Teachers Are Burning Out—And Self-Care Isn’t the Solution

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Welcome to the balancing act

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podcast i am jamie wonko i am here with mr

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joseph vitale diet coca-cola yes how

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are you today uh i'm good it's a lot going

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on um you know just just busy busy this time of uh this this time of year um

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you know getting through the doldrums of march and keeping ourself marching

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the long slog to the end of the year i love a parade mr vitale I love a parade. It's good to know.

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I love a parade. I do.

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March is fraught with parade after parade after parade. It is.

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And I, you know, have lots of marchers that I've raised and they play in the parades.

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And that, I have to say, is like the gift of March. A little Blarney Stone, you know?

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Good for you. A lot of St. Patrick's Day parades coming up, right?

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Thank you to my fellow Irishmen and women who march along, march through march.

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Yeah. You know, I do love a parade too. I also remember one of the last times

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I think I was at our town does a wonderful St. Patrick's Day parade.

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And I think one of the last times I was at it was right before the world collapsed in 2020.

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I remember being down because my parents live right close to the parade route.

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So we literally would park at my mom and dad's house and walk down the street

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and set up with the lawn chairs and get the candy that's thrown to you and see

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all the things and it was, uh, like the week before. Yeah.

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Pretty much it was a couple days before i remember being out

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there and i remember like i remember seeing a friend of mine from high

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school uh we were there with our dogs and she ran over

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and she like petted our dogs and we were talking to her for a little bit and

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she was marching with like one of the cheerleading groups or something um but

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yeah it was definitely uh those are definitely really fun i also marched in

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those parades back in the day when i was in marching band um yeah so it was

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uh it was great those are really really fun and i'm glad that your kids get that experience too.

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You know, if there's any doldrums happening, get yourself out to a parade, we say.

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Yeah. We'd love a parade. It's good stuff. I really just like,

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I said this before, I may have said it on an episode that like,

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and I don't know if it's happened yet because we're recording this episode a

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little bit earlier, but like the first 60 degree day in March is going to hit like cocaine.

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Like everyone is going to be like, and just be out there running around shirtless

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in their shorts, their flip the flops, all the things.

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Yeah. Yeah. I went to, I went to, you know, kids are going to be attending TCNJ

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in the fall, which is exciting.

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And my daughter attended some classes. And while she was at one,

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I mean, that's, you know, where I went to school.

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So I was walking around and I distinctly remember like the lawn in front of

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the towers to Travers and Wolf.

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Like that was like the place where everyone would

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like lay out in the sun and like throw Frisbees around whenever

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you would get that first warm day like that's the

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place that you want it to be um and i wonder if

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it's still like that i don't know if it is but i hope it is you'll know

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soon yeah right my kids will probably send

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some pictures and stuff like that it's definitely fun stuff um but yeah it's

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been uh it's you know that that process is still exciting um you know and now

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it's the filling out for scholarships and getting ready towards the uh the end

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of the year and prom dresses and all those things. So it's really fun.

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Yeah. I know the school, they have, I guess...

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Different organizations that give out various

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scholarships for the kids and um

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you know the the email

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reminders that come out um and i just thought it was funny like do not apply

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if you are not going to be like i guess at the ceremony so i guess it's like

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very very important for them right so the ceremony is like the day before their

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prom like the scholarship ceremony happens to be the night before. Oh, really?

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Yes. And so, yeah, so we were talking about like, wow, okay.

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You know, and I guess they, you know, have this commitment of, I said, wow, that's,

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you know, we think that we've been, I feel like this is a kind of like a lull

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almost in the winter months of like once, like May and June,

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I think will be like really wild with like things, like multiple things every week, you know?

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And even just that as an example, like Wednesday night scholarship awards and Thursday night prom.

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Prom i know it's crazy and that's right

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around memorial day weekend which is when i'm normally uh traveling yeah

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it's the week after yeah i head out west to visit a

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friend of mine and we go to the indy 500 and my daughter might actually be coming

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this year so it'll be a very busy busy week um yeah we'll see we'll see yes

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i'm so glad the prom is not memorial day weekend yeah i mean i i agree i think

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it would be best for them not to do it um yeah but yes i thought that was funny Like,

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wow. And our kids' class is huge.

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So I really wonder. I'm so interested in how many of the kids...

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Fill that out. A hundred? I know. What do you think? I would think it's about that. Yeah.

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I'm going to ask. My graduating class, unfortunately, we've had a lot of loss

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for our class, especially parents that have lost children, unfortunately.

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So we've tried to create a small scholarship, you know,

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in honor of the number of our classmates

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that have lost um uh children

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um you know for for a variety

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of different reasons and we try to so we every year

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we fill out like a little scholarship application thing we have we put that

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in we choose somebody or actually the guidance department chooses someone yeah

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and the only stipulation is is i'd like to after they get the money i'd like

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to tell them why we're giving them that scholarship um yeah which so we normally

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have like a brief little phone call and i say like hey our classes experience a lot.

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I'm the one who kind of administers the scholarship as a former class officer.

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I try to do that to pay it forward for former classmates.

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Bring the baron pride, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Look, we're actually a little late.

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We forgot because we got into some heavy stuff and started talking about things.

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So our season three, because we forgot to do our ed read, our season three is

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brought to you by our presenting sponsor, Teacher's Insurance Plan.

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Make sure you check out their website, which is tagged in our episode.

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Teacher's Insurance Plan, auto insurance that brings exclusive educator savings

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So sorry about being a little bit later there, Teacher's Insurance Plan,

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but we got into some important stuff.

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You know, life just gets it awesome. So I'm curious how many kids apply and fill it out.

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And also, you know, how many awards there are.

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Great question. Don't know. Those are my questions. You know,

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somebody did mention to me, a parent recently in a meeting said that her son

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won some music award or something like that last year.

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And she said, like, and it was a good amount of money. And I was just like,

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I wonder what that means.

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You know, like, I wonder what you think a good amount of money is.

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Like, is a good amount of money $500?

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Is a good amount of money $1,000? You know, I'm just, I have no idea.

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But it'll be interesting to see. And I know, like, as a former PTO president,

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we always gave one to a student from the elementary school that they attended.

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And, you know, until, of course, I was like, oh, geez, I really hope Drew gets that.

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Of course. You know, as someone who, like, gave of my own service and time for

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so many years, gee, that would be nice. It would be.

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It would be. But there's quite a few of them in his class that I did PTO with

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that I was like, oh, you got some tough competition this year for that.

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Yeah, but hopefully, I think they probably do a good job of sharing the wealth

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to make sure that kids get recognized for a lot of the wonderful things that they did. Yeah.

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And the things that they were involved with, whether it be sports,

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academics, community service.

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Yeah, absolutely. I would say there's probably a good, you know,

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50 to 60 awards, I would assume.

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Assume, yeah. And it's like, and if you can't be there, it just cracked me up.

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Last night we were like joking, like, don't come.

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Don't come. Yeah. No, but I don't think that that's wrong. Like,

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you should be going to the awards ceremony.

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I mean, they hopefully will let you know if, like, you'll be receiving an award.

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Please make sure you attend.

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I mean, you don't want to, like, show up and then not get anything.

