Private Brands 101: Kirkland, Target, Walmart & More | Spotlight Series

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I'm one of your co hosts for today's interview, Anne Mazinga.

And I'm Chris Walton.

And Chris, you know, we've been hanging out in the same circles as our next guests for quite a while, but we finally today get the chance to interview them and share them with our Omnitalk retail audience.

So I could not be more excited, especially when we dive into the topic that we're going to tackle today.

We got slammed last week with Q3 earnings from the likes of Walmart, Target and others.

And one of the key differentiators, Chris, I'm wondering if you can guess this.

One of the key differentiators that many of those retailers talked about was this thing.

Do you have any idea what that could be?

I think, I think I know where you're going there, Ed.

I think I know where you're going.

For some it was wicked, but I think I know where you're going there and what is it.

Yes, we are going to talk today about private brands because all of those retailers that I mentioned are very into that as their growth strategy.

So.

So it's with great pleasure that we introduce today's guest who will give us the ins and outs, the winners and the losers, and most importantly, the steps that retailers should be taking to develop their own private brand strategy from start to finish.

We have the Barcode Group's Chief Growth Officer, Brandon Warren, and President, Bethany Davis.

Brandon.

Bethany, welcome to the show.

Brandon, I've been so excited.

We've met a long time ago and we're finally here.

How excited are you to talk about private brands today?

The moment has finally arrived.

Thank you so much for having us.

We're super excited to be here and share a little bit about the private brands world to your audience.

So thanks so much for having us.

Super excited for today.

Excellent.

And Bethany, welcome to you too.

I haven't known you quite as long, but in the time that I have known you and in preparation for this call, you blew me away.

There's a couple of points in this conversation where I think I'm going to totally geek out a little bit on some of the things that you said in that meeting.

So we're really excited to have you with us as well.

Thanks.

I'm super excited to be on.

It's a good time to be having this conversation, I feel like.

So.

Yeah, it is, it is.

I'm loving this energy already.

And this is great.

This is great.

We got, we got it.

This is going to be a great interview.

I can tell.

We got a great, great group of people here.

So.

All right, Brandon, let's start with you.

So why don't, why don't you give the audience a little bit of background about your role at the Bar Barcode Group first and then, and the, and then the team that you, that you cover a lot in the retail landscape.

So what, what, what all does the Barcode Group do?

Let's just back up and start there.

Yeah, we certainly do cover quite a bit.

So again, I'm the chief growth officer here at the Barcode Group.

I'm located in Bentonville, Arkansas.

Been with the company about 11 years now, so been a little bit on this side for quite some time now.

But the short answer is what the Barcode Group does.

Listen, we're an omnichannel agency that really helps brands and manufacturers break into the retail space and succeed there.

So we help suppliers not only get in, but really stay in and grow.

And we do that through a lot of the back end operations, logistics, supply chain, as well as backed by a lot of our data, investments and consumer insights.

And that's, that's the growth, growing portion of the business.

So whether you're really just trying to get products on shelves at major retailers or just need guidance on kind of navigating the complexities of retail, we really got you covered.

So we specialize in everything from crafting, go to market strategies to building partnerships with top retailers, really ultimately just setting your brand up for long term success.

So you can kind of think of us as really your boots on the ground partner, the kind of extension of your team that happens to be located in the markets where these retailers really exist.

So again, we're a full service agency supporting sales, operations, data, consumer insights, creative, all of it.

We do it for both brick and mortar as well.

As the digital side of things.

So we touch a little bit of all of it is true omnichannel approach.

We have offices in Bentonville, Minneapolis, Chicago, St.

Louis and a team of a little over 185 people now located in about 25 states.

So it's a pretty big team out there servicing a lot of these key retailers.

All right, so, so Bethany, you have, you have president in your title.

Tell us about your role too.

Yeah, so I'm the president of our Walmart division here in Bentonville and also run our Barcode intelligence insights team.

So I manage our Walmart strategy and then also lead our insights team that takes all of our data investments and turns them into actionable insights and then also executes our qual and quant research studies that we do for our suppliers and for our retailers.

So can manage all that.

Wow.

Well, and Bethany, I want to get some of like dive into a little bit more some of those insights that you have uncovered with your extensive work with brands and retailers at the Barcode Group.

We talked about this at the beginning.

Private brands, they're a huge component to retailers growth strategies right now.

