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Caalaroga Shark Media. Good morning, I'm Reed Carter. Sunday, December seventh,
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twenty twenty five. Yesterday we covered the murder of John
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Lennon December eighth, nineteen eighty, Mark David Chapman waiting outside
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the Dakota the autograph, the hollow point bullets, the five shots,
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John Lennon dying on the floor of his own apartment building,
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cassette tapes scattered around him. Today what happened next? The
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trial that never was, the insanity defense that was never tested,
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And forty five years of Mark David Chapman sitting in
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a prison cell, denied parole fourteen times, while the world
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still mourns the man he killed. December ninth, nineteen eighty,
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the morning after the murder, Mark David Chapman was arraigned
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on charges of second degree murder in Manhattan Criminal Court.
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He was represented by a quarter apoint of attorney Herbert Adlerberg.
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The arraignment lasted minutes. Chapman entered no plea. He was
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remanded to Bellevue Hospital for psychiatric evaluation, placed under suicide watch,
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the most hated man in America, locked in a padded
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room while doctors tried to determine if he was legally insane.
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Outside the Dakota, thousands gathered singing Lenin's songs, crying, holding candles,
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a spontaneous vigil that would last for days. On December fourteenth,
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Yoko Ono called for ten minutes of silence to honor John.
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Millions around the world participated. Meanwhile, Chapman's attorney withdrew from
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the case. Too many death threats, too much hatred. No
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lawyer wanted to defend John Lennon's killer. Eventually, Jonathan Marx
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took the case, a criminal defense attorney willing to represent
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the unrepresentable, and Marx had a strategy in Sannnity. The
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psychiatric evaluations were damning paranoid schizophrenia, delusions of grandeur, the
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little people in his walls, the obsession with the catcher
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in the rye, the belief that he had become Holden Callfield,
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that killing Lenin was somehow saving the world from phoniness.
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Doctor Daniel Schwartz, director of forensic psychiatric services at King's
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County Hospital, diagnosed Chapman as a paranoid schizophrenic, said Chapman
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had literally become John Lennon in his own mind and
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killed the real Lenin because he was evil and a phony.
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He killed the person who to him represented evil and hypocrisy.
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Schwartz testified he killed him physically, he killed himself psychologically.
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Another psychiatrist, doctor Dorothy Lewis, said Chapman told her he
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summoned devils from high places the night before the murder,
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that demons forced him to kill. The insanity defense looked promising.
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Chapman might never see the inside of a prison. Instead
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ed he'd be committed to a state mental hospital for treatment,
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may be released eventually if doctors determined he was no
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longer a threat. But Mark David Chapman had other plans.
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June twenty second, nineteen eighty one, the trial was about
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to begin. Jonathan Marx was ready to present his insanity defense.
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Witnesses lined up, psychiatric experts prepared to testify. Then Chapman
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told his lawyer he wanted to plead guilty. Mark Subjected
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raised serious questions about Chapman's competence to make that decision,
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requested further psychiatric evaluation. Chapman was unmoved. He told Judge
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Dennis Edwards Junior that God had instructed him to plead guilty,
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that he would never change his plea, never appeal regardless
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of the sentence. The judge accepted the plea, declared Chapman competent,
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set sentencing for August twenty fourth. I'm reed, Carter. This
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is celebrity trials today. Mark David Chapman's guilty plea, the sentence,
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forty five years in prison, fourteen parole denials, and the
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question that haunts Yoko Ono every two years? Will the
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man who killed John Lennon ever walk free? Part two
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of two, June twenty second, nineteen eighty one. Manhattan State
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Supreme Court Judge Dennis Edwards Junior presiding. The courtroom was
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packed media from around the world. Security tight. Everyone expected
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the beginning of what would be one of the most
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sensational trials of the decade. Instead, they got six words
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from Mark David Chapman. I plead guilty, your honor. His attorney,
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Jonathan Marx, was blindsided. He'd spent months building an insanity
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defense expert witnesses psychiatric evaluations, a compelling case that Chapman
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was a paranoid schizophrenic who didn't understand the wrongfulness of
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his actions. Chapman was throwing it all away. Mister Chapman
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has exercised his constitutional right to amend his plea. Judge
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Edwards announced he will plead guilty to the charge of
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murder in the second degree. Marx told the court he
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opposed the plea change, that he had serious questions about
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Chapman's mental state, that a man who believed God was
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giving him instructions might not be competent to make legal decisions.
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But Edwards disagreed, said Chapman had made the decision of
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his own free will, declared him competent to plead guilty.
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Why did Chapman do it? He gave different explanations over
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the years. Said God told him to, Said he wanted
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to spare yoko Ono the pain of a lengthy trial.
