You Gotta Watch These Bitches

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Speaker 1: Welcome to j dot IL, a production of I Heart Radio. What's up? Everybody is the Lady General Scott. It is a pleasure to be here with you. I am with my sister friends, Layah sat Claire. Hello everybody. That's my favorite accent and the fantastic age a great and Danzla. What we're gonna talk about today? Yeah, oh man, look still got a pain on that thing. It's a pain on that thing because can our front Bill Cosby added a lot to our existence. He really did, came front on it, came front on. It. Don't go right because I made the I made the fat Albert joint. Yeah, yes, and I felt considering everything that we're talking about. But the bottom line is, I mean, she's right. These are things that kind of cultural things that are kind of stuck in our heads, you know, and and it is what it is. You still shouldn't drug people and take advantage of them. That's just a fact. So I'm just gonna say that, but like, no, you should not. Those are things you shouldn't do. But it's cool. I mean, I'm just saying, I'm just saying there was there was a lot of contributions there, but you absolutely should not drug people and and touch their parts. No, no, no, no, don't no no. I don't know if it's a song for that, but I don't know that. I tell you it's a lot of predators out here. How about that Amen's aid to the mint. It's a whole bunch of them, and you'd be surprised. Cool folks are. I just saw a video an actress on YouTube not too long ago, um, and she was like tongue kissing this little boy in the mouth. Boy was like fifteen years old. This was a long time ago. The video was very long a time ago, but nonetheless, I just saw it for the first time yesterday and I was like, damn, she was just tongue kissing a little boy over and over again in front of other grown people, and they laughed at awful, it's all funny. It's so funny, but it's really not. It's not funny at all. Look at that young Oh yeah, that's that's the langua that goes around it. That hurts my stomach. That makes me sick. Actually, I got two sons. We got some you know sons around and you don't even gotta have a son. It's sick. It makes my stomach kurt because it's it's like the things that we call normal, the things that we call okay, socially acceptable, to be so comfortable with harm makes me sick. But you know it's not. It's not I looked at his harm. It's not looking as harm at all. I've I've asked. You know, I have a lot of male friends, and you know, I talked to them about how their sexual life began, and most of them, and I'm going to go on the high end of most. I'm going to say about a good eighty five percent of the men that I know all started their sexual experience with some grown woman. It wasn't an adult woman, it was a teenager just older, the babysitter. I've heard this story a million times to Jim, It's a common story. We hear it all the time. I just had this conversation to day Jail because we full discretion. Jail had brought this up in a meet a while ago, this this this topic, and so I literally just asked one of my male friends today, like, so, did you lose your virginity to an older woman? And he was like, most definitely I did, right, And I will admit to, like before I really started to get home into men and their like their real humanity. There was a part of me growing up where I would be like, uh, why dudes always tell that same lie? They always flexing, Like that's the way that I that's the way I processed that information at first, was just like you're always lying, Like why y'all? To she was okay, I got you, you know, of course she did, you know, And so it's like, you know, so there was a lot of we just have a way of dehumanizing men, that is that makes it possible for something like that to happen unchecked like that exactly. I think a lot about this, um because I have a son. I'm gonna tell you what happened. I'm just gonna tell you. Okay, my girlfriend has a son, her and her husband and a beautiful young man. Hadn't seen him in a long time, and you know, he grew a lot, and I was like, that's wow, mummy's looking great. Go ahead, young man, I'll see you in my mind. And I caught my mind. No no no, no, no, no no no no. Hello. If your girlfriend or your her husband his friend could hear what you just thought, they'll probably punch you in the face and you would deserve it. Get yourself together, like, oh it's I'm not saying you can't see. You can see. But there's a difference between doing something and not doing something about what you're seeing. You know, this is still a child, you can still see it in their eyes. Nonetheless, I wanted to talk about this today because it just seems like it's, um, there's something going on with the men um that we know. Listen. I had to pull up I had to pull up an expert. You know what I'm saying at the grab have a friend who can speak further about these things, UM than I possibly could. I'm just paying attention to what I'm seeing. Um. I've asked my friend, Dr Thurman Webb, who is the CEO and founder of Centered Person Consulting and Associate Professor of Psychology at Tendency State University. He's also the life coach for for several young men that I know, including my my own son at the time as well. He's a part of my village and he's someone that I deeply love and trust and definitely consider a friend. And I called him. I called him, I said, what's out Webb? Hi, Dr Webb. I'm fantastic. Look, I wanted to talk to to a man about this because we you know, Agent Grad danver And and myself, um, we have sons and Dr Webs has two boys of his own as well, and I just wanted to talk to you, like, what are you what are your thoughts about