Best of Season 1: "BEHIND THE CLOWN PAINT: GACY'S TRIAL, EXECUTION & LEGACY - PART 2"

0:00 Celebrity Trials is kicking off season two with a new host and new name. Hey, I'm Garrett Fisher, and starting March sixteenth, I'll be the new host on Daily Crime and Justice. It's the same great show, now with extra crime and extra justice in the meantime. Please enjoy this encore performance of one of Celebrity Trials classic episodes. See you on March sixteenth. We'll miss you, Read Carter and wish you the best. Callaroga Shark Media. Good morning, I'm Read Carter. Sunday, October nineteenth, twenty twenty five. Yesterday we covered John Wayne Gacy's double life and the thirty three boys he murdered. Today what happened after the bodies were discovered December twenty second, nineteen seventy eight, Gasey confessed to killing thirty or thirty three, I don't remember exactly, described his methods in detail, showed investigators how he strangled victims, directed police to bodies in the crawl space and the Desplains River. Complete confession. Then his lawyers started preparing his defense, and suddenly Gaysey had a different story. He didn't remember killing anyone. Multiple personalities took over Jack Hanley did the murders.

1:18 John Gasey was innocent. He was insane, not guilty by reason of insanity. The trial began February sixth, nineteen eighty, lasted one month. The prosecution presented overwhelming evidence, thirty three bodies, Gaysey's confession, survivors who testified about assaults. The defense presented psychiatrists claiming Gaysey had multiple personalities and couldn't control his actions. March thirteenth, nineteen eighty, the jury deliberated less than two hours, guilty on all thirty three counts of murder. February nineteen eighty, Judge Louis Garripo sentenced him to death. Gasey spent fourteen years on death row at Minard Correctional Center. Painted, gave interviews, sold his artwork, maintained his innocence despite confessing, showed zero remorse for thirty three murders. Became a celebrity killer, the killer clown that America couldn't stop talking about. May tenth, nineteen ninety four, John Wayne Gacy was executed by lethal injection.

2:27 Took eighteen minutes to kill him. The IV clogged had to replace it. He was fifty two years old. Final words before the execution, kiss my ass I'm reed, Carter. This is celebrity trials today. The trial of John Wayne Gacy, death row execution, and the legacy of the man who made America afraid of clowns. February sixth, nineteen eighty, the trial of John Wayne Gacy began in Cook County Circuit Court. Judge Lewis Garrippo presiding, Prosecutors William Kunkele and Terry Sullivan representing the state Public defenders Sam Amarante and Robert Mauda defending Gasey. The case was simple on its face. Thirty three bodies, Gaysey's confession, physical evidence connecting victims to his house, survivors testifying about assaults. This should have been straightforward, guilty of thirty three murders, sentence him done, But Gasey pleaded not guilty by reason of insanity his defense. Yes, bodies were found under his house, Yes he confessed, But John Wayne Gasey didn't commit those murders. Jack Hanley did, and bad John and other personalities that took over Gasey's mind and made him kill. The insanity defense in Illinois required proving Gaysey couldn't understand his actions were wrong at the time he committed them, not that he was mentally ill.

3:57 Everyone agreed he was mentally ill, but that he was so mentally ill he couldn't distinguish right from wrong. The prosecution's case was devastating. Started with the excavation evidence, crime scene photos of the crawl space, diagrams showing where each body was buried, testimony from officers who discovered the remains, medical examiners describing causes of death, strangulation, suffocation, torture, Then the confession, Gaysey's own words describing how he killed. The handcuffed trick to restrain victims, the rope trick to strangle them, burying them in the crawl space, dumping bodies in the river when he ran out of space, all described matter of factly by Gaysey himself. Survivors testified. Jeffrey Rignall, who'd been chloroformed, tortured, and raped, then dumped in Lincoln Park, described being restrained in Gaysey's house while Gaysey assaulted him for hours, described the smell later realized it was decomposing bodies.