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Oh, right. No. You know what I mean?

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Yeah. For sure. You know, it's just a pleasure to be nominated.

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You know, stuff like that. Right.

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So, yeah, this is a follow-up episode.

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To our previous episode that we did without

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dr allison hitchens and we kind of got on a subject uh

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regarding self-care which is kind of one of those terms that's like blech uh

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it's kind of you know icky to talk about because of the systemic issues that

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we have specifically in education and i think jamie and i thought it would be

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a good uh follow-up to kind of you know,

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dive into our thoughts on it and talk about, you know, what is, what's our take?

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So here we are. That's what we're going to be discussing today as we jump into our episode.

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Yeah. And, you know, and the idea of self-care is that it is not,

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you know, I know it's like self-care is not selfish.

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And so when the term first began,

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I really, you know, we've kind of referenced some of that before of,

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you know, put the oxygen mask on yourself before putting it on someone else,

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you know, and really trying to make sure that you are not burnt out.

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However, being that it is March and it is Women's History Month,

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I really have to say that like so much of this, I think, is really female driven. Yeah.

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When we talk about balancing things, right? And we talk about, you know, all the.

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All the balls we keep in the air, all the juggling that we do,

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I think the one that gets dropped the most is the one about self-care.

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And that's a big, big ask for us, especially depending on where we are in our

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careers and in our personal lives to say, oh, let me carve out some time for myself.

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And that's where our spouses come in.

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That's where our family members come in, where we maybe get that opportunity

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where we can carve out that time for ourselves.

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But a lot of times, I think there's this idea of guilt that surrounds you taking

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time for yourself when it's probably something that's needed the most.

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And that's a challenge. That's something that's very challenging.

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I know it's challenging for you, Jamin. It's definitely challenging for me.

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Yeah, I don't feel guilty. But what I will say is what I have really,

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and I get a lot of content related to the mental load of women and the idea

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that in just listening to a clip and it said that parents today are more involved.

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Minute-to-minute time spent mothering is actually greater now as a full-time

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working mom than it was for a full-time stay-at-home mom in 1980. Yeah.

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And so, of course, because there is, you know, a greater population of females

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in the teaching profession?

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Is it another, you know, sort of patriarchal system that is set up to continue

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the idea that you just should just handle it like women do in so many ways and for so many things?

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Yeah. I actually really like the you.

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We are both on the on the student equity team at our school and what you have Women's History Month.

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So I know you actually had a very good activity for us to do in the social studies

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department regarding mental load and something that we could easily do with

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our students to have them recognize what that means.

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And if you want to kind of describe what that lesson is.

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So the idea of the, you know, unimagined mental load, and I think a lot of this

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does fall into the category with parenting and also with teaching,

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is the idea of how much women see that like the average.

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And of course, we're, you know, we're going to say some, not all,

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what happens with what women pick up on, what women see, what women handle, what women do.

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And it isn't just necessarily about chores, okay?

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It is also, tell me what I should do.

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You know, so there's a lot of this exchange in many marriages,

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great marriages, where, you

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know, the husband is going to the store and he says, well, make me a list.

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Right. Why do you need me to make you a list? If you live here,

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you should know what we have or don't have. Yes.

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Right. The idea of doctor's appointments, report cards, teacher's names, supply is needed.

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You know, there's just so many things. So it's like if you're in a home where

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there are two parents and they're both working,

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how do you really look at like the mental load of your partner and say,

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this is what you're going to do to lighten,

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you know, this is what we're going to do together.

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Or, you know, I'm going to use golf for an example.

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We were having this talk this morning here in the house.

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And I said, gosh, you know, I've heard a lot of people go back and forth about golf.

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And, you know, what a great hobby to have that can last anywhere from 6 to 12 hours.

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It's not six to 12 hours, but I get it. Right.

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So like, and when will we be done? No one knows. How long will it last? We're not sure. Yeah.

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And so actually this talk started because my husband and my son get their hair cut together.

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And I probably- As do myself and my son.

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Yes. So what I was saying was, you know, I was saying to them,

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because my daughter actually just got her hair cut by the same woman.

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And I said, oh, my goodness, you know, we're talking about college and oh, my goodness.

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And she has been cutting his hair since he was three and a half,

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four, like forever and ever.

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We felt like this is like the third salon we followed her to. Right.

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And she's just like, I can't believe he's going to college. And oh, my gosh, you know.

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And and so my husband used to go to a barbershop.

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And I said, geez, I've never. And he said, I'll I'll never go back to the barbershop.

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You sit there for so long. And I said, yes, you do.

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I'm so interested, is that another advantage that like men have set up for time

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away from wherever they're trying to get away from?

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I mean, not not for me.

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I know. I don't mean you, but I was like, gosh, I've never really.

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Is that like the golf situation? Like, we're just not sure.

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We can't make an appointment. We have to go and sit there.

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And of course, you want me to get my haircut and I want to get a haircut.

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So I'll be back in four hours at most barbershops. That's what it is.

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I know the barbershop that I go to.

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It's you can show up if you don't have an appointment, but you're going to get who you get.

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But you can get an appointment I can get an appointment And I get an appointment

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every time Because I don't want to Sit there for three hours Because I don't

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have that time And every time I'm there I go to this place in a local town Which I really like,

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What are you afraid people are going to flood you?

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Say where it is No, no, Corey Matthews It's called Corey Matthews I mean,

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come on, salute the beautiful coif Yeah, the same kid from Boy Meets World Cuts

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my hair, Corey Matthews Yeah, Mr.

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Feeney is in the back room Topanga's there Oh my god, Topanga Her hair is glorious

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Was she not just an absolute specimen?

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What a pretty woman I love you honey, if you're listening So Um.

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Yeah, I don't. And even when I go there, they'll even offer like,

00:17:02.008 --> 00:17:04.168
hey, do you want like a beer or bourbon or something?

00:17:04.368 --> 00:17:08.788
And I'm like, no, I have only taken it once. There was one time.

00:17:09.108 --> 00:17:12.488
It was just like, it was a long week. And I was like, you know what? I'm having one.

00:17:13.208 --> 00:17:16.248
And, you know, because I'm a bourbon guy. So I had a little drink there.

00:17:16.328 --> 00:17:18.008
But like, I'm sure it's not legal.

00:17:18.728 --> 00:17:21.688
Um but at the same time i was i had a mimosa at

00:17:21.688 --> 00:17:24.788
a at a hair store before i i mean i don't i

00:17:24.788 --> 00:17:27.488
don't think anybody i think people look the other way as long

00:17:27.488 --> 00:17:30.668
as people aren't getting like hammered um you're

00:17:30.668 --> 00:17:33.588
also not exchanging any money for that like they

00:17:33.588 --> 00:17:36.548
just give it away like giving a few yeah yeah and

00:17:36.548 --> 00:17:39.368
it's not like it's an expectation of service it's like

00:17:39.368 --> 00:17:42.408
if and actually the time

00:17:42.408 --> 00:17:45.128
that i got it i actually said hey look i know you guys normally offer it

00:17:45.128 --> 00:17:48.108
i normally say no uh but i'm saying yes

00:17:48.108 --> 00:17:51.368
i'm saying yes this time and it's actually um you

00:17:51.368 --> 00:17:54.028
know i really love going there i like the girl that cuts my hair it's not

00:17:54.028 --> 00:17:58.088
a man it's a you know she she does she cuts my hair every time my son goes to

00:17:58.088 --> 00:18:02.168
somebody different every time um for the most part unless there's one specific

00:18:02.168 --> 00:18:05.448
person that he wants to go to but he's like yeah i don't care i'm just a creature

00:18:05.448 --> 00:18:12.048
of habit um what's really funny is i'll tell this story just because i i think it's funny um Um.

