One Million Satellites, Space Mushrooms & the Search for Martian Shorelines | Space Nuts:...

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Hello again. Thanks for joining us. This


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is Space Nuts. My name is Andrew Dunky.


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Thanks for joining us. We've got a big


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program today. It is jam-packed. We've


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got 27


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at least 27 maybe six stories. Um


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here's one. I I don't know if you heard


00:00:16.560 --> 00:00:19.429
the song um 1 million bicycles in


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Beijing. It probably wasn't a big hit,


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but now we're talking 1 million


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satellites in space. Yep. It's it's a


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possible thing. Uh, some good news out


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of Chile though. We'll talk about that.


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Artemus 2, not bad news. Probably not


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surprising news. A launch delay. Space


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mushrooms. Yes, they are real and they


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are very yummy. Apparently, uh,


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Perseverance is going AI and they have


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discovered or confirmed a Martian


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shoreline. We'll talk about all of that


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on this episode of Space Nuts.


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>> 15 seconds. Guidance is internal. 10 9


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Ignition sequence start.


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>> Space Nuts.


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>> 5 4 3 2


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>> 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1


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>> Space Nuts.


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>> Astronauts report. It feels good.


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>> And taking a break from a little sojourn


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to a horrible part of the world in


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Australia is Professor Fred Watson,


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astronomer at large. Hello, Fred.


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>> Hello. Hello, Andrew. Greetings from


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Nelson Bay.


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>> Yeah, dreadful, dreadful place. I I


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spent much of my youth in Nelson Bay,


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just north of Newcastle. It's just um it


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was a sleepy little fishing village when


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I used to go there, but now it's just um


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nothing like that.


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>> Well, it's been discovered, hasn't it?


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That's the thing. You know, two two


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hours from Sydney, it's uh and what,


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half an hour from Newcastle. It's not


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really


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>> It's It's bound to be a target. And it's


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still got its charm, though. I have to


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say as we were talking a few minutes


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ago, I've been coming here for 43 years


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nearly. In fact, it is it's 43 years and


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uh and uh it's as you exactly as you've


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said, it's very very different, but it's


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still uh geographically it's a lovely


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spot with Port Stevens, this huge


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expanse of water uh with um you know,


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islands in it and uh hills all around.


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Really quite remarkable.


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>> It is lovely. Yeah. Uh I miss it a lot.


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The last time we were there was for a


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beach wedding, but that's going back a


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few years. But even then, it didn't look


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like the, you know, the fishing village


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that I grew up, is it?


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>> Uh while we're talking about different


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places, um I was having a bit of a um I


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don't know what you'd call it, a job at


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Colorado's cold weather uh on a recent


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episode. And um I I got a note from


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Michael who said um on the podcast


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you're concerned about the frigid


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temperatures in Colorado. Unfortunately,


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we've just had one of the warmest


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Decembers on record with daily highs


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often 10 to 15° C. That's that's a


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winter in do um until this weekend,


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January, uh was on track to be well


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above normal uh with highs around 7 to


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10. And to add insult to injury, our


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mountain snow packs are the worst on


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record. Uh, and while our um um USB50


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ski industry is getting hurt, the real


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problem is that they rely on melting


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snow for water and they didn't get a lot


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of snow this year. So, um, yeah. Uh,


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that's that's a scary one. Um, and and I


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I think a lot of places in the world


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rely on snow for, you know, the the the


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spring melt for their water supplies.


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So, hopefully that's just a one-off in


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Colorado.


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Um, got a lot to talk about, Fred. Let's


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start with this uh this


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news that we received uh during the


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week. It's it's been um highly


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publicized.


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Uh Elon Musk, SpaceX


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has put in an application to launch


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possibly 1 million satellites. 1


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million. This this is a a completely


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different project to that of um uh uh


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the the um internet service that he's


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that he's been working on. This this is


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another kettle of fish.


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>> It is it's an orbiting data center. Uh


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>> so uh in fact SpaceX has basically


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teamed up with another company, an AI


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company. Um and together there is this


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plan to launch three sorry not 300,000 a


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million satellites


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um between 500 kilometers and 200 2,000


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kilometers in altitude um and at


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probably quite interesting inclinations


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not far from the equator uh and also


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some uh which will be in polar orbits


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What's the idea? Well, you you basically


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harness the sun's energy uh using these


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uh these spacecraft uh in order to power


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your data center uh and you link them by


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lasers essentially optical links. Uh and


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so uh the you know the the whole thing


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then engages with Starlink to send the


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data up and down to the earth. So it's a


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it's a wild idea. Um, it fills


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astronomers with horror. Uh, because a


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million satellites in orbit is just


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gonna completely pollute the sky.


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Especially


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>> when you have the some of them at 2,000


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kilometers, which means that they're


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they're visible for in fact at some


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latitudes they'll be visible all night.


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>> Uh, so that's uh, yep, that's uh, the


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latest shock horror. Uh, that is a


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filing that has gone, I think I'm right


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in saying, to the Federal Communications


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Commission. Uh I don't know whether it's


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been filed with the International


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Telecommunications Union which is the


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only international body that uh can


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basically regulates um space flights.


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There are many national bodies but uh


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the only international one is the ITU.


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Uh I would guess they would accept it uh


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because they accepted a filing back in


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2020 for 300,000 satellites put in by


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the Rwanda government. Um, but that uh


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if it hasn't already, and I don't think


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it has yet, that will have expired


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because I think they've only lost


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launched one cubat uh rather than


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300,000. So, it might be a little bit a


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little bit like the Rwanda was something


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like putting your foot in the door uh to


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uh you know to uh to to stake a claim.


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But we will see what happens. It's a


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very interesting development and said


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one that scares us to death in the


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world. Yeah, certainly a divisive issue


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and um it's not the first time as you


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said um the year before last there were


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complaints about the Starlink network


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and you know the blinding of telescopes.


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Astronomers got upset about that. Uh


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Elon Musk has actually rejected those


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claims and he'd probably reject these


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ones too. I mean


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>> it has to be said he's not he hasn't


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really of all the the internet uh supply


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companies of course Starink is the the


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one that's most populous. They've got uh


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9,000 a little bit more than 9,000


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spacecraft in orbit and um SpaceX has


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worked with the astronomical community


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to try and minimize their effect of of


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all the companies they've been the most


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forthcoming. But it's hard to see how


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when you put it up to a million


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satellites, how you can reconcile that


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with with astronomy.