4:57 Testified Gaysey knew exactly what he was doing, was in control the entire time. This wasn't multiple personalities. This was a predator enjoying his work. Robert Donnelly, nineteen, survived an assault by Gaysey in nineteen seventy seven. Testified Gasey picked him up, took him to the house, chloroformed him, restrained him, tortured him, raped him repeatedly, then drove him home. Told him if he reported it, Gaysey would kill him. Donnelly went to police anyway. They investigated, but didn't search Gaisey's house. If they had, this trial would have happened in nineteen seventy seven instead of nineteen eighty. Multiple victims would have been saved. The physical evidence was overwhelming. Jewelry belonging to victims found in Gaysey's house, a class ring from one victim, driver's licenses, personal items, Gaysey kept his trophies, his car, the same vehicle multiple victims had been seen entering before disappearing, and the timeline. Gaysey had been questioned by police multiple times about missing boys. Each time he had explanations. They ran away, they were unreliable, they moved on, and each time police believed him because he was John Wayne Gacy, successful businessman, Democratic Precinct Captain Pogo the clown, why would they suspect him? The prosecution argued, this wasn't insanity, this was calculation. Gaysey carefully selected victims, vulnerable teenagers, runaways, boys

6:30 from troubled homes, boys who wouldn't be immediately missed. He lured them with job offers or shelter, isolated them in his house, killed them, buried them, cleaned up, then went back to his normal life. That's not insanity, that's planning. The defense argued Gaysey had a split personality, that John Wayne Gacy, the contractor, the community leader, the clown, didn't commit these murders. That another personality, Jack Hanley, took over and killed. That Gaysey would black out and when he regained consciousness there would be a body he didn't remember killing, didn't intend to kill, couldn't control his actions. Defense psychiatrists testified about Gaysey's childhood trauma. Abusive father, physical beatings, called a sissy, never approved of all, creating psychological damage. They claimed Gaysey developed a dissociative disorder, his mind split into different personalities to cope with trauma. When stressed, these alternate personalities emerged and committed violence. Doctor Richard Rappaport testified Gasey had borderline personality disorder and antisocial personality disorder, that he was a paranoid schizophrenic, that multiple personalities controlled his behavior, that Gaysey genuinely couldn't remember committing the murders, but the prosecution had their own psychiatrists. Doctor Robert Stein testified Gaysey was anti social but not in insane, knew right from wrong,

8:02 made deliberate choices to kill. The multiple personality claim was manipulation. Gaysey trying to avoid responsibility. The key evidence against the insanity defense Gaysey's behavior after the murders. He went to work the next day, attended Democratic Party events, performed as Pogo the Clown through elaborate neighborhood parties. If he was so insane he couldn't control his actions, how was he functioning normally the rest of the time? And the cover up? Gaysey buried bodies carefully spread lime to mask decomposition smell, told neighbors the smell was moisture problems. When the crawl space filled up, he changed disposal methods, dumping bodies in the river instead. That's not insanity, that's problem solving. That's a rational person adapting his murder methods to avoid detection.

8:53 Prosecutor William Cunkle's closing argument was brutal. He was not crazy. He knew what he was doing, he planned it, he executed it, and he got away with it for six years because he was smart enough to fool everyone. That's not insanity, that's evil. The defenses closing, John Wayne Gacy is sick. He needs treatment, not execution. The man you see in this courtroom isn't the man who committed these murders. That was Jack Hanley. That was the dark side of a damaged mind. Gasey couldn't control it, couldn't stop it. That's the definition of insanity. More In a. Moment March twelfth, nineteen eighty, closing arguments finished, the jury began deliberations. They had to decide was Gasey insane when he committed thirty three murders or was he a calculating predator who knew exactly what he was doing. Less than two hours later, the jury returned guilty all thirty three counts murder, not insane, responsible for his actions, knew right from wrong, chose to kill. Gasey showed no emotion. His lawyers immediately began planning appeals, but the verdict was clear.

10:13 John Wayne Gacy was a serial killer, not a sick man. The jury didn't buy the multiple personality defense, didn't believe Jack Hanley existed, believed Gaysey was whose survivors described a cold, calculating predator who enjoyed torturing and killing teenage boys. The sentencing phase was brief. Illinois law at the time mandated death penalty for multiple murders. Judge Garipo had no discretion. March thirteenth, nineteen eighty The sentence of the court is that you be taken to a place of confinement and that on a date to be determined by the Illinois Department of Corrections, you be put to death. Gasey responded, your honor, I am innocent. I did not commit these crimes.