so many young young men being um, having their first sexual experience or their fifth or whatever the case may be with a grown ass woman. Yeah, what's going on? It's as popular as you all are thinking in this moment? Absolutely, you know what I mean. Like it's one thing that identified the elephant in the room, is another thing where you don't have a label for the elephant that's in the room. And this is one of those things. Right, So that ain't that ain't sexual, saw, that's not it's not moment, it's not it's not all the things that it's all of that, right, But it's there's a socialization that happens with young men that like when we when we're putting masculine energy on them, they're not allowed to be victims. Right, So when we see that is that not patriarchy absolutely, but like we would be remissed if we weren't saying that that's not constantly influencing the way that we exist in this world. Right, it ain't right, but it is. And that thing like it, even when we're trying to combat the system, we inadvertently support it. Right, So they're not allowed to be victims. Um, the vulnerability is not allowed to show up either, because when you go to share the story, believe it or not, it does matter how attractive she was, right, And so like the vast majority of men that I've talked to who have had sexual encounters, you'd be surprised how many of those women were married with kids, and and these individuals who are fourteen fifteen years old, right, So there's another deviation happening there because like what and and these are people who are having their first sexual experience. It does something to your physiology and how you understand it because you don't have enough experience to context to allige that sensation you're feeling as pleasure. Right, So so that's that throws the whole system off, like, because how can I please a woman? And this is just a new feeling that I'm feeling altogether. But the thing is, she's not in it for pleasure. She's in it for the trick of it, right, She's in it for the turnout of it. So it's it's almost a power it's a power play because what could she possibly be getting from someone who has no experience this is their first time. However, she finds satisfaction to repeat that act. This what you're how you're explaining this sounds almost identical to the way we describe it when it happens to young girls. I think it's so. I mean, like the language you're using about it being our power and not sex, about not being able to contextualize the pleasure that you feel. These are all things that I just it's I'm sorry, I mean interrupt you, but this is sad to me that we don't then use the same language when we talk about boys in this particular kind of experience. It's it's it's molestation as sexual assault. Yeah, but it stops in about the situation if the situation stays the same. But are the way we talk about it is what changes? It stops being about that and it starts being about us, And then you inadvertly become complicit. And that's what a lot of older black men end up doing. The younger Black boys who are trying to make sense of this new feeling and why it felt exploited. How because keep in mind, I have to sacrifice a piece of my innocence in order to get into that intimate space, Like that's the trade off to get the insight. I gotta give up some of my innocence. But how can I talk to that and black men we ain't been vulnerable about it? And then we want to pack you on the back, like you hit that you got into that. So now I can't even have a decent conversation around the stuff that I'm feeling. And technically it doesn't seem like as much you can do from a black female perspective, because there's certain things you need to be validated too. But if we talk, if we talk about it and it's aggressive sense, and we say that that's rape, go at the young man, what rape is the vast majority gonna say, when when a when a man penetrates a woman? All right, cool, Now that doesn't apply to the woman raping him. So he don't even have a working definition for rape, for what rape looks like on him. But I think that's that's part of a huge misunderstanding we have around what rape culture and what rape is period because women, I mean, well, all people who are assaulted end up in a situation where they have a difficult time trying to express what has happened to them because there's a lack of language and understanding around what actually happened to them. And it doesn't surprise me that boys find themselves lost in this moment because I mean, you said something that that really touched me, where you said when you put masculinity on the experience, then it doesn't allow them to feel like a victim because to be masculine is is does not align with being victimized exactly. And so that that act becomes the initiation for the next sexual acts that they follow, right with a girl who is probably their age exactly. And guess what happened though, because there's not a lot of experience there, they mimic the power differentiation. WHOA. Then they get into something with somebody who's kind of you know, in the same bracket, and then they want to dominate that space, and then it stops being about pleasure and intimacy and all that. They keep in mind, you're still young in your sexual experience that's new to you anyway, Hell us a lot of adults that they figured that out. But now the best thing that you have is to mimic the dominance that you experienced. M We're gonna take a quick break and then we'll be right back. You know. I saw this interview with d Ray Davis, a comedian and I'm only saying his name because he has been, you know, pretty public about it. And he said that some adult person um or someone that was