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Said he didn't want to be seen as crazy. The
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truth probably all of the above, and something else. Control
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Mark David Chapman's entire life was about control. The little
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people in his walls who worshiped him, the Holden Caulfield fantasy,
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where he decided who was phony and who deserved to live,
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the murder itself, choosing who dies and when. A trial
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would have taken that control away. Lawyers arguing psychiatrists testifying
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a jury deciding his fate. Chapman would have been a
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passive observer in his own story. By pleading guilty, he
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controlled the narrative, made himself the author of his own ending.
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Even in prison, he would be the one who chose
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to be there. Make it make sense. He murdered John
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Lennon for fame, then pleaded guilty to avoid a trial
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that would have kept him in the spotlight for months.
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The logic doesn't hold, but logic never applied to Mark
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David Chapman. August twenty fourth, nineteen eighty one, sentencing day.
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The courtroom was crowded again, cameras everywhere, the whole world watching.
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Two psychiatrists testified on Chapman's behalf. Doctor Daniel Schwartz repeated
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his diagnosis of paranoid schizophrenia, said Chapman had become Lenin
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in his own mind and killed him because he was evil.
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Doctor Dorothy Lewis described Chapman's claims about summoning devils, his delusions,
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his detachment from reality. Prosecutor Alan Sullivan presented evidence that
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Chapman had considered killing other celebrities before settling on Lenin.
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David Bowie, Johnny Carson, Elizabeth Taylor, Marlon Brando, Walter Cronkite,
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George C. Scott, Jacqueline Kennedy, O Nassis, even Ronald Reagan
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the only criterion fame Chapman wanted to kill someone famous.
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Lenin was the most accessible. Then Chapman was asked if
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he had anything to say. He stood, pale, pudgy, clutching
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a paperback copy of The Catcher in the Rye, and
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he read aloud from the novel, the passage about Holden
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Caulfield's fantasy of being the Catcher in the Rye, standing
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at the edge of a cliff, catching children before they
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fall into the corrupt adult world. The courtroom was silent.
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Here was a murderer reading from the book that supposedly
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explained his crime, but it explained nothing, just the ramblings
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of a fictional teenager weaponized by a disturbed mind. Judge
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Edwards pronounced sentence twenty years to life, just five years
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less than the maximum of twenty five to life. The
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judge also ordered psychiatric treatment during incarceration, said he hoped
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doctors could figure out what made Chapman tick, understand the
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pathology prevent future tragedies. Chapman showed no emotion, was let
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out of the courtroom in handcuffs, transported to Attica Correctional Facility,
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the maximum security prison in upstate New York. His wife, Gloria,
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was not charged. She knew about his plans. He'd told
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her before his second trip to New York, but she
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thought he was joking, or crazy, or both. She didn't
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take it seriously, and by the time she realized he
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was serious, it was too late. They divorced. Eventually, Gloria
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returned to Hawaii tried to build a new life, but
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she'll always be the woman who was married to John
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Lennon's killer. Mark David Chapman entered Attica on August twenty fourth,
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nineteen eighty one. He would become eligible for parole on
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August twenty fourth, two thousand, nineteen years away, plenty of
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time to think about what he'd done, or so the
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world hoped. Attica Correctional Facility one of the most notorious
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prisons in America, sight of the nineteen seventy one riot
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that left forty three people dead, maximum security home to murderers, rapists,
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and the worst criminals New York had to offer, and
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now home to Mark David Chapman. Prison officials immediately recognized
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the problem. Chapman wasn't just a murderer. He was the murderer,
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the man who killed John Lennon, a target for anyone
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who wanted to make a name for themselves. They put
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him in protective custody, solitary confinement, twenty three hours a
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day in a cell, one hour for exercise, minimal contact
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with other inmates. Chapman's first months were turbulent. In February
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nineteen eighty two, he went on a hunger strike, refused
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to eat for twenty six days. The New York State
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Supreme Court authorized force feeding. He was given liquid nutrients
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through a tube. Why the hunger strike, Chapman never fully explained.
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Maybe he was seeking attention, Maybe he was trying to
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punish himself. Maybe he was just unstable, as the psychiatrists
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had said all along. He declined all interview requests for
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his first six years. Said he didn't want to give
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the impression he'd killed Lenin for fame, that he regretted
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the murder, that he was genuinely remorseful. But actions speak
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louder than words, and Chapman's actions suggested something else. Journalist
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James R. Gaines managed to interview him anyway, wrote an
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eighteen thousand words series for People magazine. Chapman later told
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the Parole Board he regretted that interview. In nineteen ninety two,
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Jack Jones of the Rochester Democrat and Chronicle published let
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Me Take You Down Inside the Mind of Mark David Chapman,
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based on audio taped interviews with Chapman over several years,
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a deep dive into his psychology, his delusions, his rationalizations.
