168. Real Housewives of Pennsylvania (with Eric Praniewicz)

Snarky Opener (0:00)

Rob Loveless

Honestly, let's talk about the husband…because I'm thirsty.

 

Episode Introduction (0:24)

Rob Loveless

Hello, my LGBTQuties, and welcome back to another episode of A Jaded Gay. I'm Rob Loveless and, today, I am a non-jaded gay because the holidays are right around the corner.

 

I have been working hard to get ahead for 2026 to start planning out the episodes.

 

And I just feel like I'm getting in a place where I'm able to plan ahead a little bit more and breathe a little easier, so I'm not trying to just like, run wild, trying to release episodes each week, and feeling like I'm behind.

 

So yeah, definitely ready for a holiday break.

 

The Real Housewives (0:52)

Rob Loveless

And as we're approaching the holidays, I did want to end the year on a lighter note. So obviously, our previous episode was quite a bit heavier. We were talking about politics.

 

Some of it was inspiring. Some of it's, you know, a little dreadful just because of the state of the world we live in. So, I didn't want to end 2025 on that note.

 

So, I thought, as a little holiday treat to all the listeners, I would release a bonus episode from the Patreon as the final episode of 2025.

 

And I thought a fun, lighter one to end the year on would be talking all things Housewives with my good friend Eric.

 

After all, it seems like there is a faction of gay men who are obsessed with Real Housewives, and a lot of us do have our own obsessions with pop culture in general.

 

So, we'll be getting into the bonus episode shortly, but before we do, you know the drill. Let's pull our tarot card.

 

Tarot (1:41)

Rob Loveless

So, for this episode, we drew The Magician, which is a Major Arcana card. As you'll remember, Major Arcana cards signify big life changes or lessons we need to learn.

 

Now, The Magician is the second card in the Major Arcana following The Fool, but it's the first card with an assigned number of one. And in numerology, one is tied to the beginning or the individual.

 

So, this is signifying the start of a new chapter. Also, traditional depictions of this card show a representation of all the elements.

 

So, we get a blend of them all, plus masculine and feminine energies. However, The Magician is holding a wand up, and there's an infinity sign over his head, which represents that our energy is always flowing.

 

So, this card leans heavily into that masculine energy, and it's very action-oriented. And you'll remember Wands, it's tied to passion, creativity, and sometimes sexuality.

 

And when we draw The Magician, it's telling us that we have everything we need to create the outcomes we desire.

 

And we need to take inspired action that's intentional and rooted in logic and passion so we can make our dreams a reality.

 

And just like The Magician has all the elements at his fingertips, we must also remember to keep those ingredients in balance.

 

Wands our passion and creativity, Swords our communication, Cups our emotions, and Pentacles our hard work and groundedness.

 

And when we keep that all in balance, we are more powerful than we know and can achieve our dreams. And with that in mind, here's the episode, which originally ran on Patreon in March of this year.

 

Bonus Episode Introduction (3:08)

Rob Loveless

Hello, my LGBTQuties, and welcome to your March bonus episode. I am super excited because, as you can tell from the episode description, we have a very special guest here, my friend Eric.

 

You might remember him from about two years ago now. We had an episode titled Love in the Third Degree, talking all about polyamorous relationships.

 

And in that you were privy to a little Real Housewives ASMR. We did a little impromptu ASMR there, and it was no secret that we love all things Housewives.

 

So, I thought, what better way to do a March bonus episode than talk about all things Housewives? So, Eric, thank you so much for joining.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yes, thank you for having me. I'm so excited. This is awesome.

 

Rob Loveless

I know I'm really excited too.

 

Actually, funny enough, I've been transcribing some older episodes, and I've recently transcribed the episode we did back in I think it came out March or April 2023, and did the blog post.

 

So, the blog will be coming out the next couple months, but it was fun re-listening to that. And, you know, our little references here and there of, you know, Kim and the husband and this and that.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh my god, I still, I mean, I think anybody who knows that scene still references it like weekly, if not daily. I know I do.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yeah, I know I like and I hear it across podcasts too, because I listened to a true crime podcast and they referenced T Kyle, who did the ASMR of that Beverly Hills fight.

 

And then I was just listening to Legends Only who they it's T Kyle and Bradley Stern, who they do, you know, all pop culture. And they were talking about the new Lady Gaga album, which is so good.

 

But they even referenced her song, The Beast in it, which they're like, oh, it was clearly an homage to beast. So, it just, it lives on.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I love those memes so much. Any of the, any of the Beast memes, I will share instantly with everybody I know.

 

Rob Loveless

I know anytime I see the word beast, I can only hear it like whispered, like in the ASMR.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I literally followed up with how dare you every single time, without fail.

 

Getting into Real Housewives (4:57)

Rob Loveless

Oh my gosh, classic. Well, I guess before we get too into the niche references, I should start off by asking, so like, tell us about your history with Housewives.

 

When did you get into it? How did you get into it? What drew you to it?

 

Eric Praniewicz

So, I, God, I first got into Housewives, and I'm like, not, I'm not. I'm not, like a deep, deep, deep Housewives lore person. I do not follow all the franchises as much as I would love to.

 

That would be like a full-time job, especially catching up. But I did first start loving Housewives when I was probably like early teens, maybe like 12, 13, 14, something like that.

 

So, it has been a while. I started with Jersey because my mother is a Jersey Italian lady, and she was turned onto it by one of her sisters. She has five sisters, so big, loud family.

 

It's basically like, how you see on TV is, like, that's a family function for me. Like, that's not out of the ordinary. I'm just watching this. Like, okay, yeah.

 

Like, and, but yeah, so. So, my mom, my mother, and I would watch it together a lot. You know, I'm talking like OG like, you know, Theresa, Danielle...

 

Rob Loveless

Love and light, Danielle.

 

Eric Praniewicz

The table flipping scene. I remember seeing that on TV, like, for the first time, like what? I was blown away.

 

Rob Loveless

"Clearly it was not just name change and arrest. Was it drugs? Engaged 19 times? You stupid fucking bitch. You came to my house and fucked some guy."

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, I will never get over that. I actually want to re watch those early seasons and, like, provide some commentary on them, because it I have not watched those since then, like, since I was a child.

 

So, it'd be really, I think it'd be really, really interesting to go back and watch them as an adult, and maybe either, like, not necessarily understand them a little bit more.

 

I mean, maybe understand a little bit more because, you know, I'm a messy bitch, but, but, yeah, no, I think it would be really cool.

 

And then, after Jersey, I've always watched Beverly Hills on and off throughout the years.

 

I didn't really get into a lot of other franchises until probably the last like five years or so, but I have watched a good bit of Atlanta.

 

I honestly the thing about Atlanta, I love watching Atlanta, but I would always watch it when I drink, and I would be really into it in the moment, and then the next day, I would have to re watch the episode again, it'd be like I don't remember anything that happened, but Atlanta always, always a great time.

 

I Phaedra Parks will always live on in my heart forever. Um, love. Beverly Hills. My favorite is Salt Lake City, though.

 

Rob Loveless

Yes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

And I'm all caught up on Salt Lake. I'm all caught up on Beverly Hills. I can talk endlessly about those two right now. The others. I've got some catch up work to do. I've got some catch up.

 

I really want to watch Potomac. Everybody is always telling me to get into Miami. I have seen, I have watched Miami on and off, but nothing recent. Yeah.

 

Rob Loveless

Nice. I actually, I didn't realize that your mom was North Jersey Italian, and it makes sense why we get along. So, it's my mom's family as well.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Union City born and raised.

 

Rob Loveless

Okay, okay, yeah, my mom is from like, near, like, the Wayne area. And actually, she has, I don't know if I told you, she has a couple connections to the housewives.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Really?

 

Rob Loveless

So, she went to school with Camille Grammar, like they were in like, high school together. She was a grade behind my mom. And I think her name was like Donnatucci, or Donnatachi there, back then.

 

And then she also, so my mom didn't know this. My aunt told me about it, her sister. Apparently, we are loosely related to Kim G, I think from Jersey.

 

Which one, which one is the one that was friends with the Manzos, like her son was friends with the Manzos. It's either Kim D or Kim G, whichever one didn't own Posche.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I don't want to say one or the other, because if I'm wrong, I'm gonna get roasted for it.

 

Rob Loveless

I think, well, I only have like two subscribers. But no, I think Kim D owns, uh, Posche, and then Kim G was the friend.

 

But, yeah, apparently, and I don't know this is just all hearsay, apparently, like, one of my grandfather's cousins married into, like, Kim G's family way back when.

 

So, like, distantly, somehow our family lines cross. I don't know. I wasn't born in Jersey, just all my extended family.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Okay, yeah.

 

Rob Loveless

But interesting, yeah, with Housewives, so I kind of got into some in a different way.

 

So, I'd always heard about Housewives, and I would see, like, I knew there was New Jersey and New York and Beverly Hills, but I kind of thought it was like an anthology.

 

Like one season would be one city, one season would be the other. So then in 2018 I, like, splurged and got Hulu because I didn't have it at the time, and I saw that Real Housewives was on there.

 

So, I'm, like, all right, I guess I'll get into it. But I want to, like, start at the beginning. So, I'll start with the first franchise and start with that one.

 

And then I realized how many there were, and I went back to, like, 2006. So, I started with the OC. Watched all the OC. Then after that, I moved on to New York.

 

After New York, I started with Atlanta, but that one, I had a little trouble getting into, like, the first two seasons, and I fell off so and I switched to Jersey because I was just really excited for Jersey.

 

And then, I think after Jersey was Beverly Hills. And then, so I should probably give a timeline too. Like, okay, I watched OC from July to, like December 2018 got all caught up.

 

Then, like January, 2019 till May was New York. Started Atlanta, then switched to Jersey. Jersey, I finished around November 2019 switched to Beverly Hills.

 

I did not have much of a social life and the dating scene was very sad then, so I was just living vicariously through these women with money.

 

And then I, by 2019 I watched Beverly Hills into, like, the pandemic, and then I got caught up, and it was like getting to Potomac, and then, like, Salt Lake City had just come out, okay, so.

 

And I kept going back and forth to Atlanta. So, I got up to 2015 and then I just fell off completely with it. But really, you mentioned Phaedra Parks.

 

Like seeing her in the Real Housewives Ultimate Girls Trip weekend, like is what kind of revived me to, like, want to go back and watch more of Atlanta. Yeah, just, she cracks me up.