older than him forced him to go down her when he was a kid, like somewhere between the ages of nine and thirteen years old, and because of that, it triggers something in him. And he said, you know, he doesn't matter how much he loves a woman or or how much he wants to be with her or to please her, that is something that he cannot do. And I can't imagine how many young men, or how many men in general, who have had that kind of experience where they were forced to do something that, um, they clearly are too young to be doing, first of all, especially and especially with the dog on adult you know what I'm saying, Or somebody way older than them, their baby said, or somebody that was put in charge of their hair. So you it made me think like, damn, maybe maybe there's a reason why there's an animosity towards women if this is the first, you know, experience of so many males, you know, maybe there's there's a reason why, Yeah, I'll give you, um, I'll keep giving you babies and not take care of them and not take care of you. Maybe that's why I strain you along for for years and years as much as I possibly can and not commit to anything. Maybe there's a real reason why men may not really like us that much if this is their first experience. You know, you were like, like, man, we we there's something that happens that we call psycho sexually arrested. So like when you when when that happens you, you get psycho sexually arrested, which means that your sexual response is that of the wounded child. So you respond to that sexual situation in the same way of when the abuse actually happened to you. So it's almost like an intimacy aversion, just like you have taste of versions, and then that's the thing that you show up with like to this day, you know, just a little disclosure because of my colleges. I cannot smell hypnotic or alas a like. It puts me in a bad way, you know what I mean. But and and so when I smell it, it automatically catapulsts me back to when I had no control of it coming back up. The intimacy of version happens the same way. And so you show up as that child again, like that vulnerability of that child, you know, that innocence that we referred to earlier, Like that comes back up. And as a man, one of the things that masculine energy says to us is that I should and I have to be able to protect myself. But as a child, you couldn't do that. So you don't want to be in that position again. And then and then, because the music and the TV shows hyper sexualized men in such a way, you know, they're getting all of all of pussy, just getting it all. It makes me feel like it makes again makes me feel like maybe they just don't like us, you know, maybe they've had such had an experience that um prohibitive prohibits them from giving the damn for instance, it's too general. Because I'm trying to understand, I feel like there's a little hat for going on. It's not that they don't like women, they don't like the feeling, and so like, I don't like the feeling, so I got to do the things to avoid the feeling. The feeling is the universal thing, like that may not have the same experience that elicited the feeling, but I can meet you at the feeling, right, We say that all the time, But I don't like the feeling. And when we're talking about something as specific as intimacy and sex and how I came to like the only way like to get in that space, which is celebrated by most men, elicits that feeling. So that at a version has me like, I can't be vulnerable in that space. I have to dominate the space because the vulnerability feels weak. And the reason why we we vilify vulnerability is that oftentimes, and maybe the thing that you're thinking about women, is that we vilify vulnerability by then calling vulnerability a female or a or a feminine trait, and that makes it therefore weaker than being masculine. So it's like, if vulnerability represents womanhood or femininity, and and then we say femininity is beneath or lower or not as strong as masculinity, then of course who wants to be associated with that. So there's the feeling, and then there's also kind of like what we tell young people or young men that that feeling projects. So it's like, I don't want to feel this feeling, and I definitely don't want to project feeling this feeling in public because then I'm not a man, or then I'm not you know, and I just reject everything that's not manly. I watched this movie called Notes on the Scandal. I don't know if you guys have ever seen this. It's with Um Dane, Judy Dench and Um I can't think of the other name. Lady's name who I adore. I think she's fantastic actress. But what happened in the movie is that a teacher, Because you know, they're getting arrested every month for for having sex with some little boy in their class. It's happening a lot. We can't ignore this. Anybody who's got a brother or a son or nephew, you gotta watch these bitches. I'm sorry I said what I said, You gotta watch these bitches. You cannot leave everybody alone with your child. We say this stuff about our daughters, or we can't leave our daughters with everybody. That's right, we also cannot leave our sons with everybody. Yes, you gotta watch people, period. But also we have to consider the fact that we assume also certain things about femininity that it's also nurturing. So we leave children with women because we believe them to be more nurturing than men. So if we if if we actually left our children with people who were actually nurturing, regardless of their sex then or gender, then we would be in a different place. We would be judging people who needed to be around our children based on their actions and not based on just what they show up as. And that's that backdoor