Shocker (1989) Review

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[SPEAKER_01]: Hello, movie lovers.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking at the show.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So today I have my good friend Jason from It's not that bad podcast.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We're here to talk about shopper.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And this was one of my favorite films growing up and things like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So let's go ahead and let's get into it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to go with the nostalgia review first and then go and break it down for the modern day.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I like we normally do.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I hope you guys enjoy this.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And hey Jason, welcome back to the show.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Hey man, how's it going?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I am so freaking stoked for this episode.

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[SPEAKER_00]: See, I feel like you went easy on me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The last couple of times I've been on this show because you know, anyone who's listening to it's not that bad knows that I kind of live in bad movie world.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And now that past couple of times I've been here, we've talked about heat.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We've talked about the departed and those are ridiculous to good movies.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not used to watching ridiculous and good movies.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So I still remember, like, home here.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: You're in my world now.

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[SPEAKER_01]: No, okay, but you know what though I love just hurrying my brain off sometimes and just watch an hour on 40 minute movie without having to really dive in deep on something and just to quote my friends podcast, it is what it is you get what you get when it comes down the West Craven you get what you get with the writing the direction the style and things like that so you get to turn your brain off for about an hour some more minutes and just enjoy what West has created.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, does this movie hold up on non-estaturically through a modern day I?

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[SPEAKER_01]: We're just going to find out after we get them doing a breakdown.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, you're right, normally I actually do good movies, but this time I decided to go in your warehouse and take a movie off your shelf and dust it off a little bit and like, ah, shocker.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Let's go ahead and do that because I haven't seen that movie since I was a kid.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I just don't have any experience.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Funny thing is that, yeah, when you talk about a good movie, you're like, oh, this movie came out of it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It was awesome.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It was pretty cool.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And that's kind of where the conversation ends.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The minute the film tends to hit that green tomato road on where unrotting tomatoes.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You sit there and go, huh?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And you find yourself having a much more...

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[SPEAKER_00]: full discussion about films that didn't quite live up to expectations.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We were recently released our 200th episode over on it's not that bad, where we covered the entire 365 days trilogy on Netflix.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Don't ever do that to yourself.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But the funny thing is, it spawned one of the best conversations we've ever had on the show because there's so much to talk about.

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[SPEAKER_01]: That's one of the best things about reviewing something at a lower score because you, like you said, you can actually say, okay, that didn't really pin out the way that they had in the writings room because here's the thing what might be good on the paper might not actually be a good and adapted onto the screen.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, it could be good on paper, but once it gets plastered on the screen, it doesn't flow out like it should.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But it's good to have those conversations of like what work, what didn't work, and have that subjective conversation of like, well, it worked for me.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, cool.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad it worked for you.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But let me tell you why, you know, X, Y and C didn't work for me.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why I love doing stuff like that, too.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I find that the critics have a weird scale when it comes to genre fiction.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, more often than not, something that would, you know, take a look at a book store.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it just falls under fiction, then it's going to be for the masses, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: The many get into science fiction and horror.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There seems to be a sliding scale and I don't know if critics really know how to

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[SPEAKER_00]: properly review horror and science fiction.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The two kind of get treated the same way.

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[SPEAKER_00]: People who get it are going to get it and they're going to love it for exactly what it is.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And people who don't don't know what to properly expect.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I love science fiction.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I will jump into it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: action film, no matter what.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I can appreciate all of it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: My reading the science fiction, most of my general watching his science fiction and specular fiction, I love the genre.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Even for horror, I find sometimes the campier the better.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like I don't know if I would jump into

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, a hostile kind of mood or a or a saw kind of mood.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Get me into that Friday the 13th Nightmare on Elm Street kind of vibe.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm along for the ride.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's because, you know, those are the films that were there when I grew up.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm here with me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I still remember the one horror film that freaked me the F out when I would watch it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Cause the A, the age I watched it,

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[SPEAKER_00]: that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I've seen that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I've got a great film because it lived more in voodoo and it lived in this the possibilities.

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[SPEAKER_00]: This wasn't a serial killer film.

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[SPEAKER_00]: This was very, very atmospheric dealing with Haitian voodoo and the the seeing and I'm just just well right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The scene where Duke gets buried alive and it's from that point of view.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, oh my god, this is so creepy.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It each me out for the longest time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You see, I think it's also to the realism behind it as well because of how being a close to home it is with people can actually practice Roodoo, versus it being something, you know, like Chuck E. Come back and, you know, someone's sold being possessed by a doll.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, no, a big giant guy with the goalie mask.

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[SPEAKER_00]: No one's going to believe that's ever real, but when you think about the first Friday the 13th film, when it wasn't like the big unstoppable Jason Voorhees, when it was a bit more grounded and a reasonable thought of reality.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's where Friday the 13th started to wear it ended up.

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[SPEAKER_00]: kind of you look at the journey of Sharknado because it started out as being like you typical being movie and then the next thing you know you got David Hasselhoff and everyone else on the planet jumping in on the Sharknado fun.

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[SPEAKER_00]: This one, this one I watched it again just before recording this actually and I was surprised and like I love the concept and what West Craven was trying to create.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Does it work?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yes, we'll find out.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But I love the concept and the potential franchise that he could have made out of this.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I agree he had a lot of potential with this movie and you know he tried to create something different outside a nightmare on straight and even denied.

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[SPEAKER_01]: doing another nightmare and arm street movie before doing this one, I think he wanted to go ahead and make this movie.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, I think some people said, oh, it's too close to home too much on the nose.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It sounds, of course, pinker is kind of like Freddy Cooper, but in the different way, stuff like that too.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, there's mixed reactions from it, but I know that you have the scores for us, the tomato meter goes as far as people are thinking about it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I've got the full breakdown, Alah, it's not that bad stuff.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So let me run through the numbers for you here and give you a decent wide view of how this film is viewed by both the audience and the critics over at Rotten Tomatoes that has a tomatometer of 30% any popcorn meter of 32% so not much difference there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But then it gets different.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Over at IMDB, it sits at 5.5 stars under 10 for a 55% score.

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[SPEAKER_00]: At Metacritic, it sits at 51.

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[SPEAKER_00]: At Letterbox, it's 2.8 stars at a 5 for a 56% score, which is the same as the movie database.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And now I recognize the movie database.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It kind of is the more generous of your critic sites, but still take all those numbers together.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And what we like to call the aggravated aggregate, you're looking at a 46.6% score, the 30 Tomatometer really does kind of line up with my theory that critics don't know how to properly review horror films.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The 56 kind of feels like that's the horror genre fans getting the very fact that West Craven's name is attached to this almost feels like it instant automatic plus 40% right there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I agree and also to Robert, don't forget we also have people from the 1980s at all.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They don't know how to turn their brains off just enjoy a film without it being so critical.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, because you're not expecting cinema, you're expecting easy dialogue, one lineers, over the top characters.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You're not expecting a deep dive into anything.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It is all that it is.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Think about 1989, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Not only are you tapping into the horror genre, because of course, you know, West Graven, that just screams like, come and watch me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If you're a horror fan, you see West Graven attached.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to go watch it, but this also dives into the heavy metal community.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like a lot of films that that time did.

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[SPEAKER_00]: you go back to a Nightmare on Elm Street part three, Dream Warriors, Dawkins theme song for that movie is like one of the best horror theme songs from the 80s, even with Friday the 13th part 6 and you had Alice Cooper doing the man behind the mask, of course those are great songs, but here not only do you have right off the bat of this film,

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[SPEAKER_00]: The the opening song is from a super group called the dudes of wrath and listen to who is in this band that they put together for this on lead vocals you have legendary songwriter Desmond child and the one and only Paul Stanley from kiss, but also.

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[SPEAKER_00]: in this band, Vivian Campbell, currently with deaf leopard, Rudy Sarzo from quiet riot and like legendary bass player into himself.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Tommy Lee on drums, you also back up vocals for Michael Anthony of Van Halen and King Roberts, who not only his Alice Cooper's guitarist around that time, but is in this film.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So he's crazy.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, anyone who watched, now we're back in the 80s, you see King Robert, who's just a mountain of a man and made every single guitar that he ever played looked like the tiniest guitar ever.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He was almost made to be in horror films.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Agreed.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, just seeing the heavy metal out of the 80s and stuff like that, because I'm a huge fan of Alice Cooper.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I only, and I think it's because of this movie that I became, became an Ellis Cooper fan, but I'm also a fan of Iron Maiden and also deaf leopard and stuff like that and all this originated from this movie.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, because I like the fact that I'm moving was able to introduce me to bands that I never heard of as a kid and just do a whole entire filmography, thanks to my uncle who will taught me hard rock and hard rock because I grew up on 60 to 50s and 60s music for my mom and then from there I progress from 70s to 80s with my uncle and then from 90s to 1000s on my own stuff.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I pretty much went on ahead and did my own own figuring out things on what I liked.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, as we were talking to it before, we actually recorded this podcast and had go on it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The whole reason why I was initially interested in this film we back in the day was because, of course, mega-deathed a cover of Alice Cooper's no more Mr. Nice guy.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's actually, to my opinion, the quintessential cover of that saw, mega-deathed, that's a good job on that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But you also had,

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[SPEAKER_00]: a gui pop on the soundtrack and dangerous toys, you know, and there's a song in this movie called Sword and Stone.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I remember hearing a bootleg recording from Paul Stanley doing it live and it says like this song, this is the song and you go back and watch it and you remember

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[SPEAKER_00]: This had so many different audiences that was playing to.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So that's where you can see where that 56% and 55% comes from are from people of that era and that in that age, looking back at that movie fondly because it hit probably a bunch of there, their likes, their genres of you will.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Right, and so my question is this.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I know we talked about it, and it's logically behind the scenes, but how do you feel about this moving just logically?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Where do you stand on it?

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[SPEAKER_01]: How did you find out about this moving?

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[SPEAKER_01]: You already talked about what got you interested in it, but what else got you into this?

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[SPEAKER_00]: You keep in mind, you know, in real life, you know, outside of the podcast world, I am a video editor, and even back then I was interested in television production.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So the entire idea of a villain, who was able to, you know, put themselves into a television and transmit themselves electronically,

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[SPEAKER_01]: I agree with you because it's something of original something authentic that we haven't seen before where you actually have someone coming out of the damn TV.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what got me interested in it as a kid because here's the thing I remember as a kid watching the watching it on the TV spots because you didn't know there was no YouTube back in the 80s so I remember watching this and I'm like being entertained and just felt threatened because this man that's bigger than I am comes through the TV and that can kill you and like I told my mom I'm like I want to see this and she's like no

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then finally I rented it at Blockbuster and I seen it like that, but I just couldn't imagine how it would look like on the big screen because that has to be something that has to be horrifying to actually see in theirs back in those days.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, even if you go back and I'm really good at myself on this one, if you remember the old Spider-Man and his amazing friends cartoon, from the early 80s and anyone who'd like

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[SPEAKER_00]: actually pretty darn cool.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's Saturday morning cartoons vibe.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Those episodes are actually on Disney plus right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But there was an episode in Spider-Man and his amazing friends where there was a villain who got himself, there was able to put the superhero's, the three of them into these different video games.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So Shocker kind of pulled a little bit from that storyline as well.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I can definitely see how West is like, okay, I want to go in and pull away from nightmare and arm street and do this and have inspiration behind spider man and pull on that and then put what everybody else is entertained with within those days because everybody's if you think about it, everybody's stuck watching TV in the 80s, they're not going out, they're not doing anything and we're getting into the ending on how I think that the ending.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And how why it ends the way it does, but I think it's like in the words of Jim Carrey, somebody has to kill the babysitter from the cable guy.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I also think, and I'm going to put this out there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I have a feeling that this film is probably a little bit more influential than people are probably going to give it credit for.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I remember on it's not that bad covered a film called Stay Tune, it was released in 1992.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I remember that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we're John Ritter and Pandora were sucked into like this cable network from Hell and found themselves kind of going through all these TV shows.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It was a little UHF, but also had the idea of being sucked into the TV and into the TV shows that are designed to try to kill you.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You have to think that maybe possibly and maybe even, you know, one of those great minds think of like kind of things.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You could see where Shocker may have been in influence on a film like stay tuned.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I can definitely see that as well, because here's the thing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't for shocker.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We wouldn't have stay tuned because that isn't.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So it's paying homage to that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: While also doing something different, because John Redder's character makes a deal with the devil and then the devil sells them this big cable package and he gets this big satellite and gets sucked into the TV.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I like how they manage to pull something from that and made their own thing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that's actually one of my favorite movies of John Redder, so I have from problem child.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But still, I like that movie.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'd be good on randomators, but I love it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I do like stuff in my face with popcorn and turn my brain off and just enjoy something.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I like it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Aren't you on Netflix for that?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh yeah, it's like going through the five dollar bin of Walmart and you never know what you're going to get out of that five dollar bin.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm this bargain bins like you mentioned like renting this a blockbuster and I remember like, you know, you rent the seven movies for seven days kind of thing you just like book your week and all you just sit in front of the TV.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But I remember never wanting to skip through the trailers at the beginning of the VHS team right you get the trailers and then of course you get the FBI warning because God forbid you actually got with the movie.

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[SPEAKER_00]: everyone did.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We all know that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But the funny thing is it's like even if I go to the theaters today, I don't want to miss the trailer.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's something so intriguing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, but watching a really, really good trailer.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Some trailers can clearly ruin the film.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But then you get some trailers and it just sucks you in and then no matter how good or bad the movie is, the trailer brought you in.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's a movie out there right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's funny we were talking about Netflix.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's a movie that's out there right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's gonna have a very limited theatrical run starting October 10th.

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[SPEAKER_00]: called a house of dynamite and the trailer.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The first trailer for that is arguably one of the best trailers I have seen in a long, long time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, wow.

18:26.141 --> 18:35.204
[SPEAKER_01]: Because the one for me that stands out for me is weapons because I was not expecting what I expected out of weapons and they didn't really give a lot away in the trailer.

18:35.384 --> 18:38.225
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's where I have to say weapons is probably my favorite trailer

18:40.826 --> 18:53.551
[SPEAKER_00]: I would put House of Dynamite's first trailer right up against it because it gives you just enough of the vibe that you're going into you know what you're going into right, but you don't really know what you're going into and directed by Katherine Bigelow.

18:53.571 --> 18:56.852
[SPEAKER_00]: I am so looking forward to this film.

18:56.872 --> 18:58.353
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

18:59.793 --> 19:01.134
[SPEAKER_01]: So let's see here.

19:01.214 --> 19:02.934
[SPEAKER_01]: Now that we talked about this nostalgia.

19:02.954 --> 19:06.896
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, so what do you give it as your score for nostalgia?

19:08.915 --> 19:10.256
[SPEAKER_00]: for an nostalgia edit 10.

19:10.436 --> 19:12.837
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm probably going to give it about a 4.5.

19:13.718 --> 19:25.463
[SPEAKER_00]: And I say that because I know that there are, I don't want to say problematic things with the film, but there are questions I have about the plot that never properly got answered.

19:25.723 --> 19:31.566
[SPEAKER_00]: And I would actually take a look at this film and want to completely re-edit it and end it a different way.

19:32.684 --> 19:38.487
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so that's not, that's nostalgicly like stuff in your face younger you question.

19:38.607 --> 19:51.854
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so for me younger me who's like, maybe eight or nine years old watching this, I'm enjoying the heart rock, I'm enjoying as Cooper, I'm enjoying no more Mr nice guy is thinking going to drop my lungs.

19:52.835 --> 19:55.096
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm also intrigued with horse pinker.

19:55.156 --> 19:56.636
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm intrigued with all that.

19:57.276 --> 20:00.237
[SPEAKER_01]: I gotta get this at least an eight for me, nostalgicly.

20:00.257 --> 20:02.297
[SPEAKER_01]: And no one can even, yeah.

20:02.737 --> 20:04.418
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe four point five might be a little bit harsh.

20:04.538 --> 20:07.298
[SPEAKER_00]: It might be, you know, looking to Southically probably about a six.

20:07.778 --> 20:15.940
[SPEAKER_00]: And I say that knowing that this comes out kind of in around that part of the 13 night marital industry, you know, kind of era.

20:16.420 --> 20:20.321
[SPEAKER_00]: So you're obviously going to be looking at Horace Pinker and going,

20:20.901 --> 20:29.647
[SPEAKER_00]: Cool, okay, but doesn't compare to Freddie and Jason and Leatherface and Pin had in all those other iconic characters at a horror films.

20:30.347 --> 20:31.768
[SPEAKER_00]: Does it match up to that?

20:32.329 --> 20:35.331
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe maybe not, so probably, but maybe a six out of ten then.

20:36.286 --> 20:39.047
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, I can give it to, I can see why you would give a six out of 10.

20:39.087 --> 20:47.330
[SPEAKER_01]: Not only that, even at a hard convention, you don't see a horse pinker anywhere for a, uh, for a cosplay or anything.

20:47.350 --> 20:49.091
[SPEAKER_01]: I have a hard eye on.

20:49.771 --> 20:51.272
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't see a horse pinker.

20:51.292 --> 20:52.892
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no.

20:52.952 --> 20:59.795
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like literally take a big or bright orange jumpsuit and grab the nearest checkered flag from a race track and wrap it around your waist.

20:59.835 --> 21:04.697
[SPEAKER_00]: And then met, there you go, your horse pinker all of a sudden and then shave your head and then put some marks on your head.

21:05.466 --> 21:07.568
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.

21:07.808 --> 21:09.169
[SPEAKER_01]: No one's even harder this movie.

21:09.509 --> 21:13.432
[SPEAKER_01]: I've talked to a lot of my friends, I'm like, I know that this movie exists.

21:14.734 --> 21:17.256
[SPEAKER_01]: And I also know it exists too, because I just bought this in 4K.

21:17.896 --> 21:20.178
[SPEAKER_00]: But we heard when you gave me the list of films.

21:20.618 --> 21:22.039
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, hey, I love to have you back on the show.

21:22.079 --> 21:22.800
[SPEAKER_00]: And here's the list of films.

21:23.380 --> 21:25.722
[SPEAKER_00]: I see, like, shockered, literally jumped out of the email.

21:25.742 --> 21:27.624
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, I found my jam.

21:27.704 --> 21:28.104
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go.

21:29.327 --> 21:30.848
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm glad that you wanted to do this.

21:30.988 --> 21:34.071
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I said, this has been on the back burner for a long time, like two years.

21:34.591 --> 21:41.496
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's glad to actually check this one off my list up from a bucket list for hard movies for to review a journal October.

21:42.096 --> 21:44.158
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm happy to have you back on for this.

21:45.139 --> 21:45.299
[SPEAKER_01]: So.

21:46.058 --> 21:51.100
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's go in with a little bit of trivia, and then we'll go on ahead and go into the whole and tie a breakdown.

21:51.881 --> 22:00.725
[SPEAKER_01]: So Shocker was submitted 13 times to the MPAA, who demanded extensive editing just so West Craving could get the already rated on the film.

