Gran Torino / Benchmark Single Barrel ft. Noah Gittell

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In 2008 director and star, Clint
Eastwood gave the world a gritty

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drama, about how to gain a
backbone and be a real man.

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In 2023, we return to a flight
of five whiskies from Buffalo

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Trace.
The film is Gran Torino.

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The whiskey is Benchmark, Single
Barrel.

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And we'll review them both.
This is the film and whiskey

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podcast,
welcome to the film.

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And whiskey podcast, where each
week, we review a classic movie

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and a glass of whiskey.
I'm Bob book.

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Look, I'm Brad G.
And this week, we are wrapping

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up our mini series of films, by
director, Clint Eastwood, with

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his 2008 film Gran Torino, Brad
before we dive into anything

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else.
Today I gotta get your like

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immediate reaction having just
watched this movie.

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Hmm.
Thoughts on these three Eastwood

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films, do they feel kind of like
of a peace?

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Do they feel very different from
each other?

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Like, are we going to have?
That are consistent throughout

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all three here.
That's an interesting question.

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I think that Mystic River stands
out partially because Clint's

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not in it like that definitely
makes a difference but Gran

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Torino kind of feels like, I
don't know.

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The the baby boomer version of
Unforgiven.

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Is that fair?
Yeah, I think so.

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Like like he's been around the
block a few times.

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He's back for one last Rodeo.
I think it's More like the you

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know, the greatest Generation
version more than even a baby

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boomer version.
But I'm with you man.

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You know, over the last couple
weeks I've been kind of kicking

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around this theory that I don't
know if it's really a theory or

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if it's just generally accepted
knowledge that ever since

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Unforgiven, his directorial
output has really kind of all

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revolved around the themes of
the effects of violence and that

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and violence can be interpreted
a number of ways and Unforgiven.

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It's, you know, literal handgun.
Murder violence in movies.

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Like No, changeling.
It's violence.

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That's inflicted upon people by
corrupt systems, in Mystic

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River.
It's sexual violence in this

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movie, it's racial violence and,
you know, the effects of War,

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which is something he also
touched on in the two movies he

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made prior to this.
I really do think when you view

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any one of these Woods movies,
post Unforgiven through the lens

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of, how is this movie about the
lasting impact?

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And effects of violence, it
really did help me reframe and A

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number of his movies, and it
actually gave me a much greater

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appreciation for this movie than
I would have expected coming

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into it.
Mmm, you know, Brad, I'd seen

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this movie when it first came
out and I thought that it was a

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much more simplistic and kind of
frankly, like, amateurish movie

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than some of the ones that he
had been making, you know, he

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wins the Oscar obviously for
Million Dollar Baby.

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And then he has this incredibly
ambitious back-to-back to movie

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stretch, where he does Flags of
Our Fathers and letters from Iwo

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Jima which Basically tell the
opposite sides of the story of

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Iwo Jima from the American and
the Japanese side of things and

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they're both really brilliant
movies in their own right.

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But for Clint to take on
something that ambitious

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especially at that age, I think
people will really like lauding

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him just for the attempt in that
way.

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And then Gran Torino comes out
and I think because it was so

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different and it seemed like
such a return to form and it was

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on such a smaller scale.
I actually think people swung

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the pendulum too far the other
way.

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And they weren't willing to go
along with Clint and what he

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wanted to tackle in this movie,
and they basically just

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dismissed it as like, oh, it's
Dirty Harry as an old man.

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Hmm, yeah.
I don't know if I would have

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thought about that especially
the Dirty Harry reference.

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I mean, I've only ever seen the
first Dirty Harry.

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So maybe there's, you know,
stuff in the other ones that

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would Point towards this being a
continuation.

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Yeah, I think it's more, just
like the, you know, Taking

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matters into his own hands, the
political incorrectness of it,

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like the fact that he's driving
a Ford, the fact that he's doing

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the growly Clint voice again,
you know, there's just a number

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of things that it seems like in
a lot of ways.

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I actually think he's using this
movie to comment on Dirty Harry

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and not relive Dirty Harry.
Yeah, that's interesting to me,

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I think for me, Gran Torino is a
movie that when I came into it,

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I knew almost nothing about
Clint.

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This might be My first Eastwood
film I've ever seen when it came

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out.
So this was like my introduction

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to Clint and I remember walking
away from this film just

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thinking, wow, He knows how to
play a racist guy, really well.

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That was that was my big doing?
Yeah, that was 18 year old.

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Brad's take away from this film.
We'll save that for Brad

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explains which we'll get to in a
minute.

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But before we get there, we have
a guest today.

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That's been patiently waiting
here on the other end of the

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line.
His name is Noah gittel.

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He's joining us for the first
time, he is a film critic for

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Washington City paper.
He has by lines, that have

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appeared in the wringer, the
Atlantic La Review of Books.

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He's been in jail.
Cue the guys been all over the

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place.
He's one of my favorite follows

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on Twitter, knowing how are you
today?

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I'm great and I was listening to
your theory with great interest.

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I'd love to know how Space
Cowboys fits into the

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consequences of violence,
violence against the ozone

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layer, man.
Come on.

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I totally forgot the Eastwood
directed that movie, he directed

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it.
He also directed Bridges of

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Madison County on this time.
Midnight in the Garden of Good

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and Evil.
I really like your theory.

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I just every every now and then
his filmography he stepped out

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to make like a kind of silly
movie.

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Maybe we just need to like bring
it a little closer.

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It's like every movie post
Mystic River.

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Follows this Theory, you know.
All right, so no is going to

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help us break down this movie
because Brad, if I'm being

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frank, I think this is the
trickiest movie of the three to

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review.
Even though last week's movie

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was about, you know, people
dressing as cops and Priests and

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molesting children and like this
movie.

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I think If you read it at
surface value or at surface

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level and face value, I think it
is hashtag problematic and I

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think you can easily dismiss
what the movies really trying to

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say because it is really deeply
buried in a.

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Not very good script and
underneath a ton of racial slurs

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and yet, however, I think
Eastwood is not just trying to

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comment on those things but he's
actively.

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Using that form to comment on
like he did with Unforgiven on

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himself, on his own career on
America.

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I really walked away from this
movie, having a ton of respect

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for what Eastwood did as a
director, especially like I

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said, taking a script that I
don't think is that good and

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doing a lot with it.
Well, I was just going to say, I

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think I think his presence makes
it better just be cut for all

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those reasons you know, when
Eastwood is in a movie, these

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days, it's not just a movie.
It's a comment on the evolution

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of the Eastwood Persona, you
know, he has been this symbol.

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Like, as you rightly point out
of violence of often American

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violence, sometimes of State
violence, you know, in the Dirty

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Harry movies.
And I think in the hands of

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someone else, you know, Roger
Ebert in his review mentioned,

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maybe one other person who could
have played this role would have

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been someone like James Garner,
but he points out, you know,

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he's probably too nice.
And Clint Eastwood is not really

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nice at his core, so I think in
the hands of anyone else, it

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would have been pretty close to
a disaster.

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But when you add this other
layer of, we are watching

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Eastwood comment on his own
Persona.

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That makes the whole thing go
down a lot smoother because

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we're almost a little detached
from it that way.

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I think it's a good point.
And I guess I want to ask you

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this because Brad, and I have
been like, circling the drain

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with it a little bit for the
last couple weeks.

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But Eastwood commenting on his
own Persona and in some ways I

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want to say condemning it but
definitely contextualizing it

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and you know, like in the case
of And it does seem like he kind

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of comes down on the side of
like sometimes these horrific

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acts of violence are necessary.
And yet you can't divorce

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necessary acts from the effect
that it has on a person's soul

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after the fact, even if it was
necessary.

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I guess my question is with a
movie like Gran Torino that came

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out to, you know, pretty
substantial critical Acclaim and

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was one of the biggest hits of
his career.

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Why do you think that for the
most part General audiences seem

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to miss the fact that That he's
commenting on these things and

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continue to read them as if he's
like, championing them.

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I don't does that.
Does that question make sense?

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Yeah.
I mean I don't remember what the

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reaction was at the time.
From the public.

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I mean this movie was it was a
big hit, so people liked it.

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But you know, did they like it
because they liked that he was

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racist?
Or did they like it?

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Because he stopped being racist,
you know, I don't actually know,

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but I do.
I do think the timing of the

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movie is really important.
You know, this film did.

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I'm out in 2008.
As you pointed out in December

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of 2008, a very significant
event happened in America in

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November of 2008, which was the
election of our first black

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president and I think maybe at
the time it was just a little

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bit hard to get past all of the
racial slurs and to get past the

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white savior as I'm, although
white savior ISM would would

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continue in film for some time
after this there aren't a lot of

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examples.
Where the character is really as

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kind of as bigoted, and as
Prejudiced, and as vile as he is

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early on, in this film.
And I think, you know, the film

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and come out 20 years ago, 20
years before that, it might have

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those.
Those things might not have been

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as much of an issue, but one
month after the election of

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Barack Obama, I'm not sure if
the academy was interested in

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this, I'm not sure people really
wanted to celebrate it, even if

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they kind of couldn't deny that,
it had a certain power.

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Yeah, the fascinating thing to
me is that you On a budget of 33

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million which, you know, Clint
always keeps himself on a low

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budget.
This made 148 million domestic

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and 121 million worldwide.
Wow.

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This wasn't like, you know,
coming in just under two hundred

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seventy million.
So it's not like this film only

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played in America, like it
played overseas and made some

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good money out there as well.
I think they like Eastwood in

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Europe, if memory serves and
this film was nominated for the

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says, are awarded like the
French Oscar's for they're like

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best non French film.
So amazing.

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They liked it, at least.
Yeah, I know that I think

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Eastwood shared con the year
that Pulp Fiction won the palme

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D'Or.
So like they have always really

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embraced Eastwood at not just as
an actor and like an icon of

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Cinema, you know, from the you
know, the coyote Cinema days but

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like as a naught or I really
think that they examine his

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movies at a much deeper level
than American audiences

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typically, do, and Speaking of
examining movies, really deeply

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our resident film critic here.
Brad G has seen this movie for

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what the second time.
Now Brad, I think this is my

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third time.
Okay.

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Wow, man, that might be a record
for you, dude.

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Yeah, but they very well, could
be.

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So if you're new to the show,
the conceit of our show is that

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I grew up a huge movie nerd.
Brad grew up, not watching quite

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as many films as I did.
And so, I took the opportunity

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to introduce him to some of my
favorite movies and some

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classics.
That he had as blind spots and

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we've just continued on with it
for Seven Seasons now.

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But what that usually means is
that Brad has seen the movie

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Just For the First Time and
because of that, we instituted a

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little segment that we like to
call Brad explains Brad's gonna

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give us the movie plugs with
only 60 seconds ticking on the

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clock.
So let's go ahead and do you

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take with this little segment
that we call?

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Brad explains?
That's right.

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Brad explains the part of the
podcast where Brad breaks down

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the plot of the movie that he
has just seen.

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Often for the first time Brad as
you know you get 60 seconds on

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the clock to explain the plot of
Gran Torino.

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I have my finger on the sensor
button ready to go because I

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don't know how much trouble
You're Gonna Get Us in with this

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movie but you have one minute
and go.

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Clint Eastwood is playing a
older gentleman named Walt.

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Kowalski Kowalski, who has just
lost lost his wife.

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He lives in a neighborhood that
has slowly changed over time.

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And largely has a minority among
population living in it.

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His new neighbors are a young
long family, who slowly, in

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Deers themselves to him, mostly
through the use of food and

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attention.
But he takes a young man named

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towel under his wing to help,
keep him away from the gangs

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that are trying to lure him in,
and this becomes violent.

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After a while, leading to
Clint's going to Shouldn't for

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the first time in probably
eighty seven years with a very

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young, crappy priest named
father Janovich.

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And he then goes and sacrifices
himself, like Jesus.

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So that Tau will be able to have
a future.

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Is that how the story of Jesus
goes?

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I mean, he lies on the ground in
crucifix.

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That's true.
Are cruciform.

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It is, yeah.
It's pretty hard to miss that,

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that symbolism there the other.
It says close to a Cyril white

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savior movie as I think we've.
Yeah.

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Well I mean and like the there's
like blood like spilling out

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from under his wrists.
Yes, like he like he got pierced

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in the hands for our
transgressions.

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Man, this is gonna go off the
rails real quick today.

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You guys.
We've got a lot to talk about

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Brad.
I'm gonna let you steer the ship

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here because there's a lot of
things I have many thoughts on

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this movie.
A movie that I will say, I liked

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quite a bit and was not
expecting to, after the first

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say, 35 minutes of this movie,
but there's many directions we

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can go.
So, where do you want to start

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today?
I, I want to get the bad stuff

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out of the way first so that we
can focus on the good stuff

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because I really do like this
film.

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But Just going to go out there
and say it.

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The only reason this film could
even come close to working on a

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just, just the film standpoint.
We'll get to all the the other

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things later.
But as a film, this would be

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like a sea movie if it wasn't
for Clint being a really great

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actor.
Yeah, and that's because the

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script is terrible.
The dialogue is terrible and the

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acting is terrible outside of
Clips.

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So I'm just going to put it that
bluntly.

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I don't know how you guys feel
about it.

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Well, I mean Cliff has been
doing this thing of late where

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he really likes to use untrained
actors in his movies.

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It's a very very neo-realist
thing.

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00:16:08,100 --> 00:16:10,800
He's been working on here and
this a culminated a few years

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00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:14,300
back, he did this movie called
The 1517 to Paris and it was

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about this real-life story of a
train that Got Hijacked and they

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were some American Marines or
some sort of soldiers on board

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that the war did the attempt and
Clint recreated this as a film

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using the real people as his
actors and it It's a difficult

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00:16:30,700 --> 00:16:34,300
movie to watch because they are
not good actors and it's like I

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00:16:34,300 --> 00:16:38,800
feel like that's a therapist
pipe dream like he paid you to

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00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:42,600
recreate the traumatic
experience, you had to go

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00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:45,200
through.
Let's talk about the right.