support of patriarchy. You see, you inadvertently supported the system because I expect the female to be the nurturing individual as if she can't hunt to oh s, sorry, And that's that's exactly what's happening. You see it all the time, and you wonder, you know, I know, I wonder. I'm like, why is why is this? Why is this inability? It can't just be because you didn't see healthy relationships. That's not the only reason. You know, if if you're heterosexual and you know you want a relationship with the think you might want a relationship with the woman, Like what what is What's what's the big halt? And if the reality is most of the men that you know have been sexually assaulted by some woman. Hi, So when you take that shame and that humiliation from being sexually abused and you asked him to revisit that moment to prove his masculinity, of course he's gonna show up anger, not at the woman, but at the moment. See, that's so much complexity and simplis city. So when we look at a simple act of intimacy, the complexity is at all about the experiences that informed that moment. He's bringing all of that rage and that anger to that Why because he shows up as the protector he wished he had when he was abused, So he knows he on the scandal not to not to. I just wanted to just bring it back here. The woman that was was having sex with the with the young boy. Two things happened. One of them made me very happy. The mother, you know, finds out and whoops that ass And I I appreciated that moment because I feel like that's fair. The other thing is I believe she ended up having to go and spend some time in jail. Now, Agent I had this conversation and her being an abolitionist or in the journey to be an abolition so there's no jail time. I also feel like sexual predators may need to have their weapons taken around. Oh Lord Jesus, I don't. I don't like people that that that mess around with kids. I just can't. I can't do that. I can't do that. You also know that those kinds of perversions are not necessary that you know, it's not about the sex, it's about the you know, the power. Okay, three things. First of all, Okay, so prison as a general rule does not do anything to actually stop crime or or stop people from wanting to do crime, or fixes them or anything. Prison as we know it does not accomplish that. So there's to say that someone should do jail time because that then aligns with the emotion that you're feeling at the time, because you you what you want is reciprocity and justice, and you only choose the one thing that you have at your disposal, is is an emotional response that doesn't actually you know, fix your issue. So that's the reason why I'm like, well, go to jail. That's our goal to put into jail. Second, with castration or something like that, we live, I mean, until we fix the society we live in. You and I both know that something like that will more likely happen to brown women, and more likely happened to brown women who may or may not be guilty. But because that's an option and a tool for white supremacist, capitalistic society, they're gonna use it on us with impunity. They're just gonna say, you know what fun it she needs to have hercuch you sold up, or her clitter is cut off or whatever it is. That's what that looks like for a woman. And they've and they're already doing this to us and have a history of doing this to us. And it is a tool that is is a tool of torture that though in the emotion of wanting justice, and let me just say this, you can I think this is yeah, but I think I think this is RD lorrid. So forgive me. But she said, you can't dismantle the Master's house with the Master's tools. You need different tools. You need different tools. You can't you can't utilize these tools. And that doesn't mean that I don't think, Well, what about in this situation when this this teacher is pregnant by one of her students, Because we say that a question, where are you aligning yourself dr webbing these solutions? How you feel about this? For me, that's a it's a slippery slope. Like even if we were to cash straight or we were just just sew up that, you know what I'm saying that the private parts, like it doesn't stop the mentality that initiated the behavior, Like we gotta address that, you know what I mean? Because what we what you gotta realize such sexual abuses, overt covert violation of value, like so like people are gonna do what they want to do even if they got a lot to do it, right, That's why they jails are fool Anyway, The aversion will manifest itself a different way, all right, So if you if you want to speak spiritually or travelally, like generational curses really ain't as mythical as as some of these religions make them out to be. It's this ship right here, when you passed on the aversion without it being confronted and checked. So now I learned my intimacy and I call it intimacy. I'm calling it something that's not. And then I'm showing up with you talking but let's be intimate. And then I'm trying to choke it or I'm trying to you know what. I'm like, I'm not giving you your full range of comfort, but I'm calling that intimacy and that's not what it is. But I passed that alone. And now I'm patting my son on the back like, oh, you slept with a twenty six year old you fourteen. Don't tell your mama. You see that, that's that generation. I passed that on again. We'll be right back, so can I can I just say this, And this is what we talk about all the time, is that you call ulture is one of the biggest hardest systems to break down because culture and language is so important. When you're passing along different things within your culture that's say this is intimacy or this is okay, or this is how you say this to use