22:01.693 --> 22:16.515
[SPEAKER_01]: At the mid west release, Chalkar was greened up in 1,999 theaters, the movie was really released along with virus as a double feature for DVD by TGG direct on.

22:17.036 --> 22:17.576
[SPEAKER_01]: September 23, 2015.

22:19.137 --> 22:27.459
[SPEAKER_01]: The movie also included the Westcrab in horror collection, DVD, set of wine with the serpent in the rainbow, like you mentioned.

22:27.639 --> 22:30.860
[SPEAKER_01]: And the people under the stairs, the collection was released on September 15, 2009.

22:31.841 --> 22:34.542
[SPEAKER_01]: And then of course, Shrakow was released on

22:39.058 --> 22:46.700
[SPEAKER_01]: So there you go, and this movie is not stream streaming anywhere, so you're gonna have to run it on YouTube or buy it at show, show factory.

22:46.720 --> 22:50.221
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't have renting it and buying it, so there you go.

22:50.661 --> 22:52.141
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, Jason, grab your remote.

22:52.461 --> 22:56.363
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't have to TV because tonight, horse pinkers come in through the airwaves.

22:56.663 --> 22:58.043
[SPEAKER_03]: No more Mr. Nice.

22:59.093 --> 23:03.756
[SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty cool for Hedic Puzzle who feels out of electrician school in the B-Discount.

23:04.357 --> 23:05.497
[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking soccer.

23:05.637 --> 23:09.700
[SPEAKER_01]: The movie that said, one of a serial killer became one with Hedic Puzzle.

23:09.760 --> 23:12.142
[SPEAKER_01]: Before Netflix was ever a thing.

23:12.842 --> 23:16.325
[SPEAKER_01]: So plug in, hold tight, and try not to get electricated.

23:16.605 --> 23:19.127
[SPEAKER_01]: Because we're diving into West Craven's soccer.

23:20.334 --> 23:20.895
[SPEAKER_01]: seen one.

23:20.915 --> 23:24.780
[SPEAKER_01]: A news report shows a victim being pulled away on a stretcher.

23:25.281 --> 23:32.250
[SPEAKER_01]: It was it's revealed that a serial killer having killed over 30 people terrified of him and it could be in by on the street.

23:33.171 --> 23:34.032
[SPEAKER_01]: And they wouldn't even know.

23:35.262 --> 23:39.123
[SPEAKER_01]: And at this point, they don't even know who horse pinker is or anything like that.

23:39.143 --> 23:44.484
[SPEAKER_01]: And I like, I like this as well where you have were introduced to Jonathan for the very first time.

23:45.104 --> 24:00.488
[SPEAKER_01]: And you're seeing how involved everybody is in this in this Los Angeles town where this one woman was this one girl is is there and he and Jonathan's trying to get something to drink or something.

24:05.088 --> 24:05.490
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

24:06.254 --> 24:08.164
[SPEAKER_01]: And he had, like, well, turn the TV off.

24:08.305 --> 24:09.129
[SPEAKER_01]: You won't have a problem.

24:10.460 --> 24:25.367
[SPEAKER_00]: the entire idea of because they make it feel like it's a smaller town, not not necessarily a big city, but not necessarily like a very very small town, but kind of like that middle size kind of the kind of town that would have a big enough college team that, of course, it gets TV coverage.

24:25.387 --> 24:36.732
[SPEAKER_00]: The fact that it would actually have their own local TV station shows you that it's at least a medium sized town, but the fact that they're talking about how the entire city is completely on edge.

24:37.432 --> 24:59.932
[SPEAKER_00]: You go back to stories about the zodiac killer and the son of Sam and just the existential dread that people were feeling as, you know, story after story after story of the horrible things that they did, you know, just permeates the entire community, you know, go watch the movie somewhere Sam and it kind of focuses on people and how they cope.

25:00.918 --> 25:08.365
[SPEAKER_00]: living in that era and trying to go about their own lives, knowing that the next time they go out, they could be the next son of Sam Victim.

25:08.725 --> 25:16.032
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'd like that it kind of sets the mood for the community, even though, you know, eventually it's like, but no one else really feels that way.

25:16.092 --> 25:19.575
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's almost like it's an only thing that's said on television.

25:20.444 --> 25:38.554
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, but it goes into show like the media and how media hypes up stuff to scare people though to well you have the other people like well screw that I'm just going to live my life and if whatever happens to me happens to me and that's it and that's way Jonathan is he's like well if you don't like it just turn it off you don't have to worry about this.

25:39.534 --> 25:40.795
[SPEAKER_01]: You just turn off the TV.

25:41.696 --> 25:48.582
[SPEAKER_01]: And she's hypersensitive to the fact of like, well, I'm like, you don't play football this way in the way you think because this is real life.

25:48.622 --> 25:50.323
[SPEAKER_01]: This is what's happening right now.

25:51.003 --> 25:55.787
[SPEAKER_01]: And like you mentioned, this is like a song with Sam kind of vibe where she's afraid.

25:55.907 --> 25:57.228
[SPEAKER_01]: She's afraid for her own life.

25:57.809 --> 26:04.794
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's easy to actually get wrapped in your own emotions as a guy because we can actually take care of ourselves versus a woman who

26:05.875 --> 26:32.252
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I can't really take care of themselves in this sense because they don't have the same body mass as we do, and so she feels like she's paralyzed because of this person, and Jonathan is kind of like insensitive to her feelings and stuff, even though it's supposed to like be a little fun back and forth thing, but I just wish that they would have actually put a little bit more thought into the town being scared, because I felt more scared for the town and scream than I do for this town that we have right here.

26:32.792 --> 26:34.333
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I want to.

26:35.219 --> 26:37.860
[SPEAKER_00]: basically tip my hat to Peter Berg, plays Jonathan this.

26:38.360 --> 26:40.741
[SPEAKER_00]: He is a fantastic director.

26:41.641 --> 26:48.744
[SPEAKER_00]: Very bad things is like, you know, one of our favorite films in this house, actor, maybe not so much, but fantastic director.

26:49.324 --> 26:56.687
[SPEAKER_00]: I liked that they kind of built up the relationship between Jonathan and Allison in that very playful kind of way.

26:57.007 --> 26:57.947
[SPEAKER_00]: For those of you who were thinking

27:01.275 --> 27:03.697
[SPEAKER_00]: Salaciousness of some horror films back in the day.

27:03.717 --> 27:07.321
[SPEAKER_00]: This is actually a fairly clean film.

27:07.381 --> 27:15.009
[SPEAKER_00]: When you take a look back at it in hindsight and go, yes, there's blood and there's killing and all that, but there's not really anything salacious.

27:15.049 --> 27:20.574
[SPEAKER_00]: This is actually probably the most wholesome couples in horror movies in the 80s.

27:21.967 --> 27:29.873
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree because now we're going to get into this other scene where Austin's playing football and he's practicing his for the football.

27:29.913 --> 27:31.274
[SPEAKER_01]: Be big football game.

27:31.294 --> 27:32.175
[SPEAKER_01]: That's going to be happening.

27:33.036 --> 27:40.001
[SPEAKER_01]: Then he sees Alice in and he winds up catching the football, but he ponds, I'm running and banging into the field goal.

27:41.522 --> 27:45.064
[SPEAKER_01]: And Rhino is he's like standing over him.

27:45.124 --> 27:47.265
[SPEAKER_01]: The coach is over there, smack talking him.

27:47.285 --> 27:51.047
[SPEAKER_01]: And then Allison comes over there.

27:51.067 --> 27:52.947
[SPEAKER_01]: He goes, do I know you?

27:53.548 --> 27:59.711
[SPEAKER_01]: And he says, Lee and there, she goes, she goes, yeah, you said you were going to bear or I was going to have your unborn children.

28:00.011 --> 28:01.231
[SPEAKER_01]: Just, I'll, did you?

28:01.251 --> 28:03.352
[SPEAKER_01]: And she goes, not yet.

28:03.372 --> 28:07.434
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he happens to say, well, good.

28:07.494 --> 28:08.755
[SPEAKER_01]: I just want to respect you first.

28:11.417 --> 28:15.061
[SPEAKER_00]: also the cheesiest dialogue between any couple.

28:15.201 --> 28:16.642
[SPEAKER_00]: Only surpassed by

28:17.817 --> 28:37.032
[SPEAKER_00]: Anakin Skywalker and Padme Amadala in Star Wars episode two with the cheeses of cheese love dialogue, but I mean if that's kind of the way that they are like they kind of play with each other a little bit it's not really established so much, but I didn't mind it little cheesy, but then you see the next scene with them kind of walking together.

28:37.072 --> 28:41.775
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, okay, they're just playing with each other and I didn't mind that, but you're establishing Jonathan.

28:42.717 --> 29:01.497
[SPEAKER_00]: as this fantastic football player even though the coach kind of has to get them in line to the point of later on when they're like you know and Jonathan Parker star football player has even said that despite everything he's playing the video they were playing the football games like really because you haven't really established him as the best football player at this point.

29:02.198 --> 29:06.640
[SPEAKER_01]: You really have, we only see one practice thing for the football, for football.

29:06.660 --> 29:14.583
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's it, we haven't seen one single football match to establish the fact that he's a best MVP football player, part of this university.

29:14.603 --> 29:17.524
[SPEAKER_01]: Another thing, too, is the university don't even feel like a university.

29:18.065 --> 29:21.886
[SPEAKER_01]: It feels like a community college, which I always thought it was a community college.

29:21.966 --> 29:23.287
[SPEAKER_01]: I've been telling my research on it.

29:23.327 --> 29:25.508
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, wait, does this supposed to be university?

29:26.468 --> 29:28.089
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't even feel like a university.

29:30.785 --> 29:31.165
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

29:31.205 --> 29:42.971
[SPEAKER_01]: This feels like a high school game that they're trying to prepare for versus a high versus a university level game, even their budget looks for to be a university level kind of practice.

29:43.591 --> 29:46.533
[SPEAKER_01]: But I like how the coaches like kind of the nurse are distracted right now.

29:46.773 --> 29:47.313
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a woman

29:51.180 --> 30:08.348
[SPEAKER_01]: But I do like the back and forth of this hard ass coach trying to keep him in line and keep him focused on a game that's not going to happen because we don't get one, but I do believe that he is a coach and trying to help Jonathan to focus in and dial in to being a football player to get the best out of him.

30:08.789 --> 30:11.150
[SPEAKER_01]: So that part works for me right awards for me.

30:11.822 --> 30:16.524
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, everyone that they've put onto the football team has kind of worked out, right?

30:16.564 --> 30:29.591
[SPEAKER_00]: Because, and we'll eventually get to it down the road when the football team kind of comes into play in things, you establish the camaraderie and the teamwork of the team, the coach.

30:29.731 --> 30:31.772
[SPEAKER_00]: Everyone's all in together.

30:32.372 --> 30:36.855
[SPEAKER_00]: So I like that they built that aspect and it's kind of like a tough love kind of thing as well.

30:36.915 --> 30:39.116
[SPEAKER_00]: So if anyone's going to,

30:40.225 --> 30:43.666
[SPEAKER_00]: be built and trained to be able to handle whatever it is that comes their way.

30:44.126 --> 30:53.468
[SPEAKER_00]: And it also gives Jonathan a bit of an instant support network, because already, like he has lost his mom, he's lost his siblings.

30:53.488 --> 30:57.669
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, his dad is the only one left in the family, he's adopted dad, that's where that way.

30:58.329 --> 31:07.591
[SPEAKER_00]: And he has this support network that's built in, which allows us to be able to reasonably conclude that,

31:10.492 --> 31:27.296
[SPEAKER_00]: He has people there that are going to help him not be an absolute wreck because any normal human being, having lost their entire family, or almost their entire family, to a mass serial killer who is terrorizing the community, should not by any stretch be playing any football game.

31:27.316 --> 31:29.576
[SPEAKER_00]: They should be in a corner in the fetal position.

31:30.157 --> 31:36.378
[SPEAKER_00]: This at least gives us a reasonable reason why he'd be able to play football.

31:36.962 --> 31:47.083
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree because he couldn't end up being turned into like horse pinker, who, who, because don't get, don't get me wrong, you can actually have this childhood drama trauma.

31:47.830 --> 32:07.385
[SPEAKER_01]: The point where he could be a horse pinker going around killing people because of the trauma that he has not to mention psychic after kelp and stuff like that too, but no he his dad gave him the proper tools to be able to help him be a good student and also to get into a university and help guide him.

32:08.005 --> 32:24.596
[SPEAKER_01]: So he's got a good father to actually support him for this support system, but also to like he said he has a good support system even with his friends so he's good at making friends he's good at having a good life established so you make us really love Jonathan as a character.

32:27.280 --> 32:51.683
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like a reverse dexter situation where rather than your adoptive father teaching you how to be a proper serial killer, you have an adopted father that teaches you to not be a serial killer, but everything, everything, all these situations kind of go back to that one Batman comic where it's just the Joker and Batman stay in there and the Joker's like you're one bad day away from becoming me.

32:52.343 --> 32:54.705
[SPEAKER_00]: That's literally a lot of these dynamics here.

32:54.725 --> 32:55.226
[SPEAKER_00]: The killing joke.

32:55.266 --> 32:55.666
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

32:55.706 --> 32:55.866
[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry.

32:56.106 --> 32:56.967
[SPEAKER_00]: I couldn't remember it.

32:56.987 --> 32:58.749
[SPEAKER_00]: I also I blocked out the animated movie.

32:59.029 --> 33:00.190
[SPEAKER_00]: I just remember that.

33:00.570 --> 33:00.990
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

33:02.211 --> 33:11.259
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, that is so the basis of a lot of these dynamics that you have in horror and serial killer TV and movie show properties.

33:11.619 --> 33:13.521
[SPEAKER_00]: It's literally that one line.

33:13.541 --> 33:15.683
[SPEAKER_00]: You're one bad day away from becoming me.

33:16.123 --> 33:20.046
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think in this situation, you have you have that understanding.

33:21.210 --> 33:26.691
[SPEAKER_00]: Lieutenant Dawn Barker is literally like the Alfred and making sure that Jonathan doesn't become the Joker.

33:27.851 --> 33:28.411
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

33:29.052 --> 33:31.832
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's something that I really love as the support system.

33:31.872 --> 33:32.612
[SPEAKER_01]: I love the characters.

33:32.672 --> 33:35.633
[SPEAKER_01]: I love his father and stuff.

33:36.013 --> 33:42.694
[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, I think only, okay, so after this, like you said, Allison and the Hammer are walking down the street, hand in hand.

33:42.714 --> 33:49.056
[SPEAKER_01]: And the only thing I wish that they would have done was established why he has these psychic abilities

33:51.277 --> 33:51.658
[SPEAKER_04]: Mm-hmm.

33:51.798 --> 33:57.727
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like as soon as he winds up clocking his head, he gets his power of being a psychic.

34:00.011 --> 34:01.193
[SPEAKER_01]: I have psychic abilities.

34:01.808 --> 34:06.189
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the one thing that bugged me the entire time.

34:06.229 --> 34:08.590
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we're watching this for this show.

34:09.030 --> 34:15.132
[SPEAKER_00]: Cause it's like, maybe I'll glean some new insight into this cause it has been a long time since I watched the film.

34:15.432 --> 34:16.853
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm watching like, nope, nope.

34:16.893 --> 34:18.113
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, didn't explain it at all.

34:18.133 --> 34:27.456
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just like, I dream in serial killer tracking for some reason, which would also be a fantastic, you know, serial of the weak kind of thing.

34:29.839 --> 34:42.597
[SPEAKER_00]: They have no, you have no reason why he should have this kind of weird jump into the dream be able to to understand where he is kind of, there's no explanation whatsoever.

34:43.217 --> 34:44.679
[SPEAKER_00]: Not zip, zilch.

34:45.700 --> 34:46.960
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no explanation to the power.

34:47.000 --> 34:49.681
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no, there's no resolution to the power.

34:49.701 --> 34:52.742
[SPEAKER_00]: And it sees me gone away about midway through.

34:52.782 --> 34:54.423
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, oh, yeah, we forgot about that entirely.

34:54.923 --> 35:04.946
[SPEAKER_00]: And the problem is that because the name West Craven is attached to this, anyone who's going to jump into a dream to try and track a serial killer, it's immediately going to drop comparisons to pretty Krueger.

35:05.006 --> 35:06.386
[SPEAKER_00]: And this isn't that.

35:07.347 --> 35:10.668
[SPEAKER_01]: No, because instantly, whenever he has that nightmare, he wakes up.

35:11.552 --> 35:12.693
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a pretty cool group vibes.

35:12.933 --> 35:21.799
[SPEAKER_01]: It's, it's, it's brave and, and, you know, what though he didn't what what didn't want to do part two, no, no, he wanted to get away from nightmare on straight to make something else.

35:22.359 --> 35:24.120
[SPEAKER_01]: And when he did was he made nightmare on straight 2.3.

35:27.263 --> 35:34.309
[SPEAKER_01]: with shocker by using this as a theme, which is like he couldn't get away from nightmare and armstream.

35:34.409 --> 35:36.071
[SPEAKER_01]: He had to put something in there.

35:36.591 --> 35:48.782
[SPEAKER_01]: But I would have thought it would be more fascinating if he had this vision that something is happening while him and Alice are walking versus it being him sleeping.

35:50.607 --> 35:54.650
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like there's no, you wonder what's going on.

35:54.891 --> 36:06.880
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yes, we understand that because of the artwork on the front of the cover of the VHS tape that we all rented from Blackpuster, we recognize that electricity is going to be in there somewhere.

36:07.141 --> 36:18.310
[SPEAKER_00]: So even when they're walking down the street and then they kind of separate a little bit for Jonathan to walk forward, you can see the lights kind of flicker in behind Allison while she's waiting for him to come back and when he turns around, she's gone.

36:18.830 --> 36:20.753
[SPEAKER_00]: you're like, wait, wait, wait, that's an electricity thing.

36:20.773 --> 36:21.273
[SPEAKER_00]: What happened?

36:21.714 --> 36:21.954
[SPEAKER_00]: Nothing.

36:22.014 --> 36:22.495
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a dream.

36:22.815 --> 36:24.096
[SPEAKER_00]: Forget, forget you was on anything.

36:24.117 --> 36:38.494
[SPEAKER_00]: I wish they had taken this ability away from Jonathan, and it was just some kind of, you know, he's adopted father, he's a cop, so maybe by being raised by a copy, has some kind of, not, not,

36:39.654 --> 36:45.217
[SPEAKER_00]: magical mystical ability, but at least an understanding in an inkling of how to read clues.

36:45.517 --> 36:48.839
[SPEAKER_00]: Something other than magical dream power.

36:49.820 --> 36:54.102
[SPEAKER_01]: You see for me, I think it would be better if it's like a paranormal, uh, not paranormal activity.

36:56.608 --> 37:13.278
[SPEAKER_01]: Arnold Destination kind of thing with a permanent mission where you can still have Allison day up you know gone and it's just him by himself in this neighborhood and that's it it's a permanent mission, but he's passed out on the ground in Allison's trying to snap him out of it.