10:58 Jack Hanley killed them, those boys, not me, still maintaining the fiction, still refusing to take responsibility. He was transferred to death row at Minard Correctional Center in southern Illinois, Cell one hundred thirty, where he'd spend the next fourteen years. Manard Correctional Center, maximum security prison, death row. John Wayne Gacy arrived in nineteen eighty and became one of the most famous inmates in America. He adapted to prison easily, enjoyed the notoriety. Other death row inmates treated him like a celebrity. Guards found him polite and cooperative. He followed rules, didn't cause problems, model prisoner, but he never showed remorse, never apologized to victim's families, maintained his innocence despite confessing in interviews. He'd say things like, I'm the victim here, I'm the one on death row for crimes Jack Hanley committed.

12:00 Absolutely delusional or absolutely manipulative, hard to tell which. Gaysey became an artist on death row. Started painting in prison. His subject matter was telling clowns, skulls, Disney characters, self portraits as Pogo the Clown, dark, disturbing images that people couldn't stop buying. His paintings became collectibles. People paid thousands for original Gaysey artwork. The most famous his Pogo the Clown self portraits, bright colors, exaggerated features, deeply unsettling when you know the artist murdered thirty three people. His painting sold for twenty thousand dollars or more. Collectors wanted pieces by the Killer Clown victim's families were horrified their son's murderer was profiting from his crimes, making money off his notoriety.

12:50 Some jurisdictions later passed laws preventing criminals from profiting from their crimes Son of Sam, laws inspired partly by Gaysey's art sales. Gaysey gave gave numerous interviews from Death Row, talked to reporters, documentarians, authors, Always proclaimed innocence, always blamed Jack Hanley or other personalities, always portrayed himself as the real victim. In a nineteen ninety two interview, he said, I didn't kill anyone. I was framed. The police planted those bodies in my crawl space. Completely absurd. Police didn't plant twenty nine bodies, But Gasey said it with a straight face. Either he'd convinced himself it was true, or he enjoyed lying to everyone. He corresponded with people who wrote to him, serial killer groupies, people fascinated by his crimes, women who claimed to love him. He'd write back, send them artwork, play the charming correspondent. Same manipulation he used on victims, figuring out what people wanted to hear and telling them exactly that Jason Moss, a college student, began corresponding with Gaysey in nineteen ninety three as part of a recent project. Pretended to be a vulnerable young man, exactly Gaysey's victim type. Gasey's letters to Moss became increasingly sexual and predatory, same patterns he'd used to groom victims.

14:13 Gasey couldn't help himself. Even on death Row, Even knowing he'd never have access to victims, he still tried to manipulate young men. Moss later wrote a book about the correspondence. The experience traumatized him so badly that he eventually committed suicide years later. That's Gasey's legacy extending beyond Death Row. His manipulation damaged people, even through letters. During his years at Minard, Gaysey's appeals were consistently denied. He argued ineffective counsel, argued the evidence was insufficient, argued the multiple personality defense should have succeeded. Every appeal failed. The Illinois Supreme Court reviewed his case multiple times, always affirmed the conviction. The evidence was overwhelming, the confession was voluntary, the trial was fair.

15:02 Gaysey received due process. His conviction stood by nineteen ninety four, Gaysey had exhausted his appeals. Execution date set May tenth, nineteen ninety four, After fourteen years on death row, John Wayne Gacy would finally face justice for thirty three murders. The night before his execution, Gaysey was asked if he had any regrets. He said, I regret being arrested. Not sorry for killing, not sorry for the families, sorry he got caught. He ordered his final meal fried chicken, fried shrimp, french fries, fresh strawberries, and a diet coke Kentucky fried chicken.

15:42 Specifically maybe nostalgia for his father in law's business, where he'd worked before everything fell apart. He spent his final hours painting, giving interviews, maintaining his innocence, showing no remorse. Right up to the end, John Wayne Gaysey was performing the likable guy, the victim of circumstances, the man who didn't deserve this. But outside Manard Correctional Center, victim's families had gathered. They wanted to see justice done, wanted confirmation that the man who murdered their sons would die. Wanted closure after fourteen years of appeals and delays. More in a moment May tenth.

16:32 Nineteen ninety four Manard Correctional Center execution chamber. John Wayne Gacy, fifty two years old, was prepared for execution by lethal injection. Illinois had changed its execution method from electric chair to lethal injection in nineteen ninety Considered more humane. Three chemicals sodium thiopental to induce unconsciousness, pancuronium bromide to paralyze the respiratory system, potassium clade to stop the heart quick, painless dignified. Gasey's last statement before being taken to the execution chamber, taking my life won't compensate for the loss of others. The state is committing the same type of murder they say I did, comparing his execution to his murders. No acknowledgment that his victims were tortured, that they were innocent, that he chose to kill them, just the state is as bad as me. He was strapped to the gurney.

