Jan. 26, 2023

Day 295: The Trauma Has Made Me Softer

Day 295: The Trauma Has Made Me Softer

Natasha adjusts to post-treatment daily life, continuing with hormone blockers and finally seeing a mental health professional. While working with less fortunate patients who don't have mittens or cold caps, Natasha looks back with gratitude on how privileged her treatment experience was.

Natasha adjusts to post-treatment daily life, continuing with hormone blockers and finally seeing a mental health professional.  While working with less fortunate patients who don't have mittens or cold caps, Natasha looks back with gratitude on how privileged her treatment experience was.

 

At work, she finds herself pushing patients much harder to advocate for themselves around symptom management and advises them not to accept puking and feeling like crap the whole time.

 

Cold weather leads to cold feet which leads to worrying about the onset of neuropathy. She experiences a constellation of odd side effects including tingling, arrhythmia, jacked up taste buds, hot flashes that may or may not mean anything and wonders about the cause. Is it from the hormone blockers? Menopause? Aftereffects of chemo? 

 

In this final episode of Season 2, she finally gets in to see a therapist and wishes it had been possible from the beginning. 

 

Going back and listening to episodes of the podcast reminds her how far she's come and although she’ll always be terrified, it has opened her heart in a way she’s thankful for and there is a way it’s made her softer. 

 

Thank you to all who have listened to Natasha’s story. We hope her real-time story has helped you and welcome your notes, thoughts, and feedback. 

 

We’ll be back soon with some special episodes, including a long awaited Kristen update and some incredible special guests. To stay in touch with what we’re doing, the newsletter is the best place to get real time updates. Subscribe at at https://breastcancerstories.substack.com/subscribe 

 

If you have just been diagnosed, and are interested in telling your story from beginning to end on our podcast, send us a note on our website at breastcancerstoriespodcast.com

 

Your support is crucial to continuing our mission, which is simply to help those with breast cancer and the people who love them through the shock of diagnosis and treatment. 

 

To support the show, you can donate directly on the website through PayPal at https://www.breastcancerstoriespodcast.com/donate or become a premium subscriber of our newsletter at https://breastcancerstories.substack.com/subscribe 

 

**About Breast Cancer Stories**

 

Breast Cancer Stories follows Natasha Curry, a palliative care nurse practitioner at San Francisco General Hospital, through her experience of going from being a nurse to a patient after being diagnosed with breast cancer. 

 

Natasha was in Malawi on a Doctors Without Borders mission in 2021 when her husband of 25 years announced in a text message that he was leaving. She returned home, fell into bed for a few weeks, and eventually pulled herself together and went back to work. A few months later when she discovered an almond-sized lump in her armpit, she did everything she tells her patients not to do and dismissed it, or wrote it off as a “fat lump."

 

Months went by before Natasha finally got a mammogram, but radiology saw nothing in either breast. It was the armpit lump that caught their attention. Next step was an ultrasound, where the lump was clearly visible. One painful biopsy later, Natasha found out she had cancer; in one life-changing moment, the nurse became the patient.

 

This podcast is about what happens when you have breast cancer, told in real time. 

 

Host and Executive Producer: Eva Sheie

Co-Host: Kristen Vengler

Editor and Audio Engineer: Daniel Croeser

Theme Music: Them Highs and Lows, [Bird of Figment](https://music.apple.com/us/artist/bird-of-figment/1434663902)

Story Editor: Mary Ellen Clarkson

Assistant Producer: Hannah Burkhart

Cover Art Designer: Shawn Hiatt

 

Breast Cancer Stories is a production of The Axis.

https://www.theaxis.io/

 

PROUDLY MADE IN AUSTIN, TEXAS

 

 

Transcript

Eva
00:00
Hey, it's Eva.

Kristen
02
Hey, it's Kristen. Let's start over. <laugh>
 
Eva
07
It's just like looking at this like, do I really have to read that?

Kristen
11
I know.

Eva
14
Hey, it's Eva.

Kristen
00:16
Hey, it's Kristin.