37:14.639 --> 37:24.305
[SPEAKER_01]: When he resensives horse, pinker, he passes out or something that would be a whole lot more fascinating than him having to go to sleep to dream about horse.

37:26.092 --> 37:30.954
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it doesn't make sense as this power whatsoever.

37:30.974 --> 37:40.118
[SPEAKER_00]: I could understand if maybe he was electrocuted somehow, like maybe like during practice, something like that, and that gives him the ability.

37:40.618 --> 37:42.859
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe, sure, okay, because he got shocked.

37:43.480 --> 37:44.760
[SPEAKER_00]: I could live with that.

37:44.800 --> 37:48.502
[SPEAKER_00]: Might be a little cheesy, maybe a little too on the nose, but I could live with that.

37:48.642 --> 37:55.005
[SPEAKER_00]: Just don't give a character an ability, don't explain it, and then abandon it halfway through.

37:55.735 --> 37:56.235
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

37:56.736 --> 38:02.999
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, if this was in today's time, okay, I didn't know up until I watched this isn't a doubt that he was even adopted.

38:03.019 --> 38:04.940
[SPEAKER_01]: The Jonathan was even adopted or anything.

38:05.781 --> 38:20.209
[SPEAKER_01]: But if this was today's time, it would be a two hour long movie because they would actually have to go through the origin story of Jonathan, him being traumatized, him being adopted by his father, and then you get into the shocker theme of the whole entire deal.

38:21.511 --> 38:22.511
[SPEAKER_01]: That's yeah.

38:22.932 --> 38:24.472
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you don't even see the serial killer.

38:24.672 --> 38:28.334
[SPEAKER_01]: You wind up just focusing and dialing and on Jonathan and stuff like that.

38:28.394 --> 38:30.674
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's how I would see it as modern day time.

38:31.415 --> 38:33.335
[SPEAKER_01]: If they did choose to remake this movie.

38:33.856 --> 38:36.997
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, there, there's a property here that can be.

38:38.138 --> 38:45.223
[SPEAKER_00]: redeveloped, rebooted and explored in another film or even in a short series kind of thing.

38:45.463 --> 38:55.709
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I don't understand why my shutter doesn't pick up on some of these older properties and flush them out and kind of redo them the way that they should be done today.

38:55.729 --> 38:58.071
[SPEAKER_00]: Because there is a solid

38:59.012 --> 39:17.795
[SPEAKER_00]: structure to the backstory of this and some of the characters, it just needs to be flushed out, and it needs to be, you can't have your protagonist be literally fantastic at everything, and oh, by the way, has some mystical ability.

39:18.135 --> 39:20.736
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, there's nothing Jonathan can't seemingly

39:27.518 --> 39:28.058
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

39:28.279 --> 39:29.700
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's no vulnerability at all.

39:29.760 --> 39:33.843
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the only vulnerability that you get is when he goes up the stairs.

39:33.923 --> 39:35.724
[SPEAKER_01]: He sees horse for the first time.

39:36.985 --> 39:38.606
[SPEAKER_01]: And it happens to be his mom.

39:40.027 --> 39:42.549
[SPEAKER_01]: And he and she's about to be murdered by force.

39:43.990 --> 39:47.012
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I was someone's up waking him up.

39:49.114 --> 39:49.895
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's it.

39:50.235 --> 39:55.699
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he's shocked by her by his mom and he's like, Oh, I got to go ahead and go and see about my mom.

39:57.415 --> 39:59.977
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's like the only type of vulnerability they actually see.

40:00.417 --> 40:05.241
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's a phone call and it's for him because I would clear that they'd live together and that's fine, right?

40:05.741 --> 40:09.904
[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, one of the first things it says is, is the family okay.

40:10.204 --> 40:15.848
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, um, there wasn't a lot of time from them to tell you exactly what's going on.

40:15.908 --> 40:23.173
[SPEAKER_00]: If that's one of the first things you say, you're a little on the sus side immediately, dude, I wish, like even if you want to give Jonathan

40:25.838 --> 40:33.604
[SPEAKER_00]: And you make him a little bit clueless like there are so many red flags that Jonathan does them surprising and the rest him on the spot.

40:35.866 --> 40:48.335
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree because I was even noticing that like dude, reacting suspect right now, you're going over to a house, even though it's your own parents house and you don't nobody knows that they got murdered besides you.

40:48.355 --> 40:51.478
[SPEAKER_01]: And all of a sudden you just show up.

40:53.190 --> 40:54.051
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

40:54.071 --> 40:54.771
[SPEAKER_01]: That's very suspect.

40:54.791 --> 40:57.192
[SPEAKER_01]: They're going to think they didn't get in on some other serial killer.

40:57.793 --> 40:58.373
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

40:58.493 --> 41:01.915
[SPEAKER_00]: When even on the initial phone call, you're like, you know, is everyone okay?

41:02.496 --> 41:04.397
[SPEAKER_00]: Why wouldn't they be Jonathan?

41:04.417 --> 41:04.517
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

41:05.417 --> 41:05.918
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

41:05.978 --> 41:06.218
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

41:06.258 --> 41:07.559
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, Jonathan.

41:08.499 --> 41:08.719
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

41:08.959 --> 41:12.021
[SPEAKER_01]: He couldn't just say, well, I'm busy being Alison right now.

41:12.441 --> 41:13.462
[SPEAKER_01]: I just got done doing that.

41:13.782 --> 41:16.244
[SPEAKER_01]: And I fell asleep and I had a dream about my mom dying.

41:16.264 --> 41:17.905
[SPEAKER_01]: I was just trying to check on the family.

41:18.840 --> 41:22.521
[SPEAKER_01]: But even that, that doesn't mean he can't do anything about that.

41:22.601 --> 41:24.722
[SPEAKER_01]: He can't make up anything.

41:25.162 --> 41:28.183
[SPEAKER_01]: If I was him, I was just like, look, it was just a dream.

41:28.323 --> 41:31.524
[SPEAKER_01]: If this happened, let me just let it be, just a dream.

41:31.984 --> 41:36.105
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he gets to call from his dad saying, hey, look, your mom died.

41:37.225 --> 41:39.346
[SPEAKER_01]: And then that's when the realization goes, oh, snap.

41:39.686 --> 41:41.066
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't just dream this.

41:41.126 --> 41:42.227
[SPEAKER_01]: This actually happened.

41:42.247 --> 41:44.347
[SPEAKER_01]: This is me having a vision of this.

41:46.717 --> 41:50.519
[SPEAKER_01]: I would say would have actually done that, but Jonathan is very suspect everywhere he goes.

41:51.279 --> 41:55.881
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Jonathan puts two and two together, conveniently, quickly for everything.

41:56.602 --> 41:59.783
[SPEAKER_01]: And this movie is very fast-paced, you know?

42:00.303 --> 42:05.546
[SPEAKER_01]: Because then after you get that happen, then Jonathan's like, I know who it is.

42:05.566 --> 42:07.507
[SPEAKER_01]: I know what this guy looks like.

42:07.807 --> 42:08.727
[SPEAKER_01]: He's just got it flushed me.

42:09.708 --> 42:14.330
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's like, and then you see the camera's cutting to his dad,

42:15.374 --> 42:32.806
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm talking and Jonathan's over there punched the TV guy for being, you know, for interfering with their conversation and not given privacy, which he has every right to do, but at the same time, is that's going to arrest them for assaulting somebody.

42:32.826 --> 42:33.887
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

42:35.048 --> 42:37.049
[SPEAKER_01]: But his dad's in the state of shock.

42:37.089 --> 42:39.951
[SPEAKER_01]: He's not really saying anything to him or anything.

42:40.952 --> 42:41.092
[SPEAKER_01]: And.

42:42.038 --> 42:48.179
[SPEAKER_00]: I do like that scene where, you know, Jonathan's kind of telling him what happened in his dream, and that he saw this killer.

42:48.500 --> 42:52.380
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's okay, you know, Jonathan just had a dream and it just happens to be exactly what happened.

42:52.921 --> 42:57.902
[SPEAKER_00]: Him kind of talking it out with his adopted dad, right, who happens to be someone who was working the case.

42:58.242 --> 43:04.323
[SPEAKER_00]: So as he's describing Horace, you know, you had to hit a limp and all this kind of stuff.

43:04.343 --> 43:04.903
[SPEAKER_00]: And he was ball.

43:05.203 --> 43:09.124
[SPEAKER_00]: And you can see the reaction on Michael Murphy who played the 10-Don Parker.

43:12.305 --> 43:26.808
[SPEAKER_00]: basically getting, you know, he's having Horace Pinker profiled by his son who saw him in a dream, but the fact that he was able to pick up on things that happened before the murders actually happened.

43:26.828 --> 43:30.549
[SPEAKER_00]: So he was able to identify the logo on the van.

43:30.929 --> 43:37.311
[SPEAKER_00]: Basically able to figure out exactly who the killer is, something that Lieutenant Parker couldn't have done.

43:38.091 --> 43:40.792
[SPEAKER_00]: So all of a sudden now you have an adopted father,

43:42.952 --> 43:55.067
[SPEAKER_00]: through the descriptions that he was given from his son going on an act of faith and bringing a small force to kind of track down horse picker based on what Jonathan says.

43:56.790 --> 43:57.050
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

43:57.110 --> 43:59.512
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he just automatically just believes his son.

44:00.312 --> 44:03.874
[SPEAKER_01]: Because that's the son and doesn't question him or anything.

44:04.975 --> 44:11.018
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, we as an audience sees the quick sight of the of the van on the logo.

44:11.598 --> 44:12.499
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it disappears.

44:12.519 --> 44:15.441
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, OK, that was kind of fast and abrupt.

44:16.141 --> 44:22.444
[SPEAKER_01]: because instead of it just being shot differently, they just like, okay, we're just going to show the logo.

44:22.684 --> 44:23.604
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, there's the logo.

44:23.784 --> 44:24.004
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

44:24.044 --> 44:24.564
[SPEAKER_01]: Now it's gone.

44:25.265 --> 44:31.507
[SPEAKER_01]: And then after that, it goes next day and they can show the munchout of him, of course.

44:32.668 --> 44:34.528
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like the dude looks like Mr. Clean.

44:34.808 --> 44:38.770
[SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't look anything like what he's described and depicted.

44:39.630 --> 44:41.211
[SPEAKER_01]: As is, I'm like, congratulations.

44:41.231 --> 44:43.652
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you made Mr. Clean the serial killer?

44:44.509 --> 44:49.968
[SPEAKER_01]: because this guy don't even look like anything like horse pink or something.

44:49.988 --> 44:50.048
[SPEAKER_01]: Bye.

44:51.603 --> 44:55.746
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, thank God he's bald because like bald guys got to be the the easiest thing to profile.

44:56.667 --> 45:02.150
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a TV blu-where out there where they show like a character sketch of someone who's wanted.

45:02.571 --> 45:10.656
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's the it's like a great three's drawing of a phase and the the anchors trying to keep a straight face and trying to describe it.

45:10.696 --> 45:12.998
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just like this feels like that.

45:13.038 --> 45:16.000
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's a little bit closer to what horse banker would look like.

45:16.660 --> 45:41.560
[SPEAKER_00]: But if we talk about the exposition dumps from John Taschen, all of this, no one is going to say in a news report that the entire thing was brought about by the lieutenant son who had visions of a serial killer, like I get the John Taschen's part getting paid by the word and that's okay, but that's that's a whole lot of, you know,

45:41.720 --> 45:46.503
[SPEAKER_00]: You have ruined an active investigation at this point, John Tasch with your exposition.

45:47.303 --> 45:48.564
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, but that's the same time though.

45:48.604 --> 45:50.705
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, who the hell is leaking this information?

45:50.725 --> 45:50.805
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

45:51.906 --> 45:55.488
[SPEAKER_01]: Stuff like that too, because no one even talked to the reporters.

45:55.828 --> 45:57.349
[SPEAKER_01]: No cops talked to the reporters.

45:57.930 --> 46:01.392
[SPEAKER_01]: The only time that a reporter was near them was when they were having that moment.

46:01.772 --> 46:05.034
[SPEAKER_01]: But even then, that's not enough to actually go on.

46:06.204 --> 46:10.787
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not someone's looking some information somewhere and it doesn't make sense to me.

46:11.287 --> 46:13.668
[SPEAKER_00]: The 1980s had phone books.

46:13.708 --> 46:24.214
[SPEAKER_00]: So immediately the minute you say the person's name, it's like, I'm gonna walk over to the phone booth down the corner and I'm gonna flip through a few pages and I'm gonna find me a victim because that's literally what they did.

46:25.034 --> 46:34.140
[SPEAKER_00]: No one should have had that information on a newscast and yes, it does kind of set up how Pinker does,

46:35.160 --> 46:42.130
[SPEAKER_00]: try to stop Jonathan the same way he tried to stop Lieutenant Parker by going after the person that he loves being Allison.

46:42.791 --> 46:49.520
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, and also too before that we actually have police going over the horses place.

46:51.145 --> 46:51.585
[SPEAKER_01]: as well.

46:52.646 --> 46:55.168
[SPEAKER_01]: And this is also where John and Chris, I can feel him.

46:55.508 --> 46:55.988
[SPEAKER_01]: He's somewhere.

46:56.008 --> 46:56.528
[SPEAKER_01]: He's here.

46:57.249 --> 47:00.251
[SPEAKER_01]: And his does like, look, we don't have a warrant.

47:00.391 --> 47:01.391
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have anything.

47:01.451 --> 47:02.992
[SPEAKER_01]: We're just going to get in the warrant.

47:03.553 --> 47:05.354
[SPEAKER_01]: He's like, Dad, I'm telling you, he's here.

47:05.994 --> 47:06.695
[SPEAKER_01]: I have a feeling.

47:07.415 --> 47:08.596
[SPEAKER_01]: I had a feeling too when I was 16.

47:08.736 --> 47:10.797
[SPEAKER_01]: It was called masturbation.

47:11.238 --> 47:14.299
[SPEAKER_01]: But you know, but that doesn't mean that

47:21.025 --> 47:24.167
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, isn't this, um, isn't this door unlocked or something?

47:24.227 --> 47:30.910
[SPEAKER_01]: Because yeah, they want, they want that breaking the door and they go in and you see the TV sets there.

47:30.930 --> 47:32.430
[SPEAKER_01]: I love how this looks.

47:32.510 --> 47:38.213
[SPEAKER_01]: It looks small on the inside outside and then it looks big on the inside.

47:39.212 --> 47:41.193
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it looks bigger than what it's supposed to be.

47:41.633 --> 47:54.177
[SPEAKER_00]: But if you actually watch what's on the TVs, it actually really almost accents, you know, accents, horrors, painters, personality, and that's because everything that's on there, it's horrible news footage.

47:54.197 --> 47:57.558
[SPEAKER_00]: There's like walls of skulls that are being shown on this.

47:57.618 --> 48:01.980
[SPEAKER_00]: There's like riots and atrocities on every single TV.

48:02.320 --> 48:05.061
[SPEAKER_00]: No wonder horrors, pinker is a horrible human being.

48:05.601 --> 48:18.992
[SPEAKER_00]: Like if that's what he's watching, if he is, if his entire hatred of humanity, which really that seems to be the driving factor to Horace Pinker, he wants to kill the world.

48:19.052 --> 48:22.815
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no rhyme or reason to why he kills people of musties trying to stop them.

48:22.895 --> 48:29.080
[SPEAKER_00]: So that kind of, you know, profiles why he went after Parker's family, that makes sense.

48:30.041 --> 48:31.142
[SPEAKER_00]: But everything else,

48:32.072 --> 48:51.921
[SPEAKER_00]: The random people that he's going after and killing, if this is what he's taking in on all of these TVs and surrounding himself, it's almost like a clockwork orange thing where you're strapped in the chair and your eyeballs are pried open and you're witnessing atrocities over and over and over again, that's gonna mess with his brain.

48:52.421 --> 48:55.463
[SPEAKER_00]: This isn't aspect I wish they had developed a bit more.

48:55.963 --> 48:58.864
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is Horace Pinker, a serial killer?

48:59.004 --> 49:00.545
[SPEAKER_00]: Why is he the way he is?

49:01.185 --> 49:05.348
[SPEAKER_00]: and if the entire, oh my god, I don't know, go off on this one here.

49:05.789 --> 49:21.001
[SPEAKER_00]: If the entire premise is that television is this weird secret, not secret, but like television is ruined humanity and Horace Pinker is ruining himself by watching all the horrible things that's being done on the news.

49:21.541 --> 49:23.443
[SPEAKER_00]: This isn't aspect that should have been

49:24.318 --> 49:27.161
[SPEAKER_00]: built in more to develop horse bankers character.

49:27.181 --> 49:27.842
[SPEAKER_00]: I agree.

49:28.503 --> 49:31.026
[SPEAKER_00]: None of this mystical thing went over none of this.

49:31.606 --> 49:34.710
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm bad because I'm bad and don't ask reasons why.

49:34.730 --> 49:36.892
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm a reason right exactly.

49:37.213 --> 49:37.733
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

49:38.134 --> 49:40.036
[SPEAKER_00]: But even before they go into it, right?

49:40.256 --> 49:41.798
[SPEAKER_00]: That whole that we don't have a warrant thing.

49:42.419 --> 49:52.972
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that it's Lieutenant Parker that's like no, no, no, the window was broken and we're just investigating a potential robbery because he's got skin in the game.

49:53.032 --> 49:55.134
[SPEAKER_00]: His family was killed by this guy.

49:55.615 --> 49:57.697
[SPEAKER_00]: That part I love that personal.

49:58.378 --> 49:59.239
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

49:59.820 --> 50:06.187
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a reason, like regardless of the idea that Jonathan has weird mystical dreams or whatever, right?

50:06.828 --> 50:08.830
[SPEAKER_00]: Lieutenant Parker's got skin in the game.

50:08.870 --> 50:11.834
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's almost looking for any single reason possible.

50:11.994 --> 50:12.294
[SPEAKER_00]: Why?

50:13.750 --> 50:18.496
[SPEAKER_00]: If this potentially could be the guy, he's not going to let the lack of a warrant stop him.

50:18.796 --> 50:22.701
[SPEAKER_00]: He's going to have an excuse to be able and a plausible excuse there.

50:22.721 --> 50:25.184
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, okay, I broke a window.

50:25.204 --> 50:29.008
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, we're just trying to help a local business here and investigate it in a potential robbery.

50:29.949 --> 50:32.432
[SPEAKER_00]: That at least gives them a reason to get in there.

50:33.035 --> 50:55.855
[SPEAKER_01]: Also too, besides that being in person because he lost his wife, his kids, and stuff like that, he's also going off the fact that he loves his son Jonathan too and not to believe him, even though he might not believe in the supernatural thing, but he wants to be there for him and therefore he's like, well, I'm not going to believe my son because he's my son.

50:55.875 --> 50:59.078
[SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't have any reason for me not to trust him.

50:59.733 --> 50:59.993
[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.

51:00.193 --> 51:02.535
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's what I'm getting from him though, too.

