Dec. 10, 2020

How to Pitch Your Business so Mark Cuban Invests with Dan Martell

How to Pitch Your Business so Mark Cuban Invests with Dan Martell

Don't wait until you're ready to raise money to fund your company to start building relationships with potential investors. Investor and SaaS Founder Dan Martell joins Katelyn Bourgoin.

Don't wait until you're ready to raise money to fund your company to start building relationships with potential investors. Investor and SaaS Founder Dan Martell joins Katelyn Bourgoin to share:

  • Why He Thinks Relationships Are More Important Than Your Pitch
  • How He Raised $1.4M in 21 Days (Including $ From Mark Cuban)
  • The 3 Questions He Asks Before Investing In A Company
  • And So Much More

Dan Martell has founded 6 businesses and invested in over 40, including Buffer, Hootsuite, Udemy, and GetAround. He teaches founders how to scale their businesses through his SaaS Academy.

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Dan Martell: [00:00:00] And that's how I raised my round from Mark Cuban, legit over email, in about a two hour span back and forth.

[00:00:09] Didn't get on a phone call. Didn't do a product demo.  because I had a track record and people that were willing to vouch for me.

[00:00:16]  I'm so. long on my relationships,  it doesn't matter if I lost everything tomorrow.

[00:00:22] If I, if I got to keep, , my relationships, thaen I'd be able to rebuild everything I've created within three years. Like, it's just that powerful. If you decide to invest in it. I am so excited to have Dan Martell on the podcast day. Dan, thank you for being here.

[00:03:11] Kate. I'm super excited. I appreciate the opportunity.

[00:03:15] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:03:15] Okay. I want to talk to you about raising venture capital and you have been on both sides of that table, both as a founder and somebody who's looking for funding and also as an angel investor, and you've been really successful at both. you even convinced Mark Cuban to invest in your last. Business.

[00:03:34] And I'm sure that there's an incredible story there. And I want to get into that, but before we do, let's chat a little bit about your background. So how many businesses have you actually started?

[00:03:44] Dan Martell: [00:03:44] Yeah. So I, it's a funny question, right? It's how many domains have I bought versus incorporations? I've gone through that's the way I kind of filter projects from companies, but I have, started six companies that I've been the CEO of I've, exited the last, three. And I'm now still working on some active ones, my investment portfolio, and my coaching company, and, invested in 40 plus SAS companies, technology companies for them are billion dollar companies.

[00:04:13] So yeah, I just. yeah, so Intercom HootSweet, you to me around, and then a ton of other incredible founders. And again, I feel super lucky to have the chance to invest them. I'm always, usually my investment style is first money in and I'm really long-term so like Intercom, I think, is about to go public.

[00:04:33] They can't really tell me, but I know based on the emails I've seen. so that's going to be a big one. I'm definitely going to continue to hold cause they're doing incredible, but, Yeah. So I just, I just have a lot of fun.

[00:04:43] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:04:43] I love how they share how their company functions and I'm a big nerd for a jobs to be done. And I know that that's a kind of foundation on the way that they think about the company. And I'm, I didn't know you were a part of that. That's amazing. Okay.

[00:04:56] Dan Martell: [00:04:56] I met Owen back in 2009, Desi and I got to know each other on the product side and just been incredible. I mean, they popularize, I believe jobs to be done, you know, behind a few other people. And they've just, they, they just, they took a totally different approach to how they built a traditional Silicon Valley company.

[00:05:14] So they're just incredible founders.

[00:05:16]Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:05:16] Well, and you touched on this, but like, what are you working on today?

[00:05:20] Dan Martell: [00:05:20] Well today, I've got three parts of my life. I have a program I created called creators for at-risk youth. So that's a big part of my life, working with, you know, Kids that are into drug addiction, foster parents, foster care, et cetera. So that's one aspect. The other one is my coaching practice, which is sass cademy.