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>> No. Uh and I might add actually as we


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speak there is a meeting going on in in


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Vienna uh which uh the issue of uh what


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we call dark and quiet skies the idea of


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satellite constellations that will be


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discussed this week and then


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>> okay be interesting to see what comes


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out of that. Uh we'll leave that one


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there. Um but I'm sure there'll be more


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about it going forward maybe. Uh let's


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go over to Chile because we talked about


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a um an energy energy project that was


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uh being touted for that part of the


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world which was going to be very close


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to some of the most significant


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telescopes on earth. Uh the problem with


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this energy plant was it was going to be


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um basically the size of a small city.


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So the lighting would have been a major


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issue but that that seems to have all


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been scrapped.


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>> Uh indeed it has. So, so the the problem


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was uh you're quite right. Um there is


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there are two mountains in Chile which


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aren't notable for astronomy. They've


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both got optical telescopes. One is


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Sarah Paranel which houses the VT uh the


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four 8.2 2 meter uh telescopes of the of


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the very large telescope as it's called


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and about um it's about 20 kilometers


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away on the other side of the valley is


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a mountain called Sarah Armazone is


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where the biggest telescope in the world


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is being built 39 meter ELT or extremely


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large telescope and in that valley uh


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it's where uh the an energy company AES


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Andes uh they had plans for a factory to


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use solar and wind energy to make green


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hydrogen


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Uh and as exactly as you've said, it was


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citicized. Uh it were it filled


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astronomers with horror because uh it


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threatened to put light pollution into a


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region which so far has been completely


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dark and which houses perhaps the


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world's most productive and efficient


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telescope. Certainly when the ELT comes


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along, uh there is nothing to touch it


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anywhere else in the world. It's going


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to be an extraordinary instrument. Uh


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but it's been cancelled. the company has


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pulled out of the project and I think


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they've taken note of the environmental


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damage it would do to astronomy. I think


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that's been the reason why they've done


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that and so all credit to people who've


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used common sense to you know to


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progress things they'll no doubt put it


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somewhere else um where it might be less


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damaging because it is a you know it's


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an environmentally positive uh step.


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Green hydrogen's a great thing to have


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but uh but we don't want it there. No,


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no, but uh hopefully they will be able


00:10:09.760 --> 00:10:11.269
to put it somewhere else because it does


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sound like a a good project moving


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forward, but just um yeah, not not


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there. Not in that place. Um yeah,


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>> hats off to them for making that


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decision. It must have been difficult


00:10:22.399 --> 00:10:24.949
because that's a that's a 10 billion US


00:10:24.959 --> 00:10:26.150
project. That's


00:10:26.160 --> 00:10:26.870
>> very big. Yeah,


00:10:26.880 --> 00:10:27.750
>> that's a lot of bigies.


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>> I suppose that that's the ultimate nimi,


00:10:30.000 --> 00:10:32.630
isn't it? Uh a nimi pro process. Not in


00:10:32.640 --> 00:10:33.030
my backyard.


00:10:33.040 --> 00:10:34.870
>> Not in my backyard. We got a lot of nimi


00:10:34.880 --> 00:10:36.470
projects around here. I could tell you.


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>> Yes.


00:10:37.440 --> 00:10:39.430
>> Wind farms, solar farms, the inland


00:10:39.440 --> 00:10:42.630
rail. It's all causing um a lot of


00:10:42.640 --> 00:10:45.670
people to um get a bit nimi. This is


00:10:45.680 --> 00:10:47.990
Space Nuts with Andrew Dunley and


00:10:48.000 --> 00:10:52.550
Professor Fred Watson.


00:10:52.560 --> 00:10:54.550
>> Swift


00:10:54.560 --> 00:10:56.710
base here. The angle has landed.


00:10:56.720 --> 00:10:57.829
>> Space nets.


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>> Okay, Fred. Uh speaking of the boon,


00:11:00.240 --> 00:11:03.509
let's move our attention to Arteimus 2.


00:11:03.519 --> 00:11:05.190
that uh mission we talked about last


00:11:05.200 --> 00:11:07.110
week which was getting ready for its wet


00:11:07.120 --> 00:11:09.750
rehearsal and a few other tests and a


00:11:09.760 --> 00:11:13.110
few checkovers. Uh mostly things went


00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:16.630
well but they did find a hydrogen leak


00:11:16.640 --> 00:11:19.990
and that set them back another month.


00:11:20.000 --> 00:11:21.750
>> Uh it's a bit like Groundhog Day, isn't


00:11:21.760 --> 00:11:23.829
it really? Cuz this is exactly what


00:11:23.839 --> 00:11:26.470
happened with Arteimus one. Uh and in


00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:27.990
fact at one point I think they took the


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the whole spacecraft back into the


00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:32.069
vehicle assembly building to to try and


00:11:32.079 --> 00:11:34.310
fix the hydrogen leaks. Uh so yes the


00:11:34.320 --> 00:11:37.269
wet uh the wet dress rehearsal was this


00:11:37.279 --> 00:11:40.550
past weekend uh our time uh as we are


00:11:40.560 --> 00:11:43.990
speaking today on the recording. Um and


00:11:44.000 --> 00:11:47.750
the hydrogen leak as I understand it is


00:11:47.760 --> 00:11:50.389
it's the place where the pipe fits into


00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:53.590
the into the tank. You know it's like on


00:11:53.600 --> 00:11:55.670
your car. It's where you stick your the


00:11:55.680 --> 00:11:59.110
fuel bowser in hose into your petrol


00:11:59.120 --> 00:12:01.030
tank. Except it's a little bit more


00:12:01.040 --> 00:12:02.790
complicated than that. But I think


00:12:02.800 --> 00:12:04.870
that's where the leak has been. And it's


00:12:04.880 --> 00:12:08.230
sufficiently it's worrying enough to the


00:12:08.240 --> 00:12:11.030
engineers and the administrators who are


00:12:11.040 --> 00:12:13.829
overlooking 2 that what they've done is


00:12:13.839 --> 00:12:15.829
they said well actually we need to do


00:12:15.839 --> 00:12:18.310
another wet dress rehearsal when we fix


00:12:18.320 --> 00:12:20.870
this problem. And that means postponing


00:12:20.880 --> 00:12:23.110
uh at the altimus 2 launch from this


00:12:23.120 --> 00:12:25.829
month which was what we hoped uh to next


00:12:25.839 --> 00:12:28.389
month which means March at the earliest.