51:02.935 --> 51:11.860
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's personal, but not only personal to him, but it's also personal to his own son, but his love of the son for the love of the son is the why he's also doing it, too.

51:12.500 --> 51:15.062
[SPEAKER_01]: So I love that aspect of it.

51:15.522 --> 51:17.943
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I love what Michael Murphy did with his character.

51:18.424 --> 51:25.428
[SPEAKER_00]: Like for some of the dialogue in this and some of the back stories not really having a reason whatsoever.

51:26.548 --> 51:34.155
[SPEAKER_00]: I always thought the Lieutenant Parker felt very realistic in this, and you could understand his motives and his reasons for doing everything that he does.

51:35.708 --> 51:36.168
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

51:36.188 --> 51:37.289
[SPEAKER_01]: I definitely agree.

51:37.369 --> 51:38.429
[SPEAKER_01]: His motives are right there.

51:38.949 --> 51:43.371
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything is flushed out with his character to the point where you don't need an origin story.

51:43.411 --> 51:47.013
[SPEAKER_01]: You already get the fact that this guy's seen a lot of crime in his day.

51:47.133 --> 51:49.233
[SPEAKER_01]: He's actually a good club.

51:49.313 --> 51:56.576
[SPEAKER_01]: He's a good father and he loves his wife because we've seen his reaction to his own wife dying.

51:57.117 --> 51:57.897
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah.

51:58.377 --> 52:01.838
[SPEAKER_01]: I love the character development, the characterization of who that character is.

52:02.058 --> 52:10.120
[SPEAKER_01]: And the layer said he gave that character because it could be one layer don't want noted, but to be honest with you, his father's the most fleshed out person on this movie.

52:11.021 --> 52:11.221
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

52:11.301 --> 52:12.081
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, absolutely.

52:12.121 --> 52:13.601
[SPEAKER_00]: Michael Morver did a fantastic job.

52:14.601 --> 52:27.065
[SPEAKER_01]: But going into the place and then you don't see him, but he's behind the secret shelf watching as a creeper would do in the shadows, watching to spray.

52:28.116 --> 52:39.080
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he winds up getting the cop and pulling him in and then he winds up putting on the cops off it and then going on overhead and killing the two cops.

52:40.021 --> 52:55.167
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, look, I get your cycle path associated path and stuff, but you didn't really have to kill together to cops outside you're already outside all you have to do is go the other direction on the property and you're good to go.

52:58.936 --> 53:06.871
[SPEAKER_01]: In the way he thinks he's like, well, that's what these two are just as much as I pray than the other the other cop I killed so I'm going to go and go after them too.

53:07.835 --> 53:32.272
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but again, this is why I kind of wish that they kind of developed horse pinker a little bit more because if he is driven to kill humanity from because humanity can't clearly police itself, you know, from all from everything that he's been watching on TV, then okay, then maybe he's, you know, he's ready to kill no matter what and he's taking every opportunity that he can, you know, and it's not like

53:33.012 --> 53:36.193
[SPEAKER_00]: They never played horse as dumb or stupid.

53:36.253 --> 53:38.894
[SPEAKER_00]: He was just driven whatever drove him.

53:38.934 --> 53:42.235
[SPEAKER_00]: They didn't necessarily explain, but he was very driven and very methodical.

53:42.995 --> 53:45.996
[SPEAKER_00]: I wish, and again, this is kind of everything in hindsight.

53:46.336 --> 53:54.338
[SPEAKER_00]: So he's got this secret room in his TV repair shop with the VHS of horror collection apparently playing on every TV.

53:55.538 --> 54:02.141
[SPEAKER_00]: I wish we had a scene where even though he's in a secret room, there's cameras in the top.

54:02.381 --> 54:20.490
[SPEAKER_00]: So if he was watching the cops on cameras, therefore reinforcing the entire TV is the actual bad guy kind of vibe that you could put into something like this, that would have added so much more because everything feels like it's in the screen at that point.

54:23.095 --> 54:36.469
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree because just as they're watching if he's watching them on the screen, he's also watching the news on the screen and everything else everything as seen on TV and stuff and makes it more that more reality in a sense.

54:37.442 --> 54:37.622
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

54:37.702 --> 54:41.285
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's almost like he gets to be in the TV himself.

54:41.305 --> 54:59.997
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I'm sure he would probably one of those guys who, if he, if he had recorded everything that he'd go back and watch and watch everything that he's done, there's so much potential for a character like Horace Pinker because, but it was always scratched on the surface and muddied with making the protagonist that much better.

55:00.837 --> 55:01.358
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

55:01.378 --> 55:04.460
[SPEAKER_01]: And then after that happens, then we have

55:05.965 --> 55:22.733
[SPEAKER_01]: They kind of, kind of then this father comes out, they see the cops dead, and then we get into that whole entire scene where the news reports are talking about the visions that we talked about, and then, you know, my first initial thought was, well, why didn't his father put.

55:23.760 --> 55:40.384
[SPEAKER_01]: um, any kind of cops around the house where he lives at, because instead on the news that uh, his talked about how much quantum was involved with the case and the visions that he's having and he also identified the killer.

55:40.624 --> 55:44.986
[SPEAKER_01]: Hello, you need to put tabs on your son to protect him.

55:46.862 --> 55:50.207
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's the one thing I can say that I don't didn't like about the lieutenant.

55:50.247 --> 56:02.865
[SPEAKER_01]: He didn't even go ahead and put tabs on his son depth back to him in Allison and then you also have horse who's also reading in this newspaper and also looking at the picture of Jonathan.

56:04.147 --> 56:20.377
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what's funny, there's a way to make this a really, really good, almost like a logical horror film and what you do is you make Jonathan a reporter or work in the local new station.

56:21.297 --> 56:21.577
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

56:21.777 --> 56:32.081
[SPEAKER_00]: So the fact that Jonathan represents the news that that is driving Horace, it's being with all the horrible things he's watching on the news.

56:32.742 --> 56:34.983
[SPEAKER_00]: Then you have again, you have a raise on debt there.

56:36.703 --> 56:37.083
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

56:37.444 --> 56:41.025
[SPEAKER_01]: That would actually flush him out a lot better than him just being a star football player.

56:41.605 --> 56:42.326
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, stuff.

56:42.446 --> 56:43.526
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it would be a whole lot better.

56:43.566 --> 56:48.328
[SPEAKER_01]: Make him older, make him work for this news thing and make him cover it.

56:49.698 --> 56:50.859
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it would be a whole lot better.

56:51.499 --> 57:00.084
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and he can still have the adoptive father who's with the police, and then you have this connection where it's like he's trying to get information of his father on the investigation, so we can do his report on it.

57:00.504 --> 57:05.867
[SPEAKER_00]: Meanwhile, the father is trying to figure out what Jonathan knows from all of his investigative reporting.

57:05.907 --> 57:07.508
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my God, this would have been such a better film.

57:08.289 --> 57:08.729
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

57:09.890 --> 57:15.313
[SPEAKER_01]: So now we're getting into the whole thing where however is other for, okay.

57:19.688 --> 57:24.430
[SPEAKER_01]: So however, his father, other foster son, Jonathan develops a strange kid.

57:24.590 --> 57:28.932
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, prior to the it to his execution, I'm going through my notes real quick.

57:29.333 --> 57:29.653
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

57:29.673 --> 57:35.055
[SPEAKER_01]: We're in which several police officers are brutally murdered, pink, my finger one by one.

57:35.155 --> 57:36.316
[SPEAKER_01]: Pinker escapes and targets

57:39.297 --> 57:58.330
[SPEAKER_01]: Repribution, another dream leads Parker in the police to pinker in the midst of a kidnapping This time just as he's about to kill Jonathan he has arrested is quickly convicted and sentenced to die in the electric chair So Jonathan's about to leave to go to practice.

57:58.550 --> 58:04.994
[SPEAKER_01]: He's late for practice because of everything that he's dealing with and he said he was still gonna play in the game

58:10.532 --> 58:14.636
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I've been up this game because I want to see this game, but it never happens.

58:15.197 --> 58:21.443
[SPEAKER_01]: And he pulls away and then Alice and also said, hey, look, I know you have to get the practice and stuff.

58:21.883 --> 58:22.924
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll see you at practice.

58:23.545 --> 58:26.948
[SPEAKER_01]: Then course comes in and kills her even though we don't see her.

58:27.429 --> 58:32.954
[SPEAKER_01]: But you get to see her looking back at Jonathan after Jonathan hands her the necklace, but the heart on it.

58:33.735 --> 58:35.615
[SPEAKER_01]: And I just like how she's looking at it.

58:35.655 --> 58:36.876
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm sold on this.

58:36.936 --> 58:38.176
[SPEAKER_01]: This girl loves him.

58:38.696 --> 58:39.076
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.

58:39.536 --> 58:41.057
[SPEAKER_01]: And she goes, I love you Jonathan.

58:41.237 --> 58:45.978
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, this girl, I would put a ring on your finger, not just a heart.

58:46.978 --> 58:49.959
[SPEAKER_01]: Because if you're all the way in like this, you're getting a ring.

58:50.539 --> 58:52.740
[SPEAKER_01]: If, you know what I'm saying, you're supporting me.

58:52.800 --> 58:54.800
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm for the things I love and love things I do.

58:55.220 --> 58:57.081
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, I'm marrying you.

58:57.441 --> 58:58.501
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, you marry that girl.

59:00.575 --> 59:05.177
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I love the fact of what they did with Alice and I'd like that aspect to it.

59:05.698 --> 59:09.940
[SPEAKER_01]: And then finally, you know, Jonathan has another victim.

59:10.920 --> 59:18.924
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, he has his friend Rino to wake him up in the car because now it's nightmare and I'm straight again.

59:18.944 --> 59:23.026
[SPEAKER_01]: And he goes, you remember what to do, right?

59:23.106 --> 59:24.106
[SPEAKER_01]: Because yeah, I do.

59:24.186 --> 59:25.667
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, what the fuck are you supposed to do?

59:29.923 --> 59:48.166
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you realize, oh, he wants him to wake him up like it was Nancy having a nightmare from nightmare in all the street because now he's going up the stairs in this neighborhood that he doesn't know anything about he's hearing screams from upstairs then he sees horse upstairs and everything and then they have that confrontation.

59:49.173 --> 01:00:16.267
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so now and that's the thing, Jonathan once again puts two and two together real quick and figures out oh I can use my treatment track him down and I'm fine with him realizing that he can use the dream there was no reason whatsoever why he's just suspected that he could be able to die in the dream because in that first dream he lived at a horse in order to try to stop him but then went into him like at like some kind of weird.

01:00:16.947 --> 01:00:19.836
[SPEAKER_00]: section, portal, hold, whatever, whatever.

01:00:22.273 --> 01:00:26.354
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no reason why Jonathan just suspect that he could be killed in his dream.

01:00:26.374 --> 01:00:29.014
[SPEAKER_00]: Although I can understand if you don't want to die in your dream or whatever.

01:00:29.034 --> 01:00:30.014
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't want to play that game.

01:00:30.275 --> 01:00:31.715
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe he's on Nightmare and I'm straight too.

01:00:32.375 --> 01:00:44.857
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe the one thing that we didn't talk about though is that as Allison is saying I love you to Jonathan after he's left, she takes that necklace and she kisses it and it's like, please take care of him kind of thing.

01:00:44.877 --> 01:00:47.818
[SPEAKER_00]: Look, she's putting some like magical, like,

01:00:48.438 --> 01:00:50.860
[SPEAKER_00]: power into this necklace that's around her neck.

01:00:50.880 --> 01:00:52.902
[SPEAKER_00]: That's going to become very important down the road.

01:00:53.182 --> 01:00:54.323
[SPEAKER_00]: How does Allison have powers?

01:00:54.383 --> 01:00:54.863
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't know.

01:00:54.943 --> 01:00:58.006
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't ask those questions.

01:00:58.386 --> 01:01:01.288
[SPEAKER_00]: Because love conquers all for whatever reason.

01:01:01.308 --> 01:01:05.572
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I'm thinking, but you know, right, right, love, love television and football.

01:01:05.592 --> 01:01:07.493
[SPEAKER_00]: That's all we're going to talk about in this movie.

01:01:09.675 --> 01:01:09.935
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

01:01:10.696 --> 01:01:10.916
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

01:01:10.936 --> 01:01:15.460
[SPEAKER_00]: So Jonathan figures that he can figure out where this killer is going to be by going into the dream.

01:01:15.700 --> 01:01:16.081
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

01:01:16.161 --> 01:01:16.361
[SPEAKER_00]: Cool.

01:01:16.381 --> 01:01:33.056
[SPEAKER_00]: We've established that we've got that and then then they go to the place where he sees that the killer is going to strike next and then like 15 cops show up for no reason whatsoever to they have him low jacked because in 1989, I don't think you're going to low jack your son on this one.

01:01:33.656 --> 01:01:45.311
[SPEAKER_01]: No, but all of a sudden, now you go ahead and do that to him, when him and Rhino over there, where was the protection that you had when Allison died?

01:01:47.140 --> 01:01:51.324
[SPEAKER_00]: And 99 you ain't got a cell phone to stop off at the pay for one on the corner.

01:01:51.344 --> 01:01:52.665
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, where are you got a quarter?

01:01:52.685 --> 01:01:54.407
[SPEAKER_00]: I got to call the cops and tell where we're going to go.

01:01:54.747 --> 01:01:55.948
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, you're not a cop.

01:01:55.968 --> 01:01:56.929
[SPEAKER_00]: You're a football player.

01:01:56.949 --> 01:01:59.251
[SPEAKER_00]: Not a very good one from what we say at the beginning of the VELP.

01:01:59.291 --> 01:02:00.712
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not going to stop him.

01:02:01.073 --> 01:02:03.335
[SPEAKER_00]: Call your dad the cop and tell him where it's going to be.

01:02:03.695 --> 01:02:05.256
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't make them figure it out.

01:02:05.276 --> 01:02:05.757
[SPEAKER_00]: The upset.

01:02:06.217 --> 01:02:07.018
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my God, there's so.

01:02:07.738 --> 01:02:33.812
[SPEAKER_00]: That needs to be refined in this one because again, I do like this the plot or at least the the idea of the plot, but there's just so many Leaps of logic that are made by the characters in this that it's like everyone knows exactly what's going on It's not that small a town people we know but okay, so for whatever reason someone got a hold of the police and said they're gonna be here

01:02:35.112 --> 01:02:49.941
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, I understand Jonathan's got to get into the game as much as Lieutenant Parker does and then you get to, you know, the chase down and finally you capture horse, you know, we're about 40 minutes into this film and we've been not doing nothing but trying to chase horse through dreams and bullshit luck.

01:02:50.321 --> 01:02:54.623
[SPEAKER_00]: So I was some way, right, and we're halfway through the film.

01:02:54.763 --> 01:03:00.547
[SPEAKER_00]: We still got another half to go, but I don't hate it as much as I'm kind of making fun of it a little bit.

01:03:00.647 --> 01:03:02.548
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't hate it per se, but

01:03:04.174 --> 01:03:07.216
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a whole lot of taking things for granted.

01:03:07.776 --> 01:03:13.079
[SPEAKER_00]: I do love, I love what Camille Cooper brought to Allison.

01:03:13.599 --> 01:03:18.522
[SPEAKER_00]: You have just such a pure spirit in Allison, Camille Cooper.

01:03:18.542 --> 01:03:20.122
[SPEAKER_00]: They're really good.

01:03:20.623 --> 01:03:21.803
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, really, really good.

01:03:21.923 --> 01:03:23.324
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and but that's the thing.

01:03:24.104 --> 01:03:26.726
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not like it's done through like, oh, she's the sex.

01:03:26.966 --> 01:03:28.647
[SPEAKER_00]: No, she is literally

01:03:29.900 --> 01:03:32.942
[SPEAKER_00]: perfect small town girl and love with the football next year.

01:03:33.322 --> 01:03:34.343
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely.

01:03:34.363 --> 01:03:43.629
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but, you know, even remember we see her, I felt really bad because even the coaches like, hey, look, you need to go home.

01:03:44.069 --> 01:03:48.832
[SPEAKER_01]: And this before we actually have that dream sequence that we talked about just now, we go, hey, you need to go home.

01:03:49.352 --> 01:03:50.833
[SPEAKER_01]: Why, you just need to go.

01:03:50.853 --> 01:03:53.675
[SPEAKER_00]: And that was played well.

01:03:53.895 --> 01:03:54.035
[SPEAKER_00]: I was

01:03:56.122 --> 01:04:12.890
[SPEAKER_01]: And my heart sank whenever he sees Allison and then you see the blood on the mirror and everything and stuff is just so chilling it I felt bad for Jonathan then you get the whole tired then you get pulled out of that and you get into the dream sequence of this.

01:04:14.670 --> 01:04:33.482
[SPEAKER_01]: And it just doesn't work and then he throws the horse winds up throwing the woman down the stairs and then you have that like you said you have that whole entire chasing and then then we realize how slick think or is because what does he do he uses a ladder to go across the building.

01:04:35.583 --> 01:04:38.505
[SPEAKER_03]: Get one side to the other and I'm like hot.

01:04:39.015 --> 01:04:45.397
[SPEAKER_01]: Wait, you have a dumb leg, but you magically are able to move perfectly fine on a ladder.

01:04:46.617 --> 01:04:49.378
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that bum leg is is very touching.

01:04:49.418 --> 01:04:50.218
[SPEAKER_00]: Go at that point.

01:04:50.558 --> 01:05:14.327
[SPEAKER_00]: And also you went up the stairs to get to this place or did you go into the building next door, go all the way up to the roof with the ladder draped the ladder across crawl over to the next roof and then go down the stairs on that bum leg because for some reason someone Mike that's the other thing to it's not like Horace knows that Jonathan is tracking him through dreams.

01:05:15.027 --> 01:05:23.557
[SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't, because when you don't, yeah, well, that's another thing though, too, whenever he says, you know what to do when he says that to Rhino, wake him up.

01:05:24.157 --> 01:05:27.741
[SPEAKER_01]: We didn't establish the fact that he could get killed in his visions or his drinks.

01:05:28.842 --> 01:05:33.728
[SPEAKER_01]: So why does he think that he has to wake up or anything before something happens?

01:05:34.528 --> 01:05:34.748
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:05:35.349 --> 01:05:45.120
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I like the fact that, you know, you have this knocked down drag out fight between horse and Jonathan on the second roof, because I, I'll buy Jonathan can make that jump.

01:05:45.301 --> 01:05:46.142
[SPEAKER_00]: Jonathan makes sense.

01:05:46.422 --> 01:05:54.191
[SPEAKER_00]: Horses climbing across that ladder in decent time, but that bump like, but that's something a lot of set up though for her horse to be able to set up that ladder.

01:05:54.511 --> 01:05:54.732
[SPEAKER_01]: And then.

01:05:56.742 --> 01:06:05.410
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to set up my escape route in the most ass-in-ine, complicated way on the off chance that there's some Rando guy tracking me through dreams.

01:06:06.511 --> 01:06:09.794
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but there's got to be an easier way.