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So anyway, I mean in this movie
he does the same thing and

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there's move was completed in
like, 32 days.

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I think was the shooting
schedule and this movie, and we

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00:16:54,100 --> 00:16:56,700
talked a bit about this last
week, Clint likes to go at a

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Breakneck Pace.
He likes to use the First Take,

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00:16:59,900 --> 00:17:03,300
Almost always and never really
does a second take of anything.

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00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:05,800
And in this movie he said, it
was especially important because

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a lot of his actors didn't speak
English.

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00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:12,599
And so he was giving them basic
acting, 101 kind of things, and

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then would take what you got and
go into the next thing I guess.

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00:17:15,500 --> 00:17:18,400
My question is, why do you do
that?

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00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:23,200
Clint Eastwood because you're
right man, like I really think

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00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:27,800
that outside of Clint Eastwood
and maybe one or two bit Parts,

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00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:30,900
there's not very much.
It acting happening in this

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00:17:30,900 --> 00:17:32,300
movie.
Mmm.

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00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:36,100
It's very strange that he does
this as you point out because if

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you're going to use non-actors
or let's say first time actors,

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I could understand the value of
doing that if you wanted to

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00:17:43,300 --> 00:17:46,800
really shape their performance.
But Clint Eastwood does not do

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00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:49,400
that.
You know, he famously as you

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00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:52,000
only shoots one or two takes he
famously doesn't give his actors

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00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:55,400
a lot of Direction.
He doesn't even say action when

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00:17:55,400 --> 00:17:59,300
he started take because he wants
to keep everything as relaxed as

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00:17:59,300 --> 00:18:01,500
possible.
Well which also might make sense

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00:18:01,500 --> 00:18:04,900
if he was going for some sort of
naturalistic documentary feel in

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00:18:04,900 --> 00:18:08,000
his films, you know?
But this is like melodrama, it's

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00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:12,200
like myth and to have actors who
clearly are doing the first

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00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:13,800
acting they've ever done in
their life.

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00:18:13,900 --> 00:18:15,700
It just it doesn't make a lot of
sense.

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00:18:15,700 --> 00:18:18,400
No, not at all.
I mean, and here's the thing

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00:18:18,400 --> 00:18:20,500
though, Brad and I was kind of
texting you about this as I was

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00:18:20,500 --> 00:18:23,500
watching the film.
The two main, I do want to call

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00:18:23,500 --> 00:18:25,700
them kid actors, but let's be
honest like they're they're

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00:18:25,700 --> 00:18:28,200
probably teenagers.
So I'll call them the two main

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00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:31,600
kid actors.
I give a pass to in a lot of

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00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:34,500
ways because they at least to
this point we're not really

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00:18:34,500 --> 00:18:37,100
professional actors and I think
they've both had acting gigs

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00:18:37,100 --> 00:18:40,800
since then the one that really
got me is the guy that plays the

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00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:44,600
priest and we were talking about
this Brad you and I are very

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00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:48,000
sensitive to portrayals of
ministers on film as two guys

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00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,800
who went through Seminary and
are still very in tune with that

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00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:56,700
side of things, I appreciate
what Clint tries to do, or what

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00:18:56,700 --> 00:18:59,700
the script tries to do with that
character, but especially

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00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:02,800
Especially in the first 45
scenes, where the priest shows

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00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,600
up?
It's like he needed a second,

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00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:10,000
take man, because the dialogue
is so forced and so hard hard

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00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:14,300
for this guy to get through it.
Like, it was, it was a bad

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00:19:14,300 --> 00:19:17,500
performance, Brad.
Yeah, it really was.

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00:19:17,500 --> 00:19:22,700
I mean if he's trying to give a
honest, look at a really

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00:19:22,700 --> 00:19:26,700
awkward, you know, Catholic
priest, then man, he nailed me.

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00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:33,100
But as far as like a To the plot
and give you something just to

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00:19:33,100 --> 00:19:35,800
enjoy as you watch you know
because that's kind of why we

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00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:39,900
watch movies.
There wasn't much there, Bob, I

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00:19:39,900 --> 00:19:41,800
wanted to punch that.
I mean, maybe that was the

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00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:43,400
thing.
He wanted to punch the priest in

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00:19:43,408 --> 00:19:46,800
the face and I kind of did too.
I do think that's part of it,

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you know, and I did think we're
supposed to also be annoyed by

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00:19:50,100 --> 00:19:51,700
this priest and find him
insufferable.

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00:19:51,700 --> 00:19:53,800
But at the end we're supposed to
sort of admire him.

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00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:57,800
So, you know, and I didn't at
all, but I think I think maybe

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00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:00,600
maybe.
Maybe you're onto something

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00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:02,400
though.
I wonder if part of what's going

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00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:05,100
on is that he wants to be the
best actor in the movie.

364
00:20:05,100 --> 00:20:07,200
You know.
He wants the movie to center

365
00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:09,800
around him and he doesn't want
to be challenged.

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00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:11,900
I mean honestly that priest the
guy who played the priest he

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00:20:11,900 --> 00:20:14,100
looked like he was intimidated
by Clint Eastwood and I could

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00:20:14,100 --> 00:20:17,800
see that working for the
character but it didn't work in

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00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:21,900
the film because he's not a good
actor and I think maybe maybe

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00:20:21,900 --> 00:20:23,900
Clint's egos getting the better
of him.

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00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:26,700
In this case I won't step in and
defend him a little bit.

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00:20:26,700 --> 00:20:29,600
His name is Christopher Carly
the script does him.

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00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:32,200
Favors.
And this is especially apparent

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00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:35,100
towards the end of the movie
where the best scene featuring

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00:20:35,100 --> 00:20:38,800
the priest, as he comes over to
Walt's house after like this

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00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:40,400
horrific act of violence has
happened.

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00:20:40,500 --> 00:20:44,000
And basically, it seems like
he's consenting to or at least

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00:20:44,100 --> 00:20:47,300
acknowledging that Waltz about
to go kill some people and he

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00:20:47,300 --> 00:20:50,300
drinks a beer and he's like, you
know, like screw it, like what

380
00:20:50,300 --> 00:20:52,700
can you do kind of a thing and
it's like, okay.

381
00:20:52,700 --> 00:20:55,200
Like Clint is really showing
that this priest is a real

382
00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:56,600
person too.
And he doesn't have all the

383
00:20:56,600 --> 00:21:02,100
answers and then the very next
scene Clint goes back to church

384
00:21:02,100 --> 00:21:06,200
and it's as if the whole prior
scene hadn't happened, it's like

385
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:09,100
they relive the same
conversation and the priest has

386
00:21:09,100 --> 00:21:11,000
a completely different take on
it now.

387
00:21:11,500 --> 00:21:15,200
And I really threw me because
there was like, no link between

388
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:19,300
those two scenes whatsoever and
it almost seemed like you could

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00:21:19,300 --> 00:21:23,600
have had one or the other but he
used both and it really hurt, I

390
00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:26,100
think for me at least the
characters reputation and it

391
00:21:26,100 --> 00:21:29,700
also really negatively impacted
how I evaluated that.

392
00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:34,000
Let's yeah. 100%.
Like when he's yelling after him

393
00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:36,400
with, what are you going to do
Walt?

394
00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:40,000
And then, like you see him.
I don't know if it's the next

395
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:43,200
see, but soon.
After you see him at this house,

396
00:21:43,500 --> 00:21:47,200
where he knows that there's
going to be violence and he's

397
00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:50,300
like, imploring, these police
officers to say, stay and then

398
00:21:50,300 --> 00:21:52,900
their frog, marching him into
their car and leaving.

399
00:21:52,900 --> 00:21:58,700
And I'm like, that doesn't
happen in real life like that,

400
00:21:58,700 --> 00:21:59,600
like that.
See.

401
00:21:59,700 --> 00:22:06,300
In was the most egregiously just
dumb and should not have been a

402
00:22:06,308 --> 00:22:08,800
part of the movie.
The cops saying like we have

403
00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:11,100
strict orders to keep you
wherever we go.

404
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,800
Let go, you don't?
Yeah, let's just sit like the

405
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,000
taxpayers are not funding this,
come on man.

406
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,300
Well between that and the
confession scene it is almost

407
00:22:21,300 --> 00:22:24,900
like there was a late late stage
effort.

408
00:22:24,900 --> 00:22:27,800
We have to make the priest more
sympathetic or we have to give

409
00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:31,500
him more Authority in the Or
something and maybe it's just

410
00:22:31,500 --> 00:22:35,100
the filmmaker losing his nerve a
little bit or trying to satisfy

411
00:22:35,100 --> 00:22:37,200
a Catholic audience or something
like that.

412
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,300
Who knows?
But it does seem to come out of

413
00:22:39,308 --> 00:22:40,800
nowhere at that stage of the
movie.

414
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:43,600
So this is a good segue I think
into talking about the script a

415
00:22:43,608 --> 00:22:47,100
little bit and also going back
to Brad your initial statement

416
00:22:47,100 --> 00:22:50,100
that this movie doesn't work if
it's not for Clint and I think

417
00:22:50,100 --> 00:22:51,700
that's true, unlike a number of
levels.

418
00:22:51,700 --> 00:22:54,400
It doesn't work if not for Clint
because clinched the best actor

419
00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:58,500
in this movie by Leaps and
Bounds but also because without

420
00:22:58,500 --> 00:23:02,500
Clint in this movie, she then
this movie is not a commentary

421
00:23:02,500 --> 00:23:04,900
upon anything else other than
like what's on the page.

422
00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:07,900
And when you look at the script,
it's written by a guy named Nick

423
00:23:07,900 --> 00:23:11,600
schenk who then becomes kind of
Eastwood's go-to guy for his

424
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:14,900
last few movies.
He's had shank right all of them

425
00:23:15,300 --> 00:23:18,900
and he said that this script had
been kicking around Hollywood

426
00:23:18,900 --> 00:23:21,200
for quite a while and no one
wanted to produce it.

427
00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,700
And all of a sudden, Eastwood
picks it up, he films the movie

428
00:23:24,700 --> 00:23:26,600
in 32 days and then it comes
out.

429
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:28,900
And shank says that he went and
saw the movie and Eastwood

430
00:23:28,900 --> 00:23:31,300
didn't change a word.
The script and he was amazed

431
00:23:31,300 --> 00:23:33,800
like I can't believe this didn't
go through a bunch of revisions

432
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:39,100
and I think it's because
Eastwood is so concerned at this

433
00:23:39,100 --> 00:23:43,500
stage of his career with making
movies that allow him to comment

434
00:23:43,500 --> 00:23:46,100
on the things that he feels he
needs to comment on before he

435
00:23:46,100 --> 00:23:50,800
retires that the script kind of
doesn't matter to him.

436
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:54,000
Look I was thinking about this
with million-dollar baby when we

437
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:56,700
were re-watching, it for a bonus
episode that's coming up Brad.

438
00:23:56,700 --> 00:24:00,400
And that is a significantly
better script than This movie

439
00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:04,400
but I also don't know that
everything in that script is is

440
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:07,200
intended for East.
Like East was not intending that

441
00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:10,500
to be a commentary on everything
that he wants to do.

442
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,800
But he, he takes these scripts
that give him opportunities.

443
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:17,000
Like in this movie, it's an
opportunity to kind of go back

444
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:19,800
to The Unforgiven.
Well, and do the whole I'm

445
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:22,600
commenting on this phase of My
Life, The Dirty Harry's, the

446
00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:27,200
Vigilante kind of thing and the
effects of that, and I just kind

447
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:29,600
of Wonder like is that really
the best approach because I feel

448
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,200
Like Eastwood is probably a
smart enough guy that he could

449
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:34,600
have doctored this script a
little bit himself instead of

450
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:39,900
just taking it verbatim because
again like the first, I don't

451
00:24:39,900 --> 00:24:40,200
know.
Brad.

452
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:41,200
What would you say?
30?

453
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:45,200
35 40 minutes of the movie are
legit bat.

454
00:24:45,900 --> 00:24:50,300
Yeah, they are and it feels like
he just continues throughout the

455
00:24:50,300 --> 00:24:54,800
whole movie to just give you
little like, vignettes of what's

456
00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:56,500
happening.
And then there's an awkward

457
00:24:56,500 --> 00:24:59,500
transition and we're just on to
the next vignette.

458
00:24:59,700 --> 00:25:04,000
Of something that feels very
surface level.

459
00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:08,000
And I think that's the big
problem with no revisions here

460
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:11,900
on the script.
Is that every single part of

461
00:25:11,900 --> 00:25:16,200
this film, takes a lot of
digging to get to anything

462
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:19,200
meaningful.
And I think the reason this

463
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:23,800
works Bob, or I guess I should
say, I think the reason this

464
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,800
worked for the public, the this
is going to bother.

465
00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:29,000
I'm venturing into your
territory here.

466
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,200
Yes.
This not only, I could feel it

467
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:32,700
coming off of you right now,
man.

468
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:39,300
Yeah, this film plays well to an
audience.

469
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:42,500
That's just like, man.
Like yeah, we shouldn't be

470
00:25:42,500 --> 00:25:45,200
racist but like he's pointing
out some truths here.

471
00:25:46,300 --> 00:25:48,500
Yeah, but see, here's the thing.
And this is crazy.

