Interstellar Inquiries: Hot Jupiters, Rocket Fuel Solutions & Debunking the Artemis Conspiracy |...

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Kind: captions
Language: en

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Hello again. Thank you for joining us on


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another episode of Space Nuts. This is a


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Q&A edition where we take audience


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questions, we write them on a piece of


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paper, and then we throw it in the bin.


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Or we could answer them. We'll do the


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we'll do the latter. Uh we got questions


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about ultra hot Jupiters. We've also got


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questions about reusing spent rocket


00:00:21.920 --> 00:00:24.630
fuel. How would you do that? That is the


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question. And wow, how about this one?


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uh some conspiracy with the Arteimus 2


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mission being fake. We'll deal with all


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of that on this episode of Space Nuts.


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>> 15 seconds. Guidance is internal. 10 9


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Ignition sequence start.


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>> Space nuts.


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>> 5 4 3 2 1 2 3 4 5 5 4 3 2 1


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>> Space Nuts.


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>> Astronauts report. It feels good.


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And joining us to try and sort all that


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out is Jonty Horner, professor of


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astrophysics at the University of


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Southern Queensland. Jonty, hello.


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>> Good afternoon. How are you going?


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>> I'm all right. Um, please forgive me if


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there's some background noise. There's a


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gardener working uh just out the front


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and uh he's doing a fabulous job, but


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he's using that kind of equipment that


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you would um you know demolish a


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building with. So,


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uh, it's, um, it's making quite a noise,


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but, um, I've got my filter turned on,


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so hopefully it'll just keep it blocked


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out.


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>> All these things work. I use this


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microphone in front of me for my


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teaching. I've had a number of occasions


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where the dog has decided that I'm


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paying too much attention to my students


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and not enough to her. It's got quite


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vocal about that, lying just behind me


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here next to her fire at the minute,


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keeping her really happy. And they say,


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"No, we can't hear anything." It's


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amazing how well it can filter out the


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background noise.


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>> Yes. the the technology is amazing


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today. It's like the telescope uh


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technology that exists now where you can


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filter out light pollution. I don't know


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how that works, but uh it it's quite


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incredible these days. Works really


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well. I want to answer some questions,


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>> of course.


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>> All right, let's start with David who's


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on the Sunshine Coast in Queensland,


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Australia.


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>> Good day, David from the Sunny Coast


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again. I just had a question regarding


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the uh ultra hot Jupiter article from


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the latest uh podcast. Um in the


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conversation uh Fred mentioned that uh


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the belief is that stars and their


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surrounding planets all form from the


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same uh disc of material. Um I just had


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a question regarding that material. Um


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you know we tend to think of stars as


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helium or hydrogen or both. Um and


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everything else is metals and we believe


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those metals formed within stars uh due


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to the the fusion burning. Um where then


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does this material come from in the disc


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to form a star and its planets? Is that


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from material from do we believe it's


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material from another star or um is


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there some other process going on?


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Thanks very much for the show. Awesome.


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See you guys.


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>> See you David. Thank you very much. Uh,


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that sounds like it's right up your


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alley. It is. It's a good fun one to


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start off with. So,


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you're right. The material that forms a


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star and its planets has been


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contributed to by many previous stars.


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If you imagine after the Big Bang, the


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universe was hydrogen and helium and a


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tiny little bit of other stuff, but it


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really was barely any, which meant that


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a generation of stars formed that were


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pretty much just hydrogen and helium and


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very little else. those stars in the


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early universe. There's some speculation


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that they may have been including mega


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mega stars much bigger than something


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called the Edington limit, which is a


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maximum size that a stable star can


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form. Um, because of how dense the


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universe was at the time, how much


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material there was. So, the speculation


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of stars up to several thousand solar


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mass. Those stars lived fast, died


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young, put material back out into the


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cosmos. So they when they died they


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locked some of the stuff up in the


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remnants to the left whether that's a


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black hole a neutron star a white dwarf


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whatever but the material that was flung


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outwards to form planetary nebula


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supernova remnants disperses into the


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wider galaxy. So what's happening over


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the eons of time since the Milky Way


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formed is that stars are born live and


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die. And when they die they pollute the


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cosmos. stars of different masses throw


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out different things. But what that


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means is that you gradually get more and


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more heavy elements introduced into the


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galaxy


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and that goes to basically contributing


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to the composition of the gas and dust


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that floats around in our galaxy. If you


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go out particularly this time of year in


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the southern hemisphere,


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but if you go out on any night of the


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year where you can see the Milky Way,


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you'll see that in the band of the Milky


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Way there are dark patches as well as


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glowing pits. The dark patches are not


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places where there is a lack of stars,


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but rather they're places where you've


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got huge clouds of gas and dust that are


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opaque that are blocking the light from


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stars that are more distant from


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reaching us. So they look dark in the


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same way that a cloud blocking the sun


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will look dark in the daytime. It's


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blocking the light from beyond.


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>> These clouds can be vast and they're


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made of gas and dust and ice, mainly


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hydrogen and helium, but lots of other


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stuff. And that other stuff will vary


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from one cloud to the next to some


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degree based on what it has been


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polluted with. You'll have some degree


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of stirring a pollution of the galaxy


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that gives you a background increase in


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the amount of metals. But you'll also


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get local variation.


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We see all of this incidentally in the


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Earth and the solar system. There are


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suggestions that the solar system when


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it was young, when it was forming, was


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polluted by a nearby supernova that


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injected a load of very short-lived


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radioactive aluminium isotopes that


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accelerated the degree of melting you


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got in the rocky objects. There's a


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signature there of a radioisotope that


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is so shortlived there shouldn't really


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have been any of it around unless a


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supernova exploded nearby to pollute our


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disc, giving us a slightly unusual


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composition. There is also an argument


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that the earth is richer in gold than it


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should be because sometime between 10


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and 100 million years before the


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formation of the earth 10,000 light


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years from where we formed two neutron


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stars collided polluting the universe


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with gold and some of that gold made its


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way into the disc that formed the solar


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system got incorporated into the earth


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and that's why we are a particularly


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good place for goldfinger to have his


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little layer. We've got more gold than


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normal.


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>> Yeah. What this all means is that those


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giant clouds of gas and dust in space


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can be truly vast. When they get nudged


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and start to collapse, they'll fragment


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in their interiors to form a cluster of


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stars. A number of stars which form from


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the little denser bits. It's like


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driving through a fog bank. Fog banks


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are never one uniform density. There's


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denser patches and less dense patches.


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A denser patch in one of these clouds


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will collapse under its own gravity. And


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so you'll get lots of stars forming. As


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that material collapses in, it collapses


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down to form a disc around that young


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proto star that's forming. And the star


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and the disc are made of the same


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material. They're forming from the same


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material. All that material that was in


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the cloud from which they formed, which


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has been polluted over many generations


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of stars, cooking the books to give the


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composition that is uniform across that


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star system. What happens then is that


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the star forms from everything. So it


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ends up very rich in hydrogen and helium


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because even after all that pollution


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and all that evolution, hydrogen and


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helium still make up something like


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between 98 and 99% of all atoms in the


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universe. So the star is going to be


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primarily hydrogen and helium with a


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thin veneer of everything else. In other


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words, the abundance of material in the


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star is going to be very nearly


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identical to the disc. Star will end up


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being very very very slightly enriched


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in the heavier elements because from the


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disc particularly when the disc is


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cleared there will be some infall of


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rocky and icy objects like the crotzing


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comets we see that fall into the star


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and pollute it further but that's a very


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very small effect compared to the


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overall mass of the star. The planets


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that form in the disc in the main form


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through a process we call core


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accretion. There are some suggestions


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that some of the most massive stars can


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form through a process of instability.


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And those planets and binary stars would


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form with a more stellar composition. I


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lots of hydrogen and helium. But most


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planets will form by initially growing a


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core of solid material because when you


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have a low mass, you can't capture gas.


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And so therefore, your composition will


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be dominated by the solid material, not


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the gases. So that's why the Earth


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doesn't have free hydrogen and helium.


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We simply don't have enough mass to


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capture those gases and hold on to them.


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So even though 99% of all atoms in the


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protolanetary disc were hydrogen and


00:09:01.680 --> 00:09:03.750
helium, we didn't get any of them other


00:09:03.760 --> 00:09:05.509
than the odd tiny little atom that was


00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:09.030
captured in a cage of other compounds


00:09:09.040 --> 00:09:11.670
called a clatherate that was captured in


00:09:11.680 --> 00:09:14.470
a mineral effectively. So we barely got


00:09:14.480 --> 00:09:16.070
any of those materials cuz we couldn't


00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:17.430
hold on to them. We formed out of the


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solid stuff. The further you are from


00:09:19.839 --> 00:09:21.750
the star, the colder it is. So the more


00:09:21.760 --> 00:09:23.190
different things can be solid rather


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than gas, which is where we get the idea


00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:26.630
of the ice line. If you're far enough


00:09:26.640 --> 00:09:29.670
from the star, water can be solid, can


00:09:29.680 --> 00:09:31.430
be ice. And then suddenly you've got a


00:09:31.440 --> 00:09:33.750
lot more solid material because water is


00:09:33.760 --> 00:09:35.590
about the most common compound there is


00:09:35.600 --> 00:09:37.350
almost. It's the most common atom


00:09:37.360 --> 00:09:39.030
hydrogen and the third most common atom


00:09:39.040 --> 00:09:40.389
oxygen. And you put them together and


00:09:40.399 --> 00:09:42.790
you've got water. So beyond the Iceland,


00:09:42.800 --> 00:09:44.150
you've got a lot more solid and you can


00:09:44.160 --> 00:09:46.870
form planets much quicker, which is why


00:09:46.880 --> 00:09:48.710
we think Jupiter and Saturn got so big


00:09:48.720 --> 00:09:50.710
so quickly. They had a lot to feed on


00:09:50.720 --> 00:09:52.550
and eventually they got massive enough


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that their gravity was strong enough to


00:09:54.080 --> 00:09:55.509
hold on to the hydrogen and helium


00:09:55.519 --> 00:09:59.590
around them and devour it. So they are


00:09:59.600 --> 00:10:01.670
in composition much more similar to the


00:10:01.680 --> 00:10:03.190
sun than the earth is because they have


00:10:03.200 --> 00:10:05.430
all that hydrogen and helium. But they


00:10:05.440 --> 00:10:07.990
are still richer in solid material than


00:10:08.000 --> 00:10:11.350
the sun because at their core there was


00:10:11.360 --> 00:10:13.190
all the solid material needed to build


00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:14.790
up before they could gather the hydrogen


00:10:14.800 --> 00:10:17.110
and helium. So they started with more


00:10:17.120 --> 00:10:19.269
solids effectively.