Eva
18
Hey.

Kristen
19
Hey, girl. Okay. 

Eva
21
Come on.

Eva
00:23
Hey, it's Eva.

Kristen
25
Hey, it's Kristin. 

Eva
25
Before we kick off the final episode of Natasha's season, we have some updates to share. First, I want to thank our listener, Susan, for emailing me this week to ask why we didn't release an episode on schedule last week. And to be honest, Susan, this is the first time we have ever heard that anyone even missed us when we're not on schedule, and I want to thank you for that. So we promise in the future to at least update everyone if we're going to miss a week.

Kristen
53
We also want to thank Natasha for giving her time, her vulnerability and sharing her story through all the ups and downs and everything in between of this shitty disease . A huge thank you to everyone in our production team, our story editor, Mary Ellen, engineer, Daniel and writer, Hannah, and all the contributors who have made it possible to finish another great season. We have had some amazing guests too. 

Eva
01:13
For the next few months Kristen and I will be back to do some special episodes that we have had on our bucket list for a while, including a long-awaited Kristen update. So to stay in touch with what we're doing, the newsletter is the best place to get real-time updates. And you can find the link for that in the show notes. 

Kristen
01:27
Everything that we do is, in the show notes.

Eva
01:35
It's always in the show notes. It's there.

Kristen
01:37
It is. Promise. If you have chemo grain, if you have chemo hand, <laugh> just look in the show notes. We'll be on a short break, but we want to hear from you regarding what we do next. There's a pole in our recent newsletter issue, so please vote and subscribe while you're there, or just email us and tell us what's on your mind.

Eva
01:56
If you have just been diagnosed and are interested in telling your story from beginning to end on our podcast, send us a note on our website at breastcancerstoriespodcast.com.

Kristen
02:07
And lastly, if you want to support the show you can donate directly on the website through PayPal or become a premium subscriber of our newsletter. All the links are in the show notes, like we said before. Your support is crucial to continue in our mission, which is simply to help you and the people who love you, through the shock of diagnosis and treatment.

Kristen
02:32
I am Kristen Vengler, and our mission with this podcast is to help you and the people who love you through the shock of diagnosis and treatment. 

Eva
02:33
I'm Eva Sheie, and be incredible woman whose story you're about to hear is a nurse practitioner in San Francisco who has dedicated her life to caring for patients, more vulnerable than you can imagine

Kristen
02:50
Her name is Natasha This is a story about what happens when you have breast cancer told in real time. You look so good.

Natasha
03:05
I feel I have gained some weight back.

Kristen
03:08
Yeah. That's great. Okay, our goal was a pound a week. How are you doing?

Natasha
03:13
I forget how long ago that was. But I just tipped over to 110, which is good. I mean, I have a ways to go, but that's good.

Kristen
03:19
That's good, right? Because you're down to 102?

Natasha
03:22
Yeah.

Kristen
03:23
Have you just been eating the world?

Natasha
03:25
Not really. I mean, I am just eating like a regular human being. You know, I'm eating. I made a delicious dinner. I have this fabulous cookbook. This is my new thing. I am gonna send it to you as a gift. It's called The Ultimate Cooking for One Cookbook, because I hate cooking for myself. And this is just like everything is just cooking for one person. It's really good. And it's like a 20-minute, like maximum 30 minutes screwing around with food. But no, I made this thing with like, bacon and shrimp and cream and, you know, it's, yeah, it was good. It's not a Weight Watchers book. Let us put it that way.

Kristen
03:58
 <laugh>

Natasha
05:07
It was funny, just before you and I were scheduled to talk tonight, I was talking to a friend on the phone, and I was like, "Oh, I have to go, I'm, you know, doing wrapping up the, the podcast". I said, "And I'm really not sure what's on my mind. Like, I'm not sure what to talk about". And she's like, "Well, are you still getting treatment?" I was like, "Well, yeah, I go in tomorrow". You know, and she said, "Well how about trying to explain to people why you're still getting treatment even though you've been told that you're cancer free". 