00:18:12.808 --> 00:18:18.468
They give, if you, I used to have my beard, which Jamie hated and so did everyone else. Um, gross.

00:18:18.908 --> 00:18:22.228
And she wants to say, don't bring the beard back. Don't bring the beard.

00:18:22.428 --> 00:18:27.068
No. So they, you know, when they, they shave you, they like put like a hot towel

00:18:27.068 --> 00:18:30.148
on your face and in that barbershop, they would lean you back.

00:18:30.348 --> 00:18:33.348
And then one of the receptionist girls would come over and give you a hand massage.

00:18:33.348 --> 00:18:35.488
And I am like, absolutely not.

00:18:36.268 --> 00:18:38.768
Absolutely not. I do not want that. I do not want that ever.

00:18:38.968 --> 00:18:44.248
Do not give me a hand massage. So the girl after a while would keep offering me like.

00:18:45.529 --> 00:18:48.229
A hand massage and i'm like i'm like maria i've been

00:18:48.229 --> 00:18:50.929
here like like over a year how do you not know i'm not going to get the hand

00:18:50.929 --> 00:18:53.689
massage i mean come on she's like well actually i wanted to tell you like

00:18:53.689 --> 00:18:58.369
i i have like um i get seizures every once in a while so i have an effect on

00:18:58.369 --> 00:19:02.569
my short term memory so i don't like remember things and i was like oh so i'm

00:19:02.569 --> 00:19:07.409
an ass and i'll never bring that up again but now now she messes with me because

00:19:07.409 --> 00:19:09.809
every once in a while she'll be like oh do you want a hand massage and i'm like

00:19:09.809 --> 00:19:12.309
how do you know she's like i got you didn't i i'm like god damn it.

00:19:12.769 --> 00:19:15.789
Why don't you want the hand massage? It makes you feel uncomfortable. Creeps me out.

00:19:16.049 --> 00:19:19.869
It creeps me out. It just does. It's just weird to me. The girls are like 20

00:19:19.869 --> 00:19:23.749
and they're like massaging your hands and your face is covered and you can't see anything.

00:19:24.049 --> 00:19:27.849
They massage both hands at the same time or is it like two girls, one on each hand?

00:19:27.989 --> 00:19:32.069
No, it's one hand and then they go to the other hand and I'm like, nope, no.

00:19:32.469 --> 00:19:36.749
I don't want, it just, it weirds me out. I don't know why it weirds me out. It just does.

00:19:36.869 --> 00:19:39.889
I don't want anything to do with it. Do they use cream or is it just bare hand they

00:19:39.889 --> 00:19:42.849
do they use like some kind of like moisturizer stuff it's

00:19:42.849 --> 00:19:45.949
just no and what does

00:19:45.949 --> 00:19:50.989
joey say what does joey say yeah like does joey get the hand massage no no because

00:19:50.989 --> 00:19:55.109
he's never had a beard thing done they only do it if you do it's only your beard

00:19:55.109 --> 00:19:58.169
so if you're laying back in the chair and they got the thing over your face

00:19:58.169 --> 00:20:02.729
so like when we do i would say yes every time i just want you to know that's

00:20:02.729 --> 00:20:05.849
fine self-care to me like the number one self-care is like a getting a massage,

00:20:06.009 --> 00:20:08.989
foot massage, hand massage, back massage, neck massage, head massage.

00:20:09.509 --> 00:20:14.529
Yes. It's not that I don't enjoy a massage, which I kind of don't enjoy a massage,

00:20:14.629 --> 00:20:16.689
but like because I have a very active brain.

00:20:16.769 --> 00:20:20.749
I can tell that you, yeah, you can't like get it down low enough to relax. It's very hard.

00:20:20.989 --> 00:20:26.889
Yeah. Yeah. It's very hard. So like I know you brought off golf before, but like me...

00:20:27.939 --> 00:20:32.919
Walking on a quiet golf course when the sun's going down. And I've got to experience

00:20:32.919 --> 00:20:35.059
this a couple of times this past summer with my son.

00:20:35.459 --> 00:20:38.579
I tried to explain to him, this is my favorite time.

00:20:38.779 --> 00:20:43.179
The moment where it's getting dark out, you got a couple more holes to play,

00:20:43.339 --> 00:20:45.479
you might get finished, you might not. You're not really rushing.

00:20:45.659 --> 00:20:48.799
You're just enjoying it. It's not crowded. There's not a lot of people around.

00:20:49.499 --> 00:20:51.699
You get to shut down the golf course and go home.

00:20:52.599 --> 00:20:56.659
That to me is therapy. like those moments are

00:20:56.659 --> 00:21:02.179
like the time where i could i could like really soak that in and close my eyes

00:21:02.179 --> 00:21:05.299
and like really like be in that moment and now that i get to share that with

00:21:05.299 --> 00:21:10.479
my son it's even better because that little moment is and he's kind of has that

00:21:10.479 --> 00:21:13.219
about me too and i know we joke all the time about me being high strung and

00:21:13.219 --> 00:21:15.399
everything else but in those moments i am not,

00:21:16.119 --> 00:21:22.619
i'm very like relaxed and in the moment and able to control that and put everything else aside.

00:21:23.799 --> 00:21:26.719
But there's that's me and i also but i

00:21:26.719 --> 00:21:29.359
also know like i try to do it at times where it's not going to be

00:21:29.359 --> 00:21:31.999
inconvenient for the rest of my family a lot of guys are like

00:21:31.999 --> 00:21:35.239
well i'm golfing every saturday morning and i'm like i

00:21:35.239 --> 00:21:38.679
can't do that i can't i don't do that on a saturday morning number one it's

00:21:38.679 --> 00:21:43.259
a lot more expensive not that i'm cheap and number two it's it's a lot of time

00:21:43.259 --> 00:21:46.959
like you said it's like it could be four hours or you could be stuck behind

00:21:46.959 --> 00:21:50.219
people that are playing slow and it could be six hours and then people are meeting

00:21:50.219 --> 00:21:52.159
for a drink afterwards and you're having something to eat.

00:21:52.259 --> 00:21:55.499
I don't have the capacity for a 10-hour day.

00:21:55.859 --> 00:22:03.659
It's not my thing. I'd rather go at twilight in the afternoon at 3 o'clock and

00:22:03.659 --> 00:22:05.659
get done at 7 o'clock and know I can get home.

00:22:07.139 --> 00:22:12.979
So do you think that there is a possible connection between the female populated

00:22:12.979 --> 00:22:17.319
profession, the mental load, and,

00:22:18.063 --> 00:22:25.123
the unrealistic expectations that we have for women in general connected to

00:22:25.123 --> 00:22:30.703
the profession and then, of course, like your domestic life as well. Yeah.