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The earth doesn't really have the


00:10:20.880 --> 00:10:22.550
hydrogen and helium. So all of the


00:10:22.560 --> 00:10:24.870
objects in our solar system will have


00:10:24.880 --> 00:10:27.590
the same composition as the sun in terms


00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:29.430
of the balance between carbon and


00:10:29.440 --> 00:10:32.069
nitrogen and iron and all these elements


00:10:32.079 --> 00:10:33.990
except for where they weren't able to


00:10:34.000 --> 00:10:36.069
capture those elements because they


00:10:36.079 --> 00:10:37.910
weren't massive enough. So the earth


00:10:37.920 --> 00:10:39.269
doesn't have the same compensation as


00:10:39.279 --> 00:10:41.590
the sun in terms of hydrogen and helium


00:10:41.600 --> 00:10:44.470
but it does in terms of iron, nickel,


00:10:44.480 --> 00:10:46.230
all those things. The balance between


00:10:46.240 --> 00:10:47.910
iron and nickel and carbon and all the


00:10:47.920 --> 00:10:50.150
rest of it are all in the same ratios as


00:10:50.160 --> 00:10:52.470
the sun. to an incredibly high


00:10:52.480 --> 00:10:54.550
precision. And that's because we all


00:10:54.560 --> 00:10:56.790
formed from the same material that quite


00:10:56.800 --> 00:10:58.230
rightly was mentioned in the question


00:10:58.240 --> 00:11:00.230
was delivered by past generation of


00:11:00.240 --> 00:11:01.590
stars that had lived and died. And


00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:02.870
that's where the whole concept that we


00:11:02.880 --> 00:11:04.949
are stardust comes from. It's the idea


00:11:04.959 --> 00:11:06.710
that all the atoms that we need to make


00:11:06.720 --> 00:11:09.350
us us other than the hydrogen atoms were


00:11:09.360 --> 00:11:11.110
cooked in the furnaces of stars long


00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:13.190
dead. All the carbon, the nitrogen, the


00:11:13.200 --> 00:11:15.350
oxygen, the phosphorus, all those


00:11:15.360 --> 00:11:16.630
wonderful things, calcium that


00:11:16.640 --> 00:11:18.550
contributes to our bones are all


00:11:18.560 --> 00:11:20.150
stardust from stars that died long


00:11:20.160 --> 00:11:23.110
before the solar system formed.


00:11:23.120 --> 00:11:26.470
There you are, David. Um, a very uh good


00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:29.110
answer that um pretty well nails it. Uh


00:11:29.120 --> 00:11:31.030
I I like the bit about there being more


00:11:31.040 --> 00:11:32.790
gold on Earth than there probably would


00:11:32.800 --> 00:11:34.790
be in other places. So, uh that's that


00:11:34.800 --> 00:11:36.069
was a lucky break for us.


00:11:36.079 --> 00:11:37.910
>> Absolutely.


00:11:37.920 --> 00:11:39.269
and so useful for a lot of the


00:11:39.279 --> 00:11:40.550
technology we use. Not just for those


00:11:40.560 --> 00:11:43.190
who like sparkly bangly things, but you


00:11:43.200 --> 00:11:45.590
know, there's a lot of those rarer type


00:11:45.600 --> 00:11:46.949
things that


00:11:46.959 --> 00:11:48.790
>> are so vital to our technological growth


00:11:48.800 --> 00:11:50.870
that are all linked to our ancient


00:11:50.880 --> 00:11:52.310
heritage.


00:11:52.320 --> 00:11:55.509
>> Yeah. Yeah. Um well, there's gold,


00:11:55.519 --> 00:11:58.310
there's lithium, there's there's just so


00:11:58.320 --> 00:11:59.590
many of them. But we've got a lithium


00:11:59.600 --> 00:12:00.870
mine just down the road from us,


00:12:00.880 --> 00:12:01.190
actually.


00:12:01.200 --> 00:12:03.990
>> And that is probably all primordial. The


00:12:04.000 --> 00:12:05.430
lithium in the universe is almost


00:12:05.440 --> 00:12:07.829
certainly almost all leftovers from the


00:12:07.839 --> 00:12:09.509
big bang.


00:12:09.519 --> 00:12:12.550
>> Wow, that's interesting. There you go,


00:12:12.560 --> 00:12:14.150
David. Thanks for the question. Lovely


00:12:14.160 --> 00:12:15.910
to hear from you. Hope all is well on


00:12:15.920 --> 00:12:18.470
the Sunshine Coast. This is Space Nuts


00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:22.230
with Andrew Dunley and Jonty, a Q&A


00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:24.629
edition.


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00:14:12.399 --> 00:14:14.230
>> Roger. Also,


00:14:14.240 --> 00:14:16.949
>> Space Nuts. And we're with Professor


00:14:16.959 --> 00:14:19.990
Jonty her today with Freda Away. Uh


00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:22.710
let's go to our next question. Jonty,


00:14:22.720 --> 00:14:25.030
this one comes from Mark.


00:14:25.040 --> 00:14:27.910
>> Hi, it's Mark from Sunny SH in the UK.


00:14:27.920 --> 00:14:29.430
I've eventually plucked up the courage


00:14:29.440 --> 00:14:31.670
to send in an audio question. So here


00:14:31.680 --> 00:14:34.470
goes. You quite often mention water ice


00:14:34.480 --> 00:14:36.389
and the possibility of turning this into


00:14:36.399 --> 00:14:38.550
rocket fuel. So my what do you think


00:14:38.560 --> 00:14:40.710
sort of question is when you use


00:14:40.720 --> 00:14:43.110
hydrogen and oxygen as a rocket fuel it


00:14:43.120 --> 00:14:45.430
must turn back into water ice in space.


00:14:45.440 --> 00:14:47.189
So do you think it would be possible to


00:14:47.199 --> 00:14:49.110
collect it and reuse it through the


00:14:49.120 --> 00:14:51.350
rocket engine again massively reducing


00:14:51.360 --> 00:14:53.189
the amount of fuel you would need to


00:14:53.199 --> 00:14:55.189
carry for an extended journey to say to


00:14:55.199 --> 00:14:58.310
Mars. I've sort of drawn up an idea but


00:14:58.320 --> 00:15:00.230
what do you think once again? Keep up


00:15:00.240 --> 00:15:03.110
the great work from the UK.


00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:04.710
>> Thank you Mark. It's an interesting


00:15:04.720 --> 00:15:08.710
idea. Uh my first thought when I first


00:15:08.720 --> 00:15:11.509
heard the question was um how how would


00:15:11.519 --> 00:15:14.389
how would you collect it? That that


00:15:14.399 --> 00:15:16.230
might be the first challenge. That would


00:15:16.240 --> 00:15:17.350
be a bit of the challenge. I mean the


00:15:17.360 --> 00:15:18.790
thing is your exhaust is being pushed


00:15:18.800 --> 00:15:20.629
out of the back of the rocket at very


00:15:20.639 --> 00:15:23.509
high speed in a very dispersed form. Now


00:15:23.519 --> 00:15:25.030
the rocket's going forward because


00:15:25.040 --> 00:15:26.550
you're throwing the things out the back.


00:15:26.560 --> 00:15:28.310
You've got the momentum being


00:15:28.320 --> 00:15:30.870
transferred. And it's equivalent, I


00:15:30.880 --> 00:15:33.110
guess, to you, the way I'd visualize


00:15:33.120 --> 00:15:35.350
this is imagining again sitting on an


00:15:35.360 --> 00:15:37.509
ice rink on a wheelie chair. So you've


00:15:37.519 --> 00:15:39.430
got no friction whatsoever, really


00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:41.750
slippy, and you're holding, normally I'd


00:15:41.760 --> 00:15:43.269
just say one medicine ball, but instead


00:15:43.279 --> 00:15:44.710
imagine that you're holding a big bag of


00:15:44.720 --> 00:15:47.509
short puts. You throw a short put away


00:15:47.519 --> 00:15:49.110
from you, and you'll recall in the other


00:15:49.120 --> 00:15:50.470
direction. You throw another shot put,


00:15:50.480 --> 00:15:51.829
and you'll speed up, and you'll move in


00:15:51.839 --> 00:15:53.189
the opposite direction to the direction


00:15:53.199 --> 00:15:55.990
your short puts are going. So that's how


00:15:56.000 --> 00:15:57.350
you'll work. And that's essentially what


00:15:57.360 --> 00:15:58.790
you're doing with a rocket. you're


00:15:58.800 --> 00:16:00.470
pushing material out of the back and


00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:02.550
you're moving the opposite way because


00:16:02.560 --> 00:16:04.230
overall the momentum is conserved


00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:05.829
between the stuff going one way and you


00:16:05.839 --> 00:16:08.710
going the other. The problem with the


00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:11.189
rocket itself capturing its own exhaust,


00:16:11.199 --> 00:16:13.910
pumping it back in and reusing it is


00:16:13.920 --> 00:16:15.670
then you're taking that momentum and


00:16:15.680 --> 00:16:16.790
bringing it back to you, which means


00:16:16.800 --> 00:16:18.069
you're getting pulled back towards it


00:16:18.079 --> 00:16:20.790
and you'll end up having gone nowhere


00:16:20.800 --> 00:16:22.550
to some degree. So imagine now that


00:16:22.560 --> 00:16:25.509
situation with the short puts on the ice


00:16:25.519 --> 00:16:27.829
shrink, but instead you've got a really


00:16:27.839 --> 00:16:29.670
efficient bungee code so that when you


00:16:29.680 --> 00:16:30.949
throw them away, they bounce back and


00:16:30.959 --> 00:16:32.949
you catch them again. What'll happen is


00:16:32.959 --> 00:16:34.470
as they're moving away from you, you'll


00:16:34.480 --> 00:16:35.990
wheel away from them and then as they


00:16:36.000 --> 00:16:37.269
get pulled back towards you, you get


00:16:37.279 --> 00:16:38.389
pulled back towards them and you end up


00:16:38.399 --> 00:16:40.870
where you started from


00:16:40.880 --> 00:16:42.550
a little bit of change due to friction


00:16:42.560 --> 00:16:44.870
and loss of energy and stuff like that.