Kristen
05:07
Right.
 
Natasha
05:07
You know, and I can remember, you know, a couple of months ago when I'd got the, your cancer free and every three weeks you're still going to go in for treatment idea. Like, I'm not really sure what to call it. And I call it chemo because that's sort of what I associate it with.

Kristen
05:07
Right, right.

Natasha
05:07
It's still two drugs.I still have to have, you know, my port gets accessed. And I've tried to be this sort of, I don't know, stoic Brit with the port. I've never used the lidocaine cream. Just, they just, I don't know, because it takes, it hurts for less than a second.

Kristen
05:07
Oh, it hurts though. <laugh>

Natasha
05:10
But actually, it was interesting last time it hurt almost through the infusion and afterwards. They said, "Yeah. Oh no, it looks a little bit red this time. Let us know if something happens." Like, what do you mean let us know when something happens? You know, like how about... you're the port people, like why don't you,
 
Kristen
05:26
Do something?

Natasha
05:29
do something. But, and it was fine. But I have been counting down, I have five more treatments.
 
Kristen
05:33
Okay.

Natasha
05:36
And I have this, I have a weird collection of odd symptoms that I hadn't put together are related to the, the, two hormone blockers  until I... There's a really good app that a lot of Medics use called Epocrates, that is sort of the Bible for drugs and side effects and adverse reactions. 

Kristen
05:54
Okay.

Natasha
05:59
And so many of these things are an adverse reaction, like a side effect, to the hormone therapy. For example, I feel like I am getting some neuropathy in my feet.

Kristen
06:10
Oh, no, no, no. 

Natasha
06:10
I know, I know. I don't notice it in the daytime, but when I go to bed at night, that's when I have been noticing it. It's sort of, it's been bizarrely, cold for San Francisco, the last week, or so. So, there was a little bit of me, if I go, why are my feet so cold. And then, I was sort of doing a body scan in bed at night and I was like, no, that's like a kind of a warm, burn-y, tingly weirdness. Not bad.
 
Kristen
06:36
Right.
 
Natasha
06:41
I have also had this strange arrhythmia. We call it like a sort of irregular heartbeat. Doesn't happen all the time, but when it does it's...I don't know if you have ever had it, like even temporarily, it's like a, kind of like a, a bit of a shock in the chest. 

Kristen
06:44
Right. Right, right.

Natasha
06:57
And then, like you almost feel the thud when it's doing, it's either a premature heartbeat, or a late heartbeat.

Kristen
07:05
Okay.

Natasha
07:06
And then what was there was something else? Oh my taste buds are still completely jacked up.

Kristen
07:11
Yeah. 

Natasha
07:11
It's interesting because you know, they're mostly benign. I don't, I mean after chemo being so terrible where you have the chronic nausea and the like bone breaking fatigue. I don't have that. I am back at work. I am eating normally but it's just realizing this sort of constellation of side effects that I hadn't quite put together. And then, you know, looking up on Epocrates what are the side effects from these two hormone blockers? Like, ah-ha, here we go. You know, and there's no such thing as a free lunch. You don't block your hormones without side effects. And I am due a mammogram in January. And, you know, I was talking to my sister today that I have she was on hormone replacement therapy, and I have managed to get her off a because my mom and I both, my mom had a, she had a DCIS, so she was lucky. But you know, just talking to my sister's, like, we don't need to medicalize menopause. You have got hot flashes, you will be fine. 

Kristen
08:07
Right.

Natasha
08:11
And to put a caveat around that, like, some people who are listening, maybe really, really struggling. I was lucky enough that I didn't  struggle from menopause. But do this mammogram, it's like, my, my boob is still really tender from the surgery. I don't want it squished in their machine.

Kristen
08:28
No, no. Maybe they can do an ultrasound on that one instead.

Natasha
08:33
That's a great idea because I just think it's going to hurt. And yeah, I have never been one of those who think mammograms have really hurt me in the past, but this time, I know it's going to.