472
00:25:48,500 --> 00:25:51,200
I feel like we are in opposite
political sides that we normally

473
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:54,300
are Brad.
Like, I really think that this

474
00:25:54,300 --> 00:26:00,000
movie is doing a lot more
covertly than it seems like it

475
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,000
is because everything seems
like, it's right out in the open

476
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:06,200
and, like, like you said, the,
the Jesus symbolism at the end

477
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:09,600
and the Very obvious racial
dialogue, that is throughout the

478
00:26:09,608 --> 00:26:11,700
movie.
But then you get like, little

479
00:26:12,300 --> 00:26:15,000
little things in the background.
Sometimes even the way shots are

480
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,000
framed.
Like, every time you see an

481
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:21,500
American flag behind Walt in
this movie, it's when he's doing

482
00:26:21,500 --> 00:26:25,500
something that is abhorrent like
it's when he's being racist or

483
00:26:25,500 --> 00:26:28,500
it's when he's threatening
somebody and it's this really

484
00:26:28,500 --> 00:26:31,400
interesting little thing that
Eastwood's throwing, any doesn't

485
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:36,500
comment on it, but it's like
only when Walt is doing things

486
00:26:36,500 --> 00:26:40,500
that we as Americans don't like,
you know, at least that we

487
00:26:40,500 --> 00:26:44,100
wouldn't admit that we like is
when he is showing American, I

488
00:26:44,108 --> 00:26:47,600
cannot, I cannot graffiti in the
background So like it's really

489
00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:51,100
interesting because I think that
you can read this movie in the

490
00:26:51,100 --> 00:26:54,800
most surface-level way possible.
But there is a lot going on

491
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,500
under the surface, but I think
that's the issue is that he

492
00:26:58,500 --> 00:27:03,600
didn't take the time with it.
The subject matter.

493
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:11,000
And the way the script goes
about, it is so difficult that

494
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,000
he needed to spend more time
with it to draw out those

495
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:16,800
nuances.
So that the audience would get

496
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:21,600
those things more easily, I
don't think anybody would from

497
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:25,700
the average movie-going
population would be like huh.

498
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:28,700
Every time he's an a-hole,
there's an American flag in the

499
00:27:28,700 --> 00:27:30,500
background.
I get it, I get it.

500
00:27:30,500 --> 00:27:31,800
You know what I mean?
Yeah.

501
00:27:32,100 --> 00:27:33,700
All right.
Noah you set us straight here a

502
00:27:33,708 --> 00:27:36,200
little bit.
Like I mean do you think that

503
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:38,400
there's a lot under the surface
here or do you think it is a

504
00:27:38,408 --> 00:27:41,400
pretty easy to understand,
surface-level movie?

505
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,200
No, I think you're both right.
I think it's what makes us both

506
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,100
an engaging experience watching
this movie and a frustrating

507
00:27:49,100 --> 00:27:54,100
one, I will say, I think we
might be giving him a little too

508
00:27:54,100 --> 00:27:59,800
much credit when we try to
determine the origins of his

509
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:03,900
methods of not changing.
The words of the screenplay, and

510
00:28:03,900 --> 00:28:07,500
not giving his actors, any
direction, and only doing one

511
00:28:07,500 --> 00:28:11,300
takes like, is it possible?
He just doesn't really want to

512
00:28:11,300 --> 00:28:16,100
do things like he's not just
wants to have a nice day at the

513
00:28:16,100 --> 00:28:19,100
office and go home.
I mean, I don't, you know, in a

514
00:28:19,100 --> 00:28:21,100
way that that's fine.
I mean, the movies turn out,

515
00:28:21,100 --> 00:28:23,600
okay?
But I do think they would maybe

516
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:26,500
turn out better.
If he paid a little more

517
00:28:26,500 --> 00:28:28,200
attention to some of the
details.

518
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,400
If he made, if he tightened the
script up, I think.

519
00:28:31,500 --> 00:28:34,100
You could lose some stuff from
this room, frankly, one of the

520
00:28:34,100 --> 00:28:36,800
things I liked a lot about the
movie because it's sort of a pet

521
00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:41,000
issue for me, is the the
portrayal of just what it's like

522
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:45,000
to be an old person.
You know, like the way his kids

523
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:47,200
treat him the way his grandkids
treat him.

524
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:51,100
I don't know that I'd ever quite
seen it portrayed that way

525
00:28:51,100 --> 00:28:53,200
before and yet, I think that's
quite realist.

526
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:56,100
I mean my wife is a realtor.
She sees people trying to kick

527
00:28:56,100 --> 00:29:00,000
their parents out of their homes
all the time and I really liked

528
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:02,400
that part of the movie, although
I don't I really think it was

529
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:04,900
necessary at all.
Like, I think you could have cut

530
00:29:04,900 --> 00:29:07,200
quite a lot of that stuff.
We didn't need to see his son,

531
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:10,600
calling him trying to get Lions
tickets out of him.

532
00:29:11,500 --> 00:29:14,800
If they had focused a little
more on the relationship with

533
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:17,600
the family, it really tightened
to stayed tight on that I think.

534
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:19,700
I think the film would have been
a lot stronger.

535
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,200
So it's one of those movies
where it's about, a lot of, a

536
00:29:23,208 --> 00:29:26,000
lot of things and he probably
didn't need to be about that

537
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:28,500
many things.
The only reason that works we

538
00:29:28,500 --> 00:29:31,900
keep coming back to this point
is, when you have a star, Our of

539
00:29:31,900 --> 00:29:35,900
his just absolute magnetism at
the center of had to kind of tie

540
00:29:35,900 --> 00:29:38,100
it all together.
Otherwise I think this movie

541
00:29:38,100 --> 00:29:41,900
goes off into a million
different places and and I do

542
00:29:41,900 --> 00:29:44,100
think there's some lovely
touches in the film.

543
00:29:44,300 --> 00:29:47,600
I noticed the American flag
stuff as well and and, you know,

544
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:50,400
I mean movie like this, isn't
that different than something?

545
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:52,400
Oliver Stone might have made in
the 80s or 90s.

546
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:56,000
This is a movie about the trauma
of war in many, many ways.

547
00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:59,400
And that's, that's, that's
probing, and that's thoughtful.

548
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:01,300
And we like those kinds of
movies.

549
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:03,800
But it's just so rough around
the edges.

550
00:30:03,900 --> 00:30:06,800
And if we're sitting here asking
if that's accidental, or if it's

551
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:08,800
on purpose and something has
gone wrong.

552
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:11,300
Well, I will say, like I'm going
to give Clint a little bit of

553
00:30:11,308 --> 00:30:13,300
credit here.
Because as I'm thinking about

554
00:30:13,300 --> 00:30:15,800
this movie and thinking to
myself, like, yeah, I don't know

555
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:19,600
of any any other filmmaker could
have made this even more overt

556
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:22,200
than Eastwood did like in
certainly not subtle and then

557
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,000
you said, Oliver Stone and I was
like oh there's one likely,

558
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:30,200
there's a guy who's known for
his subtlety, but I'm with you

559
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:32,300
man.
I think that this is not a long

560
00:30:32,300 --> 00:30:35,900
movie like it's an hour 55 so
I'm like that and yet, it feels

561
00:30:35,900 --> 00:30:38,600
like they probably could have
trim this down to like I'm tight

562
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:43,500
90 and, and really made it about
the core story here, hinted at

563
00:30:43,500 --> 00:30:46,300
the stuff with the kids dabbled
in the stuff with Catholicism,

564
00:30:46,300 --> 00:30:50,800
but the whole priest storyline
is really unnecessary everything

565
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:54,100
with his kids is really
unnecessary and I keep coming

566
00:30:54,100 --> 00:30:57,300
back to this idea of like the
35, 40 minute, Mark in the

567
00:30:57,308 --> 00:30:59,400
movie, being where it picks up
because that's where it becomes

568
00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:04,800
a very kind of traditional
Standard narrative, you know,

569
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:09,400
complete with Montage of him
mentoring this kid.

570
00:31:09,500 --> 00:31:11,900
And it's not till that
relationship gets established.

571
00:31:11,900 --> 00:31:14,500
And, you know, the character of
Walt starts to soften a little

572
00:31:14,500 --> 00:31:17,000
bit and there's some human
connection made there.

573
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:21,000
I found myself really enjoying
this movie from that point on

574
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:24,000
and especially that final
confrontation with Walt on the

575
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:26,300
lawn of you know the gang
members house.

576
00:31:26,700 --> 00:31:29,200
It's cut really well.
It's paste really well there's

577
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,900
some genuine suspense there.
I think the movie really starts

578
00:31:32,900 --> 00:31:37,000
to click in that last hour but
it's just so uneven in the early

579
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,900
going here.
We talked about his plan a

580
00:31:39,908 --> 00:31:42,200
little bit.
Yes, there is yes.

581
00:31:42,700 --> 00:31:44,600
So I just want to make sure I
understand it correctly.

582
00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:50,000
His plan was to get killed by
the gang in public in the hopes

583
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:52,700
that the neighbors would be
watching and be willing to

584
00:31:52,700 --> 00:31:55,200
testify against the gang.
Is that correct?

585
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:57,600
Yes.
Which, which relies on a lot of

586
00:31:57,600 --> 00:31:59,700
things because he thinks get
looked.

587
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:03,000
It looked like the Howard Beale.
Seen a network like everyone

588
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:05,200
coming to their windows and be
like, what?

589
00:32:05,300 --> 00:32:07,800
Because you have to imagine that
the neighbors have seen this

590
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,000
sort of thing a hundred times
before.

591
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:12,700
And not only are they going to
their Windows to look, they're

592
00:32:12,700 --> 00:32:16,000
like putting themselves in the
way of machine gun bullets to

593
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:19,100
check out what Waltz doing.
I don't like the plan makes

594
00:32:19,100 --> 00:32:21,700
absolutely no sense.
They've never seen Clint

595
00:32:21,700 --> 00:32:23,500
Eastwood do it and that's the
whole point.

596
00:32:26,100 --> 00:32:28,300
See, that's the thing they
believe in the white savior.

597
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,500
He's going to be the one to
actually stand up to Them.

598
00:32:31,500 --> 00:32:33,300
So they got to get a front-row
seat, man.

599
00:32:33,500 --> 00:32:36,600
I mean it makes sense.
It makes no sense but it the

600
00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:39,600
reason it works is because we're
not just watching it as a movie,

601
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:42,800
we're watching it as a Clint,
Eastwood movie and exaction,

602
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,600
we're watching him.
And instead of Unforgiven where

603
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:48,900
he uses violence to stop
violence in this movie, he

604
00:32:48,900 --> 00:32:51,700
refuses to pick up that gun.
He refuses to use violence and

605
00:32:51,700 --> 00:32:55,300
sacrifice himself instead and we
see that as an evolution and

606
00:32:55,300 --> 00:32:57,800
maybe a moving.
I'm moving Evolution.

607
00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:02,400
Do you think that the choice to
give him I would assume lung

608
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,800
cancer, almost takes away from
that sacrifice.

609
00:33:06,300 --> 00:33:08,300
I do.
Yes, he doesn't have to be

610
00:33:08,300 --> 00:33:10,900
dying.
That for me was the most

611
00:33:10,900 --> 00:33:14,300
confusing thing where I'm like,
if you really want to make that

612
00:33:14,300 --> 00:33:16,700
sacrifice meaningful, you
shouldn't make it like, well,

613
00:33:16,700 --> 00:33:18,700
he's gonna die in three months.
Anyways.

614
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:22,900
So I might as well die for this
kid that I kind of like like

615
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:25,800
there's just there's too many
little loose threads hanging off

616
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:27,400
of this plot.
They really good at hiding it

617
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:28,300
up.
I do.

618
00:33:28,500 --> 00:33:31,200
We keep coming back to this idea
of like the white savior movie.

619
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:35,200
And around this time is when I
think that the, the discourse

620
00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:38,800
started to really emerge about
white savior movies because the

621
00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:41,600
following year after this is
when Avatar comes out and that's

622
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:45,400
when everyone's like, you know
what, the Last Samurai Gran

623
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:49,000
Torino haven't talked like, it's
just like, everybody was, like,

624
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:51,000
done with these kind of movies
at this point.

625
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:56,000
I do think that in some ways,
though, this movie does comment

626
00:33:56,000 --> 00:34:00,900
on that a little bit, even while
using the genre or like the form

627
00:34:00,900 --> 00:34:05,600
of Because Eastwood is clearly
commenting on his Dirty Harry

628
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:09,900
Persona here, but the solution
is the exact opposite of what

629
00:34:09,900 --> 00:34:13,699
Dirty Harry would have done.
And for me, the key scene in

630
00:34:13,699 --> 00:34:17,900
this movie, the most moving
scene in this movie, is after

631
00:34:17,900 --> 00:34:22,199
his neighbor's house gets shot
up and the neighbor girl, Sue is

632
00:34:22,199 --> 00:34:26,800
raped and she comes home like
bloodied and bruised.

633
00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:29,800
And when she finally emerges
inside the house and Eastwood

634
00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:32,900
sees her for the first time he
drops his Glass, Eastwood plays

635
00:34:32,900 --> 00:34:35,400
that scene, beautifully.
But its first time in the movie,

636
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:37,699
that the movie like overtly
acknowledges.

637
00:34:38,199 --> 00:34:41,400
This guy's plans.
This guy's anger.

638
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:45,699
This guy's trauma and
woundedness from the war and

639
00:34:45,699 --> 00:34:47,800
thinking that he has to treat
everything as if it is.

640
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:51,600
The war is having this kind of
effect on other people and like

641
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:53,300
it.
He is actively screwing

642
00:34:53,300 --> 00:34:57,000
everything up for everybody else
and that's not the, that's not

643
00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:02,000
the kind of consideration that
you typically get in a Wait,

644
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,100
save your movie, which is like
my presence.

645
00:35:04,100 --> 00:35:06,600
Here is actually actively
hurting everybody.

646
00:35:06,900 --> 00:35:09,800
And I did like that they folded
in that touch because I don't

647
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:11,100
know what it looks like on the
page.

648
00:35:11,100 --> 00:35:14,300
I don't know if that realization
hits as hard in just the script.

649
00:35:14,300 --> 00:35:18,900
But Eastwood really did I think
make sure that that was felt,

650
00:35:19,100 --> 00:35:21,600
you know, from a director
standpoint, I think it's a great

651
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:24,100
great point and and you know,
obviously that plays out where

652
00:35:24,100 --> 00:35:27,400
he locks towel in the basement
and refuses to let him get her.