00:16:44.880 --> 00:16:46.870
So the problem I'd have with this


00:16:46.880 --> 00:16:48.790
suggestion is not actually the idea of


00:16:48.800 --> 00:16:51.910
capturing and reusing the fuel. Um, I


00:16:51.920 --> 00:16:53.350
think that will be hard because the fuel


00:16:53.360 --> 00:16:55.030
will get so dispersed. So, water will be


00:16:55.040 --> 00:16:56.310
scattered out there and it's just easier


00:16:56.320 --> 00:16:57.829
to go get a big lump of ice from


00:16:57.839 --> 00:16:59.509
somewhere than to try and pick up


00:16:59.519 --> 00:17:01.189
individual water molecules or small


00:17:01.199 --> 00:17:03.350
grains of ice, disperse over a large


00:17:03.360 --> 00:17:05.669
area. But the idea of being able to


00:17:05.679 --> 00:17:07.270
capture it from the same rocket and


00:17:07.280 --> 00:17:09.029
reuse it would get you into this problem


00:17:09.039 --> 00:17:10.710
of having to pull back material that


00:17:10.720 --> 00:17:12.630
you've pushed away, which means you'll


00:17:12.640 --> 00:17:14.230
be pulling yourself back to where you


00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:16.549
started from. So, you can't get away, I


00:17:16.559 --> 00:17:19.270
think, from that momentum issue there.


00:17:19.280 --> 00:17:21.110
So I think it's two different things. I


00:17:21.120 --> 00:17:23.750
think if you had the ability to instead


00:17:23.760 --> 00:17:25.669
of using hydrogen and oxygen as a fuel


00:17:25.679 --> 00:17:28.230
and burning them to be water, you could


00:17:28.240 --> 00:17:31.029
instead have a rocket fired powered by


00:17:31.039 --> 00:17:33.830
firing pellets of water out of the back.


00:17:33.840 --> 00:17:35.510
You could fire them at a target that


00:17:35.520 --> 00:17:38.310
captures them, collect them, and reuse


00:17:38.320 --> 00:17:39.750
those pellets for something else. But


00:17:39.760 --> 00:17:41.350
that target would get pushed around by


00:17:41.360 --> 00:17:43.510
the arriving water pellets. So you'd


00:17:43.520 --> 00:17:44.789
want to be clever with that, and you'd


00:17:44.799 --> 00:17:46.390
need to continually change its orbit and


00:17:46.400 --> 00:17:47.510
stuff.


00:17:47.520 --> 00:17:49.350
So, in theory, potentially you could


00:17:49.360 --> 00:17:50.950
gather the fuel for use on another


00:17:50.960 --> 00:17:53.430
rocket without it being the rocket


00:17:53.440 --> 00:17:55.669
you're flying that gathers that fuel.


00:17:55.679 --> 00:17:57.190
But in reality, you're dispersing it


00:17:57.200 --> 00:17:58.630
over such a large area that


00:17:58.640 --> 00:18:01.029
unfortunately it wouldn't be that


00:18:01.039 --> 00:18:02.470
practical anyway. Especially when we've


00:18:02.480 --> 00:18:04.470
got just huge lumps of ice floating


00:18:04.480 --> 00:18:05.669
around anyway. I mean, you and I have


00:18:05.679 --> 00:18:07.750
both been photographing a beautiful lump


00:18:07.760 --> 00:18:09.750
of ice flying through the solar system.


00:18:09.760 --> 00:18:11.909
There we go in the background.


00:18:11.919 --> 00:18:14.230
That's enough fuel for missions forever


00:18:14.240 --> 00:18:16.150
more if we were to go and mine there.


00:18:16.160 --> 00:18:17.830
And that's a lot more efficient to mine


00:18:17.840 --> 00:18:21.990
one big comet or asteroid for water ice


00:18:22.000 --> 00:18:24.230
or mine the moon for water ice than try


00:18:24.240 --> 00:18:25.830
and catch it when it's dispersed. I


00:18:25.840 --> 00:18:28.549
think so it's a really good idea.


00:18:28.559 --> 00:18:29.990
>> It's really good thinking but it's


00:18:30.000 --> 00:18:31.029
something that wouldn't work. I think


00:18:31.039 --> 00:18:33.350
that's the way I'd view it.


00:18:33.360 --> 00:18:35.669
>> It it'd be very complicated and as you


00:18:35.679 --> 00:18:37.830
said um trying to capture it in the ship


00:18:37.840 --> 00:18:40.150
you're actually propelling would be


00:18:40.160 --> 00:18:41.830
counterproductive.


00:18:41.840 --> 00:18:44.549
>> Yes. using another spaceship to capture


00:18:44.559 --> 00:18:47.830
the ice after it's been expelled


00:18:47.840 --> 00:18:49.270
uh would be difficult because it would


00:18:49.280 --> 00:18:51.190
spread out too far, but then you're


00:18:51.200 --> 00:18:55.029
using the same technology to chase the


00:18:55.039 --> 00:18:57.830
ice that's been spent already and


00:18:57.840 --> 00:18:59.750
spending more to get the ice back. So,


00:18:59.760 --> 00:19:02.150
it yeah, it's a catch 22. It's just


00:19:02.160 --> 00:19:04.150
going to keep going around and around.


00:19:04.160 --> 00:19:07.350
So, um yeah, it makes it a little bit


00:19:07.360 --> 00:19:09.669
difficult. Uh Mark, but uh thanks for


00:19:09.679 --> 00:19:12.390
your question. Um, that was a fun one


00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:15.990
actually. But, uh, yeah. Um, yeah, I


00:19:16.000 --> 00:19:17.590
like the way people think, but I


00:19:17.600 --> 00:19:19.909
suppose, um, just to expand on it a bit,


00:19:19.919 --> 00:19:22.950
um, there's going to come a time where


00:19:22.960 --> 00:19:24.789
using those kinds of fuels probably


00:19:24.799 --> 00:19:26.549
won't be necessary. They're developing


00:19:26.559 --> 00:19:28.710
all sorts of different kinds of engine


00:19:28.720 --> 00:19:31.830
technology. Uh, everything from solar


00:19:31.840 --> 00:19:35.990
sails to scramjets and and they don't


00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:37.270
use that kind of fuel.


00:19:37.280 --> 00:19:38.549
>> There's all sorts of things you could


00:19:38.559 --> 00:19:40.950
do. I mean again going back to the Bobby


00:19:40.960 --> 00:19:42.710
verse which I mentioned before the van


00:19:42.720 --> 00:19:45.110
probes going through they used kind of


00:19:45.120 --> 00:19:47.270
um ram scoops essentially initially in


00:19:47.280 --> 00:19:49.430
the book set they then move on to other


00:19:49.440 --> 00:19:51.830
kind of speculative sci-fi things but


00:19:51.840 --> 00:19:53.590
initially the idea of having a fusion


00:19:53.600 --> 00:19:55.750
drive where you scoop up hydrogen atoms


00:19:55.760 --> 00:19:57.190
and turn them into helium and push them


00:19:57.200 --> 00:20:00.070
out the back where in front of you you


00:20:00.080 --> 00:20:01.669
deploy a big thing that gathers the


00:20:01.679 --> 00:20:03.110
hydrogen you're moving through. This is


00:20:03.120 --> 00:20:04.870
also what they did in Tal Zero by Paul


00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:06.710
Anderson is, you know, you're moving


00:20:06.720 --> 00:20:08.230
really quickly. You gather hydrogen from


00:20:08.240 --> 00:20:10.070
in front of you and compress it like a


00:20:10.080 --> 00:20:12.150
ramjet effectively.


00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:13.430
There's all these kind of things, but


00:20:13.440 --> 00:20:15.990
they will all unless we get to truly


00:20:16.000 --> 00:20:18.310
sci-fi type things like warp drive or


00:20:18.320 --> 00:20:20.950
air drives or or whatever, which require


00:20:20.960 --> 00:20:22.390
physics to be somewhat different than


00:20:22.400 --> 00:20:25.110
how we currently understand it, you


00:20:25.120 --> 00:20:27.510
still have either a source of


00:20:27.520 --> 00:20:30.310
propellant, which you then get rid of


00:20:30.320 --> 00:20:32.870
out the back one way or the other, or


00:20:32.880 --> 00:20:34.950
with solar sails, you're using the


00:20:34.960 --> 00:20:38.230
stellar wind, and that pushes you away.


00:20:38.240 --> 00:20:40.870
Um, people who are sailors can probably


00:20:40.880 --> 00:20:42.390
tell you a lot more about the complexity


00:20:42.400 --> 00:20:43.990
of how you can tack into the wind and


00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:45.590
move across the wind. But the wind, the


00:20:45.600 --> 00:20:48.230
solar wind is incredibly tenuous


00:20:48.240 --> 00:20:49.510
compared to the wind in the Earth's


00:20:49.520 --> 00:20:50.950
atmosphere. So, you need a very, very


00:20:50.960 --> 00:20:53.190
big sail. And I think that will be


00:20:53.200 --> 00:20:56.070
somewhat limiting if you wanting to do,


00:20:56.080 --> 00:20:57.990
I guess, Star Wars style dog fight


00:20:58.000 --> 00:20:59.190
maneuvers. You wouldn't do that with a


00:20:59.200 --> 00:21:01.430
solar sail. So, people will pick the


00:21:01.440 --> 00:21:02.870
right technology for the kind of mission


00:21:02.880 --> 00:21:05.110
that they want. And that was where the


00:21:05.120 --> 00:21:07.430
Dawn mission which went to series and


00:21:07.440 --> 00:21:09.110
Juno in the asteroid belt was really


00:21:09.120 --> 00:21:11.909
interesting. So it used an ion drive


00:21:11.919 --> 00:21:14.630
where it was using I think ionized xenon


00:21:14.640 --> 00:21:17.590
and that kind of drive achieves a much


00:21:17.600 --> 00:21:19.830
much lower thrust but can operate for


00:21:19.840 --> 00:21:21.590
much much longer time. So it's very


00:21:21.600 --> 00:21:24.310
energy efficient. Um but it wouldn't be


00:21:24.320 --> 00:21:25.669
any good for getting off the surface of


00:21:25.679 --> 00:21:27.430
the earth but it's very very good for


00:21:27.440 --> 00:21:28.789
cruising around the solar system when


00:21:28.799 --> 00:21:31.029
you're not in a rush. And so what will


00:21:31.039 --> 00:21:32.870
happen is I think different people will


00:21:32.880 --> 00:21:35.190
have different types of drives for


00:21:35.200 --> 00:21:38.230
different types of scenario


00:21:38.240 --> 00:21:40.789
and choose the one that works best.