the word the language or the word intimacy and then and then attach it to behavior that's toxic and rat and ratchet and raggedy. Then this all just continues this again and again and again, and so I guess what I'm trying to say is I'm riding with Dr Web on this because at the end of the day, you have to address what's behind the harm. And I would say this much sometimes when I have the right word for something in my own kind of journey and healing, I can ask myself questions like, well, why do I want that? Or or why would I why would I allow myself to be in a situation that makes me feel that way? Or how do I not feel that way? Or what is it that I'm trying to get from that. So if the idea is that a person who is causing this har arm may not even themselves know that this is a power move or that this is about power, they having discussions with people about what power is and how it's expressed might actually help them understand that they can actually achieve that power in a different way. Now, I'm not saying that predators can be you know, fixed, I'm just saying that sometimes that the language empower not just for people who are victims, but also people who actually cause harm, can empower them in a different kind of way to not cause that harm. And let me say this, like you can't control the chaos, You control you and the chaos, right, And there is a way to to live in a world where you absolutely trust, and that is to trust things to be what they're gonna be. One thing that we have to do is to recognize that the lion is in the wild and what he does, just like we recognize the rabbit is out there and the gazelle is out there. All of them have their role, they do what they do. I can't stop a racist from being a racist, but you know what I can do put him on notice that he can't be a racist right here. You can say that word, you just can't say it when I'm around. Why because there's consequences and repercussions for that, and we need to do our predators the same way. You're not gonna stop all of them. However, part of my job to show up is like like I'm here to protect the tribe, the family, on here to support the queen. She's here to support the king, and we do that by keeping a watch. Nature is always giving us the cues on how to do this. Why because there's the certain things that exist out there, and that's just how it is right. So you gotta stand watch on your cubs, just like you stand watch on your daughters, your your male sons need that too. Why because the minute that you robbed them of the innocence of childhood and they have to show up as men when they're not, they generally get older and they start acting like children because they missed that part. So that don't they don't know what commitment is, they don't know what trust is, they don't know how to love. They want to play games. So why cause I get to do that when I was little. That means you also have to let little boys play. You gotta let little boys be little boys. You gotta let little boys laugh. You gotta let them. I mean, I can't tell you how many times and we grew up. Oh you acting like a girl? You you acting them? Why are you laughing? Why are you smiling all the time? You corny? You so and so? And we treat little boys like they gotta the rigidness of trying to hold up masculinity. I feel bad for boys because that's that's exhausting. That's why I'm kind of curious. I want to ask doctor this question, Like, because you are the age that you are, but you deal with, you know, boys of a certain age as well. Do you find that the language, now that there is language for certain things, that the conversation is slowing easier than it would with our our folks, with our generation, because basically, I mean, yeah, I mean that's that's a host of things that that I think in a lot of regards are over sexualized in our kids. But I'll tell you this, this is what people don't like. We don't want to lean into this. I see more sexually aggressive females than our do males. Well, they always tell us we got yeah, I got that right. But when the when, the when the sexual aggression is, we'll spit on it and put it in here this way, and he's looking like, what are you talking about? You know what I mean? And the dominance becomes like that same dominant shows up in that first experience. And keep in mind, y'allow, right, it's generally an older female. They may be teenagers, but she's generally a little older than the male from my experience. But I'm just saying, like even that that deviation of domination is showing up in the sexual females just as much as the male, Like, there's abuse happening on both sides, right, so we gotta we really gotta step it up. But again, we don't talk about the abuse and what it looks like on our young boys. And if we're not talking about it, then they're left to try to make sense out of it from an immature perspective. But again, if the if the image of the woman is constantly looked at as being docile, then we can't really look at how sexually dominant or aggressive women can be in our or even think about trying to better understand where it comes from. And that that starts to internal contradiction because we don't talk about that. But that's everything he felt. So how am I supposed to reconcile that? Right? Like right, right? Right? Not? That not a wisdom in my body. It's not matching the wisdom you're trying to put in my head. And those are two different wisdom, Like we gotta blend that. But let me just say this, Women not being docile has to be a truth that we accept across the board. It can't just be when we're talking about that they're victimizing young boys. We have to look at them as not docile period. Absolutely, because again I said