 

Eric Praniewicz

So Ultimate Girls Trip Weekend the Berserkshers. If anybody who's anybody who's not into Housewives, and they want to know where to start, I tell them to start with that.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Because it's a little, it's a little taste of everything. It's, it's just fun. It's, it's, it's berserk, as as the name suggests. You know, there's, there's a lot of stupid shit that happens, but it's a lot of fun.

 

I think it's one of the most fun seasons that they've had. I really do, definitely do. Also, New York, I've watched New York. I don't know why I skipped that one.

 

I feel, I feel like I need to repent for not saying that. I've seen Sonia Morgan live. I've seen LuAnn de Lesseps live.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh, my God.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I got photos and videos. Sonia was trashed when she got out onto the stage. It was, the entire show was just Sonja, just telling stories that she probably should not be allowed.

 

She's probably signed an NDA somewhere saying you can't tell anybody about this.

 

Here she's blabbing on the stage of the city winery like a bottle of whatever the fuck in, this song is all about how she fucked to Kennedy or something like that.

 

Rob Loveless

And raised millions for the LGBTQ community.

 

Eric Praniewicz

It was, it was so much fun, though. Oh my god. It was a blast. And Luanne, you know, she did her Countess Cabaret. That was a wonderful show.

 

That was, that was very well put together. She had, she looked like she had so much fun with it. You know, they were both incredibly engaging with the audience, and just very, very sweet all around.

 

And I would, I would see any of them live.

 

Rob Loveless

See it's interesting because LuAnn, it's not that I ever disliked her, but she was never like my go to in New York when I watched it.

 

And I just feel like in the past few years, she's had this, like, major renaissance where, like, it was kind of after New York fell off a little bit. Like she got in, like her cabaret.

 

I mean, she's been doing cabaret for a while, but that's when I know it's more like the cabaret shows. She's gone viral with her, you know, cameos.

 

She did the, what was it? What was that lake? The Crappy Lake with Sonja, like, that was hilarious. Like, I just feel like she's gotten like, post Housewives.

 

I just love her more than like, when she was on it. I mean, she had great moments on Housewives.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I think there was a point when she was on Housewives, where she she sort of just like, it said, Fuck it.

 

Like, fuck it all. And then, like, from then on, like, like, the whole like, be cool about it. Like, don't be all uncool.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh my God. Yeah, she just stopped, like, taking herself so seriously, because when she started out, she was very much like, it's either Mrs. de Lesseps or Countess de Lesseps, but never Luanne to the drive.

 

And then she just kind of, like, let down her hair a little bit. She's like, all right, I'm on a reality show. Let's have fun.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, that's, that's that, like, gradual, sort of just like, not giving a fuck anymore. Like, as as Luann started to have more fun. Like, I feel like we all started to have more fun with her, for sure, yeah.

 

Rob Loveless

And then, like, her trajectory with that...

 

Countess LuAnn

I hope you keep on serving cunt. Okay.

 

Rob Loveless

...video. And then like, Madonna, like, sampled it, and like, it was just, it's wild, like, how that has, like, moved on in viral fame. I can't even. Ugh, love her.

 

Favorite Franchises & Housewives Dynamics (14:18)

Rob Loveless

So, with all of that, like, the franchises you've watched, out of all them, what would you say is your favorite franchise? And maybe then, like, your favorite housewife.

 

Eric Praniewicz

That's very tough. Right now, as they currently stand, Salt Lake is my number one right now.

 

I, I love the ladies on it. I there's, there's a good balance of, like, absolutely ridiculousness, a little bit of out of touchness, of course, because, you know, they're, they're rich, affluent women.

 

But also, like, there's a little bit of down to earthness with the Salt Lake ladies, I feel like.

 

Not, obviously, not always, but they're, you know, they're, they fight over crazy shit, and they, you know, there are so many moments when it's just absolutely absurd, but they also, like, are still able to, like, talk to one another.

 

I feel like in a way that maybe some of the ladies on other franchises, like, I'm gonna throw Dorit out there as an example.

 

Like Beverly, I feel like it's what Beverly Hills like was at one point. You know what I mean? I feel like now, I don't know it's... I feel like Beverly Hills has lost his luster a little bit.

 

Rob Loveless

I get what you're saying. I feel like Salt Lake has become my favorite because I remember, yeah, and it's just so campy and unhinged. It's so entertaining, like they know what they're doing.

 

And it doesn't feel like inauthentic. It feels natural, if that makes sense.

 

Like, because when I first saw the first season of Salt Lake City, it had already been out, so I, like, was watching and the second season was getting ready to come out, and I watched the first season, and I actually didn't really love it at first.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah.

 

Rob Loveless

Like, this seems kind of weird, like, it didn't feel like a typical franchise. But by the time season two came around, I'm like, this is amazing.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yes.

 

Rob Loveless

And it just, it lands differently.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah. Season one was kind of a slow burn, I will say. But yeah, I don't know.

 

Like, I feel like, like, Beverly Hills and New York, like there's sometimes, like, the social climbing aspect of it that takes over a little bit too hard and like, sometimes they're not, and this isn't like all cast members or anything, or like all episodes, you know, they're still a great show.

 

But yeah, I don't know. I just feel like there's some of that in Salt Lake, but it's not like it doesn't take front and center all the time.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

And that's I like that about it. I think that everybody's kind of looking for that, a little bit. Like everybody wants more relatability. And I think the Salt Lake ladies really have that.

 

Rob Loveless

Definitely. And what you're saying with relatability. Like Angie K was on an episode of Las Culturistas, and I feel like with her, it's like. I know she's hilarious.

 

Like, I feel like, what you see is what you get. Like, she's like, authentically herself, like she's not putting on a show on TV. That's who she is. So, I think it makes it more fun and entertaining.

 

Because I think you can always tell those people who come on and take themselves too seriously when, like, the point of is to have fun. You know?

 

Eric Praniewicz

Absolutely. I will literally, Angie...Angie K will post something, and I will be the first comment. And that comment will be mommy. She's liked a few of them, and I'm like, Oh, my God.

 

Rob Loveless

Noticed.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, I'm famous.

 

Rob Loveless

Like, and she has had so many great TV moments and lines. Like, obviously this season with the scroll, the the comment was that, like she said I looked like a trampoline with eyes.

 

I meant it as a compliment. Your skin's very tight.

 

Eric Praniewicz

She always has something to come back with every single time.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yeah, oh yeah. And like, it's never really mean. Like, she's not afraid to throw a little shade, but she's not like...well, I don't know. I guess there's been some things.

 

Eric Praniewicz

The worst thing, I think, is when she said that Britani, Britani's hair looked pornish, and that it was the...

 

Rob Loveless

High body count hair.

 

Eric Praniewicz

...I was, I was laughing at that so much. I was like, this is ridiculous. And like, you did take it too far, but like, I'm still laughing.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. Sir, she's slut shaming. Security, take her out.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, my God, that was ridiculous. I feel like, if anybody needs to reign in it a little bit sometimes it's Meredith.

 

But also, like, yes, those moments are equally memorable. Like, even when she is like, way over the top with it, I'm like, Yeah, keep, keep it up.

 

Rob Loveless

I know. Well, that's the thing. Like, when I first watched the show, Meredith was my favorite, and then around season two, I really started liking Lisa, and I still think Lisa is my favorite.

 

And I know she's wrong, like, sometimes, but like, she's like, I'll die on a hill for her, she's just hilarious to me. She but as it's kind of...oh, I know. And, like, just her Lisa-isms, like, oh, my God, I love that.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Hi, baby gorgeous.

 

Rob Loveless

Hi, baby, gorgeous. What's the other one she always...oh, I love the thing. Like, it's okay if you don't like me. I love myself enough for the both of us.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yes.

 

Rob Loveless

But I don't know. As it went on, like Meredith, I feel like she's starting to take it too seriously now, and like it just doesn't feel like her personality anymore.

 

But she did give us some good moments this season, like when she went after Britani in the sprinter van. You are vile. I invited you into my home.

 

Eric Praniewicz

You are disgusting.

 

Rob Loveless

And then Mary's in the background. Get her, Meredith.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, okay, Mary, let's talk about Mary.

 

Rob Loveless

Yes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Full 180 with her.

 

Rob Loveless

I know.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh my God, I, I was not sure. For the longest time, I was like, why is she here?

 

And it's not that like, she you know, she still, like, you know, had some memorable quotes, and she would say some things that were funny, but like, she also was just like, I don't know she was.

 

Now, I feel like I understand her a little bit more. I could probably go back and watch those seasons and understand, like, why she did things that she did or said things that she said.

 

But at the time, I was like, What? What is wrong with you? Like, I've, I don't know. Like, you're taking this a little bit too far, a little bit too seriously.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Like, I don't know. Like, I just thought that she was always, like, a little bit too mean sometimes.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, and she was very quirky. Like, the things that came out of her mouth, you're like what are you talking about?

 

Like, well, you smelled like hospital. She was, she missed, it made me think my aunt who, like, lost her leg in the hospital, or something like that. It's like, what are you talking about?

 

Eric Praniewicz

Heather was like, do you think I look inbred? And she's like...

 

Rob Loveless

I do, yes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

But now, I, I love Mary. Like, I see Mary.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I honestly, I don't think it was until she came back. What was it last season as, like, a friend of and then this year, this season, she's, like, an actual housewife.

 

When she came back, that's when I started liking her a little bit more, because, like, like I said at first, I'm like, what is she talking about? Like, it's weird.

 

But and then, actually funny enough, so my sister watches housewives as it's on TV. She's never followed it religiously. But last year, she's like, she was over. She's like, let's watch some housewives.

 

I'm like, well, how about we start at like, the beginning of one that you haven't seen? So, we started with started with Salt Lake City and going back and re watching it.

 

So now this would have been when season four was currently out, but re watching it from the beginning, like, it lands differently.

 

I'm like, knowing who the housewives are, I'm like, okay, wait, this is actually hilarious now. Because, like, the first season you're watching, like, what is going on with these women?

 

Even Mary's stuff that she was saying, like, was cracking me up this time around where the first time I watched it, I'm like, who is she?

 

Eric Praniewicz

That's good to know. See now I really want to re watch them.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, it's, it's a lot of fun. But what, what do you think about? Okay, you brought them up, um, before. Britani, what did you think about her this season?