Kristen
08:43
Right. Well, because there's the scar tissue is still like settling.

Natasha
08:47
Exactly. Yeah. 

Kristen
08:47
You know, I mean, how long ago was it? Five months, max?

Natasha
08:50
Right. And it's still, even the look of the boob is settling. Initially when I looked in the mirror, it was definitely concave and sort of deformed looking. And over the months, it's sort of like it settled down. Fats moved into where the concave bits were and it's still a little funky looking, but not as much so. But yeah, I do not want it squished between two plates of plastic.

Kristen
09:14
Because it's probably still a little sore if you put a bra on like in that spot, right?

Natasha
09:18
Yeah, just about a month ago I started wearing my regular underwire bras again, and they really are not comfortable. So, I've gone back to, not the post surgical bra, but just a much lighter. It's fine. I don't care. But yeah, the wires were really digging in. And because I have lost weight as well, they were digging in my ribs. And I was like, this is not, this is not good.

Kristen
09:41
No, no. And I think it would be good to talk about what the reason is, for this year-long thing. Because we'd hit on it a little bit, I think a couple times in the podcast, but with the receptors, mine is estrogen positive and so my endocrine therapy is taking a little pill and it's a hormone blocker. Because the idea is to keep all of the estrogen out of my body, right? And so, then I am sure there's a protocol similar for progesterone positive, right? And then yours is her2 positive, but not estrogen and not progesterone. 

Natasha
10:13
Exactly.

Kristen
10:19
So why don’t you explain a little bit about that.

Natasha
10:21
So I think of it a little bit like Pac-Man, which definitely shows my age, but I think of the tumor is any of the cancerous cells that may still be there and desperately going around the body looking for her2 because that's what they like to eat, and that's what keeps them alive. So what the two drugs that I get one is called Herceptin, and the other one is called Perjeta. And they block the body's production of this hormone, so that the Pac-Man tumor is sort of looking everywhere. I actually never really played Pac-Man, but I really,

Kristen
10:56
Oh, I was a beast, girl.

Natasha
10:57
So, my hope is that those little hungry mouths are just, they're just dying off because there's nothing for them to eat.
 
Kristen
10:58
Right.

Natasha
11:04
So in a way, I feel lucky, if I am allowed to say that, that there's not really a downside to blocking her2. Whereas, I know, and you can speak to this Kristen, like women who have to be on tamoxifen, it can be a challenge. And we know that the women who are prescribed it, not many, not many women, manage the five or ten years.

Kristen
11:29
Right. And so it was explained to me that tamoxifen is for premenopausal. And that the AI's or aromatase Inhibitors. And I don't know if tamoxifen was one or not, but I got the impression that those are postmenopausal. And for the one that I take is Arimidex.

Natasha
11:45
Okay.

Kristen
11:47
And it's true. I have to say that, I know I have some of the effects there but it's not nearly as bad as what a lot of women get. A lot of women get seriously, debilitating, emotional issues, cognitive issues. The bone pain isn't great. I have that. I know I have some cognitive issues too still.  I just I don't think of things as quickly and I can't get words to come to me. I don't know if that's leftover chemo brain, you know, or,

Natasha
12:17
Well, it's really interesting you say that because I have been noticing that in the past two or three months like the word gets there, eventually. You know, I was a little worried, I was like, "Oh I've got early onset dementia."  Like, no, probably not. Because I eventually find the word, but it takes a little bit longer than I want it to, but I am also, you know, I mean I will be 60 next year. So it's hard to.

Kristen
12:41
You will? Stop it.

Natasha
12:43
I know it's weird. I know it's crazy. But you know another reason that I think, and her2 positive can be much more aggressive than the estrogen progesterone positive, but I think, for me, one of the fears would be if I was on the hormone blocker pill for a number of years. What if I lose my health insurance?

Kristen
13:05
Right.

Natasha
13:06
Whereas you know, I mean I am not planning on losing health insurance, but I have a fantasy of doing another Doctors Without Borders thing, maybe in a year or so. 