00:22:30.983 --> 00:22:35.283
Well, a lot of the administrators in most cases are also men.

00:22:35.643 --> 00:22:40.083
And it's very easy for them to say, oh, you know, just make sure you take care of yourself.

00:22:40.643 --> 00:22:48.443
And like, I think if you are a female teacher who is also a mom of young children,

00:22:48.783 --> 00:22:51.683
you are in the weeds 24-7.

00:22:51.983 --> 00:22:58.243
And that reference references like being in a restaurant and you have four tables

00:22:58.243 --> 00:23:02.043
in your section and you got all set at the same time and you have to take four

00:23:02.043 --> 00:23:03.123
orders and you have to do different things.

00:23:03.183 --> 00:23:05.663
You're in the weeds. You're trying to get yourself out of it.

00:23:05.943 --> 00:23:11.003
And I just feel that that is a perpetual state that we need to then be removing

00:23:11.003 --> 00:23:14.583
stuff from people's plates instead of putting more on them and saying,

00:23:14.583 --> 00:23:17.803
take care of yourself is putting something more on someone else's plate.

00:23:18.703 --> 00:23:23.663
Right. Yeah, absolutely. And so I say, well, if you just took a little bit more

00:23:23.663 --> 00:23:31.443
time for yourself when someone's not really sure how to navigate doing that.

00:23:31.863 --> 00:23:35.223
Yeah. Right. And like you said, Like, there are different things.

00:23:35.383 --> 00:23:39.043
Like, for me, the things that I really like to do are expensive.

00:23:39.203 --> 00:23:42.423
So especially when my kids were little, I didn't have, like,

00:23:42.483 --> 00:23:44.423
the extra money to do that.

00:23:44.683 --> 00:23:49.003
So to suggest to someone, you know, oh, do A, B, or C, and they can't afford

00:23:49.003 --> 00:23:53.923
to do it is then now another challenge or, like, another way that you feel inadequate.

00:23:55.792 --> 00:23:59.332
Because you can't do the things that would make you happy because you can't

00:23:59.332 --> 00:24:02.292
afford to do that. You know, so it's kind of like one thing on top of the other.

00:24:02.432 --> 00:24:08.952
So instead of fixing the system, we just kind of catch on to these certain phrases.

00:24:09.332 --> 00:24:16.972
I do encourage self-care, for lack of a better term, for women,

00:24:17.252 --> 00:24:19.812
for moms, for teachers, for anybody.

00:24:20.652 --> 00:24:25.172
And what I think is difficult, especially in our like very social media driven

00:24:25.172 --> 00:24:30.712
comparative society, what you define as something that would be helpful for

00:24:30.712 --> 00:24:34.892
you is not, you know, people love to just like, oh, who would want to do that?

00:24:35.012 --> 00:24:37.012
Why would you want to do that? Why are you going to do that?

00:24:37.012 --> 00:24:41.032
I get a lot of that from certain people that I think should not interject that opinion.

00:24:44.532 --> 00:24:47.232
So I think that that's very difficult where you can say, oh,

00:24:47.292 --> 00:24:49.792
why would you want to do that? Why would you want to go to Disney World again?

00:24:49.932 --> 00:24:52.932
Why would you like that's not your it's not your it's not you.

00:24:53.372 --> 00:24:56.532
Like, don't project something you don't like on someone else.

00:24:57.172 --> 00:25:01.252
Have you ever thought I work in education? Why is finding a job so weirdly hard?

00:25:01.672 --> 00:25:05.092
Yeah. Scrolling through random job boards where half the listings don't even

00:25:05.092 --> 00:25:06.912
make sense is not the vibe.

00:25:07.012 --> 00:25:10.192
That's why njschooljobs.com actually makes sense.

00:25:10.412 --> 00:25:13.892
It's a job board built specifically for New Jersey schools, public,

00:25:14.212 --> 00:25:15.872
private, charter, and parochial.

00:25:16.012 --> 00:25:19.272
Teachers, administrators, counselors, support staff, coaching opportunities.

00:25:19.272 --> 00:25:23.732
If your job involves a bell schedule, this site's for you. It's free for job seekers.

00:25:23.992 --> 00:25:28.132
You can upload your resume, set job alerts, and apply without jumping through hoops.

00:25:28.252 --> 00:25:32.632
Schools across New Jersey actively use njschooljobs.com, so these are real,

00:25:32.852 --> 00:25:37.092
current openings. They also host virtual job fairs, where you can connect with

00:25:37.092 --> 00:25:38.392
multiple districts online.

00:25:38.592 --> 00:25:42.692
No driving all over the state. Those are coming up soon, so check the link in

00:25:42.692 --> 00:25:44.372
our episode description to register.

00:25:44.692 --> 00:25:47.512
Head to njschooljobs.com.

00:25:49.950 --> 00:25:51.190
Every teacher knows that the

00:25:51.190 --> 00:25:54.770
first five minutes of class set the tone for everything that comes after.

00:25:55.110 --> 00:25:58.830
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00:25:59.350 --> 00:26:04.050
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00:26:08.610 --> 00:26:12.350
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00:26:30.210 --> 00:26:35.030
Do you know what weaponized incompetence is? I absolutely do.

00:26:35.570 --> 00:26:36.790
All right. Tell me what it is.

00:26:38.190 --> 00:26:41.470
So... Or, like, your understanding of it, because it's also tied into,

00:26:41.470 --> 00:26:43.070
like, self-care and mental load.

00:26:45.870 --> 00:26:51.430
I know what it is. I'm just having trouble finding a good description or example.

00:26:51.690 --> 00:26:54.050
So weaponized incompetence would be...

00:26:57.071 --> 00:27:02.111
You go to the store to go do the food shopping and you purposely are just like,

00:27:02.311 --> 00:27:03.551
oh, just buy the wrong things.

00:27:03.731 --> 00:27:07.891
And then you do it so many times incorrectly that you don't get asked to do it anymore.

00:27:08.851 --> 00:27:12.051
Yeah. You know what I mean? You do it better than I do. Yeah.

00:27:12.211 --> 00:27:14.131
Isn't that weaponized? Is that weaponized? It is.

00:27:14.431 --> 00:27:17.791
I do know what it is. I'm just having trouble like wrapping my head around.

00:27:17.851 --> 00:27:19.591
I mean, to me, that's a good, that's a great definition.

00:27:19.811 --> 00:27:23.811
That's a great description. It's like, well, you know what? And I feel,

00:27:24.051 --> 00:27:31.671
as a female in our job, this has been used against me many, many times.

00:27:31.931 --> 00:27:34.151
And especially the younger that I was.

00:27:35.131 --> 00:27:38.111
You know, oh, you know what? You organized the trip.

00:27:38.891 --> 00:27:43.891
You make the phone call. You do a great job. This is also something that I have

00:27:43.891 --> 00:27:47.891
many times with difficult students.

00:27:49.251 --> 00:27:53.651
Hi, Mrs. Wonko. we're going to transfer Glenn into your class.

00:27:55.811 --> 00:28:00.911
Mr. So-and-so can't handle Glenn, so we're sending him your way.