17:30 Four lines inserted witnesses, present, victims, families, media representatives, prison officials, all watching through glass. The execution began at twelve fifty eight a m. But something went wrong. The fourth clogged, the lethal chemicals weren't flowing properly. Gasey lay on the gurney, partially conscious while officials scrambled to fix the problem. The execution was halted, four lines replaced, took eighteen minutes to kill him instead of the usual five to seven. During that time, Gaysey remained conscious, aware of what was happening. Some witnesses said he appeared distressed, others said he remained calm, but everyone agreed it wasn't the quick, painless death intended. Finally, at one sixteen am, John Wayne Gacy was pronounced dead, fourteen years after his conviction, fifteen years after his crimes were discovered. Thirty three victims finally avenged. His final words before the execution, spoken to the warden, kiss my ass.

18:34 You'll never find all the others. That last part haunted everyone. You'll never find all the others, suggesting there were more victims, more bodies never recovered, more families who'd never know what happened to their missing sons. Outside the prison, crowds celebrated, people cheered when his death was announced. Venders sold t shirts no tears for the clown. Victim's family expressed relief. Jeff Rignall, who'd survived Gaysey's assault said I finally feel safe, But some families felt empty. Their sons were still dead. Gaysey's execution didn't bring them back. Closure wasn't the relief they'd hoped for. Some said they'd wanted Gaysey to suffer more, to experience a fraction of what their sons experienced. Eighteen minutes of a botched execution wasn't enough. Gaysey's body was cremated, ashes scattered in an undisclosed location. His paintings, except those already sold, were destroyed. His house at eight two one three West Summerdale had been demolished in nineteen seventy nine.

19:43 Nothing remained of John Wayne Gaysey except memories and trauma. The execution sparked debates about capital punishment. Was death penalty justice or revenge? Did killing Gaysey honor his victims or make the state complicit in violence? Reasonable people disagreed, still disagree, But for victim's families, the debate was simple. John Wayne Gacy tortured and murdered at least thirty three people showed no remorse, laughed about his crimes, profited from his notoriety. The death penalty was the only appropriate punishment, and that final statement, You'll never find all the others, suggested Gaysey took secrets to his grave. Were there more victims? Probably?

20:26 Gasey admitted he didn't remember all of them. Said some were runaways, nobody reported missing, said some bodies were disposed of in ways police never discovered. Estimates suggest Gaysey killed more than forty people. The confirmed count is thirty three, but the true number might never be known. Some boys vanished in the nineteen seventies, reported as runaways, and nobody connected them to Gaysey. Their families might never learn the truth. That's Gaysey's final cruelty, taking information to his grave, leaving families without closure, maintaining mystery even in death. John Wayne Gacy's legacy is complicated and dark. He changed American culture in ways still visible today. First, he created the killer clown trope. Before Gaysey, clowns were associated with children's entertainment, birthday parties, circuses, harmless fun. After Gaysey, clowns became symbols of hidden evil. The monster behind the makeup, the predator pretending to be friendly, Stephen King's Pennywise in It, the demonic clown who murders children exists because of Gaysey. King was writing it in the nineteen eighties, after Gaysey's trial.

21:45 The concept of an evil clown terrorizing a community came directly from the killer clown case Pennywise is Pogo the clown as supernatural horror. The horror movie industry embraced killer clowns, killer clowns from Outer Space, clown by Eli Roth, countless films featuring murderous clowns, all descendants of John Wayne Gacy. He made clowns scary. Chulorophobia fear of clowns became recognized in psychology, partly because of Gaysey. People who were fine with clowns before nineteen seventy eight developed phobias after learning about Pogo. The association of clowns with violence became embedded in American consciousness. Second, Gaysey demonstrated how predators hide in plain sight. He was a successful businessman, community leader, married with children, hosted neighborhood parties, performed at children's hospitals. Everyone loved him, and he was murdering teenagers in his basement.