[00:05:38]I've got one of the largest coaching programs in the world, not even just for SAS anymore. It's really become a pretty incredible community of hundreds of software founders and, different programs for different levels of scale. Even my curriculum now is being, like propel. I believe where we first met, is actually.

[00:05:56] Using the curriculum to power their company's content. So I have a few accelerators doing that. And then the other one is essentially my venture arm, Intel ventures, which is where I do all my investments. I'm now into buying and holding SAS companies. So I acquire companies, you know, kind of grow them with my team there.

[00:06:15] So, I, don't not do busy. it's a little crazy, especially with a young family and the desire to travel as much as we do.

[00:06:23] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:06:23] Oh, I know. I follow what you guys are up to. You are all over the place. You've got two young kids and it's just, it's inspiring to see what you're doing. And it seems like you are definitely busy. so as you guys can hear from Dan's background, I could have talked to Dan about anything. This show is about how you persuade people.

[00:06:39] What makes people tick, click and buy Dan's running one of the largest coaching programs in the world. He is obviously hella good at this stuff. But what I want to zero in on, because I think Dan can speak to this into a level of detail that few people can, I want to know, how did you get somebody like Mark Cuban to invest in your last company?

[00:06:59] Clarity. How did that happen?

[00:07:00] Dan Martell: [00:07:00] This is a great question. well, the backstory is I first met Cuban, and he wouldn't remember cause it was late at night. I was at an event called summit series in Washington, DC. This would have been 2000, probably 10 or 11. And, you know, he was one of the speakers at this event. I mean, it was, it was a really cool thing.

[00:07:21] Summit series group created an opportunity for a bunch of young. entrepreneurs to connect with kind of people like Mark Cuban and others. Now that's when I first met him. Th the fun story, Kate, if you go even further back, I cold emailed about 20 tech entrepreneurs CEOs back when I was 19 years old.

[00:07:39] So we're talking Steve jobs, bill Gates, Mark Cuban. Like I made a list of the top 20 people that I could find online and I emailed them all. And I asked them this question. I said, cause I was always. You know, torn between, should I go to university? Should I get an education? I was, so I asked him, I said, based on these three things who, you know, what you know, or, your level of grit or determination, what's the most important factor of success in entrepreneurship.

[00:08:06] And, I got very few replies maybe, but Cubans

[00:08:11]Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:08:11] That's pretty incredible.

[00:08:13] Dan Martell: [00:08:13] Yeah, well, they just hit reply and said one or two or three or whatever. Like it was very short, but Cuban replied and he said doing all three, when everybody's trying to pick one. So that was my very first interaction with Mark as a 19 year old.

[00:08:29]and then fast forward, you know, I think I was cleric so many companies. I think I was like 32 when I started coming on 40 now. So I started in 2012. That sounds about right. I was, fundraising. So I had sold my previous company. Flowtown made my investors a lot of money. And then when I started clarity, you know, that's, that's kind of like, people are like, how did you raise your round in 21 days?

[00:08:51] Well, if you make investors money, that's a good start. Right. So like that helped. But, so essentially I did, 1.6 million or what? I had 1.4 million res, but it happened so quick that I felt like there were some other strategic angels that I wanted to get on board. So what I decided to do is go to angel list and kind of announced the fundraise, knowing that I really didn't need.

[00:09:14] Angel this community to F to, to finish out the round. It was more of just an awareness. It was the easiest way for me to tell all my friends, cause I have, I had a lot of friends that were also angel investors that probably weren't even aware that I'd started this new company or nor that I was raising around.

[00:09:29] So. Essentially I put on Angeles, we blasted it, like push it hard for five days. And during that time, when we were looking, we had this like, and this is why I invested in Intercom because Intercom had a feature where it would look like it would create a stream of all the activities being done in your product, like logged in search, et cetera.