 

Eric Praniewicz

I love Britani. I'm also team Britani. She's, she's absolutely ridiculous. And there are so many times in which I wanted to be like, stop, stop talking. What are you doing right now?

 

Like you are absolutely digging yourself a grave with these ladies. But I, I can never get enough of Britani. I think she's absolutely over the top. She's, she's campy, she and she knows it.

 

She absolutely knows it. But I like that about her, like she does not take anything too seriously. She she's absolutely there to have fun. And like, yeah, maybe she was pulling focus for several moments. But I...

 

Rob Loveless

What about me, you guys?

 

Eric Praniewicz

I think she had to fight for them a little bit. I think, I think some of the other ladies were not taking her super seriously sometimes. I think they were, they were kind of ignoring her a little bit.

 

And you know, as the season went on, I kind of felt a little badly for her. But I will, I will always ride for her. I love an underdog, and I feel like she is that. I love her social media presence.

 

My absolute favorite videos of all time right now are her singing as she's just like walking through life, like singing Pink Pony Club from the start of a flight to the finish of a flight, when she's getting her bag and riding on the baggage carousel just by herself with her phone.

 

I mean, who who does that? Who else does that? I can't name another single person who does. I love her.

 

Rob Loveless

I know like I was telling my friends, because one of my friends is, like, catching up on this season, and I was saying to her, I was telling her about Britani, and I'm like, I can't stand Britani, but she makes for great TV.

 

Like she needs to be on it, though, like, and it's like a train wreck. You can't look away, you know, like, it's just so under, like, entertaining. You're like, what is gonna come out of her mouth next? And...

 

Eric Praniewicz

There are two castmates that I feel like I would be friends with in real life. One is Angie K.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

And one is Britani. Britani reminds me a lot of my best friend. She and I are both kind of unstable at times. We really take turns.

 

Like we pass the wand to one another for who's going to be unstable. And it's a wonderful little symbiotic relationship we have. And and I see a lot of both of us in Britani, honestly.

 

Rob Loveless

Did you know?

 

Eric Praniewicz

A lot of fun.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. Did you know? I saw this on Instagram, and I didn't realize. She was in an ABC Family movie, like a Christmas movie called The Mistletones with Tori Spelling.

 

And either Tia or Tamara Mowry. I can't remember which one was in it.

 

Eric Praniewicz

She's been, I think she's been on Broadway as well. I could be wrong about that, but I know that she's been like, a theater girly. Like she's been a movie girly. Like she's she, she's in the business.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, it's wild. Like, that trajectory there. I was not expecting, I know, right? She has a beautiful singing voice. She does actually, yeah, it just, I don't know.

 

I feel like she doesn't know how to, like, she makes things about her, everything about her, like, I mean, she literally goes, what about me, you guys? And it's like, it's not the right moment.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, absolutely is not. She has zero she's got to pick up the social cues better, for sure. Oh, yeah. I think I find it kind of endearing, though. I don't know. I don't know why.

 

I know that I probably shouldn't, but I do. I don't know. I just love it. It's like, she's like this. She's like, the Sonja Morgan of, yeah, like, and like, you gotta love that, you know, you have, you need a little wild card in there.

 

Housewives Casting Choices (24:39)

Rob Loveless

Yeah, see, I think it was, and I know you said you haven't gotten into Potomac yet, but I feel like what they did with Salt Lake this year is also what they did with Potomac, where it didn't work as well, is.

 

So obviously there was, you know, last season with Reality Von Tease, that all happened with Monica. It's kind of like a rebuilding year.

 

I feel like they brought too many additional women in beyond the core group. Like, if you're adding a housewife that's fine.

 

But they had Bronwyn, who was fine, and then they had Britani, and then wasn't there at least one or two other women.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, Meili, which we, like, never heard or saw from her again, much like Denise Richards after...

 

Rob Loveless

I know.

 

Eric Praniewicz

After like, two episodes, she was just like, gone. And then she, like, was at Meredith's bat mitzvah, I think, and then she was just gone again.

 

I think that, I think the producers were just like, all right, she's, she's not making the cut.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. We'll see, I feel like sometimes, when they do that, they throw too many people to see who sticks.

 

But it's like, why not just get one person see how they land instead of because then it kind of pulls the attention away.

 

And to your point, I think it was tough for Britani to get in this season, because the core group went through this whole big thing with Reality Von Tease.

 

So, and Heather is very protective of the group, which I really think is just her coping mechanism for bullying.

 

But it's uh, but, so they already brought in Bronwyn, and then they're bringing in Britani part time.

 

It just felt like a weird time for that, whereas maybe just have one woman to have the, like, more dedicated storyline for her, and having the group get to know them more than, like, the attention being divided among a few different people.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yea. It was, it was definitely a big experiment. And I don't think that everybody fully got, I mean, everybody, like, got their storylines, but like, there was a lot, I feel like that was kind of left on the table there.

 

For sure. I totally agree with that. I like Bronwyn as an addition. I like Britani as an addition. I do hope that Britani comes back. From what I've seen in rumors, she is. And Bronwyn too.

 

Rob Loveless

Okay.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Um, yeah. I literally, I forgot Meili existed, and I think everybody else did too.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, they definitely could easily reach at it. But, I mean, I think, I think they've gotten two solid cast mates out of it, which I'm... usually it does not happen.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. See, I would have reversed it. I would have had Britani be the housewife, because she brings all that chaotic energy.

 

And then have Bronwyn be the friend of because, like, she's fine. Like she has some interesting stuff, but I feel Britani, we could have seen more throughout the season.

 

But that's what happened with Potomac. They added... so they had two women leave last year, and then this season, they brought on one, they brought on a new woman, new woman.

 

And then they had like, two or three friends of the housewives who were all there.

 

And one of the friends of the housewives was a prominent friend for a couple seasons, then had a falling out with her friend, and then came back.

 

And it just seemed like there's these new women we're trying to know. They're not getting enough air time.

 

And then the one woman had just an awful storyline this year where she's not doing great things and like that became the focus of the season.

 

So, it was such a boring season because it was all about this woman and then trying to meet a few other people, you know?

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, that's a lot. That's a lot. That's, that's, that's too much. You can't do all that.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, exactly. But I need to, like, ease into getting to knowing them.

 

Eric Praniewicz

It has, at least for Salt Lake, it has left me really excited to see what is to come for next season. So, I'm looking forward to that.

 

Um, yeah, I lost my train of thought after that. That was pretty much it. It's it's left me excited. I'm not bored.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I know. I, that's the thing. Like, some of the seasons, I feel like, when you're watching, you're like, all right, this season can end. I'm bored.

 

But like, every Salt Lake City season, it's like, Wait, this is the season finale?

 

And this season too, how about let's go through our phones and find the meanest thing we said about someone and then say it at the table and we'll burn it.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, my God. I want to know what producer put that into Heather's ear. They need, both a raise and a klonopin.

 

Rob Loveless

Because, you know she didn't just come up with that. Right? Exactly. Like, I'm sorry, nobody, even a reality star, is not going to say, like, let's just casually do this.

 

Like, and, I mean, they all had the like, screenshots on their phone, so they knew ahead of time. So, like, they knew

 

Eric Praniewicz

They knew ahead of time, and they agreed to... I.

 

Rob Loveless

I know. I know.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Wow.

 

Rob Loveless

It was, Oh, my God. Angie's was so bad about Bronwyn, where she's, like, she's got one foot on the grave and one foot on a banana or something.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I saw that clip before seeing the episode, and like, yeah, I was not ready for the episode still. Like, I was so stressed going into it, just because I knew that that was going to come up.

 

And wow, I'm actually shocked that that went over as well as it did, but Lisa's blew up to the point that it did. I mean, I'm not surprised that Lisa's blew up to the point that it did, but damn.

 

Rob Loveless

I know. Well see, and it's so funny, because all the housewives were like, but Lisa see, like, we're all taking this in stride, and you're reacting to it.

 

But my thoughts on it. Obviously, I am a Lisa apologist, but I will say...

 

Eric Praniewicz

Let's hear it.

 

Rob Loveless

I am saying that. So, what Angie said about Bronwyn, obviously, was very heavy, but Bronwyn had previously talked about some of those things.

 

And for all the two Patreon listeners who are listening to this, who might not follow housewives, Bronwyn is married to somebody. Is he, like, 30 plus years older than or there's a big age difference.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Like twenty, high twenties, like 26 or 28. I think 20, yeah, yeah, something like that

 

Rob Loveless

Big age difference. She talked about how they met. She was working in finance, and she met him. They met through work, got married, all this and how people have perceived her as this and this.

 

While it may not be right, I feel like other people from the outside could look at that dynamic and hear a little bit about what Bronwyn had talked about, and make those assumptions about gold digger this or that.

 

So, what Angie said was, again, wrong, but like more so observational, that anybody, a stranger on the street, could hear that story and think that.

 

Whereas what Whitney did, and we didn't get into this because, but I Whitney is messy.

 

But what Whitney did was she's like, oh, well, I hear that Lisa and her husband do threesomes and this and that, whereas that's not, people wouldn't look at Lisa and John Barlow and think, oh, they probably do threesomes.

 

That's like, really inside, private stuff that, true or not, like is private to their relationship, that if they chose to talk about that or not.

 

So, it's like Whitney's really bringing up something sensitive, that people wouldn't look at them and expect that from. Not even them, anyone.

 

Like you wouldn't necessarily look at somebody and think that. So that was a lot more messy and shady, I thought, whereas with the Angie K's read on Bronwyn was more like anybody might think that just from seeing that.

 

Now, obviously Lisa them saying, yeah, obviously though like, Lisa saying the stuff about Angie K's husband, like, what if I said that Shawn did circle jerks?

 

Like that, obviously is taking it to a new extreme. I get she was trying to make an analogy.

 

But considering the context of the previous season where he was trying to deny the gay rumors, like, not the right analogy to use.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, no, absolutely not. But I understand what you're saying. It was definitely a lot more of like a surprise and more of like a low blow that, like, I mean, there every single one of those texts was low blows.

 

But, um, yeah, it was a low blow that I don't think anybody was expecting or, like, was anything that anybody had, like, thought of or would have brought up otherwise.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah.

 

Let’s Talk About the Husbands (31:51)

Eric Praniewicz

So, no, I get that. And, like, there was also a lot of, like, coming after the husbands this season, which was I don't know if I've only seen that in Jersey.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, that's, like, a Jersey thing.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Like, there's like, that unspoken rule, like, you don't, you don't bring the husbands into it. You don't bring the kids into it, like, you just don't do that.