653
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:29,800
He realizes, this is something
he has to do himself.

654
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:32,800
I think it's well All done and I
think it does make the movie

655
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:36,200
complex, you know.
We'd also maybe gets a little

656
00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:39,300
bit of raced by the literal low
white savior as I'm at the end.

657
00:35:39,300 --> 00:35:43,900
You know, the fact that he does
that sacrifice I think is kind

658
00:35:43,900 --> 00:35:48,700
of overpowers any complexity in
some ways to the film but you're

659
00:35:48,700 --> 00:35:50,900
right that it's a nice touch and
that that moment stood out to me

660
00:35:50,900 --> 00:35:54,300
as well to drop into the glass
is really well directed that

661
00:35:54,300 --> 00:35:56,300
sequence to give it a lot of
impact.

662
00:35:56,900 --> 00:36:00,400
And I'm curious, because having
watched Unforgiven two weeks

663
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:05,600
ago, It was to me, I don't know
if this is an obvious homage or,

664
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:10,400
you know, reversal but
Unforgiven in order for him to

665
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:14,300
enter the game again, he has to
drink and you know, you have

666
00:36:14,300 --> 00:36:17,800
that great shot of him and the
kid and he just takes the bottle

667
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:19,500
and starts drinking when he
finds out.

668
00:36:19,500 --> 00:36:23,800
That Morgan Freeman is dead.
And yet here, he's drinking the

669
00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:27,000
entire movie.
And when does he stop drinking

670
00:36:27,100 --> 00:36:29,400
when he realizes, he needs to
take action?

671
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:31,600
Oh, interesting.
I just thought that That was an

672
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:33,800
interesting thing.
I don't know if Clint thought

673
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:36,900
about that, but I think that
we're probably thinking about

674
00:36:36,900 --> 00:36:39,100
this movie more than any three
people on earth have ever

675
00:36:39,100 --> 00:36:42,500
thought about this.
And that means that it's

676
00:36:42,500 --> 00:36:44,200
probably time for us to hit
pause.

677
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:46,300
Brad, we need to start drinking
this whiskey.

678
00:36:46,500 --> 00:36:49,800
The third in our lineup of
Benchmark products.

679
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:51,500
So we're going to try this
single barrel.

680
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:53,900
We'll come back, we'll talk a
little bit more about this movie

681
00:36:54,100 --> 00:36:57,000
and we'll segue into talking
about things we liked.

682
00:36:57,000 --> 00:36:59,200
So what do you say?
Let's get to it.

683
00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:04,500
So, here's the deal everybody.
We just absolutely love

684
00:37:04,500 --> 00:37:07,600
producing as much content as
possible for film and whiskey

685
00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:09,600
Nation.
But if our regular episodes

686
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:13,500
aren't enough for you, then you
can head on over to patreon.com

687
00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:17,300
film whiskey sign up for one of
our memberships and you will get

688
00:37:17,300 --> 00:37:19,800
a slew of extra content for your
listening.

689
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:24,500
Pleasure, check us out on
patreon.com film whiskey.

690
00:37:30,100 --> 00:37:32,400
All right, everybody.
Today we are drinking

691
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:36,700
benchmarks, single barrel, and
95 proof whiskey in this lineup

692
00:37:36,700 --> 00:37:38,900
of five that we've been drinking
the last few weeks.

693
00:37:39,300 --> 00:37:42,100
Yeah, we're slowly moving up in
proof point.

694
00:37:42,100 --> 00:37:45,300
We started at 80 proof.
We moved to 90 last week with

695
00:37:45,300 --> 00:37:47,000
the small batch.
Oh, you're right.

696
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:51,100
You're right. 86 to 90.
And now we're at 95 proof.

697
00:37:51,500 --> 00:37:54,300
I think this is the first time
I've ever seen 95 proof on

698
00:37:54,300 --> 00:37:57,000
something Brad.
Like I think you're right.

699
00:37:57,100 --> 00:37:59,900
Like I've said before, and I
think is 94.

700
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:01,700
Yeah, knives.
Yeah, 294.

701
00:38:01,700 --> 00:38:04,400
But never like right in between
90 and 100.

702
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:10,200
Yeah, good job Benchmark.
You do, you did it my wife and I

703
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:12,400
we shared this image back and
forth.

704
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:15,500
Every once in a while it's from
like, remember years and years

705
00:38:15,500 --> 00:38:20,700
ago, when cake fails was a thing
on, on the internet, like eczema

706
00:38:20,700 --> 00:38:21,900
got really.
All right, well, there was a

707
00:38:21,900 --> 00:38:24,800
whole website of like, people
that bought cakes from the store

708
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:28,700
and As Mrs. S on that on that
like Vine.

709
00:38:28,700 --> 00:38:31,000
Venae what was that website
v-neck.

710
00:38:31,700 --> 00:38:35,200
So there's there's an image of a
cake and it was supposed to say

711
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:39,500
like, congratulations.
And the cake says, Congressional

712
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,100
and then under Congressional it
says, you done it.

713
00:38:42,900 --> 00:38:46,300
It's a every time either of us
accomplishes something very

714
00:38:46,300 --> 00:38:49,200
small will just text each other,
the picture of congressional,

715
00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:50,500
you done it.
Yeah.

716
00:38:50,500 --> 00:38:54,000
So this was like a perfect
Congressional moment for bench

717
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:58,800
mauritians All right, I'm a
little nervous about this Brad

718
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,600
because we don't typically like
single barrels for the purposes

719
00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:04,800
of reviews and that's because
whatever.

720
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:06,800
You pick up on the Shelf, dear
listener is going to be

721
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:11,000
different than the barrel that
we're currently drinking and she

722
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:13,900
to, to do the our whiskey
segment as if you're writing a

723
00:39:13,900 --> 00:39:20,700
letter and like 1943, the French
front, my dearest Dolores.

724
00:39:21,900 --> 00:39:23,900
I raped.
I am to assuage myself of the

725
00:39:23,900 --> 00:39:25,500
guilt.
I feel from Okay.

726
00:39:25,500 --> 00:39:30,800
So anyway, I'm a little worried
about it is all I'm saying and

727
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:34,400
after last week, you know, we
were split a little bit because

728
00:39:34,500 --> 00:39:37,000
you liked the small batch more
than I did.

729
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:40,400
I like the top floor from week
one a little bit better and now

730
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,900
we're getting into Single Barrel
where some of the rougher edges

731
00:39:43,900 --> 00:39:48,300
of a barrel may not be rounded
out so much by blending, and

732
00:39:48,300 --> 00:39:50,900
especially since they're cutting
it down to 95 proof.

733
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:54,900
I just don't understand single
barrels that don't release at.

734
00:39:55,100 --> 00:39:57,000
Barrel strength.
And I don't mean to be like a

735
00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:59,700
barrel strength, snob about it
and there's always some good

736
00:39:59,700 --> 00:40:01,200
ones.
Like Russell's Reserve is always

737
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:04,600
really good at like whatever
that is 110 proof or whatever.

738
00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:09,800
That one might be but it feels
like 95 is a long ways off from

739
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,100
wherever the sparrow.
Yes, 100%.

740
00:40:12,100 --> 00:40:14,800
That's my issue with it.
I don't know, man.

741
00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:17,700
I'm ready to dive in.
Before we start sniffing this

742
00:40:17,700 --> 00:40:19,800
thing.
How much is it going to set you

743
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:20,500
back?
Brad?

744
00:40:21,500 --> 00:40:25,800
This is I think the most
expensive of the lineup at $5.

745
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:29,100
Wow, 25.
We have really upped it here

746
00:40:29,100 --> 00:40:32,600
from the 18 we said last week,
so yeah, you know, we do it for

747
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:33,900
you filming.
Whiskey Nation.

748
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,500
We spent 25 total American
dollars on this drop in the big

749
00:40:37,500 --> 00:40:40,000
bucks.
This seems like a Walt Kowalski

750
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:42,300
kind of bourbon though.
Like this, this seems like the

751
00:40:42,308 --> 00:40:44,600
kind of thing you reach for
after pounding.

752
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:48,000
Some pbrs on your porch.
Yeah, I was gonna say the the

753
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:51,800
fact that it has words after
Benchmark, I think would turn

754
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,200
him off to it.
I feel like I feel like he's a

755
00:40:54,200 --> 00:40:56,800
benchmark.
Kind of guy, $10.

756
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:58,500
Yep.
All right, Brad.

757
00:40:58,500 --> 00:41:01,100
What are you picking up on the
nose of this Benchmark?

758
00:41:01,100 --> 00:41:05,900
Single Barrel.
There's, there's stuff Bob.

759
00:41:05,900 --> 00:41:08,800
There's four for me.
It was Sour.

760
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:14,400
Apple, like a light brown sugar
like specifically, it's not a

761
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:18,000
dark brown sugar.
It's very light and ethanol.

762
00:41:18,100 --> 00:41:21,300
Yeah, I don't know if you've
ever gotten an ethanol nose

763
00:41:21,300 --> 00:41:23,800
before but, but it's here.
Yep.

764
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:25,800
Yeah, I mean, that's exactly.
What I'm picking up.

765
00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:28,000
When I first pour it into the
glass, it had.

766
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:32,500
This almost artificially caramel
smell like a caramel sauce that

767
00:41:32,500 --> 00:41:33,800
you get out of a jar for ice
cream.

768
00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:36,200
Topping caramel sauce.
Yeah.

769
00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:38,900
You know like the things they
squirt in your drink at

770
00:41:38,900 --> 00:41:40,600
Starbucks.
That's called caramel sauce.

771
00:41:40,700 --> 00:41:42,400
It's not caramel yes caramel
sauce.

772
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:44,600
Yep.
Yeah it's 100%.

773
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:47,000
It smelled like that and then
that went away and it was

774
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:52,300
replaced with the artificial
green apple like Jolly Rancher.

775
00:41:52,900 --> 00:41:54,900
Yep.
Just covered up in.

776
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:57,300
Oak and ethanol.
So, you know what it is.

777
00:41:57,300 --> 00:42:01,800
It's the, it's the green apple
caramel suckers that you buy.

778
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:04,200
I want to compare it to that,
but those are so much better

779
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:06,800
than this.
That is like, it's not fair to

780
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:09,700
the sucker, you know.
So I'm gonna give this a 6 out

781
00:42:09,700 --> 00:42:11,200
of 10.
It's not like a ffensive.

782
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:13,700
It's just there's not really
much here, and the ethanol is

783
00:42:13,700 --> 00:42:18,000
pretty prominent.
I'm at a five and a half, it's

784
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:21,200
okay.
When I got into the actual

785
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:26,300
palette, It got a little worse
like like it's still a sticking

786
00:42:26,300 --> 00:42:29,900
in that tart, green apple.
I got a little bit of cinnamon

787
00:42:29,900 --> 00:42:32,800
going on here and then there's
for me, it was just a lot of

788
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:36,000
corn coming through hell.
Yeah, man.

789
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:38,700
This is I'm sipping it live.
I know you've already tried it

790
00:42:38,700 --> 00:42:44,500
but Artificial green apple candy
and I've never tasted a whiskey.

791
00:42:45,100 --> 00:42:47,500
You know, I've had like Crown
apple and I, you know, we've

792
00:42:47,500 --> 00:42:51,000
tried A really lovely one from
Traverse City their Michigan.

793
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:53,900
Apple phenomena, dude, it's so
good.

794
00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:57,900
This doesn't have like the candy
flavor of that but it's just

795
00:42:57,900 --> 00:43:01,100
it's like the Lacroix of Jolly
Ranchers.

796
00:43:01,100 --> 00:43:05,100
Ha ha.
And really harsh ethanol to go

797
00:43:05,100 --> 00:43:06,600
with it.
It's it.

798
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:09,200
Mimics like a spiciness, but
it's not spicy at all.

799
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:11,200
I don't get a lot of baking
spice on this.

800
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:14,900
It's really just candy apple and
ethanol.

801
00:43:15,300 --> 00:43:17,900
And it's pretty right down the
middle with that again, not

802
00:43:17,900 --> 00:43:20,000
offensive, but just not really
that good.

803
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:23,900
And it's crazy to me that the
top floor was ten times as

804
00:43:23,900 --> 00:43:25,900
complexes this.
Yes.

805
00:43:26,300 --> 00:43:28,600
But once again I'm only going to
give it a 6 on the flavor.

806
00:43:29,500 --> 00:43:33,000
I give it a 5 on the flavor.
Bob I'm really struggling with

807
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:36,000
this one.
Compared to the top shelf and

808
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:39,400
these small batch this is
drinking a lot hotter than I

809
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:41,600
have proof.
I almost don't even mean to say

810
00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:44,700
hotter, but like once in a
while, we talk about this idea

811
00:43:44,700 --> 00:43:49,000
of the Kentucky hug, where your,
your esophagus cries out for

812
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:53,800
help as the, the whiskey travels
down it and this one, it is not

813
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,000
only, is it crying out for help
but like, I feel like, I have

814
00:43:57,000 --> 00:43:58,900
heartburn.
I feel like I need a Tums after

815
00:43:58,900 --> 00:44:01,900
this because of the way that it
is just like camping out in my

816
00:44:01,900 --> 00:44:06,500
chest and Buffalo Trace.
Does this sometimes usually for

817
00:44:06,500 --> 00:44:09,200
me, Buffalo Trace products
present as a little more okey

818
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:12,600
Then they are ethanol.
But man this one is just really

819
00:44:12,600 --> 00:44:16,000
heavy on the alcohol like
forward - yeah.

820
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:17,600
Yeah.
And that's why for me, the

821
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:19,600
finish.
I give it a 5 and a half.