00:21:40.799 --> 00:21:42.789
>> Yeah. But to get off the planet at the


00:21:42.799 --> 00:21:44.870
moment, you you need rockets. There's


00:21:44.880 --> 00:21:47.590
there's no real other technology that


00:21:47.600 --> 00:21:49.350
will get you out there. I know they've


00:21:49.360 --> 00:21:52.710
been trying um sort of catapult


00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:56.549
technology u which um could deploy


00:21:56.559 --> 00:22:00.630
satellites in the future. Um, I think


00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:02.230
you'd need to be in the right place on


00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:04.149
the planet to take advantage of the u


00:22:04.159 --> 00:22:06.070
the rotation of the earth so that you


00:22:06.080 --> 00:22:08.149
don't have like you couldn't do it too


00:22:08.159 --> 00:22:09.909
far away from the equator, that kind of


00:22:09.919 --> 00:22:11.430
thing. But


00:22:11.440 --> 00:22:14.230
>> um at the moment uh yeah, the um the


00:22:14.240 --> 00:22:16.789
standard old rocket engine is uh is the


00:22:16.799 --> 00:22:18.950
best option at the moment. So, um, part


00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:20.710
of where the refueling station idea


00:22:20.720 --> 00:22:22.710
around the moon comes from, which is,


00:22:22.720 --> 00:22:24.230
you know, if you have to take your fuel


00:22:24.240 --> 00:22:25.510
with you, you're carrying a lot of extra


00:22:25.520 --> 00:22:26.789
weight. So, you've got to burn extra


00:22:26.799 --> 00:22:28.549
fuel to carry that fuel, which means


00:22:28.559 --> 00:22:29.830
you're carrying extra weight. So, you


00:22:29.840 --> 00:22:31.669
got to take even more fuel to burn to


00:22:31.679 --> 00:22:32.789
carry the weight of the fuel you're


00:22:32.799 --> 00:22:34.950
carrying to carry the extra fuel. And


00:22:34.960 --> 00:22:36.789
so, it becomes very inefficient very


00:22:36.799 --> 00:22:38.390
quickly. So, if instead you can have


00:22:38.400 --> 00:22:39.750
small launches from Earth and then


00:22:39.760 --> 00:22:41.669
refuel once you're beyond the Earth,


00:22:41.679 --> 00:22:43.909
that's a lot more effective. I mean the


00:22:43.919 --> 00:22:45.190
other thing that people have suggested


00:22:45.200 --> 00:22:46.549
long term


00:22:46.559 --> 00:22:47.909
>> as a solution to get things off the


00:22:47.919 --> 00:22:49.510
earth more cheaply are things like space


00:22:49.520 --> 00:22:53.190
elevators which are probably still far


00:22:53.200 --> 00:22:55.350
science fiction. I don't don't think we


00:22:55.360 --> 00:22:56.950
have the material science to do that nor


00:22:56.960 --> 00:22:59.029
the political will. I mean putting that


00:22:59.039 --> 00:23:00.470
in perspective just saw the announcement


00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:02.710
this week that the vast inland rail


00:23:02.720 --> 00:23:05.430
project that was happening in Australia


00:23:05.440 --> 00:23:07.110
is no longer happening because it got


00:23:07.120 --> 00:23:09.350
too expensive and it's taken too long.


00:23:09.360 --> 00:23:11.029
And if we can't build a railway between


00:23:11.039 --> 00:23:13.350
Melbourne and Brisbane, it's going to be


00:23:13.360 --> 00:23:15.990
really hard to build an elevator between


00:23:16.000 --> 00:23:17.590
low Earth orbit, well, between the


00:23:17.600 --> 00:23:19.909
Earth's surface geostationary orbit and


00:23:19.919 --> 00:23:21.430
the same distance beyond for the


00:23:21.440 --> 00:23:23.029
counterweight.


00:23:23.039 --> 00:23:26.149
>> Yeah. So, I don't happen anytime soon.


00:23:26.159 --> 00:23:28.149
>> We can't even get a tunnel under the


00:23:28.159 --> 00:23:29.909
Blue Mountains between the West and


00:23:29.919 --> 00:23:34.070
Sydney. Uh, and that's despite the fact


00:23:34.080 --> 00:23:36.390
that that road is currently closed due


00:23:36.400 --> 00:23:39.350
to a structural failure in Victoria


00:23:39.360 --> 00:23:42.230
Pass, the old convict bridge that's uh


00:23:42.240 --> 00:23:44.710
200 years old or something or 150 years


00:23:44.720 --> 00:23:47.190
old and it's finally given up the ghost


00:23:47.200 --> 00:23:50.470
and so they've closed the road. It's,


00:23:50.480 --> 00:23:52.149
>> you know, people have been screaming for


00:23:52.159 --> 00:23:56.630
a tunnel for decades and um, no


00:23:56.640 --> 00:23:58.310
politicians willing to spend the money


00:23:58.320 --> 00:23:59.909
because there aren't enough people.


00:23:59.919 --> 00:24:01.110
Bottom line is there aren't enough


00:24:01.120 --> 00:24:02.630
people living west of the mountains to


00:24:02.640 --> 00:24:06.070
make it worth your vote. That's really


00:24:06.080 --> 00:24:07.909
what it comes down. That's what it comes


00:24:07.919 --> 00:24:08.310
down to.


00:24:08.320 --> 00:24:09.510
>> Reminds me of the old episode of The


00:24:09.520 --> 00:24:11.190
Simpsons when I was a kid with the kind


00:24:11.200 --> 00:24:13.029
of argument about books for the kids or


00:24:13.039 --> 00:24:14.310
something. It was just the two people at


00:24:14.320 --> 00:24:16.710
the front room basically shouting but


00:24:16.720 --> 00:24:18.950
our children but taxes. But our children


00:24:18.960 --> 00:24:21.029
but taxes and it's this whole thing of


00:24:21.039 --> 00:24:22.390
everybody wants it but nobody wants to


00:24:22.400 --> 00:24:23.669
pay for it.


00:24:23.679 --> 00:24:26.149
>> Exactly. Yes. Uh a tunnel under the Blue


00:24:26.159 --> 00:24:27.990
Mountains would be wonderful though.


00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:30.710
Although um some some of the arguments


00:24:30.720 --> 00:24:32.710
against it are well it'll only save you


00:24:32.720 --> 00:24:34.470
15 minutes. I think it'll probably save


00:24:34.480 --> 00:24:36.630
you more gets pretty log jammed up over


00:24:36.640 --> 00:24:37.190
that mountain.


00:24:37.200 --> 00:24:39.190
>> We have those arguments about the Towa


00:24:39.200 --> 00:24:41.669
bypass and that's been a godsend. I mean


00:24:41.679 --> 00:24:41.990
it


00:24:42.000 --> 00:24:44.310
>> yeah I used it uh last year. Yeah it's


00:24:44.320 --> 00:24:44.870
fantastic.


00:24:44.880 --> 00:24:46.630
>> It fell apart and bits fell onto it


00:24:46.640 --> 00:24:49.350
because it contracted fairly cheaply.


00:24:49.360 --> 00:24:51.510
Um, but that has saved about half an


00:24:51.520 --> 00:24:53.269
hour from my trip down to Brisbane when


00:24:53.279 --> 00:24:55.110
I go to the airport and stuff because I


00:24:55.120 --> 00:24:57.029
don't have to go through Towa and all


00:24:57.039 --> 00:24:58.549
the freight companies use it even though


00:24:58.559 --> 00:25:01.029
the tolls are quite high because the


00:25:01.039 --> 00:25:02.470
tolls being high is a lot better than


00:25:02.480 --> 00:25:03.909
the wear and tear on their vehicles


00:25:03.919 --> 00:25:05.510
coming up the old road into Toumba and


00:25:05.520 --> 00:25:06.950
having to stop at all the traffic lights


00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:09.510
and stuff. So, it worked out for them.


00:25:09.520 --> 00:25:11.269
It's better for the TWA council because


00:25:11.279 --> 00:25:12.630
they're having to repair less potholes


00:25:12.640 --> 00:25:14.390
and they have less accidents. And it's


00:25:14.400 --> 00:25:15.750
one of those things where it was a


00:25:15.760 --> 00:25:16.950
little controversial when it was being


00:25:16.960 --> 00:25:19.510
built, but since it's set, it's been a


00:25:19.520 --> 00:25:21.350
godsend. And I'd like to think that some


00:25:21.360 --> 00:25:22.710
of these big infrastructure projects


00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:24.470
would be the same. And I mean, a space


00:25:24.480 --> 00:25:26.710
elevator would be wonderful, but you


00:25:26.720 --> 00:25:27.990
know, going to be hard to persuade


00:25:28.000 --> 00:25:29.590
people to commit to building it even


00:25:29.600 --> 00:25:31.830
when we get the technology. I think


00:25:31.840 --> 00:25:34.630
>> ah wait till there are orbiting hotels.


00:25:34.640 --> 00:25:36.549
That'll change everything. You wait and


00:25:36.559 --> 00:25:38.390
see.