[00:09:47] So you'd see like this activity stream and we ha cause I built this in Flowtown. I built it in clarity and on the back end I was watching like the new sign-ups and I noticed Mark Cuban. Signed up for clarity. Now back then, the only way you could sign up for the product was by Facebook connecting your account to verify who you work.

[00:10:04] So I actually clicked the link and clarity was a marketplace for entrepreneurs to get advice over the phone. Kind of like if LinkedIn had a call button. so anyways, I clicked his profile in our system and it opened up Facebook and it showed me this was actually the Mark Cuban. It wasn't like a fake account or whatever.

[00:10:20] And. And then I messaged him and I said, Hey, Mark knows, you just signed up for clarity. I'm the founder. I'm curious what you think. And it was like, it started with one email prompt. He replied. Yeah, my buddy, Alex mentioned you guys, you know, I was, I was on Angeles. I like what you guys are doing. so Alex had barred, so it's relationships at the end of the day, like Alex Bird had started a company called the Sicily.

[00:10:43] I became friends with them in 2008. When I moved to San Francisco, I helped them at Assistly kind of build a marketing strategy. I mean, they're brilliant. I don't take any credit for their success, but that's kind of like how we became friends, because I was like actively showing them some of the growth stuff we were doing at Flowtown and they ended up getting acquired by Salesforce and Mark Cuban was an investor in a Sicily.

[00:11:02] So he made a lot of money. Trusted Alex. Alex was one of my connections on angel list. So he asked Alex about me. Alex gave me the green light and then Mark engaged. And it literally was like 13 or 14 emails of Mark going. What do you think about Pinterest? And then I would send them a product screenshot of kind of how we are thinking of building our widget structure.

[00:11:23] And you know, what do you think of this? And went back and forth to the point where he's like, I'm interested. If you've got room cool. Doing two 50. if you'd like me more as an advisor, I'd be interested in doing for an extra, like a 0.1% equity. And that's how I raised my round from Mark Cuban, legit over email, in about a two hour span back and forth.

[00:11:47] Didn't get on a phone call. Didn't do a product demo. Cause he, yeah, he just used the product and because I had a track record and people that were willing to vouch for me. And I mean, that to me is, you know, Kate is I'm I'm so. long on my relationships, you know, I've always said, you know, it doesn't matter if I lost everything tomorrow.

[00:12:06] If I, if I got to keep, you know, my relationships, thaen I'd be able to rebuild everything I've created within three years. Like, it's just that powerful. If you decide to invest in it.

[00:12:17] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:12:17] I love that. The things I remember you saying, I think it may have been the first time we met, might've been at a later date, but you said, you know, your network is your net worth. And that always stuck with me. And I think it's so powerful because especially in startup world where everyone's being encouraged, move fast and break things.

[00:12:33] I think there's a lot of, you know, transactional relationships. That happen. and having playing the long game as you've clearly done and making those investments, it pays off. And so what can founders learn from that story to share? Like, what are some of the takeaways that, of why you were able to get Mark Cuban through a few emails?

[00:12:52] Like what's the back, like, what's the takeaways there? What are the golden

[00:12:55] Dan Martell: [00:12:55] Well, the relationship side. So that, that saying your network is your net worth. I got from guidance, Tim Sanders. He wrote an incredible call. A book called love is a killer app. not very well known it, literally. She shaped my life. It was the first physical business book I ever read as a 23 year old.

[00:13:12] I'd read a bunch of software programming books prior to that from 17 onward. But I never occurred to me after two failed companies that maybe I should study business. so that's, I w I'll give a hundred percent credit and, and suggest everybody read that book because it taught me that lesson. and then the investing and the relationship side, you know, the way I've always looked at it is there's a serendipitous approach and a strategic approach.

[00:13:36] And I, and I'll do both. So I'm a big fan of attending events with no specific outcome whatsoever. And just allowing my interactions to guide my time allocation per se. Like if somebody is like, Hey, we're doing dinner tonight. You should join. I'll just, I'll just allow the universe to guide me in that case.

