Episode 73: Spinning Gold out of Yarn

1 00:00:00,510 --> 00:00:05,850 podcasting 2.0 for February 11 2020, to Episode 73 Spinning 2 00:00:05,850 --> 00:00:12,630 gold at a yarn with excuses to Rumpelstiltskin. Hello, 3 00:00:12,630 --> 00:00:16,020 everybody time once again for the board meeting of podcasting 4 00:00:16,020 --> 00:00:19,230 2.0 Everything happening at podcast index.org with the 5 00:00:19,230 --> 00:00:22,860 podcast namespace. And of course, where all the action 6 00:00:22,860 --> 00:00:26,730 always takes place podcast index dot social. I'm Adam curry here 7 00:00:26,730 --> 00:00:29,460 in the heart of the Texas Hill Country and in Alabama, the only 8 00:00:29,460 --> 00:00:32,790 guy who can refresh my metadata, my friend on the other end, 9 00:00:32,790 --> 00:00:35,250 ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Dave Jones. 10 00:00:36,420 --> 00:00:43,620 You're such a pro. For like, is it true me? So you have you have 11 00:00:43,620 --> 00:00:45,570 the road? I'm gonna let you talk about that you have you've 12 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:49,230 you've got the Rona. But is it true what you told what you have 13 00:00:49,230 --> 00:00:53,850 told me that? You've never missed a broadcast in your 14 00:00:53,850 --> 00:00:55,650 entire career because of illness? 15 00:00:55,709 --> 00:01:00,749 No, 40 years. I've never missed a broadcast ever, for any 16 00:01:00,749 --> 00:01:01,229 reason. 17 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:07,800 So there has to be at least one or two stories of you have the 18 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:11,730 camera, the cameras stop rolling, go and barf your guts. 19 00:01:12,240 --> 00:01:14,640 In the bathroom. They come right back when the camera starts 20 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:14,820 again. 21 00:01:14,850 --> 00:01:18,630 Not quite that story, because another interesting fact I have 22 00:01:18,630 --> 00:01:23,880 not vomited since I was 12 years old. Not kidding. 23 00:01:24,420 --> 00:01:27,600 Is this is this like? Is this like Prince Andrew doesn't 24 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:29,130 sweat. Is this the same? 25 00:01:29,189 --> 00:01:33,899 I don't know. It's I really don't know. I just I don't do 26 00:01:33,899 --> 00:01:34,289 that. 27 00:01:35,069 --> 00:01:38,849 Okay, yeah. Yeah, taking control of your that was that thing 28 00:01:38,849 --> 00:01:41,489 where you can like lower your breathing your heart rate. But 29 00:01:41,489 --> 00:01:44,429 will you've just told your body? You're not allowed to 30 00:01:44,700 --> 00:01:48,510 correct it? The same way I told my body. We're not getting the 31 00:01:48,510 --> 00:01:53,940 Cuf didn't listen to that or did not listen to it. And I think 32 00:01:54,150 --> 00:01:58,620 really, I picked a fine time to get it. Because things are just 33 00:01:58,620 --> 00:02:02,190 blowing up around you with marketing opportunities for 34 00:02:02,190 --> 00:02:08,790 podcasting. 2.0. But, and I know you had it, maybe everyone I 35 00:02:08,790 --> 00:02:11,670 know has in fact, I was feeling a bit left out at this point. 36 00:02:12,750 --> 00:02:16,380 At least twice, maybe three times. But really at least 37 00:02:16,380 --> 00:02:17,220 twice. Yes. 38 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:20,190 Yes. So that would have been different. Doesn't matter who 39 00:02:20,190 --> 00:02:23,340 the hell knows. I don't know. I mean, I took a test. I got two 40 00:02:23,340 --> 00:02:25,830 things. You know, I could have the cool if I could be pregnant. 41 00:02:25,830 --> 00:02:28,830 I don't know. I mean, I don't have any reason to, to give 42 00:02:28,830 --> 00:02:35,550 babies have any reason to trust anything at this point. But two 43 00:02:35,550 --> 00:02:39,120 things of note, and I still am definitely I know I'm ill 44 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:43,770 because I feel well, here's how I feel. I have taste and smell 45 00:02:43,770 --> 00:02:49,200 but taste is haywire. It's like mixed up. Or it's it's like it's 46 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:53,820 removed elements from from my taste sensation. So, I had a sip 47 00:02:53,820 --> 00:02:59,010 of wine yesterday. It was like biting into tin foil. Yeah, and 48 00:02:59,010 --> 00:03:04,950 coffee. It's like really, really, really better. As Yeah, 49 00:03:04,980 --> 00:03:10,350 and then the worst part is, weed is like a crunchy old stick. So 50 00:03:10,350 --> 00:03:10,740 that's 51 00:03:10,740 --> 00:03:13,410 out. That's your worst part. That would be you 52 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:18,480 know, the worst part is there is definitely some brain fog, 53 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:23,550 cognition something going on. Because I you know, I use my 54 00:03:23,550 --> 00:03:27,120 brain a lot. And I feel it the certain things this is like, 55 00:03:27,150 --> 00:03:31,680 Oops, just kind of mushy. And that's really annoying and a 56 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:32,460 little weird. 57 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:37,530 That the brain thing. Yeah, there's there's definitely some 58 00:03:37,530 --> 00:03:39,990 brain fog aspect to this where you're just kind of you feel 59 00:03:40,290 --> 00:03:44,760 like you're floating. Like you just don't mind, your brain 60 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:48,870 can't really land on one thing for more than, like, it's sort 61 00:03:48,870 --> 00:03:51,600 of it's, it's tickling it. It's not actually 62 00:03:52,350 --> 00:03:54,960 a little bit of that it's more just like, you know, it's like I 63 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:57,660 need to come up with a title, you know, and I just can't focus 64 00:03:57,660 --> 00:04:00,270 on that one thing, everything else I can do. But one thing my 65 00:04:00,270 --> 00:04:01,710 brain goes now I'm done with you. 66 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:05,610 But not for you. And we do 67 00:04:05,610 --> 00:04:08,250 have two guests joining us of course not really guests but 68 00:04:08,250 --> 00:04:10,410 board members who will be with us in a moment here in the 69 00:04:11,010 --> 00:04:15,540 podcasting 2.0 board meeting. But I just because it's also 70 00:04:15,540 --> 00:04:19,890 about them. I want to say how important it is what we're doing 71 00:04:19,890 --> 00:04:23,790 here. And maybe not for the reasons that that people might 72 00:04:23,790 --> 00:04:28,080 think when I say that so I did another live thing this morning 73 00:04:28,380 --> 00:04:31,110 with Brian Kilmeade Fox News 74 00:04:31,110 --> 00:04:34,380 is another live show. You've done three podcasts in two days 75 00:04:34,380 --> 00:04:38,070 with with the Rona. Yeah, your machine 76 00:04:39,390 --> 00:04:42,810 Well, it's an important time and there's stuff to discuss. But 77 00:04:42,840 --> 00:04:47,250 you know so in now this is a live radio so it's a coast to 78 00:04:47,250 --> 00:04:52,410 coast is a pretty big audience. And of course it's it's it's 79 00:04:52,410 --> 00:04:56,190 great to do live radio, but not really because well we have 16 80 00:04:56,190 --> 00:05:00,720 minutes here hard out at 52 and just like Oh, yeah, I forgot 81 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:07,140 your interruptive monetization model is very annoying. And, you 82 00:05:07,140 --> 00:05:09,720 know, so of course, what does everyone want to talk about? 83 00:05:11,070 --> 00:05:15,750 Canceled culture and Rogen? Right. That's that's what that's 84 00:05:15,750 --> 00:05:18,060 what. And that's why they're having me on. So well, why are 85 00:05:18,060 --> 00:05:23,040 you having me on? Well, you have a solution for this. And yeah, 86 00:05:23,070 --> 00:05:26,340 that's that's the marketing moment that is happening right 87 00:05:26,340 --> 00:05:33,390 now. Right now, if you look at anything about Rogan, somewhere, 88 00:05:33,390 --> 00:05:38,730 you'll see podcasting 2.0, as an alternative that people are 89 00:05:38,730 --> 00:05:39,510 talking about. 90 00:05:40,650 --> 00:05:46,650 Diets which which in relation to Rogan, I don't like some people 91 00:05:46,650 --> 00:05:51,210 are going off on this thing. Say, Oh, well, hey, Joe, come to 92 00:05:51,210 --> 00:05:55,380 podcasting. That's not that's not going to happen. This. The 93 00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:57,420 significance of this lies elsewhere. 94 00:05:57,450 --> 00:05:59,520 Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. No, it has nothing to do. Yeah, no, no, 95 00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:02,520 yeah, yeah. But we're on the radar. That's what's now I've 96 00:06:02,700 --> 00:06:05,910 look, I was there when we did 1.0. It takes a while for things 97 00:06:05,910 --> 00:06:08,550 to build. And there are moments when you get boost. And this is 98 00:06:08,550 --> 00:06:15,240 one of these moments is not the definitive moment. But what what 99 00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:19,890 is interesting is that people are starting to realize that 100 00:06:19,890 --> 00:06:24,690 Kancil culture is not really political or ideological. Yeah, 101 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:29,610 it's a part of it. It's being used right now to establish the 102 00:06:29,610 --> 00:06:34,470 rules and regulations. So it's easy for people to agree with 103 00:06:34,470 --> 00:06:38,700 the people who are being banned, banded around first. But it's 104 00:06:38,700 --> 00:06:43,020 really a class struggle. That's what to me, the truckers is 105 00:06:43,020 --> 00:06:47,400 about. This is the working middle class, who are saying, 106 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:51,540 No, we're done with it. And the ruling class, which really used 107 00:06:51,540 --> 00:06:54,000 to be the working middle class, but they got elected to 108 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:59,130 something. They they kind of despise the working middle 109 00:06:59,130 --> 00:07:05,400 class. So you know, that's why you see politicians having 110 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:07,770 dinners without masks, and the people serving them are all 111 00:07:07,770 --> 00:07:11,460 messed up, you know, it's a, it's such an obvious thing for 112 00:07:11,460 --> 00:07:15,600 me to see. And, and what is really underlying all of this. 113 00:07:15,600 --> 00:07:18,270 And that's why to me, we're doing really important work. And 114 00:07:18,270 --> 00:07:21,930 it's and that's just a few pieces of what we're doing is 115 00:07:21,930 --> 00:07:25,620 the ruling class does not want the working class and middle 116 00:07:25,620 --> 00:07:29,850 class to have their own communications channels. And 117 00:07:29,850 --> 00:07:33,570 that is evident in everything that they're saying and writing. 118 00:07:34,620 --> 00:07:38,160 It's that, well, we just can't have Joe Rogan say that. We just 119 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:43,260 can't have Alex Jones, they just can't have that. Why? Because 120 00:07:43,260 --> 00:07:47,940 they want everyone to listen to their established messaging 121 00:07:47,940 --> 00:07:52,200 system. And that's why when the new messaging system, which is 122 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:56,340 podcasting starts to say, oh, there's an alternative to 123 00:07:56,340 --> 00:07:59,820 pharmaceutical products that are being sold, that's when you 124 00:07:59,820 --> 00:08:04,110 know, the money comes out. And that's when people go full bore. 125 00:08:04,380 --> 00:08:07,860 But it's Joe Rogan now or anybody, anybody that you want, 126 00:08:07,860 --> 00:08:11,670 and anywhere and on any platform, any any opinion, it's, 127 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:15,360 it's that person now to establish the rules and 128 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:19,560 regulations, and then those will be used against everybody. And 129 00:08:20,100 --> 00:08:24,930 this brings me to podcasting. So, you know, when when someone 130 00:08:24,930 --> 00:08:28,080 says, What is podcasting? 2.0? Really, it's apps and services 131 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:32,070 that use the upgraded podcast standards. That's it. It's not a 132 00:08:32,070 --> 00:08:35,100 it's not like a huge, complicated question to answer. 133 00:08:35,730 --> 00:08:42,570 And the first benefit we get is if you use a new podcast app, a 134 00:08:42,570 --> 00:08:46,530 modern app, your podcast that you listen to won't just 135 00:08:46,530 --> 00:08:52,980 disappear overnight. Now, that's not explicitly true for for 136 00:08:52,980 --> 00:08:55,800 every app, you know, every app can make its own decision, but 137 00:08:56,040 --> 00:09:00,540 most of the apps that new podcast apps comm get their, 138 00:09:01,470 --> 00:09:05,310 their debt data from the index. And that's a pretty safe place. 139 00:09:05,670 --> 00:09:09,210 And so that's where I'm sending everybody. So I'm sending people 140 00:09:09,210 --> 00:09:12,960 to new podcast apps calm so when people hear podcasting, 2.0 141 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,330 they're seeing apps and services, they don't really know 142 00:09:15,330 --> 00:09:19,110 much else. But for that very reason. I think we need to 143 00:09:19,110 --> 00:09:24,000 recognize that podcasting itself with the conversation is is 144 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:27,780 driving it only in to look at it as one thing. It's not really an 145 00:09:27,780 --> 00:09:33,030 industry. It's more like sports, not a sport, sport, sport. You 146 00:09:33,030 --> 00:09:36,240 can do sport by yourself. You can do it with your buddies, you 147 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:39,750 can do it professionally. You can do it. commercially. This 148 00:09:39,780 --> 00:09:44,970 it's sport, and it's just as important to sport is essential 149 00:09:44,970 --> 00:09:46,260 to the human spirit. 150 00:09:48,780 --> 00:09:53,460 Tone interesting. Good. No, go ahead. I want to disrupt your 151 00:09:53,460 --> 00:09:53,880 flow. 152 00:09:56,280 --> 00:10:04,470 Tony Khan from WGBH Who is an obvious admission to the podcast 153 00:10:04,470 --> 00:10:09,000 Hall of Fame. He was one of the first to believe in the vision 154 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:14,400 of podcasting. He worked at WGBH WGBH, NPR, public radio in 155 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:19,020 Boston. He was, as far as I know, the first to put public 156 00:10:19,020 --> 00:10:24,450 radio on podcasting champion did very, very hard. He was, and I 157 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:27,300 hope he's still alive. I haven't heard from Tony in a long time. 158 00:10:28,500 --> 00:10:32,760 He really blew me away. In those early days, he talked about 159 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:37,200 podcasting, bringing something to broadcasting which had been 160 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,260 lost and could no longer be recovered. And he said he called 161 00:10:40,260 --> 00:10:45,870 it civility. And this is the truth about podcasting, any 162 00:10:45,870 --> 00:10:51,420 podcaster? Who was podcasting in the past 24 months, I guarantee 163 00:10:51,420 --> 00:10:56,190 you, no matter what your podcast is, you've received at least one 164 00:10:56,220 --> 00:11:00,330 email from someone saying, Hey, man, thanks for keeping your 165 00:11:00,330 --> 00:11:05,700 podcast going. It kept me sane during these crazy times. And 166 00:11:05,730 --> 00:11:10,350 that can be a podcast with five people listening, or 5 million 167 00:11:10,350 --> 00:11:16,740 people listening. So to look at podcasting in an industry is 168 00:11:16,740 --> 00:11:20,040 always going to be limited by the amount of money and whatever 169 00:11:20,040 --> 00:11:23,640 the amount of award shows we can do. There's an endless supply of 170 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:31,770 civility in the world. Um, that's all I had to say. So it's 171 00:11:31,770 --> 00:11:37,140 important what we're doing. Well, there's my my crew fog has 172 00:11:37,560 --> 00:11:39,930 screwed up my big my big finish. Yeah. 173 00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:43,650 He just fell off the cliff. I did. It was a The thing I've 174 00:11:43,650 --> 00:11:46,530 been thinking about this week, as there's this, there's been 175 00:11:46,530 --> 00:11:52,200 this sort of background radiation of commenting going on 176 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:57,000 on podcast index dot social about, in this comes, this comes 177 00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,510 up, it's a cycle that comes up every, every four months or so, 178 00:12:00,870 --> 00:12:05,940 of, should the index be divorced from the, as far as marketing 179 00:12:05,940 --> 00:12:10,050 goes, should the index be divorced from the namespace be 180 00:12:10,050 --> 00:12:13,740 divorced from value for value, but like, should all this is? Is 181 00:12:13,740 --> 00:12:22,080 there a podcasting? 2.0? Because because the Free Speech stuff, 182 00:12:23,220 --> 00:12:31,050 and that that comes up on this sort of timed basis? The what 183 00:12:31,050 --> 00:12:33,960 I've been thinking about is there's there's an easier and 184 00:12:33,960 --> 00:12:37,200 there's sort of an easy answer to that, which is, oh, well, the 185 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:39,210 you know, the index doesn't have anything to do with the 186 00:12:39,210 --> 00:12:44,010 namespace and blah, blah, blah. But as a whole podcasting two 187 00:12:44,010 --> 00:12:48,420 point, I don't think that there's that they're separable 188 00:12:48,420 --> 00:12:52,950 and then maintainable as independent things. Because what 189 00:12:52,950 --> 00:12:57,600 podcasting 2.0 is, is just a representation is a solidified 190 00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:02,850 representation of what podcasting is. Podcasting is, by 191 00:13:02,850 --> 00:13:08,940 itself, decentralized and censorship resistant. And it's, 192 00:13:09,330 --> 00:13:13,950 it is it is a representation of uncancelled ability, if that's a 193 00:13:13,950 --> 00:13:20,130 word. Because just like Sam Sethi said, you can, if you if 194 00:13:20,130 --> 00:13:23,370 your host, D platforms, you so to speak, you can go get it, go 195 00:13:23,370 --> 00:13:27,960 to another one. And you your, your data is portable, from host 196 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:31,740 to host. And if, if all of them cancel you, you can host it 197 00:13:31,740 --> 00:13:36,180 yourself. That is something that is inherent in podcasting. 