00:12:28.399 --> 00:12:32.550
So yes uh a push uh back in uh in in the


00:12:32.560 --> 00:12:33.910
you know in the process.


00:12:33.920 --> 00:12:36.629
>> Will will they leave the launch vehicle


00:12:36.639 --> 00:12:38.550
on the pad at this stage?


00:12:38.560 --> 00:12:40.550
>> I think at the moment that's the plan.


00:12:40.560 --> 00:12:44.389
Uh I haven't heard uh any hints of it


00:12:44.399 --> 00:12:46.150
being taken back to vehicle assembly


00:12:46.160 --> 00:12:47.750
building. That's a you know it's a big


00:12:47.760 --> 00:12:50.150
pro process is a major step to have to


00:12:50.160 --> 00:12:51.910
do that. So they will certainly I think


00:12:51.920 --> 00:12:53.829
be looking at trying to fix it on the


00:12:53.839 --> 00:12:55.269
pad beforehand.


00:12:55.279 --> 00:12:57.509
>> Okay. And and if they can't Yeah. They


00:12:57.519 --> 00:12:59.590
might have to roll back


00:12:59.600 --> 00:13:00.069
>> Yeah.


00:13:00.079 --> 00:13:01.269
>> again.


00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:02.069
>> Again.


00:13:02.079 --> 00:13:03.910
>> But you know it's it's it's all about


00:13:03.920 --> 00:13:06.150
safety. That's the most important thing.


00:13:06.160 --> 00:13:07.590
And


00:13:07.600 --> 00:13:08.230
>> yeah,


00:13:08.240 --> 00:13:10.389
>> we you know they they want to get this


00:13:10.399 --> 00:13:14.310
right. So, um, it's better to be a month


00:13:14.320 --> 00:13:17.190
late or even longer than have something


00:13:17.200 --> 00:13:19.030
go horribly wrong, which we've certainly


00:13:19.040 --> 00:13:20.470
witnessed in the past. And we talked


00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:22.389
about the anniversary of Colombia last


00:13:22.399 --> 00:13:25.670
week. And it's, you know, those things


00:13:25.680 --> 00:13:28.790
are still strong in people's minds. You


00:13:28.800 --> 00:13:31.190
got to avoid that at all costs. So, um,


00:13:31.200 --> 00:13:32.949
yeah, hopefully they'll find find the


00:13:32.959 --> 00:13:34.870
problem. Maybe it's a poo valve that's


00:13:34.880 --> 00:13:37.750
just, you know, not


00:13:37.760 --> 00:13:40.550
>> Yeah, it could be a P valve. The real


00:13:40.560 --> 00:13:43.990
problem is hydrogen atoms are so small.


00:13:44.000 --> 00:13:44.389
>> Yeah.


00:13:44.399 --> 00:13:46.389
>> Uh they're the smallest of all atoms. So


00:13:46.399 --> 00:13:49.030
they they fit through any tiny crack. Um


00:13:49.040 --> 00:13:52.949
we had a uh at one time uh when I was


00:13:52.959 --> 00:13:54.470
working as an astronomer at Siding


00:13:54.480 --> 00:13:56.790
Spring Observatory, not far from you. Uh


00:13:56.800 --> 00:13:58.949
one of our telescopes used photographic


00:13:58.959 --> 00:14:01.990
plates back in the day. And to sensitize


00:14:02.000 --> 00:14:04.230
them, we called it hypersensitizing. We


00:14:04.240 --> 00:14:05.670
we actually had to bathe them in


00:14:05.680 --> 00:14:08.389
hydrogen for a period of something like


00:14:08.399 --> 00:14:11.110
10 hours before they were used and that


00:14:11.120 --> 00:14:13.670
increased their sensitivity by se


00:14:13.680 --> 00:14:17.030
several orders in fact. Uh um but the


00:14:17.040 --> 00:14:18.550
problem was keeping the hydrogen where


00:14:18.560 --> 00:14:20.870
you wanted it. It tends to leak. Uh it's


00:14:20.880 --> 00:14:23.430
it's a very leaky gas because of the


00:14:23.440 --> 00:14:24.949
small size of the atoms.


00:14:24.959 --> 00:14:26.310
>> Yeah. Yeah. Well, just look at the


00:14:26.320 --> 00:14:29.110
Hindenburg. Certainly leaked there.


00:14:29.120 --> 00:14:30.310
>> Yes, that's right.


00:14:30.320 --> 00:14:33.670
>> Yeah. Um although didn't they figure out


00:14:33.680 --> 00:14:35.430
many many years later that it wasn't the


00:14:35.440 --> 00:14:37.590
hydrogen leaking that was the problem.


00:14:37.600 --> 00:14:41.030
It was the um ah what do they call it


00:14:41.040 --> 00:14:43.750
the stuff in the fabric um that that


00:14:43.760 --> 00:14:45.910
caused the problem. Yeah. It wasn't it


00:14:45.920 --> 00:14:47.350
wasn't actually the hydrogen that was


00:14:47.360 --> 00:14:50.230
the issue. It was the it was the static


00:14:50.240 --> 00:14:52.550
electricity in the fabric but it was the


00:14:52.560 --> 00:14:54.069
the lacquer. I think the lacquer.


00:14:54.079 --> 00:14:54.870
>> That was my


00:14:54.880 --> 00:14:55.189
>> Yeah,


00:14:55.199 --> 00:14:56.470
>> that that could be it. That was my


00:14:56.480 --> 00:14:57.750
understanding that it was static


00:14:57.760 --> 00:14:58.550
electricity.


00:14:58.560 --> 00:15:01.990
>> Yeah. different story. But yeah, Artemus


00:15:02.000 --> 00:15:05.509
2 still on the launch pad. U probably


00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:07.829
the schedule is March the 6th at this


00:15:07.839 --> 00:15:11.910
stage, but um maybe that will change uh


00:15:11.920 --> 00:15:14.470
depending on how the next test goes or


00:15:14.480 --> 00:15:16.310
the wet rehearsal or whatever they do.


00:15:16.320 --> 00:15:17.670
They did want to try and do more than


00:15:17.680 --> 00:15:19.670
one. So um yeah, well, they got an


00:15:19.680 --> 00:15:22.550
opportunity. Now they have to. Um now,


00:15:22.560 --> 00:15:25.350
uh this this story I find fascinating


00:15:25.360 --> 00:15:27.110
and I think you've got a personal


00:15:27.120 --> 00:15:28.389
connection with some of the people


00:15:28.399 --> 00:15:30.629
involved in this, but they have


00:15:30.639 --> 00:15:33.110
basically grown mushrooms in space and


00:15:33.120 --> 00:15:34.710
then they brought them back and had


00:15:34.720 --> 00:15:37.350
lunch.