But can you just set the table for us a little bit like explain to our audience again what, what are, what are customers drawn to about private brands and why are retailers putting so many eggs in this basket?

Yeah, absolutely.

I think this is super fascinating and I have been reading a lot of data points behind this because I think there's some very specific things that are going on.

It is really reminding me of E commerce during COVID Like you had the consumer behaviors that were already there, you had the basis of it, but then you send everyone home, you make it so they can't go outside.

And then you see E commerce, shopping and adoption.

Fast forward five to almost 10 years in some cases.

And I see this same thing happening here where over the last 20 to 30 years you've got this massive evolution in how people are viewing store brands.

So like think about when my parents shopped.

It was true.

Opp.

Opening price point, get the lowest price point on the shelf that you can.

But over the last, you know, KIRKLAND Signature, about 25 years old, 20 years, you've got Trader Joe's, you've got Target that come in with this.

We're going to give you the best value on the best quality product.

And so you have these like generation by generation now where this understanding of what own brand is has changed.

And then you have Gen Z that's come in and they've amplified it even more so you know, they've got dupe culture now where they're not just accepting private brands, they're celebrating them as a smarter, savvier option and they understand the market a little bit better.

So when you look at, I look at specifically, I was just reading this report from Mintel that was sharing by generation and by age what shoppers look for and own brands when they go into the store, do they specifically look for new items?

You could see this boomer over 65 age demographic, less than 13% of the time are looking for new owned brands.

For those under 25, it was over 34% were consistently looking for new own brand consumables and food items.

That is a gigantic change in shift.

And so you have this younger generation coming in who is thinks that this is the best way to save money.

It makes you smarter, there's more fun.

They've, they've grown up in a retail industry where there are fun owned brands out there.

And you just see it exploding right now with the financial pressures that we're experiencing where it's now driving people to those brands for other reasons.

But it's really just a catalyst for what I feel like was already being set up in the industry.

So.

So Bethany, is it, is it.

Are you seeing that change in the demographic solely because of the income dynamics, the macroeconomic pressures of that generation needing to save money?

Is that the majority of it or is there more to it?

I think that's a piece of it.

I mean, I think that you have these younger people that don't have the ability to go out and purchase at the same price points.

Right.

But I think more than that is that you have social Media, you have TikTok where they are really celebrating the good find and you have this wanting to go out and find the good find and they're being more excitement behind it.

So like with Costco, Kirkland Signature, there's this very treasure hunt mindset to those brands.

I think Target historically has done a good job of that, that treasure hunt mindset.

And so it's more that they've grown up in that culture.

And pride too.

Yes, the pride behind it.

Brandon, do you see other.

Do you see this like more the private brands being like more well loved or adopted at certain retailers over others?

Like Bethany mentioned Target being one.

But what is the experience like for you when you look at this across when you're examining multiple retailers?

Yeah, I mean for me, obviously, look, Kirkland Signature is sort of the gold standard there in terms of what's happening with Private brands.

Right.

Really, they're okay.

Yeah.

I mean, listen, if you can take loyalty from golf balls to chicken, you're doing something right in private brands.

Right.

Let's be honest.

Well said.

Well said.

So when I, when I think of it in that, in that capacity, look, I think, I think Costco is leading the pack there.

But I want to go back one thing to talk about, you know.

Yeah.

To Bethany's piece here on, you know, sort of why consumers or what they're drawn to and really why these consumers are putting so many eggs in their baskets.

And I think one thing we'd be remiss to talk about sort of the control aspect of what's going on.

And one of the things that I feel that addresses sort of the question of that is, you know, these retailers are putting a lot of their eggs in the private label basket and it all comes down to control.

And what I mean by that, that's really their secret sauce.

From research and development to the ability to dual source programs to spread out that and ensure stability of supply, to quality assurance and ultimately, look, profits.

Right.

Let's all be honest with each other.

So they just have a much tighter grip from start to finish on the, on the final product that reaches shelves.

And ultimately these retailers are kind of in control of their own destiny and really not relying upon brands to innovation anymore.

So that's, that's part of the reason I feel like a lot of these retailers are getting super aggressive on the private brands front and doing things that they, bringing things more in house and doing things that they feel that is, makes them a little bit more in control of their own destiny there.

And Brandon, are you seeing.

You know, you just made me think of something like in theory, retailers know their customers better than anyone.

They're not getting data from Pepsi.

That's deciding like these are the flavors that you should be doing.

The retailers know, like these are the things that, that our consumers like in this region of the country.