198 00:13:36,390 --> 00:13:39,900 That's not something that podcasting that podcast index, 199 00:13:40,170 --> 00:13:44,100 brought to podcasting, podcasting was already that 200 00:13:44,100 --> 00:13:51,720 thing, what we did was, was create the API, and the 201 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:54,810 database, the downloadable database, to where all those 202 00:13:54,810 --> 00:13:58,110 things can, where all of those distributed feeds can be 203 00:13:58,110 --> 00:14:02,820 downloaded in easily in a single place. That's that's all we did, 204 00:14:02,820 --> 00:14:09,000 we we put feet or, or mate took the cont the the concepts, and 205 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:11,490 then the building blocks of what podcasts and podcasting already 206 00:14:11,490 --> 00:14:19,440 was, and turned it into an easy to use thing. And so there 207 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:23,130 doesn't even have to be a podcast index in order to carry 208 00:14:23,130 --> 00:14:26,940 out that mission. I could just take and run those, run those 209 00:14:26,940 --> 00:14:31,710 background services myself on my own machines privately, and then 210 00:14:31,710 --> 00:14:34,380 just make it down, make the database downloadable problem 211 00:14:34,380 --> 00:14:39,810 solved. That the that is what it is. We decided to go one step 212 00:14:39,810 --> 00:14:43,890 further and create the API to make that easy for apps. Well, 213 00:14:43,890 --> 00:14:50,520 then the API is the sandbox for the new for the namespace. And 214 00:14:50,520 --> 00:14:54,210 these things build upon each other. So what really what we 215 00:14:54,210 --> 00:14:56,490 ultimately did, and this is why I don't think that they're 216 00:14:56,490 --> 00:15:03,390 separable. We we just took What podcasting already was, and 217 00:15:03,390 --> 00:15:07,170 tried to preserve it, which was the, which is the first part of 218 00:15:07,170 --> 00:15:12,870 our mission and extend it. Those, that's, that's all we did 219 00:15:12,870 --> 00:15:19,200 you, if you try to separate the index from the namespace, from 220 00:15:19,230 --> 00:15:21,900 value for value, if you try to separate those all into, into 221 00:15:21,900 --> 00:15:25,650 into component parts, you just it just all falls apart, you 222 00:15:25,650 --> 00:15:29,610 lose it. Because that's not no longer an accurate 223 00:15:29,610 --> 00:15:33,300 representation of what podcasting is, as an as a as a 224 00:15:33,300 --> 00:15:38,010 medium and as an industry and as a technology. So I don't I don't 225 00:15:38,010 --> 00:15:44,220 think the the idea that the Free Speech part of things is going 226 00:15:44,220 --> 00:15:47,940 to turn people off so much that they're going to abandon 227 00:15:47,940 --> 00:15:53,910 namespace tags, because the index doesn't censor people. I 228 00:15:53,910 --> 00:15:57,690 don't think that that is even an issue. I've heard so much talk 229 00:15:57,690 --> 00:16:01,710 about podcasting. 2.0 even even on a clip yesterday that John 230 00:16:01,710 --> 00:16:06,780 Spurlock shared some some guys talking about podcasting 2.0 It 231 00:16:06,780 --> 00:16:11,310 never it just never came up. It's not an issue because they 232 00:16:11,310 --> 00:16:14,070 already know that that's what podcasting is. 233 00:16:14,910 --> 00:16:19,380 Excellent point. There's a there's a an article another 234 00:16:19,380 --> 00:16:24,480 article in The Atlantic that came out today, given the 235 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:27,990 Atlantic is definitely a publication of the ruling class. 236 00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:32,490 Podcasts are no longer private conversations by Caitlin 237 00:16:32,490 --> 00:16:35,610 Tiffany. And I just took two paragraphs from this just to 238 00:16:35,610 --> 00:16:37,920 give you an idea of what the thinking is, by the way, there's 239 00:16:37,950 --> 00:16:40,710 there's no real conclusion to this article other than it's an 240 00:16:40,740 --> 00:16:43,470 outrage that this can be said and people can hear it. That's 241 00:16:43,470 --> 00:16:47,130 really what is being said. In the beginning podcast money was 242 00:16:47,130 --> 00:16:50,340 exchanging hands person to person through monthly fees from 243 00:16:50,340 --> 00:16:54,210 listeners via platforms like Patreon. The big money podcast 244 00:16:54,210 --> 00:16:57,750 wars are just a few years old, and truly enormous exclusive 245 00:16:57,750 --> 00:17:01,410 deals like Rogan's with Spotify are still in a trial phase. But 246 00:17:01,410 --> 00:17:04,590 as the business grows up, and as more reporters or agitators 247 00:17:04,590 --> 00:17:08,340 invest the time in poring over all this content, the days of 248 00:17:08,340 --> 00:17:11,400 podcasting without consequences will be numbered. 249 00:17:12,660 --> 00:17:15,060 without consequences, wow, podcast, I 250 00:17:15,060 --> 00:17:18,690 want that T shirt. I'm podcasting without consequences. 251 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:23,520 And then the second that love that, like it as podcasting 252 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:27,300 becomes further entrenched as a mass media format and host 253 00:17:27,300 --> 00:17:31,650 platforms grow in size, these pressures will only increase 254 00:17:31,890 --> 00:17:36,000 work like Patterson, that's a guy who listens to Rogan's show 255 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:41,070 for to note what he's doing wrong, I guess paid for it may 256 00:17:41,070 --> 00:17:43,800 be getting easier as well. The past two weeks, this was 257 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:45,990 interesting on a different level. The past two years have 258 00:17:45,990 --> 00:17:49,200 brought lawsuits against major podcast companies like Sirius 259 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:52,710 XM, and Spotify as gimlet media for their lack of podcast 260 00:17:52,710 --> 00:17:56,430 accessibility features, including transcriptions. So you 261 00:17:56,430 --> 00:18:00,000 see there's this whole these opportunities that we have that 262 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:04,050 of course, because of the wow, people are saying stuff I don't 263 00:18:04,050 --> 00:18:09,150 like therefore, I write articles about it. Is not getting the 264 00:18:09,150 --> 00:18:15,120 light of day. Yeah. So regarding regarding the separation of the 265 00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:19,080 namespace, look at how the development works. We are 266 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:25,470 literally developing the activity pub commenting tag, 267 00:18:26,220 --> 00:18:34,620 technology element OP on the fly, you know, doing it with 268 00:18:35,310 --> 00:18:40,710 everything in unison with the API with the podcast index dot 269 00:18:40,710 --> 00:18:45,570 social. I mean, it that's just how it that's how it works. It's 270 00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:49,080 we didn't even plan anything that way. We just said, Let's do 271 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:52,680 it this way. And it felt good and it grew. This, this would be 272 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:55,830 the equivalent of a fork if anyone wants to do that. But I 273 00:18:55,830 --> 00:18:58,890 think I think that would be a very, very unwise thing to do. 274 00:18:59,250 --> 00:19:01,980 Well, if you but I want to get it out there that I think that 275 00:19:01,980 --> 00:19:04,290 would be an unwise thing to do. Because I don't like it when I 276 00:19:04,290 --> 00:19:05,460 hear this personally. 277 00:19:05,850 --> 00:19:10,620 If you don't like if you don't like the deep the uncensor 278 00:19:10,620 --> 00:19:16,050 ability of podcasting 2.0 You don't like God? You don't like 279 00:19:16,050 --> 00:19:19,710 podcasts? Yes. Yeah, exactly. You're no longer talking about 280 00:19:19,710 --> 00:19:23,070 podcasts. You're talking about a centralized system. Yeah. 281 00:19:23,250 --> 00:19:26,970 Because that's, that's how it works. So you know, I don't want 282 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:29,880 I'm not going to be the guy that goes out there and champions. 283 00:19:30,150 --> 00:19:34,350 The free, you know, we roll good and come to come to the fucking 284 00:19:34,350 --> 00:19:39,240 No, no, I'm not No, no, of course not. It's just not me. 285 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:44,220 But, but what people are doing is they are interested in what 286 00:19:44,220 --> 00:19:47,970 this is. They may or might they may come for different reasons. 287 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:52,230 So whatever you have your apps and services on podcast 288 00:19:52,230 --> 00:19:57,450 index.org/apps which links from new podcast apps comm make sure 289 00:19:57,450 --> 00:20:00,780 it's good because people are coming to check out Your stuff. 290 00:20:01,770 --> 00:20:08,400 We we are, in a sense, Google. We're the Google layer because 291 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:08,670 like, 292 00:20:09,450 --> 00:20:11,490 I really hate that comparison. But I 293 00:20:12,090 --> 00:20:16,260 know, I know. I know it. We mean, we're the search engine. 294 00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:23,010 The reason I said Google is because last night, just, I just 295 00:20:23,070 --> 00:20:26,520 checked and I searched I got on Google and I searched for Info 296 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:32,370 Wars. pop right up. I, there's a link to info wars.com and Alex 297 00:20:32,370 --> 00:20:36,960 Jones has been removed from all the major podcasting. 298 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:39,750 archive.org is maybe a better, 299 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:45,750 okay. Okay. The, the, there's a layer, there's a layer there 300 00:20:45,810 --> 00:20:50,070 that we represent, which is the layer of, of information 301 00:20:50,070 --> 00:20:56,190 storage, and collection, then the application layer at the 302 00:20:56,190 --> 00:20:59,970 podcast app level. Anybody can create a podcast off the APIs 303 00:20:59,970 --> 00:21:02,610 index data, and anybody can filter out whatever they 304 00:21:02,610 --> 00:21:06,300 exactly. Problem solved. I just don't think it's a problem. It's 305 00:21:06,300 --> 00:21:07,590 just not an issue. Well, 306 00:21:07,740 --> 00:21:10,200 okay. So and I'll just hit it and I'll be done with it. And we 307 00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:16,470 can bring in our guests board members, it. Podcasting is 308 00:21:16,530 --> 00:21:22,020 becoming extremely political, and I don't like it. And it's 309 00:21:22,020 --> 00:21:25,650 unnecessary. And I'm speaking specifically about the podcast 310 00:21:25,650 --> 00:21:32,040 Hall of Fame. I have they always asked me to vote I don't believe 311 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:36,810 in it. I was very honored when I got you know, the whatever. Pod 312 00:21:36,810 --> 00:21:42,180 father Hall of Fame Award 2015 Quite a while ago, and then 313 00:21:42,180 --> 00:21:45,360 unlike him, okay, I kind of understand why I was asked and 314 00:21:45,360 --> 00:21:48,420 Dave Winer and a couple other people. But so what are all how 315 00:21:48,420 --> 00:21:50,910 does all this other than I just tried to understand what the 316 00:21:50,910 --> 00:21:55,800 criteria is, you know, for an award or a Hall of Fame. And I 317 00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:59,010 looked it up this year, because, of course, I was asked again, I 318 00:21:59,010 --> 00:22:01,410 did not participate in beauty contests. I also don't tell 319 00:22:01,410 --> 00:22:05,640 anyone which app I use over the other. The Hall of Fame 320 00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:09,120 eligibility, the criterion for entry into the Hall of Fame is a 321 00:22:09,120 --> 00:22:12,510 combination of mainstream popularity, being considered a 322 00:22:12,510 --> 00:22:16,590 great podcast or contributor to the industry by their peers, or 323 00:22:16,650 --> 00:22:20,340 or excelling in the medium of podcasting, as well as having 324 00:22:20,340 --> 00:22:24,330 historical significance in a positive manner. Candidates 325 00:22:24,330 --> 00:22:27,060 should have something to offer in all three of the categories 326 00:22:27,060 --> 00:22:30,540 mentioned or be so outstanding in one or two, they deserve 327 00:22:30,540 --> 00:22:35,040 inclusion. And to be eligible, a nominee must have completed five 328 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:37,740 years since their first involvement in the medium. But 329 00:22:37,740 --> 00:22:40,410 longevity should not be considered a qualification in of 330 00:22:40,410 --> 00:22:46,830 itself. So I'm not I'm not quite sure how that works. But I was 331 00:22:46,830 --> 00:22:51,690 happy to see Dave Slusher. inducted into the Hall of Fame. 332 00:22:52,050 --> 00:22:54,600 I think the only that I knew of some of the other names but Dave 333 00:22:54,600 --> 00:23:00,030 Slusher, who had evil genius Chronicles he definitely was 334 00:23:00,060 --> 00:23:03,750 early in the development of podcasting, he was key he was 335 00:23:03,750 --> 00:23:07,560 there and a key part of the feedback loop. But when I look 336 00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:17,400 at these these criteria, or criterion as they say tell me 337 00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,010 why Joe Rogan is not in the podcasting Hall of Fame. 338 00:23:21,660 --> 00:23:24,450 He he is a wonder he is he has created 339 00:23:24,450 --> 00:23:32,340 an entire format that is now replicated by mainstream it is 340 00:23:32,370 --> 00:23:37,050 it is the largest podcast by far he has brought more people to 341 00:23:37,050 --> 00:23:42,240 podcasting than I have. He has spawned more entertaining 342 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:52,620 podcasts that I can count so let's stop this shit. Politics 343 00:23:52,620 --> 00:23:56,040 should get out and let's just look at it as sport 344 00:23:58,650 --> 00:24:02,280 you can now play in honor of this segment you can now play 345 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,710 the greatest ISO in the history of ISOs 346 00:24:04,950 --> 00:24:09,030 Okay, is it the one I think it is? The only one okay here we go 347 00:24:09,120 --> 00:24:18,330 podcast canceled was that that's that's some that's that's where 348 00:24:18,330 --> 00:24:19,530 I go to the whale. I'm not 349 00:24:19,830 --> 00:24:23,640 revealing. Oh, okay. Oh, well hold on a second since since 350 00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:24,810 we're playing it that way. 351 00:24:25,649 --> 00:24:29,099 Loose. Mm hmm. Yeah, 352 00:24:29,190 --> 00:24:33,570 I got my own well, brother. Let's bring in our guest board 353 00:24:33,570 --> 00:24:37,470 members for today. They are the the two head honchos. The only 354 00:24:37,470 --> 00:24:40,800 men that count over the odd that hated if I said that. They are 355 00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:43,680 the men behind Buzzsprout. Ladies and gentlemen, please 356 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:46,890 welcome back to the board meeting. Tom Rossi and Kevin 357 00:24:46,890 --> 00:24:47,280 Finn. 358 00:24:48,150 --> 00:24:49,560 Hey guys, thanks for having us. 359 00:24:49,740 --> 00:24:50,910 Hey, guys, good to be here. 360 00:24:50,940 --> 00:24:54,510 Oh my god. You both actually did you tube openers. Great. Hey 361 00:24:54,510 --> 00:24:55,140 guys, 362 00:24:55,890 --> 00:24:57,810 guys, like and subscribe. 363 00:24:59,340 --> 00:25:04,440 Like Button I just got this got this picture of of swinging the 364 00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:07,410 book boardroom door open in Kevin's Kevin's here with a half 365 00:25:07,410 --> 00:25:08,790 eaten donut and a cup of coffee 366 00:25:13,559 --> 00:25:16,169 guys, I'm glad I was, you know, I was wanting to have y'all back 367 00:25:16,169 --> 00:25:21,449 home because there's so much going on and the last time. This 368 00:25:21,449 --> 00:25:26,189 is funny. This is funny how much of a cycle this is the last time 369 00:25:26,219 --> 00:25:32,309 that you guys were on the show. I had COVID Now, Adam has COVID 370 00:25:32,309 --> 00:25:40,109 Hey, wait a minute. And and the the first time we hit you out of 371 00:25:40,109 --> 00:25:43,199 the blue with value for value reveal in the lightning stuff. 372 00:25:43,709 --> 00:25:46,859 Yeah. It was like a deer in the headlights. What the heck just 373 00:25:46,859 --> 00:25:53,459 happened? And then yet just yesterday. Kevin put bus cast on 374 00:25:53,459 --> 00:25:57,119 the value for value with the value blog. All right, finally 375 00:25:57,119 --> 00:25:58,019 boost buzz gas. 376 00:25:58,050 --> 00:26:01,560 Oh, so Right. And so we'll give you a nice healthy slice of 377 00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:04,140 today's value block for the 2.0 show. 378 00:26:04,439 --> 00:26:07,229 Yes, we will. Yeah, you will be in our episode level split. 379 00:26:07,260 --> 00:26:11,700 That's right. It's like Oprah's book club. Only different. Yes. 380 00:26:12,570 --> 00:26:15,480 You'll get some SATs and you'll get some sass. 381 00:26:16,020 --> 00:26:19,710 Yeah. And I've been to school on the value for value payments all 382 00:26:19,710 --> 00:26:22,470 week. And so that was the last to do on my list was to make 383 00:26:22,470 --> 00:26:26,100 sure buzz cast was lightning enabled. 384 00:26:26,910 --> 00:26:29,520 Yeah, we were trying to figure out the problem with you can't 385 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:32,280 get your list grams out of telegram though. So trying to 386 00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:33,120 figure that out. I thought 387 00:26:33,120 --> 00:26:37,110 that I thought that Satoshi stream that didn't help pioneer 388 00:26:37,110 --> 00:26:38,460 that How come that doesn't work? 389 00:26:39,300 --> 00:26:42,450 It does work because people are using it. I just we're we're 390 00:26:42,450 --> 00:26:45,330 missing something. I don't use the tissue industry myself. So I 391 00:26:45,330 --> 00:26:49,170 don't know. Like I'm not the I'm not the guru there. But I posted 392 00:26:49,170 --> 00:26:51,060 in there to help Kevin. Yeah, I 393 00:26:51,060 --> 00:26:53,550 see the boost coming through. But I can't get the contents of 394 00:26:53,550 --> 00:26:54,180 the message. 395 00:26:54,270 --> 00:26:56,880 I think there's there's some way I thought there was some way you 396 00:26:56,880 --> 00:27:00,930 could trigger the bot to then tell it telegram you the message 397 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:02,700 with the booster Graham but I could be wrong. 398 00:27:03,420 --> 00:27:05,730 Yeah, he sounds right. I just don't know the right command. 399 00:27:06,180 --> 00:27:09,450 He sent me a message saying, hey, I need you know, I need 400 00:27:09,450 --> 00:27:14,070 this reason. I need my post cast reset so that I can re register 401 00:27:14,070 --> 00:27:19,290 in podcast or wallet. So went in there to reset it. And it was 402 00:27:19,290 --> 00:27:22,110 literally the first record in the database, because that's the 403 00:27:22,110 --> 00:27:28,230 day that we did it. And you Oh, yeah. And so I reset it. And you 404 00:27:28,230 --> 00:27:31,410 know, what I wanted to ask you, you know, what I wanted to say 405 00:27:31,410 --> 00:27:36,060 was, you know, Kevin, did you know that you can email support 406 00:27:36,060 --> 00:27:38,760 at bas cast calm and have them put your value book in there for 407 00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:38,880 you? 408 00:27:44,610 --> 00:27:48,630 She said he sent in the email to support@buzzsprout.com and asked 409 00:27:48,630 --> 00:27:51,990 for the value block to be added. And then it gives us the ticket 410 00:27:51,990 --> 00:27:55,230 gets assigned to me because I'm the one that does. What's 411 00:27:55,260 --> 00:27:56,310 happening here. 412 00:27:56,820 --> 00:27:58,050 I'm losing my mind. 413 00:27:58,260 --> 00:28:00,510 Yeah, just trying to do everything by the book. Well, 414 00:28:00,540 --> 00:28:03,720 the thing is, though, I don't know that you understand what an 415 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,960 accomplishment it is to get Kevin to do that. Because he is 416 00:28:06,990 --> 00:28:11,370 you know, he's the UI UX guy. And for him to make it through 417 00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:15,210 the obstacles means that we've come a long way in setting it up 418 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:17,370 that he's able to do that. So that's great. 