822
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:24,800
It's almost like a soured Oak.
Little bit of vanilla, the the

823
00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:28,800
Tarts almost sour apple
continues on, through to the

824
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:31,800
end.
It's not a terrible finish, but

825
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:35,100
it's not great.
I had just a little bit left in

826
00:44:35,100 --> 00:44:38,000
the bottom of my Glencairn and
it's not like enough for a sip

827
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,200
but it's just enough to kind of
get the tip of your tongue wet

828
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:44,500
again.
And it was really saline heavy,

829
00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:49,000
like I didn't pick up on the
saltiness of it before but it

830
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:52,100
actually was a lot better taste
like salted caramel.

831
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:55,300
I just don't think that's really
present while you're drinking it

832
00:44:55,700 --> 00:44:59,500
and the Finish is almost
non-existent except for that

833
00:44:59,500 --> 00:45:02,000
Kentucky hug to remind you of
what you've just been drinking.

834
00:45:02,200 --> 00:45:05,800
There's nothing left on my It
except for some very, very

835
00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:09,300
subtle corn and Oak.
I'm just going to give it like a

836
00:45:09,300 --> 00:45:11,400
5 on the Finish.
Yeah.

837
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:14,200
And with balance I'll give it a
5 as well.

838
00:45:14,900 --> 00:45:17,600
It's just average all around and
there's nothing.

839
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:20,600
There's not enough complexity
and not enough good flavors here

840
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:22,200
to give it any higher on a
score.

841
00:45:22,300 --> 00:45:23,800
Yeah, I'm gonna give it a 5 and
a half.

842
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:26,500
I'm with you.
I again like I always feel bad

843
00:45:26,500 --> 00:45:31,000
giving anything like a five or
less just because we so rarely

844
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:35,000
actually go under the halfway
They mark on our scores Brad.

845
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:38,300
Like it's really rare that you
get less than a 25 out of 50.

846
00:45:38,700 --> 00:45:42,100
If you age a whiskey 24 years,
and put it in a bottle and it

847
00:45:42,100 --> 00:45:45,300
gets to our glass.
It's at least a 50 out of 100

848
00:45:45,300 --> 00:45:46,900
most times.
Yeah.

849
00:45:46,900 --> 00:45:49,900
And so, no, I'm with you, give
it a 5 and a half on the balance

850
00:45:49,900 --> 00:45:52,400
but you're right everything.
You've said I agree with that.

851
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:57,600
Brings us to value at $25.
This is terrible value, really,

852
00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:00,800
really bad value.
When you can get the Benchmark,

853
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:05,300
top floor for 15 bucks, that is
like week after week that thing

854
00:46:05,300 --> 00:46:12,200
is doing nothing but improve in
my mind this one is like A 3 out

855
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:15,200
of 10 on value.
That's that's what I give it.

856
00:46:15,200 --> 00:46:19,800
Yeah, I mean I will say to get a
Single Barrel Bourbon at $25 is

857
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:24,700
pretty much unheard of but
that's why this is a $25 Single

858
00:46:24,700 --> 00:46:27,300
Barrel Bourbon, hmm.
Like this would not be good

859
00:46:27,300 --> 00:46:30,300
enough to bottle under any of
Buffalo.

860
00:46:30,300 --> 00:46:34,200
Trace has other labels as a
single barrel and they just kind

861
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:37,200
of slapped Benchmark on it, to
indicate value.

862
00:46:38,100 --> 00:46:39,800
And I don't think it's a very
good value.

863
00:46:39,800 --> 00:46:43,100
I'm coming out to a 25.5 out of
50.

864
00:46:43,100 --> 00:46:44,400
Brad.
Yeah.

865
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:48,200
With that 3 out of 10 on value,
I'm coming to a 24 out of 50.

866
00:46:48,700 --> 00:46:51,800
Alright, so we are just at a
forty, nine point five out of a

867
00:46:51,808 --> 00:46:55,300
hundred, so we actually are
under that 50 Mark or a twenty

868
00:46:55,300 --> 00:46:57,300
four point seven, five out of
50.

869
00:46:57,500 --> 00:46:59,100
I am not going to recommend
buying.

870
00:46:59,100 --> 00:47:03,200
I am not going to recommend
trying with the small caveat.

871
00:47:03,900 --> 00:47:07,700
This is a single barrel so I
have no idea what the variation.

872
00:47:07,800 --> 00:47:11,500
In between barrels looks like
for a product like Benchmark

873
00:47:11,700 --> 00:47:14,700
where they're going for Value
Above All Else.

874
00:47:15,600 --> 00:47:20,400
Yeah, I think that it's safe to
say that this is a reject from

875
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:25,600
some other, you know, lineup and
that there's just other really

876
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:29,800
great values in The Benchmark 6
that are worth picking up.

877
00:47:29,900 --> 00:47:33,700
I mean, if I'm being very blunt
with you, Bob, I think I would

878
00:47:33,700 --> 00:47:36,800
prefer to drink ten dollar
Benchmark over this.

879
00:47:37,500 --> 00:47:39,700
I probably would, too.
I mean, I'd have to try them

880
00:47:39,700 --> 00:47:43,300
side-by-side but they are at
least comparable enough that it

881
00:47:43,300 --> 00:47:46,700
gets me a little angry to think
about the fact that Benchmark

882
00:47:46,700 --> 00:47:51,000
and this are similar.
And there's a fifteen dollar

883
00:47:51,300 --> 00:47:53,800
difference in price.
I think we need to demand our

884
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:57,400
money back from Party Source.
All right man let's get back

885
00:47:57,400 --> 00:47:59,300
into talking about Gran Torino
what do you say?

886
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:05,500
Let's get to it.
All right everybody that was

887
00:48:05,500 --> 00:48:09,100
Benchmark Single Barrel oh A
whiskey that we drank.

888
00:48:09,300 --> 00:48:12,800
We sure did.
And that's, that's pretty much

889
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:15,600
all we can say about it.
But yeah, that's it man.

890
00:48:15,900 --> 00:48:21,500
But now we will leave that
experience behind and we look

891
00:48:21,500 --> 00:48:24,900
forward to Canada's.
Favorite segments to fax in a

892
00:48:24,900 --> 00:48:31,300
falsehood, is gonna try to stop
you by all right?

893
00:48:32,100 --> 00:48:36,700
And what is wrong?
Two facts, in a faucet to facts

894
00:48:36,700 --> 00:48:39,000
in a fall.
This is the part of the podcast

895
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:43,500
where Brad presents three items.
As fact about the making of this

896
00:48:43,500 --> 00:48:45,500
movie.
One of which he has completely

897
00:48:45,500 --> 00:48:48,800
made up and it is my job to
determine, which one is the LIE?

898
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:52,700
Luckily, I have a guest here
with me today that I can use as

899
00:48:52,700 --> 00:48:55,600
a phone, a friend.
As we all know, Noah is an

900
00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:58,500
expert in the making of the
movie Gran Torino.

901
00:48:59,300 --> 00:49:02,800
So I'll be calling on him for
some help here, Brad.

902
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:04,500
I can't imagine that.
There were a lot of trivial

903
00:49:04,500 --> 00:49:05,900
things about the making of this
movie.

904
00:49:05,900 --> 00:49:08,000
Since it only took like five.
Days to shoot.

905
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:11,400
Yeah.
The the list was a little bit

906
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:15,500
shorter than most IMDb lists.
Yeah, I will say, important

907
00:49:15,500 --> 00:49:18,000
caveat.
We usually call these facts from

908
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:22,000
the IMDb trivia page.
So, you know, we're going to put

909
00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:26,100
the word fact in quotes on this
but only one of them was

910
00:49:26,100 --> 00:49:30,000
actually generated by Brad.
I was going to say that that's

911
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:33,400
the key thing.
Is that one of them I completely

912
00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:36,800
made up and the answer.
Some of them someone else out of

913
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:38,300
the internet.
Yes exactly.

914
00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:39,300
Yes, yes.
Yes.

915
00:49:39,600 --> 00:49:43,200
I hope you at least a bronze
that 90% of I am to be users

916
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:45,600
found interesting because that
seems to be a pretty good

917
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:48,900
measure.
Yeah, I love that like five out

918
00:49:48,900 --> 00:49:51,000
of five.
People found this helpful like

919
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:53,200
okay I'm sorry.
Sorry that my knowledge of this

920
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:58,600
movie wasn't helpful for you.
All right dude hit me with your

921
00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:03,000
two facts in a falsehood.
Alrighty, fax number one, Ford

922
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:08,200
Gran Torino as were built in.
This is my editorial comment,

923
00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:10,300
God.
God's greatest gift to mankind,

924
00:50:10,300 --> 00:50:14,100
the beautiful state of Ohio.
They were built in Lorain, Ohio,

925
00:50:14,100 --> 00:50:18,200
145 miles from Detroit Michigan.
Waltz truck could have been

926
00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:21,300
built in Wayne Michigan. 20
miles from Highland Park.

927
00:50:21,600 --> 00:50:27,100
Okay, fax number to waltz dog.
Daisy is actually Clint

928
00:50:27,100 --> 00:50:30,100
Eastwood's beloved family
retriever in real life.

929
00:50:30,100 --> 00:50:33,800
Hmm, what was what was the dog's
name Daisy?

930
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:38,200
Actually Daisy.
Oh, that was not a part of

931
00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:38,800
either.
ERM.

932
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:42,800
I'm making it up or the IMDb
trivia, that all right.

933
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:45,000
Cool.
Is this a fax?

934
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:47,200
Number three.
The production of the film was

935
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:50,400
delayed in early 2008.
By a few months due to

936
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:52,500
unforeseeable conflict of the
government.

937
00:50:52,500 --> 00:50:56,000
Bailout of the big three Motor
companies and the studio was

938
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:59,200
deciding whether or not it would
be profitable to attach the

939
00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:02,300
vehicles name to their movie.
So interesting.

940
00:51:03,700 --> 00:51:05,300
Huh.
Well, okay, hold on.

941
00:51:05,400 --> 00:51:06,900
Noah, you gotta help me out
here.

942
00:51:07,500 --> 00:51:08,400
Fun.
Fact about Noah.

943
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:12,300
This is an actual fact.
You used to be a, in the

944
00:51:12,300 --> 00:51:14,100
political realm.
That's true.

945
00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:19,800
So was the, was the bailout in
the Obama Administration,

946
00:51:19,800 --> 00:51:21,900
though?
No, it happened during the

947
00:51:21,900 --> 00:51:25,000
campaign.
So Kate did happen in 2008, I

948
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:26,000
believe.
Okay.

949
00:51:26,200 --> 00:51:28,300
I was thinking like, oh man
might have been like one of the

950
00:51:28,300 --> 00:51:30,600
first things that happened under
the Obama Administration.

951
00:51:30,700 --> 00:51:34,300
I remember those guys Obama and
McCain like going, Going back to

952
00:51:34,300 --> 00:51:37,600
DC during the campaign to hold
very important meetings about

953
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:39,800
the bailout interesting.
Okay?

954
00:51:40,700 --> 00:51:44,600
All right, listen, I'm leaning
towards to being the falsehood

955
00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:47,800
just because, you know, there's
no name on this dog.

956
00:51:47,900 --> 00:51:50,100
This this seems like an
important part of the fact to

957
00:51:50,107 --> 00:51:54,900
leave out number one, sounded
true enough and this is the key

958
00:51:54,900 --> 00:51:56,800
with Brad.
Noah, is that if it sounds

959
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,600
plausible, Brad probably didn't
write it.

960
00:51:59,900 --> 00:52:03,200
So, can I say something about
the dog?

961
00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:07,300
Yeah, go for it.
I think you know that dog was

962
00:52:07,300 --> 00:52:12,500
very well trained and based on
what we're kind of determining

963
00:52:12,500 --> 00:52:16,300
about Clint Eastwood's work
ethic that I'm not sure he would

964
00:52:16,300 --> 00:52:21,000
have taken the trouble to train
that dog, but it, but he's also

965
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:22,900
too prideful to let somebody
else train.

966
00:52:22,900 --> 00:52:26,700
It really.
Well, I was going to say it's

967
00:52:26,700 --> 00:52:29,600
not as if they ask the dog to do
a lot like the dog just laid on

968
00:52:29,600 --> 00:52:32,700
the porch, I think you could
train most dogs to do that, so,

969
00:52:34,500 --> 00:52:36,900
I'll go out on a limb here so
that we won't put know his

970
00:52:36,900 --> 00:52:39,100
reputation up on the line.
Brad, I'm gonna say twos, the

971
00:52:39,100 --> 00:52:42,600
falsehood that Walt's dog.
Daisy is actually Clint

972
00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:44,800
Eastwood's dog.
Yes, that's my final answer.

973
00:52:44,900 --> 00:52:52,500
That is a truth.
No fax.

974
00:52:52,500 --> 00:52:55,500
Number three was the falsehood,
man.

975
00:52:55,500 --> 00:52:58,200
I would they were not concerned
about the impact of the auto

976
00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:00,800
bailout.
Nope, they sure weren't seems

977
00:53:00,800 --> 00:53:04,200
obvious in retrospect have been
Has a house.

978
00:53:04,200 --> 00:53:08,500
Like I finished writing that one
and I was like, I don't have the

979
00:53:08,500 --> 00:53:12,100
energy to write a different one
but I think this might be one of

980
00:53:12,100 --> 00:53:14,400
my worst.
That's hilarious.

981
00:53:14,600 --> 00:53:17,500
Yeah, I guess that's true.
Like the the studio execs would

982
00:53:17,500 --> 00:53:19,200
have just been like Ford's back,
baby.

983
00:53:19,500 --> 00:53:23,100
Let's let's feature them as
prominently as possible.

984
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:28,000
All right, so I have dropped to
1 and 2 on the season, man.

985
00:53:28,700 --> 00:53:31,500
This is not good.
No.