Kristen
13:06
Sure. 

Natasha
13:06
Which would require leaving my current job. Now, you know, when you work with Doctors Without Borders, they give you insurance, and they cover you a little bit when you get back, but not forever.

Kristen
13:25
Right.

Natasha
13:28
You know, and then you have got that whole like pre-existing condition nonsense to deal with.

Kristen
13:33
Right. That's a whole new world thinking about that.

Natasha
13:36
Yeah.

Kristen
13:36
I look at Healthcare in a whole different light.

Natasha
13:39
Yeah. No me too. No, it was really interesting. Actually, this past week at work, I had a, I have to be careful not to bust his identity too much, but a lovely new patient with an unfortunate stage 4, and obviously, it's not breast, well, not obviously, but it's not breasted cancer. 

Kristen
13:44
Right.

Natasha
13:58
And very active, he's been a mountaineer for many, many years, and he was starting to feel some neuropathy only after one treatment. So I went and talked to the nurse practitioners who run the infusion center and I said to them, "Look this, this guy needs cryotherapy and talk about quality of life, mountaineering is his thing and if he can't walk properly, and he's scheduled for 8 treatments, his life is going to be ruined". And this is County Hospital, you know, it's only Medicare, Medical, and they said, "We don't do that here".

Kristen
14:36
Ah. 

Natasha
14:36
And I was just horrified and I said, "How much is ice?" Like really.

Kristen
14:44
Right? I'll send him, what's his address? I'll send him my mittens.

Natasha
14:46
Yeah, I was going to give him mine. Yeah, and she said, "Well he has to do it all himself and nobody can help. And I said, "Wait a minute." And then I started to think about it because you know, as I have mentioned, my clinic office is in the infusion center. I have never seen any women in that infusion center with Cold caps. And it's the curse of poverty again. And it just, it really, you know, it went back to how unbelievably fortunate I feel to have got the treatment at UCSF that I did.

Kristen
15:22
Yeah.

Natasha
15:23
And if your nurses aren't bringing it up to you at your appointments, you don't know that you could... You know, I mean I didn't pay for the hair thing all by myself, like my family chipped in to help me do it. You know if somebody doesn't explain what options you have to help with quality of life and side effects, you don't know.

Kristen
15:34
No. 

Natasha
15:34
Unless you go down every Google rabbit hole there is.

Kristen
15:45
Right, but how's work been? Have you found there's any triggers? Have you found like anything that has been super emotional for you?

Natasha
15:57
So I have caught myself a few times. I had a, I mean, I, I like almost all of my patients, but I had a lovely woman new patient about two and a bit weeks ago, with unfortunately a pancreatic cancer, which anybody who knows anything about cancer knows that's not a good diagnosis. She's also young. She's in her early 40s. She's doing it as a single woman, you know, really relying on a female friends community. And there was something about her that reminded me of me. And then I do find myself occasionally over identifying, but just internally. Like, I have been very careful about, not externalizing it. But a patient last week who was talking about how all food tasted the same, and he didn't want to eat it, and I am sitting there nodding like a

Kristen
16:52
Bobblehead? <laugh>

Natasha
16:55
A bobblehead. I absolutely know. And it's I think in the, all the months since I have been back at work, I have only disclosed a couple of times. One was a, was actually hilarious, was a patient who walked in, she was like, "God, you're skinny. What cancer do you have?" <laugh> I'm like, "Funny you should mention that." You know, and then another patient really talking about neuropathy and the patient I mentioned earlier was just like, no, you need to, they get some ice on those hands and feet when you're getting your chemo. Because, yeah. So, but no it, I mean, it has been strange. Although I finished chemo in June, going in for the hormone blocker every three weeks, which is what I was doing for chemo. Often sitting in the same chairs that I sat in, when I was going through chemo. It's a little, it's a little triggering going back there all the time. So yeah, the thought of working just in the breast cancer clinic was like, what was I thinking?

Kristen
17:55
Do you ever leave there and expect to feel some of the same way that you felt after chemo?