00:15:37.360 --> 00:15:39.350
That's right. Uh this is actually a


00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:41.990
friend of ours, um Sarah Webb, who's


00:15:42.000 --> 00:15:44.069
down in Melbourne. She's a an


00:15:44.079 --> 00:15:46.310
astrophysicist and a science


00:15:46.320 --> 00:15:48.550
communicator uh which is how we've


00:15:48.560 --> 00:15:50.790
worked with her in the past. But she


00:15:50.800 --> 00:15:56.150
runs uh a project uh to basically engage


00:15:56.160 --> 00:15:59.670
um with the International Space Station


00:15:59.680 --> 00:16:03.189
uh uh on behalf of school school


00:16:03.199 --> 00:16:05.910
students. Uh and so this particular


00:16:05.920 --> 00:16:09.990
project uh was designed by 12 uh by


00:16:10.000 --> 00:16:12.230
Sarah and and one sorry Sarah and one of


00:16:12.240 --> 00:16:15.110
her colleagues uh plus 12 high school


00:16:15.120 --> 00:16:17.430
students from Hailbury College in


00:16:17.440 --> 00:16:20.870
Melbourne uh and um a lot of help from


00:16:20.880 --> 00:16:23.350
professional mushroom growers. Uh what


00:16:23.360 --> 00:16:27.430
they did was they packaged up uh not the


00:16:27.440 --> 00:16:31.430
mushrooms themselves but the things that


00:16:31.440 --> 00:16:35.350
uh essentially act almost like the roots


00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:39.350
of the mushrooms uh which are called uh


00:16:39.360 --> 00:16:41.670
mascelium uh a word I didn't know


00:16:41.680 --> 00:16:43.509
because I'm not a mushroom expert. The


00:16:43.519 --> 00:16:46.310
small filaments that are essentially the


00:16:46.320 --> 00:16:48.389
root network of mushrooms. So that's


00:16:48.399 --> 00:16:50.629
what they sent up. They were in space


00:16:50.639 --> 00:16:52.470
for a month on the International Space


00:16:52.480 --> 00:16:54.310
Station. They came back again with a


00:16:54.320 --> 00:16:57.509
crew change. Um, and so what the


00:16:57.519 --> 00:17:00.310
researchers did uh was to essentially


00:17:00.320 --> 00:17:04.549
take these mcelium uh uh filaments and


00:17:04.559 --> 00:17:07.750
plant them and turn them into mushrooms.


00:17:07.760 --> 00:17:10.230
Uh, and it worked. Uh, it worked well.


00:17:10.240 --> 00:17:12.549
And so they've now written a rather nice


00:17:12.559 --> 00:17:15.829
conversation piece which is entitled We


00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:18.150
Ate Space Mushrooms and survived to tell


00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:20.549
the tale which is I think quite a nice


00:17:20.559 --> 00:17:21.189
title.


00:17:21.199 --> 00:17:23.909
>> It is rather uh I was just looking up


00:17:23.919 --> 00:17:25.829
what the most expensive mushrooms in the


00:17:25.839 --> 00:17:28.309
world are and they're the yatsa gamboo


00:17:28.319 --> 00:17:30.390
caterpillar fungus.


00:17:30.400 --> 00:17:34.710
uh and they cost $50 to $63,000


00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:37.909
per pound because of their rarity and


00:17:37.919 --> 00:17:39.669
apparently they've got medicinal


00:17:39.679 --> 00:17:41.830
properties and you know they grow them


00:17:41.840 --> 00:17:45.909
in the Himalayas. I've got a feeling


00:17:45.919 --> 00:17:48.390
these mushrooms which are based on the


00:17:48.400 --> 00:17:50.630
lion's mane mushroom.


00:17:50.640 --> 00:17:51.190
>> Yes.


00:17:51.200 --> 00:17:52.870
>> Uh would be a bit more expensive than


00:17:52.880 --> 00:17:55.510
that by the sound of it.


00:17:55.520 --> 00:17:57.110
>> Yeah, they might be by the time you


00:17:57.120 --> 00:17:58.870
figure in the cost of the International


00:17:58.880 --> 00:18:00.310
Space Station. That's right. And the


00:18:00.320 --> 00:18:03.029
lion's mane is the one um it's a species


00:18:03.039 --> 00:18:04.549
that it's actually the one that they


00:18:04.559 --> 00:18:08.630
they ate. Um it's just to put this


00:18:08.640 --> 00:18:11.830
project in context, it's really um you


00:18:11.840 --> 00:18:14.870
know thinking about how you might uh


00:18:14.880 --> 00:18:18.070
grow fresh food for astronauts on


00:18:18.080 --> 00:18:19.909
longhaul space missions.


00:18:19.919 --> 00:18:22.150
>> Uh you know, if you've got um people


00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:24.070
going to Mars, you're going to have six,


00:18:24.080 --> 00:18:26.070
seven, eight months in the spacecraft.


00:18:26.080 --> 00:18:29.350
Um can you uh as they say in their


00:18:29.360 --> 00:18:31.190
conversation article, how can you


00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:33.510
continue to nutritionally support those


00:18:33.520 --> 00:18:37.270
astronauts? Uh and uh that is


00:18:37.280 --> 00:18:39.029
essentially uh one one of the


00:18:39.039 --> 00:18:40.870
motivations for looking at things like


00:18:40.880 --> 00:18:44.549
growing things in space uh giving them


00:18:44.559 --> 00:18:46.470
um the check out to make sure that they


00:18:46.480 --> 00:18:50.150
don't uh turn poisonous by their zero


00:18:50.160 --> 00:18:51.669
gravity environment, things of that


00:18:51.679 --> 00:18:52.870
sort. And that's what they've done with


00:18:52.880 --> 00:18:54.630
this. So very nice experiment. Yeah,


00:18:54.640 --> 00:18:56.870
I've been doing a lot of research on how


00:18:56.880 --> 00:18:59.669
you would feed people on a on a a


00:18:59.679 --> 00:19:02.310
spaceship for a long haul mission. And


00:19:02.320 --> 00:19:05.190
that's one of the solutions uh to to


00:19:05.200 --> 00:19:08.870
have um basically small farms on on the


00:19:08.880 --> 00:19:11.110
ship. hydroponics and things like that


00:19:11.120 --> 00:19:13.270
and and grow grow your vegetables and


00:19:13.280 --> 00:19:15.270
and your fungi and


00:19:15.280 --> 00:19:17.510
>> whatever else will grow easily in space


00:19:17.520 --> 00:19:21.110
and supplement the other stuff that you


00:19:21.120 --> 00:19:23.430
have to take with you um which would be


00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:26.710
the proteins. But uh yeah, it's um it's