986
00:53:34,300 --> 00:53:37,800
Alright guys, so we're steering
out of my colossal, failure into

987
00:53:37,800 --> 00:53:40,900
facts and a falsehood and we're
going to steer back into talking

988
00:53:40,900 --> 00:53:44,900
about, hey, steer back into
talking about Gran Torino car

989
00:53:44,900 --> 00:53:48,200
metaphors.
Things we liked about this movie

990
00:53:48,700 --> 00:53:52,500
and I again, I'll say I liked
this movie quite a bit and when

991
00:53:52,500 --> 00:53:56,200
I texted you Brad during my
watch of it, I was around that

992
00:53:56,400 --> 00:53:59,900
40-ish minute Mark and my exact
words to you.

993
00:54:00,200 --> 00:54:06,300
Were Gran Torino es no bueno,
and it got a lot more Bueno

994
00:54:06,300 --> 00:54:10,100
after then it's like it's a good
movie and I feel like we spent a

995
00:54:10,107 --> 00:54:12,100
half hour talking about all the
things they could have fixed

996
00:54:12,100 --> 00:54:15,100
with it, but I would like to go
in a little bit on what you

997
00:54:15,100 --> 00:54:17,200
thought was successful about
this film.

998
00:54:17,900 --> 00:54:21,000
Well, for me, what I thought was
successful is something that you

999
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:23,800
guys kind of hammered in the
first half.

1000
00:54:24,300 --> 00:54:27,800
I don't know if I actually think
that this is a white savior

1001
00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:30,200
movie.
Why is that?

1002
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:34,300
Well, so you guys, you guys
talked a lot about how the

1003
00:54:34,300 --> 00:54:38,200
family portion of the film just
wasn't necessary.

1004
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:42,100
And I actually think for me at
least in my final interpretation

1005
00:54:42,100 --> 00:54:46,300
of the film, those were actually
some of the most necessary

1006
00:54:46,300 --> 00:54:48,300
Parts.
I'm with you that the Catholic

1007
00:54:48,300 --> 00:54:52,700
priest you can get rid of him.
He was useless but the family

1008
00:54:52,700 --> 00:54:57,400
segments even as poorly acted,
as they are the, the sun's feel

1009
00:54:57,400 --> 00:55:00,400
like they belong in a really
Good Christian movie.

1010
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:08,900
But I think that what you have
here is a movie about how a

1011
00:55:08,900 --> 00:55:13,200
person has grown old.
The entire world has changed

1012
00:55:13,200 --> 00:55:15,700
around him.
His children don't care about

1013
00:55:15,700 --> 00:55:19,100
him.
His wife has died and he finds

1014
00:55:19,100 --> 00:55:24,100
refuge in a place that he never
expected to have found it.

1015
00:55:24,500 --> 00:55:28,900
And so in the end he fights and
sacrifices himself.

1016
00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:35,000
For that new family.
And so the impact of that for me

1017
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:39,900
was to say that.
Walt's isn't going to die for

1018
00:55:39,900 --> 00:55:43,200
his children.
Like his children have abandoned

1019
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:49,600
him and as he slowly moves from
a place of racism into

1020
00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:53,800
understanding this, this group
of people who he did not, like

1021
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:59,800
before they become a people that
save him from a meaningless life

1022
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:03,600
and a meaningless existence.
Because if he doesn't die for

1023
00:56:03,600 --> 00:56:07,900
Tau, then he looks at his life
and goes what the Because the

1024
00:56:07,900 --> 00:56:12,000
point like I have these kids who
suck and grandkids who are even

1025
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:16,700
worse and I've amounted to
nothing and yet now he has

1026
00:56:16,700 --> 00:56:20,800
somebody who is worth dying for.
He has a family that he cares

1027
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:25,000
about and in a certain sense
they save him from a a

1028
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:29,700
meaningless life.
What you have just described Is

1029
00:56:29,700 --> 00:56:31,800
the exact plot of the movie
Avatar.

1030
00:56:32,300 --> 00:56:34,400
Hmm.
Now.

1031
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:36,500
But for real, so here's what
I'll say, I think we need to

1032
00:56:36,500 --> 00:56:38,400
Define our terms a little bit
because we've been using this

1033
00:56:38,400 --> 00:56:42,300
term, white save your movie.
And I think that, you know, in

1034
00:56:42,300 --> 00:56:44,600
some regards it's a, you know,
it when you see it kind of movie

1035
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:48,100
but I think a really great
example is the movie The Last

1036
00:56:48,100 --> 00:56:50,700
Samurai, which I love, I love
that movie.

1037
00:56:50,700 --> 00:56:57,400
It's a good movie, but it is the
idea that a typically white male

1038
00:56:57,900 --> 00:57:02,400
enters into a Culture, that is
not his own and a culture that

1039
00:57:02,400 --> 00:57:05,000
has an insurmountable problem,
that needs to be solved.

1040
00:57:05,000 --> 00:57:08,100
That the, you know, the quote
unquote, natives in that

1041
00:57:08,100 --> 00:57:11,300
environment, can't do themselves
and only through the help of the

1042
00:57:11,300 --> 00:57:16,300
white male, can they be saved?
And I think Brad that I hear

1043
00:57:16,300 --> 00:57:21,200
what you're saying, but I think
that this is the perfect

1044
00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:24,400
corollary to this is Unforgiven.
And I've seen a lot of people

1045
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:28,000
call Unforgiven and anti-western
and it's not an anti-western,

1046
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:31,300
like there's a lot of These set
in the American West that are

1047
00:57:31,300 --> 00:57:35,400
not westerns.
Unforgiven is 100% a western.

1048
00:57:35,600 --> 00:57:40,100
It's a western that's commenting
on westerns and I think in the

1049
00:57:40,100 --> 00:57:43,600
same way like I kind of hinted
at that this in the first half I

1050
00:57:43,600 --> 00:57:46,300
think this is a white savior
movie that is commenting on

1051
00:57:46,300 --> 00:57:50,000
white savior movies because in
very few of these movies.

1052
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:55,900
Do the characters actually have
to reckon with The effects of

1053
00:57:55,900 --> 00:57:59,300
them bringing their culture and
their arrogance and their

1054
00:57:59,300 --> 00:58:01,700
dominance into the environment
that they're in.

1055
00:58:02,100 --> 00:58:04,200
And I think this movie does that
really well?

1056
00:58:04,600 --> 00:58:09,300
But I do hear you in that, like
Waltz isolation is like a huge

1057
00:58:09,300 --> 00:58:12,200
key and know you were talking
about this to like the the kids

1058
00:58:12,200 --> 00:58:13,800
thing is a big part of this
movie.

1059
00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:18,100
His kids rejecting him Is what
kind of separates this I think

1060
00:58:18,100 --> 00:58:21,200
from a lot of other movies that
you could call a white savior

1061
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:24,500
movie, you know.
I think Brad, what would you

1062
00:58:24,500 --> 00:58:28,100
were saying made me think about
it a little differently, which

1063
00:58:28,100 --> 00:58:31,300
is, you know, when I think about
white savior movie, I think of a

1064
00:58:31,300 --> 00:58:34,500
movie.
Also, something like the help,

1065
00:58:34,700 --> 00:58:40,100
you know, which is supposedly,
which is purportedly about this

1066
00:58:40,100 --> 00:58:44,200
marginalized group, right?
Is it about any mole in a prior

1067
00:58:44,200 --> 00:58:48,300
era who were discriminated?
Against marginalized oppressed,

1068
00:58:49,100 --> 00:58:52,400
that is what the movies about.
That's the points, the movie is

1069
00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:54,600
trying to win from the audience,
right?

1070
00:58:54,700 --> 00:58:59,200
Except the only way that it can
do that is by Framing it as

1071
00:58:59,300 --> 00:59:01,900
through a white characters eyes,
right?

1072
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:05,600
And having a white character
lift them out of poverty or

1073
00:59:05,600 --> 00:59:07,300
oppression, or whatever them a
voice.

1074
00:59:07,700 --> 00:59:11,500
Exactly.
And the one thing I will say in

1075
00:59:11,500 --> 00:59:15,300
favor of Gran Torino, not being
a white savior movie is there is

1076
00:59:15,300 --> 00:59:18,200
not any more.
Moment in this movie that I

1077
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:21,400
think Gran Torino is about the
Hmong people.

1078
00:59:21,800 --> 00:59:23,800
It's not.
It is about Clint Eastwood's

1079
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:27,000
character, 100%.
He doesn't, I think it is

1080
00:59:27,000 --> 00:59:30,500
interested in discrimination
against them and the challenges

1081
00:59:30,500 --> 00:59:32,900
that they face, but not that
interested.

1082
00:59:32,900 --> 00:59:35,000
I think it's much more
interested in Clint Eastwood's

1083
00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:38,000
attitude towards them.
So that either makes it the most

1084
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:41,200
white savior, a movie, or it
makes it not one at all because

1085
00:59:41,200 --> 00:59:44,700
it's not, it's not selling
itself as a film that like, has

1086
00:59:44,700 --> 00:59:46,000
something meaningful to say
about.

1087
00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:50,000
That group of people?
Yeah, no, I'm 100% with you.

1088
00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:53,700
I, as I was kind of percolating.
This idea of it.

1089
00:59:53,700 --> 00:59:56,400
Not being a white savior movie,
it hit me.

1090
00:59:56,400 --> 01:00:03,000
I was like this movie is, is so
deeply cemented in Walt's point

1091
01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:07,400
of view and like the honestly
the most white savior, anything

1092
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:11,300
that happens is when he's
teaching Tao how to do these

1093
01:00:11,300 --> 01:00:14,200
things.
You know, like care for his home

1094
01:00:14,200 --> 01:00:19,100
and you know, reap Chip paying
off the thing, repaint homes and

1095
01:00:19,100 --> 01:00:21,100
all that.
Like, that's fine.

1096
01:00:21,100 --> 01:00:25,900
Ty was a young kid but it's when
he's sending Tau to, like fix up

1097
01:00:25,900 --> 01:00:31,400
other Hmong people's homes that
it's like, oh, none of these

1098
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:35,500
people know how to care for a
home unless Clint comes in and

1099
01:00:35,500 --> 01:00:38,900
helps them like that.
Like that's the only thing that

1100
01:00:38,900 --> 01:00:42,700
for me really like strongly
smacks of white savior is MM,

1101
01:00:43,100 --> 01:00:46,500
but the rest of it, like you
said, Noah feels like It's

1102
01:00:46,500 --> 01:00:50,100
honing in on his isolation, and
what's going to save him from

1103
01:00:50,100 --> 01:00:53,800
that?
I did like the scenes of him and

1104
01:00:53,800 --> 01:00:59,400
Tau hanging out getting along.
It's felt very formulaic to me,

1105
01:00:59,500 --> 01:01:01,400
like a, you know, a man called
Auto.

1106
01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:03,600
I haven't seen a man called
Auto, but I assume something

1107
01:01:03,600 --> 01:01:07,400
like that happens in it.
When old grumpy, man, you know,

1108
01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:09,300
learns to open up by being
around a kid.

1109
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:11,200
That is really, that's good
stuff.

1110
01:01:11,300 --> 01:01:14,900
Listen, I ate that movie up, I
was like this is terrible and I

1111
01:01:14,908 --> 01:01:19,000
love it.
I did not enjoy and called on it

1112
01:01:19,400 --> 01:01:22,700
whatsoever.
All right.

1113
01:01:22,700 --> 01:01:24,900
Real quick, I want to touch on
something that we really haven't

1114
01:01:24,900 --> 01:01:28,700
talked about very much Brad and
that is Eastwood as composer.

1115
01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:31,500
So we mentioned it.
I think you mentioned it in your

1116
01:01:31,500 --> 01:01:33,500
two facts in a falsehood on
Unforgiven.

1117
01:01:34,000 --> 01:01:37,200
And we talked about it a little
bit last week with Mystic River

1118
01:01:37,200 --> 01:01:40,100
and how the weird major chords
and that movie don't work for

1119
01:01:40,100 --> 01:01:43,700
us.
But here it Eastwood does

1120
01:01:43,700 --> 01:01:45,700
something that's probably the
most egregious thing I've ever

1121
01:01:45,700 --> 01:01:47,700
heard.
Him do as a composer and I kind

1122
01:01:47,700 --> 01:01:51,900
of still loved it and it's when
at multiple points in the movie

1123
01:01:52,100 --> 01:01:56,000
your you're immediately attuned
to the fact that he was a Korean

1124
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:58,600
war vet.
And at multiple points in the

1125
01:01:58,600 --> 01:02:02,700
movie they play these.
Like When Johnny Comes Marching

1126
01:02:02,700 --> 01:02:08,000
In drums underneath Eastwood's
actions and I kind of loved it

1127
01:02:08,100 --> 01:02:10,900
and it's a terrible score like I
would never turn this on in the

1128
01:02:10,900 --> 01:02:15,200
car to listen to like however
once again I think it's this

1129
01:02:15,200 --> 01:02:18,400
really Yes.
But kind of neat thing that he

1130
01:02:18,400 --> 01:02:21,700
does of commenting on a certain
thing and it's like you could

1131
01:02:21,700 --> 01:02:24,500
read that as hell.
Yeah, Clint Eastwood's going to

1132
01:02:24,500 --> 01:02:27,900
ride into battle and kill these
guys or like, you know,

1133
01:02:27,900 --> 01:02:32,400
justifying his vengefulness and
his anger, but it's really not.

1134
01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:37,000
I think it's 100%, you know,
because that that theme stops

1135
01:02:37,100 --> 01:02:39,900
once.
Walt has that confrontation with

1136
01:02:39,900 --> 01:02:43,300
the consequences of his actions,
in the home of his neighbor.

1137
01:02:43,800 --> 01:02:47,900
It is very much a comment on
like He has been trained by what

1138
01:02:47,900 --> 01:02:51,000
he did in the military and by
the trauma that has been caused

1139
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:55,000
by that throughout his life to
retaliate, as if he needs to go

1140
01:02:55,000 --> 01:02:57,200
into battle.
And so when they play that

1141
01:02:57,200 --> 01:03:00,800
theme, you as an audience,
member are not supposed to be

1142
01:03:01,300 --> 01:03:04,500
like rooting for him or you
know, perhaps it's like

1143
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:07,300
implicating us in our own like
desire.