419 00:28:17,820 --> 00:28:21,930 I love it. I'm terrified when somebody says he's the UI UX 420 00:28:21,930 --> 00:28:27,240 guy. And then in the didn't have to think about your disgust as 421 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:30,930 you went through the podcast wallet calm process, with with 422 00:28:30,930 --> 00:28:33,750 the horrible the UI that i Hey, man, 423 00:28:33,750 --> 00:28:38,100 hey, I live. I've been living with that kind of UX UI for over 424 00:28:38,100 --> 00:28:41,460 a decade. And I love my Dave Jones work. 425 00:28:41,610 --> 00:28:45,810 It is the user it is the user interface equivalent of a beat 426 00:28:45,810 --> 00:28:50,190 up f1 fit 1983 F 150. That is that is exactly what you get. 427 00:28:50,550 --> 00:28:50,880 Hey, 428 00:28:50,969 --> 00:28:53,669 it worked. It worked. I was I was delighted though, after I 429 00:28:53,669 --> 00:28:56,459 set everything up. Then I found like you've got little three 430 00:28:56,459 --> 00:28:58,889 little icons in a row in the middle one I think is edit and I 431 00:28:58,889 --> 00:29:03,179 can edit my value block on the podcast or wallet. Yeah, but I 432 00:29:03,179 --> 00:29:06,929 did. I was telling Dave earlier that I did it after I'd already 433 00:29:06,989 --> 00:29:10,049 manually updated my value block and sent it to Tom. And then I 434 00:29:10,049 --> 00:29:13,319 was annoyed because the podcast index value block that they 435 00:29:13,319 --> 00:29:15,149 wrote out the tags were in a different order than the one I 436 00:29:15,149 --> 00:29:20,399 met. My OCD was triggered big time. 437 00:29:20,670 --> 00:29:24,240 Yeah, that's like a you know, nobody sees that. Kevin. It's 438 00:29:24,270 --> 00:29:25,950 it's all his interview brother. 439 00:29:26,190 --> 00:29:28,380 But I know I know. It's still that way. So I've got 440 00:29:29,370 --> 00:29:35,910 Yeah, so you have done a I mean a ton of stuff you you've got. I 441 00:29:35,910 --> 00:29:38,490 mean, tell me tell me the tags you've got now you obviously 442 00:29:38,490 --> 00:29:43,590 logged obviously, chapters. You are in the GUID like 443 00:29:43,710 --> 00:29:48,750 book Hold on. If I if I can just interrupt for one second. I just 444 00:29:48,750 --> 00:29:52,860 want to thank you guys. I mean, because we're you know, talking 445 00:29:52,860 --> 00:29:55,590 about the first entry in the database and going back and you 446 00:29:55,590 --> 00:29:58,140 know, the first time you gave COVID to us and all that and 447 00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,670 just reminisce Listening. And you know, look at where we've 448 00:30:02,670 --> 00:30:05,400 come from not knowing each other, to now having a 449 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:08,580 conversation like, Man, you've implemented so many tags, where 450 00:30:08,580 --> 00:30:11,100 are you? I mean, I just want to stop and recognize that and 451 00:30:11,100 --> 00:30:11,910 thank you for it. 452 00:30:13,349 --> 00:30:17,609 Well, thank you guys. It's it's been great to see the things 453 00:30:17,609 --> 00:30:19,319 that we've been able to accomplish in such a short 454 00:30:19,349 --> 00:30:23,249 amount of time. I mean, it's, it's benefiting the whole 455 00:30:23,249 --> 00:30:27,389 industry for which we are a part of and so we're really thankful 456 00:30:27,389 --> 00:30:28,589 for the work that you guys have done. 457 00:30:29,009 --> 00:30:33,719 Yeah. Yeah. What do y'all support? Now? Y'all see y'all 458 00:30:33,719 --> 00:30:35,999 have good down. 459 00:30:36,149 --> 00:30:40,619 Yeah, tag wise we do. Transcript locked funding chapters, sound 460 00:30:40,619 --> 00:30:46,649 bytes, location, person, Gu ID, and value. And value is not in 461 00:30:46,649 --> 00:30:48,839 the UI. That's a support request. 462 00:30:50,160 --> 00:30:51,540 That's robot Tom, just send a 463 00:30:51,870 --> 00:30:56,100 robot, like go straight to Tom, which is a valuable thing to 464 00:30:56,100 --> 00:30:59,340 know. Because you can just put in a phony value blog request, 465 00:30:59,340 --> 00:31:01,410 and then just really ask him anything you want. 466 00:31:02,850 --> 00:31:05,790 What's great is I got to test that value system yesterday. And 467 00:31:05,790 --> 00:31:08,520 I think he had an in within about 10 minutes, email. And 468 00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:10,560 within 10 minutes, he wrote back and said, I'll say, 469 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:14,280 Wow, that's really credible. It's really cool, man. 470 00:31:15,300 --> 00:31:20,790 And so what you've got, you've got an on the chat on the 471 00:31:20,790 --> 00:31:25,260 chapter front. You pray Eve, I think y'all tweaked that at one 472 00:31:25,260 --> 00:31:28,650 point. And now you've got most everything that chapters can do 473 00:31:28,650 --> 00:31:31,200 in there. I mean, not not literally everything. And like, 474 00:31:31,230 --> 00:31:33,540 there's some other stuff that's kind of obscure, like you can 475 00:31:33,540 --> 00:31:36,540 add locations to chapters, but he's got the main ones. And 476 00:31:36,540 --> 00:31:40,440 you've got the you got pictures. Do you have links? 477 00:31:40,620 --> 00:31:44,370 Yes, we have links and pictures. We launched it with just links. 478 00:31:44,940 --> 00:31:47,400 But we came back later and added images. Yeah, 479 00:31:47,550 --> 00:31:48,600 yeah, that's right. Oh, yeah. 480 00:31:48,630 --> 00:31:51,930 How much overhead is that? How much overhead? Did that add for 481 00:31:51,930 --> 00:31:55,290 you with the images? Making? Does it make a dent? 482 00:31:56,070 --> 00:31:59,880 No. I mean, the goal with chapters, right is that it 483 00:31:59,880 --> 00:32:03,660 should reduce overhead, because we're moving out of putting all 484 00:32:03,660 --> 00:32:08,400 that inside of metadata, making it a link in the RSS feed. So 485 00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:12,000 this is a great example of where, you know, it's benefiting 486 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:14,790 both Buzzsprout in the podcast index for us working together, 487 00:32:14,790 --> 00:32:18,660 because eventually we hope that more people will respect the 488 00:32:18,660 --> 00:32:22,500 chapters tag and stop pulling meta information out of the mp3, 489 00:32:22,530 --> 00:32:25,170 right, which will make everybody's life better. 490 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:31,320 Yeah. Did y'all see that Google? drop their namespace? Evidently, 491 00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:34,830 evidently, they just abandon it. And Google abandoned 492 00:32:34,830 --> 00:32:35,280 something. 493 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,310 No, that never happened. They say 494 00:32:38,310 --> 00:32:40,320 it was a sunset. It was a beautiful sunset. 495 00:32:40,650 --> 00:32:45,450 It was yes. Like, no, you had to see that. Yeah, I was glad to 496 00:32:45,450 --> 00:32:49,020 see that. I was glad to see in, get your thoughts on it, that, 497 00:32:49,110 --> 00:32:52,770 that they not only abandoned it, which I thought it was. It was 498 00:32:52,770 --> 00:32:56,430 kind of a waste of everybody's time, but that they also took 499 00:32:56,430 --> 00:32:59,280 the documentation off and appear to be saying like, Look, don't 500 00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:01,350 even use it because a lot of times those things get 501 00:33:01,350 --> 00:33:05,430 abandoned. But then the the the information about it stays up 502 00:33:05,430 --> 00:33:07,440 online, like, like Symbian 503 00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:08,490 iOS II? 504 00:33:09,060 --> 00:33:12,750 Yeah. Yeah. As opposed to Apple who took the documentation down 505 00:33:12,810 --> 00:33:17,430 before they stopped. Doing spec is still not published. 506 00:33:17,460 --> 00:33:21,000 I'm still looking for the AppleScript documentation. 507 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,880 Honestly. It was never findable. 508 00:33:24,390 --> 00:33:27,870 Yeah, try it try to Google for the Apple podcast or 509 00:33:27,870 --> 00:33:31,890 recommendations like the best practices. It's it's unfixable? 510 00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:34,500 Yeah, it's completely unfindable. Yeah, 511 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,860 I think the link in their, in their DTD that you put in the 512 00:33:37,860 --> 00:33:41,520 top of every RSS feed for podcasting goes to nowhere. It's 513 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:42,180 a portal for 514 00:33:44,100 --> 00:33:47,760 the standard for the for a podcast RSS feed includes a link 515 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:48,840 to a forum for like, 516 00:33:51,090 --> 00:33:53,010 Hey, we're moving it forward. 517 00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:57,300 Yes. Well, this is what I wanted to kind of get into a little bit 518 00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:04,230 because I want I want to really opinion here. The Google 519 00:34:04,230 --> 00:34:08,490 namespace probably should have never existed, so that's fine. 520 00:34:08,910 --> 00:34:12,420 But now what we're left with really is for now obviously, 521 00:34:12,420 --> 00:34:15,090 there's others I understand that there's W core, there's there's 522 00:34:15,090 --> 00:34:23,880 things but as far as main stream act, actively used, that's not 523 00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:26,430 the right word. I'm trying to say. Anyway, as far as important 524 00:34:26,430 --> 00:34:31,200 to podcasting namespaces go right now. You have iTunes and 525 00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:37,440 you have the podcast namespace. I am still have a deeply held 526 00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:43,890 belief that the podcast namespace should be the single, 527 00:34:44,100 --> 00:34:48,360 holistic, fully baked namespace that incorporates everything. 528 00:34:48,900 --> 00:34:53,250 Now, because iTunes belongs to a company, it doesn't belong to 529 00:34:53,250 --> 00:34:59,850 podcasting. Do so that makes me think that what we shouldn't be 530 00:34:59,850 --> 00:35:06,810 doing Long Term is incorporating the iTunes tags into the podcast 531 00:35:06,810 --> 00:35:11,610 namespace tags, so that they have equal representation. So 532 00:35:11,610 --> 00:35:13,770 that some at some point in the future, let's say it's 10 years 533 00:35:13,770 --> 00:35:16,950 from now, some point in the future people can just drop in 534 00:35:16,950 --> 00:35:20,640 the podcast namespace and have all of it and not have to have 535 00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:25,650 a, the the open source podcasting namespace. And this 536 00:35:25,650 --> 00:35:29,160 other namespace is owned and operated, controlled by the 537 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:30,180 largest company in the world. 538 00:35:30,990 --> 00:35:35,640 Yeah, I mean, it's reminiscent of what happened with HTML on 539 00:35:35,640 --> 00:35:38,190 the web, right, with Internet Explorer, and Microsoft creating 540 00:35:38,190 --> 00:35:41,520 all their own standards. And I think we reached, you know, 541 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:46,410 Pinnacle garbage with like, ie six, or IE seven. And that is 542 00:35:46,410 --> 00:35:49,740 where the W three C as an organization came around and 543 00:35:49,740 --> 00:35:52,800 said, the web is bigger than Internet Explorer. And there 544 00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,380 needs to be some standards, and they started working on, I think 545 00:35:55,380 --> 00:35:59,100 it was first x HTML and Bordado, transitional and for Dotto one. 546 00:35:59,100 --> 00:36:01,620 But then when they came out, they finally put a really good 547 00:36:01,620 --> 00:36:06,840 spec together with html5. And at the same time, Chrome launch on 548 00:36:06,870 --> 00:36:09,840 latched on to that or the Chromium project or whatever. 549 00:36:10,470 --> 00:36:11,880 Anyway, we don't need to go through the whole history of 550 00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:14,700 what happened in the web. But it's, it's, it's similar to what 551 00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,220 needs to happen in podcasting. So I would agree with what 552 00:36:17,220 --> 00:36:19,620 you're saying the position that you're taking, and I don't know 553 00:36:19,620 --> 00:36:22,770 that. I mean, who knows what goes on behind the walls at 554 00:36:22,770 --> 00:36:26,430 Cupertino, and what their their motives were when they came out 555 00:36:26,430 --> 00:36:29,670 with a spec. But you can't really point a finger at them 556 00:36:29,670 --> 00:36:32,100 and say, You guys shouldn't be doing this when the community 557 00:36:32,370 --> 00:36:35,910 when podcasting as a whole hasn't offered an alternative. 558 00:36:36,510 --> 00:36:39,300 Yeah. And so I think that is the direction that we need to move. 559 00:36:39,630 --> 00:36:42,180 And then when we get to that point, then we can, you know, 560 00:36:42,180 --> 00:36:44,130 start to point the finger to him and say, Hey, we really don't 561 00:36:44,130 --> 00:36:46,650 need you guys providing your own namespace anymore. This one 562 00:36:46,650 --> 00:36:49,680 covers everything that you have, and more so and you can support 563 00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:51,030 as much or as little as you want. 564 00:36:51,060 --> 00:36:55,410 Can it can ask the question. So does this mean that we will 565 00:36:55,410 --> 00:37:02,940 replicate tags that are in the iTunes namespace that will 566 00:37:02,940 --> 00:37:06,750 replicate them in the podcast namespace? does that also mean 567 00:37:06,750 --> 00:37:09,810 it'll have the iTunes colon block? I mean, will it have 568 00:37:09,810 --> 00:37:11,550 iTunes in there? It won't have that. 569 00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:14,790 No, it will just be like, like, for instance, in the podcast 570 00:37:14,790 --> 00:37:19,350 namespace, there is no, there is no block tag. There is no 571 00:37:19,350 --> 00:37:25,260 podcast colon block, right? Yet. There is a proposal for one. The 572 00:37:25,260 --> 00:37:29,730 iTunes does have iTunes colon block. So we would just when we 573 00:37:29,730 --> 00:37:34,110 implement podcast colon block, that could be a direct 574 00:37:34,110 --> 00:37:36,510 replacement for iTunes block. And we would do that we would 575 00:37:36,510 --> 00:37:39,960 just go through and say, you know, okay, here's this, this 576 00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:40,590 tag sheets. 577 00:37:40,590 --> 00:37:45,210 And here's, here's my prediction. Google saw that 578 00:37:45,210 --> 00:37:48,600 Google knows what we're doing. They dropped it, they gave up 579 00:37:48,630 --> 00:37:51,450 they're fine. I think they're fine. If they do anything, 580 00:37:51,450 --> 00:37:55,380 they'll use the podcast namespace. I think Apple 581 00:37:55,380 --> 00:38:01,290 capitulated. It, you know, a lot of things happened in tandem, I 582 00:38:01,290 --> 00:38:06,900 had a conversation with the Oh, my God, I forgot his name 583 00:38:06,900 --> 00:38:11,580 already. Games, bugs, yeah, bugs. And I said, You're crazy. 584 00:38:12,780 --> 00:38:14,580 And he said, That's a great way to start a conversation. 585 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:19,740 And of course, they said what you do, and it's crazy, don't do 586 00:38:19,740 --> 00:38:23,190 that. And so they went all in on the subscriptions because I 587 00:38:23,190 --> 00:38:27,810 thought that was going to be the big play against Spotify. For 588 00:38:27,810 --> 00:38:30,870 all intents and purposes, I think that's failed, but they 589 00:38:30,870 --> 00:38:34,740 turned around screwed up what they were doing kind of okay. 590 00:38:35,070 --> 00:38:38,400 And I think that they would probably die. Dave, you and I 591 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:41,160 spoke about it. I think they welcome the fact that podcasting 592 00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,370 was going to be safe over there were the nut jobs. So they could 593 00:38:44,370 --> 00:38:48,150 go and drop it. They dropped it in there doing of course they 594 00:38:48,150 --> 00:38:50,280 put someone on to fix the problems. I don't know if 595 00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,790 they're all fixed right now. I don't think they I really don't 596 00:38:53,790 --> 00:38:58,200 think they would mind dropping it all together and saying you 597 00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:01,920 know what, use this we don't want to maintain it. It's just 598 00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:06,630 an it's just an annoying add on for us at this point. And but 599 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:11,280 I'm so confident that I love making the annual bet with James 600 00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:14,160 Cridland, I will keep winning money from him. They will never 601 00:39:14,190 --> 00:39:20,310 release iTunes or podcast app on on Windows or Android. I mean, 602 00:39:20,610 --> 00:39:24,000 because they they show no support for it. They don't care 603 00:39:25,829 --> 00:39:28,379 for for the four of four of the namespace and 604 00:39:29,940 --> 00:39:31,560 404 of the namespace 605 00:39:31,589 --> 00:39:32,339 Yes, yes. 606 00:39:32,370 --> 00:39:35,580 Seriously, I I think that's a great idea. I mean, I was a 607 00:39:35,580 --> 00:39:39,090 little concerned because I didn't want any Apple glue in 608 00:39:39,090 --> 00:39:41,880 the in the namespace. But if if we're just replicating, you 609 00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:44,340 know, the tags that we don't have or work a little 610 00:39:44,340 --> 00:39:46,440 differently. Yeah, this seems like a great drop in 611 00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:48,480 replacement, said he very expertly. 612 00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:51,480 Yeah, and I think they've already demonstrated that 613 00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:54,480 they're willing to do it like they have moved away from a few 614 00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:58,830 of the iTunes proprietary tags. I used to have a tag. That was 615 00:39:58,890 --> 00:40:01,710 no description. call an iTunes or something iTunes go in 616 00:40:01,710 --> 00:40:04,290 description whichever direction it was. But in their latest 617 00:40:04,290 --> 00:40:06,690 documentation in the latest release of their app, now 618 00:40:06,690 --> 00:40:09,120 they're just reading the podcast documentation or not 619 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:10,590 documentation description. 620 00:40:10,740 --> 00:40:14,010 Can I ask you guys did you do you see a lot of people doing 621 00:40:14,250 --> 00:40:17,220 private stuff at the subscription stuff at Apple? I 622 00:40:17,220 --> 00:40:20,490 mean, just not necessarily your clients Makino is a real uptake 623 00:40:20,490 --> 00:40:22,890 on that. I mean, I'm, I'm just saying I don't see it. But 624 00:40:23,250 --> 00:40:26,100 no, we don't see it either. Yeah, a few of our bigger 625 00:40:26,100 --> 00:40:28,830 podcasts are doing it. It's still a lot of hurdles to jump 626 00:40:28,830 --> 00:40:32,280 through to just be able to monetize one subset of your 627 00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:33,780 audience. Course 628 00:40:33,810 --> 00:40:36,780 da. Yeah, 629 00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:43,260 dude, I don't think just from you know, our chats in the past 630 00:40:43,260 --> 00:40:46,650 and stuff. Tom, I don't. I don't think y'all really have a taste 631 00:40:46,650 --> 00:40:51,540 for the whole private feed subscription model. Or at least 632 00:40:51,540 --> 00:40:54,210 if you do, it's not, it doesn't seem like it's something that 633 00:40:54,210 --> 00:40:55,920 you're, you know, aggressive about. 