Blue Ruin (2013) The Brutality of Revenge

0:09 I apologize for the mystery. You're not any trouble. I just thought you should be somewhere safe when you found out everything's fine. You'll be fine. Two, three, four. It's an awful thing he did to them. Three if I don't mean to scare you, I'm just gonna hold you here for a little.

0:55 While and like you breathed. In a world where podcasts reign supreme. Two friends dare to ask? Do you even? Movie? Hosted by filmmaker Enrique Kuto and movie aficionado David Denier.

1:39 Spoiler alert, So David, so, hen, how's the Lonely Hearts Club? Lonely and heartful? What does that mean? I don't even know. That's good. That's good. It's best that it be ambiguous. Ambiguous are empty at this point? Well, that got fucking dark. Yeah you're welcome. Yeah, great job, great, good way to go with the movie Tonight though, well, I mean Tonight's movie is a story about true love and where it'll take you. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's it. I mean, it is, it is, so it is. But yeah, but before we talk about that, geez, we just saw love hurts, Yes, we did, which you know, I mean, we're recording this right before actual Valentine's Day. Yeah, and uh yeah, there were a lot of couples at the theater in line there was, and none of them for Companion. It looked like, yeah, they were all going to Companion. Yeah, a lot of really young folks.

2:46 Which I think honestly that I think we've seen every single Valentine's Day available in theaters now because we've seen Companion, Hard Eyes and Love Hurts. Yeah. I think you're right. Yeah, yeah. So as far as Love Hurts goes action comedy, absolutely in theory, romance is somewhat. Yes. Uh I. My biggest issue with Love Hurts was it the title. The title made sense, but the romance aspect of it did not. It didn't hit I would say, oh yeah, I didn't think. So, Oh hateful Dave. You've said the same thing in the car, what are you talk about? Well, no, my problem with Love Hurts and I hate being harsh, but the whole film came off as really really half baked, unbalanced. Well I mean totally exactly, like what happens when something's half baked, Like some of it's all mushy and still whatever, and then the other parts splengy and nice. Yeah, it didn't seem like it was very comfortable being a comedy or an action movie and infinitely uncomfortable being a romance story. Entirely zero chemistry between the lead and his romantic interest, although it's not like they had a chance. They were like the room together like three times. And yeah, there's not a lot going on there.

4:05 I mean, it's basically that the classic story of you don't know who you're messing with again, but at the same time, like it's it's a story we've seen a thousand times before. Well, but but this version is a little different. Like he's not hiding because he's a former hit man. Yeah, but he's not like hiding from the people he used to work with. They know that he's out. Yeah, they let him, they leave or whatever his life. Yeah, but uh, he gets dragged back in because the woman he loves was he was ordered to kill her. Yeah, and although I guess they weren't. Dating, they weren't dating. There was just ever in love with really any hints of romance. It was basically that he let her go spoiler alert, he let her go.

4:48 Oh that's like we already we know that pretty much immediately he let her go. I mean, you really can't spoil the movie except for like the one death that actually affected us. Yeah. Yeah, well, and that's kind of my point about it being kind of half baked, Like it's kind of like you ever listen to interviews where Jackie Chan says, like what movies he says no to? It's very much the kind of movie Jackie Chan would say no to. Yeah, Jackie Chan often says like, I don't want movies that are overly violent. I don't want movies that are overly you know, like they're overly violent, too much murder or whatever, too much base. I think he says, for the most part, like murder for murder's sake, like there's no there, like it's just basically just up a body count. Well, and if you watch a Jackie Chan movie, I mean, for the most part, if anybody dies, it's a big deal in a Jackie Chan movie. Aside from like that movie where he played the villain or whatever, those are very different. We're talking for The Foreigner, which I liked The Foreigner. It was good, it was dark, it was cool seeing him play a villain, but he was a but he was also like a for lack of a better term of righteous villain. Yeah, he had been horribly wronged.

5:49 His daughter I believe had been killed. Yeah, and he was basically on a war path for vengeance. Yeah. That was self destructive on purpose. Yeah, and he knew it. And it's not a It wasn't a surprise to the audience. No, And it really wasn't an action film either. Had action sequences. Yeah no, no, I mean it has a few stunt scenes there. But with Love hurts. I wanted to like it a ton, but it felt like the components they had were sparks. They were just like, we want what's his name of the actor. They wanted him to star in an action movie, and they wanted him to be a badass. And then and they got a well known stunt fight coordinator to be the director for his feature film debut, guy by the name of Jonathan I don't know. But so you have Ti Kwang and he's this kind of dorky average guy, which he's really great at playing. I mean, I mean, I mean he this is like the this is the worst thing we're gonna get from everything everywhere, all at once being a hit. Yeah, and I mean that with love because everything everywhere at once was amazing, and it showed what an incredible actor he was. It showed how endearing he could be and what rain she could have.

7:13 But then you watch love Hurts, and I guess the biggest problem, if I had to really dig into my psyche, would be the love interest is very unlikable because the whole concept is that she was allowed to not get assassinated, and then what does she do? She comes back a while later and shows up in his life. Is like, I can't keep hiding and you shouldn't hide from your brother either, money and she wants to money. Although there's more to it, well kind of, but but what ends up happening is she shows up in his life and literally starts, and it starts just ruining people's lives unrelated.

7:57 There's an immense amount of very being degrees of collateral damage. Some are we're very out of place in a comedy. It was one of those movies where you you have amazing action sequences. I mean, some of those fights are are incredible and insanely brutal, but then your murder count for like actual like main characters is like two. Yeah, and only the characters that are nice yeah, like only the characters that literally did nothing. Our villain spoilers technically doesn't get murdered on screen at least. Yeah. Well, from the way the first fight scene, when I assumed just nobody was gonna get murdered, that was gonna be one of those, which is very Jackie Chan asked that, like, you just don't kill anybody. But then so then this whole thing where his love interest is like I want the real you to come out or whatever, and then she's so happy when he starts.

8:46 Like becoming vicious, well because he. Kills like Henchman, yeah toward the end, and she's like so happy, and I'm all thinking, is like I thought that our whole his whole character development was that that was bad. Yeah, and he hated that, but now it's like, I'm so glad you're back, Like that's who I needed, the vicious murderer. She Yeah, she was, cause she came off really unlikable because all she did was show up at wreck everything. No, I agree. I think my biggest issue with it was it just it didn't feel like it really ever gave us anything that we didn't get in like the first ten minutes. Well, and if they wanted to to get that across in a way that was a little bit more entertaining. Yeah, they could have had it be one sided, like he's really in love with her and she's callous. That could have been a good like growth moment if it was like, you know, he realizes, like you don't care about me very much, do you? But no, it's supposed to be a love story. They're supposed to actually be in love. Yeah, And all I could think the whole movie was, man, his life was so great. He like I remember about halfway through the film when is because his brother turns out his brother again not a big spoiler. His brother is the person who's like, uh running yeah, knuckles, he's running the organization he used to work at. Once you start to see what's going on and all this, my first thought was, really, like, man, this like our main character.

10:08 He would have been. He would have had such a good life if you just murdered that woman probably and apparently he had killed dozens before as a hitman. Well. That was the thing too, was you had so many different main villains to stack up to your actual top dog, and it was just and I didn't have an issue with that in regards of just like learning who those people were. But it was just like they amounted to nothing. They were just they were just names for. The most part. I mean we had a few that got some development, but that. Everybody was against everybody, like. Yeah, it wasn't a terrible movie. Yeah it was a fun time. Eighty eighty two eighty three minutes. You mean you're you're in and out for one. Yeah, but I could, I could definitely understand why audiences were not coming to see Love Hurts in the theater.

10:49 They were there to see companions like you. And I said, it's a movie where you can definitely tell studio involvement heavily, because I don't think an eighty three minute movie was the original idea. I mean, have been Mitos in. Do You Even? Movie? Will be right back, welcome back to Do You Even? Movie. The other thing was that there was a lot of moments that were predicated by voiceover, which made me feel like maybe the movie was a big mess and they were trying to make it make sense.

11:30 Yeah, and not just one voiceover, multiple character voiceovers. It was just him and the woman. There was Knuckles had a couple two. Oh okay, no, no, you're right right, he did. Yeah, but they were kind of he was like in a room with somebody. It didn't feel quite as like as opposed to like the leading man and the leading lady were like laying in bed, and it's just kind of it felt more like a voice over as opposed to like a monologue. Genuinely, I would have probably probably enjoyed it just a little bit more if the first ten minutes would have been him telling the story that we kind of saw spread throughout the movie. I think if we would have been like, you know, I like I used to do this blah blah blah blah, and like go through all his run ins and everything like that, and then it's just like, but now I live this quiet life. Well, I think that what they were going for was the like you find out as we go and I don't.

12:18 I think because he's so likable and because he seemed to be a legitimately changed person, because that's the other thing. It wasn't like those other you don't know you're messing with movies where it's like, oh, the like the badness was always still in me and it always wanted to get out. Yeah, Like there was never a moment when he was working as a mild manner real estate agent where like he like resisted the urge to like punch somebody or like or like tackled somebody and like or or got even got or even raised his voice. Shit, I just realized something. The big death that we've already that we talked about, we're not gonna spoil. But the other one is the the the realtor dude. Yeah, he's barely in the movie at all, and all he does is try to help. Yeah, and not only try to help, he tries to help like his number one competitor. So he's literally like not a jerk at all.

13:03 Well and not only that though, like. And I'm not even sent sure he was a property brother. And he dies like really violently. Yeah no, he absolutely does. We actually see you inside his head. Yeah yeah, he gets his brains blown out. Meanwhile, like the killers who are like, you know, just NonStop killers, get like a lot of love. I don't know, maybe Scott, it totally was a property brother. I'm not familiar with. Property brothers are a reality show. It's it's two twin brothers that sell realty. Drew Scott that was one of them. Oh, that's funny. Yeah, but since we you know, love hurts what it's fine. But we could also talk about the movie that we really did enjoy this past weekend. Oh oh, I think you're saying Happiness.

13:45 I haven't watched it in a while. Well, Valentine's Day is right around the corner. I gotta get that criteria Blue Rays at that point. Yeah, you do. No, we did four K. I think we did check out Hard Eyes, which was a really fun Valentine's Day horror movie. Done by Josh Rubens, who, if you're not familiar with the name, he is the man who gave us so far. Scare Me and Where Wolves Within? Yes, two very good movies in my opinion. Scare Me was is his best film to this day. It's kind of neck and neck with me for Where Was Within? Because Where Was Within? That twist, like I texted you when it happened. Yea, I know, it's that's so good. No, it was great. It's just Scare Me. There was something about the honest simplicity.

14:25 Of telling stories. It's literally a guy and a girl in a cabin and they're both writers, yeah, who are vaguely competitive with each other. Yeah, And they end up just trying to scare each other by telling them a story that they're developing, which I thought was the friggin' coolest concept and and I loved it. I absolutely adored it. But nothing against Werewolves Within or Hard Eyes. They were both really fun. Hard Eyes. I was very surprised to find myself feeling like was very influenced by early two thousands and slasher movies. Yeah, there's no there's no doubt. Yeah, and not just Valentine, which is kind of the obvious comparison, but it was similar to Valentine in a lot of ways, but but also it was very It reminded me a lot of like Black X Meus. It reminded me of Sorority Row, Yeah, where it had this very slick look to it, which is nothing wrong with that. The characters were all a little caddy, like a little extra caddy, and like to where it was like, if you dialed it a little bit more, it would be unbelievable. But they always reeled it in just in time, just when you thought like, oh, this person's a caricature of a person, and then they would do something and be like, Okay, no, I believe that they're real aside from like a few of the sillier slasher victims, but I mean a lot of slasher victims are going to be relatively one dimensional.