00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:31.270
a really interesting um story uh what


00:19:31.280 --> 00:19:33.750
they can do with food. I mean, if you're


00:19:33.760 --> 00:19:35.669
going to spend a year out in space or or


00:19:35.679 --> 00:19:38.549
whatever, you you can't just rely on


00:19:38.559 --> 00:19:42.789
packets of chips. And


00:19:42.799 --> 00:19:44.789
>> yeah, you you won't get out of the hatch


00:19:44.799 --> 00:19:47.270
when you get home. But um yeah,


00:19:47.280 --> 00:19:50.150
nutrition is very important and uh yeah,


00:19:50.160 --> 00:19:52.549
they got to get that right too uh in


00:19:52.559 --> 00:19:55.029
time. It's all it's not it's not an easy


00:19:55.039 --> 00:19:56.870
thing, is it? going into space when you


00:19:56.880 --> 00:19:59.750
consider all the logistics involved in


00:19:59.760 --> 00:20:03.750
in feeding and disposal of waste and um


00:20:03.760 --> 00:20:06.470
you know um all the other things that go


00:20:06.480 --> 00:20:08.710
with it. Quite quite extraordinary. But


00:20:08.720 --> 00:20:10.870
uh I wonder what they were like like um


00:20:10.880 --> 00:20:13.990
I um I think the report basically


00:20:14.000 --> 00:20:16.549
suggests that they were quite yummy.


00:20:16.559 --> 00:20:19.029
>> Yes. Um that's right. Exactly that. They


00:20:19.039 --> 00:20:20.150
were very tasty.


00:20:20.160 --> 00:20:20.549
>> Yeah.


00:20:20.559 --> 00:20:22.710
>> I wonder did do you think space changes


00:20:22.720 --> 00:20:25.830
the the taste of things? Well, in you


00:20:25.840 --> 00:20:27.750
know, that might be one of the um the


00:20:27.760 --> 00:20:31.029
tests that you do. You you you take uh


00:20:31.039 --> 00:20:33.110
mycelium that's been to space and


00:20:33.120 --> 00:20:36.390
mycelium that hasn't and um try try to


00:20:36.400 --> 00:20:37.909
contrast the two. I'm sure they've done


00:20:37.919 --> 00:20:38.710
that, too.


00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:40.870
>> Yeah, maybe. It's great story. You can


00:20:40.880 --> 00:20:44.070
read it at the conversation website. Uh


00:20:44.080 --> 00:20:46.230
yes, it's called We Ate Space Mushrooms


00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:49.029
and Survived to Tell the Tale. Love it.


00:20:49.039 --> 00:20:51.110
Uh this is Space Nuts with Andrew Dunley


00:20:51.120 --> 00:20:55.350
and Professor Fred Watson.


00:20:55.360 --> 00:20:57.669
We choose to go to the moon in this


00:20:57.679 --> 00:21:00.149
decade and do the other things not


00:21:00.159 --> 00:21:02.549
because they are easy but because they


00:21:02.559 --> 00:21:03.190
are hard.


00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:05.750
>> These nuts.


00:21:05.760 --> 00:21:07.350
>> Now Fred, we're going to dedicate the


00:21:07.360 --> 00:21:10.630
last section of the show to Mars. And


00:21:10.640 --> 00:21:13.270
this was uh a story that caught me a


00:21:13.280 --> 00:21:15.110
little bit by surprise. We've talked a


00:21:15.120 --> 00:21:17.430
lot about the Perseverance rover and


00:21:17.440 --> 00:21:20.710
what it's up to. Um these two stories


00:21:20.720 --> 00:21:24.230
actually involve Perseverance. Um, but


00:21:24.240 --> 00:21:26.549
this one, um, yeah, Perseverance has


00:21:26.559 --> 00:21:30.070
gone AI. No more no more human drivers.


00:21:30.080 --> 00:21:32.950
We've left it up to the computers.


00:21:32.960 --> 00:21:35.669
>> They've That's right. So, it's, um, the


00:21:35.679 --> 00:21:38.630
story is really about the first ever


00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:40.789
drive on Mars, fully planned by


00:21:40.799 --> 00:21:42.470
artificial intelligence.


00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:42.950
>> Wow.


00:21:42.960 --> 00:21:44.549
>> And it h happened actually at the end of


00:21:44.559 --> 00:21:47.430
last year. Um, the two demonstrations


00:21:47.440 --> 00:21:48.950
carried out on December the 8th and


00:21:48.960 --> 00:21:52.070
December the 10th last year. uh and it's


00:21:52.080 --> 00:21:55.830
all about how you plan a route across


00:21:55.840 --> 00:22:00.070
the terrain uh of Mars uh with no manual


00:22:00.080 --> 00:22:05.669
input. And so it's a a process that uh


00:22:05.679 --> 00:22:09.510
usually is is performed by humans as you


00:22:09.520 --> 00:22:11.830
might expect. People on Earth pouring


00:22:11.840 --> 00:22:15.029
over the maps that we've got the high


00:22:15.039 --> 00:22:16.950
resolution images that have been taken


00:22:16.960 --> 00:22:19.190
by Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter and


00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:22.230
things of that sort. Um so uh what


00:22:22.240 --> 00:22:25.270
they've done is given all that to the AI


00:22:25.280 --> 00:22:28.950
um u machine and said okay we want to


00:22:28.960 --> 00:22:32.470
get to there how do we do it and


00:22:32.480 --> 00:22:35.350
basically that's what they've done and


00:22:35.360 --> 00:22:39.430
it's um it there's a very nice report on


00:22:39.440 --> 00:22:43.110
this on the uh space.com website


00:22:43.120 --> 00:22:46.870
>> uh that gives us uh a map showing the


00:22:46.880 --> 00:22:50.470
planned and the actual routes that were


00:22:50.480 --> 00:22:54.390
taken by the Perseverance rover. Uh, and


00:22:54.400 --> 00:22:57.029
it just goes to show how close the


00:22:57.039 --> 00:22:58.870
actual route was to the planned route,


00:22:58.880 --> 00:23:00.149
which means that they, you know, they


00:23:00.159 --> 00:23:03.029
didn't encounter unexpected obstacles


00:23:03.039 --> 00:23:03.990
and things of that sort.