634 00:40:56,579 --> 00:40:58,889 Yeah, it's definitely not something that we're aggressive 635 00:40:58,889 --> 00:41:02,129 about, because we think it is just one way, right? It's just 636 00:41:02,129 --> 00:41:06,329 one way for a podcaster to potentially control the way that 637 00:41:06,329 --> 00:41:08,879 they want their their podcast to be consumed right through a 638 00:41:08,879 --> 00:41:11,369 subscription. And that's how they're gonna monetize it or for 639 00:41:11,369 --> 00:41:14,999 whatever reason, but it's not the end all be all. It's not. 640 00:41:15,209 --> 00:41:18,629 It's not the only way. And I think that's, that's kind of our 641 00:41:18,629 --> 00:41:19,349 position on it. 642 00:41:19,530 --> 00:41:22,200 Yeah, I like, you know, um, I don't know if you guys have ever 643 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,170 listened to the dithering podcast with John Gruber. And 644 00:41:26,370 --> 00:41:28,830 no, I haven't No, no. Okay. Well, 645 00:41:28,860 --> 00:41:31,410 they do a I mean, it's subscription only, right. So 646 00:41:31,410 --> 00:41:33,960 they've got an episode that they put out as a, you know, a 647 00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:36,420 freebie teaser. And then they just if you want to listen to 648 00:41:36,420 --> 00:41:39,090 their podcast, you pay him $5 a month, and you get three 649 00:41:39,090 --> 00:41:42,030 episodes every week, 15 minutes an episode, and I subscribed 650 00:41:42,030 --> 00:41:44,250 paying $5 A month because for me, it's worth that I enjoy that 651 00:41:44,250 --> 00:41:49,170 show. But the that's that's one subscription model and it works 652 00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:52,050 for them. And it works for me as listener, but the idea that 653 00:41:52,050 --> 00:41:56,040 somebody would do a regular show, and then do premium or 654 00:41:56,130 --> 00:41:58,860 special episodes and put that behind the paywall to me doesn't 655 00:41:58,860 --> 00:42:01,260 make any sense. Why are you going to take your absolute best 656 00:42:01,260 --> 00:42:03,840 stuff and hide that from anybody who's not willing to pay you? 657 00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:07,950 Yeah, yeah, this is the best stuff. And this is the stuff 658 00:42:07,980 --> 00:42:10,950 worth paying for. Go ahead and put that out there. And so 659 00:42:10,950 --> 00:42:14,130 people can find you discover you find value in what you're doing, 660 00:42:14,130 --> 00:42:15,960 and then give them the ability to pay. 661 00:42:15,990 --> 00:42:18,570 And that that's like what you were talking about. Kevin, you 662 00:42:18,570 --> 00:42:22,380 talked about this on buzz cast, maybe a couple weeks ago, but 663 00:42:22,380 --> 00:42:25,680 just talking about, that's great for somebody who has a following 664 00:42:25,710 --> 00:42:28,380 Sam Harris as a podcast that I listened to as well. And he has 665 00:42:28,380 --> 00:42:31,500 a subscription model where he'll have a limited episode that's 666 00:42:31,500 --> 00:42:33,270 available to the public. But if you want to hear the whole 667 00:42:33,270 --> 00:42:34,890 thing, you've got to go subscribe, same thing. But if 668 00:42:34,890 --> 00:42:37,920 you've got a following like Sam Harris, or the dithering 669 00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:40,200 podcast, then you can do that. But what about the guy who's 670 00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:44,850 building the following, if the only offer for him for for being 671 00:42:44,850 --> 00:42:48,660 able to monetize his podcast is to grow a massive following, and 672 00:42:48,660 --> 00:42:51,720 then turn it all off to turn it into a subscription model? It 673 00:42:51,720 --> 00:42:54,180 just, it's just not gonna work for everybody. There's no stop. 674 00:42:54,180 --> 00:42:57,990 A lot of people from being able to get into podcast is nothing 675 00:42:57,990 --> 00:43:02,340 like starting a podcast telling a few buddies, and then within 676 00:43:02,340 --> 00:43:08,430 five minutes of publishing your episode. There's nothing like 677 00:43:08,430 --> 00:43:11,610 that feeling. Yeah, there's nothing like it, you get those 678 00:43:11,610 --> 00:43:15,570 Satoshis coming in, be like you just have I'm happy. 679 00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,800 When we, when we first launched a bus route, I remember, it 680 00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,140 would send us an email Buzzsprout would actually send 681 00:43:22,140 --> 00:43:25,380 Kevin and I an email on time someone published an episode. 682 00:43:25,500 --> 00:43:29,280 And he thought it was so awesome. Because we made it so 683 00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:31,980 easy. Anybody could just take a recording, they didn't have to 684 00:43:31,980 --> 00:43:33,900 know anything about mp3. They'd have to know anything about 685 00:43:33,900 --> 00:43:36,360 encoding, they could just take any audio recording and release 686 00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:39,270 a podcast. And we were so excited. We would get an email 687 00:43:39,300 --> 00:43:41,460 so that we could go in and listen and see you know what's 688 00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:45,570 out there. Yeah. And it's just it's just crazy. Like you said, 689 00:43:45,570 --> 00:43:48,990 just how how easy it is for someone right now to be able to 690 00:43:48,990 --> 00:43:51,540 get with their buddies record something and get it out there 691 00:43:51,540 --> 00:43:52,590 to the world in no time. 692 00:43:53,159 --> 00:43:57,419 Well, I was thinking about the sort of the pay wall type deal 693 00:43:57,419 --> 00:43:59,429 because I've thought about this in the past and we've come up 694 00:43:59,429 --> 00:44:03,419 with with some ideas and then actually Mike over at Red Circle 695 00:44:04,979 --> 00:44:07,409 posted on the on the master on the other day about this thing 696 00:44:07,409 --> 00:44:09,689 called pod pass that I'd never heard of it. If you 697 00:44:09,689 --> 00:44:12,089 really are that you are really the slot of the hosting 698 00:44:12,089 --> 00:44:16,709 companies, aren't you? You lay down with everybody, man. Yeah, 699 00:44:16,709 --> 00:44:17,849 always talking to him. 700 00:44:18,630 --> 00:44:23,790 And I was like, I've never even heard of this thing. It's like 701 00:44:23,790 --> 00:44:27,660 this fully fleshed out thing from those radio public, I 702 00:44:27,660 --> 00:44:32,460 think. Anyways, this fully fleshed out way for like, apps 703 00:44:32,460 --> 00:44:36,360 to pass through a subscription thing and get a token back. And 704 00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:42,030 so there's been all these all these concepts around how to do 705 00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:46,200 open subscriptions where you don't have to have like a 706 00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:50,580 separate private feed and all this jazz. And so I keep 707 00:44:50,580 --> 00:44:53,940 bouncing back and forth between is that really like I don't, I 708 00:44:53,940 --> 00:44:56,310 don't know whether that's a really valuable use of time 709 00:44:56,310 --> 00:45:01,410 because just just like you said, Kevin, I don't Just the whole 710 00:45:01,410 --> 00:45:05,520 notion that you're going to take, you're going to make your 711 00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:10,650 content, not listen to people, by most people. I mean, I get 712 00:45:10,650 --> 00:45:13,620 it, I understand the monetization of that, of that. I 713 00:45:13,620 --> 00:45:18,030 mean, I get I understand the concept clearly. But I don't 714 00:45:18,030 --> 00:45:20,610 know, it's just a little weird. And I'm wondering if it's if 715 00:45:20,610 --> 00:45:24,750 it's even worth spending time on to come up with an open source, 716 00:45:24,780 --> 00:45:27,030 like an open standard for paywalls? 717 00:45:29,099 --> 00:45:32,429 Isn't there already something like that? Or there was 718 00:45:32,429 --> 00:45:36,839 something that was supposed to do that for? like Spotify is 719 00:45:36,839 --> 00:45:38,159 open version 720 00:45:38,159 --> 00:45:43,049 open access? Yeah, we've got all these ideas. Here's the other 721 00:45:43,049 --> 00:45:43,619 thing that bothers 722 00:45:43,619 --> 00:45:45,419 me. But it's your job to do that. 723 00:45:46,769 --> 00:45:51,659 So that's what I'm not sure that it's, it has that has that model 724 00:45:51,659 --> 00:45:56,159 shown that it's sustainable for enough percentage of podcast is 725 00:45:56,159 --> 00:45:58,379 worth spending all the time and effort to do? 726 00:45:59,940 --> 00:46:03,450 Yeah, I mean, my recommendation to our customers has always been 727 00:46:03,570 --> 00:46:07,410 that you it's not until you get to a pretty big like until your 728 00:46:07,410 --> 00:46:10,920 following is pretty big. The challenge with subscriptions is 729 00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:12,870 that you're doing the same amount of work to create this 730 00:46:12,900 --> 00:46:15,600 alternative content, premium content, bonus episodes, 731 00:46:15,630 --> 00:46:18,240 whatever it is that you decide to do, whether you have one 732 00:46:18,240 --> 00:46:22,110 subscriber or you have 50,000. And so if it takes an extra 10 733 00:46:22,110 --> 00:46:24,870 or 15 hours of your week to go ahead and create this content, 734 00:46:25,110 --> 00:46:28,110 are you doing it for $5? For that one person? Are you doing 735 00:46:28,110 --> 00:46:32,370 it for $50,000? For you know, all of them? And so if you have, 736 00:46:32,430 --> 00:46:35,490 if you're huge, then maybe it makes sense for you to explore 737 00:46:35,490 --> 00:46:38,160 something like that. But the majority of podcasters are not 738 00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:39,810 huge. It's not 739 00:46:39,810 --> 00:46:43,080 it's not a starter, starter kit type idea. 740 00:46:43,469 --> 00:46:43,949 That's right. 741 00:46:44,369 --> 00:46:47,039 It's almost like a lid right? As soon as you put a subscription. 742 00:46:47,039 --> 00:46:49,109 As soon as you put a paywall in front of your podcast, you just 743 00:46:49,109 --> 00:46:52,169 put a lid on your growth, right? It's not going to grow beyond 744 00:46:52,169 --> 00:46:55,379 probably where you are, unless you've got some other avenue of 745 00:46:55,589 --> 00:46:58,439 getting people to find out who you are and be interested. 746 00:46:59,309 --> 00:47:01,379 Well, what do you think is interesting is if you solve the 747 00:47:01,379 --> 00:47:05,369 problem for the smaller podcaster, and you solve it in a 748 00:47:05,369 --> 00:47:08,069 way that's scalable, then what you have is a solution for 749 00:47:08,069 --> 00:47:08,579 everybody. 750 00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:11,789 Right? Yes, yes, yeah. And that's what gets us 751 00:47:11,910 --> 00:47:14,580 excited. So I think what subscriptions today, what they 752 00:47:14,580 --> 00:47:17,070 look like is they solved it for the big person, but it doesn't 753 00:47:17,070 --> 00:47:20,310 scale down. But if we do a good job of scaling it, you know, 754 00:47:20,430 --> 00:47:22,530 creating a solution for the small person, I think there's a 755 00:47:22,530 --> 00:47:24,300 better chance that that scales up. 756 00:47:25,230 --> 00:47:28,710 Yeah, cuz you can start if you find the like, that's the value 757 00:47:28,740 --> 00:47:32,370 value as a solution for I mean, you can, there is no barrier, 758 00:47:32,370 --> 00:47:35,040 you just throw it out there. And then as you scale up bigger and 759 00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:37,650 bigger, it just continues to work. I mean, like the the you 760 00:47:37,650 --> 00:47:40,770 don't have to change models, depending on your size. And you 761 00:47:40,770 --> 00:47:44,250 have to do that for advertising revenue to you can't advertise. 762 00:47:44,550 --> 00:47:46,800 I mean, nobody's gonna be interested in advertiser buying 763 00:47:46,830 --> 00:47:52,110 buy ads on a on a show this got 10 listeners, but but you can, 764 00:47:52,590 --> 00:47:55,680 if you have, if you have 10 listeners, and all 10 of those 765 00:47:55,680 --> 00:48:00,090 listeners are willing to give you a value for value, then you 766 00:48:00,090 --> 00:48:03,270 can do that. There's no like, Yeah, I think that's right. 767 00:48:03,270 --> 00:48:06,180 Ultimately, the solution to that, you know, has to be 768 00:48:06,210 --> 00:48:07,140 scalable. Yeah. 769 00:48:07,590 --> 00:48:10,140 You think about the podcaster. And you think about the 770 00:48:10,140 --> 00:48:13,680 listener, neither one of them want the advertisements, right? 771 00:48:13,710 --> 00:48:16,740 The podcaster, doesn't want that he wants the revenue. He wants 772 00:48:16,740 --> 00:48:18,990 to be able to monetize this podcast, but he doesn't want the 773 00:48:18,990 --> 00:48:21,720 advertisement in the middle of his podcast. And the listener 774 00:48:21,720 --> 00:48:25,290 doesn't want that. It's just the monetization strategy that that 775 00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:29,820 they're aware of. Right. And so this idea that if we can find a 776 00:48:29,820 --> 00:48:32,400 monetization strategy that works that doesn't involve 777 00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:35,130 advertising, I mean, it could, but it doesn't have to involve 778 00:48:35,130 --> 00:48:38,190 advertising, but it's something that can scale up with the 779 00:48:38,190 --> 00:48:41,400 podcast. That's, that's the kind of thing that Buzzsprout would 780 00:48:41,400 --> 00:48:42,990 be interested in, because that's what we care about. 781 00:48:44,159 --> 00:48:48,089 That is the worst. The worst aspect of this to me of the 782 00:48:48,089 --> 00:48:51,479 paywall aspect is what I saw the other day. And I mean, you see 783 00:48:51,479 --> 00:48:55,139 this a lot. But I was, I don't know how I ended up on Mamma Mia 784 00:48:55,139 --> 00:48:59,909 his website. I was on their website and 785 00:49:01,079 --> 00:49:02,039 have a musical. 786 00:49:03,330 --> 00:49:09,180 No, not that one. The Australian podcast Oh, oh host or 787 00:49:09,180 --> 00:49:15,510 publishing company or whatever they're in. They have it said, 788 00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:19,800 you can listen to our podcast. But then if you want to, if you 789 00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:23,790 want to get our bonus content, you have to subscribe. And 790 00:49:23,790 --> 00:49:27,570 that's like these extra little small episodes that they put out 791 00:49:28,500 --> 00:49:33,030 in debt. That was like that seems completely backwards to 792 00:49:33,030 --> 00:49:37,530 me. Because it implies that your base product podcast isn't worth 793 00:49:37,530 --> 00:49:40,170 anything in the only thing that you're going to like we want you 794 00:49:40,170 --> 00:49:45,210 to pay so that you can get this this other stuff like it tells 795 00:49:45,210 --> 00:49:48,090 the world it signals to the world that our actual podcast 796 00:49:48,090 --> 00:49:52,320 that everybody listens to isn't very valuable. Am I wrong? 797 00:49:54,119 --> 00:50:00,299 No you're not you're spot on and and all of this is book Back to 798 00:50:00,299 --> 00:50:04,259 my civility when people really really love a product and 799 00:50:04,259 --> 00:50:07,919 they're asked they will support it. It's the same ask for 800 00:50:07,919 --> 00:50:14,099 someone to subscribe to a secret superduper feed and pay $5 A 801 00:50:14,099 --> 00:50:17,999 month extra as it is to say, hey, set up a recurring PayPal 802 00:50:18,509 --> 00:50:24,119 now it's it's it's it's an old it's it's bringing the old 803 00:50:24,119 --> 00:50:30,389 thinking into the new world of paywall I personally, you know, 804 00:50:30,389 --> 00:50:35,009 I think the interruptive advertising model is in its last 805 00:50:35,009 --> 00:50:39,209 days, this is what streaming has streaming television and movies 806 00:50:39,209 --> 00:50:42,989 has taught us everything and everything that is interruptive 807 00:50:42,989 --> 00:50:48,569 advertising is just going down. You know, is it still a long 808 00:50:48,569 --> 00:50:53,099 road for radio to go away, etc. But I think that we're seeing 809 00:50:53,279 --> 00:51:01,169 that is not the best model. And the with, with asking people to 810 00:51:01,169 --> 00:51:05,339 support you, whether it's subscription or value for value, 811 00:51:05,369 --> 00:51:09,899 or bringing food to your door, that can be done with one 812 00:51:09,899 --> 00:51:14,129 listener, you don't need and this is another thing, I just 813 00:51:14,129 --> 00:51:17,339 want to press, the concept of everyone having to I got to grow 814 00:51:17,339 --> 00:51:20,459 my show, I have to grow my show, my show has to grow. It's not 815 00:51:20,459 --> 00:51:29,399 growing. It's not a fucking chia pet. It's so we I think we lose 816 00:51:29,399 --> 00:51:31,769 sight of that often when we're talking about these things. 817 00:51:31,919 --> 00:51:35,519 People just want to podcast for a whole bunch of reasons. And a 818 00:51:35,519 --> 00:51:39,239 lot of them fail. And that's what anchor is all about. 819 00:51:39,239 --> 00:51:42,749 Because there was no real professional. Like, hey, here's 820 00:51:42,749 --> 00:51:45,239 here's a real setup. And you know, it's not just some stupid 821 00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:49,139 app, you've got education, you're the the here, here is 822 00:51:49,169 --> 00:51:53,549 sports, go ahead and create your own. You know, everything else 823 00:51:53,549 --> 00:51:57,239 to me is just ancillary. And should you know, there's enough 824 00:51:57,239 --> 00:52:00,239 solutions out there, I don't think it has to be a technical 825 00:52:00,239 --> 00:52:03,239 thing. Yeah, you know, 826 00:52:04,289 --> 00:52:07,559 you mentioned a few minutes ago, Adam, like the feeling that you 827 00:52:07,559 --> 00:52:11,549 get as a podcaster, when you get that first payment, right, 828 00:52:11,549 --> 00:52:13,409 somebody is listening to my podcast, and I get the first 829 00:52:13,409 --> 00:52:16,559 payment. That is an amazing feeling. And then Tom mentioned 830 00:52:16,559 --> 00:52:18,539 when we launched Buzzsprout, the amazing feeling that we would 831 00:52:18,539 --> 00:52:21,659 get as a platform helping somebody push that content out 832 00:52:21,659 --> 00:52:24,329 to the world. And then, you know, just this week, I 833 00:52:24,329 --> 00:52:28,589 experienced the third side of that, which is as a listener, I 834 00:52:28,589 --> 00:52:31,469 set up a listening app, and I funded it. I funded the wall in 835 00:52:31,469 --> 00:52:34,079 the app. And I started listening to podcasts, and I set up my 836 00:52:34,079 --> 00:52:37,949 streaming sets to the podcaster. And I'm getting dopamine hits, 837 00:52:37,979 --> 00:52:40,829 as I'm listening to the podcast, knowing that I'm supporting the 838 00:52:40,829 --> 00:52:43,919 person who I'm listening to. Yes, yes, like that. You're so 839 00:52:43,949 --> 00:52:47,099 good. And when they say something great that I agree 840 00:52:47,099 --> 00:52:51,779 with you boost the boost button. And I mean, that's, that is so 841 00:52:51,779 --> 00:52:54,389 fun. I'm listening more podcasts this week than I have, you know, 842 00:52:54,389 --> 00:52:56,849 in the past two years, because I'm so excited to be able to 843 00:52:56,849 --> 00:53:01,049 send money directly to the person who I'm listening to your 844 00:53:01,559 --> 00:53:07,919 entertainment. Poverty. Yeah. But yes, giving me something 845 00:53:07,919 --> 00:53:10,349 they're educating me or they're entertaining me or whatever it's 846 00:53:10,349 --> 00:53:13,169 doing for me. Now I can give back like, whatever I'm, I'm 847 00:53:13,169 --> 00:53:16,499 binge watching Yellowstone right now. Right? And oh, I just 848 00:53:16,499 --> 00:53:20,129 started that. Yeah. So it's been great. Fine. I'm watching 849 00:53:20,129 --> 00:53:22,889 through the peacock and somebody, NBC is getting rich, 850 00:53:23,099 --> 00:53:26,429 fantastic. But if I if I knew when I was watching that show, I 851 00:53:26,429 --> 00:53:28,979 could get super excited that Kevin Costner just you know, 852 00:53:29,009 --> 00:53:33,209 often another bad guy boost straight to costume 853 00:53:34,289 --> 00:53:35,369 costume with love it. 854 00:53:35,429 --> 00:53:37,529 That's what that's the opportunity we have in 855 00:53:37,529 --> 00:53:39,659 podcasting. There's no other medium where you can do that 856 00:53:39,659 --> 00:53:40,109 right now. 857 00:53:41,429 --> 00:53:45,569 That so I sent my one of my favorite podcasts is causality. 