22:44 That realization terrified America. Your friendly neighbor could be a serial killer. The guy who volunteers at charity events could be a monster. Trust nobody anyone could be dangerous. Law enforcement changed because of Gaysey. Police became more aggressive about investigating missing persons, more willing to search homes of suspects, more aware that respectability isn't innocence. Jeffrey Rignall reported his assault in nineteen seventy eight. Police investigated Gaysey but didn't search his house because he seemed credible. After Gaysey, that mistake wouldn't be repeated. Third, Gaysey's case highlighted failures in the criminal justice system. He was convicted of sodomy in nineteen sixty eight, served eighteen months, released on parole. Within two years, he was killing again. If he'd served his full ten year sentence, multiple victims would have been saved.

23:36 Victim's families filed lawsuits against the state of Iowa for granting early parole, against Illinois for not supervising him after he moved, against police departments for not investigating complaints about missing boys. Some cases settled, others were dismissed, but the message was clear the system failed. Multiple agencies had opportunities to stop Gaysey and didn't. Fourth Acy's notoriety created the modern celebrity serial killer phenomenon. Before Gasey. Serial killers were monsters to be forgotten. After Gasey, they became famous. Books written about them, documentaries made art, collected interviews published. Gasey enjoyed his fame, loved being the killer clown, loved selling paintings, loved giving interviews. That attention incentivized future killers. If you want to be famous, commit spectacular crimes. Gasey proved that murder could make you a household name. Now we have true crime as entertainment, podcasts about serial killers, Netflix documentaries, books and movies glorifying murderers, Peacock's Devil in disguise as part of that legacy, we're fascinated by John Wayne Gacy.

24:51 Can't stop talking about him. That's exactly what he wanted. Fifth The unidentified Victims Several bodies from Gaysey's c all space were never identified. They're buried in unmarked graves as victim ten victim, twenty six victim, twenty eight teenage boys who died horrible deaths and nobody claimed them. In twenty eleven, Cook County Sheriff's Office reopened investigation into the unidentified victims. Used modern DNA technology exhumed remains for testing identified one victim, William Bundy nineteen, last seen in nineteen seventy six, but others remain unknown. That's Gasey's lasting crime, not just killing thirty three people, but making some of them disappear, completely erasing them from history, leaving families without answers. The eight to two one three West Summerdale address no longer exists.

25:48 The house was demolished, the lot remained empty for years. Eventually a new house was built, different layout, different address, no connection to Gaysey except giography, but neighbors know real estate agents have to disclose the history. The land where Gaysey buried twenty nine bodies is forever haunted. John Wayne Gaysey died May tenth, nineteen ninety four, but his influence lives on. Every time someone sees a clown and feels uncomfortable, every time police investigate a respected community member suspected of crimes, every time we binge true crime documentaries about serial killers.

26:29 That's Gaysey's legacy. He wanted to be remembered, wanted to be famous, wanted to matter, and he got his wish. We can't stop talking about him. Peacock made a new series forty five years after his arrest. We're still fascinated, still horrified, still trying to understand how John Wayne Gaysey fooled everyone. That's the devil in disguise, that's the monster behind Pogo's smile. That's the legacy of the killer Clown. That's part two of our John Wayne Gaysey Special February sixth, nineteen eighty. His trial began, pleaded not guilty by reason of insanity, claimed multiple personalities made him kill. Jury deliberated less than two hours. Guilty on all thirty three counts, Sentenced to death. Fourteen years on death row, painted clowns, gave interviews, sold artwork for thousands of dollars, maintained his innocence, showed zero remorse right up to the end, manipulating anyone who'd listen. May tenth, nineteen ninety four. Executed by lethal injection, took eighteen minutes. Four clogged had to replace it. Final words, kiss my ass, You'll never find all the others. Died at one sixteen am, age fifty two. Legacy. Gaysey created the killer clown trope that defines modern horror, made America afraid of what hides behind friendly faces, changed how police investigate missing persons created the celebrity serial killer phenomenon, left

28:03 families without answers about unidentified victims. Peacock's Devil in Disguise explores Gaysey's crimes and impact. Watch it understand how one man's evil changed American culture, how Pogo the Clown became the symbol of hidden monsters. I'm Red Carter. This was our two parts special on John Wayne Gacy, thirty three victims, six years of murder, one of the worst serial killers in American history, and the man who made us afraid of clowns. Tomorrow back to regular programming with Monday's show covering the latest trials and updates. See you then,