 

And like, they kind of do, and that's, like, the one thing I don't like about Salt Lake. I'm like, yeah, like, you know, if it's, you know, something going on, like, like, what Mary had with, you know, everything that was going on with her son.

 

I thought that was, I thought that was important, you know. It she really opened herself up in a way that she did not have to.

 

But that's, I mean, that's very different than, you know, oh, I think your husband is fucking other men.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, exactly. And, like, to your point too, like, even in the finale, the husbands were kind of going at each other.

 

And I feel like we've only really seen that in like, Jersey, because and with Jersey there was like, you know, Joe Giudice, Joe Gorga. Like, there family so some of that's where that dynamic came from.

 

It's not just like, oh, I'm fighting with the husband of this woman that's friends with my wife.

 

But I will say, though, when, like, because I really didn't like how Todd, Bronwyn's husband was, like, kind of going, at Lisa.

 

Like I felt it seemed a little inappropriate. And Todd just came across as awkward, like a little old school, let's say, to put it lightly, this season.

 

But when that was going on, I did get a little, my heart fluttered when I heard Daddy John go watch your tone. I was like, oh my gosh, John, defend me next.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, my God, no. I will also be a Shawn apologist forever.

 

Rob Loveless

Yes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh yes. I love that man. And honestly, if any of those rumors are true, I support it.

 

Rob Loveless

You know where to find us. Slide into the DMs.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I'm just saying I can always travel to Salt Lake City. It's fine.

 

Rob Loveless

It does look beautiful. I will say, from like the shots of the landscape. I never thought much of Salt Lake City and then I started watching the show. It looks like a beautiful area.

 

Eric Praniewicz

It's beautiful. I actually went to a wedding there. This time two years ago. It was, yeah, it was early March, no early April, but yeah, right around this time. Oh my God, it was absolutely stunning.

 

There was still snow on the ground, but it was like, like, here on the East Coast when it's snowy, like, it's really cold and dreary and dark and gross and just absolutely depressing.

 

But there the sun is shining super bright on your face. It's wonderful. It's cold, but like, you walk outside in a hoodie and jeans and you're like, oh, this is nice.

 

Like, I don't understand. Like, I could actually feel happy in the winter? Okay. Crazy.

 

Rob Loveless

That'll have to be my next travel destination.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I highly recommend it. I think we're going to try to go to Utah this summer too, if we can. But I don't know if it'll happen.

 

Rob Loveless

Nice. Well, fingers crossed. That sounds like an awesome trip.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah. But yeah, getting back to it, I am a Shawn apologist. And honestly, like, what goes on in their marriage is their business.

 

And like, if they have an arrangement like that, go for it. But like, well, I don't know. Don't be trying to blow them up like that.

 

The Art of Pot Stirring (35:06)

Rob Loveless

And see, the frustrating thing I can't stand with all the franchises is when they talk about things that are rumors they heard off camera, or that somebody that's not on the show brought up because then I'm like, what's the real story?

 

Like, I like Beverly Hills. I love the one where, like, Kim Richards confronts Lisa, Lisa Rinna, and she's like, did you say that I was like, an addict and at death's door, and that people are fearing for my life?

 

And it cuts like, it goes back to Lisa, and then it cuts like, three months later, and or earlier, and she's like, and she's like, you know, they really are scared for Kim's life.

 

Like they are knocking at that store, and then it cuts back. She's like, I don't think I said that. No.

 

Like, I need that kind of proof. Like, I don't like, when people bring hearsay up from, like, off the show, because then it's like, I think that's a low blow.

 

But also, then it leaves the audience wondering, like, what is true?

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, like, what's the actual story there? And like, why aren't you giving it to me?

 

Rob Loveless

Also, this might be an unpopular opinion, but like, I want Lisa Rinna back. I know everybody thought she was the villain of the show, but she was so entertaining.

 

Eric Praniewicz

She absolutely could be back. I don't think she wants to come back because she was, yeah, really just booed off of that season. I think that whatever happened in that season, she probably took it too far.

 

I definitely think that she took it too far. Maybe she needed a break or whatever. I think that she should come back, because she, I mean, she is always the life of the party.

 

She really, really is. I think that, aside from being an absolute pot stirrer and, you know, rumor, paper plane thrower everywhere, I love her. I mean, she's, she's absolutely great TV.

 

I think she is always somebody who can be a glue for that cast. And, yeah, it hasn't been the same without her,

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, and see, the thing that's interesting is Lisa Rinna is 100% a pot stirrer, but I always felt that she did it in, like, I don't know this might be rose-colored glasses, but I felt like it wasn't malicious, how she malicious, how she did it.

 

Whereas, like, with Whitney on Salt Lake City, I feel like a lot of it's very intentional. Like, I'm doing this to like, dig the dagger in deeper.

 

And, like, I don't know, Lisa just made it more fun and not as serious. So, it just lands differently. Like, I like that kind of pit stirring, not like the Whitney Rose I'm healing journey.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Whitney Rose. That girl. Oh, I want...

 

Rob Loveless

My feelings.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I want to love Whitney Rose so badly sometimes, but she makes it so hard.

 

Rob Loveless

I know, I know it's like, just, I don't know, because she's such a hypocrite. She's like, we need to communicate better. And then she's talking shit about people and, like, spreading rumors.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I think I would like her so much more if she just, yeah, lived by her word, but she doesn't.

 

Rob Loveless

I know she really doesn't. And like, not that Lisa Rinna always did either. But like I said, it just felt more light hearted and more fun, like it wasn't as serious.

 

But she definitely, like, the last season, she was definitely going through that, like when she freaked out at Sutton. She's like, don't fuck with my family. I had never seen her scream like that before.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, yeah, no, agreed. It was, it was a lot. It was just a lot. And was she going through stuff at the time with her family?

 

Rob Loveless

I think that was, I think her mom was sick at that time, and there were some other things going on.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, that's right, that was all going on at that time. I mean, there you have it.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. Yeah, but I know you had mentioned kind of upfront, you feel like Beverly Hills has kind of lost its luster a little bit.

 

Do you think that's because of Lisa Rinna leaving, or it's been two seasons? I think it's like the storyline currently.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, I think there's a lot at play there. I think that's definitely part of it. But, I mean, there's, there's so much else to it.

 

The cast has had a little bit of a revolving door. I mean, there's still that core group there, but there have been a lot of new newcomers within the past few years.

 

A lot of people have departed. I think some people who have left are just kind of tired of the bullshit. And I think some of the people who have stayed have been the bullshit in some ways.

 

You know what I mean? I don't know. Some of it just feels like a little tired, like it feels like some of it's the same kind of storylines, but with just a new flavor to it.

 

Some of it is, you know, some of it is explosive, like, like, the divorces.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Divorce on divorce on divorce.

 

But I don't know, it feels like it's, it's just the things that come up are things that are just absolutely so minor and, like, absolutely blown out of proportion for no reason whatsoever.

 

Just like, to make a storyline out of nothing. I feel like that's what a lot of it is.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. And it sucks, because I feel like Beverly Hills was always fun. And then I don't know, like, I feel like it was more recently, like, the past couple seasons.

 

It's kind of, it's been fine, but not as great. Yeah, and this season is weird with, like, Dorit and Kyle being at each other, although it seems like, right now, they're better.

 

But I will also say, I think, you know, there is a core group. It is Dorit, Erika, Kyle, and it was Lisa Rinna beforehand, and then they added in Crystal, Sutton, Garcelle.

 

I don't feel like Sutton ever made sense. Like she's just, I'm not a big fan of Sutton. Wait, now are I know somebody. Is it you that's like, the big Sutton fan? 

 

Eric Praniewicz

I go back and forth about Sutton.

 

Rob Loveless

Okay, I must be thinking somebody else, cause I know somebody's like, a die hard, Sutton fan. Like, uh oh, I might have just, like, started

 

Eric Praniewicz

It could be me, like, a year ago.

 

Rob Loveless

Eric might be flipping the table.

 

Eric Praniewicz

A year ago, I might have been a die hard, Sutton. I don't even remember, because it changes all the time, because she changes all the time.

 

Yeah, it's so hard with her, because she is, on one hand, very relatable. You know, she, she doesn't come from a lot.

 

You know, she has that small town, Southern charm kind of thing with her, and like that kind of Sutton, like the episodes where she brought Garcelle and Kyle home to her mother.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh, yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I actually, I loved those episodes. I really felt for Sutton. I really enjoyed that time that they kind of spent together there.

 

And I really, like, felt like they all connected, and then they came back and, like, the switch just flipped, and she was Beverly Hills Sutton again, and...

 

Rob Loveless

Like, calling Dorit out, like, pick on somebody your own wallet size.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, that...

 

Rob Loveless

That was just embarrassing. That's tacky.

 

Eric Praniewicz

That the whole social climber thing. Like, I yeah, I hate that. I hate that so much.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, and even last season, when Sutton was really fighting with Kyle, and she just goes, name 'em, name 'em, name 'em. Like, shut up. Like, let her finish, you know? Like...

 

Eric Praniewicz

I know. And that was so memed. And, like, I have a wine glass that says name 'em, you know? Who doesn't?

 

Rob Loveless

I mean, and it just was replayed over and over. Like, every episode of Beverly Hills in the recap they showed that part again. I'm like, we get it. She said, name 'em, like, 50 times.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I have named 'em, I promise. So, yeah, see, it's just too much.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I feel like it was when Lisa Rinna left. And I'm not saying it's because Lisa Rinna left. I think it's a medley. I think Lisa Rinna was really good about stirring the pot, making it fun.

 

And then I think the storylines changed a little bit, because the whole Morgan Wade/Kyle thing was weird, like, just the rumors about it. Then now this season, Kyle and Dorit are both getting divorced.

 

And it's also like, so Crystal, I never liked. I mean, I like how people, you know, Housewives can be great that people bring a storyline on to talk about, like an issue, like mental health, things like that.

 

But to me, Crystal was like, the epitome of millennial culture. And I'm a millennial, and it was so annoying every episode's, "Oh, I'm triggered, guys. This is triggering me."

 

It's like, yeah, to an extent, like, you know. So, when she left, I wasn't really that sad.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I actually like Garcelle. She as she like the seasons went on with her. I liked her more towards the end than I did at the beginning. Weirdly enough.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, her last season I think I liked her a little bit better, because I was probably just like, used to her. But the first season seemed very whiny. And Garcelle is fine. I go back and forth with her.