00:28:01.551 --> 00:28:07.211
And I know that you are such a great teacher.

00:28:07.571 --> 00:28:11.771
We have all the... No, I... No.

00:28:12.031 --> 00:28:16.591
So you're good at your job, and then they're going to use your ability against

00:28:16.591 --> 00:28:18.851
you to give you more work.

00:28:19.031 --> 00:28:22.311
Yes. And I've talked about that for a very long time.

00:28:23.011 --> 00:28:25.971
Like, it's like, oh, we can't give this person that class. Or we can't give

00:28:25.971 --> 00:28:28.031
it because they just can't. I'm like, well, okay, well.

00:28:29.164 --> 00:28:32.444
You never know, like, give it to them.

00:28:33.844 --> 00:28:38.524
So you're kind of saying someone else is incompetent. That makes more work for me.

00:28:38.884 --> 00:28:42.324
Yeah. No, thank you. Like, and we've joked around it all the time that when

00:28:42.324 --> 00:28:44.984
you are good at your job, you get to do other people's jobs.

00:28:46.084 --> 00:28:50.204
So, yeah, whether it be like, oh, I'm just too old for.

00:28:50.484 --> 00:28:53.824
Yeah. Oh, we can put this person in cafeteria duty because they're the one that

00:28:53.824 --> 00:28:55.164
is going to hold the students accountable.

00:28:55.164 --> 00:28:59.684
And then, like, all the other people around you maybe don't have the,

00:28:59.844 --> 00:29:03.624
not that they don't know how to do their jobs, but they might not have the personality

00:29:03.624 --> 00:29:06.924
to be like, hey, what are you doing? What? No, we don't do that here.

00:29:07.644 --> 00:29:12.204
Like, cut it out. Like, I have no problem having those conversations with anyone,

00:29:12.304 --> 00:29:17.304
but some people don't find that comfortable space to be able to do that.

00:29:17.484 --> 00:29:22.284
So they're quiet and more reserved. That is not a commentary on the person.

00:29:22.284 --> 00:29:25.224
It's just like sometimes you have

00:29:25.224 --> 00:29:28.124
to put people in those situations and it makes it more difficult for

00:29:28.124 --> 00:29:30.904
the people that are trying to do things the right

00:29:30.904 --> 00:29:34.524
way in a particular situation yeah so yeah

00:29:34.524 --> 00:29:38.464
and so i think it's this it's it is a systemic issue when we were talking to

00:29:38.464 --> 00:29:45.264
dr hitch and she was saying that you know the idea of in teaching to encourage

00:29:45.264 --> 00:29:51.204
self-care is likened almost to that phrase that Nick Ferroni had said,

00:29:51.344 --> 00:29:53.704
you know, like, do it for the kids, you know?

00:29:53.884 --> 00:29:59.124
And so it is this, we are doing it for the kids. And if I could take three hours

00:29:59.124 --> 00:30:08.544
to myself, it still may not change what's happening to me in my day-to-day at work.

00:30:10.144 --> 00:30:14.704
So, you know, even it makes me think of when we spoke to Jamie Ruffner and she had talked about,

00:30:15.904 --> 00:30:24.004
that her school district had someone had suggested that perhaps she needed anti-anxiety medication.

00:30:24.784 --> 00:30:32.344
Yeah. And it was not something that she had ever, you know, it's like, I don't, I don't.

00:30:32.624 --> 00:30:36.324
It's this class. It's this environment. It's this student, you know.

00:30:36.664 --> 00:30:40.664
And so I think we've all had situations where that is, has happened.

00:30:40.664 --> 00:30:47.764
And it is unfortunate because I have yet to really come across someone who said,

00:30:47.764 --> 00:30:52.444
someone swooped in and they took care of it right away.

00:30:53.404 --> 00:30:58.544
Yeah. We don't hear that very often. We hear the stories of the suffering of

00:30:58.544 --> 00:31:03.624
the staff who were sort of finagled, cajoled, cajeled, cajield,

00:31:03.804 --> 00:31:06.704
whatever that word is, into handling it.

00:31:08.414 --> 00:31:13.274
But then at what cost? So one of the pieces of research that Dr.

00:31:13.394 --> 00:31:18.774
Hitchens had shared with us was by Michael Huberman, The Professional Life Cycle

00:31:18.774 --> 00:31:24.394
of Teachers, which we will try and find the article specifically and link it

00:31:24.394 --> 00:31:25.434
in this episode description.

00:31:26.854 --> 00:31:30.814
So one of the points from that article was that teachers' professional lives

00:31:30.814 --> 00:31:35.014
unfold in evolving emotional and psychological phases, okay?

00:31:35.334 --> 00:31:38.574
That the research shows that teaching isn't a flat career.

00:31:38.774 --> 00:31:42.354
It moves through distinct phases from career entry through mid-career experimentation

00:31:42.354 --> 00:31:43.874
to later disengagement.

00:31:44.394 --> 00:31:48.234
Each phase has its own typical feelings, reality shock and survival in the early

00:31:48.234 --> 00:31:51.494
years, bursts of creativity and self-doubt during experimentation,

00:31:51.494 --> 00:31:55.194
and later in the career, serenity or resistance to change.

00:31:55.754 --> 00:31:58.694
Recognizing these phases helps us understand how stress, motivation,

00:31:58.734 --> 00:32:02.434
and self-care needs to change over time, meaning that what a teacher needs for

00:32:02.434 --> 00:32:05.154
well-being isn't static. It evolves with experience.

00:32:05.954 --> 00:32:11.154
And yep, I'm essentially in the later disengagement phase.

00:32:11.294 --> 00:32:14.294
Now, I enjoy what I do. We had a conversation just the other day.

00:32:14.514 --> 00:32:16.214
We were driving home, and I

00:32:16.214 --> 00:32:19.974
said to you, I really, really enjoy what I do and being in the classroom.

00:32:20.974 --> 00:32:25.114
I hate everything else. That was my exact statement.

00:32:25.674 --> 00:32:28.754
I don't want to deal with the additional trainings.

00:32:28.814 --> 00:32:31.534
I don't like the fact that professional development a lot

00:32:31.534 --> 00:32:34.674
of times is an afterthought i don't want to deal with um

00:32:34.674 --> 00:32:37.614
xyz pro like i just i don't

00:32:37.614 --> 00:32:40.554
i i don't um and all the

00:32:40.554 --> 00:32:44.314
extra things and the stuff that piles on top of it and the changing of the you

00:32:44.314 --> 00:32:47.934
know doing your own clerical work and time sheets and and we've talked about

00:32:47.934 --> 00:32:54.514
all this stuff like um you know doing all of that stuff creates yet another

00:32:54.514 --> 00:32:58.754
need for people to i don't want to say disassociate but But like,

00:32:58.954 --> 00:33:02.494
and what's the, you used it in the last couple episodes,

00:33:02.734 --> 00:33:04.714
the term that you were using, detachment.

00:33:05.705 --> 00:33:10.085
Right. Where you are detaching from the situation. I have done a much better

00:33:10.085 --> 00:33:13.925
job because I went through that mid-career experimentation phase where I was

00:33:13.925 --> 00:33:18.525
like working on technology initiatives and trying to do things in district to make it better.