[00:13:54] And then on the flip side, like every time I start a new company, I write down the 10 people that are the best in the world at it. The 30 people that I needed advisors in the 60 people that I want as peers that understand that market and where I'm going. So I'm very strategic on that level and I'll reach out to them and I'll try to add value and I'll, I try to spend time with them and create, you know, I host founder dinners, which you've been to, I'm a big fan of, you know, just adding as much value as I can.

[00:14:24] That's why I share everything I've ever learned. That's one of my models in life is like, learn, do, and then teach. And, so that's the network side of it. Just like people just underestimate, like I know today that no matter what. Crazy dream. I have, I already know everybody. I need to know to make it come true.

[00:14:40] I just gotta be creative enough to connect the dots. Like I believe that in my core, so.

[00:14:46] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:14:46] And I mean, it's from probably more than, you know, decades of relationship building, but you know, you know, you've been on Richard Branson's Island, Mark Cubans in your last company, like all of the heavy hitters that people dream of one day, being able to have a conversation with are giving you time and really building and you're building relationship with them.

[00:15:02] And there's so much value there for people to learn from. 

[00:15:05]Dan Martell: [00:15:05] I will say on that one, just be curious. I think a lot of founders, aren't curious enough. Learn how to ask good questions.

[00:15:11] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:16:43] so now let's get into some of that founder advice. I want you to put your investor hat on. So you've invested in over 40 companies, a bunch that people, the listeners will be familiar with. what do those companies have in common? Anything that kind of stands out and kind of threads that tie them together?

[00:16:58]Dan Martell: [00:16:58] yeah, one is they're solving a problem that I have and I'm familiar with. I don't, I don't like to invest cause my investment style is so personal. Like I don't, I'm not doing this as a fund and I manage other people's money. It's my money on deploying and deciding essentially through my, my investment, who I spend time with.

[00:17:17] So one is. Is it a problem that I have personally, that I feel I'm like interested in to do. I feel like I can actually add value. Is there any aspect of my network or my experience, et cetera, that I feel will be differentiated. And then three, when I talk to the founders, do they teach me things? And to me that's a non-negotiable.

[00:17:38] If I don't feel interacting with this company and their team, That I'm learning about the market or learning new strategies. I mean, in many ways I've always looked at my angel investing as kind of a paid, you know, accelerated, exec MBA. Like I didn't go to university. I don't have a degree in business, but being able to not only build my own companies, but invest in, see like how, like you, to me taught me a lot about growth hacking.

[00:18:04] They had an incredible growth team at, to me that I helped shape. And I also learned a ton from. And li like Keaton Shaw, who I know you've had on the podcast, you know, he was an early advisor and friend of mine and like learning from these people, you know, Eric Reese, Sean Ellis, like the, the, the people who shaped the technology marketing world, Andrew Chen, all these, these, these are all formal advisors to me because I was involved either in a company that they were involved in.

[00:18:33] And that's how I got to know them. Or, you know, the, the relationship side, but those are the three big factors that are non-negotiables for me, that I I'm never investing just for the money.

[00:18:42] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:18:42] I love that you shared that you didn't prior, when you said that Mark gave you that feedback about, you know, do all three, you did all three, you didn't do all three in the conventional way. You didn't end up going to school and paying lots of money to get a piece of paper on your wall, but now you're paying lots of money to get that knowledge in your head.

[00:18:58] And that's so incredible. I love that outlook. . how, if I'm a founder, let's say that I'm thinking it's time to start raising money. How do I even know if I'm ready?

[00:19:07] Dan Martell: [00:19:07] Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, raising capital is a decision and the decision you're making, even if you're not aware is, do you want to build a hundred million a year company? And that's a very personal decision that you have to make. And the reason why is I coach typically bootstrap B2B software as a service founders.