 

But the thing I didn't like was when, and maybe this is because, like, the dynamic of, like, the not original, but like, kind of like the core group that's been there for a while, it always felt like Sutton, Garcelle, and to some extent, Crystal would really kind of go after Kyle, but it would be like, back and...And, like, here's the other thing.

 

I'm also a Kyle apologist. I know some people can't stand her, but to me, it just seems weird, because there seems to be a genuine fakeness where, like, especially, we're seeing it with Sutton this season, where she's brings, well, she was talking shit about Kyle beforehand with, oh, Kyle just stormed out of the house, and then brings her to meet her mother.

 

And then as soon as they're back in Beverly Hills, she starts talking shit with Garcelle about Kyle. And, like, oh, I think this photo was staged, and this and that. She doesn't want to go through divorce.

 

It's like, either pick your side. Like you're either friends with somebody or not.

 

But like, it just, and there never been that long standing level of like, cat like, I don't say cattiness, like the backstabbing like, it is, yeah, yeah. This season it feels more like it.

 

Like, obviously, that happens in every franchise a little bit. But in like, it seems like it's a core theme the past couple seasons where it's, like, trying to bring Kyle down.

 

Yeah, it's just, and there's, like, the friendships just seem a little fractured now and stuff, so it just doesn't feel totally aligned.

 

And I mean, I really do like Kyle, and I know some people think she deflects a lot and stuff, but I've always liked her, and I don't know.

 

So just it, it just and like, last season, even her fight with Sutton, it just felt weird. You know, like all the time, feels like people are trying to, like, turn on her, just like, make some TV time.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, yeah. No, I agree. I I have a little bit of a different stance on Kyle. I'm not, like, get her out of here, like, whatever, blah, blah, blah.

 

But I always have liked Kyle. I always will, to some extent, but she has made it really hard to like her lately.

 

I feel like, I think part of it is that I and I mean, looking at it from like, you know, a human perspective, like, she has a lot going on in her life.

 

She doesn't necessarily need to share everything with the world, like, obviously.

 

But some of the things, like, with the whole Morgan thing and a bunch of other stuff like that, I feel like she has kind of deflected a lot, and I feel like, I feel like a lot of things would be easier for her if she just owned whatever she was doing.

 

And like, I don't know if she's necessarily willing to or like, she thinks it's going to. I feel like she's so focused on her public image that it's like to her own detriment.

 

Yeah, I feel like a lot of people are seeing that as, like, being kind of fake, or like being kind of disingenuous. And I think that people were just kind of tired of that.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. It's tough, because I agree, like there was, like, this season with the whole PK text thing and how she was going back and forth with that.

 

Eric Praniewicz

PK texts her.

 

Rob Loveless

I don't, oh, I know. It's just, it just means. Now it's texts.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I really want a t shirt or something that just said PK texts her. And just like, the state of Texas, her.

 

Rob Loveless

I know, oh, my God, those memes were hilarious. But like, I I genuinely don't think there was anything malicious going on there.

 

But I don't think she did a good job defending her, like explaining herself. Like you said, like, I think she was digging a deeper hole by how she was going back and forth with it.

 

And I think some of it is obviously, you know, people, I mean, Lisa Rene even said it, like, when you come on the show, they ask you just tell the truth.

 

And it's not for everyone, as she said about Denise Richards. But I think...

 

Eric Praniewicz

Lisa was right, and Lisa did it right too. Anything that was going on, she put it out there. She was like, oh yeah, here's what's going on. Yeah, that's yes, if you're on a show like that, that's what you sign up for.

 

Rob Loveless

I agree. But I think to some extent, feel like there's a lot going on with Kyle, because there was, there had always been the rumors about her Mauricio. Then last season, the Morgan Wade rumors.

 

Her kids have now fully moved out of the house, and as is happening now, she's going through a divorce.

 

Like I could understand why she wouldn't want to be openly talking about because it is a little bit of an identity crisis, you know, of what you've known for your whole life.

 

So, I think if it was maybe one of those things at a time, we might get a little bit more transparency from her. Not that she owes it to us, but like on reality TV, that's what people are expecting are expecting.

 

But I think it's just so much that she's still trying to figure out what her image is and what her identity is.

 

And I feel like the other women are not really sympathetic to it, because, I mean, in the past, yes, she's definitely poked them all saying, like, well, don't, you know, walk out.

 

Don't just, like, do this, like, you know, explain it, this and that. But I don't know if any of the other women have had a complete life 360 like this happening all at once.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, except for Erika.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yeah, she's a victim too.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, but we all saw how she handled that.

 

Rob Loveless

And she got the fucking earrings in the end.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I am also team Erika always.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh my God, I love her. And her music lately has been, I cannot get Dominos out of my head. It's so good. Yeah. That and Drip Drop. I run on the treadmill too it, it's so good.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, that's a good idea. I should do that.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, it's a good, like, good, like, power, like, hot girl strut walk, you know?

 

Eric Praniewicz

Speaking of Erika, can I just say I am very happy for her?

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, she is at in her life right now. I feel like she's really been through through the ringer, whether, whether she knew what was going on or not.

 

She has been through the ringer, and I think at this point she, you know, whatever flowers she has left, she has earned them. She deserves them.

 

I like that people are letting her be finally, and she's able to just live her life. I'm very happy for that.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, and you can see it too, like this season, and even less, like, she just seems more at peace, and like, tranquil with everything. And like...

 

Eric Praniewicz

The fact that she's the voice of reason in some of these discussions.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, exactly. Well, because, like, I mean, I don't obviously, I'm not a legal expert.

 

I genuinely don't believe she knew what Tom was doing, because here's a guy who was like, I just think he was thirty years her senior, because he was, yeah, yeah.

 

And, I mean, if I had somebody putting money in my account who had all this money in the world, I wouldn't think, well, where exactly is money getting sourced from?

 

I think it's coming from his job, not funneling it from, you know, victims in Malaysian flights, you know? Like, Oh my God. But I did love how she went after Sutton.

 

Like, one of my favorite things was like, when she's wearing the excessive amount of foundation and she starts crying like a single tear.

 

You can see the trail down her face, and she goes, Look at me, Dorit. Go ahead, look at me. And then she turns to Sutton, she's like, or what? Or what? Exactly, so shut the fuck up.

 

Eric Praniewicz

That made me cringe so much when I saw that the first time. I physically had to cover my face.

 

Rob Loveless

But see that level of performative, I don't actually mind, because I feel like that is entertaining. Like, not that it's authentic, but it goes back to, like, the Salt Lake City.

 

Like it feels like it works for that, you know? Like that situation worked if it was somebody else, or if it was a little different, it wouldn't have but.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, it works, or it doesn't. And I hate to say that there's just some sort of factor to it that's kind of hard to describe.

 

But like, yeah, you know when you know and like, if you're trying to push it, like a lot of these ladies have been kind of trying to do, like, Okay, now what?

 

Housewives Music Careers (50:11)

Rob Loveless

Yeah. And also, like, kudos for Erika. I think she's the only one whose music career is actually good.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, oh, yeah.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, that's not true. Countless LuAnn has her cabaret show. I'm, I'm not discounting that, but I mean, like, it's, I'm thinking of like the Melissa Gorga singing or...

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, it's a different it's a different vibe. It's a really different audience. The audience is actually just, if it was a Venn diagram, it would be a circle. It's just Housewives fans, but....

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yeah, exactly. Although I will say I do sometimes listen to Tardy for the Party at the gym. Just something about it. It's so bad, but so good.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I'll put some of LuAnn's songs on, like party playlists and things like that for sure.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, Chic C'est La Vie's fun. What's the other one? Feeling Jovani. Oh my God, there was one I really liked.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Seeing Feeling Jovani live was so fun.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh my God, I bet. I can only imagine.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I have a few photos. I'll have to send them to you.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh my God, yes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I got a photo of her shoes because we were like, right at the foot of the stage there. So much fun, so cute too. Like, super, super high heels that she was just dancing all night. I was like, Oh, my God. I hope that...

 

Rob Loveless

It just seems like she's having fun now, which is good. Yeah, I said it just seems like she's having fun now, which is like, good because, like, I feel like she had to put up, like, a facade for so long.

 

Like, oh, I'm married to a count, you know, I'm this and that. And now it's just like, I got my DUI. You've seen the good and the bad. Here I am.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I also have my LuAnn mug shot, my LuAnn and Sonja mug shot mug.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh my gosh. Wait, LuAnn, it wasn't a DUI. It was just like, public intoxication or something, right?

 

Eric Praniewicz

It had something to do with intoxication. I can't remember. It was one of those.

 

Rob Loveless

I remember that footage came out and, like, she, like, kicked the cop and threatened to kill him and stuff. I'm like, Oh my God.

 

RHONY Reboot (51:53)

Rob Loveless

But well, while we have New York up here, what do you think about the, you know, new New York, let's say, and like, how they're in the second season of the reboot?

 

And for people who don't know, like, literally, they just, they had their last season in, like, 2020ish, it was during the pandemic, and then it was on pause. Yeah, it was on pause.

 

And then in 2023 like, we're doing a whole new New York, and it was just full reboot. They did a girls trip ultimate weekend that was, like a big chunk of, like legacy RHONY cast.

 

But I don't know this well, I'll let you speak about what you think of the new one first, before I say anything.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I like Jenna Lyons.

 

Rob Loveless

Yes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I love her. And I mean, like, I'm for a lot of like, my early career was, like, in that sort of realm of fashion. Not like high fashion or anything like that.

 

But like, I mean, I was in retail, but like, I looked up to people like Jenna Lyons. Like I she was, like, my style icon, and also, she's an incredible business woman.

 

She's super, super smart, and, you know, to see her in, like, later in life, after all of that, and like, being this, like, openly queer woman. I mean, it's incredible. I no notes for her…

 

But as for the rest of the season, I, I've, I've watched some of it here and there. I, I don't know it's, it's not the same, and that's what you're going to hear from anybody. I feel like it's just not the same.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, and even in the second season, I fell out of the second season halfway through. But like, it just feels like none of the connections are authentic with each other, and like, at least other franchises.

 

Yeah, it felt like there was some level of friendship there, or at least connection. And see, I get that they wanted a younger cast, because, like, RHONY, OC, Jersey, they started in, like, 2006, 2008, 2009.

