36:23.753 --> 00:36:28.159
I only want to be a guest if you really think I can add value, but I'd love to hear back from you either way.

00:36:28.240 --> 00:36:30.393
I end with almost those exact words every single time.

00:36:30.393 --> 00:36:32.065
That way don't feel like they're going to break my heart.

00:36:32.065 --> 00:36:34.768
If it's a no, at least we can get a conversation going.

00:36:34.768 --> 00:36:38.842
uh Anyway, those are my six steps that I always do that work really well for me, Alan.

00:36:38.842 --> 00:36:43.527
I don't know if you want to jump in there for a minute before we move on to the question at hand now.

00:36:43.532 --> 00:36:48.907
No, no, thank you for backing that up because this is exactly what I wanted to make sure I kind of worded it in the wrong way.

00:36:48.907 --> 00:36:52.690
It's really that it's like, okay, steps to actually seeing this.

00:36:52.690 --> 00:37:01.659
And I think what you said right there really helps me kind of define this better because once you lead with value, right, you say, hey, I'm not thinking about me.

00:37:01.659 --> 00:37:08.083
I want to share with your audience and I want to make sure I promote you, whether or not you even have me as a guest.

00:37:08.224 --> 00:37:11.630
I think that does move you into area of where you are.

00:37:11.630 --> 00:37:12.320
It's authority.

00:37:12.320 --> 00:37:13.552
think that's what I'm looking for.

00:37:13.552 --> 00:37:14.112
Right.

00:37:14.112 --> 00:37:19.916
That's kind like what I was trying to aim at, which is how do you become someone who is confident with that pitch?

00:37:20.056 --> 00:37:21.608
So thank you for actually backing it up.

00:37:21.608 --> 00:37:28.451
Cause I think once you step through those six steps, now you are saying to someone, Hey, I don't, I'm not begging in a sense.

00:37:28.451 --> 00:37:29.643
You know what I mean?

00:37:29.762 --> 00:37:30.726
I'm not begging.

00:37:30.726 --> 00:37:36.867
I want to help because I do feel confident in my own authority, my own voice, what I want to share.

00:37:36.867 --> 00:37:39.030
And it's not like you said, just scatter shot.

00:37:39.030 --> 00:37:41.072
Hey, B I want to be on your, I want to be in show.

00:37:41.072 --> 00:37:46.184
We listen to my book, read my story, talk about me, me, me, me, me.

00:37:46.184 --> 00:37:48.474
So no, you absolutely answered it the right way.

00:37:48.474 --> 00:37:53.565
Because if you are pitching to people in that way, it's not a me first attitude.

00:37:53.565 --> 00:37:57.547
It's more of a, I'm here to serve and I'm confident in what I'm sharing.

00:37:57.547 --> 00:37:59.297
So you already answered that perfectly right there.

00:37:59.297 --> 00:38:01.208
So I appreciate that backing it up.

00:38:01.208 --> 00:38:10.661
And I think honestly, if they follow that and just create a system of that, which again, PodMatch makes it very easy, but also in terms of just your own process.

00:38:10.724 --> 00:38:22.344
because I do believe that as you become a guest, think this is where, tell me if this is true, people who become very good guests would probably also make very good hosts because now you understand your voice and you know what you're sharing.

00:38:22.344 --> 00:38:24.536
that something you've seen possibly more often?

00:38:24.536 --> 00:38:31.115
There are people who think they can't be hosts, but then realize, hey, I'm actually good at this and I enjoy it and they become hosts.

00:38:31.115 --> 00:38:33.989
Yeah, you know, I actually find it works better than the opposite.

00:38:33.989 --> 00:38:38.353
Not all hosts are good guests, but most guests are good hosts.

00:38:38.936 --> 00:38:43.161
I'd say it's a harder form of communication to some extent.

00:38:43.161 --> 00:38:45.324
To me, I'm a much better host than I'm a guest.

00:38:45.324 --> 00:38:48.760
I overshare as a guest and I have input on everything.

00:38:48.760 --> 00:38:50.273
I think you've done amazing.