[00:19:28] That's like my, what I know how to do really well. Do I have venture companies for sure. 30% of my clients that I coach are venture back, that I know to do well, but what I love about the bootstrap founders is the tactics and strategies have to work in absence of a lot of capital. And that's, that's why I focus on that community.

[00:19:45] And because of that, I'm. Expose. And I've seen so many incredible companies that never raised venture capital that produce literally have a client that does about 14 million in revenue a year and 8 million in profits. So at 8 million in profit, there's really no lifestyle that you can't live. If you want to fly around private and, and live on a Island and literally not work because you can afford to pay a CEO half a million dollars a year.

[00:20:13] Like there's no lifestyle, you can't live. And now it took him 15 years to build that. And a lot of people would've gave up. but I also have other clients like David at deal machine. He's been able to do similar in about two years, right? Or, Jason at lead Sherpa, similar economics in a boat, 16 months.

[00:20:33] So it doesn't have to take 15 years. I only started working with, with no of that founder, probably, two and a half years ago and, and help them scale. But to me, that's a decision. Are you going to go swing for the fences or not? If you do take the money, just know that the outcome is binary. It's either going to be an incredible grand slam or it's going to be probably zero and that's okay if that's what you want to do.

[00:20:55] So I raised venture capital back for Flowtown and clarity. Both were venture funded because I was aiming for. The bleachers, like I was looking to knock the ball out of the park and that worked out for us, but it could have easily not been that. So when, and then what, what do you need to see for traction?

[00:21:13] You need to have a product that gets customers activated and retained. I think that's a proxy. People are like, what about charging and pricing and freemium the end of the day, the proxy for quality of your software and interest in the market is can you get them activated right away? And can you keep them around using the product week over week?

[00:21:32] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:21:32] Awesome. Okay. So I'm a founder, hypothetically that has definite aspirations of building a hundred million dollar company. I've got a product we're seeing good activation, good retention. Now I'm trying to get a meeting with a busy person like you. So I'm sure you get a lot of requests for chats and feedback and all this stuff.

[00:21:50] Like how do, how would somebody like me break through to actually have a conversation with you?

[00:21:55] Dan Martell: [00:21:55] Yeah, it's easy. It's called, well, the, the idea is investors don't want to meet you. They want to be introduced to you. So that's the big idea that a lot of people miss. So there's three phases of fundraising. I've helped founders raise over 400 million. So I've, I've, I've built a process and a systems like it's literally, if you follow it, it'll work out.

[00:22:13] If people want to go to a, and I'll give you the link, it's just LP. So landing pages dot Dan forward slash fundraising. Then I have a whole. 90 minute training on how to do fundraising and breaking down those three phases. The first phase is pre-marketing and then let's say fundraising. So now that you've done phase one year and a phase two, that's where you have to reach out to entrepreneurs that have recently raised money from an investor.

[00:22:36] You have identified. And connect with them first asking for advice. And I do that with air quotes, because yeah, you want their advice, but the truth is you're really just getting them interested in what you're doing so that you can ask for the introduction to the investor. Right? So anybody can go on my angel list or Crunchbase or whatever, and see like who are the companies I recently invested in reach out to them.

[00:22:56] And the reason why those founders versus the other ones is the other ones are further along and really busy. Right. So as you know, if you raise venture capital, like you and you just raise around, it actually is like, you've got a little bit more time on your hands because you were spending so much time on the fundraising that now you can kind of breathe a little bit.

[00:23:12] And if an entrepreneur reaches out asking for advice, you're more likely to do it because you know what it feels like you just went through it. And usually if you do your. Yeah. If you do your conversation right at the end, the entrepreneur is going to say, Hey, how can I be helpful? And you go, well, I noticed that Dan Martell invested in your last round, you know, we're building acts and I know he's invested in these two companies and he has experienced based on his blog posts.