858 00:53:46,169 --> 00:53:49,769 John Cage's podcast. And so he puts out it's one of these 859 00:53:49,769 --> 00:53:53,939 podcasts where he, he just does this deep dive research into a 860 00:53:53,939 --> 00:53:56,519 natural disasters are not a natural, I'm sorry, a an 861 00:53:56,519 --> 00:54:00,599 engineering disaster. And then, however long it takes them to 862 00:54:00,599 --> 00:54:02,369 research, that's how long it's gonna take, and you're just 863 00:54:02,369 --> 00:54:06,509 gonna have to wait. And so then he puts the show out. And it may 864 00:54:06,509 --> 00:54:10,409 take two months, or it may take six months. I don't know. But 865 00:54:10,679 --> 00:54:14,279 it's gonna it's gonna be good. Is every time one of those lands 866 00:54:14,279 --> 00:54:17,999 in my podcast app? I'm like, yes, I've been you know, a want 867 00:54:17,999 --> 00:54:20,969 this because, you know, it's gonna be an hour of just really 868 00:54:20,969 --> 00:54:25,619 good content. And so he released his episode a couple days ago. 869 00:54:25,829 --> 00:54:29,279 Listen to it last night. I sent him 50,000 SATs, which is 870 00:54:29,279 --> 00:54:32,429 roughly 20 bucks in a boost and put in put a booster gram 871 00:54:32,429 --> 00:54:36,119 message in there. And it felt so good. It just like you're 872 00:54:36,119 --> 00:54:39,659 talking about Kevin, it feels so good to know that within two 873 00:54:39,659 --> 00:54:42,569 seconds, he's gonna see he's gonna hear pew pew and he's 874 00:54:42,569 --> 00:54:46,079 gonna see the 50,000 SATs and he's gonna read the message. And 875 00:54:46,079 --> 00:54:50,189 he did. He responded to me on Mastodon about 20 minutes later 876 00:54:50,189 --> 00:54:53,519 and he said, Thank you so much for the SATs, Boo Boo. It's just 877 00:54:54,599 --> 00:54:58,499 that we you know, you can start that. But I mean, that's that's 878 00:54:58,499 --> 00:55:02,819 what that's what it's about. It feels so much better than it's 879 00:55:02,819 --> 00:55:06,479 like. Like Tom said, everybody. Everybody involved hates the 880 00:55:06,479 --> 00:55:10,919 advertising. So isn't it great if we can take it out and make 881 00:55:10,919 --> 00:55:13,889 it go away? Yeah. Anyway, 882 00:55:14,070 --> 00:55:18,150 well also then, then you the work you're doing or the fun 883 00:55:18,150 --> 00:55:22,380 you're having, or whatever you're sharing becomes something 884 00:55:22,380 --> 00:55:26,130 that you're doing for the people on the other end, not for the 885 00:55:26,130 --> 00:55:29,790 numbers for advertising. This is what pisses me off. And that's 886 00:55:29,790 --> 00:55:34,230 all all the whole podcast is all advertising. Oh, how big had it? 887 00:55:34,230 --> 00:55:35,970 Is it? Good? 888 00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:42,180 Seriously, it squashes a lot of podcasters. I mean, one of this, 889 00:55:42,210 --> 00:55:42,870 oh, I'm 890 00:55:42,870 --> 00:55:45,660 too late. I can't get in there. The market saturated? 891 00:55:45,749 --> 00:55:47,549 Yeah. Or they're looking at their numbers. And they're 892 00:55:47,549 --> 00:55:50,999 comparing their numbers. I'm no good. I'm no good. Because my 893 00:55:50,999 --> 00:55:52,859 numbers don't compare to somebody else's like, Well, you 894 00:55:52,859 --> 00:55:55,679 didn't get into podcasting for the numbers. I'm assuming that 895 00:55:55,679 --> 00:55:58,289 there was something you were passionate about. But I wanted 896 00:55:58,289 --> 00:56:00,809 to talk like this, get a following. But listen 897 00:56:00,810 --> 00:56:04,260 to what everyone's talking about growing your audience growing 898 00:56:04,260 --> 00:56:08,640 your podcast. That is that is the hosting companies inherent 899 00:56:08,640 --> 00:56:11,040 message. Everyone's 900 00:56:11,759 --> 00:56:12,809 huh. I don't know if 901 00:56:13,650 --> 00:56:16,770 you've said this at least eight times on this show alone. 902 00:56:17,520 --> 00:56:20,370 Growing the audience building your audience. I'm not I'm not 903 00:56:20,370 --> 00:56:23,520 saying it's wrong. I'm just saying that is a general, it's 904 00:56:23,520 --> 00:56:26,010 like media, we still consider it to be media. 905 00:56:26,309 --> 00:56:29,369 So what a dopamine hit, knowing that we have a large audience 906 00:56:29,820 --> 00:56:33,150 there, we get a dopamine hit with a number change. 907 00:56:33,450 --> 00:56:36,660 Yeah, there's no there's nothing wrong with with having a big 908 00:56:36,660 --> 00:56:39,090 audience. It's just that's not your measurement of success. 909 00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:42,720 It is I don't I want less less audience people unsubscribe now. 910 00:56:44,219 --> 00:56:47,549 But that's what I try. You know, I get to speak at conferences 911 00:56:47,549 --> 00:56:49,349 and stuff. And I usually talk about stats, because it's 912 00:56:49,349 --> 00:56:51,509 something that I know a lot technically about, but I also 913 00:56:51,509 --> 00:56:55,529 love to encourage people with, don't look at your stats, you 914 00:56:55,529 --> 00:56:58,109 just That's not why you got into podcasting. That's not how you 915 00:56:58,109 --> 00:57:00,449 measure success. It's some people that's the only 916 00:57:00,449 --> 00:57:02,699 measurement that they have for success. And that's just not 917 00:57:02,699 --> 00:57:03,479 that's just not right. 918 00:57:03,510 --> 00:57:07,650 Well, one day, it may even be heli pad is going to show me a 919 00:57:07,650 --> 00:57:11,580 graph. And the stats will be highly interesting, because it 920 00:57:11,580 --> 00:57:14,970 will tell me, when people are listening, when they're 921 00:57:14,970 --> 00:57:20,550 boosting. It'll give me an average of how many sets per 922 00:57:20,550 --> 00:57:23,820 minute. These are things. These are statistics that I find 923 00:57:23,820 --> 00:57:26,670 highly interesting. I'd like to know when people drop off, I'd 924 00:57:26,670 --> 00:57:29,550 like to know what parts people liked. I think these are 925 00:57:29,550 --> 00:57:32,700 statistics that focus on the core. This is something we've 926 00:57:32,700 --> 00:57:37,710 never had in I've been subjected to Nielsen ratings Arbitron 927 00:57:37,710 --> 00:57:43,560 ratings, Dutch Government rating systems, and it's horrible. And 928 00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:48,120 the reason why it's the most depressing is because guaranteed 929 00:57:48,330 --> 00:57:51,660 every single time and I've done television shows with, you know, 930 00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:55,980 with 100 people working on it. 12 cameras, and we did a live 931 00:57:55,980 --> 00:58:00,120 show, and this was such a kick ass. Everyone's like, holy, I'm 932 00:58:00,120 --> 00:58:03,900 getting goosebumps just talking about it. Such a great show. 933 00:58:03,930 --> 00:58:08,790 Alright, everybody guaranteed the next day, crap ratings. It's 934 00:58:08,850 --> 00:58:11,820 all demotivating or it's motivating for the wrong 935 00:58:11,820 --> 00:58:16,050 reasons. And it doesn't improve the actual quality of the work 936 00:58:16,050 --> 00:58:20,670 that way. In fact, it makes it worse over time. That's how we 937 00:58:20,670 --> 00:58:25,050 got to 20 minutes of commercials on am radio per hour. 938 00:58:26,010 --> 00:58:29,220 Yeah, yes, like five minutes of content and the 12 minutes of 939 00:58:29,220 --> 00:58:32,880 commercials. It's all radios almost unlistenable now, it's 940 00:58:32,880 --> 00:58:34,200 yeah, it's so bad. 941 00:58:34,530 --> 00:58:37,890 Boy, you mentioned streaming. I can't I can't watch TV anymore. 942 00:58:37,920 --> 00:58:42,060 Because if I travel somewhere, I've got a watch on my laptop. I 943 00:58:42,060 --> 00:58:43,080 just can't watch live 944 00:58:43,079 --> 00:58:46,349 TV. So why would we treat podcasting any differently? 945 00:58:46,679 --> 00:58:49,739 Well, because we have a fast forward button. Yeah. Okay. 946 00:58:49,830 --> 00:58:53,280 Well, the ad loads going up to I mean, it's just it's it's just 947 00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:53,490 such 948 00:58:53,490 --> 00:58:59,160 a, like a viral load and ad load viral. Heavy ad load. 949 00:59:01,860 --> 00:59:04,950 On the I mean, going back to some tech stuff, what, 950 00:59:05,610 --> 00:59:14,580 specifically on the on the block tag? Tom, what is your feeling 951 00:59:15,180 --> 00:59:20,550 about whether or not the iTunes block tag and I don't know if 952 00:59:20,550 --> 00:59:25,410 y'all use it on your platform at all, but they, they, we we 953 00:59:25,410 --> 00:59:28,140 started honoring the iTunes block tag when we're ingesting 954 00:59:28,140 --> 00:59:31,350 feeds at the beginning and then in the US started and then I 955 00:59:31,770 --> 00:59:34,800 disabled that because you're the iTunes blogtagged. You have the 956 00:59:34,800 --> 00:59:39,810 Google block tag. And I'm like, Okay, what, I don't know what's 957 00:59:39,810 --> 00:59:43,500 what and the documentation for the iTunes block tag says that 958 00:59:43,710 --> 00:59:46,710 if you put this in here, then Apple will not index the feed. 959 00:59:48,750 --> 00:59:52,050 So of course, they're gonna say that and I'm gonna say anything 960 00:59:52,050 --> 00:59:54,690 else. But then there's other hosting companies that seem to 961 00:59:55,020 --> 00:59:58,530 treat it as a general universal block tag that says I don't want 962 00:59:58,530 --> 01:00:03,330 to show up anywhere. What? What's your opinion on that? And 963 01:00:03,330 --> 01:00:09,480 do you think that the podcast block tag version should be more 964 01:00:09,480 --> 01:00:12,930 granular that just says that that allows you to say, Okay, I 965 01:00:12,930 --> 01:00:16,080 want this this in this directory to be able to index it, but not 966 01:00:16,140 --> 01:00:17,160 but nowhere else. 967 01:00:18,539 --> 01:00:23,339 So we don't use the iTunes block at all. Okay? 968 01:00:24,089 --> 01:00:28,259 Well, we do, but we don't use it. So with Apple, you have the 969 01:00:28,259 --> 01:00:30,539 ability to put your podcast in or not like that, they're not 970 01:00:30,539 --> 01:00:33,149 going to discover it, right, you have to go through a process and 971 01:00:33,149 --> 01:00:37,109 submit to them. So the only time that we use the block tag is 972 01:00:37,109 --> 01:00:42,419 when somebody says they want out of Apple. And, like, they 973 01:00:42,419 --> 01:00:46,589 struggle to, like remember their their Apple ID login or 974 01:00:46,589 --> 01:00:48,689 something, and they can't get into the UI anymore to get 975 01:00:48,689 --> 01:00:52,439 themselves out. So we can manually wrap it in there. And 976 01:00:52,469 --> 01:00:55,619 the other time we use it is if we say like blocked from all 977 01:00:55,919 --> 01:00:58,589 search engines, then we don't use the apple block, we used to 978 01:00:58,589 --> 01:01:00,539 use the Google block, which I guess they don't respect 979 01:01:00,539 --> 01:01:03,389 anymore, that we might need to change that code. But if they 980 01:01:03,389 --> 01:01:06,689 don't want their podcast discovered, like if you want to 981 01:01:06,689 --> 01:01:08,489 go to Google and just type in the name of their podcast, and 982 01:01:08,489 --> 01:01:11,219 they don't want to show up in the search results, we use the 983 01:01:11,219 --> 01:01:14,429 block tag in the RSS feed, we also, you know, shut off their 984 01:01:14,429 --> 01:01:17,009 Buzzsprout public page and we put a noindex nofollow. So 985 01:01:17,039 --> 01:01:19,589 hopefully search engines respect that and don't pick it up. But 986 01:01:19,589 --> 01:01:22,259 that's been our only use for those two tags, 987 01:01:23,280 --> 01:01:27,780 we'll see that that actually makes it that actually makes it 988 01:01:27,780 --> 01:01:33,420 a little bit more confusing. Because there it may see that, 989 01:01:33,510 --> 01:01:35,730 that's where I can't, I don't know where to fall down. Because 990 01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:40,350 I iTunes block tag really, really feels like an apple only 991 01:01:40,350 --> 01:01:44,460 thing. But I know for a fact that that a lot of people are 992 01:01:44,460 --> 01:01:50,190 using it as a general indicator. And, and I just, I think this is 993 01:01:50,190 --> 01:01:53,820 a, this is a perfect example of something that needs to be in 994 01:01:53,820 --> 01:01:56,760 the podcast namespace and not part of iTunes. Because we can 995 01:01:56,760 --> 01:02:01,290 put the pot, we can make a podcast blog tag, and say this 996 01:02:01,320 --> 01:02:07,020 in make it better, make it work more granular and make it make a 997 01:02:07,020 --> 01:02:09,540 better. I just think we make a better tag. 998 01:02:09,690 --> 01:02:12,030 Right? And there's a model for this. There's the robot dot txt 999 01:02:12,030 --> 01:02:17,190 file model. Yeah, yeah, you can say, you know, maybe block is 1000 01:02:17,190 --> 01:02:18,870 the wrong way to think about it. Maybe it's like, what do we 1001 01:02:18,870 --> 01:02:23,370 allow? And reverse our verse to thinking? Yeah, and so I would 1002 01:02:23,430 --> 01:02:25,980 think that we'd approach it from allow all which means any 1003 01:02:25,980 --> 01:02:28,200 directory that comes upon this RSS feed, you find that you want 1004 01:02:28,200 --> 01:02:32,640 to index it, have at it, or we get specific. And we say, you 1005 01:02:32,640 --> 01:02:35,040 know, we want to be in this, this, this, this and this, and 1006 01:02:35,040 --> 01:02:37,140 we're specific. And then we might say, you know, disallow, 1007 01:02:37,140 --> 01:02:39,600 we're specifically saying we do not want to be in Spotify. So 1008 01:02:39,600 --> 01:02:42,090 Spotify bot comes upon this feed, you do not have permission 1009 01:02:42,090 --> 01:02:42,660 to call Yeah, 1010 01:02:42,659 --> 01:02:46,499 like a Spotify is gonna honor that. Well, do they? 1011 01:02:47,460 --> 01:02:50,130 I don't know. I mean, they they don't now. 1012 01:02:50,640 --> 01:02:54,480 Yeah. Now, it's one of the one of our most frequent support 1013 01:02:54,480 --> 01:02:57,540 requests is being removed from Spotify. If they supported a 1014 01:02:57,540 --> 01:03:01,410 block tag, it would actually reduce support on both sides. 1015 01:03:01,559 --> 01:03:04,289 Yeah. Because there's not an easy way for us through the API 1016 01:03:04,289 --> 01:03:08,279 to remove a show. We have to email him right now. We should 1017 01:03:08,279 --> 01:03:11,279 so it would be nice to have an allow or disallow Island. I 1018 01:03:11,279 --> 01:03:11,699 would love 1019 01:03:11,699 --> 01:03:15,599 to try that. Because the no agenda show feed keeps getting 1020 01:03:15,599 --> 01:03:21,509 put back on the Spotify. It's all pirated, of course. So it 1021 01:03:21,509 --> 01:03:25,949 would be interesting to try it with the with iTunes block tag. 1022 01:03:26,549 --> 01:03:29,189 I don't think I don't think I don't think they they honor it. 1023 01:03:29,969 --> 01:03:34,049 We haven't adopted any tags, I really haven't engaged much on 1024 01:03:34,049 --> 01:03:38,189 any of the tags that involve the name. Like it just it seems like 1025 01:03:38,189 --> 01:03:41,939 it's a hard tag to build, right? Because Spotify gets bought out 1026 01:03:41,939 --> 01:03:47,129 by stuck ease and they change their name to duckies listener 1027 01:03:47,129 --> 01:03:50,879 app. Like I just don't like seeing that in the spec. 1028 01:03:51,029 --> 01:03:53,969 Whenever there's names of apps and stuff like that, but I don't 1029 01:03:53,969 --> 01:03:56,669 know what that's like a slug list type thing. Yeah, that slug 1030 01:03:56,669 --> 01:03:59,639 list, I push back on it all the time because I just hate the 1031 01:03:59,639 --> 01:04:03,659 idea of codifying the name of a product knowing that these 1032 01:04:03,659 --> 01:04:05,819 products change names. I mean, we already see with iTunes, 1033 01:04:05,909 --> 01:04:09,239 Apple has moved straight away from iTunes, they you know, got 1034 01:04:09,239 --> 01:04:11,249 get us whenever we use iTunes anywhere the best 1035 01:04:11,250 --> 01:04:14,520 marketing company in the world couldn't out market out of that. 1036 01:04:14,820 --> 01:04:15,390 Yeah, 1037 01:04:15,480 --> 01:04:18,750 yeah. And so that's, that's my challenge. Whenever I look at 1038 01:04:18,750 --> 01:04:21,630 the tags that involve those, those app slugs, but it doesn't 1039 01:04:21,630 --> 01:04:24,840 mean that it doesn't. I like the way Kevin said about a robot 1040 01:04:24,990 --> 01:04:27,870 robot txt file, maybe there's some type of reference file that 1041 01:04:27,870 --> 01:04:31,740 we can go to where we use domain names or something that is, um, 1042 01:04:32,790 --> 01:04:38,490 you know, more objective, not not a slug list that we create. 1043 01:04:39,300 --> 01:04:41,940 Like, yeah, like that. We need to do that. I'm going to get 1044 01:04:41,940 --> 01:04:45,240 back on on that for Phase Five, because I think it's, it's it's 1045 01:04:45,240 --> 01:04:47,700 important to come up a couple of times lately and it's kind of 1046 01:04:47,700 --> 01:04:52,110 been an annoyance. And it's led to this to this very blatant, 1047 01:04:52,380 --> 01:04:56,190 or, excuse me, very obvious shortfall here. So we need to we 1048 01:04:56,190 --> 01:04:56,880 need to fix that. 1049 01:04:57,090 --> 01:04:59,520 Yeah, we could definitely work on that. That's a great tag to 1050 01:04:59,520 --> 01:05:01,530 work on because Just non breaking, it's not gonna break 1051 01:05:01,530 --> 01:05:05,880 anything for us to put that out there. Um, and so that's 1052 01:05:05,880 --> 01:05:07,440 definitely something we could work together. 1053 01:05:07,889 --> 01:05:14,879 Yeah. Okay, cool. That as far as the the other thing that the bus 1054 01:05:14,879 --> 01:05:17,069 route was super instrumental in at the very beginning was 1055 01:05:17,069 --> 01:05:25,769 piping, and I was just just some numbers here 263,941 feeds now 1056 01:05:25,799 --> 01:05:30,719 are deprioritized because of pod pain. So we do not meet D 1057 01:05:30,719 --> 01:05:34,439 prioritizing, meaning we are not actively pulling them anymore. 1058 01:05:34,769 --> 01:05:38,099 We're just getting pod pain signals and that's how we know. 1059 01:05:38,249 --> 01:05:41,729 So that's an eighth of the of the universe. It's an eight to 1060 01:05:41,729 --> 01:05:44,819 the universe. It's pretty good. It's not bad out of the gate for 1061 01:05:44,819 --> 01:05:51,269 some wonky crap Brian put together. Just kidding. It's 1062 01:05:51,269 --> 01:05:53,219 obviously a runaway success. 1063 01:05:54,210 --> 01:05:58,620 That's gonna be the subtitle of Brian's autobiography. Brian, 1064 01:05:58,950 --> 01:06:02,370 when he's dead, London, wonky, wonky crap. And 1065 01:06:02,370 --> 01:06:09,150 he's basically running a money changing machine, isn't he? I 1066 01:06:09,150 --> 01:06:13,710 don't know what he's doing. I love him for it. Because he's 1067 01:06:13,710 --> 01:06:15,360 Adam, if Adam could code 1068 01:06:17,310 --> 01:06:23,790 like, what have you done? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. 263,941 phase. 