00:38:50.273 --> 00:38:52.817
I think you are equally good at hosting and guessing.

00:38:52.817 --> 00:38:54.369
I'm right now, I'm putting that on.

00:38:54.369 --> 00:38:55.882
So make sure that Alicia hears that.

00:38:55.882 --> 00:38:59.425
think he's, I think he's both and both and.

00:38:59.425 --> 00:39:00.115
Well, thank you.

00:39:00.115 --> 00:39:01.697
I just feel like I overshare a little bit.

00:39:01.697 --> 00:39:04.940
When you're the host side, diving in those little things helps a lot.

00:39:04.940 --> 00:39:06.630
On the guest side, sometimes you just got to let it go.

00:39:06.630 --> 00:39:14.336
But to your point, I think that yes, if you end up being a guest on a few shows and you end up really loving it, have your own platform.

00:39:14.336 --> 00:39:20.831
mean, there being a podcast host these days with an active show is becoming the top of the media channels.

00:39:20.831 --> 00:39:23.003
I mean, it's a big deal now.

00:39:23.003 --> 00:39:24.563
so notice I say active show.

00:39:24.563 --> 00:39:25.664
You can't just do one episode and quit.

00:39:25.664 --> 00:39:27.369
Like you got to actually stick with it, right?

00:39:27.369 --> 00:39:28.242
Exactly.

00:39:28.242 --> 00:39:31.244
this guy's got 30, 40, 50 episodes of this.

00:39:31.244 --> 00:39:32.974
This lady's got a hundred plus episodes.

00:39:32.974 --> 00:39:35.885
Like that goes a really long way from an authority building standpoint.

00:39:35.885 --> 00:39:44.019
So yeah, I think that you should definitely consider if you find this a medium that you enjoy and people resonate with it, it's probably time to consider your own show.

00:39:44.079 --> 00:39:44.559
I love it.

00:39:44.559 --> 00:39:53.282
And that's exactly why I said it, because I'm remembering really how my life changed from starting my show and then getting the confidence to show up on other people's shows.

00:39:53.282 --> 00:39:59.655
Honestly, it was a few of those pod match first connections that I was like, wait a minute, like people actually want to hear from me.

00:39:59.655 --> 00:40:01.900
Like they care about what I say.

00:40:01.900 --> 00:40:07.748
And it was, it wasn't until I started showing up as a guest, I started realizing like, my voice matters.

00:40:07.768 --> 00:40:14.244
Like it's one thing to interview other people and to make them the center of attention, which is great as a host.

00:40:14.244 --> 00:40:15.864
That's my job as a host, right?

00:40:15.864 --> 00:40:17.204
To put them in some attention.

00:40:17.204 --> 00:40:22.318
But once I became a guest, I started realizing that, a minute, like people actually do care about my perspective as well.

00:40:22.318 --> 00:40:25.409
As when I got more comfortable with solo shows, to be honest with you, man.

00:40:25.409 --> 00:40:26.831
I was comfortable with doing solo shows.

00:40:26.831 --> 00:40:29.112
I always wanted to put the guest out front.

00:40:29.112 --> 00:40:34.835
But then I realized, wait a minute, as a guest myself, I have an obligation to share my perspective.

00:40:34.835 --> 00:40:41.838
And so like I said, I think all this comes down, like we said, like all in one big bucket of, hey, you have a voice, you have something to share.

00:40:41.943 --> 00:40:43.704
And God has put it in you for a reason.

00:40:43.704 --> 00:40:48.614
So here's a medium that literally just says, Hey, go out there and share it and connect with the right people.

00:40:48.614 --> 00:40:51.155
So Alex, brother, you are absolutely the man.

00:40:51.155 --> 00:40:53.206
I know you have so much more to share.

00:40:53.206 --> 00:40:57.989
So they, you know, I've already looked at all the links, but let's just do it old school.

00:40:57.989 --> 00:41:03.807
If they want to follow more about learning how to be a host or a guest, where would you take them to learn more about your resources?

00:41:03.807 --> 00:41:09.550
Yeah, I'm going to send y'all somewhere I don't usually send people, but we've already referenced your episode a little bit, Alan.