How much does that play into this?

Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, they, again, they know flavor profiles by region.

They know, you know, what products are appealing.

And you know, in the Walmart world, they call it store of the community a lot.

But they understand their shoppers.

They know exactly what they're looking for in which markets and they're developing to.

That they've got.

Not only that, they're developing to the competitive landscape as well.

Right.

They're attacking.

Certain retailers are putting out an offering now that competes across the entire retail landscape.

So it's not just competing with the dollar stores in private label anymore.

You're competing with the Trader Joe's and some of the other ones with their offerings there.

So they know a lot more about their own shoppers.

They are getting very strategic on how they compete and how they bring products to market that are going to, that are going to win pretty much against anybody.

Would just add on to that though that I think with the workload of what they've taken on, they have a lot of data and insights, but I don't know that they always have the time to dig into that.

So I think that's one thing that we've seen on the manufacturer side.

They are expecting you to know the business from a group of people who have historically just made the product and shipped it.

And so they expect you to know a lot more about that and what's going to work.

So I think there's a lot of that data and insights work that's getting pushed on the manufacturer side though.

Right?

Right.

Yeah.

But that is a skill set that the retail in theory could learn.

I mean, that's why I guess I love, that's why I love doing this show because it brings up epiphanies for me in the moment too as you guys are talking.

Because the other aspect of this too is the media and advertising landscape is changing to a very large degree right now.

And so that makes me actually think that private label brands will become even more important when you factor the media spend and the ad spend into the equation too.

And who has the data, you know, in the future going forward, that being the retailers and the retail media network.

So.

So yeah, really interesting when you start thinking about all the angles at play here that I've never thought about from a private label brand perspective.

So.

Wow.

Bring up another.

Yeah, you bring up another good point though, Chris.

In terms of media, the retailers that are winning are the ones that are really pushing their own private brands in a big way.

You know, historically, you look back, it used to be just dead net costing, dead net pricing.

Let's just put the cheapest product out there or not cheapest product, but you know what I mean, put the most affordable product out there for the customer or gu and compete.

What they didn't do at the time was promote it very well.

They didn't get out in front of it.

There wasn't a lot of dollars reserved and the costing there to push it either on E Commerce or just in traditional end cap or promotional activities that were happening in the stores.

So I think that shift is changing quite a bit on the retail landscape.

When you look across all these brands, the retailers are realizing that there is a big profit grab in pushing their own private brands out there in a much more meaningful way.

And so they're getting behind them a lot more.

Yeah.

And to Bethany's point too, with the rise of the social influencer and them playing a larger role too, there's people out there doing it for them at a very low cost or a very.

And they're very accessible too, because influencers are not hard to find.

There's just tons of them out there.

So.

Wow.

Wow.

Really great stuff.

All right, so let's shift gears a little bit.

So you know, Bethany, you mentioned it too.

Like the one question I always have whenever I talk to people about private label strategies, like, okay, what are you actually talking about?

Because there is, there's the opp, there's the differentiation play, there's all kinds of things in between.

Brandon, let's go to you first.

Like what do you, what, how do you, how would you kind of map out the landscape of how different retailers are approaching their private brand strategies?

Yeah, yeah.

So I'll start, let me just start with Walmart.

I'll kick it off there and I'll tell you, okay, when you take a couple steps back, a really high level look, their overall strategy is to just expand their private label footprint and offer value focused products.

Right at the end of the day, that's what they're trying to do.

But they've been pretty vocal about aiming to keep private label brands priced low to really lessen the impact, impact of inflation on their customer.

And I think that's really resonating with their customer in a big way.

You can see, I mean, they're winning in grocery in a big way.

And you can see that through the data where they're picking up quite a bit in terms of share gains.

So again, they're focused on offering their shopper something that can compete no matter where he or she might be looking.

And I think they're doing a good job of introducing new products that are really solving that equation.

Now, when you look at Target at a high level, again, they're focused on exclusive to target items that are on trend but really affordable.

And they're leveraging their own brand products really to attract and retain customers, primarily in some of their frequency categories, if you think about it like essentials and consumables.

But you know, those categories have shown some growth out there despite some of the broader challenges.

Let's be honest, we all know about it's in the news quite a bit lately.

But listen, their ability to push new innovation is really what's working for them and they're doing a pretty good job there.

Again, when it comes to Costco, we start thinking about they've had some recent shakeups in terms of their overall strategy and what they're doing with Kirkland Signature.