00:25:38.400 --> 00:25:40.789
might be waiting a while. Uh, thanks


00:25:40.799 --> 00:25:42.549
Mark. Lovely to hear from you. This is


00:25:42.559 --> 00:25:45.029
Space Nuts with Andrew Dunley and


00:25:45.039 --> 00:25:49.750
Professor Jonty Hornath


00:25:49.760 --> 00:25:51.110
and I feel


00:25:51.120 --> 00:25:54.149
>> space nuts. One more question, Jonty.


00:25:54.159 --> 00:25:57.510
And this one comes from Paul.


00:25:57.520 --> 00:25:59.669
>> Good day, Gre and Andrew. Paul here from


00:25:59.679 --> 00:26:03.269
sunny Bris Vegas. I have a question and


00:26:03.279 --> 00:26:07.909
a dirty secret that I need to confess.


00:26:07.919 --> 00:26:11.029
So, I was on this flat earth group on


00:26:11.039 --> 00:26:14.230
Facebook. Yes, I know. I know. Anyway,


00:26:14.240 --> 00:26:17.750
this guy provided some AI information


00:26:17.760 --> 00:26:20.950
which was absolutely correct to contend


00:26:20.960 --> 00:26:23.430
that there is no way that the Aremis


00:26:23.440 --> 00:26:25.350
mission could have ever caught up to the


00:26:25.360 --> 00:26:26.870
Earth because the Earth travels a hell


00:26:26.880 --> 00:26:29.269
of a lot faster than that little


00:26:29.279 --> 00:26:32.549
spaceship. I pointed out that they


00:26:32.559 --> 00:26:35.110
didn't need to catch up to the Earth at


00:26:35.120 --> 00:26:36.710
all. They just needed to point


00:26:36.720 --> 00:26:39.510
themselves to where it was going to be


00:26:39.520 --> 00:26:43.750
and then splash down, land safely, and


00:26:43.760 --> 00:26:45.830
be applauded by everybody except for the


00:26:45.840 --> 00:26:48.230
flatearthers like him, uh, who are


00:26:48.240 --> 00:26:51.990
absolutely insensed at the moment about


00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:57.029
how it's all fake as per usual. Anyway,


00:26:57.039 --> 00:26:59.430
I told him that if he really wanted a


00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:01.430
better answer, exact answer, he really


00:27:01.440 --> 00:27:04.070
needed to talk to an astrophysicist. So


00:27:04.080 --> 00:27:06.630
my second question is well my first


00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:08.870
question is was I on the right track and


00:27:08.880 --> 00:27:11.669
my second question is are there any


00:27:11.679 --> 00:27:13.909
astrophysicists or any websites out


00:27:13.919 --> 00:27:17.110
there that can give us an animation of


00:27:17.120 --> 00:27:19.190
the earth


00:27:19.200 --> 00:27:22.390
going around the sun that also has uh


00:27:22.400 --> 00:27:24.710
the animated version of the Artemis


00:27:24.720 --> 00:27:26.710
going around the moon so that we can see


00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:29.350
the whole thing in context in terms of


00:27:29.360 --> 00:27:31.190
the solar system or at least our area of


00:27:31.200 --> 00:27:34.390
the solar system. uh it's not going to


00:27:34.400 --> 00:27:36.470
convince him, I'm sure, but I think it'd


00:27:36.480 --> 00:27:38.789
be pretty cool to see something like


00:27:38.799 --> 00:27:41.269
that. Anyway, thanks very much,


00:27:41.279 --> 00:27:43.510
gentlemen, for the show as always. Um,


00:27:43.520 --> 00:27:46.149
look forward to it every week and catch


00:27:46.159 --> 00:27:48.630
us later. Have a good one. You too,


00:27:48.640 --> 00:27:51.190
Paul. Thank you. If only we had an


00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:52.710
astrophysicist


00:27:52.720 --> 00:27:56.230
somewhere nearby. Jonty any any I know I


00:27:56.240 --> 00:27:58.470
know he was directing the question to


00:27:58.480 --> 00:28:02.149
Fred but he asked for an astrophysicist.


00:28:02.159 --> 00:28:04.070
>> Yeah we are legion for we are many.


00:28:04.080 --> 00:28:06.070
There's plenty of us around. It was


00:28:06.080 --> 00:28:08.310
always a thing when I was at uni of what


00:28:08.320 --> 00:28:09.669
title you use for what you're studying


00:28:09.679 --> 00:28:11.029
would depend on how bothered you were


00:28:11.039 --> 00:28:13.110
about the conversation cuz if you know


00:28:13.120 --> 00:28:14.950
if I told someone I was studying physics


00:28:14.960 --> 00:28:17.110
they'd very quickly edit st exit stage


00:28:17.120 --> 00:28:18.310
left. If I told them I was doing


00:28:18.320 --> 00:28:20.070
astronomy they'd stay and chat. And if I


00:28:20.080 --> 00:28:21.510
told them I was doing astrophysics


00:28:21.520 --> 00:28:23.269
they'd just look a little bit scared.


00:28:23.279 --> 00:28:27.190
Um, but I was doing all three. This is a


00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:29.830
an interesting one. I mean, I people


00:28:29.840 --> 00:28:32.870
like the flatearthers are difficult


00:28:32.880 --> 00:28:35.750
because there is no amount of truth, no


00:28:35.760 --> 00:28:37.510
amount of evidence that you can put


00:28:37.520 --> 00:28:39.029
before people who are convinced that


00:28:39.039 --> 00:28:40.549
they've been lied to.


00:28:40.559 --> 00:28:43.269
>> Um, other than talking to them gently


00:28:43.279 --> 00:28:45.590
about it. And it's like discussions of


00:28:45.600 --> 00:28:47.590
climate change I've had in the past with


00:28:47.600 --> 00:28:49.190
people who argue climate change isn't


00:28:49.200 --> 00:28:51.909
real. Arguing and fighting with people


00:28:51.919 --> 00:28:54.149
over this doesn't win hearts and minds.


00:28:54.159 --> 00:28:55.830
It just gets them more entrenched. But


00:28:55.840 --> 00:28:57.269
talking to them about it and talking


00:28:57.279 --> 00:29:00.230
about why we think something is a case.


00:29:00.240 --> 00:29:01.909
This is our evidence. This is what it


00:29:01.919 --> 00:29:03.430
is.


00:29:03.440 --> 00:29:05.029
That can be a little bit more fruitful I


00:29:05.039 --> 00:29:06.310
guess. But it is really challenging. I


00:29:06.320 --> 00:29:07.430
mean especially given that we had a


00:29:07.440 --> 00:29:08.870
beautiful eclipse of the moon just a few


00:29:08.880 --> 00:29:11.029
months ago where you can see that the


00:29:11.039 --> 00:29:13.750
shadow of the earth is round.


00:29:13.760 --> 00:29:14.789
>> I mean you know


00:29:14.799 --> 00:29:16.470
>> and that's the big argument. If the if


00:29:16.480 --> 00:29:19.110
the earth was flat, the shadow at some


00:29:19.120 --> 00:29:21.990
stage would be just a a line across the


00:29:22.000 --> 00:29:22.389
moon.


00:29:22.399 --> 00:29:24.470
>> We'd see the elephants and the turtle.


00:29:24.480 --> 00:29:26.950
>> Um the other thing is if the earth was


00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:28.230
flat, the cats would have pushed


00:29:28.240 --> 00:29:29.669
everything off the edge by now.


00:29:29.679 --> 00:29:31.269
>> Yes.


00:29:31.279 --> 00:29:31.750
>> Yes,


00:29:31.760 --> 00:29:33.430
>> that's the other one. But um


00:29:33.440 --> 00:29:33.990
>> Oh god.


00:29:34.000 --> 00:29:35.990
>> In terms of Artimus,


00:29:36.000 --> 00:29:38.389
at the end of the day, we know it


00:29:38.399 --> 00:29:41.190
happened because we saw it. You know, I


00:29:41.200 --> 00:29:43.750
was over in Europe at the time and my


00:29:43.760 --> 00:29:46.310
colleagues at UNISQ were happily sharing


00:29:46.320 --> 00:29:47.669
their own little footage of the


00:29:47.679 --> 00:29:49.590
spacecraft that they got from our


00:29:49.600 --> 00:29:52.630
telescopes. They have no reason to lie.


00:29:52.640 --> 00:29:55.110
They have no vested interest in this.


00:29:55.120 --> 00:29:56.230
It's not like they're secretly on the


00:29:56.240 --> 00:29:58.389
payroll of NASA, ignoring the fact that


00:29:58.399 --> 00:30:01.350
if it was faked, Russia and China would


00:30:01.360 --> 00:30:03.750
be racing to tell everybody because that


00:30:03.760 --> 00:30:06.230
would be the best PR victory ever. You


00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:07.269
know, it's the same with the moon


00:30:07.279 --> 00:30:10.149
landings in 1969.


00:30:10.159 --> 00:30:11.830
>> Did anybody really really think that the


00:30:11.840 --> 00:30:13.110
Russians would have stayed quiet if


00:30:13.120 --> 00:30:15.750
there was a sniff of it being faked?


00:30:15.760 --> 00:30:19.190
>> In fact, my great grandmother


00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:21.350
always thought the Apollo landings were


00:30:21.360 --> 00:30:24.549
faked. She She absolutely refused to


00:30:24.559 --> 00:30:25.590
believe it.


00:30:25.600 --> 00:30:27.990
>> But she grew up in an era before flight.


00:30:28.000 --> 00:30:32.389
>> Yeah. So, I can understand why she would


00:30:32.399 --> 00:30:33.669
she would think that, but she just


00:30:33.679 --> 00:30:35.110
thought it was all just some sort of


00:30:35.120 --> 00:30:37.510
publicity stunt, but I don't remember


00:30:37.520 --> 00:30:39.510
what they might have been trying to get


00:30:39.520 --> 00:30:40.389
publicity for


00:30:40.399 --> 00:30:41.669
>> because they beat the Russians. I mean,


00:30:41.679 --> 00:30:42.870
that's what it was to them or beat the


00:30:42.880 --> 00:30:44.789
Soviets as it was then. Have been pulled


00:30:44.799 --> 00:30:45.669
up on that a couple times.