15:48 And going to Hard Eyes. The overall design of the Hard Eyes killer I thought was really cool. I thought, just creating that character, creating that slasher film, and then we live in this slasher film now where this character has been killing people for years now, yes on Valentine's Day. I just I love the concept of it. But I think what I really liked about Hard Eyes most was, you know, we go from Love Hurts that had very bad chemistry. Hard Eyes had really good chemistry between the two leads. Yeah, they know they had. They had great chemistry to the point where it almost pissed you off. Yeah, Like they were just they were so likable. And that's kind of the thing that made me love it even more, is it? It kind of in a twisted way, works as a rom com y. It definitely works as a slasher movie, and it works as kind of a comedy as well. It works as all three simultaneously, and the only one that loses out the most is rom Com, which makes sense because rom Com doesn't merge very well with horror.

16:40 And I'm seen a bunch of people commenting that I had too much rom comment it for them. I without spoiling. Yeah, it had some very ballsy choices. Yeah that I loved. It had moves where it did not give you what you what horror fans would expect, which I think is what they deserve is to not be given exactly what they're always expecting. Again and again, I think the key too was they gave us a lot of red herrings, which kept us wanting to guess who the killer was throughout the movie. Yeah, but the red herrings even were a little winky. They were winky. They were winky. But at the same time, I didn't call the movie like like, I didn't call who the. Killer was until probably about like twenty minutes. Well, they did that thing where they left you plenty of suspicion, but then they made it more complex in order to make it pay off better, which I thought was great.

17:28 Well, and also I love the tropes that the romantic comedy tropes that they do, like the the the running to the train station, airport at airport. Oh yeah, that whole fake out was fantastic. Yeah, so no hard Eyes was probably one of my top three of the year so far, even though we're only in February. I was just saying, so, what are your other three, because we've only seen like six movies for the handing to Flight Risk. Flight Risk was so much fun. Yeah, Companion bar none though, top Valentine's Day movie, and it will be in the box office as well. I mean it already is pretty much but Hard Eyes a ton of fun and I would love to see it do better. It's right now not doing great. Maybe maybe it'll up swing during Valentine's Day, who knows. But it's funny though, because you could say, like, well, it's not gonna up swing a Valentine's Day because you know what, you know, it's such a guy movie. I mean, it's all slasher, bloody and stuff. It's like, no, no, the girls want to take their guys to see the movie about the sex robot murdering everybody. You see what I mean. It's kind of funny.

18:26 I'm just happy that we have the holiday like horror in two of them in theaters this year. Basically, Yeah, we haven't had that in a while. Yeah, we really have, especially on Valentine' Day. Well, I feel like it's been tried, and I mean even my Bloody Valentine. I mean that was a long time ago. Then the remake did not pull big numbers. I don't think it might have might have. I think the three D really killed it, actually. I mean I saw it in three D and n D opening night. Yeah, now I'm curious, but uh, my point is really, my main point is I would like it to do well because, and this is something a lot of my friends, especially my horror fan friends, don't want to hear. Slasher movies don't do well in the box I know, and haven't for for quite a while unless it's literally Halloween or pretty much just Halloween Halloween.

19:16 I mean it's it's a big pull for that name obviously. Yeah. No, no, that doesn't mean horror movies haven't been pulling. I mean a lot of what Blumhouse has come up with, especially now what Neon has come up with. But like the biggest slasher hit we've had in a while that wasn't an immediate remake or whatever was what was that movie? The one where we followed the killer the whole time. Oh, violent nature, violent nature in a violent nature. It did pretty well I liked it. It was fine. It was a fun one. It wasn't it was thought. Out really well, it was fine. I didn't love the ending. Yeah, but but that being said, man salty Dave is here. I really wanted to like in a violent nature, but I was I got bored after a bit. There were parts that were kind of boring, and I mean, for me, you know, it gets a little harsh watching people die horribly. Oh yeah, My Bloody Valentine three D was a huge hit. I thought one hundred million dollars against a fourteen million dollar budget. I thought it was big, good, good, Well, and yet it didn't get a sequel, which is a real change. Yeah why not?

20:12 Oh yeah, yeah, well you know the story with the ending of My Blood Valentine knowing you oh, there were five different ending shot and they didn't tell the actors which one they were going to use, so they didn't know who the killer was gonna be. Well, I mean it's kind of like how Scream. They didn't release the last three pages till like the last possible second. Yeah. Well that's because the fucking script got leaked so much. Yeah, well, and scripts were getting that was the the internet was fresh yep. So it was like the Usenet groups, yep, use net. Do you even movie? Will be right back, welcome back to do you even movie?

20:56 No. So I mean, unfortunately, like slasher movies just haven't been able to really kick Now, then you could say, like what about Terrifier three and Terrifier two, Sure, but those are like circumstances well they're they're outliers. And but here's the problem with that, and the reason I'm kind of like, damn, I wish slasher movies would would get that little resurgent boost is when a when a real deal hit happens in a genre, that genre tends to become the genre, not the movies tend to become really popular. Yeah. So with Terrifier two doing really well and then three doing really well, it really was like Terrifier two's huge success really just made Terrifier three a huge success. It didn't cause a boom of slasher movies, like like conjuring caused a boom of ghost movies, paramoral activity caused a boom of found footage ghost movies, supernatural movies. We haven't had that. Like I was hoping when the first Halloween hit, I was like, I hope. We just get a friggin ton of slasher movies, and we had a few try, like like health ast and stuff, and none of them really hit big. So that's where it gets really tough, because I try to see all of this stuff even if I if I wouldn't be that that into it. Yeah, And one of the reasons that, like, I'm first in line to see the Terrifier movies even though they're not exactly my favorite thing, is because I want to see more stuff like that in the theater. I want to support it. I love it, I love I love what it's doing almost as much, if not more than I love exactly what it is, which is also fine. So

22:28 I don't know. I would love for Hard Eyes to have been a huge hit. And maybe it'll get an upswing, maybe it'll get good word of mouth. It'll probably I bet it'll probably get a lot more attention on bod obviously, but I don't, I don't. I just don't know. I don't know where theater audiences are right now. I mean, it's a tricky time for theater movies anyway. Like, I'm really curious if that new Blumhouse movie, what was it called The drop, Drop Drop. I'm really curious how that'll do. It's not a slasher movie, but it's a horror thriller kind of thing. But I think it looks like the kind of thing people would really go out and see. So I don't know. But but unfortunately, it's like with with something like hard Eyes. I'm not hearing a ton of people rave about it on my social media.

23:09 I've seen a few, I mean too, just. A few, unfortunately, and I'm shocked I'm not seeing more of especially you know, my friends and stuff. I've seen a lot of positive reuse hoord on letterbox at least, so I mean people are definitely seeing it. But yeah, I think I think it's one of those movies that the core audience is obviously going to go see it in theaters. But I think at this point, I don't know where the audience is for most movie theaters because I mean, like just for night, when we went to go see Love Hurts, we were shocked at how many were they were there to go see Companion. Yeah, because we were waiting in line at the snack counter and there was a giant line and as people were leaving, I was watching where they were going they were all going right into the eight o'clock or the Yeah, the eight o'clock companion. Yeah. So and that's good. Oh, it's great. I love that. Yeah, and and and this twenty twenty four was a good year for horror and yet Immaculate you had the first omen they all did pretty good. I mean there were there were a ton and then I mean Late Now with the Devil did really well in theaters. Yeah, long Legs, Maxine, they were all but and Maximum would be the closest thing to a slasher movie, but it really wasn't a slasher movie. But again, but it's also a part three Yeah, so it also has that also gets tricky with it too.

24:08 X would be a good example of a slasher. But that one I think was the lowest. Performing of the thing, I think. Yeah, So it makes me wonder sometimes before we, you know, we get to the topic at hand. It makes me wonder sometimes if if the issue is horror fans aren't going out to theaters to support, or if the issue is that there just aren't that many die hard horror fans to begin with, I mean enough to make a movie a forty five thousand dollars hit. I mean Abigail. Yeah, you know, should have been a hit. I think, honestly one of the biggest issues. And I run into this with my roommate, not to throw shade to him, but people don't watch movies a lot anymore. Like I hate saying it that way, but a lot of people are watching like web based content, influencers and stuff like that. I'm I'm just telling you, Like it seems like that is kind of a trend somewhat that I'm seeing.

24:56 But what we had big box office movies. We did, Yeah, But at the same time, I think, I don't know, I think it just doesn't seem like the theaters have gone back to what I remember them as being, or what what you and I used to see when we would go to like mattineve shows and whatnot, Like it seemed like there was a decent crowd there on Tuesdays for a while, and we just haven't seen one in a bit. So. According to a quick research bit, box office totals in twenty twenty four were eight point five six billion dollars, down four percent from twenty twenty three. I'm not having an easy time finding like anything else, like like the like a whole list of of them. But I don't think that that people going to the theaters is down that much. I mean, granted, we're still recovering from COVID, but I mean, but we were having slasher movies. But I mean, Hellfest was way before COVID, way before COVID, and it just didn't and I thought that was a fucking blast.

25:50 But I mean, I do remember our theater for health Fest seemed pretty packed though too when we went to see it. So I mean that's the thing, is like, I feel like it's, you know, the biggest draw for while we're Marvel movies, and now everybody's burned out. I don't I don't know a single person that is going to see Captain America this Friday. I mean yeah, but I I mean, and it made it very well bombed yea and health healthest because I don't want to sound like a picking on. It did a respectable eighteen million against a five million dollar budget, but it likely spent advertising five to ten million on advertising, and that is often a problem you have with those those films. That's why the Blumhouse method of generally often making them very cheap and then promoting them efficiently is supposed to be like the big you know, the Big Way, But that's kind of my point is like it seems like for a die hard like slasher horror movie, it's very hard to cross a twenty million dollar box office.

26:45 So that's why I'm saying, I wonder if there just aren't enough diehards for that kind of content, because we know what kind of horror is somewhat hot, and last year it did change a lot, but it didn't it didn't change towards like a movie like Late Night with the Devil doing forty million. It had Late Night with the Devil doing like I don't know exactly how much, but you know, many millions, yeah, against a very low budget, And that's what we're seeing a lot of which I like that. I like the idea of like cheaper movies, but plenty of them in the theaters, lots of opportunities. But I wonder if it's just what I'm really saying, is I wonder if the studios are in denial that you should make such an you should make an expensive slasher movie and it'll make even more money. It could be.

27:31 That's kind of what I'm getting at, because there's nothing wrong with making a movie that fits a niche that an audience will come out and see. But like hard, I is making eight million dollars in its first roughly first week against an eighteen million dollar budget. Yeah, that's rough. It's rough. That's that's really rough. And I hate to see it because it was a really friggin fun movie. Oh no, yeah, yeah, first week. Sorry, I just saw the release date and I forgot what day of the week it is. When we're reading this. Well and I think too it goes. That's saying that we're also seeing a lot of success with the Legacy pictures, from the Legacy sequels to the new you know breakofs of. Those I mean only for the Last Forever. Yeah, I mean, I know what you're saying, but yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like there's that's where a lot of the audience is going is to those familiar, familiar characters and stories and whatnot.

28:16 But we're like in the post remake remakes. We're in the remakes that try a little harder to be appealing to the fans, which I like, Like I love David Gordon Green's Halloweens including ends Fight Me, I don't care. But you and me both I know, I know you do. Yeah, it's just there's secretly another person in the room. They're listening, they're watching. But I love those I thought those were super fun. I thought what they tried to do with Exorcists, with the New Exorcists, it was Yeah, I mean I thought what they were trying to do with it was interesting. I think it just didn't quite have the well but I but you know, David Gordon Green was clearly very very inspired when he made the first time Halloween. That that he did, I mean, like super inspired, and that inspiration carried the three movies, even when three had to change a ton because of COVID and everything. So I don't know. My point is, like I would love to see a slasher movie just clean up at the box office. Yeah, and and I wouldn't even care. But like if Hard Eyes, just for context, Hard Eyes was awesome, but if it had been made and I'm not saying they could have made the exact same movie for like four million dollars, but if they made it for four million dollars, it would be on its way to being a hit right now.