Natasha
18:01
Yes. Yeah, yeah.And  I often have nausea even just sitting there.

Kristen
18:05
I can imagine that it's a little psychosomatic with that.

Natasha
18:09
And it's the same nurses who gave me the chemo. Yeah.

Kristen
18:15
Whole new level. So you're talking about you have gained a little bit of weight. And I, I don't want to trigger anything but like how do you feel your healing both physically and emotionally. I think that one of the last times, maybe a couple times ago that we talked you were talking about going and seeing an oncology…

Natasha
18:38
Oh that's right. The psycho oncologist or something.

Kristen
18:41
Yeah, when I texted you, I think I call them the onco shrink.

Natasha
18:44
Right, the onco shrink. So I did. So, I forget when I saw the onco shrink, maybe it was a couple of weeks ago. You know and I said to her, "Like, I could have used you eight months ago. Like, it feels a little strange coming in at this point"> But they were just so backed up. She couldn't see me any sooner. So, it didn't feel like I was setting up a therapeutic relationship with her because she doesn't want to talk about my divorce and my struggles with new relationships. And like, that's not what she's there for. But I think it could have been helpful from the beginning. When I was seeing a therapist at the beginning, sort of to help me pick myself up from the divorce and the early diagnosis. But she was very clear at the beginning, and maybe she had some of her own, you know, issues that were little similar. But she did basically say, "I am not comfortable with having a client who's going through cancer". Which was very honest. It was a little sad but I you know, I had to respect that and, but it's also, it's you know, it's outrageously expensive. It's really hard to.

Kristen
19:53
It's hard. Like yeah, it's really hard to find somebody and especially after the pandemic to find somebody who's available like within a month or two or four. Right?

Natasha
20:04
Yeah. And the whole Zoom therapy thing didn't quite work for me. No.

Kristen
20:08
But so physically, you're gaining some weight.

Natasha
20:10
I am gaining some weight. I am still, I think I am getting close to between 85 and 90 percent of myself. I am still more tired. You know, last night was, I am about to sound like a baby. It wasn't really cold but it was San Francisco cold, and I could not get the house warm. And I just went to bed at about half past seven, and lay in bed with the pets and listened to the radio. And, you know, I probably wouldn't have done that a year or so ago, but there's also a way of giving myself permission to really luxuriate in some self-care.

Kristen
20:46
Well, it's hibernation season too.

Natasha
20:47
Yeah. No, absolutely. You know, it was 43 degrees, which is cold for San Francisco.

Kristen
20:52
Oh yeah.

Natasha
20:53
You know, and I'm in a big drafty Victorian that I just could not get the heat above 60 degrees. I was like, this is ludicrous.

Kristen
21:00
Yeah. 

Natasha
21:00
Yeah, and that's sort of the physical side. I think it emotionally, I don't know if I will ever wake up one day and the whole thing will hit me and I will like have to go. I mean, I feel pretty pragmatic about the whole thing in a way. And there's definitely been a little bit of, you know, I think I have talked about this, a kind of, like a sort of a medical curiosity. I have gone through the regiments that I see my patients go through. 

Kristen
21:25
Right.

Natasha
21:30
I've taken a lot of the drugs that I have prescribed to other people and now I know, I kind of know that Zofran doesn't really work for chemo or definitely didn't work for me. And so if I myself really pushing patients to advocate for themselves around symptom management. It's like, you do not have to put up with X, Y and Z. Like, nausea, don't accept that you're puking and feeling like crap the whole time. Like there are, there's other drugs.

Kristen
21:58
Right.

Natasha
22:01
And really a lot of people approach chemo understandably expecting it to be not a walk in the park, but it doesn't have to be an out-and-out nightmare. You know if there's a message to people out there in podcast world, really advocate for yourself around symptom management when you're going through chemo. You know, it's not easy but it doesn't have to be horrible.

Kristen
22:27
Okay. So on the personal front, is your divorce final?

Natasha
22:31
It is. It was finalized on Halloween.