00:30:45.679 --> 00:30:48.389
>> It was definitely a big PR exercise in


00:30:48.399 --> 00:30:49.029
that regard.


00:30:49.039 --> 00:30:51.269
>> I had a fun PhD student who worked with


00:30:51.279 --> 00:30:54.070
me, Jake Clark, Dr. check that out. Um,


00:30:54.080 --> 00:30:55.750
gave a wonderful talk a couple of times


00:30:55.760 --> 00:30:57.269
about


00:30:57.279 --> 00:30:59.909
the moon landings in 1969 and why they


00:30:59.919 --> 00:31:01.029
couldn't have been faked because we


00:31:01.039 --> 00:31:03.909
couldn't afford it. Talking about faking


00:31:03.919 --> 00:31:05.350
it with the technology we had at the


00:31:05.360 --> 00:31:06.549
time would have actually been more


00:31:06.559 --> 00:31:08.789
expensive than going there,


00:31:08.799 --> 00:31:10.789
>> which is fairly compelling for me. I


00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:12.149
mean, there's always a joke that, you


00:31:12.159 --> 00:31:13.590
know, yeah, the moon landings were


00:31:13.600 --> 00:31:14.870
always going to be faked, but they hired


00:31:14.880 --> 00:31:16.389
Stanley Cubri to direct and he was such


00:31:16.399 --> 00:31:17.830
a perfectionist that they demanded that


00:31:17.840 --> 00:31:20.950
they do it on site. Um, which is always


00:31:20.960 --> 00:31:24.950
the old joke. Um, with Artimus 2, there


00:31:24.960 --> 00:31:27.029
is abundant evidence that it really


00:31:27.039 --> 00:31:28.950
happened. Um, you can you could with a


00:31:28.960 --> 00:31:30.710
small telescope or binoculars go outside


00:31:30.720 --> 00:31:32.950
and see the spacecraft. And I mean, you


00:31:32.960 --> 00:31:34.310
can't fake that. It's not like we're


00:31:34.320 --> 00:31:35.750
beaming thoughts into your head and if


00:31:35.760 --> 00:31:37.190
you think we are, you can wear some tin


00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:41.430
foil. That's all good. Um, in terms of


00:31:41.440 --> 00:31:43.430
the argument that the earth is going too


00:31:43.440 --> 00:31:46.149
quick for this thing to catch up, that


00:31:46.159 --> 00:31:49.830
is in the kindest interpretation of it,


00:31:49.840 --> 00:31:51.669
that is


00:31:51.679 --> 00:31:53.669
allowing common sense based on your


00:31:53.679 --> 00:31:55.669
understanding of how day-to-day life


00:31:55.679 --> 00:31:59.350
works interfere with looking at how


00:31:59.360 --> 00:32:01.350
things would move through space. I can


00:32:01.360 --> 00:32:02.950
see why you would get to that. If you


00:32:02.960 --> 00:32:05.190
think about a small child running along


00:32:05.200 --> 00:32:06.630
with a model of Arteimus in their hand


00:32:06.640 --> 00:32:08.630
and a Ferrari driving down the motorway


00:32:08.640 --> 00:32:10.630
or insert other make of car driving down


00:32:10.640 --> 00:32:12.950
the motorway at 100 km an hour, the


00:32:12.960 --> 00:32:14.389
child is not going to catch the thing


00:32:14.399 --> 00:32:16.389
because they're not quick enough. And


00:32:16.399 --> 00:32:18.389
there are limits on how fast a child can


00:32:18.399 --> 00:32:19.990
run and how fast the car can move to do


00:32:20.000 --> 00:32:22.470
with air resistance.


00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:25.430
It's however almost similar to saying,


00:32:25.440 --> 00:32:27.029
you know, I can't throw a ball up in the


00:32:27.039 --> 00:32:29.110
air and catch it because I'm moving at


00:32:29.120 --> 00:32:31.830
over 1,000 km an hour around the Earth.


00:32:31.840 --> 00:32:33.430
So, I'm moving too fast to catch up with


00:32:33.440 --> 00:32:35.909
that ball. Doesn't work like that cuz me


00:32:35.919 --> 00:32:37.590
and the ball are both moving at 1,000


00:32:37.600 --> 00:32:40.470
km/h. And so, it's a relative speed


00:32:40.480 --> 00:32:43.190
between us that matters. The Earth is


00:32:43.200 --> 00:32:45.029
going around the Sun at about 30 km a


00:32:45.039 --> 00:32:47.750
second. That's demonstrably true.


00:32:47.760 --> 00:32:49.909
Arteimus moving in orbit around the


00:32:49.919 --> 00:32:52.950
Earth is moving around the sun at 30 km


00:32:52.960 --> 00:32:55.269
a second with the Earth. It's falling


00:32:55.279 --> 00:32:57.029
with the Earth. So, it's a relative


00:32:57.039 --> 00:32:58.950
speed that matters.


00:32:58.960 --> 00:32:59.350
>> Yeah.


00:32:59.360 --> 00:33:01.590
>> Now, if I went above the Earth onto the


00:33:01.600 --> 00:33:03.990
space station, but instead of orbiting


00:33:04.000 --> 00:33:05.990
the Earth and falling with things, I was


00:33:06.000 --> 00:33:08.870
able to use rockets to stand still or I


00:33:08.880 --> 00:33:11.190
had an an imaginary hovering platform of


00:33:11.200 --> 00:33:13.350
doom that wasn't moving. I'm out of the


00:33:13.360 --> 00:33:15.350
atmosphere. If I threw a ball up in the


00:33:15.360 --> 00:33:17.029
air, it would move away from the Earth


00:33:17.039 --> 00:33:18.230
and the Earth's gravity would slow it


00:33:18.240 --> 00:33:19.509
down and pull it back and it'd fall back


00:33:19.519 --> 00:33:21.190
down to me just the same as how it does


00:33:21.200 --> 00:33:24.870
on the ground. Now, if I was in orbit


00:33:24.880 --> 00:33:26.710
around the Earth and I was stood on the


00:33:26.720 --> 00:33:28.149
International Space Station and I tossed


00:33:28.159 --> 00:33:30.230
the ball upward, it would actually start


00:33:30.240 --> 00:33:31.669
moving on a different orbit around the


00:33:31.679 --> 00:33:33.029
Earth. So, while it would move up away


00:33:33.039 --> 00:33:35.029
from me and it would move down, it would


00:33:35.039 --> 00:33:36.470
be going around the Earth on an orbit


00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:38.070
that takes slightly longer to go around


00:33:38.080 --> 00:33:39.669
the Earth than I do. So, it'd also fall


00:33:39.679 --> 00:33:41.669
behind. And that would look like wind


00:33:41.679 --> 00:33:43.590
resistance, but it's actually just a


00:33:43.600 --> 00:33:45.830
quirk of orbital mechanics in that I've


00:33:45.840 --> 00:33:48.389
put it onto a different orbit. Um,


00:33:48.399 --> 00:33:50.230
because we are both falling at the time


00:33:50.240 --> 00:33:52.630
I let go of it. So, if we imagine our


00:33:52.640 --> 00:33:54.470
flat earther jumped off a cliff, and I'm


00:33:54.480 --> 00:33:56.230
not encouraging them to, please do not


00:33:56.240 --> 00:33:58.310
do this, but imagine one jumps off a


00:33:58.320 --> 00:34:00.549
cliff while holding one of the shortputs


00:34:00.559 --> 00:34:02.389
from the previous answer without it


00:34:02.399 --> 00:34:04.710
being on a bungee cord, and they let go


00:34:04.720 --> 00:34:06.870
of the shortput. The shortput will fall


00:34:06.880 --> 00:34:08.950
with them at the same speed.


00:34:08.960 --> 00:34:10.629
It won't move away from them and come


00:34:10.639 --> 00:34:12.790
back. It will accelerate downwards in


00:34:12.800 --> 00:34:14.790
exactly the same way that they do. And


00:34:14.800 --> 00:34:17.349
they'll only diverge once air resistance


00:34:17.359 --> 00:34:19.510
takes effect depending on which of them


00:34:19.520 --> 00:34:21.510
feels more air resistance.


00:34:21.520 --> 00:34:23.589
>> It's the it's the Galileo experiment,


00:34:23.599 --> 00:34:23.990
isn't it?


00:34:24.000 --> 00:34:25.430
>> So, if you're on the space station and


00:34:25.440 --> 00:34:26.950
you throw a tennis ball up in the air,


00:34:26.960 --> 00:34:28.470
you're both actually falling, but you've


00:34:28.480 --> 00:34:29.669
changed the speed of the tennis ball's


00:34:29.679 --> 00:34:31.510
falling so it'll move away from you and


00:34:31.520 --> 00:34:33.589
not appear to come back because you're


00:34:33.599 --> 00:34:36.149
both still falling. The reason all this


00:34:36.159 --> 00:34:37.829
is relevant to Arteimus is Arteimus


00:34:37.839 --> 00:34:40.310
boosted off towards the moon at a speed


00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:42.389
that was not greater than the escape


00:34:42.399 --> 00:34:44.710
velocity from the earth was a speed that


00:34:44.720 --> 00:34:46.869
was high enough to get to the moon and


00:34:46.879 --> 00:34:48.470
the moon stayed it around and flung it


00:34:48.480 --> 00:34:50.389
back towards the earth but then it fell


00:34:50.399 --> 00:34:53.190
towards the earth under earth's gravity


00:34:53.200 --> 00:34:56.310
moving with insufficient sideward speed


00:34:56.320 --> 00:34:57.829
that as it fell towards the earth it


00:34:57.839 --> 00:34:59.910
would miss us. it instead was going to


00:34:59.920 --> 00:35:01.109
hit us and they controlled it with


00:35:01.119 --> 00:35:02.630
rockets and stuff so that it entered in


00:35:02.640 --> 00:35:04.150
a controlled rather than uncontrolled


00:35:04.160 --> 00:35:05.670
fashion.