1069 01:06:23,790 --> 01:06:27,060 That's a lot. That is a lot of stuff that 1070 01:06:27,059 --> 01:06:31,049 we internet. Thank you. Hey, the internet. Thanks. We 1071 01:06:31,050 --> 01:06:34,380 need we need to put a number out we need to put a carbon number 1072 01:06:34,380 --> 01:06:38,730 on it. Come on boys, we need to calculate can we do number? Can 1073 01:06:38,730 --> 01:06:41,550 we Yeah, can we do like a back of the envelope? Well, you have 1074 01:06:41,550 --> 01:06:42,960 the data, right? You have some of 1075 01:06:42,960 --> 01:06:45,990 it, I can tell you how much we pay per gigabyte of bandwidth. 1076 01:06:45,990 --> 01:06:51,510 And we get back into how many gigabytes typical RSS feed back 1077 01:06:51,510 --> 01:06:52,020 into Number 1078 01:06:52,079 --> 01:06:54,659 Have you also have to take in the electricity. That's I want 1079 01:06:54,659 --> 01:06:56,579 to get it all the way to the climate change. 1080 01:06:57,059 --> 01:06:59,879 I wanted the issue to be measured in cow farts, you know? 1081 01:07:00,089 --> 01:07:00,779 Yes. 1082 01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:03,510 Yes. Yes. Excellent, Dave. 1083 01:07:04,679 --> 01:07:07,979 And the debt it was so and we have after the latest round of 1084 01:07:07,979 --> 01:07:13,619 purging, we have 700 737,946 Dead feet now wanted to say the 1085 01:07:13,619 --> 01:07:17,309 difference between dead and deprioritize because that was 1086 01:07:17,309 --> 01:07:24,419 confusion on the mastodon today with dead means the feed is is 1087 01:07:25,379 --> 01:07:33,269 is not a quality listable thing. So like, we talked about this 1088 01:07:33,269 --> 01:07:36,299 before, when we market feed dead, it disappears. It's like 1089 01:07:36,299 --> 01:07:39,269 it doesn't even exist anymore. And that's because it's either a 1090 01:07:39,269 --> 01:07:44,339 duplicate of some other legitimate feed, or it's just 1091 01:07:44,369 --> 01:07:49,439 complete garbage. So meaning it has one episode that's 15 1092 01:07:49,439 --> 01:07:53,699 seconds long of somebody saying poop. So that that's what that 1093 01:07:53,699 --> 01:07:58,529 is the D prioritization happens when? And this was to answer 1094 01:07:58,529 --> 01:08:02,759 Steven bass question today. D prioritizing means that we set 1095 01:08:02,759 --> 01:08:07,529 the the aggregator priority for that feed to negative one, 1096 01:08:07,589 --> 01:08:14,669 meaning don't poll it. That happens based on the host. So 1097 01:08:14,729 --> 01:08:20,429 anything, anything from bus from feeds, buzzsprout.com is is all 1098 01:08:20,459 --> 01:08:23,489 automatically set upon ingestion to a negative one priority so 1099 01:08:23,489 --> 01:08:27,629 that we don't pull it. It's not that we saw it pod ping once and 1100 01:08:27,629 --> 01:08:31,259 then D prioritized. It. That's not how it works. It's based 1101 01:08:31,259 --> 01:08:35,159 only on people that we know, on hosting company URLs that we 1102 01:08:35,159 --> 01:08:39,539 know are pod ping enablers that are enabled. 1103 01:08:40,800 --> 01:08:46,350 I love that to Steven B's. Sovereign feeds. Has a pod ping 1104 01:08:46,350 --> 01:08:49,260 thing in there. Have you seen that? Yeah, yeah, we set him up. 1105 01:08:49,260 --> 01:08:52,200 Yeah. But it's super cool. Because in order so you publish 1106 01:08:52,200 --> 01:08:55,890 your feed, and then you have to solve a puzzle, which is like 1107 01:08:55,890 --> 01:09:02,460 nine plus four plus two. And then it pings it. Yeah, I guess 1108 01:09:02,460 --> 01:09:05,220 that's so it can't be spammed or something. You have to you have 1109 01:09:05,220 --> 01:09:09,690 to come up with a you have to answer the CAPTCHA. Abuse. Yeah. 1110 01:09:09,690 --> 01:09:11,340 But it's really cool. It works. 1111 01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:14,070 Well, one thing Steven has been looking for, and I don't know if 1112 01:09:14,070 --> 01:09:17,070 you can speak to this, Tom, is he's been, you know, he's 1113 01:09:17,100 --> 01:09:19,320 created this thing called Sovereign phase where it's like 1114 01:09:19,320 --> 01:09:23,370 a, it's a fee generator, where you can host a create your own 1115 01:09:23,640 --> 01:09:28,800 your own feed, and but he, he needs he needs a host on the 1116 01:09:28,800 --> 01:09:33,840 backend to be able to, like, integrate with so that his his 1117 01:09:34,470 --> 01:09:39,960 software can sort of be a third party and use a host API to 1118 01:09:39,960 --> 01:09:42,810 upload the audio and save the feed somewhere. Is that 1119 01:09:42,810 --> 01:09:46,680 something that because does breast bass API allow that or? 1120 01:09:47,100 --> 01:09:47,490 No, 1121 01:09:47,520 --> 01:09:51,990 no. I mean, you could, you could do it, but you'd be paying for 1122 01:09:51,990 --> 01:09:53,700 something that you wouldn't be using because you're gonna pay 1123 01:09:53,700 --> 01:09:55,560 for the hosting. Yeah, 1124 01:09:55,650 --> 01:09:57,960 I don't think No, I don't think the paying is the part is the 1125 01:09:57,960 --> 01:09:59,880 problem. I think he just needs the tech you know, 1126 01:10:00,900 --> 01:10:04,290 Yeah, I mean, our API set up so that you can push episodes to us 1127 01:10:04,290 --> 01:10:06,480 through the API. And then you can get back a URL for those. 1128 01:10:06,540 --> 01:10:08,340 And if he doesn't want to use our feed, he wants to generate 1129 01:10:08,340 --> 01:10:09,870 his own feed. You could do that. 1130 01:10:10,470 --> 01:10:12,750 Yeah, that's I think that's really what it's about. It's not 1131 01:10:12,750 --> 01:10:13,050 about 1132 01:10:13,080 --> 01:10:15,660 that. Yeah. Anybody could do that with the engine. 1133 01:10:16,140 --> 01:10:18,900 But then, and he can also publish the feed to your 1134 01:10:18,900 --> 01:10:19,470 hosting. 1135 01:10:20,670 --> 01:10:23,730 No, we wouldn't. We just host right, we'd host our feed, which 1136 01:10:23,730 --> 01:10:24,300 he wouldn't want. 1137 01:10:24,330 --> 01:10:27,540 Right? Yeah. Right. That's the problem. Yeah. He's 1138 01:10:27,780 --> 01:10:30,600 trying to create the RSS. And then ice 1139 01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:34,650 API is trying to find a partner who's already established who 1140 01:10:34,650 --> 01:10:40,020 can process customers, I guess. I guess, in a way, like we're 1141 01:10:40,020 --> 01:10:45,000 the WordPress plugin with the whatever that ties into, to tie 1142 01:10:45,000 --> 01:10:48,240 into blueberry, like a power press type power. Yeah. And so 1143 01:10:48,240 --> 01:10:50,040 that that kind of access he's looking for? 1144 01:10:50,910 --> 01:10:53,160 Yeah, we're just like, I'm gonna give you because he, he wants to 1145 01:10:53,160 --> 01:10:55,590 be able to do custom stuff in the feed. So he just wants to 1146 01:10:55,590 --> 01:10:58,350 say, hey, here's the here's the feed, can you can you publish 1147 01:10:58,350 --> 01:11:01,680 this for hosted for me? And then I'm just gonna give it to you 1148 01:11:01,680 --> 01:11:06,510 fully formed? And then sound like he'll have that? No, no, 1149 01:11:06,630 --> 01:11:09,390 but I mean, I don't know what he feels about Amazon or something. 1150 01:11:09,390 --> 01:11:10,110 But um, yeah. So 1151 01:11:10,980 --> 01:11:14,070 for Dropbox, even Dropbox has a pretty sophisticated API, I saw 1152 01:11:14,070 --> 01:11:15,060 some people are building 1153 01:11:15,389 --> 01:11:18,749 drop boxes. And that's a very interesting idea to do it that 1154 01:11:18,749 --> 01:11:21,299 way. I've seen a lot of interesting projects work 1155 01:11:21,869 --> 01:11:22,979 through Dropbox. Yeah. I 1156 01:11:22,979 --> 01:11:24,779 don't know, if they support byte range requests and stuff. I 1157 01:11:24,779 --> 01:11:27,509 don't know if they'd be fully podcasting compatible. But like 1158 01:11:27,509 --> 01:11:28,649 Amazon CloudFront, does. 1159 01:11:29,970 --> 01:11:34,050 That's true. What? What have we missed? I mean, like, you know, 1160 01:11:34,050 --> 01:11:38,760 y'all, you've been here since the beginning, what? What is, is 1161 01:11:38,760 --> 01:11:43,260 there? Is there a blind spot in the, in the namespace or the, 1162 01:11:44,130 --> 01:11:48,450 the Poquoson, 2.0 thing that we're trying to do that we're 1163 01:11:48,450 --> 01:11:50,490 just not seeing? I think 1164 01:11:50,490 --> 01:11:53,370 we touched on the big ones. I like the idea of making sure 1165 01:11:53,370 --> 01:11:56,670 that we have a compatible tag for all of the iTunes tags. 1166 01:11:57,060 --> 01:12:01,410 But in 10 years, we shouldn't expect to see iTunes anywhere in 1167 01:12:01,410 --> 01:12:05,700 our RSS feeds. Right. And we talked about that, Dave, early 1168 01:12:05,700 --> 01:12:07,470 on, when we were doing the namespace, we were saying, Hey, 1169 01:12:07,470 --> 01:12:10,500 don't go propose all the iTunes tags, like, we know that that's 1170 01:12:10,500 --> 01:12:13,770 something that we want to do. But let's not start there. Like, 1171 01:12:13,800 --> 01:12:16,380 that's not gonna, that's not going to create innovation. It 1172 01:12:16,380 --> 01:12:18,990 is something that at some point we should do. But it's 1173 01:12:18,990 --> 01:12:21,090 essentially going to just increase the size of our RSS 1174 01:12:21,090 --> 01:12:25,140 feeds, it could create more work for our podcasting apps. But at 1175 01:12:25,140 --> 01:12:27,540 some point, we're going to have to swallow it, we're going to 1176 01:12:27,540 --> 01:12:28,260 have to do that. 1177 01:12:28,620 --> 01:12:31,350 Right. I like the idea of making sure we're cleaning out the 1178 01:12:31,350 --> 01:12:34,980 legacy namespaces. Like there's no no more reason to carry them 1179 01:12:34,980 --> 01:12:35,370 forward. 1180 01:12:35,970 --> 01:12:40,710 Have you guys been following the cross app comments? Development? 1181 01:12:41,610 --> 01:12:43,680 Yeah, that's something that I'm pretty excited about. I've 1182 01:12:43,680 --> 01:12:44,910 talked with Dave about 1183 01:12:46,650 --> 01:12:50,580 it, he activity pub. So there's been a lot of, 1184 01:12:50,910 --> 01:12:54,570 I got to stop again, I got to stop again. Holy crap. It's like 1185 01:12:54,570 --> 01:12:58,620 a beautiful movie. I'm watching one that's in Korean. So I don't 1186 01:12:58,620 --> 01:13:01,830 understand what they're saying. But I like all the actors, 1187 01:13:01,950 --> 01:13:04,350 they're really interesting. I like how they interact. And I 1188 01:13:04,350 --> 01:13:06,960 think I see what's going to happen. So I'm very, very 1189 01:13:06,960 --> 01:13:08,790 pleased, it's really exciting to watch 1190 01:13:09,660 --> 01:13:14,760 that activity pub stuff is, has taken a really big leap over the 1191 01:13:14,760 --> 01:13:18,330 last really two to three weeks, when people have gotten in there 1192 01:13:18,330 --> 01:13:21,780 rolled their sleeves up, gotten dirty with with publishing their 1193 01:13:21,780 --> 01:13:27,660 research. Because this stuff, you can you can conceptualize 1194 01:13:27,660 --> 01:13:31,470 how it works. But when you actually get to write code, you 1195 01:13:31,470 --> 01:13:35,700 really need more than just a vision, or an or a conceptual 1196 01:13:35,700 --> 01:13:39,300 framework, you need actual nuts and bolts details of the way the 1197 01:13:39,300 --> 01:13:44,700 protocol functions. And the difficult reality with activity 1198 01:13:44,700 --> 01:13:48,930 Pub is that they don't, the implementations in the real 1199 01:13:48,930 --> 01:13:52,890 world of it don't all operate the same way. And you find that 1200 01:13:52,890 --> 01:13:55,830 out pretty quick when you start poking around at the API's 1201 01:13:55,830 --> 01:13:58,830 within Mastodon and Roma in these different these different 1202 01:13:59,040 --> 01:14:06,120 platforms. So the new work that that John Spurlock has done and 1203 01:14:06,120 --> 01:14:11,940 then the research recently, by Gail, May, they they really took 1204 01:14:12,300 --> 01:14:16,800 the framework that Alex gates kind of visualized, and in and 1205 01:14:16,800 --> 01:14:19,410 just did a bunch of research and published it in document form. 1206 01:14:19,410 --> 01:14:23,640 So it's, and then John at created some apps and NPM 1207 01:14:23,640 --> 01:14:27,870 modules for fleshing it out to make it easier for the apps to 1208 01:14:27,870 --> 01:14:30,540 pick up and run with and they're just going through that funnel 1209 01:14:30,870 --> 01:14:33,300 or not, I'm not gonna say final but they're going through that 1210 01:14:33,480 --> 01:14:38,730 heartache right now of trying to get this some some baseline MVP 1211 01:14:38,730 --> 01:14:43,740 type software up and running. So I think I think within the next 1212 01:14:44,460 --> 01:14:46,950 I really think within the next couple of months to three months 1213 01:14:46,950 --> 01:14:51,390 we're going to have something that is like usable where you 1214 01:14:51,900 --> 01:14:56,370 can say okay, go do this, and your app will show calm. 1215 01:14:56,640 --> 01:15:00,510 Will it take involvement from hosting companies or Can it or 1216 01:15:00,510 --> 01:15:01,050 should it? 1217 01:15:01,710 --> 01:15:05,280 Well see, that's the question really, I think I think it 1218 01:15:05,280 --> 01:15:06,270 really should to be, 1219 01:15:06,720 --> 01:15:10,230 well think of it think of it this way. But Buzzsprout when 1220 01:15:10,260 --> 01:15:15,930 when we are able to pull that into our platform, we host every 1221 01:15:15,930 --> 01:15:20,190 one of our podcasts as website. So we'll be able to launch the 1222 01:15:20,190 --> 01:15:23,520 comments on all of their websites when we do them. So I 1223 01:15:23,520 --> 01:15:26,670 think it'll be it's definitely something that we're talking 1224 01:15:26,670 --> 01:15:29,970 about, and it's something that I think would really benefit our 1225 01:15:29,970 --> 01:15:30,750 podcasters 1226 01:15:30,930 --> 01:15:35,700 it's already pretty sexy though, man when when I publish every 1227 01:15:35,700 --> 01:15:39,990 show I do now at least he has a comment thread. And and Dave, 1228 01:15:39,990 --> 01:15:42,840 you posted a screenshot Oh, there it is on pod verse and 1229 01:15:42,840 --> 01:15:44,970 like, that's already pretty cool. Just to see that 1230 01:15:44,970 --> 01:15:45,480 happening. 1231 01:15:45,989 --> 01:15:48,809 Have you have you seen that? Have you guys seen that in 1232 01:15:48,809 --> 01:15:53,489 action? I have not. I'm so if you go if you go to pod verse, 1233 01:15:53,699 --> 01:15:57,539 and then just, I mean, if you just go to pod verse.fm and look 1234 01:15:57,629 --> 01:16:03,779 and search for podcasting 2.0 and then go in then just click 1235 01:16:03,779 --> 01:16:07,559 on Like when the most recent episodes, you'll see the 1236 01:16:07,559 --> 01:16:11,309 activity pub comments there. So every time somebody, every time 1237 01:16:11,309 --> 01:16:15,989 we post a show a post an episode, I do a post on podcast, 1238 01:16:15,989 --> 01:16:19,709 index dot social, and I just say the name of the episode, or the 1239 01:16:19,709 --> 01:16:23,819 episode number, and this is the comments thread. And then Adam 1240 01:16:23,819 --> 01:16:27,899 takes the URL for that activity pub post, and puts it into the 1241 01:16:27,899 --> 01:16:31,349 social interact tag in the fit in our feed. And then 1242 01:16:31,349 --> 01:16:36,449 immediately pod verse and pod friend to put I think Martin has 1243 01:16:36,449 --> 01:16:38,639 disabled it for now. He's going to bring it back because he's 1244 01:16:38,639 --> 01:16:41,249 recoding. And I believe Oh, it's working on the web version. 1245 01:16:41,789 --> 01:16:46,679 Okay, cool. Well, that the pod friend and pod verse, both show 1246 01:16:46,709 --> 01:16:52,319 accont the all those comments in there. So if if you go and reply 1247 01:16:52,319 --> 01:16:55,709 to it on podcast, index, social, social or any other Mastodon 1248 01:16:55,709 --> 01:16:59,459 instance, or Pleroma, it will show up in pod verse 1249 01:16:59,489 --> 01:17:00,959 automatically as a reply. 1250 01:17:00,989 --> 01:17:05,999 And what's really trippy is that because I do the same thing I do 1251 01:17:05,999 --> 01:17:12,239 the comment thread. Before we record it's like the comments 1252 01:17:12,239 --> 01:17:16,259 are from the future. The minute the episode is there, like shit, 1253 01:17:16,259 --> 01:17:17,879 there's already comments on this thing. 1254 01:17:18,120 --> 01:17:22,650 Yeah. It's it's fully formed, but it's like a it's like that. 1255 01:17:22,680 --> 01:17:25,410 That's every night live. Where Will Ferrell was born as an 1256 01:17:25,410 --> 01:17:27,030 affiliate as an adult. Like, 1257 01:17:27,030 --> 01:17:30,240 yeah, but it also it makes it feel like that episodes alive 1258 01:17:30,240 --> 01:17:34,020 already. Like, okay, oh, that's just people commenting. Yeah, 1259 01:17:34,380 --> 01:17:34,590 yeah, 1260 01:17:34,590 --> 01:17:35,610 it's cuz psychological 1261 01:17:35,610 --> 01:17:37,140 psychologically. Very interesting. 1262 01:17:37,800 --> 01:17:40,110 Yeah. And it's a great way to interact. One of the things 1263 01:17:40,110 --> 01:17:42,810 about podcasting, that's, that's awesome is you feel this 1264 01:17:42,810 --> 01:17:46,200 connection with the podcaster. And so this is yet another way 1265 01:17:46,200 --> 01:17:47,520 to connect with the podcaster. 1266 01:17:48,570 --> 01:17:52,590 Yeah, it would be so how cool is it to have the Buzzsprout 1267 01:17:52,590 --> 01:17:56,250 podcast page for that podcast? With all these comments? And 1268 01:17:56,250 --> 01:17:59,970 then you know that it's going to show up the exact same way in 1269 01:18:00,000 --> 01:18:05,580 every single app. Right? That's cool. Yeah, I think we're gonna 1270 01:18:05,610 --> 01:18:09,210 knock behind some wall, right? It's not behind some wall where 1271 01:18:09,210 --> 01:18:11,520 I have to download an app to be able to see the comments if I'm 1272 01:18:11,520 --> 01:18:14,280 a podcaster. I don't have to go, you know, download all these 1273 01:18:14,280 --> 01:18:16,200 different apps to go see what people are saying about my 1274 01:18:16,200 --> 01:18:17,250 podcast. Yeah. Which 1275 01:18:17,250 --> 01:18:21,540 has always been the default for some stupid reason. Yeah, and 1276 01:18:21,540 --> 01:18:25,470 the most common place right now for podcast. reviews and 1277 01:18:25,470 --> 01:18:28,290 recommendations to come through is Apple podcasts. And there's 1278 01:18:28,290 --> 01:18:31,920 it's such a terrible broken system. I don't know, the full 1279 01:18:31,950 --> 01:18:35,040 like delay or process that, like vetting process that those 1280 01:18:35,040 --> 01:18:37,680 things go through before they get published. But it is a very 1281 01:18:37,680 --> 01:18:40,920 common support request for us get that says, you know, I just 1282 01:18:40,920 --> 01:18:43,350 launched my podcast, my you know, my friend told me, they 1283 01:18:43,350 --> 01:18:45,600 listened to it, and then left me writing a review. It's not 1284 01:18:45,600 --> 01:18:49,620 showing up and yeah, you got to give it a week. Like it's just 1285 01:18:49,620 --> 01:18:50,070 so 1286 01:18:51,420 --> 01:18:54,060 Yeah, whenever we say comments, the first thing that people 1287 01:18:54,060 --> 01:18:56,220 always say, Well, we have ratings and reviews, that's what 1288 01:18:56,220 --> 01:18:59,730 everyone jumps up and says, and I was thinking about it, just 1289 01:18:59,730 --> 01:19:05,160 like the at the item level. Can we also have a channel level 1290 01:19:05,220 --> 01:19:09,690 thread, which then by default becomes just like every other 1291 01:19:09,690 --> 01:19:10,680 review thread? 1292 01:19:11,610 --> 01:19:12,480 I don't see why not. 1293 01:19:12,480 --> 01:19:16,080 I mean, though, isn't that exactly what a review is? It's a 1294 01:19:16,080 --> 01:19:20,760 thread of people's and Okay, I think you can I don't know this. 1295 01:19:20,790 --> 01:19:24,690 There's no maybe not a star rating thing Viet in activity 1296 01:19:24,690 --> 01:19:27,510 pub. But it seems like that's a channel level and element. And 1297 01:19:27,510 --> 01:19:31,500 it's just a whole list of people say and I love it. I hate it. 1298 01:19:31,500 --> 01:19:33,420 That's what it is reviews. Yep. 1299 01:19:34,500 --> 01:19:37,590 Not it doesn't seem very special to me. And it can show up 1300 01:19:37,590 --> 01:19:38,130 everywhere. 