 

So obviously, if you have 40- to 50-year-old women on there, then 15 years later they're going to be, you know, in their mid-60s, maybe pushing 70s.

 

So, I get that they want younger women, but I feel like there's a better way to do it. Like I think what they should have done was kept.

 

I so the people that I would like to see still on New York from the current cast are Jenna Lyons, Brynn, even though she's a troublemaker, but she's entertaining.

 

Eric Praniewicz

She's the Britani of that season.

 

Rob Loveless

Exactly. And Jessel, I actually really like Jessel a lot. I think what they should have done, yeah, I think what they should have done was, who was on the last season of RHONY?

 

It was still Dorinda, right? Like, keep Dorinda, LuAnn, Sonja.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Dorinda was not because that was when she was, she was put on pause. It was LuAnn, Ramona, Sonja.

 

Rob Loveless

There was Ebony and Leah McSweeney. And was there another woman?

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, but I can't remember. I didn't finish that season either. It was, it got weird.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, because that was like a heavy pandemic, it wasn't like, yeah, it was fully masked everywhere.

 

Eric Praniewicz

There was a lot of stuff with, like the racial reckoning and stuff like that too, which is an important conversation to have, absolutely.

 

But on Housewives, I don't know if, and I think they realized as well, like, with that cast, I don't know if that was the place to have that conversation.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. You still had Ramona referring to people as the help. Yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

It did not feel organic. It felt very forced. They knew they needed to pull for sure.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I will say, though, that last season I loved that Ramona is yelling at somebody as they're leaving a restaurant, and Sonja has her face mask on and chugs entire glass of wine through the face mask.

 

Hands the glass back to Ramona, and Ramona goes to take a sip and she's like, what happened? But yeah, it just, I mean, that was amazing.

 

But yeah, that last season just felt like you said, like, I think it's good to have the heavier conversations on Housewives. But with that cast, like Ramona had had some racial issues on it.

 

Apparently, there were, like, allegations of racism afterwards, which is part of the reason why that whole cast was put on pause.

 

I really liked Ebony. It was a shame. I think that was her only season we saw her on. I would have liked to see her come back.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I liked Ebony a lot. I wish that she came back for the reboot, for sure.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, see, I think what they should have done, though, was keep some of the original cast.

 

So, you have, like, I'd say, in my dream world, Dorinda, LuAnn, Sonja, and maybe bring Ebony, because I did like her. And then bring and then have Jenna Lyons, Jessel, and Brynn.

 

So that way you're getting you're kind of blending them. Like, I mean, think of like Dorinda dealing with some of the bullshit that Brynn has been doing, or whatever.

 

Or like, how certain women could bond with each other.

 

Like it just, I think it would feel more organic, because then you saw the friend groups and the connections and the familiarity while bringing in newer, younger faces

 

RHONJ Feuds (56:31)

Rob Loveless

And I'm kind of nervous about New Jersey doing that, because now New Jersey is in a whole tailspin. I mean, it can't continue the way it's been going on the past two seasons.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I worry about Jersey as well. I think, I think you're so right about the connection.

 

And I I think that a reason that some of the franchises really took off like they did in earlier seasons, and why Salt Lake is so successful is because, and maybe this is just because of, like, my own upbringing, but, like, I fell in love with Jersey because it reminded me of my own family.

 

Which is very dysfunctional, yeah, but like a good Housewives cast really does have to function like a dysfunctional family.

 

Like you are going to yell at each other, you are going to scream at each other, you are going to insult one another, and you're gonna say shit that like, you probably should regret, even if you don't regret.

 

Like, but at the end of the day, at the end of the season, you are still gonna come together. You're not going to be like, oh, I can't be in the room with this person.

 

Like you are going to be in that room with that person, and you are either going to, you know, you're still going to be there for them.

 

You're so you know, they're still going to be your ride or die whatever, even if it's not 100% true, but you're still going to at least get along with one another in some way.

 

And I think there's so much ice and tension between some of them that it's just not possible. And like, that's, that's where you lose people.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, and Jersey was one that always had the connections there, because I always kind of joked that, like, each franchise has its own identity.

 

Like the OC, I feel was like heavy plastic surgery and like, full on backstabbing, you know? New York was drinking too much, and Jersey was like having family.

 

Because the first season, it was Theresa, Danielle, and then we had Caroline Manzo, Dina Manzo, so they were sisters, and then their sister-in-law, Jacqueline.

 

And then after season two, so season three is when they brought on Melissa Gorga, who was Theresa's sister-in-law, and then their cousin Kathy Wakile. And it still had, like the Manzos on.

 

So, for the first, like five seasons or so, it was like big family dynamics and family drama.

 

Remember there was, yeah, and then there was, but there was that random, weird season in between where it was, like they got rid of everyone, and it was just Theresa and Melissa.

 

And then they brought on the twins, who is Theresa. I forget the other one, Theresa and Nicole. There was Amber, who had the really problematic husband. And then, like, there was one other woman.

 

And then the next season, it was a whole new cast, and it was Theresa, Melissa, and then we got some of the core group, like the Dolores, Margaret Josephs.

 

I think Jennifer Aiden came on shortly after that, and Siggy, who she was wild and apparently a Trump supporter.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, wait, yeah. Oh, my God.

 

Rob Loveless

I think was I heard allegedly, her son was at January 6.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I wouldn't be surprised. Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised. There's, there's a lot of that in Jersey.

 

Rob Loveless

Although I will say, even though Siggy, Soggy Flicker, um, she, like, despite her political affiliations, because I didn't know that and Trump was not around when that came out.

 

But, um, she like, cracked me up when she was first on there, and I loved her tagline.

 

Like, some people I say, say I'm too much, and you know what? They're absolutely right. And like, well, that's, I feel like that's me. I relate to that.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, yeah. Like, again, you just gotta own it. Be honest with it.

 

Rob Loveless

And then there was that whole weird storyline with, like, the cake being thrown or whatever.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, I really fell off of Jersey in the later years. And, yeah, like, I want to love it, and I want to to feel that familiarity with it, but I just don't anymore.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, did you watch the most recent season?

 

Eric Praniewicz

No.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh, well, the last two you weren't missing much because, like, the last two seasons, it was like the typical Melissa Theresa feud, but, like, it was just unbearable.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I couldn't get past it. That's why I didn't watch it. I kept seeing so much about it. I was like, this is this is not for me.

 

Rob Loveless

And see, this is another one where the entire friend group is so fractured, because there is Margaret and Theresa have issues with each other. Margaret and Melissa have issues with each other.

 

Margaret and Jen Aiden have issues with each other. Danielle who, Danielle is a newer woman who I really like her. I hope they bring her back.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I heard good things about her.

 

Rob Loveless

She was hilarious, and she but like, she's had issues with Jen Aiden. And like, first she was close with Jen and Theresa, then she feels like she was used. Then she had issues with Melissa.

 

And it's just and it's just and then Dolores is, like, pretty much the mediator and all. And I love Dolores. But see, they're talking about they didn't even do an actual reunion.

 

What they did was they went back to the restaurant where the finale was filmed up because there's a major blow up there, and they had two rooms where the friend groups that got along could sit in the room and re watch the final episode.

 

And Dolores was the only one that was like, good with the two groups. So, she bounced between room to room. It was just so awkward and weird.

 

But it's so now they're talking about doing like a major recast of Jersey as well.

 

And see, I think what they should do is like, learn from the mistakes of RHONY. What I would like to see is blend some of the original cast with some new people.

 

Keep Theresa, because I'm a Theresa apologist.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Same.

 

Rob Loveless

Keep Dolores. Yeah, keep Dolores. Keep Danielle because Danielle is, like, in her, like, mid 30s, probably, so she's kind of like a little bit of a newer face.

 

I think they should bring Gia on as a housewife, because Gia actually spent a lot the past two seasons. She was like, in confessionals lot. So, Gia would make a good housewife.

 

And then bring in a few other women that are a mix of, like, around Gia's age, and then like Theresa and Dolores' age.

 

So, you get, like, kind of a natural, there's the connections there, but you're bringing in new faces still.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I like that idea. I don't know if they'll do it. I think they're too nervous about like, sort of like, factions forming with stuff like that.

 

I mean, it could happen, but I think it's better than the alternative of just burn it down. Let's find a bunch of random ladies and start over here, because it's not working. Yeah, it's not.

 

Rob Loveless

It's yeah, I don't know.

 

Although with Jersey, a whole new cast could be more interesting because I feel like it could be, the Jersey girls could have more personality, because I feel sometimes with New York, it's like, oh, I'm trying to put on this facade of I'm New York money, blah, blah, blah.

 

Where I feel in other cities, you're not necessarily putting on that front. So, it could be entertaining, but I'm just very nervous about it.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I'm curious. I'm very curious to see how it goes. I also saw that they were potentially, what was it they were mulling, like giving Melissa a spin off series. Did you see that?

 

Rob Loveless

I heard about that. I really was never a big Melissa fan.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah. I mean, I, I could take her, take it or leave it with Melissa. But, yeah, if Joe is on the TV.

 

Rob Loveless

He's so problematic, though, but he's pretty to look at.

 

Eric Praniewicz

If Joe was on that TV, I would be watching. That's all I'm gonna say.

 

Rob Loveless

Pretty much every husband from Jersey. I was like, that's why I loved watching Jersey because they featured the husbands just as much.

 

And I'm like, I mean, you get it, having like an Italian mother, like I saw like the douche bag Jersey beefcakes, growing up.

 

Not from family. I just mean, like, yeah, spending time in like Jersey and family, seeing like neighbor, their neighbors, going to the Jersey Shore. Yeah, exactly.

 

But so like, and I kind of love it, because being in Philly, I'm in South Philly, and there's a similar dichotomy here.

 

So, I'm like, Oh my God. I mean, now they're all like, probably toxic straight men, but I'm like, yes, my type. Oh, so seeing the husbands featured on the show, I'm like, Oh my God, yes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Like, please, please, please, please. Yeah, I love that.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh, so good. I need to cool down a second. So, I guess, since we've kind of gone through a few of the franchises, are there any like?

 

Why Gay Men Love Real Housewives (1:03:51)

Rob Loveless

Well, I guess, first off, like, you know, obviously we're both gay. We've been talking about this. Why do you think, like, I mean, gay men flock to the show. Why do you think it's so popular with us gays?