00:35:05.680 --> 00:35:07.109
>> What matters is not the speed the


00:35:07.119 --> 00:35:08.790
earth's moving around the sun or the


00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:10.470
speed the sun's moving around our galaxy


00:35:10.480 --> 00:35:11.990
or the speed that the galaxy's moving


00:35:12.000 --> 00:35:14.710
through space. All that matters is the


00:35:14.720 --> 00:35:16.069
difference in speed between the Earth


00:35:16.079 --> 00:35:17.430
and the object cuz they're moving


00:35:17.440 --> 00:35:20.310
together. This thing's speed was at no


00:35:20.320 --> 00:35:22.230
time greater than the escape velocity of


00:35:22.240 --> 00:35:24.710
the Earth. So, it could never fall away


00:35:24.720 --> 00:35:26.069
from the Earth and never come back. it


00:35:26.079 --> 00:35:27.430
was always going to go up and then come


00:35:27.440 --> 00:35:29.990
down again, unless they use rockets to


00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:31.430
boost it into an orbit around the moon


00:35:31.440 --> 00:35:33.430
to shed some of that energy, which they


00:35:33.440 --> 00:35:34.950
didn't. They instead slingshoted around


00:35:34.960 --> 00:35:37.829
the moon to come back. All of that is


00:35:37.839 --> 00:35:39.750
perfectly rational and straightforward


00:35:39.760 --> 00:35:42.069
given our understanding of physics, but


00:35:42.079 --> 00:35:44.069
it doesn't necessarily fit your common


00:35:44.079 --> 00:35:46.550
sense because you think about throwing a


00:35:46.560 --> 00:35:48.150
ball out of the window of your car while


00:35:48.160 --> 00:35:49.829
your car's doing 100 km an hour and the


00:35:49.839 --> 00:35:51.109
ball will fall behind you and never


00:35:51.119 --> 00:35:54.150
catch you up. And so a lot of the


00:35:54.160 --> 00:35:57.670
arguments that flat earth believers or


00:35:57.680 --> 00:35:59.190
other people in that kind of situation


00:35:59.200 --> 00:36:02.230
make and making good faith are built on


00:36:02.240 --> 00:36:04.630
a faulty groundwork


00:36:04.640 --> 00:36:07.109
where the common sense of how they


00:36:07.119 --> 00:36:08.790
understand the world to work is not


00:36:08.800 --> 00:36:10.310
applicable to the situation they're


00:36:10.320 --> 00:36:13.270
applying it in. Um and that's true of


00:36:13.280 --> 00:36:15.910
things like you know the oceans are


00:36:15.920 --> 00:36:17.510
flat. If you put a spirit level on them


00:36:17.520 --> 00:36:18.870
they're flat. Well, it's actually that


00:36:18.880 --> 00:36:19.990
they're curved, but they're curved at


00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:21.589
such a small level that locally they


00:36:21.599 --> 00:36:22.950
look flat.


00:36:22.960 --> 00:36:24.550
>> It's a subtle difference, but it's one


00:36:24.560 --> 00:36:25.910
that's easy to miss cuz it's hard to get


00:36:25.920 --> 00:36:28.069
your head around those distances.


00:36:28.079 --> 00:36:29.910
>> In terms of the animations, I just did a


00:36:29.920 --> 00:36:31.670
quick Google search for Artemis


00:36:31.680 --> 00:36:33.829
animation of orbit, and there's some


00:36:33.839 --> 00:36:35.990
beautiful The first hit is a NASA flight


00:36:36.000 --> 00:36:39.109
with an an annotated and animated path.


00:36:39.119 --> 00:36:41.030
There's a few YouTube videos. There is a


00:36:41.040 --> 00:36:43.109
Reddit link with an interactive 3D


00:36:43.119 --> 00:36:45.030
animation.


00:36:45.040 --> 00:36:47.109
There's a lot of little YouTube short


00:36:47.119 --> 00:36:49.589
videos that pop up which are not to


00:36:49.599 --> 00:36:51.670
scale because if you make things to


00:36:51.680 --> 00:36:52.950
scale, the sun and the earth and the


00:36:52.960 --> 00:36:54.950
moon are points that are one pixel


00:36:54.960 --> 00:36:57.990
across and the spaceship is a point that


00:36:58.000 --> 00:36:59.430
is a pixel across as well cuz nothing


00:36:59.440 --> 00:37:02.550
can be smaller than a pixel. Um there is


00:37:02.560 --> 00:37:04.230
a fabulous thing incidentally and I'm


00:37:04.240 --> 00:37:05.670
going to see if I can find it see if


00:37:05.680 --> 00:37:08.390
it's still there.


00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:10.230
There's a this great thing called if the


00:37:10.240 --> 00:37:14.790
moon were only one pixel. Um, it is. I'm


00:37:14.800 --> 00:37:16.150
going to see if the website still works


00:37:16.160 --> 00:37:18.069
cuz this is one of the great things on


00:37:18.079 --> 00:37:19.109
the internet. Here we go. I'm going to


00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:22.150
drop it into the chat window. Um, this


00:37:22.160 --> 00:37:24.390
was an effort somebody made many many


00:37:24.400 --> 00:37:25.910
long long years ago. I'll put this into


00:37:25.920 --> 00:37:27.349
the public chart which never gets used.


00:37:27.359 --> 00:37:30.230
There we go. To visualize the scale of


00:37:30.240 --> 00:37:33.430
the solar system. If you made the moon


00:37:33.440 --> 00:37:35.349
one pixel across, so the Earth will then


00:37:35.359 --> 00:37:38.310
be two or three pixels across. You can


00:37:38.320 --> 00:37:39.990
when you get bored of scrolling, you can


00:37:40.000 --> 00:37:41.430
click play. But if you open that up and


00:37:41.440 --> 00:37:44.069
then you scroll to the right to explore,


00:37:44.079 --> 00:37:46.470
you move along and then you've got the


00:37:46.480 --> 00:37:49.910
scale. One pixel is 3,500 km. So the sun


00:37:49.920 --> 00:37:52.069
is a fairly big blob. And you scroll to


00:37:52.079 --> 00:37:54.390
the right from the sun and you've got a


00:37:54.400 --> 00:37:56.230
distance at the bottom. Scroll to the


00:37:56.240 --> 00:37:57.670
right along way. We've gone 10 million


00:37:57.680 --> 00:37:59.829
km. This is this fabulous visualization


00:37:59.839 --> 00:38:03.670
to let you see how big things are. Oh,


00:38:03.680 --> 00:38:05.430
isn't that clever? How fast light


00:38:05.440 --> 00:38:08.550
travels. You can click and that's slow.


00:38:08.560 --> 00:38:11.829
It's fabulous. Now what you can do is


00:38:11.839 --> 00:38:14.230
you can skip through I need to find


00:38:14.240 --> 00:38:16.150
where there was a way to skip to the


00:38:16.160 --> 00:38:18.550
earth. Yes, at the top skip to the earth


00:38:18.560 --> 00:38:19.990
goes whiz whiz whiz whiz whiz really


00:38:20.000 --> 00:38:21.589
really quick goes past Venus comes to


00:38:21.599 --> 00:38:23.910
the earth and the moon if the moon is


00:38:23.920 --> 00:38:26.150
one pixel the earth is only two or three


00:38:26.160 --> 00:38:28.470
and you get the scale of them 8.3 light


00:38:28.480 --> 00:38:30.790
minutes out from the sun and think how


00:38:30.800 --> 00:38:33.430
far you've got to scroll to get there.


00:38:33.440 --> 00:38:34.790
>> Think with that moon being a single


00:38:34.800 --> 00:38:37.510
pixel how far it is from the earth. This


00:38:37.520 --> 00:38:39.270
is why none of those animations have


00:38:39.280 --> 00:38:41.990
things to scale because you wouldn't see


00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:43.510
the spacecraft. You wouldn't see the


00:38:43.520 --> 00:38:44.550
Earth and the Moon. They wouldn't look


00:38:44.560 --> 00:38:46.710
pretty. So, the caution there is that


00:38:46.720 --> 00:38:48.790
the animations that you see, even the


00:38:48.800 --> 00:38:50.550
beautiful NASA ones that show the flight


00:38:50.560 --> 00:38:53.829
path are not to scale and that can be


00:38:53.839 --> 00:38:55.510
misleading.


00:38:55.520 --> 00:38:57.910
That can also add to some of the


00:38:57.920 --> 00:38:59.430
arguments that this is fake cuz people


00:38:59.440 --> 00:39:01.430
say, "Well, the Earth and the Moon are


00:39:01.440 --> 00:39:02.390
much smaller than that and they're much


00:39:02.400 --> 00:39:05.190
further apart. That looks wrong." Um, so


00:39:05.200 --> 00:39:07.510
it's worth being explicit that these


00:39:07.520 --> 00:39:10.230
visualizations are definitively not to


00:39:10.240 --> 00:39:12.710
scale. Um, the one incidentally that was


00:39:12.720 --> 00:39:14.950
linked on the Reddit page looks like the


00:39:14.960 --> 00:39:16.470
dots for Earth and Moon actually are


00:39:16.480 --> 00:39:17.750
more to scale. So, I'll just drop that


00:39:17.760 --> 00:39:19.750
one in as well. Um, not sure how this


00:39:19.760 --> 00:39:21.030
works. I've not really played with it,


00:39:21.040 --> 00:39:22.630
but you can drag the orbits around. You


00:39:22.640 --> 00:39:24.470
can move them back and forward in time.


00:39:24.480 --> 00:39:26.069
You can see the in and out of plane


00:39:26.079 --> 00:39:28.870
stuff and you can move the visualization


00:39:28.880 --> 00:39:30.470
around even with the background stars,


00:39:30.480 --> 00:39:32.710
which is quite nice. Um, so that's worth


00:39:32.720 --> 00:39:34.150
a play as well. and that looks a bit


00:39:34.160 --> 00:39:36.470
more to scale and there's lots of things


00:39:36.480 --> 00:39:39.349
you can play with, but fundamentally


00:39:39.359 --> 00:39:41.829
we could see it. The hardest part for me


00:39:41.839 --> 00:39:44.069
about the small number of people who


00:39:44.079 --> 00:39:46.069
have argued that the Atimus mission


00:39:46.079 --> 00:39:48.390
didn't happen is that it's something


00:39:48.400 --> 00:39:50.069
that anybody on the planet could see so


00:39:50.079 --> 00:39:51.349
long as they own binoculars or a


00:39:51.359 --> 00:39:52.630
telescope.