1144
01:03:07,300 --> 01:03:09,700
To see Clint Eastwood kill
people because it's fun to

1145
01:03:09,700 --> 01:03:11,700
watch.
Police would kill people - I

1146
01:03:11,707 --> 01:03:14,300
really like that little touch
and I know that like yeah, you

1147
01:03:14,300 --> 01:03:15,800
guys have both already said I'm
giving useful.

1148
01:03:15,900 --> 01:03:17,700
Too much credit.
And I didn't think this would be

1149
01:03:17,700 --> 01:03:20,900
the movie that I would do it
with like, over again, Stephen

1150
01:03:20,900 --> 01:03:25,100
Unforgiven, but it's really nice
to see him still dealing with

1151
01:03:25,100 --> 01:03:29,400
those same themes, even into,
you know, 2008 with this movie

1152
01:03:29,900 --> 01:03:33,900
for me, all of the little drum
drum rolls that they, he gives

1153
01:03:33,900 --> 01:03:36,100
himself.
I thought that it was just kind

1154
01:03:36,100 --> 01:03:39,900
of like a callback to be like,
hey, have you ever heard of

1155
01:03:39,900 --> 01:03:42,900
PTSD?
This is it.

1156
01:03:44,300 --> 01:03:47,200
Yeah, yeah, I can't do it.
Either I can't name another

1157
01:03:47,200 --> 01:03:50,100
movie that does that, but I feel
like a hundred other movies have

1158
01:03:50,100 --> 01:03:51,400
done that.
Yeah, mmm.

1159
01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:55,200
I just, I love that.
It was like this Rob eat, you

1160
01:03:55,200 --> 01:03:57,900
know, they could have made like
a really eerie strings or

1161
01:03:57,900 --> 01:04:00,800
something, when he's having
PTSD, but they play it as if

1162
01:04:00,800 --> 01:04:03,400
it's, you know, the
Revolutionary War.

1163
01:04:03,400 --> 01:04:07,800
And like it's just just a really
interesting choice and there is

1164
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:10,300
another interesting choice.
That Noah you were saying that

1165
01:04:10,300 --> 01:04:12,200
you wanted to mention as well.
I did.

1166
01:04:12,200 --> 01:04:16,900
Yes, it goes like this.
Gentle now the A breeze.

1167
01:04:16,900 --> 01:04:22,300
Blows Whispers through my Grand
Torino and those are the lyrics

1168
01:04:22,800 --> 01:04:27,900
to the song that Clint Eastwood,
inexplicably, sings or rasps.

1169
01:04:27,900 --> 01:04:29,700
I think would be a better word.
Yeah.

1170
01:04:29,900 --> 01:04:34,100
Over the closing credits of this
movie, is it Clint Eastwood?

1171
01:04:34,100 --> 01:04:37,100
Or is it Tom Waits?
Are we sure or is it like

1172
01:04:37,200 --> 01:04:40,000
late-era Bob Dylan?
That is perhaps singing that

1173
01:04:40,000 --> 01:04:44,000
song There's a fine line between
rasping well and raspbian badly

1174
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:46,300
but this this makes it a little
clearer.

1175
01:04:46,300 --> 01:04:51,200
I think it just it makes no
sense to me.

1176
01:04:51,200 --> 01:04:53,800
Why Clint Eastwood sang this
song?

1177
01:04:53,800 --> 01:04:57,200
He does not have a good voice.
The lyrics are not good.

1178
01:04:57,700 --> 01:05:00,800
The song apparently was written
by Jamie Cullum who I don't

1179
01:05:00,800 --> 01:05:03,700
really know who that is, but he
seems to be a songwriter of some

1180
01:05:04,900 --> 01:05:07,400
Renown.
He got his song into a movie.

1181
01:05:07,400 --> 01:05:10,800
I mean have you ever done that
Noah certainly not that's

1182
01:05:10,800 --> 01:05:12,200
certainly not.
Okay.

1183
01:05:12,200 --> 01:05:15,200
So I remember Jamie Cullum
having like a really minor pop

1184
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:18,000
hit in the The early 2000s, I do
remember what it was, but I

1185
01:05:18,000 --> 01:05:21,700
remember the name did.
He also sing, there's like a

1186
01:05:21,700 --> 01:05:26,300
song that plays over a montage
in the movie and it sounds like

1187
01:05:26,500 --> 01:05:29,300
discount Coldplay.
Do you know what I mean?

1188
01:05:29,400 --> 01:05:33,500
It sounds like The Scientist by
Coldplay but not as good that

1189
01:05:33,500 --> 01:05:35,500
that's probably him.
That sounds like Jamie Cullum.

1190
01:05:35,700 --> 01:05:38,600
Okay, alright, cool.
I feel like he just keeps got

1191
01:05:38,600 --> 01:05:41,000
bodied by us and he didn't even
deserve.

1192
01:05:41,000 --> 01:05:46,000
We don't even know who he is.
Where are we supposed to think

1193
01:05:46,000 --> 01:05:48,300
that Walt is singing that song
from Heaven?

1194
01:05:48,300 --> 01:05:51,100
Is that, is that the vibe you're
getting, that's the only way to

1195
01:05:51,100 --> 01:05:52,500
interpret it.
Noah that.

1196
01:05:53,400 --> 01:05:56,200
Let me tell you guys.
I have never turned off a movie

1197
01:05:56,200 --> 01:06:00,000
Faster than like the second.
I saw the fretted directed by

1198
01:06:00,000 --> 01:06:02,600
Clint Eastwood.
I was like, and I'm done because

1199
01:06:02,600 --> 01:06:05,300
I heard three lines of that song
and I was like, oh, I'm not

1200
01:06:05,300 --> 01:06:09,300
doing this for a minute and a
half and I'm glad I did I heard,

1201
01:06:09,300 --> 01:06:12,200
I didn't even know that the the
words Grand Torino were in the

1202
01:06:12,200 --> 01:06:15,200
song because I think I checked
out before we Got to that point.

1203
01:06:15,400 --> 01:06:18,000
I mean, it, that that's the
thing is, like, we want to talk

1204
01:06:18,000 --> 01:06:24,000
about this movie and how complex
it is, and how ambiguous its

1205
01:06:24,000 --> 01:06:29,000
portrayal of Walt is, but in the
end, it's Walt singing a song

1206
01:06:29,000 --> 01:06:33,000
from Heaven about his car.
I mean, the car which is a

1207
01:06:33,008 --> 01:06:36,000
symbol of this kind of
old-school masculinity.

1208
01:06:36,000 --> 01:06:38,500
Like it does make me it doesn't
make me wonder in this final

1209
01:06:38,500 --> 01:06:41,200
Choice.
How much Clint Eastwood really

1210
01:06:41,500 --> 01:06:44,200
is ambivalent about all all
that.

1211
01:06:44,400 --> 01:06:46,100
The movie.
Well, getting back to what you

1212
01:06:46,100 --> 01:06:48,900
were saying in the first half of
like, you know, maybe Eastwood

1213
01:06:48,900 --> 01:06:50,800
just didn't want to do this or
didn't want to do that.

1214
01:06:51,100 --> 01:06:53,400
I mean the guy has won two
directing Oscars.

1215
01:06:53,400 --> 01:06:56,800
He's 12 best pictures.
He's never won for acting even

1216
01:06:56,800 --> 01:06:58,200
though he's been nominated a
couple times.

1217
01:06:58,200 --> 01:07:01,000
And I think, you know, maybe he
just comes back to do this movie

1218
01:07:01,000 --> 01:07:04,100
because he's like, I want my
acting Oscar and I want to be

1219
01:07:04,100 --> 01:07:09,100
recognized for writing music so
I'm not only am I going to

1220
01:07:09,100 --> 01:07:12,100
compose the score?
I'm going to sing this song so

1221
01:07:12,100 --> 01:07:14,100
that I can get on stage at the
Oscars.

1222
01:07:14,400 --> 01:07:18,000
And sing my Oscar nominated best
original song.

1223
01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:21,100
Like I wouldn't put it past him
that that's what he's doing here

1224
01:07:21,700 --> 01:07:23,500
and it's a tragedy that it did
not happen.

1225
01:07:23,800 --> 01:07:27,400
Can you imagine seeing Clint
Eastwood on stage at the Oscars

1226
01:07:27,900 --> 01:07:33,300
singing this song we've seen
worse performances at the

1227
01:07:33,300 --> 01:07:36,900
Oscars.
I just want like I want Clint

1228
01:07:36,900 --> 01:07:40,600
Eastwood and Jamie Cullum to
basically be doing the Bradley

1229
01:07:40,600 --> 01:07:44,200
Cooper Lady Gaga shallow moment
on stage together.

1230
01:07:44,400 --> 01:07:47,000
During a piano bench and
canoodling while they sing this

1231
01:07:47,000 --> 01:07:50,900
song or maybe sitting or maybe
singing to an empty chair at my

1232
01:07:50,900 --> 01:07:54,700
work.
All right, guys, before we wind

1233
01:07:54,700 --> 01:07:57,700
down today, we do have one more
segment left and that is perhaps

1234
01:07:57,700 --> 01:08:01,000
my favorite one and it's called.
Let's make it a double we near

1235
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:04,100
the end of the episode.
So thanks for listening to the

1236
01:08:04,100 --> 01:08:06,800
film and whiskey show.
Let's pair another film with

1237
01:08:06,800 --> 01:08:08,500
this one.
Even if it's struggle, it's a

1238
01:08:08,500 --> 01:08:11,400
final segment of the day.
Now let's make it a double.

1239
01:08:11,800 --> 01:08:15,900
This is the part of the podcast.
Where we Pick a movie to pair up

1240
01:08:15,900 --> 01:08:18,200
with the film.
We've been reviewing to make the

1241
01:08:18,200 --> 01:08:21,700
perfect double feature Brad.
I'm going to start with you

1242
01:08:21,700 --> 01:08:24,500
because I've really been racking
my brain to try to figure out

1243
01:08:24,500 --> 01:08:27,399
what I want to pair this with.
And I'm not sure.

1244
01:08:27,600 --> 01:08:30,300
So I'm gonna I'm going to Vamp
for a couple more seconds and

1245
01:08:30,300 --> 01:08:34,500
let you go ahead and do it.
Oh man, I don't think this is a

1246
01:08:34,508 --> 01:08:36,899
good pairing Bob, but I'm gonna
do it.

1247
01:08:36,899 --> 01:08:42,899
Anyways, I'm gonna pair this
movie with another film, largely

1248
01:08:42,899 --> 01:08:46,200
about cars and one that Made
car, chases famous.

1249
01:08:46,399 --> 01:08:47,899
I'm going to pair it with
bullet.

1250
01:08:48,500 --> 01:08:51,899
How interesting, I don't
honestly know why other than the

1251
01:08:51,899 --> 01:08:55,899
fact that the Gran Torino came
out, you know, in the same era

1252
01:08:55,899 --> 01:09:00,600
as all the cars and bullet and I
think that'd be a fun fun little

1253
01:09:00,600 --> 01:09:03,500
evening.
And on a bit of a lighter note

1254
01:09:03,500 --> 01:09:04,899
with both.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1255
01:09:04,899 --> 01:09:08,800
Yeah.
All right, knowing how about

1256
01:09:08,800 --> 01:09:10,800
you?
Well, I've given this a lot of

1257
01:09:10,800 --> 01:09:18,000
thought and I'm going to pair it
with with blue collar which to

1258
01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:24,500
me is another movie set in
Detroit and another film about

1259
01:09:24,700 --> 01:09:27,100
race relations.
But one that's going to make

1260
01:09:27,100 --> 01:09:30,000
Gran Torino look very bad in
comparison because I think it

1261
01:09:30,000 --> 01:09:35,100
has one of the more thoughtful
Nuance to portrayals of race

1262
01:09:35,100 --> 01:09:38,500
labor issues and some other
things that you will that you

1263
01:09:38,508 --> 01:09:42,399
will find in a movie So I'd make
it a Detroit double feature and

1264
01:09:43,500 --> 01:09:45,399
you know Gran Torino is going to
come out on the losing end on

1265
01:09:45,399 --> 01:09:47,200
that one, unfortunately.
Yeah yeah yeah.

1266
01:09:47,200 --> 01:09:50,000
I mean we could we use paired
with a ton of Detroit movies.

1267
01:09:50,000 --> 01:09:54,100
You Beverly Hills Cop the
obvious choice.

1268
01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:56,200
Well he's from Detroit, Axel
Foley.

1269
01:09:57,500 --> 01:09:58,600
Okay.
Here's what I'm going to do,

1270
01:09:58,600 --> 01:10:00,300
Brad.
I'm going to use my, let's make

1271
01:10:00,300 --> 01:10:04,800
it a double to correct an error
that I know Mission.

1272
01:10:05,200 --> 01:10:08,200
So I said earlier, that aside
from Eastwood, there was only

1273
01:10:08,200 --> 01:10:11,000
like one or two bit players.
I thought were really good and

1274
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:13,000
one of those is the character
actor.

1275
01:10:13,000 --> 01:10:16,300
John Carroll Lynch, who I love
in every movie.

1276
01:10:16,300 --> 01:10:18,800
He does Brad, we've had him on
the show a couple times before

1277
01:10:19,100 --> 01:10:23,200
he played Marge's, husband in
Fargo, he shows up here as the

1278
01:10:23,200 --> 01:10:25,800
barber and he doesn't really
have a lot to do.

1279
01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:29,600
It's one of the more like
hashtag problematic Parts in the

1280
01:10:29,600 --> 01:10:33,000
movie because of what it's
trying to say about like how men

1281
01:10:33,000 --> 01:10:35,900
just break each other's balls
like what like the initial the

1282
01:10:35,900 --> 01:10:40,500
initiation rites of becoming a
man but I really love him.