01:06:09.834 --> 01:06:11.936
[SPEAKER_00]: There's got to be an easier way out of this, right?

01:06:12.236 --> 01:06:12.657
[SPEAKER_00]: At that point,

01:06:13.617 --> 01:06:16.779
[SPEAKER_00]: What's I'm going to guy wire from this, the roof down to the street?

01:06:16.799 --> 01:06:27.848
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure that's a way faster way to get it out of there, especially we got a bum like, but the fact that these establishes that Horace is a much better fighter than Jonathan, like, he's just raw energy.

01:06:27.868 --> 01:06:30.349
[SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, Sir Jonathan's got strength and Jonathan's got speed.

01:06:30.950 --> 01:06:34.312
[SPEAKER_00]: Horace is a ruthless fighter and killer.

01:06:34.673 --> 01:06:41.217
[SPEAKER_00]: So the fact that it's not like Jonathan actually stopped him, the only thing that stopped Horace was a bunch of cops showing up on the second

01:06:42.560 --> 01:06:46.463
[SPEAKER_00]: You did not want Jonathan to be victorious.

01:06:46.683 --> 01:06:51.686
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the one point where I sit there and say no, they wrote that scene right, Horace would have killed him.

01:06:52.366 --> 01:06:52.646
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

01:06:53.007 --> 01:06:54.668
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that they should have done it like that.

01:06:55.628 --> 01:06:57.049
[SPEAKER_01]: Because get this.

01:06:57.089 --> 01:06:59.751
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you see Horace, why is that body slamming him?

01:06:59.811 --> 01:07:04.834
[SPEAKER_01]: You see him pushing against his glass top window on top of the roof.

01:07:05.455 --> 01:07:08.256
[SPEAKER_01]: Then you see, I like how Jonathan lies up doing this.

01:07:08.336 --> 01:07:10.198
[SPEAKER_01]: You have see tight move on him.

01:07:10.978 --> 01:07:16.667
[SPEAKER_01]: where he was taking both of his feet and just going, uh, going full out on it.

01:07:17.207 --> 01:07:25.520
[SPEAKER_01]: As if it was like a UFC match, and he was up knocking them against the wall, Dazingham, which also caused the cops to be able to arrest them easy.

01:07:27.205 --> 01:07:30.328
[SPEAKER_00]: And also, why is every fight move is one of these films like all right.

01:07:30.528 --> 01:07:32.370
[SPEAKER_00]: And now you're going to put it hidden with the suplex.

01:07:32.710 --> 01:07:34.191
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not WWF.

01:07:34.672 --> 01:07:37.414
[SPEAKER_01]: No, this is not an action scene per se.

01:07:37.474 --> 01:07:40.437
[SPEAKER_01]: This is just a regular Joe who was a football player.

01:07:41.378 --> 01:07:46.643
[SPEAKER_01]: And now all of a sudden, you gained UFC abilities because of his accident on the field goal.

01:07:47.143 --> 01:07:50.366
[SPEAKER_00]: It was a prize horse didn't jump up on something then like land, you know, l.e.

01:07:50.426 --> 01:07:51.868
[SPEAKER_00]: elbow on a muffled top term buckle.

01:07:52.208 --> 01:07:52.869
[SPEAKER_00]: Like gold dust.

01:07:54.008 --> 01:07:57.129
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, I put the, it's a ladder match now.

01:07:57.189 --> 01:07:58.089
[SPEAKER_01]: It's what this is.

01:07:58.229 --> 01:08:05.430
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so the, again, the belt, it's about who's going to get off the roof first before they, before he gets arrested.

01:08:05.450 --> 01:08:09.231
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, you know, that scene just doesn't work for me.

01:08:09.391 --> 01:08:13.532
[SPEAKER_01]: I wish that they would have been more threatening where horses about the slid is throw.

01:08:14.152 --> 01:08:20.253
[SPEAKER_01]: The cops come up and bust down the door that's locked into horses trying to pick and then arrest him.

01:08:21.830 --> 01:08:29.416
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and also Horace, why are you trying to kick the door in when it, when it goes the other way, the door doesn't look that way.

01:08:31.158 --> 01:08:32.159
[SPEAKER_01]: He doesn't know any better.

01:08:33.320 --> 01:08:36.222
[SPEAKER_00]: He knows enough to put a ladder across two buildings, right?

01:08:37.163 --> 01:08:38.164
[SPEAKER_01]: He didn't think that one through.

01:08:38.184 --> 01:08:41.466
[SPEAKER_01]: That was out of everything else before he went to home depot for a ladder.

01:08:42.627 --> 01:08:44.289
[SPEAKER_00]: But, uh, that was not a rental.

01:08:45.114 --> 01:08:48.357
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, it's probably a rental when you need to so I'm not just for my serial killing.

01:08:48.557 --> 01:08:52.040
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, then half of the all the time, I had to ran rap.

01:08:52.380 --> 01:08:56.884
[SPEAKER_00]: I had to switch vans because someone has dream powers and I can't drive my regular van around.

01:08:56.904 --> 01:08:57.905
[SPEAKER_00]: Where's that home depot van?

01:09:00.787 --> 01:09:11.936
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, uh, then you have finally they made the arrest and then father and his father over there talking and he's like, I want to see that bastard rod.

01:09:12.176 --> 01:09:14.018
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to see him pride.

01:09:14.983 --> 01:09:19.590
[SPEAKER_01]: And at first, his father's like, no, we're just going to, we've rest at him, that's the end of the story.

01:09:19.610 --> 01:09:23.637
[SPEAKER_01]: And he goes, Allison was murdered because of this guy.

01:09:23.657 --> 01:09:24.639
[SPEAKER_01]: Because you know what?

01:09:26.361 --> 01:09:27.884
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that you, I think you deserve that.

01:09:27.904 --> 01:09:27.944
[SPEAKER_01]: OK.

01:09:29.859 --> 01:09:34.340
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so I think I've earned that in the deaths and they go in, yeah, I think I've earned it too.

01:09:35.040 --> 01:09:36.381
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll make sure we get box seats.

01:09:36.721 --> 01:09:53.704
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yes, again, Michael Murphy, as Lieutenant Parker is one of the strongest parts of this cast because every moment, because there's that initial instinctive reaction to protect Jonathan from watching someone die, you know, from going down that road, because clearly Lieutenant Parker

01:09:56.445 --> 01:10:00.367
[SPEAKER_00]: But then the fact that he's like, now you know what, now we're going to watch this sucker fry.

01:10:00.407 --> 01:10:06.730
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to be front row center because you know what, our family is gone because of him.

01:10:06.810 --> 01:10:12.013
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, I love the reality of Lieutenant Parker.

01:10:12.493 --> 01:10:16.555
[SPEAKER_01]: Me too, because this is exactly how a father would react if he was part of the force.

01:10:17.076 --> 01:10:18.316
[SPEAKER_01]: So I definitely like that.

01:10:18.456 --> 01:10:23.039
[SPEAKER_01]: And then finally we have Alice Cooper sing in no more Mr. Nice guy.

01:10:23.119 --> 01:10:24.640
[SPEAKER_01]: We see that happening.

01:10:24.680 --> 01:10:26.441
[SPEAKER_01]: You see the doctor coming in.

01:10:26.481 --> 01:10:27.701
[SPEAKER_01]: You see the executioner.

01:10:27.721 --> 01:10:30.003
[SPEAKER_01]: It feels like a music video for a choir right.

01:10:30.715 --> 01:10:38.646
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what it feels like to me or I, you know, I'm saying, play, it works and that cheesy flare flavor of it.

01:10:38.787 --> 01:10:40.870
[SPEAKER_01]: We're getting prepared for this execution.

01:10:40.890 --> 01:10:46.778
[SPEAKER_01]: It's an event because it feels like we as an audience is invited to this event, just as um,

01:10:47.599 --> 01:11:02.829
[SPEAKER_01]: honor them as father also there for this event to go down and we're witnessing this serial killer that's finally been captured being brought to justice and we get to have that horror moment, front row and center, and these box seats to be able to watch him die.

01:11:02.849 --> 01:11:05.411
[SPEAKER_00]: Because when they go get them.

01:11:06.667 --> 01:11:12.551
[SPEAKER_00]: and it's time to bring them to the chair and like he fakes falling down or whatever.

01:11:13.212 --> 01:11:17.815
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry if I'm a cop and then you have someone who is on death row.

01:11:18.135 --> 01:11:22.459
[SPEAKER_00]: So, both to go to the chair and they fake their death.

01:11:23.039 --> 01:11:24.300
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to give CPR.

01:11:24.320 --> 01:11:26.942
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, oh well, I guess we can say one of the electricity bill.

01:11:27.202 --> 01:11:31.985
[SPEAKER_00]: There's no reason why that cop should be giving him CPR except for some, you know,

01:11:36.236 --> 01:11:36.757
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

01:11:37.037 --> 01:11:37.418
[SPEAKER_01]: Come on.

01:11:37.578 --> 01:11:45.247
[SPEAKER_01]: Even whenever he's over there, also too, whenever he's laying down there and then they're trying to pick them back up and see what's going on.

01:11:45.267 --> 01:11:46.749
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he buns up, biting their lip.

01:11:46.969 --> 01:11:48.271
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a finger lick and good.

01:11:48.291 --> 01:11:50.594
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, okay, very cool girl.

01:11:51.852 --> 01:11:52.072
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

01:11:52.152 --> 01:11:59.915
[SPEAKER_01]: And then even when ever they're making the deal with the TV, with these demons that he's summoning, then you have the praise coming of D.D.

01:11:59.935 --> 01:12:01.236
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, really?

01:12:01.256 --> 01:12:06.098
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, praise would not be doing this in the first place.

01:12:06.778 --> 01:12:14.321
[SPEAKER_00]: But also he's doing some weird satanic ritual to a television, which is not an establishment at all.

01:12:14.561 --> 01:12:16.062
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, we're halfway into the movie.

01:12:16.102 --> 01:12:17.402
[SPEAKER_00]: We should at least see something like this.

01:12:17.783 --> 01:12:19.383
[SPEAKER_00]: And he had been doing this.

01:12:19.583 --> 01:12:19.683
[SPEAKER_00]: That

01:12:21.404 --> 01:12:26.185
[SPEAKER_00]: That opening scene, you know, where we're panning by all these TVs, all these news reports.

01:12:26.545 --> 01:12:35.486
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure, the last shot of that opening scene is showing the back of Horace Pinker surrounded by TVs and all these candles and doing his ritual or whatever.

01:12:36.407 --> 01:12:38.107
[SPEAKER_00]: Then you would establish that here.

01:12:38.187 --> 01:12:40.367
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, what the hell is going on here?

01:12:40.427 --> 01:12:42.748
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I love watching TV too, but not that much.

01:12:43.548 --> 01:12:43.808
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

01:12:43.928 --> 01:12:45.908
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, you know what, I'm going to crunch here.

01:12:46.048 --> 01:12:49.389
[SPEAKER_01]: I think I'm going to get Satan to bail me out of this situation here.

01:12:49.987 --> 01:12:52.449
[SPEAKER_01]: They say, yeah, look, I'm going to go on ahead.

01:12:52.489 --> 01:12:53.669
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to be electrocuted.

01:12:53.790 --> 01:12:56.371
[SPEAKER_01]: I only have about five minutes until they come and get me.

01:12:56.772 --> 01:13:01.615
[SPEAKER_01]: And the first request I requested was a TV because I want to worship you through TV first.

01:13:02.055 --> 01:13:03.736
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I want you to possess my body.

01:13:04.457 --> 01:13:08.219
[SPEAKER_01]: And then after that, we'll work on whatever issues that we have after that.

01:13:08.359 --> 01:13:09.880
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's my situation that I'm in.

01:13:10.140 --> 01:13:11.401
[SPEAKER_01]: OK, not a problem, dude.

01:13:11.481 --> 01:13:12.082
[SPEAKER_01]: I got you.

01:13:12.985 --> 01:13:15.527
[SPEAKER_01]: But it just, that's what it feels like to me.

01:13:15.587 --> 01:13:22.452
[SPEAKER_01]: It feels like, I'm in this situation about to be executed, get me out of this situation, gone in.

01:13:23.433 --> 01:13:24.754
[SPEAKER_01]: And it feels rushed.

01:13:25.255 --> 01:13:26.195
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, nice.

01:13:26.255 --> 01:13:27.716
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that how we's watching Morepovic?

01:13:27.736 --> 01:13:29.938
[SPEAKER_00]: Because it feels like that doesn't watch Morepovic.

01:13:30.959 --> 01:13:33.481
[SPEAKER_00]: And the young folks says, you are not the victim, OK?

01:13:33.501 --> 01:13:34.962
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

01:13:35.823 --> 01:13:37.764
[SPEAKER_01]: Then they put them in the execution chair.

01:13:38.004 --> 01:13:40.026
[SPEAKER_01]: He says his last words, then we realized

01:13:43.912 --> 01:13:44.494
[SPEAKER_01]: begin with.

01:13:45.900 --> 01:13:48.489
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, wait, I mean, remember, this is a kid.

01:13:49.663 --> 01:14:15.569
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, okay, so this is a lot deeper than witness in your girlfriend, having your girlfriend die in your foster parents dying and the only remaining person is your father, this guy also killed your real biological parents and he was also the responsible for having that limp there thoughts and wise so I like the layers that they gave him for that, but do we really need to see it or do we or do you like that cell illness of it?

01:14:15.988 --> 01:14:21.172
[SPEAKER_00]: I like the solos of it, but all of a sudden you've turned horrors pinker into Voldemort and Frick and Jonathan is Harry Potter.

01:14:21.192 --> 01:14:22.633
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

01:14:22.673 --> 01:14:26.856
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you want to see what shocker?

01:14:30.663 --> 01:14:47.329
[SPEAKER_01]: But then you see, of course, he's getting electrocuted and finally the doctor winds up and we go there to check this pulse, he gets electrocuted and he's and then all of a sudden he disappears, then like a magic trick for him, they have a copper field.

01:14:48.229 --> 01:14:53.410
[SPEAKER_01]: He's behind the door, he falls down, he bursts into flames because that's fucking normal.

01:14:53.810 --> 01:14:58.071
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the father says, okay, go hungry now.

01:14:58.091 --> 01:15:00.831
[SPEAKER_01]: You want to go Burger King or what do you want to eat?

01:15:01.791 --> 01:15:05.412
[SPEAKER_01]: Like it's like, you know, like it happens on every day occurrence.

01:15:05.472 --> 01:15:06.992
[SPEAKER_01]: Like somebody just evaporates.

01:15:08.212 --> 01:15:09.233
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what's funny?

01:15:09.673 --> 01:15:14.734
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to draw the weirdest comparison or the weirdest parallel to this.

01:15:15.114 --> 01:15:16.194
[SPEAKER_00]: So follow me around, okay?

01:15:18.305 --> 01:15:25.390
[SPEAKER_00]: Back in the late 70s and early 80s, Marvel had the rights to do the comic book, Rome Space Night.

01:15:25.890 --> 01:15:43.622
[SPEAKER_00]: And the whole thing about Rome Space Night is that he's this gallient warrior from Gallador, and he's tracking down the dire rates, who are this alien species that attacked his home world and he, you know, he along with all these other people who would give it up his humanity to

01:15:44.122 --> 01:15:59.121
[SPEAKER_00]: to dawn this armor and become space thanks and fight off the diaries and chase them off into the the the universe and then the diaries make their way to earth and they have the ability to shape shift and take on the guys of humans so when rom tracks the known earth.

01:15:59.782 --> 01:16:04.266
[SPEAKER_00]: He uses his neutralizer in order to be able to send them off into limbo.

01:16:04.587 --> 01:16:07.589
[SPEAKER_00]: So when he does that to a dire rate, they just become ashes.

01:16:07.609 --> 01:16:08.550
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm watching this.

01:16:09.291 --> 01:16:23.344
[SPEAKER_00]: And all of a sudden, like the villain who's already changed bodies at this point through that electrical current that's going into the doctor who's witnessing the execution, all of a sudden, and I'm like, oh my god, it's a dire rate.

01:16:25.125 --> 01:16:32.811
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I highly doubt that that's the inspiration for that scene, but it is the weirdest freaking parallel like it possibly come up with.

01:16:33.191 --> 01:16:39.535
[SPEAKER_01]: I can definitely see why you would think that too, seriously, because, you know, you got to evaporate it.

01:16:39.595 --> 01:16:42.618
[SPEAKER_01]: There's not one else, you know, I'm saying it's not normal.

01:16:43.557 --> 01:16:47.561
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, this is where Horace becomes interesting.

01:16:47.782 --> 01:16:53.788
[SPEAKER_00]: So the fact that, and I'll even give him this whole idea of him charging himself up with electricity.

01:16:53.949 --> 01:16:54.809
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe this is something.

01:16:55.718 --> 01:17:19.708
[SPEAKER_00]: didn't see it in the beginning the first hour of the film or whatever but okay so he charges himself up with electricity because that's his juice that's what charges this is part of why his brain is fried and why all these images are making him a serial killer okay I'm fine with this but then the overcharge gives him this ability to be able to transfer his personality through electrical impulses through electrical current by by touch with human skin.

01:17:20.573 --> 01:17:20.913
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

01:17:21.233 --> 01:17:22.974
[SPEAKER_00]: I love this aspect of it.

01:17:23.315 --> 01:17:28.417
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a little bit of the thing, you know, where the, the alien kind of transfers to different people.

01:17:28.837 --> 01:17:33.000
[SPEAKER_00]: I like this aspect though, because then the killer could be anybody.

01:17:33.440 --> 01:17:36.822
[SPEAKER_00]: This is where shocker really starts to find its groove.

01:17:37.822 --> 01:17:44.706
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree because it starts off really slow pace in a sense up until this point, and then we finally get the movie that we've been wanting.

01:17:45.346 --> 01:17:45.707
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:17:47.173 --> 01:17:51.498
[SPEAKER_01]: He winds up possessing a couple of the prison guards there.

01:17:51.658 --> 01:17:54.742
[SPEAKER_01]: Then the first he does the doctor, the female doctor.

01:17:55.643 --> 01:17:59.827
[SPEAKER_01]: She winds up, uh, licking the guy, the prison guards face.

01:17:59.907 --> 01:18:01.629
[SPEAKER_01]: He won't find a make out with him.

01:18:02.110 --> 01:18:04.633
[SPEAKER_01]: And then after that, she possesses the other guy.

01:18:06.855 --> 01:18:19.043
[SPEAKER_01]: He wants up, I think, biting his face or something, and then after that, you see a big explosion happen and then John is like, wait, something's wrong and I'm like, of course, something's wrong.

01:18:19.763 --> 01:18:20.644
[SPEAKER_01]: The car just blew up.

01:18:21.483 --> 01:18:26.908
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the mushroom cloud of fire is it's got to be an indication that there's something wrong.

01:18:26.928 --> 01:18:27.109
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

01:18:27.509 --> 01:18:40.622
[SPEAKER_00]: And you knew something was going to happen with that doctor because no one gets a low angle reveal with no character name whatsoever walking into that room without there being something more for them beyond that.