00:23:04.000 --> 00:23:06.549
>> Yeah, that's uh very unlike when I used


00:23:06.559 --> 00:23:07.990
to go in the car with my grandmother.


00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:10.390
She Yeah, I


00:23:10.400 --> 00:23:12.549
remember one day we turned into the


00:23:12.559 --> 00:23:14.310
highway and she was on the wrong side of


00:23:14.320 --> 00:23:16.310
the road.


00:23:16.320 --> 00:23:19.190
>> Anyway, that's not a problem on Mars.


00:23:19.200 --> 00:23:20.710
No, there there isn't a wrong side of


00:23:20.720 --> 00:23:22.950
the road on Mars. That's right. I


00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:25.590
suppose um you know getting off the your


00:23:25.600 --> 00:23:27.750
beaten track is uh but there isn't a


00:23:27.760 --> 00:23:29.270
beaten track. That's the other thing. So


00:23:29.280 --> 00:23:31.110
you're always on virgin territory when


00:23:31.120 --> 00:23:34.470
you're uh driving a spacecraft on Mars.


00:23:34.480 --> 00:23:38.149
Um I think um I think it's uh a step


00:23:38.159 --> 00:23:40.390
forward because I think there's quite a


00:23:40.400 --> 00:23:46.470
lot of uh you know work goes in uh to um


00:23:46.480 --> 00:23:48.230
the the the


00:23:48.240 --> 00:23:50.870
human planning of the the routes to


00:23:50.880 --> 00:23:56.230
Mars. Um it's it's uh it's a labor


00:23:56.240 --> 00:23:59.110
intensive process. Um in fact I might


00:23:59.120 --> 00:24:01.190
read a little bit from that space.com


00:24:01.200 --> 00:24:04.710
article which is really quite sums up


00:24:04.720 --> 00:24:06.710
the the whole process. Uh because Mars


00:24:06.720 --> 00:24:09.750
is an average of 150 million miles or


00:24:09.760 --> 00:24:12.070
225 million kilometers from Earth.


00:24:12.080 --> 00:24:14.070
Communication delays make realtime


00:24:14.080 --> 00:24:16.710
control impossible. For decades mission


00:24:16.720 --> 00:24:18.710
teams have instead planned daily routes


00:24:18.720 --> 00:24:21.430
by hand. Human drivers analyze the


00:24:21.440 --> 00:24:24.789
terrain and rover status data,


00:24:24.799 --> 00:24:27.430
then map out paths using way points,


00:24:27.440 --> 00:24:29.430
typically spaced no more than about 100


00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:33.190
meters, 330 ft apart, to avoid hazards.


00:24:33.200 --> 00:24:34.870
And then these plans are sent to Mars


00:24:34.880 --> 00:24:37.430
via the deep space network where the


00:24:37.440 --> 00:24:42.070
rover executes them. Uh so this is uh uh


00:24:42.080 --> 00:24:44.149
really um you know a step forward. If


00:24:44.159 --> 00:24:46.470
you can get AI to do all that, then the


00:24:46.480 --> 00:24:48.470
other mission scientists could go and do


00:24:48.480 --> 00:24:51.269
something else like analyze uh what the


00:24:51.279 --> 00:24:53.669
what the sample uh you know sample


00:24:53.679 --> 00:24:55.590
gatherers are telling us about the


00:24:55.600 --> 00:24:56.789
terrain on Mars.


00:24:56.799 --> 00:24:59.990
>> Yeah. Uh it's it's a big leap forward


00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:02.549
really. And when you think about it, I


00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:04.549
mean


00:25:04.559 --> 00:25:06.470
they've they've done it pretty tough


00:25:06.480 --> 00:25:08.549
trying to make decisions about where to


00:25:08.559 --> 00:25:10.149
where to go and how to do it. And if you


00:25:10.159 --> 00:25:12.470
have to make a direction change, the


00:25:12.480 --> 00:25:16.390
time factor is like 4 minutes up to 24


00:25:16.400 --> 00:25:18.630
minutes to get the message to


00:25:18.640 --> 00:25:20.470
Perseverance


00:25:20.480 --> 00:25:22.149
and then you got to wait that time again


00:25:22.159 --> 00:25:23.510
for the message to come back saying,


00:25:23.520 --> 00:25:25.909
"No, we hit a rock."


00:25:25.919 --> 00:25:28.149
>> That's right. Yes. So, yeah. Exactly.


00:25:28.159 --> 00:25:29.990
So, um you know, that's why you've got


00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:32.310
to upload the the instructions


00:25:32.320 --> 00:25:35.430
beforehand. Um and if AI can help with


00:25:35.440 --> 00:25:36.789
that, so much the better.


00:25:36.799 --> 00:25:38.710
>> Yeah. Incredible. Yeah. I I mean you


00:25:38.720 --> 00:25:40.950
hear a lot of doom and gloom about AI


00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:43.269
from certain commentators. Uh you know


00:25:43.279 --> 00:25:45.750
it's going to be the end of humanity.


00:25:45.760 --> 00:25:48.710
That's the extreme. But it's so useful.


00:25:48.720 --> 00:25:51.029
Like even in general day-to-day stuff,


00:25:51.039 --> 00:25:53.830
uh it is so very useful. I was trying to


00:25:53.840 --> 00:25:55.350
look something up the other day and I


00:25:55.360 --> 00:25:58.070
could not get the wording right in my


00:25:58.080 --> 00:26:00.870
browser for it to look up what I wanted.


00:26:00.880 --> 00:26:02.870
It doesn't happen often like that, but


00:26:02.880 --> 00:26:05.830
it was driving me nuts. So, I just went


00:26:05.840 --> 00:26:08.549
to um AI mode and went, I want to know


00:26:08.559 --> 00:26:09.990
this. And it went ding, ding, ding,


00:26:10.000 --> 00:26:13.430
done. It's it's pretty impressive stuff.


00:26:13.440 --> 00:26:15.430
>> Really impressive stuff. And we're only


00:26:15.440 --> 00:26:17.350
at the very dawning of it, aren't we?