Kristen
22:34
Okay. Oh. <laugh>

Natasha
22:35
I know, which is such a perfect date. I have paid my ex off for the house. So it's now 100% mine, which is a little scary because I am not a handy person at all. So things, <laugh> 

Kristen
22:49
So when things break they stay broken? <laugh>

Natasha
22:49
You know I like the sink was blocked in one of the upstairs bathrooms and I got some Mr. Plumber, or Drano or whatever it's called, poured it down, didn't fix it. I was like, "Guess, I"ll just have to sell the house, then. That's it". <laugh>

Kristen
23:07
<laugh> I've got a bum drain, so.

Natasha
23:07
I know, but no, it's nice. I mean like I was saying before we really started recording, my roommate is going to be moving out at the end of December, and I am looking forward to having the house to myself for a while. I mean, I will need another housemate but just having it to myself and making some changes and the plan,  I get a little tiny bit of time off over the holidays. So to, you know, I want to do a like a decluttering. I have lived in the house for 25 years, so stuff accumulates. Yeah. It's interesting. I have a couple of drawers in my bedroom that have my mittens and all the beanies that I thought I was going to wear before I decided to do the cold caps. And, you know, that kind of frumpy ugly gown they gave me through radiation and I feel strangely attached to them.

Kristen
24:00
I know, so weird.

Natasha
24:00
Yeah, it was interesting. I was talking to the same friend that I was talking to just before you and I got on tonight. She didn't realize that I still had my port, and I was like, "Yeah, I, I still have the port". And that's probably end of March the port will come out, and more things are just being taken away that were very much identified with cancer, with my treatment. And I ran across the other day on my bookshelf the Susan Love. Is it Susan Love?  Somebody Love, breast cancers something book. The one that everybody  has. Yeah and I didn't read it. I barely looked at it, I must confess. So, if anybody out there wants it, let me know, you can have it. And I have got another one called something like, Just Get Me Through This, which was actually a more useful book.

Kristen
24:48
Oh good, good. 

Natasha
24:48
Yeah. And in a way, what I have loved about doing this podcast is every now and then I will pick an episode and I will listen to it. And it's almost like my own personal journey and my journal and it just reminds me how far I have come.

Kristen
25:06
Yes. Yes and you have. I know I mean you're a different person.

Natasha
25:12
Yeah I was listening to the episode just before my surgery. I was such a wreck before surgery and I sailed through it there was nothing to it. It's been a funny experience.

Kristen
25:23
Okay, I am going to confess. You're going to be like, girl. I had no idea you were this girl, this messed up. I saved every hospital bracelet.

Natasha
25:37
Oh wow.

Kristen
25:38
From the very first chemo from the very first everything. I mean I have one from the other day when I had the ultrasound done, and I am still convinced, I am going to make flowers out of them. I am going to, but I was going to make flowers and put a thing in the middle. And I don't know why. It's not like it was a great time but it really takes, it's really a badge of honor.

Natasha
25:57
Yeah.

Kristen
25:58
And it's almost like I imagine being in the military or even the stuff that you do, you know, in Malawi, going through and it's hell and it's traumatic and why would you want to see those things? Right? But I don't know, I just it's like I have gone back and listened and I think we said something in one of the later podcasts, later in season one, I was like oh my gosh I was like it's like, "I have got this, like there's a journey, and I am going to be fine and, blah,blah,blah". And I was like how annoying were you? You know?

Natasha
26:35
<laugh>

Kristen
26:37
Like how annoying and naive? But you know what, at the same time I think, like I had to tell myself that, so I could get through it.

Natasha
26:47
So I was just having a strange thought and I will put you on the spot first and then I will do my confession. If somebody said, you can go back three years and you don't have to have cancer.

Kristen
27:03
Okay.

Natasha
27:04
Would you choose not to have it?

Kristen
27:06
That's really tough. Oh, you know, I wouldn't know you. I wouldn't, you know what I mean? It's not a gift. You are a gift.  But, cancer is not a gift.