29:29 And while it was an awesome movie, to look at and had a lot of great moments. There is a part of me that's like, why did it cost so much? Yeah, And and on the other side, like I also want to make it very clear, like Josh Ruben is a freaking baller director, and I hope he got a fat paycheck and didn't take too many points on the on the. Back, especially since the house that he and his wife just bought Paris and those fires before that you moved into it. Oh fuck, I'm so sorry to hear that. Yeah, there's a whole crowdfunting campaign. Man, I didn't know that. Yeah, well damn. Way to keep the positive activity, Dave. But yeah, but my wrap up on that is I really hope that more people do find hard eyes. It's if you are a lover of Valentine, Sorority Row, House of Wax, thirteen Ghosts, Cost Ship, any of those like early two thousands, those are this is exactly that audience.

30:17 Well, the problem is a lot of people are just now starting to come around on how fun those movies were, because it was very popular to hate on those movies, very popular. I remember seeing Sorority Row at the Dan Barry Dollar Saver Rest in Peace and having a blast. I was so mad at myself that I didn't see it opening weekend because I wanted to support. It opening weekend at the Mayflower when the Mayflower was still open in Troy. Rest in Peace, Mayflower too, Piece Mayflower? Do you even movie? Will be right back? Welcome back to Do you Even Move?

31:05 So? I mean, yeah, the cinema experience has definitely changed a lot. I don't think that people are disinterested in going to the movies, but I do think that they're They're more interested in the experience, which is why you have Maxine and Long Legs and Terrifyer three being bigger hits. That's because people are interested in an experience. They're interested in something that they've never seen before, at least to some extent. Well, I mean, and some of those retro screenings, like when they did the eighties Summer eighty four this past year, and like Last Starfighter, Nightmare and Elm Street, all those those theaters were packed. Some of them are really packed. Yeah, yeah, so I think, yeah, I think there's just a point to figure out of what do people still want to see on the big screen and what are they going to just completely skip the big screen four and wait till streaming because.

31:49 Yeah, well, and and from there there's also a really important point, And this is something I was saying back when people were rallying and crying a river against digital projection over thirty millimeter. You probably remember me saying flat out. I was like, but theatrical distribution is going to become so accessible. I was talking, like I was commenting on and Andrew Scott's podcast, because and Andrew says, one of my favorite podcasts if you're an audio nerd, really just a nerd in general. His podcast is great releases on Sundays. But I had commented because he was talking about he went to see Terrified three and he had an amazing time and all this stuff. And I commented and said, like, keep in mind that before digital projection and digital theater projection being common, you needed a minimum of around three thousand dollars to make one film print that could go around the country. Sometimes way more. You might be able to get the number less, but then you're making hundreds of them. In the olden days, you know, Roger Corman would make fifteen prints, and he would start some in la and some in New York and have the meat in the middle of the country. That was one of his methods. He had other methods too. Sometimes he would just start in mississipp because he knew he'd break in cash in the drive and then once the cash came and he could make even more prints and he'd expand, and he'd expand, et cetera, et cetera. Well, now I mean we're talking the hard drive isn't even three hundred dollars anymore. No, I mean half the time now their satellite beaming to a lot of the especially if they're not showing four KLL.

33:18 What I went to see the revival screening of Signs of the Lambs that TCM was putting on. They played it off a DVR. Well, that's that's what I mean. That's why I mean, it's being broadcast over south. That's how they do riff tracks. That's how they do and that's how they can do live events. To what they do is that it's it's kind of like how television stations used to work. How they used to send it over the satellite and they would just record the satellite stream so that they had the tape in all these places and then they could air the tape later, it's it's very similar to that. Hey, nothing will ever be as great as that Breakfast Club screening we went to. Oh god, that was like off a DVD off what's it was so rough? Well, I went to a planes, trains, and automobile show and I want to say twenty fifteen or twenty sixteen, and it did not it was not a remass.

34:00 Addition, Hey, nothing will beat that time that we were sitting in a theater that I will not name because they are still in operation today and doing very well. But we went to see a double feature of Halloween and Halloween Too, and I could tell what they were playing because the menu kept recycling and recycling. I don't even remember. Yeah, oh wait, oh oh that theater I was under different owners. Yeah it was, but yeah, but I remember that well. I mean, what do you want I remember one time the drive in? They ever tell you that story? One time when I was I was going to the drive in back when my buddy Bill was the manager at the Dixie Twin, and they were showing they were doing like the classic of the First Friday of October or Last Friday of October or whatever it was, Halloween Evil. It was Lloween change No, it was Halloween Friday and Nightmare Elm Street. In the second night was Evil Dead Texas Chainsaw and I want to see the Hills have eyes.

34:48 I think he was evil at too. I feel like it was evil. Well. They did it a few times too. This was the first time and Bill sent me a text. He was like, hey, this is probably like this basical sounds silly, but you have have a copy of Blu Ray of Evil Dead one, right, yeah? And I was like sure doing. He's like, our DCP hasn't arrived yet and you're coming, right And I was like, oh yeah. He's like, could you just bring it in case you go? So I brought my copy. They actually showed they showed my copy on Blu Ray, which, hey, you know, you gotta do what you gotta do. I remember that too, because the screen was doing the Japanese the credits at the end, and then they had the like it was all that like at the end of the Blue Ray. It's really really funny. But anyway, so my point just being that, I mean, I still love the cinema experience.

35:32 I'm like David who hates it now and and I do. I will say, uh, if you haven't seen Hard Eyes and you've been putting it off, go see it before it leaves theaters, because it deserves your support. If you love horror films, and if you love a fun time in the theater, because it And think about the fact that on this very show where I have how many times talked about how horror comedies just don't work for me, this one worked pretty damn well. Really, it really so. And that's saying something because, like even Leff Hurts, I was like, this is a little too jokey for how violent it is. I mean, you know. So Anyway, that was very long when I was gonna say, yeah that our movie Tonight, Dave Yes, Sir, is a film I had not revisited, possibly since I first saw it on Netflix in twenty fourteen.

36:19 I think I had. The last time I revisited it was when I bought the Blu rays, and I think that was like about five years ago. I think I bought it during COVID once I. Wish I had bought it. Yeah, that you do. Well, I have a region free player now, so I'll buy it from Germany. But our film Tonight is Blue Ruin from twenty thirteen, one hour and thirty minutes, rated R for strong, bloody violence and language. I would say that's fair. Yeah, I would say so too. I'm synopsis says, a mysterious outsider's quiet life is turned upside down when he returns to his childhood home to carry out an active vengeance. Proving himself an amateur assassin, he winds up in a brutal fight to protect his estrange family. That's a solid description, my synopsis says. Upon hearing that the murderer of his parents is being released from prison, dwy Evans returns to his hometown of Virginia to take vengeance, to take vengeance on him, unaware the retaliation could reach his own family.

37:07 That's pretty good. It's a little too much. That's fair. I mean, I mean that's constructive criticism. A little too much. Even though the other one has more words than mine. It felt like too much. Taglines include Revenge comes home. The night, the Revenge comes home second. A man with nothing to lose is a man with nothing to fear. I like that one. That's pretty good. Blue Ruin at This Time is currently available to stream through fowsome Plex, Pluto to B and you can also, if you're lucky enough, find a old release of it through Anchor Bay on DVD and Blu ray. But it's going to be a bit pricey. Yeah, And I went ahead and bought a digital copy for myself here because I want to make sure I have a digital.

37:48 Through Fandango at home right now. In the US is eight dollars, so I will say it. Was eight dollars on Amazon as well. Okay cool. So director and writer and cinematographer on the film is Jeremy Solner. He gets to start as writer and director Murder Party in two thousand and seven, goes on to do Blue Ruin in twenty thirteen, as writer and director Green Room in twenty fifteen rebel Ridge. He also is a director on The Killer Speaks in twenty thirteen, Hold the Dark, an episode of True Detective in twenty nineteen, and he also was the director of photography on Tis Autumn, The Search for Jackie Parris Hamilton in two thousand and six, Murder Party, Putty Hill, Septian, you hurt my feelings in Our Nature Seagirl run I used to be Darker, and Blue Ruin in twenty thirteen was as last as DP. Well I mean at that point. I mean Blue Ruin was a big point because his first feature, Murder Party, I did an entire episode of cutting deep into horror over Weekly Spooky on It, which is a great episode.

38:40 It is because that's a movie I discovered straight up on a Friday night at Blockbuster when I lived in Jersey and I had not heard of it at all. I just saw that poster. I took it home, and it killed me. I told you that I didn't like it the first I watched it. Right, Yes, I tried to forget that from I. Bought the DVD from Foye, took it home, was super excited, put it on, and I was just like, this is not at all what I expected it. It's fine. And then I can't remember what caused me to revisit it a couple of years later, and I was like, I'm stupid and wrong and this is amazing. Well, that's another example. That's a horror comedy that I consider one of my tops. Yeah, of all time, Oh absolutely so. And murder But Murder Party, released by Magnolia and Magnet Releasing, didn't set the world on fire, but it had incredible word of mouth. It had the reviews were great. The people who loved it loved it. The people who loved it were obsessed with it.

39:27 Lock It was on Netflix for like what six years. On and off it Yeah, because it went away and came back. Yeah. I remember showing it to one of my roommates way back in the day and on Halloween, he had gotten home from work he worked at a restaurant. He got home at like that. I was like, dude, you want to watch murder parties? Like, what the hell's murder party? I was like, just hold on. When it was over, he turned to me, was like, gotta watch that every fucking Halloween. Man. Like he was shocked how how fun it was fun? And it holds up every time I watch it gets better. Very well made movie. But so with that film having come out in seven, Sawleer had a lot of trouble, you know, kind of finding his way. I suppose I feel like I remember hearing and you'll you'll probably know this in the trivia that that in a way Blue Ruin was potentially the Swan song. Yeah, and which I understand because I made I made my Swan song in twenty eleven and then continued, you know, I'm still making movies to this day, so I respect that feeling though of making a movie that's gonna be your swan song.

40:27 Absolutely, do You Even movie will be right back, welcome back to Do You Even? Movie? And Blue Ruin not a very funny movie, very well acted, very well paced, very well shot. It was made right when we went from the DSLR digital camera revolution to having digital cinema cameras. It was shot on the Cannon C one hundred I believe, or maybe it was C three hundred, doesn't matter, one of the first cameras that was meant to be like a DSLR like a photography camera, yeah, but was meant for video so you could use photography lenses, which were very affordable, and Soallner did shoot it on photography lenses. I remember because people were shocked. Now great it looked because it was considered shot on lesser equipment, but it got such a huge amount of attention. In part it was because he knew what he was doing to make it look great. It's funny because that was the camera I was considering when I bought my first digital cinema camera, but I went Sony in part because it was cheaper. Makes sense a lot cheaper.

41:40 Well, I mean, the reason that the movie is effective, and we'll get into this obviously, but the reason the movie is effective is because it is a beautiful movie. But it's a haunting film, and the imagery is so beautifully shot, and it's horrible, horrible acts. No, it's and it's very matter of fact. Yeah, it's very realistic. Here we go. Well, and that's the thing. It's a revenge film that is, in my opinion, like hyper realistic. Yeah, which is scary, and you don't get a lot of those revenge movies are usually a bit more about satisfaction, although one of the most common tropes there's an old saying, he who seeks revenge should dive dig two graves. I don't know what that's from. Maybe that's from the Bible. I don't even know. I think it's a I've heard it. I'm a lot of Westerns, but I don't know.

42:23 Well that it might be the Bible. Yeah, a man who seeks revenge Confucius? Honestly, maybe, Well, you know, what, do you have any favorite Confucius? No? My favorite was he who stands on toilet high on pot TM. What Yeah, pretty solid? Oh yeah, just you got nothing to say. I mean, I was gonna conso, so it is. A proverb up from confused. Well it's attributed to Confucius, but no one really knows that's fair, but it appears to be Confucions. But yeah, I mean that's that's a wrong tie to any vengeance film that's always usually referenced in. And I think that's one thing that attracted me to Blue Ruin when I when I didn't even know really who Solner was.