00:33:18.825 --> 00:33:25.065
And like trying to be like, I would consider myself a voice of reason for a specific.

00:33:25.645 --> 00:33:28.285
It makes sense in the timeline because, you know, in the beginning,

00:33:28.525 --> 00:33:31.745
that reality shock, as she described, is just that of, oh, my goodness,

00:33:31.945 --> 00:33:34.705
like, I'm a grown up now and I have to do all of these different things and

00:33:34.705 --> 00:33:36.045
I have to try to stay on top of them.

00:33:36.385 --> 00:33:39.305
And a lot of it is just like managing, getting stuff done.

00:33:39.525 --> 00:33:44.045
And then you realize, OK, I kind of feel myself. I know how to do this.

00:33:44.185 --> 00:33:46.645
I have a handle on, you know, certain parts of this job.

00:33:47.265 --> 00:33:52.025
So let me branch out because you still have that idea of I'm going to make a

00:33:52.025 --> 00:33:54.785
difference. I'm going to make a change. I want to make things better.

00:33:55.065 --> 00:34:01.525
And you start to do that. And then, yeah, you swing into that disillusionment of, my goodness,

00:34:01.905 --> 00:34:10.245
every time I try to move the needle forward, I just get tossed back. Yeah. And it's it's.

00:34:12.024 --> 00:34:15.584
It's just like the only word that keeps coming to my head is like everything,

00:34:15.764 --> 00:34:16.384
everything, everything.

00:34:16.684 --> 00:34:22.264
Like we are, we are doing everything. Like we are, we are doing multi-tiered innovation,

00:34:22.524 --> 00:34:26.724
intervention strategies with multiple different kids at all different stages

00:34:26.724 --> 00:34:32.404
in the same classroom, as well as dealing with kids in a special education environment,

00:34:32.724 --> 00:34:37.204
regular education students who personally are being held back by anchors.

00:34:37.204 --> 00:34:40.244
And and i don't mean that in a negative way towards

00:34:40.244 --> 00:34:43.604
those students but like the fact that a regular education student

00:34:43.604 --> 00:34:46.504
is also in those classes kind of drags down

00:34:46.504 --> 00:34:49.164
the aggregate and makes it difficult for those students to be

00:34:49.164 --> 00:34:52.024
pushed academically so and granted we're

00:34:52.024 --> 00:34:54.964
in a middle school so we're not tracking them we're not putting them in like

00:34:54.964 --> 00:34:57.804
advanced or or higher classes where

00:34:57.804 --> 00:35:01.024
maybe we need to also look into doing that right

00:35:01.024 --> 00:35:04.984
which is a whole other animal but like you

00:35:04.984 --> 00:35:08.564
know we're we're trying to do all of these individualized one-on-one

00:35:08.564 --> 00:35:11.464
instruction things working with the student

00:35:11.464 --> 00:35:14.564
who you know is is on tiered intervention

00:35:14.564 --> 00:35:21.224
in a classroom of 26 kids in an English class and you're expected to meet with

00:35:21.224 --> 00:35:26.644
this student for 10 minutes a day and give them individual work and then provide

00:35:26.644 --> 00:35:31.024
feedback in whatever online portal so then we can look at whether or not they're

00:35:31.024 --> 00:35:32.624
going to be tested or classified later.

00:35:33.044 --> 00:35:38.144
You have 25 other students that are on ELL levels, one, two,

00:35:38.184 --> 00:35:42.104
and three, all in the same classroom, different special ed needs in all the same classroom.

00:35:42.684 --> 00:35:47.284
It's just, it is, it is more and more and more untenable. And then you say,

00:35:47.364 --> 00:35:49.124
yeah, well, you know, just take care of yourself.

00:35:49.984 --> 00:35:54.744
To quote the great Reese Witherspoon. What, like it's hard? Yeah.

00:35:55.984 --> 00:35:58.184
What, like it's hard? I mean, I really do. Am I on top of that,

00:35:58.304 --> 00:36:01.944
Rose? As you're saying all those things, it's like, what? Like, it's hard?

00:36:02.204 --> 00:36:07.264
And that is the way that we are looked at.

00:36:08.865 --> 00:36:12.245
What, what's the big deal? Why can't you do that?

00:36:12.765 --> 00:36:17.585
Why not? You know, and, and so that is when we say systemic problem,

00:36:17.585 --> 00:36:22.765
you know, we do go back to yes, because the public's perception and the way

00:36:22.765 --> 00:36:26.225
that we are viewed is what?

00:36:26.565 --> 00:36:27.645
Like it's hard.

00:36:28.145 --> 00:36:31.605
Yeah. And I think that there's a lot of that coming, you know,

00:36:31.705 --> 00:36:34.445
everybody gets things from the top and then it trickles down. Right.

00:36:34.605 --> 00:36:38.645
So I think there's a lot of like, there's no time for actual training,

00:36:38.805 --> 00:36:42.285
implementation and professional development. So it's watch a video and figure it out.

00:36:42.845 --> 00:36:46.885
Like you kind of have to figure all this stuff out on your own.

00:36:47.345 --> 00:36:52.985
And people are like, no, I don't have the capacity to do that.

00:36:53.225 --> 00:36:58.265
When am I supposed to do it? I mean, and, you know, when we talk about this

00:36:58.265 --> 00:37:03.245
idea of the professional life cycle, right, I can get to that point now where

00:37:03.245 --> 00:37:06.345
I am because I'm confident enough in my ability in the classroom.

00:37:06.365 --> 00:37:10.945
I'm confident enough in how I administer my lessons, talk about my curriculum,

00:37:11.425 --> 00:37:12.785
do things in the class with my students.

00:37:12.785 --> 00:37:15.365
I'm confident enough with all those things where I could say,

00:37:15.385 --> 00:37:18.045
this is just not something that I can handle.

00:37:18.045 --> 00:37:24.225
But I think that those teachers that are in that early phase,

00:37:24.445 --> 00:37:28.045
right, where they're maybe just getting passed through the reality shock part

00:37:28.045 --> 00:37:31.865
and like, I can make a difference. I can do this. And you are trying to do all the things.

00:37:33.285 --> 00:37:37.405
It's not possible. And then you put on top of that, like...

00:37:38.590 --> 00:37:44.210
Motherhood. And there is just, the mental load for a female teacher going through,

00:37:44.290 --> 00:37:51.230
and I'm not saying it's not different for men, but it is. It's not the same. It's not the same.

00:37:51.610 --> 00:37:56.770
It's not the same. What we're learning and what we're talking about is sort

00:37:56.770 --> 00:38:03.730
of the idea of how much a woman has to think about and to say,

00:38:03.850 --> 00:38:05.410
oh, you don't need to think about that.

00:38:06.610 --> 00:38:11.990
But I do. because that is, like, genetically, like, how I am made.

00:38:12.670 --> 00:38:21.190
Yeah. And when you, like, sorry. To compare that is such a disrespect, truly.

00:38:21.490 --> 00:38:24.330
And I'm not saying that, you know, dads aren't more involved and,

00:38:24.510 --> 00:38:27.470
you know, that they're not a part of, you know, getting up in the middle of

00:38:27.470 --> 00:38:31.230
the night or whatever that might look like in different households.