Now, I'll tell you, they are still the goal gold standard for private brands.

They absolutely stand for quality and value.

But they have recently done some things that historically they haven't done.

They've adjusted some of their pricing strategy to really allow them to capture some of that discretionary spendering spending by offering price reductions that are really resonating again with a cost conscious shopper.

So I'll give an example of the chicken tenders program.

I don't know if you guys saw that in the news, but they took some example.

This is just one of the examples.

They did it across several different items out there.

But you know, they dropped the price of a chicken tender program by like 13%, but the pounds purchased increased by 21%.

So that shows that demand was out there in terms of pricing and really going after that cost conscious shopper.

Even though they're paying to shop there, they still need some relief and inflationary times.

And I think that's the Kirkland Signature brand has given them that.

Now with some of their, some of their adjustments to strategy.

Now they're also going back to some things that we've heard a lot of in the Club Channel, which is what I consider the treasure hunt opportunity.

They're across some categories with Kirkland Signature.

They're, they're, they're putting a new focus and emphasis on the treasure hunt opportunity.

And that's really just to draw some excitement and get members back engaged in the warehouses and really, you know, find that hit or miss item.

They know they have to buy it then otherwise it's not going to be available to them and in six weeks.

And so that's really creating a lot of buzz around the Kirkland Signature brand treasure hunt opportunities.

And then the most recent kind of shift in strategy that we've been hearing a lot about is their incorporation of really Costco International into the equation.

Now that's something fairly new.

But, and I don't know if you want to call it an edict or not, it could be considered that, I guess.

But the direction we've been hearing is that all new Kirkland Signature items that are developed now have to have a standard that they can cross international borders.

So whether it be ingredient decks or whatever product qualifications go into it.

They now have to expand across international lines.

So it's going to put a lot of pressure on bringing the right items, the right innovation.

Everybody knows Costco International is a large opportunity out there right now, but this new introduction of products that are going to cross borders is going to shake up things a little bit with that brand.

So.

Well, so.

So, Brandon, so let me step back.

So then my question for you is like you just laid out three of the biggest retailers there are right in the US and which is a great way to break out their strategies.

Would you say that in review of those three, are their strategies more similar or dissimilar at when you step back from the whole thing?

Because it sounded like for the part to me that the strategy is actually very similar and there's just maybe slight tweaks to how they're executing it.

How would you sum that up?

I think you're exactly right.

Listen, I think everybody's focused on getting shoppers in the door with affordable products, right?

At the end of the day, let's be honest, inflation's impacting everybody and everybody's trying to shift consumer, consumer shopping habits a little bit to win over that shopper.

They are very similar in that aspect.

What I will say though, is it if we're going to address it one by one, private label strategy as a whole is to do that.

But when you see there's certain pieces of the store, let's take Target, for instance, I think they're doing really a really good job of putting unique and innovative items within the grocery segment.

Now, when you look at the general merchandise segment of that, of that business, I struggle a little bit to understand kind of what they're doing there, because I think they are.

I think there's been, you know, there's some rumors of quality degradation where when you start looking at some of the things that are happening across the home department at the expense of profitability.

So they're trying to focus on really winning through profit as opposed to what they're known for, which is great quality value products out there.

So there is a little bit of a back and forth there that I think.

But at the end of the day, look, you're right.

There's some very overarching similarities that everybody's trying to win over this new shopper in an inflationary environment and do what's right to adjust the shopper habits and win their fair share.

Well, Brandon, I want to ask you just one more question.

And when we're on the topic of Target, one thing that we saw them do within the last year or so is introducing even lower private brand, like Deal Worthy.

I think it's called Deal Worthy.

In addition to their up and up brand, especially in some of the general merchandise categories that you're talking about.

Is that like, explain that strategy to me and kind of what your thoughts are.

And are we seeing other retailers doing this?

Yes, I think, look, again, they're going after that Walmart shopper, right?

I think in a lot of ways.

And being able to compete from that aspect.

Again, it goes back to the overarching macroeconomic things that I see happening out there.

Discretionary spending has been cut back in a lot of areas, a lot of households.

And so they're trying to bring products to the forefront that will allow their customers to feel more comfortable shopping their aisles and find products that they can afford.

At the end of the day, I think Target, I think they're just trying to figure out they've got a lot of different consumers in their store.

But I'll tell you, I think the Costco shopper and the Target shopper are the same person.