43:08 I mean I didn't even know he had Murder Party because I just didn't even really pay attention that much. You got into Murder Party that late. I got into Murder Party when I still lived at home, and it was a used DVD that I found at f YE, and it would have had to have been twenty ten, twenty eleven. Wow, Yeah, so right before Blue Rooin. Was because then I don't think, honestly, dude, I don't think I went back to Murder Party till after Blue Ruin now to think about it. Wow, So yeah, I think I think it took me. A bit, but yeah, it was, uh, but Blue Ruin was just it was a different vengeance tale that i'd seen ever before. I mean because I had not seen like a rolling thunder at that point, because that's a great one. Trying to think of some other vengeance movies that have that kind of tone to them, get Carter's one of them, I would say too, But like it's just it is a true blue vengeance.

43:57 Tale, a true blue true brueve. Yeah. Well, and Soalliner they went at and making Blair, who make him Blair? I means were spent. Christ is the launch of his shockingly and I mean this with love, yeah, because he's a great actor, but like a shockingly good so career. He actually so making Blair who plays Dwight Evans in the film. He gets a start in two thousand and five on a film called Gretchen, then does Murder Party in two thousand and seven, appears on an episode of SVU, and eight side by each and eight You Hurt My Feelings twenty eleven, The Man from Orlando, Hellbenders in twenty twelve, then does Blue Ruin, followed by Green Room in twenty fifteen, Gold in twenty sixteen with Matthew McConaughey. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, And this is when I started to notice. I was like, yeah, I remember one point he walked into a scene and I was like and I was like, wait, I'm watching a Clon Eastwood movie. Yet.

44:42 Then he does I Don't Feel at Home in This World Anymore, which he also directs in twenty seventeen, which is the writer and director on Small Crimes in twenty seventeen, Into the Who Knows in twenty seventeen, Mustang Island, The Florida Project, Logan Lucky in twenty seventeen, Yes, Yes, Yes, thunder Road in twenty eighteen, Hold the Dark in twenty eighteen, which he's a writer on. Oh I didn't know that. That's awesome, Sister. Amy in twenty nineteen, Room one oh four, which he's writer and director on swamp Thing TV series in twenty nineteen, I Blame Society in twenty twenty, The Hunt in twenty twenty, I Care a Lot in twenty twenty h than he does, Oppenheimer in twenty twenty three, Yes, Then Toxic Avenger in twenty twenty four, which hasn't been released. In which he's direct He wrote and directed I Believe. And he also appeared in Reservation Dogs, Rent, Free the Thicket, and mow Man.

45:24 Yeah I Mean incredible and considering that, like when they made Blue Ruin, he was kind of like, well, I've tried. Yeah, I haven't gotten to do much. And now all of a sudden blowing up in like his late thirties, All of a sudden, he's in Eastwood movies. He's in Christopher Nolan movies. I love it. I remember when he walked in on The Hunt and we were just like. Ohly shit, it's a baking Blair. Yeah, but that one, at least, I mean, but that one was more expected than when he walked down in Oppenheimer. Yah. The Hunt. It's like, yeah, but it's like it's a fun, kind of lower budget, you know, it's a Blumhouse thing. I loved seeing him pop up in these like big, oh, major films. When he appears in the beginning of I Care a Lot and then it closes out the film, I was just like, yeah, make him Blair.

46:06 Yeah, No, that was a good one. That was a really good movie. Yeah. So David Thompson also in our cast, who plays William in the film. He gets a start in twenty eleven with Win Win How to Make It in America in twenty eleven Unforgettable in twenty eleven, A Christmas Story two in twenty twelve, does Blue Ruin in twenty thirteen, appears on board Walk, Empire in twenty fourteen, Moon in the Sun twenty fourteen, Unbreakable, Kemmy Schmidt in twenty fifteen, Oh, I didn't see that episode Green Room in twenty fifteen, The Outcast, Gotham, The Boys, Panic, Fear Street Part one, and in twenty twenty one. Then He'd does Station nineteen twenty twenty two, and most recently It's What's Inside in twenty twenty four. Right, which is not an ed Great movie. Eggar Wright was credited on a review I read. I don't know why, but I'm gonna find out. Maybe they said it reminded them of an ed Great could have been that was a fun Maybe he appears in the movie. I don't know, he doesn't, okay.

46:52 Amy Hargraves also wrapping up our cast, who plays Sam in the film. She gets her start in nineteen ninety four's Brain Scan. His sister is the main chicken brain Scan No Way, no Way, indeed, well it's yes way, yes way. And sorry. Then she does ABC after school specials in ninety four Remember Me in ninety five, Flashback in ninety seven, Family Log, Growing Down in Brooklyn, Law and Order, Criminal Intent in two thousand and two, Little Bill in two thousand and three, Third Watch two thousand and three, Michael Clayton, The Unusuals, Offspring, Shame, Homeland, Person of Interest, Blue Bloods, The Carry Diaries, The following Blue Ruin in twenty thirteen, The Blacklist, Elementary, How He Fell In Love, Power, Blind Spot, thirteen Reasons Why Sometimes Other Than Now in twenty twenty one, Bowl in twenty twenty one, Billions, hay Seed, Founder's Day, and most recently, Test Screening in twenty twenty four.

47:41 We never saw Founders dated, but. We did not. We needed we need miss miss us in theaters. And I think it's like, I think it's on two B now. Oh well to check it out. But man, she has I had no idea she went. She built such a career after brain scan. That's awesome. I love that. So what was your first time watching Blue Ruin? So I was a fan of Jeremy Solliner since, like I said, since Murder Party, and I was living on the East Coast at that time working in movies, so I added him on Facebook and he accepted my friend request. We had some friends in common, mostly like people through Fangoria, the old Fangoria, and I remember him promoting I Kicked In. I want to say I put in a very small amount of money on the Kickstar. I was very broke at the time, but I think I might have put five bucks in or something. And I remember being so excited that he was crowdfunding a new movie because I just wanted to see a new movie from him. Oh hell yeah. And I remember kind of like falling off and not hearing about it, and then all of a sudden seeing people saying like, it's on Netflix and it's really good. And that was when I had to watch it because I was already a Netflix subscriber. So I put it on and my jaw was like on the floor pretty much the whole movie. That that first third of the film is some of the best filmmaking. Perfect It's just perfection. The way the film opens is we meet this beach bump played by Macon Blair. Yeah, and he's a beach bump.

49:08 He's a beach living in his car. Yeah, well and occasionally in people's houses when they're not holding it yet. Because we open with him, I believe, taking a bath in making a bath in someone else's. He had a sandwich, he's got it, and he's just in this house. The TV's on, and then they come home. Yeah yeah, and he just leaves and takes some clothes on his way out. Yeah. So he's just kind of hanging out doing whatever. He's all disheveled and and and stuff, and he has this he's living in this beat up car that doesn't run. Yeah, it just sits there. And it appears that the beach community know him. They probably don't know that he's like breaking into people's houses because he seems good at it. He was able to slip out, you know, real quick. Yeah do you Even? Movie? Will be right back. Welcome back to do You Even?

49:56 Movie. So, now as he's like hanging out doing this thing, this cop comes and he's of course nervous because he thinks they're going to tell him like you can't sleep with the beach or whatever. And the cop is super nice to him and she tells him like, look, I just need you to come with me. You're not in trouble. He comes along and we find out that someone who committed a crime related to him, he's being legally notified, Yes, that this person is being released from prison. Wade Cleland Junior. Yes. And as the film progresses, we find out what happened, what he did, well, well, we find out what they think happened versus what actually really happened. Yeah, And basically we find out that his parents were murdered and a long time ago.

50:43 Long time twenty years, Yeah, twenty years. And he's just been bumming it up ever since. Yeah. But now all of a sudden, instead of being like an aimless vagabond, all of a sudden, he's gathering up all the little bits of money he has left, and he's and he goes, this is why I love it. He goes to like an AutoZone, He buys a car battery. He fixes his car so like, That's for the reason I love that is not because not just because he knew how or whatever, but because he had been choosing not not to. He had been beating a beach bump, didn't care. He was like, why does the car need to move? I'm not moving. So he gets his car up and running, and it's a great sequence because he's so dutifully and silently just does all this yeh, and at this point he's barely spoken. Yeah, he may not have spoken at all.

51:30 Well, and he also buys a postcard. Well, that's that's why he after he's fixed the car, because he's at a pawn shop trying to get a gun. Yes, but he doesn't have enough money for this. Not enough money, no, no, So he tries to steal a gun by breaking into a car. Breaks into a truck, goes and gets the gun case, gets the gun and realizes there's a lock on the trigger. Yeah, there's a trigger lock on it, so tries to break it off, can't, breaks the gun yep. Takes it to a beach and breaks the gun entirely. And I love this because he's using a crowbar trying to hit it off, breaks the gun completely because he snaps the pardon my gun knowledge. A finger guard. No, he's out of the gun. He breaks the gun by the round the oh you mean the cylinder, the cylinder, The cylinder gets knocked out of the gun. So he takes the gun and the crowbar and puts them both in the trash on the beach.

52:19 Well, that ain't working, so then. He has to get a gun somehow. Well, or does he or does he indeed? So that's when we follow him to the prison. He basically finds out that the day that he's getting released, and he gets his car, he goes out there and he just waits and he waits, and then we see this white limousine pull up. We see some people get out, and we see Wade Cleveland Junior come up with his little box of stuff, puts it in the limo, and the limo goes driving, and he follows them to a bar. Now, and here's one thing I love. It's never explained why they have a limousine. There's a throwaway line of dialogue help his sister. They are running a limousine company. Oh that's what their money.

52:59 That's what they're money is. Oh okay, okay. That makes a lot more sense because when we see their family home later, it's not much to look at, so you kind of go, oh, where's the money going. So that's it's. A throwaway line from his sister about that because she's like, you know, and now they get to run a limousine company, like, how fair is that? So well, that makes perfect sense. I totally missed that. So they go to this bar and that is when Dwight pulls up, and I love I love this too, because he pulled, they they go past, or they go park their car. He drives past and parks his car off a little bit. Yeah, and then sneaks around the back of the bar. And the one thing that I love about this movie in regards to Dwight's shots, especially, he's he's going by the run. He he doesn't know what he's doing. He's just going by what he thinks he should be doing.

53:41 And he's kind of instinct. Yeah, and he's and he's out of his element. Yeah, oh yeah, but he's but he's still like very slow and methodically plotting. Yeah, And that's the other thing I love. I love that he just like sees this as happening. He's like, well, gotta get the car running, gotta get a weapon, gotta get to where I need to go. I don't think he speaks his first a dialogue until after. Yeah, I don't think he's because I don't think he speaks to the cop. I don't think he says a word out loud. Yeah, because then so well we don't want to get ahead. But yeah, but basically later on, when he sees his sister and they're talking. He says like, I'm not used to. Talking as much. Yeah, yeah, so uh so please please so yeah. He so he's sneaking around the back and he's going through this alley. He gets into the back of the club and we see that the bar is in business and everything. And he sneaks past this entry of the bar and goes into one of the supply rooms and finds a knife that you would use to like basically chop like the olives and stuff like that. Yes, so he's got this little tiny blade and he goes into the bathroom and he waits and he waits, and then Wag Junior comes in with the one guy. The other guy leaves him and then he comes out of the stall just sticks him in the neck. He and he starts fighting with him and everything. And then when he gets the upper hand again, he takes the blade and just sticks it right into his head.