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Chapman cooperated with the book, then said he regretted it.
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A pattern was emerging. Do something for attention, then claim remorse. Repeat.
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Over the years, Chapman was transferred from Attica to various facilities,
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eventually landed at Greenhaven Correctional Facility in store Ormville, New York,
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about an hour north of Manhattan. He's been there ever since.
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In prison, he found religion again, was baptized in the
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Protestant faith in May nineteen ninety four, claimed he'd become
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a born again Christian again, said he was genuinely repentant.
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He also got married in nineteen eighty one, while awaiting sentencing.
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He divorced Gloria in June nineteen ninety one, he married again.
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Her name has never been publicly disclosed. She visits him regularly.
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Conjugal visits were allowed until New York State banned them
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for convicted murderers in twenty eleven. Chapman has worked various
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jobs in prison, legal clerk, kitchen helper, chapel attendant. He's
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described as a model prisoner, follows the rules, doesn't cause trouble,
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stays in protective custody to avoid being killed by lenin fans,
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and every two years, like clockwork, he applies for parole.
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August two thousand, his first parole hearing, twenty years served.
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Chapman told the board he wasn't a threat to society,
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that John Lennon himself would have approved of his release.
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The board denied him. Yoko Ono had submitted a letter
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asking them to keep Chapman behind bars, said she feared
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for her safety, for Sean's safety, for the safety of
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anyone Chapman might target next. That denial set the pattern
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for the next quarter century. October two thousand and two denied.
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October two thousand and four denied. Yoko wrote again, I
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am afraid it will bring back the nightmare, the chaos,
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and the description of a vision I experienced when I
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saw my husband lying dead. August two thousand and six denied,
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August two thousand and eight denied, August twenty ten denied.
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Chapman told the board he was obsessed with attention. When
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he killed Lenin, I felt like nothing, and I felt
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if I shot him, I would become something which is
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not true. That's a lie, that's a delusion. August twenty
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twelve denied, August twenty fourteen denied, August twenty sixteen denied,
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August twenty eighteen denied. Chapman said he felt more and
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more shame each year. August twenty twenty denied. I assassinated
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him because he was very, very very famous, and that's
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the only reason. Chapman told the board, I was very
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very very very much seeking self glory, very selfish. August
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twenty twenty two, denied twelfth time. The board cited his
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selfish disregard for human life of global consequence set his
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actions left the world recovering from the void of which
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you created. March twenty twenty four denied thirteenth time, August
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twenty seventh, twenty twenty five, denied fourteenth time. Just three
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months ago. Chapman is now seventy years old. His next
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parole hearing is scheduled for February two, twenty twenty seven.
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He will likely be denied again and again and again.
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The pattern is clear. The board will never release him.
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The crime was too notorious, the victim too beloved, the
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cultural impact too profound. Mark David Chapman will die in prison,
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not because of any single factor, but because he killed
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someone who mattered to millions of people, and those people
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will never forgive him. We'll be right back with the
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legacy of John Lennon's assassination. Why Chapman still represents something
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dangerous about fame and forty five years later, why the
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world still mourns. Welcome back to celebrity trials. I'm reed.
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Carter yoko Ono is ninety two years old, now still
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living in the Dakota apartment she shared with John, the
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same building where he he was murdered forty five years ago.
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Every two years, when Chapman's parole hearing approaches, she writes
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a letter. The content varies, but the message is always
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the same. Keep him locked up. In twenty fifteen, she
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told The Daily Beast, one thing I think is that
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he did it once, he could do it again to
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somebody else. It could be me, it could be Sean,
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it could be anybody. So there is that concern she's
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not being paranoid. Chapman had a hit list multiple celebrities
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he considered killing before settling on Lenin. What's to stop
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him from targeting someone else if released? But Yoko's opposition
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goes beyond safety. It's about justice, about honoring John's memory,
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about refusing to let his killer walk free while she
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still draws breath. Their son, Sean Lennon, is now fifty
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years old. He was five when his father was murdered,
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remembers almost nothing of that night. Has spent his entire
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adult life in the shadow of that tragedy. Sean has
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spoken about Chapman rarely. What is there to say The
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man who killed your father applies for freedom every two years.
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You have to relive the worst moment of your life
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over and over. There's no closure, there's no healing, just
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an endless cycle of parole hearings and denials. John's other son,
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Julian from his first marriage to Cynthia Powell, was seventeen
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in nineteen eighty living in England, learned of his father's