 

Eric Praniewicz

I don't know. I think it's, it's definitely a little bit of, like, the glamor and the lifestyle.

 

You know, we all, all of us, kind of flock to that a little bit here and there, even if we're not like a social climber type or whatever. It's just always fun to see.

 

I think for one, at least for me, it's a fascination of seeing how rich people live their lives and spend their money.

 

And if any, if this show can teach you anything, it's that rich people, just because you have money does not mean you have good taste. There's a lot of questionable choices made across the board.

 

Number two, I think there is a sort of relatability with with strong female characters. I mean, any gay man and any strong female character, there's an instant link there.

 

I think that's just goes without saying. And I think that's a big part of the draw. A lot of the women, at least from the franchises I watch, are divorced too.

 

And I think there's, like, the independent woman kind of angle to it as well. I think we're drawn to that same, you know, same strong female kind of thing.

 

I don't know. In addition to that, I think, like the social aspect of it too, and just. Yeah, I don't know, that's what I got.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I mean, I definitely think I get that with the strong female, like, you know, hashtag girl boss or whatever.

 

Because especially some of the early ones, like, for the first, I mean, well, throughout all those people like Vicki Gunvalson, she was my favorite from the get go.

 

Has not aged as well in terms of some of her statements on things. So, I'd say, I stanned her up until, like her 2017, 2018 season, when it got to very much being like, this is my show. Get off of it.

 

And like some of her political affiliations. But she was always like, working hard. Like, she's like, oh, I love work. I love business. Blah, blah, blah, this and that.

 

You had Bethenny Frankel in New York, who she was another one. I loved her on the show, but then also did not age so well with some of her actions.

 

But like, you always see, like, those, like, kind of like strong, and especially Bethenny, it was kind of like, I don't say controversial, but like, she wasn't married, and she was on Real Housewives.

 

People were like, well, how can you be a housewife if you're not married? But like, it extends just beyond that identity of like a housewife.

 

She's like a strong woman, like, especially with New York, a strong single woman, works hard, dating, navigating love, like the city, all these things. I think it just made sense.

 

And definitely something that, like, I think gay men can be drawn to because for us, you know, we might not be getting married at 25 like our, you know, straight peers, and we might put our careers first.

 

And we might, you know, want to aspire for the fancy glamor.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, a lot of us want, want that sort of, not necessarily the lifestyle of just like the rich and famous, but like that same sort of storyline. I do think that we're really drawn to it.

 

I think we're right, the sort of self-made, you know, I built this from the ground up, and fucking look at me now. Like, I think we love that.

 

Rob Loveless

Look at me now, Dorit. Go ahead, take a look.

 

Eric Praniewicz

No, I think you're right. I think that is, that is a huge part of it, for sure. And I think it's also just fun to see, like these friendships, you know, grow and change and destroy themselves and grow again.

 

Yeah, I think that we see a lot of ourselves in these women from time to time.

 

Rob Loveless

Definitely. And I think also, like in the way that like Drag Race brings together, like gay men to like bond and stuff, I think Housewives does in a way too, because, you know, like, you'll bring it up to somebody, and they'll be like, oh, what franchise?

 

And I think, actually, the first time you and I met, I think, and I can't believe we haven't talked about 'til now.

 

I think you were wearing a sweater that had the whole thing, like, Tom's house was broken into, and he tried to confront the burglar, and he had to go to the hospital. And then my son...

 

Eric Praniewicz

I wear that sweatshirt often.

 

Rob Loveless

I think it was like a game night or something, and I met you, I'm like, wait, is that Housewives? Like, do you watch Housewives?

 

And we immediately went into it. And, like, it's just like a great, like, conversation piece.

 

Eric Praniewicz

You know, I wear that sweatshirt to work, and now I have, like, a little group of girls that we talk about Housewives with, just because I wore that in one day. It's like, a conversation starter.

 

Rob Loveless

I know. And especially that. I like, I love that video. It gets reposted all the time where, like, she just sits down and she's like, well, Tom's house is broken into, and he tried to confront the robber, and then he had to go to the hospital, and then my son was driving there, and he flipped his car five times on the snow.

 

Yeah, I'm under a lot of stress right now.

 

Eric Praniewicz

It never gets old. It never gets used in so many different ways.

 

Rob Loveless

It's like, how this email signs me.

 

Eric Praniewicz

What's that?

 

Rob Loveless

It's like, how this email finds me.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yes, absolutely. That and my Elizabeth Holmes sweatshirt have been my biggest conversation starters.

 

Rob Loveless

Classic.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Because I'm also really into scammer women, which is probably another reason why I love Housewives.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, oh my gosh, that could be another spin off. All the housewife crimes.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Actually, that would be really cool. I would love to do that. I would do research on that. I would make a presentation for sure.

 

Rob Loveless

True crime housewives edition. Maybe that'll be another monthly bonus episode.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I'm in. I'm so in. You just tell me when.

 

Housewives Taglines (1:09:04)

Rob Loveless

Well, I guess if you were to be on Housewives, what would your tagline be?

 

Eric Praniewicz

See, I knew that you were going to ask this, and I didn't pick one ahead of time, and I really should have.

 

One did come to me, like, a week or two ago, and I was like, Oh, that's so good, and it's so stupid, but funny. And now I can't remember what it is. Maybe I wrote it down. Let me check my notes app here.

 

My notes app is very unhinged. I also have a list of PowerPoint presentations that I want to do for people that are unhinged. One of them is on the fact that Avril Lavigne is actually dead.

 

Rob Loveless

I've heard about that. RIP.

 

Eric Praniewicz

One is also about vanity plate options I want for a license plate for my next car.

 

Rob Loveless

Ooh.

 

Eric Praniewicz

No, I did not write it down.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh. Well, if you think of one after this, let me know, and I could put in the show notes so everybody can identify you by your Housewives tagline.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I will, I will, for sure. I'm, I'm so upset I can't think of it now.

 

Rob Loveless

It'll come to you as soon as we hit, like, stop on the recording, I'm sure, it'll come to you.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh yeah. There is one that it's, it isn't original, so I wasn't going to say it. But since I can't think of another one, I will say this one, just like, as a placeholder in the meantime.

 

But if you're gonna call me a bitch, at least call me a sensitive bitch.

 

Rob Loveless

Who says that is that? Is that Whitney?

 

Eric Praniewicz

It was just a meme.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh, okay. I thought I'm like, whose tagline is that?

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, it's not a Housewives tagline, but I would make it one, for sure.

 

Rob Loveless

That would be a good one. Nice.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Right? I like it.

 

Rob Loveless

That could be a good vanity play too. If you get, like, maybe sensitive bitch or something for your vanity plate.

 

Eric Praniewicz

A lot of letters to fit in there, but we can make it work.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I always said to my friends, I feel like mine would be, so I'm growing my hair out now, so it's a little different. But like, before that, I would change up my hair all the time.

 

Like I'd want to, like, do a buzz cut, and then I want to, like, do a faux hawk, whatever. So, mine would always be, you know, my emotions change more than my hair.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, okay.

 

Rob Loveless

But recently, a shower thought I had recently for, because I always pretend I'm auditioning for, you know, reality TV.

 

In case the whole corporate job doesn't work out. But the one that came to me recently is, I live by the three Ds dollars, dicks, and democracy.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I love it. That, that's it. That's it for, send it.

 

Rob Loveless

Andy. Andy Cohen, cast me.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I'm ready. Ready, baby.

 

The Traitors (1:11:29)

Rob Loveless

Oh my gosh. And it's also fun too, because I know we kind of touched about touch upon this a little bit earlier, but the Housewives have kind of started to transcend into The Traitors universe now, which I would love to see an all-Housewives cast of The Traitors.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I need that so badly. I also hate that they always kill off the Housewives first.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, this season made no sense. It's like, first of all, I can't believe the producers let that go. You're murdering Dorinda the first night? That would have made such good TV.

 

But also, for The Traitors, like Dorinda would have been a good scapegoat, because she would shoot herself in the foot with something she said eventually, and people would think she was guilty.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I just, coming into this season, all I wanted to see was somebody accused Dorinda of being a traitor.

 

Rob Loveless

She'd be like, now, you gotta back that shit up. Clip.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I was dying. I was so ready for it, and then just gone. Beyond upsetting.

 

Rob Loveless

I know. And now I know you said you don't watch Potomac. I was so disappointed they casted Robyn because she is from Potomac. I never found her really interesting on the show.

 

But also, for nine seasons, her husband cheated on her publicly, and she denied it. So, how's she gonna catch a traitor when she can't even catch her husband cheating on her on public television?

 

You know? Like, so I was not sad when she got murdered early on in the show.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, my God. Yeah, I thought she was okay. She didn't really bring that much to the table. But, I mean...

 

Rob Loveless

I mean, same for Potomac. But I will say Dolores was amazing this season on The Traitors. And I loved, I know, I know.

 

I got nervous she was going to be murdered, but, I mean, she was, yeah, she was like, such a mom of the group the whole time.

 

I loved with when Bob the Drag Queen said to Dylan, when, like, Dylan Efron's like, well, I grew up with an actor. He's like, not a good one.

 

And she goes, Oh, now that's not nice. Dylan, your brother is a very good actor. I'm just like, goddamn, Dolores. You're amazing.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Your brother's a very good actor. Oh, yeah. Oh, that killed me. She really brought nothing to the table intel wise, but she didn't have to.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, exactly. And last season with Phaedra. Oh, my God, Phaedra was amazing last season. That was another thing that made me fall in love with her again.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I need her to come back, because I need justice for Phaedra. She was, I fully believe that she would have made it to the end and won it...

 

Rob Loveless

If it wasn't for fucking Dan.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Like Cirie did on the first season. She absolutely would have if Dan did not absolutely ruin her game.

 

Rob Loveless

I know it was awful. And I mean, she let him have it in the reunion, so I was glad about that. But I also said too, I would love to see if they did, you know, there's like, Drag, uh, Drag Race All Stars.

 

If they did, a Traitors All Stars, where they bring all the traitors from every season to have them compete.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I want that. I want that so bad. And I want fewer straight white men on it, because they ruin it every season.

 

Rob Loveless

Unless they're really hot. I don't mind some of the shots, if they're hot, though.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Like, no. That's true. I, that's okay. Dylan and Sam this season.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yes. I know. It was a good and I was so happy to see Bob Harper. This is totally unrelated, but I used to love the Biggest Loser, and I love Bob Harper, so I was just like, so glad to see him on that.