54:53 Yeah. Quick, but well the sticking into his head is quick. Yeah, but he stabs him in the neck. Yeah, Wade, he grabs him. He's there. And the thing I liked about that was making Blair his reaction to like being strangled and stuff is not really even fear. No, I mean he's aware, like he doesn't want to die like outwardly. Would you like to know something in regards to that scene that's a that's technically trivia. Sure. The guy that's playing Wade was actually strangling making and Macon had to tell him a couple of times like hey man, like all you gotta do is like throw me, because like when he has his hand on his throat and you like see his eyes go, he was literally choking him. Everybody knows that if somebody's choking you too hard, all you have to say is easy daddy or you're safe. Word.

55:38 I mean I think easy daddy's better, not bad or yellow. Yeah, you know, but yeah, I mean he stabs him in the neck, and then he stabs him in the temple. And when we say the violence is realistic, the blood that comes out is not like horror film style. It's exactly what would be if somebody got stabbed in the temple. And when he falls down after he's pulled the knife out, yeah, they put there's blood in his eye, but not a ton and his eyes just all red and the blood's coming out and coming out, and he starts to slowly die. And Macon gets covered in his blood. Oh yeah. So he walks, walks out and goes over to the car, and before he leaves, he sticks the knife into the tire the limousine. Then he gets back in his car, realizes his keys are in the bathroom. Well, because they'd established earlier that he keeps the car keys around his neck. Yeah, and I'm pretty sure that was his parents car. Yes, So so it's like it's sentimental.

56:27 So fun story that they don't talk about the movie at all. Uh you notice how the bullet holes are in the car. Oh yeah, that's because his parents were killed in that car. Oh that makes perfect sense because they mentioned at one point they say, like your mom being in the car was unfortunate. Yep, so that now that makes perfect So yeah, perfect sense. So he gets back into his car, realize he doesn't have the keys, so then he goes and steals the limousine with the knife in the tire, yeah, with the flat tire, flat tire, and speeds off, speeds off. They come running out after him because they found Waight at this point. So he's driving and he goes a bit weighs, he's frantic, and then he starts hearing some knocking on the back window and realize says that somebody's in the back of the limousine. Yes, so he pulls over to the side and that's when the younger brother, William, comes out and he's like, you know, did you hurt Wade, And he's like, yeah, he hurt my family, and William, not missing a beat, goes, I don't think he did, takes off running. Yeah, it just runs away from him.

57:17 Yeah. And that's a great moment too, because we're learning so much about this character. We're learning so much about how he views this vengeance. But and that's kind of what I like about the movie is this idea of a person who has nothing to lose, and also the idea of of he's not stupid. No, he's not going into these situations believing he's John Rambo. He's going into these situations with a very realistic attitude that he'll probably die doing this and that's fine. He wants to have this conclusion to his story. And because of that, he makes mistakes because he's literally your average man taking vengeance. I mean like when he stabs the tire, he cuts his hand super Yeah.

58:00 It's one of my favorite little moments. Sandas is covered in blood, and he's already covered in blood, but now he's bleeding even more, even more. And that's another thing is his injuries are very realistically depicted, especially later on, Yeah, when it it nearly makes you sick to your stomach. That's That's one of the things that makes the movie work is that it's very it's very guttural and very realistic in a way that is unpleasant. And I always enjoy when things are unpleasant. Ye, when they're when they're an inherently unpleasant thing like murder, murder, Yeah, you know, and. You know, when you get done with a murder, you gotta go change your appearance. So he takes his car and that takes the limousine, ditches it, eventually breaks into another house, shaves his beard completely off, tied his hair up, gets nice clothes on. Then he checks the news, reports the news and sees that nothing has been reported.

58:48 And we we forgot to mention. He mails that postcard, mails the postcard to his sister, Yeah, which basically the postcard was to explain that he was going to kill Wade and that he was basically gonna like everything should be fine from this point. Yeah, so he mails the postcar breaks into that house, and that's when he leaves. He goes over to a gas station, gets a ride with the trucker, and then he eventually arrives at his sister's house. Yeah, and his sister lives in a suburban neighborhood. She appears to have a good job, Her kids are kids. She has two adorable little kids, and she's just getting ready to say goodbye to the kids and the baby guitters there, and as she leaves, she sees her brother. This is another part again. Realism is really the key to what makes this movie really incredible to me. Even when things are a bit more outrageous or fantastic, it's still very real.

59:40 Do You Even? Movie will be right back, welcome back to Do You Even? Movie. His sister doesn't react, but when like but she just kind of goes like, oh hey, like and she takes him out to get a hamburger and they sit down just at this fast food restaurant, and again not saying much, not saying much at all, she does ask him like, do you need money, and he's like, no. No, I got it. You have a box of stuff at the house. You're still a twenty eight hundred dollars you know, if the car, if you're still driving the Pontiac, you need to switch it over to your name.

1:00:22 Yeah, And it scared me. The moment I heard that, I was like, oh shit, yeah, because the car was left behind. Yes, So that's like the ultimately calling card of who was that? Yeah. And then what is great about this scene is she's like, you know, if you're here because Wade got out, I know, they let you know when they release a prisoner, they also send us a restraining order. Yeah, And that's when he basically is like, I killed Wade. Wade's dead, and they know it's me, And that's when the whole thing about the car comes out. But also before that, she even says that you know, I want them all dead, not just you know, that whole family should die, not just Wade. So that's when Macon puts together that since the car is registered, shit is who's with your kids right now?

1:01:03 Well? Well, the other realization is that there was never a police report, So that's what he goes they never called the police. That means they're going to take care of themselves. So he's like, who's with your kids right now. And it's a great tense moment. I do want to mention without getting into incredible amount of detail. I once had a girlfriend who got a notice that a violent criminal related to her in some way I don't want to be, you know, was being released. She got that notice, Jesus it was. She was okay, we went out and got hamburgers and milkshakes to like cheer to chill out about. But she was just kind of like, I need to tell you this, and then I don't want to talk about it. And I was like, all right, So yeah, so they really do notify victims and and uh and whether it's a direct victim or the victims families and stuff, they really do in most in most places. So yeah, they rush back to her place, very tense moment. They get there and as they're going, they're calling the babysitter's I'm answering your.

1:02:03 Being Oh yeah, like bad out of hell. So she gets in the driveway, runs up. The babysitter comes from the side and she's like, well, what's going on? Goes in the house, kids are fine, nothing is wrong and everything, and now she's pissed. She even starts attacking him. A little bit. Yeah, she's bad that he scared her so bad. Yeah, And it's also it's hilarious to think about how like how that works in life though, Like you need to get a hold of somebody right now to make sure they're alive. Yeah, and they don't answer. In general, if someone, say, doesn't pick up their phone for twenty five minutes, not a big deal, not a big deal, but in this case, yeah, quite a big deal, very big deal. So she's like, you know, I want you go on and everything, like, you know, don't don't be around here. And he basically tells her that he's concerned because now that they know the cars registered to her, they can come right here. It's not just between him that he's worried that she's gonna get involved.

1:02:51 Yeah, and he's worried that they're gonna come for revenge. Yeah, he's hoping. And because one of the things he keeps, you know, saying, is he's like, I wonder if they're here for me or they're here for you. Yeah, And that's a really, you know, solid point. So she convinces her, He convinces her to just get out of town, out there, Yeah, just her and the kids, just leave, and he sets himself up in her house. He posts up, so he basically is making every men's possible to like to check if they're coming, Like he's checking out the window, and eventually does see them at night parked outside the house. Yeah, and at this point he's tried to grab anything that he can for a weapon, which I think is a pitchfork. He finds a pitchfork, Well he doesn't. He's like, again, this is kind of that point about he's not an idiot. Yeah.

1:03:32 He he sets up things to help him know if doors are being you know, opened. He has the pitchfork. He goes upstairs. He makes the bed up like somebody's laying in bed wrapped in blankets, and turns lound, turns the faucet on, hoping that that'll distract them, to make them think to go upstairs. Yeah, so we can hopefully get some kind of jump on these guys. And sure enough, as soon as he turns on that light. They're in the house there. Well, he notices the guy, the guy walking up to the house. He breaks the little piece of glass and unlocks the door. Yep, and we're off to the races. So he's in the house with him and makings or Dwight's trying to avoid him. He hides behind a couch at one point. One of my favorite shots is he's hiding behind this couch. We see the one guy come from the side looking and he's just basically trying to figure out what to do. And by this point he knows that he's got to do something.

1:04:19 Well, I mean yeah, yeah. So that's when he gets out. He goes outside to his car, right. Yeah, he goes out. Well, he goes outside because there's another guy out there. Yeah, he escapes because, yeah, you got Teddy in the house and Carl's out front, so or maybe it's no wait, because Teddy's the one he hits in the car. Yes, Teddy's in the house, Carls out front. Karl's got the crossbow. So he gets out to his car and he gets it started, and that's when Teddy comes up with a shotgun, but he runs his car into him, knocks him out. He takes the shotgun and he goes up to Carl who's got the crossbow, and then Carl goes running. But Carl gets one shot off right in. His leg into his thighs thigh, which is worse. Well, not just worse, because I mean it hurts a lot, it's higher up your leg, harder to walk, but also it could nick your car.

1:05:03 Is that where your argument? Oh yeah, it could nick an artery and you'll bleed, it'll die immediately die. So it's pretty scary. Yeah. So he gets Teddy's body into the trunk before he gets the shotgun. So he's got Teddy's body in the trunk and he goes after Karl briefly, but then Karl gets to a dark like alley behind the house and he's like no, like, I'm not doing this. So it gets back in the car and drives off and that's when he realizes he has to treat his wound. Yeah, so he he cuts the arrow so that it's not sticking out. Yeah, he cuts it so he can like cover it up and he goes into just a pharmacy. I love. So my favorite my favorite part about him cutting it though, is he you know, he gets Teddy into his car and that's when he pulls out a hacksaw, a hammer, some clippers and then puts the arrow into the door, like closes the door on it, cuts it with the hacksaw and then realizes he's got to get something to take take try and take it out.

1:05:57 Oh yeah, yeah. So he ends he's just in a pharmacy and he's buying like all of the like. He buys a jug of alcohol and a jug of peroxide and buys all this stuff, painkillers, scalpel. Well, and this is why it's so great. Well, he buys an exact exactly because I don't know what kind of pharmacies you have around you, but they don't usually carry scalpels super glue, so well, you trust me, you want super glue. But he grabs a needle and thread and this is another great moment. So he's getting all the things, all the trement to take care of this wound yourself. He goes up to the to the cashier and as he's paying one of the dollar bills just to cover the blood. And what I love about that is that he looks at he goes I yeah yeah, and he doesn't he doesn't explain at all, and the pharmacist is just like here you go, yeah yeah, I mean, considering what he's buying.

1:06:46 If if I mean, although he did kill somebody, but out right, then if he had killed somebody he must have decided to save their life, you know. But yeah, the pharmacists. So now he's in his car and and one of the most gruesome scenes in the whole movie horrific. He's trying to dig into his skin. Well, and he's trying to dig out the arrow. He's got the pliers and he's trying, he's trying to he's screaming, screaming, and then and it's it's really shocking. It's they don't cut away at all from it. And then he just kind of and it cuts and he's in a hospital. Yeah, he goes. So he walks into a hospital and he's like, I had an accident and then faints. My leg and then he just falls over and he's dragging blood across the wall. Yep. Well I just love that because again, he's not John Rambo. No, you know Rambo would would would you know, put his knife in the fire and then cauterize that wound. No, No, he tried.

1:07:35 He saw he he whether he saw it in a movie or he took a first aid kit class. Yeah, like he knows what he needs to do, but how do you do that to yourself? And and another thing I love is that from the time, like he goes into the pharmacy, his he's his complexion is so pale. He's he's not doing well. He's well. So now he wakes up in the hospital, wakes up. In the hospital, realizes they've taken care of the air. He opens his thing and yet it's all stitched up. So then he escapes the hospital. He runs wearing gown, wearing his gown, his assless gown, gets. Back to the Pontiac, which is the car that he borrowed from his sister, because we forgot to mention that she did say the extra pair of keys was in the house, so she did take the pawny. He takes the Pontiac, he's hidden it. He goes back and puts his ear to the trunk just to see if Teddy's still alive in there, and knocks on it and Teddy starts like, you know, hey, I mean yes, you like So that he gets back in the car and drives, and that's when he realizes that he needs to find a way to get a gun.