Natasha
27:19
Right. And I hate, I mean, I hate to take us into the Pollyanna realm because neither of us, well, you've been accused of being a little more Pollyanna than I have, but I feel like it's opened, and I am about to sound really Californian, and I am from a small village in the north of England, so forgive me, but I feel like it's opened my heart in a way that I am thankful for. And yes, there was trauma, and yes, it's going to be with me forever and I will always be terrified, but there's a way that it's made me softer, I think.

Kristen
27:56
Yes.I think it's so interesting how something can make you softer and stronger,

Natasha
28:01
Yeah.

Kristen
28:01
and tougher at the same time. Right?

Natasha
28:04
Yeah. Yeah. And we have talked about like the challenges of doing this alone. I mean, as a single woman and other people give me a lot of credit for it, that I don't often take. Cause I'm like, no, it was fine. But you and I are badass women, like.

Kristen
28:23
Right? Right?

Natasha
28:24
Yeah. 

Kristen
28:24
I was on this Retreat. It was a Meditation Retreat. And there were some people from Australia that were there, that were the mentors of my meditation teacher. And it was wonderful. But one of the people who was there has, I would listen to his music when I would go to chemo, and he was there in person playing these songs. 

Natasha
28:28
Oh wow.
 
Kristen
28:28
Right? And I went up to him. And I said "Mareya, I just have to tell you," like and I got tears in my eyes. I said, "I hadn't met you but every day when I went to chemo like every week I had a playlist that gave me courage to go". And I said, "I am so thankful for those and to have you here playing them when I am recovered from cancer. Like you were with me through this journey and thank you for healing me with your songs". And he like kind of looked down, and he said, "You've got so much courage". And I skirted the compliment because I was so uncomfortable with someone who I was, think so much of as a person, as a musician, as a healer. I was like, how could this person who makes such a difference in so many people's lives, you're telling me, I had so much courage. And I thought about it, and I was like, "Cause you do".

Natasha
30:02
Yeah.
  
Kristen
30:02
To answer your question, now that I am on the kind of other side and knowing that Eva I picking up the mic or the zoom just so that I didn't have to tell my story to my friends and family over and over. And then finding out it helped people, I would want those people to still be helped. 

Natasha
30:29
Yeah. I mean I remember how much finding Season 1 of the podcast, your story, how much it helped me. I mean, to sort of go back to, what was it almost a year ago? My story of having the two-week Dark Night of the Soul, when I am waiting to find out what stage I am, spending the weekend in bed Googling breast cancer podcasts and finding your story and listening to all the episodes in one sitting. I mean, I didn't stop. So yeah, I mean I hope this has been as useful to other people as you were to me.

Eva
31:07
Thank you for listening to Breast Cancer Stories. To continue telling this story and helping others, we need your help. All podcasts require resources, and we have a team of people who produce it. There's costs involved and it takes time.

Kristen
31:26
If you believe in what we're doing and have the means to support the show, you can make a one-time donation or you can set up a recurring donation in any amount through the PayPal link on our website at breastcancerstoriespodcast.com/donate. 

Eva
31:32
To get the Key takeaways from each episode, links to anything we have talked about and promo codes or give-aways from our partners, sign up for our email newsletter. 

Kristen
31:43
You will get notes and thoughts from me related to each episode and links to the most useful resources for all the breast cancer things. So if you have chemo brain, you will be able to just go read your email or find anything we talked about on the podcast without having to remember it.

Eva
32:04
The link to sign up is in your show notes and on the newsletter page of breastcancerstoriespodcast.com.
 
Kristen
32:06
We promise not to annoy you with too many emails.

Eva
32:14
Thanks for listening to Breast Cancer Stories. If you're facing a breast cancer diagnosis and you want to tell your story on the podcast, send an email to hello@theaxis.io. I am Eva Sheie, your host and executive producer. Production support for the show comes from Mary Ellen Clarkson and our engineer is Daniel Croeser. Breast Cancer Stories is a production of The Axis