01:18:40.642 --> 01:18:45.046
[SPEAKER_00]: So you knew the doctor was going to be involved somehow, but you know.

01:18:46.908 --> 01:18:48.109
[SPEAKER_00]: I like this aspect.

01:18:48.129 --> 01:18:54.155
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, I like this idea too of also Horace trying to find the proper host to be able to take over.

01:18:55.196 --> 01:18:59.660
[SPEAKER_00]: It's established a little bit later, but I like that aspect of it.

01:18:59.980 --> 01:19:06.306
[SPEAKER_00]: And by using the doctor as a way to get out of the prison, it's a smart move for Horace.

01:19:07.116 --> 01:19:07.456
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

01:19:07.476 --> 01:19:10.558
[SPEAKER_01]: This was probably the spark moment for him to be able to get out of there.

01:19:10.578 --> 01:19:12.599
[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, look, I have the credentials to get out of here.

01:19:12.619 --> 01:19:20.443
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me go and kill her, shock her and have my soul possess her body to find the perfect specimen for what I have planned.

01:19:21.164 --> 01:19:27.647
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, okay, I'm guessing that that plan went south after the cloud.

01:19:27.667 --> 01:19:30.009
[SPEAKER_01]: So she's like, okay, well, I got to go on and business.

01:19:30.169 --> 01:19:33.991
[SPEAKER_01]: They'll top the survived, which is even smarter because now you're a cop.

01:19:35.581 --> 01:19:50.626
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so yeah, it's almost like the T 1000 in Terminator 2 right picking the right person and to impress the in order to be able to track down John Connor exactly and that's what I got out of it.

01:19:50.666 --> 01:19:52.406
[SPEAKER_01]: I got T 1000 vibes from it.

01:19:53.366 --> 01:19:56.887
[SPEAKER_01]: And also to nobody will believe that this thing is actually happening.

01:20:05.882 --> 01:20:06.102
[SPEAKER_01]: this.

01:20:06.603 --> 01:20:09.865
[SPEAKER_00]: And all of the dream stuff at this point is for gotten now.

01:20:10.145 --> 01:20:13.928
[SPEAKER_00]: We are completely out of the old team of nightmare and elm street vibes.

01:20:14.309 --> 01:20:15.469
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we're into something different.

01:20:15.530 --> 01:20:17.191
[SPEAKER_00]: Now we're into its own property.

01:20:17.291 --> 01:20:20.073
[SPEAKER_00]: This is where I wish the film was more like this.

01:20:20.593 --> 01:20:26.178
[SPEAKER_00]: I wish we had a gotten rid of about at least half of the tracking down Horace, right?

01:20:27.078 --> 01:20:46.947
[SPEAKER_00]: get let let's track him down let's fry him more and then let's lean more into this ability of him be able to transfer his consciousness through people as as as a signal as electricity because he's a great of electricity again like it's and because TV signals are transmitted through their own version of electricity yes this all makes sense now

01:20:48.079 --> 01:20:48.479
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

01:20:48.679 --> 01:20:49.640
[SPEAKER_01]: It picks up right here.

01:20:49.780 --> 01:20:55.383
[SPEAKER_01]: It needs to be this movie now knows its identity versus before where it didn't know what it wanted to be.

01:20:56.024 --> 01:20:56.284
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:20:56.644 --> 01:21:09.671
[SPEAKER_01]: And now you actually have a cohesive story going on within it and Jonathan trying to figure out which ones are the people that he can trust, which ones he can't trust, what souls has pinker got to and things like that

01:21:12.393 --> 01:21:27.921
[SPEAKER_01]: The Bible comes over to his house and knocks on his door who he who winds up escaping from the hospital and has his own has yet now it's actually pinker, but we don't know that we think that is actually a cop from the.

01:21:29.142 --> 01:21:30.102
[SPEAKER_01]: From the execution.

01:21:31.983 --> 01:21:40.628
[SPEAKER_01]: And then we find out through a phone call, hey Jonathan, just letting me know that this cop got loose and now we don't know ways that.

01:21:41.988 --> 01:21:43.330
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it was being knocked on the door.

01:21:43.911 --> 01:21:55.606
[SPEAKER_00]: And the fact that the Lieutenant Parker is Jonathan's adopted dad, it makes sense that you know, the Lieutenant would just say the the the policeman's name and Jonathan would have a decent idea of who it is.

01:21:55.646 --> 01:21:56.868
[SPEAKER_00]: So that that part makes sense.

01:21:56.928 --> 01:21:57.548
[SPEAKER_00]: I'd like the.

01:21:58.526 --> 01:22:06.889
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, that that looking through the people moment, and then he realizes and then it's that bullet through the people that that's just a great moment.

01:22:06.989 --> 01:22:07.329
[UNKNOWN]: 1,000.

01:22:07.429 --> 01:22:08.290
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

01:22:08.390 --> 01:22:08.809
[UNKNOWN]: 1,000.

01:22:08.910 --> 01:22:09.150
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:22:09.310 --> 01:22:14.712
[SPEAKER_00]: But Horace knows enough to think that that that would be where his eye would be and that's where my bullet's going to go.

01:22:14.732 --> 01:22:15.652
[SPEAKER_00]: That makes sense.

01:22:16.353 --> 01:22:16.573
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

01:22:16.613 --> 01:22:22.915
[SPEAKER_01]: And of course, he would know that Jonathan got a phone call around that time as well because of how long Johnson's taking the answer to the door.

01:22:22.935 --> 01:22:22.995
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

01:22:29.310 --> 01:22:32.551
[SPEAKER_01]: And just sing nothing and he'll walk away.

01:22:34.071 --> 01:22:37.452
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, there's no reason for you to be even talking to this dude.

01:22:37.472 --> 01:22:40.092
[SPEAKER_01]: You don't even know him or anything.

01:22:40.332 --> 01:22:42.393
[SPEAKER_01]: You're just there to witness an electrocution.

01:22:42.453 --> 01:22:43.773
[SPEAKER_01]: That's all you were there for.

01:22:45.653 --> 01:22:47.174
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you don't why should you care.

01:22:47.194 --> 01:22:50.354
[SPEAKER_01]: He was just you were just there at the wrong place at the wrong time.

01:22:50.374 --> 01:22:52.775
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like that's the thing.

01:22:52.975 --> 01:22:55.435
[SPEAKER_00]: You hear the message and you go past story.

01:22:55.635 --> 01:22:57.916
[SPEAKER_00]: No, don't say, think nothing but they're not there.

01:22:59.225 --> 01:23:06.590
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you see pastory doing a GTA thing where he's chasing him down in the park and trying to kill him.

01:23:07.250 --> 01:23:16.076
[SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, it's like, well, even his father's like, well, there's a bunch of witnesses that saw, you know, pastory trying to shoot at you.

01:23:16.397 --> 01:23:24.302
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, did you not do the witness is also not see that he shot a person jogging for no reason in shooting him.

01:23:25.810 --> 01:23:44.512
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the the park dwellers of this town have to be how bad is this town that no one is flinching when there's a cop with a gun pulled chasing and shooting someone who has clearly been in the news and they've used this big football player people know who he is.

01:23:45.695 --> 01:23:54.885
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know about you, but if I'm in that park, I am running for my dear life to the nearest phone booth because it's 1989, and it's helpful and still exists.

01:23:55.486 --> 01:23:58.729
[SPEAKER_00]: But everyone's real chill about this.

01:23:58.769 --> 01:24:01.272
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh, there's someone somewhere around with the gun.

01:24:01.292 --> 01:24:03.033
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no, it's Sunday.

01:24:03.094 --> 01:24:04.395
[SPEAKER_00]: No, that's what happens around here.

01:24:04.475 --> 01:24:04.855
[SPEAKER_01]: exactly.

01:24:04.915 --> 01:24:10.519
[SPEAKER_01]: It just happens every Tuesday, you know, it is typical day in Los Angeles, nothing to worry, but it's just Jonathan.

01:24:10.559 --> 01:24:18.164
[SPEAKER_01]: He's part of his routine workout regimen for his coach to get him into into the game for the big game that he has training.

01:24:18.204 --> 01:24:21.246
[SPEAKER_00]: If you could not run a bullet, you could not run a football player.

01:24:21.266 --> 01:24:23.688
[SPEAKER_01]: If you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball.

01:24:30.178 --> 01:24:44.439
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, and then you see this little girl that's walking as well and then he possesses the girl in the construction worker, then the mother of the girl because he realizes that the girl is not a good fit.

01:24:45.480 --> 01:24:47.022
[SPEAKER_01]: or what he's going to do.

01:24:47.702 --> 01:24:54.969
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he's he also got the girl to drive a fork lift or because somehow they're construction machinery, which I thought was funny.

01:24:54.989 --> 01:24:59.974
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the most comedic jump scare in the entire game film.

01:25:00.475 --> 01:25:02.637
[SPEAKER_00]: Because like, okay, I, I, I, I, I,

01:25:03.197 --> 01:25:22.553
[SPEAKER_00]: The one aspect I do like about this is that with Horace going from body to body and he's clearly trying to find the best body possible right so he's in the body of the cop that gives him cover in order to be able to track down Jonathan okay cool and then that probably because it's been severely damaged because if you don't remember the mushroom cloud of fire that signify that something was wrong.

01:25:23.133 --> 01:25:30.675
[SPEAKER_00]: So clearly this body doesn't have the energy to go that far, but then he gets into the jogger, which is a problem because he already shot that jogger and then he goes into the little girl.

01:25:30.955 --> 01:25:41.637
[SPEAKER_00]: But every time he jumps it to a different person, he figures it away to use that body that he's now taking over to his advantage.

01:25:41.697 --> 01:25:50.059
[SPEAKER_00]: So the times when Jonathan's chasing down this little girl, the mom is freaking the F out and the, yeah, he's like, to be very suspect again,

01:25:53.100 --> 01:25:56.962
[SPEAKER_00]: Jonathan is the sussiest suss of the ever-suss and he fell nuts over.

01:25:57.403 --> 01:26:01.745
[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, so he gets to this, you know, this big trash bin or whatever.

01:26:01.785 --> 01:26:03.506
[SPEAKER_00]: He's looking around and he's trying to figure things out.

01:26:03.727 --> 01:26:07.109
[SPEAKER_00]: Then he goes around and this tractor drives the run him over driven by a little girl.

01:26:07.429 --> 01:26:13.993
[SPEAKER_00]: There is no way he didn't hear a revved up, like bulldozer kind of tractor.

01:26:14.273 --> 01:26:16.975
[SPEAKER_00]: Like you were hearing that cat truck going from

01:26:23.105 --> 01:26:25.347
[SPEAKER_01]: No, I would actually hear that in a mile away.

01:26:25.367 --> 01:26:26.848
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, in fact, I hear a train right now.

01:26:27.289 --> 01:26:31.132
[SPEAKER_01]: So you mean to tell me you've included in here, that coming at you.

01:26:32.433 --> 01:26:33.053
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, man.

01:26:33.174 --> 01:26:36.456
[SPEAKER_03]: All right, it's comedic at that board.

01:26:36.476 --> 01:26:36.777
[SPEAKER_01]: It is.

01:26:36.997 --> 01:26:37.417
[SPEAKER_01]: It is.

01:26:37.697 --> 01:26:41.541
[SPEAKER_01]: They actually labeled this like a horror comedy, which,

01:26:42.735 --> 01:26:48.880
[SPEAKER_01]: make sense because of the ending on the way they did this, but you know, this is common to me.

01:26:48.940 --> 01:26:57.508
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, seeing this girl on this big machinery, trying to run Jonathan over and he's scared to death because of all the sudden supposed to be a jumpscare.

01:26:57.628 --> 01:26:58.649
[SPEAKER_01]: That's not a jumpscare to me.

01:26:58.969 --> 01:27:01.031
[SPEAKER_01]: That's just, I'm just laughing.

01:27:01.431 --> 01:27:04.814
[SPEAKER_00]: Earlier in the movie, there's things I'm like, you can't run anything.

01:27:05.638 --> 01:27:14.681
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, run a tractor because you're going to give that try because it kind of feels at this point like that scene in Austin Powers when the dude's like screaming at the zamboni's is coming at him in like two miles an hour.

01:27:15.381 --> 01:27:15.662
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

01:27:16.642 --> 01:27:30.947
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, before that though, too, we have that other dream sequence with Alice in coming back and then she has them the, you know, the heart necklace because it represents love and then he wanted to use that necklace on the girl.

01:27:32.134 --> 01:27:36.299
[SPEAKER_01]: And she does this whole type of type of thing where she's having a seizure attack.

01:27:37.200 --> 01:27:43.706
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, and then, or swines up using it after, you guess, I'm using the body for that.

01:27:43.787 --> 01:27:45.228
[SPEAKER_01]: He winds up jumping in the mother.

01:27:46.249 --> 01:27:50.874
[SPEAKER_01]: And then after the mother, he sees the social worker that looks like DM slash.

01:27:51.815 --> 01:27:53.377
[SPEAKER_00]: And K through Roberts.

01:27:55.991 --> 01:28:02.938
[SPEAKER_01]: and you get a pitch for pitchax and throws it into the into the pond into the lake.

01:28:03.338 --> 01:28:12.208
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, so you didn't bother trying to kill a Jonathan with it, but you thought this necklace was the reason why you needed to go ahead and get rid of it.

01:28:12.752 --> 01:28:19.958
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that makes sense, because clearly Horace figured out because that necklace was put on onto the girl and that was the horse.

01:28:20.318 --> 01:28:22.479
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and a force him out of the body.

01:28:22.519 --> 01:28:31.806
[SPEAKER_00]: So he so Horace is pulling a Jonathan and putting two to two together pretty quickly and I like the fact that he uses the pickaxe as a way to send that necklace is.

01:28:32.527 --> 01:28:45.990
[SPEAKER_00]: far as possible because yet King Roberts is jacked and he can probably throw a friggin pitch fork that far, but the fact that the necklace is actually on it, which will give you a reason because there's no way he was going to be able to throw a necklace by itself that far.

01:28:46.030 --> 01:28:47.450
[SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't have the aerodynamics.

01:28:47.910 --> 01:28:49.611
[SPEAKER_00]: Pitch fork that does.

01:28:49.691 --> 01:28:51.111
[SPEAKER_00]: So that part makes sense.

01:28:51.551 --> 01:28:54.912
[SPEAKER_00]: And it looked, the fact that he looks down, how do you like this body?

01:28:54.952 --> 01:28:56.472
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh, crappy did he leveled up?

01:28:56.792 --> 01:29:14.658
[SPEAKER_00]: The, this is the part of the forest makes sense and I'm like, okay, I like you're creating now a villain that is using the logic with this new power right because it's like, okay, I couldn't get the energy that I needed from these other people and now I found the perfect person now.

01:29:15.298 --> 01:29:20.260
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll say he would actually just be that one person the whole entire time now that he jacked up.

01:29:21.660 --> 01:29:34.568
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because he's able to take his electric current and being able to be that person, but no, instead, he winds up figuring out, okay, he's going to ask help from his friends to help him and that's sure enough what he does.

01:29:34.668 --> 01:29:48.296
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, John, the lines up telling his friends, hey, look guys, we need to go on ahead, go over to back to the lake and get my necklace out of it, because the only way to get a horse out of the body that he's in.

01:29:49.376 --> 01:29:51.817
[SPEAKER_01]: And everybody believes that there's a woman like his neck.

01:29:51.837 --> 01:29:53.737
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, okay, good for you.

01:29:53.757 --> 01:29:55.558
[SPEAKER_01]: And he gets up into another body.

01:29:57.018 --> 01:29:57.198
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:29:57.558 --> 01:30:10.482
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, at some point, you lose the element of surprise, which, you know, Horace clearly realizes, because again, at every step of the way Horace is painted, while yes, homocidal, but not a dumb.

01:30:11.505 --> 01:30:24.531
[SPEAKER_00]: No, not a dumb villain like so he's clearly going to switch bodies to give him the best advantage to get at Jonathan is that this point now it's it's become a vendor he's going to get this guy

01:30:25.411 --> 01:30:28.693
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he doesn't know that he's sending him up into a trapper or anything.

01:30:29.974 --> 01:30:32.456
[SPEAKER_01]: He's sending his own friends up until he gets killed.

01:30:33.576 --> 01:30:36.879
[SPEAKER_01]: But I like how everybody has separate in it makes sense.

01:30:37.279 --> 01:30:40.421
[SPEAKER_01]: He's got Rhino, one of the guys that will actually back him up.

01:30:41.161 --> 01:30:46.045
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he's got the coach doing this, going into the doing it as house.

01:30:46.485 --> 01:30:48.987
[SPEAKER_01]: Who also have all his other friends going over there.

01:30:50.087 --> 01:30:53.389
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's now something that I'm not Man, they were going to go back.

01:30:53.849 --> 01:30:57.771
[SPEAKER_00]: Pac-Man being played by Ted Ramey, The younger brother of Sam Ramey.

01:30:57.791 --> 01:30:58.111
[SPEAKER_01]: Ramey.

01:30:59.531 --> 01:31:03.013
[SPEAKER_01]: Which I thought was pretty cool because I'm like, Oh, that's Sam Ramey's brother.

01:31:03.033 --> 01:31:03.853
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

01:31:04.093 --> 01:31:07.035
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, and then they wound up getting killed.

01:31:07.095 --> 01:31:10.836
[SPEAKER_01]: Jonathan's wandering by a sick and so long, but then they come back.

01:31:11.477 --> 01:31:12.597
[SPEAKER_01]: He's like, no, something's wrong.

01:31:12.917 --> 01:31:14.518
[SPEAKER_01]: Because Coach would have been back by now.

01:31:16.053 --> 01:31:19.495
[SPEAKER_01]: Then come to find out, the coach is being possessed by pinker.

01:31:20.216 --> 01:31:21.496
[SPEAKER_01]: Everybody else is dead.

01:31:21.837 --> 01:31:22.757
[SPEAKER_01]: Pat man's dead.

01:31:24.138 --> 01:31:31.583
[SPEAKER_01]: And This is one of those sad scenes because I was hoping that the coach would actually been stronger enough to actually conquer him.

01:31:33.504 --> 01:31:34.244
[SPEAKER_01]: But he wasn't.

01:31:35.025 --> 01:31:37.546
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you also have the girlfriend that just comes out.

01:31:37.687 --> 01:31:39.788
[SPEAKER_01]: Allison was coming in to the picture.

01:31:40.990 --> 01:31:41.190
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:31:41.630 --> 01:31:49.736
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, how does Jonathan realize that someone has the ability to, through willpower, get Horace out of their body?

01:31:49.836 --> 01:31:50.316
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't.

01:31:50.596 --> 01:31:51.937
[SPEAKER_00]: He just puts doing to together.

01:31:52.557 --> 01:31:55.940
[SPEAKER_00]: It's almost like, I'm going to think of something, and that's going to be what's happening.

01:31:56.240 --> 01:31:58.101
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like he's making up the plot on the spot.