00:38:32.030 --> 00:38:40.110
But anyone that talks about the mental load of women has to really genuinely

00:38:40.110 --> 00:38:45.170
believe that it's true. I am going to be honest with you.

00:38:45.330 --> 00:38:50.010
When I created the plan for what we were going to do as a school for March for

00:38:50.010 --> 00:38:56.570
Women's History Month, I thought to myself, I'm in a department of almost all men.

00:38:57.490 --> 00:39:07.270
Yes. I don't know if I believe that most of them are going to believe in a woman's mental load,

00:39:07.590 --> 00:39:13.410
respect and understand it, or take the time to explain to the kids what that is,

00:39:13.950 --> 00:39:15.770
even though I put it in the directions.

00:39:16.810 --> 00:39:19.750
And that is my experience as a female.

00:39:21.063 --> 00:39:23.203
Do you expect us to read the directions? Is that what you...

00:39:23.203 --> 00:39:28.123
I would expect you to read the directions and then respect, you know,

00:39:28.183 --> 00:39:30.343
the concept of a female... I think it's a great idea.

00:39:30.703 --> 00:39:33.583
Right. And because it's true. And I do think a lot of them are,

00:39:33.743 --> 00:39:37.523
you know, I think pretty much every, almost everybody in our department's married

00:39:37.523 --> 00:39:39.543
and almost everybody has kids.

00:39:39.743 --> 00:39:43.843
And I would hope that, like, having seen it through that lens as a partner...

00:39:45.123 --> 00:39:47.563
I think you're right. I think everybody... Yeah. I think so.

00:39:47.683 --> 00:39:52.123
I think you're right. So I feel like there's going to be a little bit of a better

00:39:52.123 --> 00:39:53.883
response, I would hope, you know.

00:39:54.663 --> 00:40:00.343
And I'm interested to see how that'll play out with the kids because it's so true.

00:40:00.603 --> 00:40:03.943
So there's this one girl that I follow and she talks a lot about,

00:40:04.363 --> 00:40:06.603
you know, hey, what's for dinner?

00:40:06.883 --> 00:40:12.923
You know, and her spouse, you know, I guess they kind of sat down together and

00:40:12.923 --> 00:40:16.763
they said, look, like, these are the things that I'm really struggling with.

00:40:16.763 --> 00:40:21.963
And one of them was like what's for dinner and.

00:40:23.854 --> 00:40:30.934
She said, I don't want to know anything about dinner. I just want to sit down and eat it.

00:40:31.934 --> 00:40:37.714
So there was like, no, there's absolutely like, he is shopping. He is preparing.

00:40:38.014 --> 00:40:42.214
He is getting, he is, you know, because it kind of became this like exchange.

00:40:42.654 --> 00:40:47.394
And then she ended up like, even just the decision, which I am in a period right

00:40:47.394 --> 00:40:49.274
now of decision fatigue.

00:40:50.074 --> 00:40:55.034
Oh, yes. I do not want to make social decisions.

00:40:55.494 --> 00:41:01.214
I don't want to have to, I don't, I don't even want to walk into a room right

00:41:01.214 --> 00:41:03.354
now as being the first person to walk in.

00:41:03.614 --> 00:41:09.094
I don't want to have to decide what chair to sit. Like I am so like at my limit

00:41:09.094 --> 00:41:12.714
that those things seem so incredible to me.

00:41:12.914 --> 00:41:16.034
So the decision fatigue is real.

00:41:16.214 --> 00:41:21.074
And especially, you know, we have a lot of great husbands and partners and wives

00:41:21.074 --> 00:41:27.874
that are showing up and doing really terrific things and don't realize how much

00:41:27.874 --> 00:41:30.014
is actually swirling and going on.

00:41:30.414 --> 00:41:35.634
And so I think to say, you know, oh, well, why don't you go get a massage?

00:41:35.874 --> 00:41:40.094
That's something that, you know, my partner will say to me, why don't you just go get a massage?

00:41:40.354 --> 00:41:43.854
And my thought is like, oh, my God, I have to call.

00:41:44.194 --> 00:41:47.794
I have to schedule it. I have to fund it, I have to book it,

00:41:47.954 --> 00:41:53.354
I have to show up for it, I have to make sure that it doesn't conflict with

00:41:53.354 --> 00:41:54.514
anyone else's schedules.

00:41:55.506 --> 00:42:00.586
So, sure. Great. And it's really easy for me to say, no, you don't. You can just go.

00:42:01.406 --> 00:42:04.766
And it doesn't work that way. I'm that serious.

00:42:05.006 --> 00:42:09.706
And I think that that's really, like, where the idea of that gets people,

00:42:09.906 --> 00:42:15.506
like, oh, sure. I got my wife and my daughter massage gift certificates and,

00:42:15.586 --> 00:42:19.386
like, a salt scrubby thing from a local place. Right.

00:42:19.646 --> 00:42:25.406
And they haven't went yet. And I do, like, I often thought, like, should I really do this?

00:42:25.506 --> 00:42:28.266
Like it's like yeah they got to do it but then it's the day and go take

00:42:28.266 --> 00:42:31.846
it and like my but my daughter had also been complained like it's like it's like

00:42:31.846 --> 00:42:34.886
dry skin season right it's like uh like dry

00:42:34.886 --> 00:42:38.446
january is actually just like dried skin um in

00:42:38.446 --> 00:42:41.326
our house you know you know how it is it's winter time and

00:42:41.326 --> 00:42:44.286
everything sucks and it's awful and i hate it so

00:42:44.286 --> 00:42:47.486
it's like the giving of the permission is nice i

00:42:47.486 --> 00:42:50.646
think the part that sometimes people don't see is how

00:42:50.646 --> 00:42:53.586
much is involved in carving out that time

00:42:53.586 --> 00:42:57.366
but like what you said earlier of like feeling guilty i felt

00:42:57.366 --> 00:43:00.606
that way as a young like mom a

00:43:00.606 --> 00:43:03.886
mom to young children whereas like

00:43:03.886 --> 00:43:08.446
that the wisdom of my age and time i mean i got to a point where i like if anyone

00:43:08.446 --> 00:43:12.386
here was like when are you coming back i would go out like i'd go out for dinner

00:43:12.386 --> 00:43:15.546
or like go out with friends and it was like when what time will you be back

00:43:15.546 --> 00:43:20.506
and i was like don't don't even ask me that yeah i i had that happen a couple

00:43:20.506 --> 00:43:21.946
times with my wife when she would go out.

00:43:22.086 --> 00:43:25.326
But honestly, and it wasn't like, when are you coming back? I can't take this anymore.

00:43:25.526 --> 00:43:28.866
It was like, when are you coming back? Just so I know, because...

00:43:30.273 --> 00:43:34.713
I, you know, sometimes like she goes out after work and I'm like where she goes

00:43:34.713 --> 00:43:41.193
out, you know, she, she works in Newark, New Jersey, which is not the safest place to go out.

00:43:41.373 --> 00:43:45.013
So I do have concerns. I, even when she leaves like super early in the morning

00:43:45.013 --> 00:43:49.213
to go to her office and she has a parking spot and it's a gated, guarded, whatever.