1:08:30 Yeah, so he needs to do something about Teddy in the trunk, and I love that. Then he goes and he like gets gas and there's a guy screaming in the trunk. I was My first thought was, pro tip, turn on the radio. Turn the radio. Yeah. So is this the part where he finds his buddy? Yeah? So this is where he uh, I can't remember. Oh. So he gets the stuff out of his trunk out out of his sister's house. The box and stuff finds the picture. I think that references Ben or something like that. I think so, yeah, And so that's when he decides that he's gonna go see his buddy, Ben Gaffney. And so he goes to his parents' house. His mom invites him in and she's like, you know, Ben doesn't live around here anymore. Here's his address. And he finds out that he works at this bar. So he goes to this bar in a really cool scene with the lighting especially well. And I want to mention that his friend Ben, you said. Yeah.

1:09:12 Ben is played by Devin Ratra or rat Ray right Ray. I love him because this was one of the first movies where I noticed he was in a lot of stuff. I noticed him in this in Nebraska, and I noticed him in an episode of I Think of Louis the luisek TV series, and he's been a working actor for a long time. But the thing that I didn't recognize him from immediately that now I always do is he was older brother Buzzy in Home a Alone in two and I'll be I'll be dipped in shit if that mother Hubbard is like, I don't swear on that part. If that mother Hubbard is not a phenomenal actor in everything he does a stand up, which is actually one of the reasons I was shocked that he was the child actor buzz in Home Alone, because that was such a character. You know, he was a young he was he was built to be a bully kid Like he looks like somebody sculpted him. They were like, what's a jerk, older brother. We'll get the nose, we'll get the eyebrows.

1:10:09 But as an adult he's a really great actor. Yeah, And his part in this part of the film is very complex, very interesting because he runs into his buddy and. Waits for him outside, like that's my favorite is like he waits, waits for him outside and then sees him come out. He's got headphones on, so he keeps calling to him and calling to him. Finally gets him and he's just like he's like oh shit, you disappeared, dude, Like I didn't even know where you were. Well, he makes some reference like I put up missing posters for you, although I think he turns out he was joking about that. Do You Even movie? Will be right back, welcome back to Do You Even?

1:10:56 Movie? But yeah, so you realize these guys were childhood friends because I want to say he would have been like twenty when I because the murder happened in like the late nineties. Yeah, so he would have been maybe eighteen or nineteen, maybe twenty somewhere in that neighborhood. Yeah, And so he hasn't seen him in for a really really long time. Yeah. And his introduction to him is I need a favor. It's big, which I love that too because the honesty, you know, the direct honesty of it, none of that like trying to make it all right and say like hey man, I mean you know I meant to come back. No, no, just I need a favor. And it's big.

1:11:38 So we see them drive out to his house and he's like basically telling him like, you know, hey, man, like I found a polaroid recently, a UMI and a stripper, and everything skips over that and then he's just like, you know, I need you know, I'm on time, Like I need this gun. Yeah, And that's when we find out he needs a gun yep, and his. Buddy is target practice. Well well target practice. He doesn't hunt, he lot of guns because it's target practice. Well, it appears that he has occasionally been involved in unscrupulous activities, yeah. Because he mentions that he's killed two people by choice, on purpose, on purpose, yeah yeah. But but later on he does reference like you got to do it right and legal. Yeah, so he's like, I had to wait because I mean, we're spoiling everything.

1:12:22 But like, uh, when when he shoots somebody to save his buddy, he says like, I had to wait until he he aimed the gun at you to do it legal. So like that makes me wonder if when he says he killed people by choice, it was in some kind of self defense. I mean, he very he much cares about his property and what happens on it. He does, no, but that's the thing. But then there are like little hints, like because he ends up giving him a Mini fourteen, which is the gun from the eighteen and many fourteen for those who don't know anything about firearms or know very little about firearms. It is a lot of people like to joke it's basically the Kinder assault rifle. In air quotes, it's the Kinder modern sporting rifle. It's it's a semi automatic rifle. It's basically the same thing as an Air fifteen, except it's got a it's all wood. Yeah, so it looks more like a hunting rifle and people don't worry about many fourteens very much. A fine gun, but it literally shoots the same bullets as an Air fifteen. It's a pretty reliable firearm.

1:13:19 And that's the gun he gives him because he says, I bought it at a gun show. It's got no paper, it's just it's just here to go. And even ask him, he's like, you know, because that's my favorite is the initial He goes, so what what gun deal? Or what what do you need it for? Or what kind of gun? Or I can't remember because he asked him in a certain way, and he's like, oh no, no, I'm not asking that. Like the better I the better I don't know. Yeah, I don't want the details. I just need to know, like long distance close. Fame, up close far away. So, yeah, he gives him the gun and he basically tells me he owns sixteen acres and that you know, that's where he can go and do the business. So he goes back to his car and he drives his car out with Teddy in it, and he my favorite shot. He goes to the side of the car, open the door, opens the glove compartment and he's just waiting and waiting and then he hits the trunk button, races around back with the rifle.

1:14:06 Yeah. It's a great, a great moment. Yeah, and now he's got this guy basically he's his prisoner. Yeah, and he says that Teddy says his leg is broken. So because even he's like stay in the trunk and he's like, I won't be a problem. Leg's broken. So that's when he asked him, you know, like, uh, you know, why are you doing this? And he's just like, you know why, like you know, he uh, Wade killed my parents and he's like, well, that's actually not what happened. We find out that Wade Senior is who killed Dwight's parents and his only target was his father because his father had an affair with Wade Senior's wife, right, and the mom just got in the crossfire. And Teddy even says that, like, you know, it. Was unfortunate she was in that car too. Yeah. And that's the thing is there's this whole exchange between Teddy and Dwight at this point where basically Teddy says, you know, the man with the gun gets to tell the truth. So because he even says, like, you know, William said that you didn't kill my dad, and he's like, oh, well, then that's that, you know, may with the gun tells the truth.

1:15:00 And this is also really an interesting point too, because it's almost like a little bit of like Hatfields and McCoy's that this like feud began because of this. And the reason there had never been a need for reprisal was that the supposed killer, Wade, was serving time. Yeah, therefore justice was served. Justice was serva and he had cancer and. Well, well, I mean the Wade went to prison. Yeah, And the reason they didn't want Wade Senior to go to prison was was he was sick with cancer already, so they didn't want him to send him away. And then the reason that the other brother, Teddy, Yeah, the reason Teddy didn't do it was he had already had two strikes, so he would have went to prison for a really long time. And since Wade Junior had no history, they were like, well, you'll do the least amount of time for this crime.

1:15:44 And even Teddy says at one point, because Dwight asked him, he goes, you know, and what about the younger one. He's like, oh, he's just a boy. Like, doesn't even bring him into you. Yeah, he won't even say he's his brother. Yeah, he's just like, oh, that's just a boy. Just a boy. So that's when Dwight asked him to basically call them. He's like, you know, call them, tell them it's over. We'll meet in a public place. We'll settle this, you know. So here's the phone. Well, and he says like, why didn't you call the police, And he's. Like, we want to finish this in house. We want just like you, just like you did. Yeah, and he says like, what if I turn myself And he's like hell yeah, and he's like I mean to the police. And he's like, you know, well I love that. He just goes, Nope, that won't do it. Yeah, you don't get that option. So that's when he hands him the phone and he has him call one cell phone. It goes voicemail, leaves a voicemail and then he's like, can you wand if I call the house and he's like, yeah, call the house, acts like he has the sister on the phone. He's like, you know, she wants to talk to you, gets him come over.

1:16:30 As soon as he comes over with that gun, he grabs the barrel, grabs the gun from him, and climbs out of the trunk and is aiming the gun right on. Dwight, and he pretty much tells him what happened, Yeah, how the family what works, and how they're not going to give up until they get their revenge. And he says like, if you're gonna you can kill me, but you just need to promise me my sister's out of it like that it ends here. Yeah, And he won't give him that satisfaction. No, And he's getting ready to kill him, and then we hear a bullet whiz past him. Yes, and then we hear another fire and his fucking head goes to one side. Yes, because he gets shot by his Buddi's Mosen the Gaunt, which he said was his gun that he was really enjoying, the gun that I got Rachel for her birthday. Told me that so, which is a long rifle Soviet era rifle shoots a very powerful projectile. And I love it what he walks me because his face he's like, that's what bullets do. He's like, that's face line the lions do, that's what bullets do. Yeah.

1:17:20 So Ben comes from the side and he's just like, you know, had to wait for him to pull on you. And Ben is very very clear that he does not want this on his property. He wants him in the trunk. He wants the gun in the trunk, he wants the cell phone, and and Dwight does even like what about the piece of his brain? He's like, COYOTESO get that. Yeah, He's like, as long as there are no teeth, Yeah, no teeth. So matter of fact about it, which is which is a great example of what can happen when you're gone for so long. You know, you've been gone for ten fifteen years, and your buddy is he's seen some shit. And we failed to mention too that Dwight did tried to take like a warning shot and completely prove that he does not know how to handle that gun, so then Ben makes the comment I'm gonna set you up a bug shot.

1:18:01 Yeah, you're not gonna hit anything otherwise. So he takes him out to the field has in practice. H do you know what kind of gun he gives him. It is some kind of a of a revolver style, smaller shotgun. I couldn't tell it may have been a ten gage or something. I couldn't tell you exactly what gun it was. But Dwight' hitting everything with this. So he says, you know, that's that's the gun for you and basically tells him that you know, hey, man, like you know, I'll sit you up SOMERI some extra AMMO, but like this vengeance business is ugly. Like I'm normally I would be, you know, here for you, but like this is ugly man. Well, well, he says, like I don't mind being here for you, but like this isn't okay, Like this is ugly. We're business like That's what he's basically saying, Like I'm I'm here for you, I'm your friend and everything, but this is hideous. Yeah, what we're doing is not okay, And then he gives them some really interesting advice, which is he says, this is personal for you when you get in there. Don't talk, don't don't don't, don't explain things, don't try to whatever. He's like, that gets you killed.

1:18:57 Just shoot you, just shoot. And I thought that was a really brilliant point two. I mean, like, if because it's personal, you're more likely to fail. Yeah, and he takes that somewhat to heart at first, a little bit so. And he also tells Ben to burn the polaroid of him in this and then. If he finds, he's like, please burn it. And we see him in the in his kitchen and join a beer and puts the polaroid in the microwave and just smokes that some bitch. Yeah, it just it's just gone zo. So he drives off and we see Ben is in his truck and he tries to start it, but nothing happens. He goes around front to see that Dwight remove his battery, which we cut to Dwight's car and the batteries right behind Dwight's seat. I figured he did that so we wouldn't follow him. Yeah, that's exactly why I figured. Do you even move, he will be right back welcome back to Do You Even movie?

1:19:54 So that's when Dwight decides that he is just going to go straight to the Cleveland's house. And he gets there, he sneaks round back and kicks in the door and they are not home. I did find out what kind of firearm it is. It's a rossy circuit judge, which he does mention that name what he's going through the Judge. Yeah, and I was rot it's a four to ten or a forty five long Colt, which is a you can in a forty five long colt firearm. You can use four ten shotgun rounds, yeah, or you can use the long colt. It became more famous as a gun called the Judge, which is a revolver pistol. Well, it's a revolver pistol, but you could put. Even says that thing takes slugs, but you wouldn't hit any You wouldn't.

1:20:36 Yeah, and he's like, but you only have five shots? Yeah, but so which is, you know, not a lot for a guy who doesn't know a lot about gun. So he's kicked in the door, he's going around the house of the gun. They're not home, So what's his first instinct is to remove all the firearms from the. House, and there are plenty of plenty of them. He just piles them up on a bed sheet. Rolls them up, and throws them into the lake that's right by the house. Yep, whatever it is out. So that's when you know, this is where I really really appreciate the way that they show this because he does not wait until just dark. He waits two days in this house for them to return home, which is drinking water and also looking up at their pictures like he's he's he's learning things about the family a little bit that or reaffirming what he already knew.