01:31:58.841 --> 01:32:01.063
[SPEAKER_00]: And also, not that it's ever really,

01:32:01.643 --> 01:32:11.080
[SPEAKER_00]: determine why Allison seems to be the only one who's able to cross or from being dead into some weird spirit spiritual presence in order to be able to help Jonathan.

01:32:11.461 --> 01:32:12.623
[SPEAKER_00]: She's the only one.

01:32:12.643 --> 01:32:13.524
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, yes.

01:32:14.511 --> 01:32:25.660
[SPEAKER_00]: before being, you know, sentenced to death, you know, Horace is taunting Jonathan by saying like, she died good, she died strong, you know, like, okay, cool.

01:32:25.840 --> 01:32:27.902
[SPEAKER_00]: And we didn't need to see it on camera.

01:32:27.922 --> 01:32:31.044
[SPEAKER_00]: I like the fact that he used that as a torment.

01:32:32.045 --> 01:32:38.891
[SPEAKER_00]: But is there something in Allison's faith that has allowed her to be able to cross over and help him?

01:32:39.471 --> 01:32:41.333
[SPEAKER_00]: We don't know, don't ask questions.

01:32:42.648 --> 01:32:51.294
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, because I feel like it's like not only because she loved him, but also because of the fact that the dead don't that has like unfinished business.

01:32:51.955 --> 01:33:01.942
[SPEAKER_01]: So from finished businesses to protect Jonathan up until think or goes on ahead and dies, but then even after that, at the end, we get Alison again.

01:33:02.142 --> 01:33:03.743
[SPEAKER_01]: So that doesn't even make sense.

01:33:04.864 --> 01:33:05.064
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no.

01:33:06.589 --> 01:33:07.910
[SPEAKER_01]: So there goes that logic.

01:33:08.630 --> 01:33:10.031
[SPEAKER_01]: So it just doesn't make sense.

01:33:10.091 --> 01:33:17.295
[SPEAKER_01]: Even whenever they you need to tell me, Allison could have just went on ahead and gave him the heart necklace all this time in his dream.

01:33:17.855 --> 01:33:19.656
[SPEAKER_01]: And his friends didn't even have to go through this.

01:33:20.157 --> 01:33:31.343
[SPEAKER_00]: And also at some point, Allison was able to stop Horace with some weird care bear stair light that comes out of her stomach and attacks like, where was this power?

01:33:31.423 --> 01:33:31.743
[SPEAKER_00]: Why didn't

01:33:33.124 --> 01:33:37.548
[SPEAKER_01]: It was like, as if she's saying that she's now pregnant with John's Jonathan's baby.

01:33:39.050 --> 01:33:41.913
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't even, that they just had a one night thing with it.

01:33:41.933 --> 01:33:43.434
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't even know if she's pregnant or not.

01:33:43.995 --> 01:33:49.881
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think they actually had sex because remember, the very beginning, she's like, you know, I wouldn't know.

01:33:49.961 --> 01:33:50.802
[SPEAKER_00]: We haven't had sex.

01:33:51.102 --> 01:33:52.764
[SPEAKER_00]: So, and they're dressing up.

01:33:54.585 --> 01:34:01.130
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think she spent the night just to make to keep an eye on him because she thinks he's got a concussion.

01:34:01.190 --> 01:34:02.832
[SPEAKER_00]: So she's tending to him.

01:34:02.892 --> 01:34:03.572
[SPEAKER_00]: That part I get.

01:34:03.893 --> 01:34:06.835
[SPEAKER_00]: But the fact that she's clearly all in white when she's disappeared form.

01:34:07.115 --> 01:34:10.838
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, could you paint her as virginal and pure just a little bit more?

01:34:10.918 --> 01:34:13.120
[SPEAKER_00]: Cause you're not being digactic enough movie.

01:34:14.043 --> 01:34:14.764
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, exactly.

01:34:14.784 --> 01:34:16.725
[SPEAKER_01]: You're not giving us any explanation of it.

01:34:16.745 --> 01:34:23.730
[SPEAKER_01]: We're just supposed to believe the fact that she's able to stop him because of the fact that for love for Jonathan and that's it.

01:34:24.310 --> 01:34:25.831
[SPEAKER_01]: There's nothing really to go on.

01:34:26.452 --> 01:34:30.335
[SPEAKER_01]: So that takes away from me as far as that part goes.

01:34:30.855 --> 01:34:40.182
[SPEAKER_01]: And then also think it's just a dick move to be able to go ahead, go in your boyfriend's dream, to give him the heart necklace again,

01:34:40.942 --> 01:34:50.885
[SPEAKER_01]: When he didn't even have to wear basically he wasted everybody's time all that time to go ahead and get this go into the into the lake.

01:34:51.708 --> 01:34:53.330
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, it gets the hard necklace.

01:34:53.730 --> 01:34:54.951
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, which okay.

01:34:54.991 --> 01:34:56.452
[SPEAKER_00]: So the mask is ruined.

01:34:56.512 --> 01:34:57.714
[SPEAKER_00]: And that that's fine.

01:34:57.814 --> 01:34:58.034
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

01:34:58.094 --> 01:35:01.317
[SPEAKER_00]: I get it because Horace heard the entire plan.

01:35:01.377 --> 01:35:02.738
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes a kills pack man.

01:35:03.119 --> 01:35:04.640
[SPEAKER_00]: He embodies the coach.

01:35:04.720 --> 01:35:05.381
[SPEAKER_00]: He breaks.

01:35:05.421 --> 01:35:06.482
[SPEAKER_00]: He destroys the mask.

01:35:07.503 --> 01:35:10.205
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry, is this not a town.

01:35:10.265 --> 01:35:12.868
[SPEAKER_00]: Can we not just go and buy a brand new mask.

01:35:12.908 --> 01:35:17.292
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure there are more there's more than a driving mask in the entire town.

01:35:18.647 --> 01:35:18.987
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

01:35:19.047 --> 01:35:22.409
[SPEAKER_01]: Why does it have to be that one specifically?

01:35:23.529 --> 01:35:25.510
[SPEAKER_01]: And you mean to tell me this coach can't afford.

01:35:25.550 --> 01:35:27.511
[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, look, man, I know you're having a go into it.

01:35:27.531 --> 01:35:28.072
[SPEAKER_01]: Have a good time.

01:35:28.112 --> 01:35:29.712
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me buy the mask for you.

01:35:30.193 --> 01:35:34.455
[SPEAKER_01]: And we can all try and conquer pink together.

01:35:34.475 --> 01:35:39.037
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but no, it's all this is scuba gear either, right?

01:35:39.517 --> 01:35:47.483
[SPEAKER_00]: driving at night with no light underwater trying to find one little necklace in the bottom of a lake.

01:35:47.703 --> 01:35:51.866
[SPEAKER_00]: He goes to like the, you know, the one spot in the middle dives down three times.

01:35:51.966 --> 01:35:53.367
[SPEAKER_00]: Gives up, says, please help me.

01:35:54.695 --> 01:36:02.322
[SPEAKER_00]: And then Allison, who has already visited him at this point, shows up in the middle of the lake, and he runs.

01:36:02.662 --> 01:36:11.050
[SPEAKER_00]: He swims his fast from his from his love, the spirit of his love as fast as he can, like she's the Loch Ness monster.

01:36:12.091 --> 01:36:14.033
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you forget who she is?

01:36:14.053 --> 01:36:14.794
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

01:36:16.735 --> 01:36:18.937
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he spooked out twice by her.

01:36:22.590 --> 01:36:32.160
[SPEAKER_00]: He almost gets run over by a bulldozer and he, he, he, he, you know, sportsmen like gets out of the way somehow, but spirit Allison shows up.

01:36:32.180 --> 01:36:33.862
[SPEAKER_00]: You look a lot like my girlfriend who died.

01:36:34.242 --> 01:36:36.445
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to swim the other way even though he helped me before.

01:36:37.226 --> 01:36:37.446
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

01:36:38.824 --> 01:36:43.226
[SPEAKER_01]: And then we finally get the fact that he takes over the latina's body.

01:36:43.807 --> 01:36:49.570
[SPEAKER_01]: Pinker does and then you have this whole chase and the user playing no more Mr. Nice guy.

01:36:50.130 --> 01:37:04.198
[SPEAKER_01]: And then finally he tells us that he did you have to spike this you have to fight fight this and then finally he does and he's fake the heart attack or he well, he actually has a heart condition.

01:37:04.858 --> 01:37:07.720
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think Pinker doesn't know that he has a heart condition.

01:37:10.031 --> 01:37:11.612
[SPEAKER_00]: love this part of it again.

01:37:12.053 --> 01:37:18.977
[SPEAKER_00]: You created vulnerability in the city parker and you've created a reason for Horace to not be able to finish the job.

01:37:19.238 --> 01:37:26.223
[SPEAKER_00]: You have this great chase scene, the going up the top of a television tower and we already talked about how much television kind of plays into this whole thing.

01:37:26.263 --> 01:37:27.303
[SPEAKER_00]: So fantastic.

01:37:27.704 --> 01:37:34.208
[SPEAKER_00]: You have this great moment and then just as Lieutenant Parker's heart is about to give out and Horace is about to lose.

01:37:34.569 --> 01:37:35.389
[SPEAKER_00]: He finds a way to

01:37:39.352 --> 01:37:49.660
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, Lieutenant Parker passes away, but his own failing hard is enough to be able to save his adopted son and horse is gone.

01:37:50.601 --> 01:38:02.070
[SPEAKER_00]: Can we please put this movie into an edit system, take a big ol' scissor cut right there and and credits right because that's all you really need it.

01:38:02.591 --> 01:38:07.455
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me get you know, we have to keep going because the movie's not over yet.

01:38:10.451 --> 01:38:11.412
[SPEAKER_01]: Why do that, Jason?

01:38:11.532 --> 01:38:12.272
[SPEAKER_01]: Why do that?

01:38:12.493 --> 01:38:19.418
[SPEAKER_01]: We still have to go on a hand and try to kill them through admitting the fact that John is not the killer.

01:38:20.229 --> 01:38:26.010
[SPEAKER_01]: We have to establish that he's not the killer when all the other cops are actually seeing his own father chase after him.

01:38:26.390 --> 01:38:29.011
[SPEAKER_01]: So now we have to show that he's being not being in frame.

01:38:29.051 --> 01:38:35.012
[SPEAKER_01]: So now it becomes the fugitive and then we have to go in and call this network team to show and say, look,

01:38:51.290 --> 01:38:54.451
[SPEAKER_01]: and they're about to cut the power and five minutes till.

01:38:54.671 --> 01:39:05.976
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the most convoluted plan since Baron Zemo tried to start civil war in the MCU or worse, Lex Luther figured out that with Batman had moms named Martha.

01:39:06.236 --> 01:39:08.357
[SPEAKER_00]: So let's really just kind of

01:39:09.097 --> 01:39:10.159
[SPEAKER_00]: Boyle is down here.

01:39:10.559 --> 01:39:19.051
[SPEAKER_00]: Jonathan, for reasons, figures out that, and okay, he knows that Horace is in the television signal.

01:39:19.131 --> 01:39:20.874
[SPEAKER_00]: He's disappeared through his amount.

01:39:20.934 --> 01:39:21.715
[SPEAKER_00]: Why does he saw it?

01:39:21.855 --> 01:39:23.037
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I'm fine with that.

01:39:23.858 --> 01:39:34.721
[SPEAKER_00]: But now, in the span of about five minutes, he's come up with this idea that he's going to trap him through television, convinces a TV station to send an ENG unit and a live sat truck to his house.

01:39:35.021 --> 01:39:39.122
[SPEAKER_00]: Convinces his entire football team knockout power for the entire town I'm sorry.

01:39:39.142 --> 01:39:40.322
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not the fantastic four.

01:39:40.682 --> 01:39:45.683
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't get to tell the world to turn the power off and has it all happening in midnight.

01:39:45.763 --> 01:39:52.045
[SPEAKER_00]: Meanwhile, he's got to go out to the lake in the middle of the night with no mask whatsoever to try to find the necklace of power

01:39:53.845 --> 01:40:06.533
[SPEAKER_00]: there, who, and, and, you know, every the spirit of every single person that horse has killed is now visiting him after he tries to, you know, to speed swim away from the ghost of his girlfriend.

01:40:07.994 --> 01:40:14.317
[SPEAKER_00]: And then all of a sudden he somehow is able to get himself into the TV signal.

01:40:14.357 --> 01:40:14.537
[SPEAKER_00]: Like,

01:40:15.958 --> 01:40:30.443
[SPEAKER_01]: And then he fell asleep very quick if you notice this like, okay, and then his friends like Jonathan, you know, I fall asleep and I can catch let him catch you while you're sleeping and then at that moment you see pinker, come out of the TV set.

01:40:31.529 --> 01:40:34.632
[SPEAKER_00]: No, before that, so he goes to sleep, right?

01:40:35.013 --> 01:40:36.635
[SPEAKER_00]: And everyone's like, don't let him get your wife sleeping.

01:40:36.655 --> 01:40:37.836
[SPEAKER_00]: So he wakes up, okay, perfect.

01:40:38.216 --> 01:40:47.266
[SPEAKER_00]: And then he goes over to, and this is where the movie telegraphs itself so much, because, you know, as he's relaxing with all, big, very beginning in the film.

01:40:47.286 --> 01:40:48.227
[SPEAKER_00]: We see him relaxing in,

01:40:48.567 --> 01:40:53.470
[SPEAKER_00]: the vibomatic chair that barely fits his body, right, but it's an electric chair.

01:40:53.530 --> 01:40:55.250
[SPEAKER_00]: So, okay, find your football player.

01:40:55.270 --> 01:40:56.011
[SPEAKER_00]: You got to relax.

01:40:56.311 --> 01:41:07.177
[SPEAKER_00]: So, he goes over to the chair and then Horace is in the chair because of course, down he's an electrical signal and it turns into a freaking Harry Potter professor's log horn thing that starts to like hug him to death.

01:41:08.489 --> 01:41:09.010
[SPEAKER_00]: The what?

01:41:10.050 --> 01:41:12.072
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, another thing though, too, man.

01:41:12.212 --> 01:41:23.359
[SPEAKER_01]: If you know this serial kill, if you have a news people already over there, why the hell are you going to go in and wake up and go ahead and go in your chair to relax when you just got done relaxing.

01:41:23.379 --> 01:41:28.402
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you're then all of a sudden the chair just comes alive like as a fucking P.V.

01:41:28.422 --> 01:41:32.345
[SPEAKER_01]: Herman Playhouse thing and starts electrocuting him.

01:41:32.365 --> 01:41:34.967
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh my goodness.

01:41:36.485 --> 01:41:42.567
[SPEAKER_00]: Mike, so like the minute we saw that chair at the beginning of the movie, I'm just like that's an electric chair.

01:41:42.627 --> 01:41:43.988
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not going to come in handy.

01:41:44.188 --> 01:41:45.388
[SPEAKER_00]: Some point down the road.

01:41:45.708 --> 01:41:49.410
[SPEAKER_00]: Why would you have a chair sitting in the middle of the room, right?

01:41:49.430 --> 01:41:52.451
[SPEAKER_00]: It's called shocker because it's called shocker, right?

01:41:52.491 --> 01:42:01.714
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're the vibe of magic because that's a brand that exists and the chair just looks so cheesy and it's the eyeballs.

01:42:02.054 --> 01:42:13.061
[SPEAKER_00]: that that's comes out of the top of the head of the chair and it's cute for a little bit that it's just like you were you're trading back into nightmare on Elm Street territory here.

01:42:13.121 --> 01:42:14.422
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a good thing.

01:42:14.442 --> 01:42:21.927
[SPEAKER_01]: No, this is like the worst of the nightmare on Elm Street dreams that you could ever have because it don't make no sense.

01:42:22.447 --> 01:42:23.067
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I'm sorry,

01:42:26.329 --> 01:42:28.291
[SPEAKER_00]: My massage chair wants to hug me.

01:42:28.471 --> 01:42:30.774
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to let it because why it's a massage chair.

01:42:30.794 --> 01:42:33.897
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm just going to sit here and let it hug me enjoy the vibes, right?

01:42:33.917 --> 01:42:35.138
[SPEAKER_00]: The vibe of magic.

01:42:37.180 --> 01:42:40.323
[SPEAKER_01]: And then finally we have him going.

01:42:40.783 --> 01:42:45.948
[SPEAKER_01]: Going through the different channels and stuff like that because they wind up jumping into the TV.

01:42:48.538 --> 01:43:02.391
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the news report and then, uh, then you also have this other thing down to you that plays out with this preacher talking to the devil is behind you or something like that, and then perimeter.

01:43:02.831 --> 01:43:07.816
[SPEAKER_01]: perimeter perimeter and it's the damn chair.

01:43:08.913 --> 01:43:20.115
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, okay, and then they go through it, and then they do the whole time montage of all the stuff that go through, but I laughed my ass off every single time I see it, even though it's totally ridiculous.

01:43:20.855 --> 01:43:21.496
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, God.

01:43:22.176 --> 01:43:28.277
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, before four is gum hit every single news cast that this existed exactly.

01:43:29.317 --> 01:43:37.539
[SPEAKER_00]: And why are you screaming at the beaver like for real, hey, beaver, what the hell is he going to do right?

01:43:39.226 --> 01:44:00.518
[SPEAKER_01]: Then you have more war to people who the hell are these people coming through and then you have a lot of other stuff and then finally the newscast people are like this distance in people have been seeing horse pinker and Jonathan come through every single station all of a sudden now that he's at the news room.

01:44:10.375 --> 01:44:15.903
[SPEAKER_00]: see there, here is how you actually rebuild this franchise.

01:44:16.644 --> 01:44:27.098
[SPEAKER_00]: Also, or, you know, if you had actually properly ended the credits after horse, was able to transmit himself into a television signal, then you have a sequel where Jonathan's trying to escape.

01:44:27.879 --> 01:44:31.261
[SPEAKER_00]: all of technology because Horace is hunting him down through the technology.

01:44:31.601 --> 01:44:38.384
[SPEAKER_00]: So Jonathan becomes this weird unabommer type personality, living in a law cabin completely off the grid.

01:44:38.444 --> 01:44:45.008
[SPEAKER_00]: How is Horace going to get his electric signal out to finish off Jonathan, which is a much more interesting style of stuff.

01:44:45.108 --> 01:44:47.149
[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of like the most in the machine.

01:44:47.169 --> 01:44:49.790
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you're trying to escape technology

01:44:51.631 --> 01:45:01.515
[SPEAKER_00]: Because there's a serial killer who has become electricity itself, how do you live off the grid as long?

01:45:01.655 --> 01:45:04.857
[SPEAKER_00]: Because it's not like he's out there killing his own food, is he?

01:45:05.017 --> 01:45:05.577
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

01:45:06.017 --> 01:45:09.339
[SPEAKER_00]: How long can Jonathan stay off the grid to stay away from Horace?

01:45:09.779 --> 01:45:12.420
[SPEAKER_00]: That is a much more fascinating film.