1301 01:19:38,370 --> 01:19:42,810 Yes. And that can be specified as the the channel level which 1302 01:19:42,840 --> 01:19:47,820 any app could then translate to these reviews. Yeah. solves. 1303 01:19:47,850 --> 01:19:51,210 Okay. Let's be great, guys. Yeah. 1304 01:19:52,560 --> 01:19:53,460 We have our work cut out for us. 1305 01:19:54,540 --> 01:19:57,630 I wanted to follow up on something. I don't think I did 1306 01:19:57,630 --> 01:20:01,290 this on the last day. Didn't we have a Because because you 1307 01:20:01,290 --> 01:20:04,740 brought it up on the show, someone sent a real nasty email 1308 01:20:04,740 --> 01:20:08,790 to you about their podcast not being listed properly 1309 01:20:09,329 --> 01:20:12,209 on the index is a bad redirect. Yeah. 1310 01:20:12,929 --> 01:20:16,019 Did you see that? I, I went back at him? And he replied, 1311 01:20:16,469 --> 01:20:18,179 yeah. And he was any apologize, 1312 01:20:18,209 --> 01:20:20,999 I think I think I should, because he was really, really 1313 01:20:20,999 --> 01:20:24,719 rude about you stupid company, you should be paying me to do 1314 01:20:24,719 --> 01:20:28,799 it. And wow, no, no, great. But what's interesting is I've 1315 01:20:28,799 --> 01:20:30,869 learned over time that when people do this, there's 1316 01:20:30,869 --> 01:20:33,209 something else going on. So when I said, Hey, man, you know, I 1317 01:20:33,209 --> 01:20:36,089 don't think you understand we're doing. And I just I think, 1318 01:20:36,119 --> 01:20:38,759 because we did that after read his apology, I would like to 1319 01:20:38,759 --> 01:20:41,519 apologize for my last email to you and your company, I was 1320 01:20:41,519 --> 01:20:44,939 wrong for sending such an email like that. I was angry at all 1321 01:20:44,939 --> 01:20:47,969 the podcast directories like Google, Apple, and so on. So I 1322 01:20:47,969 --> 01:20:51,629 lumped everyone together. What was happening with the other 1323 01:20:51,629 --> 01:20:54,059 companies, they had my show and a new show on their platform 1324 01:20:54,059 --> 01:20:58,169 related to duplicate show and they deleted the wrong one. I'm 1325 01:20:58,169 --> 01:21:01,289 still new at podcasting. I'm only going into my second year 1326 01:21:01,289 --> 01:21:03,809 and stuff makes me worried of what's happening. Again, I'm 1327 01:21:03,809 --> 01:21:05,489 sorry, for my last email, shouldn't have lumped your 1328 01:21:05,489 --> 01:21:08,189 company without directories. hope you can forgive me. Of 1329 01:21:08,189 --> 01:21:11,429 course, we forgive him. But it tells you something. It tells 1330 01:21:11,429 --> 01:21:16,409 you something. Those guys are messed up. And and I don't think 1331 01:21:16,409 --> 01:21:17,639 they're doing anything about it. 1332 01:21:18,990 --> 01:21:21,480 Yes, we see that in our support. Yeah. 1333 01:21:22,050 --> 01:21:24,570 This sounds like a support email that you guys would receive. 1334 01:21:24,570 --> 01:21:25,080 Exactly. 1335 01:21:25,769 --> 01:21:28,919 We our support team is incredible. And they are way 1336 01:21:28,919 --> 01:21:32,009 more patient than I am. Right. Like I would I wouldn't respond 1337 01:21:32,009 --> 01:21:32,879 well to you. 1338 01:21:33,750 --> 01:21:35,760 You're fired as a customer? Yeah, no, 1339 01:21:36,210 --> 01:21:40,710 I've done it. And so I think it's hard to get in their mind 1340 01:21:40,710 --> 01:21:43,530 that they're just so frustrated, because they just assume you're 1341 01:21:43,530 --> 01:21:45,600 like Google, they're just screaming into the wind, 1342 01:21:45,600 --> 01:21:49,350 nobody's listening, right? Like, like Kevin was talking about 1343 01:21:49,350 --> 01:21:52,320 when they write into Buzzsprout. And they say, you know, somebody 1344 01:21:52,320 --> 01:21:54,480 told me, they left a review, and it's still not showing, they 1345 01:21:54,480 --> 01:21:57,780 write in a bus problem, because we write back to them. They 1346 01:21:57,780 --> 01:22:00,990 don't hear back, they just find themselves, you know, screaming 1347 01:22:00,990 --> 01:22:01,440 into the wind. 1348 01:22:02,190 --> 01:22:05,790 And they don't understand. They don't understand all the crap 1349 01:22:05,850 --> 01:22:10,650 that you have to deal with like a like Alberto over RSS comm. He 1350 01:22:10,650 --> 01:22:14,100 had to write an entire machine learning system to get rid of 1351 01:22:14,100 --> 01:22:17,970 some of this one bot that kept signing up for free podcast and 1352 01:22:17,970 --> 01:22:21,510 putting like porn images in it over and over and over. Like, 1353 01:22:21,570 --> 01:22:25,680 there's so much garbage that you have to get the hosting company 1354 01:22:25,680 --> 01:22:29,640 and the directories are the filter for Yeah, like it's, it's 1355 01:22:29,640 --> 01:22:30,390 insane. 1356 01:22:31,290 --> 01:22:38,130 Which is why we should have we should attack. Anchor, we need 1357 01:22:38,130 --> 01:22:40,920 to enter it, we need to enter it. We need to hoist the Jolly 1358 01:22:40,920 --> 01:22:44,010 Roger. I got it. I got a note from someone the other day and 1359 01:22:44,010 --> 01:22:47,040 he said because he said I'd really want to get on 1360 01:22:47,070 --> 01:22:50,910 podcasting. 2.0 Because I start off with anchor. And it's like 1361 01:22:50,940 --> 01:22:53,940 it's come there's no support. There's nothing happening is 1362 01:22:53,940 --> 01:22:57,240 really weird that place over there. Just but then once I got 1363 01:22:57,240 --> 01:23:01,620 some downloads, all of a sudden Spotify contacted me. Yeah, so 1364 01:23:01,620 --> 01:23:03,960 that's what they're using it for. They're just looking at 1365 01:23:03,960 --> 01:23:07,890 anything that pops a little bit above the needle, and then they 1366 01:23:07,890 --> 01:23:12,330 contact you. Oh, okay. It's a farm team. It's I think it's not 1367 01:23:12,330 --> 01:23:16,080 a farm. It's more like a Petri dish of bacteria. 1368 01:23:18,210 --> 01:23:20,940 Is the is the coop incubator. Exactly. 1369 01:23:22,740 --> 01:23:31,020 Yeah. It's fine. No, it's not far from a fun product that was 1370 01:23:31,020 --> 01:23:31,770 created to 1371 01:23:31,770 --> 01:23:32,430 respect all 1372 01:23:32,430 --> 01:23:33,600 of our competitors 1373 01:23:36,480 --> 01:23:38,820 Shall we thanks some people you guys want to hang around for 1374 01:23:38,820 --> 01:23:41,550 this and listen to some booster grams and stuff. 1375 01:23:41,760 --> 01:23:45,690 Sure. They want to add Kevin want the he must hang around for 1376 01:23:45,690 --> 01:23:49,110 this because he's now the owner of a value for value enabled 1377 01:23:49,110 --> 01:23:51,390 show and he needs to be instructed on how the process 1378 01:23:51,390 --> 01:23:51,870 works. 1379 01:23:51,960 --> 01:23:55,110 Got it? Ah, yes. Okay, so he's taking my attention here. You're 1380 01:23:55,110 --> 01:23:55,530 going 1381 01:23:55,530 --> 01:23:58,170 to do a live cast, you'll be able to talk about Buddha 1382 01:23:58,170 --> 01:23:59,970 Gramsci or Siva, yes, yes. 1383 01:24:01,590 --> 01:24:04,920 This podcast, as you may have figured out his value for value, 1384 01:24:05,160 --> 01:24:08,760 which means the only way it continues and it represents of 1385 01:24:08,760 --> 01:24:11,640 course, the work of podcasting 2.0. In general, all the 1386 01:24:11,640 --> 01:24:16,230 servers, the liquidity on the node, is everything is financed 1387 01:24:16,230 --> 01:24:19,950 through the support of the people who find any value in it 1388 01:24:19,950 --> 01:24:23,100 that can be developers, it's often listeners, it's just 1389 01:24:23,100 --> 01:24:26,850 people who want things to want to see things succeed. And you 1390 01:24:26,850 --> 01:24:30,900 can support us in a number of ways. A great way still still 1391 01:24:30,900 --> 01:24:33,450 valid as you fill out fun coupons. If you go to podcast 1392 01:24:33,450 --> 01:24:37,500 index.org. Go down to the bottom there's a red donate button, you 1393 01:24:37,500 --> 01:24:40,200 can support us through Pay Pal and all the options they have or 1394 01:24:40,200 --> 01:24:43,440 of course, through a modern podcast app at new podcast apps 1395 01:24:43,470 --> 01:24:46,710 comm where you can stream SATs to as value for value in real 1396 01:24:46,710 --> 01:24:50,670 time. It's a dopamine circuit that we've created. I've just 1397 01:24:50,670 --> 01:24:54,840 learned where the because of the the communications going back 1398 01:24:54,840 --> 01:24:57,390 and forth, everyone gets a little dopamine hit on each 1399 01:24:57,390 --> 01:25:01,920 circle of it. And again, a new podcast saps.com So let's thank 1400 01:25:01,950 --> 01:25:05,430 some of our let's thank all of our supporters for this week 1401 01:25:05,430 --> 01:25:05,760 Dave. 1402 01:25:07,080 --> 01:25:12,360 We have a grand total of one PayPal donation this week, so is 1403 01:25:12,360 --> 01:25:14,220 that I think we met during that sad 1404 01:25:14,220 --> 01:25:16,140 puppy is what happened. 1405 01:25:17,160 --> 01:25:18,480 Evidently we did some okay 1406 01:25:18,479 --> 01:25:23,879 this is a this is another important value for value moment 1407 01:25:25,019 --> 01:25:27,479 where you just have to say it's not enough is that what you're 1408 01:25:27,479 --> 01:25:27,869 saying? 1409 01:25:28,440 --> 01:25:33,600 Yes, lick your pencil lead. Kevin. Good note this down when 1410 01:25:34,140 --> 01:25:39,030 when people do not donate enough sad must put chapter art of 1411 01:25:39,030 --> 01:25:40,260 really sad things and 1412 01:25:41,940 --> 01:25:44,580 sad puppies works really well. 1413 01:25:45,750 --> 01:25:48,300 Yes, children was sad looks on their faces. Yeah, 1414 01:25:48,330 --> 01:25:50,430 yeah. Yeah. Preferably holding a shoe. 1415 01:25:50,910 --> 01:25:56,550 Yeah. So it I think I have a indicate like as like an 1416 01:25:56,550 --> 01:26:01,800 indication of why then and I think Ben hills, the developer 1417 01:26:01,800 --> 01:26:06,690 behind at any time podcast player. I think he perfectly 1418 01:26:06,720 --> 01:26:11,400 sums up why we got lower donations. Okay, so he says he's 1419 01:26:11,400 --> 01:26:15,870 seen as $24.07 And he said, Saturdays I go for a walk and 1420 01:26:15,870 --> 01:26:19,740 catch up on the latest episode. Not only does podcasting 2.0 1421 01:26:19,740 --> 01:26:21,900 give you a great give you great new features and value for 1422 01:26:21,900 --> 01:26:25,410 value. Turns out it's also it also keeps you fit. Having said 1423 01:26:25,410 --> 01:26:28,770 that last week's marathon two hour and 10 minute episode 1424 01:26:28,770 --> 01:26:32,010 nearly killed me. Go podcasting Ben at anytime player. 1425 01:26:32,580 --> 01:26:34,800 podcast was too long. 1426 01:26:35,580 --> 01:26:40,800 How many we are actually a public health threat. Yeah, 1427 01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:41,070 that's 1428 01:26:41,070 --> 01:26:42,000 the problem. How 1429 01:26:42,000 --> 01:26:45,600 many videos have to die before they cancel this show? 1430 01:26:47,580 --> 01:26:48,810 We're killing our audience. 1431 01:26:49,739 --> 01:26:53,009 Yes, we're gonna get canceled. That's it. That's that's our 1432 01:26:53,009 --> 01:26:54,029 PayPal donations. 1433 01:26:54,060 --> 01:26:57,720 Wow. Yes. All right, good. 1434 01:26:58,950 --> 01:27:01,440 Let's see here. We got mere mortals podcast or buddy Karen 1435 01:27:01,440 --> 01:27:05,400 down to the fountain that gave us a big long road ducks 22 to 1436 01:27:05,400 --> 01:27:12,930 22. And he says, not sure if this boost is for Dave smooth, 1437 01:27:12,930 --> 01:27:18,210 crooning. Adam sultry French dinner for the wife for the DJ 1438 01:27:18,210 --> 01:27:23,220 groin replacement. That's when I tried to blow my groin off with 1439 01:27:25,110 --> 01:27:28,200 in any case, these sets are well earned love the last episode. 1440 01:27:28,200 --> 01:27:29,670 Quack, quack, quack. Yes. Thank 1441 01:27:29,670 --> 01:27:30,300 you very much. 1442 01:27:31,140 --> 01:27:38,130 You do it. He's a bro. is able Kirby gave us 50,000 sets. 1443 01:27:38,160 --> 01:27:40,080 Was he the big baller for today? 1444 01:27:40,410 --> 01:27:45,330 I think he made the there might have been another 15 We're gonna 1445 01:27:45,330 --> 01:27:49,230 have Shakalaka blades on? 1446 01:27:50,310 --> 01:27:52,290 He can he could share his baller status. 1447 01:27:52,920 --> 01:27:55,890 Curio caster was the app in question here. And he says, I 1448 01:27:55,890 --> 01:27:59,640 don't like writing notes. I just want to boost but don't write 1449 01:27:59,640 --> 01:28:06,720 something you don't know. I'm listening. Boost. The big 1450 01:28:06,720 --> 01:28:12,210 baller. John's BRT send his 49,000 SATs. That's almost 1451 01:28:12,270 --> 01:28:18,720 50,000 I think he deserves a baller to podcast. Shot Carla 20 1452 01:28:18,720 --> 01:28:24,570 is Blaze owner. He sent that one through fountain and he just 1453 01:28:24,570 --> 01:28:34,350 says r&d That's the message r&d Our n or m in an indie or indie 1454 01:28:35,100 --> 01:28:36,690 random obviously 1455 01:28:37,770 --> 01:28:40,830 any anything Kevin. Pick 1456 01:28:41,370 --> 01:28:44,280 up the other day I got a donut This is one of the problems with 1457 01:28:44,280 --> 01:28:49,440 donut again a value for value lesson guys. I got a note on the 1458 01:28:49,440 --> 01:29:01,380 no agenda show and someone said I am an S A hmm SHM no S H M and 1459 01:29:01,380 --> 01:29:05,640 everyone's like surprised I'm surprised you don't know what 1460 01:29:05,640 --> 01:29:11,700 that means. stay at home mom. Oh, like I did. I mean it took 1461 01:29:11,700 --> 01:29:15,600 me a long time to get w f h I didn't I didn't understand that 1462 01:29:15,600 --> 01:29:21,180 one for you. We know wfh work from home. Work From Home these 1463 01:29:21,180 --> 01:29:25,650 are all pandemic terms now work for is like what is W F h but I 1464 01:29:25,650 --> 01:29:30,120 did not get that so be careful with your acronyms people. WTF 1465 01:29:32,220 --> 01:29:34,770 WTF whf? 1466 01:29:35,850 --> 01:29:40,050 Why every time every time somebody posts post one of those 1467 01:29:40,050 --> 01:29:42,750 like short, something that starts with a W i just 1468 01:29:42,750 --> 01:29:45,600 automatically think it's dirty. I mean, yes, yes. Yes. 1469 01:29:46,260 --> 01:29:46,650 You know, 1470 01:29:46,800 --> 01:29:49,710 like, I'm like wfh, I'm come My mind is coming up with all kinds 1471 01:29:49,710 --> 01:29:53,790 of horrible phrases. I don't know what r&d is, but I know 1472 01:29:53,790 --> 01:29:55,500 that isn't BRT. Yeah. 1473 01:29:55,530 --> 01:29:57,150 Nice. is a national treasure. 1474 01:29:57,180 --> 01:30:03,930 Yeah. Thank you John's BRT. Steve Webb Oh Steve when he got 1475 01:30:03,930 --> 01:30:09,150 cast our God caster Yeah 7777 cents through pod friend and he 1476 01:30:09,150 --> 01:30:13,680 says because you rock Oh my podcast at audio Bible dot Link 1477 01:30:13,680 --> 01:30:16,440 has a constant incoming stream of sets and it's all because of 1478 01:30:16,440 --> 01:30:17,940 you guys go podcasting 1479 01:30:24,120 --> 01:30:31,290 I like that combo combo it's work Abel Kirby sent us 13,333 1480 01:30:31,290 --> 01:30:38,640 sets and he says boost for Kyron down boost. Okay I guess he just 1481 01:30:38,640 --> 01:30:43,680 likes Karen a lot see oh there's a page that just says boost on 1482 01:30:43,680 --> 01:30:53,610 it and that's from forged foe is 11,011 11,111 SATs so a row ones 1483 01:30:53,940 --> 01:30:57,930 through fountain and he just says boost Oh on boost. 1484 01:30:59,189 --> 01:31:00,329 I was a little weak and we try to 1485 01:31:02,250 --> 01:31:08,490 kind of flesh it boosted a pinky and this one set just as high. 1486 01:31:08,790 --> 01:31:10,050 Okay, okay. 1487 01:31:11,130 --> 01:31:16,440 This is the one SATs Hey, thanks for your boost 1488 01:31:16,470 --> 01:31:22,500 boost estetica the inventor of the term booster gram sent us 1489 01:31:22,710 --> 01:31:27,270 2376 SATs to fountain and he says love the icon go booster 1490 01:31:27,270 --> 01:31:36,600 grams. Yeah. How you doing? 15,000 SATs from David meatus 1491 01:31:36,630 --> 01:31:40,830 and he says thanks for the mention of Fun Fact Friday. See 1492 01:31:40,830 --> 01:31:42,960 you Monday, Adam Lila and David meet us. 1493 01:31:42,990 --> 01:31:46,470 Oh my goodness. I sure hope so. I'm going to do a test Sunday 1494 01:31:46,470 --> 01:31:54,540 night. mean if I'm negative Sunday night, I mean I'm willing 1495 01:31:54,540 --> 01:31:58,380 to go to Nashville but I'm I'm more I'm more cautious about 1496 01:31:58,380 --> 01:31:59,430 that than anything. 1497 01:31:59,910 --> 01:32:01,860 But did you actually test positive? Yes, I 1498 01:32:01,860 --> 01:32:05,850 did. I did. Okay, yeah. But I mean, what does it mean? Now? 1499 01:32:05,850 --> 01:32:07,020 Okay, sure. 1500 01:32:07,200 --> 01:32:09,510 Maybe first one was negative, but your second one was 1501 01:32:09,510 --> 01:32:10,440 positive. Right? Yeah. 1502 01:32:10,440 --> 01:32:14,370 The first one I tested immediately on on Monday. I was 1503 01:32:14,370 --> 01:32:19,050 like, Okay, let me just check nothing, and then waited until 1504 01:32:19,680 --> 01:32:24,210 yesterday and was showed positive. And today I'm sick. I 1505 01:32:24,210 --> 01:32:27,600 mean, definitely. Um, yeah. I mean, I right now as we speak, 1506 01:32:27,600 --> 01:32:31,050 I'm sloshing Washington my galoshes, 1507 01:32:31,260 --> 01:32:37,290 I remember at podcasts business omit me we, me and Tom walked 1508 01:32:37,290 --> 01:32:40,380 into that. It was like some kind of club thing where they had 1509 01:32:40,380 --> 01:32:43,770 this huge dance party. I think it was like a heart radio or 1510 01:32:43,770 --> 01:32:47,610 something like that. He walked in and I'm like, sat there and 1511 01:32:47,610 --> 01:32:50,730 stared for about 30 seconds. He's like, No, I'm out. Around 1512 01:32:50,730 --> 01:32:53,850 he's like he said, you can see the Delta floating in the air. 1513 01:32:57,510 --> 01:33:02,370 Oh, Billy Newman since 2000 SATs through fountain at said SATs 1514 01:33:02,370 --> 01:33:03,330 from the Cash App. 1515 01:33:03,479 --> 01:33:07,709 Oops. Oh, cool. That's working now. Nice. Yeah. Nice. 1516 01:33:08,820 --> 01:33:15,690 Scott. Listed as s dot c dot O dot t dot T yes in this 10,420 1517 01:33:15,690 --> 01:33:17,850 SATs and he says go podcasting. 2.0 1518 01:33:17,880 --> 01:33:19,320 very nice respectable Thank 1519 01:33:19,320 --> 01:33:27,480 you. Okay, sir. Sir Spencer's in a 6887 says through fountain it 1520 01:33:27,480 --> 01:33:34,080 says 6887 equals nuts in t nine. This is my nuts boost for being 1521 01:33:34,080 --> 01:33:37,170 nuts and running with running with the podcasting 2.0 1522 01:33:37,170 --> 01:33:42,750 Scissors. That is the new mantra of podcasting. Two ways. 1523 01:33:43,170 --> 01:33:44,160 Podcasting. 2.0 1524 01:33:45,270 --> 01:33:46,350 running this is 1525 01:33:48,359 --> 01:33:50,699 we're all greatly looking forward to having Dave join us 1526 01:33:50,699 --> 01:33:52,589 with bowls for buds. Oh, that's right. I'm gonna be on there. 1527 01:33:53,339 --> 01:33:56,519 Live following no agenda on Sunday, February the 20th. 1528 01:33:56,729 --> 01:33:59,549 Thanks for all you do. Cool. We are going to be stepping up on 1529 01:33:59,549 --> 01:34:02,069 crowdsourcing some code this year. So Dave doesn't have to 1530 01:34:02,069 --> 01:34:04,469 work front end. Love his lid. 1531 01:34:06,330 --> 01:34:09,840 Wow, what a punishment day if you don't have to work on front 1532 01:34:09,840 --> 01:34:11,820 end. Your favorite thing to do 1533 01:34:11,970 --> 01:34:15,120 that he's saying that we don't have to work on front end really 1534 01:34:15,120 --> 01:34:18,090 means is Can somebody else please do this? Because this 1535 01:34:18,090 --> 01:34:24,930 looks like it looks like they're calling McCormick send us 333 1536 01:34:24,930 --> 01:34:30,240 sets. Thank you, fountain and he says I deliver legally mot I 1537 01:34:30,240 --> 01:34:34,110 deliver legally mobbing through the streets. What does that 1538 01:34:34,110 --> 01:34:38,190 mean? I delivered legally mobbing through the streets of 1539 01:34:38,190 --> 01:34:41,670 Woodland Hills, California. Oh, if I moved to Texas, I will only 1540 01:34:41,670 --> 01:34:44,520 accept SATs from curry for his pod father vapes. 