00:41:09.550 --> 00:41:20.007
So I think it's actually the next logical step because if you do want to hear a testimony from somebody who hears your episode where you're a guest specifically, they have to feel comfortable all the way through doing that.

00:41:20.007 --> 00:41:21.858
And that's actually really, important to get right.

00:41:21.858 --> 00:41:23.059
And most people get it wrong.

00:41:23.059 --> 00:41:27.121
And that's a whole nother conversation, but thankfully it's exactly what you talked about in my show, Alan.

00:41:27.121 --> 00:41:32.342
You talked about the role your brand plays in establishing trust with podcast listeners.

00:41:32.342 --> 00:41:35.534
And brand, it doesn't mean like a big logo and stuff like that.

00:41:35.534 --> 00:41:36.545
That's not what it means at all.

00:41:36.545 --> 00:41:39.548
So I encourage you if you're like, well, I'm a brand you do, it's you.

00:41:39.548 --> 00:41:44.034
And really positioning that right is how you're going to be able to really have that ongoing impact.

00:41:44.034 --> 00:41:56.938
People who hear you on a podcast, if any, if anyone's interested in hearing that, which I encourage all of you to check it out, go to pod match.com slash EP slash three zero seven pod match.com slash EP slash three zero seven.

00:41:56.938 --> 00:42:00.643
Once you're there, you can look at the navigation, find everything else I do, how to contact me, all that stuff.

00:42:00.643 --> 00:42:03.985
But I just encourage you, that is the next best step after hearing this today.

00:42:04.320 --> 00:42:15.864
man, Alex, you see, are the man because look how you tie the all night, nice in a bow, putting me in the middle of all of that, but they get to hear from me and you and you being so gracious to have me on podcasts.

00:42:15.864 --> 00:42:19.855
made simple, but this is exactly what I think we're modeling what we're talking about, right?

00:42:19.855 --> 00:42:28.177
You showing up on my show, having been a CEO of an incredible company, yet you came serving, you were gracious, you had value.

00:42:28.177 --> 00:42:30.907
You never pointed at yourself as being the center of attention.

00:42:30.907 --> 00:42:33.777
You serve the people who are listening and watching right now.

00:42:33.777 --> 00:42:36.829
So you literally just might be on a show.

00:42:36.949 --> 00:42:38.170
That was the lesson, right?

00:42:38.170 --> 00:42:43.012
The lesson was, hey, be like Alex, show up on podcast.

00:42:43.387 --> 00:42:52.923
So it'll be like, sometimes, not all time, but this specific time, like, hey, follow, in this case, follow us as we follow Christ, but don't follow the rest of this stuff, right?

00:42:52.923 --> 00:42:53.942
Exactly.

00:42:53.942 --> 00:43:02.157
So I love how much this means to me, man, because again, this is a relationship that would not have existed outside of podcasting because you took the step of faith.

00:43:02.503 --> 00:43:07.123
after serving an amazing church and creating this community, right?

00:43:07.123 --> 00:43:08.762
And learning how to build relationships.

00:43:08.762 --> 00:43:15.722
You're now doing it in a whole another sphere, but it's the same message, which is give people a voice so they can share what God put on the inside of them.

00:43:15.722 --> 00:43:17.362
And he's working out the rest of it.

00:43:17.362 --> 00:43:18.543
So man, God bless you.

00:43:18.543 --> 00:43:21.282
Thank you so much for being a part, finally, of the God in Gigs show.

00:43:21.282 --> 00:43:25.983
I pray this is not the last and final time that we'll make this a regular occurrence, man.

00:43:25.983 --> 00:43:29.063
But anything you need from God in Gigs, you will always have it.

00:43:29.063 --> 00:43:32.822
We will always be huge supporters and fans of everything you're doing.

00:43:32.887 --> 00:43:33.389
Alan, thank you.

00:43:33.389 --> 00:43:37.346
That's totally mutual by the way and seriously an honor to be here and thanks for checking this out everybody.

00:43:37.346 --> 00:43:38.112
Appreciate you.