01:45:12.760 --> 01:45:16.542
[SPEAKER_01]: Because then even, let's say for instance, he decides to get rid of his TV set.

01:45:19.528 --> 01:45:20.288
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that point.

01:45:20.828 --> 01:45:24.469
[SPEAKER_01]: So you can use the signal from the radio to get through to him.

01:45:26.910 --> 01:45:27.310
[SPEAKER_01]: Somehow.

01:45:27.650 --> 01:45:30.050
[SPEAKER_01]: So that would be a fascinating thing, too.

01:45:30.590 --> 01:45:36.752
[SPEAKER_00]: Imagine if his cabin is near some farm land and the farmer decides to put up an electric fence to keep the candle in.

01:45:37.432 --> 01:45:39.432
[SPEAKER_00]: All of a sudden, an electrical current.

01:45:39.612 --> 01:45:40.432
[SPEAKER_00]: What is that?

01:45:40.752 --> 01:45:42.313
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, all of a sudden, horrors has found him.

01:45:44.899 --> 01:46:03.230
[SPEAKER_01]: But no, we, instead, we get this and then after that, we get him go, then you have rather don't slip in through fast forward and rewinding pinker, you also have the people who are actually trying to show that John is not being framed, they get spooked out they leave.

01:46:03.691 --> 01:46:08.254
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, it's just not my style, that's just not the way I like to do.

01:46:09.054 --> 01:46:13.517
[SPEAKER_01]: And it just pauses pinker after he wants to think, this is from my family, this is for this.

01:46:14.605 --> 01:46:38.090
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Adam Sandler called he wants his remote control back for click to because this is where it kind of falls into that comedy thing like he's moving the remote control around in order to like beat chorus, you know, that is his own game, but I'm sorry, the remote control doesn't work that way and if it did, it would affect you too because you're also in the TV signal.

01:46:38.870 --> 01:46:48.395
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, because that's also what I was thinking too, even if Jonathan did escape on time and they cut the power, he would still be stuck in that camcorder.

01:46:49.256 --> 01:46:53.538
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, no matter what, I mean, camcorders got battery.

01:46:53.838 --> 01:46:58.001
[SPEAKER_00]: So maybe he stuck inside the camcorder, but not necessarily in the TV signal.

01:46:58.401 --> 01:47:01.523
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not like that's going to a satellite truck or maybe it is.

01:47:01.563 --> 01:47:04.224
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe there's a cable that's going to the satellite truck and he's able to do a lot of work.

01:47:10.872 --> 01:47:12.634
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, are you dreaming again Jonathan?

01:47:12.674 --> 01:47:13.214
[SPEAKER_00]: What are you seeing?

01:47:13.234 --> 01:47:14.355
[SPEAKER_00]: You're dreaming Jonathan?

01:47:15.676 --> 01:47:17.137
[SPEAKER_00]: Can you focus a little Jonathan?

01:47:17.157 --> 01:47:18.058
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm trying to get this shot.

01:47:18.438 --> 01:47:19.439
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, it doesn't feel right.

01:47:19.639 --> 01:47:20.480
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't feel right.

01:47:20.500 --> 01:47:21.661
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just wrong.

01:47:22.441 --> 01:47:23.923
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and it's 1989.

01:47:23.963 --> 01:47:27.405
[SPEAKER_00]: That's like beta camera 3.4 regimeatic kind of tapes like that.

01:47:27.766 --> 01:47:29.487
[SPEAKER_00]: You are now stuck on a magnetic tape.

01:47:29.667 --> 01:47:30.888
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, that's electricity too.

01:47:30.968 --> 01:47:31.509
[SPEAKER_00]: Why not?

01:47:32.429 --> 01:47:33.490
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, exactly.

01:47:33.550 --> 01:47:35.632
[SPEAKER_01]: And let them do get out in a VHS tape.

01:47:39.740 --> 01:47:42.783
[SPEAKER_00]: You're doing it on beta max, almost and beta max is obsolete.

01:47:42.823 --> 01:47:44.084
[SPEAKER_00]: VHS is taking over.

01:47:46.867 --> 01:47:54.235
[SPEAKER_00]: You're sent out to like some kind of garbage pit with the rest of the Atari 2600 ET video cartridges because you're obsolete.

01:47:55.076 --> 01:47:59.380
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, which sucks because now you're obsolete and therefore you can't do anything now.

01:48:00.221 --> 01:48:01.503
[SPEAKER_01]: And you're just being reformatted.

01:48:02.835 --> 01:48:04.855
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, God, there's a story in there.

01:48:04.895 --> 01:48:10.077
[SPEAKER_00]: You might be in trapped in some kind of media format that becomes obsolete and gets sent into the dumpsters.

01:48:10.477 --> 01:48:16.118
[SPEAKER_00]: But then there's some like revisionist retro kind of culture that brings that technology back.

01:48:16.178 --> 01:48:22.159
[SPEAKER_00]: And someone finds that tape with you on it and is able to release you into a brand new world with all these technologies.

01:48:22.179 --> 01:48:22.639
[SPEAKER_00]: No, okay.

01:48:23.179 --> 01:48:23.539
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?

01:48:24.280 --> 01:48:25.900
[SPEAKER_00]: There were, he was spirits in the E.T.

01:48:25.940 --> 01:48:29.121
[SPEAKER_00]: cartridges that are in the landfill, and then they come back because Atari 2600 is cool.

01:48:34.143 --> 01:48:35.364
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:48:35.384 --> 01:48:36.604
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's a much better story.

01:48:36.765 --> 01:48:37.465
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll be honest with you.

01:48:37.485 --> 01:48:39.706
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a whole lot better story for a sequel.

01:48:40.367 --> 01:48:40.867
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

01:48:41.848 --> 01:48:46.030
[SPEAKER_01]: But now we actually have gotten going through the camera.

01:48:46.690 --> 01:48:48.532
[SPEAKER_01]: You have Rhino who cuts the power.

01:48:49.352 --> 01:48:51.874
[SPEAKER_01]: Then finally everybody doesn't have power.

01:48:51.954 --> 01:48:52.974
[SPEAKER_01]: Everybody's outside.

01:48:53.735 --> 01:48:56.616
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they're all looking at the stars.

01:48:56.837 --> 01:48:59.758
[SPEAKER_01]: And then there's there's Allison.

01:49:00.739 --> 01:49:02.180
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I like how he's looking at this guy.

01:49:02.200 --> 01:49:02.960
[SPEAKER_01]: You see that Allison.

01:49:03.380 --> 01:49:04.301
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I do.

01:49:04.641 --> 01:49:06.502
[SPEAKER_01]: And then cut roll credits.

01:49:06.622 --> 01:49:07.243
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, what?

01:49:07.803 --> 01:49:16.965
[SPEAKER_00]: See, oh, this is where had Horace stayed in the electrical signals and Jonathan had to go off the grid and get off the grid.

01:49:17.005 --> 01:49:21.646
[SPEAKER_00]: Finds a place that's completely off the grid and then looks at the stars and Allison still with him in spirit.

01:49:21.886 --> 01:49:24.226
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, that I can get behind, right?

01:49:24.586 --> 01:49:35.048
[SPEAKER_00]: But the minute they turn the power back on Horace should be come back because I'm sorry, there are, there's a thing called capacitors in electrical pieces of equipment that store energy.

01:49:35.809 --> 01:49:54.137
[SPEAKER_01]: Even adapters, they can even use charging cords and stuff like, you know, there's other avenues to actually use, but this actually feels anti climatic and I get and it's feels like it's like, okay, we have to kill the babysitter, which is the TV, which is why everybody's stuck inside the house, not noticing what's around them.

01:49:54.757 --> 01:49:54.937
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:49:55.829 --> 01:50:07.380
[SPEAKER_01]: So in that's when I seem like it's the next message, but using it as a serial killer kind of vibe, it, I don't know, it just, I just didn't like this ending as much as I wanted it to.

01:50:07.901 --> 01:50:18.632
[SPEAKER_01]: And then even whenever he winds up, having the fight with horse and stuff like that too, I didn't really feel like I was on the edge of my seat at all.

01:50:21.658 --> 01:50:28.294
[SPEAKER_01]: Now that we've stripped away the nostalgia, now that we talked about this, now that we actually decided to make different sequels out of this.

01:50:31.534 --> 01:50:36.255
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope someone listens to this episode and says these are some really good ideas.

01:50:36.295 --> 01:50:58.440
[SPEAKER_00]: Let me go get a no pad and some pen because I do I do think that there is there's a spark in the idea of a franchise centered on a killer turned into electricity through a malfunctioning electric chair and then use that electricity to then seek vengeance on those that may be

01:51:02.582 --> 01:51:29.696
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a franchise that could be built out of shocker, not through this movie, but if you take the idea of shocker, the idea of a horse-pinker type killer and redevelop it into a modern world that where everything is technology, there is absolutely a way to bring this franchise to something that is that feels modern, fresh and very, very

01:51:32.170 --> 01:51:32.691
[SPEAKER_00]: Bankable.

01:51:33.211 --> 01:51:39.077
[SPEAKER_00]: I think something that's shutter would be able to make bank on a franchise like this.

01:51:39.437 --> 01:51:44.983
[SPEAKER_00]: Why isn't for all the retro nostalgia of some of these franchises?

01:51:45.744 --> 01:51:49.908
[SPEAKER_00]: And yes, they're going after the big name franchises and no, I recognize that the

01:51:50.499 --> 01:52:14.957
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, the remakes of Friday the 13th and the remakes of Nightmare on Elm Street didn't do as well, despite some of the good aspects of those film don't try to bring back something that everybody loved go grab something that people forgot about and then exactly build it and then make it better because there are so many films out there in the genre and in this kind of realm where it's like

01:52:15.757 --> 01:52:25.422
[SPEAKER_00]: It could be okay, it needs some tweaks, it's maybe not as good and very much a victim or at least a creature of its time because shocker very much does feel like a movie.

01:52:25.442 --> 01:52:26.923
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a release in 1989.

01:52:27.183 --> 01:52:30.725
[SPEAKER_01]: It really does, but it feels like the 80s and it looks like the 80s.

01:52:31.125 --> 01:52:44.036
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, but there are aspects of this film that would translate to a 2025, 2026 kind of release, bring that back as horror enthusiasts will sit there and go back at it.

01:52:44.357 --> 01:52:51.523
[SPEAKER_00]: And the nice thing about that is that if shocker was ever remade today by any streamer or even by any production company that will put it into the theaters,

01:52:52.103 --> 01:52:57.687
[SPEAKER_00]: That's going to rebuild nostalgia for the film, and you're going to start to see shock or show up on site.

01:52:58.328 --> 01:53:03.392
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly, on aplex or on a two-be or something like that, because there is going to be nostalgia for it.

01:53:04.112 --> 01:53:11.598
[SPEAKER_01]: Right, and also two, man, like, I really think that Blumhouse should have went on ahead and tried something with it.

01:53:12.098 --> 01:53:13.699
[SPEAKER_01]: Get about the Halloween franchise.

01:53:13.719 --> 01:53:17.222
[SPEAKER_01]: Try to do something that didn't work the first time.

01:53:17.867 --> 01:53:28.334
[SPEAKER_01]: and make it better versus making a Halloween movie that was perfect and what Jamie Lee Curtis and do something different.

01:53:29.306 --> 01:53:35.007
[SPEAKER_01]: And let me tell you how I would do tomorrow and today's been, I would do this streaming and technology angle.

01:53:35.207 --> 01:53:48.911
[SPEAKER_01]: Imagine pinkers spreading through Wi-Fi, smart TVs, or social media, haunting people through the devices instead of television signals that update would be the concept of terrifying relevance, but also the visual effects and symbolism, though, man.

01:53:48.991 --> 01:53:54.652
[SPEAKER_01]: With today's visual effects, the channel hopping finale could be a brilliant metaphor for media overload,

01:53:59.794 --> 01:54:03.158
[SPEAKER_01]: And Wes Craven was ahead of his time with that idea.

01:54:03.178 --> 01:54:07.042
[SPEAKER_01]: And then also too, we also talked about the classic reboot, right?

01:54:07.062 --> 01:54:07.763
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

01:54:07.863 --> 01:54:17.634
[SPEAKER_01]: So in the middle of our world, things to scream and Kevin the woods, shockered with leaning into a absurdity, embracing the camp in the commentary with it.

01:54:19.488 --> 01:54:21.370
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it doesn't have to be Horace Pinker.

01:54:21.390 --> 01:54:35.723
[SPEAKER_00]: It can be someone else who is somehow finds themselves turn into an electric signal or turn into a data signal by a malfunctioning attempted an execution.

01:54:36.103 --> 01:54:40.427
[SPEAKER_00]: And then maybe his Jonathan Parker that happens to have an inkling of this.

01:54:40.487 --> 01:54:42.109
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe Jonathan Parker has become

01:54:43.070 --> 01:54:53.362
[SPEAKER_00]: an advocate against, you know, mass media because of all the things that he went through because he had to avoid electricity because of because of Horace Pinker, right?

01:54:54.223 --> 01:54:59.009
[SPEAKER_00]: You can have a retro nostalgia vibe for a film like this and make it modern.

01:54:59.369 --> 01:55:17.163
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're right, like the number of people you see on, you know, on downtown streets and whatnot, completely glued to their phones and not paying attention to the real world, it can become a secondary message to a shocker reboot by saying get out of your phones and get back to living in the world.

01:55:17.644 --> 01:55:18.404
[SPEAKER_00]: And come around here.

01:55:18.805 --> 01:55:21.246
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it leads into a bunch of

01:55:26.030 --> 01:55:46.152
[SPEAKER_00]: monitored or recorded in some kind of way thanks Google for all the ads for the random things I say just near my phone I needed to see all those advertisements but you know you're every moment is tracked by something but what did there was a killer in the signal that could track you along with it so the idea of people

01:55:48.061 --> 01:55:53.828
[SPEAKER_00]: unable to put down their phones, unable to disconnect, and that becomes the room down vault.

01:55:53.988 --> 01:55:55.770
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a brilliant idea for a film.

01:55:55.790 --> 01:55:56.811
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

01:55:57.773 --> 01:56:01.998
[SPEAKER_01]: So, what would you actually give this as far as a modern day rating?

01:56:02.979 --> 01:56:07.845
[SPEAKER_00]: As far as a modern day rating, I mean, you have to take a look at this for what it is, right?

01:56:09.449 --> 01:56:32.216
[SPEAKER_00]: A modern day remake, if done right and done properly and done, you know, very much, you know, with the bases that we were just kind of talking, but I think that would fit into like an eight and eight and a half kind of thing, you know, like going back and taking a look at this film, yeah, we've had a bunch of laughs kind of talking about some of the absurdity of this, I think I like this movie more because it's so absurd looking back at it, but I think.

01:56:33.080 --> 01:56:47.948
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, the pieces are there for a modern reboot, and if they ever did, and they made it with a bit more of almost social commentary on media dependence, then I think it does sit in that eight and a half kind of realm.

01:56:49.689 --> 01:56:50.049
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

01:56:50.069 --> 01:56:54.732
[SPEAKER_01]: For me, I gave it an eight, I'm going to have to go.

01:56:55.447 --> 01:57:00.012
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe a little bit down because of my love for it and I still like it.

01:57:00.092 --> 01:57:04.637
[SPEAKER_01]: I still wouldn't watch it even if it was on cable or streaming if I saw this was like the first thing on.

01:57:05.799 --> 01:57:12.086
[SPEAKER_01]: Prime I would go and click on it because I like it that much so I'm going to least going to go down to like a 6.5.

01:57:14.105 --> 01:57:26.453
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think my original sex is probably still around where this film sits for me kind of thing, but again, this is why I say that sometimes having a movie there are podcasts that looks at movies that are

01:57:28.022 --> 01:57:45.022
[SPEAKER_00]: on fairly maligned or sometimes just that bad, you know, it's, it's a fun to talk about because we've now spent two hours sitting here, you know, and it has been some educational diet type about the metaphysics of everything and the symbolism and all.

01:57:45.362 --> 01:57:52.104
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we haven't had to sit here and you'll have the sources and cyclopedias in the entire Funk and Wagnos collection to make sense of everything.

01:57:52.124 --> 01:57:53.905
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's on a puzzle box.

01:57:53.985 --> 01:57:56.866
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not a meta commentary on reality.

01:57:57.306 --> 01:58:08.430
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a goofy, fun, not-solacious, slasher kind of- It's a serial killer horror film that has a whole ton of heavy metal in there for you.

01:58:14.212 --> 01:58:15.453
[SPEAKER_00]: and it gave us something to enjoy.

01:58:15.733 --> 01:58:18.014
[SPEAKER_00]: We found good things to say about this film.

01:58:18.314 --> 01:58:20.195
[SPEAKER_00]: We had a good laugh while we were talking about it.

01:58:20.255 --> 01:58:34.462
[SPEAKER_00]: And I swear to God, I would watch a bad movie like this, sometimes more that I would rewatch a good movie because there's just something fun about watching something that is so close that could have been right but was so wrong.

01:58:35.645 --> 01:58:44.156
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree, even though they hit Mr. Marker for this movie, they got a lot of stuff that I could actually just let just turn my brain off and enjoy still.

01:58:44.176 --> 01:58:46.880
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you know, and I really like it.

01:58:46.960 --> 01:58:48.161
[SPEAKER_01]: I really like this movie a lot.

01:58:48.201 --> 01:58:49.002
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll still go ahead.

01:58:49.022 --> 01:58:52.527
[SPEAKER_01]: I bought it on 4K for crying out loud and there's a reason why.

01:58:53.171 --> 01:58:54.171
[SPEAKER_00]: You're a brave man there.

01:58:54.932 --> 01:59:02.554
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I bought this on 4K and then I rented it on YouTube because it didn't come with a digital code and I was just trying to cook.

01:59:03.014 --> 01:59:09.116
[SPEAKER_01]: So, but I did was I went on ahead and just rented it on YouTube for like four bucks.

01:59:09.397 --> 01:59:10.257
[SPEAKER_01]: So there you go.

01:59:10.889 --> 01:59:13.692
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, complaining with that man, but that's like it's fun.

01:59:13.872 --> 01:59:19.217
[SPEAKER_00]: I love watching a bad movie and I have loved what rewatching this film and having a good chat with you on this one.

01:59:19.317 --> 01:59:19.637
[SPEAKER_01]: Me too.

01:59:19.937 --> 01:59:20.418
[SPEAKER_00]: Me too, man.

01:59:21.098 --> 01:59:23.801
[SPEAKER_01]: Well guys, that's going to be it as far as this show goes.

01:59:24.121 --> 01:59:26.483
[SPEAKER_01]: And thank you again for listening to the podcast.

01:59:26.543 --> 01:59:28.625
[SPEAKER_01]: Get your audio podcast for you guys.

01:59:28.665 --> 01:59:30.847
[SPEAKER_01]: Get your audio and always until next time guys.

01:59:31.268 --> 01:59:31.388
[SPEAKER_03]: Bye.

02:03:21.009 --> 02:03:21.850
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you.