1:21:20 Yeah, and remember Teddy had referenced before he died that his sister is bossy, bossy and most Yeah. So that's when you know he decides that he's just going to wait this out. And he eventually picks up the number of the house, goes outside on his phone and calls them, leaves an answer machine message and basically says, you know, Teddy's dead, waits dead, and as far as I'm concerned, that's two of mine and two of yours. This can be done or we can keep going. Well, he says, this can be done. All I ask is that you don't come after my sister. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so uh, now they come home. They come home. So before this has happened, we've seen him waiting and everything, just around the corner and whatnot. So he's posted up at this point they come home, he hears the car and he just hides around the corner, and he's also left the message on this machine. By the point, yes, so they come in immediately or no. He calls the house so that they'll go to the phone, right, which I always love. So he calls the house, they go to the phone, they play the message, and that's when he says the thing about you know, I just want my sister left out of this. While this is happening, he is right around the corner with his gun.

1:22:22 Directly behind him. But as that as it's the voicemails or the answer machine is explaining everything, yeah, he stops aiming at them because he wants to see how they reacted. And then the one brother is just like, that's when we're driving to Ptompert the first place, where go that's we're heading straight to Pittsburgh. Kill that bitch. Pops around the corner and blows him away. Yeah. Well one shot, yeah, two shots and he's gone. Yeah, and it is very sudden, very tense. Yeah. And at that point it's just the mayhem is is stilted. Yeah. And we also see that William, he did not know was with them, has in the doorway hearing all this. So he goes back out to the car and grabs the. Shotgu because they were hunting, they were on a hunting trip. Yeah, So that's when he basically tells them, you know, like I want this to end, and this is this is tonight, like this your all are going to have to die, like we're all going to have to die basically as.

1:23:11 Well, he says, there was a line that I thought was really important. He said something along the lines of like I wish they'd killed me or something like that, Yeah, you uh will will kill you. You should have or something like that, I hope you do or something or I hope I wish, I wish you would have. Yeah, And and I think that's a really important element too, because, like I said, everything about this movie has been about being realistic, even if it if at first, like with the removing the arrow, he thought he could do it, but then he realistically he goes to the hospital instead of passing out in his car or some shit. Yeah, same thing here. He's like, everything he's done, he's expected to die doing. And in a way, if Wade Junior had killed him back. He even says when he went after he's like, I thought he'd kill me. Yeah, he really, And this is where I love the movie but I hate them. He really just wants to be out of his own misery because he was he was clearly just skating by living as a beach bum because he didn't really value much. But he didn't want to die, no, he just whatever. Yeah, now after the killer of his parents has been released, and now he has this need for vengeance, this need for justice, this need for whatever the hell. Yeah, he can't help it, no, And I think that's why he wanted to die, because he felt this innate need, you know, a compulsion to go after them, and he knew that he couldn't stop it.

1:24:37 Well, and he also says that, you know, I don't understand why my dad loved your mom, Like this was never anything bad, it was. I don't why my dad loving your mom. Yeah. So by this point William is back in the house and we see. One of my favorite shots of the movie is Williams in the doorway of the shotgun. We pan across this mantle that's decked with all their photos of the of the family all having guns for the most part too. Yeah, I mean they're they're clearly a hunting fanily Yeah, and then a little bit more. Yeah. That last pan as we get to the last photo is william coming around with the shotgun, the new blood of the family basically, and he gets a shot into Dwight hits him right in the side and then. With shot knocks actually I think it was bird shot. Yeah. Then Dwight knocks the gun up. It's getting the last shot out, and he's like, as far as i'm I think, if I can count, right, you have less shots than I do.

1:25:22 Yeah, because he had a double barrel shotguns, so it's empty and uh and now Dwight has the gun. But the young guy, they say kill and kill him, and he says, I don't want to. Kill want to kill him, Yeah, I don't want to kill him. And that's when Dwight tells him to leave. My car's down the road, you know, get out of here. Well, but but the way he says it because he's like he's bleeding now, and he actually says, like this hurt a lot less bad than the era, and he's kind of laughing about that, but he says, like my cars are there, you know, the keys or whatever. He says, but you know, be careful. It's it's dark and it might be hard to but like go go do that, like get out of here. Yeah, and then reveals that Will is the half brother to Dwight. Well, well, Dwight reveals that, yeah, which means that dwy I just knew. Yeah. I think I think he knew from the way Teddy referred to him as just a boy. Yeah. And also, but I think especially the age, because there was a reference when Teddy was talking, or one of them was talking, I think was Teddy was talking about his dad. He said, like, the man loved to smoke, he loved to drink, and well, if it weren't for the cancer, he would have fucked.

1:26:19 He would have fucked. Yeah, And and but that sets up like, then, how is there a brother so young? Yeah, that makes sense. And honestly that probably what gave away that there was an affair going on was a pregnancy. Yeah, that probably is a dead result. Yeah. So so now you're realizing that the one person who will likely survive is the intersection of all of this. So Hope goes to attack Dwhite. She gets shot and killed, and that's when Chris the mother reaches under the autom and grabs a freaking Tech nine, a. Tech nine submachine gun. And and a true. Ghetto blaster firearm a A, I mean, just full automatic.

1:27:01 I was not expecting that it was it was it was underneath the reclining chair. Yeah. She just tips it over, grabs it, grabs it, and he gets the last shot off. And we see this happen because Williams walking away from the house and he hears both shots right, and we also see the light in the house. So then Williams walking down the road. He's still holding the shotgun, which he throws to the side. He walks off into the night. Dwight's laying in his own podal blood and he's just like Keyser in the car. Keyser in the car like repeating that yeah and then passes yeah. And he dies right there, and that's when we cut over to uh Sam's house. The next day, mail slot opens, the postcard comes through and that is twenty thirteen's Blue Ruin, a movie that.

1:27:41 Was I held in high regard and was shockingly better. Yeah, then I remembered, which doesn't make any sense because, like I said, I held it in the high regard. I felt that it was a phenomenal, perfect yeah movie, and it's rare that a movie. So I mean, like a it's a very low budget movie. I know some people simple, but I know some people. I know that they raised thirty five thousand dollars on Kickstarter and that Sollner put in some of his own savings. Yeah, but you know some people I know you said, like there was a claim that the budget was four hundred thousand dollars. Yeah. I don't know if I believe that, unless maybe that was post production funds that like Anchor Bay or somebody threw in. But like for a relatively cheap movie, incredibly photographed, incredibly well acted, and very well thought out, and it just it just knocked me on my ass a second time. Yeah, and I man, I just can't say enough about this.

1:28:39 If you haven't watched the movie, even with all that we gave you, and we do warn you at the beginning of the show in the narration. There's still plenty of oilers, but there's so much to it because it's not it's kind of like, it's not just what happened, it's how it happened. How it happens, how it looks, the editing. I mean, this is this is a movie that is shot, edited, scored beautiful well. And it's like. One of my favorite movies of the last you know, decade is Cecaria. And I remember when I went to show Rachel Sacario. I was so ampty to come out on home video because I saw in the theater and we had a great time watching it. And she was like, well, what's it like? And I was like, I'll put it to you this way. Everyone dies and I haven't spoiled it. She was like, whoa.

1:29:24 And that's the way I feel about Sacario too. Is that and Cario and Cacario Part two, is that you could know basically what's going to happen, but it's it's how it happens that makes it such a great feat of filmmaking and why it truly launched the careers of making Blair and Jeremy Soliner and I cannot my you know, little micro budget filmmaker heart goes out to this film because I love that it gifted both of them the career they deserve, that it made Macon Blair an actor in major movies who now was a director in his own right and a very talented one. Oh I don't feel at home in this world anymore.

1:30:04 I just watched recently, and I cannot recommend that movie enough. It has an exact feel of like Blue Ruin and Green Room, with that humor that's sprinkled in there, but. Really like just off kilter. It's it's such a good movie, such a great film. Do You Even movie will be right back, welcome back to do you Even movie? So Blue Ruin is just an absolute top notch film. Yes, And so I want to know more things because well, you did your research.

1:30:46 I did my research. I watched the film with the commentary, which I cannot recommend enough. But like I said, this is a little tough to get with the current release of it. But the commentary has Sauner and Blair on it both. There's also some deleted scenes and a like a thirty minute making of so the budget, acording to Wikipedia and IMDb, is four hundred and twenty thousand dollars. Opening weekend was April twenty seventh of twenty fourteen, where it took in thirty two thousand. Gross of US and Canada is two hundred and fifty eight thousand gross. Worldwide is nine hundred and ninety three thousand. And this was a not a major release. It was it was an indie release, and I wish I could have caught it in the theater. I don't think it screened anywhere near it might have. It might have showed in Columbus or something on I don't think it even got there. I mean, you gotta remember this is early on in the digital conversion. Yeah, a lot of theaters were still were still resisting it somewhat so cause I feel like the full blown digital conversion being basically you either do it or you die, or you be the mahoning and make it work because you're just a brilliant team and a brilliant drive in h was really like around fifteen sixteen was when it was like, Okay, it's just all digital all the time, because that's when Danberry switched to digital and everybody was shocked they were able to do it. I was not because as much as I loved the Danburry Dollar Save Rest in Peace. I remember seeing the Joker there one time and going, wow, they have this on like economy mode on It's oh dude, no.

1:32:06 Like when Mom and I went to see Oceans, what was the one that was the all female cast eight as Ocean's Eight. I think it was Ocean's eight. I went out to the lobby several times because I was like, Hey, the movie's really dark. Oh yeah, we'll get to that never changed. I don't know if it was that they were playing it in eco mode yeah, which is what like home projectors have, or if it was or if it was just that the bulbs were old and dimming. It could be. You know, your mileage may vary, but it was still fun to see movies in the big screen. So the film itself was shot in Virginia and Delaware. One of the establishing shots on an ocean wide boardwalk was filmed in Rebeth Beach, Delaware. It depicts Dolly's iconic and instantly recognizable lighted sign. Dolly's is a known locally for their saltwater taffy and long history of Rebideaux Boardwalk.

1:32:48 Dwight is initially living in his car inside Cape Hanilton State Park outside of Los Delaware, a few miles from Rebeho beach Man. That's wild that they actually shot it where they takes place, because yeah, he starts in Delaware and then he goes to Virginia where his sisters man they really shot and that's really cool. I love that blue ruin is a reference to the blue and ruined Pontiac, the car home of Dwight. I never even ah ah, that's I I never. I just thought because blue is like sad, debt, desolate, and then there's the ruin of whatever. But that's perfect. The blue ruin is the car. Yep, fuck okay, yeah yeah. Sawner funded production on the film through a successful Kickstarter campaign, which MTD called the perfect example of what crowdfunding can't accomplish.

1:33:31 Especially because it was still somewhat young. Yeah. Ben Gaffney Devin rat Ray is based on a real high school friend of director Jeremy Soulner. Solner contacted the real Ben while he was writing the script to get an accurate representation of Ben's moral views and gun collection. I hope to one day be that friend. Yeah. At one time, Benny mentions, ducha who got hit by a train. This is al friendship. This is a reference to l Ducha, lead singer of punk hardcore band The Mentors, who claimed Courtney Love offered him fifty thousand to kill Kurt Cobain. He appeared in Nick Broomfield's Curt and Courtney documentary and died under mysterious circumstances after he made these claims. So that was one of my favorite Easter eggs. I didn't remember from the first time I watched it. Yeah, was when he says, right around the time Ducea died. Yeah, so el Ducha, if I remember correctly, died in nineteen ninety seven. Wait, yeah, yeah, yeah, he died nineteen ninety seven.