[00:23:34] You know, when the time's right, would you be open to making introduction? I really appreciate it. They go for sure. You say great, awesome. You cue them up in the list and then you follow up maybe in three or four weeks and say, Hey, you know, we've decided to raise, we've got a ton of meetings. You know, you mentioned you make an introduction, here's an email and I teach all this in the masterclass, but like here's the email structure you use because you actually want to write the email that the founder uses to make the introduction to the investor.

[00:23:59] You don't want them to write it? Yes.

[00:24:00]Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:24:00] Oh, interesting. Okay. So you give it to them and like,

[00:24:05] Dan Martell: [00:24:05] Feel free to edit.

[00:24:06] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:24:06] gotcha. Yeah. Cause it saves them time. Right? I teach people the same thing when it comes to getting interviews with customers or prospective customers that they want to learn from them. Like, you know, make them do as little work as possible.

[00:24:17]Dan Martell: [00:24:17] Totally. And it's just, it lets you guide. What's being said, which is the most important thing. Like the information being unfolded in the right sequence is going to decide if people invest or pass.

[00:24:29] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:24:29] okay.  I think that this is the big one that people really want to really want to know. So if I've done all the things, right, I've gotten that warm introduction to somebody like yourself, a super busy person. And you actually said, yeah, like this sounds interesting.

[00:24:41] I want to talk to you, you know, show me what show you got. So like I'm getting ready. For that meeting, like, is there anything I should be doing in advance of that meeting to prepare?

[00:24:52] Dan Martell: [00:24:52] Yeah, you got to practice the amount of lack of practicing blows my mind. Like when I was raising capital, me and my co-founder Ethan for Flowtown, we would sit there and role-play and we would practice. I would like, to me, you want to create a well-designed choreography of exactly how you want the conversation to go.

[00:25:12] I personally, and most investors want to see the product at an early stage. You can sit it there in blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, market size, blah, blah, blah, money. You're going to make, just show me the product at the end of the day. That's going to tell me a whole lot about how much you truly understand the customer, how your ability to translate vision into actual execution.

[00:25:35]the quality of the experience, et cetera. They'll tell me how good your team is. So I'm a big fan of. Hey, this is the market size. Here's the problem we're solving. Here's how I decided to solve it. So story really quick, three big things. And then let me show you how the product works, because if you don't, that's all, they're thinking.

[00:25:51] They're like, this sounds cool, but how does it work? So just show them, I always say show don't tell

[00:25:57] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:25:57] I love that. And when will, you know if they're interested? Like, are there little subtle cues or is it just going to be so obvious?

[00:26:03] Dan Martell: [00:26:03] they're, you know, they're interesting when they start giving you advice,

[00:26:06] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:26:06] Hmm.

[00:26:07] Dan Martell: [00:26:07] you know, they're not, when they don't. Give you anything, like if they start going like, Oh, I'm you thought of this? Or, you know, what you could do is consider doing this, this and this. I really like this, but do you know about this thing?

[00:26:19] It's like, no, tell me more about it. And now the truth is, is as an entrepreneur, you can. strategically prompt and ask questions to get the investor interested in you, right? Like back to the be curious, like you might say, you know, one question I had for you is I noticed you invested in this company.

[00:26:37] I'm curious. What did you see in the early days that made you feel like it was the right investment? The reason you asked this, this is sales one Oh one K. You asked that because they're going to give you the hit list of things. You need to show them to get them, to make a decision to invest in you like.

[00:26:53] That's like this, people should read some books on selling. Cause this is, you know, persuasion, this, some of the stuff's one Oh one and they, and they totally missed the opportunity.

[00:27:03] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:27:03] Absolutely. And this has been so good, so rich. So I know you have an enormous amount of content. A great library of content is a followup to this. So people want to go deeper. I know you've got a YouTube video where you talk about the four steps for raising capital, any other things that we should link to in the show notes, to help people to kind of go deeper with you on fundraising.