1541 01:34:45,300 --> 01:34:48,270 Remember he talked about what he was doing when he was listening? 1542 01:34:48,270 --> 01:34:51,840 He was delivering something. Oh, that's right. That's right, man. 1543 01:34:51,870 --> 01:34:53,820 I may have to move man, but I got memory. 1544 01:34:55,830 --> 01:34:58,680 That's right. This is the official, the official drug 1545 01:34:58,680 --> 01:35:00,690 supplier of the podcast. Two Point OSHA. 1546 01:35:01,080 --> 01:35:01,980 No, he's not. 1547 01:35:03,659 --> 01:35:06,209 He said he said delivering delivering the vapes aren't 1548 01:35:06,209 --> 01:35:09,899 those illegal in that they make it illegal. I 1549 01:35:09,900 --> 01:35:12,870 think the vapes that he's talking about in California are 1550 01:35:12,870 --> 01:35:13,740 legal. Yeah. 1551 01:35:14,460 --> 01:35:18,930 Oh, okay. Okay. That's right state by state laws. I still 1552 01:35:18,930 --> 01:35:20,700 live in good old Alabama. Hey, 1553 01:35:20,730 --> 01:35:24,390 Texas, man, isn't it? It's, it's like I think they, they 1554 01:35:24,390 --> 01:35:26,730 immediately throw you in the river with a rock around your 1555 01:35:26,730 --> 01:35:29,280 neck. That's right for knowledge. 1556 01:35:30,210 --> 01:35:35,370 Comic Strip blogger. Hey, send us 10,033 sets through pod 1557 01:35:35,370 --> 01:35:38,250 friend and he says, howdy podcasting 2.0 Team Dave and 1558 01:35:38,250 --> 01:35:41,370 Adam. Today I just want to say Get well soon Adam after 1559 01:35:41,370 --> 01:35:44,250 catching COVID You've won genetic lottery so I'm sure your 1560 01:35:44,250 --> 01:35:45,450 recovery will be smooth. 1561 01:35:46,979 --> 01:35:52,259 What am I doing rematch? Yes, I have Vonda genetic lottery. Hey, 1562 01:35:52,289 --> 01:35:57,059 I need a comic strip blogger boost jingle gotta have one yes 1563 01:35:57,059 --> 01:35:59,999 that's a CSV I need a boost. I need one in yours baby. 1564 01:36:00,720 --> 01:36:06,480 Anonymous anonymous boost from the breeze app 5000 SATs nice he 1565 01:36:06,480 --> 01:36:09,870 says great plug I don't know who it is. Don't know what the 1566 01:36:09,870 --> 01:36:14,310 referencing but we'll take it. Thank you. All right. That's the 1567 01:36:14,340 --> 01:36:15,570 histograms I had. 1568 01:36:17,010 --> 01:36:22,650 So for our guests here today, no so please see how important the 1569 01:36:22,680 --> 01:36:26,280 numerology is in booster grams. This is another thing you can 1570 01:36:26,280 --> 01:36:30,990 play with it becomes really funny you can have donation 1571 01:36:30,990 --> 01:36:36,750 drives based upon the date, pi date you know the PI 314 You 1572 01:36:36,750 --> 01:36:39,990 know there's there's all these things you can do special like 1573 01:36:39,990 --> 01:36:43,140 episode numbers. I'll give an example from Korea and the 1574 01:36:43,140 --> 01:36:46,440 keeper I was just looking at the heli pad boost check this out. 1575 01:36:47,400 --> 01:36:53,100 To Korean the keeper 6969 sets the booster Graham. My therapist 1576 01:36:53,100 --> 01:36:55,920 wife and I are certified relationship coaches and sex 1577 01:36:55,920 --> 01:37:00,240 alternative sex educators. If any is interested in a better 1578 01:37:00,240 --> 01:37:03,570 relationship with better sex contact us. I mean, we're all 1579 01:37:03,570 --> 01:37:07,530 getting advertised advertising through this method is really 1580 01:37:07,530 --> 01:37:08,310 interesting. 1581 01:37:09,000 --> 01:37:12,120 I tried this I tried this with my first boost yesterday I sent 1582 01:37:12,150 --> 01:37:17,610 I was listening to the pod land and I boosted them 4401 The 1583 01:37:17,610 --> 01:37:20,430 message had nothing to do with the number but I'm wondering if 1584 01:37:20,430 --> 01:37:22,290 they're gonna figure out why I chose that number. 1585 01:37:23,130 --> 01:37:29,910 Numerology Yeah, it's beautiful to say the the legal pad in 1586 01:37:29,910 --> 01:37:32,280 front of Kevin is now completely full. You're having a sound of 1587 01:37:32,280 --> 01:37:38,310 writing margins to figure this donate donations, monthly 1588 01:37:38,310 --> 01:37:43,800 donations Jeremy new $5 Cameron Rose $25 pod verse, our buddies 1589 01:37:43,800 --> 01:37:52,440 at pod verse. So $50 Thank you. Sorry, I'm good rebound writing. 1590 01:37:52,590 --> 01:37:58,020 Lauren ball $24.20 Mitch Downey $10 Krista ruber, char Barak 1591 01:37:58,050 --> 01:38:03,030 $10. And Terry Keller. $5. Every time I read Terry Taylor's name 1592 01:38:03,030 --> 01:38:08,400 I always think of Tim Keller. Tim. Yes. Oh, yep. Yep. Tim 1593 01:38:08,400 --> 01:38:14,280 Keller, the preacher and Christian philosopher. Would you 1594 01:38:14,280 --> 01:38:16,800 call it from up in New York? I think 1595 01:38:17,310 --> 01:38:20,820 yeah, yeah, he's, they've got a podcast with some of his best 1596 01:38:20,820 --> 01:38:21,660 teachings is really good 1597 01:38:22,080 --> 01:38:25,200 care. Terry Keller is known as the human subscription machine. 1598 01:38:25,920 --> 01:38:29,070 He, he had this isn't Esther's nickname he donates to 1599 01:38:29,070 --> 01:38:33,840 everything. Mo facts, no agenda. I think D H unplugged 1600 01:38:34,320 --> 01:38:37,680 podcasting. 2.0 There are just people who are just really 1601 01:38:37,680 --> 01:38:41,520 rooting for podcasting. 2.0 success, and they will just 1602 01:38:41,520 --> 01:38:44,580 donate and push and boost everything they can and I love 1603 01:38:44,580 --> 01:38:45,060 them. All. 1604 01:38:46,050 --> 01:38:49,500 Right, let's booster gram tutorial over 1605 01:38:49,560 --> 01:38:54,660 Yes. And thank you to all of our supporters. We could do more on 1606 01:38:54,660 --> 01:38:57,360 the on the bigger numbers in the Pay Pal because of course the 1607 01:38:57,360 --> 01:39:00,900 booster grams. Though some big ballers are nice. We definitely 1608 01:39:00,900 --> 01:39:04,560 need more to support the 12 $1,300 a month nut that we 1609 01:39:04,560 --> 01:39:08,310 have now. And growing. Because I hear we're going to be doing 1610 01:39:08,310 --> 01:39:12,330 subscription shit now all of a sudden. Just kidding. Just 1611 01:39:12,330 --> 01:39:18,450 kidding. Just kidding. So yeah, new podcast apps.com. And 1612 01:39:18,480 --> 01:39:26,370 obviously, at podcast index.org. Any questions, Kevin? No. 1613 01:39:27,479 --> 01:39:31,859 You mentioned? Gosh, this is this is totally off of what we 1614 01:39:31,859 --> 01:39:34,319 just did. But you just mentioned subscriptions. Again, I just had 1615 01:39:34,319 --> 01:39:36,929 this idea. Like I mean, it's possible we get to the point 1616 01:39:36,929 --> 01:39:39,329 where the value payments where there's enough enough apps that 1617 01:39:39,329 --> 01:39:41,609 support it in the way that we want that you could add a tag 1618 01:39:41,609 --> 01:39:45,719 that says, you know, I don't want people listening past this 1619 01:39:45,719 --> 01:39:47,999 much or listening to this many episodes unless you're 1620 01:39:47,999 --> 01:39:50,309 supporting me at a certain point, but I wonder how scalable 1621 01:39:50,309 --> 01:39:52,349 that is. I want to keep on doing better on my brand. 1622 01:39:52,560 --> 01:39:57,750 Have you seen the bonus content tag proposal? Is that almost 1623 01:39:57,750 --> 01:40:02,670 fits exactly with what you're saying. It's basically content, 1624 01:40:03,210 --> 01:40:07,680 certain content is it's behind a paywall that you unlock through 1625 01:40:07,680 --> 01:40:08,910 a boost. Yeah. 1626 01:40:09,810 --> 01:40:14,100 Interesting. See, I want the exact opposite. Yeah, I'll tell 1627 01:40:14,100 --> 01:40:20,040 you what, here's what I know I did you say that Kevin? You say, 1628 01:40:20,220 --> 01:40:25,560 Me too. Yeah, here's what I want. I love all apps for 1629 01:40:25,560 --> 01:40:30,750 different reasons. What I really like is when an app has a queue 1630 01:40:30,780 --> 01:40:34,500 of new episodes that have just updated in chronological order, 1631 01:40:34,800 --> 01:40:37,170 I can because I can, like pod friend does this in a very 1632 01:40:37,170 --> 01:40:40,830 visual way. Like, okay, here's all the episodes, and this one 1633 01:40:40,830 --> 01:40:43,650 just came out yesterday, you know, going back and I can kind 1634 01:40:43,650 --> 01:40:46,830 of scroll back and you know, it creates an automatic cue for me, 1635 01:40:47,040 --> 01:40:50,730 what I would like, is the minute a new, a new here comes, the 1636 01:40:50,730 --> 01:40:56,010 minute a new pod drops, the I would like 10,000 SATs to go to 1637 01:40:56,010 --> 01:40:58,380 my favorite to that podcast right away without even 1638 01:40:58,380 --> 01:41:03,030 listening to it. It shows up in the app boost 1639 01:41:06,060 --> 01:41:07,350 from Kevin says, Man, 1640 01:41:08,609 --> 01:41:13,319 I don't know. But You're 100%, right, like that is the beauty 1641 01:41:13,349 --> 01:41:16,619 of you figure out what you want. You know, and if you're a 1642 01:41:16,619 --> 01:41:20,129 developer, then go and build it. Yeah, the trouble that we get 1643 01:41:20,129 --> 01:41:23,039 into is when we try to solve problems for other people. And 1644 01:41:23,039 --> 01:41:25,889 that's what I was just thinking like, I could probably come up 1645 01:41:25,889 --> 01:41:28,049 with some ideas that may be pretty good for people who want 1646 01:41:28,049 --> 01:41:30,329 to do subscription podcast stuff, but it's really not where 1647 01:41:30,329 --> 01:41:32,549 my interests lie right now. So I should probably let somebody 1648 01:41:32,549 --> 01:41:32,999 else solve 1649 01:41:33,000 --> 01:41:36,810 it right on. And we can't solve all problems of the world, but 1650 01:41:36,810 --> 01:41:40,470 we can continue on the path we're on and just keep doing 1651 01:41:40,470 --> 01:41:40,860 better. 1652 01:41:41,609 --> 01:41:43,559 in it. You know, one of the things that you guys were 1653 01:41:43,559 --> 01:41:47,759 running point on in the namespace proposals was the 1654 01:41:47,759 --> 01:41:52,589 channel's idea of bringing channels to the namespace. Is 1655 01:41:52,589 --> 01:41:55,289 that do you think that's still worth pursuing? What do you what 1656 01:41:55,289 --> 01:41:58,769 are your feelings on that? That was that worked out for like 1657 01:41:58,769 --> 01:42:00,809 that of Apple and other people have tried it? 1658 01:42:02,880 --> 01:42:06,360 I mean, I think it just caused a ton of confusion. Really? 1659 01:42:06,479 --> 01:42:08,999 Yeah, I feel like it derailed us because we were kind of getting 1660 01:42:08,999 --> 01:42:11,309 excited about the idea of using channels for networks, but 1661 01:42:11,309 --> 01:42:13,259 that's not really the way that they're using channels. 1662 01:42:14,190 --> 01:42:17,250 Okay, I've never really understood the channels issue, 1663 01:42:17,250 --> 01:42:19,950 is that worth explaining it to me? Is it something? Or is it 1664 01:42:19,950 --> 01:42:21,810 just something that we're not that interested in? 1665 01:42:23,250 --> 01:42:28,500 Um, I like thinking about channels in terms of, and I 1666 01:42:28,500 --> 01:42:30,810 think this is the way we started bringing the conversation before 1667 01:42:30,870 --> 01:42:34,020 it died off. But the idea of like, similar podcast or podcast 1668 01:42:34,020 --> 01:42:35,940 that I'm willing to recommend, or podcasts that have some 1669 01:42:35,940 --> 01:42:41,310 association, in so, you know, Adam, you're you don't just have 1670 01:42:41,340 --> 01:42:44,040 this show, you've got other shows. So being able to say in 1671 01:42:44,040 --> 01:42:48,060 your feed, hay podcast apps, if you want to recommend other, you 1672 01:42:48,060 --> 01:42:50,010 know, enjoying this show, and you want to recommend some other 1673 01:42:50,010 --> 01:42:53,520 shows, here's some other shows that I'm on. I like that idea. 1674 01:42:54,090 --> 01:42:59,340 But I don't know how, sorry, how far we need to go with that. I 1675 01:42:59,340 --> 01:43:02,910 think Apple definitely made it pretty confusing with with the 1676 01:43:02,910 --> 01:43:04,890 way they set up subscriptions, and you had to have a channel 1677 01:43:04,890 --> 01:43:08,400 and then you can have Ah, okay, so it was under a channel and a 1678 01:43:08,400 --> 01:43:10,800 channel, not necessarily the show. And like, that's all very 1679 01:43:10,800 --> 01:43:14,280 confusing. But in terms of a recommendation from the person 1680 01:43:14,280 --> 01:43:16,800 who's publishing the speed, hey, here's other shows. I'm either 1681 01:43:16,800 --> 01:43:19,380 in or I like that. I just want to recommend to people, I think 1682 01:43:19,380 --> 01:43:20,550 that a valid 1683 01:43:20,580 --> 01:43:23,250 but we have a tag for that, don't we, Dave? Or a proposal 1684 01:43:23,250 --> 01:43:27,360 related? Yeah, we have deleted pod? Yeah, yeah. Holy crap. We 1685 01:43:27,360 --> 01:43:28,350 thought of everything. 1686 01:43:30,210 --> 01:43:33,360 Kevin and Tom started fleshing that out. And then we had to get 1687 01:43:33,360 --> 01:43:36,780 guid done first, really, because you don't want to base channels 1688 01:43:36,780 --> 01:43:40,170 on feed URLs really do want to have them based on some, like 1689 01:43:40,230 --> 01:43:43,620 higher level metadata. And so we had that, we got that done. And 1690 01:43:43,620 --> 01:43:47,430 then we never really returned to talk about the channel proposal 1691 01:43:47,430 --> 01:43:52,500 more. So. I mean, it's, it may be one of those things that's 1692 01:43:52,500 --> 01:43:55,890 like, I'm not afraid of of having tags that didn't 1693 01:43:56,430 --> 01:44:00,870 ultimately end up never getting used. That's not a problem. I 1694 01:44:00,870 --> 01:44:02,820 mean, people people are either going to use them find them 1695 01:44:02,820 --> 01:44:06,630 useful, or they're not. Having them there is not is not an 1696 01:44:06,630 --> 01:44:10,680 issue. But But I don't want to I don't want to waste time if we 1697 01:44:10,680 --> 01:44:13,560 don't think it's going to be a real successful thing. 1698 01:44:17,670 --> 01:44:22,290 Dave, did we did we somehow not? I mean, maybe it came in between 1699 01:44:22,290 --> 01:44:26,400 shows or somehow I don't think we really promoted the fountain 1700 01:44:26,430 --> 01:44:27,420 app news. 1701 01:44:28,649 --> 01:44:32,639 It just came this week, like the mid the mid week, I think, yeah. 1702 01:44:32,639 --> 01:44:36,029 Fountain fountain is now onboarding. podcasters. With 1703 01:44:36,269 --> 01:44:40,709 with a wallet right in the app is amazing. Yeah, the way that 1704 01:44:40,709 --> 01:44:46,079 works, too, like I worked with Oscar to he, um, I have the 1705 01:44:46,079 --> 01:44:49,169 ability, you know, what I do is for specific use case for this, 1706 01:44:49,169 --> 01:44:53,339 I can set up a Partner API. So it's just sort of a subset of 1707 01:44:53,339 --> 01:44:59,729 the normal API that's restricted to only that specific app or 1708 01:44:59,729 --> 01:45:04,829 that If developer set of API keys. And so what we did, what I 1709 01:45:04,829 --> 01:45:10,469 did was set up a Partner API for Oscar at fountain, so that he 1710 01:45:10,469 --> 01:45:16,379 could send value blocks into the index for so he can say, hey, 1711 01:45:16,769 --> 01:45:21,689 hey, podcast index here, this feed ID now has this once this 1712 01:45:21,689 --> 01:45:24,869 value block, so it'll it'll hand it off to us. And it will stick 1713 01:45:24,869 --> 01:45:26,849 it in there sort of like a podcast or wallet, but through 1714 01:45:26,849 --> 01:45:32,219 the API. Very cool. That allows them to do that they can 1715 01:45:32,219 --> 01:45:36,539 onboard. They rolled their own LNP node, and now they're done. 1716 01:45:36,600 --> 01:45:39,720 They take the they do the open source. They took that and made 1717 01:45:39,720 --> 01:45:40,590 that and use that. 1718 01:45:41,640 --> 01:45:44,010 Now, Tim is running their stuff like he does for us. 1719 01:45:44,040 --> 01:45:46,290 Oh, perfect. Oh, perfect. Okay. Oh, good. 1720 01:45:46,770 --> 01:45:49,860 I'm really glad about that, too. Because a 1010 deserves to me 1721 01:45:49,860 --> 01:45:53,280 He, He does great work. He needs that business. That's a good 1722 01:45:53,280 --> 01:45:53,880 business. I'm 1723 01:45:53,880 --> 01:45:56,490 glad he's wanting to do it too. But of course, that's what he's 1724 01:45:56,490 --> 01:45:59,460 always wanted. He's always wanted to work with B will 1725 01:45:59,460 --> 01:46:03,240 always want to do b2b. Yeah, yeah. So perfect business. Well, 1726 01:46:03,240 --> 01:46:07,380 congratulations to fountain man. That's that's, that's really, 1727 01:46:07,380 --> 01:46:09,360 really progressive. That's progressing. 1728 01:46:09,359 --> 01:46:12,299 What's up? What's up with POD land like horning in on our 1729 01:46:12,299 --> 01:46:15,509 turf? They're like interviewing Gigi and not and Oscar Mary. 1730 01:46:15,509 --> 01:46:19,799 They're like, scooping or scooping are our guests. No, no, 1731 01:46:19,829 --> 01:46:23,099 no. I'm gonna start doing Spotify press releases. 1732 01:46:23,130 --> 01:46:28,950 Oh my god. Wow. Well, that was that was really rude in so many 1733 01:46:28,950 --> 01:46:34,860 ways. I loved it. Good. Oh, man. That was almost British level 1734 01:46:34,860 --> 01:46:40,440 rudeness. Humor I was good. At it delights me to no end. 1735 01:46:40,710 --> 01:46:44,730 Because yeah, it's boring to talk about the the legacy app 1736 01:46:44,730 --> 01:46:48,150 companies, this exciting people out there doing exciting things. 1737 01:46:48,270 --> 01:46:51,300 And that includes Tom and Kevin from Buzzsprout, who not only 1738 01:46:51,300 --> 01:46:54,990 have supported this, this project from the very beginning, 1739 01:46:55,560 --> 01:46:58,890 with their work with their effort, but also with their 1740 01:46:58,890 --> 01:47:02,940 finances. That is, is incredibly appreciated. We would not be 1741 01:47:02,940 --> 01:47:06,660 doing it to this level without us for sure. So I want to thank 1742 01:47:06,660 --> 01:47:09,870 you again, both personally, but also thank you, thank all of 1743 01:47:09,870 --> 01:47:13,500 your employees who I'm sure we only make life more complicated 1744 01:47:13,500 --> 01:47:17,790 for them and, and, you know, especially the Support Division, 1745 01:47:18,540 --> 01:47:22,890 but also the implementation part. I know it's it's work, and 1746 01:47:22,920 --> 01:47:25,590 I have an idea of what it takes and and it's just really 1747 01:47:25,590 --> 01:47:28,650 appreciate it. And it's great to be working with you guys. 1748 01:47:29,340 --> 01:47:31,140 Thanks. Appreciate it. Appreciate you guys. 1749 01:47:31,170 --> 01:47:33,120 Yeah, it's always a fun afternoon. We can talk to you 1750 01:47:33,120 --> 01:47:34,110 guys. So thank you so much. 1751 01:47:34,260 --> 01:47:36,060 Yeah, don't get used to it. We, 1752 01:47:37,170 --> 01:47:41,340 we, we we need to we need to end it because people are literally 1753 01:47:41,340 --> 01:47:43,140 dying on the sidewalk. Yes, it's 1754 01:47:43,140 --> 01:47:45,390 getting too long. We've got to stop. Thank you very much, 1755 01:47:45,390 --> 01:47:48,720 everybody for joining the board meeting of podcasting. 2.0 We 1756 01:47:48,720 --> 01:47:51,150 look forward to be here next week talking about everything 1757 01:47:51,150 --> 01:47:53,970 that's going on. Be good everybody. See you then bye bye. 1758 01:48:09,569 --> 01:48:14,129 You have been listening to podcasting 2.0 Visit podcasts 1759 01:48:14,159 --> 01:48:16,829 index.org For more information 1760 01:48:19,979 --> 01:48:20,759 go podcast. 1761 01:48:22,890 --> 01:48:23,670 moost