1:34:20 He was sleeping on railroad tracks. So some people believe he may have been murdered. He was in one of the most the most deeply like I don't even how to described. The BMRC went after the Mentors pretty bad. Well. The Mentors, unlike a lot of other groups, they relished the idea they were I mean, they called themselves the Mentors as an insult. They were like, oh, yeah, we're the Mentors. People look up to us. But their songs were heinous. They were about not always about violence sort of. There were only a few songs that were like they were mostly about just total subjugation of women. I mean songs like Mother Daughter Team and Suck Me for and there. If you like listening to stuff that's so bad, it's funny.

1:35:03 And also that documentary came out recently, the Tapes. I watched it. Yeah, and uh, it's interesting because he was he was a really odd person. He was not unintelligent, yeah, but he was also like he was such a drunk that it was hard to tell. He was actually well liked for being a guy who was just like not only like kind of a piece of shit, but he also like wanted to be a piece of shit, Like that was his whole thing. Most famously went on Jerry Springer with war and but but when people would say, like, do you think it's okay if someone listens to your music and decides to rape Somebody'd be like, yeah, I love it, And people were like frothing at the mouse. He was just being he was such a I mean the fact that the documentary from twenty fourteen, the Mentors Kings of Sleeves, Yeah, I mean yeah, so anyway, but I also want to mention that their album they they they got back together as a band a few years after the Mentors died, and they did a song on the album over the Top, which was after he died.

1:36:01 I believe they did. I know they did a song. I can't find the exact name, but they did a song called something like Don't Lay on the Yeah, which is just like that tells you everything you need to know about about the band, about what how they feel about just everything. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, Ben. Gaffney has a tattoo on his left inner forearm of an electric chainsaw, which is a reference to Jeremy Solnder's film Murder Party. Oh Man That chainsaw all painless yep. Jeremy Sounder revealed in A Q and A that the reason the Pontiac has bolt holes in it at the beginning of the story is because it is the same car that Dwight's parents were murdered in by Big Wade Cleland. I mean, there's a lot to this film. Yeah, I love it. Ben Twel tells Dwight the speeches will get him killed.

1:36:43 In the end, Dwight's speech is what gets him shot by William and eventually dying Blue ruined temporary faut originally, but when the film went to festival, Solner was nervous about changing the font, so he didn't. So the font at the beginning of the movie was not what he wanted. He just kept it when it went to festival. Oh that's funny. Yeah, yeah, I didn't want to change it. Well, I get that to a spec. Actually, you have your first, like real serious hit. Yeah, it's like, I'm not going to change an an iota. I no, Like, we have a hit, I'm not gonna In the immortal words of Roger Corman, don't fuck with a winner. Kidah, there you go. The opening scene was originally going to be more elaborate, with Blair's character avoiding the family around the house. However, due to a wire fraud scandal, the location was forced to be changed at the last minute. Holy crap, Yeah that's a story.

1:37:24 A five foot camera slider was used for most of the shot where Dwright returns to the car. So that little slide is a camera slider. Oh yeah, it makes sense. Sidney Anderson, who plays Officer Eddie, was actually not licensed to drive a vehicle in the state, which Sauner wasn't aware of until her day of filming. As a result, any of her driving scenes caused the car to be physically moved around. I've had that happen. I've been on movies where an actor was like, in the scripture said they drive a car, and they're like, I don't have a driver's license. Is that a problem? We're like, uh boy. The first shot of principal Photography is the scene of Dwight buying the map at the store. Okay, the car is Sawner's parents' car. The car was in pristine condition and required the art department to do their magic to it to give it the look of course. Sauner commented that the lawn drawn out takes of Dwight are key to his character and motivation of Dwight being unprepared.

1:38:09 Yeah. I just have no complaints with how they did anything. Handheld camera was used in the bathroom attack scene due to the shooting space available, but also made the scene more intimate for the attack. I would agree, I mean that scene so tense and unpleasant. Sandy, the actor who plays Wade Junior, was actually choking Macon during the bathroom attack, and Macon had to remind him several times that they could just fake it, but Sandy choked him a couple more times before Jeerremy Sonder had to step in cheez well, I mean you know actors, man, they'll do that. Yeah, they'll choke you. Originally, the Clevelands were supposed to come over. One of the Clevelands was supposed to come over the hill twa chasing Dwight when he pulled over to the side and let William out. So originally one of them was still going to be coming over the hill running at them, which they had filmed, but they took it out the last second because they were like, it's kind of silly.

1:38:53 I like the way they did it. Instead. Sawner's daughter's make an appearance in the film as Sam's daughters. I mean there are four. Yeah. The most expensive effect in the movie was the fake leg when Dwight is doing the operation on his leg for the arrow. I mean, it's I believe it because it's so effective. Yeah, it's believable. One of Sauner's proudest low budget lighting moments was the initial meeting of Dwight and Benny. The two lights are used for the mains, while natural lighting is used for the rest. He also mentioned that the sound in that scene was hell because there was a train right above them. Ah, the light especially when and sound mixing before AI tools. Yeah, the polaroid melting shot in the microwave took over a month to complete and cause Jeremy Soner to have to reach out to forty different people to get it finalized.

1:39:35 Okay, Yeah, I don't know why. Mirror filming inside a microwave while it's actually going, Yeah, can be tricky because you don't want to damage the camera. Makes sense, Yeah, mer refracting device was used for the finale to mimic the headlights approaching the house. Oh yeah, I've seen that trick done before a lot. By the way, that's a popular wave of simulating headlights driving by in daytime scenes. Yeah. Is you get a really strong reflector and you spin it so like if you're in, like say a diner, so you could just get that little light pass every now and then you just slowly spin it and it points the sun. That makes sense, It looks It's very convincing. Yeah. And finally the legacy shot at the end as we pan over the Cleveland's family, that was his legacy shot because he wanted it to be the completion of both seeing them go through the stages of the family having it and with William, and then having William throw the gun at the end was the conclusion to the Cleveland's.

1:40:28 That makes sense. Yeah, do you Even? Movie? Will be right back. Welcome back to do You Even movie? So what are your final thoughts? Well? On twenty thirteen's Blue Ruin, did you get anything about how they thought it was going to be their last film or the last film they did? Oh, because that was on the Wikipedia. Yeah, No, I didn't get that it he mentioned that commentary. Uh yeah, I want to mention that real quick, because that's something that really stuck with me. When they wanted to make this movie, they kind of felt like they hadn't had the success that they would have liked with their first film, which I mean, I don't blame them for being disappointed. The Friggin' Murder Party such a great film. Yeah, But according to this, it said the two wanted to make one last film together. Solner said, quote, we embraced the fact that we had to wrap up this childhood arc, this insane fantasy of wanting to be filmmakers and just make a film that was right and true. The concept of a revenge story appealed to Sollner, who said it was quote just about grounding the film in a very mundane scenario that needed so little exposition. The film's plot also serves as a critique for Solener of films that he enjoyed growing up, in particular violent crime movies of the early twenty tens. That quote made him miserable, and he said, quote couldn't do a film that was akin to those awesome genre spectacles of my youth. In said climate, So they thought that this might be their last, the last,

1:41:58 although not nearly to the level of success. Yeah. I mean, I've not made a Hollywood movie. I don't know that I will. I don't know that I care too. But that's whatever I mean. You know, when somebody knoxsi your door with a bag full of money, we'll see how I actually feel. Fair enough. But when I made Depression the movie, I actually thought that was probably gonna be my last film ever. Yeah, And so I was like, so, I'm just gonna make whatever I want. And it was the first film I made that was substantially financially successful, which made no sense compared to the rest of the prior of my entire career. So I really identify with this, like the last one, and then all of a sudden, it's like, Okay, everybody likes what you're doing. Now keep doing. Yeah, keep doing. Uh So I Blue Ruins A buy it? Yeah, cruel cruel irony that you can't get a blu Ray easily. Yeah, but it's worth owning if you love films. No, that's all I got because I've said everything else I need to say about that. Yeah. Same here.

1:42:43 Blue Ruin is just it's the it's the takeaway of the non traditional vengeance film that really focuses on the realism of it. Really just paints a portrait of what it is like to decide you're going to do something and have to stick it out to the end. Yeah. No, definitely, So I really I. Really enjoy that. So we always like to end the show with a couple of recommendations. My first one this week is two thousand and seven's Death Sentence. Darring Kevin Bacon Nick Hume is a mild mannered executive with a perfect life until one gruesome night he witnesses something that changes him forever. Transformed by grief, Hume eventually comes to the disturbing conclusion that no length is too great when it comes to protecting your family. This movie I cannot recommend enough. It's basically his death wish, but it is in the sense of breaking down your character to think he can do this vengeance, does the vengeance, and then completely pulls all the retaliation back on.

1:43:32 Yeah, that's good. That's a good wreck. Yeah. Second recommendation is twenty seventeen Small Town Crime, which is currently available on Stars and Fandango. An alcoholic X cop finds a woman on the roadside who was left for dead. He offers to find the killer pro bono as a private investigator. Her granddad hires him, and things get nasty. That's a phenomenal movie. Yeah. I remember I bought that on Blu Ray right after we finished watching it together. Yet same here, Such a good film. Yeah, small Town Crime. Cannot recommend that enough. What's your recommendation, sir? I actually have two this week because I had I really was thinking of it, and I have two movies that kind of gave me a similar feel but didn't give me a similar feel. The first one is twenty eleven's Killer Joe Good one, Yes, I love Killer Joe. It's by William Friedkin, famous for the Exorcist. But the description is when a debt puts a young man's life in danger, he puts to hitting.

1:44:20 He turns to putting a hit out on his evil mother in order to collect insurance. I feel like that movie has a great amount of dread. It's really highly stylized. It's not honest. It's scary. Yeah, no, he's terrifying. It's not nearly as realistic, but really good. But then the other one, and this is one that I like because it makes me sick to my stomach a little bit, is twenty seventeen's Good Time Good Time is Good and that stars Robert Pattinson. It's from the directing team who I believe wanted to do Uncut Gems, which is another movie that makes me sect to my Saffie Brothers. Yeah, the Saft Deep Brothers. After a botched bank robbery lands his younger brother in prison, Connie Nika's embarks on a twisted odyssey through New York City's to get his brother Nick out of jail.

1:45:02 Line up a light watch after that one, because it's going to hit you right in the fucking stomach. You'll be fine. So that Good Time is a great movie though. Also yeah, honorable mentions any of Saulner's filmography. In regards to Greenroom, rebel Ridge, you said, hold the Darks fantastic. I really liked it. Yeah, I cannot recommend green Room enough. Greenroom may be my favorite of his so far. It's really phenomenal. It was originally going to be this episode, by the way, but unfortunately green Room is fucking available nowhere right now. Saw it three times in the theater. I saw it once with you. Three times. We went to see that in Beaver Creek. Yeah. Yeah, I went back to see it in Beaver Creek two more. That's awesome.

1:45:42 So no, that's a phenomenal film. So before we get out of here, I do want to remind everybody if you want to send us an email suggest something you want us to check out or talk about a little bit, you can email us at do you even movie pod at gmail dot com or go to dooevenmovie dot com. There are all kinds of social media things in the description or show notes. You can find us on x, Instagram, Facebook, wherever you want to find us. We do look forward to hearing from you, guys, So send us an email or go to dooevenmovie dot com for any and all information about the show. And that leads us into actually what we're talking about next week, because this was an email request, we are going to be diving into nineteen eighty five's Tough Turf WHI would be a first time watch for you, first time for me, currently available on Plex, Pluto TV, and Prime.

1:46:27 Yes, so make sure you check that out so you guys can join me for the first time. And let's hope Dave doesn't do us rum. It's not gonna be a long good Friday. I'll promise you that much. You know, looking back, I do like that movie, but boy was it a long good Friday. I think you just need to check out my new four K from Criterion. I mean, I've got the system for you. So but well, with that all being said, I guess all that's left to say, kids is go see Hardeis Yes, and we will see you next Tuesday. Problem