again they women can hunt as well, and then a lot of as they hunt a hell of a lot, which is why they don't get caught up. And we don't even know these numbers. These numbers are scaring the hell out of me thinking about it, because I know already that boys don't even report sexual assault and god forbid, and and really their way of reporting It really is these conversations that we've been having with our men friends, is we're learning this data through them being, you know, just talking, just having casual conversation, and now we all have this social data around it, and it's scary. It's scary. So can we talk about that? Just the fault that it seems like the epidemic is the is this this way in which children themselves are just victimized. The children are some of the most unsafe people in the world. So so can I grab can we grab some friends and go? If they asked, like, what like something, I mean, I mean I mean something I need I need something. You We saw Antoine Fisher, right, and remember remember how emotionally disturbed he was, how he couldn't wanted to connect but didn't know how to that he had to go to therapy. We and that she folded her abuse into nurturing. She hid it in in the bullshit. I never forget at the end of that movie where he came to the door and she was like nigga, like she was happy to see them you home like that. I wanted to set her ablaze. I'm with you, Jill, I understand what that infuriated me. That that infuriated me, because that's the way I was just loving you. I was just taking care of you, making you happy. That's a movie, right, But we know what this happened to feel more slimy what I'm saying, But filmore slim has a story similar to that. Jay Brown had a story similar to that. Right, They was in these places getting that mind like blown, and then that was the foundation for how they interacted in every other relationship past that. And those are the ones that we know about because they're you know, iconic figures in their own right. But these things that happened to tell our little boys and they don't have that voice. So Steve Harvey had um I was talking about the girl who who jumped on him and tongue kissed him when he was a kid or whatever. You know, he's like probably like nine or ten years old, and he talked about it so much so that they brought the lady on the show. They brought her on the show and she stood up and you know, on camera, was like, remember me, I'm stuck the audacity right. How so to look at that machine? How how am I supposed to experience that abuse when a machine that big is celebrating my quote unquote initiation in the man? Well, yeah, that's a lot we're asking of a young man to speak against. So like we have to become accomplices to his poet. Can I say this, though, the system that needs to be dismantled is the same one that men benefit from. Two. So when we talk about that system in terms of the way that they benefit from it and presented as the same one that is on their neck and causing their vulnerability and their victimhood to be erased, then how do we make that connection so that there is an investment from from older men and at least kind of dismantling the systemic part of it. The culture part of it is one thing. But then there's this, like you said, this machine, but that same machine that dehumanized and humiliated Steve Harvey is the same machine that is consistently telling men that this is what it is to be a man, and that women are beneath this and this, that it's the same, it's the same one. It is the same machine. But I would push back on, like, but what's the benefit? You know, just because it's the norm, don't mean that that that that's the benefit for a human being, not for a whole man. It ain't, you know what I mean, Like, you're but you're right. The machine exists, and it does spit out the equation that way. Absolutely. But what we're saying, like if children were so resilient, then so many adults would need therapy. Oh yeah, I hate when people say children are resilient. So that annoys the crap out of me. What is the benefit? I don't like people saying women are resilient. I don't like that. I don't I don't like none of that. Ship When you say women are resilient, you're just celebrating how well they suffer. I be like, this's just that's ragged. But you know, the the humanity of it all is what I'm interested in, is how we can really start looking at each other like human beings. And when people violate your humanity, that that's that's the enemy. The enemy is the violation of your humanity. And then what steps do we take from there? More real talk after the break. So what what I got out of this number one is that we absolutely have to watch over our cups like it's it's just not a game. It's just not because we don't know. We don't know what's wrong with people or what happened in their in their life. We don't know, So we have to be really mindful of the people that we allow around their children. And then and then what what does punishment is? That? Is that what we're looking at? The punishment? I want to know how we show up for boys? How do we show up for these young boys who have already victimized? How do we who do we? Who? Do they need for us as adult women to be for them? First all? You know what I'm saying, we gotta, we gotta in our own way go against the celebration of this initiation, right and as as mothers um creating that space to really have that conversation. You know, I'm fortunate enough to be surrounded by strong women who are strong because they exercise their ability to create a palette where people can just have a conversation right about what that looks like and and what are the tricks that will be played how people enter