Right.

So I think they've got a lot to think about in terms of how do they compete with Kirkland Signature, who's offering such deep discounts in terms of retails and affordable products and all that kind of stuff.

So they've got to figure out some things in terms of who they want to be, what they want to stand for and in what categories.

Right?

Yeah.

The other thing, Bethy, I'm curious to get your take on this is as Brandon, you're describing it, like, what is the impact on the supplier, the manufacturing community, as they're thinking through, like, all the different strategies that are at play here across the retailers.

What color can you add there?

There is a lot that I think that goes into that because we have suppliers that are great.

Costco, private label suppliers that struggle when they come to Walmart or suppliers that are great at Walmart, and it doesn't translate to Target.

So I do think there are some things there that are challenging for the supplier community.

On that side of things.

I think with Target, they're so focused, you have to be very adaptable.

You know, if they want a lilac zipper instead of a plum zipper, you gotta make that change, Right?

And.

But I think they're making them themselves work harder too, because they bid out some of these programs that, like, does body lotion really need to be bid out every single year?

So for the supplier, they have to keep up with that constant, ever changing cycle.

Which in some trend categories totally makes sense.

But I feel like in other categories makes it very difficult for them to be bidding out programs.

They can't amortize the packaging costs and some of the program costs over a longer period of time, which they can at Walmart and at Costco.

So I think that is, that is an issue with Costco.

Man, they are ride or die with their suppliers.

Like you have to work yourself out of the job if once you have that at Costco.

And their institutional memory is so strong there.

And I think that's a huge positive with Walmart.

They almost want you to bring the insights to them and so they lean on their supplier partners a little bit more.

Whereas Costco and Target are going to tell you here's, here's what our store is going to look like and this is what we want.

Walmart's going to be a little more collaborative of like what's working in the industry.

And so that pivot is difficult sometimes for suppliers to make.

So there's just different pieces.

You know, Costco and Target move very slow.

That's.

You have to get everyone aligned in those organizations and that's a lot of people to get on the same page with one sku.

So you have to be able to, I think be very transparent.

You have to be able to customize with them.

You have to be able to wait and get everyone's alignment with Walmart.

It's more do you have the insights?

How quickly can you move and what can you bring to the table from a knowledge and insights perspective?

So they all have their different ways of approaching it that definitely impact the manufacturer a lot and how they approach these programs when they're bidding them out.

That's.

This is fascinating because the other thing you get me thinking about there is like there's been also a trend which we haven't talked about yet in this podcast.

There's also been a trend of re platforming or rebranding the private brands too, just with a new label and everything.

And so that's got to be difficult for the suppliers and that's got to be more costly.

And you can only go the.

My big takeaway from what you just said too is you can only go to the well on that strategy so often or to be going to become more costly over time.

What are you, what are your thoughts there, Bethany?

Yeah, I wonder a little bit.

With Target, they have over 45 private label brands to your point, they keep adding them in and I Wonder if there isn't a little bit of a degradation and understanding from the consumer and from the guest on what each of these brands mean and what they bring to the table.

So I get a little bit concerned about that with them and with Walmart on better Goods.

A little bit.

I get concerned to your point too about are the brands that they no longer have, like, are they missing out on the, on the marketing and the customers and the guests that these brands are in knowledge that these brands are driving to the shelf, are they going to start missing out on that?

So I think about that quite a bit with Walmart on better Goods.

I think they're starting to bring a different, they're filling the need of a different consumer.

They've got that, that more higher income consumer now in their aisles and in their stores and so I think they're doing a good job of keeping that.

But it's the consistency and strategy that I wonder about with these retailers.

You know, Sam's Club about five years ago started cutting out all of their different private brands and really focusing on members.

Mark, you've got Costco is Kirkland Signature, you know, and that's what they do with Walmart.

I think they're getting their better goods.

Launch was super interesting.

And Target, it just feels like there's a lot of different change.

I don't know that they're bringing the guests along with them sometimes.

Yeah.

That's interesting.

Wow.

Well, this is, I, this is so fascinating.

You too.

Thank you for spending the time with us.

One thing I have to be sure that we get to, which is my favorite part of the show is talking about the real winners and losers.

Who are they?

Who's doing this best in class?

We've kind of gone through a few case studies but do you have any even like more specific examples?

Because I think this is the best part for us, the audience to get to hear and get to go check out.

Yeah, so I'll jump in and take that one.