00:26:17.360 --> 00:26:19.190
Really, it's it's only in the early


00:26:19.200 --> 00:26:22.710
days. And uh it makes me wonder, Fred,


00:26:22.720 --> 00:26:25.430
what we can use in terms of AI as


00:26:25.440 --> 00:26:28.710
day-to-day people, what have they got


00:26:28.720 --> 00:26:33.190
going in secret, you know, in in in


00:26:33.200 --> 00:26:35.269
the dark rooms of the military and


00:26:35.279 --> 00:26:37.830
places like that. Their AI systems must


00:26:37.840 --> 00:26:39.909
be amazing.


00:26:39.919 --> 00:26:41.269
>> Yeah, that's where it really starts


00:26:41.279 --> 00:26:43.510
worrying when you let robots go off and


00:26:43.520 --> 00:26:44.470
kill people.


00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:46.149
>> Yeah, that'll happen one day.


00:26:46.159 --> 00:26:46.630
>> Yeah,


00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:48.789
>> I don't doubt it. But, uh, yeah,


00:26:48.799 --> 00:26:51.750
fantastic story about Perseverance, uh,


00:26:51.760 --> 00:26:54.310
using AI technology to find its way


00:26:54.320 --> 00:26:56.710
around and, uh, maybe it'll miss those


00:26:56.720 --> 00:26:58.630
rocks now. And you can read it at


00:26:58.640 --> 00:27:00.470
space.com.


00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:05.029
Still on Mars and, uh, still on the, um,


00:27:05.039 --> 00:27:08.230
Perseverance rover. Uh, this is a


00:27:08.240 --> 00:27:10.149
fabulous story to finish on, Fred. And


00:27:10.159 --> 00:27:12.390
this is I I think we've talked about the


00:27:12.400 --> 00:27:16.950
potential for a shoreline uh being


00:27:16.960 --> 00:27:19.269
suggested for Mars, but now they reckon


00:27:19.279 --> 00:27:21.750
they've actually uncovered


00:27:21.760 --> 00:27:24.870
definitive evidence of it. That's right.


00:27:24.880 --> 00:27:26.710
Yes. So you you're absolutely right.


00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:29.750
There's um uh for a long time there have


00:27:29.760 --> 00:27:32.390
been features in just in the geomapology


00:27:32.400 --> 00:27:34.470
of Mars the you know the layout of the


00:27:34.480 --> 00:27:39.990
land that uh suggest uh shorelines uh


00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:44.789
from this this hypothetical ocean which


00:27:44.799 --> 00:27:46.789
that the evidence is building probably


00:27:46.799 --> 00:27:48.390
covered the northern hemisphere of Mars


00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:50.710
for a long period. Uh we've talked about


00:27:50.720 --> 00:27:52.470
several stories recently that seem to be


00:27:52.480 --> 00:27:54.070
confirming that it was a large body of


00:27:54.080 --> 00:27:56.549
water rather than just a few lakes that


00:27:56.559 --> 00:27:59.350
came and went uh with uh with the


00:27:59.360 --> 00:28:03.990
climate. Um so but the you know we it's


00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:06.710
one thing identifying possible


00:28:06.720 --> 00:28:09.269
shorelines from orbit but it's quite


00:28:09.279 --> 00:28:12.789
another to have definitive evidence on


00:28:12.799 --> 00:28:15.029
the ground. And that's uh what


00:28:15.039 --> 00:28:18.389
Perseverance seems to have found now


00:28:18.399 --> 00:28:21.750
with an analysis of rocks. And we're


00:28:21.760 --> 00:28:23.909
still talking about Jezero Crater, which


00:28:23.919 --> 00:28:26.310
is where the spacecraft is. Remember,


00:28:26.320 --> 00:28:27.909
it's this crater that we believe was


00:28:27.919 --> 00:28:30.389
once full of water. And there's a a


00:28:30.399 --> 00:28:32.710
river delta on one side of it, which is


00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:35.510
what Perseverance is is looking at. Um


00:28:35.520 --> 00:28:38.950
but the shoreline uh hypothesis comes


00:28:38.960 --> 00:28:42.789
about uh and this is actually uh um from


00:28:42.799 --> 00:28:44.710
studies carried out by scientists at


00:28:44.720 --> 00:28:47.029
Imperial College in London. Uh what


00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:49.350
they've done is they've looked at it's


00:28:49.360 --> 00:28:51.990
an area which is called the margin unit.


00:28:52.000 --> 00:28:55.269
Uh interesting you it's sounds bit more


00:28:55.279 --> 00:28:57.110
like a jazz combo to me but it's the


00:28:57.120 --> 00:29:00.230
margin unit. That's the that's the the


00:29:00.240 --> 00:29:03.669
name of this uh geological feature. M uh


00:29:03.679 --> 00:29:07.430
and it's got a double whammy in terms of


00:29:07.440 --> 00:29:10.789
uh the way its history has evolved


00:29:10.799 --> 00:29:15.430
because uh there's there's signs of uh


00:29:15.440 --> 00:29:17.590
what's been called subsurface water


00:29:17.600 --> 00:29:22.070
activity where you've got water that is


00:29:22.080 --> 00:29:25.190
changing the characteristics of rock. Uh


00:29:25.200 --> 00:29:28.230
and the I think the thinking summarizing


00:29:28.240 --> 00:29:30.070
it very quickly and I hope I'm doing the


00:29:30.080 --> 00:29:32.389
scientist justice in doing this. Uh what


00:29:32.399 --> 00:29:34.070
you've got is basically it starts off


00:29:34.080 --> 00:29:37.430
with volcanic rock but uh that rock is


00:29:37.440 --> 00:29:41.029
then altered by water uh and turns out


00:29:41.039 --> 00:29:43.029
to have uh you know to be sort of


00:29:43.039 --> 00:29:45.750
carbonacious after that carbon dioxide


00:29:45.760 --> 00:29:48.389
uh rich water underground circulating


00:29:48.399 --> 00:29:51.350
underground. It it gives the a chemical


00:29:51.360 --> 00:29:53.830
alteration to the to the to the


00:29:53.840 --> 00:29:57.350
landscape underground. Um and so that's


00:29:57.360 --> 00:29:59.830
one of the things that this study has


00:29:59.840 --> 00:30:01.909
revealed that that is almost certainly


00:30:01.919 --> 00:30:05.269
what happened. But the other thing is uh


00:30:05.279 --> 00:30:08.630
the fact that they now see evidence of a


00:30:08.640 --> 00:30:12.710
shoreline in terms of the basically the


00:30:12.720 --> 00:30:15.110
layers the um the there there are


00:30:15.120 --> 00:30:18.630
structures in the sand sandstone which


00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:20.549
is kind of what it is. It's this altered


00:30:20.559 --> 00:30:24.149
rock um which match structures as they


00:30:24.159 --> 00:30:26.789
say typically formed by wave action on


00:30:26.799 --> 00:30:27.669
the shoreline.