into this space. Um, you know, I've been fortunate too through my practice to talk to pedophile, so I get an inside track on like what it looks like for them to whoa young women and young men, and like I bring that stuff home when I talked to my boys, like, yo, is this happening? Have you seen this? When you see this? This is what it's like? Like, Uh yeah, like what the narrative is? People are like why I wouldn't want to talk to a pedophile. When I talked to the pedophile and we had a conversation, like he taught me how he builds rapport so fast what a child like? I don't think like that, So he gave me inside like how he creates and makes things comfortable. He speaks to child's dialect, one that they can completely understand, right because as adults sometimes we talk over their head. Not to pedophile. He speaks to the things that that they find pleasurable at that developmental age, and those are the things that he used to lure me in. He uses their fear against authority to pull them in also, right as they want, they want to please, they want to be obedi hire, and he uses that, he leverages their their authority figures in that in that right, right, especially with children who have been taught to be seen and not heard to be following directions. Ultimately, when you tell a child to do what I say and don't ask questions, you are creating a follower. He knows that. So the other thing is like, we gotta sit down with our children and have critical conversations and allow them to develop their voice. Right. I tell my sons all the time, like, just because this person may hold the title of principle or vice principle does not mean that you stop being my son. So you tell them I ain't saying nothing till my father gets here, Right, I'll figure out the rest. Like, but you gotta he's gotta have the courage, both of them. And we talk about you know, Jil, We talk about this with the suns, like you gotta have the courage to stand in the moment until I get there, and when I get yeah, I'm coming. I can handle everything that's coming with me. But I just need you, like I gotta grow you so that you can hold the line until I get there. And you know, as mothers, we gotta teach our children, our sons to like hold the line. I'm coming to just hold the line. Man. If we can empower them to do that, I swear like that's that's going to change the trajectory, like with me and women look like in the tribe and the family, and that's what's going to change the narrative. Well, I think I think sometimes there's there's just a learning curve our parents didn't know. I mean, I feel like my mother knew to an extent because I did get that. You know, why you let them girls talk to you? Why you let them girls speak or have an opinion? People said this to my mother. I know this for a fact, you know, And I know that it's something that we as a as a generation struggle with because we want to give our child a voice. For a lot of us revert back to those old ways when it don't feel comfortable for us. When that child speaks up and they're speaking up to you. It's one thing to hold the line on somebody else, but when they have that opinion towards you. There's there's some pushback there, but I do think that, you know, as a group of parents, we're probably doing more of this than our parents did. As far as the young people that I know, they are definitely doing more of this. But I would say of the parents I know who have experienced children with their children who have been violated in some way, I would say, have the conversation earlier, because what has happened and what I've observed is that we're having that conversation with our young people when they're a little older, and we can really have it when they're much much younger. I think we underestimate how strong curiosity is, and so one of the things, and one of the is we combat that as much. Like you just said, you know, we have the conversation, have the intimate conversation, you know what I mean? Like I remember when my boys came to me one time and there's you know that their friends who at school talking about, you know, where he's gonna put his dick? And I said, all right, man, sitting ou let's talk about why, because that's that's one way we describe it under one dialect. And then we went through all the other names that you may hear it called. But I just need you to understand what's being said when it's being said, Like I want you to speak multiple dialects, because Daddy speaks multiple dialects. The way I talk on this show ain't the way I talked when I'm sitting in my living room when I'm you know, like, I got multiple ways that I'm gonna translate or get this message off. And there's two different things that happened. There's a translation that happens, and then the next like that has to be an interpretation of the translation. You can't just stop at the translation. Interpret that for me. Why Because I want to make sense of this information so I can claim it to be knowledge. That means that you can't go from fear. We've been talking to these kids. Immediately we get scared of the ship they're about to say or and then we respond with that fear response. You know what I mean. I talked to a parent like that one time. Um My daughter would and her daughter were like texting back and forth during class and one and it was like a picture of a joke or something somebody had but been over something stupid something that she just was like freaked out by. But the mom was very very churchgoing and things like that, nothing wrong withould be in church going. But the point is that she was so fearful of what this could possibly mean that she didn't even have no conversation with the children or thought that there