I think.

Listen, when I start thinking about winners and losers, you heard me say a couple times, Costco really kind of being the gold standard.

And I think they are the winner, let's be honest, just based on overall, overall quality and value.

I mean, you heard me say it, Chris, golf ball's a chicken.

Right.

If it translates across that they've got a, they've got a cult following.

Let's be honest, the value proposition strong there right in the, in some of the recent changes in price points.

They're just doing a lot of things right.

One of the things that I thought was pretty cool, I don't.

And a lot of your listeners may not know this, or they may, I don't know.

But, you know, Kirkland Signature makes up about 23% of all Costco sales, which is astonishing if you really think about it.

So.

And that what they also may not know, that Kirkland Signatures is a standalone brand, is larger than Nike and Coca Cola, which I didn't know that for the longest time.

I mean, I never thought about that.

Yeah, it is a massive, massive brand.

So, you know, for reference, that's about twice the size of Walmart's great value brand.

So which we all know does incredibly well.

It ranks number one household penetration.

So it's a big number.

So to say they're really not winning would be, would be a struggle for me to put out there.

But I have to say, listen, I'd be remiss to say if Walmart wasn't a really second close in terms of their focus again on driving down retails and inflationary environment, I think they're doing the right things there.

Also in terms of household penetration, Walmart owns the top five spots for private brands.

So they're clearly doing something right with their offerings and putting the right products out there and consumers are gravitating towards that offering.

So, you know, they're again, they're looking to expand that footprint.

They've done it with better goods.

They're winning with the household, the affluent households.

Households over 100,000 a year.

I think they're already, a lot of those shoppers are probably already in there, but they're really converting them now, which is a lot different than where they used to be.

Some of those people might, might go there for essentials, but they're trading up to some other, you know, more premium, the sprouts of the world or the fresh markets of the world or something like that for some of their more fresh or premium offerings.

But I think the better goods is addressing a lot of some of the needs that those affluent households are looking for in their aisles.

And they're doing that.

And I'll tell you, Walmart has a commitment to stick with that.

They put a lot of energy into that.

That brand's not going anywhere.

They may tweak some products along the way in certain categories where it may not be resonating as much as others.

They're really winning in some categories.

I think they may have gone a little too niche in some of the other categories, but they'll tweak, but I'll Tell you, better goods is here to stay and it's doing pretty darn well for them.

So again, they're, they're balancing affordability with premium offerings to really compete across the entire landscape.

So I think they're doing it right.

Okay, who needs to improve?

Who's.

Who's your, who's your loser for room for improvement.

I hate the word loser, but listen, I figured this, this question was coming.

So let's be honest here.

Within our portfolio of retailers that we service, look, I think Target just seems to be struggling the most.

And to be fair, I almost feel like it can be categorized as collateral damage a little bit when you look at grocery and kind of what they're doing over there.

Listen, they have some of the best, well developed private label products in retail.

Like, I think they're doing a really, really good job with innovation ingredient panels, you know, unique to target.

SKUs that look great, they taste great, they sell great.

But when you just look at the rest of the pad, I think they're struggling in terms of, you know, quality versus profit.

They're trying to grab some dollars out there, and I think it's coming at the expense of quality, quality that Target's been known for in the general merchandise space.

So I think that is the, that is the struggle that we have that they're going to have to overcome here, you know, in address relatively soon.

Yeah, without a doubt.

Okay, Bethany, I'm going to you next.

Who's your winner?

And so that we don't say loser.

Room for improvement.

This is very opportunities.

Everyone would say everyone gets a trophy.

Podcast here in Bentonville.

Yeah, I'm already surprised at the candidates we're getting.

This is great.

Yeah, I'm going to hide behind Brandon a little bit.

On mine.

I would agree on the Kirkland signature.

I mean, I think that I always think back to.

I'm going to make a football analogy, but like, how important is an elite running back in the NFL, right?

Like, how important is it to have individual SKUs that just absolutely perform and deliver?

They do that every single time.

If they put an item out there, it's going to do more than 15 million.

Like, they just know what their members want and they're going to deliver that.

So I like the consistency in the strategy, too.

They've had the same strategy for, you know, over 20 years and that's impressive.

They have the institutional knowledge to back that up.

So I love that.

From a sleeper perspective, I think Sam's club is getting over the fact that for decades they had no Standard for what members Mark meant.

Right.

They're getting over that.

They're bringing all together.