1283
01:10:40,500 --> 01:10:43,200
As an actor, we will get around
to watching the movies.

1284
01:10:43,200 --> 01:10:45,500
Zodiac one day that he is
phenomenal in.

1285
01:10:46,200 --> 01:10:48,300
But for now, I want to pair it
up with another movie that

1286
01:10:48,300 --> 01:10:51,000
features him really prominently
because he doesn't get enough

1287
01:10:51,200 --> 01:10:53,300
discussion as one of our great
character actors.

1288
01:10:53,700 --> 01:10:56,900
He is really fantastic in a
movie that came out a few years

1289
01:10:56,900 --> 01:11:00,200
ago called the founder.
And this is a movie about Ray

1290
01:11:00,200 --> 01:11:04,400
Kroc, the guy who basically
expanded the McDonald's Empire,

1291
01:11:04,700 --> 01:11:08,100
taking it away from the McDonald
brothers, who founded it?

1292
01:11:08,100 --> 01:11:09,500
It's essentially The Social
Network.

1293
01:11:09,900 --> 01:11:12,600
For Baby Boomers.
It's a really good movie with

1294
01:11:12,600 --> 01:11:15,900
Michael Keaton and John Carroll
Lynch plays one of the McDonald

1295
01:11:15,900 --> 01:11:18,900
brothers, and I just want to
give the guy a little bit of

1296
01:11:18,900 --> 01:11:20,900
love.
I think that I would, I would

1297
01:11:20,900 --> 01:11:23,600
absolutely watch a double
feature with this movie and

1298
01:11:23,600 --> 01:11:26,800
Fargo to see him with this movie
and zodiac to see him.

1299
01:11:27,000 --> 01:11:28,900
But I'm going to give a little
bit of love to a movie.

1300
01:11:28,900 --> 01:11:30,700
I really, really liked called
the founder.

1301
01:11:31,600 --> 01:11:34,000
Well, the founder that is a
choice.

1302
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:40,600
Bob, I think very clear if any
reason if only the McDonald

1303
01:11:40,600 --> 01:11:43,600
Brothers had held up.
Raycrockett gunpoint and said,

1304
01:11:43,600 --> 01:11:46,000
get off my lawn that what might
have been?

1305
01:11:46,300 --> 01:11:47,300
Yeah.
What might have been.

1306
01:11:47,300 --> 01:11:51,900
We wouldn't all be consuming.
Just terrible food for us all.

1307
01:11:51,900 --> 01:11:56,100
Yeah, man, that would be a sad
all true alternate future Bob.

1308
01:11:57,500 --> 01:12:01,300
Well guys, I think we've said a
lot of things that have needed

1309
01:12:01,300 --> 01:12:04,200
to be said about this movie.
We probably could have gone a

1310
01:12:04,200 --> 01:12:07,600
lot more deeply into certain
areas, but I think we're kind of

1311
01:12:07,600 --> 01:12:11,000
getting to that point.
What are Guys, is final scores

1312
01:12:11,000 --> 01:12:14,000
for Gran Torino.
Brad, I'm gonna give this movie

1313
01:12:14,000 --> 01:12:17,000
a seven and a half out of ten.
I think that there are moments

1314
01:12:17,000 --> 01:12:18,800
of this movie that are, they're
quite good.

1315
01:12:19,000 --> 01:12:20,700
Like, I would probably give
parts of this movie and eight

1316
01:12:20,700 --> 01:12:23,000
and a half out of 10.
I would give the first 40

1317
01:12:23,000 --> 01:12:27,600
minutes at this movie about a 3
out of 10 and I guess it kind of

1318
01:12:27,600 --> 01:12:29,900
washes out.
It's a good movie.

1319
01:12:30,000 --> 01:12:33,600
It is the worst of the three
that we watched, just remove

1320
01:12:33,600 --> 01:12:36,200
filmmaking standpoint and
especially from a scripting

1321
01:12:36,200 --> 01:12:40,200
standpoint but it's still
worthwhile and I I didn't expect

1322
01:12:40,200 --> 01:12:42,600
it to be worthwhile and I think
it's to be frank, like, kind of

1323
01:12:42,600 --> 01:12:45,500
a minor miracle that it ended up
being a worthwhile movie.

1324
01:12:46,000 --> 01:12:49,900
That is a pretty good feather in
the cap for Clint Eastwood, even

1325
01:12:49,900 --> 01:12:53,500
though he's still making movies,
15 years later that we didn't

1326
01:12:53,500 --> 01:12:56,100
expect him to be making.
So it's a seven and a half for

1327
01:12:56,100 --> 01:13:00,200
me.
Yeah, I don't know what to do

1328
01:13:00,200 --> 01:13:03,300
with this because I remember
walking away from it.

1329
01:13:03,300 --> 01:13:07,000
The first time I saw it and
being like, oh, wow, I like that

1330
01:13:07,000 --> 01:13:08,900
movie those those fine, it was
good.

1331
01:13:09,500 --> 01:13:13,600
And the second time I watched it
being like huh this wasn't as

1332
01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:16,100
good as I remember.
There's there's some issues here

1333
01:13:16,700 --> 01:13:20,300
and then the this time my third
time watching it being like, oh

1334
01:13:20,300 --> 01:13:24,200
wow, there are some problems
with this movie and it's not

1335
01:13:24,200 --> 01:13:28,100
just the, the racial stuff like
that, like the acting and the

1336
01:13:28,108 --> 01:13:32,200
script and, you know, even the
way he transitions from, from

1337
01:13:32,200 --> 01:13:35,100
one scene to scene, it's kind of
like he just was like, well, I'm

1338
01:13:35,100 --> 01:13:37,900
done with that now so I guess
I'm going to start this new

1339
01:13:37,900 --> 01:13:43,300
thing.
I like this movie a lot but I'm

1340
01:13:43,300 --> 01:13:47,300
gonna give it a six and a half
or wow.

1341
01:13:47,300 --> 01:13:49,900
Okay.
It's the highest six-and-a-half.

1342
01:13:49,900 --> 01:13:52,100
I would ever give it like a film
where I'm like.

1343
01:13:52,200 --> 01:13:55,500
Yeah, I'd probably watch this
again at some point but it just

1344
01:13:55,500 --> 01:13:58,600
doesn't really work for me and
yet it kind of does.

1345
01:13:58,600 --> 01:14:00,500
I don't know, man, I'm almost up
here.

1346
01:14:01,000 --> 01:14:04,100
There is like there's a part of
me that completely understands

1347
01:14:04,100 --> 01:14:06,000
that.
This is like your two and a half

1348
01:14:06,000 --> 01:14:09,100
out of four star movie that you
catch on AMC.

1349
01:14:09,200 --> 01:14:12,000
E on a Saturday and you're like,
yeah, watch part of Gran Torino,

1350
01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:13,600
that's fine.
Yeah, yeah.

1351
01:14:13,600 --> 01:14:17,400
I get it.
You know, I think I agree with

1352
01:14:17,400 --> 01:14:19,800
both of you like this is not bad
enough to be a six.

1353
01:14:19,800 --> 01:14:22,000
Definitely not good enough to be
an eight, right?

1354
01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:23,600
It's that kind of movie.
Yep.

1355
01:14:23,600 --> 01:14:26,900
The thing about it is as we've
been talking about it, I feel my

1356
01:14:26,900 --> 01:14:30,600
opinion of it getting lower and
lower and lower because when you

1357
01:14:30,600 --> 01:14:34,700
start unpacking it, and you see
the contradictions and you see

1358
01:14:34,700 --> 01:14:39,100
the flaws, it really doesn't
hold together, but there is a

1359
01:14:39,100 --> 01:14:42,100
power to the filmmaking.
I mean, Eastwood knows what he's

1360
01:14:42,100 --> 01:14:45,100
doing somehow.
He's getting home by.

1361
01:14:45,300 --> 01:14:49,300
Our time and he's making a good
movie and he does know how to do

1362
01:14:49,300 --> 01:14:51,200
this.
And I'm trying to put myself

1363
01:14:51,200 --> 01:14:54,600
back in the space that I was in
when I watched it which was that

1364
01:14:54,600 --> 01:14:57,100
was a pretty good movie.
So I'm going to split your

1365
01:14:57,100 --> 01:15:00,600
difference and I think I think
this is a straight 7, a lot of

1366
01:15:00,600 --> 01:15:01,800
it.
All right, so we are all coming

1367
01:15:01,800 --> 01:15:06,100
out to an average of a 7 out of
10 but we like to know what you

1368
01:15:06,100 --> 01:15:08,200
think.
Have you seen Gran Torino?

1369
01:15:08,200 --> 01:15:10,100
Did you see it?
When it first came out 15 years

1370
01:15:10,100 --> 01:15:12,300
ago.
Have you re-evaluated at since?

1371
01:15:12,300 --> 01:15:15,000
Then you can let us know your
opinion on the movie.

1372
01:15:15,200 --> 01:15:18,100
By reaching out to us on our
social media accounts, Facebook,

1373
01:15:18,100 --> 01:15:22,600
Twitter or Instagram at film,
whiskey, or jump onto the

1374
01:15:22,600 --> 01:15:24,800
Discord.
We are on there every single

1375
01:15:24,800 --> 01:15:27,600
day, talking to you guys, the
fans of the film and whiskey

1376
01:15:27,600 --> 01:15:30,500
podcast.
So if you want to join, you can

1377
01:15:30,500 --> 01:15:32,600
find a link to our Discord.
At the end of every single one

1378
01:15:32,600 --> 01:15:36,600
of our show notes, Brad, we are
leaving, Clint Eastwood behind

1379
01:15:36,800 --> 01:15:39,000
and we are going in the Wayback
machine.

1380
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:42,300
Revisiting Classic Hollywood for
the first time in a while.

1381
01:15:42,300 --> 01:15:45,500
I'm really glad to be thrown at
way back to the 40s and These

1382
01:15:45,500 --> 01:15:48,500
again, because we are going to
be doing a mini series of films

1383
01:15:48,500 --> 01:15:50,000
by one of our favorite
directors.

1384
01:15:50,100 --> 01:15:53,200
Billy Wilder, and we're kicking
it off with what might be his

1385
01:15:53,200 --> 01:15:57,500
Masterpiece 1950s, Sunset
Boulevard, bro.

1386
01:15:57,500 --> 01:16:01,800
I am like, so jazzed to watch
this movie and to, you know, to

1387
01:16:01,800 --> 01:16:04,700
watch three billion a row.
Yeah, I can't wait, man.

1388
01:16:05,000 --> 01:16:07,000
Well, we want to say thank you
again to Noah gets all for

1389
01:16:07,000 --> 01:16:09,500
joining us today.
Noah, what do you have coming

1390
01:16:09,500 --> 01:16:10,900
down the pike that you can plug
here?

1391
01:16:11,600 --> 01:16:15,000
Oh, okay.
Well, nothing urgent coming up.

1392
01:16:15,200 --> 01:16:18,700
I would just encourage folks to
keep an eye on my Twitter

1393
01:16:18,700 --> 01:16:22,200
account, which is Noah could
tell that's two T's and two L's.

1394
01:16:22,200 --> 01:16:25,200
And like, most folks, I have
started a sub stack over the

1395
01:16:25,200 --> 01:16:29,000
last few months, it's called
good eye, and it's about movies

1396
01:16:29,000 --> 01:16:32,100
and also about baseball quite a
bit and a little bit about

1397
01:16:32,100 --> 01:16:35,900
baseball movies.
We did a mini like a bonus

1398
01:16:35,900 --> 01:16:40,100
episode a few years ago and we
did the best baseball movies and

1399
01:16:40,100 --> 01:16:43,900
we shook out to I think the
final two were Moneyball for

1400
01:16:43,900 --> 01:16:46,600
people who don't like baseball.
League of Their Own, which I

1401
01:16:46,600 --> 01:16:49,800
know is the film that you have
since crowned, as the best

1402
01:16:49,800 --> 01:16:52,000
baseball movie, I know that
you're doing.

1403
01:16:52,200 --> 01:16:54,700
I think this coming weekend,
you're doing like an intro of

1404
01:16:54,700 --> 01:16:56,900
the movie.
I am at the measure graph in New

1405
01:16:56,900 --> 01:16:59,300
York.
It is my favorite baseball

1406
01:16:59,300 --> 01:17:02,200
movie, but Moneyball is the
correct choice for people who

1407
01:17:02,200 --> 01:17:05,200
are not Baseball fans that movie
was not designed for baseball

1408
01:17:05,200 --> 01:17:07,400
people.
Baseball, people pick it apart,

1409
01:17:07,400 --> 01:17:09,600
especially, baseball players.
I've spoken to quite a few of

1410
01:17:09,608 --> 01:17:11,900
them, and they really hate that
movie.

1411
01:17:12,600 --> 01:17:15,200
But I know a lot of folks who
don't like baseball at all, I

1412
01:17:15,200 --> 01:17:17,100
think it's great.
You guys aren't going to put

1413
01:17:17,100 --> 01:17:20,900
Trouble with the Curve up there.
Boy your boy Clint Eastwood.

1414
01:17:22,200 --> 01:17:24,400
I'm ready to do another pot on
Trouble with the Curve.

1415
01:17:24,700 --> 01:17:27,700
Listen man, come back on.
We'll revisit the, the power

1416
01:17:27,700 --> 01:17:30,700
ranking of baseball movies and
we'll dive debug Trouble with

1417
01:17:30,700 --> 01:17:32,100
the Curve.
I would love to.

1418
01:17:32,600 --> 01:17:35,100
Alright, that does it for us
this week, we will see you next

1419
01:17:35,100 --> 01:17:39,100
Tuesday for Sunset Boulevard,
but until then I'm Bob book, I'm

1420
01:17:39,100 --> 01:17:41,500
Brad G and we'll see you next
time.