was any context to it, which it was tons of it. But because me and my kid talked, now I found myself having to call his other parent who explain to her and talk to her about what I had a conversation with my child about. She hadn't even talked to her a kid. So I think it's a fear thing. I know we are scared as parents. I know some things can be like triggery for us because it's like okay, and you think, oh no, this, that and the other and this me and my kids this or this means their friends are this or bola blah. But we can't let the fear stop us from having these conversations and just listening and being open, because the kid knows when you're talking to them and you're just listening for the bad stuff or whatever you think means something, and then you you chime in with your crap. They actually want to believe that you're having a real conversation with them. I mean, they can feel it when you're not, and they will hold back. I really think I think kids will absolutely hold back there watching all your energy. Yeah, You've been surprised how many parents show up protecting their kids from the thing that they needed to be protected from. And so like, uh, you know. The analogy that I use is like, if I grow themselves, they think themselves need to be protected from. So like that's how we we. If I grew up and I was hungry, one of the things that I make a promise to my family is that you all never go hungry. So every time they walk in the house, there's food on the table, from meat to whatever you may call it. And my sons could be looking at me and they're like, yeah, that's cool. I'm like, you're hungry. They're like now. And then I going upstairs and they're sitting there, but they said, but that I'm thirsty. My experience was one that did that. You didn't. I'm dehydrated. You've been giving me food when my experience lash water. You know what I'm saying. So now I gotta open up my awareness and realized, like the time to save me in that situation has come and gone, which means I gotta I gotta make sense of that. I gotta get the lesson from that, open up my awareness to take any information and then truly provide what they need. So a lot of times when kids are asking you why, why why, it's not defiance. It's because when their brain develops, they're trying to connect the dots to understand what problem solving and conflict and critical thinking actually look like. And so we as people of color, especially in our community, we gotta get out of this or uh massive obedient or authoritarian space and we gotta sit down and help them develop their critical thinking muscle. What's the next iteration of that? I gotta be able to critically think in the critical moment. So it ain't even not enough for me to critically think. I gotta be able to do it in the critical moment. Why, because that is the thing that changes our trajectory. I'm gonna run. I'm literally trying not to get up out of this chair and run and run from the top. Listen, sir, yeah, sir, thank you. Thurman Ala Wishes Dante Jock Kuan Daniel Web you age a confirmed, it's official. That's all. Okay. Listen. If I give you a middle name, it's it's And if you get sat sir, wait, do I have a little name? Girl? You've had many many, you have had many. I've given you many throughout the course of this this podcast, Jill Rhodesia Scott look look here, family, j dot l is it's a podcast that we have conversations to spark conversations. It's been a while since I said that, but that's what this is. And we're we're here too to learn what you say live? Are you called it? Learning? Live learning, live learning, lives happening right now. We're discussing things and and and finding out, um, how much, how deeply and sincerely we have to pay attention and listen to our children, how much we have to share with them because these predators are out there. They really are, they really are. And sometimes they're in your church, sometimes they're in their school, sometimes they're amongst friends and these things. I still feel like the tribunals will come and whoop they ask. That's my feelings. I think in the in the middle of the time, you've gone too far, You've done too much shot before we get to the whooping ask portion, please talk to your children, Please talk to your sons. It's not just male predators, it's also female too. Okay. They are valuable and important and you know that. So keep your eyes open, keep your ears open, and uh keep your heart open. Okay, listen to them babies. Thank you so much, Dr Webb, and thank you so much everybody out there for listening again to Jay dot Ill the podcast. Be good, y'all. How do you eat an elephant? One by it time? Hey, listeners, it's Amber, the producer of j dot Ill. Today's conversation was intense and important. If you are anyone you know is dealing with sexual abuse, you can reach out to RAIN dot org. Rain r AI n N is the nation's largest anti sexual violence organization. I'll leave a link in the show notes. Also, if you want to connect with Dr web check out his websites at rebrand the black Man dot com and centered Person dot com. Or you can find him on Instagram at rebrand the black Man Alive. Links to his websites and the show notes. Hi, if you have commen so on something we said in this episode called eight six six, Hey, Jill, if you want to add to this conversation, that's eight six six nine five four five five. Don't forget to tell us your name and the episode you're referring to. You might just hear your message on a future episode. Thank you for listening to Jill Scott Presents Jay dot Ill. The podcast Jay dot Ill is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcast from I heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.