It's going to take them I think five to ten years to really, you know, get over that.

But they're doing social media and marketing on members, Mark, in a way that's much better than anyone else's.

And so, you know, you see it in so many social ads and my reels of recipes.

And so I think that they're doing a really good job there so far.

I would guess maybe I would call it a sleeper in members Mark and what Sam's club is doing there.

I like, I like what Walmart is intending with better goods.

I think the longevity of the execution and strategy is what's going to matter.

Feels like they went like one or two steps too far with some of the items and flavor profiles.

Like I don't know if figs in a blanket is needed at, at Walmart.

It's delicious.

But so I think that there might be a couple, you know, pivots and, and steps there.

But there are some items that they chose that were phenomenal from a data perspective.

Like from an insights and data perspective.

Someone was in deep and they made some great decisions.

So I think that they're getting that consumer in the building and they're going to keep them with, with what they're doing with better goods.

So I think that's great.

Target is doing some really cool things in seasonal.

Like they deserve some kudos for going up.

I don't know that you can necessarily call Target David versus Goliath but what they're doing is seasonal with candy is really cool.

They're going into what like year 34 of this strategy of, of having my favorite day be a staple in seasonal.

They're doing fun things and you know, I'm going To quote my 8 year old, she told me the other day, can I do what you do?

But I want to do it at Target.

So I actually like what I sell.

So you know, they still got that consumer there.

They're coming with fun trendy things and I like that.

I do think to Brandon's point there's some strategy alignments and some things with Omni that they need to focus on to bring that home.

But yeah, that's.

And I wouldn't say that there's necessarily like big losers.

I think there's some strategies within Target that they've got to align on.

They talked about the great performance of beauty, which is the one category that they don't over index in brand on.

Right.

So the dichotomy of that was super interesting to me.

So I think that there's some things that they can do there.

And I'll be interested to see how Walmart pivots as the next year or two goes on with better goods to really cement how I feel about that.

But I think from a strategy perspective, I like where they're going with it.

Wow.

It's really.

Yeah, there's a couple of takeaways from what you just said.

I mean, one, you know, you know, Target's kind of falling off the private label pedestal in a lot of ways.

I think that's the big takeaway I've got so far.

And then, and then the Sam's Club call, it's really good, too.

I mean, we interviewed, and remember we interviewed Chris Nicholas at grocery shop, and he was very much overtly talking about their private label program.

So it's good to hear that resonate that you think that's resonating with consumers, because it sure looks like it from the financials, too, that Sam's Club has been putting out there.

All right, Bethany, let's close out things with this last question.

So you had a quote as we were preparing for this podcast that Ann and I just absolutely loved.

You said you have to delicately, I like the word delicately, explain to clients all the time, quote, it's not your fault, but it's your problem.

So what exactly did you mean by that?

And what advice would you leave to retailers listening on taking the first steps to solving their private label problems or, you know, maybe capitalizing on their private label, too?

Yeah, I would say, you know, it's usually the manufacturers that.

I'm saying that too, in fairness, of, like, look, it's not your fault that you're in this position, but we do have to fix our, you know, we have to fix our way out of it.

I think there's a couple of things I think you have to know, your data and insights as a manufacturer nowadays.

Like, there is not an excuse of, well, they wanted it and I made it and it didn't work, so it's on them.

Like, that is not going to work.

And you have to be responsible for that.

And you have to be willing to hang your hat on what you believe is going to work and what you don't.

So I think that is one thing that I would say, you know, have a realistic point of view on what are, what is this really going to do from a velocity perspective and what can we comp it to?

And I think that that's really important from a, a supplier and a retailer angle.

I mean, I think with all of these trendy items, you're losing the value and the benefit that private label and own brands gave to manufacturers and that they could give you the best cost because they were able to amortize costs over two or three years.

They were able to be stable and dependable and you knew you were going to have that business.

And so I would say from a retailer perspective and then also from a manufacturer perspective, one don't get caught in the, in the wave of these very incremental and trendy own brand items of thinking you're going to have that item three years from now because you might not.

And then from a retailer perspective, I think recognize that, that it does put a financial burden and an operational burden on these manufacturers and suppliers when you're these changes all the time.

So I think having that loyalty of being able to go back to them knowing that if this doesn't work, there's a next step to it and we can work it out together and iterate on it is important for both sides in this equation and where we're at today.

And then this, I would say, the last thing I would say, and this is, goes against what everyone would tell you to do.