00:43:49.633 --> 00:43:52.433
Sure. I'm always like, please text me when you get in the building.

00:43:52.713 --> 00:43:55.913
I was like, I don't care what time it is. Like, I know you leave super early

00:43:55.913 --> 00:43:58.613
and I know you get there. I want to know that you're in the building.

00:43:58.913 --> 00:44:03.093
And if she doesn't text me when she's in the building, I get upset because like

00:44:03.093 --> 00:44:05.493
I want to know she's in the building and I want to know she's safe because I

00:44:05.493 --> 00:44:09.333
am genuinely worried about her when she goes out.

00:44:09.333 --> 00:44:12.893
And I also, I'm worried about her, like, and I don't check her location,

00:44:12.893 --> 00:44:16.233
but like, there are times where it's late and I'm like, okay,

00:44:16.293 --> 00:44:18.713
she's still where she says she's going to be because she said she'd be home

00:44:18.713 --> 00:44:23.393
by now because I'm worried about the fact that she's out. I check her location all the time.

00:44:23.593 --> 00:44:27.353
So that's my, that's my mental, that's my mental load. I'm not checking it like,

00:44:27.633 --> 00:44:29.113
oh, is she where she says she's going to be?

00:44:29.473 --> 00:44:34.113
That's not me. I don't think it's about that. I think it's more about being

00:44:34.113 --> 00:44:37.453
able to really go and do something without.

00:44:38.033 --> 00:44:43.093
Yeah. I saw somebody the other day who was like, oh, I'm going on a girl's weekend

00:44:43.093 --> 00:44:47.093
and I'm getting my house ready for me to be gone.

00:44:48.293 --> 00:44:52.353
And then she like turns around and she goes, nope, just kidding. I didn't marry a loser.

00:44:53.679 --> 00:44:58.199
And, you know, so it is like it is like, yeah, you should be able to go and

00:44:58.199 --> 00:45:00.519
not have to set the person up.

00:45:01.139 --> 00:45:03.659
And so I think that that's part of and, you know, and of course,

00:45:03.659 --> 00:45:06.239
in teaching, we can't not be there.

00:45:06.979 --> 00:45:10.959
You can't just not go to work. So if your child is throwing up in the middle

00:45:10.959 --> 00:45:17.379
of the night and you have to call out, you also have to get plans together and get the whole day ready.

00:45:17.379 --> 00:45:20.299
You can't just focus on like i'm sick you're

00:45:20.299 --> 00:45:23.659
sick you know it's like it never ends

00:45:23.659 --> 00:45:27.159
i think yeah exactly and i also

00:45:27.159 --> 00:45:32.939
and just one final comment here on this like i also think that like a lot of

00:45:32.939 --> 00:45:36.319
times schools will be like oh it's a professional development day or it's this

00:45:36.319 --> 00:45:40.819
day and like let's do a yoga class and like let's do this thing and like i am

00:45:40.819 --> 00:45:45.639
like i know i'm speaking about me, not from the female perspective,

00:45:46.239 --> 00:45:47.679
the last thing I want to do.

00:45:48.575 --> 00:45:52.915
Is do when I'm at work and I know I have work that I have to do while I'm at

00:45:52.915 --> 00:45:58.535
work is like do bracelet making or, or yoga.

00:45:58.735 --> 00:46:03.175
I just, I, that to me is like a, I don't want to do this.

00:46:03.275 --> 00:46:07.035
I would rather be homesick and I always go, but I'd rather not be there.

00:46:07.235 --> 00:46:12.835
I think the point is understanding that it looks different for everyone.

00:46:14.135 --> 00:46:20.915
And genuinely respecting that it is people have to choose not only what makes

00:46:20.915 --> 00:46:25.715
them feel better, but also things that are sustainable over time,

00:46:26.055 --> 00:46:29.095
not just like a one and done and you're good for 45 minutes.

00:46:29.495 --> 00:46:33.935
And then we're just going to go back to the way that it was before.

00:46:34.075 --> 00:46:40.115
And I think Dr. Hitchens, yes, changing the system is amazing.

00:46:40.115 --> 00:46:42.255
And especially for someone like her, who's a college professor,

00:46:42.395 --> 00:46:43.935
yeah, try to change the system.

00:46:44.135 --> 00:46:49.395
Try to get the younger people to understand how they can possibly shift and

00:46:49.395 --> 00:46:50.695
do things in a different way.

00:46:50.835 --> 00:46:54.275
And I think they are because like we talked about in the episode,

00:46:54.495 --> 00:46:58.715
when we visited a local college and they were like, leave it your contract hours.

00:46:58.815 --> 00:47:00.495
Don't take on extra responsibilities.

00:47:01.155 --> 00:47:05.115
They were saying all the things that we didn't learn. So maybe we're a product

00:47:05.115 --> 00:47:06.935
of the time and the environment.

00:47:07.155 --> 00:47:11.035
This goes back to that, you know, the life cycle again of, of teachers and how

00:47:11.035 --> 00:47:16.255
it's, uh, you know, how it's something that's cyclical and everybody gets there.

00:47:16.395 --> 00:47:19.675
And again, I'm not disengaged with being in the classroom.

00:47:19.855 --> 00:47:23.815
I think I'm disengaged with all the other BS that surrounds it.

00:47:24.746 --> 00:47:29.146
Um, where I've just, I'm not, I'm not willing to, you know, I will,

00:47:29.226 --> 00:47:31.146
I will go above and beyond for my students.

00:47:31.286 --> 00:47:35.606
I will do, you know, different projects and initiatives in class.

00:47:35.606 --> 00:47:37.766
Like you initiate something new, that's fine.

00:47:37.866 --> 00:47:40.806
You want me to use whatever program I'll use it. But if you're not going to

00:47:40.806 --> 00:47:45.886
properly train me on it and there's no support in place for me to get help with

00:47:45.886 --> 00:47:52.506
it when I need it, then don't be surprised if it's not given the 100% good old college try. So.

00:47:53.046 --> 00:47:54.906
Agree. That's where I'm at. Yeah.

00:47:55.846 --> 00:47:59.886
All right. So our season three. Season three is brought to you by our presenting

00:47:59.886 --> 00:48:01.606
sponsor, Teacher's Insurance Plan.

00:48:01.906 --> 00:48:04.366
Check out their website or give them a call.

00:48:05.026 --> 00:48:06.606
Say, hey, Jack, it's me.

00:48:07.306 --> 00:48:10.666
For more information and to get a quote, Teacher's Insurance Plan,

00:48:10.806 --> 00:48:14.166
auto insurance that brings exclusive educator savings and exceptional customer

00:48:14.166 --> 00:48:17.446
care to New Jersey and Pennsylvania educational employees.

00:48:17.726 --> 00:48:20.166
All right. So I'm going to go take care of myself.

00:48:20.806 --> 00:48:24.226
Yes. And, you know, it's I absolutely

00:48:24.226 --> 00:48:27.066
hate it. Enlighten someone's mental load for the month of March.

00:48:27.446 --> 00:48:33.306
Yes. That's what everybody should do. All of our listeners, especially if you

00:48:33.306 --> 00:48:36.666
feel that your spouse needs it. Make sure you give them that opportunity.