00:39:52.640 --> 00:39:53.589
>> You could just point it somewhere and


00:39:53.599 --> 00:39:55.750
you could see the capsule moving there.


00:39:55.760 --> 00:39:57.349
If you really wanted at any time when


00:39:57.359 --> 00:39:59.750
the moon was above the horizon, you


00:39:59.760 --> 00:40:02.630
could track it round.


00:40:02.640 --> 00:40:04.390
And if you've got good enough gear, you


00:40:04.400 --> 00:40:07.109
can actually look at the moon and see


00:40:07.119 --> 00:40:10.230
the landing positions of some of the


00:40:10.240 --> 00:40:12.310
Apollo if you've got the gear.


00:40:12.320 --> 00:40:13.430
>> If you've got the gear, I mean, that's


00:40:13.440 --> 00:40:14.870
kind of spice satellite level. But what


00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:16.470
you can do if you've got slightly less


00:40:16.480 --> 00:40:21.190
of the gear is bounce laser pulses off


00:40:21.200 --> 00:40:23.109
the retroreflects that the astronauts


00:40:23.119 --> 00:40:25.109
left at those sites and measure the


00:40:25.119 --> 00:40:26.550
distance to the moon and measure its


00:40:26.560 --> 00:40:28.950
recession to an incredible precision.


00:40:28.960 --> 00:40:30.630
And we can only do that because people


00:40:30.640 --> 00:40:33.430
went to the moon.


00:40:33.440 --> 00:40:37.510
Yeah, absolutely. I


00:40:37.520 --> 00:40:39.829
I remember the the day that Neil


00:40:39.839 --> 00:40:42.150
Armstrong stepped on the moon. I was um


00:40:42.160 --> 00:40:46.230
sent home from school. I I I


00:40:46.240 --> 00:40:48.069
it's one of the strongest memories of my


00:40:48.079 --> 00:40:50.550
childhood. I was 7 years old and uh I'll


00:40:50.560 --> 00:40:53.349
never forget it. It was uh quite an


00:40:53.359 --> 00:40:55.990
extraordinary thing in human history.


00:40:56.000 --> 00:40:58.710
>> Inspirational. I mean, I I'm not old


00:40:58.720 --> 00:41:00.230
enough to have ever seen anybody walk on


00:41:00.240 --> 00:41:02.309
the moon. I'm hoping that'll change. But


00:41:02.319 --> 00:41:05.670
the generation of astronomers who are


00:41:05.680 --> 00:41:08.069
15, 20 years older than me, who were old


00:41:08.079 --> 00:41:09.750
enough to see the moon landings and take


00:41:09.760 --> 00:41:12.470
them in, so many people were inspired to


00:41:12.480 --> 00:41:14.710
become scientists and engineers by that.


00:41:14.720 --> 00:41:18.069
We got a whole generation of people


00:41:18.079 --> 00:41:19.750
across the sciences, across the


00:41:19.760 --> 00:41:21.829
engineering subjects that changed the


00:41:21.839 --> 00:41:25.030
world who were all inspired by seeing


00:41:25.040 --> 00:41:27.829
people walk on the moon. And it's kind


00:41:27.839 --> 00:41:29.510
of exciting to me, even ignoring the


00:41:29.520 --> 00:41:31.349
science, even ignoring the technology,


00:41:31.359 --> 00:41:32.630
that we're going to get that experience


00:41:32.640 --> 00:41:34.150
again in the coming years. If we go back


00:41:34.160 --> 00:41:35.270
there, there'll be a whole new


00:41:35.280 --> 00:41:37.190
generation who will change the world.


00:41:37.200 --> 00:41:38.950
All inspired by those people touching


00:41:38.960 --> 00:41:41.109
down and seeing it happen.


00:41:41.119 --> 00:41:43.670
>> Yes. Yes. So I was very lucky to meet


00:41:43.680 --> 00:41:46.470
one of them, Buzz Aldrin um some years


00:41:46.480 --> 00:41:49.750
ago came here because they built a right


00:41:49.760 --> 00:41:52.470
flyer at a place called Naramine just up


00:41:52.480 --> 00:41:54.390
the road from here 40 kilometers away


00:41:54.400 --> 00:41:57.030
and they took it out for a fly and he


00:41:57.040 --> 00:41:59.990
came for the occasion uh and gave a


00:42:00.000 --> 00:42:02.470
wonderful speech and uh a handful of us


00:42:02.480 --> 00:42:03.910
in the media got to interview him


00:42:03.920 --> 00:42:07.190
afterwards in a in a hanger at the same


00:42:07.200 --> 00:42:09.109
time as a helicopter decided to take


00:42:09.119 --> 00:42:09.510
off.


00:42:09.520 --> 00:42:11.589
>> Yeah, that sounds about right. He


00:42:11.599 --> 00:42:13.750
famously, you know what? You just you


00:42:13.760 --> 00:42:14.550
just go with it.


00:42:14.560 --> 00:42:16.470
>> Well, he very famously gave very short


00:42:16.480 --> 00:42:18.069
shrift to people who told him that he'd


00:42:18.079 --> 00:42:19.430
not been to the moon.


00:42:19.440 --> 00:42:21.030
>> Oh, I know.


00:42:21.040 --> 00:42:23.270
>> Uh yeah, I did actually raise that


00:42:23.280 --> 00:42:25.510
question, but gee, it was such an


00:42:25.520 --> 00:42:27.910
interesting answer.


00:42:27.920 --> 00:42:31.430
>> Yeah, fabulous. Um Paul, great question.


00:42:31.440 --> 00:42:35.510
Really enjoyed that one. And I


00:42:35.520 --> 00:42:37.829
>> I can understand your frustration, but


00:42:37.839 --> 00:42:39.829
um maybe just avoid those Facebook


00:42:39.839 --> 00:42:41.109
pages.


00:42:41.119 --> 00:42:43.270
Uh because you can't you just can't save


00:42:43.280 --> 00:42:45.510
them, my friend. Uh but good to hear


00:42:45.520 --> 00:42:47.109
from you. Uh if you've got questions for


00:42:47.119 --> 00:42:48.710
us, please send them in. Uh you can do


00:42:48.720 --> 00:42:50.230
that via our website, spacen


00:42:50.240 --> 00:42:53.829
nutspodcast.com or spacenuts.io.


00:42:53.839 --> 00:42:56.230
You can also visit us on social media.


00:42:56.240 --> 00:42:57.670
We've got the official Spacenuts


00:42:57.680 --> 00:43:00.630
Facebook page and the official uh what's


00:43:00.640 --> 00:43:03.510
the Instagram page. Uh we've also got


00:43:03.520 --> 00:43:06.630
the user group on Facebook. um the


00:43:06.640 --> 00:43:10.950
podcast uh group uh which is all it's a


00:43:10.960 --> 00:43:13.109
lot of fun. It's where people who listen


00:43:13.119 --> 00:43:15.190
get together, swap photos of stuff


00:43:15.200 --> 00:43:17.990
they've taken in space and uh ask


00:43:18.000 --> 00:43:20.870
questions and uh it is a really good


00:43:20.880 --> 00:43:23.589
group. So the Space Nuts podcast group


00:43:23.599 --> 00:43:26.630
on Facebook very much worth uh joining


00:43:26.640 --> 00:43:29.190
that one as well and hope you'll join us


00:43:29.200 --> 00:43:31.109
again real soon. And and thank you to


00:43:31.119 --> 00:43:33.270
Johnny her for filling in for Fred for


00:43:33.280 --> 00:43:35.430
the last month or so. It's been


00:43:35.440 --> 00:43:37.750
fantastic and hopefully we can get that


00:43:37.760 --> 00:43:39.510
uh photography special off the ground


00:43:39.520 --> 00:43:41.349
and get you back and have a chat about


00:43:41.359 --> 00:43:43.349
astrophotography, Jonty. That would be a


00:43:43.359 --> 00:43:43.910
real good one.


00:43:43.920 --> 00:43:46.390
>> Fingers crossed. That would be awesome.


00:43:46.400 --> 00:43:48.150
>> Yeah. All right. Catch you soon. Thank


00:43:48.160 --> 00:43:48.870
you so much.


00:43:48.880 --> 00:43:50.950
>> Later. Take care. Thank you very much.


00:43:50.960 --> 00:43:52.550
>> Professor Jonty Horner, professor of


00:43:52.560 --> 00:43:54.150
astrophysics at the University of


00:43:54.160 --> 00:43:56.150
Southern Queensland, filling in for


00:43:56.160 --> 00:43:59.430
Fred. Fred should be back uh next week


00:43:59.440 --> 00:44:01.829
or later this week. I can't I can't get


00:44:01.839 --> 00:44:03.829
my head around when it'll be. It's a


00:44:03.839 --> 00:44:06.710
time slip thing. Uh but uh yeah, thanks


00:44:06.720 --> 00:44:08.710
to Jonty for filling in and thanks to


00:44:08.720 --> 00:44:10.470
Hugh in the studio who couldn't be with


00:44:10.480 --> 00:44:14.390
us today because he's fake. Boom boom.


00:44:14.400 --> 00:44:15.990
And from me, Andrew Dunley, thanks for


00:44:16.000 --> 00:44:17.349
your company. We'll see you on the next


00:44:17.359 --> 00:44:20.069
episode of Space Nuts. Bye-bye.


00:44:20.079 --> 00:44:21.030
>> Space Nuts.


00:44:21.040 --> 00:44:23.109
>> You've been listening to the Space Nuts


00:44:23.119 --> 00:44:25.430
podcast


00:44:25.440 --> 00:44:28.390
>> available at Apple Podcasts, Spotify,


00:44:28.400 --> 00:44:31.030
iHeart Radio, or your favorite podcast


00:44:31.040 --> 00:44:33.430
player. You can also stream on demand at


00:44:33.440 --> 00:44:36.309
byes.com. This has been another quality


00:44:36.319 --> 00:44:40.760
podcast production from byes.com.