All right, let's hear it.

Contrary it.

I love it.

Let's do it.

Totally my mom.

It's just such a small operational thing.

But even if you're going to launch an own brand, leave some money aside to operationally execute that item at the store level.

And I know that it's the retailer's problem if it doesn't get operationally executed on the floor.

I know it's a dead net program, I know that you don't have funding for that, but just leaving a little bit of money to the side to make sure that your product gets on shelf on the floor and execute it appropriately, amortize it or justify it however you feel like you need to.

But you know, I think that is going to allow your product to be successful and it's going to allow you to have the ability to pivot and work with these retailers.

Whereas if you go in with like nothing planned, you're not going to be able to help them in any way.

So, you know, really think of this as a partnership and, and consider doing that would be some of my advice.

Got it.

So if you're a manufacturer, your job is not just to produce it and ship it.

You've got to think about more and more, more of the, the whole you've.

Got to be more holistic.

Yeah.

Yes, you've got to be more holistic.

That's, that's great advice.

All right, Brandon, any parting words from you?

Well, I'll just tag on to that operational excellence piece.

You know, I like to, I like to say you may not own the cells, but you own the people behind the sales.

And so at the end of the day, you have to have a team in place that's going to pro prioritize operational excellence like these retailers expect it.

I mean, if you can't get it there when the retailers need it, they're going to find somebody who can.

So you have an obligation to their shopper and as just as much as they do.

So get the right teams in place, you know, prop it up.

That's where a group like the barcode group can come in and help with a lot of that stuff.

But ultimately, you know, prioritize operational excellence within the organization.

Then secondly, I would say, you know, we've come across this, this a couple times in our, in our business.

But, but manufacturers need to know their walk away point.

And a lot of times these guys and gals are pretty eager.

The excitement can get the best of them.

They see the opportunity, size in front of them.

And we all know private brands have huge margins for a reason.

But sometimes these guys and gals can get out over top of their skis a little bit.

So they're so eager to get the business that they may make a little bit of poor decisions around costing and ultimately that can be detrimental to the company.

So be smart, ask the right questions, make sure you're capturing everything in your cogs.

And again, that's something we can help with and coach people through in terms of making sure you're taking everything into consideration so that it is a fair and equitable product that you're launching for both sides of reseller as well as you as a manufacturer.

And then, and then lastly, I just, I just say this.

Look, speed to market is paramount.

We just left the PLMA show.

There's a lot of innovation out there.

There's a lot of exciting things happening in the market right now.

A lot of new things that are shaking up spaces and giving buyers reasons to get excited.

Again, if you can bring products to market quick, you would be and commercialize them quickly.

You would be amazed by how quickly these retailers can adopt some of these products that if you bring something that's going to be a disruptor, they're going to find a way to get it on shelf and make a bet with you in an early stage.

So I would just tell you, open up that R and D pipeline, show them what you're working on, bring some exciting things to the table.

And you'd be.

You'd be amazed by how quickly they can react.

Yeah, that's a great point.

It reminds me of an anecdote.

I remember I was walking the floor with somebody from Heinz, and I asked him.

He was kind of a mentor of min.

The time I asked him, I said, what's the one question every merchant like me asks you?

And he said, what's.

What's new?

What's new.

Right.

Brandon, that gets exactly what you're saying, like, what's new?

The merchants will always look at something new, and they'll decide if their assortment needs it or not.

So, wow, that was.

That was absolutely wonderful.

Love that conversation.

Bethany, if people want to get in touch with either one of you, get in touch with the barcode group.

What's the best way for them to do that?

Yeah, I would say check out our website at the barcode group.com and or email us at info the barcode group.com and we'd love to have a conversation.

And we don't want people to get stuck in a pickle.

So reach out to us before there's a problem.

You do want people to create pickle flavored products.

However, let me clarify.

You can help them with their pickle flavored products.

Everything.

We just did a whole flavor profile project about that.

So you just did a seg and you also did a segue into the PLMA recap that's on our website.

I mean, pickles are everywhere.

Flavored pickles were all over the place at plm.

Oh, my gosh.

I cannot wait.

I cannot wait.

Why don't you just sell pickles, not get in them?

All right, well, that wraps us up today.

Thanks for.

Thanks for sitting down with us both Brandon and Bethany.

And thanks, everyone, for listening in.

As always, on behalf of all of us at Omnitalk, be careful out there.