[00:27:22]Dan Martell: [00:27:22] the big thing is the master class I provide. So, so I'll have that link and then also search online fundraising, Dan Martell, I've done so many talks and podcasts and YouTube videos on the topic for different things around how to decide, how to split up equity to, you know, should you raise venture or should you bootstrap?

[00:27:39] So everything's online. I literally try to teach and give away everything. I know.

[00:27:44] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:27:44] Amazing. And so any last words of wisdom for founders who are in that fundraising journey, they're at the earliest. Stages anything to kind of like give them that Gusto to keep going.

[00:27:55] Dan Martell: [00:27:55] Yeah. If you're decided to raise. Decide to raise so many founders are half pregnant on it and you need to decide, you need to attack it. Like it's the only outcome that matters for you and your business. And you have to wake up every single day and spend the first two or three hours, a hundred percent focus on fundraising.

[00:28:11] And you have to let your team know like, Hey, for the next two to three months, I'm not going to be as available because I'm trying to get this really important thing done and you need to attack it and be obsessed around it. And if you don't do that, you'll either. Not raised for sure. Or you'll raise from a bunch of not sophisticated high net worth individuals that ask you for a proforma and a business plan.

[00:28:34] Like that's, those are the only two outcomes. If you don't take this seriously. And most people that res don't take it as seriously as they need to think about it. Right.

[00:28:42] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:28:42] I wish that I would've asked you that question like five years ago when I was raising money for my first VC backed company. Cause I think I was half pregnant. You know, I think that I had the, the, the vision of like, if I want to do this thing and as hard thing, I'm going to need capital to do it. But I remember I was doing a accelerator in Vegas, put on by Tony, Tony Shay from, from, Zappos.

[00:29:04] And I was touring his campus and it was only 1500 people, which is huge, but like not that huge for a tech company. And we were trying to build a network and I was looking at, I was like, I do not want to manage this many people. I don't want to build a company this big. And it was this. Horrifying moment where I was like, I'm going about this whole thing wrong.

[00:29:23] So I wish that I would've had this conversation with you a lot sooner. And I love that you say that about 70% of your coaching clients are doing it the bootstrapped way, because it shows that there's another path. There's another path to be able to build a really meaningful company and an incredible lifestyle without having to necessarily go the traditional way.

[00:29:40] And you're helping people with that. So thank you. Thank you for

[00:29:44] Dan Martell: [00:29:44] My my appreciation, Kate. Thanks so much.

[00:29:47] Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:29:47] So founders want to learn more from you. Where's the first place they should go. And I'm, I'm sure that they'll find the other tentacles from there.

[00:29:53] Dan Martell: [00:29:53] Yeah. I mean, Dan tools and Martel. That's my site where I link to everything. If they want the behind the scenes, Instagram stories, if they want to learn how to YouTube, if they want to just see my motivation, Tik TOK got a half a million followers on Tik TOK, a bunch of teenagers that I'm really committed to just, yeah, no, no, no crop tops and dances for me, but.

[00:30:15]I'm on every social platform, LinkedIn, more on the business content. I really try to, publish literally every day. I've got a team dedicated to just pumping out as much as I can.

[00:30:23]Katelyn Bourgoin: [00:30:23] the world is thankful that you're working in the capacity you're working in today because now not just your investors get their benefit, but a whole lot of founders get to benefit too. So thank you, Dan.

[00:30:32] Dan Martell: [00:30:32] Thanks so much.



Katelyn Bourgoin Profile Photo

Katelyn Bourgoin

Host of Customer Show & Founder of Customer Camp

Katelyn is the founder of Customer Camp, a training and research firm that helps growth-ready product teams to get inside their customer’s heads so they can market smarter.

Dan Martell Profile Photo

Dan Martell

Investor & SaaS Coach

Dan Martell has founded 6 businesses and invested in over 40, including Buffer, Hootsuite, Udemy, and GetAround. He teaches founders how to scale their businesses through his SaaS Academy.