00:30:27.679 --> 00:30:27.990
>> Yeah.


00:30:28.000 --> 00:30:30.870
>> Um and a lovely comment from one of the


00:30:30.880 --> 00:30:32.789
uh one of the researchers. We are


00:30:32.799 --> 00:30:35.590
looking at what was once a beach. Uh


00:30:35.600 --> 00:30:38.230
that's Alex Jones who is a PhD student


00:30:38.240 --> 00:30:40.070
at the Imperial College and he's the


00:30:40.080 --> 00:30:43.590
lead author of uh this this study.


00:30:43.600 --> 00:30:45.430
>> Yeah, it's fascinating. So


00:30:45.440 --> 00:30:47.510
>> I I think for me, Fred, the most


00:30:47.520 --> 00:30:49.830
exciting part of this story is that they


00:30:49.840 --> 00:30:52.230
are suggesting this discovery pushes


00:30:52.240 --> 00:30:54.870
back the timeline for conditions that


00:30:54.880 --> 00:30:58.630
would support life on Mars. So it g does


00:30:58.640 --> 00:31:00.710
that mean that the the time frame is


00:31:00.720 --> 00:31:02.310
much larger than they originally


00:31:02.320 --> 00:31:03.350
thought?


00:31:03.360 --> 00:31:05.190
>> Yes, I think that's the bottom line that


00:31:05.200 --> 00:31:06.789
you you know you you you're giving


00:31:06.799 --> 00:31:10.230
yourself a bigger window uh in which uh


00:31:10.240 --> 00:31:13.430
life could form on Mars. So yes, it's uh


00:31:13.440 --> 00:31:16.310
it is a very nice piece of work. Uh once


00:31:16.320 --> 00:31:18.470
again, it's just adding to the growing


00:31:18.480 --> 00:31:21.510
body of evidence that we we are amassing


00:31:21.520 --> 00:31:23.909
that yes, Mars once had a climate very


00:31:23.919 --> 00:31:24.870
like the Earth's.


00:31:24.880 --> 00:31:28.470
>> Yeah. And may may well have had life as


00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:30.710
a consequence of that. And now that the


00:31:30.720 --> 00:31:35.190
window is bigger, um yeah, it's I my


00:31:35.200 --> 00:31:36.870
brain is saying it's only a matter of


00:31:36.880 --> 00:31:39.909
time before we find the evidence. And


00:31:39.919 --> 00:31:41.830
whether or not there's still life on


00:31:41.840 --> 00:31:43.909
Mars, no one's dismissing that


00:31:43.919 --> 00:31:45.029
possibility either.


00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:47.830
>> No, that's that's right. Exactly.


00:31:47.840 --> 00:31:49.750
Fascinating story. You can read it at


00:31:49.760 --> 00:31:52.149
daily galaxy.com.


00:31:52.159 --> 00:31:56.710
Uh or you can do the uh geeky thing and


00:31:56.720 --> 00:31:58.070
read the paper at the Journal of


00:31:58.080 --> 00:32:01.669
Geoysical Research Planets. Uh gosh,


00:32:01.679 --> 00:32:03.190
Fred, we've uh we've covered a lot of


00:32:03.200 --> 00:32:05.110
territory and we're all done for the


00:32:05.120 --> 00:32:07.430
day. Thank you very much.


00:32:07.440 --> 00:32:09.990
Pleasure and uh great to revisit Mars


00:32:10.000 --> 00:32:11.350
again. Your favorite planet.


00:32:11.360 --> 00:32:12.950
>> Yeah, it's Well, it's got a lot to tell,


00:32:12.960 --> 00:32:14.789
hasn't it? That's that's what makes it


00:32:14.799 --> 00:32:18.230
exciting. Yeah, we've got um um so much


00:32:18.240 --> 00:32:20.549
going on there and there's always news


00:32:20.559 --> 00:32:22.389
almost every day coming out of Mars.


00:32:22.399 --> 00:32:24.230
Yeah. Fascinating. Thanks, Rick. We'll


00:32:24.240 --> 00:32:25.830
catch you real soon.


00:32:25.840 --> 00:32:27.509
>> That sounds great. See you soon.


00:32:27.519 --> 00:32:29.990
>> See you. Uh and uh don't forget to visit


00:32:30.000 --> 00:32:32.789
our website uh between episodes. You can


00:32:32.799 --> 00:32:34.870
do that at spaceodcast.com.


00:32:34.880 --> 00:32:36.470
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00:32:36.480 --> 00:32:38.389
have a look around. You can get your uh


00:32:38.399 --> 00:32:41.750
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00:32:41.760 --> 00:32:43.269
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00:32:46.399 --> 00:32:48.310
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We've got everything. Uh and don't


00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:52.470
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00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:54.630
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00:32:59.440 --> 00:33:01.430
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00:33:01.440 --> 00:33:03.669
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00:33:03.679 --> 00:33:06.070
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00:33:06.080 --> 00:33:08.070
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00:33:08.080 --> 00:33:10.950
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00:33:10.960 --> 00:33:12.950
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00:33:12.960 --> 00:33:15.830
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00:33:15.840 --> 00:33:17.590
thanks to Hugh in the studio who


00:33:17.600 --> 00:33:18.870
couldn't be with us today because he's


00:33:18.880 --> 00:33:20.630
in Brisbane.


00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:22.470
That's funny for a lot of reasons that


00:33:22.480 --> 00:33:24.710
no one will understand, but um anyway,


00:33:24.720 --> 00:33:26.389
we'll leave it there. And from me,


00:33:26.399 --> 00:33:28.470
Andrew Dunley, uh thanks for your


00:33:28.480 --> 00:33:29.669
company. We'll catch you on the next


00:33:29.679 --> 00:33:31.750
episode of Space Nuts. Bye-bye.


00:33:31.760 --> 00:33:32.789
>> Space Nuts.


00:33:32.799 --> 00:33:34.870
>> You'll be listening to the Space Nuts


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