 

Eric Praniewicz

He's just a little teddy bear.

 

Rob Loveless

Yes, more Housewives, more queer people, and only non-problematic, hot, straight men.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yes, yes. Praise it.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. And no, Ivar. We don't need any gay royals. Like he was so problematic.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I don't know. He absolutely was gay. He absolutely yes.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh no, he said he was.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, did he?

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, he's like, that was the thing he said the first episode. Like, he kind of got, like, outcast by the royals, because it was, like a little scandal that he was gay.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I forgot about that. At the end of, like, coming towards the end of the season, I was like, that's a gay man, right there.

 

That's, that's a gay man. That's a homo. I don't care if he says he is or not. That is. So, all right, I was, at least, I was right.

 

Rob Loveless

Yes, we definitely need, like, an all-Housewives season. And bring back Dorinda. Like, bring her back next season. Justice for Dorinda.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yes. Justice for Dorinda. Justice for Phaedra. I would love to see so many Housewives on it. I feel like Theresa...

 

Rob Loveless

She'd flip the whole round table.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Could you imagine?

 

Rob Loveless

That would be amazing.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh, my God. What other Housewives would we love to see? I want to, I want to workshop this now.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I'm trying to think. I would like to see Vicki Gunvalson.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I would like Vicki for sure.

 

Rob Loveless

She doesn't let things go. Actually, Tamra was on. Tamra was good.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I think Heather would be good on Traitors.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I do.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, she would. Um, I'm trying to go like, franchise by franchise now. From Jersey, although I don't like her anymore, Margaret Joseph would probably be good at it.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Okay, I could see that. Um...

 

Rob Loveless

Um, Beverly Hills. Kyle would probably be good. Like, kind of, like, voice of reason on there.

 

Eric Praniewicz

She probably would. Yeah.

 

Rob Loveless

Erika would be fun on it.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I could see Garcelle being good on that too, actually.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I could see Garcelle. She would be good. Oh, Lisa Rinna, that's who I want on.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yes.

 

Rob Loveless

She will be getting on the round table and dancing like at Andy Cohen's baby shower.

 

Eric Praniewicz

And I would let her. I don't care if they don't discuss a single suspicion that they have. Just let Lisa dance and then vote.

 

Rob Loveless

Exactly.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I would love that. Oh, my God, I would kill for that. Oh, that would be so good.

 

Rob Loveless

Sonja would be funny to watch on The Traitors.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Sonja would be. She would not, bless her heart, she would not last long, but I would love to see her on there.

 

Rob Loveless

And actually, Bethenny Frankel would probably be good on there.

 

Eric Praniewicz

She probably... the thing about Bethenny is that she would be suspicious of everybody.

 

Rob Loveless

Everyone, yeah.

 

Eric Praniewicz

She would, she would like, look at the most faithful, Faithfuls, and be like, I'm gonna fuck you up. Like, that would be Bethenny the whole time. She'd be like, Tom Sandoval at the table, like.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh my God. Tom Sandoval, I know he's a terrible person. He was hilarious on the show, though. Like, whoever did the editing for him did a good job.

 

Eric Praniewicz

He really did have a redemption arc. And I think, now, I mean, obviously, like his actions were unconscionable.

 

He, he has gotten what he deserves for the past several years now, and he deserved all of it. And, you know, I don't feel badly about it, but, yeah. It's, it's been a while.

 

Yeah, he's, you know, he's made his play for redemption, and I think at some point it's earned.

 

Yeah, I do. I hope the same for Raquel, honestly, because I feel like women in these situations always get it way worse than the men.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah. Like the majority of the blame gets placed on them.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah. And I think that this is a unique situation in which Tom took a lot of the heat, but I think Raquel has lost more in it.

 

But yeah, yeah, no, I do think that this was kind of a redemption arc for Tom in a way, and it was fun to see. And it was, it was good TV. It really was.

 

Rob Loveless

Definitely, and I only know. So, I started watching Vanderpump Rules, but I only got up, like season three or four, so I need to get back to that. So, I know the gist of Scandoval, but I haven't gotten into it yet.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Okay. Okay, all right. Well, I won't spoil it too much then.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, I'm sure we'll, we'll do another episode on that. I feel like we could talk reality all day.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh yeah, for sure.

 

Rob Loveless

But I I do actually have to go in a few minutes because I have to take a call from my accountant, who, don't worry, it's a different one than the Giudices used.

 

So, I don't have to worry about, you know, tax fraud or anything. But this has been a lot of fun.

 

Real Housewives Impersonations (1:18:44)

Rob Loveless

But as we're closing it up, can you to put you on the spot, can you do like a Housewife impression? Are there any like go to Housewives impressions, you do that?

 

Eric Praniewicz

So yes, but it's not a Housewives quote. It's just Phaedra going, Oh, Ekin-Su. Lord not Ekin-Su. Oh, Lord.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh, Lord not Ekin-Su.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh Jesus, Lord, not Ekin-Su. I say that all my fucking day long. I had that poster in my office that I printed out on legal paper that's that.

 

But, I work in the steel industry and the tariffs right now. And it just says, Oh Jesus, Lord not the tariffs. Not the tariffs.

 

Rob Loveless

That's amazing.

 

Eric Praniewicz

That would be it for me. That or or Shereé from Atlanta. Yeah, and this is also so stupid, but I say this probably multiple times a week, and it's extremely niche.

 

I don't know if this is really a popular thing that a lot of people know or not, but I saw it on Twitter at one point, and I was just hooked on it.

 

She's just, like, at her kitchen table or something, and she's eating a bag of potato chips, and it's just this whole, like, ten-minute monologue.

 

She's like, I'm snacking. I'm having some kettle chips lightly salted. They just got a good crunch to them. And like it's it absolutely reads like it's some sort of dramatic product placement.

 

You never see the brand on the bag. She never says the name of the brand. This is just her passion for these kettle chips. I love it so much.

 

I will walk around the house all the time, just walk up to somebody like I'm snacking. So that's my other, that's my other memorable quote.

 

Rob Loveless

Very nice.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Thank you. Thank you.

 

Rob Loveless

Oh. Mine, my go to is usually Vicki Gunvalson, but I can only do it if I scream. So, like, because it's like, always her things, where it's, like, her excited voice, like, where she's like, whoop it up and stuff.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Oh yeah, yeah. Or Tamra, Tamra Judge's, that's my, my opinion. I do that a lot too.

 

Rob Loveless

Well, I love the Vicki one, where she's like, you sent a little family van?! You sent a family van?!

 

Or the other one. All right, everybody listening, turn your volume down because I'm about to scream. Eric, maybe back away a little bit, but it's, do you know you've never seen any OC?

 

Eric Praniewicz

No, but, I mean, I've, I've seen the clips, you know?

 

Rob Loveless

In one of the early, in one of the early seasons, her son goes away to college, and she, they're like, doing, like, a tailgate, and she decides to, like, surprise him.

 

So, like, it's a full college party, and his mom just shows up, and he's like, yeah, literally, like, he's in like, the back of the house with a girl. Like, not like, hooking up.

 

They’re just hanging out, but he literally doesn't even see her. He just hears his mom screaming. It's just like, woo-hoo, Michael!

 

Eric Praniewicz

I love that clip so much.

 

Rob Loveless

My neighbors hate me.

 

Eric Praniewicz

It's fine, it's fine.

 

Rob Loveless

It's fine. I'm just giving them a little culture.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, they need it.

 

Rob Loveless

Exactly. South Philly. You need to up your Housewives game.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Yeah, yeah. Put them up.

 

Rob Loveless

Yeah, Eric, thank you so much for joining. It was so good seeing your face again. It's been like two years.

 

Eric Praniewicz

I know, it's been so long. I miss you. Thank you for having me.

 

Rob Loveless

Of course, I couldn't think of anybody better to talk to Housewives about than you. So, thank you for being a very special return guest for this month's bonus episode.

 

I hope all you LGBTQuties out there enjoyed it. Thank you, as always, for supporting on Patreon. And I'll see you next month for the next monthly bonus episode. Mmm-bye.

 

Eric Praniewicz

Mmm-bye. Mwah.

 

Episode Closing (1:22:25)

Rob Loveless

All right. Well, there you have it. All things, Real Housewives with me and Eric. I hope you all enjoyed that. And connecting it back to the Tarot, The Magician.

 

Again, this card is signifying we have everything at our fingertips to create whatever we want. And while it may be a little sillier and lighter, I do think you can see that in the Real Housewives.

 

Each franchise has its own identity, and within each of those franchises, we have women from all different backgrounds, different personalities, different communication styles... some flipping tables.

 

And with their different identities, I think you can really see how some gay men may identify with subsects of the Real Housewives.

 

It definitely gives us a glimpse into that glitz and glamor, and for some gay men, that could be really affirming.

 

Maybe there's someone who really just wants to settle down and have kids and takes pride in their identity as a parent.

 

Or maybe there's somebody who really just wants to work hard and excel at their careers, like Vicki or Bethenny.

 

Maybe there's others who really want to explore their creativity through a hobby like music, like Countess LuAnn or Erika Jayne.

 

Or maybe some of us are simply just hot messes like Sonja Morgan and enjoy a little chaos and partying now and then.

 

Whoever we may identify as from those franchises, or who we may relate to, or even who we aspire to be, we have the ability to be that version of ourselves, and we can manifest that and achieve those outcomes if we keep all the elements in balance.

 

And while there may be times where you want to just smash a glass on the ground or flip a table or yell at somebody that you made it nice and tell them to take a Xanax and calm down, it's important that we always remain in touch with ourselves and work to take intentional, inspired action and not just react recklessly and emotionally, but with intent and logic and grounded in reality... and not just in reality TV. 

 

Connect with A Jaded Gay (1:24:06)

Rob Loveless

So, there you have it. Hope you enjoyed this little holiday treat, and I hope you all have a happy and healthy holiday season.

 

As always, you know the drill. For any questions or feedback, you can reach out to me rob@ajadedgay.com.

 

Please remember to rate, review, and subscribe. Five stars only. I greatly appreciate it.

 

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That gets you instant access to episodes ad-free, a day early, plus exclusive monthly bonus content, just like the episode you heard today.

 

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And remember: every day is all we have, so you gotta make your own happiness.

 

Mmm-bye.